Magic answer sought

[BigonaBianchi]

Ok I know the best way to boost fitness is to ride ride ride....but im kinda doing that already (ish) . I have a little scope for riding more so I will up the miles etc.

The thing is I need to increase my speed over longer rides and I need to ride further without breaks. Reason, I will be riding with much fitter faster riders soon and need to be at a higher level.

I need some kind of exercises, or 'tips' I can build into my rides to boost my speed and and distance between breaks.

A magic answer if you like (yeah I now...lol!)

Currently I tend to ride for about 25-30 miles then stop for a few moments for a rest etc. My ave speeds over say 100 miles is about 15mph and higher over shorter distances..roughly.

In April I will be tour guiding much younger fitter team riders and I have to keep it up (fitness as well) over the winter months....The tours will be every day solid for 6 days then day off then start again. Each ride IRO 60-80 miles with a good degree of mountan climbs.

I will increase mileage, but I find recovery times get longer with increased years....being 53 now isnt in my favour I guess...

I tend to find my 'groove' and plod along at a comfy pace. Thing is that comfy pace isnt fast enough over distance.

I think what I am after is anything I can change/add to my riding style that will help. SO i know increasing base mileage etc is a must but its more about HOW i ride to max use of energy, increase ave speed ove rlonger distance, and how to climb better, especially as I am 100 kilos and 6'4".

Also how to recover better overnight.

Riding at my own pace is easy, riding with clients who are younger and fitter and more hung up on strava stats is something I need to get used to.

Magic wand required...or at least a few sensible comments on how to build pace over distance and recover quickly overnight.

 

[Kevoffthetee]

I've been advised if time or distance is limited then hit the hills. The more you work the muscle, the stronger they will get and the faster you'll get

As for recovery, I've been paying close attention to liquids and carbs with significantly reduced recovery time. Drinking plenty of water before during and after a ride, you can never drink too much. When your taking a break when out on your bike, buy additional fluids and restock your bottles.

Also before and after I go for a ride, I've started drinking strawberry milkshake. Tesco own brand gives 9g protein and 29g carbs per serving so I haven't bothered with SIS or High5 shakes

 

[Rob3rt]

I've been advised if time or distance is limited then hit the hills. The more you work the muscle, the stronger they will get and the faster you'll get

As for recovery, I've been paying close attention to liquids and carbs with significantly reduced recovery time. Drinking plenty of water before during and after a ride, you can never drink too much. When your taking a break when out on your bike, buy additional fluids and restock your bottles.

Also before and after I go for a ride, I've started drinking strawberry milkshake. Tesco own brand gives 9g protein and 29g carbs per serving so I haven't bothered with SIS or High5 shakes

That is not how cycling fitness works! Cycling is not a strength sport.

Yes you can and whilst most people don't drink enough to actually do themselves any harm, I would hazard a guess that most people drink more than they need to! It is not uncommon for excessive liquid consumption to have a larger negative effect on performance (stomach upset and the exertion poops or sicky) than minor dehydration. It makes me laugh when I see someone carrying a drink in a 25 mile or shorter time trial unless the temperature is VERY hot. You would lose more time sitting up to drink from the bottle and/or feeling sick from ingesting liquids at that intensity than you would if you accepted you were going to get a little bit dehydrated and pressed on!

Good solution, although I'd opt for Chocolate, the problem arising from this though is that milk goes bad, therefore it is sometimes more convenient/safer to have a sachet and mix it in a bottle with water when needed.

 

[Rob3rt]

Back to the OP,

As I understand it, you want to get a little faster but without investing yet more time into cycling (more time cycling is not the answer anyway IMO, you already do plenty of riding). If you wish to increase your speed over longer distances you should read up on tempo and sweetspot training, you needn't go all structured or scientific here, but understand a little about what is going on and do some!

A simple way to go about it would be to start dropping say 2 x 15 mins minutes worth pushing on at a pace that renders it difficult to say more than a few words at a time (this tends to happen around ~85% MHR for many people) into your current rides. Over time, either extend the duration or start to do more than one "interval" break it up so you are increasing the time but in chunks, eg. you might start with 2 x 15 mins, then 2 x 20 mins, then 3 x 15 mins, then 2 x 25 mins mins etc. It doesn't have to be structured, just drop it on where you see fit. Doing this, you will be getting in some solid work, but the resulting fatigue will not be excessive, so you should be able to do several days back to back. Eventually you will be able to ride at this intensity for several hours at a time, for several days in succession.

Additionally, your FTP will be increasing without you directly targeting it, so not only will you be able to ride for longer at 85% of FTP, 85% of FTP will actually be a higher value (power wise) so you are going to be faster and for longer!

The blocks above seem quite rigid etc, this is for the sake of illustration, the reality is, structure can be minimal, say you are out for ~2 hours, you decide I will get ~40 mins of tempo in during this ride, then out on the road you come to a nice long climb so you maybe say, "okay I'm going for 15 mins now", and do it. A bit later you get a nice flat section, "I'll press on for 20 mins" and do it. You get home and have done 35 mins of effort during your 2 hour ride. That's fine!

 

[ColinJ]

Congratulations on the tour job!

I reckon you can sort out your speed on the flat easily enough, but 100 kg is a lot to cart up mountains - I know because I've done it myself! Every kg you can shed is going to make that a lot easier.

I have got down from a peak of about 106 kg to about 78 kg now, and can probably lose at least another 3 kg without too much difficulty. It has made a huge difference to my climbing ability. Even with damaged lungs, I am going uphill faster than any time since 2006.

