# The bakers' thread



## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

We've got a few on here who enjoy baking and there are posts scattered all over so I thought it might be useful for us to gather together in one place, whether it's about bread, cakes, buns or pastries.

Please post your recipes, successes, disasters, questions, advice & tips.


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

I've been trying out a new sourdough recipe and it's producing some cracking bread:







This is from a recipe I found at Shipton Mill's site for an overnight, no-knead sourdough.

I do mine in an enamelled pot with lid, so that I can keep as much moisture in as possible during the first 20 minutes of baking.


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## DCLane (19 Dec 2017)

Any samples sent this direction will be gratefully received


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## Dave 123 (19 Dec 2017)

Why did the baker have smelly hands?

Cos he kneaded a poo.


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

Dave 123 said:


> Why did the baker have smelly hands?
> 
> Cos he kneaded a poo.








Out!


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## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2017)

And at the other end of the scale, soda bread, which is incredibly easy and quick to make.
350 ml buttermilk (or just add two tbsps lemon juice to ordinary milk, full fat is best and leave for 15 mins)
500g plain flour (or whatever mixture of flours you want)
1 tsp salt, 1 tsp bicarbonate of soda
Mix everything together, shape into a round, roll in oats, or linseed or any seed really, cut a cross into the top (this is to help it cook through)
36 mins in oven at 180C.

For added deliciousness, one or two tbsps black treacle at the mixing stage (my favourite) or fried onion and cheese. 
The basic recipe gets you this


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## burndust (19 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I've been trying out a new sourdough recipe and it's producing some cracking bread:
> 
> View attachment 387755
> 
> ...


that looks good GG, always fancied making sourdough but the whole making a starter for weeks in advance has always put me off, this looks very easy, i've used the sponge method in the past which has worked well


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## wormo (19 Dec 2017)

When I use spelt or rye flour, no matter what, I find that the loaves tend to be heavy. Is this normal? Do you add white flour?


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

burndust said:


> that looks good GG, always fancied making sourdough but the whole making a starter for weeks in advance has always put me off,



My starter (now 17 months old) was ready to go after 7 days, it's really not a faff as it does its own thing and all you need to do for those first 6 days is feed it. That takes two minutes tops each day.
After that, I store mine in the fridge, bringing it out on Thursday evening to warm up again, feed it on Friday so it's lively for use that evening.


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## annedonnelly (19 Dec 2017)

Tail End Charlie said:


> And at the other end of the scale, soda bread, which is incredibly easy and quick to make.
> 350 ml buttermilk (or just add two tbsps lemon juice to ordinary milk, full fat is best and leave for 15 mins)
> 500g plain flour (or whatever mixture of flours you want)
> 1 tsp salt, 1 tsp bicarbonate of soda
> ...



I read somewhere - Paul Hollywood perhaps - that you could just use watered down milk instead of buttermilk, so that's what I do. I'll try the lemon juice trick next time.

I got some seeded flour very much reduced recently so I've been using it up making soda bread.


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## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2017)

burndust said:


> that looks good GG, always fancied making sourdough but the whole making a starter for weeks in advance has always put me off, this looks very easy, i've used the sponge method in the past which has worked well


Burndust, I know what you mean about the starter taking time, but once you've got it going, it can live in the fridge for years and you just top up when making a new batch. It ends up looking like this in the fridge, which can cause some consternation to anyone looking in your fridge. I've had this going for about five years now and last made a sourdough at least six months ago, but the starter will be fine the next time I make one.


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

wormo said:


> When I use spelt or rye flour, no matter what, I find that the loaves tend to be heavy. Is this normal? Do you add white flour?




Are you following a recipe or winging it?

Spelt has only a moderate amount of gluten and rye has hardly any, so both will benefit from the addition of white flour to give it a better rise.


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## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2017)

annedonnelly said:


> I read somewhere - Paul Hollywood perhaps - that you could just use watered down milk instead of buttermilk, so that's what I do. I'll try the lemon juice trick next time.
> 
> I got some seeded flour very much reduced recently so I've been using it up making soda bread.


The lemon juice is to react with the bicarb to provide the lift. I guess you could use milk and baking powder but I've never tried that. Yoghurt and a bit of lemon juice works well aswell. I use whatever flours I have to hand and regularly buy up flours close to their end date (Aldi specials?).


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## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Are you following a recipe or winging it?
> 
> Spelt has only a moderate amount of gluten and rye has hardly any, so both will benefit from the addition of white flour to give it a better rise.


This is true, without adding strong white flour both flours will give a very dense loaf (which some people prefer of course). They both need more water than usual aswell.


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## summerdays (19 Dec 2017)

annedonnelly said:


> I read somewhere - Paul Hollywood perhaps - that you could just use watered down milk instead of buttermilk, so that's what I do. I'll try the lemon juice trick next time.
> 
> I got some seeded flour very much reduced recently so I've been using it up making soda bread.


I've often used vinegar to sour the milk.


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## wormo (19 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Are you following a recipe or winging it?
> 
> Spelt has only a moderate amount of gluten and rye has hardly any, so both will benefit from the addition of white flour to give it a better rise.


Cheers for that, I will up the white flour content.

Ta


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2017)

wormo said:


> Cheers for that, I will up the white flour content.
> 
> Ta



Here's a recipe that uses a high ratio of white to rye. The quantities are for a big loaf so you could cut it down proportionately to an easier size.

https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/basic-rye-bread.htm

You can vary the ratio to suit your taste, more white flour means more rise and a lighter crumb. Happy experimenting!


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## MichaelW2 (19 Dec 2017)

Open pack of Aldi shortcrust pre-rolled lastry. Cut into rounds, fill with spoonful of Aldi mincepie filling, bake until baked. Gateway baking.


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## threebikesmcginty (19 Dec 2017)

wormo said:


> When I use spelt or rye flour, no matter what, I find that the loaves tend to be heavy. Is this normal? Do you add white flour?



If you buy Dove's brown spelt there's a recipe in the back for a Roman loaf which is basically 500g flour, yeast, salt and a tablespoon of honey dissolved in 400ml of warm water. Mix dry stuff, add water and then a tablespoon of olive oil while still craggy. Minimum needing, chuck it in a tin for 25 minutes then in a 180 fan oven for 40 minutes. The loaf is sweetish and not overly dense, it does rise and is therefore a bit lighter but not like normal bread. I don't mix in regular bread flour, what's the point as you might as well just make a normal loaf. It's very good.


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## wormo (19 Dec 2017)

Thanks for the responses. When I get a spare minute I will have a go.


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## threebikesmcginty (19 Dec 2017)

I use this natural yoghurt, rather than buttermilk, recipe for sodabread, I use Matthews Cotswold Crunch instead of brown flour, lovely nutty malty taste, also that temp is a bit too hot, I generally find that 25 minutes at 200 is fine (in our oven). Forget the linseed nonsense too. You can have a loaf ready in a little over half an hour.


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## classic33 (19 Dec 2017)

* Golden Syrup Flapjacks* 

*Ingredients*
250g Porridge Oats
125g Butter
125g Brown Sugar
2-3 tbsps Golden Syrup (depends how gooey you want it)

*Method*

Place all ingredients in a food processor and pulse until fully mixed, but be careful not to overmix making sure the oats keep their texture.
Lightly grease a baking tin with butter and spoon in all the mixture.
Using the back of a spoon press into the corners so the mixture is flat and score the mixture into 12 squares.
Place in the oven and bake on 180 until golden brown (about 20 minutes).


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## r04DiE (19 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> We've got a few on here who enjoy baking and there are posts scattered all over so I thought it might be useful for us to gather together in one place, whether it's about bread, cakes, buns or pastries.
> 
> Please post your recipes, successes, disasters, questions, advice & tips.


Mmmm, bread. Thanks for starting this thread


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## summerdays (20 Dec 2017)

Speaking of soda bread, does anyone have a good recipe for soda or wheaten farls? As a child my granny and my mum would have made them very regularly but both used the "by eye" type of recipe and I've never quite managed to recreate the original deliciousness.


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## Reynard (21 Dec 2017)

wormo said:


> When I use spelt or rye flour, no matter what, I find that the loaves tend to be heavy. Is this normal? Do you add white flour?



Yeah, especially spelt. It is a notoriously fickle flour to work with. Rye not so much. Though it depends whether you are using wholegrain or light rye / spelt.

Generally, I tend to stick to 30% wholegrain when making bread - I've found it gives me the best balance for a good loaf that's not too heavy.


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## Reynard (21 Dec 2017)

And now for a seasonal recipe - especially for those of you who like a wee bit of Lebkuchen. Runs rings around the shop bought varieties. From my 1930s Bavarian cook book and a must here for Xmas.

*Honigleckerlei mit Punschglasur*

100g honey
35g butter or margarine (softened)
125g brown sugar
1 heaped teaspoon ground cinnamon
½ teaspoon ground cloves
½ teaspoon mixed spice (or lebkuchengewurtz if you can get it)
good grating of nutmeg
zest of half a lemon
75g ground almonds
100g chopped mixed peel (blitzed to a paste)
250g flour (sifted)
1 heaped teaspoon baking powder
couple of tablespoons of milk

plus:

4 heaped tablespoons of icing sugar
lemon juice
rum or whisky
water

Gently warm the honey in a saucepan together with the spices until it is runny. Cream the butter and the sugar. Add in the honey, the lemon zest, ground almonds and the mixed peel. Last of all, add the flour a little at the time. The dough will be quite dry and breadcrumby at this stage. Knead well, adding just enough milk to bring it into a ball. Wrap in cling film and chill in the fridge overnight.

To make the biscuits, divide the dough into four portions. Roll each portion into a sausage between one and a half to two centimetres thick. Slice diagonally into individual portions about 3 cm long. Place on a greased baking sheet (or a use baking parchment on the sheet, makes life easier later). Continue until all the dough has been used up. You will get around 36 biscuits from this quantity. Bake in a preheated oven 180C / Gas 4 for 12 - 15 mins. Best to err on the side of caution here as you want them to be a very pale golden colour. Any darker than that and they'll be bitter.

For the punschglasur, take four heaped tablespoons of icing sugar and sift into a mug. Add two teaspoons of water, a teaspoon of whisky or rum and a teaspoon of lemon juice. You should have something that is the consistency of runny honey – you can always add more sugar or liquid accordingly. When the biscuits are done, take them out of the oven – if you have used baking parchment, you can just pull the paper off the tray with the biscuits still on them. If not, transfer to a wire rack with some kitchen roll underneath. While the biscuits are still warm, brush over the glaze (you will have enough for two coats) and leave to dry.

When cold, store in an airtight tin. These are best made several weeks in advance, but in reality, they never seem to last that long as they're pretty good from the get go.


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## classic33 (21 Dec 2017)

summerdays said:


> Speaking of soda bread, does anyone have a good recipe for soda or wheaten farls? As a child my granny and my mum would have made them very regularly but both used the "by eye" type of recipe and I've never quite managed to recreate the original deliciousness.


https://delishably.com/baked-goods/Irish-Soda-Farls

http://allrecipes.co.uk/recipe/23495/wheaten-farls.aspx


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## jayonabike (21 Dec 2017)

The wife iced her Christmas cake this morning. She made it back at the end of October, has been feeding it with Remy Martin and she marzipaned it on Monday. 
Looking forward to a slice or 3


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## Old jon (21 Dec 2017)

I cannot claim any originality as far as recipes go, except for the occasional substitution of an ingredient or two.
The pics below are of what Linda Collister calls Cheese Baps, no spring onions were in the shop this morning, so shallots went in instead.

Before






And after







And the next two are a more or less standard sourdough raised dough, most of the liquid was beer.
Before, again. The sourdough was maybe not as well fed as it should have been






And after,






I can guess what they will taste like, but will of course be eating some soon!


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## Tin Pot (21 Dec 2017)

*Pao de Quejo*

125ml semi milk
75ml veg oil
Tspn Salt

Heat in a pan then add,

250g tapioca flour

Take off the heat and mix in;

1 egg
Then
90g grated Parmesan 

Roll into ten balls, bake for 45 mins at 180°C Fan.

Inexplicably I did not take a photo. Delicious.


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## threebikesmcginty (21 Dec 2017)

Old jon said:


> I cannot claim any originality as far as recipes go, except for the occasional substitution of an ingredient or two.
> The pics below are of what Linda Collister calls Cheese Baps, no spring onions were in the shop this morning, so shallots went in instead.
> 
> Before
> ...



Nice baps!

Is there a link to a recipe please?


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## Old jon (21 Dec 2017)

threebikesmcginty said:


> Nice baps!
> 
> Is there a link to a recipe please?



The recipe is from a book. Antediluvian, I know.
Try, this is from memory

650 grams flour
200 cl water
200 cl milk
150 grams grated cheddar, as strong as you can find
50 grams spring onions
salt
yeast
mustard powder

Mix it all together, knead for ten minutes, let rise about two hours

before baking, but after dividing into 12
brush with milk
50 grams grated cheddar sprinkled over the tops
let rise til doubled in size, about 30 minutes
bake at 220 for about 15 minutes.

Enjoy!


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## Katherine (21 Dec 2017)

What a lovely thread and great ideas!



Reynard said:


> And now for a seasonal recipe - especially for those of you who like a wee bit of Lebkuchen. Runs rings around the shop bought varieties. From my 1930s Bavarian cook book and a must here for Xmas.
> 
> *Honigleckerlei mit Punschglasur*
> 
> ...



Wow, they sound good. I'm going to try this. 



jayonabike said:


> The wife iced her Christmas cake this morning. She made it back at the end of October, has been feeding it with Remy Martin and she marzipaned it on Monday.
> Looking forward to a slice or 3
> 
> View attachment 387948



Looks beautiful. 

I have just put the marzipan on the cake that I made in May! (I made a square wedding cake but my daughter in law preferred a round one, so the original is now our Christmas cake.) 
It's been well fed with brandy a few times. 



Old jon said:


> The recipe is from a book. Antediluvian, I know.
> Try, this is from memory
> 
> 650 grams flour
> ...



Thank you, I think Mr K will like these!


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## Reynard (21 Dec 2017)

Katherine said:


> Wow, they sound good. I'm going to try this.



You won't be disappointed. 

I have well over a hundred different recipes for Lebkuchen, but somehow I always end up sticking to my favourites.  This year I made myself try a new recipe out of principle - with candied ginger and raisins.


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Dec 2017)

Old jon said:


> 200 cl water
> 200 cl milk



With that amount of liquid (4 litres) you're going to get a very runny batter! 
I assume you mean millilitres (ml)?


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Dec 2017)

If you want to give your bread some oven spring, get yourself an off-cut of marble worktop. I was in my local salvage yard getting some slabs when I spotted a large broken piece of marble. I asked the guy how much it would be and he said I could have it for nothing! (If you look at baking stones on bakery websites, they charge £30-£40 for them.)

I trimmed it to fit my oven and cleaned it and now use it all the time. It makes a noticeable difference to the rise.

Before







After


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## Reynard (22 Dec 2017)

I have a terracotta baking stone that I picked up on a jumble sale for 10p years ago.

However, my oven is vented, so I can't steam my bread. I have to bake under a cloche to stop getting wonky / burst loaves. A stock pot serves that purpose for large loaves or anything baked in a tin. Otherwise I have a chicken brick which is brilliant for smaller breads. I do the first 20 / 25 mins of the bake under the cloche and then whip the lid off.


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## Katherine (22 Dec 2017)

Reynard said:


> You won't be disappointed.
> 
> I have well over a hundred different recipes for Lebkuchen, but somehow I always end up sticking to my favourites.  This year I made myself try a new recipe out of principle - with candied ginger and raisins.



Last week I made the recipe in the Sunday Times. Lovely flavour but they were quite biscuity.





First batch without the marzipan centre. 





Second batch with the marzipan centre.


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## Reynard (22 Dec 2017)

Katherine said:


> Last week I made the recipe in the Sunday Times. Lovely flavour but they were quite biscuity.
> View attachment 388077
> 
> 
> ...



Ooo, those look good 

The recipe I posted gives you a soft, cakey texture, which is what you'd expect from Lebkuchen.


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## Old jon (22 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> With that amount of liquid (4 litres) you're going to get a very runny batter!
> I assume you mean millilitres (ml)?



Ooops! I guess I am metrication resistant.


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## Threevok (22 Dec 2017)

Welsh-Cakes (if it hasn't been posted already)

Add to a mixing bowl -
8oz of Plain flour
2oz of Caster Sugar
and mix well with a wooden spoon 

Add 4oz of cooking margarine and rub until the consistency of breadcrumbs

(at this point you can add 4oz of currants too if that's how you like them - personally I don't)

Beat an egg with a teaspoon of milk and a pinch of salt

Add to the bowl, mix and then knead to a dough ball (gradually adding more flour - if you find the mixture too wet or sticky)

Roll out the mixture to about 8mm - 10mm thick and use a cutter to make discs

Use a bake-stone (or an old frying pan) on a moderate to high heat and cook on each side for about a minute each, being careful not to burn.

Additional
Rolling out the mixture a little thicker will create a doughy line through the middle of the Welsh-cake, making them easier to cut in half, should you want to use a filling like jam or lemon curd.

Another good trick (if you like peanuts) is to add 2oz of peanut butter the same time as the margarine.


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## robjh (22 Dec 2017)

Three photos from my day :

the starter added to some white flour, pre-mixing





starting to rise (with a spare bit on its own at the side)





out of the oven. Slightly overcooked but crusty and good.





There's no measuring of ingredients involved - it's a recipe I've been using in one form or another for years, and it makes bread I enjoy.


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## Tail End Charlie (23 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> If you want to give your bread some oven spring, get yourself an off-cut of marble worktop. I was in my local salvage yard getting some slabs when I spotted a large broken piece of marble. I asked the guy how much it would be and he said I could have it for nothing! (If you look at baking stones on bakery websites, they charge £30-£40 for them.)
> 
> I trimmed it to fit my oven and cleaned it and now use it all the time. It makes a noticeable difference to the rise.
> 
> ...


I used a marble chopping board (from somewhere like Aldi or The Range) which I cut down and agree it does make a difference to the rise. 

Recipe wise, I give you povitica (I hope the link works, I've never linked before) 

This is fun to make, although a little tricky. The hard part is getting the filling and the dough thin enough. After spreading the dough as far as I can (which is nowhere near how far Hollywood gets it) I use clingfilm on top of the filling and use a rolling pin to spread out the filling and thin the dough further at the same time. The best bit is when it's cooked and the first time you cut it, there's a real ta-da moment when you see the inside and your guests swoon at your awesomeness (I may have made that bit up). 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/povitica_92623

This was my first effort, I have since managed to get four proper swirls.


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## jayonabike (23 Dec 2017)

Mince pie Baklava






Recipe 

https://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/mince-pie-baklava


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## glasgowcyclist (23 Dec 2017)

User13710 said:


> I made these this morning. Phwoar .



Erm, no photo?
A 'phwoar' warrants one.


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## glasgowcyclist (23 Dec 2017)

User13710 said:


> Sorry, you'll just have to take my and tinpot's word for it .



Pah, I think I'll just have to make my own.


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## glasgowcyclist (23 Dec 2017)

Just checked and I don't have any tapioca flour. Is that easily available in supermarkets?


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## Tin Pot (23 Dec 2017)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Just checked and I don't have any tapioca flour. Is that easily available in supermarkets?


I had to go to one of those hippy dippy Health Food places that sell magic potions as well to find some.

I think it was a Holland and Barratt.


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## Old jon (23 Dec 2017)

In Leeds, tapioca flour is available at Out of This World on New Market Street. Tapioca pancakes are totally wondrous things . . .


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## annedonnelly (24 Dec 2017)

I always use the Be-ro recipe for my Christmas cake. This year I decided to follow a Hairy Bikers recipe for decoarting it. My attempt to brown the marzipan under the grill wasn't a success - I ended up with cooked marzipan stuck to the baking tray. But the orange slices came out ok.


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## jayonabike (24 Dec 2017)

Been busy this morning, as well as making a chicken liver parfait I’ve made a ton of sausage rolls and 2 white loaves. The mince pies are about to go in the oven and with the left over pastry I’ll make some cheese straws. Going to make another batch of the baklava as well as the first batch has nearly gone!


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## jayonabike (24 Dec 2017)

Mince pies done. I use the zest of an orange in the pastry for an extra Christmassy hit


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## sheddy (24 Dec 2017)

Is anyone making a Gingerbread House ? 
Fun for all the family


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## threebikesmcginty (24 Dec 2017)

Old jon said:


> The recipe is from a book. Antediluvian, I know.
> Try, this is from memory
> 
> 650 grams flour
> ...



Ok, I changed the recipe a bit, smaller quants (as a first go), look pretty good though.


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## jefmcg (24 Dec 2017)

Bless me, baker thread, for I have sinned

<skip the venial sins and straight to the mortal one> 

I murdered my sour dough starter. This was during summer, I took it down to a friends hired cottage. I used it all in loaf, that was terrible because the timing went to hell, and it ended up over proven and dead. Really should have topped it up with more flour and let it prove again, but I didn't, so I just shared a disappointing loaf of acidy stodge. 

But I got home and found that I hadn't split the starter and left half in the fridge, as I was certain I had. It wasn't there. I had baked the whole starter into the worst loaf of bread I had ever made.

It was wild caught yeast, and it made fabulous bread. I could of course repeat the process of catching it, but there's been too much death in my life recently, and I didn't have the heart.

Thread, I am heartily sorry for offending you ....


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## Tail End Charlie (24 Dec 2017)

User13710 said:


> Date crunches .
> 
> View attachment 388425


Ooh yeah, looks good cycling food (purely for energy you understand), recipe please.


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## Tail End Charlie (24 Dec 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Bless me, baker thread, for I have sinned
> 
> <skip the venial sins and straight to the mortal one>
> 
> ...


Well not a like, but you know what I mean.


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## Reynard (24 Dec 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Bless me, baker thread, for I have sinned
> 
> <skip the venial sins and straight to the mortal one>
> 
> ...



Oops.

You're not alone. Mine just got abandoned and consequently it keeled over.

I just don't bake enough bread to warrant getting another one going.


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## jayonabike (27 Dec 2017)

Had a few hours to kill so baked another loaf as the two I baked on Christmas Eve have been eaten.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Jan 2018)

jefmcg said:


> I took it down to a friends hired cottage. I used it all in loaf



When you say used it all, did you have any scrapings of starter left behind in the container? Any at all?

This is no help for your long-dead starter now but may help in future. I regularly use all my starter, bar the few grammes that remain on the inside of the tub, and what's left behind is enough to kick it off again if I add some flour and water as usual. (I normally have less than a third of the remaining starter shown in the picture attached, barely half a teaspoon sometimes.)


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## jefmcg (5 Jan 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> When you say used it all, did you have any scrapings of starter left behind in the container? Any at all?


Thanks for the help, but ... no.

I brought starter from London to the far reaches of Devon, leaving half in my fridge, so I thought. Used it all, cooked, ate. Cleaned the kitchen, tidied and locked the cottage, ready for the next tenant (the cottage is owned by a family who let my friend take a precious week there each year, so we cleaned it thoroughly). 4 hour drive back to london, carrying the spic and span jar the starter had been in, to open the fridge and ... nada!

So by the time I realised what had happened it was probably 12 hours since the last of the starter was scrubbed and fairy-liquidated into the Devon sewage system/groundwater - yup, I have no idea about the plumbing at the cottage.

Obviously in London I thought "Shall I split the starter, or bring half of it back? Bring half back" And when I got to Devon, I was completely convinced I'd split it.


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Jan 2018)

I was watching Rick Stein's Mexico Road Trip recently where he was served a clam chowder in a sourdough, so I thought I'd try something similar but using Cullen Skink instead (I don't eat clams). Turned out pretty good and tasted fab but boy was there a lot of eating in it.


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## Tin Pot (17 Jan 2018)

What’s the trick to baking healthier bread? Healthier than Hovis or Morrison’s for example...


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Jan 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> What’s the trick to baking healthier bread? Healthier than Hovis or Morrison’s for example...



None, all the trickery is in supermarket bread; preservatives, additives, enhancers etc. All sort of things to give the illusion of healthy, fresh bread for longer.

All you really need is flour, water, yeast and time.


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## threebikesmcginty (17 Jan 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> None, all the trickery is in supermarket bread; preservatives, additives, enhancers etc. All sort of things to give the illusion of healthy, fresh bread for longer.
> 
> All you really need is flour, water, yeast and time.



You don't need time though really, you only have to get involved for a few minutes, the bread does the rest of the stuff on its own.


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Jan 2018)

threebikesmcginty said:


> You don't need time though really, you only have to get involved for a few minutes, the bread does the rest of the stuff on its own.



Absolutely. What I should have said was time does the rest.


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## Reynard (26 Jan 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> None, all the trickery is in supermarket bread; preservatives, additives, enhancers etc. All sort of things to give the illusion of healthy, fresh bread for longer.
> 
> All you really need is flour, water, yeast and time.



And salt! 

@Tin Pot - just a wee note though. Unless you're talking sourdoughs most home baked lean breads i.e. just flour, water, salt and some kind of yeast tend to go stale quickly. They do make good toast, however. If you want home baked bread to keep, adding a little fat in the form of oil or lard works very well.


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## CharlesF (27 Jan 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I was watching Rick Stein's Mexico Road Trip recently where he was served a clam chowder in a sourdough, so I thought I'd try something similar but using Cullen Skink instead (I don't eat clams). Turned out pretty good and tasted fab but boy was there a lot of eating in it.
> 
> 
> View attachment 391873
> View attachment 391874



This is called a Bunny Chow in Zimbabwe and Kwazulu Natal. There it is half a white loaf, hollowed out and filled with curry, bung the insides on top. Now that brings back happy memories as curry in Durban is made by the large Indian community.


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## Reynard (28 Feb 2018)

As requested over on the Fray Bentos thread...

*Chelsea Buns a la Gordon*

Dough:
500g white bread flour
300g tepid milk
40g butter
teaspoon salt
9g dried active yeast
1 egg, beaten

Filling:
75g caster sugar
65g melted butter
300g mixed dried fruit (or whatever mix takes your fancy)
1 tsp ground cinnamon
1/8 tsp ground cloves
1/8 tsp ground nutmeg
pinch ground cardamom

Glaze:
4 tbsp milk, scalded
enough sieved icing sugar to make a glaze that's not too stiff and not too runny

Activate the yeast in the milk. Rub the butter into the flour & salt. Make a well in the centre and add milk, yeast & egg. Knead dough till silky. Let rest for an hour. Roll out dough on floured board into a rectangle and cover with filling. Roll up tight and divide into 12 slices. Put onto a greased & floured baking tray. Cover and leave in fridge overnight. Remove, let prove for an hour or two, and bake in a preheated oven 200C for approx 25 mins until golden. Cool slightly before glazing - drizzle or brush according to preference.

P.S. This recipe was originally given to me by a chap who runs his own bakery. I have since adapted it a little, mainly to make the filling a wee bit more generous, as I didn't want to have to use a bicycle to cycle from one raisin to another.


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## CharlesF (28 Feb 2018)

I will have to try this as it has more spices than my recipe. Be hard to wait overnight!


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## Reynard (28 Feb 2018)

You kinda get used to planning ahead LOL 

I love doughs I can leave overnight etc, as the yeast does all the hard work while I'm off in the Land of Nod.


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## CharlesF (28 Feb 2018)

Quite right. Patience is a virtue.


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## Reynard (28 Feb 2018)

It is when making bread. 

I like the hardly-any-yeast-but-looooong-bulk-ferment type doughs. Which also have a poolish as well. About 2 days to make a loaf, but well worth it.


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## CharlesF (28 Feb 2018)

I am learning about patience now that I have sour dough successfully breeding in a warm corner. And the taste is worth the wait.


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## Reynard (28 Feb 2018)

Which reminds me, I'd better get a poolish started if I want bread for Friday...


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## Reynard (2 Mar 2018)

Here is today's bake - a jewish-style rye, 30% wholegrain, 64% hydration. Very nice with butter & tilsitzer cheese. Could've done with a touch more cumin though...


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## Reynard (3 Mar 2018)

Even better today with a fresh batch of homemade butter 

Picked up four tubs of Duchy Organics double cream on YS at 15p a tub. Not bad, 60p for just over half a kilo of butter.


----------



## Old jon (4 Mar 2018)

My partner's daughter was married last month, a long tale. During our visit to partnersdaughterland to celebrate this event we called in a café, where amongst the goodies on offer was poppy seed cake. This reminded me of a recipe for poppy seed bread, and I made a couple of loaves after we returned. The pic below is today's whimsy on the same recipe but using chia seeds instead, only because someone bought some. The same someone who likes the bread I bake . . .


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## CharlesF (4 Mar 2018)

My sour dough wholewheat loaf, no worries about the lack of bread in the shops


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## Reynard (4 Mar 2018)

That looks rather fine 

I've had to put another poolish on, as the rye I made the other day is almost gone.  Bag end bread this time, so a mix of granary, oat and ordinary white by the looks of it.


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## CharlesF (4 Mar 2018)

I like the that term "Bag End Bread"; I always refer to it as "gemors" which is Afrikaans for mess.


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## Reynard (4 Mar 2018)

Mess - now that's neat. 

The only downside of bag end breads is the fact that you really can't replicate them. Also call them Bitsas breads, because it's bitsa this and bitsa that LOL


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> That looks rather fine
> 
> I've had to put another poolish on, as the rye I made the other day is almost gone.  Bag end bread this time, so a mix of granary, oat and ordinary white by the looks of it.



Some of my best loaves have been bag ends, but you try making it again.....


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## Reynard (4 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Some of my best loaves have been bag ends, but you try making it again.....



Exactly... It's the same with bottom-of-the-veg-drawer soup.


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## jefmcg (4 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Exactly... It's the same with bottom-of-the-veg-drawer soup.


As long as you actually took them out and made the soup, rather than opening the door and finding it already there.

I remember opening my parents' fridge and finding summer vegetables (tomatoes, peppers, cucumbers etc) way past their best, starting to soften and liquify and decided mum was making slow food gazpacho in the veggie drawer.

**note, my mum was an excellent cook and housekeeper, but she was also an excellent solicitor, so sometimes something would slip - but never her care for her clients. Nor us. But the veggies might suffer.


----------



## Reynard (4 Mar 2018)

jefmcg said:


> As long as you actually took them out and made the soup, rather than opening the door and finding it already there.



Yeah. 

Which reminds, I've got some very tired looking pears that want using. Some kind of sponge pudding calls methinks. With ginger. And sultanas.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Mar 2018)

I'm aware I've been neglecting the thread with baking updates but rest assured I have not stopped baking. 
Here's my (1st time) effort at making brioche buns. We had them with roasted red peppers, rocket and haloumi cheese for lunch.


----------



## CharlesF (5 Mar 2018)

Superb. I need more time to try all on display here.


----------



## Reynard (5 Mar 2018)

Those look good @glasgowcyclist 

I've got a granary loaf in the oven at the moment. Now that Tescos aren't flogging off their breads for 5p on YS anymore (they were 80p tonight), no excuse not to put another loaf on.


----------



## Reynard (6 Mar 2018)

Update: looks (and smells) fabulous. Will do nicely for a few lunches.


----------



## CharlesF (8 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> You kinda get used to planning ahead LOL
> 
> I love doughs I can leave overnight etc, as the yeast does all the hard work while I'm off in the Land of Nod.



Yesterday evening, I didn't have enough time to make a loaf, and remembering this advice, I put the dough in the fridge overnight. This morning I took the bowl out and left it in a cool place. Just got home and opened the bag up - what a sight. Well risen dough with lots of lovely a bubbles. The loaf is on the second rise and we can't wait to try it a bit later.

I'm a complete convert and will try to plan properly (PPPPP) so that all my bread does the first rise overnight. 

Thanks Reynard for the tip!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (8 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> I didn't have enough time to make a loaf, and remembering this advice, I put the dough in the fridge overnight.


I don't know if you saw my link to the overnight recipe I use for sourdough. It gives great results every time and you can use the fridge too to extend the fermentation to suit your timetable.
Here it is: https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/tom-s-overnight-no-knead-sourdough.htm


----------



## CharlesF (8 Mar 2018)

Thanks, I will try this at the weekend, I love new recipes..


----------



## Reynard (8 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Yesterday evening, I didn't have enough time to make a loaf, and remembering this advice, I put the dough in the fridge overnight. This morning I took the bowl out and left it in a cool place. Just got home and opened the bag up - what a sight. Well risen dough with lots of lovely a bubbles. The loaf is on the second rise and we can't wait to try it a bit later.
> 
> I'm a complete convert and will try to plan properly (PPPPP) so that all my bread does the first rise overnight.
> 
> Thanks Reynard for the tip!



You're welcome. 

If you plan on doing long bulk ferments, then maybe cut back a wee bit on the yeast to prevent escaped dough. My breads usually have less than a gramme in - a generous pinch in the poolish and then the same again in the final dough. (I use dried active yeast granules btw)


----------



## Reynard (14 Mar 2018)

Just about to pop a 3 grain with caraway seed into the oven - equal quantities of white bread flour, white oat flour and whole rye.

Now that the weather's somewhat milder, I'm finding I need to cut back on the yeast a bit to stop the dough from galumping away on the bulk ferment. Got a 12 hour poolish, plus it's done a 20 hour bulk ferment (part in the unheated hallway, part in the fridge) and it's about proved after just shy of 2 hours at room temperature.

Never ceases to amaze me how you can raise a loaf with 600g flour at 64% hydration with no more than two small pinches of yeast.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Mar 2018)

This is another 1st attempt bread: baguettes.

My wife had bought me this silicone sheet for them from Lakeland so I thought it was time to try it out.
While I was happy with the result, I didn't achieve the airy crumb I'd hoped for, nor was the crust as crispy as I'd have liked.

Most importantly though, it tasted bloody marvellous and they were instantly demolished.


----------



## Reynard (15 Mar 2018)

Those look good, @glasgowcyclist - next time, I'll bring the Brie 

Maybe try upping the oven temp?

When you say not airy enough, is the crumb too dense or are the holes too small? Perhaps upping the hydration a wee bit and being gentler in the knock back / shaping?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Those look good, @glasgowcyclist - next time, I'll bring the Brie
> 
> Maybe try upping the oven temp?
> 
> When you say not airy enough, is the crumb too dense or are the holes too small? Perhaps upping the hydration a wee bit and being gentler in the knock back / shaping?




I'll need to dig out the recipe to check what the oven temp was at and the hydration level. As for the knocking back & shaping, I was very careful. The crumb wasn't too dense, the holes were small just like an ordinary loaf.
I'll definitely give it another go.


----------



## Reynard (15 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'll need to dig out the recipe to check what the oven temp was at and the hydration level. As for the knocking back & shaping, I was very careful. The crumb wasn't too dense, the holes were small just like an ordinary loaf.
> I'll definitely give it another go.



Maybe it was the hydration then.  Rule of thumb is more water = more open crumb, but then it's the trade off between a dough being easy to handle and having a sticky pile of goo that won't co-operate no matter what. I sort of run out of baking talent at around 65% hydration.


----------



## CharlesF (15 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> This is another 1st attempt bread: baguettes.
> 
> My wife had bought me this silicone sheet for them from Lakeland so I thought it was time to try it out.
> While I was happy with the result, I didn't achieve the airy crumb I'd hoped for, nor was the crust as crispy as I'd have liked.
> ...



Those look delicious. 

The recipe I use has pan of water in bottom of the oven and after the first minute, open the oven door and mist the whole oven. Also they are baked for longer than seems right, but are crispy, and can't be kept, not that is a problem.


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## CharlesF (15 Mar 2018)

This is my sour dough loaf baked in a tin for a change, not such a good idea a it looks like a volcano about to erupt. Still 10 minutes remaining of the obligatory 20 minutes before we can taste.


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## glasgowcyclist (15 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Still 10 minutes remaining of the obligatory 20 minutes before we can taste.
> View attachment 400183
> 
> View attachment 400183



I could be there in ten! ....


----------



## CharlesF (15 Mar 2018)

You would have to get past the wife.. .


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Mar 2018)

Damn!


----------



## Reynard (15 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> This is my sour dough loaf baked in a tin for a change, not such a good idea a it looks like a volcano about to erupt. Still 10 minutes remaining of the obligatory 20 minutes before we can taste.
> View attachment 400183
> 
> View attachment 400183



I think your volcano looks rather fine


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## Reynard (17 Mar 2018)

Am in the process of building a new sourdough starter. Lost my original to neglect - thing is, when you can get loaves of bread for 5p on yellow sticker... I know, I know... But recently my local Tesco has stopped marking bread down below half price, and that's been the incentive to get back into baking my own again.

