Another cyclist down

[Globalti]

Fine as long as you're alive!

 

[classic33]

It shouldn't be a problem. It should be a quick adjustment to a reasonably forseeable change in conditions: the sun rises and sets every day!


I am not comfortable with advice that seems like blaming cyclists for riding on roads at certain times.

It was gone 11:00 when the incident happened.

You saying that the time of day a cyclist was killed is a cheap way of blaming of blaming a person who cannot answer back. And at present we don't have the full story yet.

 

[mjr]

It was gone 11:00 when the incident happened.

Not the incident I was posting about but I apologise for continuing the thread drift.

 

[classic33]

Not the incident I was posting about but I apologise for continuing the thread drift.

Put another way, neither sunrise nor sunset played a direct part in the incident. Sunrise being nearly four hours earlier.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

And this one too :https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-49809119

"A cyclist on an "unusual three-wheeler bike" has died in a crash with a lorry.
The collision, on the westbound carriageway of the A303 near Solstice Park Services, happened just after midday on Monday.
Wiltshire Police said the 71-year-old man died at the scene and the road was closed for five hours"


I don't think there's anything inherently unusual about a 3-wheeler, even if it's something like a recumbent.

It was an upright trike and he rode it on that road regularly. When they say unusual they mean not common in my view.

 

[part-timer]

Thanks for the information, seems strange they are keeping it quiet, please update the thread when you can.

As both a part-time cyclist on Mull and a driver I have sympathies with both. Some things cyclists do here I've seen make your hair stand on end. We have only 20 miles of double track here, and only 3 places on that double track where it's safe to overtake another car. So you can imagine the frustration when you're heading for the ferry and 2 or more cyclists hear you coming and suddenly swing out in front of you, to force you to overtake wide. The only trouble is, as a local, you know you've got another 5 miles to go before you can overtake safely, so have to lose maybe 15 minutes. I've actually been taking a sick child to the hospital and slowed down by this. So that's the first thing to realise. When I'm cycling here I pull over if I'm not at a safe overtaking place, but so often visitors (sadly usually central belt Scots - the English tend to be a bit more humble) won't do this. Secondly, it's not unusual here to have a cyclist toiling uphill in front of you at 2 or 3 miles an hour on a single track who refuses to pull over at the next passing place to allow overtaking (which is actually illegal). The third and most terrifying thing is the cyclist who is inexperienced and suddenly loses balance and lurches out in front of you (often without a helmet). I'm a cyclist too, we like to see cyclists, but it would be good to see a bit more humility and an understanding that - even if you're a Scot - there might be lots of local knowledge about roads that you don't know. I noticed that someone talked about a driver heading right at them. It's normal practice for local drivers to maintain their usual speed here on single tracks when approaching one another, and time their passing to coincide with a passing place. To the newbie it looks like there's going to be a head-on collision. You get the hang of that after a couple of years. I can see why cyclists find that scary, but local driving here is actually actually exceptionally good and courteous most of the time. Cyclists do also need to realise that this is a working island and those here for leisure should have the courtesy to give way for that.

 

[lazybloke]

And this one too :https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-49809119

"A cyclist on an "unusual three-wheeler bike" has died in a crash with a lorry.
The collision, on the westbound carriageway of the A303 near Solstice Park Services, happened just after midday on Monday.
Wiltshire Police said the 71-year-old man died at the scene and the road was closed for five hours"


I don't think there's anything inherently unusual about a 3-wheeler, even if it's something like a recumbent.

You or I don't, but Joe D. Mail will think it's the work of Satan and Richard Nixon.

Which is why the police deserve criticism for saying that in https://www.wiltshire.police.uk/article/5002/Witness-appeal-after-cyclist-dies-in-A303-collision

RIP all.

I'm with @YukonBoy on this. When I see a bike on the roads it usually has two wheels, so it seems fair to describe a 3-wheeler as unusual, especially in a police appeal for witnesses. Why would you omit an unusual characteristic, if trying to jog memories?


Of course I'm aware of anti-cycling bias in the media (and have complained about it previously on CC), but I just don't see it here, and I wonder exactly what concerns are being raised in the above quotes.


Let me finish by condemning the terrible and avoidable events in Mull as well as on the A303, and the continuing level of carnage on all our roads in general.
So many drivers, including but not limited to the the group of so-called "professional" lorry-drivers, drive their lethal weapons with a sometimes casual & careless indifference to other road users, perhaps given that opportunity because the police have been deprived of funding to adequately patrol the roads. And when this appalling standard of driving results in death, it's particularly galling to hear jurors excusing it.
Those are issues that demand urgent attention.

 

[oldwheels]

Part-timer makes a few good points but I would argue about the helmet remark. I never wear one.
Regarding the fatality one should never jump to conclusions. The latest information I have from a reasonably reliable source is that the woman suffered a massive heart attack before the collision and in a rare case she is said to have collided with the trailer rather than the other way round and was dead before the collision. There are still a few strange aspects in that the road was closed for several hours and recovery vehicles and coastguard teams were seen heading out so not that simple but perhaps just normal practice.
More may emerge in time.

