State cycles

[wafter]

I'm actually running hydraulics on mine, I've upgraded the gravel bike to run 4 piston Hope RX4 calipers and 180mm discs. I will say that this is complete overkill for 80% of my riding, but when I'm away bikepacking and running down some long sketchy mountainous descents I really appreciate the set up.

I made the change for two reasons really, the original 2 piston SRAM calipers developed a leak during the middle of the pandemic and spares were unobtanium. So I thought what the heck and for a few Euros more than replacement Rival calipers I bought the vastly superior Hope ones. Then fast forward a few years and descending down a long rough gravel descent whilst bikepacking, the front brakes were getting really hot and a little fade was starting to creep in. I discovered how easy and cheap it was to upgrade from 160mm to 180mm, so I thought why not.

Day to day, I find the brakes are fantastic, really nicely modulated and easy to operate from the hoods, but the power is there if I really need it. On long bikepacking trips I have a lot of confidence now as well to go for big descents knowing the brakes will see me through.

It is odd that Genesis continue to fit IS mounts to their cheaper frames, given that adapters will need to be fitted to convert them to post mount, why don't they just fit post mounts straight away or more logically keep the flat mounts from the more expensive frames? Even Kona have moved away from IS mounts, I think from the 2018 model year of the Sutra LTD they went to flat mount from IS mounts.

Sounds like a nice setup! As it happens I was looking at those Hope calipers recently and they look very good; certainly a decent alternative to / upgrade from groupset-specific parts if the cost difference is insignificant. In use how do you find they differ from the (single-piston?) SRAM items; better for both modulation and outright bite?

I think my brakes have a much easier life and when new I was very impressed by both their outright stopping power and control. Having ridden the bike recently they seem less impressive (although certainly still adiquate) - not sure if this is due to changes in my perception or the brakes themselves - perhaps surface contamination from being stood in the house..

Unfortunately I think Genesis might be retaining the older features on their lower-spec frames to create breaks between models and push people towards the more expensive variants. This was certainly my experience when buying mine in 2020; the choice essentially boiling down to QR / IS / Mech. Tiagra or TA / FM / Hydro 105 for 50-60% more. Joys of hydraulic braking aside the frame was definitely a big factor in pushing me towards the more expensive bike, however back then it seemed perhaps less exploititive - the TA and FM standards being relatively new on road-adjacent bikes so it felt more like I was paying more to future-proof with new tech rather than being pushed away from old.

Regardless of the frame material I think the forks are probably the same steel across the range, so it would certainly make sense to standardise these. The frames are perhaps a different story as the planar / profile-cut dropouts on the QR frames look obviously less complex / expensive than the cast / forged / machined items on the TA frames... so this could be one reason.

I don't think the issue is existing inventory as the frames have recently changed with new geometry and (IMO questionable) dropped seatstays, so it's not like they're working through a backlog of stock.

Anyway, meh. IMO the steel CdF peaked in 2019/2020 when I bought mine, a few niggles aside I'm generally very happy with it and remain unaffected by how the brand choose to go with this model in future. It's certainly nice not to have felt the need to rush out and buy the latest variant

 

[chriswoody]

In use how do you find they differ from the (single-piston?) SRAM items; better for both modulation and outright bite?

They have an entirely different feel from the SRAM Rival calipers, which to be fair weren't that bad. The SRAM ones always felt a bit soft and like you needed to pull more lever to get them to bite. The Hope ones feel a lot firmer through their travel but the modulation is brilliant they never feel like they will suddenly lock they wheel up. They are also quite light to use and overall the surface area of the pad is much larger than on the SRAM ones. Downsides are the fact that they can be a pig to bleed with four pistons and the costs of replacement pads are more.

One of the main reasons I bought them was not really performance though, I was more taken by the fact that as a small company Hope would offer better after care service and spares would be much easier to come by for many years ahead. Trying to think sustainably and also supporting a smaller company than the behemoth that is SRAM.

Anyway, meh. IMO the steel CdF peaked in 2019/2020 when I bought mine, a few niggles aside I'm generally very happy with it and remain unaffected by how the brand choose to go with this model in future. It's certainly nice not to have felt the need to rush out and buy the latest variant

It's funny you should say that, I kind of feel the same about the Sutra LTD. Kona has lost their way with it a bit in the last years, the latest one really doesn't appeal at all with a €500 increase but lesser components than mine. I'm slowly tweaking and changing mine to make it into the perfect gravel/bikepacking bike for my needs and can't see me ever selling it. I've got one last big change coming to the drivetrain in the next couple of months and then I think it will be close to perfect. I just wish I could change the QR to Thru-Axle, but that's not possible so we'll leave that one.

