gates carbon drive

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rowan 46

Über Member
Location
birmingham
I was all ready to click the buy button for the norco ceres 10 I had a ride and it was ok but I figured the easier maintenance would be an advantage. The ride is firm, but it has an 8 speed alvine hub, disc brakes and gates carbon drive. I have been reading some articles about this system and quite a few people have been having problems with the tension on their carbon drive. Which has reulted in new belts having to be bought. Has anybody used this system and how are you finding it?
 

Sleeper

New Member
Can't help, sorry! Just bumping this up for you, maybe someone can help on a blustery dark sunday night! :smile:
 
I was all ready to click the buy button for the norco ceres 10 I had a ride and it was ok but I figured the easier maintenance would be an advantage. The ride is firm, but it has an 8 speed alvine hub, disc brakes and gates carbon drive. I have been reading some articles about this system and quite a few people have been having problems with the tension on their carbon drive. Which has reulted in new belts having to be bought. Has anybody used this system and how are you finding it?

Rowan...i've been riding a Trek Soho with hub gears and carbon belt drive for the past 18 months - 4 days a week, 20 miles a day to work and back come rain or shine. Absolutely no problems with the belt drive or hub gears whatsoever. a fantastic low maintenance and highly enjoyable bike to ride. My advice - go for it!
 

MacB

Lover of things that come in 3's
No actual experience but have read up a fair bit and I thought that Gates now had to approve frame designs for use with their system. My understanding was that it was far more sensitive to flex, in certain areas, than a chain drive would be.

It really depends on where you're reading and the competence of the company/individual that's done the work. For example I wouldn't want to trust this system as a retrofit option on a frame not originally designed for it.
 

snailracer

Über Member
Surely the dropouts can be adjusted to keep suitable tension as long at the axle nut it kept tight enough?
Yes, but then what exactly is suitable tension for a belt? A chain works over a large range of tension, including zero tension, but AFAIK a belt is fussier.
 

GrumpyGregry

Here for rides.
Yes, but then what exactly is suitable tension for a belt? A chain works over a large range of tension, including zero tension, but AFAIK a belt is fussier.

True. Which is why Gates are fairly explicit in their literature about the acceptable range of tension.
 
Gates frame approval process must, I presume, also take into account frame alignment.

What I'd like to know is what's involved in adjusting the ratios? I assume there's a chart or formula if you want to swap from (whatever the equivalent is of) 52/11 to (whatever the eqivalent is of) 48/12 which takes into account the length of the bike's chainstay.

I'd also like to know if it's possible to retrofit a Gates belt drive to my bakfiets - it would be ideal.
 

GrumpyGregry

Here for rides.
Gates frame approval process must, I presume, also take into account frame alignment.

What I'd like to know is what's involved in adjusting the ratios? I assume there's a chart or formula if you want to swap from (whatever the equivalent is of) 52/11 to (whatever the eqivalent is of) 48/12 which takes into account the length of the bike's chainstay.

I'd also like to know if it's possible to retrofit a Gates belt drive to my bakfiets - it would be ideal.

What Gates say....

"Gates Carbon Drive does not recommend retrofitting a belt drive to a frame that was not designed for a belt. There are several things that may cause you problems. 1) modification of the frame is most likely necessary; you can’t break the belt to get it into the rear triangle, so you need the frame to have a ‘break’ in it to get the belt inside. 2) You need a method of tension adjustment. This could range from sliding vertical dropouts, horizontal dropouts, or even an EBB, but some sort of tensioning is needed.

3) Frame stiffness - if your current frame (with the modification) is not stiff enough, you may not be able to get rid of tooth jump problems.

4) Clearance - Our sprockets are wider than chain sprockets, and so you may run into chainstay clearance issues, especially when trying to get the needed ratio and belt line for IGH’s.

5) Gearing selections and belt lengths - While we are trying to continuously expand our product line, we may not have the specific belt or sprocket size that you need to fit your frame and/or hub choice.

Again, while we don’t recommend trying to retrofit your frame, we are here to help. If you have read the above considerations, and still want to try, please contact us so that we can make sure to answer any questions you may still have."

But clearly it can be done, if you can sort splitting the rear triangle




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]View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ih-5yiRz-g[/media]


You may find this calculator useful
 

GrumpyGregry

Here for rides.
I am nearly as geeked out by possibilities Gates belt drives as MacB btw, and will be interested to see what improvements the new Centre Track[sup]TM [/sup]belts and pulleys deliver given how Gates' marketing suggests the existing product is perfect!
 

MacB

Lover of things that come in 3's
I am nearly as geeked out by possibilities Gates belt drives as MacB btw, and will be interested to see what improvements the new Centre Track[sup]TM [/sup]belts and pulleys deliver given how Gates' marketing suggests the existing product is perfect!

:biggrin: that one caught my notice as well, claiming a product is perfect and then bringing out an upgrade
 

GrumpyGregry

Here for rides.
Thanks Greg.

Welcome...

I'd love a Gates drive bike (over and above my Strida) but my jury is still out. Perhaps when Ernie or the lottery ticket comes up.

If you go on the CoMotion website and look at a CityView you'll see the simplest of all broken rear triangles. (and no snubber bearing as it is an Alfine) I think their way of doing it suggests/inspires the simplest approach for modifying an existing bike. If you have dropouts which have expanses of flat metal on them it should be possible to cut, drill and then plate them together with a pair of M5 bolts. The CoMotion has a single bolt after all. No idea how much flex you would get or how reliable such a dropout would be in the long term.

No idea what a Bakfiets drop out is like, never seen one in the flesh without a chain case on.
 
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