Are they correct? Bicycle lights the key to improving safety.

[classic33]

Realise its an Australian study, but the basics apply all anywhere.
http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/b...researcher-20140819-105lau.html#ixzz3ApR8Zzx5

"One of the country's leading researchers into cycling safety says police are stabbing in the dark if they are trying to improve cycling safety with a blitz on helmets and red-light runners.

Dr Marilyn Johnson, the Amy Gillett Foundation's researcher and research fellow at Monash University's institute of transport studies, said police resources should focus on fining cyclists without bike lights rather than on policing in areas where riders were largely compliant such as helmets and obeying traffic signals.

''To me that is the single most important cyclist behavioural change that police could effect that would have the greatest impact on rider safety and driver-rider relations,'' Dr Johnson said."

 

[slowmotion]

I have no idea of what happens in Australia. My guess, and it is a guess, is that most KIA cyclists in the UK are in broad daylight. Sounds like a flag-waving empire builder.

 

[Shut Up Legs]

I have no idea of what happens in Australia. My guess, and it is a guess, is that most KIA cyclists in the UK are in broad daylight. Sounds like a flag-waving empire builder.

We have so-called "safety blitzes", which suffer from many defects: they occur only at rare intervals, and during these exercises, the police are busy booking cyclists for such trivial offences as failing to wear the mandatory helmets, failing to have a bell attached to the bike, etc., and while this is occurring, motorists drive by running red lights, failing to indicate, yakking on their phones while driving, and just generally making the roads unsafe areas to be in.

(if I sound angry and bitter, it's because I am)

 

[glenn forger]

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/dec/15/cycling-bike-accidents-study

Risky cycling rarely to blame for bike accidents, study finds
Cyclists disobeying stop signal or wearing dark clothing at night rarely cited in collisions causing serious injury

The study, carried out for the Department for Transport, found that in 2% of cases where cyclists were seriously injured in collisions with other road users police said that the rider disobeying a stop sign or traffic light was a likely contributing factor. Wearing dark clothing at night was seen as a potential cause in about 2.5% of cases, and failure to use lights was mentioned 2% of the time.

 

[classic33]

Helmets are a legal requirement in Austrailia. Making anyone not wearing one an easier target.

 

[Shut Up Legs]

http://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/dec/15/cycling-bike-accidents-study

Risky cycling rarely to blame for bike accidents, study finds
Cyclists disobeying stop signal or wearing dark clothing at night rarely cited in collisions causing serious injury

The study, carried out for the Department for Transport, found that in 2% of cases where cyclists were seriously injured in collisions with other road users police said that the rider disobeying a stop sign or traffic light was a likely contributing factor. Wearing dark clothing at night was seen as a potential cause in about 2.5% of cases, and failure to use lights was mentioned 2% of the time.

Exactly. This sentence sums it up:

With adult cyclists, police found the driver solely responsible in about 60%-75% of all cases, and riders solely at fault 17%-25% of the time.

Australia has similar statistics, so I really wish the victim-blaming would stop. Motorist education is what we need.

 

[sidevalve]

Exactly. This sentence sums it up:

Australia has similar statistics, so I really wish the victim-blaming would stop. Motorist education is what we need.

So is 17 - 25% ok then ? Are we to assume that this is an acceptable figure. 25% is a quarter and that is only SOLELY at fault - it doesn't include partially or 50/50. If we work this out assuming we had a 100% perfect set of drivers we would still have 25% of the accidents and these would be solely due to cyclists.
As for the OP sorry but what is the problem with using lights anyway ? They don't cost much they don't weigh much and waffling on about how bad everybody else is is simply trying to blur the issue. As for cars with faulty lights, well yes there are those but if stopped they may be fined - how many cyclists don't bother simply because they are anonymous and can often simply ride away ? The "oh it's somebody else's problem to see me I won't take any responsibility for my own safety" seems to be a common idea. Secondly a car carries TWO reflectors even if the lamps are not working - again many cyclists don't even bother with one.
Victim blaming ? Fine - but that goes BOTH ways. What punishment is meted out to a cyclist who causes an accident ? Unless insured [and we all know many arn't] the cost of repairs to a car /cars and compensation for a driver can be huge and a driver would have to claim on their own insurance [which does cost in lost NCB etc] through no fault of their own. It may be less common by a long way but it does happen. How about taking responsibility. Victim blaming -a double edged sword.

