# How many patches on an inner tube before you bin it?



## Colin_P (8 Sep 2015)

This evening I'm quite disappointed.

I had to bin an inner tube. It already had seven patches on it but alas the latest hawthorn puncture was too close to an existing patch to allow another. I probably could have had a go but decided to bin it.

I know there are those that won't even consider patching a tube, not even once but for those that do, what is the most you've ever got on a tube before you gave up and binned it? 

I say, make do and mend and live that dream to the full


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## screenman (8 Sep 2015)

49. Only kidding, I live life to the full and do not mess around sticking patches on old tube, from experience of thousands of club rides the guys who puncture the most are the guys with loads of patches on.


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## cosmicbike (8 Sep 2015)

Only when I cannot get one to seal nicely, normally over one of the raised seams. Most of my bikes have at least 1 repaired tube.


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## Mark_J (8 Sep 2015)

I haven't been trainspotter-ish enough to count but I'd say about 4 or 5 max. That's plenty.


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## Yellow Saddle (8 Sep 2015)

Patch it until the valve fails. Patches on seams are not a problem, that's what sandpaper is for.


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## xxDarkRiderxx (8 Sep 2015)

Same as @Yellow Saddle. I think the most I have got on my hybrid which I used to commute is 5. and Still going strong at 90psi.


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## Drago (8 Sep 2015)

3.


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## tyred (9 Sep 2015)

If there's room for one more, it's fine imo. If it's a decent quality patch put on properly there won't be a problem.

The tubes on one of my vintage roadsters appeared to be entirely made of patches when I removed the tyres. But they held air so are still in use.


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## robgul (9 Sep 2015)

Depends where they are and how big a hole they are fixing .... I've been up to about 7. [I repair the tubes at home - not on the road - and clamp the tube/patch between 2 bits of wood in the jaws of a vice to get a good fix]

... one of our long-standing club members (from Yorkshire, of course) normally has "spare patches with a bit of tube in between" ! - he did shock us last week with a new tube.

Rob


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## I like Skol (9 Sep 2015)

Actual repair count is irrelevant in my opinion. The condition of the tube and previous repairs are the deciding factor and the severity of the damage that has caused the latest inspection. If the tube is badly split or cut then in the bin. If any of the old repairs look perished then in the bin. If the material of the tube looks perished (especially around the valve) or the leak is a patch of leaks where the rubber appears to have become porous, in the bin. If the valve is leaking, in the bin. I think you might get the idea by now. I have plenty of tubes with multiple repairs but not since my childhood have I suffered a deflation due to a previous repair failing. Routinely throwing away a tube after a single puncture, regardless of severity is criminal IMO and perpetrators should be taken outside and shot for crimes against reason, the environment and their finances!


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## I like Skol (9 Sep 2015)

robgul said:


> and clamp the tube/patch between 2 bits of wood in the jaws of a vice to get a good fix


Not necessary, but does show an attention to detail that will help achieve a good repair anyway


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## shouldbeinbed (9 Sep 2015)

My current commuter roadside spare has 5.

Most of the ones hung up at home have 2 or 3, mainly skab glueless types now. Rubber solution is SO 20th century dahlings, mwah.


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## sbeqs (9 Sep 2015)

I look upon my patches as badges of challenges fought and won. So I'm not going to buy any new ones until my 2 +1 spare have more patch than rubber.


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## Yellow Saddle (9 Sep 2015)

shouldbeinbed said:


> My current commuter roadside spare has 5.
> 
> Rubber solution is SO 20th century dahlings, mwah.


Yea, but sniffing a glueless patch doesn't give me a kick. Sniffff. Aaaah.


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## cd365 (9 Sep 2015)

1 puncture and I throw the tube away


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## I like Skol (9 Sep 2015)

cd365 said:


> 1 puncture and I throw the tube away


Why?


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## cd365 (9 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Why?


I don't trust a tube after it has been patched.


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## I like Skol (9 Sep 2015)

cd365 said:


> I don't trust a tube after it has been patched.


I patch my own tubes including for my 'best' road bike. I run my tyres at pressures up to 120psi and hit speeds over 50mph. If a tube is repaired properly then it is just as safe and reliable as a new tube and every bit as good except it is almost free (a puncture repair costs about 40p?). The only negative is the slight increase in weight.......


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## cd365 (9 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> I patch my own tubes including for my 'best' road bike. I run my tyres at pressures up to 120psi and hit speeds over 50mph. If a tube is repaired properly then it is just as safe and reliable as a new tube and every bit as good except it is almost free (a puncture repair costs about 40p?). The only negative is the slight increase in weight.......


New innertubes cost around £2, time taken plus cost of repair it is not worth it to me


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## jonny jeez (9 Sep 2015)

I would say two.


But having read this thread. This seems wildly wasteful so shall stretch this to five in future


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## I like Skol (9 Sep 2015)

cd365 said:


> I don't trust a tube after it has been patched.





cd365 said:


> New innertubes cost around £2,.......



I wouldn't trust a tube that only cost £2 

IME a tube costs at least £3 for a known brand and once you start getting specific about valve length and stuff they are often £4.50 or more if you stick with the reputable brands (I have always had a good feeling about Michelin tubes). Besides cost there is also the unforgiveable waste of earths finite resources and the growing problem of disposing of the huge amounts of unnecessary waste generated by todays society. I hope you can sleep at night


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## Profpointy (9 Sep 2015)

cd365 said:


> New innertubes cost around £2, time taken plus cost of repair it is not worth it to me



well I dare say I can buy a tea cup for £2 but doesn't make me so bone idle I chuck 'em out rather than washing up


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## steveindenmark (9 Sep 2015)

7 patches in a tube? There is more hole than tube there.

1 patch is enough for me. Tubes are cheap enough to replace.


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## Simpleton (9 Sep 2015)

Invest in some decent tyres for the time and expense of patching a tube.


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## Supersuperleeds (9 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> I wouldn't trust a tube that only cost £2
> 
> IME a tube costs at least £3 for a known brand and once you start getting specific about valve length and stuff they are often £4.50 or more if you stick with the reputable brands (I have always had a good feeling about Michelin tubes). Besides cost there is also the unforgiveable waste of earths finite resources and the growing problem of disposing of the huge amounts of unnecessary waste generated by todays society. I hope you can sleep at night



Halfords 5 for a tenner, never had problems with them.