The starter build is going OK so far, but I don't want to waste my discard. But then I ran across this:

https://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/classic-sourdough-waffles-or-pancakes-recipe

Definitely going to give them a whirl.


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> when you can get loaves of bread for 5p on yellow sticker..



That is not bread!
Let us never speak of this again.



Reynard said:


> Definitely going to give them a whirl.



That's what I do with excess starter, it gives a great tang to them and they're gone in minutes.

This weekend I'm having a bash at a long ferment sourdough pizza base and will probably have some leftover starter from that, so it looks like pancakes tomorrow too.


Edited to add recipe link.


----------



## CharlesF (17 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Am in the process of building a new sourdough starter......
> 
> The starter build is going OK so far, but I don't want to waste my discard. But then I ran across this:
> 
> ...



These look like they are worth a try. I like watching King Arthur's YouTube on shaping bread.


----------



## stephec (17 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> This is another 1st attempt bread: baguettes.
> 
> My wife had bought me this silicone sheet for them from Lakeland so I thought it was time to try it out.
> While I was happy with the result, I didn't achieve the airy crumb I'd hoped for, nor was the crust as crispy as I'd have liked.
> ...





CharlesF said:


> Those look delicious.
> 
> The recipe I use has pan of water in bottom of the oven and after the first minute, open the oven door and mist the whole oven. Also they are baked for longer than seems right, but are crispy, and can't be kept, not that is a problem.



My baguettes always turn out like sausage shaped loaves as well.

I tried the water in the oven after reading that specialist ovens have water jets in them, didn't know about opening the door to mist it though, or the higher temperature either.

I might have to try again later.


----------



## Reynard (17 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> This weekend I'm having a bash at a long ferment sourdough pizza base and will probably have some leftover starter from that, so it looks like pancakes tomorrow too.



Mmmmm, pizza! 

I'm experimenting with a higher percentage of preferment after running across a formula for a 90% biga italian style bread on thefreshloaf - I usually use 100g of 600g total flour, but am upping it to 300g this time. Not entirely confident of a 90% fermented flour bread just yet...


----------



## stephec (17 Mar 2018)

stephec said:


> My baguettes always turn out like sausage shaped loaves as well.
> 
> I tried the water in the oven after reading that specialist ovens have water jets in them, didn't know about opening the door to mist it though, or the higher temperature either.
> 
> I might have to try again later.


It's worked, oh yes!


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

A preferment that threatened to escape its bowl has resulted in late night bread making. Currently in the middle of a series of stretch & folds before consigning dough to the fridge for its bulk ferment.

A 50% preferment is something of a pain to mix into the other ingredients - took a lot longer than usual before everything started to come together during kneading. All those different textures I guess. But wow, have I got the most amazing silky, supple dough ever...

Other than upping my usual 100% hydration preferment to 50% of the total flour, the rest of the formula is, barring a slight reduction in hydration due to using all white flour (62% total as opposed to 65%), the same for my everyday bread.

Preferment:
300g white bread flour
300g tepid water
1 pinch DA yeast

Dough:
all of the preferment plus
150g white bread flour
150g durum flour
72g water
1 pinch DA yeast
12g (2%) salt
2 tbsp olive oil

We'll see what this turns out to be...


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## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

Lunch was my first homemade sourdough pizza (fermented overnight) with prosciutto, finnochiona, chorizo, mozzarella and basil. Mmmmm..

I'm really enjoying my weekend baking, being relatively new to it all means there's tons of '1st time' bakes for me to discover.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Lunch was my first homemade sourdough pizza (fermented overnight) with prosciutto, finnochiona, chorizo, mozzarella and basil. Mmmmm..
> 
> I'm really enjoying my weekend baking, being relatively new to it all means there's tons of '1st time' bakes for me to discover.
> 
> View attachment 400490



I forgot to add the recipe for the pizza base: https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/no-knead-sourdough-pizza.htm


----------



## Dave7 (18 Mar 2018)

I am probably the worst/least experienced chef on here but since retiring have started to learn.
I have just made a dish steak pie with suet pastry......it will be ready in 20 minutes.
Baby boiled, cabbage and carrots to go with it.
Here's hoping for a result.


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## Svendo (18 Mar 2018)

On the pizza front,I usually use the frying pan/grill method as it replicates a 450°C pizza oven better than a domestic oven. Stretch or roll the dough out, put it in a preheated pan, add the toppings as the bottom of the dough cook then put under a preheated grill once the base has the dark brown bubbly bits on the bottom and grill til cheese is how you like it.
Be warned this will damage plastic frying pan handles if you put the whole pan under the grill.


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Lunch was my first homemade sourdough pizza (fermented overnight) with prosciutto, finnochiona, chorizo, mozzarella and basil. Mmmmm..
> 
> I'm really enjoying my weekend baking, being relatively new to it all means there's tons of '1st time' bakes for me to discover.
> 
> View attachment 400490



Is there any left? 

For me it's second time around - had a hiatus of over a year (apart from the odd bake). I'm just praying I haven't lost my touch.


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

Dunno exactly what kind of yeast I've managed to capture in my baby sourdough starter, but whatever it is, it nearly trebles every time I feed it.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Is there any left?
> 
> For me it's second time around - had a hiatus of over a year (apart from the odd bake). I'm just praying I haven't lost my touch.



None of that particular pizza but I did make a lot of dough, enough for two more.
We're having them for dinner tomorrow night, if you can make it...


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> None of that particular pizza but I did make a lot of dough, enough for two more.
> We're having them for dinner tomorrow night, if you can make it...



Oooh... 

Unfortunately I shall have to decline the very kind offer, but I have a date with a very nice ribeye steak planned for tomorrow that I do not intend to miss...


----------



## Heigue'r (18 Mar 2018)

Second brown loaf of the weekend,first one disappeared.


----------



## CharlesF (18 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> A preferment that threatened to escape its bowl has resulted in late night bread making. Currently in the middle of a series of stretch & folds before consigning dough to the fridge for its bulk ferment.
> 
> A 50% preferment is something of a pain to mix into the other ingredients - took a lot longer than usual before everything started to come together during kneading. All those different textures I guess. But wow, have I got the most amazing silky, supple dough ever...
> 
> ...



Please let us know how it turns out, it’s another recipe to try.


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Please let us know how it turns out, it’s another recipe to try.



Will do. It's about an hour away from wanting to be degassed and shaped. Had it in the fridge overnight as a precaution as the poolish went rampant on me last night, but it's been on something of a go slow instead.


----------



## sheddy (18 Mar 2018)

Looking for something else and found this on the radio 
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p033dnkd


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

I’ve got this in the oven right now but tempted to give it a wee bit longer for a better colour...


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I’ve got this in the oven right now but tempted to give it a wee bit longer for a better colour...
> 
> View attachment 400551





What sort is that? Looks fabby.

I've just degassed and shaped mine. Went in the banneton about 10 mins ago.


----------



## CharlesF (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I’ve got this in the oven right now but tempted to give it a wee bit longer for a better colour...
> 
> View attachment 400551


That won’t keep very well, needs immediate eating with lots of butter and cheese. The food of gods.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> What sort is that? Looks fabby.
> 
> I've just degassed and shaped mine. Went in the banneton about 10 mins ago.



Plain sourdough from the overnight, no knead recipe I posted earlier. I switched the timings round by kicking it off first thing this morning.

I've taken it out now, it's dark enough for me.
I'm now listening to it cracking loudly...






CharlesF said:


> That won’t keep very well, needs immediate eating with lots of butter and cheese. The food of gods.



FFS Don't make it any more difficult for me to stay out of the kitchen. I'm trying to save this for tomorrow.


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

Or maybe butter and honey - or home made jam 

Or... or... butter and thinly-sliced black forest ham... Or perhaps a pate d'Ardennes...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Mar 2018)

sheddy said:


> Looking for something else and found this on the radio
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p033dnkd


Thanks for that. Just heading off to bed now so I'll catch up with it at work tomorrow.
I mean, in my lunch break... obvs.


----------



## Reynard (18 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Plain sourdough from the overnight, no knead recipe I posted earlier. I switched the timings round by kicking it off first thing this morning. I've taken it out now, it's dark enough for me. I'm now listening to it cracking loudly...



My bread never does that... Maybe because it's that my oven only goes up to 220C and is vented - have to bake my breads under a cloche, else I get burst, wonky loaves.

Will have to give that a go once my new culture is more stable.

Having said that, there are some wonderful aromas currently emanating from the kitchen...


----------



## Reynard (19 Mar 2018)

Well, it's out of the oven and cooling on the rack. Lovely crust, wonderful oven spring and smells a-ma-zing.

Will get pics in the morning xxx


----------



## Reynard (19 Mar 2018)

Well, that turned out one banging loaf of bread  Crunchy crust, tender semi-open, slightly glossy crumb and a flavour similar to proper French pain rustique. And I even got a (small) grigne.  All it wanted was butter, so that's exactly what I had for lunch.


----------



## CharlesF (19 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Well, that turned out one banging loaf of bread  Crunchy crust, tender semi-open, slightly glossy crumb and a flavour similar to proper French pain rustique. And I even got a (small) grigne.  All it wanted was butter, so that's exactly what I had for lunch.
> 
> View attachment 400626
> 
> ...



Superb, nothing more to say.


----------



## Reynard (19 Mar 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Superb, nothing more to say.



Thanks 

I definitely intend on doing more experiments with high proportions of preferemented flour - hopefully they'll be equally tasty.


----------



## jefmcg (19 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> under a cloche


----------



## Reynard (19 Mar 2018)

jefmcg said:


> View attachment 400655



Love it!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Well, that turned out one banging loaf of bread  Crunchy crust, tender semi-open, slightly glossy crumb and a flavour similar to proper French pain rustique. And I even got a (small) grigne.  All it wanted was butter, so that's exactly what I had for lunch.
> 
> View attachment 400626
> 
> ...



That's a belter!


----------



## Reynard (19 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That's a belter!



Thanks! 

How did your lovely-looking sourdough pan out btw?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (20 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Thanks!
> 
> How did your lovely-looking sourdough pan out btw?



Rather nicely (even if I say so myself)


----------



## Reynard (20 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Rather nicely (even if I say so myself)
> 
> View attachment 400757



Mmmmm, that looks good!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (20 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Mmmmm, that looks good!



Thanks.

I also made a couple of cheese & mustard loaves (a 2lb and a 1lb) but I'm still working on getting the balance right. 
The first try had too much of both and this pair have not enough of either. 
There will be a Goldilocks moment any day now...


----------



## Tail End Charlie (20 Mar 2018)

The last sourdough I made last week was a failure. My starter has been sitting in my fridge for months, so I thought I'd better start using it again. I didn't refresh it for long enough I think, so next time I'll refresh for a couple of days before using. 
The three ducks which have started to visit my garden said it was good though. 

Mind you, I did make a rather good, TISIM, banana loaf using a recipe on the side of a bag of spelt flour, it added a dollop of yoghurt. I've just bought a load of over ripe bananas to make another!


----------



## SteveF (20 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Rather nicely (even if I say so myself)
> 
> View attachment 400757



I have to say, that looks lovely, hope it tasted as good as it looks....


----------



## Reynard (20 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I also made a couple of cheese & mustard loaves (a 2lb and a 1lb) but I'm still working on getting the balance right.
> The first try had too much of both and this pair have not enough of either.
> ...



Ah, yes. One of *those*. The loaves look good though. 

A really sharp cheese like Provolone piccante works well for this sort of thing.


----------



## Reynard (20 Mar 2018)

Tail End Charlie said:


> The last sourdough I made last week was a failure. My starter has been sitting in my fridge for months, so I thought I'd better start using it again. I didn't refresh it for long enough I think, so next time I'll refresh for a couple of days before using.
> The three ducks which have started to visit my garden said it was good though.
> 
> Mind you, I did make a rather good, TISIM, banana loaf using a recipe on the side of a bag of spelt flour, it added a dollop of yoghurt. I've just bought a load of over ripe bananas to make another!



It can't have been as bad as these two that I turned out a while back. My friend's chooks flatly refused to eat them...


----------



## Leedsbusdriver (20 Mar 2018)

My first attempt at Hot Cross Buns.








It's a Mary Berry recipe.
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/mary_berrys_hot_cross_65003/amp


----------



## Reynard (20 Mar 2018)

In the end, I made these waffles: https://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2011/01/bread-baking-sourdough-waffles-recipe.html

Less fiddly than the King Arthur ones i.e. no overnight build needed - can use starter / discard as is, and really tasty.  Had a dozen out of the batch (my waffle iron is smaller than the one mentioned) and there're only four left.  Would really recommend. 

P.S. my starter is a 100% hydration using wholemeal flour. Didn't need to add any additional flour or liquid to the recipe. Only change I made was adding a teaspoon of vanilla extract to the batter.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 Mar 2018)

Leedsbusdriver said:


> My first attempt at Hot Cross Buns.
> View attachment 400810
> 
> View attachment 400811
> ...



They look smashing!


----------



## Reynard (23 Mar 2018)

Made a cracking bread with the discard from my wholewheat SD starter.

Used the discard to make a very vigorous levain, which in turn made a very vigorous dough. It was already galloping away when doing the stretch & folds the other evening, so wanged it in the overnight fridge for the bulk ferment and hoped for the best. I was convinced it was going to overprove, but no, had a nice billowy dough in the morning that needed an hour at room temperature to finish off before degassing and shaping. Final proof was very quick (less than an hour).

Turned out a lovely bread with wonderful aroma and oven spring. Broke into it at lunchtime today after letting it sit overnight. Flavour is good, though you can tell it's not a yeasted bread, crunchy crust, soft, semi-open and glossy crumb. Was very nice with a dollop of hummus.

Have frozen some of my starter for insurance, and will have a go at drying some as well. This culture seems so much more predictable than my old one.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> It can't have been as bad as these two that I turned out a while back. My friend's chooks flatly refused to eat them...
> 
> View attachment 400775



My first ever sourdough back in July 2016 was very similar, it could have been used as a discus in the next Olympics.

Lord knows what went wrong but I created a ceramic crust that was impenetrable to my best bread knife, which just skated from side to side. Ended up using it as a doorstop for the garage door.


----------



## Reynard (24 Mar 2018)

Ouch! Seriously? Pics, unless it didn't happen re doorstop 

I'd already been baking basic sourdoughs for a little while when I turned out these. Had been encouraged by the bods on thefreshloaf to try some new things, but overreached my then skills when trying porridge-based breads. I overproved these massively, hence the frisbees.

Have since learnt to watch the dough, not the clock...


----------



## Heltor Chasca (24 Mar 2018)

Just had some sourdough from Lidl. Good effort but now a few hours later it’s repeating on me. Weirdly, in a fish and chips kind of way. Vinegar?


----------



## Reynard (24 Mar 2018)

Heltor Chasca said:


> Just had some sourdough from Lidl. Good effort but now a few hours later it’s repeating on me. Weirdly, in a fish and chips kind of way. Vinegar?



Probably - or something else of a similar ilk. Most shop bought sourdoughs are in fact yeasted doughs with only a tiny amount of culture in (to meet legal requirements on labelling) and the sour flavour is achieved through the use of acidic flavourings.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> Have since learnt to watch the dough, not the clock



That's a top tip that should be included in every bread recipe. 

There are so many variables, from flour used, water temperature, the room temperature etc., that timings are only rough guidelines. I do it by eye now too, with a better success rate.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 Mar 2018)

Heltor Chasca said:


> Just had some sourdough from Lidl. Good effort but now a few hours later it’s repeating on me. Weirdly, in a fish and chips kind of way. Vinegar?


Could be that or it could be yoghurt.

Often referred to as sourfaux because its flavour is artificially reproduced by the use of those additives or dried sourdough culture. In any case it will contain around 40 ingredients instead of the 4 that are used to make genuine sourdough: flour, water, salt and time.


----------



## Reynard (24 Mar 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That's a top tip that should be included in every bread recipe.
> 
> There are so many variables, from flour used, water temperature, the room temperature etc., that timings are only rough guidelines. I do it by eye now too, with a better success rate.



Yeah, even the weather can change things... Yeast (whether standard saccharomyces cerevisiae or whatever you've captured from the wild) is a living organism with all the quirks that this entails. Although standard yeast is more predictable than a sourdough culture.

I've also learnt that the fridge is most definitely my friend.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 Mar 2018)

Reynard said:


> I've also learnt that the fridge is most definitely my friend.



It's not a fridge, it's a time machine!


----------



## Reynard (26 Mar 2018)

On Thursday I will make a start on baking this:

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/45353/sourdough-easter-babka-babka-wielkanocna-na-zakwasie

Must have one for Easter.


----------



## CharlesF (27 Mar 2018)

Looks very interesting, but I have promised SWHMBO hot-cross buns so I might try it later. My list of things to try is growing faster than I am baking!


----------



## C R (29 Mar 2018)

This is called "rosca" a traditional sweet bread from Galicia, which children are given as a present by their godparents for easter. The dough is similar to hot cross bun dough, but without cinnamon, normally you are supposed to use aniseed, but forgot to buy yesterday.


----------



## robrinay (30 Mar 2018)

summerdays said:


> I've often used vinegar to sour the milk.


I’m late to the Soda bread thread so apologies if this has been said elsewhere.

You need an acid to react with the Sodium bicarbonate to release Carbon dioxide gas bubbles, so lemon juice (Citric Acid) or vinegar (Acetic Acid) or Buttermilk (lactic acid) all work. Baking powder has a dry powdered food safe acid (usually Disodium Diphosphate) and Sodium Bicarbonate in it and when wet the two react to release Carbon dioxide bubbles into the dough. A bit of extra acid from buttermilk etc helps produce it faster. I’ve also had quite good results by substituting a sharp sour tasting Natural Yoghurt (lactic Acid), for the buttermilk.


----------



## Reynard (30 Mar 2018)

robrinay said:


> I’m late to the Sourdough thread so apologies if this has been said elsewhere.
> 
> You need an acid to react with the Sodium bicarbonate to release Carbon dioxide gas bubbles, so lemon juice (Citric Acid) or vinegar (Acetic Acid) or Buttermilk (lactic acid) all work. Baking powder has a dry powdered food safe acid (usually Disodium Diphosphate) and Sodium Bicarbonate in it and when wet the two react to release Carbon dioxide bubbles into the dough. A bit of extra acid from buttermilk etc helps produce it faster. I’ve also had quite good results by substituting a sharp sour tasting Natural Yoghurt (lactic Acid), for the buttermilk.



I'm assuming you mean soda bread as opposed to sourdough?


----------



## robrinay (30 Mar 2018)

Whoops! Yep Soda bread sorry - now edited/corrected.


----------



## Reynard (30 Mar 2018)

robrinay said:


> Whoops! Yep Soda bread sorry - now edited/corrected.


----------



## C R (4 Apr 2018)

Baked some barbari (Iranian flat bread) today.

Before the oven







and after






I struggle to get a uniform thickness and the look is not quite right, but it tastes good.


----------



## SteveF (14 Apr 2018)

Followed a Paul Hollywood sourdough recipe, with and added an overnight rise in the fridge. ..


----------



## CharlesF (14 Apr 2018)

Perfect!


----------



## C R (14 Apr 2018)

SteveF said:


> Followed a Paul Hollywood sourdough recipe, with and added an overnight rise in the fridge. ..
> 
> View attachment 404192


That looks nice. Regarding sourdough, I tried making flatbread with mine, but it wouldn't spread or hold properly, the mechanical properties of the dough weren't right. I have seen some of you make pizza bases with sourdough, do you knead the dough differently to get it to spread properly?


----------



## SteveF (14 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> That looks nice. Regarding sourdough, I tried making flatbread with mine, but it wouldn't spread or hold properly, the mechanical properties of the dough weren't right. I have seen some of you make pizza bases with sourdough, do you knead the dough differently to get it to spread properly?



To be honest I'm a bit of a novice at the breadmaking , I've only used a sourdough starter in a couple of pizzas and that was in addition to rather than instead of yeast, mine just added a bit more taste.

No doubt there will be some here with more knowledge and experience! !


----------



## glasgowcyclist (14 Apr 2018)

@C R I don't knead my dough any differently.

If you find yours is shrinking back as you shape it, cover it with a tea-rowel and let it rest for 15 minutes before shaping again. Depending on the elasticity of it, you may have to do this more than once. Make sure you don't do this on a heavily floured surface as the dough will have no grip and you will be there all day.

There are lots of videos on YouTube for achieving a proper base, you'll find one that suits you.

The pizza I make uses this recipe: https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/no-knead-sourdough-pizza.htm

If you find that makes more than you'll use, it does keep well in the fridge for use later in the week.


----------



## Reynard (14 Apr 2018)

You could always add a little more liquid to give you a slacker dough @C R 

But it's swings and roundabouts with that, as wetter doughs are harder to handle. What hydration are you working at btw? I shoot for somewhere between 60 and 67 %, depending on the percentage of wholegrain in the mix.


----------



## C R (14 Apr 2018)

Thanks @glasgowcyclist and @Reynard. My problem was that the dough had very little elasticity, so it was difficult to work, imagine runny plasticine. I don't have a starter at this point, but once I get one going I will check try your suggestions.


----------



## Reynard (14 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> Thanks @glasgowcyclist and @Reynard. My problem was that the dough had very little elasticity, so it was difficult to work, imagine runny plasticine. I don't have a starter at this point, but once I get one going I will check try your suggestions.



The same applies to yeasted doughs as well.

Some doughs are quite dry; bagel dough is only 55% hydration, and that's tough to work with as it's stiff with not too much give. A good bread dough should be silky, supple and stretchy.

BTW, what flour are you using?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 Apr 2018)

Another productive day yesterday in the kitchen and another first-time recipe for me: date & walnut loaf. 
I was attracted by the addition of brandy and a cup of coffee to the ingredients so just had to give it a go. 





I'm pleased to day that the result was a delicious loaf, moist and soft on the inside with a lovely crunchy crust on the outside.





(Don't worry if you don't like coffee, it doesn't flavour the bread but its acidity reacts with the baking soda to give a better rise than plain water.)

The recipe is at : https://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/old-fashioned-date-nut-bread-recipe


----------



## Reynard (16 Apr 2018)

Mmmmm, looks good.  Even better with a smear of butter, I'd expect.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> Mmmmm, looks good.  Even better with a smear of butter, I'd expect.



Yes, it was and that's how I had it.
It was torture waiting for it to cool before cutting.


----------



## Reynard (16 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Yes, it was and that's how I had it.
> It was torture waiting for it to cool before cutting.



Ah. Yes. That. Mind, now that the weather's warmer, you could always crack a window open and share the torture with the neighbours... 

I'm rather partial to Irish Tea Loaf (bram brack) myself.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 Apr 2018)

I also made a cheese & chilli tear 'n' share loaf for our daughter.
If she's anything like me there won't be much sharing going on...


----------



## Reynard (16 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I also made a cheese & chilli tear 'n' share loaf for our daughter.
> If she's anything like me there won't be much sharing going on...
> 
> View attachment 404602



Oh my, that would make some banging ham sandwiches!


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## CharlesF (16 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> Mmmmm, looks good.  Even better with a smear of butter, I'd expect.



Never merely a smear, lashings of butter is more like it!


----------



## Reynard (16 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Never merely a smear, lashings of butter is more like it!



Well, my wardrobe would develop a case of terminal dampness if I did that on a regular basis


----------



## C R (17 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> The same applies to yeasted doughs as well.
> 
> Some doughs are quite dry; bagel dough is only 55% hydration, and that's tough to work with as it's stiff with not too much give. A good bread dough should be silky, supple and stretchy.
> 
> BTW, what flour are you using?


I just use strong white flour, Alinson of late.

My understanding is that the kneading influences the mechanical properties of the dough by increasing the amount of cross linking of the protein. I understand that more kneading produces more elastic dough, and the art is knowing how much is right for each type of dough, and I am not good at that.


----------



## Reynard (17 Apr 2018)

Ah, I use the same white flour. 

Kneading develops the gluten. You should be able to feel the dough changing as you work it, gradually becoming silky and more supple - and less sticky. Alas, it's one of the things that you learn by doing... 

This is pretty well much the method I use for kneading: https://saidels.com/articles/kneaddough.htm

HTH xxx


----------



## CharlesF (21 Apr 2018)

*Calling Glasgow Bakers. *
I order flour via Amazon, and today received 5 bags of FWP Matthews Cotswold Strong Wholemeal Flour 1.5 kg instead of the white flour. Amazon are sending the correct flour which means that I have 4 bags of wholemeal flour looking for a good home. Contact me if interested.


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## Reynard (21 Apr 2018)

I'm assuming it's a mistake on their part and are letting you keep it?

When it comes to wholemeal, I like the Tesco's stoneground. It's one of the cheaper ones, but is actually very nice.

Am making calzone tonight.  Dough is in the fridge doing its bulk ferment.


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## CharlesF (21 Apr 2018)

Yes, their mistake and they don't accept returns of foodstuffs I haven't trip this, so I'm keeping one bag.


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## Reynard (21 Apr 2018)

Fair enough. 

I get through a fair bit of wholemeal, as a) I use it to feed my sourdough starter and b) most of my bread is typically 30% wholegrain.


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## CharlesF (21 Apr 2018)

So do I, but I have bought 3kg recently. For a quick and easy loaf I make a honey wholewheat as two small loaves. It was the first loaf I tried so is special!


----------



## Reynard (21 Apr 2018)

Mmmm, that sounds nice. I make something similar every now and again, but with oats and raisins as well


----------



## Tail End Charlie (21 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> I'm assuming it's a mistake on their part and are letting you keep it?
> 
> When it comes to wholemeal, I like the Tesco's stoneground. It's one of the cheaper ones, but is actually very nice.
> 
> Am making calzone tonight.  Dough is in the fridge doing its bulk ferment.


I agree, the Tesco stoneground is very good, only bettered by some from a water mill which I visit, which is a little more expensive and is 40 miles away, so quite a ride when I do go. And the ride back can be pretty slow!!


----------



## Dayvo (21 Apr 2018)

I've gone straight to page 14 without trawling the previous pages. 

I'm thinking of buying this, the Electrolux EKM4000, to knead my dough (don't like sticky fingers). Anyone use one and what do you think?


----------



## Tail End Charlie (21 Apr 2018)

Dayvo said:


> I've gone straight to page 14 without trawling the previous pages.
> 
> I'm thinking of buying this, the Electrolux EKM4000, to knead my dough (don't like sticky fingers). Anyone use one and what do you think?
> 
> View attachment 405380


You really should get used to kneading, put oil on your hands if you don't want dough sticking. Kneading is so much part of the process of making bread, feeling how the dough comes together and becomes silky, you shouldn't miss out on it. There are few doughs which need a mixer (although they are useful to have for many things, so if you haven't got one, the one you posted looks fine).


----------



## Dayvo (21 Apr 2018)

Tail End Charlie said:


> You really should get used to kneading, put oil on your hands if you don't want dough sticking. Kneading is so much part of the process of making bread, feeling how the dough comes together and becomes silky, you shouldn't miss out on it. There are few doughs which need a mixer (although they are useful to have for many things, so if you haven't got one, the one you posted looks fine).



Thanks for the reply.

I did make (and knead) bread about 15 years ago, but stopped/lost interest due to my dislike of sticky fingers. I'll try the machine and see how it goes.


----------



## Reynard (21 Apr 2018)

Dayvo said:


> Thanks for the reply.
> 
> I did make (and knead) bread about 15 years ago, but stopped/lost interest due to my dislike of sticky fingers. I'll try the machine and see how it goes.



Or...

You could make no-knead bread. 

Seriously, worth trying.

And cheaper than buying a stand mixer.


----------



## Dayvo (21 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> Or...
> 
> You could make no-knead bread.
> 
> ...



Yeah, it looks all right!

https://pinchofyum.com/no-knead-bread


----------



## Reynard (21 Apr 2018)

There are various versions of. Worth looking around to find a recipe that suits.

Most are fairly high hydration with a tiny bit of yeast and need a couple of days in the fridge.


----------



## CharlesF (21 Apr 2018)

That looks like it will be fine,



Dayvo said:


> . ..
> I'm thinking of buying this, the Electrolux EKM4000, to knead my dough (don't like sticky fingers). Anyone use one and what do you think?/QUOTE]
> 
> and being will be stronger and faster than any other.
> ...


----------



## CharlesF (21 Apr 2018)

Sarah Black's "One dough, ten breads" is all no kneading just folding. Some excellent recipes and takes you through as a novice to expert. I love it.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> *Calling Glasgow Bakers. *
> I order flour via Amazon, and today received 5 bags of FWP Matthews Cotswold Strong Wholemeal Flour 1.5 kg instead of the white flour. Amazon are sending the correct flour which means that I have 4 bags of wholemeal flour looking for a good home. Contact me if interested.
> View attachment 405329



I'm fully stocked with flour for now or I might have tried some.

If it's surplus and you're not out of pocket, what about donating it to a local social enterprise bakery such as the High Rise Bakers in the Gorbals? They do great work with marginalised people such as refugees, people with mental health problems and drug addicts.

Or maybe there's a food bank near you that would appreciate it.


----------



## CharlesF (22 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'm fully stocked with flour for now or I might have tried some.
> 
> If it's surplus and you're not out of pocket, what about donating it to a local social enterprise bakery such as the High Rise Bakers in the Gorbals? They do great work with marginalised people such as refugees, people with mental health problems and drug addicts.
> 
> Or maybe there's a food bank near you that would appreciate it.



That's an excellent idea, that never occurred to me. I'm back in Glasgow on Thursday and I see if High Rise Bakers are open. Thanks Glasgowcyclist for a brilliant suggestion.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> That's an excellent idea, that never occurred to me. I'm back in Glasgow on Thursday and I see if High Rise Bakers are open. Thanks Glasgowcyclist for a brilliant suggestion.



I think they bake on a Wednesday and Friday, here's their FB page with contact info. https://www.facebook.com/pg/highrisebakers/about/?ref=page_internal

I knew little of them until yesterday when I went to the @Crossmyloaf Bread Festival and learned more about them.


----------



## CharlesF (22 Apr 2018)

Thanks, I have emailed Catriona and I'll let you know when she replies. Gutted I missed Bread Festival.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> Gutted I missed Bread Festival.



My apologies.

I feel such a diddy for forgetting to mention it on here.


----------



## CharlesF (22 Apr 2018)

There's always next year!


----------



## Reynard (22 Apr 2018)

Was the festival any good @glasgowcyclist ? Don't have anything like that in this neck of the woods, I don't think.

I'm planning on having a crack at making my own tiger bread. I love the stuff. Need to work out what goes into the paste that's spread over the loaf. Yeast, oil and salt probably, amongst other things...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> Was the festival any good @glasgowcyclist ? Don't have anything like that in this neck of the woods, I don't think.



It was the first one to be held and I hope it becomes a regular event.

I really enjoyed it; there were various stalls with breads, cheeses, Indian food (best samosas I've ever had), talks by representatives of bakery enterprises, including Freedom Bakery who help with rehabilitation of offenders at Barlinnie and Lowmoss. There was also an interesting presentation by a farmer from Ayrshire who produces organic, non-homogenised milk, that you can buy on tap.
Sadly tow of the main speakers couldn't make it so there was no sourdough demonstration from Michael of Baikhaus and no talk from Andrew Whitley of Bread Matters. Those were my two main motivations for going too. Bum.




Reynard said:


> I'm planning on having a crack at making my own tiger bread. I love the stuff. Need to work out what goes into the paste that's spread over the loaf. Yeast, oil and salt probably, amongst other things...



So far I've stayed away from that as the paste bit looks too much of a faff. I'll let you have a bash first then you can report back!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 Apr 2018)

Another first time bake for me yesterday: pitta breads. 

I can't tell you how they taste as they were for my daughter's office lunch club. I'm hoping to hear back soon.


----------



## Reynard (23 Apr 2018)

Ah, bummer @glasgowcyclist that the two things you really wanted to see didn't happen. But a really good samosa is one of life's little pleasures, and I really do like the sound of that milk...

I see you're waiting for me to make all the mistakes first...  I'll need to get rice flour and sesame oil in though, as they're not cupboard staples here. Then we'll have a crack at it. Most recipes seem to call for a basic white bread, so that's what I'll use.


----------



## Reynard (25 Apr 2018)

About to wang a granary loaf in the oven.

Just a standard bread-in-a-hurry rather than what I'd been intending to make: 600g flour, 360g water, 12g yeast, 12g salt, 2tbsp oil, one generous dollop of malt extract.


----------



## LeetleGreyCells (25 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> About to *wang* a granary loaf in the oven.



Baking technical term?


----------



## Reynard (25 Apr 2018)

RealLeeHimself said:


> Baking technical term?



Yeah LOL 

It's easier to say instead of tip out of banneton into clay baker, score, put lid on baker and put ensemble in the oven. 

Bread is lovely btw, had about a third of a loaf with a pot of cullen skink


----------



## MikeG (26 Apr 2018)

A bit lop-sided today. Granary (100g wholemeal, 100g white, 300g granary flour):


----------



## SteveF (27 Apr 2018)

Another sourdough, tried the "folding method" rather than the usual kneading... Have a rosemary , sun-dried tomato and cheese version I'm hoping to have a crack at this weekend. ..


----------



## glasgowcyclist (27 Apr 2018)

SteveF said:


> Another sourdough, tried the "folding method" rather than the usual kneading... Have a rosemary , sun-dried tomato and cheese version I'm hoping to have a crack at this weekend. ..
> 
> View attachment 406202



It's hours yet until lunch so thanks a bunch for posting that.


----------



## CharlesF (27 Apr 2018)

SteveF said:


> Another sourdough, tried the "folding method" rather than the usual kneading... Have a rosemary , sun-dried tomato and cheese version I'm hoping to have a crack at this weekend. ..
> 
> View attachment 406202


Looks good enough to eat! I wish mine would come out that well formed


----------



## PaulSB (27 Apr 2018)

Of course there are alternatives to going out on the Friday Fry Up ride................such as setting up the turbo in the shower. Several advantages including warm wet stuff!!!!!


----------



## Reynard (27 Apr 2018)

Still got a good chunk of the granary loaf left (it's very nice - I do love the Duchy Organics flour) but have a loaf on to give to a dear friend tomorrow.

Will try the tiger bread after the weekend.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (29 Apr 2018)

A first go at Chelsea buns.






One or two slightly well done but our oven seems a bit like that. I can make four large Yorkshire puddings. Three will rise wonderfully whilst the other is like a soggy mess. They have been tested and graded as good.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (29 Apr 2018)

Hugh Manatee said:


> A first go at Chelsea buns.
> 
> View attachment 406657
> 
> ...


They look bloody marvellous!
I'll have the one on the bottom left, thanks.


----------



## Reynard (29 Apr 2018)

Hugh Manatee said:


> A first go at Chelsea buns.
> 
> View attachment 406657
> 
> ...



I wouldn't mind one too...  Just right with a 

I'll need to make some, I think. We have a tradition chez Casa Reynard of eating chelsea buns while watching the final of the world snooker going back to the Hendry v White finals.

Oh yeah, I made a honey rye today. Overnight ferment of 150g rye and 150g white with 300g water and a pinch of yeast. Then added to 50g rye and 250g white, plus 2tbsp oil, 2tbsp honey, 12g salt, 70g water and 7g DA yeast. Nom, nom, nom...


----------



## MikeG (29 Apr 2018)

Hugh Manatee said:


> A first go at Chelsea buns.
> 
> View attachment 406657
> 
> ...




Quick!! Hide them, before Katherine scoffs the lot.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (29 Apr 2018)

I'm just waiting for this to cool; my first limoncello loaf (or cake if you prefer).


Meanwhile, this week's cheese and jalapeño sourdough has just gone in the oven. I'll chuck a picture up in the morning.


----------



## Reynard (29 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'm just waiting for this to cool; my first limoncello loaf (or cake if you prefer).
> View attachment 406670
> 
> Meanwhile, this week's cheese and jalapeño sourdough has just gone in the oven. I'll chuck a picture up in the morning.



A posh lemon drizzle cake? Who cares, looks totally lush


----------



## glasgowcyclist (30 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> A posh lemon drizzle cake? Who cares, looks totally lush



It turns out to be a little disappointing in the flavour department. Texture's lovely but there's not much lemoniness to it. I blame myself for buying the limoncello from Sainsburys as it turns out it's not Italian but made in France. I really should have known better. I've tried the limoncello and it's harsh with little flavour.

