# Pulled the trigger Tern HSD S8i



## macp (10 Apr 2021)

Loved my time with my Brompton but an opportunity (and giving my car to my daughter) has come my way. So I decided on a change. Particularly as im replacing my car for almost everyday use. There is a 2nd car in the family but its actually only available evenings & weekends. 

Love cargo bikes but didnt want/need the full size GSD so the HSD really fits my needs. Its being delivered next week and cant bloody wait.


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## Drago (10 Apr 2021)

We can't wait either!


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## macp (10 Apr 2021)

Drago said:


> We can't wait either!


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## Drago (11 Apr 2021)

No sarcasm here. Genuinely keen to see your new scoot!


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## TheDoctor (11 Apr 2021)

^^That. A small-wheel cargo bike is an intriguing idea, and not a style of bike I've ridden (and I've done a few different pennys and a triplet trike).


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## Fab Foodie (12 Apr 2021)

TheDoctor said:


> ^^That. A small-wheel cargo bike is an intriguing idea, and not a style of bike I've ridden (and I've done a few different pennys and a triplet trike).


We have an Orbea Katu with rear rack, it’s a hoot and a good load lugger, a mini version of my Elephant bike....


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## sheddy (12 Apr 2021)

https://www.ternbicycles.com/uk/bikes/471/hsd-s8i


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## Pale Rider (12 Apr 2021)

I have a compact framed 20" wheel Bosch ebike which is more fun to ride than a traditional big wheel bike.

Very capable as well - I've done a few 50+ mile rides on mine.

A limiting factor for panniers is the height of the rear carrier.

The Tern's looks to be set fairly high, but I imagine large capacity panniers might not sit well.

At least it has a belt and hub gears, so there's less chance of anything fouling on the drive side.


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## macp (12 Apr 2021)

Thanks all I still have a thing for small wheel bikes and love the idea of a two wheeled pickup. I looked at the Orbea Katu and liked it. And it was a good bit less expensive but I just felt the Tern offered me more. Believe it or not I would have settled for the less expensive Tern P9 but got a better (for me) deal on the S8i. I guess because its thought to be the bigger seller. Amazed I got one from stock with a fairly quick delivery time. 

Regarding panniers I think Tern have it figured out. I have these Tern cargo panniers on order so I will let you know. For those interested I will also let you know how I get on with the bike. I might consider going for a box type cargo bike after this.


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## Drago (12 Apr 2021)

I just like the idea of a utility bike and integrating it into your daily living.


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## macp (12 Apr 2021)

Drago said:


> I just like the idea of a utility bike and integrating it into your daily living.


Yes me too and im taking the plunge to replace my car with this.


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## Fab Foodie (12 Apr 2021)

Small-wheelers are fab...


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## macp (12 Apr 2021)

Fab Foodie said:


> Small-wheelers are fab...


Definitely where its at for me.


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## Fab Foodie (12 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> Definitely where its at for me.


We have 5 here and I’ve just ordered my second Brompton :-)


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## Drago (13 Apr 2021)

Fab Foodie said:


> Small-wheelers are fab...


Or tney would be if anyone other than Tern made them with a payload capacity that allows real men to tide them. Brompies are fine for librarians, vegetarians, thespians, and anyone without muscle tone to ride them, and thats about it.


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## T4tomo (13 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> Thanks all I still have a thing for small wheel bikes and love the idea of a two wheeled pickup. I looked at the Orbea Katu and liked it. And it was a good bit less expensive but I just felt the Tern offered me more. Believe it or not I would have settled for the less expensive Tern P9 but got a better (for me) deal on the S8i. I guess because its thought to be the bigger seller. Amazed I got one from stock with a fairly quick delivery time.
> 
> Regarding panniers I think Tern have it figured out. I have these Tern cargo panniers on order so I will let you know. For those interested I will also let you know how I get on with the bike. I might consider going for a box type cargo bike after this.


Looks ideal for the job. you could fashion a decent sized box or basket to attach on the rear rack too. Easier to lob shopping etc into than packing panniers.