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## Colin_P (9 Sep 2015)

I'm glad I'm not the only one. After starting this I thought it would be difficult to call but it seems that there are as many mad patchers as me. Saying that, I reckon quite a few no-patchers are quite embarrassed to make themselves known.

Keep up the good work Ladies and Gents and for those that don't, don't be so wasteful.


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## screenman (9 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> I wouldn't trust a tube that only cost £2
> 
> IME a tube costs at least £3 for a known brand and once you start getting specific about valve length and stuff they are often £4.50 or more if you stick with the reputable brands (I have always had a good feeling about Michelin tubes). Besides cost there is also the unforgiveable waste of earths finite resources and the growing problem of disposing of the huge amounts of unnecessary waste generated by todays society. I hope you can sleep at night



I hope the pwer to run your computor is green? And that you make your tea and bath with cold water.


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## Supersuperleeds (9 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> I'm glad I'm not the only one. After starting this I thought it would be difficult to call but it seems that there are as many mad patchers as me. Saying that, I reckon quite a few no-patchers are quite embarrassed to make themselves known.
> 
> Keep up the good work Ladies and Gents and for those that don't, don't be so wasteful.



I'm a no patcher as I am crap at patching tubes. I do recycle some of the tubes, using them as protection for the bike and getting a better grip when attaching lights and gps mounts and the like


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## totallyfixed (9 Sep 2015)

Back in the day before decent tyres were available I used to patch patches, it wasn't uncommon to have tubes with a dozen patches on them. I rarely puncture anymore [should not have said that] but when I do I still patch. I hate the fact that we now live in a throw away society that generates so much waste.


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## Andrew_P (9 Sep 2015)

I had a shed full of tubes waiting to be patched, slight exaggeration but I binned them in the end. Life is too short as it is. Anyway I run tubeless now solves the problem..


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## hatler (9 Sep 2015)

I patch until the tube gives out properly (as detailed by I Like Skol above). Never bothered counting.


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## cd365 (9 Sep 2015)

Supersuperleeds said:


> Halfords 5 for a tenner, never had problems with them.


+1

I have had one puncture in 3 years


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## screenman (9 Sep 2015)

One of my bikes has not had a puncture in 15 years.


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## biggs682 (9 Sep 2015)

i never repair them


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## YahudaMoon (9 Sep 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> I had a shed full of tubes waiting to be patched, slight exaggeration but I binned them in the end. Life is too short as it is. Anyway I run tubeless now solves the problem..



1: Well say 5 tubes, thats at a price at £4 each as a example will cost: - £20

2: Time for fixing 5 tubes 1.1/2 hour if your slow: cost: £0.00 (add your average income for 1. 1/2 hour, or how ever long it takes you)

3: Repair kit cost: - £2.00

4: Time for purchasing 5 more tubes, 5 minutes/infinity (add your time with your average income with point 2)

5: Calculate saving/loss and whether you would rather being working extra hours/or loss of valuable social life, or fixing bike

Ive had a drink and of out for more drinks so all the above may not make any sense


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## Dec66 (9 Sep 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> I had a shed full of tubes waiting to be patched, slight exaggeration but I binned them in the end. Life is too short as it is. Anyway I run tubeless now solves the problem..


Me too... I'll get round to patching them all one day, honest...


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## Profpointy (9 Sep 2015)

YahudaMoon said:


> 1: Well say 5 tubes, thats at a price at £4 each as a example will cost: - £20
> 
> 2: Time for fixing 5 tubes 1.1/2 hour if your slow: cost: £0.00 (add your average income for 1. 1/2 hour, or how ever long it takes you)
> 
> ...




1-1/2 hours to mend a tube (or 5)? Is this blindfolded with repair kit hidden somewhere in next door's shed?

Maybe 10 mins elapsed time - perhaps 5 of which is sipping tea whilst aiting for the glue to get touch-dry. And each extra tube adds what 2 minutes?

Remember the wheel and tyre removal bit is already a sunk cost.

I reckon mending a tube takes about the same time as ordering the tubes on the internet, answering door to postman and opening the parcel - and is a lot quicker than a trip to the shops or to the parcel depot if it arrives when you're out.

And for the poster saying he didn't trust a patch - well I've never had a puncture on the patched bit. (failed to stick in first place maybe, not once its done).


I have to say I am rather dismayed by the wastefullness. That said, I don't reaharpen my razorblades so so maybe being slightly hippocritical


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## Andrew_P (10 Sep 2015)

YahudaMoon said:


> 1: Well say 5 tubes, thats at a price at £4 each as a example will cost: - £20
> 
> 2: Time for fixing 5 tubes 1.1/2 hour if your slow: cost: £0.00 (add your average income for 1. 1/2 hour, or how ever long it takes you)
> 
> ...


Having two brand new tubes in boxes in my rucksack guaranteed not to slowly deflate = priceless


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## Profpointy (10 Sep 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> Having two brand new tubes in boxes in my rucksack guaranteed not to slowly deflate = priceless



well yes, do that as well as it's easier than roadside patching in the rain, without a bowl of water to find the puncture. But still patch the flat one at home later. I tend to carry two spare tubes, one brand new and one patched, plus repair kit for the very bad day. 

Just a thought - a patched tube as a spare os proven to be good, but a brand new one is likely untested and maybe a dud


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## classic33 (10 Sep 2015)

Supersuperleeds said:


> Halfords 5 for a tenner, never had problems with them.


Poundland, you'll get twice as many. Or the same amount at half the cost.


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## I like Skol (10 Sep 2015)

screenman said:


> I hope the pwer to run your computor is green? And that you make your tea and bath with cold water.


I'm not puritanical about it but I do my best to minimise unnecessary waste. Consumerism for consumerism's sake makes me a little queasy.


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## mwktar (10 Sep 2015)

I used to be economical - now i'll just chuck a punctured tube when i get home!


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## screenman (10 Sep 2015)

So one inner tube every few years, which in my case is not thrown away but used for other purposes.

Come on just admit it, your tight.


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## jowwy (11 Sep 2015)

Im a no patcher.......hole it and bin it, lifes to short to sit around mending rubber

Then again ive only had 3 punctures in 3 years......decent tyres, check after every ride, dig out the debris if need be then good to go....

I also change tyres every year, so worn tyres arent an issue either


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## tyred (11 Sep 2015)

screenman said:


> Come on just admit it, your tight.