Here's the recipe I followed (just make sure you use a decent limoncello): https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/lemon-limoncello-cake.htm

I'll need to buy some proper stuff when I'm in Italy next month...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (30 Apr 2018)

Here's the cheese & jalapeño sourdough loaf I baked late last night:





Recipe >> https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/jalape-o-and-cheddar-sourdough.htm


----------



## CharlesF (30 Apr 2018)

That looks delicious, and have had a quick look at the recipe. It talks about 200g starter. 

How long is that left for, prior to combining with the rest of the ingredients? Could you use a sour dough starter instead.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (30 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> That looks delicious, and have had a quick look at the recipe. It talks about 200g starter.
> 
> How long is that left for, prior to combining with the rest of the ingredients? Could you use a sour dough starter instead.



I'm not sure what you mean by use a sourdough starter instead, the one in the recipe is a sourdough starter but one made with white flour. My starter is always fed with rye and I used that without a problem. 

I've gotten to know how my particular starter behaves so I'll typically feed it (up to the required amount) about 6 - 12 hours before I want to use it in a recipe. It depends on weather, humidity, room temp etc but you eventually get a feel for the right amount of time.


----------



## CharlesF (30 Apr 2018)

Aha! Thanks for clearing that up; I thought that was the case and then wasn't sure. 

My sour dough starter lives in a jar and I feed it twice a week by getting rid of half and adding 250g flour and water. I started it by following Hollywood's directions but I used organic rye flour as I had read somewhere that rye was the best flour to use. I now vary between white and wholewheat.

I will try it this weekend.


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> It turns out to be a little disappointing in the flavour department. Texture's lovely but there's not much lemoniness to it. I blame myself for buying the limoncello from Sainsburys as it turns out it's not Italian but made in France. I really should have known better. I've tried the limoncello and it's harsh with little flavour.
> 
> Here's the recipe I followed (just make sure you use a decent limoncello): https://www.shipton-mill.com/baking/recipes/lemon-limoncello-cake.htm
> 
> I'll need to buy some proper stuff when I'm in Italy next month...



Mmmmm, it's always a pain when that happens... Have looked at the recipe, wonder if it's worth trying using the alternative of lemon zest instead of the liqueur. I'm teetotal, so no point my buying the Limoncello. Other option is maybe to add a few drops of lemon extract and / or some extra juice...


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## glasgowcyclist (30 Apr 2018)

CharlesF said:


> My sour dough starter lives in a jar and I feed it twice a week by getting rid of half and adding 250g flour and water.



Crikey, that's a lot!

I keep mine at around 60 - 75g (combined weight of flour and water) then boost it to the necessary amount the night before I need to bake with it.
Remember, you can leave yourself with just the scrapings in the bottom of your jar and still be able to refresh it to a decent starter in one day.

What do you do with the all the discard? Please don't say it goes down the drain!


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

I have a 1/4 cup scoop that I use to measure out the flour to refresh my starter. One full (packed) scoop, and then about 2/3 that of water. Gives me (more or less) a 100% hydration mix. Usually I take about 50g of that and use it to build however much of whatever sort of levain is needed for the bake.

Excess (beyond the cup I keep in my jug) either gets put into whatever bread I'm baking or turned into waffles.

P.S. I feed mine with tescos stoneground wholemeal.


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## C R (30 Apr 2018)

My children have been complaining that I haven't made bread rolls for some time, so I made some half and half. I wish I could make them look as professional as you guys manage. 




Also, I cheated, and used the bread maker for kneading and proving, but did the second kneading and shaping by hand.


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## glasgowcyclist (30 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> Also, I cheated, and used the bread maker for kneading and proving, but did the second kneading and shaping by hand.



That's not cheating, that's resource management. I'm sometimes doing four different breads in one day and I'll be doing two with the stand mixer, one by hand and, like you, using the bread machine to knead and prove the fourth.

And as my wife says, "If you want it to look as if it came from M&S you might as well just buy it from them."
She'd also describe your lovely rolls as artisanal.


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## C R (30 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> ... I'm teetotal, so no point my buying the Limoncello. Other option is maybe to add a few drops of lemon extract and / or some extra juice...



Wouldn't the alcohol evaporate during baking?


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> Wouldn't the alcohol evaporate during baking?



I would imagine so. But what am I going to do with a bottle of something that I might not use ever again?


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## C R (30 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> I would imagine so. But what am I going to do with a bottle of something that I might not use ever again?


Make more cake, until you run out? 

Amazon sells small bottles, though it is probably anyone's guess how good it is:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Limoncello...F8&qid=1525113219&sr=8-15&keywords=limoncello

I was going to say that it may be good enough for baking, but perhaps not given @glasgowcyclist's experience.


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> Make more cake, until you run out?



There is that. But then I'll be the size of a small house. 

I have heard it said by my friends who do drink, that you shouldn't cook with anything that you won't drink.


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## C R (30 Apr 2018)

Reynard said:


> There is that. But then I'll be the size of a small house.
> 
> I have heard it said by my friends who do drink, that you shouldn't cook with anything that you won't drink.



You just need to put in a few more miles in the bike! In any case, you don't have to eat it, send it my way. I hate when food goes to waste.


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> You just need to put in a few more miles in the bike! In any case, you don't have to eat it, send it my way. I hate when food goes to waste.



 

I'd have to build a trebuchet though - I can't throw that far.


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## C R (30 Apr 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That's not cheating, that's resource management. I'm sometimes doing four different breads in one day and I'll be doing two with the stand mixer, one by hand and, like you, using the bread machine to knead and prove the fourth.
> 
> And as my wife says, "If you want it to look as if it came from M&S you might as well just buy it from them."
> She'd also describe your lovely rolls as artisanal.



Thanks @glasgowcyclist for your kind words. I would settle for all approximately the same size and shape.

The family didn't seem to mind though, none left!


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## Reynard (30 Apr 2018)

C R said:


> The family didn't seem to mind though, none left!



*THAT* is the hallmark of a good bake.


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## SteveF (1 May 2018)

Sun-dried tomato, gouda and parmisan sourdough.. .have a boule about to go in the oven.. .. May have over doughed a tad....


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## C R (1 May 2018)

Looks good @SteveF, that's what I mean with professional presentation!


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## SteveF (1 May 2018)

C R said:


> Looks good @SteveF, that's what I mean with professional presentation!



Thanks, however it's a bit more "rustic" close up....


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## Dave7 (4 May 2018)

Pizza base question............................(in my previous related post someone mentioned "the bakers thread" so I thought I would post this specific question.
My bread make has a recipe for pizza base but it simple tells me to form the dough into balls then press and leave to rise for 15 minutes.
I like thin bases...........once it has risen can I roll it to make it thin ?
If so how thin (approx) without ruining it?
Thanks


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## C R (4 May 2018)

Dave7 said:


> Pizza base question............................(in my previous related post someone mentioned "the bakers thread" so I thought I would post this specific question.
> My bread make has a recipe for pizza base but it simple tells me to form the dough into balls then press and leave to rise for 15 minutes.
> I like thin bases...........once it has risen can I roll it to make it thin ?
> If so how thin (approx) without ruining it?
> Thanks


At home we just spread the base by hand, no rolling pin, because we like the base thick. I don't see any reason not to use a rolling pin, though, just play with the thickness until you get it the way you like it. Experimentation is part of the fun.


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## Dave7 (4 May 2018)

my latest wholemeal bread attempt. About to tuck in with smoked peppered mackerel.....yum


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## Dave7 (4 May 2018)

View attachment 407381

my latest wholemeal bread attempt. About to tuck in with smoked peppered mackerel.....yum


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## Reynard (4 May 2018)

Cracked open my latest bake at lunchtime - a ukrainian style sourdough. 

50% wholegrain: half rye, half wholemeal and some rolled oats (because I'd goofed up a bit on hydration and oats are a good soaker-upper of too much liquid). Half of the flour pre-fermented with the levain for a day, then the dough bulk fermented for a day (including overnight stay in the fridge). Plus 1/4 of the moisture in the form of live natural yoghurt. Also added my usual 2tbsp of oil for 600g of flour.

Not much oven spring, but a dark, firm, flavourful loaf with a nice sour tang to it. Reminds me of the bread I used to be able to buy that was supplied by the Kolos bakery in Bradford.

Will be fabby sliced thinly, buttered and served alongside some pickled herrings in cream sauce.


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## Dave7 (6 May 2018)

Well......my first ever home made pizza. Thanks to all CCrs for the advice.
Topping was various cheeses, onion mushroom and pepper. Sausage. Sauce was a mix of tomato, chili and garlic pure.


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## Reynard (6 May 2018)

Far cheaper and almost certainly far tastier than what you had at Pizza Express. 

Looks pretty good to me.


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## Dave7 (6 May 2018)

Reynard said:


> Far cheaper and almost certainly far tastier than what you had at Pizza Express.
> 
> Looks pretty good to me.


Not like me to boast but .
Mrs Dave reckons it was far tastier.


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## glasgowcyclist (7 May 2018)

Today was a bit of a rush so it was a sundried tomato & black olive loaf together with some sourdough pancakes made with leftover starter (@CharlesF )


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## SteveF (13 May 2018)

Finally figured out how to get that holey texture.....


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## C R (13 May 2018)

SteveF said:


> Finally figured out how to get that holey texture.....
> 
> View attachment 408982


Looks great, how did you do the ripples?


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## SteveF (13 May 2018)

C R said:


> Looks great, how did you do the ripples?


It's the proving banneton, it leaves imprints of the dough.


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## C R (13 May 2018)

SteveF said:


> It's the proving banneton, it leaves imprints of the dough.


Aaaah, you shouldn't have told me, now I need more tools!


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## Reynard (13 May 2018)

SteveF said:


> Finally figured out how to get that holey texture.....
> 
> View attachment 408982



Nice  Higher hydration and a very gentle degassing, I presume? 

Always satisfying to get a nice open crumb, but if I'm to be honest, I prefer a tighter crumb as it's mighty difficult to stop your marmalade falling through the holes otherwise.


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## SteveF (13 May 2018)

Reynard said:


> Nice  Higher hydration and a very gentle degassing, I presume?
> 
> Always satisfying to get a nice open crumb, but if I'm to be honest, I prefer a tighter crumb as it's mighty difficult to stop your marmalade falling through the holes otherwise.



Yes, and I found using a higher than normal temperature at the beginning helped. 

Actually, I want to thank you, I believe you mentioned baking cloches upthread, I got myself one and have been very pleased with the results, alot more predictable ....


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## Reynard (13 May 2018)

SteveF said:


> Yes, and I found using a higher than normal temperature at the beginning helped.
> 
> Actually, I want to thank you, I believe you mentioned baking cloches upthread, I got myself one and have been very pleased with the results, alot more predictable ....



Cloches make the world of difference, don't they?  IIRC @glasgowcyclist uses a dutch oven or something of that ilk.

Here's what I use - worth every penny.







Am thinking in investing in a pullman pan as I want square slices that will fit into the toaster.


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## Reynard (14 May 2018)

Right, am having a crack at tiger bread. Dough has almost finished its bulk ferment, and it's about to be degassed, shaped and left to prove - it's just my bog standard "everyday-bread-in-a-bit-of-a-hurry-with-some-rolled-oats-chucked-in-because-I-got-the-hydration-wrong" kind of loaf.

Will make the paste while its proving. BTW, ground rice / rice flour is a PITA to find. Only place I could get it was Holland & Barrett, and they charge through the nose. If this works, will look for a cheaper source.

Update to follow later in the evening xxx


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## Reynard (14 May 2018)

Well, we have a loaf of tiger bread  It looks right at any rate, and smells pretty good.

Not as much oven spring as I was expecting. Not sure whether that's down to my making a mess of the hydration (the dough was softer and slacker than I normally have it), the thickness of the paste or the fact that you don't score the bread.

Paste is easy to make and easy to apply (I used a pastry brush), but I do need to reduce the quantity. I slapped it on fairly thickly not to waste it as I made too much - the recipe I found (Allinsons website) was for a single loaf and I'd already made less as it *looked* like too much. I also think I need to cut some of the sugar in the mix to stop the loaf from getting too dark.

Looking at the raft of different recipes for the paste, it looks like there's definitely room for tweakage.

Will see what the bread's like tomorrow.


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## glasgowcyclist (21 May 2018)

Reynard said:


> IIRC @glasgowcyclist uses a dutch oven or something of that ilk.



Yes, I use an enamelled cast-iron pot with lid as my dutch oven. From time to time you can get them at Lidl for about £15 - £20 depending on the size. I'll need to check its size when I get home but this is the pot I use for all my big loaves (the distortion of the photo makes it look tall and narrow when it's not; it's a standard big, broad, casserole pot):


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## Reynard (21 May 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Yes, I use an enamelled cast-iron pot with lid as my dutch oven. From time to time you can get them at Lidl for about £15 - £20 depending on the size. I'll need to check its size when I get home but this is the pot I use for all my big loaves (the distortion of the photo makes it look tall and narrow when it's not; it's a standard big, broad, casserole pot):
> 
> View attachment 410291



Oh, I'll have to keep an eye out for one of those in Lidl then. For large loaves I use a steel stock pot upended over my terracotta baking stone. It works, but it's not ideal.

BTW, the tiger bread ended up tasting like a basic sourdough, which wasn't what I was looking for. Will have another crack at it with a proper white loaf.


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## glasgowcyclist (31 May 2018)

Having checked the Lidl pot, there's no capacity marked on it so I measured it and it's a little over 3.5 litres. We've had it about 5 years and when I took it out of the oven tonight to put my sourdough in, the handle for the lid snapped off in my hand. Oh well, it had shown signs of blistering lately; maybe it's not meant to be used at 250°C.

My oval casserole pot that I use for longer loaves is marked as 3.2 litres. Handle on that is fine but it was a lot more expensive and is Le Creuset.

I've got two loaves in right now, pictures to follow in the morning (if I haven't eaten them by then).
Tonight


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## Reynard (31 May 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Having checked the Lidl pot, there's no capacity marked on it so I measured it and it's a little over 3.5 litres. We've had it about 5 years and when I took it out of the oven tonight to put my sourdough in, the handle for the lid snapped off in my hand. Oh well, it had shown signs of blistering lately; maybe it's not meant to be used at 250°C.



Drat. What a shame. 

Mind, my oven only goes up to 220C. So may still be worth a punt from my perspective...


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## glasgowcyclist (31 May 2018)

Reynard said:


> Drat. What a shame.
> 
> Mind, my oven only goes up to 220C. So may still be worth a punt from my perspective...



I'll find a replacement handle that can, er, handle the temperature.
It's a standard screw fitting.


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## C R (31 May 2018)

It is half term so the monkeys and I made apple pie and custard. We cheated for the apple pie and used ready rolled pastry, but the custard was made from scratch, as the monkeys say that the ones from the shop, even the expensive ones, taste too much like the one at school.

As I had a lot of egg whites left I thought I would have a go at a pavlova. This was the meringue, I think the oven was still too hot, so it browned a bit






This is the final result 






And this was it after 20 minutes, I call it success


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## SteveF (4 Jun 2018)

Some baguettes, there were four , my waist is suffering....


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Jun 2018)

Belatedly adding the photo of the loaves I made the other day and mentioned up thread. The baked one is walnut & parmesan sourdough and the one in the banneton is crusty Italian herb & pecorino.

Sorry, I don't have a photo of the finished herby one as I, erm, ate it. All of it.


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## Hugh Manatee (10 Jun 2018)

I need a bit of advice. Occasionally at this time of year and rather more often in Winter, as a Sunday dinner I cook four large Yorkshire puddings in Victoria sponge tins.

These get filled with roast potatoes, parsnips and a myriad of other veg as well. My son is especially fond of them and as he is now 6'2" with a 28" waist, I don't suppose they do too much harm as a treat.

Trouble is getting them all to rise. Three of the four rise wonderfully with 10cm sides not unusual. The forth one looks like a cross between a limp discus and a dog biscuit.

I think it has to be a cold spot in the oven. Odd as it is a fan version. Any other ideas?


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## Reynard (10 Jun 2018)

Hugh Manatee said:


> I need a bit of advice. Occasionally at this time of year and rather more often in Winter, as a Sunday dinner I cook four large Yorkshire puddings in Victoria sponge tins.
> 
> These get filled with roast potatoes, parsnips and a myriad of other veg as well. My son is especially fond of them and as he is now 6'2" with a 28" waist, I don't suppose they do too much harm as a treat.
> 
> ...



That's entirely possible - each oven has its own idiosyncrasies. I know mine has...

Only other thing I can think of is that if you take the tins out of the oven at the same time before you pour the batter in, the fat and batter in the first tin cools down too much before it goes back in the oven - especially since you are using sponge tins.


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## annedonnelly (16 Jun 2018)

I've been on a breadmaking course this morning. Managed to get a photo before I start eating it all...





If anyone is in this area I'd highly recommend the tutor at Northumberland College.


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## C R (17 Jun 2018)

I think it was @Reynard that complained about the cost of rice flour. I got this today from an Iranian shop




This is a small pack, but you can get bigger ones. If you can't find an Iranian shop, Turkish or Kurdish shops tend to carry some persian stuff too.


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## Reynard (17 Jun 2018)

I think I paid £2.50 for half a kilo...

But thanks for the heads up about alternative sources.  Don't have any such locally, but will invariably run across some when out and about.


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## C R (17 Jun 2018)

Reynard said:


> I think I paid £2.50 for half a kilo...
> 
> But thanks for the heads up about alternative sources.  Don't have any such locally, but will invariably run across some when out and about.



Ah, that's cheaper than the one I found, the pack in the photo is 150 grams for 1.59 squids.


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## Tin Pot (17 Jun 2018)

You people might know this - what’s the difference between supermarket/mothers pride bread and sourdough?

Can’t really put my finger on the taste difference either.


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## glasgowcyclist (18 Jun 2018)

I managed to neglect my starter fairly badly in the recent heat so I didn't make a sourdough at the weekend. The starter is recoverable but will need a couple of feeds before it's ready again.

Instead, I made a lovely soda bread with manchego, cheddar and oats. It's really tasty, especially toasted.

The other dough was a mixture of white spelt, wholemeal rye and white bread flours, with poppy seeds. The recipe was for 16 rolls but I changed that to make 5 rolls (lunches) and a 2lb loaf with the remaining dough. This is rather tasty too.


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## glasgowcyclist (18 Jun 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> You people might know this - what’s the difference between supermarket/mothers pride bread and sourdough?
> 
> Can’t really put my finger on the taste difference either.




I'm not sure if you're being serious here!

Supermarket bread is industrially processed pap with a list of ingredients as long as your arm; all sorts of additives, preservatives, enhancers and other fakery to prolong that 'soft' feel that is mistaken for freshness. It is generally tasteless.

Check the label on your next shop loaf and see the stuff they put into the humble loaf. The worrying thing though is that if you bought it from an in-store bakery, they're not required to list all these ingredients! This only adds to the con trick that your supposedly getting a freshly made loaf.

From mixing all these ingredients to removing the finished product from the oven can be as little as 45 minutes in total. That's a forced system designed to churn out as much of the product as quickly and cheaply as is possible.

In contrast, sourdough is made with four ingredients; water, flour, salt, time. The fermenting process can be several days or at least overnight. You end up with a bread that has flavour, structure, nutritional value, and is easier to digest. (Some people who have self-diagnosed as having a wheat intolerance have found they can happily eat sourdough.)

The flavour is dependent on a number of factors but typically it will have a sharp or sour tang to it. The degree to which this is present is affected by the type of starter used, how it's fed, how long the fermentation was & so on. Of course, you can chuck in all sorts of ingredients to make a sourdough of your choice rather than sticking with the bare version.

They are, in all respects, at opposite ends of the bread spectrum.


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## Reynard (18 Jun 2018)

Couldn't have put it better @glasgowcyclist 

Even my bread-in-a-hurry (which still takes around 4 hours) has bags of taste.

My most recent loaf is a hybrid - started out as a sourdough, also with a bit of a neglected starter, which meant that the levain (with 1/3 of the flour) took ages to get going. As I was by then a bit short of time (and bread) I wanged that into a yeasted bread-in-a-hurry loaf and ended up with a very nice loaf of bread. Make up was 150g whole rye, 150g wholemeal, 50g rolled oats and 250g white bread flour. And a heaped tablespoon of caraway seed.


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## Tin Pot (18 Jun 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'm not sure if you're being serious here!
> 
> Supermarket bread is industrially processed pap with a list of ingredients as long as your arm; all sorts of additives, preservatives, enhancers and other fakery to prolong that 'soft' feel that is mistaken for freshness. It is generally tasteless.
> 
> ...



I’m with you, in spirit. Bare with me, I’ll catch up. 

Water, flour and salt? So sourdough is just “normal” bread then? I though there was something special that made it have the name, but it’s basically same as say a bloomer..or does that have sugar in?


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## Reynard (18 Jun 2018)

Yes and no...

Ordinary bread is made with proprietary bakers' yeast (saccharomyces cerevisiae) whereas sourdough is made with yeasts captured from the natural environment - each sourdough culture is pretty well much unique in its colonies of yeasts and bacteria.


----------



## Tin Pot (18 Jun 2018)

Reynard said:


> Yes and no...
> 
> Ordinary bread is made with proprietary bakers' yeast (saccharomyces cerevisiae) whereas sourdough is made with yeasts captured from the natural environment - each sourdough culture is pretty well much unique in its colonies of yeasts and bacteria.



Ah, same ingredients but the yeast gives the different flavour...okay, makes sense 

I have family in Germany where apparently it’s normal practice to keep a yeast colony alive in the kitchen for regular baking.


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## glasgowcyclist (18 Jun 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> I’m with you, in spirit. Bare with me, I’ll catch up.
> 
> Water, flour and salt? So sourdough is just “normal” bread then? I though there was something special that made it have the name, but it’s basically same as say a bloomer..or does that have sugar in?




Sourdough uses the naturally occurring yeast that is present within the bag of flour you have bought from the shop. When you take a little of that aside, place it in a tub and add water, the moisture encourages the yeast to multiply and feed on the flour. Same goes for the naturally present lactobacillus bacterium, which is partly responsible for the yogurt/acidic tang of the sourdough.
There is no commercial yeast, dried or otherwise (like you get in those wee sachets) used in sourdough, only a natural leaven as described above.

Your traditional bloomer will not be made this way and will use some form of commercial yeast, be it compressed, dried or whatever but it will be added as a separate ingredient. Such yeast is engineered to produce predictably fast-rising bread so that you don't need to wait overnight or longer for a loaf.
And there is no sugar in a bloomer, at least not in my bloomers. (ooh err Mrs)


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## Reynard (18 Jun 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> Ah, same ingredients but the yeast gives the different flavour...okay, makes sense
> 
> I have family in Germany where apparently it’s normal practice to keep a yeast colony alive in the kitchen for regular baking.



And the much longer fermentation times... The longer a bread takes to make, the more flavour you can extract from the ingredients.


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## Hugh Manatee (24 Jun 2018)

Pizza for dinner tonight. I use 22oz of flour and then usually make four. I went for three tonight and it was much better. I also let them rise slightly for a second time on the trays as it is so warm tonight.

Vegetarian chilli sausage worked very well and I do like those mini plum tomatoes. There's even some proper tomato flavour in them this time of year!


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## glasgowcyclist (27 Jun 2018)

My neglected starter recovered well enough for me to make a sourdough on Sunday, this time another walnut number.

I forgot to lightly toast the nuts in a dry pan but I have to say that it hasn't made much difference. (I'll often toast the bread anyway.)






For this week's sandwiches I made a wholemeal loaf from a new recipe. This has too much honey in it for my liking, making it a bit claggy when chewing it so I'll be leaving the honey out next time.


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## glasgowcyclist (2 Jul 2018)

A while ago (and in another thread) I posted about a bread I had while on holiday in Sorrento. I couldn't get it definitively identified beyond being pane a legna which is just a generic reference to wood-fired bread but recently came across a very similar looking bread on social media so I asked the poster for the recipe. Turns out it's from a book by Otto Lenghi (I'd never heard of the guy but apparently he's a well-known foodie) and involves using a biga.

It's not quite the same loaf as I'm searching for but really nice nonetheless.


So here I am with another first; Italian Crusty Loaf made using a biga. There was one ingredient in the recipe that I didn't have, malt powder, so I just went ahead without it.

The crust on the loaf was amazing, with a good crunchy snap all the way around. I'm really impressed with the depth of flavour too, and I guess that's down to the 15-20 hour fermentation time.

Apparently the malt powder will help the colour and the crust so I'm getting some for the next time I make it.

EDITED TO ADD: Here's a link to the forum where I found the recipe and method: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=29623.0


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## Reynard (2 Jul 2018)

I make a similar loaf, but french style, with a poolish as opposed to a biga. Difference is the amount of water that goes into the preferment. And yes, it's the fermentation time that gives you the lovely flavour - you could actually reduce that yeast by some margin and extend the fermentation time.

If the malt powder is there to give a darker crust and a slightly sweeter taste, might I suggest just adding a teaspoon of sugar to the dough? It'll do more or less the same thing.


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## bluenotebob (10 Jul 2018)

Biking and baking - two pleasurable leisure activities. I've been baking bread and cakes since the 1980s but it's only recently that I've managed to combine these two sensory delights.

At home after a long ride, I get even more enjoyment than usual from eating whatever I've baked - the physical effort expended has stimulated the taste buds, or perhaps it's just prolonged exposure to fresh air? If I've planned properly, the enjoyment of a long ride can also be enhanced by scoffing an 'in-flight snack' (sugar booster).

If I'm going out on the bike for 3 or 4 hours, apart from ensuring I've got enough fluids, I usually only carry a banana, some dates and perhaps an energy bar. Energy bar? I reckon the energy expended in trying to unwrap it far outweighs any benefit I get from having eaten it. But that's probably just my fumbling incompetence.

On longer rides (5 to 7 hours) I've found that I really need something more substantial to help sustain the effort. I don't know whether there's any appetite (sorry) in this forum for sharing enthusiasms for favourite 'long-haul' food - but I thought that I'd mention three of my current home-made favourites. I try and carry a bit of one of these on all my long runs:

Cornbread - I first discovered this bread/cake back in the 1980s when I was travelling in the US. It's taken me more than 30 years to knock together a workable recipe but I've finally done it. It's slightly sweet and quite heavy so I don't need much - a smallish rectangle of this is enough to give me a lift.

Pear & vanilla cake - this is a variant of the French _Quatre Quarts_ (which I believe is 'pound cake' in English). I use a conference pear - it cooks as part of the baking process - so not too hard or too soft. If I've got it right, the end-result is 'melt in the mouth' pear suffused with the flavour of vanilla. And believe me, that tastes just perfect after a few hours' of riding

Cinnamon & chocolate cake - also a _Quatre Quarts_ variant. Whilst trialling this cake, I discovered (quite by accident) the concept of 'immediate and delayed' chocolate. Probably only of interest if you like chocolate, but I do, I really do. Lexia raisins would be perfect in this cake but as they're way too expensive, I've found a cheaper French alternative. My neighbour's 3-year old loves this cake - I think it's his favourite food. I don't know if that's a recommendation or not but, like him, I've found it really hard to stop eating this cake once I've started. Eating a little bit of this whilst I'm out on the bike gives me a further incentive to get home - so I can have some more...

I wanted to post this in the 'Cookery' section of the forum but I discovered to my surprise that there isn't one. Dear website designer - here's a 'future enhancement request', to be added to your doubtless lengthy list.

Anyone else want to share details of a few of their favourite home-made long haul snacks?


----------



## C R (10 Jul 2018)

bluenotebob said:


> Biking and baking - two pleasurable leisure activities. I've been baking bread and cakes since the 1980s but it's only recently that I've managed to combine these two sensory delights.
> 
> At home after a long ride, I get even more enjoyment than usual from eating whatever I've baked - the physical effort expended has stimulated the taste buds, or perhaps it's just prolonged exposure to fresh air? If I've planned properly, the enjoyment of a long ride can also be enhanced by scoffing an 'in-flight snack' (sugar booster).
> 
> ...



You are not the only one, may want to have a look at the bakers thread in the cafe:

https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-bakers-thread.228233/


----------



## Pat "5mph" (10 Jul 2018)

C R said:


> You are not the only one, may want to have a look at the bakers thread in the cafe:
> 
> https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-bakers-thread.228233/


*Mod Note:*
Beat me to it!
Therefore, I will merge the two


----------



## Poacher (10 Jul 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> A while ago (and in another thread) I posted about a bread I had while on holiday in Sorrento. I couldn't get it definitively identified beyond being pane a legna which is just a generic reference to wood-fired bread but recently came across a very similar looking bread on social media so I asked the poster for the recipe. Turns out it's from a book by *Otto Lenghi* (I'd never heard of the guy but apparently he's a well-known foodie) and involves using a biga.



aka Yotam Ottolenghi - I imagine he'd be amused to be called Otto!


----------



## Poacher (10 Jul 2018)

bluenotebob said:


> I wanted to post this in the 'Cookery' section of the forum but I discovered to my surprise that there isn't one. Dear website designer - here's a 'future enhancement request', to be added to your doubtless lengthy list.


There _used _to be a cookery section, but it was split off to a separate website, CookingBites , administered by former stalwarts of cyclechat. Several cyclechat members post on there, some under different names, but it's also gained quite a few international posters with no known cycling connections. Worth a look!


----------



## monstadog (10 Jul 2018)

Poacher said:


> There _used _to be a cookery section, but it was split off to a separate website, CookingBites , administered by former stalwarts of cyclechat. Several cyclechat members post on there, some under different names, but it's also gained quite a few international posters with no known cycling connections. Worth a look!



Well you learn something every day!!!


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## bluenotebob (13 Jul 2018)

Poacher said:


> There _used _to be a cookery section, but it was split off to a separate website, CookingBites , administered by former stalwarts of cyclechat. Several cyclechat members post on there, some under different names, but it's also gained quite a few international posters with no known cycling connections. Worth a look!



Thanks @Poacher , I finally got round to checking this website out. It's remarkably similar in feel to CC - and looks like it's worth signing-up to.


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## glasgowcyclist (15 Jul 2018)

I had a bit of a late night last night as I'd misjudged the timings for a new dough I was trying and didn't get to bed until 1:20am! However, I was kept entertained by the Forum Language thread started by Vantage.

As you may have seen on that thread, I made this boule (pardon my French), taken from the marvellous book The Bread Baker's Apprentice, by Peter Reinhart.






It's just listed as white bread but is made with 340ml of whole milk and 3 tablespoons of sugar. The result is remarkably similar to brioche in flavour and has a light-as-air quality and very soft texture. It's ideal for sandwiches, burger buns or hot dogs.

Toasted and buttered, it has a taste not unlike a croissant (oops, I did it again).


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Jul 2018)

I had to make a midweek loaf last night because the previous one was so good it was scoffed very quickly.

This was another traditional white loaf (recipe at bakingmad.com ) and although I followed the recipe properly, I've somehow managed to make an arse of it.


----------



## Reynard (19 Jul 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I had to make a midweek loaf last night because the previous one was so good it was scoffed very quickly.
> 
> This was another traditional white loaf (recipe at bakingmad.com ) and although I followed the recipe properly, I've somehow managed to make an arse of it.
> 
> View attachment 420048





That's a rather fine pair of cheeks...


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Jul 2018)

Reynard said:


> That's a rather fine pair of cheeks...



It's not the first loaf I've cocked up...


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## Reynard (19 Jul 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> It's not the first loaf I've cocked up...
> 
> View attachment 420067



Now *that's* classy


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Jul 2018)

Reynard said:


> Now *that's* classy




I wasn't expecting that response!

It was a cottage loaf, which should have looked like this




but my top ball of dough slid off to the side and produced, well, *that*.


----------



## Reynard (19 Jul 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I wasn't expecting that response!
> 
> It was a cottage loaf, which should have looked like this
> 
> ...



LOL! 

You could've tried a million times to get that deliberately and failed rather miserably... 

P.S. Thanks for the good laugh


----------



## C R (3 Aug 2018)

Made an accidental sourdough a couple of days ago. I made some bolas (the French call them boules) using the bread maker to mix, knead and prove, and then refilled the machine to make some half and half rolls. When it came to take the dough out for shaping it became apparent that I hadn't added any yeast. As the weather is quite warm I thought that there was a chance that the dough may ferment on its own, so left it in the machine, and baked it the following day.




That was the result. Quite stodgy, but it did ferment a bit. It could probably have done with a couple more days to raise, but I was concerned it might go off.


----------



## SteveF (6 Aug 2018)

Some baguettes, a little more rustic than anticipated!


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## C R (6 Aug 2018)

SteveF said:


> Some baguettes, a little more rustic than anticipated!
> View attachment 422960



Pah, you call that rustic? 




No more baking this week. It is too hot in the kitchen.


----------



## SteveF (6 Aug 2018)

C R said:


> Pah, you call that rustic?
> View attachment 422966
> 
> No more baking this week. It is too hot in the kitchen.


Very nice. .


----------



## C R (6 Aug 2018)

SteveF said:


> Very nice. .


They always taste nice, but I am absolutely useless at presentation. I have tried to follow instructions from books and youtube, but I always make a pigs ear of it. Yours do look very good, and I bet they taste even better.


----------



## SteveF (6 Aug 2018)

Bought a 4 baguette cooking tray from Bakery Bits, really useful, came with a recipe that works really well.....


----------



## C R (6 Aug 2018)

SteveF said:


> Bought a 4 baguette cooking tray from Bakery Bits, really useful, came with a recipe that works really well.....
> 
> View attachment 422975


That looks like something I could put to good use, thanks.


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Sep 2018)

I haven't posted in a while but I haven't stopped baking, just the standard sandwich loaves though.

Recently I had a succession of poor results, which took a few days to figure out. Bread didn't rise properly and had a wet, tacky crumb. When toasted it was useable but for sandwiches it was awful. You could roll a bit of the bread between your fingers and it would almost go back to being a dough, eurgh.

Using new yeast made no difference so I tried a different flour and bingo!, great bread. The original flour was still well within date and I'd used it previously without a problem. What went wrong with it? Who knows.

Today I'm having another go at baguettes for lunch and some pizza for dinner.
I discovered that the Aldi near me is selling T55 flour and 00 flour so had to have a go with them. Pictures will follow soon, fingers crossed!


----------



## Reynard (8 Sep 2018)

I've noticed that atmospheric conditions can make a big difference to the same formula. It's gone from a long period of being very hot and dry to being cooler and damper - wouldn't surprise me if that didn't have something to do with it.


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## glasgowcyclist (15 Sep 2018)

I've mentioned before that I use a couple of Lidl casserole pots as dutch ovens, well the good news is they're back in the store from Thursday 20 September. The big oval one (4L) is £24.99 and the round one (2.8L) is £19.99. I use the former for the bloomer shaped loafs and the latter for my sourdough boules.

I'd post a link but strangely they're not on the site, yet they are on p19 of this week's in-store brochure.



Reynard said:


> I've noticed that atmospheric conditions can make a big difference to the same formula. It's gone from a long period of being very hot and dry to being cooler and damper - wouldn't surprise me if that didn't have something to do with it.



Ah, I'd accounted for that by baking a loaf with the old flour and a loaf with the new flour at the same time and the old flour one failed again. Still no idea what spoiled it.


----------



## Reynard (15 Sep 2018)

Thanks for the heads up @glasgowcyclist


----------



## annedonnelly (16 Sep 2018)

[QUOTE 5382953, member: 9609"]is baking just bread ? or can I put me blackberry pudding in ?

the perfect end to a good meal - Blackberry and apple crumble washed down with a good dark ale
View attachment 430231
[/QUOTE]

I'm hoping to get out today to pick some more blackberries. Already got a bagful in the freezer.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Sep 2018)

[QUOTE 5382953, member: 9609"]is baking just bread ? or can I put me blackberry pudding in ?[/QUOTE]

Anything goes, bread, buns, cakes, pizza, and definitely blackberry pudding!


----------



## C R (19 Sep 2018)

My first go at toad in the hole, to go with the coleslaw daughter one made in food tech. Raised ok, but it was too much batter and it took forever to cook.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (25 Sep 2018)

I had a go at some cinnamon buns at the weekend. I'd heard of using a Japanese flour roux, known as tangzhong, and how it helps retain softness and moisture within the finished dough and I came across this recipe at King Arthur Flours. I used half quantities for the icing as I didn't want to smother the buns in it. I also added a little orange zest to the icing.

