Value to be had in Carbon?

[bennydorano]

As a relative newbie thinking of making the final step up to a Carbon Fibre bike. Been doing a lot of research, as I'll be in the lower end of the CF market, looking to get a bit of value and advice on what to look out for.

First thing I've noticed is the weight difference (which I think is a bit a paltry tbh) in the price bracket I'm looking at (£1-2k max...probably). My Bianchi and Secteur Elite (Winter) are both roughly 1kg heavier than the CF bikes I've been looking at - I was expecting a bit more of a gain tbh, so much so that it's made me wonder if it's worth the bother??

Also been looking at Ribble bikebuilder and like http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/bikeb...uctor&part=BB11RIBNERORC&sub=conf_BBRC&bike=1 with either 105 or Ultegra, the weight calculator in the bike builder doesn't seem to work - a shot in the dark but would any one know what sort of weight a 57cm bike would come in at there?

Maybe I'm overestimating the gains to be made from a lighter bike? Maybe the weight gain I'm looking for is out of my range? Is a 1 kg gain worth it considering the money I've already spent on 2 fine bikes (and also I've lost 2 stone weight - aiming for another one)?

Contributions appreciated

 

[smokeysmoo]

Maybe I'm overestimating the gains to be made from a lighter bike?

and also from carbon IMO.

I would recommend getting a Cannondale CAAD10, lighter than any cf frame in your budget. With your price band you could either get the 105 model for £999, or the Ultegra version for £1900.

All CAAD10's use the same frame, just with different colourways.

So from just £999 you get the worlds most advanced alu frame, and it's lighter than carbon, no brainer IMHO

You can view the range HERE

Bear in mind, as a CAAD10 owner myself I will admit to being a tad biased, but that aside, everything in this post is fact

 

[bennydorano]

What weight would (could) you estimate a 58cm bike would come in at with the Ultegra? Have to say I love the feel of my Bianchi and ideally would love a lighter version of it, there was no appreciable weight gain from upgrading to it from my Specialised Secteur Elite, but the difference in performance was well worth it.

 

[brockers]

Don't obsess over the weight. If you get a bike that fits you properly, you won't notice a few kilos here or there, and you'll just want to ride it all the time hence you'll get fitter, lighter, and go faster. (Say you weigh 75kg. Adding 8kg of bike to that gives 83kg. Do you really think that 1kg will make the slightest bit of difference? Answer: it won't - unless you're down to 8% body fat or need to gain a couple of seconds up a long climb) Remember that guys* were doing 49 minute 25 mile time trials on bikes that weighed 9-10kg thirty years ago. Only a bit slower than Bradley Wiggins** did today.

*like Alf Engers

**

Did you know that Smokeysmoo has a CAAD10? ()

 

[accountantpete]

I'm with Smokey - I have a Pro-Lite alloy frame which weighs 1kg and is a great frame (although they can't compete with Cannondale on price)..

In my experience top-end products are the way to go as design counts for as much if not more than the material.

 

[smokeysmoo]

What I do know is I've weighed my CAAD10 Dura-Ace and it's a 60cm frame.

I did upgrade the wheels at the time I bought it to Mavic Ksyrium SL's, and I've swopped the finishing kit to Ritchey WCS, (in alu), but that also means I've swopped the standard Cannondale carbon seatpost to a WCS one, so, what does it weigh, well I can tell you, 16.5lbs, (with pedals) Can I introduce you to my mistress, Rhianna?

 

[smokeysmoo]

Did you know that Smokeysmoo has a CAAD10? ()

Have I mentioned that before

Seriously though, I did mention that in my first post,

Bear in mind, as a CAAD10 owner myself I will admit to being a tad biased, but that aside, everything in this post is fact

I don't mind who knows the fact as the bike is freakin' awesome

 

[bennydorano]

If I dont bother upgrading - Any weight saving measures I could take with my Bianchi? What sort of weight saving would you be talking about putting a new set of better wheels on? Anything else considering it's got an Ultegra groupset (with 105 brakes)?

 

[amaferanga]

CAAD9/CAAD10's are light because they use thinner tubing than on almost any other alu frame. That means they're more easily damaged. Probably as easily damaged as a carbon frame (not that carbon frames are as easily damaged as some people think). So in that case what's the advantage of the CAAD9/CAAD10 then? Do they appeal to folk with a carbon phobia?

Have a look at Planet X Nanolight - for £2k you could probably get a sub 7kg bike. Not that weight is all that as others have said - saving a kg or two isn't going to make you significantly faster. Its about having a nice bike that you enjoy riding and as an owner of a P-X Nanolight with SRAM Red I can tell you that it's a lovely bike that I really love to ride

 

[bennydorano]

Saw a Nanolight down for £1,299 there not £2k or was I missing something? That could be a goer alrite.

 

[Rob3rt]

CAAD9/CAAD10's are light because they use thinner tubing than on almost any other alu frame. That means they're more easily damaged. Probably as easily damaged as a carbon frame (not that carbon frames are as easily damaged as some people think). So in that case what's the advantage of the CAAD9/CAAD10 then? Do they appeal to folk with a carbon phobia?

