# Limited space to grow food what to grow?



## Time Waster (3 Jul 2022)

We've got a big garden full of larger shrubs and trees. It's on a slope and there's limited space that can be cleared and gets enough sun. We've put raspberry and gooseberry plants in two partial sun areas. Also, strawberry plants in the raised border above the patio. Tap plants grew very well with loads of strawberries which the blackbirds loved, net going up soon. We just planted 3 more next to them by taking out the tiny patch of lawn behind the border. The first two strawberries are sending out runners and we'll get lots of new plants all go well. Next to the strawberries are three broccoli plants and a few herbs. Other side of the border past the steps are more herbs and broccoli plants. 

Our wish is to grow stuff that are cost and space efficient. There's only a few small patches left that could be easily cleared and planted that gets decent sun. One area is underneath an apple tree. Can you under plant an apple tree? 

What is worth growing in small areas of cleared borders with reasonable sun? Can you underplant open trees like the apple tree we have?


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## PaulSB (3 Jul 2022)

@Time Waster how many people in your household? It makes a difference to what I will suggest.


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## cyberknight (3 Jul 2022)




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## Pat "5mph" (3 Jul 2022)

@Time Waster what do you and your family like eating?
I wouldn't directly plant under the apple tree: competition for nutrients I think, trees normally only have mushrooms growing under them if you look in nature.
Then, how would you harvest the apples without damaging the crop growing underneath?
However, shade loving veg, like lettuce, brassicas and spinach can all be grown in containers under the tree.


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## midlife (3 Jul 2022)

When we moved in to our house with a reasonable garden we thought about growing food. After a couple of years we decided to buy our veg and grow stuff in the garden to eat which is more interesting than staples. Kohlrabi for example, each year we plant something that takes our fancy.


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## PK99 (3 Jul 2022)

I used to grow lots of veg, but eventually decided that having crops at the time the farmers markets were at their cheapest was not a sensible us of my time.

So I now focus on a very small selection of things that just taste so much better straight off the plant

A wide selection of herbs
Tomatoes - 4 or 5 varieties
Basil - I split a large pot from waitrose and plant out around the tomatoes in a patio be near the kitchen door
Rocket Seeds scattered in with the tomatoes

Automatic watering system makes it almost hassle free.

If I had a suitable patch I would grow Sweetcorn, put a pan on to boil, go out a pick a cob or two, on the way back strip the leaves. Drop into the now boiling water. Slather on nice butter, salt and pepper = utter delight!


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## Pat "5mph" (3 Jul 2022)

Lol @PK99 all those crops you mention are hit and miss here in Scotland, unless one has a polytunnel or heated greenhouse.
Lucky you!


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## Time Waster (3 Jul 2022)

We have a plant like that cyberknight in our front garden. Bought it from a big, local garden centre. Was in a pot but didn't do well so when we moved here we put in it the border and it grew off very quickly. Nice plant but not a weed I'm assured from the garden centre label.


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## Time Waster (3 Jul 2022)

Two adults and a 9 year old in the house. 

We thought of kohlrabi too. The idea of things you can't get in most supermarket deliveries. The fruit idea appeals as supermarket raspberries and strawberries are usually a bit bland unless you pay booth's premium prices that is.

I was thinking purple sprouting. A good healthy crop but I think you need a bigger area to make it a worthwhile crop.

We visited someone who only had a decked area. They put wooden troughs at waist height full of veg, herbs and salad plants. Underneath and growing through were larger plants for cropping. Underneath were more troughs of food. A grape vine grew on the house wall and they had to cut it back each year. That cropped well because the wall got full sun and kept the heat too. Plenty of shelter helped too. Apparently they got plenty of grapes to eat and make wine with. There's blueberries and other fruit around. Not self sufficient in everything but herbs, salad, greens, grapes they were. I was stunned at how much food they had growing and were cropping too. They've inspired us to start doing things. Slowly at first first and we're simply experimenting to see what works.


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## Pat "5mph" (3 Jul 2022)

Time Waster said:


> We thought of kohlrabi too.