The result was good, if a little drier than hoped but still soft. I'd baked at the suggested 176C without making the standard 20C reduction for a fan oven. Even then I think I'd cut the baking time by 2 or 3 minutes too. You'll need to keep an eye on these the first time you do them as there's the blink of an eye between done and overdone.

Anyway, here's the result. I'll definitely make these again, they'd be ideal at Christmas with maybe some candied peel added too...


----------



## Hugh Manatee (25 Sep 2018)

Looking very good @glasgowcyclist 
I'm always wary when the recipe states, "A somewhat sticky dough." Is it OK or are you scraping it off every surface in the kitchen for hours to come?

I have marked that page and will try to make them soon.


----------



## Reynard (25 Sep 2018)

Tangzhong is really good for making bread that's (almost) got the same texture as sliced loaf.

For an enriched dough, yeah, I can see where it would make things stickier than they already would be. I got a really good bun recipe (it's upthread somewhere) from a chap who runs a bakery - the dough handles like a dream.

One thing to bear in mind though regarding the above - KAF is american, and and american flours can handle more hydration than the flour here in the UK. So I'd suggest cutting back on the water or milk. Say 5% of the total amount.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Sep 2018)

Hugh Manatee said:


> I'm always wary when the recipe states, "A somewhat sticky dough." Is it OK or are you scraping it off every surface in the kitchen for hours to come?



No, I mixed the dough in my stand mixer and it was fine. When it came to rolling it out and cutting it, it was very easy to handle. Still a little tacky but came away from the worktop cleanly.



Reynard said:


> One thing to bear in mind though regarding the above - KAF is american, and and american flours can handle more hydration than the flour here in the UK. So I'd suggest cutting back on the water or milk. Say 5% of the total amount.



I used Allinson's strong white flour with the suggested hydration in the recipe and it was perfect.


----------



## Bobby Mhor (27 Sep 2018)

Question for bread making gurus..
I use a Panasonic maker for my everyday loaves..

Bread flours..

I use various..
Allinsons when on 'cheap'
Aldi, Lidl and Asda variants the rest of the time..
(I'll just say white flour for now)

I notice no difference in any of the finished loaves..
texture or otherwise.
Thoughts please

apologies if discussed before..


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## Reynard (27 Sep 2018)

Hmm... Bread makers make bread on a fixed time cycle IIRC, so no, I don't think you'll notice much of a difference.

Where you will really notice flour quality is if you make bread by hand with a long, slow fermentation - either yeast or sourdough. Waitrose's Leckford Estates flour is particularly fine for this IMHO.

FWIW Allinsons is my "go to" everyday flour. I buy the 3kg bags.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (27 Sep 2018)

Reynard said:


> FWIW Allinsons is my "go to" everyday flour



I've recently discovered there's a Waitrose near me where I get lovely Canadian bread flour for the same price as Allinson at Morrison's.
It's very nice.


----------



## C R (27 Sep 2018)

Another Alinson user here.

I use a bread maker in dough mode to mix, knead and prove. I put the ingredients in the proportions the recipe demands, and leave the machine to it. Once that finishes the dough comes out for second kneading/forming/further proving as needed.


----------



## Reynard (27 Sep 2018)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I've recently discovered there's a Waitrose near me where I get lovely Canadian bread flour for the same price as Allinson at Morrison's.
> It's very nice.



Yeah, I know the stuff you mean. And yes, it is very nice. Mind, I rarely bake 100% white loaves - am usually working in the 30 to 50% wholegrain range, and for that. what I've got works pretty well.

FWIW I pay £2.40 for a 3kg bag of the Allinsons, but I still have one bag left from the load I bought at £2 when it was on offer earlier in the year.


----------



## Bobby Mhor (27 Sep 2018)

Thanks all


----------



## C R (4 Oct 2018)

Bobby Mhor said:


> Question for bread making gurus..
> I use a Panasonic maker for my everyday loaves..
> 
> Bread flours..
> ...



@Bobby Mhor

This is my baking from a couple of days ago.

The recipe takes:

300ml of water
Heaped teaspoon of salt
Heaped teaspoon of sugar
Squirt of olive oil
Three cups of flour, I use the Alinson strong white
Half to three quarters of a teaspoon of yeast. I use the Alinson fast acting that comes in the green can.

Put the water, salt sugar and oil in the bread maker pan, then the flour and then the yeast. Select the dough program which will mix, knead and prove. I leave the dough in until it almost fills the pan, takes about three hours. Then pour out the dough onto a floured surface and knead lightly, you don't want to knock it back too much. Now shape as you like, this is what I do




Let stand for another hour.

I use a baking stone, so start the oven and warm up the stone for about twenty minutes before the bread goes in. Start at 210C, bake for about ten minutes and then reduce to 180C and bake for a further 25 minutes or so. This is the result








You can control how fluffy it gets by changing the duration of the second kneading.

It seems a faff, but as the bread maker does the hard work, it is actually quite easy.


----------



## Bobby Mhor (4 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> View attachment 432714
> 
> 
> @Bobby Mhor
> ...


Thanks
I shall certainly give this a try.

I use the same yeast.
I must pick up some Allinson so an excuse to go out in this miserable weather..
Thanks for the inspiration...


----------



## C R (4 Oct 2018)

Bobby Mhor said:


> Thanks
> I shall certainly give this a try.
> 
> I use the same yeast.
> ...


You're welcome. Let us know how it goes.


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## Bobby Mhor (4 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> You're welcome. Let us know how it goes.


If it looks anything like your photos above, absolutely no chance


----------



## C R (4 Oct 2018)

Bobby Mhor said:


> If it looks anything like your photos above, absolutely no chance


?


----------



## Bobby Mhor (4 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> ?


Sorry, worded that kinda wrongly
It should read, no chance for any photos as if what I make looks as delicious as your bread, it will be gone before I got the camera out.
My family love home made bread....


----------



## C R (5 Oct 2018)

Bobby Mhor said:


> Sorry, worded that kinda wrongly
> It should read, no chance for any photos as if what I make looks as delicious as your bread, it will be gone before I got the camera out.
> My family love home made bread....


Ah, yep, I take the photos as the bread comes out of the oven. We have to embargo the bread before dinner, otherwise by the time we get dinner on the table the monkeys will have filled themselves with the warm bread.


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## Motobecane (5 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> @Bobby Mhor
> 
> This is my baking from a couple of days ago.
> 
> ...



This does look good. I never use a bread maker but results like this could change my mind.


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## Motobecane (5 Oct 2018)

My last loaves - twisty buckwheat and white grain bread:


----------



## Bobby Mhor (5 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> Ah, yep, I take the photos as the bread comes out of the oven. We have to embargo the bread before dinner, otherwise by the time we get dinner on the table the monkeys will have filled themselves with the warm bread.


First attempt, not as fluffy inside as yours..
I think maybe a touch too much oil TBH..
crust a bit harder than it should be..needs less baking time?
but half one loaf disappeared..
it still won't last past lunchtime(or breakfast) tomorrow
I'll rattle up a soup for tomorrow's lunch...


----------



## Bobby Mhor (5 Oct 2018)

Motobecane said:


> My last loaves - twisty buckwheat and white grain bread:
> 
> View attachment 432913


Hiya
I'm learning this..
the breadmaker has always been too easy


----------



## Motobecane (5 Oct 2018)

I've also been experimenting with focaccia - anyone else make that? This is with red onion topping:


----------



## C R (5 Oct 2018)

Bobby Mhor said:


> First attempt, not as fluffy inside as yours..
> I think maybe a touch too much oil TBH..
> crust a bit harder than it should be..needs less baking time?
> but half one loaf disappeared..
> ...


It looks beautiful. For the fluffiness, did you knock the dough back a lot? Just play with the process to see the effect of each change.

I personally prefer a crunchy crust, which takes longer cooking time, but the monkeys prefer the softer crust, just a matter of personal taste.


----------



## Bobby Mhor (5 Oct 2018)

C R said:


> It looks beautiful. For the fluffiness, did you knock the dough back a lot? Just play with the process to see the effect of each change.
> 
> I personally prefer a crunchy crust, which takes longer cooking time, but the monkeys prefer the softer crust, just a matter of personal taste.


I never gave the dough a hard time....
requests are in for more.
One left for tomorrow...
Thank you


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 Oct 2018)

Motobecane said:


> I've also been experimenting with focaccia - anyone else make that? This is with red onion topping:
> 
> View attachment 432916




Thanks a bunch, that's given me the midnight munchies.


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## SteveF (19 Dec 2018)

First attempt at some cinnamon buns, am rather pleased with them....


----------



## jayonabike (23 Dec 2018)

So the Christmas baking has started. 1st batch of mince pies and mince meat baklava are just out of the oven. The mincemeat is homemade also, I made it back in October where it’s been maturing in the back of the cupboard till today


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## jayonabike (23 Dec 2018)

Just out of the oven, 2 white loaves. I make my bread the traditional way, kneaded by hand, proven twice then proven again once shaped and baked in the oven. I also fill a baking tray with boiling water on the bottom shelf of the oven when the loaves go in to create steam to aid the loaves to rise in the oven


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## SteveF (13 Jan 2019)

Some "rustic" Chelsea buns...


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## C R (13 Jan 2019)

Nothing as fancy here, some Yorkshire puddings to go with the Sunday chicken roast.


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## Reynard (13 Jan 2019)

Making good yorkshires is something of an art @C R 

Those look damn good to me.


----------



## C R (13 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> Making good yorkshires is something of an art @C R
> 
> Those look damn good to me.


Thanks, they were good today, but I don't always manage.


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## Reynard (13 Jan 2019)

C R said:


> Thanks, they were good today, but I don't always manage.



The fat in the tin needs to be smoking hot. That's what gives them the "oomph"

FWIW, I always make my yorkshires / toad in the hole with dripping.


----------



## Katherine (16 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> The fat in the tin needs to be smoking hot. That's what gives them the "oomph"
> 
> FWIW, I always make my yorkshires / toad in the hole with dripping.


So do I


----------



## bluenotebob (17 Jan 2019)

Has anyone played with chestnut flour in breadmaking? I don't know if it's available in the UK..?.

I was lucky enough to get a couple of kilos of it in December. A little goes a long way.

Here's a 600g loaf that I made with just 40g of chestnut flour for Xmas day.


----------



## C R (17 Jan 2019)

bluenotebob said:


> Has anyone played with chestnut flour in breadmaking? I don't know if it's available in the UK..?.
> 
> I was lucky enough to get a couple of kilos of it in December. A little goes a long way.
> 
> ...



That looks good, could you share the recipe? 

I love chestnuts, didn't realise there was chestnut flour. Just searched for it and amazons has it, but it is not cheap.


----------



## bluenotebob (18 Jan 2019)

C R said:


> That looks good, could you share the recipe?
> 
> I love chestnuts, didn't realise there was chestnut flour. Just searched for it and amazons has it, but it is not cheap.



I paid 15 euros/kilo for an 'organic' chestnut flour - and I think a few favours were exchanged along the way for me to get at that price.

There's a bit more information about that specific loaf here :

http://www.cookingbites.com/threads/a-winter-bread.13768/page-2#post-138958

There are more breads using chestnut flour in that thread on Cooking Bites, and there's an explanation of all the flours that I've used in the opening post in that thread. A lot of time, discussion and experimentation has gone into all these loaves. I don't give recipes away for free on 'open' forums - but I'm more than happy to share the recipe with you privately. If you PM me, I'll send you the precise details.


----------



## Poacher (18 Jan 2019)

bluenotebob said:


> I paid 15 euros/kilo for an 'organic' chestnut flour - and I think a few favours were exchanged along the way for me to get at that price.
> 
> There's a bit more information about that specific loaf here :
> 
> ...


Full of admiration for your continued and rational experimentation (an embarrassing contrast with my dabbling efforts) - and I envy your neighbours! I'll make my annual appearance on cookingbites to comment further...


----------



## EltonFrog (18 Jan 2019)

Just made this..






I usually make one or two loaves a week, the basic recipe is 500g flour which is usually a half and half of flours, 10g yeast, 10g sugar or honey or treacle, 10g salt, 300ml of liquid ( sometimes 150ml cider 200 ml water) .

Sometimes I make a white loaf as above and 50g butter. 

I knead it all using a Kenwood chef with dough hook, prove for an hour, then another knead then prove for 30 mins, then bake for 27 mins.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (18 Jan 2019)

Although I've not posted for a wee while, I've still been baking every week.

Recently I've been trying some new recipes from a book I got for Christmas; Dan Lepard's Short & Sweet. It covers a lot more than bread but that was the part that interested me most and I have to say that those which I've made and eaten so far have been excellent: soured cream sandwich loaf, spelt & ale loaf, and black pepper rye.

No pictures of those as they were devoured too quickly.

However, my attempt at his black bread (with cocoa powder, coffee, treacle, muscavado sugar, caraway seeds and cumin seeds) was a complete disaster. It was user error so I'll be more careful when I next attempt it but I thought I'd post a picture of the claggy catastrophe.

Anyone else want to own up to a baking blunder? (With pictures, of course!)


----------



## Reynard (18 Jan 2019)

Well, how about these... 






Even a friend's chooks didn't want to eat them...


----------



## C R (18 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> Well, how about these...
> 
> View attachment 447743
> 
> ...


They look ok, what were they supposed to be?


----------



## Reynard (18 Jan 2019)

C R said:


> They look ok, what were they supposed to be?



They were supposed to be a sourdough bread made with an oat soaker. I kind of got the proving wrong, hence the frisbees...

Well, more of a cross between a frisbee and a house brick, really.  They'd have made a good door stop.


----------



## C R (18 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> They were supposed to be a sourdough bread made with an oat soaker. I kind of got the proving wrong, hence the frisbees...
> 
> Well, more of a cross between a frisbee and a house brick, really.  They'd have made a good door stop.


Ah. What about soaking in soup?


----------



## Reynard (18 Jan 2019)

C R said:


> Ah. What about soaking in soup?



Even that would've been a tad optimistic. Besides, it didn't taste very nice either...


----------



## Slick (18 Jan 2019)

My sister makes the best banana bread. I tried to replicate it tonight. I won't be doing it again. 





No bananas


----------



## Reynard (18 Jan 2019)

Slick said:


> No bananas



Umm, well.... yeah...

That would be problematic.


----------



## bluenotebob (20 Jan 2019)

Another contribution from me .. yesterday's turmeric bread ('pain au curcuma').

More details, including a full list of ingredients here :

http://www.cookingbites.com/threads/turmeric-bread.14181/


----------



## C R (22 Jan 2019)

Over the weekend our boy asked about seeded bread, which we don't buy or bake very often.

I got so seeds from the shop (pumpkin, sunflower and poppy) to add to the rolls I usually make. When I was gathering the ingredients I found some ground walnuts, and thought I would add some of that too, taking inspiration from @bluenotebob's mention of chestnut flour.

They came out good, but didn't raise as much as usual, I think the yeast may be too old. Son really liked them, which is a triumph on its own as there aren't many things he will eat willingly.


----------



## Dave 123 (23 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> Well, how about these...
> 
> View attachment 447743
> 
> ...




They'd make nice bread boards...


----------



## Archie_tect (23 Jan 2019)

Someone's broken one of your loofahs.


----------



## Reynard (23 Jan 2019)

*chuckle*


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## Dave7 (23 Jan 2019)

I put this on the retirement thread but wish to smugly boast on here also.
Add the butter and cheese.....thats my lunch


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## Hugh Manatee (23 Jan 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I put this on the retirement thread but wish to smugly boast on here also.
> Add the butter and cheese.....thats my lunch



And a very fine lunch it looks, sir.


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## Reynard (23 Jan 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I put this on the retirement thread but wish to smugly boast on here also.
> Add the butter and cheese.....thats my lunch



Swap the beer for a couple of  and that'd do very nicely.

What cheese, btw?


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## Dave7 (23 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> Swap the beer for a couple of  and that'd do very nicely.
> 
> What cheese, btw?


Today it was a bog standard crumbly Cheshire.... which I am partial to.


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## Reynard (23 Jan 2019)

Dave7 said:


> Today it was a bog standard crumbly Cheshire.... which I am partial to.



Cheshire and plum chutney on rye is pretty


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## EltonFrog (23 Jan 2019)

Just made an orange cake, waiting for it to cool then I’m going to pour melted dark chocolate on it.

Edit: it’s not an orange cake, it’s a marmalade cake.


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## Dave7 (23 Jan 2019)

Reynard said:


> Cheshire and plum chutney on rye is pretty


I actually had Drivers Real Ale Chutney which is very nice


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## Reynard (23 Jan 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I actually had Drivers Real Ale Chutney which is very nice



Hmm, I'll look out for a recipe for a chutney with beer in it. I like the sound of that. At the moment, I'm going through a gar of my gingered yellow plum. It's just the thing with a rather fine piece of Stilton


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## glasgowcyclist (24 Jan 2019)

I've made Dan Lepard's sour cream sandwich loaf again and managed to take a photo before I ate it.

If you want the perfect sandwich bread, with a crispy golden crust and which also makes super toast, this is the bread for you.


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## Dave7 (24 Jan 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I've made Dan Lepard's sour cream sandwich loaf again and managed to take a photo before I ate it.
> 
> If you want the perfect sandwich bread, with a crispy golden crust and which also makes super toast, this is the bread for you.
> 
> View attachment 448788


You really need to send me a bread maker recipe


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## SteveF (27 Jan 2019)

These went down a treat.....


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## C R (27 Jan 2019)

SteveF said:


> These went down a treat.....
> 
> View attachment 449297


I'm not surprised, they look great.


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## Slick (27 Jan 2019)

SteveF said:


> These went down a treat.....
> 
> View attachment 449297


They do look delish, glad you didn't post a picture of the roast.


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## glasgowcyclist (28 Jan 2019)

Here's another Dan Lepard loaf: Black Pepper Rye

Lots of flavour in this one from the black pepper and caraway seeds (or you could use anise or fennel).


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## Reynard (28 Jan 2019)

That would go wonderfully well with my home made gravadlax @glasgowcyclist


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## SteveF (28 Jan 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Here's another Dan Lepard loaf: Black Pepper Rye
> 
> Lots of flavour in this one from the black pepper and caraway seeds (or you could use anise or fennel).
> View attachment 449495


That looks a great loaf, will have to have a go myself..!


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## glasgowcyclist (28 Jan 2019)

I should have included a link to the recipe; you can get a few of his recipes on old Guardian pages. Here's the one for the black pepper rye https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2009/sep/19/how-to-bake-rye-bread

A word of caution on the part where you heat the coffee, pepper, caraway and flour in a pot: keep whisking all the time and when it starts to thicken take it off the heat immediately and transfer it to a bowl to cool. It will quickly turn into a heavy mess if you let it boil.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

My wife came home from work the other day and apologetically produced a bag of hot cross buns she'd bought at the shops.
I was crest-fallen, "How could you?"

So I made my own as a protest. Boy were they good!


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

Split, lightly toasted and slathered with butter... Nom, nom, nom, nom!!!


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> Split, lightly toasted and slathered with butter... Nom, nom, nom, nom!!!


That's exactly how I like them.
I burnt myself on the first one though, that sticky apricot jam glaze gets really hot. A piece of that and a superheated raisin stuck to my finger as I pulled the bun from the toaster. Flippin' sore, even after I plunged my hand into a basin of cold water.


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That's exactly how I like them.
> I burnt myself on the first one though, that sticky apricot jam glaze gets really hot. A piece of that and a superheated raisin stuck to my finger as I pulled the bun from the toaster. Flippin' sore, even after I plunged my hand into a basin of cold water.



Ouch! 

I find using the grill helps prevent the "getting out of the toaster" ouchies...


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## C R (5 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That's exactly how I like them.
> I burnt myself on the first one though, that sticky apricot jam glaze gets really hot. A piece of that and a superheated raisin stuck to my finger as I pulled the bun from the toaster. Flippin' sore, even after I plunged my hand into a basin of cold water.


We have wooden tongs like these for that purpose.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Kitchen-Ai..._QL65&keywords=wooden+tongs+for+toaster&psc=1


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## benb (5 Feb 2019)

I got this beauty for Christmas.






So far I've made 2 batches of chewy double chocolate cookies which have come out really well, and one loaf of wholemeal bread.
The bread had a really nice flavour, but it lost its shape - the dough had puffed out the top of the tin during proving, but when it came out of the oven the bulge collapsed, leaving a flat or even concave top. Maybe I left it too long proving and it over-rose?


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> Maybe I left it too long proving and it over-rose?



I'd say that's exactly what's happened. The loaf has become so big that it can't support its own weight and collapses.

If I suspect my dough has reached that stage, I can save it (sometimes) by gently knocking it back and reshaping it again, keeping as much gas in it as possible. Then let it rise again but keep a close eye on it and get it into the oven while it's still got some rebound.


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## benb (5 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'd say that's exactly what's happened. The loaf has become so big that it can't support its own weight and collapses.
> 
> If I suspect my dough has reached that stage, I can save it (sometimes) by gently knocking it back and reshaping it again, keeping as much gas in it as possible. Then let it rise again but keep a close eye on it and get it into the oven while it's still got some rebound.



I went out, so it was proving for nearly 2 hours instead of the 1 hour in the recipe.
I'll keep a better eye on the time when I try again!

Anyone got some good sites for bread recipes?


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> Anyone got some good sites for bread recipes?



I generally use books for my recipes but there are lots of good ones on www.bakingmad.com , where you can apply filters to narrow down your results.


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> I went out, so it was proving for nearly 2 hours instead of the 1 hour in the recipe.
> I'll keep a better eye on the time when I try again!
> 
> Anyone got some good sites for bread recipes?



Watch the dough, not the clock xxx

If you know you're going to go out, either a) stick the dough in the fridge, b) reduce the amount of yeast or c) both

www.thefreshloaf.com - one of the best bread baking resources online. Some cracking tutorials and some lovely recipes.


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## benb (5 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> Watch the dough, not the clock



OK, what would I be looking for to know the optimum state to put it in the oven?


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> OK, what would I be looking for to know the optimum state to put it in the oven?



Hard to say - it's a "feel" that comes with experience. But certainly you don't want it to quite double in volume for the final proof. You can also do the "poke test" - you want the dough to indent and spring back slowly.

But better to underprove a loaf slightly than to go the other way. At least a burst loaf is better than a frisbee...


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## EltonFrog (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> I got this beauty for Christmas.
> View attachment 450875
> 
> 
> ...



Got one very similar to that too, make about two loaves a week, plus other stuff, a marvellous bit of kit.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> Watch the dough, not the clock xxx
> 
> If you know you're going to go out, either a) stick the dough in the fridge, b) reduce the amount of yeast or c) both
> 
> www.thefreshloaf.com - one of the best bread baking resources online. Some cracking tutorials and some lovely recipes.



As you say, great recipes and tutorials. The one thing that drives me bonkers about it is the volume measurements. How much is a cup of flour? What size of cup? A stick of butter? Grrr! Give me proper weights every time, I don't care whether they're metric or imperial.


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> As you say, great recipes and tutorials. The one thing that drives me bonkers about it is the volume measurements. How much is a cup of flour? What size of cup? A stick of butter? Grrr! Give me proper weights every time, I don't care whether they're metric or imperial.



It *is* an American site... 

But once you start delving below the surface, most of the recipes in the threads and blogs are given in bakers' percentages, which assumes weight, and with 100% being the weight of the flour used.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> OK, what would I be looking for to know the optimum state to put it in the oven?



Are you using a tin?

I generally make my bread in a 2lb tin and when the dough is shaped and placed in the tin, it is usually around half to two-thirds the height of the tin. I cover that with an oiled sheet of clingfilm and it's ready to bake when the dough has crested the top of the tin and the clingfilm has started to bow upwards.

As has already been said, you'll get a feel for it the more you bake. Timings in recipes are just a rough guide as people's kitchen environments can vary enormously.


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> As has already been said, you'll get a feel for it the more you bake. Timings in recipes are just a rough guide as people's kitchen environments can vary enormously.



And it can vary day to day as well, depending on temperature, atmospheric pressure, humidity...

+1 for using a tin as it's easy to see where you're at in terms of volume. Otherwise, break off a bit of the dough when shaping the loaf, put it in a straight-sided glass, pop an elastic band where the top of the dough is, another at double that, and voila - instant visual guide to how your dough is behaving.


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## Asa Post (5 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> And it can vary day to day as well, depending on temperature, atmospheric pressure, humidity...
> 
> +1 for using a tin as it's easy to see where you're at in terms of volume. Otherwise, break off a bit of the dough when shaping the loaf, put it in a straight-sided glass, pop an elastic band where the top of the dough is, another at double that, and voila - instant visual guide to how your dough is behaving.


Not just a pretty face, are you?


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## Reynard (5 Feb 2019)

Asa Post said:


> Not just a pretty face, are you?



I have my moments


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## benb (6 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Are you using a tin?
> 
> I generally make my bread in a 2lb tin and when the dough is shaped and placed in the tin, it is usually around half to two-thirds the height of the tin. I cover that with an oiled sheet of clingfilm and it's ready to bake when the dough has crested the top of the tin and the clingfilm has started to bow upwards.
> 
> As has already been said, you'll get a feel for it the more you bake. Timings in recipes are just a rough guide as people's kitchen environments can vary enormously.



Perfect, thanks.
Yes, using a tin at the moment - might try one not in a tin some time soon.


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## glasgowcyclist (6 Feb 2019)

@benb Here's another site I use for recipes: https://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/bread

It's an American one too but it at least gives the reader the option of switching between measurement styles with a simple radio button.


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## benb (6 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> @benb Here's another site I use for recipes: https://www.kingarthurflour.com/recipes/bread
> 
> It's an American one too but it at least gives the reader the option of switching between measurement styles with a simple radio button.



Thanks. I get so annoyed with recipes in cups, and oven temperatures in F.


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## Dave7 (6 Feb 2019)

I am sure its been said several time (probably by me ) but I prefer to use a bread maker/machine thingy. Throw the ingredients in, choose the setting & loaf size, press the start button and 3 hours later I have a nice loaf.
The only times I have problems is when I allow some of the ingredients to get 'too old'.
I am sure your artisan loafs are better but I am not a good chef and the machine is (mostly) fool proof.


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## glasgowcyclist (6 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I am sure its been said several time (probably by me ) but I prefer to use a bread maker/machine thingy. Throw the ingredients in, choose the setting & loaf size, press the start button and 3 hours later I have a nice loaf.
> The only times I have problems is when I allow some of the ingredients to get 'too old'.
> I am sure your artisan loafs are better but I am not a good chef and the machine is (mostly) fool proof.



Nowt wrong with the machine, I've still got mine and it turns out a bloody good loaf.

There are two things about doing it freehand that I prefer and those are; I can vary my loaf ingredients and styles more, and my bread doesn't have that annoying void in the bottom where the kneading paddle sits.

Actually there's a further reason and that is the buzz I get from making a successful loaf by hand; it's therapeutic and uplifting, particularly if other stuff has got me down during the week. I can't wait for Sundays!


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## benb (6 Feb 2019)

Nothing wrong with using a bread machine, but there are 2 annoyances which make it preferable to bake bread "properly" for me:
1. As @glasgowcyclist says, with a machine you get a hollow where the blade was. Or worse, on mine, it would frequently come out of the tin and stay stuck in the bottom of the loaf and I'd have to dig it out with a knife.
2. Because you only get heat on 5 of the 6 sides, you don't get as nice a crust.

Maybe those are both issues with the machine I was using, but as I can knead the dough in my mixer, which is the hardest part, there isn't an advantage to using a machine for me.


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## Reynard (6 Feb 2019)

Nothing wrong with a bread maker - not everyone has the time or inclination to do bread by hand. Agree with what @glasgowcyclist says, though, especially about the buzz of getting a superbly turned out loaf.

FWIW, I don't have a bread maker.


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## Poacher (7 Feb 2019)

Panasonic bread maker for regular wholemeal loaves (usually 85% wholemeal, 15% white, sometimes with added linseed, pumpkin seeds, sunflower hearts depending on mood).
When Mrs Poacher wants a rustic French style loaf, dough is made in bread maker with type 55 flour plus up to 15% wholemeal if she's not watching, but shaped by hand, proved on oven tray in a swing-bin bag, slashed, sprayed with hot water and cooked at 200° C for 30 minutes fan. Usually good results.
I _would _knead by hand, but my arms are too weedy!


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## Reynard (7 Feb 2019)

Poacher said:


> Panasonic bread maker for regular wholemeal loaves (usually 85% wholemeal, 15% white, sometimes with added linseed, pumpkin seeds, sunflower hearts depending on mood).
> When Mrs Poacher wants a rustic French style loaf, dough is made in bread maker with type 55 flour plus up to 15% wholemeal if she's not watching, but shaped by hand, proved on oven tray in a swing-bin bag, slashed, sprayed with hot water and cooked at 200° C for 30 minutes fan. Usually good results.
> I _would _knead by hand, but my arms are too weedy!



There are some really good "in the bowl" kneading techniques that don't require serious elbow grease. It's more like a folding process that develops the dough.

I do this rather than a "traditional" knead as only having a galley kitchen, it minimizes the mess.


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## OldShep (7 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Nowt wrong with the machine, I've still got mine and it turns out a bloody good loaf.
> 
> There are two things about doing it freehand that I prefer and those are; I can vary my loaf ingredients and styles more, and my bread doesn't have that annoying void in the bottom where the kneading paddle sits.
> 
> !



Surely a third one.. great fir getting the hands clean


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## glasgowcyclist (7 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> There are some really good "in the bowl" kneading techniques that don't require serious elbow grease. It's more like a folding process that develops the dough.
> 
> I do this rather than a "traditional" knead...



Me too!

Once I've mixed the ingredients I cover the bowl and leave it for ten minutes. Then I fold the dough in the bowl, repeating after 15 minutes and once again after 30 minutes. The fold I use was shown to me by a local baker and is the easiest thing. 

Wet your hands (this makes it much easier to handle the dough without getting messy) and slip them under the dough at 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock.
Pick up the dough and let its own weight stretch it out a little.
Flop it back into the bowl on its side.
Turn the bowl 90 degrees and repeat.
Do this about 6 times before leaving it to rest.
Go through these steps again after 15 and 30 minutes.
Leave it to rest for 30 minutes after the final fold then shape as desired.

Once it has sufficiently proved, bake.


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## C R (7 Feb 2019)

I use a bread maker on the dough program to mix, knead and rise. I then pour the dough, knock back, "shape", and bake after leting it prove again.

This was today's bake










White with poppy, pumpkin and sunflower seeds.


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## benb (8 Feb 2019)

Yesterday's attempt was better. Flavour is nice, but lacking something I can't quite put my finger on. Maybe a little sugar in the recipe is in order.


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## EltonFrog (8 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> Yesterday's attempt was better. Flavour is nice, but lacking something I can't quite put my finger on. Maybe a little sugar in the recipe is in order.
> 
> View attachment 451354
> View attachment 451353
> View attachment 451352



Bread usually needs sugar, about 10g should be enough to 500g flour. Sugar is food for yeast.


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## Dave7 (8 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> Bread usually needs sugar, about 10g should be enough to 500g flour. Sugar is food for yeast.


My recipe calls for one tbs of sugar for a 1 Lb loaf.


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## EltonFrog (8 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> My recipe calls for one tbs of sugar for a 1 Lb loaf.



If it works it works.


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> Yesterday's attempt was better. Flavour is nice, but lacking something I can't quite put my finger on. Maybe a little sugar in the recipe is in order.



If you like a slightly malty flavour from your bread, forget the granulated sugar and add a tablespoon of treacle instead. OMG!

I find it easiest to add the treacle covered spoon to my measuring jug then pour in enough boiling to just cover the treacle, then stir until it dissolves. Top up with cool water to required amount and add that to the flour. Gives the bread a nice colour too.


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## EltonFrog (8 Feb 2019)

I've got a bun in the oven as I type.

500g of your favourite flour, usually 250g Sainsbury's Wholemeal Bread Mix and 250g Sainsbury's Wholegrain Seeded Flour
10g Yeast
10g Salt
10g Sugar, sometimes honey, or treacle
10g dried milk
300ml Water.

The dried milk, salt, sugar go in a jug with water which is warmed up, the flour and yeast in the Kenwood mixing bowl, mix the whole lot together with a dough hook for 5 mins on a low setting, then another 5 minutes on a medium setting. Leave for an hour in the airing cupboard, then another go with the Kenwood for 3 minutes then into a warm lightly oiled and floured bread pan for another 30 minutes, then bake for 26 minutes @175


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Feb 2019)

I'd a few leftover bananas the other day so thought I'd try a banana loaf. 

This time it was a Mary Berry recipe and it's the best yet, nice and light. Yum.


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## Dave7 (8 Feb 2019)

A quick question on yeast.
I use the packet stuff but I only make 1 or 2 loaves per week which is just 1 teaspoon of yeast.
Once opened, how long do you think it will last ie be effective?
The box has a use by date but no "once opened" info.


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> A quick question on yeast.
> I use the packet stuff but I only make 1 or 2 loaves per week which is just 1 teaspoon of yeast.
> Once opened, how long do you think it will last ie be effective?
> The box has a use by date but no "once opened" info.




Well that's the dearest way to buy it, at least twice the price of buying the ~125g tin.

Anyway, it'll keep for a long time (many months) provided you keep it dry and cool. If you only part use a sachet, roll it up tight and use a food clip or tape it shut and you'll be fine. But honestly, at your rate of loaf making you'd be better off buying the tin.


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## benb (8 Feb 2019)

I just use the yeast sachets, which are one sachet per loaf.
No idea if I'd get better results with fresh yeast, but might not be worth the effort.


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## Reynard (8 Feb 2019)

I buy the tins. But most of my loaves only tend to have half a teaspoon (or less) of yeast in them, so a tin lasts me a fair old while.

How to get more flavour into a loaf?

1) Flour - different flours have different flavours, so maybe try a different flour. IMHO the Tesco's own brand stoneground wholemeal is one of the nicest around when it comes to wholemeal, while for white, Waitrose's Leckford Estate is really nice.

2) Is there enough salt in the loaf? Typically you want 2% salt, so 500g flour will want 10g salt

3) The less yeast and the longer the bulk ferment, the more flavour you will extract from the dough

4) You could toast some flour in a frying pan and add that to your dough. Likewise rolled oats are good for this

5) Use a soaker and/or a preferment


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## C R (8 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well that's the dearest way to buy it, at least twice the price of buying the ~125g tin.
> 
> Anyway, it'll keep for a long time (many months) provided you keep it dry and cool. If you only part use a sachet, roll it up tight and use a food clip or tape it shut and you'll be fine. But honestly, at your rate of loaf making you'd be better off buying the tin.


Seconded

I buy the tin as well, never had any problem keeping it in the fridge. I don't bake a lot, so it lasts for a few months.


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## C R (8 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> 2) Is there enough salt in the loaf? Typically you want 2% salt, so 500g flour will want 10g salt



Concur with the salt, every time the flavour seems to be missing I've traced to not enough salt.


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## Slick (8 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'd a few leftover bananas the other day so thought I'd try a banana loaf.
> 
> This time it was a Mary Berry recipe and it's the best yet, nice and light. Yum.
> 
> ...


Show off.


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## Reynard (8 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'd a few leftover bananas the other day so thought I'd try a banana loaf.
> 
> This time it was a Mary Berry recipe and it's the best yet, nice and light. Yum.
> 
> ...



I might have a crack at that - have some bananas that really want using...


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## Reynard (10 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> I might have a crack at that - have some bananas that really want using...



Did make that Mary Berry banana loaf yesterday. Ridiculously easy to make. Thanks for the heads up @glasgowcyclist 

A good chunk of it was demolished for breakfast this morning.


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## EltonFrog (10 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'd a few leftover bananas the other day so thought I'd try a banana loaf.
> 
> This time it was a Mary Berry recipe and it's the best yet, nice and light. Yum.
> 
> ...





Reynard said:


> Did make that Mary Berry banana loaf yesterday. Ridiculously easy to make. Thanks for the heads up @glasgowcyclist
> 
> A good chunk of it was demolished for breakfast this morning.



I’m baking this right now. An hour seems a long time. Is that correct?


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## Reynard (10 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> I’m baking this right now. An hour seems a long time. Is that correct?



Mine only wanted about 50 mins... Guess it depends on your oven. I'd start checking it from about 45 mins on.

Would also recommend covering with tin foil for the last bit to stop it browning too much - mine is rather darker than the one @glasgowcyclist posted the other day.