Have a look at Planet X Nanolight - for £2k you could probably get a sub 7kg bike. Not that weight is all that as others have said - saving a kg or two isn't going to make you significantly faster. Its about having a nice bike that you enjoy riding and as an owner of a P-X Nanolight with SRAM Red I can tell you that it's a lovely bike that I really love to ride

Whilst being as light as many carbon bikes, they are also very stiff and have great power transfer etc, they apparently perform as well as a carbon bike that costs considerably more. So I guess its not just about weight, its a combination of weight, performance and price.

I ride a CAAD9 because at the time, I wouldnt have got a bike with a frame as nice (in any material) with this sort of upgrade potential for the same cost.

I also have a carbon Cannondale bike.

 

[smokeysmoo]

CAAD9/CAAD10's are light because they use thinner tubing than on almost any other alu frame. That means they're more easily damaged. (Really? and your evidence of this is what exactly?). Probably as easily damaged as a carbon frame (not that carbon frames are as easily damaged as some people think) At least not that you can see externally!. So in that case what's the advantage of the CAAD9/CAAD10 then? Do they appeal to folk with a carbon phobia?

Unfortunately that is utter bunkum, and is is a complete assumption on your part having read various online threads/articles about the issue, (granted that's an assumption on my part but you get my drift, you have clearly read the same bunkum elsewhere for you to repeat it here).

The dent issue is the one that carbon lovers/anti CAAD people always state. There is no denying the tubeset is relatively thin, however, my own experience is that it's also incredibly resilient. Mine was knocked over by some random knob during this years Manchester to Blackpool whilst I was, ahem, relieving myself , and it fell straight into an metal post , however, apart from a small scuff on the top tube there is not even the slightest sign of a dent, so IME the dent argument is a moot one Besides, a dent could potentially write off a carbon frame, (maybe a bit OTT, but possible none the less, and something that will always play on your mind once you ahve dented/scratched your carbon ), whereas a dent on an alu frame is only going to spoil the aesthetics without having to worry about the internal integrity of the weave

What's the advantage you ask? Well the CAAD10 certainly appealed to me after having 3 carbon frames replaced over the last few years. None for anything catastrophic to be fair, but I've never had to have a alu or steel frame replaced at any point during the last 38 years. So the idea of a carbon beating bike in my preferred frame choice was to me a complete no brainer

At the end of the day the alu/cf/steel/ti argument is always going to crop up, and there will probably never be a definitive answer to it. So I'll simply refer you to point number 11 of the SURLY BLOG

Whilst being as light as many carbon bikes, they are also very stiff and have great power transfer etc, they apparently perform as well as a carbon bike that costs considerably more. So I guess its not just about weight, its a combination of weight, performance and price.

+1 for Rob's comments

 

[bennydorano]

Hunted this thread out again as the Cannondale raqnge has been catching my eye consistently since brought to my attention in this thread. Is the Synapse like their Sportive version? Is the Super Six range a full on race geometry?


As the owner of a dodgy back I have found (perhaps strangely) that my own Sportive (Secteur Sport) is highly uncomfortable and my Bianchi's 'harsher' geometry a lot more comfortable for me.

 

[Wobblers]

Hunted this thread out again as the Cannondale raqnge has been catching my eye consistently since brought to my attention in this thread. Is the Synapse like their Sportive version? Is the Super Six range a full on race geometry?


As the owner of a dodgy back I have found (perhaps strangely) that my own Sportive (Secteur Sport) is highly uncomfortable and my Bianchi's 'harsher' geometry a lot more comfortable for me.

The Super Six has the same geometry as the CAAD 10. It's more aggressive than the Synapse. I'd compare the geometry of your Bianchi to the Super Six/CAAD 10. Pay particular attention to the seat and head angles, top tube length, stack and reach. If there's a size that comes close (within a few mm) of your Bianchi, then you'll probably find it comfortable (but get a test ride if you can!). I did that, and ended up buying a 52 cm CAAD 10. I've found it extremely comfortable, more so than my Focus Cayo. So comfortable, in fact, that I had no qualms about riding it on last week's FNRttC - with no issues.

I've found the CAAD 10 to be just as stiff as my Cayo, but has a far less harsh ride. How much of that is due to the frame and how much to the wheels I've yet to find out, but it's certainly as good as a low end carbon frame (and the Cayo has an excellent frame). I've no doubt that the Super Six will be just as good, if not better. I believe Wiggle have the 105 Cayo on offer at the moment, and it's a steal at the price. But so is the CAAD 10 at £964 from All Terrain Cycles!

Edit: I think you'd be happy with the CAAD, Super Six or Cayo, to be honest. And don't forget that upgrading the wheels on your Bianchi would give it a new lease of life: that's probably the safest (and cheapest!) option if you find it comfortable.

 

[bennydorano]

Any suggestions for a pair of wheels that would significantly enhance performance and not break the bank?