Sapper's Health thread thingie...

[Sapper]

Hi all

I am trying to be motivated and do more cycling, partially to reduce my increasing fuel bill of the car but to regain the fitness when Iused to cycle 3-4 days regularly into work a total of 20 miles or so per day.

One of my weaknesses is my ability to attack hills...

So I need to improve my hill technique and fitness....

Suggestions please

Adrian

 

[brockers]

Ride up hills. Rest and recover. Repeat.

 

[Banjo]

You arent allways going to be in an attacking mood on your commute. How about a larger cassette?

 

[Sapper]

Ride up hills. Rest and recover. Repeat.

As in interval training? Attack a hill, cycle/cruise back down and attack it again 3-4 times on the way home?

 

[Sapper]

You arent allways going to be in an attacking mood on your commute. How about a larger cassette?

On the front or the rear gear?

I presume you mean the rear. I do not know what cassette i have though can have a look...

Would a change in cassette affect down hill performance?

Adrian

 

[brockers]

As in interval training? Attack a hill, cycle/cruise back down and attack it again 3-4 times on the way home?

Sounds good! Do it whenever. Go out at the weekend for an hour or so if you want. Warm up first though. But don't do a set of intervals unless your legs are fresh, and you're fully recovered from the last set (which might take up to ten days at first and so might mean going up the hills really gently on your commute if necessary for a bit).

There's no real shortcut to going faster, unfortunately. You're going to have to push yourself at some point. And motivation - well you've either got it or you haven't. But when you notice that you seem to be going uphill with greater ease, then you'll get motivated! Bit of a catch 22 really.

One thing though - you use the word 'attack', which makes me worry that you'll overdo it and give yourself a heart-attack. Be sensible - you're probably too old to get a pro contract!

 

[Sapper]

Sounds good! Do it whenever. Go out at the weekend for an hour or so if you want. Warm up first though. But don't do a set of intervals unless your legs are fresh, and you're fully recovered from the last set (which might take up to ten days at first and so might mean going up the hills really gently on your commute if necessary for a bit).

There's no real shortcut to going faster, unfortunately. You're going to have to push yourself at some point. And motivation - well you've either got it or you haven't. But when you notice that you seem to be going uphill with greater ease, then you'll get motivated! Bit of a catch 22 really.

One thing though - you use the word 'attack', which makes me worry that you'll overdo it and give yourself a heart-attack. Be sensible - you're probably too old to get a pro contract!

Thanks for the advice...

As to my terminology "attack" there will be an element of common sense. I am 45 this summer and carrying too much weight. However on a commute my average speed is 12-14 mph whilst on a weekend 'pleasure ride' it is closer to 15 mph

I am aware that my weakness lie in my general fitness and my up hill technique.

Fitness will come with eating sensibly and regular exercise.

Up hill though requires improving my hill technique, in addition to fitness. DO I stand up, do I sit, do I maintain my cadence as high as practical? I have a Garmin 705 with both the cadence sensor and HRM attached. I am currently trying to keep a higher cadence and use the gears accordingly.

Adrian

 

[marinyork]

Find a medium sized hill, say 500ft that includes some reasonable gradients such as 7, 8, 9, 10% and do repetitions of this. Start of doing the hill, wheeling back down the bottom and then a short rest and do it second time. After a few training sessions like this do the 500ft hill and then immediately do it again and if you're feeling it easier on a good day do it a 3rd or 4th time.

 

[Sapper]

Marin,

Thanks for this, similar to brckers's suggestion..

I think I know such a hill but might be too steep but will try it next time I cycle home from work..

What sort of cadence should I be looking at maintaining?

Find a medium sized hill, say 500ft that includes some reasonable gradients such as 7, 8, 9, 10% and do repetitions of this. Start of doing the hill, wheeling back down the bottom and then a short rest and do it second time. After a few training sessions like this do the 500ft hill and then immediately do it again and if you're feeling it easier on a good day do it a 3rd or 4th time.

 

[marinyork]

What sort of cadence should I be looking at maintaining?

Everyone's different. I do all right on hills because I can push low to middling gears much faster than similar low ability riders to myself. If you watch some other newbies on hills you'll see their cadence goes totally to pot it might become completely lethargic and be 15-45 rpm. You don't need a stupidly high cadence up a hill 60+ will do, just enough not to mess up the knees. As you get better at it and on longer climbs you'll probably be able to get a higher cadence and get into a nice rhythm. For some of the shorter climbs you might have to grin and bear it and honk your way up with a bit of temporary pain.