Fitting two new tubes would double the value of my bike...


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## Profpointy (11 Sep 2015)

jowwy said:


> Im a no patcher.......hole it and bin it, lifes to short to sit around mending rubber
> 
> Then again ive only had 3 punctures in 3 years......decent tyres, check after every ride, dig out the debris if need be then good to go....
> 
> I also change tyres every year, so worn tyres arent an issue either



you change tyres that aren't worn ?


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## deptfordmarmoset (11 Sep 2015)

I've been known to pick up tubes discarded by the roadside and mend them at leisure indoors. I've just caught up with my little pile of puncturees while watching - surprising how much time is just talk, and then add the ads in... - the Tour of Britain. A punctured tube tells you more about the road or the tyre than it tells you about the tube itself. No absolute limit to the number of patches I use, though they do get to look a bit shabby after a while. And that's when I bin or recycle them.


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## jowwy (11 Sep 2015)

Profpointy said:


> you change tyres that aren't worn ?


Yes


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

jowwy said:


> Im a no patcher.......hole it and bin it, lifes to short to sit around mending rubber





jowwy said:


> check after every ride, dig out the debris if need be then good to go....


These two comment are rather contradictory. The time spent checking tyres must far outweigh the time taken to repair 3 punctured tubes? Life's too short to spend it staring at my tyres.
I reckon my road/commute bikes haven't had a much worse puncture rate than you and I never check for bits stuck in them and run my tyres until the inner layers start to show through.

To be honest, I accept that the two camps are never going to agree on the topic of whether to repair or just bin & replace, that is usually a personal choice of the individual. But please don't try to justify the unjustifiable with flawed arguments. The few minutes spent checking for foreign bodies after every ride would add up to more than enough time to repair a handful of tubes every year and the vast majority of punctures are random events that happen instantly, i.e the incident of riding over something sharp and the penetration occurring are simultaneous, regardless of whether you suffer an immediate deflation or a slower, more prolonged let down. No amount of tyre checking will stop that.
If your time really is that valuable then what you should be doing is not checking your tyres after every ride and throwing away each inner tube at the first puncture.


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## jowwy (11 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> These two comment are rather contradictory. The time spent checking tyres must far outweigh the time taken to repair 3 punctured tubes? Life's too short to spend it staring at my tyres.
> I reckon my road/commute bikes haven't had a much worse puncture rate than you and I never check for bits stuck in them and run my tyres until the inner layers start to show through.
> 
> To be honest, I accept that the two camps are never going to agree on the topic of whether to repair or just bin & replace, that is usually a personal choice of the individual. But please don't try to justify the unjustifiable with flawed arguments. The few minutes spent checking for foreign bodies after every ride would add up to more than enough time to repair a handful of tubes every year and the vast majority of punctures are random events that happen instantly, i.e the incident of riding over something sharp and the penetration occurring are simultaneous, regardless of whether you suffer an immediate deflation or a slower, more prolonged let down. No amount of tyre checking will stop that.
> If your time really is that valuable then what you should be doing is not checking your tyres after every ride and throwing away each inner tube at the first puncture.


It takes about 20seconds to spin the tyre and check for debris..............


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## Profpointy (11 Sep 2015)

jowwy said:


> It takes about 20seconds to spin the tyre and check for debris..............



so 40 seconds per bike 5 times a week - that's about same as weekly patching


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

Profpointy said:


> so 40 seconds per bike 5 times a week - that's about same as weekly patching


You are assuming he doesn't find anything during the inspection. If he does, that time multiplies significantly as he looks for something to dig out the offending item and then spends valuable seconds flicking out the tiny stone or glass fragment that probably wouldn't have caused a puncture in his nearly new (<12mths) tyre anyway.


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## Origamist (11 Sep 2015)

2


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## jowwy (11 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> You are assuming he doesn't find anything during the inspection. If he does, that time multiplies significantly as he looks for something to dig out the offending item and then spends valuable seconds flicking out the tiny stone or glass fragment that probably wouldn't have caused a puncture in his nearly new (<12mths) tyre anyway.


Is there an issue with changing tyres each year???? 

Personally i dont think it is and each to their own. I know people on here that get a new bike each year....i see no problem with that either


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> the two camps are never going to agree on the topic of whether to repair or just bin & replace, that is usually a personal choice of the individual. But please don't try to justify the unjustifiable with flawed arguments.





jowwy said:


> Is there an issue with changing tyres each year????
> 
> Personally i dont think it is and each to their own. I know people on here that get a new bike each year....i see no problem with that either


Great, I think we agree on this then? It's personal choice, each to their own etc. You do not have to justify your choice and I have not asked you to.

All I am trying to do is point out that your self-volunteered justification for throwing away perfectly useable inner tubes doesn't bear scrutiny, just in case other cyclists see your example and think this is the normal or best way to do things.


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## jowwy (11 Sep 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Great, I think we agree on this then? It's personal choice, each to their own etc. You do not have to justify your choice and I have not asked you to.
> 
> All I am trying to do is point out that your self-volunteered justification for throwing away perfectly useable inner tubes doesn't bear scrutiny, just in case other cyclists see your example and think this is the normal or best way to do things.


I believe other posters above mine do the same thing......yet no scrutiny of their post has been made

But hey ho.....as you were


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

jowwy said:


> I believe other posters above mine do the same thing......yet no scrutiny of their post has been made
> 
> But hey ho.....as you were


I think I did....


I like Skol said:


> Why?





I like Skol said:


> I wouldn't trust a tube that only cost £2
> 
> IME a tube costs at least £3 for a known brand and once you start getting specific about valve length and stuff they are often £4.50 or more if you stick with the reputable brands (I have always had a good feeling about Michelin tubes). Besides cost there is also the unforgiveable waste of earths finite resources and the growing problem of disposing of the huge amounts of unnecessary waste generated by todays society. I hope you can sleep at night



Yep, didn't think my memory or impartiality was that poor.

Never mind...as you were.


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

Bin and replace always. Trust me on this, there is no one in this world who would want to ride a tube at 130psi that had been patched by me


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

martint235 said:


> Trust me on this, there is no one in this world who would want to ride a tube at 130psi that had been patched by me


Fair cop


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## Dogtrousers (11 Sep 2015)

I quite enjoy patching tubes. Its a nice ritual. Find the hole, sandpaper it, apply rubber, let it dry, apply patch, talc. All done while pottering around doing something else simultaneously.

