ROSPA HGV/Cyclist Safety Video

[Origamist]

Good(ish) awareness vid:

http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/resources/videos/cycling.html

 

[MartinC]

Couldn't view it with the sound on at work - I'll take a look when I get home.

I lost all respect for RoSPA recently when I read the helmet plug on their website - I was genuinely surprised at how deliberately dishonest their presentation was.

 

[Origamist]

I was pleased to see it was sponsored by Cemex, mentioned ASLs and filtering (although they could have made more of this) and was presented in a clear/concise way. The "stay back, stay safe" slogan is simple and gets the message across.

No mention of railings though - this should have been emphasised as an additional hazard. It might also have been useful to warn cyclists against the "follow my leader" filtering phenomenon that happens at junctions.

I'd also question the need for the cyclist to get so close to kerb and HGV when waiting at the lights. He may be able to see you in his mirrors if he looks, but I'd rather be further back and in the centre of the lane (ideally when he's hopefully clocked me) when waiting at the lights as another left turning vehicle will often pull along side, hemming you in. I guess an advantage of being left/closer is that it might inhibit other cyclists from going up the inside though...

Hi Viz, lights and reflectors all get a mention or are prominent, but not helmets...

 

[SlowCoach]

I'd also question the need for the cyclist to get so close to kerb and HGV when waiting at the lights. He may be able to see you in his mirrors if he looks, but I'd rather be further back and in the centre of the lane (ideally when he's hopefully clocked me) when pulling away from the lights as another left turning vehicle will often pull along side, hemming you in.

I concur. The cyclist's positioning next to the kerb was bad (I used to stop there so I could be seen, but kept having other HGVs pull alongside and put me back in the death zone). Much better to take the centre of the lane, but leave some distance but watch for his reversing lights.

 

[summerdays]

Next week at the council bike breakfast apparently there is going to be a lorry for us to be able to get into the cab and see what they can actually see from the driving seat. I'm hoping I get the chance to do that.

I think they should have also mentioned moving forward if in front of a lorry - to make sure you are visible from the cab.

I recently found out from one of the bin men that their lorries have camera's at the back so that they can see behind (makes sense given that there are often bin men at the back of the bin lorry). But it was interesting to know that they knew I was there even when I couldn't see their mirror's (I was still well back from the lorry - but in primary position to prevent a car from overtaking me).

 

[Origamist]

Next week at the council bike breakfast apparently there is going to be a lorry for us to be able to get into the cab and see what they can actually see from the driving seat. I'm hoping I get the chance to do that.

I think they should have also mentioned moving forward if in front of a lorry - to make sure you are visible from the cab.

HGV awareness days are worthwhile, but I'd ask what mirrors are fitted to the cab as it makes a difference to what can be seen.

As regards moving in front of the HGV/getting their attention, if the vehicle comes along side you - definitely. But if you are in the centre of the lane as is recommended, you should be able to stop them coming along side (he will have seen you) - still worth reminding the driver you're there with eye contact/mad waving etc.

Two-lanes are more problematic - and very occasionally I have jumped lights in these situations.

The thrust of the video is about the dangers of undertaking HGVs at junctions, but I'd agree that it could have looked at a few related issues and provided additional guidance.

 

[Bokonon]

The thrust of the video is about the dangers of undertaking HGVs at junctions, but I'd agree that it could have looked at a few related issues and provided additional guidance.

I think on the whole it is a good video, and contains good guidance that has been a long time coming. The next challenge is to get the video viewed by the people who most need to see it!

There are a whole lot of issues around cyclists at lights/junctions, of which undertaking large vehicles is one of the most dangerous. Tackling this is a very good first step to improving cyclists' behaviour at junctions. Going into more depth would, at this stage, have been inappropriate - key points need to be fed in small chunks and "stay back, stay safe" does this quite well.

 

[summerdays]

HGV awareness days are worthwhile, but I'd ask what mirrors are fitted to the cab as it makes a difference to what can be seen.

What would you be hoping the answer would be to what mirrors were fitted?