If the hill's too steep work on it anyway. Just focus on getting up it by any means, never mind the tailored training. After a few weeks you'll be passably good at it and can start paying attention to what gear you do the hill in, what speed, what cadence and you can set yourself a few goals. Say your typical climbing speed up a hill is 7mph, try and do it at 8.5mph that sort of thing. Flick up one gear and try and maintain the same cadence, that sort of thing. Get a good warm up before you really push a steep one though.

I'm sure with such healthy average speeds you don't need tips from me though. It'll soon be me wanting tips off you

 

[Banjo]

On the front or the rear gear?

I presume you mean the rear. I do not know what cassette i have though can have a look...

Would a change in cassette affect down hill performance?

Adrian

A larger cog on the rear cassette would allow you to spin at a faster cadence going uphill. For more speed downhill you need a smaller cog at the rear or a larger chainwheel at the front.

I changed my rear cassette from an 11 to 25 to an 11 to 28 ,the extra 3 teeth make a surprising amount of difference on a hill when your tired.

Good Luck from another old Sapper.

 

[515mm]

I wouldn't worry about downhill performance so much. Folk of our ability are much better off getting into a nice comfy yet aerodynamic position and worry about spotting hazards and braking for corners!
We can gain far more speed by being smooth and tidy through the bends at high speed rather than worry about spinning out a 50x12. Remember every increase in speed requires an increase of the cube of power to overcome air resistance. Trying to accelerate from 30 to 33 mph by pedalling costs us a lot of energy - much easier to get on the drops, cover the brakes, relax and concentrate on the bends.

Like Banjo said If you changed from your (probably if you have a standard road bike) 12-25 cassette of sprockets to a 14-27, you'd probably not notice the difference in top speed, but you would appreciate the low 27tooth gear for climbing hills and the nice close gear ratios which will enable you to keep to a constant cadence - which is much easier to achieve and more comfortable than a constant power output.

Oh, I live in hilly South Wales btw - where we have the Dragon Ride like.

Another hill tip is to always keep pedalling over the top of the hill and DOWN THE OTHER SIDE! You don't have to put much effort in - just keep the legs turning over and flicking up through the gears as you spin them out. When you get to the bottom of the hill you'll be moving much faster than if you merely freewheeled down and your legs will not be as stiff - you'll also not have to accelerate to your regular cruising speed - just gradually change down until you can maintain a gear.

The alternative is to freewheel from the top after caning your legs on the climb, allowing lactic acid to remain in your muscles. They - and you - cool down rapidly on the descent. You get to the base of the hill and slow down. You think that you better start pedalling again and then realise you have to accelerate to your regular cruising speed with cold, stiff legs that are powered with muscles that remain full of lactic acid.

Try it - it works like a bloody charm!

 

[Brahan]

There's no real shortcut to going faster, unfortunately. You're going to have to push yourself at some point. And motivation - well you've either got it or you haven't.

+1

It needs to hurt to get better. From my own experience, I learned that high cadence in a low gear was the only way I could climb Kidds Hill in Sussex. I failed at my first attempt and suffered the walk of shame. But then realised I needed to spin my fat legs as fast as possible and not look at the top of the hill but to remain focussed on the road about 8 metres in front of me. It worked a treat and after I had beaten it once the challenge was then to do it in a harder gear.

Don't buy a new cassette dude, tough it out with the gear you have

EDIT: What I believe about hill climbing is that a lot of it is in your head. I was just about to pack in my effort up The Beacon when a voice from behind me said, "you're nearly there mate." I promise, it was all I needed to continue. I never got the chance to thank that guy either, but his encouragement got me up there. I remember having trainers on normal pedals and swaying to the left and just about to put my foot down when the voice came. Cheers fellah.

 

[gb155]

You arent allways going to be in an attacking mood on your commute. How about a larger cassette?

Now, Banjo, Mate, you know im gonna bring you to task on that statement :-)

 

[Banjo]

Were not all as committed as you Gaz :-) .

I have to admit that especially after a nightshift occasionally I envy the blokes getting into cars.

It also surprises me how I tackle the same hills in much different gear ratios . I can get home (uphill mostly) using only the middle chain ring but more usually use the granny on the steeper bits.

Most of the time I look forward to getting on the bike ,it clears my head of work stuff before I get home.