I don't get many punctures. I quite look forward to it.


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

There is some top notch man-maths going on in this thread, I'll try and do some more...

The extra over time and cost of;

1, Finding the puncture (£0.00)
2, Roughing up the tube (£0.00)
3, Applying a blob of glue (£0.05, probably)
4, Waiting a few minutes for the glue to 'flash off' which is time you would use to check the tyre, remove the thorn et al and wipe the wheel over so it isn't wasted time (£0.00)
5, Pressing the patch on (£0.30, say)

Is not much more time than having to swap over to a new tube, given that you have to take the wheel and tyre off anyway.

Of course for practicality reasons, unless you are having some really bad luck on a ride, you would do this at home and use a pre-patched spare to effect repairs mid ride.

I don't understand the throwaway mindset especially when fixing a puncture is so quick and easy.

Having started this and admitting to throwing away a tube with what I know now as a lowly number of patches on it makes me feel even more disappointed with myself.


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> There is some top notch man-maths going on in this thread, I'll try and do some more...
> 
> The extra over time and cost of;
> 
> ...


6. Taxis to and from hospital for outpatients appointments following blow out of tyre at 35 mph going down Shooters Hill (£50.00)
7. Dental treatment to fix what's left of teeth (£240.00)


* see my previous post.


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## Dogtrousers (11 Sep 2015)

You have to factor in loss of brownie points when doing this. Empty tubes of rubber solution on the side in the kitchen. Talc moved from bathroom and not replaced. Tube left hanging from door handle. All of these can be costly errors.


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

Dogtrousers said:


> I quite enjoy patching tubes. Its a nice ritual. Find the hole, sandpaper it, apply rubber, let it dry, apply patch, talc. All done while pottering around doing something else simultaneously.
> 
> I don't get many punctures. I quite look forward to it.





martint235 said:


> 6. Taxis to and from hospital for outpatients appointments following blow out of tyre at 35 mph going down Shooters Hill (£50.00)
> 7. Dental treatment to fix what's left of teeth (£240.00)
> * see my previous post.



8, Martin235, buy some drawing pins
9, Dogtrousers, go round to Martins house
10, Martin, use drawing pin to cause puncture
11, Dogtrousers will teach you how to fix one properly, he enjoys it!
12, Give money you save to me
13, Everybody wins and is happy.


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> 8, Martin235, buy some drawing pins
> 9, Dogtrousers, go round to Martins house
> 10, Martin, use drawing pin to cause puncture
> 11, Dogtrousers will teach you how to fix one properly, he enjoys it!
> ...


Nope I don't think you're really grasping the limitless bounds of my cackhandedness. No amount of tutoring will result in me being able to patch a tube that would inspire the confidence required to get the bike out the front door.


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

martint235 said:


> Nope I don't think you're really grasping the limitless bounds of my cackhandedness. No amount of tutoring will result in me being able to patch a tube that would inspire the confidence required to get the bike out the front door.



Do you work in "IT" by chance ?


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> Do you work in "IT" by chance ?


Does IT show?

I have actually been a bricklayer (large outside dividing walls) and an upholsterer (pub furniture) but most of my working life is IT


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> Do you work in "IT" by chance ?


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

IT does, I somehow sensed it.

You should be able to add 'patcher' to your skills as you did have a life before IT.


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## screenman (11 Sep 2015)

It seems that people who patch get more punctures than those that do not.


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

Maybe we either cycle further or to more adventurous places.

But there again, maybe you are right !


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## cd365 (11 Sep 2015)

Colin_P said:


> There is some top notch man-maths going on in this thread, I'll try and do some more...
> 
> The extra over time and cost of;
> 
> ...


My time isn't free!
My experience from many years ago was that some patches didn't hold, could have been bad patching by me or whoever patched it.


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## I like Skol (11 Sep 2015)

screenman said:


> It seems that people who patch get more punctures than those that do not.


But, what is frequently and consistently repeated is the fact that nobody gets punctures in the same place as a previous repair. So the act of patching the tube does not induce further punctures. A bad repair will go down again but this is not a repeat puncture, merely a botched repair.


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## screenman (11 Sep 2015)

I feel that rubber deteriorates with age, I think there is some connections with the molecules and air. Cannot be sure and I am short of time to do the research.


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## Colin_P (11 Sep 2015)

Oh it does.

I got a brand new but very old 26" tube out of the box recently to swap [1] the tube on my sons [2] mountain bike and it had perished where it was folded over. Sadly it had to go in the bin.

[1] Valve was gone.... before the trow-away-ers start.
[2] Youngest son, he is twelve and it was _just_ easier to do it myself.

CD365; As for time not being free, indeed, if anyone is lucky enough to have a job their time at work isn't free. At home though it is. Could be a different matter if you are a cycle courier or work 24 hours a day. The time is money thing is relating to fixing a puncture is inconsequential as it only adds five minutes to the process.

More man maths...

At 50k [3] a year gross, say 35k net with 5 weeks holiday, 47 weeks worked 

47 weeks x 5 days x 8 hours a day = 1,880 hours per year
35k / 1,880 = £18.60 an hour
£18.60 / 60 = £0.31 per minute
£0.31 x 5 minutes = £1.55 !!
Less cost of patch and glue, say 25p
So you save 20p based on using a new £2 tube
x5 punctures a year = £1 saved 
That has got to be worth it.

However the price of saving the children, the trees, the elephants and seals is priceless.

[3] I reckon that is a good average.


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

I have to say @Colin_P I am impressed. It's still not for me but I am impressed.


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## potsy (11 Sep 2015)

jowwy said:


> Im a no patcher.......hole it and bin it, lifes to short to sit around mending rubber


I'm with jowwy, very rare that I'll repair a tube, usually cut the odd one up to make strips for fettling but that's about it.

For the few times a year I get a flat it just doesn't seem worth it.

Not quite ready to follow him with the new tyres every year though, now that is strange


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## albal (11 Sep 2015)

I,M old school, always repair. I,d say ther is no number you can put on it. In my limited exprience the valves leak around the join. I discovered whilst attending my Level 2 IMI course the tutor was of the same opinion. Stating that newer tubes have less Buytol in them, ie, less rubber so leak ahir more frequently.