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## T4tomo (13 Apr 2021)

Drago said:


> Brompies are fine for librarians, vegetarians, thespians, and anyone without muscle tone to ride them, and thats about it.


Most people I've seen using Brompton, self included, don't fall into one of those categories. I'm not exactly a chubber, but 80kg I'm no lightweight, and do fine on one.


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## Drago (13 Apr 2021)

The best Brompie has a piffling 110kg limit. 

Probably not a bad thing, because the Tern folder is a more stable platform for heavier loads anyway.


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## Pale Rider (13 Apr 2021)

Drago said:


> The best Brompie has a piffling 110kg limit.



As do many bikes - notionally.

I rode my Brommie at more than that without any bother.


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## macp (13 Apr 2021)

My new ride has arrived and visually its a bit of a beast. Had a quick run down the road and its a lovely ride. Very smooth and really quiet. That Bosch motor makes almost no noise. Love how it climbed a particularly infamous hill in our village. One thing though in 5th I noticed it jumping in and out of gear once or twice. Could be adjustment or could be me. Do you keep spinning as you change with the Nexus 8 system ?

Looking forward to my first commute tomorrow.

Edit: just found this and very pleased I did 
How to set Shimano Nexus


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## Pale Rider (14 Apr 2021)

Looks smart - and that's just your kitchen.

I was going to start burbling on about Shimano's yellow dots, but you've found out about those.

The axle nuts need to be kept tight.

On my Alfine 11 bike they kept coming loose, so also need to be checked regularly.

Of course, you will need to carry a proper spanner if you want to do any wheel out roadside puncture repairs.

Does the bike have Big Ben Plus tyres?

They are about the most puncture resistant in the 20" balloon size, but are not as tough as Marathon Pluses.

What's the sketch for belt tension?

Some of the instructions for that are a bit daunting, although user experience is the belt is more tolerant of low tension than the maker suggests.


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## macp (14 Apr 2021)

Pale Rider said:


> Looks smart - and that's just your kitchen.
> 
> I was going to start burbling on about Shimano's yellow dots, but you've found out about those.
> 
> ...



Thanks and yes its living in the kitchen until Monday when my insurance approved lock arrives . We live almost in the middle of nowhere and never had a bike stolen but im taking no chances.

That youtube guide was spot on and i adjusted and sorted the problem. However I do feel there is maybe a knack to shifting gears with this system as there was a slight jumping in and out of gear once on my way home following a gear change. Also as I changed down fast from 6th to 3rd it stuck in 1 gear until i changed up and down and everything was back to normal. A mate of mine bought a new Pashley with this gear system and was having similar issues except he said he lost all gears. He got shot of it within days but at this stage im not worried. I will monitor it though.

The bike has the Big Ben Performance Line, Raceguard, Liteskin whatever they are but they feel excellent. The bike handles beautifully and feels so balanced. Even more so when coming to a stop. May seem silly but it also feels like it has presence on the road. 

Honestly I have briefly looked at the piles of documents & manuals that came with the bike but I saw something where it mentions using your phone to measure tension. 

The panniers you see are the Tern Cargo 37L and frankly I dont like them. Cant get on with the velcro attachments for the rack and the miles of strap that flaps about when closing them. They are definitely going back to be replaced with something else. I loved the Brompton medium messenger bag with its internal pockets and versatility. And at about 13 litres volume it was enough. So I want a pair of panniers with those kind of attributes. Any suggestions, do I need to be mindful of anything ?


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## Pale Rider (15 Apr 2021)

Ebikes - even small wheeled ones - do have more road presence than a skinny racer.

My 650b Riese and Muller Supercharger is something of a beast - a mate described it as 'the HGV of bicycles'.

There's no doubt motorists are less inclined to barge me out of the way on it.

The smartphone belt tension app uses harmonics - seems over complicated to me when you can simply check the play.

I was thinking more of how the tension is applied.

There's no means of moving the chainring on a Bosch motor, so an eccentric bottom bracket is out.

Thus you will need to move the rear wheel.

I can't see the dropouts on your bike because of the panniers.

