planning a Brevet - Advice needed

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Polecat

Guest
To be fair, the same is true of most audaxes. I've been known to go off-piste when the route goes through areas that I know well, and I have a preferred route. I did discuss this with one organiser once, as I took my regular route to the next control and the published course deviated off on longer, smaller, much hillier roads. It felt a bit like cheating but I did it anyway and the organiser had no problem when I mentioned it.

I ride in the US (randonneuring) where staying on the route for brevets is mandatory. I have been disqualified for riding a route parallel to the official route even though the miles I rode were slightly longer . Maybe AudaxUK is different?
 

Ajax Bay

Guru
Location
East Devon
I ride in the US (randonneuring) where staying on the route for brevets is mandatory. I have been disqualified for riding a route parallel to the official route even though the miles I rode were slightly longer . Maybe AudaxUK is different?
Please share an example of a permanent (ie not calendar) you've ridden, or one you might ride next year. How did the organiser know you had ridden the route you did?
 

Dogtrousers

Kilometre nibbler
I ride in the US (randonneuring) where staying on the route for brevets is mandatory. I have been disqualified for riding a route parallel to the official route even though the miles I rode were slightly longer . Maybe AudaxUK is different?

I guess so. I think some audaxes in the UK require you to stick to the route but I've never done one like that.
 

Polecat

Guest
Please share an example of a permanent (ie not calendar) you've ridden, or one you might ride next year. How did the organiser know you had ridden the route you did?

Well you asked for it:

Randonneurs USA​

Rules for Permanent Riders
Article 1
Only Randonneurs USA has sanctioning authority for RUSA Permanents.
Article 2
RUSA Permanents may be ridden only by current RUSA members, and the rider must be a current member of the RUSA Permanents Program. Any form of human-powered vehicle is acceptable. The only stipulation is that the vehicle must be propelled solely by the rider.
Article 3
To participate in a permanent, the rider selects a permanent route from the RUSA Permanents library, and then registers on the RUSA website to ride it, specifying the starting date of the ride.
Ride Direction and Starting Checkpoint Options - Permanent routes may be ridden in reverse direction. The rider must determine that the reverse route is safe and legal, and revise the route if necessary to make it so (for example, to avoid riding the wrong way on a one-way street). For a permanent route that starts and finishes at the same location, the rider may (1) start and finish the permanent at an intermediate checkpoint or (2) start at any location, proceed to a checkpoint, traverse the other checkpoints in their order on the route, and return to the original starting location. In the case of #2, the rider must document the start and finish location in a manner described in Article 8, providing timed proof of passage for both starting and finishing.
Article 4
When taking part in a Permanent ride, riders accept and consent to the possible publication of their names, time results, and photographs.
Article 5
During the Permanent ride, each rider is considered to be on a personal ride. The rider must ride in accordance with all applicable traffic codes, obey all traffic signals, and use bike paths when required by law. When riding, all riders must wear an approved helmet. RUSA does not accept any liability for anything that might occur associated with the Permanent ride or during the course of the ride, including collisions and other mishaps, and the rider must sign a waiver without which it is not a RUSA credited ride.
Article 6
Each rider must be self sufficient. No personal follow cars or support of any kind are permitted on the course. Personal support is only allowed at checkpoints. Any violation of this requirement may result in disqualification.
All riders are required to conduct themselves in a civil manner and abide by all applicable vehicle codes, laws, and regulations. All riders are required to respect local customs with regards to decorum.
Article 7
The RUSA Permanent Routes Library provides a RideWithGPS online route for the Permanent, which the rider can use to navigate, either by downloading it to a device, or by printing off the cue sheet it provides. If the rider wishes to reverse the route or start from an intermediate control, the rider may make a copy of this route, or export the cue sheet to a format which the rider can revise.
If the rider needs or desires a brevet card - for example, for clerk-supplied proof of passage at an establishment, or to annotate the card at checkpoints - the rider can construct a brevet card based on the templates provided in the Permanents Resources page of the website.
Between checkpoints, the rider can follow the official route, or ride alternative routes, so long as they are legal and safe. The distance credited, however, is the distance of the official route. The “official route” is the one which was submitted for the approved Permanent, and is the route accessible from the RUSA Routes Library.
The rider must transit every checkpoint, unless a detour prevents legally and safely transiting one. In that case, the rider should obtain proof of passage at an alternate site to serve as the missing checkpoint.
The rider must ride at least the distance of the official route. If the rider’s route ends up being shorter than the official route, the rider must make up the distance at some point during the ride (e.g., at the finish).
Article 8
The rider must establish proof of passage at each checkpoint, including start and finish. This proof of passage can be (a) a receipt from an establishment or clerk’s annotation of time of passage on a brevet card, (b) receipt from an automated device showing the time of passage (such as an ATM), (c) timestamped photo identifying the checkpoint location, or (d) a GPS track passing through the control location. Which type(s) of proof of passage to use is at the discretion of the rider.
If the rider does not have photo capabilities or GPS and is using a brevet card, then if the control has an open establishment or usable automated device, the rider must obtain proof of passage from the clerk, ATM, etc. If there are multiple riders riding together on the route, they may sign each other's card. Start and finish controls are timed, to establish the duration of the ride. Intermediate controls' times of passage establish that the controls were navigated in the correct order. However, there are no time limits for intermediate controls.
All controls are Open, meaning that any establishment or automated device at the checkpoint venue can be used, or any photographic subject so long as it identifies the checkpoint locale.
Missing checkpoint verification, finishing beyond the cutoff time, incomplete or corrupted data, or - if a brevet card has been provided - loss of the brevet card (regardless of how far into the ride a rider is) are grounds for disqualification. Each rider is responsible for seeing that proper verification has been secured at each checkpoint.
Article 9