A repaired tube is as good as a non punctured tube if it done correctly. Good quality patches and vulcanizer is all thats needed.


Quite often do I encounter tubes thrown out at the roadside, as it is litter I pick it up and repair it.


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## martint235 (11 Sep 2015)

Ok look at my previous comments and I'm being serious now. You (all you patchers) are happy to run tyres at 100+psi that you've stuck a patch on? With glue? And you have no nervousness at all?

And this is a serious question. Cackhandness aside, I will always bin and replace. I don't want to argue, I want a discussion. You have an obvious point of failure but you can cope with that?


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## deptfordmarmoset (11 Sep 2015)

martint235 said:


> Ok look at my previous comments and I'm being serious now. You (all you patchers) are happy to run tyres at 100+psi that you've stuck a patch on? With glue? And you have no nervousness at all?
> 
> And this is a serious question. Cackhandness aside, I will always bin and replace. I don't want to argue, I want a discussion. You have an obvious point of failure but you can cope with that?


Yes, I'm not worried by that. The tube has nowhere more to go so extra pressure has no effect on the puncture repair where it's patched. The most obvious point of failure is the tyre itself.


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## hatler (11 Sep 2015)

martint235 said:


> Ok look at my previous comments and I'm being serious now. You (all you patchers) are happy to run tyres at 100+psi that you've stuck a patch on? With glue? And you have no nervousness at all?
> 
> And this is a serious question. Cackhandness aside, I will always bin and replace. I don't want to argue, I want a discussion. You have an obvious point of failure but you can cope with that?


Not worried at all. I've been riding patched tubes all my life and there's nothing that means they are more likely to puncture than an unpatched tube.

The glue is glorious stuff and to my mind makes the patch and tube one.


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## Dogtrousers (12 Sep 2015)

Slightly OT but a month or so ago I saw a sad looking MTB er by the side of the road. I stopped and it turned out that he had punctured and had with him the tool kit (and spare tubes) from his road bike. He was well happy with my gift of a packet of self adhesive patches.

As I rode on I thought that in his position I'd have tried riding back carefully with the wrong sized tube fitted. After all the are very stretchy.


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## MiK1138 (12 Sep 2015)

Life is to short for patching, cheap tubes, expensive tyres has served me well these past 2 years.Guess who is getting a visit from the PF on his way home tonight


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## screenman (12 Sep 2015)

Psssssst! Do not tell them about it.


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## ColinJ (12 Sep 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> Having two brand new tubes in boxes in my rucksack guaranteed not to slowly deflate = priceless


But possibly = false sense of security ...

A mate once bought a pack of 10 Specialized tubes and every one of them was faulty! Obviously a bad batch.

Both of his brand new tubes in boxes let him down, so he scrounged one of my reliably-patched spare tubes to get him home! 

I carry 2 or 3 tubes depending on the length of the ride. Usually 1 new tube, and the other(s) patched. I also carry a puncture kit.

As for the original question - probably binned after 4 or 5 patches. There is a small risk of a decent repair failing and that risk is going to be multiplied by the number of times that the tube has been repaired. Usually, something else happens first like the valve getting damaged or the tube splitting along a seam.


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## Andrew_P (12 Sep 2015)

Although I shouldn't really be posting on here as I converted to Schwalbe One tubeless. Lovely.


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## MiK1138 (14 Sep 2015)

it never fails comment on a puncture related post get a visit, headed out yesterday morning, lovely day planned a nice 25 m route, 6 miles in PFT screw nail through the tyre, replaced tude and must have nicked it with the lever, no patches so a 3 mile walk to the nearest LBS, by that time the rain gods decided i needed taught a lesson. i am never posting on a puncture related thread again. and yes i do expect a visit tomorrow but i dont care coz my new wheels will be waiting for me in Evans


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## Colin_P (14 Sep 2015)

MiK1138 said:


> I am never posting on a puncture related thread again. and yes i do expect a visit tomorrow but i dont care coz my new wheels will be waiting for me in Evans



Punctures and rain are character building. This evening I'm disappointed, I got rained on but didn't get a flat.


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## MiK1138 (14 Sep 2015)

Ah but you will tomorrow coz you posted on this thread, Its cursed CURSED I TELLS YA


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## slowmotion (14 Sep 2015)

Three.


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## fossyant (14 Sep 2015)

Latex tubes are binned - but thats for the posh bike. More recently I haven't done too much patching as been getting the Decathlon Tubes - the cheap shrink wrapped ones for £3 for two. I think I have a couple that need patching, but the Durano Plus seem to be ruddy bomb proof. The Decathlon 18-23 700c are very similar to the much more expensive Michelin Butyl.... probably the same tubes TBH.


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## fossyant (14 Sep 2015)

It's usually three if spread about, but if near each other or near the valve it's in the bin.


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## I like Skol (21 Dec 2015)

Just fixed the tube that picked up a puncture on my last commute of the year (I have always said fit a spare tube at the roadside and fix the punctured one later in comfort ). I had a quick count and this tube now has 6 patches but is still good and will be rolled up and packed in to the pannier in case of a future visit!

Repair took about 15 minutes and at least 10 of them were spent checking through my bike tool kit and faffing about with other things while the glue dried.


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## screenman (21 Dec 2015)

On club runs we notice that the people who get the most punctures are the one's with the most patches on thier old tubes.


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## summerdays (21 Dec 2015)

5 and that was when the bike shop replaced it without asking..... it was the original one that was still in there 6+ years later! I have replaced a different one with fewer patches but it was because a patch eventually failed on a seam.


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## Mrs M (21 Dec 2015)

Ssh!
Haven't had a you know what since the 80's.


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## Red17 (21 Dec 2015)

I've manage to work out a cunning 2-3 patch system. 

First go use a self adhesive patch, then stick tube back in bike. Next day find tyre has gone down, so remove tube, remove patch and try again. Next day either give up or have third go usually with a glue patch. Day 4 bin tube as still leaking.

I know the theory but for some reason I just cannot repair more than about 1 in 4 punctures successfully.


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## Jimidh (21 Dec 2015)

None - punctured tubes go in the bin - life is too short to waste time fixing punctures.


