Can anyone identify this frame?

[Poacher]

What about the lugs ? Were they the same as mine ?

Not as decorative, much more basic. Sorry I don't have pics, but there are probably some on the net if you look for early 70s Falcon Olympic.
Cross posted - you're quick off the mark!

 

[oypolloy]

Yes, sometimes like a dog with a bone until I find the info

 

[Poacher]

OK, I can tell you're serious, so here's a couple of tasks to help narrow it down.
How much do the frame and fork weigh?
What diameter seat post / internal diameter of seat tube? Expect 27.0 mm or even better 27.2 mm for 531db or similar quality.
I think my Olympic was 26.8 mm, for 531 plain gauge: yours looks better!

 

[oypolloy]

I can't weigh it until tomorrow. I have just primed it this afternoon and it is hanging up to dry. I have one of those seat post sizing gauges and it is 26.6.

 

[oypolloy]

Something else. Normally there are small holes in the forks and stays, seems normal to have 4 in the forks and at least 1 in each of the stays. On this there are no holes in either of the stays and just one on each of the fork blades near the bridge. It has also had a head badge at some time. I have filled the holes with solder now. But they are tiny, maybe 1.5mm dia and are vertical drilled with approx 45mm between centres.

 

[oypolloy]

Just found a website hilarystone.com. Copied and pasted this ...
26.6mm SEATPOSTS
Commonly found on top quality French frames with metric dimensioned Reynolds 531 double butted tubing, some standard Reynolds 531 plain gauge frames too.

 

[Illaveago]

Are there any badge holes in the steerer tube ? If there are their position and orientation can help to narrow down the make .
The way in which the frame number is done may help identify it . Falcons tended to be numbers and letters .
If you run your finger round on the inside of the seat tube you can see if it has a weld seam or not to help identify the type of tubing .

 

[Rusty Nails]

Probably they were used by several manufacturers but I used to have a Sun bike that had the same lugs and crown.

 

[oypolloy]

Yes it has had a badge, I have soldered up the holes. The holes are oriented vertically approx 45 mm apart. The holes were tiny - maybe only 1.5 mm dia. The bottom bracket housing has been identified as French. I was given a link and found this... The seat tube is 26.6 which seems to be also French. I haven't ever had a bottom bracket in it but it looks to be normal 68mm.

"....I used them (RGF bottom brackets) on most of the frames I built in England through the 1970s, and bought them from Ron Kitching who imported them along with the Prugnat lugs. These BB shells were 'Bulge Formed' which is an interesting process and I will explain for the benefit of those who have not heard of this."
"A steel tube with the diameter and wall thickness of a bottom bracket shell is fed into a special machine. A mold clamps around the tube that has internal sockets that form the down tube, seat tube, and chain stay sockets. The ends of the tube are sealed and hydraulic oil is pumped inside. The pressure causes the steel to blow into the sockets like a bubble."
"The mold opens, the tube slides sideways to clear the mold and a saw cuts it off. The machine repeats whole process automatically. In a separate process the sealed ends of the sockets are machined off making the finished sockets for the tubes. Finally the BB shell is faced and threaded."
"I used these BB shells because they were the best available at that time. By the late 1970s investment cast bottom brackets, which are far superior, became available. I’m sure the bulge forming process is still being used for lower end bikes." Dave Moulton, frame builder (retired)​

​

Are there any badge holes in the steerer tube ? If there are their position and orientation can help to narrow down the make .
The way in which the frame number is done may help identify it . Falcons tended to be numbers and letters .
If you run your finger round on the inside of the seat tube you can see if it has a weld seam or not to help identify the type of tubing .

 

[oypolloy]

Something else. Normally there are small holes in the forks and stays, seems normal to have 4 in the forks and at least 1 in each of the stays. On this there are no holes in either of the stays and just one on each of the fork blades near the bridge. It has also had a head badge at some time. I have filled the holes with solder now. But they are tiny, maybe 1.5mm dia and are vertical drilled with approx 45mm between centres.

Not bridge - crown

 

[oypolloy]

Yes it has had a badge, I have soldered up the holes. The holes are oriented vertically approx 45 mm apart. The holes were tiny - maybe only 1.5 mm dia. The bottom bracket housing has been identified as French

Probably they were used by several manufacturers but I used to have a Sun bike that had the same lugs and crown.

I will look at eBay and see if I can recognise anything

 

[Illaveago]

Yes it has had a badge, I have soldered up the holes. The holes are oriented vertically approx 45 mm apart. The holes were tiny - maybe only 1.5 mm dia. The bottom bracket housing has been identified as French

I will look at eBay and see if I can recognise anything

That is a good starting point! It helped me to identify an unknown frame that I had . I can easily rule out yours as not being a Flying Scot.
Knowing the orientation and spacing of the holes can rule out a lot of cycle makers. Finding the correct one is the fun bit !

 

[Illaveago]

Just had a quick look at my bikes . You can rule out mid 60's Dawes as the hole spacing is not big enough although they underwent several changes over the years . Likewise for Falcon . Carlton and BSA the holes are horizontal . Not sure of the spacing of Holdsworth or Claud Butler but I think they are vertical .

 

[Illaveago]

I was wondering if it could be an early Freddie Grubb but it seems like the frame numbers only went up to 5 digits.
Using French lugs doesn't necessarily mean that it is French . A lot of British bikes used Nervex lugs which are French .

 

[oypolloy]

I have had a look for a weld inside the bb housing and there isn't one. However there is a metal lining tube inside it. It has closed off the down & seat tube to stop debris, there is a gap so that the rear stays can breathe.