Carbon Frames Are they really needed.

[Baggy]

Across the world of fora I'm seeing more and more reports of titanium frames failing...

 

[Canrider]

Just a passing note: why are the people making strikingly light weight claims not mentioning make/model?

Honestly, 'my Canadian steel roadie'?

 

[Canrider]

Across the world of fora I'm seeing more and more reports of titanium frames failing...

That's interesting. My understanding was that Ti worked like steel: as long as you don't exceed certain stress levels, it'll never fail. Are they building them too lightly?

 

[MarcA]

Just purchased a Carbon (Focus Cayo so at the budget end). I previously rode a steel bike and the carbon is lighter and faster (+2mph average on a long ride). However the thing that surprised me was that, with thinner tyres and an extra 20psi, it was significantly more comfortable over poor surfaces. Can't really compare with Alu though.

 

[zigzag]

i've trasferred the same components to 531c steel, triple butted alu(+carbon forks) and carbon framesets. it's not easy to compare as the bikes have slightly different geometries, so handling is not the same. correct and comfortable fit is so much more important than a frame material. tyres, pumped to correct pressure, comfy saddle and handlebars are very important too. now back to the frame materials:

steel is a fine ride, but flexes too much when sprinting out of saddle or grinding uphill. it's also quite heavy and combined with flexiness is not a great climbing bike. if nicely finished it can be a work of art.

alu bike was my partner on my longest ride so far (1000miles in 5days) and i had no issues with the comfort whatsoever. the frame was stiff which was great on big hills and mountain passes. maybe a bit harsh on rough roads, but this didn't bother me too much as i had other things to worry about at the time.

carbon framset is the lightest (about 0.5kg lighter than alu) and has a very quick steering, but flexes a bit more than alu. ride quality is similar to and maybe better than steel, climbs well due to low weight and corners like it's on rails. i've yet to take it on a long ride, but so far it seems it could cope very well. it's only a pity that carbon frames don't look very nice (usually plain or no colours and no chrome ).

in my opinion - choose the bike that fits well, with the tyres that are not too hard and the ride will be good whatever frame material (as long as it's not the cheap and nasty stuff). if seconds or milliseconds matter go for the lightest/stiffest combination possible or the one that allows to upgrade in the future.

 

[Baggy]

Just a passing note: why are the people making strikingly light weight claims not mentioning make/model?

Honestly, 'my Canadian steel roadie'?

Sorry, I'd forgotten that everyone would want to rush off to Google so they could refute my claims. It's a Kona Haole, a small one. Now discontinued.

That's interesting. My understanding was that Ti worked like steel: as long as you don't exceed certain stress levels, it'll never fail. Are they building them too lightly?

From what I remember (it's all anecdata!) the majority have been welds failing, but definitely reports of some cracked tubes. I think vorsprung of this parish killed his after a few years of Audaxing.

 

[MacB]

Across the world of fora I'm seeing more and more reports of titanium frames failing...

yep and if you visit the right places you'll find people warning of alu, carbon and steel failures...not helped by certain 'establishments' that spout off coz they only do steel, though I now see that they offer carbon forks. I trawled for info very carefully when having a frame specced and came to the conclusion that there is no conclusion. Apart from the odd example you rarely get full detail, ie useage, rider info, weights, if it had previously been crashed, if they might have gone a bit mad with some allen wrenches, etc, etc. You don't need to look very far to find people that won't trust a carbon fork, a low spoke count wheel(I probably fall into that category), carbon bars, long seatposts and so on.

One of the joys and curses of the net, trying to weed out accurate info, from a source you can trust that has actually got proper real world data.

 

[John the Monkey]

Eh, MacB, we ALL have our luddite frontier, old chap

 

[MacB]

Eh, MacB, we ALL have our luddite frontier, old chap

I know, but having just shelled out for my second custom Ti frame, comments like that make me want to weep...still at least I can blame Baggy if either of my frames fails

 

[John the Monkey]

I know, but having just shelled out for my second custom Ti frame, comments like that make me want to weep...still at least I can blame Baggy if either of my frames fails

Heh I can remember some stuff about welds, and one problem with integrated headsets - both are from a while ago now though.

 

[theclaud]

I know, but having just shelled out for my second custom Ti frame, comments like that make me want to weep...still at least I can blame Baggy if either of my frames fails

You should be fine. I think they only fail when you ride them.

 

[Baggy]

I know, but having just shelled out for my second custom Ti frame, comments like that make me want to weep...still at least I can blame Baggy if either of my frames fails

Nooo, blame vorsprung! I suppose it surprises me as it seems to be more prevalent than I'd have thought.

More anecdata - there was much sucking of teeth, sardonic laughter and predictions if immediate catashtrophic failure when my brother bought an aluminium Peugeot in the 80's, but it survived over 20 years of being mauled about before it finally developed a hairline crack.

 

[MacB]

You should be fine. I think they only fail when you ride them.

Now, now, back on topic, this thread is about plastic bikes after all

 

[Canrider]

Sorry, I'd forgotten that everyone would want to rush off to Google so they could refute my claims. It's a Kona Haole, a small one. Now discontinued.

..or just to buy one for themselves? I singled you out but you're not the only one. I'd have thought if the bike was so good/light/whatever people would be happy to name it, is all.

From what I remember (it's all anecdata**!) the majority have been welds failing***, but definitely reports of some cracked tubes. I think vorsprung of this parish killed his after a few years of Audaxing.

**I'm stealing that one.
***That I could well believe just because Ti is said to be so tricky to weld right. Cracked tubes is a bit more scary.

 

[Baggy]

..or just to buy one for themselves? I singled you out but you're not the only one. I'd have thought if the bike was so good/light/whatever people would be happy to name it, is all.

Point taken, though my reply was being a bit tongue in cheek as I've had quite a few comments (in real life) about why on earth I bought a steel road bike. IMO it's a shame they've been discontinued (though still available at bargain prices in the less common sizes), but perhaps the fact they're steel put people off?

***That I could well believe just because Ti is said to be so tricky to weld right. Cracked tubes is a bit more scary.

Without wanting to upset MacB, vorsprung's cracked along the top tube, across the weld and then up the seat tube, but at the time it seems as if there might have been an issue with a batch/particular manufacturer.