A cautionary tale

[Dogtrousers]

TL;DR I am an idiot.

A while back I replaced the Miche brake calipers on my bike with 105s. This was purely a cosmetic thing. I'd bought a load of 105 stuff as spares because it was cheap and the brakes came with it. How nice and blingy they look. Lovely.

Fast forward to a couple of weekends ago, about 60 miles into a 100 miler I gradually lost pressure in my front tyre. I was running tubeless so I looked for a hole that needed plugging (none) and found that it would hold low pressure but not high. So not wanting to hang about at the roadside I just stuck a tube in and carried on. It worked fine and got me home. I had some theories about why I'd lost pressure. I'd hit a big pothole just before, maybe it had unseated the tyre or something. Anyway when I got home I cleaned the sealant out, refitted the tube and filed it under "worry about it later".

"Later" arrived yesterday morning, out on a ride I heard a sniper take a shot at me. Front tyre blown out. About a 4cm tear in the tyre where the bead had come away. I took one look and decided against any roadside faffing with tyre boots and so on, as I was only a few km from a station, so I walked.

And now I understand. The arms of the 105 callipers are too short for my bike.. Even with the brake blocks right at the end of the slot, the top of the brake block is juuust above the rim. I didn't notice this when fitting. Because I am an idiot. So as the brake blocks wore in they began to contact the tyre, wore it away ... and first slow pressure loss (with tubeless) and later bang (with a tube).

Sooo... all this morning I've been faffing around cleaning and refitting my old Miche callipers. I like to keep my bike clean but I don't clean under the armpits of my brakes. There was over 10 years of grot on them. The (new) blocks are now nice and central in the brake track. Faff faff faff. I checked the old rear blocks and tyre and they don't look to have worn enough to cause a problem, so I haven't replaced the rear tyre. Although I probably should. Faff faff faff.

Job done? Can I have a sit down and watch Liege Bastogne Liege now? While tidying everything up, my chain checker ended up in my hand, so I thought I'd just check. Surely it wasn't so long ago since I last checked? Oh balls, it's worn to buggery. Check records ... how long ago? Bum. So I'm going to have to do that too. But coffee and sit down first.

I hate bikes. Great things to ride. Pain in the arse otherwise. Faff faff faff.

 

[biggs682]

I hate bikes. Great things to ride. Pain in the arse otherwise. Faff faff faff.

That's so true

 

[ExBrit]

TL;DR I am an idiot.

A while back I replaced the Miche brake calipers on my bike with 105s. This was purely a cosmetic thing. I'd bought a load of 105 stuff as spares because it was cheap and the brakes came with it. How nice and blingy they look. Lovely.

Fast forward to a couple of weekends ago, about 60 miles into a 100 miler I gradually lost pressure in my front tyre. I was running tubeless so I looked for a hole that needed plugging (none) and found that it would hold low pressure but not high. So not wanting to hang about at the roadside I just stuck a tube in and carried on. It worked fine and got me home. I had some theories about why I'd lost pressure. I'd hit a big pothole just before, maybe it had unseated the tyre or something. Anyway when I got home I cleaned the sealant out, refitted the tube and filed it under "worry about it later".

"Later" arrived yesterday morning, out on a ride I heard a sniper take a shot at me. Front tyre blown out. About a 4cm tear in the tyre where the bead had come away. I took one look and decided against any roadside faffing with tyre boots and so on, as I was only a few km from a station, so I walked.

And now I understand. The arms of the 105 callipers are too short for my bike.. Even with the brake blocks right at the end of the slot, the top of the brake block is juuust above the rim. I didn't notice this when fitting. Because I am an idiot. So as the brake blocks wore in they began to contact the tyre, wore it away ... and first slow pressure loss (with tubeless) and later bang (with a tube).

Sooo... all this morning I've been faffing around cleaning and refitting my old Miche callipers. I like to keep my bike clean but I don't clean under the armpits of my brakes. There was over 10 years of grot on them. The (new) blocks are now nice and central in the brake track. Faff faff faff. I checked the old rear blocks and tyre and they don't look to have worn enough to cause a problem, so I haven't replaced the rear tyre. Although I probably should. Faff faff faff.

Job done? Can I have a sit down and watch Liege Bastogne Liege now? While tidying everything up, my chain checker ended up in my hand, so I thought I'd just check. Surely it wasn't so long ago since I last checked? Oh balls, it's worn to buggery. Check records ... how long ago? Bum. So I'm going to have to do that too. But coffee and sit down first.

I hate bikes. Great things to ride. Pain in the arse otherwise. Faff faff faff.