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## EltonFrog (10 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> Mine only wanted about 50 mins... Guess it depends on your oven. I'd start checking it from about 45 mins on.
> 
> Would also recommend covering with tin foil for the last bit to stop it browning too much - mine is rather darker than the one @glasgowcyclist posted the other day.



Ok I’ll keep an eye on it.


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## Katherine (10 Feb 2019)

I'm going to try the banana loaf recipe ..


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## EltonFrog (10 Feb 2019)

Katherine said:


> I'm going to try the banana loaf recipe ..


It’s really nice, I didn’t have the correct size tin so it rose up and split on the top so it looks a bit rustic, but it tastes fab, is a light texture and is very simple to make, as @Reynard says, keep an eye on it for the last ten minutes.

Thanks @glasgowcyclist for posting the link.

Edit: I noticed the cake split at the top in the recipe photo.


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## glasgowcyclist (10 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> I’m baking this right now. An hour seems a long time. Is that correct?



It is unless you're using a fan-assisted oven, in which case you should either reduce the temperature by 20C to 160C or reduce the time by 20 minutes. I went with the former.

And yes, it's expected to split along the top.

It's great fun this baking lark, isn't it?


----------



## EltonFrog (10 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> It is unless you're using a fan-assisted oven, in which case you should either reduce the temperature by 20C to 160C or reduce the time by 20 minutes. I went with the former.
> 
> And yes, it's expected to split along the top.
> 
> It's great fun this baking lark, isn't it?



I do have a fan assisted oven, but it’s not very accurate with the temperature, I did reduce the temp a little. 

Yup, it’s good fun, when it works.


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## Reynard (10 Feb 2019)

The recipe's been scribbled down in my "book of bakes" for future reference.

I might add some lemon zest and some poppy seeds to it next time. Or maybe a handful of chopped pecans...


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## EltonFrog (10 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> The recipe's been scribbled down in my "book of bakes" for future reference.
> 
> I might add some lemon zest and some poppy seeds to it next time. Or maybe a handful of chopped pecans...



I was considering making the mixture as is without banana then at the last minute folding in chopped pear and sliced almonds. Whadya fink?


----------



## Reynard (10 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> I was considering making the mixture as is without banana then at the last minute folding in chopped pear and sliced almonds. Whadya fink?



It's pretty well much a basic cake mix with banana added into it, but I think you'd have to up the liquid to take account for that. I'd probably look for an equivalent recipe on the interweb, because you may end up with a frisbee or a house brick - the rise is a chemical reaction after all, and if you get the ratio wrong, then there'll be


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## C R (10 Feb 2019)

Another Berry recipe here. Not me this time, though, but my daughter. She is a couple of weeks short of 12, but a much better baker than me. This was her first go at chocolate eclairs







I only helped making sure that the choux wasn't lumpy, they taste so much better than the ones from the shop.

Can you tell how proud I am?


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## Reynard (10 Feb 2019)

Mmmm, those look good. 

My go-to recipe for anything choux-and-chocolate is from "Sainsbury's Book of Baking". OK, it's mid 80s vintage, but it's a goodie for all sorts of cakes and biscuits. Good recipe for choux pastry and a wonderful one for a warm bitter chocolate sauce that is just  which gives you the makings of a profiterole stack that's


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Feb 2019)

Okay, who'd like to see my buns?


I made some lovely brioche buns (and a brioche loaf too) because they're my wife's favourite and she's smashing.





The bottom two got up to a bit of smooching in the oven...


----------



## Reynard (11 Feb 2019)

Brioche with butter and apricot jam


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> Brioche with butter and apricot jam



Butter + jam =


----------



## benb (11 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Okay, who'd like to see my buns?
> 
> 
> I made some lovely brioche buns (and a brioche loaf too) because they're my wife's favourite and she's smashing.
> ...



They look nice. Recipe?


----------



## Reynard (11 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Butter + jam =



I think we'll have to agree to disagree on that one...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> They look nice. Recipe?



It's in one of my wife's veggie cookbooks (for halloumi burger in a brioche bun). I'll look it out for you when I get home.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (12 Feb 2019)

@benb Sorry for the delay, I've taken the shortcut of posting a picture of the recipe as I'm too lazy to type it out. You should be able to read it okay, if not let me know.

Eat these on the day of baking or the day after, unless you store them in an airtight tub. I hope you like them.


----------



## benb (12 Feb 2019)

Thanks, @glasgowcyclist I'll give those a go.

My latest loaf was the one made with sour cream linked earlier.
Except I ran out of white flour, so mine is with about a third white flour and two-thirds wholemeal. Really nice. Possibly 5 minutes too long in the oven.


----------



## EltonFrog (12 Feb 2019)

benb said:


> Thanks, @glasgowcyclist I'll give those a go.
> 
> My latest loaf was the one made with sour cream linked earlier.
> Except I ran out of white flour, so mine is with about a third white flour and two-thirds wholemeal. Really nice. Possibly 5 minutes too long in the oven.
> ...



Looks yummy.


----------



## Katherine (12 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> I’m baking this right now. An hour seems a long time. Is that correct?





Reynard said:


> Mine only wanted about 50 mins... Guess it depends on your oven. I'd start checking it from about 45 mins on.
> 
> Would also recommend covering with tin foil for the last bit to stop it browning too much - mine is rather darker than the one @glasgowcyclist posted the other day.





Katherine said:


> I'm going to try the banana loaf recipe ..





glasgowcyclist said:


> It is unless you're using a fan-assisted oven, in which case you should either reduce the temperature by 20C to 160C or reduce the time by 20 minutes. I went with the former.
> 
> And yes, it's expected to split along the top.
> 
> It's great fun this baking lark, isn't it?



Delicious cake. 
I baked it for 45 minutes at 170°C

Did you all eat it as it was or did you put any icing on or spread anything on the slices?


----------



## C R (12 Feb 2019)

Reynard said:


> warm bitter chocolate sauce that is just  which gives you the makings of a profiterole stack that's


I love bitter chocolate, could you share the recipe, please.


----------



## EltonFrog (12 Feb 2019)

Katherine said:


> Delicious cake.
> I baked it for 45 minutes at 170°C
> 
> Did you all eat it as it was or did you put any icing on or spread anything on the slices?



I tried it with some butter yesterday, but it doesn’t need it tbh.


----------



## The Bystander (16 Feb 2019)

This morning's loaf.
20% Wholemeal, 80% White, expected to be 100% delicious...


----------



## The Bystander (16 Feb 2019)

If I could have let it cool down I would have but, presented with the combination of warm, crusty and buttery, I hadn't the power to resist.


----------



## C R (16 Feb 2019)

The Bystander said:


> If I could have let it cool down I would have but, presented with the combination of warm, crusty and buttery, I hadn't the power to resist.
> View attachment 452688


There's nothing like warm bread freshly out of the oven. One of my earliest and fondest memories of my childhood is the baker's van arriving at the farm gate. The baker would always give us a chunk of a loaf he kept for that purpose, warm and crunchy, ... Uhm, I am going to have to bake some bola now.


----------



## bluenotebob (20 Feb 2019)

A 'Pane alle Nocciola' (a hazelnut bread). After weeks of looking, I finally found a packet of ground toasted hazelnuts a couple of days ago. I also added a small amount of molasses. The crumb is actually slightly browner than the photos suggest. I'm very pleased with this - it's a keeper


----------



## EltonFrog (26 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I'd a few leftover bananas the other day so thought I'd try a banana loaf.
> 
> This time it was a Mary Berry recipe and it's the best yet, nice and light. Yum.
> 
> ...



& @Reynard & @Katherine 

I’m experimenting with this recipe. As I type baking in the oven is this basic mixture, but instead of banana, I’ve added grated orange peel, orange curd in the mixture, then chopped up the orange flesh and put on top of the mixture in the tin. 

I shall report back.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> & @Reynard & @Katherine
> 
> I’m experimenting with this recipe. As I type baking in the oven is this basic mixture, but instead of banana, I’ve added grated orange peel, orange curd in the mixture, then chopped up the orange flesh and put on top of the mixture in the tin.
> 
> I shall report back.




I look forward to the result.

I made another at the weekend (enjoying a piece right now) and meant to put in some roughly chopped walnuts but forgot. Will try next time.


----------



## EltonFrog (26 Feb 2019)

I think I’ve over cooked it, it cooling now. Smells good though.

Edit: just sliced into it,

Looks ok, a little over done.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Feb 2019)

CarlP said:


> I think I’ve over cooked it, it cooling now. Smells good though.
> 
> Edit: just sliced into it,
> 
> ...




Looks fine to me. How does it taste?


----------



## EltonFrog (26 Feb 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Looks fine to me. How does it taste?


Tasty tasty very very tasty.


----------



## Dave7 (26 Feb 2019)

bluenotebob said:


> A 'Pane alle Nocciola' (a hazelnut bread).
> 
> I'm very pleased with this - it's a keeper


A keeper?
I am no expert but I think it will eventually go mouldy.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (2 Mar 2019)

This weird looking mixture is apparently the original British Rail gingerbread recipe for first class coaches! Once cooked, it is better matured for 2 or 3 days.







I'll update once it is baked and out of the loaf tin.


----------



## Reynard (2 Mar 2019)

C R said:


> I love bitter chocolate, could you share the recipe, please.



125 g dark choc of choice broken into pieces
150 ml water
1 tsp instant coffee powder (optional - I don't tend to put any in)
50 g granulated sugar

Put all the ingredients into a pan. Heat gently until the chocolate has melted. Then turn the heat up, bring to the boil and then simmer for 10 minutes.

Couldn't be easier.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (2 Mar 2019)

The gingerbread was a bit of a disaster. Has anyone got a 2lb loaf tin? When you get a moment, could you measure one and give me a rough L x W x D for me in cm? Rather a lot ended up on the oven floor. I'm sure that tin was the right size. I have used it before.

Thanks.


----------



## SteveF (2 Mar 2019)

A malted, sultana and apricot loaf... Lovely!


----------



## annedonnelly (2 Mar 2019)

Hugh Manatee said:


> The gingerbread was a bit of a disaster. Has anyone got a 2lb loaf tin? When you get a moment, could you measure one and give me a rough L x W x D for me in cm? Rather a lot ended up on the oven floor. I'm sure that tin was the right size. I have used it before.
> 
> Thanks.



Mine is 21 x 11 x 6. Shame about your overflowing gingerbread


----------



## SteveF (10 Mar 2019)

A basic, simple white loaf.... Very pleased with how it's turned out..


----------



## EltonFrog (10 Mar 2019)

SteveF said:


> A basic, simple white loaf.... Very pleased with how it's turned out..
> 
> View attachment 456845



Can I have the crust?


----------



## Reynard (10 Mar 2019)

All that wants is a nice bit of butter @SteveF 

Forgot to say, I made some rocky road on Friday afternoon. It is one of my favourite things to eat.


----------



## benb (11 Mar 2019)

So the bread I've been making tastes really good, but isn't rising as well as I think it should.

Here's my steps:
Stir 2 teaspoons of dried yeast and 2 teaspoons of sugar into 150ml of tepid water.
While that's starting to froth a little, mix 450g of flour (whatever combination of white and wholemeal) and a teaspoon of salt
When the yeast has a bit of froth going, mix in with the kneading hook on the mixer
Add another 150ml of tepid water and let it knead for 5 minutes
Cover with oiled clingfilm and leave in a warm place for an hour or so until roughly doubled
Knock back for 30 seconds and shape into a loaf in a tin
Cover with the clingfilm again and wait until it's risen a couple of cm above the top of the tin
Bake for 30 minutes at 200

So, it just doesn't want to rise much more when it's in the oven.
I'm wondering if I'm knocking back too much - might try skipping that. Any other tips?

Thinking about it, when I was using the sachets of yeast I think it was rising better, so maybe I'm not using enough yeast. I'm using Allinson Easy Bake Yeast


----------



## C R (11 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> So the bread I've been making tastes really good, but isn't rising as well as I think it should.
> 
> Here's my steps:
> Stir 2 teaspoons of dried yeast and 2 teaspoons of sugar into 150ml of tepid water.
> ...


I use that, and mix dry directly into the flour. Haven't had issues with raising.


----------



## benb (11 Mar 2019)

C R said:


> I use that, and mix dry directly into the flour. Haven't had issues with raising.



How much do you use?


----------



## C R (11 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> How much do you use?


For my "bola", which is quite fluffy, 3/4 of a teaspoon.


----------



## Mugshot (11 Mar 2019)

I haven't looked at this thread previously because my baking skills go as far as popping a part baked baguette in the oven. Having had a look through I have to congratulate you all on being awesome, the bakes in your pics look absolutely gorgeous, you're very talented!!





And I hate you all


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> So the bread I've been making tastes really good, but isn't rising as well as I think it should.
> 
> Here's my steps:
> Stir 2 teaspoons of dried yeast and 2 teaspoons of sugar into 150ml of tepid water.
> ...



There's no need for the first step of soaking the yeast. All that frothing is gas that your dough isn't benefitting from. Just whack everything in together and mix, let the yeast do all its work in the dough.

I don't let my dough get to double in size as by then it's rather exhausted. This is evident by prodding the surface to see if it springs back. If it sags after prodding then it's over-proved but saveable. I would suggest letting it rise until it had increased in volume by a little over half, then knock it back.

When knocking back, don't be too rough. Some recipes talk about 'punching down' and people interpret this as beating every last drop of gas out. Don't do that, simply partially deflate it (gently). All you're doing at this stage is getting the yeast back in contact with its food source so it can produce more gas.

Shape it and put it in the tin, keeping a close eye on it. When it crests the rim of the tin by no more than 1cm at its highest, bake it. Once in the oven, sometimes the crust of the bread can start to form before the yeast has done its thing and although the yeast will carry on gassing, the hard crust prevents expansion. To avoid this you could place a small roasting tin or dish in the bottom of the oven while it heats and when you're about to put your loaf in, pour about 250ml of boiling water into it. The steam will keep the dough surface soft enough to prevent premature crusting and let your bread rise nicely. Remove this roasting tin after 15 minutes to allow your loaf to form a crust and colour to your liking.

Despite having made a lot of bread over the last couple of years, I still use a food thermometer to check when it's ready. All this advice to tap the loaf to see if it sounds hollow is way too vague, mine all sound the same, even when they're not ready. Standard bread I bake until it reaches 195F in the centre and sourdough until it's 205F.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Mar 2019)

SteveF said:


> A basic, simple white loaf.... Very pleased with how it's turned out..
> 
> View attachment 456845




I'd buy that!


----------



## bluenotebob (11 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> So the bread I've been making tastes really good, but isn't rising as well as I think it should.



I've been making my own bread for 35 years now. I disagree with some of the comments above - but it doesn't matter: if it works for you, that's fine. For the record, I don't think using accurate fluid measurements are helpful - get the initial dough right by 'touch and feel' (a dough hook isn't necessary either - use your hands). Loaf tins and oiled clingfim aren't essential either.

Don't skip the knocking-back - it's important (and yes, I agree - don't be too brutal).

Have you checked the expiry date on that tin of Easy-Bake yeast? 'Old' yeast won't work as well. It might be that ..?


----------



## benb (11 Mar 2019)

Thanks, will try those tips next loaf.


----------



## EltonFrog (11 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Thanks, will try those tips next loaf.


FWIW I agree with GC that’s pretty much the way I make my bread, sometimes for no reason I understand the bread sometimes doesn’t rise as well as other times.


----------



## Reynard (11 Mar 2019)

Yeah, could be the yeast. But with easy bake, you just add the yeast straight in, no need to activate it. (I use the stuff in the yellow tin, which I *do* have to activate...)

Things like temperature, humidity and atmospheric pressure have a bearing on how well your dough performs. The storm systems coming in could well be a factor as well - in fact, I'd be surprised if they weren't.

Also, watch the dough, NOT the clock. Sounds like you may be overproving your dough, which is why you're not getting oven spring. Other possibility is that the crust is forming on the bread before the dough has had a chance to spring, so try either a) putting a tin of boiling water in the bottom of your oven to generate steam or b) back your bread under a cloche.

P.S. No need for the oiled clingfilm, just put your bowl in a large plastic bag. Clear bag is helpful, though not necessary.


----------



## EltonFrog (11 Mar 2019)

I cover my dough with a tea towel on the first prove, nothing on the second.


----------



## Reynard (11 Mar 2019)

Don't you get problems with a dry skin forming on the dough then?


----------



## benb (12 Mar 2019)

Thanks. I'm doing another loaf tonight, so I'll see what happens.
When you say "Watch the dough not the clock" how do you know when it's proved enough but not too much?
When it indents with a finger and springs back fairly promptly?


----------



## C R (12 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Thanks. I'm doing another loaf tonight, so I'll see what happens.
> When you say "Watch the dough not the clock" how do you know when it's proved enough but not too much?
> When it indents with a finger and springs back fairly promptly?


Yep, finger pressure. If it doesn't spring back it is overproved. Good luck.


----------



## The Bystander (12 Mar 2019)

CarlP said:


> I cover my dough with a tea towel on the first prove, nothing on the second.





Reynard said:


> Don't you get problems with a dry skin forming on the dough then?



+1 for the tea towel (but I use it both times) and I do get a thin dry skin on top of the dough after the first rise but it doesn't seem to cause a problem and gets reabsorbed when knocking back.

Here's today's effort - one short of a baker's dozen


----------



## EltonFrog (12 Mar 2019)

Reynard said:


> Don't you get problems with a dry skin forming on the dough then?


Nope, as long I don’t leave it to long.


----------



## benb (12 Mar 2019)

OK, thanks all.

Still not 100% sure about how much yeast to use.
I'm sure that the tin is exactly the same as the sachets. The sachets have 7g in, which is at least 2 teaspoons, probably more like 2½.
But above someone was only putting in less than 1 teaspoon. I guess that too much is as bad as not enough.


----------



## bluenotebob (12 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Still not 100% sure about how much yeast to use.
> I'm sure that the tin is exactly the same as the sachets. The sachets have 7g in, which is at least 2 teaspoons, probably more like 2½.
> But above someone was only putting in less than 1 teaspoon. I guess that too much is as bad as not enough.



I've gone back through my notes to 2016 which was the last time I used the Easy-Bake Yeast. I used 2 teaspoons for a 500g loaf, if that helps.

Incidentally, I don't think you need to add sugar with that yeast. But I did - and still do, now that I'm using French sachets of yeast. I'm making another 600g loaf today and I've used 2 x 5g sachets. Oh, and I've also added a dessertspoonful of molasses - which makes the bread smell even better, stains it slightly brown, and it tastes heavenly...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (12 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> OK, thanks all.
> 
> Still not 100% sure about how much yeast to use.
> I'm sure that the tin is exactly the same as the sachets. The sachets have 7g in, which is at least 2 teaspoons, probably more like 2½.
> But above someone was only putting in less than 1 teaspoon. I guess that too much is as bad as not enough.




Two teaspoons is the right amount for the ingredients you posted. I'm about to make a similar loaf (using 450g of spelt) and it calls for two teaspoons. You'll be fine with that.


----------



## benb (12 Mar 2019)

Thanks, will update tomorrow.
I suspect I've been leaving it to prove too long and/or knocking back too vigorously.


----------



## Reynard (12 Mar 2019)

CarlP said:


> Nope, as long I don’t leave it to long.



Fair enough - I go for the low yeast & long bulk ferment type breads.


----------



## Reynard (12 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> But above someone was only putting in less than 1 teaspoon. I guess that too much is as bad as not enough.



Yeah, that'll be me.

I tend to put only half a teaspoon in (4g typically), but as I mentioned in the post above, I use a 12 hour pre-ferment, and then however long it takes for the bulk ferment. - 8 to 10 hours at room temperature typically, or longer if I prove the dough in the fridge.

You don't need much yeast to raise a loaf of bread - it just needs time - but too much yeast will give you a loaf that crumbles and tastes beery.


----------



## SteveF (12 Mar 2019)

Reynard said:


> Fair enough - I go for the low yeast & long bulk ferment type breads.



That reminds me, I let my sourdough starter go over the winter, will have to prep another soon.


----------



## Reynard (12 Mar 2019)

SteveF said:


> That reminds me, I let my sourdough starter go over the winter, will have to prep another soon.



Might be worth keeping some in the freezer / drying some. Makes it much easier to seed a new culture.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (13 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Thanks, will update tomorrow.
> I suspect I've been leaving it to prove too long and/or knocking back too vigorously.




How'd it go?


----------



## benb (13 Mar 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> How'd it go?


Miles better.
I let it prove for about 30-40 minutes and it seemed ready, as per the finger test. Previously I'd been leaving it for an hour or more.
Then instead of knocking back in the mixer for 30 seconds which I had been doing, I just gently shaped it into a rugby ball and placed into the tin. I didn't squash it in too firmly. Rose much better, and tastes amazing.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (13 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Miles better.
> I let it prove for about 30-40 minutes and it seemed ready, as per the finger test. Previously I'd been leaving it for an hour or more.
> Then instead of knocking back in the mixer for 30 seconds which I had been doing, I just gently shaped it into a rugby ball and placed into the tin. I didn't squash it in too firmly. Rose much better, and tastes amazing.
> 
> ...




Woohoo!

That looks fab.


----------



## SteveF (13 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Miles better.
> I let it prove for about 30-40 minutes and it seemed ready, as per the finger test. Previously I'd been leaving it for an hour or more.
> Then instead of knocking back in the mixer for 30 seconds which I had been doing, I just gently shaped it into a rugby ball and placed into the tin. I didn't squash it in too firmly. Rose much better, and tastes amazing.
> 
> ...


Nice looking loaf that...


----------



## benb (13 Mar 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Woohoo!
> 
> That looks fab.





SteveF said:


> Nice looking loaf that...



Thanks. I didn't bother with a thermometer, nor the dish of water in the oven - just baked it for 30 mins at 200 and it looked fine.
My oven is very consistent, so don't think I need to test the temperature.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (13 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Thanks. I didn't bother with a thermometer, nor the dish of water in the oven - just baked it for 30 mins at 200 and it looked fine.
> My oven is very consistent, so don't think I need to test the temperature.



The thermometer isn't to test the oven temperature but the bread temperature. Some doughs can look like they're ready on the outside but haven't fully baked on the inside, this is where I use the thermometer to check.

Nine times out of ten the bread is done but there's been the odd time where it's needed another five minutes and would have been too doughy had I relied on appearance and not extended the bake.


----------



## Reynard (14 Mar 2019)

Made the banana loaf again. Added a teaspoon of cinnamon and some chopped pecans to the mix. Also lowered the oven temp to 160 (fan) - it did take an hour and 20 to bake this time, but it rose well and didn't burn. Might try this at 170C next time.

That's breakfast sorted for tomorrow at any rate.


----------



## C R (14 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> OK, thanks all.
> 
> Still not 100% sure about how much yeast to use.
> I'm sure that the tin is exactly the same as the sachets. The sachets have 7g in, which is at least 2 teaspoons, probably more like 2½.
> But above someone was only putting in less than 1 teaspoon. I guess that too much is as bad as not enough.


Sorry missed the updates yesterday. I use just under one teaspoon, but let it prove for quite a long time, though not as long as @Reynard, about four hours usually.


----------



## EltonFrog (15 Mar 2019)

I’m in the process of baking a Lemon Drizzle cake. Standby.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (17 Mar 2019)

Ready for the oven. Sausage (vegetarian), potato and lentil pie(s). As usual, it was meant to be one big one but, too much was prepared.

Also going in are some chocolate chip biscuits.


----------



## benb (18 Mar 2019)

I made some double chocolate cookies. Unfortunately they all got eaten before I could take a photo. Sorry.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Mar 2019)

This cheered me up after a down weekend; porage loaf. It's from one of my wife's magazines so if anyone wants the recipe I'll type it up. (By the way it's a no-knead loaf.)


----------



## Reynard (26 Mar 2019)

Please, @glasgowcyclist 

That looks really good


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Mar 2019)

Reynard said:


> Please, @glasgowcyclist
> 
> That looks really good



You'll have to wait until my wife gets home from work as she's tidied the magazine away and I don't know which one it was in (she has dozens of them).


----------



## Reynard (26 Mar 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> You'll have to wait until my wife gets home from work as she's tidied the magazine away and I don't know which one it was in (she has dozens of them).



No worries, there's enough bread here chez Casa Reynard for the moment. I shan't go hungry


----------



## benb (26 Mar 2019)

Looks great. Can you take a pic of the inside please?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Mar 2019)

benb said:


> Looks great. Can you take a pic of the inside please?




Tighter crumb, very soft texture that still springs back when pressed. Great for holding any filling and great toasted (esp with Brussels pate, as I had for lunch).


----------



## Reynard (26 Mar 2019)

A good all-round sandwich loaf.

I prefer a tighter crumb as stuff does have a tendency to fall through the holes otherwise


----------



## benb (26 Mar 2019)

Yum. I'll definitely try that when you dig the recipe out


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Mar 2019)

Reynard said:


> No worries, there's enough bread here chez Casa Reynard for the moment. I shan't go hungry




Thankfully the recipe is from one of her Sainsbury's magazines so I don't have to type it out, just give you the link https://www.sainsburysmagazine.co.uk/recipes/bread/no-knead-porridge-bread

I used less yeast, put 8g of salt into the mixture instead of in the porage, and I used a 350g white and 50g wholemeal mix of flour.


----------



## Reynard (26 Mar 2019)

That's easy enough. I'll definitely have a crack at that. 

It'll probably end up fairly similar to my "sneakily healthy loaf" where I replace part of the flour with porridge oats.


----------



## benb (27 Mar 2019)

Mini cheese and chorizo rolls. 
Orgasmic.


----------



## benb (5 Apr 2019)

Best loaf yet. 
I got a tip from someone to let the dough rise in a cold oven with a mug of just boiled water on the bottom shelf. Since I did that I've had dough that rises much better. It takes on a bit more moisture though, so is stickier than usual when you take it out and shape it for the tin.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (6 Apr 2019)

CarlP said:


> I’m in the process of baking a Lemon Drizzle cake. Standby.



This must be a massive cake.
I've had the kettle on for a fortnight. How much longer?...


----------



## EltonFrog (6 Apr 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> This must be a massive cake.
> I've had the kettle on for a fortnight. How much longer?...


I forgot about that. Soz.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (6 Apr 2019)

CarlP said:


> I forgot about that. Soz.



Was it nice?


----------



## EltonFrog (6 Apr 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Was it nice?


Can’t remember, it didn’t last long so it must’ve been.


----------



## EltonFrog (7 Apr 2019)

Currently baking in the oven is a loaf. It’s slightly experimental ‘cos I only had 300 grams of bread flour, so I made the difference with white self raising flour.


----------



## EltonFrog (7 Apr 2019)

Here’s the result, sunk a little in the middle, but made a nice light loaf with a nice crust and a nutty sort of taste.


----------



## annedonnelly (7 Apr 2019)

This is an English muffin loaf from a recipe on a US website.






It's incredibly soft inside. And a bit too salty I think.


----------



## EltonFrog (7 Apr 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> This is an English muffin loaf from a recipe on a US website.
> 
> View attachment 461349
> 
> ...


Looks nice though.


----------



## annedonnelly (8 Apr 2019)

CarlP said:


> Looks nice though.


Nice toasted which is the point of muffin bread


----------



## Tail End Charlie (8 Apr 2019)

Recently made a cake from a Paul Hollywood book, based on a Polish recipe apparently.
It's a spinach cake topped with pistachio and pomegranate seeds, which sounds disgusting but is delicious.
Firstly the base with the top cut off (you use the top to blitz with the pistachio and then put on the pomegranate)





Then the finished cake





I made as my wife had the local WI committee meeting at our house and was a bit nervous as WIs have the reputation of being top bakers. However they raved about it and seemed to like it as they only left this bit (they also had a lemon polenta cake to scoff).





Apparently at the end of the meeting they were deciding where to hold the next and my wife piped up "we could have it here again"!!!
No!!!!!!


----------



## Reynard (8 Apr 2019)

Tail End Charlie said:


> Recently made a cake from a Paul Hollywood book, based on a Polish recipe apparently.
> It's a spinach cake topped with pistachio and pomegranate seeds, which sounds disgusting but is delicious.



Yeah, Poles do fabby cakes, but that's a new one on me...


----------



## EltonFrog (8 Apr 2019)

Just made some very quick Mary Berry fork biscuits.


----------



## benb (8 Apr 2019)

They look forking tasty


----------



## Tail End Charlie (9 Apr 2019)

Reynard said:


> Yeah, Poles do fabby cakes, but that's a new one on me...


Yeah they do. I think it'd be a great basis for a carrot cake, using carrot instead of spinach obs, and possibly walnuts instead of pistachio.


----------



## Reynard (9 Apr 2019)

Tail End Charlie said:


> Yeah they do. I think it'd be a great basis for a carrot cake, using carrot instead of spinach obs, and possibly walnuts instead of pistachio.



Yeah. Mind, carrot cake is 

Reminds, must dig out my recipe for a babka for Easter... Can't have Easter without one...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (9 Apr 2019)

Bit of a different fruit scone here, made using Bowmore 17 yr old single malt...

If ever you needed smellivision, this is where it would come into its own. 
Lightly smokey, vanilla and toffee scented, they are phenomenal.
Soft and fluffy inside, perfect when still warm, with plenty butter.


----------



## C R (9 Apr 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Bit of a different fruit scone here, made using Bowmore 17 yr old single malt...
> 
> If ever you needed smellivision, this is where it would come into its own.
> Lightly smokey, vanilla and toffee scented, they are phenomenal.
> ...


Oh, come on man, I had promised myself I wasn't going to have any biscuits today! Now I feel hungry.


----------



## LeetleGreyCells (9 Apr 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Bit of a different fruit scone here, made using Bowmore 17 yr old single malt...
> 
> If ever you needed smellivision, this is where it would come into its own.
> Lightly smokey, vanilla and toffee scented, they are phenomenal.
> ...


I've shown my wife the photo. She's asking how you make the scones rise so well, hers never do. Any tips?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (9 Apr 2019)

LeetleGreyCells said:


> I've shown my wife the photo. She's asking how you make the scones rise so well, hers never do. Any tips?



It's my first attempt at scones but I know that many TV bakers say don't twist the cutter when pressing out the shape as this can inhibit the rise. Cut straight down firmly.

I'll add a link to the recipe once I've found it. It's another from my Dan Lepard book 'Short & Sweet'.

Here it is https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2007/nov/24/foodanddrink.baking62


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## Reynard (9 Apr 2019)

Also, don't over-work the dough, and work quickly once you've added the liquid.


----------



## LeetleGreyCells (9 Apr 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> It's my first attempt at scones but I know that many TV bakers say don't twist the cutter when pressing out the shape as this can inhibit the rise. Cut straight down firmly.
> 
> I'll add a link to the recipe once I've found it. It's another from my Dan Lepard book 'Short & Sweet'.
> 
> Here it is https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2007/nov/24/foodanddrink.baking62





Reynard said:


> Also, don't over-work the dough, and work quickly once you've added the liquid.



Thank you to you both. She’s going to have a go as soon as she can. Fingers crossed.


----------



## annedonnelly (10 Apr 2019)

LeetleGreyCells said:


> Thank you to you both. She’s going to have a go as soon as she can. Fingers crossed.


And the dough should be sticky.

I've a Mary Berry recipe that works well for me.

Continuing the scone theme, does anyone have a recipe for scones including oats (not oatmeal)? I found one online and I liked the texture of a resulting scones but they didn't rise and took ages to cook - I suspect that the suggested oven temp was too low. I'll try them again but I'd be interested to see other recipes.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (10 Apr 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> And the dough should be sticky.



The resultant dough in my recipe was smooth and easy to handle, not sticky.
His recipe for everyday scones specifies the dough should be soft and sticky but not the whisky dough.


----------



## Reynard (10 Apr 2019)

I use a two fat ladies recipe. Dough is pretty slack, but not terribly sticky (from memory, it's a while since I made any...)


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## LeetleGreyCells (11 Apr 2019)

So my wife had a go at @glasgowcyclist ’s scone recipe and used the tips you all suggested. Here’s what she came up with:










She was pleased with how they turned out. The scones had risen much more than usual and were very light and fluffy. 

Next time, she's going to do the same recipe, but add 50g of raisins (or whatever it is that goes in scones).

Thanks again for your help!


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## C R (14 Apr 2019)

Today's Yorkshires, I wish I knew how I got them to raise like that.


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## annedonnelly (14 Apr 2019)

I don't like Yorkshires but they are very impressive!


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## C R (15 Apr 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> I don't like Yorkshires but they are very impressive!


Thank you. We are partial to a yorkshire or three in this house, these didn't last very long.


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## C R (15 Apr 2019)

Half term and home with the monkeys today and tomorrow. We cooked empanadas for dinner, mostly daughters one and two's work





Tomorrow we are making rosca da pascua, which is a traditional Galician easter bread, made with eggs and butter, something between hot cross buns and brioche. Will keep you posted.


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## annedonnelly (19 Apr 2019)

Hot cross buns. Though I confess that I let the bread maker do the mixing & proving - I was making fish pies at the same time.






There may have been another bun that didn't survive long enough for the photo shoot


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## Reynard (19 Apr 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> There may have been another bun that didn't survive long enough for the photo shoot



LOL, one has to have quality control after all


----------



## Reynard (19 Apr 2019)

I have a babka drozdzowa about to go into the oven (it's been rising nice and slowly since last night) and there's a three grain bread with caraway seed doing its bulk ferment. I've had to banish the bread dough to the fridge for a bit as it's been rising more quickly than I'd anticipated.

Hopefully I'll have a nice babka and bread for my swieconka for tomorrow.


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## Reynard (20 Apr 2019)

My easter basket (swieconka), which includes a chunk of the three grain bread, plus the babka.







Also included is sausage, cheese, hard boiled eggs, butter, salt and a lamb. Latter is cast in sugar, also made by yours truly. That lot will make a very fine brunch tomorrow... 

Oh, and Happy Easter to all my fellow CC bakers.


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## benb (4 May 2019)

Sundried tomato and parmesan bread. Oh yes.


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## Reynard (4 May 2019)

Reminds, I'd better put on a preferment. Otherwise there might be a distinct lack of bread on Monday...


----------



## alicat (5 May 2019)

Hi @Reynard - I would love to know why you do a preferment?


----------



## EltonFrog (5 May 2019)

What’s a preferment?


----------



## Reynard (5 May 2019)

alicat said:


> Hi @Reynard - I would love to know why you do a preferment?



Just gives more flavour and a nicer texture to the bread. I typically preferment between 20 and 50% of my flour depending on where my mood takes me.


----------



## Reynard (5 May 2019)

CarlP said:


> What’s a preferment?



A certain percentage of your flour, usually with an equal amount in weight of water and a pinch of yeast. Mix together and leave for between 12 to 18 hours prior to making the rest of your dough.


----------



## alicat (5 May 2019)

Thank you for satisfying my curiosity @Reynard.


----------



## CharlesF (11 May 2019)

As someone self-taught, it was an eye-opener to go on the taster course run by the Glasgow Little Sourdough Bakery. It is only a taster of 4 hours with lunch at the end. I was able to ask lots of questions and was put right on a few of my misunderstanding. Although I have a successful starter, I eagerly took home one Vicky got us to prepare with rye flour. Interestingly, she does everything in plastic containers, not bowls. Her tip to wet your hands before handling the dough was, for me, worth the whole course. Besides bread, she is very knowledgeable of foraging, vegan and fermented foods. Well worth it if you're near Glasgow.


----------



## Reynard (11 May 2019)

If you're working with high hydration dough, then keeping your hands and the work surface wet is pretty well much the only way not to have dough sticking to everything.

DAMHIKT


----------



## CharlesF (11 May 2019)

Ah, but for me “ every day is a school day”!

Vicky made sourdough pancakes, that seemed very slapdash in the quantities, but were superb. After heating the coconut butter, she ground sea salt in the pan, resulting in a really tasty pancake that were gobbled down neat. 

Trying that for tomorrow’s breakfast.


----------



## Reynard (11 May 2019)

Sourdough waffles...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 May 2019)

CharlesF said:


> As someone self-taught, it was an eye-opener to go on the taster course run by the Glasgow Little Sourdough Bakery. It is only a taster of 4 hours with lunch at the end. I was able to ask lots of questions and was put right on a few of my misunderstanding. Although I have a successful starter, I eagerly took home one Vicky got us to prepare with rye flour. Interestingly, she does everything in plastic containers, not bowls. Her tip to wet your hands before handling the dough was, for me, worth the whole course. Besides bread, she is very knowledgeable of foraging, vegan and fermented foods. Well worth it if you're near Glasgow.



