Need help identifying frameset

[pamaguahiker]

I have a frameset that I am looking to clean up and repaint, restore. I do not have any history other than it might be Italian. That’s pretty broad. I took some pictures of the lugs and other details. The foil stickers that are on it are I never asked to whether they are original. Some of them look like they were put on after market. The headset has no name. The pump brackets do not have a name. The seat collar is Unknown whether it’s a name or design. If it’s a name, it look like it may start with a C, Unknown second letter, S 3rd. But that’s kind of conjecture because it’s Unknown not that is for sure. There is no serial number near the headset anywhere, none on the sheet cluster and none on the bottom bracket.

Please look it over and let me know if anyone has ideas on how to possibly date or identify.

Thank you in advance

 

[biggs682]

Welcome @pamaguahiker
Looks interesting and I always think people don't add chrome to cheap bikes so from that point of view I would think quality but then the rear brake bridge and the stand mount plate are unusual on quality bikes but if they are what the original owner wanted then the frame maker would supply.
Just enjoy what ever you do with it

 

[midlife]

Can’t make up my mind about how old. Late 60’s / 70’s maybe. Reminds me of Puch (Steyer-Daimler-Puch).

 

[pamaguahiker]

Welcome @pamaguahiker
Looks interesting and I always think people don't add chrome to cheap bikes so from that point of view I would think quality but then the rear brake bridge and the stand mount plate are unusual on quality bikes but if they are what the original owner wanted then the frame maker would supply.
Just enjoy what ever you do with it

Those were kind of my thoughts too. The rear chrome triangle, and chrome lugs. But then you look at that rear break bridge and the bottom plate and it makes you wander. it could be quite old or maybe somebody making his first frame and using what parts they have lying around. It’s a mystery.

 

[pamaguahiker]

I thought I would share the information that I got from another source. It seems this gentleman really, really knew what he was talking about and could identify all the bits on this frame set.

Here’s his response and it can probably help in the future too. It was like an education session for me.

frame bits -

head lugs: Agrati "SPORT" ART. 000.80050/E/U
upper is Nr. 000.8054
lower is Nr. 000.8053

seat lug: Agrati "SPORT" Nr. 005.8059

bottom bracket shell: Agrati "SPORT" Nr. 005.8057

fork crown (under the cap): probably Agrati "SPORT" Nr. 026.8058; should you have occasion to disassemble headset you could remove cap to facilitate specific ID

plate style chainstay & seat stay bridges: Agrati

chainstay stop & top tube housing stops: Campag Nr. 621

dropouts: Agrati Nr. 000.8002

fork ends: Agrati Nr. 000.8010

drive side derailleur cable guide: Campag Nr. 663

---

 

[biggs682]

Did he mention who put them altogether?

 

[pamaguahiker]

Did he mention who put them altogether?

Yea. Some guiding info here, lots of info:

marque: good to remember that most Italian retail cycle shops have a house brand, there are thousands of these, if cycle were produced for one of these it would be quite challenging to identify

the most likely manner for a house branded machine to show up in PA would be if it were brought home by a traveler or member of the military
one major Italian producer who did a tremendous amount of private-labelling manufacture was Chiorda

do not wish to assert a manufacturer
forgot to give model information you inquired about

it "appears" it might be a half step or so up from the very base

the combination of two plate style bridges and the "bullet" seat stay caps suggest a low model

two details which bring it up slightly are the true three-piece head and the chrome plating

a very bottom model would have a bulge-formed head and no chrome

one easy check to determine frame tubing quality is to measure the seat post diameter

ordinary calibre high tensile frame tubing will have a seat post diameter of either 25.4mm or possibly 26.0mm

quality plain gauge tubesets for Italian machines tend to begin at 26.2mm seat post diameter

it does not merit a big investment as it would be easy to put more in than what it would be worth when completed

appreciate that if you approach project out of hobby interest this is a secondary consideration

two details which might possibly advance your identification inquiry would be if you could post images of the foil transfer remains and the seat binder collar marking

hope this helps a bit

 

[pamaguahiker]

thank you very much for the information. Yes it’s very strange as it appears to have those chrome front logs in the rear triangle. Yet the other pieces remind you of Gas pipe tubing, which I’ll check the diameter of the seat post, and the strange rear bridges.

This might be a candidate for me to just do a general cleanup and use as a fixed gear without any major crazy work. Or, clean it up and do it simple and fast re-spray and then build it up as a fixie and use it.

Remnants of the foil stickers did not give me much faith. I had some thoughts and. It saying. Super sprint. SPR on the down tube with the rest gone. And on the side with the EL visible. It made me think of gazelle. But the parts, bits and pieces don’t jive with that brand plus it was Unknown whether these were original foil stickers that were on it.

 

[biggs682]

Sounds like a quick and easy build up with minimal costs is a good job, but just enjoy @pamaguahiker

 

[simongt]

Reminds me of Puch (Steyer-Daimler-Puch).

It does have the flat plate between the chainstays instead of the more commonly used tubing. I believe this was common Puch practise in the 70s & 80s.