fossyant
Ride It Like You Stole It!
- Location
- South Manchester
I'm with you on that too.
Happy for a quiet Christmas, an don't want this proposal of five days of relaxing rules, for 25 days of tough rules.
Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.
I'm with you on that too.
Happy for a quiet Christmas, an don't want this proposal of five days of relaxing rules, for 25 days of tough rules.
bitsandbobs
Über Member
Agreed. I guess this is why the higher impact journals weren't especially excited by it.
Apologies about posting this in the wrong forum previously - it was only for 'flu vaccines and this is about Covid vaccine - so I trust you will afford an elderly gentleman some leeway on this one!
My wife heard yesterday that her department will take delivery of the first Covid vaccine commencing 1st December. She was instructed to get her nurses (she's the big boss) to do the vaccinations (general public in the medical centre to where they're directed, not hospital patients or care home residents) from 5th December and to work 12 hours a day seven days a week until they're all done. She wasn't going to take that lying down so she enquired about pay - there was no extra even mentioned. She fought that one and got her nurses pay commensurate with the hours and days they'll be working. But unlike the headline-grabbers, she worked out the logistics and says this is no magic wand; at its very best, there's no way we'll be seeing the first fruits of this until next March at least.
Firstly, from vaccine arrival, they have five days to use what they've got or it will be rendered useless. It will arrive concentrated - not in measured vials - and they have to dilute it, from which time they'll have five hours to use it or it becomes useless. I naively asked if, once injected, the vaccinee (it is now) would get a sistificate...certfci....piece of paper showing their immune status. She laughed. The only paper the vaccinee (it's common parlance now!) would get would be to instruct them to come and get the follow-up injection. She predicts mayhem from then on. Firstly, she sees what's going on as she's got to pick up the pieces already (the indestructible who can't get infected - until they do or their mother dies of it), and knows that a percentage (which will be high given the area she covers) will believe they're immune. Then there will be those who didn't like the pain of the needle so won't come for the second part, or those who can't get there in time for the second one, rendering the first one completely useless. Kim Kardashian even after the second injection, they won't be declared immune until they have yet another needle (to take blood and test if they have built up sufficient immunity to be declared 'safe') before their journey is over. And that has to be done in sufficient numbers of people to have any beneficial effect. She's very skeptical and has been through this - albeit on a different scale - so many times, she can predict pretty much what's going to happen. Non-compliance, serious effects, public apathy. She's annoyed at the way the government are doing this and the way that the manufacturers have been given the freedom to declare their own product safe and 90-odd percent effective.
My wife heard yesterday that her department will take delivery of the first Covid vaccine commencing 1st December. She was instructed to get her nurses (she's the big boss) to do the vaccinations (general public in the medical centre to where they're directed, not hospital patients or care home residents) from 5th December and to work 12 hours a day seven days a week until they're all done. She wasn't going to take that lying down so she enquired about pay - there was no extra even mentioned. She fought that one and got her nurses pay commensurate with the hours and days they'll be working. But unlike the headline-grabbers, she worked out the logistics and says this is no magic wand; at its very best, there's no way we'll be seeing the first fruits of this until next March at least.
Firstly, from vaccine arrival, they have five days to use what they've got or it will be rendered useless. It will arrive concentrated - not in measured vials - and they have to dilute it, from which time they'll have five hours to use it or it becomes useless. I naively asked if, once injected, the vaccinee (it is now) would get a sistificate...certfci....piece of paper showing their immune status. She laughed. The only paper the vaccinee (it's common parlance now!) would get would be to instruct them to come and get the follow-up injection. She predicts mayhem from then on. Firstly, she sees what's going on as she's got to pick up the pieces already (the indestructible who can't get infected - until they do or their mother dies of it), and knows that a percentage (which will be high given the area she covers) will believe they're immune. Then there will be those who didn't like the pain of the needle so won't come for the second part, or those who can't get there in time for the second one, rendering the first one completely useless. Kim Kardashian even after the second injection, they won't be declared immune until they have yet another needle (to take blood and test if they have built up sufficient immunity to be declared 'safe') before their journey is over. And that has to be done in sufficient numbers of people to have any beneficial effect. She's very skeptical and has been through this - albeit on a different scale - so many times, she can predict pretty much what's going to happen. Non-compliance, serious effects, public apathy. She's annoyed at the way the government are doing this and the way that the manufacturers have been given the freedom to declare their own product safe and 90-odd percent effective.
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
Meanwhile, Belgium is leaking the other way ahead of an announcement expected after a crisis committee meeting tomorrow: "We Don't Want A Christmas Wave" says PM De Croo, according to the news website headline brandished on TV.
Another similar-but-different news item there is that one of their leading campaigners for what I think is called "The Excluded" in the UK (I may be confused: it's people missing out on furlough or self-employment covid support grants due to start dates or whatever, being left to go broke) has suicided and it's been reported widely. Other businesses of The Excluded are putting white roses in their windows in memory, which is also demonstrating the scale of the problem to customers.