 

[IanSmithCSE]

Good morning,

Using a retail exchange rate that becomes £725 or £876 (adding VAT).

The UK sites lists it at £819 but that seems VAT exclusive, which gives £164 VAT or a total of £982

I picked a UK address (which I have cut out) and got this;
View attachment 760851


Pretending there isn't shippping as it's a bit silly to ship this type of bike from the US, this ain't so cheap and given that we are talking about generic 4130 and from the link I weighed it and it came out to a little over 28lbs, I am starting to shudder.

Given the big tyres that's not too bad but it is hardly impressive, the State web site has the frame/forks as 2.9kg/1.3kg which may mean a solid off road frame or something build at a low price. Add to that one of the less well known groupsets, Sensah, and my credit card is not shouting to come out. :-(

A couple of years ago I was looking for an 70's style chainset and found this

View attachment 760849
Had it been made in the UK I would have been tempted, but it seemed to be a cheaper generic product with a "Retro" price hike, the State branding comes across as the same idea.

Bye

Ian

 

[tyred]

I misread the title as slate bike. I was going to say it might be a bit heavy and brittle.

 

[wafter]

They have an entirely different feel from the SRAM Rival calipers, which to be fair weren't that bad. The SRAM ones always felt a bit soft and like you needed to pull more lever to get them to bite. The Hope ones feel a lot firmer through their travel but the modulation is brilliant they never feel like they will suddenly lock they wheel up. They are also quite light to use and overall the surface area of the pad is much larger than on the SRAM ones. Downsides are the fact that they can be a pig to bleed with four pistons and the costs of replacement pads are more.

One of the main reasons I bought them was not really performance though, I was more taken by the fact that as a small company Hope would offer better after care service and spares would be much easier to come by for many years ahead. Trying to think sustainably and also supporting a smaller company than the behemoth that is SRAM.



It's funny you should say that, I kind of feel the same about the Sutra LTD. Kona has lost their way with it a bit in the last years, the latest one really doesn't appeal at all with a €500 increase but lesser components than mine. I'm slowly tweaking and changing mine to make it into the perfect gravel/bikepacking bike for my needs and can't see me ever selling it. I've got one last big change coming to the drivetrain in the next couple of months and then I think it will be close to perfect. I just wish I could change the QR to Thru-Axle, but that's not possible so we'll leave that one.

Cheers - the Hope calipers sound in-keeping with the company's decent reputation and I agree about supporting some of the smaller players.

While generally happy with the brakes I have, were I to need new calipers I think I'd definitely be considering a pair of these


Sadly Kona aren't alone in the very obvious hike in prices / fall in spec, which seeme to be pretty much industry-wide. As you're probably aware for a while they were in the ownership of some third party (possibly bought after the Covid boom) but are now back in the hands of the founders so hopefully things will improve again. I've never owned a Kona but they seem like a decent, authentic company with some decent products.

That's a sod about the through-axles; must admit I'm very much sold on these and it's something I'd prefer not to move away from now I've experienced it. QR still gets the job done of course but I can see where you're coming from. Sounds like the rest of the bike's on point though, so a small thing in the grand scheme

Good morning,

Using a retail exchange rate that becomes £725 or £876 (adding VAT).

The UK sites lists it at £819 but that seems VAT exclusive, which gives £164 VAT or a total of £982

I picked a UK address (which I have cut out) and got this;
View attachment 760851


Pretending there isn't shippping as it's a bit silly to ship this type of bike from the US, this ain't so cheap and given that we are talking about generic 4130 and from the link I weighed it and it came out to a little over 28lbs, I am starting to shudder.

Given the big tyres that's not too bad but it is hardly impressive, the State web site has the frame/forks as 2.9kg/1.3kg which may mean a solid off road frame or something build at a low price. Add to that one of the less well known groupsets, Sensah, and my credit card is not shouting to come out. :-(

A couple of years ago I was looking for an 70's style chainset and found this

View attachment 760849
Had it been made in the UK I would have been tempted, but it seemed to be a cheaper generic product with a "Retro" price hike, the State branding comes across as the same idea.

Bye

Ian

Yes, I did similar. At the asking prices in the US I think these potentially offer decent value and would make a good entry-level offering for all-road / utility... once all the costs are added over here they sadly become a lot less appealing.