Well, do you like it? I grow it sometimes, it's really an overrated turnip 


Time Waster said:


> The fruit idea appeals as supermarket raspberries and strawberries are usually a bit bland


Yes, very pricey too. Bonus, with raspberries and strawberries you get lots of free offspring plants too.
Beware of both in the ground, they multiply like crazy.


Time Waster said:


> I was thinking purple sprouting. A good healthy crop but I think you need a bigger area to make it a worthwhile crop.


If it's only 3 of you at home, 3 psb are plenty.
More you cut, more they sprout if conditions (not too hot) are right.
As for all brassicas, beware of the cabbage butterfly moth you might need to cover crops with a fine mesh netting.


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## KnittyNorah (3 Jul 2022)

I'd suggest things you might term as 'novelties' - fresh herbs, if you like and use them, one or two fresh veg of the sort you rarely see at the supermarket, but which you like (eg runner beans, PSB, WSB, scorzonera, three sorts of artichokes etc), an occasional tray of salad leaves if you would otherwise buy them year-round, and soft fruit if you use it (eat, cook, make wine/preserves). Don't grow anything unless you are sure you will want to use it when it's grown. You could grow deep purple potatoes in a potato bag or bucket, or orange or lime-green cauliflower ... that would be an interesting potato salad or cauliflower cheese ...

Soft fruits with the best flavours don't travel well, but many are very easy to grow either in the ground or even in containers and many aren't as affected as much as are some veggies by slugs, caterpillars etc, as well as not needing as much concentrated hard work in their care. As well as strawbs and rasbs, how about loganberries (they drape beautifully over a framework, are thornless with huge fruits and delicious), currants red white and/or black, goosegogs - sour or dessert, the good dessert varieties when fully ripe taste like a cross between a plum and vanilla fudge IMO! - and any of the other berries. In New Zealand boysenberries are popular and delicious - there are a great many hybrid and other berries you can get from a good nurseryman - blueberries, kiwifruit, alpine strawberries, golden-yellow raspberries, pinkberries, cranberries, wineberries, honeyberries, jostaberries, gojiberries, tayberries, tummelberries and more. Rhubarb! Whatever you like if you can give it the conditions it needs.


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## Time Waster (3 Jul 2022)

Gooseberry plants went in last autumn. I looked earlier in the year but everywhere sold out. It's an autumn plant to put in apparently. Only moved in March 2021. Would have them in by April but for that. 

My partner thinks like that with raspberries. I got put off by shop bought ones with maggots in. Shudder.


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## PaulSB (4 Jul 2022)

Time Waster said:


> *We have a plant like that cyberknight in our front garden. Bought it from a big, local garden centre. Was in* a pot but didn't do well so when we moved here we put in it the border and it grew off very quickly. Nice plant but not a weed I'm assured from the garden centre label.



Very unlikely as cyberknight's image is Cannabis saliva.


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## Once a Wheeler (4 Jul 2022)

Time Waster said:


> What is worth growing in small areas of cleared borders with reasonable sun?


If horticultural history is a subject of interest to you, you could try out the maize-beans-squash complex. It was a highly productive technique developed by Native Americans. Maize is planted into individual small mounds of about a metre diameter, beans are then planted alongside the maize and grow to fruition climbing up the maize stalks. Squash (melon, marrow etc) are also planted into the mound and the leaves form a ground cover which deters weeds and conserves water. From a plant nutrition point of view, the beans return nitrogen to the soil, so nourishing the maize; and the squash also has soil enhancing properties. In this way it is possible to get three food crops off a small area of cultivation with minimal, if any, artificial fertilizer. More about it here:
Wikipedia
A 'how to' description of the technique
A background read on Carl Sauer, the geographer who first studied such systems in detail
Enjoy the hot, buttered maize.


More where this image came from here.


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## Time Waster (4 Jul 2022)

PaulSB said:


> Very unlikely as cyberknight's image is Cannabis saliva.



Leaf is but it isn't a pot plant, took planting in the soil to take off! 😊


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## Poacher (4 Jul 2022)

PaulSB said:


> Very unlikely as cyberknight's image is Cannabis *saliva*.



*Sativa*, shirley? Making my mouth water, thobut.


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