It may not matter, there's an adventure cyclist on YouTube who runs his belt almost floppy, so it does look like they are more tolerant of low tension than the manufacturer suggests.

As regards panniers, too much depth is your enemy.

You also want something reasonably rigid to avoid flop against the balloon tyres - the bag cannot sit 'inside' the rim as it would on a 700c bike.

It would be inappropriate to fit anything cheap on a bike like yours, so I reckon the small 12.5l sized Ortliebs would be a good bet.

They have a few different names, Sport Roller, City Roller, Front Roller, but all are much the same.

Looks like you have the cheaper, less puncture resistant Big Bens.

Fixing a puncture is harder with a heavy ebike, although the 20" ones are a bit easier to handle.

Then there's pratting around with the nutted axle, cable release - not your hub's strongest point - and belt tension if the flat is on the back.

Might be worth going for the more puncture resistant Big Ben Plus when replacement time arrives.

Finally, a brief pause in pedalling seems to be the best way to shift gear - it soon becomes second nature.

You ought to be able to grab a handful of gears at rest, which is one of the advantages of hub gears.

Sounds to me as if the bike requires use, bang some miles on it with plenty of unnecessary shifts.

As a general point, the Shimano twist shift is not as positive as rapid fire, so that's something else you may need to use a fair bit to become familiar with - another reason to do lots of shifting on the first few rides.

https://www.rutlandcycling.com/acce...dHQygOY4X3HUnzhyF68aAgpJEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds


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## macp (15 Apr 2021)

Many thanks for the reply and excellent advice. I agree with the HGV comment mine feels big but beautifully balanced. And it feels so planted over rough or uneven road surfaces. Yet handling is still fun and you can flick it about. I had my concerns about the Bosch motor having enough grunt but its definitely got enough. Within reason I tend to do my own maintenance but a puncture seems like it will be a challenge. So yes I will go to the BB plus sooner rather than later 

I think I have the shifting pretty much down now with, as you say a brief pause. But like you say I suspect a combination of operator error and some bedding in is needed. Had a wonderful ride home tonight taking the extra long route and got a proper feel for the hub gears and superb road holding.

As you say I think Ortlieb have all the options I need. I loved my Brompton messenger bag so im going to see if I can include some of the things from that bag into my new panniers.

And finally one of the reasons I bought it. I had to get this box containing cycle parts to my work. Just so easy


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## Drago (15 Apr 2021)

I'm loving it!


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## CXRAndy (15 Apr 2021)

The Nexus 8 hub for changing gear, you need to back off pedalling to allow the shift. Also Shimano put very little lubricant inside from new. I found this out when I dismantled my wife's Nexus 8 hub.

First two photos showing little factory grease applied. Final photo is after I smothered the internals with semi fluid grease. It shifts alot better and runs quieter 

The shift cable adjust is done in 4th gear. You check on the nexus for 2 yellow lines which should be perfectly aligned. However this doesn't guarantee perfect shifting. Adjust the barrel next to the gear shift (handlebar) a few mm either side of yellow marks. Do this until best shifting is achieved.


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## Tenkaykev (16 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> Thanks and yes its living in the kitchen until Monday when my insurance approved lock arrives . We live almost in the middle of nowhere and never had a bike stolen but im taking no chances.
> 
> That youtube guide was spot on and i adjusted and sorted the problem. However I do feel there is maybe a knack to shifting gears with this system as there was a slight jumping in and out of gear once on my way home following a gear change. Also as I changed down fast from 6th to 3rd it stuck in 1 gear until i changed up and down and everything was back to normal. A mate of mine bought a new Pashley with this gear system and was having similar issues except he said he lost all gears. He got shot of it within days but at this stage im not worried. I will monitor it though.
> 
> ...


There's a new video on the Brilliant Bikes YouTube channel where they show the Brompton rack top bag. They show a different bag with fold down panniers at the end of the video and its the " Madison rack top bag with fold out panniers" not sure if it would suit but might be worth a look.

https://brilliantbikes.co.uk/brompt...ck-top-bag-with-fold-out-pannier-pockets.html
https://www.freewheel.co.uk/madison-rt20-rack-top-bag-with-fold-out-pannier-pockets-mcb004


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## Pale Rider (16 Apr 2021)

Lubing Shimano hubs is a tricky subject because some take oil and some take grease.

