A57 Snake Pass Closure February and March 2022

[Tail End Charlie]

I can understand why the council have closed more than the landslip stretch. The last thing workers need is for people turning up "can't I just squeeze by?" I'm not particularly interested in whether they have the legal right to, as others have said, there are plenty of other roads to ride.

Reminds me of the time the Manchester bomb went off. Several conversations along the line of
"sorry we're evacuating the area, you can't go down there",
"but I'm only nipping to Boots, I'll be five minutes",
"I'm sorry there's a possibility a bomb is nearby"
"but I need XXX for later"

Anyone who goes on the "mass trespass" is being ridiculous.

 

[Deleted member 23692]

Nobody can just decide to close a road unless they apply for an emergency TRRO as was the case with the landslip section. Otherwise it is subject to a normal consultation process

What about planned works? ie closure by legal order, as opposed to closure by notice aka an emergency TTRO? You do not need to consult with anyone to close a highway, you just need to satisfy the regulations.

Anyhoo, the road will become a construction site whilst the works are underway and they are governed by other legislation primarily CDM regs 2015.

Highways are great fun. On one hand you have the public moaning about the state of the surface, and when you undertake the works they moan that they can't get through. Get a grip on reality of things folk, there are far worse thing than being denied a bloody bike ride.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I can understand why the council have closed more than the landslip stretch. .

They haven’t , just over zealous workers miles from the actual closed section.

 

[nickyboy]

But it is hardly dangerous when open to traffic, other than during the rush hour periods when the mad dash brigade are out in force!

I agree. Outside rush hours it's fine. I wouldn't go near it during rush hours however

 

[nickyboy]

What about planned works? ie closure by legal order, as opposed to closure by notice aka an emergency TTRO? You do not need to consult with anyone to close a highway, you just need to satisfy the regulations.

Anyhoo, the road will become a construction site whilst the works are underway and they are governed by other legislation primarily CDM regs 2015.

Highways are great fun. On one hand you have the public moaning about the state of the surface, and when you undertake the works they moan that they can't get through. Get a grip on reality of things folk, there are far worse thing than being denied a bloody bike ride.

Two sorts of TTROs...emergency (to cover stuff like the landslip) and consultative (to cover planned closures). If the total closure of a road is required and it isn't an emergency, there is a consultative process to be followed prior to the approval of the TTRO.

So all those planned total closures you see have been subject to a consultative TTRO.

Anyway, the Snake Pass is safer for cyclists now compared to when it is open as normal. So cycling on it should be encouraged but all cyclists must use the footpath/bridleway diversion to avoid the landslip section

 

[presta]

A guy on twitter recently posted a video showing that the road's all clear, and there's no reason for it to be closed. This photo appears to explain why the video has a jump in it where it's been edited:

I hope they're not planning to just write the road off, like the A625 at Mam Tor.

 

[Deleted member 23692]

If the total closure of a road is required and it isn't an emergency, there is a consultative process to be followed prior to the approval of the TTRO.

The Road Traffic (Temporary Restrictions) Procedure Regulations 1992​

Procedure for making a temporary order​

3.—(1) Subject to the following provisions of this Part, this regulation makes provision for the procedure to be followed in connection with the making of an order under section 14 of the 1984 Act.

(2) Not less than 7 days before making an order, the traffic authority shall publish notice of their intention to make the order in one or more newspapers circulating in the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated.

(3) The notice mentioned in paragraph (2) above shall state—

(a)the reason or purpose mentioned in section 14(1) of the 1984 Act for the making of the order;

(b)the effect of the order and, where applicable, the alternative route or routes available for traffic; and

(c)the date on which the order would come into force and its maximum duration.

(4) The traffic authority shall, on or before the day on which the order is made, give notice of the order—

(a)to the chief officer of police of any police area in which any road to which the order relates is situated;

(b)where the traffic authority is not the fire authority for the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated, to the chief officer of the fire authority for that area;

(c)where the order would be likely to have direct effect on traffic or any class of traffic on any road for the maintenance of which another traffic authority is responsible, to that other traffic authority; and

(d)where the order is likely to have a direct effect on traffic or any class of traffic on—

(i)a road which is subject to a concession, or

(ii)a road in respect of which an assignation has been granted under section 28(1) of the 1991 Act,

• to the concessionaire.

(5) Within 14 days after making the order the traffic authority shall publish a notice of the making of the order in one or more newspapers circulating in the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated.

(6) The notice mentioned in paragraph (5) above shall state—

(a)the reason or purpose mentioned in section 14(1) of the 1984 Act for the making of the order;

(b)the effect of the order and, where applicable, the alternative route or routes available for traffic; and

(c)the date on which the order will come into force and its maximum duration.

(7) If and to the extent that it appears to the traffic authority that it would be desirable in the interests of giving adequate publicity to the order, the authority shall comply with the requirements of Part I of the Schedule to these Regulations in relation to each length of road to which the order relates.

There is a requirement to notify but not to consult

(8) When the order has been made, the traffic authority shall comply with the requirements of Part III of the Schedule to these Regulations (traffic signs).

 

[nickyboy]

The Road Traffic (Temporary Restrictions) Procedure Regulations 1992​

Procedure for making a temporary order​

3.—(1) Subject to the following provisions of this Part, this regulation makes provision for the procedure to be followed in connection with the making of an order under section 14 of the 1984 Act.