As regards moving in front of the HGV/getting their attention, if the vehicle comes along side you - definitely. But if you are in the centre of the lane as is recommended, you should be able to stop them coming along side (he will have seen you) - still worth reminding the driver you're there with eye contact/mad waving etc.

Two-lanes are more problematic - and very occasionally I have jumped lights in these situation.

The thrust of the video is about the dangers of undertaking HGVs at junctions, but I'd agree that it could have looked at a few related issues and provided additional guidance.

I meant in Primary in front of them - I still feel that when they are up in their cab, if I am immediately in front of them I feel a little invisible unsure if they have seen me - where as pulling forward a little (if necessary over the line), I am more clearly visible. Though from stationary I should always be able to beat a lorry I think.

 

[stoatsngroats]

I think they should have also mentioned moving forward if in front of a lorry - to make sure you are visible from the cab.

Hopefully, you'll get the chance to sit in a lorry cab, if you do, see what forward view you get too.....sometimes, if its a 3 step cab, you'd need to be at least 6-8 feet in front to be seen by the lorry driver, any closer, and you still may not be seen!

My choice as a cyclist and an HGV driver, is to sit behind, in primary, where possible, and far enough beck to get out of the way...

 

[very-near]

Couldn't view it with the sound on at work - I'll take a look when I get home.

I lost all respect for RoSPA recently when I read the helmet plug on their website - I was genuinely surprised at how deliberately dishonest their presentation was.

Q - would or have you put a cycle hat on your children when they were learning to ride a cycle ?

 

[summerdays]

Hopefully, you'll get the chance to sit in a lorry cab, if you do, see what forward view you get too.....sometimes, if its a 3 step cab, you'd need to be at least 6-8 feet in front to be seen by the lorry driver, any closer, and you still may not be seen!

My choice as a cyclist and an HGV driver, is to sit behind, in primary, where possible, and far enough beck to get out of the way...

That's what I mean - I want to be that distance in front. But I don't go up the side to get there and I'm happy to sit a bit behind a lorry as long as it doesn't have its reversing lights on and that they are working! I'm hoping there isn't too big a queue to sit in the cab as I won't have ages to stop at the breakfast.

 

[Origamist]

I think on the whole it is a good video, and contains good guidance that has been a long time coming. The next challenge is to get the video viewed by the people who most need to see it!

There have been a couple of vids in the past, but this is a step forward for sure. The second point is well made as reaching a wider audience will not be easy. Start disseminating, Bokonon!

There are a whole lot of issues around cyclists at lights/junctions, of which undertaking large vehicles is one of the most dangerous. Tackling this is a very good first step to improving cyclists' behaviour at junctions. Going into more depth would, at this stage, have been inappropriate - key points need to be fed in small chunks and "stay back, stay safe" does this quite well.

The problem is I'm doubtful a part deux will follow soon - ancillary issues will therefore not be addressed. That said, I'm a firm believer in KISS and the film gets its key message across successfully, IMO.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

You can sit in my cab any day Summerdays! Mine has excellent visibility to the front and mirrors everywhere, so it's probably not representative of most trucks out there.

 

[Origamist]

What would you be hoping the answer would be to what mirrors were fitted?.

Class VI safety mirrors. These mirrors give a view of the road directly in front of the driver’s cab.

I meant in Primary in front of them - I still feel that when they are up in their cab, if I am immediately in front of them I feel a little invisible unsure if they have seen me - where as pulling forward a little (if necessary over the line), I am more clearly visible. Though from stationary I should always be able to beat a lorry I think.

I'm all for reminding the driver (with some histrionics) that I have not teleported myself to another postcode when he pulls up behind me...!

 

[MartinC]

Q - would or have you put a cycle hat on your children when they were learning to ride a cycle ?

All right, I give in. I can't see any logical connection between my post and your question.

My post was indirectly related to the OP - it was an explanation of my suspension of judgement about the RoSPA video (which I think is worthwhile now that I've seen it).

Your post is a non sequitur - don't spoil Origamist's thread. Start another if you really want to explain your abstruse point.