 

[Drago]

As both a part-time cyclist on Mull and a driver I have sympathies with both. Some things cyclists do here I've seen make your hair stand on end. We have only 20 miles of double track here, and only 3 places on that double track where it's safe to overtake another car. So you can imagine the frustration when you're heading for the ferry and 2 or more cyclists hear you coming and suddenly swing out in front of you, to force you to overtake wide. The only trouble is, as a local, you know you've got another 5 miles to go before you can overtake safely, so have to lose maybe 15 minutes. I've actually been taking a sick child to the hospital and slowed down by this. So that's the first thing to realise. When I'm cycling here I pull over if I'm not at a safe overtaking place, but so often visitors (sadly usually central belt Scots - the English tend to be a bit more humble) won't do this. Secondly, it's not unusual here to have a cyclist toiling uphill in front of you at 2 or 3 miles an hour on a single track who refuses to pull over at the next passing place to allow overtaking (which is actually illegal). The third and most terrifying thing is the cyclist who is inexperienced and suddenly loses balance and lurches out in front of you (often without a helmet). I'm a cyclist too, we like to see cyclists, but it would be good to see a bit more humility and an understanding that - even if you're a Scot - there might be lots of local knowledge about roads that you don't know. I noticed that someone talked about a driver heading right at them. It's normal practice for local drivers to maintain their usual speed here on single tracks when approaching one another, and time their passing to coincide with a passing place. To the newbie it looks like there's going to be a head-on collision. You get the hang of that after a couple of years. I can see why cyclists find that scary, but local driving here is actually actually exceptionally good and courteous most of the time. Cyclists do also need to realise that this is a working island and those here for leisure should have the courtesy to give way for that.

I just don't know where to begin with that little lot!

 

[glasgowcyclist]

I just don't know where to begin with that little lot!

It’s the final sentence that is a give away for the writer's sense of entitlement.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

And this one too :https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-49809119

This is taken from a Motorcycling forum, but copied from a Lorry/HGV forum, don't know which one,

Fatal 23/09/19

On Monday I was heading back up the A303 from Oxford back to my depot in Henstridge after tipping my steel load. One or two hills before Solstice Services the small black car in front of me put on its right indicator and changed lanes. Despite questioning why on earth he was moving out of the empty inside lane to the outside lane I followed suit. I squinted my eyes, it was noon and the light was good. Was that a bike? Omg there was a 3 wheeled bike cycling on the 70mph dualed A303 - I could barely see him! From the view in my cab looking down on the bike who was travelling uphill, the backdrop was tarmac. Trust me that bike was nearly invisible to me. Non lorry drivers think that because of our elevated view we have a better view of everything but this is not always the case. The view of the bike from a car was probably much better. They would have been at a very similar height so a car drivers view would probably have silhouetted the cyclist against the skyline making him much more visible. I remember passing the bike with the cyclist standing up in his pedals trying to get up the hill thinking that was an accident waiting to happen!

5 minutes later that cyclist was dead.

A truck hit him just after that junction before the top of the last hill before Solstice. It was literally a couple of minutes after I passed him. Now obviously it’s terribly sad and condolences to the family and friends but WHY??!! What sort of person cycles up what is effectively a motorway without a hard shoulder? He can’t have been doing more than 10-15mph uphill.

I feel desperately sorry for the truck driver as that could have been any one of us. The police appealed for anyone who saw either vehicle shortly before the incident to ring 101. I did what I thought was right and rang up describing the view I had from my cab. They are taking a statement from me next week.

Why oh why are bicycles allowed on dual carriageways like the A303??

 

[Drago]

It's not "effectively a motorway", and shouldn't be treated as one. That lorry driver is so far up his own rear he probably lives on Mull.

 

[JPBoothy]

It shouldn't be a problem. It should be a quick adjustment to a reasonably forseeable change in conditions: the sun rises and sets every day!


I am not comfortable with advice that seems like blaming cyclists for riding on roads at certain times.

Ha Ha, yes it does come out 'most' days.. There was no blame being implied by my comment, it was just my own opinion. We are all free to make our own choices, and mine is to anticipate the unexpected and arrive at my destination safely. If that means giving up my 'right' to mix it with heavy traffic at the busier times of the day and/or when the conditions aren't the best then so be it. I don't have to wear a helmet but I choose to, I don't have to ride in single file but I choose to, I don't have to use lights and a bell so often but I choose to. Each to their own

 

[fossyant]

Cyclists do also need to realise that this is a working island and those here for leisure should have the courtesy to give way for that.

Troll alert !

Joker. Everywhere is a 'working place'.

We've all got rights, and it's not always needed to pull over - it's quite hard to stop on a hill and get going.

Your attitude is exactly why I've stopped riding on roads, as a 'similar' person broke my bloody spine because they couldn't be bothered 'waiting' - oh it's a bike, I'll pull across him.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

It's not "effectively a motorway", and shouldn't be treated as one. That lorry driver is so far up his own rear he probably lives on Mull.

Agreed and that is part of the issue. Lordy drivers treating it as a motorway and not looking out and taking care around more vulnerable road users.