Apple trees

[davidphilips]

In BM bargains in Bangor this morning and they have lots of apple trees about 4 feet tall selling for £6,have a few in my garden and only my view but at £6 a tree over the next few years an apple tree pays for its self many times over,only bought one this morning but thinking i may have room for another ?

 

[Reynard]

These can be a bit Caveat Emptor...

Generally, the label won't tell you what rootstock it's on. Inevitably you'll get a half standard or standard (the cheapest, which is why they can sell them at that price compared to a nursery), which tends to be too vigorous for a small garden. Unless you're prepared to keep it pruned way back that is, which will in turn affect the yield.

Also, you will need to check the pollination habits, as some apple varieties can have very strange sex lives. Unlike plums and cherries, they will not be self-fertile, so unless there's a nearby tree (or two, as some varieties are triploid) that's in the right pollination group, you won't get a very good yield. Crab apples are good all-round pollinators though, but still... Also, watch out for dual varieties, as sometimes the two grafted varieties can't actually pollinate each other. (I have one of those, where one variety is one of the parents of the other!)

Lastly, some of the varieties typically offered up for sale by discounters are not the best ones to grow in the UK, as we're too far north and so fruiting and/or the quality can be unreliable.

If you want good varieties that will do well in your local area, have a look to see if there aren't any community orchard projects around. They're funded by DEFRA on the premise that local heritage varieties are grown. If the orchard is anything like the one in the village where I live, you'll find everything from an early dessert to late season dual-purpose keepers. Most heritage variety saplings will cost you somewhere between £15 to £30 depending on availability, but the upsides is that you will know exactly what you are getting.

 

[oldwheels]

These can be a bit Caveat Emptor...

Generally, the label won't tell you what rootstock it's on. Inevitably you'll get a half standard or standard (the cheapest, which is why they can sell them at that price compared to a nursery), which tends to be too vigorous for a small garden. Unless you're prepared to keep it pruned way back that is, which will in turn affect the yield.

Also, you will need to check the pollination habits, as some apple varieties can have very strange sex lives. Unlike plums and cherries, they will not be self-fertile, so unless there's a nearby tree (or two, as some varieties are triploid) that's in the right pollination group, you won't get a very good yield. Crab apples are good all-round pollinators though, but still... Also, watch out for dual varieties, as sometimes the two grafted varieties can't actually pollinate each other. (I have one of those, where one variety is one of the parents of the other!)

Lastly, some of the varieties typically offered up for sale by discounters are not the best ones to grow in the UK, as we're too far north and so fruiting and/or the quality can be unreliable.

If you want good varieties that will do well in your local area, have a look to see if there aren't any community orchard projects around. They're funded by DEFRA on the premise that local heritage varieties are grown. If the orchard is anything like the one in the village where I live, you'll find everything from an early dessert to late season dual-purpose keepers. Most heritage variety saplings will cost you somewhere between £15 to £30 depending on availability, but the upsides is that you will know exactly what you are getting.

Interesting.
I have a book on kindle which touches on how apples came here from somewhere along the Silk Road. They were eaten I seem to remember by the ponies and the pips excreted and grew more apple trees which gradually spread along the route in a westerly direction over many years.
My bedtime reading has just been reselected.

 

[PaulSB]

In BM bargains in Bangor this morning and they have lots of apple trees about 4 feet tall selling for £6,have a few in my garden and only my view but at £6 a tree over the next few years an apple tree pays for its self many times over,only bought one this morning but thinking i may have room for another ?

Only if you either learn how to store apples or are prepared to eat apples by the pound, daily, when in season.

Personally I wouldn't bother, says the man with a 44 year career in horticulture and two mature apple trees on his allotment - 80% of our crop ends up in the compost heap.

Grow a good cooking variety, if you must, as these store better and can be cooked in a variety of ways before freezing.

 

[Reynard]

Only if you either learn how to store apples or are prepared to eat apples by the pound, daily, when in season.

Personally I wouldn't bother, says the man with a 44 year career in horticulture and two mature apple trees on his allotment - 80% of our crop ends up in the compost heap.

Grow a good cooking variety, if you must, as these store better and can be cooked in a variety of ways before freezing.

Tell me about it... I'm always up to my eyeballs in bramleys come the autumn. I only keep a small James Grieve and a crab apple to pollinate the bramley.

Only thing, I can't store them as I can't reach the fruit without a ladder (oh the joys of being undertall and having a full standard tree), and so I wait for them to drop. Mind you, they do make a fabulous jam, and they're good for making apple butter and various chutneys. Which come in SO handy as nice gifts at Christmas.

Not to mention apple sauce, apple cake and apple crumbles, of course...

I avail myself of keeping apples from the community orchard. I've still got five trays left, two of cookers and three of a late season dessert apple.

TBH, I'd recommend getting a keeping dessert / dual purpose apple rather than an outright cooker. I really rate Lord Burghley. They're a relatively late apple, but do keep well over the winter - just finished the last of them the other day. They're a burgundy-skinned apple with cream-coloured flesh, crisp yet juicy, tangy rather than sweet, and with a real depth of flavour you don't get in commercial apples.

