Knees starting to play up

[Old timer]

I`m 65, been back on a bike for 4 months and no big problems other than my knees are starting to feel a bit unstable when I get up in the morning and walking downstairs. My knees were starting to show signs of wear before I got back onto a bike (my trade saw me working on the floor down on my knees)

I know there is no big answer and accept that as time goes on from now things will get tougher but if I take something like cod liver oil or something else rich in Omega oils will that do anything to help.

A point of interest, I have two bikes and one of them is a 20 year old Evans that has a triple shimano biopace chain ring set and I have read on the web that some people indicate that that set up has caused them pain.

Also, as an oldie should I err on a slightly lower saddle height or a slightly higher saddle height than normal to help.

Thanks

 

[Chamfus Flange]

May sound strange you may want to get your gate checked by a Osteopath and take some glucosamine and chondroitin tablets.

I was having difficulty with walk to the point where I was thinking even a walk of any distance was going to be out of the question.

On the recommendation of a friend I went to a Osteopath and although he told me a lot about me and my body that I've not used since. He did tell me how to walk better which I tried and after finding it initially difficult and uncomfortable it did relieve pain in both knees and hips. I continue to use this "new" gate to this day and quiet naturally now.

The "new" gate didn't solve all my joint pain issues and after several visits to different professionals came up with glucosamine and chondroitin tablets. Taken daily this seem to relieve the remaining pain.

Maybe one or more of the above will help you. They've help me for the last ten years.

 

[Old timer]

May sound strange you may want to get your gate checked by a Osteopath and take some glucosamine and chondroitin tablets.

I was having difficulty with walk to the point where I was thinking even a walk of any distance was going to be out of the question.

On the recommendation of a friend I went to a Osteopath and although he told me a lot about me and my body that I've not used since. He did tell me how to walk better which I tried and after finding it initially difficult and uncomfortable it did relieve pain in both knees and hips. I continue to use this "new" gate to this day and quiet naturally now.

The "new" gate didn't solve all my joint pain issues and after several visits to different professionals came up with glucosamine and chondroitin tablets. Taken daily this seem to relieve the remaining pain.

Maybe one or more of the above will help you. They've help me for the last ten years.

a few people have told me to get glucosamine and chondroitin I get some and try them.
I`m just in general wearing out after 50 years of hard work

Thanks

 

[rmiker]

Oldtimer, at the same age as you, I am in the same situation. Have been trying to get my bike setup as comfortable as it can be.
Things tried so far.
Saddle, I have raised to let my knees stretch out more.
Stopped using SPD/toeclip pedals. Returned to standard double sided pedals to free my feet up and allow variable positions.
Am also far more conscientious about using lower/easier gears and just 'twiddling'.
Mike

 

[Old timer]

Raised my saddle today( about 1 1/2") using the on line guides, moved the saddle back 1" and went out for about a 10mile ride keeping the gears lower and making sure I don`t try to push too higher gear and my knees felt a lot better than they did yesterday after a ride. So we shall see how it goes. Obviously my knees are not as young as they used to be but as long as I can get my rides in without doing too much damage then I`ll be happy.

Thanks everyone for your advice.

 

[ASC1951]

a few people have told me to get glucosamine and chondroitin. I get some and try them.

Like most non-prescription treatments, there is a lot of hype and twaddle about these two compounds and very little evidence. There have been a few properly designed (i.e large numbers and double blind) trials on glucosamine, which suggest that it can relieve discomfort in mild to moderate osteoarthritis, but that's about it. We're not talking proper science here, but it might be worth having a go. (My experience was that they made no difference at all. That said, I do take cod liver oil and a multivitamin tablet every day, despite overwhelming evidence that supplements are a complete waste of money for anyone with a sensible diet).

A good cheap source for all these potions is www.zipvit.co.uk

I`m just in general wearing out after 50 years of hard work

Very possible, I'm afraid. It is several years now since my GP started saying to me "You do have to accept a certain amount of degenerative change."

The most important thing is to make sure that you have your bike set-up spot on.

 

[Fiona N]

Another thing to try - and comes with Burrows seal of approval - is shorter cranks. This sounds counter-intuitive (as the effect is to apparently increase the gearing as your lever - the crank - is shorter thus requires more force to turn a given gear) until you realise that if the lower pedal is half an inch higher, the saddle can go up a half inch and the top foot, when at the top of the cycle, is actually a full inch lower - and the knee that much less compressed. This can help if your problems are coming from decreasing mobility in the joint.

 

[Old timer]

Another thing to try - and comes with Burrows seal of approval - is shorter cranks. This sounds counter-intuitive (as the effect is to apparently increase the gearing as your lever - the crank - is shorter thus requires more force to turn a given gear) until you realise that if the lower pedal is half an inch higher, the saddle can go up a half inch and the top foot, when at the top of the cycle, is actually a full inch lower - and the knee that much less compressed. This can help if your problems are coming from decreasing mobility in the joint.

Yeh! all understood. The bike that has caused more problems is my Evans conversion and I just picked up a cheap 110BCD 5 bolt chainwheel (circular) of 48T as is the biopace just to throw on and try.

I did read on the web that if you can put your foot down when you stop easily then your saddle is too low.