I've found a rye starter to be more reliable and easier to maintain. 
The wet hands trick is a favourite too because it's so simple and clean.

Thanks for the link to the Little Sourdough Bakery, I'd never heard of it. I've done a sourdough course before but the foraging course looks interesting so I fancy giving that a go.


----------



## C R (20 May 2019)

An accidental sourdough today. I wad meant to make some barbari (Iranian flatbread) on Saturday. Did my usual lazy step of using the bread maker for mixing and raising. It wasn't until I went to get the dough out for the second kneading that I realised I hadn't added any yeast. Rather than wasting the dough, I left it in the tin, and by this afternoon it had risen quite a bit, so started the bake program and this is what came out





I was surprised how well it rose. 

Of course, I should have done two things

* Keep some of the dough as a starter for next time

* Instead of being lazy and just hit bake in the bread maker, I should have taken it out and make a proper "molete" in the oven

Next time.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (3 Jun 2019)

I treated myself to a new baking tool last week; a pullman pan for making pain de mie.

I fancied getting back to nice square(ish) sandwiches and toast so I bought this tin with a lid on. I followed a standard pain de mie recipe but substituted about 90g of the white flour with wholemeal to give me that extra bit of bite that I like.


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## Reynard (3 Jun 2019)

That looks fabby @glasgowcyclist 

Is the bread the size of a typical small sliced loaf?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (3 Jun 2019)

Reynard said:


> That looks fabby @glasgowcyclist
> 
> Is the bread the size of a typical small sliced loaf?




Yes, I'd say so. It's approximately 4.5 inches square and 8 inches long.

The blurb suggests that it's for 450g of dough but I found it needed all of the ~690g that I made from this King Arthur recipe, designed for a tin just 1 inch longer than mine.


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## Reynard (3 Jun 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Yes, I'd say so. It's approximately 4.5 inches square and 8 inches long.
> 
> The blurb suggests that it's for 450g of dough but I found it needed all of the ~690g that I made from this King Arthur recipe, designed for a tin just 1 inch longer than mine.



Thanks for the heads up.

My usual quantity of dough will need to be cut back by about 1/3 then.


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## Dave 123 (3 Jun 2019)

I’ve moved on from pizza dough today


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## Electric_Andy (3 Jun 2019)

I've never really baked before, but I can now make some very good drop scones (or scotch pancakes?).

I used 190g gluten free flour
40 grams sugar
1tsp baking powder
2tsp honey
pinch of salt
some milk

Being gluten-free flour it doesn't thicken up as much as normal flour, so I put in about 30ml less milk than the recipe called for.


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## Dave 123 (13 Jun 2019)

First picture is my brothers sourdough loaf. He gave me some starter at the weekend...













The second is a loaf I made yesterday. I made a bit of a cock up by scoring it, and I forgot the dough was being flipped onto the pizza stone in the oven from the chopping board, so it came out a funny shape.

Rosemary rolls is the next one. She’s a nice girl!


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## benb (13 Jun 2019)

I like the concentric flour rings!


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## Reynard (13 Jun 2019)

benb said:


> I like the concentric flour rings!



That's from the banneton that's used to prove the loaf once it's been shaped.

I bake batards rather than boules, so my loaves have stripes on them


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## Reynard (13 Jun 2019)

Baked a lovely batard as part of a friend's birthday gift (she prefers bread to cake!) to go with the cheese I'd also got her:

600g flour: 350g white, 200g atta (chapatti) and 50g porridge oats
375g tepid water
12g salt
2 tbsp rape seed oil
4g yeast.

Bulk ferment done in fridge overnight.

Sorry, no pics, but I hear it went down rather well.


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## Tail End Charlie (13 Jun 2019)

Electric_Andy said:


> I've never really baked before, but I can now make some very good drop scones (or scotch pancakes?).
> 
> I used 190g gluten free flour
> 40 grams sugar
> ...




A really good drop scone is excellent, far better than normal pancakes IMO. Must try your version with the honey, seems a good idea.


----------



## Electric_Andy (14 Jun 2019)

Tail End Charlie said:


> A really good drop scone is excellent, far better than normal pancakes IMO. Must try your version with the honey, seems a good idea.


Yes, and probably even better with maple syrup if you can afford it!


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## glasgowcyclist (25 Jun 2019)

I had some buttermilk to use up at the weekend so I tried another soda bread, apparently called Limerick soda bread, using fennel seeds and raisins or sultanas. It made a fairly sticky batter and looked nothing like any other dough I've made for soda bread in the past. The resulting bread is not the normal texture either; not quite bread and not quite a cake but enjoyable enough.





For sandwiches I found this recipe, also on King Arthur's Flour, for a classic white. I always add a bit of wholemeal for a coarser texture but since I'd run out of my usual wholemeal, I used dark rye to substitute and it made a fantastic loaf. (The recipe called for 482g of all purpose flour, I switched that to 400g strong white bread flour and 82g dark rye. I might experiment with gradual increases in the rye.)

The dough is very easy to handle using the folding & resting technique and makes a wonderfully soft sandwich with a tasty crust.


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## Dave 123 (4 Jul 2019)

Today’s effort 
Sea salt and rosemary crust


----------



## C R (4 Jul 2019)

Empanadas with daughter 1, she did most of it, I did the washing up.


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## Dave 123 (6 Jul 2019)

My first sourdough. Looks a bit flat...


----------



## C R (6 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> My first sourdough. Looks a bit flat...
> 
> View attachment 474218


It is the taste that matters.


----------



## Bazzer (6 Jul 2019)

This afternoon's effort;





What is left (for the time being) of a spelt loaf. 
I made one for the first time about a month ago. I thought at the time as sandwich bread a bit meh, but had potential with soup. So this afternoon I made mushroom soup (from the BBC web site) a spelt loaf. Terrific combo if you like mushrooms.
In the background is a cheese and onion white loaf made yesterday.


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## Dave 123 (6 Jul 2019)

C R said:


> It is the taste that matters.



Hard and bitter crust....


----------



## EltonFrog (7 Jul 2019)

Not baking but I’m making gooseberry jam. I’ll keep ya posted.


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## C R (7 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Hard and bitter crust....


That may be because of overbaking, sourdough is a bit hit and miss, you just need to keep trying until you find the method that works for you.


----------



## EltonFrog (7 Jul 2019)

...and done


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## Dave 123 (7 Jul 2019)

C R said:


> That may be because of overbaking, sourdough is a bit hit and miss, you just need to keep trying until you find the method that works for you.




I stuck to the instructions, though our oven is good....

I will keep trying!


----------



## C R (7 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> I stuck to the instructions, though our oven is good....
> 
> *I will keep trying*!


That's the spirit!


----------



## Reynard (13 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Hard and bitter crust....



Overproved perhaps? You didn't get much in the way of oven spring.

Sourdough is less predictable than yeast, so the adage "watch the dough, not the clock" is even more relevant.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 Jul 2019)

I haven’t made sourdough for a while now but my wife asked for one. This is a 75%/25% white and dark rye mix with some caraway seeds thrown in, fermented overnight.

It is proper tasty


----------



## Dave 123 (16 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Overproved perhaps? You didn't get much in the way of oven spring.
> 
> Sourdough is less predictable than yeast, so the adage "watch the dough, not the clock" is even more relevant.




Oven spring?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Oven spring?




The oomph that the sudden high temperature gives to the gas production of the yeast.

I bake directly on a stone or in a preheated pot with a lid (Dutch oven) and both are far better than just a thin tray on the oven shelf. You want to replicate, as far as possible, the effect of the real baker's hot oven floor.


----------



## Reynard (16 Jul 2019)

^^^ this.

I also bake in a clay pot (I have one of those oval mason cash ones), but that's in part because I can't steam my oven as there are vents in the door. A pot or cloche keeps the moisture from the dough contained and stops the crust from forming too early, therefore allowing maximum oven spring to take place.

If the crust forms too early, you end up with a burst, misshapen loaf...


----------



## Dave 123 (17 Jul 2019)

@glasgowcyclist and @Reynard 

Every day is a school day! I will now bore everyone with my tales of oven spring!

I do use a pizza stone, and when I did my sourdough I had a tray of water in the oven.

I’m still learning !


----------



## Dave 123 (17 Jul 2019)

And speaking of learning... the first picture is of bread baked by my 17 year old sidekick. This was her second time baking. I just supervised 






The two tin loaves had rosemary stolen from a posh garden in them. We only ate the round one, it was perfect.

The second pic is my first attempt at whole meal. They tasted great 




How can I get more rise?


----------



## oldwheels (17 Jul 2019)

Pouring rain and windy here today so cast about and in my usual slapdash way made a carrot “ thing “ as I got a bag of carrots in Aldi yesterday. No picture as most has been eaten.
Small bowl of SR flour
1 large grated carrot
Handful of mixed fruit
Large spoonful of treacle
Touch of salt and small dessert spoon of caster sugar
Half tsp of ground ginger
Mix the lot with water and then 40 minutes at 200 C


----------



## Reynard (17 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> The second pic is my first attempt at whole meal. They tasted great
> View attachment 475810
> 
> How can I get more rise?



Is that 100% wholemeal?

If so, you won't get a very springy loaf. The bits of bran cut the gluten strands, and shorter strands won't stretch as much.

You're probably better off using a 50-50 mix of wholemeal to white.

Also, bake in a clay pot. They're not that expensive and are a good investment. (See my previous post re oven spring.) Half the bake time in the pot with the lid on, and finish the bake with the lid off.


----------



## Dave 123 (17 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Is that 100% wholemeal?
> 
> If so, you won't get a very springy loaf. The bits of bran cut the gluten strands, and shorter strands won't stretch as much.
> 
> ...



100g white 400 whole meal


----------



## Reynard (17 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> 100g white 400 whole meal



So 80% wholegrain... Still quite high. Try a 50-50 mix and see where it takes you.

Also, what percentage hydration are you using? You may well want to up it some at that level of wholegrain, and that should also give you a bouncier loaf.


----------



## Dave 123 (19 Jul 2019)

So my latest sourdough was more sour than doughy...

I did everything that the recipe said to the letter.

No ride. Slightly bitter crust that was as hard as hell.

Tastes lovely toasted though...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> I did everything that the recipe said to the letter.



Could you post the recipe here? Also, did you bake it on a tray, in a pot etc., how warm is your kitchen (if that's where the proving took place)? Did you make any adjustments in the proving time or in the amount of water used? How active was the starter you used? How long before you used it in the dough had you refreshed it?

My first guess would be the lack of rise suggests it may have been overpoved so that the structure was too weak to support any rise.


----------



## Dave 123 (19 Jul 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Could you post the recipe here? Also, did you bake it on a tray, in a pot etc., how warm is your kitchen (if that's where the proving took place)? Did you make any adjustments in the proving time or in the amount of water used? How active was the starter you used? How long before you used it in the dough had you refreshed it?
> 
> My first guess would be the lack of rise suggests it may have been overpoved so that the structure was too weak to support any rise.





Baked on a pizza stone 
Proving in airing cupboard
Proving and water to recipe
Starter had been fed lots over the week on advice from pastry chef at work


----------



## Reynard (19 Jul 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> My first guess would be the lack of rise suggests it may have been overpoved so that the structure was too weak to support any rise.



Or an underactive starter... A sourdough culture can take up to a month to become reliable.

Could be a combination of both though...


----------



## Reynard (19 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Baked on a pizza stone
> Proving in airing cupboard
> Proving and water to recipe
> Starter had been fed lots over the week on advice from pastry chef at work



Don't use the airing cupboard - it's too warm. Does point to overproving.

Generally, the cooler, the better - and chuck the clock out of the window. The rise of a dough depends on far too many variables for a clock to be a reliable method of determining when your dough is proved just right.


----------



## Dave 123 (19 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Don't use the airing cupboard - it's too warm. Does point to overproving.
> 
> Generally, the cooler, the better - and chuck the clock out of the window. The rise of a dough depends on far too many variables for a clock to be a reliable method of determining when your dough is proved just right.




Ok


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Baked on a pizza stone
> Proving in airing cupboard
> Proving and water to recipe
> Starter had been fed lots over the week on advice from pastry chef at work



First off, as Reynard has already pointed out, an airing cupboard is too warm. I prove mine where I can see it, on the coffee table if I am reading or on the kitchen table if I'm doing other baking stuff. It is never out of my sight and I check it frequently. Unless you're baking to a tight schedule, time is your friend and you want things to be slow -it improves the results.

Proving and hydration to the recipe sounds like the right thing to do but no two kitchens are the same, heck , the recipe might even be from another country with a different climate. If you followed it to the letter then it doesn't work for where you are (assuming you didn't overprove it in the cupboard) so you'll need to make adjustments. 

I feed my starter several hours before I need to use it. Once it's foamed up like a huge aerated marshmallow it's ready. I can tell by looking at it but a good test is take a spoonful of it and place it in a glass of water. It's ready if it floats.

I can't add a lot more, you need to experiment by adjusting one aspect at a time to see what happens. But I recommend you go by look and feel over timings. Your dough should go into the oven while it's still on the rise and feels springy. If you press it with your finger and it doesn't bounce back fairly quickly, you've overpoved it.


----------



## Reynard (20 Jul 2019)

I tend to feed my starter about 12 hours before I make my levain. I rarely use starter direct in a bread unless I have too much of it - I only keep a small quantity going, which means I need to do a build stage before I can make my dough.

I'm a big fan of leaving bread dough in the fridge for the bulk ferment as I know it's not going to run away with me - great for overnight or if I'm too busy during the day to keep checking. Final proof after shaping tends to happen a lot faster than the bulk ferment, so as @glasgowcyclist says, it's better to keep it in sight. And it's always better to err on the side of underproving - rather a burst loaf than a frisbee.

Breadmaking is as much an art as it is a science. You learn by doing, and the more you bake, the better your bread will get. However, there are a lot of different variables, so if you can, only change one at the time.


----------



## Dave 123 (20 Jul 2019)

So much to learn....

Thanks @glasgowcyclist and @Reynard for your time and advice!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (20 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> You learn by doing, and the more you bake, the better your bread will get.



I remember my first sourdough was similar to the one that @Dave 123 produced above only mine was more like a discus. The crust was like thick ceramic so the knife just skated across the top. 

Subsequent loaves were better but still mediocre until one day I made a belter; lovely rise, beautiful colour, fabulous crust etc. 
I was delighted for a split second and then said out loud, "Shįt! What did I do right?"


----------



## Dave 123 (20 Jul 2019)

I’m trying s different recipe and method. This fat little bugger is going in the fridge over night.
I’m excited, but this might be make or break....


----------



## Dave 123 (21 Jul 2019)

Right, it went into the fridge overnight. Came out well.
I wish I’d have put a deeper cut into it.

The recipe said a darker crust equals a better taste, but I think I overdid it a touch.

I’ve not cut into it yet...


----------



## Dave 123 (21 Jul 2019)

Well, I’ve tested it....
Bloody lovely!

Thank you for the tips everybody.


----------



## Reynard (21 Jul 2019)

Looking good @Dave 123  Told you an overnighter in the fridge works a treat. 

Sure, a bit less oven time might work. What are you using to score the dough, btw? Scoring is another thing that comes with practice...


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Looking good @Dave 123  Told you an overnighter in the fridge works a treat.
> 
> Sure, a bit less oven time might work. What are you using to score the dough, btw? Scoring is another thing that comes with practice...




I know how to score.....!

One of those curved razor blade things that have a proper name I can't remember.


----------



## Reynard (22 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> I know how to score.....!
> 
> One of those curved razor blade things that have a proper name I can't remember.



A "lame" IIRC... 

I use a bog standard razor blade out of a packet that I bought for personal use.  Not the same blade I use to shave my legs, might I add... 

A chap on the fresh loaf gave me the best tip, which is to make the first cut vertically, and then make a second cut with the blade almost horizontally to get under the skin of the dough. This gives the dough plenty of expansion in the oven and should, if things are right, give your loaf a nice "ear" on the edge of the score.


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> A "lame" IIRC...
> 
> I use a bog standard razor blade out of a packet that I bought for personal use.  Not the same blade I use to shave my legs, might I add...
> 
> A chap on the fresh loaf gave me the best tip, which is to make the first cut vertically, and then make a second cut with the blade almost horizontally to get under the skin of the dough. This gives the dough plenty of expansion in the oven and should, if things are right, give your loaf a nice "ear" on the edge of the score.




How much jargon did you squeeze in there?


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Jul 2019)

I’ve just had a piece of it toasted, it’s the real deal!
Hope I can make another!


----------



## Reynard (22 Jul 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> How much jargon did you squeeze in there?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 Jul 2019)

Can you spot the deliberate mistake here in this repeat of Mary Berry's lovely banana loaf?






Still a nice flavour but didn't rise as before so was a bit stodgy. Okay with a cup of tea.




Spoiler: answer



I forgot to put the bloody eggs in!


----------



## Reynard (24 Jul 2019)

Oooopsssssss! 

Question though. How the hell did you manage to forget to include one of the main ingredients?!?!?!?!?!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (29 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Oooopsssssss!
> 
> Question though. How the hell did you manage to forget to include one of the main ingredients?!?!?!?!?!




The best excuse I can come up with is that I forgot I was making a non-standard loaf and had everything in it that I needed. Eggs don't feature in any other loaf I make.
The truth is probably that I'm at an age where it's too easy to forget simple stuff.


----------



## C R (29 Jul 2019)

glasgowcyclist said:


> The best excuse I can come up with is that I forgot I was making a non-standard loaf and had everything in it that I needed. Eggs don't feature in any other loaf I make.
> The truth is probably that I'm at an age where it's too easy to forget simple stuff.


Nah, I think you'll find that you were subconsciously experimenting, that's what I tell myself anyway.


----------



## Reynard (29 Jul 2019)

Ah... LOL...

I'm one of these bakers who will read the recipe, weigh out all the ingredients, and then lay them out on the worksurface in the order in which I need to use them. And then read the recipe again, just to make sure.


----------



## C R (29 Jul 2019)

Reynard said:


> Ah... LOL...
> 
> I'm one of these bakers who will read the recipe, weigh out all the ingredients, and then lay them out on the worksurface in the order in which I need to use them. And then read the recipe again, just to make sure.



That's called OCD, I think there are treatments for that .


----------



## Reynard (29 Jul 2019)

C R said:


> That's called OCD, I think there are treatments for that .



It's how my brain works. Ho hum...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (3 Aug 2019)

I’m having a go at using a poolish for the first time. Fingers crossed!
I’ve just put it together and will finish it in the morning.


----------



## Dave 123 (4 Aug 2019)

Yesterday I started a sourdough loaf. That spent the night in the fridge. 
I cooked it when I got up.

I then made an oregano loaf, an onion loaf and a blob loaf.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 Aug 2019)

The poolish method seemed to give me a very wet dough which was almost impossible to shape. After a lot of work it began to come together but when I took it out of the proving basket it just wanted to spread as flat as a pancake again.

@Reynard is this normal? The recipe is here https://www.breadexperience.com/sing-to-me-my-bread-crackle-sweetly/ and uses a 75% hydration level.

Anyway, it wasn't a disaster and rose fairly well when baked. Once it's cool enough I'll cut a slice to try.


----------



## Reynard (4 Aug 2019)

Cripes!  75% hydration is heading towards ciabatta territory - surprised you managed to shape it at all... American recipe though, so you probably do need to tone the hydration down a fair bit.

My basic bread uses a poolish / preferment, and I work typically with hydration mark between 60 and 65%, depending on how much / little wholegrain. I'm not a big fan of big holes in my bread, you see, as stuff falls through the holes. 

I sometimes go up to a 50% quantity of preferment to final dough (end result is truly lovely), but it's so slimy and oozy that it's a pain to mix into the rest of the dough that I tend to go for around 20% preferment, purely for ease-of-use.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 Aug 2019)

Reynard said:


> Cripes!  75% hydration is heading towards ciabatta territory - surprised you managed to shape it at all... American recipe though, so you probably do need to tone the hydration down a fair bit.
> 
> My basic bread uses a poolish / preferment, and I work typically with hydration mark between 60 and 65%, depending on how much / little wholegrain. I'm not a big fan of big holes in my bread, you see, as stuff falls through the holes.
> 
> I sometimes go up to a 50% quantity of preferment to final dough (end result is truly lovely), but it's so slimy and oozy that it's a pain to mix into the rest of the dough that I tend to go for around 20% preferment, purely for ease-of-use.



I knew I should have asked you *before* I started!

I was 45 minutes slapping it around, using Richard Bertinet's method, and a lot of scooping with two dough scrapers. Knackered by the end of that.

The bread tastes fab, particularly the crust which has a nice initial crack to it then beautifully chewy. Reminds me very much of a bread I had in Sorrento a couple of years ago and unsuccessfully tried to replicate. It doesn't have the big holes though.


----------



## Reynard (4 Aug 2019)

That looks good @glasgowcyclist 

Crumb's tighter than I thought it might be to be fair - but then if you spent 45 minutes trying to get the dough to behave... 

Now time to crack open a nice ripe brie, or a pate d'ardennes, methinks...


----------



## Dave 123 (11 Aug 2019)

On the left is a seeded whopper! 12x6 inches 

Top right is onion bread 
Then cinnamon and sultana
Then rosemary bread


----------



## benb (20 Aug 2019)

No idea what the hell happened to mutate this monstrosity. I didn't use any more yeast than normal. Should taste nice though.


----------



## Reynard (21 Aug 2019)

benb said:


> No idea what the hell happened to mutate this monstrosity. I didn't use any more yeast than normal. Should taste nice though.
> View attachment 481034
> View attachment 481035
> View attachment 481036





That's oven spring and a half!

Bigger tin next time, maybe?


----------



## benb (21 Aug 2019)

I can confirm it tasted nice, despite being a genetic abomination


----------



## benb (21 Aug 2019)

I mean look at it, it's insane!


----------



## Reynard (21 Aug 2019)

benb said:


> I mean look at it, it's insane!
> View attachment 481087





_*Definitely*_ a bigger tin next time...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (21 Aug 2019)

Reynard said:


> _*Definitely*_ a bigger tin next time...



TWO tins!


----------



## Proto (25 Aug 2019)

Thoughts on bread makers - Panasonic, Sage etc.?


----------



## annedonnelly (25 Aug 2019)

Proto said:


> Thoughts on bread makers - Panasonic, Sage etc.?


I like my Panasonic - I've used it for years without any problems. Stick to the same couple of recipes mostly & it's not the fancy one that automatically adds extra ingredients part way through the cycle. Sometimes use the timer feature so that I can set it away & have bread ready early in the morning.

Of course, the problem with all breadmakers is that they leave a hole in middle of the loaf where the paddle goes.


----------



## annedonnelly (25 Aug 2019)

I was gifted some marrows and wasn't sure what to do with them. For a random recipe I found on the internet I'm very pleased with this.


----------



## EltonFrog (25 Aug 2019)

I made a pavlova today, the first for about 45 years.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (26 Aug 2019)

Proto said:


> Thoughts on bread makers - Panasonic, Sage etc.?



My Panasonic (I think it’s the SD-255) is excellent and has been very reliable. It has that extra compartment for dropping in seeds or nuts part way through the kneading. It wasn’t cheap though at around £90 when I bought it. 

I can also strongly recommend the Biffinet bread machine that is sometimes available in Lidl. We got one for our daughter and it’s just brilliant, it even makes jam. Not bad for £29.95! It’s also sold in Tesco’s under their own badge. Great workhorse for making bread every week.

While looking for an image of it, it appears to be sold under numerous labels so you ought to find one somewhere.


----------



## C R (17 Sep 2019)

I've been baking barbari for a while, getting close to the real thing, but not quite there. A couple of days ago my mother in law found a couple of videos on youtube, and it turns out I was baking at too low a temperature.

Today followed the video instructions, bake at 250 for around 15 minutes. That's what I was missing. Forgot to take a photo as the bread came out of the oven, this is what was left after 30 minutes.




This is what it should look like




MIL was impressed, so happy with the result.


----------



## annedonnelly (22 Sep 2019)

Has anyone made their own proofing box? I'm thinking of trying an insulated box (or maybe a bag that can be squashed down for storage) with a heat source inside - hot water bottle perhaps. Or would a dish of hot water be better to add some humidity?

Any thoughts please?


----------



## C R (22 Sep 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> Has anyone made their own proofing box? I'm thinking of trying an insulated box (or maybe a bag that can be squashed down for storage) with a heat source inside - hot water bottle perhaps. Or would a dish of hot water be better to add some humidity?
> 
> Any thoughts please?


I use our bread maker in dough mode for that. 

The hot water bottle sounds like a good idea, though the temperature will change as the water cools, and you need to start with the water always at the same temperature to have repeatable results.


----------



## OldShep (22 Sep 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> Has anyone made their own proofing box? I'm thinking of trying an insulated box (or maybe a bag that can be squashed down for storage) with a heat source inside - hot water bottle perhaps. Or would a dish of hot water be better to add some humidity?
> 
> Any thoughts please?


If you’ve not got a warm draught free place maybe you could use the oven?
I use the oven to make yoghurt. Heating it to 100C for 20 minutes then I switch it to light on only and it’s still warm in the morning when I remove the jars.


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Sep 2019)

I made some flat breads yesterday. Flour, natural yogurt and a bit of baking powder. Nice!


----------



## annedonnelly (22 Sep 2019)

OldShep said:


> If you’ve not got a warm draught free place maybe you could use the oven?
> I use the oven to make yoghurt. Heating it to 100C for 20 minutes then I switch it to light on only and it’s still warm in the morning when I remove the jars.



I use a vacuum flask to make yoghurt - put the milk/youghurt mix into the warmed flask & leave for about 24 hours.

I've a gas oven & I wouldn't expect it to stay warm for long. I do sometimes put the bread in the grill part to proof with the oven on below but I'd rather not waste the energy having the oven lit.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 Sep 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> Has anyone made their own proofing box? I'm thinking of trying an insulated box (or maybe a bag that can be squashed down for storage) with a heat source inside - hot water bottle perhaps. Or would a dish of hot water be better to add some humidity?
> 
> Any thoughts please?



What is the reason for the proofing box? I mean, do you have problems with your proofing environment that makes this necessary?

Any draught-free receptacle will do and you want to be careful not to have it too warm. Time is your friend when bread making and the longer the proof the better the loaf. I’m proofing one in my kitchen now, in a 2lb tin with clingfilm over it. My kitchen temp is currently 17C and the loaf will be ready to bake in about 90 minutes. I wouldn’t proof it in a room that was anything over 22C.

Edit to add: It has in fact taken only 60 minutes for my dough to rise and I’ve just put it in the oven now.


----------



## Poacher (22 Sep 2019)

annedonnelly said:


> Has anyone made their own proofing box? I'm thinking of trying an insulated box (or maybe a bag that can be squashed down for storage) with a heat source inside - hot water bottle perhaps. Or would a dish of hot water be better to add some humidity?
> 
> Any thoughts please?





C R said:


> I use our bread maker in dough mode for that.
> 
> The hot water bottle sounds like a good idea, though the temperature will change as the water cools, and you need to start with the water always at the same temperature to have repeatable results.


Sounds like a plan. Maybe a rectangular plastic storage box full of hot water, to ensure your dough doesn't tip to one side?
Here's a bit of lateral thinking, though. How about a thermostatically controlled propagator?
Damned if I'm going out to the greenhouse in the pouring rain to check, but I think mine can be set to anywhere between 5 and 30 c, and seems quite accurate.


----------



## C R (22 Sep 2019)

Poacher said:


> Sounds like a plan. Maybe a rectangular plastic storage box full of hot water, to ensure your dough doesn't tip to one side?
> Here's a bit of lateral thinking, though. How about a thermostatically controlled propagator?
> Damned if I'm going out to the greenhouse in the pouring rain to check, but I think mine can be set to anywhere between 5 and 30 c, and seems quite accurate.


Good idea, the advantage of the bread maker is that it does the mixing and kneading too. Did I mention that I am a lazy so and so?


----------



## Poacher (22 Sep 2019)

C R said:


> Good idea, the advantage of the bread maker is that it does the mixing and kneading too. Did I mention that I am a lazy so and so?


Proud and lazy owner of a Panasonic SD-2511 here, which goes a long way to explaining (but not excusing) my weedy arms! When I use it to produce dough, usually a white French rustic with 90% type 55 and 10% wholemeal, it gets proved on the baking tray in a bin liner in any suitable room - often the greenhouse.


----------



## Reynard (22 Sep 2019)

I just pop the bowl or banneton with the dough inside a large clear plastic food bag and knot the handles.

The bulk ferment and proof are better when carried out if it's cooler. More often than not, I'll do the bulk ferment overnight in the fridge (summer) or in my unheated hallway (winter). A longer process gives you more flavour. And the clear bag lets you keep an eye on the dough without having to open it.


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Sep 2019)

Seeded whole meal and rye loaves


----------



## benb (23 Sep 2019)

My preferred method of proving is to put the dough in a large mixing bowl (mine is already in one as I've used my mixer to knead it) in a cold oven covered with a damp tea towel, along with a mug of just boiled water. This makes the environment nice and humid for proving. 
Leave for roughly 1h30. Knock back if you want, or I just shape it. (pulling it around itself for a nice tight outer layer) 
Then put it into your tin and prove again as above (but uncovered) for about 45m.

The only thing with this method is that as the dough absorbs some steam from the mug you don't need as much water in your initial mix. I now use 550g flour and 300ml of warm water.


----------



## numbnuts (24 Sep 2019)

My beadmakers toast  still it lasted 11 years, new one tomorrow


----------



## annedonnelly (26 Sep 2019)

Thanks for everyone's comments on proving & boxes & temperatures - and sorry for the late reply. Lots of ideas for me to try out when I get time.


----------



## Dave 123 (4 Oct 2019)

I baked this loaf this morning. Whole meal and rye sourdough. The taste is lovely. My best loaf yet!


----------



## C R (4 Oct 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> I baked this loaf this morning. Whole meal and rye sourdough. The taste is lovely. My best loaf yet!
> 
> View attachment 487682


Very nice. You just tempted me to start sour doughing again.


----------



## benb (7 Oct 2019)

That's making me hungry just looking at the photo.


----------



## Dave 123 (16 Oct 2019)

Rosemary and sea salt crust sourdough


----------



## Fiona R (20 Nov 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> Rosemary and sea salt crust sourdough
> 
> View attachment 489272


Is the seasalt and rosemary just on the crust?

Also what ratio flours:water do you use for the wholemeal/rye one? I've only dared do a 20% rye one with a touch extra hydration. My starter has been dormant in the fridge for 3 weeks whilst on holiday, currently having a couple of days being fed before I make my loaves. I need to get away from just white or 20% rye loaves and be a bit more sourdough radical.


----------



## CharlesF (20 Nov 2019)

A surprisingly well formed sour dough loaf from the weekend


----------



## Reynard (20 Nov 2019)

Ooooer, that's a fine "baker's attic" @CharlesF


----------



## Dave 123 (20 Nov 2019)

Cranky Knee Girl said:


> Is the seasalt and rosemary just on the crust?
> 
> Also what ratio flours:water do you use for the wholemeal/rye one? I've only dared do a 20% rye one with a touch extra hydration. My starter has been dormant in the fridge for 3 weeks whilst on holiday, currently having a couple of days being fed before I make my loaves. I need to get away from just white or 20% rye loaves and be a bit more sourdough radical.



the sea salt is just in the crust, rosemary inside and out.

for the sourdough I normally base it on this recipe

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/food/recipes/classic_sourdough_21029/amp
I usually put 50% strong white, 25% whole meal and 25% rye.

I may put about 10% more water than the recipe states.


----------



## Fiona R (20 Nov 2019)

Dave 123 said:


> the sea salt is just in the crust, rosemary inside and out.
> 
> for the sourdough I normally base it on this recipe
> 
> ...


Brilliant, thank you


----------



## Dave 123 (23 Nov 2019)

Roll up, roll up!

50% strong white flour
30% whole meal 
20% spelt

3 sachets of yeast
2tbsp sugar 
1tbsp salt
650ml water

25 minutes at 180°c


----------



## benb (29 Nov 2019)

They look amazing.

Not sure if it counts as baking, but I made a very nice chocolate banoffee pie.
Sorry, we ate it all before I could take a photo.


----------



## Dave 123 (28 Dec 2019)

I was given a baguette tray by Lisa’s parents for Christmas...

sourdough baguettes.....!


----------



## oldwheels (14 Jan 2020)

Somewhere upthread there is a recipe for an All Bran loaf. Which has AB obviously plus mixed fruit,sugar,flour and milk. I can never resist experimenting with variations so instead of milk and sugar I bunged in a tin of condensed milk with water. Result is rather good to taste. I make a couple of small ones and one larger as I sometimes give them away to friends after tasting to make sure they are ok. Trying to stop gaining weight. This one of the smaller ones.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (16 Jan 2020)

Does anyone have a good recipe for malt loaf? As similar as possible as the classic Soreen loaf but without the palm fat.

Any old tried and tested family favourites?


----------



## LeetleGreyCells (16 Jan 2020)

Hugh Manatee said:


> Does anyone have a good recipe for malt loaf? As similar as possible as the classic Soreen loaf but without the palm fat.
> 
> Any old tried and tested family favourites?


I'd be interested in this too.


----------



## Dave 123 (18 Jan 2020)

The immature 50 year old using left over dough...


----------



## Dave 123 (18 Jan 2020)

My cottage loaf looks like a baboons bum...
Or even the end of a todger!


----------



## Reynard (21 Jan 2020)

*SNORK* @Dave 123


----------



## Dave 123 (2 Feb 2020)

I made some sourdough yesterday. It went in the fridge over night In a well floured banneton.

When I tried to get it onto the pizza stone it was super sticky, stuck in the banneton. With a molten stone and a gooey, gluey dough I got a bit flustered! 

Anyway, here’s the result. Just had it with Camembert, tastes amazing!


----------



## Reynard (2 Feb 2020)

Maybe do the bulk ferment overnight instead? Then the proof at room temp. Less chance of sticky dough getting stuck. 

DAMHIKT...


----------



## CharlesF (2 Feb 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> I made some sourdough yesterday. It went in the fridge over night In a well floured banneton.
> 
> When I tried to get it onto the pizza stone it was super sticky, stuck in the banneton. With a molten stone and a gooey, gluey dough I got a bit flustered!
> 
> ...


I can taste that from here, looks perfect. Toast and marmalade from breakfast.


----------



## Dave 123 (9 Feb 2020)

Last Sunday I made my own rye sourdough starter ...










Last night I made my first batch of dough.
This morning I made this...






Hopefully it tastes good!


----------



## Dave 123 (9 Feb 2020)

You can tell it’s not cycling weather today... even Cleo is inside helping...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (9 Feb 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> You can tell it’s not cycling weather today... even Cleo is inside helping...
> 
> View attachment 503849



When did you open a shop?!


----------



## Houthakker (9 Feb 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Last Sunday I made my own rye sourdough starter ...
> 
> View attachment 503837
> 
> ...


Certainly looks good!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (9 Feb 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> You can tell it’s not cycling weather today... even Cleo is inside helping...
> 
> View attachment 503849


What recipe are you using for those rolls?


----------



## oldwheels (9 Feb 2020)

Given the weather I spent some time doing a kind of ciabatta. Whole jar of sliced olives with a generous dollop of extra virgin olive oil in SR flour with some salt and a touch of sugar. Don’t ask about exact quantities as my cooking and baking is a bit spontaneous . About an hour at 170 in my oven. Tastes good anyhow. I have lots of EV olive oil as I get given it as presents from relatives returning from holiday.


----------



## Dave 123 (9 Feb 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> What recipe are you using for those rolls?



700g white flour 
300g wholemeal spelt
650ml water
2tbsp sugar
1tbsp salt
25g yeast

180°c for 25 minutes


----------



## C R (13 Feb 2020)

Have decided to try sourdough from scratch again. Made a starter at the weekend, part wheat, part rye, which got going quite easily, and by Tuesday was already bubbling quite happily. Split the starter in two, fed both halves and put one in the fridge to keep.

I let the other half get going and then used it to prepare a dough with wholemeal rye, and brown and white wheat. I also added a handful of seeds. The dough raised nicely during the day and then went into the fridge.

This morning I took the dough out, waited for it to get to room temperature, knocked it back and prepared two small loaves which proved for about six hours. Then into the oven, and this was the result:









The crumb is a bit irregular, because the dough wasn't very easy to work with, so the knocking back was not efficient. I think I didn't add enough water.