If the OP is considering a tinker, or asking his bike shop to do it, it needs to be established beyond doubt which is the correct lubing technique.

Not all, say, eight speed hubs are the same, so the only way to get it right is to use the hub's long model number.

My Alfine hub took oil with a regular change - like a Rohloff.

Some take grease like Andy's, but my bike shop had one in which the service instructions were to immerse in oil in a beaker for an hour or two.

So that's at least three specified methods.


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## CXRAndy (16 Apr 2021)

Generally, the Alfine range have oil and most obviously they have a drain plug on the body of the hub. The lesser models are greased (with no drain plug) or lets say, have a bit of white put here and there. 

Its quite straightforward for a practical person and a few basic tools. There are plenty of threads about doing what I did.

I also have an Alfine 11 di2 hub which I fitted a magnetic drain plug to pull the swarf out of the oil


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## Tenkaykev (16 Apr 2021)

CXRAndy said:


> The Nexus 8 hub for changing gear, you need to back off pedalling to allow the shift. Also Shimano put very little lubricant inside from new. I found this out when I dismantled my wife's Nexus 8 hub.
> 
> First two photos showing little factory grease applied. Final photo is after I smothered the internals with semi fluid grease. It shifts alot better and runs quieter
> 
> ...



lovely photos. I worken on many gearbox assemblies ( usually attached to electric motors. )
We mostly kept deep groove ball bearings in our stock in C3 fit and 2 RS ( two rubber shields ) for use on the electric motors, as it was easy to flip out either one or both of the shields as required. When we flipped a shield it always amazed me how very little grease was fitted, this was consistent over a large range of bearing sizes. 
When changing bearings we would flip one of the shields and add extra grease, about a third of the void. 
We always used quality bearings and got through a lot of them in a typical week. I remember getting a visit from the SKF area rep and mentioned the lack of grease. He said the grease fill was all that was required and that their research had shown that the most common cause of bearing failure was over greasing.


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## macp (16 Apr 2021)

Tenkaykev said:


> lovely photos. I worken on many gearbox assemblies ( usually attached to electric motors. )
> We mostly kept deep groove ball bearings in our stock in C3 fit and 2 RS ( two rubber shields ) for use on the electric motors, as it was easy to flip out either one or both of the shields as required. When we flipped a shield it always amazed me how very little grease was fitted, this was consistent over a large range of bearing sizes.
> When changing bearings we would flip one of the shields and add extra grease, about a third of the void.
> We always used quality bearings and got through a lot of them in a typical week. I remember getting a visit from the SKF area rep and mentioned the lack of grease. He said the grease fill was all that was required and that their research had shown that the most common cause of bearing failure was over greasing.



Agreed and I also work in the electric motor industry. Fitted plenty worm boxes. I had to fit some 6306 2RS bearings to a motor this morning 

Had a really hard day at work today so I decided to let the bike do the work on the way home. Absolutely awesome !!


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## macp (18 Apr 2021)

Went for a long ride on Saturday and it was sheer bliss. I saw a Youtube video the other day where the presenter was giving advice on what ebike you should buy starting with power. He suggested that 250w is ok on the flat but no good for climbing hills. Ok I live in Cheshire its not overly hilly but they do exist. Im also in relatively good shape physically but at no time does my bike ever feel like its struggling uphill. 

Btw got an unbelievable deal on Thule Shield panniers.


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## Pale Rider (19 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> Went for a long ride on Saturday and it was sheer bliss. I saw a Youtube video the other day where the presenter was giving advice on what ebike you should buy starting with power. He suggested that 250w is ok on the flat but no good for climbing hills. Ok I live in Cheshire its not overly hilly but they do exist. Im also in relatively good shape physically but at no time does my bike ever feel like its struggling uphill.
> 
> Btw got an unbelievable deal on Thule Shield panniers.