The overall time limit varies for each permanent according to its exact distance (rounded down to the nearest km). The official distance is the distance of the “standard” route as approved, not the distance the rider actually rode.
The master schedule used to calculate time limits and control opening and closing times is detailed in the Rules for Permanent Route Contributors document, in the paragraph headed "Calculation of Opening and Closing Times."
Article 10
While riding between sunset and sunrise and during other low-light conditions (rain, fog, etc.), a set of working front and rear lights must be firmly mounted on the vehicle and turned on. At least one of the rear lights must be in a steady (rather than flashing) mode. The lights must meet the requirements of local laws. Backup lighting systems and/or spare bulbs are strongly recommended in case the primary system fails and cannot be repaired on the roadside.
Between sunset and sunrise and during other low-light conditions, all riders must wear a reflective vest or some other device that clearly places significant reflective material on the front and back of the rider. During these times all riders will also wear a reflective ankle band around each ankle. (Due to their seating position, recumbent riders may modify their reflective torso devices to show better from front and rear.) Other reflective devices on clothing, shoes, helmets, and machines are encouraged for increased safety - but they are extra and may not take the place of the minimum items listed above. Riders must review the RUSA Reflectivity Guide and are strongly encouraged to meet the recommended minimum standards for torso reflectivity described in that document.
Article 11
Within 7 days after the ride, the rider must submit the ride result via the RUSA website, either the elapsed time to finish, or report of not starting, not finishing, or not finishing within the time limit.
The rider should retain materials validating the ride - digital files, posted ride tracks, receipts, etc. - for 12 months in case RUSA audits the result.
Article 12
These rides are not competitive events
, so no rider classifications are made.
Article 13
No medals are available for riding a Permanent. However, Permanents count as credit towards a number of RUSA awards.
Article 14
A permanent ride cannot be counted as participation in, or as credit for, another ride.
Article 15
Any fraud, cheating, or deliberate violation of these rules may result in the exclusion of the rider from RUSA-sponsored rides and events.
Article 16
If a penalty, disqualification, or other action is taken against or affecting a rider (an "appealable action"), then the rider may appeal in writing (including the option of an e-mail) within 72 hours from being notified of the action. The appeal will be to the Permanents Committee. If the Permanents Committee denies the appeal, or if the rider does not receive a response from the Permanents Committee within 10 calendar days after submitting the appeal, the rider may appeal to the Board of Directors of Randonneurs USA for a final decision. Upon receipt of the appeal, the Board of Directors will promptly contact the rider and the Permanents Committee and, if it deems necessary, will ask for any additional information. The Board of Directors will then render a decision in a timely fashion. A rider may submit any other question or complaint (other than an appealable action) directly to the Board of Directors.
Article 17
Randonneurs USA
will be the final arbiter of any questions that arise which may not be covered explicitly in these rules.

REVISED 5-JUL-2020​

 

ColinJ

Puzzle game procrastinator!
Article 7
...
Between checkpoints, the rider can follow the official route, or ride alternative routes, so long as they are legal and safe. The distance credited, however, is the distance of the official route. The “official route” is the one which was submitted for the approved Permanent, and is the route accessible from the RUSA Routes Library.
The rider must transit every checkpoint, unless a detour prevents legally and safely transiting one. In that case, the rider should obtain proof of passage at an alternate site to serve as the missing checkpoint.
The rider must ride at least the distance of the official route. If the rider’s route ends up being shorter than the official route, the rider must make up the distance at some point during the ride (e.g., at the finish).
That sounds like the UK rules which DO allow variations between checkpoints!
 
OP
OP
steveindenmark

steveindenmark

Legendary Member
No, the route doesn't have to be metalled, but consider what sort of riders/bikes might accept the challenge (and who might be put off). The length really doesn't matter unless it's just less than a hundred km or multiple thereof.
For example I have a route ready to roll out: a diagonal of Wales, and back. It's 608km as recommended, but a rider could, choosing poorer but more direct roads, get it down to just over 600. My controls are carefully chosen to take that into account.
My firm recommendation is that you do a DIY on the route and see how that goes: whomever you choose to buy your DIY brevets from will be a source of knowledge. This is 'walk before you run' advice: not the physical aspect but the albeit simple admin (entry/control list) stuff.
https://www.audax.uk/choose-a-ride/do-it-yourself-diy-events/

Yes. I would certainly go and ride it first before submitting it. I have learnt so many times that what it appears like on a map, does not always correspond with what its like on the ground.

When I plan my own routes, I always try to pass churches as in Denmark, they always have toilets and water. I try not to skirt villages and pass by the village shop. I live in a very rural part of Denmark and refuelling stops are few and far between.
 

Ajax Bay

Guru
Location
East Devon
Well you asked for it:
Well actually I asked: "Please share an example of a permanent (ie not calendar) you've ridden, or one you might ride next year. How did the organiser know you had ridden the route you did?" And I got 'de rulz' (RUSA). Carry on.
The thread topic (if not title) concerns planning a permanent ("I would also like to submit some Permanents for my area"), not a calendar event (I appreciate the word 'brevet' has multiple meanings and its use varies in different countries).
For Steve ("I have never ridden an Audax"): I'm suggesting you ride someone else's ride first (and second) so you can empathise with the riders who might choose to ride yours, and hopefully experience good practice. Of course you'd ride yours before submitting it.
 
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