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## martinclive (23 Dec 2015)

Red17 said:


> I've manage to work out a cunning 2-3 patch system.
> 
> First go use a self adhesive patch, then stick tube back in bike. Next day find tyre has gone down, so remove tube, remove patch and try again. Next day either give up or have third go usually with a glue patch. Day 4 bin tube as still leaking.
> 
> I know the theory but for some reason I just cannot repair more than about 1 in 4 punctures successfully.


+1 last one i patched failed
All my cycling is commuting - so new tube goes in (but I did used to give the odd punctured one to @MisterStan to repair for himself so I can sleep at night!)


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## I like Skol (23 Dec 2015)

screenman said:


> On club runs we notice that the people who get the most punctures are the one's with the most patches on thier old tubes.


This doesn't seem like a very statistically balanced observation. To make a fair comparison the test would have to be run using control tyres of the same make, model and amount of wear. If the people who have multiple repairs on a tube are getting more punctures then this could be more indicative of a tendency to keep tyres for longer before replacing whereas the people who fit a new tube everytime and throw away the old tube are doing similar with their tyres. i.e changing tyres every few months or even after a puncture (don't laugh, I have seen it suggested on this forum quite a few times). I still stand by my claim that it is physically impossible for a correctly repaired inner tube to be the cause of further punctures (I obviously exclude botched repairs from this statement).


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## Tin Pot (23 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> This doesn't seem like a very statistically balanced observation. To make a fair comparison the test would have to be run using control tyres of the same make, model and amount of wear. If the people who have multiple repairs on a tube are getting more punctures then this could be more indicative of a tendency to keep tyres for longer before replacing whereas the people who fit a new tube everytime and throw away the old tube are doing similar with their tyres. i.e changing tyres every few months or even after a puncture (don't laugh, I have seen it suggested on this forum quite a few times). I still stand by my claim that it is physically impossible for a correctly repaired inner tube to be the cause of further punctures (I obviously exclude botched repairs from this statement).



So, what's a botched repair?


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## Dogtrousers (23 Dec 2015)

I have never had a patch fail. Now, I (knock knock) don't get many punctures, but I firmly believe that if you do the repair properly - sandpaper first, then a nice layer of rubber solution, let it dry, then a patch then talc - and provided it's really a puncture and not a great big tear, then the repair will be tougher than the original. Take your time over it. It's quite enjoyable.

I carry some of those instant "scab" patches, but I've never had to use them. If I did I'd redo the repair at home. The only time they've ever been called into action was to donate a packet of them to another cyclist I came across who didn't have a spare tube.


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## I like Skol (23 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> So, what's a botched repair?


One that doesn't work! This might be because the reason for the puncture wasn't remedied (stuff still stuck in the tyre) and a new or used tube won't fix that, or because the patch has been poorly applied and is leaking. A botched repair can also be done with a brand new tube straight out of the box if the person fitting is careless enough to pinch the tube with a tyre lever when refitting the tyre.


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## Tin Pot (23 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> One that doesn't work! This might be because the reason for the puncture wasn't remedied (stuff still stuck in the tyre) and a new or used tube won't fix that, or because the patch has been poorly applied and is leaking. A botched repair can also be done with a brand new tube straight out of the box if the person fitting is careless enough to pinch the tube with a tyre lever when refitting the tyre.



Cheers.

I'm asking because I just applied a glueless patch and I've 30mikes to get home on it.

Partially inflated to find the hole, just a mil if that.(Was a slow puncture). Wiped, scraped with sand paper.

First patch was careless, so applied the second peeling the back off and applying without touching the sticky bit.

Held for sixty, holding all of the patch down.

Checked rim, checked tyre twice for sharpness, found tiny mark corresponding to hole.


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## Colin_P (23 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> Cheers.
> 
> I'm asking because I just applied a glueless patch and I've 30mikes to get home on it.
> 
> ...



It is all about the glue. You must let it 'flash off' / dry before pressing the patch on. Sounds counter intuitive but if the glue has any 'wet' visible that is the path that leads to a bodged repair, that is.


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## Tin Pot (23 Dec 2015)

Colin_P said:


> It is all about the glue. You must let it 'flash off' / dry before pressing the patch on. Sounds counter intuitive but if the glue has any 'wet' visible that is the path that leads to a bodged repair, that is.


Glueless...


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## Colin_P (23 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> Glueless...



I'll stick around to see how you got on.


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## Tin Pot (23 Dec 2015)

Colin_P said:


> I'll stick around to see how you got on.



I have no idea what we're talking about anymore


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## screenman (23 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> This doesn't seem like a very statistically balanced observation. To make a fair comparison the test would have to be run using control tyres of the same make, model and amount of wear. If the people who have multiple repairs on a tube are getting more punctures then this could be more indicative of a tendency to keep tyres for longer before replacing whereas the people who fit a new tube everytime and throw away the old tube are doing similar with their tyres. i.e changing tyres every few months or even after a puncture (don't laugh, I have seen it suggested on this forum quite a few times). I still stand by my claim that it is physically impossible for a correctly repaired inner tube to be the cause of further punctures (I obviously exclude botched repairs from this statement).



I was merely making an observation.


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## I like Skol (23 Dec 2015)

OK, I just thought you were intending to add something relevant to the thread......


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## potsy (23 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> OK, I just thought you were intending to add something relevant to the thread......


I still have that inner tube in the car that you swapped over for me at CV, it would normally have been binned but those mtb tubes are that big it would fill it.
Maybe I'll repair it one day, but probably not.


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## I like Skol (23 Dec 2015)

potsy said:


> I still have that inner tube in the car that you swapped over for me at CV, it would normally have been binned but those mtb tubes are that big it would fill it.
> Maybe I'll repair it one day, but probably not.


Give it to me then, It will do for the boy's best bike......


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## StuartG (23 Dec 2015)

I guess I get about 2/3 punctures a year. I carry two new tubes and a patch kit for the unlikely event I had a multiple failure and couldn't nick another from a fellow rider.
Punctured tubes are thrown when I get home because:

1) Patching is the Butler's job - and I don't have one.
2) The time to fix, test and repack is worth more than a new tube.
3) I can never get an old tube to fit into the space of a new tube.
4) On a group ride the imperative is to fix fast and not to have to re-fix because the patch failed.
5) Even my successful patches tended to become 'slows' in use. Worst of all worlds.


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## screenman (23 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> OK, I just thought you were intending to add something relevant to the thread......



Do you not think there maybe a link between the people with the most patches getting the most punctures.