(2) Not less than 7 days before making an order, the traffic authority shall publish notice of their intention to make the order in one or more newspapers circulating in the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated.

(3) The notice mentioned in paragraph (2) above shall state—

(a)the reason or purpose mentioned in section 14(1) of the 1984 Act for the making of the order;

(b)the effect of the order and, where applicable, the alternative route or routes available for traffic; and

(c)the date on which the order would come into force and its maximum duration.

(4) The traffic authority shall, on or before the day on which the order is made, give notice of the order—

(a)to the chief officer of police of any police area in which any road to which the order relates is situated;

(b)where the traffic authority is not the fire authority for the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated, to the chief officer of the fire authority for that area;

(c)where the order would be likely to have direct effect on traffic or any class of traffic on any road for the maintenance of which another traffic authority is responsible, to that other traffic authority; and

(d)where the order is likely to have a direct effect on traffic or any class of traffic on—

(i)a road which is subject to a concession, or

(ii)a road in respect of which an assignation has been granted under section 28(1) of the 1991 Act,

• to the concessionaire.

(5) Within 14 days after making the order the traffic authority shall publish a notice of the making of the order in one or more newspapers circulating in the area in which any road to which the order relates is situated.

(6) The notice mentioned in paragraph (5) above shall state—

(a)the reason or purpose mentioned in section 14(1) of the 1984 Act for the making of the order;

(b)the effect of the order and, where applicable, the alternative route or routes available for traffic; and

(c)the date on which the order will come into force and its maximum duration.

(7) If and to the extent that it appears to the traffic authority that it would be desirable in the interests of giving adequate publicity to the order, the authority shall comply with the requirements of Part I of the Schedule to these Regulations in relation to each length of road to which the order relates.

There is a requirement to notify but not to consult

(8) When the order has been made, the traffic authority shall comply with the requirements of Part III of the Schedule to these Regulations (traffic signs).

And in the case of the Snake Pass, none of the above has happened. The local council has made a unilateral decision instead. If you're cool with local councils making unilateral decisions instead of following the regs, that's great. But I'm not

 

[Ming the Merciless]

A guy on twitter recently posted a video showing that the road's all clear, and there's no reason for it to be closed. This photo appears to explain why the video has a jump in it where it's been edited:
View attachment 635005
I hope they're not planning to just write the road off, like the A625 at Mam Tor.

Closing the pass to motorised traffic, but keeping it open for walking, cycling etc wouldn’t be such a bad thing. Become a real asset. Cargo bike pop up cafes at the top…

 

[Deleted member 23692]

And in the case of the Snake Pass, none of the above has happened. The local council has made a unilateral decision instead. If you're cool with local councils making unilateral decisions instead of following the regs, that's great. But I'm not

I'm not interested in how, why or what they are doing. That's for folk who are directly affected... or believe they are affected. I was merely pointing out that public consultation is not a requirement for a TTRO.

 

[Deleted member 23692]

A guy on twitter recently posted a video showing that the road's all clear, and there's no reason for it to be closed. This photo appears to explain why the video has a jump in it where it's been edited:
View attachment 635005
I hope they're not planning to just write the road off, like the A625 at Mam Tor.

And what about when construction traffic is there? Still safe?

 

[Deleted member 23692]

And in the case of the Snake Pass, none of the above has happened. The local council has made a unilateral decision instead. If you're cool with local councils making unilateral decisions instead of following the regs, that's great. But I'm not

Sorry for quoting you again, but for all those reading I've found the notice on the DDC website and it's an emergency TTRO, covering the period 22 Feb to 22 March. It closure by notice, and as such there is no need to advertise the closure in advance, as any delay in getting the highway closed would negate the term 'emergency' which implies its needed no, (usually for safety reasons).

Unless the use of an emergency TTRO is questionable, I can't see how they've not followed regulations

On the assumption they can't complete the works by 22 March I'd expect the TTRO to be extended

 

[nickyboy]

Sorry for quoting you again, but for all those reading I've found the notice on the DDC website and it's an emergency TTRO, covering the period 22 Feb to 22 March. It closure by notice, and as such there is no need to advertise the closure in advance, as any delay in getting the highway closed would negate the term 'emergency' which implies its needed no, (usually for safety reasons).

Unless the use of an emergency TTRO is questionable, I can't see how they've not followed regulations

On the assumption they can't complete the works by 22 March I'd expect the TTRO to be extended

TTRO only covers the landslip section which is about 200m. DCC has closed the entire length (about 11 miles)

 

[Boopop]

Full Statement from CyclingUK. You'll all have to forgive me if I take their word over the likes of @Tail End Charlie . They're experts and their work is paid for by cyclists, and they have our best interests at heart.

Also, I consider comparing what these people are doing to avoiding a police corden following a terrorist attack both hyperbole to the extreme, and shockingly bad taste.

 

[classic33]

Full Statement from CyclingUK. You'll all have to forgive me if I take their word over the likes of @Tail End Charlie . They're experts and their work is paid for by cyclists, and they have our best interests at heart.

View attachment 635021

View attachment 635023
View attachment 635024

Also, I consider comparing what these people are doing to avoiding a police corden following a terrorist attack both hyperbole to the extreme, and shockingly bad taste.

The landslip is one set of works on that road, there are more.