Over 50's in most e-bike accindents: Netherlands.
- Thread starter PK99
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wiggydiggy
Guru
"E-Bikes are heavier and go faster than conventional models" - Stated a surgeon not a bike expert.
Heavier - maybe, mine is certainly heavier but their are plenty of e-bikes that are lighter than many conventional bikes.
Faster - Only in acceleration, if Dutch rules are the same as ours then it only helps with acceleration and offers no top speed advantage.
Heavier - maybe, mine is certainly heavier but their are plenty of e-bikes that are lighter than many conventional bikes.
Faster - Only in acceleration, if Dutch rules are the same as ours then it only helps with acceleration and offers no top speed advantage.
BoldonLad
Not part of the Elite
- Location
- South Tyneside
Without knowing the age profile of e-Bike riders, the article headline is meaningless.
It could be that most e-Bike riders are over 50
it could be that the advent of e-bikes has encouraged more over 50s to cycle
It could be that most e-Bike riders are over 50
it could be that the advent of e-bikes has encouraged more over 50s to cycle
T4tomo
Legendary Member
on average they are heavier, and even the lightest ebikes are heavier than the equivalent regular bike, unless you can get negative mass motors...
Its more likely to be the unexpectedly quicker acceleration catching out the old codgers....
roubaixtuesday
self serving virtue signaller
Probably for an old codger used to a weighty sit up and beg Dutch roadster, an e-bike would be a lot faster in both acceleration and cruising speed.
lazybloke
Priest of the cult of Chris Rea
- Location
- Leafy Surrey
What shape helmet protects against vertebral fractures?
wiggydiggy
Guru
Sorry I meant maybe as in "weight maybe linked to more accidents, but we don't know either way". I do agree on average they are heavier.
See below for acceleration.
We really need to know more about what types of bike are involved in the accidents, and how their acceleration compares to what the person who had the accident was riding before.
The dutch have two sets of laws for e-bikes based on wether it is a standard (max speed 25kph) or fast (max speed 45kph). I'm guessing that is the same as over here where "max speed" actually means "max assisted speed". Either way if you are riding the second type of bike in Holland you are already required to wear a helmet.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
It could be the bikes cost rather more, so it tends to be older riders with a greater financial wherewithal that uses them. We simply do not know.
But this is typical. Someone with zero insight into any demographic cause behind the numbers, zero expertise in cycling beyond possibly being able to ride about themselves, and zero expertise in protective equipment airing their hoity toity opinions about the place. We've got politicians to do that for us, don't need Doctors Behaving that way as well.
But this is typical. Someone with zero insight into any demographic cause behind the numbers, zero expertise in cycling beyond possibly being able to ride about themselves, and zero expertise in protective equipment airing their hoity toity opinions about the place. We've got politicians to do that for us, don't need Doctors Behaving that way as well.
All uphill
Still rolling along
- Location
- Somerset
I notice there is no absolute rate of accidents given, no estimate of the health benefits of cycling or what the consequences of enforced helmet wearing might be.
My 88 year old Dutch ex MIL would immediately stop cycling if she had to mess up her appearance with a helmet!
My 88 year old Dutch ex MIL would immediately stop cycling if she had to mess up her appearance with a helmet!
mjr
Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
- Location
- mostly Norfolk, sometimes Somerset
I'm pretty sure one of the Belgian road safety organisations was in the news after finding that ebike rider training reduced injuries more, which makes sense because most of the 'extra' injuries are falls not head impacts.
But I'm told that the UK government is considering reducing the current meagre Bikeability budget, allegedly because it teaches people how to ride on road while some ministers would prefer nervous cyclists to walk between cycleways.
But I'm told that the UK government is considering reducing the current meagre Bikeability budget, allegedly because it teaches people how to ride on road while some ministers would prefer nervous cyclists to walk between cycleways.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
I'm not sure BB is fit for purpose any way, although the aim is noble.