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## Colin_P (23 Dec 2015)

screenman said:


> Do you not think there maybe a link between the people with the most patches getting the most punctures.



I don't. I'm obviously a 'patcher' and I can go for very long periods without a puncture and then like buses I might get two or three at a time.

But there may be something in it, if the repairs are not done properly.

....But, as cyclists we are all doing our bit for the environment and that should extend to not throwing something away that can be easily fixed.


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## screenman (23 Dec 2015)

Colin_P said:


> I don't. I'm obviously a 'patcher' and I can go for very long periods without a puncture and then like buses I might get two or three at a time.
> 
> But there may be something in it, if the repairs are not done properly.
> 
> ....But, as cyclists we are all doing our bit for the environment and that should extend to not throwing something away that can be easily fixed.



Completely agree with your last line I have found a good use for the one punctured inner tube I have had in the last 5 years. I think we should all stop using the internet as well as I am sure that does as much damage as one inner tube every few years


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## Tin Pot (24 Dec 2015)

So I'm just ordering some fresh tubes and some patches, but I can't find an obvious puncture repair glue at Halfords.

They have tyre or tube sealant that you "squirt in and rotate the wheel a few times" which doesn't sound like puncture repair glue.

My "good" patch failed after 2hrs last night.


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## I like Skol (24 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> So I'm just ordering some fresh tubes and some patches, but I can't find an obvious puncture repair glue at Halfords.
> 
> They have tyre or tube sealant that you "squirt in and rotate the wheel a few times" which doesn't sound like puncture repair glue.
> 
> My "good" patch failed after 2hrs last night.


Halfords!
THIS is what you need, although I usually buy THIS one which is essentially the same. The important bit is to get feather edge patches to use with glue. If you do it right there is more than enough glue in that tiny tube and I now have a few unopened tubes of glue knocking about the workshop.


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## Tin Pot (24 Dec 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Halfords!
> THIS is what you need, although I usually buy THIS one which is essentially the same. The important bit is to get feather edge patches to use with glue. If you do it right there is more than enough glue in that tiny tube and I now have a few unopened tubes of glue knocking about the workshop.



Cool, thought you might buy them seperately. I guess Ill have to see if Santa thinks I was good this year!

What a crappy Christmas list I have...


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## totallyfixed (24 Dec 2015)

I used to have a source of smaller sized patches for narrower tubes, does anyone know where they can be purchased as a stand alone buy? I don't want to have to buy a repair kit as I have plenty of those. IME a lot of repairs fail because the patch is too wide for the tube so the edges don't stick down properly.


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## Tin Pot (24 Dec 2015)

totallyfixed said:


> I used to have a source of smaller sized patches for narrower tubes, does anyone know where they can be purchased as a stand alone buy? I don't want to have to buy a repair kit as I have plenty of those. IME a lot of repairs fail because the patch is too wide for the tube so the edges don't stick down properly.



I'm getting Halfords pack of patches £1.99, think you can just cut em in half, of they do a continuous strip you cut yourself.


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## Ian193 (25 Dec 2015)

Continental Gatorskin Hardshell tyres bought in January 2014 one puncture the other week so new tube fitted old one binned I'm no good at patching. New tube cost £5.00 so 12p a week on punctures sorry but it's a no brainer to me


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## jay clock (25 Dec 2015)

I have given up mending....


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## bigjim (26 Dec 2015)

I patch all my tubes if possible. I also patch them by the roadside. Takes me about 5 mins. I got a strip from China of 48 for £1 delivered and they are very good. I've never had a patch fail. Most of the punctures I have had are in new unpatched tubes. I've got some of the instant glueless ones and they seem to work fine but they are very thin. Where I ride I pick up a lot of glass and thorns so I do get more than the average on thinish tyres. My Schawlbe touring tyres seem to be immune. I don't worry about a few minutes fixing a tube. It's quite satisfying to beat the corporate throwaway system, IMO. I spend a lot time doing more useless stuff believe me.


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## G3CWI (26 Dec 2015)

Binned one today - cheap Aldi patch failed at the edge. Repaired two others though. Removed a humungous thorn from my rear tyre.


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## Lloss (27 Dec 2015)

Bin them straight away I am not rich but have better things to do than repairing an inner tube.


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## gilespargiter (27 Dec 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> I had a shed full of tubes waiting to be patched, slight exaggeration but I binned them in the end. Life is too short as it is. Anyway I run tubeless now solves the problem..



I know this was posted a while back - but: In what way do tubeless tyres solve the problem? It is more difficult to patch a tubeless tyre or else you end up with a tube fitted anyway.
Maybe you just chuck the tyres away?


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## Tin Pot (27 Dec 2015)

Lloss said:


> Bin them straight away I am not rich but have better things to do than repairing an inner tube.



Ok, you're about the fifteenth person to post that, so I'm not picking on you  but:

You're at home, after work, you've had dinner, there's a couple of hours before bed time...

_Name one thing_ you did last week in that period that was objectively better than repairing an inner tube. Betterment of society or the environment is what we're looking for here. Watching "Strictly" doesn't count. 

Same goes for the rest of you "better things to do" mob, I dare you!


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## Andrew_P (27 Dec 2015)

gilespargiter said:


> I know this was posted a while back - but: In what way do tubeless tyres solve the problem? It is more difficult to patch a tubeless tyre or else you end up with a tube fitted anyway.
> Maybe you just chuck the tyres away?


A tubeless tyre normally has a latex fluid in it that when exposed to air hardens and seals a puncture. One ride stopping puncture in 8000 miles, which I did sling a tube in and then patched at home and removed the tube and put it back in my rucksack. 

There is a big financial difference between a £50 tyre and a £2-3 tube, so not sure what your point was? As it was my first one I used a tube, but now I would patch it at the roadside as it is as quick as it would be to get a tube in.


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## Andrew_P (27 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> Ok, you're about the fifteenth person to post that, so I'm not picking on you  but:
> 
> You're at home, after work, you've had dinner, there's a couple of hours before bed time...
> 
> ...


Remind me how much aggro you have had with your tyres and tubes?


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## Tin Pot (27 Dec 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> Remind me how much aggro you have had with your tyres and tubes?



New ones!

Brand new tubes brand new tyres!


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## Andrew_P (27 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> New ones!
> 
> Brand new tubes brand new tyres!