If you're looking for a mid-season dessert apple, then a Cox's Orange Pippin if you must, but I recommend Chivers Delight instead. It's similar in type, but with a much better flavour.

Bramleys are the most acidic of the cooking apples and as a result, perhaps not to everyone's taste. My favourite is Murfitt's Seedling. It looks like a smaller version of a bramley, but it is markedly sweeter, and with keeping, you can actually eat it as is.

 

[slowmotion]

Only if you either learn how to store apples or are prepared to eat apples by the pound, daily, when in season.

Personally I wouldn't bother, says the man with a 44 year career in horticulture and two mature apple trees on his allotment - 80% of our crop ends up in the compost heap.

Grow a good cooking variety, if you must, as these store better and can be cooked in a variety of ways before freezing.

Wouldn't cider making get rid of a lot of them? I've no idea if that would be the case BTW.

 

[HMS_Dave]

Wouldn't cider making get rid of a lot of them? I've no idea if that would be the case BTW.

They're probably not cider apples, but if i have a surplus of apples with not a lot to do with them. Gotta be worth a go!

 

[davidphilips]

Very interesting points guys,never thought about type of rootstock? Perhaps i should have planted it in a big pot? Actually have 3 other apple trees in my garden, one that gives hundreds of apples every year, one against a fence that gives 3 different types of apples but only a few each year, another that only gives a few.
As for what to do with the apples have advertised them a few times and found many people delighted to get free apples either to eat or give to there horses.

 

[figbat]

There are places around that will press your apples into juice for you; the remaining pulp is used for animal feed. Or you could DIY.

 

[Reynard]

Very interesting points guys,never thought about type of rootstock? Perhaps i should have planted it in a big pot? Actually have 3 other apple trees in my garden, one that gives hundreds of apples every year, one against a fence that gives 3 different types of apples but only a few each year, another that only gives a few.
As for what to do with the apples have advertised them a few times and found many people delighted to get free apples either to eat or give to there horses.

I learned this the hard way. About rootstocks that is. Though I have a VERY large garden, so size is less of an issue than for some.

Sounds like you've got one tree that gets well pollinated, but that the others potentially aren't quite in the right groups, and / or may be triploids*. That's assuming all the trees are sheltered and have plenty of light. Pollination groups are (largely) set by the order in which the trees flower. It's worth getting a book (or looking it up online) to check this out.

* a Bramley is a triploid, for example. It needs two other different varieties from the same group to act as pollinators.

 

[Gillstay]

I save any left over apples for the birds over winter. A short fat stake with a nail in the top is great for plonking an apple on and then getting to watch the birds feed. Or if lots I just cover the lawn.

 

[Gillstay]

Tell me about it... I'm always up to my eyeballs in bramleys come the autumn. I only keep a small James Grieve and a crab apple to pollinate the bramley.

Only thing, I can't store them as I can't reach the fruit without a ladder (oh the joys of being undertall and having a full standard tree), and so I wait for them to drop. Mind you, they do make a fabulous jam, and they're good for making apple butter and various chutneys. Which come in SO handy as nice gifts at Christmas.

Not to mention apple sauce, apple cake and apple crumbles, of course...

I avail myself of keeping apples from the community orchard. I've still got five trays left, two of cookers and three of a late season dessert apple.

TBH, I'd recommend getting a keeping dessert / dual purpose apple rather than an outright cooker. I really rate Lord Burghley. They're a relatively late apple, but do keep well over the winter - just finished the last of them the other day. They're a burgundy-skinned apple with cream-coloured flesh, crisp yet juicy, tangy rather than sweet, and with a real depth of flavour you don't get in commercial apples.

If you're looking for a mid-season dessert apple, then a Cox's Orange Pippin if you must, but I recommend Chivers Delight instead. It's similar in type, but with a much better flavour.

Bramleys are the most acidic of the cooking apples and as a result, perhaps not to everyone's taste. My favourite is Murfitt's Seedling. It looks like a smaller version of a bramley, but it is markedly sweeter, and with keeping, you can actually eat it as is.

I love home grown Spartan as an eater, and as a cooker Peasgood nonsuch for grating into porridge with quince jelly as a topping.

 

[fossyant]

Our apple tree is just a boring apple tree. It used to be an apple pie tree.

My neighbour would pick our apples and turn them into pies for us. Such a shame she has passed away.

 

[davidphilips]

I save any left over apples for the birds over winter. A short fat stake with a nail in the top is great for plonking an apple on and then getting to watch the birds feed. Or if lots I just cover the lawn.

Yes agree %100 with feeding birds and indeed wildlife, perhaps not to every ones liking i even leave bits of apple out for wasps in the summer and find that the wasps seem to know where there food is and some even seem to spend most of there time living on bits of apple left for them.

Just noticed apple tree has an M9 root stock, and are said to grow between 200 and 300 cm,good news for me as should be ok where i planted the one i bought and thinking of going over and buying another 1 or 2?