BoldonLad
Not part of the Elite
- Location
- South Tyneside
We have visited Netherlands on a few occasions, over the years. I never cease to be amazed at:
- the sheer number of people cycling
- the number of elderly (I am 75, so, elderly, to me is 75+
) and apparently infirm people cycling- the apparent lack of effort as they waft past us, on what appear to be ancient bicycles
- biggest shock, cars actually give way to cyclists!
Pale Rider
Legendary Member
Steady on, a trauma surgeon is well entitled to comment on people he's put back together.
It's up to the reader to decide if he has any expertise outside of his healing hands.
Reminds me of the head A&E surgeon at Sunderland who decided to comment on a brewery's application to open another pub in the town.
He said: "I'd like to invite the chairman of the brewery to join me on a weekend night shift when I'm picking glass out of people's faces who have imbibed too much of his product."
Does the surgeon know anything about the night time economy, planning, the perceived need for more licensed premises?
Absolutely not, but his remarks certainly struck a chord with residents.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
A trauma surgeon is well entitled to pass comment about injury.
He is not qualified to comment upon the external physics behind it, any more than Einsteinm a renowned physicist, could give a credible insight into trauma surgery.
For example, I doubt he could accurately tell you the rate of acceleration of an object under gravity without checking. If he's well read he might get close and say 10m/s2, which is still far enough out to produce significant error when calculating the fall of an object - such as a cyclist - due to gravity.
For example, if he knew about acceleration due to gravity he would know that a heavy ebike falls at exactly the same rate as a super light carbon job.
As such the weight, more more correctly the mass, of a bike is irrelevant unless it actually lands on your head, in which case helmets are a moot point as they're not designed to provide protection in vehicular collisions, only contact with the ground.
Such matters are simply beyond his expertise, yet he feels qualified to comment upon them with authority. This must surely be seen by any reasonable observer as odd.
He is stepping beyond his own training and expertise and is stacking assumption upon preconception and demanding action on the basis of the resulting faulty reasoning. When politicians do this we call it populism.
There may well be something in that which he claims, but the arguments he presents are faulty.
The matter needs proper, holistic investigation by those qualified in every field involved, and not simply the voice of one person who is stretching credulity beyond the limits of his actual expertise. Indeed, the keen amateurs above have already picked fault with some of his reasoning and assumptions, or at the very least raised credible doubt worthy of proper research before anyone gets remotely close to basing legislation upon it.
As aforementioned, we have politicians to talk pants for us. We do not need supposedly learned people joining in such behaviour.
He is not qualified to comment upon the external physics behind it, any more than Einsteinm a renowned physicist, could give a credible insight into trauma surgery.
For example, I doubt he could accurately tell you the rate of acceleration of an object under gravity without checking. If he's well read he might get close and say 10m/s2, which is still far enough out to produce significant error when calculating the fall of an object - such as a cyclist - due to gravity.
For example, if he knew about acceleration due to gravity he would know that a heavy ebike falls at exactly the same rate as a super light carbon job.
As such the weight, more more correctly the mass, of a bike is irrelevant unless it actually lands on your head, in which case helmets are a moot point as they're not designed to provide protection in vehicular collisions, only contact with the ground.
Such matters are simply beyond his expertise, yet he feels qualified to comment upon them with authority. This must surely be seen by any reasonable observer as odd.
He is stepping beyond his own training and expertise and is stacking assumption upon preconception and demanding action on the basis of the resulting faulty reasoning. When politicians do this we call it populism.
There may well be something in that which he claims, but the arguments he presents are faulty.
The matter needs proper, holistic investigation by those qualified in every field involved, and not simply the voice of one person who is stretching credulity beyond the limits of his actual expertise. Indeed, the keen amateurs above have already picked fault with some of his reasoning and assumptions, or at the very least raised credible doubt worthy of proper research before anyone gets remotely close to basing legislation upon it.
As aforementioned, we have politicians to talk pants for us. We do not need supposedly learned people joining in such behaviour.
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Gwylan
Veteran
- Location
- All at sea⛵
Just another non numerate journo expert looking for something his sub will like and fill a space.