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## gilespargiter (27 Dec 2015)

I didn't really think you chucked the tyres away Andrew. Saying that I bet somebody has somewhere. . . I have found on some cycle routes, especially near hire centres that enough cyclists vandalise the country side they have come to see by chucking down punctured tubes - which I clear up. So I haven't actually bought a tube in a very long time.
You can of course use the tyre sealer that you mention in tubes too, if you think it is worth using. Like you personally I just fix them on the spot and be done with it, unless it is particularly inconvenient.
I suppose in reply to the OP; not usually more than three or so before I find another tube.


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## Bodhbh (27 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> _Name one thing_ you did last week in that period that was objectively better than repairing an inner tube. Betterment of society or the environment is what we're looking for here. Watching "Strictly" doesn't count.



To be fair I was just about to repair my inner tube, but then needed to combat Magneto to stop the mutants taking over the world so decided to give it a rest.

It probably takes as much time to fix an inner as it does to log on and order a new one, but I think there's a fair point the more you do it, the more chance that tube is going to fail down the line.


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## cd365 (28 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> Ok, you're about the fifteenth person to post that, so I'm not picking on you  but:
> 
> You're at home, after work, you've had dinner, there's a couple of hours before bed time...
> 
> ...


Chopped fallen wood up to use in my log fire to save my gas fired central heating going on.


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## Colin_P (28 Dec 2015)

As the starter of this thread, it appears that some patch and others bin.

Here is a twist;

I carry a pump and a CO2 cannister system. When I do get a flat on the hybrid I just use the pump as it is easy to get sufficient pressure in the tube. But when I get a flat on the roady, I start off off with the pump and then use a CO2 cannister to get up to pressure.

I do feel guilty about doing that as the cannisters are far more wasteful than lobbing a tube away. Yet I always patch my tubes. I suppose I should purchase a more efficient pump.

The other thing as a few others have mentioned is that for those that do lob their tubes, quite a few do exactly that, lob them where ever they may be. You quite often see discarded tubes littering the roadside.


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## Poacher (28 Dec 2015)

totallyfixed said:


> I* used to have a source of smaller sized patches for narrower tubes*, does anyone know where they can be purchased as a stand alone buy? I don't want to have to buy a repair kit as I have plenty of those. IME a lot of repairs fail because the patch is too wide for the tube so the edges don't stick down properly.


Were they from the late, lamented Mike Dyason, by any chance? I don't know of a current supplier, but I still have quite a few feather-edge patches of about 22mm diameter.
If I remember (not a given nowadays!) I'll drop you a couple of dozen next time I pass through Oakham.


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## summerdays (28 Dec 2015)

Poacher said:


> Were they from the late, lamented Mike Dyason, by any chance? I don't know of a current supplier, but I still have quite a few feather-edge patches of about 22mm diameter.
> If I remember (not a given nowadays!) I'll drop you a couple of dozen next time I pass through Oakham.


You have intrigued me... Err how many do you have anyway


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## Tin Pot (28 Dec 2015)

I got co2 for triathlons, I've only ever used two - both on the road as it happens. Having unseated a tube, I'm not sure the speed benefit is a good trade off against a pump.


More on the "if you patch it properly it's as good as new" front...this how my glueless patch failed earlier in the thread. It seems to have come off a bit and folded:







Having inspected it further there was no damage inside the tyre, no sharp things left, so Indont see what I did "wrong".


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## Poacher (28 Dec 2015)

summerdays said:


> You have intrigued me... Err how many do you have anyway


Probably about 50 if I track them down from their various locations (saddlepack, panniers, scattered around outhouse, etc.)
Remains of a bag of about 100 bought maybe eight years ago. The ones I'll have left should see me out, all being well!


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## Poacher (28 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> I got co2 for triathlons, I've only ever used two - both on the road as it happens. Having unseated a tube, I'm not sure the speed benefit is a good trade off against a pump.
> 
> 
> More on the "if you patch it properly it's as good as new" front...this how my glueless patch failed earlier in the thread. It seems to have come off a bit and folded:
> ...


Glueless - say no more.


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## summerdays (28 Dec 2015)

I use the ones with the little orange skirt around them so it blends into the tyre better.


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## youngoldbloke (28 Dec 2015)

summerdays said:


> I use the ones with the little orange skirt around them so it blends into the tyre better.


 Rema Tip Top 16mm, available in quantity online eg £10.49 for 100


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## uclown2002 (28 Dec 2015)

Only 4 punctures over 4.5 years riding over 50K miles, so mine go in the bin.


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## loveandpeace1 (28 Dec 2015)

3


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## cyberknight (29 Dec 2015)

I try to patch if i can within reason , sometimes if you get a patch on a tube with mould edging a patch will not sit right anyway,


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## screenman (29 Dec 2015)

If patching is so sound why is there a limit as to how many some people will use? honest question. As you all may know I use the tube for something else once it gets punctured. Hold new tree's or shrubs up, holding feet together when swimming, holding number plate on trailer, cushioning on some of the tools I use etc.


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## Dogtrousers (29 Dec 2015)

screenman said:


> If patching is so sound why is there a limit as to how many some people will use? honest question.


I've never had a patch fail and I'd never discard a tube because it was patched. I may decide that one with a lot of patches was a bit old, or if I noticed that a patch was coming loose perhaps ... but that's never happened.


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## classic33 (30 Dec 2015)

If you remove a patch and replace, or patch over one already in place due to a puncture.
Does that count as one or two patches?


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## I like Skol (31 Dec 2015)

Tin Pot said:


> More on the "if you patch it properly it's as good as new" front...this how my glueless patch failed earlier in the thread. It seems to have come off a bit and folded:
> View attachment 114109


Glueless patch! Never used them and never intend to.



screenman said:


> If patching is so sound why is there a limit as to how many some people will use? honest question.


No limit to the number of patches but just a judgement call on the tubes overall condition at the time. If their are any signs of deterioration to the tube, old repairs or the valve then it is time for the bin. No chance I want to be avoidably stopped due to a dodgy tube.


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## Lloss (1 Jan 2016)

Tin Pot said:


> Ok, you're about the fifteenth person to post that, so I'm not picking on you  but:
> 
> You're at home, after work, you've had dinner, there's a couple of hours before bed time...
> 
> ...


Go out training ,take the dog for a walk ,chat to a neighbour ,clean the car,go shopping and I do not know what Strictly is .


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