Pedestrian crossings - flashing green man

[annedonnelly]

Sorry, this isn't a cycling related thread but I know there are people on here who know about this stuff.

Can anyone point me to legislation about how long the flashing green man should operate on pedestrian crossings please? I'm extremely frustrated by how short a time is allowed for crossing on some of Newcastle's city centre crossings. I walk briskly and tend to anticipate the light changes but I barely have time to cross some of them. Small children or someone with mobility problems have no chance of crossing the entire road while the light is flashing.

If I can see what the rules are I may be able to complain about it.

 

[tom73]

Don’t think they have any rules that are set in stone. Ave is about 8 seconds. I do know that the NICE not too long ago issued a report looking into getting people active and inc crossing times and the need for transport planners to look at them. To better take into account the needs of users.

Good pratice for newer puffin type are here.
http://webarchive.nationalarchives....pgr/roads/tss/gpg/puffingoodpracticeguide.pdf

 

[Slick]

I always assumed that you only had to worry about the green man as you started to cross as once you were on the road you had priority?

 

[MontyVeda]

Definitely have priority if you're in the process of crossing... but whether most drivers are aware of this isn't always clear.

 

[classic33]

"The timing for the flashing green figure/flashing amber period should normally be set at. 6 seconds."

From this...

 

[keithmac]

I had ti smile at the ones in London with the big countdown timers, presumably id you're still on the road at 0 you're fair game!.

 

[Bazzer]

I think they can be varied, although in whose area changing them would fall, I am not sure. My guess would be the local authority as they generally are responsible for roads.
There are two pelicans in the nearest town to my home, where there is a high elderly population. They stay on flashing green for longer than most other pelicans I have experienced. There is also one in Irlam near a school, which seems to take longer than other pelicans.
Some city centre roads for historical reasons may be wider than average, so it seems pretty dumb for someone in a transport department to assume the standard time for crossing would apply to those.

 

[Deleted member 26715]

You're lucky the new ones in Sheffield don't have any lights for the pedestrians, the only clue you have is the panel above the button, how you are supposed to see that when there are other people there I don't know

 

[Katherine]

I think the flashing lights and beeps are the time allowed to start crossing, not finish crossing. So, once you've started crossing, you are fine.

 

[HLaB]

Sorry, this isn't a cycling related thread but I know there are people on here who know about this stuff.

Can anyone point me to legislation about how long the flashing green man should operate on pedestrian crossings please? I'm extremely frustrated by how short a time is allowed for crossing on some of Newcastle's city centre crossings. I walk briskly and tend to anticipate the light changes but I barely have time to cross some of them. Small children or someone with mobility problems have no chance of crossing the entire road while the light is flashing.

If I can see what the rules are I may be able to complain about it.

Sounds like the older type Pelican rather than the newer type Puffin (Pedestrian User Friendly). The newer crossing it'll have On Crossing Detectors that will extend the green man to give slower folk time to cross and the flashing man has been done away with, there were found to encourage accidents and encourage drivers to be impatient and harass. Most councils have upgraded to the Puffin standard or are in the process.

 

[classic33]

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/puffin-crossing

 

[Deleted member 26715]

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/puffin-crossing

Thanks but from experience I can say they don't work, whoever decided they were safer when setup in their laboratory needs to come & use the one on West Bar Green in Sheffield they are positively dangerous compared to the ones they replaced

 

[classic33]

From the earlier link, they appear to work on a walking speed of 31/2 feet per second.

Edited to include unit being used.

 

[mjr]

Sounds like the older type Pelican rather than the newer type Puffin (Pedestrian User Friendly). The newer crossing it'll have On Crossing Detectors that will extend the green man to give slower folk time to cross and the flashing man has been done away with, there were found to encourage accidents and encourage drivers to be impatient and harass. Most councils have upgraded to the Puffin standard or are in the process.

The ones near me only extend the red lights on the carriageway, not the green man. If somebody is still on the crossing, I cross too, despite the red man. It nearly always keeps the lights red. I am not waiting two minutes for the next green man!

And I agree that many (most?) are no safer. Rip the lot up and replace them all with zebras!

 

[mjr]

You're lucky the new ones in Sheffield don't have any lights for the pedestrians, the only clue you have is the panel above the button, how you are supposed to see that when there are other people there I don't know

You wait for the people nearest the panel to start walking, hoping it's because there's a green man and not just getting bored waiting!

Some councils have started putting repeater panels higher up the poles, which rather defeats the object of getting people waiting to cross to look at traffic that might fail to stop for red lights. Well, unless we want them to look for low flying aircraft too!