You are 3 inches taller than me so perhaps a more realistic target weight for you might be 80-85 kg?

 

[ColinJ]

Hmm - I just noticed the frequency of riding that you will be attempting ... Doing about 400 miles of mountainous riding week after week is going to be hard work with only 1 rest day a week! You will either get super-fit or grind yourself down. Any chance of arranging that the mid-week ride is an easier one, say 45-50 slower miles with not much climbing and a decent cafe stop?

 

[Rob3rt]

Something people don't realise with a rest day, you are actually, in most cases getting 48 hours rest (if you train/ride at the same time each day), that should be plenty for most people

 

[ScotiaLass]

That is not how cycling fitness works! Cycling is not a strength sport.

Yes you can and whilst most people don't drink enough to actually do themselves any harm, I would hazard a guess that most people drink more than they need to! It is not uncommon for excessive liquid consumption to have a larger negative effect on performance (stomach upset and the exertion poops or sicky) than minor dehydration. It makes me laugh when I see someone carrying a drink in a 25 mile or shorter time trial unless the temperature is VERY hot. You would lose more time sitting up to drink from the bottle and/or feeling sick from ingesting liquids at that intensity than you would if you accepted you were going to get a little bit dehydrated and pressed on!

Good solution, although I'd opt for Chocolate, the problem arising from this though is that milk goes bad, therefore it is sometimes more convenient/safer to have a sachet and mix it in a bottle with water when needed.

Thank goodness it's not me then. I only drink 500ml or less on a 15-25 mile ride and Houghton I wasn't drinking enough. I'm never in a rush though

 

[ColinJ]

Something people don't realise with a rest day, you are actually, in most cases getting 48 hours rest (if you train/ride at the same time each day), that should be plenty for most people

It might be ok for a month or two, but to try and keep it up for a year? He would be doing 20,000+ mountainous miles! Ok for a pro, but that is some mileage for a 53 year old non-pro ...

 

[Rob3rt]

It might be ok for a month or two, but to try and keep it up for a year? He would be doing 20,000+ mountainous miles! Ok for a pro, but that is some mileage for a 53 year old non-pro ...

I doubt he will be expected to do this year round without some built in down time, don't forget even if a full time, year round position, he will get holidays...

 

[ColinJ]

It would be quite interesting to hear how you get on @BigonaBianchi, so remember to let us know!

 

[400bhp]

Rob's reply is perfect.

I think you answered it yourself somwehat -you get into a groove. Having been through it (and I'm sure a lot on here have, especially Rob) you have to push yourself to improve. Simplistically, the legs need to hurt.

I do no structured training whatsoever (I probably should) but I have got faster by simply getting out of my comfort zone for prolonged periods (and usually sat behind @Hacienda71 ). Do you have a fast(er) rider you can go out with as just being with someone who pushes on can help a lot.

 

[ayceejay]

This is what will happen: day one your young clients will ride like hell racing and competing with you and themselves,
Day two: 50% will not turn up and the others will be looking to you to slow the pace.
The rest of the week you will be fine.

 

[BigonaBianchi]

Back to the OP,

As I understand it, you want to get a little faster but without investing yet more time into cycling (more time cycling is not the answer anyway IMO, you already do plenty of riding). If you wish to increase your speed over longer distances you should read up on tempo and sweetspot training, you needn't go all structured or scientific here, but understand a little about what is going on and do some!

A simple way to go about it would be to start dropping say 2 x 15 mins minutes worth pushing on at a pace that renders it difficult to say more than a few words at a time (this tends to happen around ~85% MHR for many people) into your current rides. Over time, either extend the duration or start to do more than one "interval" break it up so you are increasing the time but in chunks, eg. you might start with 2 x 15 mins, then 2 x 20 mins, then 3 x 15 mins, then 2 x 25 mins mins etc. It doesn't have to be structured, just drop it on where you see fit. Doing this, you will be getting in some solid work, but the resulting fatigue will not be excessive, so you should be able to do several days back to back. Eventually you will be able to ride at this intensity for several hours at a time, for several days in succession.

Additionally, your FTP will be increasing without you directly targeting it, so not only will you be able to ride for longer at 85% of FTP, 85% of FTP will actually be a higher value (power wise) so you are going to be faster and for longer!

The blocks above seem quite rigid etc, this is for the sake of illustration, the reality is, structure can be minimal, say you are out for ~2 hours, you decide I will get ~40 mins of tempo in during this ride, then out on the road you come to a nice long climb so you maybe say, "okay I'm going for 15 mins now", and do it. A bit later you get a nice flat section, "I'll press on for 20 mins" and do it. You get home and have done 35 mins of effort during your 2 hour ride. That's fine!

Thank you. This is the sort of thing I was thinking of with my rather long winded vague OP.

I wont be riding 6 days a week every week of the year !.....but will be riding on different tours as they fly in, hopefully on a reasonably regular basis throughout the season here which is spring and autumn.

Riding with a faster rider is what i have just been doing and hence my post lol!

Losinh weight is defo on the agenda big time, I did this recently via a dose of the nicossia shitz ....maybe not the best way though as its back on now ha ha....after a ride i am now using a recovery shake, which does seem to reduce the craving to eat an elephant.

The main thing for me I feel is to change how I ride when I am in the saddle, so I will try Rob3rt's suggestion ....getting more out of each ride is where I am at here rather than riding more.

Cheers all for input

 

[Joshua Plumtree]

Can we not just have an "Ask Robert " thread?