I've done something similar to the brake issue but I could hear a slight difference in the sound when I braked, so after much confusion I realized I was hearing rubber on rubber. I ruined a $40 tire but I after reading your experience I think I got off lightly. I love working on my bike when I'm in the mood, otherwise it's a chore. One reason I haven't bought an e-bike yet is it's even more stuff to maintain. Not just a bike, but also battery, motor, sensors, controller, more cables, more mounts. What a pain.

 

[Ajax Bay]

A while back I replaced the Miche brake calipers on my bike with 105s. This was purely a cosmetic thing. I'd bought a load of 105 stuff as spares because it was cheap and the brakes came with it. How nice and blingy they look. Lovely.
"Later" arrived yesterday morning, out on a ride I heard a sniper take a shot at me. Front tyre blown out. About a 4cm tear in the tyre where the bead had come away. I took one look and decided against any roadside faffing with tyre boots and so on, as I was only a few km from a station, so I walked.

And now I understand. The arms of the 105 callipers are too short for my bike.. Even with the brake blocks right at the end of the slot, the top of the brake block is juuust above the rim. I didn't notice this when fitting. Because I am an idiot. So as the brake blocks wore in they began to contact the tyre, wore it away ... and first slow pressure loss (with tubeless) and later bang (with a tube).

@Dogtrousers
This is spooky: may I apply for the 'idiot' class too.

A while back (?New Year) I replaced the RX100 brake calipers on my bike with 105s. This was purely a cosmetic thing. I'd bought these 105 calipers as spares because they seemed good value. How nice and blingy they look. Lovely.
But the drop was very tight so swapped the rear back again before use, but kept the front calipers on. Dope!
Many rides including a 200 and a 300.
'Normal' tubed Conti 4000s.

Fast forward to 7 days ago, about 40 miles into a 70 miler . . . alone down a fairly steep narrow Dartmoor hill with brakes applied . . . I heard a sniper take a shot at me. Front tyre: pleased to stay straight, upright, rear brake only applied, with backsidehanging off the back of the saddle. Out with the tube: little puncture but 'on the side'. Short tear (maybe 3mm) in the tyre just above the bead. Hypothesis: the tube had bulged out ever so slightly and the brake block had caught it. Also relevant that the Dura 2 blocks were quite worn and as brake blocks wear they hit the rim ever so slightly higher (as you describe), close to the tyre. I took one look and decided to replace the tube, patch the tyre inside, arrange a boot, inflate and ride on. Aimed not to touch the front brake (more or less achieved). Ride completed, in company.

The arms of the 105 callipers are too short for my bike. Even with the brake blocks right at the end of the slot, the top of the brake block is juuust above the rim. I did notice this when fitting but left the front on there, because I am an idiot. So as the brake blocks wore in they began to contact the tyre, slowly (1000km?) wore it away ... and . . bang (with a tube).

Sooo, home, ... tyre off, and I discovered another pair of slits along from and as well as the place it punctured. Lucky boy (and v sensible to stay off that front brake for the rest of the ride). RX100 calipers back on - plenty of drop. My last 4000 fitted. On the positive side, am pleased this happened on an 'unimportant ride' - well important to the 70 year old whose birthday ride it was - and not on a PBP qualifier, 10s of miles from 'nowhere'.

 

[Dogtrousers]

That is indeed spooky.

I guess the 105s are aimed at very racy bikes that don't have things like mudguards that I (and I imagine you) are using. They do look nice tho. But my old Miche brakes look quite nice now, having been thoroughly cleaned.

The first deflation was a bit worrying because I'd taken the risk and gone out on a train strike day. So despite being on familiar ground I was 10s of miles from anywhere of any use.

I've just popped in from the garage to watch the end of the racing. I've been a bit lazy with checking mechanical things lately and I've been discovering bad things. Lower jockey wheel is not looing much like a jockey wheel any more. Chainrings are not looking good. I look into my crystal ball and I see more faffing in future. Or perhaps another visit to the LBS.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Pretty sure that if you let your chain run to 'end-of-life' ie till its slips on the cassette as opposed to a couple of changes for each cassette, that increased (>1%) pitch wears one's chainrings at a greater pace.
With 8sp and 9sp drive trains, the economics of changing chains when elongation 0.005<dl/L<0.0075 as opposed to running till done is marginal (given chain and cassette unit cost). Until one considers the chain ring wear.
I shall be changing them now (at about 2200km, distance based on experience of my riding, YMMV).

 

[Dogtrousers]

Pretty sure that if you let your chain run to 'end-of-life' ie till its slips on the cassette as opposed to a couple of changes for each cassette, that increased (>1%) pitch wears one's chainrings at a greater pace.