Attachments
roubaixtuesday
self serving virtue signaller
The Christmas leaks are just more of the same from the govt.
No consistency. No clear messages. Constant desire to talk up removing restrictions and reluctance to impose restrictions. Constant talk of how we need to compromise between economy and virus.
It's really simple.
Unless we suppress the virus, we will damage our economy more, restrict our freedom more and kill more people.
So far:
"Eat out to help Covid"
"Stop skiving, save Pret, catch Covid"
"Tiers of a clown"
Now coming to a family near you:
"Granny for Christmas, crematorium for New Year"
No consistency. No clear messages. Constant desire to talk up removing restrictions and reluctance to impose restrictions. Constant talk of how we need to compromise between economy and virus.
It's really simple.
Unless we suppress the virus, we will damage our economy more, restrict our freedom more and kill more people.
So far:
"Eat out to help Covid"
"Stop skiving, save Pret, catch Covid"
"Tiers of a clown"
Now coming to a family near you:
"Granny for Christmas, crematorium for New Year"
Joey Shabadoo
My pronouns are "He", "Him" and "buggerlugs"
Apparently the shops are mobbed today in Glasgow ahead of the shutdown tomorrow night - people getting their Xmas shopping in where they can. I had to go to B&Q this morning to get some repair sealant for my shed roof and it was very busy.
rockyroller
Guru
- Location
- 20 miles northwest of Boston, MA
Massachusetts is building another field hospital, this one, in one of it's convention centers. Just spoke to one of our sales reps on the phone who said he has a crazy bad cough that he can't get rid of & his breathing didn't sound right to me, very labored. I told him to call 911 or drive himself to a hospital & call his wife. For those of us living in a bubble of health, my family included, it can all be turned upside down, or worse, in a minute.
@PaulB interesting which vac brand are we talking about if you know?
Clearly not enough Vials to go round. Mixing it in a clinical environment is bad enough but that will render it even more useless in community settings. Can't do that in care homes or in peoples homes mixing up enough for the start of a DN's list is a none starter.
Even in your average GP surgery finding space to do the jabs, space for the 15 min post jab supervision both in line with social distancing.
Now add in a room for jab prep and storage just how big do they think the ave GP surgery is ?
Jab prep on top of PPE changes , pre jab checks and paper work together with reduced clinic capacity. They just wont be enough hours in the day to numbers though quick enough.
No extra pay you do surprise me
You're right about the fall out not counting the mass rush to get to the doc's once word get's out. It's plainly wrong the way this being reported both by the gov spin machine and mass media. It's not a magic bullet and they need to own up to it. Some real unrest will be building over this and the NHS will get both barrels.
Clearly not enough Vials to go round. Mixing it in a clinical environment is bad enough but that will render it even more useless in community settings. Can't do that in care homes or in peoples homes mixing up enough for the start of a DN's list is a none starter.
Even in your average GP surgery finding space to do the jabs, space for the 15 min post jab supervision both in line with social distancing.
Now add in a room for jab prep and storage just how big do they think the ave GP surgery is ?
Jab prep on top of PPE changes , pre jab checks and paper work together with reduced clinic capacity. They just wont be enough hours in the day to numbers though quick enough.
No extra pay you do surprise me
You're right about the fall out not counting the mass rush to get to the doc's once word get's out. It's plainly wrong the way this being reported both by the gov spin machine and mass media. It's not a magic bullet and they need to own up to it. Some real unrest will be building over this and the NHS will get both barrels.
Yes, I heard the same about the local supermarket - heaving. Idiots.
less at risk numbers is one way to help make the limited vaccine go round. The word is the house hold number will be big enough to meet up with them all. You won't have to pick which Granny you can get all the oldies in one go. Very kind of them. Funeral plans the next bog roll shortage ?
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
Yep: dither, delay and death seem to be Johnson's three key policies. Just what we don't need. Just what businesses don't need.
The Belgian "No Christmas Wave" leaking is coming from a country which started what UK would call a lockdown on 19 October and has peaked its second wave (hospitalisations peaked about 10 days ago, deaths peaked a week ago), whereas England locked down 2½ weeks later on 5 November and may have peaked its cases (absolute numbers have fallen but % of tests positive hasn't) but not hospitalisations or deaths.
I think Johnson is extremely foolish to be talking up a free-for-all at Christmas this far out. What kind of Christmas present would it be to give us loads of avoidable covid cases?
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
What the fark? Does the coming Glasgow lockdown mean even supermarkets and home repair shops will be shut or are people being amazingly stupid?
That I don't know. I'll ask her when she gets home and come back to you on that. There's five such centres in East Lancashire where she's based, apparently. The logistics to do all that have to be sorted - consent room, pre-injection room, injection room etc.
roubaixtuesday
self serving virtue signaller
Well, makes it easier to buy prezzies - urns for the oldies
