stiff drivetrain?

[2clepto]

hey folks,

ive upgraded my raleigh scorpio with a sora groupset 12 28t. the problem i have is when im in large large the entire drivetrain stiffens up. is this due to the larger cassette, or could i sort the problem with a longer chain, or do i dump the sora cassette and rear mech because they were already a problem on my main bike and the reason i upgraded. i just couldnt get them to pedal backwards on the main bike no matter what i tried.

but, the upgrade on my main bike has the 12 25t instead of the physically larger 12.28t. i was wanting to know if its best to get first a longer chain, or a 12 25t cassette, or do both, or do both + dump the sora rear mech it must be kaput? i know i should do all three it would just be nice landing on a longer chain and everything working smooth lol.

ill just take it for a test ride now whilst avoiding using the large crank chainring.

 

[Cycleops]

Could be your chain is too short. How many teeth on your large chainring?

 

[2clepto]

Could be your chain is too short. How many teeth on your large chainring?

it does feel like a few extra links may solve the problem for the moment. the large chainring is 53t. returned from a little test and its running like a swift lol. its a 9 speed rear casette but im avoiding the outside two cogs. the 12t i cant actually get to go in even tho it seems like its almost going to fall in there.

one other thing, this afternoon the bike had mavic wheels on, which id planned to use, that had been set up for an 8 speed shimano 600 drivetrain. and it had a 105 chainring and crankarms, but the chain went even stiffer and locked up pretty hard sometimes, and sometimes out the blue lol for no reason whatsoever. the wheels on now are from a 10 speed with a freehub and ive replaced the 105 with a shimano 600 and its running much much better than it was. i think the old mavic rear wheel was a little too wide for the scorpio frame, or the freehub from a 10 speed is more suited to a 9 spd cassette, than a 8 speed freehub running a 9 spd cassette. i dont know enough to figure that one yet.

does anyone know the best place to get reasonably priced chains for a 9 spd?

im going for another ride after a bacon sandwich, for a larger test and such like. heres a photo below,

cheers mark

 

[Nigelnaturist]

Wrap the chain around the large front and large rear without going through the RD and then overlap by one whole link this should be the length of chain you require. LxL and SxS are not ideal but should work with nothing more than a little bit of chain noise because of the more extreme angle the chain is asked to work at.

 

[2clepto]

Wrap the chain around the large front and large rear without going through the RD and then overlap by one whole link this should be the length of chain you require. LxL and SxS are not ideal but should work with nothing more than a little bit of chain noise because of the more extreme angle the chain is asked to work at.

thanks nigel. i went ahead last week and purchased a new nine speed chain and the drivetrain is working pretty well, apart from i cant access the smallest cog on the cassette. ive tried a few ways but cant find the sweetspot. altho im not too concerned if all the other gears are accessible but it would be satisfying. one thing i suspect limiting the rear mech is i purchased a mech hanger for the old raleigh which attaches to the drop outs using a small backplate to clamp itself firm, maybe this is the culprit?

 

[Jimmy Doug]

You do know that you're not supposed to ride large/large? You set the chain up that way, as Nigel suggested, but you defo shouldn't ride on this combination. Same remark for small/small.

 

[2clepto]

You do know that you're not supposed to ride large/large? You set the chain up that way, as Nigel suggested, but you defo shouldn't ride on this combination. Same remark for small/small.

yes thanks i do know the advice concerning large large but i do like riding large large, maybe the extra torque? i have a ten spd shimano set up which runs LL and the 9spd i refer to here is running pretty sweet in LL on the stand, ive yet to take it out.

 

[Jimmy Doug]

yes thanks i do know the advice concerning large large but i do like riding large large, maybe the extra torque? i have a ten spd shimano set up which runs LL and the 9spd i refer to here is running pretty sweet in LL on the stand, ive yet to take it out.

Ooo ...! When I accidentally end up in large/larg,e I can hear the chain screaming at me in pain! Know what you mean about the torque, though: sometimes I'm tempted to stay there!

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@Jimmy Doug even though its not advisable it should be possible in a normal set up, as its not outside the design parameters, and neither should it for a short time be a dangerous set up, it just puts extra sideways force on the chain leading to slightly more wear.
I ended up on my 50x27 the other day, first thing I really noticed is I thought it a little high gear when I had no more gears left, maybe I was a little deaf that day.

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@2clepto I will be doing a similar thing to my Carlton once its painted, now the handle bars are off.

 

[2clepto]

Ooo ...! When I accidentally end up in large/larg,e I can hear the chain screaming at me in pain! Know what you mean about the torque, though: sometimes I'm tempted to stay there!

when i installed the new chain last week, i didnt opt for the standard installation route as outlined by nigel earlier in the thread, and others elsewhere. i installed the chain complete, took stock of the slack and then removed a link at a time shifting gears and observing inbetween. i look at peoples chain setups in a diiferent way now lol.

ive just returned from a 5 miler on the scorpio and the chain is skipping about a bit in certain gears, mainly the ones in the middle on the smaller chainring. adjusting the cable tension calmed it a little, but it needs another tweek.

nice tip on the chainwear issue nigel thanks. what would you recommend? test the chain with a chainstretch tool or compare to a new chain after a few months cycling, or 1000 miles? or remove another link? i think i can remove one more and still acess LL.

 

[Nigelnaturist]

@2clepto done that too, but find it better with the bigxbig way, if you want leave a couple of links extra then remove one at a time if you want, the problem with doing it that way is the chain can be too long, as for chain wear I just use a ruler to measure 12 links, it should be 12" if less then 12 1/16th it should be fine longer it needs changing loner than 12 1/8th " both chain and cassette will probable need changing,
As for replacement. 105 and lower it is quiet feasible to replace both about £35 for 105, all depends on you budget I suppose.

 

[2clepto]

thanks nigel top tips. ive not tried the bigbig way yet. i was concerned i may shorten the chain too much with the drivetrain becoming stiff with the old chain, ill try it next time tho.

 

[Nigelnaturist]

Just to add to the above ending up on the 50x27 last week, I ended up on the 26x12 today and thought gee this is easy for a 38x12, simply because there was no chain rub or noise of any kind, it was just the fact I had no more gears, thinking I was on the 38th middle ring, so you see triples can be set up really well.

 

[raleighnut]

when i installed the new chain last week, i didnt opt for the standard installation route as outlined by nigel earlier in the thread, and others elsewhere. i installed the chain complete, took stock of the slack and then removed a link at a time shifting gears and observing inbetween. i look at peoples chain setups in a diiferent way now lol.

ive just returned from a 5 miler on the scorpio and the chain is skipping about a bit in certain gears, mainly the ones in the middle on the smaller chainring. adjusting the cable tension calmed it a little, but it needs another tweek.

nice tip on the chainwear issue nigel thanks. what would you recommend? test the chain with a chainstretch tool or compare to a new chain after a few months cycling, or 1000 miles? or remove another link? i think i can remove one more and still acess LL.

Removing a link from a worn chain will not make it last any longer or run any better on the sprockets.