glasgowcyclist
Charming but somewhat feckless
- Location
- Scotland
"Can I listen to headphones whilst riding / training"...
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So it shoukd be illegal for cyclists not have mirrors like cars?
As this is a discussion about hearing - only if they improve the cyclists hearing as much as they apparently do for cars.
The answer is the wonderful Florence Foster Jenkins.
Cruise around town with Florence booming out of the Sound System.............. Instant Street Cred
No. You asked why it's ok for cars to have music on, it's because of mirrors. I was then told cyclists have a neck. I have the same neck in my car. You can't compare cyclists and drivers yet refuse to acknowledge what cars have but cyclists don't.
You need a method of being drawn ti what's behind yiu. It may be mirrors it may be hearing. People who have neither are fools. If you are in a car you're breaking the law.
I think you are mistaking me for someone else..........
However:
]
No I didn't - Pointed out that the same decrease in ambient hearing occurs with headphones and closed car windows. Both are choosing to compromise their hearing, yet one is "a fool" and the other is a genius?
Which raises the question of how these mirrors improve ambient hearing. Mirrors cannot and do not replace or augment ambient hearing
... and that is?
One thing a car has and cyclists do not is a roof and side panels that decrease vision and create blind spots that cannot be seen even with a magical mirror?
Just the sort of place where hearing an approaching vehicle or cycle would be important?
Which again asks how mirrors improve or replace ambient hearing (and why being a person being deaf is "a fool")[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE 3281923, member: 45"]It's simple.
Listening to music when cycling affects your ability to hear anything else. That's physics, so there's no point arguing it.
It's up to the rider to decide whether he or she is happy with the level of impairment they are choosing to bring.
Deaf people have no choice.
Comparison with cars is irrelevant, as we're comparing listening to music when cycling with not listening to music when cycling.
Close the thread....[/QUOTE]
I always love it when these things become difficult and discussion simply stops
We are comparing road users who compromise their ambient hearing.
One is acceptable, one is not..... refusing to discuss this because it is inconvenient is nonsensical
Listening to music when cycling affects your ability to hear anything else. That's physics, so there's no point arguing it.
It's up to the rider to decide whether he or she is happy with the level of impairment they are choosing to bring.
Deaf people have no choice.
Comparison with cars is irrelevant, as we're comparing listening to music when cycling with not listening to music when cycling.
Close the thread....[/QUOTE]
I always love it when these things become difficult and discussion simply stops
We are comparing road users who compromise their ambient hearing.
One is acceptable, one is not..... refusing to discuss this because it is inconvenient is nonsensical
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
Comparison with cars is not irrelevant. They are also road users and seem to do ok with a similar sensory deprivation to t ha under discussion. Therefore, it is perfectly valid for us to debate whether or not the conditions encountered by motorists in these circumstances is also applicable to cyclists.
It really isn't difficult, and complicating matters by excluding a valid comparison is an intentional tactic created to divert from the facts.
It really isn't difficult, and complicating matters by excluding a valid comparison is an intentional tactic created to divert from the facts.
It doesn't. You need something to draw your attention to what's behind you. Are you suggesting that using nothing is acceptable?
As for deaf people, as I said above, there's a cyclists who rides with one arm and one leg. He's fudging awesome. I'd think a cyclist negotiating heavy traffic with one hand whilst the other is, say, sending a text is a fool.
jefmcg
Guru
[QUOTE 3281923, member: 45"]It's simple.
Listening to music when cycling affects your ability to hear anything else. That's physics, so there's no point arguing it.
[/QUOTE]
I listen to words in one ear.
I can hear cars, with or without an ear phone. I can't tell if they are about to pass me too close, with or without an ear phone. Sometimes I can hear bicycles with or without an ear phone. Sometimes I can't. Depends on wind, their bike, lots of factors. If they say something to me, I can always hear that either way. So I always take a look, no matter what I hear. I do not feel the voices in my ear affect my safety.
(Huge ear covering headphones that remove all ambient noise for the purpose of creating an immersive environment are not suitable for cycling of course, and no one hear is saying they are. For me they are as dangerous because they are immersive. )
Listening to music when cycling affects your ability to hear anything else. That's physics, so there's no point arguing it.
[/QUOTE]
I listen to words in one ear.
