Ultegra front shifter

[wyre forest blues]

I recently purchased a new Giant Defy Advanced Pro 1 (2017). Its Shimano Ultegra with hydraulic discs. The front shifter is a 'triple', the front chainrings being a compact double. When changing down two clicks the front derailleur shifts to a position where a small third chainring would be positioned. Can anyone tell me if it's normal to supply a compact setup with a triple shifter. Is this a standard Shimano Ultegra setup.

 

[Smokin Joe]

All you need to do is adjust the low stop screw on the derailleur so it cannot shift past the first click.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I recently purchased a new Giant Defy Advanced Pro 1 (2017). Its Shimano Ultegra with hydraulic discs. The front shifter is a 'triple', the front chainrings being a compact double. When changing down two clicks the front derailleur shifts to a position where a small third chainring would be positioned. Can anyone tell me if it's normal to supply a compact setup with a triple shifter. Is this a standard Shimano Ultegra setup.

I didn't think Ultegra had a triple option.

Are you perhaps confusing the different trim positions that the latest Shimano FD's use compared to older varients ie when shifting down from large ring to small it trims to the outer position on the small ring and then a further trim shifts it to the inner position?

 

[Drago]

Its not a triple shifter. The middle click is to allow the cage position to be trimmed slightly to avoid rub. Your inner limit screw needs setting properly is all.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Its not a triple shifter. The middle click is to allow the cage position to be trimmed slightly to avoid rub. Your inner limit screw needs setting properly is all.

The latest versions shift down differently to previous versions. Instead of dropping down from the big ring to the furthest innermost setting of the FD they drop down to a position inboard of the innermost setting ie effectively at the old outermost trim setting on the small ring on older versions.

The inner limit screw may well be off but I think the problem will cured with getting the cable tension correct - the FD should still require some inboard trim after it has shifted down to the small ring which is totally different to older versions. 6800 has a very different set-up process to eg 6700 AFAIK and based on my experience setting up 5800 vs 5700.

Page 13 of the attached shows the double trim mechanism more clearly than my explanation:

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-FD0002-05-ENG.pdf

 

[wyre forest blues]

The latest versions shift down differently to previous versions. Instead of dropping down from the big ring to the furthest innermost setting of the FD they drop down to a position inboard of the innermost setting ie effectively at the old outermost trim setting on the small ring on older versions.

The inner limit screw may well be off but I think the problem will cured with getting the cable tension correct - the FD should still require some inboard trim after it has shifted down to the small ring which is totally different to older versions. 6800 has a very different set-up process to eg 6700 AFAIK and based on my experience setting up 5800 vs 5700.



Page 13 of the attached shows the double trim mechanism more clearly than my explanation:

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-FD0002-05-ENG.pdf

I guess I'm showing my inexperience. This was the first ride on the 'new' bike and the chain was slightly rubbing on the inside of the cage when I was in the large chainring and middle of the cassette to the larger cogs. Upon putting the bike on the stand to check I noticed that when I clicked the shifter it moved to the smaller chainring , but then I was able to click again and the cage moved even further, hence believing it was a triple. Am I right in assuming the second of those lever clicks is the trim, and that probably all I need to do is a slight adjustment of the high or low screws. ?

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I guess I'm showing my inexperience. This was the first ride on the 'new' bike and the chain was slightly rubbing on the inside of the cage when I was in the large chainring and middle of the cassette to the larger cogs. Upon putting the bike on the stand to check I noticed that when I clicked the shifter it moved to the smaller chainring , but then I was able to click again and the cage moved even further, hence believing it was a triple. Am I right in assuming the second of those lever clicks is the trim, and that probably all I need to do is a slight adjustment of the high or low screws. ?

Yes that second click is the inboard trim position on the small ring. It confused the hell out of me when I first came across it.

If the chain is rubbing on the inside of the cage in the position you describe it is chain tension that needs adjusting. The low stop screw will not make any difference on the large ring.

I'd say that you have a tad too much tension on the cable and it is not allowing the cage to move inboard enough. NB: the cable may stretch slightly after a few rides and cure the problem.

I'd get a few decent rides in on the bike and then if it is still rubbing...

...you could try backing off the tension slightly using the barrel adjuster (hopefully it's been set up with some adjustment available in the direction you want to go) - if that doesn't work then take it back to the dealer and ask them to set it up properly.

 

[wyre forest blues]

Thanks SpokeyDokey. .I get it now. (Well I think so !!)

 

[Ajax Bay]

the cable may stretch slightly after a few rides and cure the problem.

I refer the honourable member to this CC thread - from Post #11 where 'stretch of a stainless gear cable making a difference' was posited by rr.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

I refer the honourable member to this CC thread - from Post #11 where 'stretch of a stainless gear cable making a difference' was posited by rr.

@Ajax Bay

Merci! I didn't know that. I wonder why bike shops (two that I have used) repeat this.

Also I have learnt tonight that the series 8000 Ultegra shifters do not need a barrel adjuster as there is a hex key adjustment within the shifter - at least according to one road test I have read.

 

[wyre forest blues]

Update.
My lack of understanding of the trim operation of the front lever was partially to blame. However the fact that the chain was rubbing on the inside of the cage when in the middle of the cassette and on the large chainring caused me to check the high limit screw setting. The cage was fractionally too far away from the chain, so by moving it nearer caused the chain to rub only when in the 3rd largest cog....effectively when I should change to the smaller chainring. Alternatively, at this point I can trim the fd to stop the rubbing by half click on the front lever.

 

[Ajax Bay]

adjust the cable tension but also check the height and the angle. if it's never worked from the beginning, it may not have been set up right.
http://www.parktool.com/blog/repair-help/front-derailleur-adjustment#article-section-7

Check the height [correct distance from the bottom curve of the FD cage to the large chain ring] and the angle [of the derailleur cage - should be aligned with the chain rings].

 

[SpokeyDokey]

Update.
My lack of understanding of the trim operation of the front lever was partially to blame. However the fact that the chain was rubbing on the inside of the cage when in the middle of the cassette and on the large chainring caused me to check the high limit screw setting. The cage was fractionally too far away from the chain, so by moving it nearer caused the chain to rub only when in the 3rd largest cog....effectively when I should change to the smaller chainring. Alternatively, at this point I can trim the fd to stop the rubbing by half click on the front lever.

Excellent! That makes sense now. I had assumed you were in the large ring trim position when you had the rubbing!

Enjoy your new bike.

I have an Advanced Pro on demo' for a week in two weeks time and I'm looking forward to seeing how I get on with it.

 

[SpokeyDokey]

@wyre forest blues

FYI:

Just been reading the installation manual for new Ultegra FD-R8000 and the cable tension adjustment is not in the shifter unit as I first thought but is dialled in on the FD itself which is pretty neat. Page 18 of manual:

http://si.shimano.com/pdfs/dm/DM-RAFD001-02-ENG.pdf

 

[Ming the Merciless]

The older Ultegra came in triples. I have one on my bike.