The bread is a bit stodgy, but the aroma and taste are all there, so at least the starter is good and the timing more or less right, though perhaps next time I'll take the dough out of the fridge the night before.

Happy with the experiment.


----------



## SteveF (22 Feb 2020)

Some wonky baguettes....


----------



## C R (22 Feb 2020)

SteveF said:


> Some wonky baguettes....
> 
> View attachment 505591


As long as they don't taste wonky, who cares what they look like?


----------



## Kryton521 (28 Feb 2020)

wormo said:


> When I use spelt or rye flour, no matter what, I find that the loaves tend to be heavy. Is this normal? Do you add white flour?


Yes, perfectly. Also they tend to fall to pieces due to lack of gluten. You can add say 150 gms white to the mix which lighten, very slightly, but also add a little stickiness.


----------



## Kryton521 (28 Feb 2020)

spelt and rye flour bread is a bit ryvita like but is super tasty with poached or scrambled egg.


----------



## oldwheels (28 Feb 2020)

Rotten day again so did some playing around with 4 bananas, 150 grams mixed fruit,400 grams porridge oats with a couple of handfuls blitzed in the Magic Bullet. Mashed the bananas with touch of salt and a couple of dessert spoons of Demerara sugar and some creme fraiche to moisten a bit. Bunged everything else in and mixed by hand but had to add a bit more porridge oats to get a reasonable consistency. Put some in a small baking tray divided with a wet knife and the rest into balls squashed flatish. 20 minutes at 220F to finish. Not many left now.


----------



## Dave 123 (6 Mar 2020)

Off work yesterday after a nasty tooth extraction. I took my time in the kitchen making some rolls, baguettes, a sea salt and rosemary twist, some flapjack and a sourdough loaf 





















Rice flour on the sourdough, ground up myself. Great for a sticky sourdough!


----------



## Dave 123 (6 Mar 2020)

Not baking, but a good accompaniment to my bread, this morning I have made chilli jam and chicken, bacon and mushroom pate. Very nice too!


----------



## CharlesF (6 Mar 2020)

@Dave 123 Flappies look the best, care to share the recipe?


----------



## Dave 123 (6 Mar 2020)

CharlesF said:


> @Dave 123 Flappies look the best, care to share the recipe?



oats
butter
sugar
a pinch of cinnamon 
lemon zest

can’t recall the quantities......


----------



## DCBassman (9 Mar 2020)

My first successful hand made loaf. Used Wessex Mills French bread flour and recipe from the Tesco website. Lovely! Home made soup too.


----------



## figbat (9 Mar 2020)

I use a lot of Wessex Mill flour, including the French, 00, strong white, rye and the fabulous Wessex cobber mix. The mill is just up the road and the wheats are grown in the fields I ride and drive past.


----------



## DCBassman (10 Mar 2020)

figbat said:


> I use a lot of Wessex Mill flour, including the French, 00, strong white, rye and the fabulous Wessex cobber mix. The mill is just up the road and the wheats are grown in the fields I ride and drive past.


Bought a couple of packs in Shoreham a while back. The other one is 3 seed, if I remember correctly. Used to make bread all the time using a machine, either hand-measured or packet. My only other "freehand" attempt produced a very heavy but tasty biscuit...


----------



## C R (10 Mar 2020)

DCBassman said:


> Bought a couple of packs in Shoreham a while back. The other one is 3 seed, if I remember correctly. Used to make bread all the time using a machine, either hand-measured or packet. My only other "freehand" attempt produced a very heavy but tasty biscuit...


I use a machine for mixing and kneading, as I am not very good at kneading. I then bake in the oven, though.

BTW, any of you guys stockpiling flour? When I went to get some from Tesco yesterday, they were out of their own brand stuff. They had an offer on the 3kg allinson strong flour, which is what I use, but only one bag left.


----------



## DCBassman (10 Mar 2020)

C R said:


> I use a machine for mixing and kneading, as I am not very good at kneading. I then bake in the oven, though.


We have an ancient Kenwood A901, am trying to source a dough hook without it costing an arm and a leg. That will certainly increase productivity somewhat!


----------



## Reynard (10 Mar 2020)

I don't knead, I fold in the bowl. A damn sight less messy, and produces a good result.

Got lucky on yellow sticker with flour recently, so I'm good. Have 10 kg of Atta (80% extraction), 6kg of Allinsons's white, plus assorted rye and spelt.


----------



## figbat (11 Mar 2020)

I used to knead by hand and still will if I have the time and inclination. Otherwise I use a dough hook in my stand mixer. I also always use this for very wet doughs (I have done this by hand but it’s very messy).

I keep meaning to have a go at the ‘no-knead’ technique I first saw on a Paul Hollywood programme.


----------



## numbnuts (11 Mar 2020)

C R said:


> BTW, any of you guys stockpiling flour? When I went to get some from Tesco yesterday, they were out of their own brand stuff. They had an offer on the 3kg allinson strong flour, which is what I use, but only one bag left.


My local Sainsbury and Asda were sold out of all bread flour, so I went down the expensive route and bought it on line £23 for 10kg from Wessex Mills


----------



## C R (11 Mar 2020)

numbnuts said:


> My local Sainsbury and Asda were sold out of all bread flour, so I went down the expensive route and bought it on line £23 for 10kg from Wessex Mills


How well does it keep? Ten kilos would last me quite some time.


----------



## numbnuts (11 Mar 2020)

C R said:


> How well does it keep? Ten kilos would last me quite some time.


Shelf life is one year, but I make a loaf every 5 days


----------



## DCBassman (12 Mar 2020)

2nd attempt. Thinking it's still a bit small and dense, although better than the first. Time to try a different recipe? Will also go back to hands, the dough hook left too many voids.


----------



## figbat (12 Mar 2020)

What is your proving strategy?


----------



## DCBassman (12 Mar 2020)

Knead 10 minutes, prove 2 hours, knead 2 minutes, prove another hour.


----------



## Reynard (12 Mar 2020)

DCBassman said:


> Knead 10 minutes, prove 2 hours, knead 2 minutes, prove another hour.



Watch the dough, not the clock... 

For bulk ferment, leave till doubled in volume. For final proof, go 1 1/2 times the volume - better a burst loaf than a frisbee.

BTW, how much yeast and flour are you using, and what's the hydration?


----------



## DCBassman (12 Mar 2020)

Reynard said:


> Watch the dough, not the clock...
> 
> For bulk ferment, leave till doubled in volume. For final proof, go 1 1/2 times the volume - better a burst loaf than a frisbee.
> 
> BTW, how much yeast and flour are you using, and what's the hydration?



This recipe. Definitely going to try others after this though.


----------



## figbat (12 Mar 2020)

DCBassman said:


> This recipe. Definitely going to try others after this though.


That‘s a pretty solid, standard recipe - I use pretty much the same measures for a basic white loaf. But the proving I do by what happens - this can depend on the ambient temperature, the temperature of the ingredients and so on (I tend to use a slightly warmed water for example). I also use a steam bath in the oven for extra crustiness.

You can prove in the fridge - an overnight prove will develop more of the yeasty flavours. If I’m in a hurry I’ll force prove in an oven set just above ambient but given time I leave it on the kitchen side and just keep an eye on it.

Tip: disposable shower caps make excellent covers for proving in a bowl or tin. I always take any from hotel rooms I stay in.


----------



## Reynard (12 Mar 2020)

Yup, as @figbat says, that's a pretty bog-standard 60% hydration loaf, nothing intrinsically wrong with it.

I'd just chuck the timings out of the window for the bulk ferment and the proof and simply do it by eye. Watch the dough, not the clock.


----------



## DCBassman (13 Mar 2020)

Did it a bit more by eye the second time, better result for sure. Haven't got a gram scale here though, so essentially guestimating yeast, never a good idea. Back at home, there's more precision to be had, but a flakier oven...


----------



## figbat (13 Mar 2020)

I use a level teaspoon measure of dried yeast.


----------



## annedonnelly (13 Mar 2020)

figbat said:


> Tip: disposable shower caps make excellent covers for proving in a bowl or tin. I always take any from hotel rooms I stay in.



Oooh, that's a good idea.


----------



## annedonnelly (13 Mar 2020)

Just found this pic on my phone. Goosnargh cakes from a couple of weeks ago. More biscuit than cake really.


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## Reynard (13 Mar 2020)

DCBassman said:


> Did it a bit more by eye the second time, better result for sure. Haven't got a gram scale here though, so essentially guestimating yeast, never a good idea. Back at home, there's more precision to be had, but a flakier oven...



Yeast quantity really doesn't matter in the long run - as long as you don't put too much in and just watch the dough. If that happens, then you'll have a crumbly loaf that tastes beery. You can make a really good loaf with a gramme of yeast or less if you have the time to let it do the bulk ferment.

Flaky oven is easy to get round - bake your loaf in a clay pot. 

P.S. If you're struggling to judge dough volume by eye, here's an easy tip or two. Find a small, straight-sided glass. Put a pinch of dough inside it and mark the volume. Then mark double to volume, and use that as a control for your main dough. Else find a large, straight sided clear container and do the same for the whole batch of dough.


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## Dave7 (18 Mar 2020)

Is it worth making my own pizza bases (and other questions).
I have breadmaker and tbh only use it for bread (mainly wholemeal) and it makes a nice loaf.
Thinking now of trying pizzas. But as I can but a basic pizza for £1.00 and add my own ingredients I need convincing that it worth the effort.
Also.......do I part bake the bases, let them cool and freeze (as when I normally buy them).....then add toppings and heat in oven as and when required.
Any other thoughts welcome.
Thanks.


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## C R (18 Mar 2020)

Dave7 said:


> Is it worth making my own pizza bases (and other questions).
> I have breadmaker and tbh only use it for bread (mainly wholemeal) and it makes a nice loaf.
> Thinking now of trying pizzas. But as I can but a basic pizza for £1.00 and add my own ingredients I need convincing that it worth the effort.
> Also.......do I part bake the bases, let them cool and freeze (as when I normally buy them).....then add toppings and heat in oven as and when required.
> ...


Bases made from your own dough are much nicer than the ones you get from the shop. Partially cooking them sounds like a good idea.


----------



## LeetleGreyCells (18 Mar 2020)

Dave7 said:


> Is it worth making my own pizza bases (and other questions).
> I have breadmaker and tbh only use it for bread (mainly wholemeal) and it makes a nice loaf.
> Thinking now of trying pizzas. But as I can but a basic pizza for £1.00 and add my own ingredients I need convincing that it worth the effort.
> Also.......do I part bake the bases, let them cool and freeze (as when I normally buy them).....then add toppings and heat in oven as and when required.
> ...


Try it and find out. You can always go back to buying the pre-baked bases.


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## C R (19 Mar 2020)

Daughter 1 and son made this as part of their stay home activities






To go with the soup daughter 2 and I are making.


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## Hugh Manatee (20 Mar 2020)

Anyone tried slow cooker bread? We have failed to buy bread on the last four attempts. I am off later to buy a sack of chipatti flour. If worst comes to worst, we will have a supply of flat breads!

I wondered about mixing some of my dwindling supply of strong flour to the above, kneading it and seeing how it goes! Rather than use the recently repaired (by me!) fan oven, I have a large slow cooker and want to try it.

Online suggests it is possible. Anyone tried?


----------



## Hugh Manatee (20 Mar 2020)

Following on from the previous post, I indeed tried a couple shops for chapatti flour (Atta) and it had all gone. Eventually at another shop I frequent (spices etc) I was able to buy 10kg of slightly out of date stuff. I going to mix some up tonight and give it overnight to prove. It might end up a sticky mess but worth a try.


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## Reynard (20 Mar 2020)

Atta flour is just ordinary 80% extraction brown flour. I use it cut with white flour to make bread.


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## figbat (20 Mar 2020)

I have to say I am saving my flour stocks for if/when we can't get baked goods. Ordinarily I'd like to make some buns or loaves or pies just because it's nice to have a go and see how they turn out, but now I am treating the flour like a lifeline and will only use it when it is needed, rather than wanted.


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## Hugh Manatee (20 Mar 2020)

figbat said:


> I have to say I am saving my flour stocks for if/when we can't get baked goods. Ordinarily I'd like to make some buns or loaves or pies just because it's nice to have a go and see how they turn out, but now I am treating the flour like a lifeline and will only use it when it is needed, rather than wanted.



That's a good point well put! That moment has happened here. I'm sure we will end up eating a lot less bread which for me, is no bad thing. We have plenty of other stuff in as I always cook for basic ingredients.


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## Reynard (20 Mar 2020)

Mmmm, remember that flour can be bulked out with oats and potatoes to make it go further.


----------



## figbat (20 Mar 2020)

I also have pasta in mind, should the need arise.

Also, you can cut flour with cocoa powder.


----------



## Reynard (21 Mar 2020)

figbat said:


> Also, you can cut flour with cocoa powder.



That is, assuming you have the butter, eggs and milk that particular concoction also requires...


----------



## CharlesF (21 Mar 2020)

A question for the expert bakers (you know who you are!)

In the last few weeks, my sour dough bread has been very sticky after the second rise, this makes it almost impossible to shape and to get a nice taut skin and the loaf is spreading.

Now I haven't changed anything, quantities, type of flour, timing, etc as I had got to the stage where each loaf was perfect and well shaped.

There's no change to the taste, so what causes the stickiness? And more importantly, how to overcome it.


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## Reynard (21 Mar 2020)

Could be purely down to atmospheric conditions. It has been very wet of late, and humidity does have a bearing on how the dough behaves. I'd suggest cutting back on your hydration slightly and see what difference that makes - you don't say what your hydration is, but ideally you want to be between 60 and 65 % of water to quantity of flour, depending on what flour you're using. Wholemeal needs slightly more water than white for the same consistency of dough.

Also, timings... Your dough could be somewhat overproved if you're ending up with a frisbee. As I keep saying, watch the dough, not the clock.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (21 Mar 2020)

It didn't turn out too badly at all!








That's around 25:75% strong white to chapatti (Atta) flour. I went for a small loaf to test the theory and now feel happy to go for a full size version next time.

Mrs Manatee, (who unlike me, does the social media thing) read on there that the local artisan bakery (part of a cafe) are going to sell flour and supply sour dough starters. Result.


----------



## figbat (21 Mar 2020)

I was considering getting a sourdough starter going again, but they do like to munch through the flour just to keep them alive. I’ve decided in these austere times to stick to dried yeast for now.


----------



## neil_merseyside (21 Mar 2020)

figbat said:


> I was considering getting a sourdough starter going again, but they do like to munch through the flour just to keep them alive. I’ve decided in these austere times to stick to dried yeast for now.


I know some people feed ~ half kilo before bake, with massive feedings but when I tried it I found no difference to my current regime:- starter comes out of fridge and gets 15g of flour and water, probably 4 times before use, in any case a starter can just have a small feed to tick over in the fridge, and then be fed any amount before use. I've never understood the benefit of 50% discard/feed huge amounts (then rinse and repeat 'x' times).


----------



## glasgowcyclist (21 Mar 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> I know some people feed ~ half kilo before bake, with massive feedings but when I tried it I found no difference to my current regime:- starter comes out of fridge and gets 15g of flour and water, probably 4 times before use, in any case a starter can just have a small feed to tick over in the fridge, and then be fed any amount before use. I've never understood the benefit of 50% discard/feed huge amounts (then rinse and repeat 'x' times).



That’s what I do. I’ve never seen the point of wasting lots of flour when all you need to do is keep the process barely ticking along between bakes. Even then I measure out what I need for my production starter plus 10g as a leftover to maintain.


----------



## Reynard (21 Mar 2020)

Although the excess "feed" does make the most excellent waffles 

But I'm sticking to yeasted bread and soda bread for now.


----------



## CharlesF (21 Mar 2020)

Reynard said:


> Could be purely down to atmospheric conditions. It has been very wet of late, and humidity does have a bearing on how the dough behaves. I'd suggest cutting back on your hydration slightly and see what difference that makes - you don't say what your hydration is, but ideally you want to be between 60 and 65 % of water to quantity of flour, depending on what flour you're using. Wholemeal needs slightly more water than white for the same consistency of dough.
> 
> Also, timings... Your dough could be somewhat overproved if you're ending up with a frisbee. As I keep saying, watch the dough, not the clock.


Thanks, my hydration is usually 60% and I still get a great loaf, just not shaped properly as the dough sticks to my fingers when shaping.

I will slightly reduce the water and see. I find it strange that after the kneading stage the dough is silky smooth and non stick. Only after a night in the fridge, covered, does it turn sticky.


----------



## Reynard (21 Mar 2020)

CharlesF said:


> Thanks, my hydration is usually 60% and I still get a great loaf, just not shaped properly as the dough sticks to my fingers when shaping.
> 
> I will slightly reduce the water and see. I find it strange that after the kneading stage the dough is silky smooth and non stick. Only after a night in the fridge, covered, does it turn sticky.



Mmmm, sounds more like overproving. Reducing the amount of culture should slow the process down.

At 60% hydration, your dough shouldn't be sticky at all. Although if you're struggling to shape etc, try using water on your work surface rather than flour.


----------



## figbat (21 Mar 2020)

Or oil. You can lightly oil your hands before handling the dough too.


----------



## CharlesF (21 Mar 2020)

I learnt early on not use use flour on the work surface, caused a very heavy loaf.

I will reduce the first prove now I’m home all day, that is easier. I’ll report back later in the week.

ThankS for the help!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 Mar 2020)

Hugh Manatee said:


> Anyone tried slow cooker bread? We have failed to buy bread on the last four attempts. I am off later to buy a sack of chipatti flour. If worst comes to worst, we will have a supply of flat breads!
> 
> I wondered about mixing some of my dwindling supply of strong flour to the above, kneading it and seeing how it goes! Rather than use the recently repaired (by me!) fan oven, I have a large slow cooker and want to try it.
> 
> Online suggests it is possible. Anyone tried?



I haven't tried it myself but if Jack Monroe says so, it's doable. 

https://cookingonabootstrap.com/2019/01/11/slow-cooker-bread-recipe/


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## C R (23 Mar 2020)

I made empanadas for dinner




daughters made apple pie


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## oldwheels (23 Mar 2020)

For bread I use 30% or thereabouts of fine or medium oatmeal with normal bread flour which makes a slightly more solid loaf but I think improves the texture and is easier to slice. I have tried porridge oats but they inhibit the rise a bit tho’ the end result tastes ok. I may try blitzing some porridge oats to see if that makes a difference. I cannot get oatmeal now anyway unless mail order perhaps as with the lockdown I cannot go to Oban. Somebody in Manchester has decreed that in Scotland we do not need oatmeal and the local Coop cannot stock it as it is not on their list.


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## Reynard (23 Mar 2020)

I've been baking bread for a friend who couldn't get any in the shops. And will be doing a loaf for me tomorrow.

Am just sticking to basic "bread-in-a-hurry" for now as it's idiot proof. No fiddling around with unnecessary ingredients and steps etc, as I really don't want any booboos. Or frisbees...


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## oldwheels (25 Mar 2020)

Since I cannot get oatmeal and have limited porridge oats which I like to use in my bread I fancy trying something different. I have some Allbran which I use in a recipe I got on this thread so I will crush some of it and see how that goes. I also found some weetabix type things in the cupboard. Clearing out stuff not likely to be used anyway so it could start a trend.


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## glasgowcyclist (25 Mar 2020)

Had a go at a classic ciabatta recipe today and looking forward to eating the result...


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## glasgowcyclist (25 Mar 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Had a go at a classic ciabatta recipe today and looking forward to eating the result...




I don't want to blow my own trumpet but the bread is fab. It's soft, airy and light. I'll be making this again!
(A Gino d'Acampo recipe)


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## Reynard (25 Mar 2020)

Made a banging soda bread. So much nicer than bought.

Substituted wholemeal flour for atta flour and milk for buttermilk.


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## jayonabike (28 Mar 2020)

White loaf just out of the oven


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## vickster (29 Mar 2020)

Now I don’t usually bake but I had overripe bananas and managed to find eggs yesterday
So made...


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## Donger (29 Mar 2020)

We gave up when my wife produced a tomato flavoured meteorite that even a 2.5lb lump hammer couldn't crack open.


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## glasgowcyclist (29 Mar 2020)

Donger said:


> We gave up when my wife produced a tomato flavoured meteorite that even a 2.5lb lump hammer couldn't crack open.



So that’s your wife, what’s your excuse?


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## glasgowcyclist (29 Mar 2020)

Some sourdough pancakes made from leftover starter...


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## Reynard (29 Mar 2020)

Made what is now my usual idiot-proof "bread-in-a-hurry" yesterday. Turned out very nicely, I must say. Can't recommend atta flour highly enough.

Admittedly it's not got as much flavour as a loaf that takes a day and a half longer to prepare and bake, but right now, with flour on the shelves as rare as unicorn farts, I really don't want to be making any mistakes...


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## DCBassman (2 Apr 2020)

Donger said:


> We gave up when my wife produced a tomato flavoured meteorite that even a 2.5lb lump hammer couldn't crack open.


Been there, done that...
More than once!


----------



## oldwheels (4 Apr 2020)

I like to make my own oatcakes but since the local coop refuses to stock oatmeal and I cannot get to Oban I as usual experimented. I may sometimes be able to get porridge oats so used 70% porridge oats,20% fine oatmeal and 10% plain flour. Added a tablespoon of bog standard cooking oil with a touch of salt and sugar and made into a thick dough with water. Left this for an hour or thereabouts and made into a ball with my hands using water as lubricant before flattening out with my palm using water on a non stick surface. Purists would use a rolling pin. This was then transferred to a griddle and cooked on a highish heat till they looked ready. [in Scotland I have always heard this referred to as a girdle] Turn over of course when one side is done. Water is used rather than oatmeal when flattening and also to get a lifter under to transfer to the griddle to conserve oatmeal but it probably works better with less mess. Tastes good.


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## Dave 123 (4 Apr 2020)

Not baking... but today I’ve foraged in the woods. This afternoon I made wild garlic pesto. Tastes great, and a beautiful colour!


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Apr 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Not baking... but today I’ve foraged in the woods. This afternoon I made wild garlic pesto. Tastes great, and a beautiful colour!
> 
> View attachment 512595
> 
> ...


Jack by the Hedge?


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## Dave 123 (4 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Jack by the Hedge?



No, I came home and did it in the bathroom....

Ramsons, wild garlic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allium_ursinum


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## DCBassman (5 Apr 2020)

Latest effort, getting better!
This was a mix of flours (convenience, not experiment as such), French bread and strong white. Using Allinson's Easy bake yeast with just one knead and prove.
Practice makes perfect!


----------



## DCBassman (5 Apr 2020)

Aaaand....
I found this forgotten Christmas present!





Will give that a bash - when I can get some beer!


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## Dave 123 (5 Apr 2020)

Today I made sourdough crackers 







wonderful!


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Apr 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Today I made sourdough crackers
> 
> View attachment 512853
> 
> ...



Lovely!

What's the recipe?


----------



## Dave 123 (5 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Lovely!
> 
> What's the recipe?








I used wholemeal spelt as that’s all I have at present.
The cooking time was about 11/12 minutes.


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## glasgowcyclist (11 Apr 2020)

After having to ditch my starter a week ago and begin all over again I thought I'd do an overnight sourdough. I know this to be quite a wet dough so I floured the top of it and the tea-towel heavily to prevent it from sticking.

It stuck.






By the time I had carefully teased the cloth away from the dough, it had spread out like a pancake and looked like a total dough-saster. I'd come this far, the oven and pot were piping hot and I hate waste so I baked it anyway. What's the worst that could happen?

40 minutes later I had this tangy loaf 👇







So, never give up! You can nearly always eat the result, even if you only make it into croutons or whizz it up for breadcrumbs.


----------



## C R (11 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> After having to ditch my starter a week ago and begin all over again I thought I'd do an overnight sourdough. I know this to be quite a wet dough so I floured the top of it and the tea-towel heavily to prevent it from sticking.
> 
> It stuck.
> 
> ...


Do you have a recipe for that? I've given up on keeping a starter, as I seem to be the only one that eats sourdough in our house, so not worth the effort, but something that doesn't require keeping a starter would be great.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Apr 2020)

C R said:


> Do you have a recipe for that? I've given up on keeping a starter, as I seem to be the only one that eats sourdough in our house, so not worth the effort, but something that doesn't require keeping a starter would be great.



It still needs a starter. My previous one failed on me so a week ago I started a new one and it only became active enough yesterday. Sorry if that wasn’t clear in my previous post.

The recipe I use is from Shipton Mill’s site and is called Tom’s overnight no-knead sourdough.

If you keep your starter in the fridge it is much easier to maintain and you can keep it very small until the day before you need to use it, at which point you remove it, feed it so it is 10g over the amount you need for your recipe and use it once it’s fully active. The remaining 10g can go back in the fridge until you want another loaf.

(Edited to remove duplicate word)


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## Houthakker (11 Apr 2020)

Just made an Italian Easter bread from a recipie e-mailed to me from Fillipe Berrio, the olive oil people.
Lots of cheese, Parmesan as well as Pecorino and enriched with eggs and olive oil. 
Was quite a sticky mix, my word its moreish!!
Not much left to photgraph I'm afraid.......


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Apr 2020)

Houthakker said:


> Just made an Italian Easter bread from a recipie e-mailed to me from Fillipe Berrio



Can you share the recipe?


----------



## Dave 123 (11 Apr 2020)

After 3 weeks of miscommunication with Shipton Mill I finally got my hands on my 16kg of strong white Canadian flour....!






and some mackerel pate to go with it....


----------



## glasgowcyclist (11 Apr 2020)

Forgot to mention that I made a nice wee bit of ricotta cheese too. Yum


----------



## Houthakker (11 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Can you share the recipe?


But of course. I didn't have any young pecorino so substitued mature cheddar instead. Probably not in keeping with the Italian theme, but hey, needs must....

*Crescia di Formaggio – Easter Bread *
Resembling a savoury panettone, Crescia Easter Bread takes various forms depending on the area from which it hails, be that Le Marche, Umbria and even Tuscany. It can be cooked in a terracotta flowerpot or made as flat discs and enjoyed, topped with prosciutto.
But one signature ingredient is always present - every Crescia contains cheese, either Parmesan, pecorino or both. This traditional recipe comes from "The Italian Cookery Course" book by Katie and Giancarlo Caldesi.
Makes 16 in dariole moulds, flowerpots or brioche tins, or 4 loaves in charlotte tins.




*Ingredients:*
•500 to 550g strong plain flour or '00' flour•150g freshly grated pecorino•100g freshly grated Parmesan•10g salt•5g black pepper•100ml olive oil•100ml warm water•50g fresh yeast•5 eggs, beaten•150g young pecorino, cubed



1.Put 500g flour, the grated cheeses and salt and pepper into a large bowl. Add the oil and water to the yeast and mix until creamed then add this to the flour, followed by the beaten eggs.2.Bring the mixture to a dough and, if necessary, add a little more flour (this will depend on the size of your eggs). Turn out onto a lightly floured surface and knead by hand for 10 minutes. Leave the dough in a warm place to rise until doubled in size (this may take up to 1 hour).3.Preheat the oven to 160°C/325°F/Gas Mark 3. Knock back the dough and cut into 4 pieces. Fold one quarter of the cubed pecorino into each piece, allowing the cheese to poke out slightly.4.Divide one piece in half and pull each half into equal lengths. Plait the two lengths together with the end of the plait slightly folded over, facing upwards, and put into the well-buttered tins or moulds. Repeat with the remaining three pieces of dough.5.Cover with a dry clean tea towel and leave to prove until doubled in size. Bake in the oven for 35-40 minutes, the rolls for 20 minutes. Once baked pop the loaves out. Unmould and cool on a rack.


----------



## C R (11 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Forgot to mention that I made a nice wee bit of ricotta cheese too. Yum
> View attachment 514313


Oooh. One thing we've been talking about with the children was making some cheese. I have fond memories of having curds on fresh bread when my mum made cheese.

Do you use rennet or vinegar to get started? I was planning to use vinegar, as I don't know where to get the rennet from.


----------



## Tail End Charlie (12 Apr 2020)

C R said:


> Do you have a recipe for that? I've given up on keeping a starter, as I seem to be the only one that eats sourdough in our house, so not worth the effort, but something that doesn't require keeping a starter would be great.


Put your starter in a sealed jar (something like a Kilner jar) in the fridge, it forms a black film over the top and keeps for ages. I haven't made a sourdough anything for probably a year, but I'm very confident that my starter will be Ok (I've left it longer than that before). You just take it out, add flour and water and use as normal after a day or so.


----------



## C R (12 Apr 2020)

Tail End Charlie said:


> Put your starter in a sealed jar (something like a Kilner jar) in the fridge, it forms a black film over the top and keeps for ages. I haven't made a sourdough anything for probably a year, but I'm very confident that my starter will be Ok (I've left it longer than that before). You just take it out, add flour and water and use as normal after a day or so.


I've tried that, but eventually mold starts growing. I've read that surface mold can be removed and the starter is safe, but I don't really want to risk it.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (12 Apr 2020)

C R said:


> Oooh. One thing we've been talking about with the children was making some cheese. I have fond memories of having curds on fresh bread when my mum made cheese.
> 
> Do you use rennet or vinegar to get started? I was planning to use vinegar, as I don't know where to get the rennet from.



My ricotta came from this recipe, using whole milk, cheese salt and citric acid.

You can buy rennet from loads of online shops.


----------



## Reynard (12 Apr 2020)

I always keep some starter in the freezer. And I also have some dried in a jar. Both can be used to seed a new batch.


----------



## neil_merseyside (12 Apr 2020)

If you make your starter damn near a solid dry ball with loads of flour it'll keep for ages without mould, break it open and use the core to restart the process (though all of can be used).


----------



## glasgowcyclist (13 Apr 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> I used wholemeal spelt as that’s all I have at present.
> The cooking time was about 11/12 minutes.



Thanks for sharing the recipe Dave123, I had the end of a bag of white spelt and this used it up nicely. I didn't have nigella seeds so used linseeds instead. 

It made 5 trays of crackers and my wife ate three of them at lunchtime .


----------



## figbat (13 Apr 2020)

I made a low-yeast, overnight bread this morning. Well it started last night: a simple 500g flour/320ml water/0.25 tsp yeast/bit of salt dough, roughly mixed and kneaded a little, then rested for an hour, then book-folded three times with 30 minute intervals, then proved overnight in the garage (coolest place available), then book-folded once more this morning, shaped and put into a loaf tin, proved again in a warm place then baked.

It turns out with a close, springy structure not unlike a sourdough and a somewhat similar flavour (especially in the crust). It means I can have a fresh loaf ready for lunch without having to get up at the crack of sparrow’s. Plus it extends the yeast you may have available (I used dried).


----------



## Proto (19 Apr 2020)

Novice alert!! 

Anyone got a good recipe for wholemeal spelt bread?

This will be my third loaf. First was excellent, second, in theory the same, came out less good (possibly oven too hot). I had used recipe on side of flour bag (Sharpham Park) but it got thrown away when empty. Doh!


----------



## Hugh Manatee (19 Apr 2020)

No bread today but I had a baking day yesterday. I made a ginger cake that is maturing in the fridge for a day or two. I made mini Homity Pies using wholemeal flour (Atta) and then had some potato left over; around 500g or so.
With that I made some Irish Potata Bread. I have a potato ricer so put the still hot potatoes through that. Whilst it was still warm, I hand mixed the potato with a good pinch of salt and 130g of plain flour. Hand mix until a dough forms. I divided the dough into two and rolled it out as round as I could keep it to about 10mm thick. Cut into quarters and prick each slice with a fork.

I then left mine on a floured plate as we didn't need it until tea time. I cooked it on a cast iron hot plate that I had very lightly floured. After 2 or 3 minutes you'll see sort of small air pockets forming. Turn with a flexible knife or slice and cook on the other side for a similar time. Butter and serve! My son just popped the last slice into the toaster and it did fine:






With a couple of the pies for lunch.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Apr 2020)

I made Dan Lepard's amazing whisky scones again today. Even before you bite into them they give off a beautiful, sweet aroma that tells you you are in for a treat.
They are obscenely good.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Apr 2020)

Proto said:


> Novice alert!!
> 
> Anyone got a good recipe for wholemeal spelt bread?
> 
> This will be my third loaf. First was excellent, second, in theory the same, came out less good (possibly oven too hot). I had used recipe on side of flour bag (Sharpham Park) but it got thrown away when empty. Doh!



I've not made a wholemeal spelt loaf but I have found the recipes on Dove's site to be reliable. Here's their recipe for what you're after https://www.dovesfarm.co.uk/recipes/spelt-bread


----------



## Proto (19 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I've not made a wholemeal spelt loaf but I have found the recipes on Dove's site to be reliable. Here's their recipe for what you're after https://www.dovesfarm.co.uk/recipes/spelt-bread



Thanks, I ended up going with this one, found on the Sharpham Park website

https://www.sharphampark.com/recipes/article/80-seeded-loaf

I'll report back later!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Apr 2020)

Proto said:


> Thanks, I ended up going with this one, found on the Sharpham Park website
> 
> https://www.sharphampark.com/recipes/article/80-seeded-loaf
> 
> I'll report back later!



Don't forget the photos!

(By the way, when I've made spelt loafs in the past, I've found they rise very quickly. Definitely a dough you need to keep a close eye on. )


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Apr 2020)

After the success of the ciabatta last month, I am trying another Gino d'Acampo recipe; panini al latte. 





The dough is currently resting and should be ready to bake around 4pm. I might do a seeded top on them.






I'm doing half quantities so this dough is only for four panini.


----------



## Reynard (19 Apr 2020)

I might pinch that recipe. Looks a bit like a slightly less rich brioche...


----------



## Proto (19 Apr 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Don't forget the photos!
> 
> (By the way, when I've made spelt loafs in the past, I've found they rise very quickly. Definitely a dough you need to keep a close eye on. )



Here you go!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Apr 2020)

Reynard said:


> I might pinch that recipe. Looks a bit like a slightly less rich brioche...



It does, I'll report on the flavour tomorrow. Here's the full method:






He has a similar recipe for pizzicotti, which are sweet, soft, butter rolls and they look much closer to brioche.


----------



## Reynard (19 Apr 2020)

Cheers ears 

A similar method to a lot of enriched doughs.


----------



## Dave 123 (26 Apr 2020)

It’s all 80/20 strong white/ whole meal spelt 

closest loaf done in Le Crueset Dutch oven


mddle is on a pizza stone

cottage seeded loaf


----------



## CharlesF (26 Apr 2020)

@Dave 123 - those are too professional standards, I hope you have tasted as least one. Tasting the result is almost the best thing about bake your own bread


----------



## CanucksTraveller (26 Apr 2020)

I'm not normally a baker so forgive the intrusion, but boredom drove me to make a Pain de Campagne yesterday, it didn't look too professional but it tasted great.


----------



## Dave 123 (26 Apr 2020)

CharlesF said:


> @Dave 123 - those are too professional standards, I hope you have tasted as least one. Tasting the result is almost the best thing about bake your own bread



I’ve tasted the darker loaf. It’s very nice and light, soft and tasty.

professional? No chance!


----------



## Dave 123 (26 Apr 2020)

JtB said:


> I’ve run out of dried yeast now and there’s none in the supermarkets round here.  Does anyone know where I can buy some?



Check out any catering suppliers near you. They’ll sell to anyone at the moment.


----------



## Reynard (26 Apr 2020)

JtB said:


> I’ve run out of dried yeast now and there’s none in the supermarkets round here.  Does anyone know where I can buy some?



Does your local supermarket have an in store bakery?

If so, ask the bods in the ISB. I know Tesco will give you some fresh yeast for free, but others may charge a nominal amount for a dollop.


----------



## jayonabike (28 Apr 2020)

White loaf just out of the oven and in the background lemon shortbread thins about to go in


----------



## jayonabike (28 Apr 2020)

These biscuits smell amazing, kettles going on for a brew when they’ve cooled down!


----------



## jayonabike (30 Apr 2020)

Baked some Chelsea Buns this morning 






Here’s the recipe if anyone’s interested


----------



## CharlesF (30 Apr 2020)

Got to hunt down some flour before I can do anything!


----------



## Reynard (30 Apr 2020)

Which reminds, I managed to get my mitts on some flour on Tuesday. 

My local Tesco had sacks of Elephant-branded Atta flour in.

The advantage of being raised in London yet now shopping in a very provincial Tesco - the natives don't often recognise the "weird" ingredients or are suspicious of them, and thus leave them well alone. If they'd known what the stuff was, that shelf (in the offers section) would've been picked clean I'm sure, as the pukka baking aisle is still denuded bar the odd dented tin of treacle.