I can hear cars, with or without an ear phone. I can't tell if they are about to pass me too close, with or without an ear phone. Sometimes I can hear bicycles with or without an ear phone. Sometimes I can't. Depends on wind, their bike, lots of factors. If they say something to me, I can always hear that either way. So I always take a look, no matter what I hear. I do not feel the voices in my ear affect my safety.
(Huge ear covering headphones that remove all ambient noise for the purpose of creating an immersive environment are not suitable for cycling of course, and no one hear is saying they are. For me they are as dangerous because they are immersive. )
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
"Should I wear headphones when cycling or not?"
When supporting the 'yes' argument it is perfectly valid to draw comparison with those in a similar position.
It's not much of a debate if you try to artificially prevent one side from making reference to material that may support their stance. Indeed, such repression is unhealthy, and is why peoples right to free speech is enshrined in law under Article 10 of the ECHR.
If you don't feel able to participate in a debate without depriving those of a different viewpoint the same opportunity as yourself to defend their stance, then the onus is on you to leave the debate, not them to discard supporting evidence just to suit you.
And no, I'm not pro headphone - I'm just anti bullying.
When supporting the 'yes' argument it is perfectly valid to draw comparison with those in a similar position.
It's not much of a debate if you try to artificially prevent one side from making reference to material that may support their stance. Indeed, such repression is unhealthy, and is why peoples right to free speech is enshrined in law under Article 10 of the ECHR.
If you don't feel able to participate in a debate without depriving those of a different viewpoint the same opportunity as yourself to defend their stance, then the onus is on you to leave the debate, not them to discard supporting evidence just to suit you.
And no, I'm not pro headphone - I'm just anti bullying.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
Telling someone they can debate with you, but only if they conveniently discard evidence that may support their stance is bullying.
Unreasonably asserting your will upon another is overbearing, childish and bullying.
If you're so sure you're right then you will smite down their argument with unassailable logic of your own. Telling them you'll only discuss the matter when they've discarded the evidence you don't feel like discussing lowers the debate to the playground level.
Now, why don't you provide evidence to support that last paragraph, or should I suggest that it's irrelevant and you shouldn't bring that point to the discussion.
So, come on. Back it up with some EVIDENCE.
Unreasonably asserting your will upon another is overbearing, childish and bullying.
If you're so sure you're right then you will smite down their argument with unassailable logic of your own. Telling them you'll only discuss the matter when they've discarded the evidence you don't feel like discussing lowers the debate to the playground level.
Now, why don't you provide evidence to support that last paragraph, or should I suggest that it's irrelevant and you shouldn't bring that point to the discussion.
So, come on. Back it up with some EVIDENCE.
jefmcg
Guru
[QUOTE 3282017, member: 45"]
The OP wanted to compare riding with headphones or not riding with headphones. That's two scenarios. Not three. So the comparison is ear-naked or music.
[/QUOTE]
(forgetting about the car thing, which I agree is not relevant)
It's way more than two scenarios. There's no headphones, there's wearing some so you "failed to hear the passenger train’s horn as it thundered towards him, or the shouts of horrified bystanders who tried to stop the cyclist from moving on to the crossing". But there are lots of other ways to add some aural enjoyment to a ride that are between the two.
The OP wanted to compare riding with headphones or not riding with headphones. That's two scenarios. Not three. So the comparison is ear-naked or music.
[/QUOTE]
(forgetting about the car thing, which I agree is not relevant)
It's way more than two scenarios. There's no headphones, there's wearing some so you "failed to hear the passenger train’s horn as it thundered towards him, or the shouts of horrified bystanders who tried to stop the cyclist from moving on to the crossing". But there are lots of other ways to add some aural enjoyment to a ride that are between the two.
david k
Hi
- Location
- North West
i always listen to my ipod with mainly podcasts or audio books, i enjoy them and dont find it a distraction, i normally ride on trails or quiet roads
i have a mirror and look behind before any manuvre also do a life saver each time, im quite conscious of my surroundings, i dont feel it makes a big difference to my safety so continue with it
i find it more comfortable than wind noise, helps keep me relaxed and to enjoy the ride
i have a mirror and look behind before any manuvre also do a life saver each time, im quite conscious of my surroundings, i dont feel it makes a big difference to my safety so continue with it
i find it more comfortable than wind noise, helps keep me relaxed and to enjoy the ride
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Methinks that headphones are the least of this cyclist's issues.
Unless the headphone band is over his eyes then the problems here are visual rather than auditory
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