 

[Old timer]

Getting up this morning and walking downstairs was a lot better than before I lifted the saddle and moved the seat. Obviously that was the main cause of the problem. don`t get me wrong my knees are well worn but a better riding position isn`t agrovating them.Also I found it easier to keep the legs more in a straight line rather than splaying out which I shall keep an eye on in the future.

Now I`m tempted to lift the saddle a touch more and find the limit.

 

[ASC1951]

Now I`m tempted to lift the saddle a touch more and find the limit.

This works for me in setting the coarse adjustment - at the bottom of the rotation with the heel of my cycling shoes on the pedal, my leg is locked out.

 

[catalan chris]

Glucosamine & Chondroitin

My neighbour's labrador developed a limp and the vets put her on G&C tablets. After a couple of months it seems to have worked a treat! [who needs scientific evidence?!]

I've started taking them as a preventative measure. No side effects - other than I chase cats when I'm cycling

 

[Old timer]

My neighbour's labrador developed a limp and the vets put her on G&C tablets. After a couple of months it seems to have worked a treat! [who needs scientific evidence?!]

I've started taking them as a preventative measure. No side effects - other than I chase cats when I'm cycling

 

[catalan chris]

Half-jesting. I do take G&C tabs and also cod liver oil. I'm convinced they help keep the joints in good condition but they won't prevent injury -and as all the good folk above have already said - getting the set up right on your bike - and then not going up hills in too high a gear - will treat your knees with the respect they deserve.

Sounds like you're on the right road. Keep us posted. We all have a vested interest in mitigating the effects of time & miles on the knees!

 

[hotmetal]

I would definitely recommend looking at pedal adjustment (if you use clipless pedals) but especially seat height, which has a big effect. ASC1951's 'rule of thumb' is a good place to start. Leaning against a wall, (or with someone holding you) with both feet on the pedals, putting your heel on the bottom pedal should mean your leg is pretty much straight. When your feet are in the normal position on the pedals, your leg should be just slightly bent. If your seat is too low it makes pedalling really hard on the knees. A bit of experimenting can help you dial it in.
I'm only 40 but years of cycling, running, swimming and martial arts have wrought havoc with my knees so I unfortunately speak from experience. As for pedalling technique, as I don't have the thighs I would ideally like, I generally spin rather than stomp anyway. Glad I'm doing myself a favour there!

Or there's this method (courtesy of http://www.cyclemetrics.com/Pages/Docs/6-BikeFitting/LemondSystem/fit_formulas.htm

SEAT HEIGHT (cm) = Inseam (cm) x .883

This formula assumes that at the bottom of the pedal stroke, the knees should be slightly bent, about 15 degrees. Riders who pedal slightly toe-down will find the resulting number a bit short. Riders with reduced flexibility or other special considerations want the saddle slightly lower to start (This tends to change as the rider gains experience). ​

In general, the resulting number will be within a cm or two of "correct". So, use this as a starting point.

If you are using traditional pedals (with or without straps) then you can ignore the pedal aspect. If you do use clipless, you may find that a lot of road pedals have very little float. I use Crank Bros "eggbeater style" MTB pedals which have plenty of lateral float, and this helped me a lot.

I did try the Glucosamine and Chondroitin tablets but was never 100% convinced that they made much difference – I just stopped running and cycled more.

 

[Old timer]

I would definitely recommend looking at pedal adjustment (if you use clipless pedals) but especially seat height, which has a big effect. ASC1951's 'rule of thumb' is a good place to start. Leaning against a wall, (or with someone holding you) with both feet on the pedals, putting your heel on the bottom pedal should mean your leg is pretty much straight. When your feet are in the normal position on the pedals, your leg should be just slightly bent. If your seat is too low it makes pedalling really hard on the knees. A bit of experimenting can help you dial it in.
I'm only 40 but years of cycling, running, swimming and martial arts have wrought havoc with my knees so I unfortunately speak from experience. As for pedalling technique, as I don't have the thighs I would ideally like, I generally spin rather than stomp anyway. Glad I'm doing myself a favour there!

Or there's this method (courtesy of http://www.cyclemetrics.com/Pages/Docs/6-BikeFitting/LemondSystem/fit_formulas.htm

SEAT HEIGHT (cm) = Inseam (cm) x .883

This formula assumes that at the bottom of the pedal stroke, the knees should be slightly bent, about 15 degrees. Riders who pedal slightly toe-down will find the resulting number a bit short. Riders with reduced flexibility or other special considerations want the saddle slightly lower to start (This tends to change as the rider gains experience). ​

In general, the resulting number will be within a cm or two of "correct". So, use this as a starting point.

If you are using traditional pedals (with or without straps) then you can ignore the pedal aspect. If you do use clipless, you may find that a lot of road pedals have very little float. I use Crank Bros "eggbeater style" MTB pedals which have plenty of lateral float, and this helped me a lot.

I did try the Glucosamine and Chondroitin tablets but was never 100% convinced that they made much difference – I just stopped running and cycled more.

I use toe clips but without straps just to give me a little more support and using the same spot on the pedal everytime although someone was telling me that he had taken his toe clips off to allow a bit more flexibility and to be able to reposition from time to time.