The reviewer might have been talking about direct drive hub motors, often called pancake motors because of their large diameter.

They produce very little torque in comparison to other types, so to climb hills you need 500w or more.

On the plus side, they are whisper quiet and go quite well once wound up.

The bad outweighs the good, so there aren't many factory direct drive ebikes, but there are kits and 'ebay specials'.


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## steveindenmark (19 Apr 2021)

What sort of range are you getting out of it?


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## macp (19 Apr 2021)

steveindenmark said:


> What sort of range are you getting out of it?


Its early days Steve but I have mine in sport and the range keeps climbing. Currently its showing that I have a range of 71mls.


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## macp (28 Apr 2021)

New panniers have arrived and really pleased with them.


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## Drago (28 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> He suggested that 250w is ok on the flat but no good for climbing hills.


I would seriously question the reviewers knowledge/intellgence/sanity. Im 19 stones and 250W assist me up hills very nicely. OK, I still got to work for it, but not found a hill yet where I had to get off and walk.


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## macp (28 Apr 2021)

Drago said:


> I would seriously question the reviewers knowledge/intellgence/sanity. Im 19 stones and 250W assist me up hills very nicely. OK, I still got to work for it, but not found a hill yet where I had to get off and walk.



I agree its a quarter kilowatt and I sell & modify motors of this size so have some experience. Exactly as you wrote you do have to work a little on hills but in my case im hardly fatigued or out of breath.


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## Pale Rider (28 Apr 2021)

macp said:


> New panniers have arrived and really pleased with them.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Looks like the panniers sit on the carrier as well as could be expected.

They might be properly waterproof, but sitting so low down they will get some stick in the wet weather.

My cheapo Halfords panniers leak in heavy rain from the bottom when fitted to my 20" wheel ebike.

I know that because there's a puddle of water in the bottom of the bag, but the stuff further up stays dry.

Worth considering a liner if the contents are particularly precious or until you establish if the Thules are 100% waterproof.

I use a couple of supermarket bags for life.

If I don't pack the shopping too tightly, I can put it in the pannier still in the bag, and lift it out still in the bag when I get home.

Which is neat, even in dry weather.


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## macp (2 May 2021)

Pale Rider said:


> Looks like the panniers sit on the carrier as well as could be expected.
> 
> They might be properly waterproof, but sitting so low down they will get some stick in the wet weather.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the reply.
So today I fitted the Tern cache box described as a glovebox for your bike. It fits low down in a a made to measure gap and is perfect for a lock and a spare inner tube/tools. Very pleased with it.

What im not so enamored with is the Abus rear wheel lock. One good thing is the same key fits the lock and the battery release. However when the rear wheel is unlocked you cant remove the key. So anytime you leave the bike unattended you must lock it and remove the key or risk somebody nicking your battery. But of course you cant put the key on the fob with all of your other keys. Unless you dont mind a bunch of keys rattling and scratching your paint as you ride. I know im going to lose that key one day or accidentally bend a spoke as I forget the lock is still engaged. I notice it is attached to the bike with just two small allen bolts. Not particularly secure in my opinion.


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## Pale Rider (3 May 2021)

macp said:


> So anytime you leave the bike unattended you must lock it and remove the key or risk somebody nicking your battery.



The other small risk is someone locks the wheel while you are away, takes the key, leaving you to return to an immobilised bike.

The lock itself would usually be welded to the bike, making removal difficult.

Abus supply their products with a key number on a plastic card, so ordering spares is fairly straightforward.

My Riese and Muller Charger is twin battery, both locks are the same, and both came with a spare, so I started off with four keys, all alike, and two plastic reference cards, also alike.


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## macp (3 May 2021)

Pale Rider said:


> The other small risk is someone locks the wheel while you are away, takes the key, leaving you to return to an immobilised bike.
> 
> The lock itself would usually be welded to the bike, making removal difficult.



I read that somewhere else. Another owner was worried that somebody may do that. I could really see that happening. I think with the lock being bolt on it fits with the modular theme that Tern have gone with. And in most cases I really like that but not in this case.


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