 

[Archie_tect]

What we all lack is reliable information of the numbers of cyclists on the roads, the number of incidents, and a breakdown of the number where attributable factors can be identified, not statistics or %ages which can be manipulated to suit.

 

[glenn forger]

So is 17 - 25% ok then ? Are we to assume that this is an acceptable figure. 25% is a quarter and that is only SOLELY at fault - it doesn't include partially or 50/50. If we work this out assuming we had a 100% perfect set of drivers we would still have 25% of the accidents and these would be solely due to cyclists.
As for the OP sorry but what is the problem with using lights anyway ? They don't cost much they don't weigh much and waffling on about how bad everybody else is is simply trying to blur the issue. As for cars with faulty lights, well yes there are those but if stopped they may be fined - how many cyclists don't bother simply because they are anonymous and can often simply ride away ? The "oh it's somebody else's problem to see me I won't take any responsibility for my own safety" seems to be a common idea. Secondly a car carries TWO reflectors even if the lamps are not working - again many cyclists don't even bother with one.
Victim blaming ? Fine - but that goes BOTH ways. What punishment is meted out to a cyclist who causes an accident ? Unless insured [and we all know many arn't] the cost of repairs to a car /cars and compensation for a driver can be huge and a driver would have to claim on their own insurance [which does cost in lost NCB etc] through no fault of their own. It may be less common by a long way but it does happen. How about taking responsibility. Victim blaming -a double edged sword.

I'm curious, if uninsured cyclists really are a big problem, are there any actual examples that can be verified of a cyclist causing an unrecoverable loss?

 

[jonesy]

What we all lack is reliable information of the numbers of cyclists on the roads, the number of incidents, and a breakdown of the number where attributable factors can be identified, not statistics or %ages which can be manipulated to suit.

In other words, 'statistics'?

 

[Archie_tect]

...meant to just say %ages... forgot to edit to remove the word statistics!

 

[jonesy]

Stats like these perhaps?
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cm...nd-casualities-in-greater-london-sep-2011.pdf

 

[Cycleops]

Very important. Some people never learn. The Krays were always getting put away for riding without them.

 

[classic33]

So is 17 - 25% ok then ? Are we to assume that this is an acceptable figure. 25% is a quarter and that is only SOLELY at fault - it doesn't include partially or 50/50. If we work this out assuming we had a 100% perfect set of drivers we would still have 25% of the accidents and these would be solely due to cyclists.
As for the OP sorry but what is the problem with using lights anyway ? They don't cost much they don't weigh much and waffling on about how bad everybody else is is simply trying to blur the issue. As for cars with faulty lights, well yes there are those but if stopped they may be fined - how many cyclists don't bother simply because they are anonymous and can often simply ride away ? The "oh it's somebody else's problem to see me I won't take any responsibility for my own safety" seems to be a common idea. Secondly a car carries TWO reflectors even if the lamps are not working - again many cyclists don't even bother with one.
Victim blaming ? Fine - but that goes BOTH ways. What punishment is meted out to a cyclist who causes an accident ? Unless insured [and we all know many arn't] the cost of repairs to a car /cars and compensation for a driver can be huge and a driver would have to claim on their own insurance [which does cost in lost NCB etc] through no fault of their own. It may be less common by a long way but it does happen. How about taking responsibility. Victim blaming -a double edged sword.

Important difference between the UK and Australia. Helmets are compulsory/legal requirement, here they're not.
The article posted did say that policing things such as lights would have a greater impact on cyclist safety, rather than coming down on those not wearing helmets.

 

[david k]

its more often than not that cycling is not to blame and the motorist is, it is therefore assumed that motorist education is key to improving the statistics
Im not so sure - yes i agree with motorist education but i think they will continue to drive fast/take short cuts etc. when it is perceived to be safe, only for it to be too late
I dont like the idea that its ok to continue as we are as it not our fault - i dont want to be another statistic but be smug as it wasnt my fault
i do think lights help - but not the complete answer
i like cycle lanes - my personal feeling is every new road must have a separate cycle lane and to develop them were we can - yes we shouldnt have to as there is already a road but mixing cyclists and motorists leads to accidents, whether we like it or not, very difficult to change driving culture