As a result, I'm 20kg of flour to the good.


----------



## Dave 123 (2 May 2020)

Rolls,baguettes, sourdough crackers and focaccia baked this morning. Bike time now...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (2 May 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Rolls,baguettes, sourdough crackers and focaccia baked this morning. Bike time now...
> 
> View attachment 519336
> 
> ...



Do you feed the whole street every weekend?


----------



## Dave 123 (2 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Do you feed the whole street every weekend?




Actually today I did. Pam next door had a baguette for lunch, the focaccia was shared with Pam and Julie next door but one, they also got some mackerel pate and crackers . The rest will freeze for the week.


----------



## Hugh Manatee (7 May 2020)

We have a street party tomorrow. Everyone has to stay in their own driveway/front garden. I have done a baking session for it:







We have a loaf for sandwiches. I forgot to cross the top with a sharp knife.
Mini potato, garlic and cheese pies.
Irish potato bread for breakfast.
A ginger cake. Should have done the cake yesterday so it could have had an extra day in the fridge. 

That is blackcurrant gin in the background. When ready it tastes worryingly like Ribena.


----------



## Reynard (9 May 2020)

Managed to get my little mitts on 20kg of Elephant Atta previous week as mentioned upthread. Happy Reynard 

It's actually one of my go-to bread flours anyways. But it does make a banging bread. So those of you who have some in (or 80% extraction brown flour, as that's what it is) then try this...

100g wholemeal rye
250g atta
250g white
12g salt
2 tbsp oil
5g DA yeast
400g tepid water.

Put the rye flour with 150g of the water in a bowl and leave for 24 hours. Then make up a dough with the soaker and the rest of the ingredients. Bulk ferment, knock back, shape and prove etc as per usual. You can use more or less yeast depending on how much time you have.

This is quite a soft and tacky dough with the rye and the 67% hydration, but trust me, it makes a lovely loaf.

For my oven, this wants 45 mins; 25 mins at 230C fan in my clay pot with the lid on, then a further 20 mins at 190 with the lid off.

I've managed to demolish a third of a loaf for lunch.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (9 May 2020)

A few weeks back, Morrisons was doing that Atta flour at £6 for 20kg sack. I’ve no room for that so gave it a miss as I have a 3kg bag anyway. This week they’re selling a 16kg sack of plain flour for £9, Heygates I think.


----------



## jayonabike (12 May 2020)

Just out of the oven 
First time I’ve made a loaf with granary flour, it smells lovely. Can’t wait to try it!


----------



## jayonabike (12 May 2020)

Really pleased with the way it turned out


----------



## figbat (12 May 2020)

jayonabike said:


> Really pleased with the way it turned out
> View attachment 521687


Nice one! If you can get it may I recommend the Wessex Cobber flour from Wessex Mill? It's a malted granary flour and makes an awesome loaf.


----------



## CharlesF (12 May 2020)

@figbat sounds good stuff, have to wait until things settle down and Wessex Mills reopens


----------



## jayonabike (13 May 2020)

Used the rest of that Granary flour l had left to make a couple of baguettes


----------



## annedonnelly (14 May 2020)

I know some of you buy flour in bulk. How do you store it?

I've placed an order with Shipton Mill and they say to store the sack either in a crock or a clean metal bin. Well I can easily find a metal bin but it's not the most attractive solution. Does anyone have a source for a crock?

Now I can be a bit more relaxed about using the flour I have - I've ordered enough to last me for the rest of the year!


----------



## Reynard (14 May 2020)

Vintage metal kitchenware?

The enameled stuff, that is. I have and use such for sugar and flour.


----------



## annedonnelly (14 May 2020)

Reynard said:


> Vintage metal kitchenware?
> 
> The enameled stuff, that is. I have and use such for sugar and flour.



I thought that, but haven't seen anything that looks big enough. It's the sort of thing that'll turn up at a flea market or antique shop but there's not much happening in that line at the minute...


----------



## Reynard (14 May 2020)

Bay of E?

Otherwise good quality plastic storage bins - wilkos should have them.


----------



## jayonabike (14 May 2020)

Just out of the oven


----------



## annedonnelly (15 May 2020)

Reynard said:


> Bay of E?
> 
> Otherwise good quality plastic storage bins - wilkos should have them.


Shipton Mill specifically say not plastic


----------



## figbat (15 May 2020)

annedonnelly said:


> Shipton Mill specifically say not plastic


Indeed. Probably less important for white flours but with more oil-rich wholemeal flours there is the chance of oil/plastics interaction. They also talk about allowing the flour to ‘breathe’ to avoid ‘sweating’, which I’d assume is water and/or oily vapours emitting from the flour and potentially binding it.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 May 2020)

Is everyone else still having difficulty finding bread flour other than white?

All that my supermarkets have is white and the occasional bag of wholemeal, no spelt and most importantly, no rye which is what I feed my starter with. 

And don’t get me started on yeast and the barstewards hoarding it to sell on that auction site at ten times(!) the normal retail price. 🤬


----------



## IaninSheffield (16 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Is everyone else still having difficulty finding bread flour other than white?
> 
> All that my supermarkets have is white and the occasional bag of wholemeal, no spelt and most importantly, no rye which is what I feed my starter with.
> 
> And don’t get me started on yeast and the barstewards hoarding it to sell on that auction site at ten times(!) the normal retail price. 🤬


Yep. Tried two large supermarkets last night. No bread flour of _any_ variety and very little plain or self raising.
I fail to see how the spike in demand from early April hasn't now passed ... or been addressed.


----------



## Reynard (16 May 2020)

Other than the 20 kg of Atta that I bagged in Tesco a fortnight ago, not a sniff of anything in there - bread flour or otherwise. Haven't been anywhere else in Ely or Littleport, so can't say what it's like in the other supermarkets.

The baking aisle in Tesco has been denuded since mid March, and when I went on Tuesday, the shelves where the flour normally resides have actually been dismantled.

No yeast either. Or baking powder.

Just realising how damn lucky I was to get that chapatti flour...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 May 2020)

I got wholemeal in Morrisons on Thursday, along with plain and self-raising, one bag of each. They appear to be taking it from bulk supplies and splitting it into their own brown paper bags. 60p per kg.





I also picked up some fresh yeast at their bakery department. Never thought I'd be so excited to see a bag of yeast! Just 20p for 50g.




So today I'm baking a seeded wholemeal bloomer which is coming out of the oven in a few minutes.


----------



## Reynard (16 May 2020)

Mmmmm, next time I'm in Tesco, I might enquire in the ISB whether they have fresh yeast.

They're still baking bread and pastries, but everything is now packaged, nothing loose or sliced.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 May 2020)

Here's the seeded wholemeal bloomer, recipe by Jack Sturgess.


----------



## IaninSheffield (16 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Here's the seeded wholemeal bloomer, recipe by Jack Sturgess.
> 
> View attachment 522763


Bloomin' marvellous!
Came across Jack's YT channel recently; he's a sound lad. I've learned a lot since watching.
Wonder if he knows why we can't get flour? 🤔


----------



## glasgowcyclist (16 May 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> Bloomin' marvellous!
> Came across Jack's YT channel recently; he's a sound lad. I've learned a lot since watching.
> Wonder if he knows why we can't get flour? 🤔



Thanks.

I’m a recent follower of Bake with Jack too and he’s damn good at both baking and at teaching you how to do it. I love his straightforward approach, no fancy terminology or frippery, just the facts. 

Initially I thought his delivery might get annoying but , as you say, he’s a sound lad and his enthusiasm is endearing and infectious.

Anyone else watch his YouTube channel? It’s well worth it as he shares absolutely all of his knowledge.


----------



## IaninSheffield (16 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Initially I thought his delivery might get annoying


Me too!
I'm always conscious of my old f**t prejudices and I try to keep them in check. In the end someone's clear and superior knowledge and skill always win me over.


----------



## IaninSheffield (18 May 2020)

Tonight on BBC4 at 21:00, "Bread: A loaf affair" narrated by, wait for it, Tom Baker. Natch.
A Timeshift repeat from 2010, but it should gently while away an hour.


----------



## IaninSheffield (18 May 2020)

BBC Newsround have alternative suggestions to try if you can't get your hands on any flour:




Unfortunately they don't provide recipes, so if anyone can help me with one for 'soda bread, no-yeast pizza dough, naan breads, potato scones, or dumplings' which needs no flour, I'd be grateful. 🤔


----------



## figbat (18 May 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> BBC Newsround have alternative suggestions to try if you can't get your hands on any flour:
> View attachment 523122
> 
> Unfortunately they don't provide recipes, so if anyone can help me with one for 'soda bread, no-yeast pizza dough, naan breads, potato scones, or dumplings' which needs no flour, I'd be grateful. 🤔


I'm pretty sure they meant "yeast". All of those need flour, but none need yeast.


----------



## Dave 123 (18 May 2020)

A baking day yesterday.
2x focaccia for birthday presents
2x sourdough for the week 
2x pizza for last night 

I ordered 00 flour from Shipton Mill. The base was lovely and light.


----------



## Houthakker (18 May 2020)

Just started my first sourdough starter. Hope to be giving it a try this weekend.


----------



## Dave 123 (18 May 2020)

Houthakker said:


> Just started my first sourdough starter. Hope to be giving it a try this weekend.


Exciting. Any idea what you want to bake?


----------



## neil_merseyside (18 May 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Exciting. Any idea what you want to bake?


Tangy fattish but mostly flat bread for a first attempt (or was that just me?) 
Or with mouseholes like cathedrals (oh that was me too wasn't it?) 
All edible though!


----------



## Reynard (19 May 2020)

The only downside to bread with big holes in it is that the toppings always fall through the holes...


----------



## Houthakker (19 May 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> Exciting. Any idea what you want to bake?


Planning on starting with just a plain white loaf, expect to take a few times to get the feel for it though.


----------



## neil_merseyside (19 May 2020)

Reynard said:


> The only downside to bread with big holes in it is that the toppings always fall through the holes...



Cheese and ham to the rescue here, though you can laminate any loose filling with sliced ham[1].
Or at a push a lettuce leaf might be actually useful 

[1] ox tongue, haslet, corned beef, smoked salmon etc.


----------



## Reynard (19 May 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Cheese and ham to the rescue here, though you can laminate any loose filling with sliced ham[1].
> Or at a push a lettuce leaf might be actually useful
> 
> [1] ox tongue, haslet, corned beef, smoked salmon etc.



Yebbut spreading the butter on is a right PITA...

As for marmalade, forget it...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 May 2020)

Houthakker said:


> Just started my first sourdough starter. Hope to be giving it a try this weekend.




How did it go?


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 May 2020)

Fresh from the oven, two soured cream sandwich loafs. Well, yoghurt loafs as I didn't have any soured cream and yoghurt works just as well.


----------



## Houthakker (24 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> How did it go?


Not quite as well as I'd hoped but OK. Dough was very sticky, even after the final shape. Followed instructions from "Bake with Jack" which has no kneading, just a stretch and fold technique, and it came out a little flatter than I expected (Spread when out of the mould, probably cos it was wetter that I think it should have been) Taste was very good though, even Mrs H said it was nice and she's not a great sourdough fan. Now Ive got a starter going will try again next week. Might try Paul Hollywoods recipies which has more kneading in it. 
as we ate the full loaf yesterday/today just made a 50/50 plain/wholemeal loaf which was really well risen and tasty. Do love that first slice when still warm from the oven!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 May 2020)

Houthakker said:


> and it came out a little flatter than I expected (Spread when out of the mould, probably cos it was wetter that I think it should have



If mine does that I bake in an enamelled pot. That keeps it from spreading so that the only movement is upwards. I've saved a few that way.


----------



## CharlesF (24 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> If mine does that I bake in an enamelled pot. That keeps it from spreading so that the only movement is upwards. I've saved a few that way.


I like that idea, searching now for a suitable pot.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (24 May 2020)

CharlesF said:


> I like that idea, searching now for a suitable pot.



I got mine in Lidl, it's a copy of the Le Creuset style but a fraction of the price. About £20 instead of £150.


----------



## Reynard (24 May 2020)

Or if you're doing batards, one of those terracotta Mason Cash bakers works a treat.


----------



## SteveF (25 May 2020)

More baguettes, Paul Hollywood recipe this time, slightly wetter dough and a higher more even rise...


----------



## Houthakker (25 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> If mine does that I bake in an enamelled pot. That keeps it from spreading so that the only movement is upwards. I've saved a few that way


Now why didn't I think of that? Still know now for next time.


----------



## neil_merseyside (25 May 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> If mine does that I bake in an enamelled pot. That keeps it from spreading so that the only movement is upwards. I've saved a few that way.


Does it not weld itself to the pot and need a soaking to clean?


----------



## Reynard (25 May 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Does it not weld itself to the pot and need a soaking to clean?



If it's like using my glazed clay pot, then no. 

Because you put your pot in the oven before turning it on, and the pot heats up as the oven does. So by the time the dough's ready, the pot is up to oven temperature. It's just like cooking pizza / naan / pita on a baking stone - the heat from the surface "seals" the dough, preventing stickage.


----------



## Reynard (25 May 2020)

Another atta flour bread baked; 2 parts atta to one part white, 70% hydration. I threw in a generous handful of malted wheat flakes as well.

We've scoffed half a 900g loaf. Oops...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (25 May 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Does it not weld itself to the pot and need a soaking to clean?



Not in the slightest.

When I first began using the dutch oven method I used to drop the dough straight in from the banneton but that caused problems with degassing and it was rare to get it in neatly. I then came up with the idea of transferring it onto a silicone baking sheet and then using that as a carrier to carefully lower the dough into the pot.

Here’s a series of pictures showing what I do. (Click the thumbnail for the larger version.)

Dough ready to transfer:




Silicone sheet over the dough, ready to flip:



Turn over slowly and remove banneton:



Score (if desired):



Lower gently into the hot pot:



Pour about 50ml of water between the silicone and the pot. This creates a lovely, instant steam bath that allows the dough to rise for longer before forming a crust.




Get the lid straight on and bung it in the oven:




Check it after 20 minutes and if it’s risen as much as possible, remove the lid and continue to bake for the allotted time:




The top can end up darker than the rest so I usually take it out of the pot and bake the last five minutes naked on the stone.



Even without the silicone sheet, my bread always came out of the pot cleanly with no mess and no sticking. I guess that’s the enamel doing its job. The silicone means you’ll always be able to lift out straight out anyway.

Sorry for the very long reply to a simple question.


----------



## Dave7 (28 May 2020)

Todays offering.
Just enjoyed thick slices with lovely roast beef.....washed down with a nice glass of red (thats each, not between us).


----------



## Houthakker (31 May 2020)

Starting to get a feel for this sourdough now. First one was too wet and spead a bit, 2nd one (Paul Hollywood recipie) was a bit dry and formed a small loaf with a tight crumb. Nice but more like traditional bread than sourdough.
Played around with the recipie today and got the hydration about right, Could have done with a bit more time in the oven but am happy with that. Am just ordering a banneton so I don't have to use a bowl for the final shape (had trouble getting it out today.)


----------



## Dave 123 (1 Jun 2020)

Monday morning sourdough


----------



## IaninSheffield (1 Jun 2020)

Oaty wholemeal






Made late last night, but left overnight to cool. Really firmed up the crust ... which I like!


----------



## SteveF (14 Jun 2020)

Rustic but delicious, homemade Chelsea buns...


----------



## Reynard (19 Jun 2020)

A bit of a calamity here chez Casa Reynard. My baking stone (well, not stone, it's terracotta) has split in two after years of use. 

Doubt I can replace like for like, as this one was a boot sale find well over two decades ago, but anyone got any recommendations? Am looking for something around 15 inches in diameter.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (20 Jun 2020)

Reynard said:


> A bit of a calamity here chez Casa Reynard. My baking stone (well, not stone, it's terracotta) has split in two after years of use.
> 
> Doubt I can replace like for like, as this one was a boot sale find well over two decades ago, but anyone got any recommendations? Am looking for something around 15 inches in diameter.



I got a large piece of marble that had been a kitchen worktop and cut it to fit my oven shelf.
Found it while buying a couple of slabs from a building reclamation yard and he let me have it for nothing.

See my post earlier in this thread... https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-bakers-thread.228233/post-5088373


----------



## Reynard (20 Jun 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I got a large piece of marble that had been a kitchen worktop and cut it to fit my oven shelf.
> Found it while buying a couple of slabs from a building reclamation yard and he let me have it for nothing.
> 
> See my post earlier in this thread... https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-bakers-thread.228233/post-5088373



Hmm, the local tip does architectural salvage, but their sales area isn't open right now. Maybe I can find something at the local builders' merchant.


----------



## Reynard (20 Jun 2020)

The naan bread were bloomin' good though


----------



## DCBassman (25 Jun 2020)

I have finally turned this





Into this





using Birra Morretti. Very nice too.
Surprised it worked at all, it's well-travelled!




There was some CO2 pressure in the mix powder, and I thought that didn't bode well either, but all good!


----------



## Reynard (27 Jun 2020)

Is it just me, but for some reason, my sourdough breads are just turning into plops.

Admittedly it's a new culture and I'm still learning its peculiarities (it makes fabby waffles btw) but am trying to figure out what's causing the dough to be a gooey, liquid, unhandleable mess. I have to flip it with a spatula like a no-knead bread, and then just pour it into the banneton. I don't get particularly good oven spring.

It's not overproved. I've a good handle on that as I always prove my dough in the same bowl and use the same quantity of flour.

All I can think of that's causing it is either the weather or the flour type. I'm using a 50-50 mix of atta and strong white at 65% hydration, which turns out a fabby bread usually. No problem with that when using yeast, even if it's only a couple of grammes.

Am starting to think that atta flour, with its lower protein levels, isn't terribly happy with the significantly longer bulk ferment.

The loaves *taste* amazing though, with a lovely tang to them.

Any ideas?


----------



## cambsno (8 Jul 2020)

Reynard said:


> Is it just me, but for some reason, my sourdough breads are just turning into plops.
> 
> Admittedly it's a new culture and I'm still learning its peculiarities (it makes fabby waffles btw) but am trying to figure out what's causing the dough to be a gooey, liquid, unhandleable mess. I have to flip it with a spatula like a no-knead bread, and then just pour it into the banneton. I don't get particularly good oven spring.
> 
> ...



Same here - got going in lockdown and had a couple of decent loaves but most are just a bit flat with smallish air bubbles. Use a recipe of 375g flour with 250g of starter, prove for around 5 hours, shape and then prove again for around 12.


----------



## neil_merseyside (8 Jul 2020)

cambsno said:


> Same here - got going in lockdown and had a couple of decent loaves but most are just a bit flat with smallish air bubbles. Use a recipe of 375g flour with 250g of starter, prove for around 5 hours, shape and then prove again for around 12.


That reipe is missing a lot of water, about 175-200ml of it.


----------



## cambsno (8 Jul 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> That reipe is missing a lot of water, about 175-200ml of it.



I do add water, probably about 200ml and 10g of salt


----------



## figbat (9 Jul 2020)

cambsno said:


> Same here - got going in lockdown and had a couple of decent loaves but most are just a bit flat with smallish air bubbles. Use a recipe of 375g flour with 250g of starter, prove for around 5 hours, shape and then prove again for around 12.


That sounds like a very long second prove - maybe it is over-prooving and collapsing? I tend to do a long proove on the first one, with the second one just long enough for a decent rise, often a much shorter time.

One thing that gets created during prooving is water - it is a by-product of the fermentation process.


----------



## cambsno (9 Jul 2020)

figbat said:


> That sounds like a very long second prove - maybe it is over-prooving and collapsing? I tend to do a long proove on the first one, with the second one just long enough for a decent rise, often a much shorter time.
> 
> One thing that gets created during prooving is water - it is a by-product of the fermentation process.



Its a Paul Hollywood recipe- how long do you prove for?


----------



## figbat (9 Jul 2020)

I'll typically prove overnight on the first prove but the second one will be much shorter - a couple of hours or so dependent on how active the dough is and how quickly it rises to double volume. I have had some flops like you describe and I worked out that they were essentially left too long and collapsed.


----------



## benb (9 Jul 2020)

Some pretty nice baguettes.


----------



## annedonnelly (31 Jul 2020)

Someone on this thread mentioned Bake with Jack. Thanks!!

This is the result - English muffins












Just looking at the pics makes me want another one!


----------



## IaninSheffield (1 Aug 2020)

First attempt at focaccia - red onion & rosemary.


Nom, nom. Although would have been even more delicious with fresh rosemary.
Really should replace the woody, tired old bush I tore out a couple of years ago.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (2 Aug 2020)

annedonnelly said:


> Someone on this thread mentioned Bake with Jack. Thanks!!
> 
> This is the result - English muffins
> 
> ...


I saw that recipe on his blog a couple of days ago too. Definitely going to try making those tomorrow but today I tried his recipe for a fruit loaf.

Tastes even better than it looks and when toasted it is just superb. 





I made two and it was a real struggle to give the other one to my neighbour.


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## annedonnelly (3 Aug 2020)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I saw that recipe on his blog a couple of days ago too. Definitely going to try making those tomorrow but today I tried his recipe for a fruit loaf.
> 
> Tastes even better than it looks and when toasted it is just superb.
> View attachment 539480
> ...


That looks really good!! 

Probably just as well that I don't have all the ingredients handy


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Aug 2020)

annedonnelly said:


> Someone on this thread mentioned Bake with Jack. Thanks!!
> 
> This is the result - English muffins



These were very tricky to bake, my cast iron pan was either too hot or too cold. Burnt the first one within 3 minutes (still ate it ) and it wasn’t until the final pair of muffins that I think I got the temperature right.
I did the others partly in the pan and finished them in the oven, as Jack suggested.

Very tasty!









Yes, that’s the burnt one.


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## glasgowcyclist (16 Aug 2020)

Something a little different, tonight I had a go at making veggie samosas. Since it involves making a dough I am claiming it qualifies for this thread.





Turned out much better than I expected!


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## figbat (16 Aug 2020)

Focaccia - 75% hydration recipe made using a ‘biga’, started yesterday, finished today.


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## glasgowcyclist (16 Aug 2020)

figbat said:


> Focaccia - 75% hydration recipe made using a ‘biga’, started yesterday, finished today.



The biga, the better!


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## glasgowcyclist (14 Oct 2020)

Here’s an interesting article on the science of sourdough, with a few hints for the home baker.

https://knowablemagazine.org/article/living-world/2020/microbial-secrets-sourdough?


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## Dave 123 (22 Nov 2020)

The evolution of spelt rolls...


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Nov 2020)

Dave 123 said:


> The evolution of spelt rolls...
> 
> View attachment 559524



That final shot is quite a mouthful!


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## Chris S (22 Nov 2020)

I've found an easy way to make naan breads or pizza bases. Just mix four parts of self raising flour with one part acidic drink - beer, cider, wine, lemonade (etc). You don't have to knead the dough, just roll it out till it's about 5mm thick and then cook each side on a hot pan for a few minutes.


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## figbat (22 Nov 2020)

Ooh I’d forgotten about this thread! I was given some sourdough starter a few weeks ago and have been making a loaf every few days. Sourdough is a fickle beast but I seem to have come to an arrangement with it that sees it behaving in exchange for regular feeding. The latest loaf was little short of spectacular.




I have also started some practice baking for Christmas. Having seen these mentioned on a Facebook post I had a go at them: baci di dama (ladies’ kisses). The biscuit is made with toasted hazelnuts and sandwiched with dark chocolate. Turned out very well, although next time I might do a ganache rather than just chocolate.


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## IaninSheffield (22 Nov 2020)

Chris S said:


> I've found an easy way to make naan breads or pizza bases. Just mix four parts of self raising flour with one part acidic drink - beer, cider, wine, lemonade (etc). You don't have to knead the dough, just roll it out till it's about 5mm thick and then cook each side on a hot pan for a few minutes.


Interesting. Is that 4 parts by weight or volume?


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## figbat (22 Nov 2020)

Chris S said:


> I've found an easy way to make naan breads or pizza bases. Just mix four parts of self raising flour with one part acidic drink - beer, cider, wine, lemonade (etc). You don't have to knead the dough, just roll it out till it's about 5mm thick and then cook each side on a hot pan for a few minutes.


You can do the same using plain yoghurt. I’d guess buttermilk would do it too.


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## Chris S (22 Nov 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> Interesting. Is that 4 parts by weight or volume?


Volume - I haven't got any scales. It's just approximate though, if the mixture won't form a single mass then just add a little more liquid. Water will do, there is already enough acid to react with the baking soda in the flour.


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## BrumJim (23 Nov 2020)

Had great fun last weekend cooking croissants:














Turned out really yummy.


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## C R (23 Nov 2020)

BrumJim said:


> Had great fun last weekend cooking croissants:
> 
> View attachment 559677
> View attachment 559672
> ...


How long did it take?


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## BrumJim (23 Nov 2020)

C R said:


> How long did it take?


Made the dough on Friday night. Rolled it out / laminated it on Saturday morning (three times). Then did the final roll and cut on Saturday evening, leaving them to rise overnight. Egg wash and stick it in the oven on Sunday morning.


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## glasgowcyclist (23 Nov 2020)

BrumJim said:


> Had great fun last weekend cooking croissants:
> 
> View attachment 559677
> View attachment 559672
> ...



Excellent work!

You look a lot younger than I imagined.


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## C R (23 Nov 2020)

BrumJim said:


> Made the dough on Friday night. Rolled it out / laminated it on Saturday morning (three times). Then did the final roll and cut on Saturday evening, leaving them to rise overnight. Egg wash and stick it in the oven on Sunday morning.


Thanks, our children are getting interested in making things from scratch, this looks like a good project.


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## BrumJim (23 Nov 2020)

C R said:


> Thanks, our children are getting interested in making things from scratch, this looks like a good project.


The prelude to this was watching Gregg Wallace's Inside the Factory program where he visited the Brioche Pasquier factory in Valence, France. He really enjoyed this one, and a casual question of "do you want to make croissants" was answered very enthusiastically.
I would advise some practice in rolling out before you start. It is a skill that you need to learn.
So we started with this:
Sourdough Crackers
I leave the dough in the fridge overnight minimum to get them ready for rolling out. Only move on to Croissants when they can roll it out to paper thin before putting them in the oven.
Then followed this method:
Weekend bakery
Although adjusted the timings to get morning croissants rather than afternoon ones.


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## Archie_tect (23 Nov 2020)

Wow, that Weekend Bakery recipe is a lot of work over 3 days for 15 croissants!


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## Reynard (23 Nov 2020)

Actually, the Weekend Bakery recipes are brilliant.

The one for speculaas is  Lotus biscuits, eat your little flavourless hearts out...


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## vickster (26 Nov 2020)

I’ve been baking again, I need to widen my repertoire and eat bananas more quickly 
Banana and choc chip muffins


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## figbat (30 Nov 2020)

My love affair with the sourdough starter continues - this loaf is near-identical to the last one, unheard of in my kitchen! And my wife thinks it looks like a cycling helmet.


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## C R (30 Nov 2020)

figbat said:


> My love affair with the sourdough starter continues - this loaf is near-identical to the last one, unheard of in my kitchen! And my wife thinks it looks like a cycling helmet.
> View attachment 560979


She is right


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## Tail End Charlie (30 Nov 2020)

figbat said:


> My love affair with the sourdough starter continues - this loaf is near-identical to the last one, unheard of in my kitchen! And my wife thinks it looks like a cycling helmet.
> View attachment 560979


That looks exceptionally good. Any chance of a photo of when it's cut?


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## figbat (30 Nov 2020)

Tail End Charlie said:


> That looks exceptionally good. Any chance of a photo of when it's cut?


It’s quite a tight crumb but soft and very robust - easily takes a firm spread without tearing.


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## Reynard (2 Dec 2020)

Good thing with a tight crumb is that your marmalade doesn't fall through the holes. 

Anyways, I made a lovely soda bread using atta flour and creme fraiche.  It's lovely topped with home made gravlax... 

And I plan on trying this at the weekend as I've an itch for peperkoek that wants scratching...

https://www.weekendbakery.com/posts/my-dutch-speculaas-gingerbread-with-rye-buttermilk-honey/


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## figbat (14 Dec 2020)

I’ve switched flours for today. The sourdough starter seems to love this one, getting all worked up when fed with it and giving an impressive prove overnight. Loaf still a bit warm to cut but looks, smells and sounds good.


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## figbat (14 Dec 2020)

figbat said:


> I’ve switched flours for today. The sourdough starter seems to love this one, getting all worked up when fed with it and giving an impressive prove overnight. Loaf still a bit warm to cut but looks, smells and sounds good.
> View attachment 563319
> 
> View attachment 563320


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## SteveF (24 Dec 2020)

A chocolate Babka, my 1st attempt...


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## figbat (24 Dec 2020)

For the last few Christmases, since I became a born-again baker, I have baked a lot for the festive season, often to take to parties or give away to family and friends. This year the baking spreadsheet had to be cut-back somewhat since our planned small gathering has been kiboshed. However, I also bake because I can and because I like to, so here’s a small showcase of this year’s efforts:




On the tin is a panettone - yes it’s loaf-shaped because I was only making a small one this year so it wouldn’t fill the normal panettone tin, plus my wife likes to slice it and toast it so this facilitates that. Nobody other than me likes traditional fruit cake hence this alternative.

On the plate are:
- deep-filled mince pie
- Italian hazelnut biscuits
- shortbread
- mini stollen.

Not shown is the mincemeat ‘Bakewell’ tart that will be for dessert after lunch since - again - nobody but me likes Christmas pudding.

Merry Christmas!


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## figbat (26 Dec 2020)

figbat said:


> Not shown is the mincemeat ‘Bakewell’ tart that will be for dessert after lunch since - again - nobody but me likes Christmas pudding.


Now shown - not actually cut until today as we were all stuffed yesterday.


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## figbat (28 Dec 2020)

Just a relatively standard farmhouse-type loaf today. I used up the half-and-half flour I had and topped it up with strong white, so it’s a kind of 25:75 loaf. I used dried yeast for this as it was a last minute decision to make a loaf for today and my sourdough starter was still in the fridge. However I still wanted to be able to bake it for lunchtime today without getting up at the crack of dawn so made a low-yeast-content dough last night and proved overnight in the garage (cool but not frigid). Then I just needed to second-prove this morning and bake.


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## annedonnelly (2 Jan 2021)

I was given a cookbook from Shetland for Christmas & finally got round to making Shetland bannocks. I think we'd call them griddle cakes in this part of the world. Plus carrot & lentil soup.


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## Poacher (8 Jan 2021)

Mrs Poacher made some delicious carrot, butternut squash and coriander* soup yesterday, and included a red chilli at my suggestion.
It's a bit on the spicy side, but mild by some standards, and so thick it can be heaped up in the middle of the bowl. (Sorry, no photo, you'll just have to imagine it.) Today was my turn to trash the kitchen. I decided that the oven would provide some welcome assistance to the struggling central heating, so a baking afternoon was called for. Here's a 100% white loaf (normally I'd include about 10% wholemeal), some of which will go with the rest of the soup, and some cheddar twists made with left over shortcrust from.....





...the smoked salmon, leek and broccoli quiche I teased @mudsticks about the other day. You probably didn't miss much, chuck, and travel from your area to mine wouldn't be allowed anyway (see Derbyshire Police inviting ridicule and an appeal after fining two women for travelling 5 miles and drinking coffee brought from home!). My obsession with avoiding waste led me to include tenderstem broccoli stalks, all that was left after Mrs P commandeered the more desirable parts, probably rather too much red Leicester cheese after I found it was trying to become a blue cheese, and some Greek yoghourt which had also developed a blue furry outer skin. I'm sure it'll be edible, if challenging to the palate. We'll find out later today.





* I couldn't believe it until Mrs Poacher showed me, but the coriander has survived the frosts like a gallant soldier! I always thought it was half hardy.


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## mudsticks (8 Jan 2021)

Poacher said:


> Mrs Poacher made some delicious carrot, butternut squash and coriander* soup yesterday, and included a red chilli at my suggestion.
> It's a bit on the spicy side, but mild by some standards, and so thick it can be heaped up in the middle of the bowl. (Sorry, no photo, you'll just have to imagine it.) Today was my turn to trash the kitchen. I decided that the oven would provide some welcome assistance to the struggling central heating, so a baking afternoon was called for. Here's a 100% white loaf (normally I'd include about 10% wholemeal), some of which will go with the rest of the soup, and some cheddar twists made with left over shortcrust from.....
> View attachment 567933
> 
> ...




Lookss yummy - my thoughts are turning to food now too - cold weather brings on the appetite like nothing else.

Regarding the dubious dairy - i generally work on the principal that if you can still outrun the cheese - its probs just fine ..

Don't quote me on that though - i suspect my biome is on the strongish side - on account of my _filthy _lifestyle 

Enjoy 

Edit - yes coriander is much hardier than many people realise - i suppose we still regard it as something a bit 'exotic' - i find it overwinters and keeps cropping slowly under non heated covers all through the winter.


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## Reynard (8 Jan 2021)

I'm of a mind that as long as it's not walked out of the fridge of its own accord and / or developed language skills, then it's probably perfectly fine. 

So i'm singing off the same hymn sheet as @mudsticks


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## jayonabike (10 Jan 2021)

Treated myself to a new 2lb loaf tin, which turned up yesterday. I used it to make a wholemeal loaf this morning. 
Pleased with both the tin and the loaf. 🙂


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## Tail End Charlie (11 Jan 2021)

Some buns I made recently. A sweet dough with a cream cheese, ricotta and icing sugar filling. From a Paul Hollywood book, he called them Vatrushka, a Russian recipe. They were delicious






The book is "The Weekend Baker" by PH, where he travels the world and gives you recipes from each country. Some of them are extremely good, I especially like the Polish Moss cake, which is a cake made using spinach. Sounds gross but it really works. My local WI were very impressed, which is high praise indeed.

Part way through making - 






Et voila !!


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## figbat (11 Jan 2021)

Just another overnight sourdough. I have the dough sorted, now experimenting with decorative slashing.


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## figbat (20 Jan 2021)

We had this last night. Classic Neapolitan pizza made using a traditional dough method. First hydrate the flour, then add yeast, knead and fold numerous times to incorporate air, prove (I proved overnight), one last fold, prove again, shape on the baking tray by pressing out with fingers (rolling is forbidden!), add a simple tomato sauce (blitzed tomatoes, olive oil, salt, sugar) and bake as hot as you can. Add the cheese a couple of minutes before the end and add the basil after it comes out.







It was hands-down the best pizza dough I’ve ever created, by a long margin. It was just like the artisan pizza dough I was after.

My oven goes to about 240°C and has an unfanned top and bottom element option, which I used here. Ideally I’d use a pizza oven, but don’t have one. I also don’t have a pizza stone but may get one. This was done on a semolina-covered, non-stick baking tray and came out crisp and light.

My tutor explained that for cooking in a domestic oven you need a wetter dough as it will be in there longer - a pizza oven dough can be dryer since it’ll only get 90 seconds or so in the oven.

Anyway, here’s how the dough looked after the overnight prove:




I used this flour, which I hadn’t realised was a blend of wheat and semolina - apparently this is why my dough was so wet as the semolina doesn’t absorb water like wheat does so can be a tricky flour to bake with. I just about managed to handle the sticky dough but would back out some water next time:


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## glasgowcyclist (20 Jan 2021)

figbat said:


> It was hands-down the best pizza dough I’ve ever created, by a long margin. It was just like the artisan pizza dough I was after.




That looks fab!

Any chance of the recipe, please?


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## figbat (20 Jan 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That looks fab!
> 
> Any chance of the recipe, please?


MY PIZZA RECIPE | Mariella Bliss


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## glasgowcyclist (20 Jan 2021)

figbat said:


> MY PIZZA RECIPE | Mariella Bliss



Excellent, thank you.


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## Tail End Charlie (23 Jan 2021)

Made a wholemeal loaf yesterday and I've not cut into it yet, but I know it'll be like a brick. In my defence, I've hurt my wrist and find kneading a bit difficult at the mo. Still, the birds will be happy, there's been a load of snow overnight and they'll need something in addition to my feeders.


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## Reynard (23 Jan 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> Made a wholemeal loaf yesterday and I've not cut into it yet, but I know it'll be like a brick. In my defence, I've hurt my wrist and find kneading a bit difficult at the mo. Still, the birds will be happy, there's been a load of snow overnight and they'll need something in addition to my feeders.



No need to knead the dough. