vintage Campag chorus 8 speed cassette on new wheels?

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delnemnis

New Member
Location
Wickford
I would like views on the following challenge?

I own a Condor chorus 8 speed bike of 1997 vintage. The components are all working fine however I am riding tubs not clinchers....it means I feel less confident cycling distances....

Should I re rim the hubs ( quotes £150+) or buy new wheels, say chorus 10 speed and then stick the old 8 speed cassette on which would allow me to keep the drivetrain, or should I just carry tub spares in my pocket?

I know that shimano free hubs are backward compatible but I am not sure how easy campagnolo is?

So the question is will a 1997 chorus cassette fit on a 2012 chorus freehub?

Regards

Andy
 

RecordAceFromNew

Swinging Member
Location
West London
So the question is will a 1997 chorus cassette fit on a 2012 chorus freehub?


The answer is no because the splines are different. Highpath describes it here and I believe they sell special spacers to use on modern Campag cassettes to deliver the same spacing.
 
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delnemnis

delnemnis

New Member
Location
Wickford
The answer is no because the splines are different. Highpath describes it here and I believe they sell special spacers to use on modern Campag cassettes to deliver the same spacing.

Thank you for this, it is always good to know that someone, somewhere has a link or kowledge of the answer.
 
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delnemnis

delnemnis

New Member
Location
Wickford
£150 for 2 rims & new spokes :eek: I'd expect to pay half that for Mavic Open Sport and stainless double butted.:headshake:

Genunie quote from today from a professional wheel builder. Funny that factory built wheels are significantly cheaper. I was quoted, £30 per wheel labour, £1 per spoke, and whatever the rim costs on top. So with 32 hole hubs, the spokes and labour alone is £124.... cheapest rims I could find were only £20 each...

Where as shimano R500 by comparison was £76 for a pair, which is why I asked whether I could use my old 8 speed. As can be seen from reply above, this is roughly a no.:sad:
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Open Pro or CXP33 are about £45 each. Add on quality spokes and a rebuild. Thats what it cost me to switch tub rims to clinchers.
 

Wobbly John

Veteran
I've been running a Campag 8 speed cassette on Fulcrum 5 wheels for a few years - seems to work even tho' most people think it doesn't. I think I needed a 2mm spacer.
 

RecordAceFromNew

Swinging Member
Location
West London
I've been running a Campag 8 speed cassette on Fulcrum 5 wheels for a few years - seems to work even tho' most people think it doesn't. I think I needed a 2mm spacer.

Don't think it is right. Fulcrum only makes freehubs for Campag 9-11 and Shimano/sram 8-11 cassettes, see this. Campag 8 has a completely difference spline and has been obsolete for around 15 years. Some people use Shimano/sram 8 speed cassette/freehub with Campag 8 shifter/mech, relying on the small (0.2mm per click) difference in sprocket spacing, it is not perfect, and is susceptible to shift performance degradation.
 

raleighnut

Legendary Member
I'm not saying who my wheelbuilder is just that.
1 He has worked at one shop his entire career.
2 When the owner of the shop packed it in he was given the shop.
3 Although now past retirement age he is open 5 days a week (closed Thursday)
4 He's just as likely to be building a wheel for a vintage racing Morgan 3 wheeler or a vintage racing sidecar outfit as a bicycle. (last time I was in there he was doing a set of 4 wheels for a vintage open bodied single seat Maserati)
The last wheels he did for me were built onto a set of restored Maillard wide flange hubs using a 70s style ally rim and butted stainless spokes for £70 the pair(he was complaining that the spokes were now 35p each)
 

Wobbly John

Veteran
Don't think it is right. Fulcrum only makes freehubs for Campag 9-11 and Shimano/sram 8-11 cassettes, see this. Campag 8 has a completely difference spline and has been obsolete for around 15 years. Some people use Shimano/sram 8 speed cassette/freehub with Campag 8 shifter/mech, relying on the small (0.2mm per click) difference in sprocket spacing, it is not perfect, and is susceptible to shift performance degradation.

The Campag 8 speed hub has the same splines spacing as the 9-11 but not as deep, so yes - I am running an old campag 8 speed cassette on a 9-11 speed fulcrum hub.

I forgot to add, the 9-11 hubs use a different lockring to the 8 speed.
 
WobblyJohn is correct - the current 9/10/11 body is compatible with the 8s sprockets but a 2mm spacer behind the biggest sprocket, plus a small reset of the limit screws is required.

It is also important to point out that the tightening torque of the lockring needs to be observed as the older sprockets use a shallower spline and no alloy carrier on the lower sprockets (which in general are transmitting more torque to the cassette body) so the potential for the sprockets to either mark the cassette body, or in extreme cases, to damage the cassette body over time so badly that they will actually spin round it (you have to try pretty hard to let it go this far but I have seen it) ... is greater than with the more recent, deep-splined 9/10/11s sprockets.

This is because the original 8s bodies were steel, whereas more recently alloy has been used for the splined part (and most recently, since 2006, for the whole cassette body).

On the wheelbuilding question, to a certain extent you get, provided the wheelbuilder is honest, what you pay for. It takes me around 40 min to 1 hour to build a "standard" wheel - i.e. one with conventional spoke pattern, spokes and nipples - and I charge around £40-50 + spokes. I could do it in half that time (and therefore at half the labour cost) but wheel trueness and equality of spoke tensions would not be as accurate. Also, you are paying for the time taken to sort out exactly the right product for what you want to use it for and the 30 plus years of experience that sit behind that. We give full data on every wheel we build, too - actual spoke tensions in the form of a radial tension graph, the actual rim-run outs radially and axially and the accuracy of the dish & offset. Others may do it cheaper and just as well, of course - how we choose to price all these little slices of our finite lives we sell off to others is a personal decision!

Factory built wheels may and may not be done entirely by machine, partly by machine & finished by hand, or completely by hand. They build in large numbers and to one specification which is a one-size-fits-all approach which rarely makes the most of the available bank of components as the manufacturer has to think of 60kg racing snakes in the same mental breath as 100kg commuters - all the recommendations under the sun about rider weights won't stop a vendor selling the wrong wheelset to the customer, nor will they prevent a determined customer from trying to out-bling his mates and in any case, just the weight of the customer has relatively little to do with whether the wheel is a sensible compromise for that individual - wheel makers know this so are pretty conservative, in general. This allows them to be very aggressive on prce against a more artisinal "right product for you" approach.

There is a "third way" to the tubular x likelihood of puncture question and that is to run something like Tufo tubulars with sealant - that will work for cuts up to 3mm or so long and is reliable. We do it on our racing tandem as a front flat on a tandem is pretty scary and a front flat on a clincher on a tandem is pretty much uncontrollable, so Tufos and sealant work well in that application. +30g in each wheel for the sealant is no big deal unless you are racing and even then *to finish 1st, you 1st have to finish ...". We race. We (used to, back in the day) even win, sometimes ...
 
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