This is probably true. This is why I'm assiduous about checking chain wear and replace the chain before it gets too bad.

At least that's the plan. Reality is somewhat different and I end up replacing a completely worn out chain and looking at the rather sorry state of my drivetrain.

Did I ever mention that I'm an idiot?

 

[cyberknight]

if your obsessed with having shimano you can get non series r451 for half the price of 105 long drop

 

[Sea of vapours]

Is the caution to [try to] avoid braking systems which are too closely associated with 'stay on the road' elements, aka the tyres?

 

[Dogtrousers]

I love working on my bike when I'm in the mood, otherwise it's a chore.

Same here. The thing is, I tend to cause more problems than I solve. The 105 brakes being a case in point. That's why these days my LBS gets more and more work from me. I don't mind cleaning it and doing basic maintenance. I don't even mind changing chains and cassettes. But the older I get the less appetite I have for messing around with bottom brackets, changing cables and so on. I can do it, and I keep a stock of spares just in case. But the more problems I cause for myself, the more I prefer to get someone who isn't an idiot do it. And my LBS have a decent track record in not being idiots.

 

[Dogtrousers]

if your obsessed with having shimano you can get non series r451 for half the price of 105 long drop

I 'm more obsessed with (a) not dying and (b) not spending hours on the roadside. So the Miche ones that worked perfectly well for years can stay. I only put the 105s on because I happened to have them ... and I'm an idiot.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Is the caution to [try to] avoid braking systems which are too closely associated with 'stay on the road' elements, aka the tyres?

I appreciate the (morsel of) subtlety in your question.
I suggest the lesson identified is that if one tries to fit caliper brakes and the blocks are at the limit of the drop they allow yet very close to the (upper) edge of the rim, then just don't.
Also the risk is increased by other factors (besides drop limit):
1) worn blocks (new ones might be 'just' OK)
2) tyres quite wide for the rims eg a 28 on a 14mm internal rim width (DAMHIKT)

 

[Jameshow]

TL;DR I am an idiot.

A while back I replaced the Miche brake calipers on my bike with 105s. This was purely a cosmetic thing. I'd bought a load of 105 stuff as spares because it was cheap and the brakes came with it. How nice and blingy they look. Lovely.

Fast forward to a couple of weekends ago, about 60 miles into a 100 miler I gradually lost pressure in my front tyre. I was running tubeless so I looked for a hole that needed plugging (none) and found that it would hold low pressure but not high. So not wanting to hang about at the roadside I just stuck a tube in and carried on. It worked fine and got me home. I had some theories about why I'd lost pressure. I'd hit a big pothole just before, maybe it had unseated the tyre or something. Anyway when I got home I cleaned the sealant out, refitted the tube and filed it under "worry about it later".

"Later" arrived yesterday morning, out on a ride I heard a sniper take a shot at me. Front tyre blown out. About a 4cm tear in the tyre where the bead had come away. I took one look and decided against any roadside faffing with tyre boots and so on, as I was only a few km from a station, so I walked.

And now I understand. The arms of the 105 callipers are too short for my bike.. Even with the brake blocks right at the end of the slot, the top of the brake block is juuust above the rim. I didn't notice this when fitting. Because I am an idiot. So as the brake blocks wore in they began to contact the tyre, wore it away ... and first slow pressure loss (with tubeless) and later bang (with a tube).

Sooo... all this morning I've been faffing around cleaning and refitting my old Miche callipers. I like to keep my bike clean but I don't clean under the armpits of my brakes. There was over 10 years of grot on them. The (new) blocks are now nice and central in the brake track. Faff faff faff. I checked the old rear blocks and tyre and they don't look to have worn enough to cause a problem, so I haven't replaced the rear tyre. Although I probably should. Faff faff faff.

Job done? Can I have a sit down and watch Liege Bastogne Liege now? While tidying everything up, my chain checker ended up in my hand, so I thought I'd just check. Surely it wasn't so long ago since I last checked? Oh balls, it's worn to buggery. Check records ... how long ago? Bum. So I'm going to have to do that too. But coffee and sit down first.

I hate bikes. Great things to ride. Pain in the arse otherwise. Faff faff faff.

I've done that too through a new tyre too down a steep hill in Baildon!

Scared the life out of me!

At least it was a short walk home and picked up another bike!!

 

[Jameshow]

if your obsessed with having shimano you can get non series r451 for half the price of 105 long drop

But they are grey painted not polished...!

 

[Drago]

But they are grey painted not polished...!

They are very good though.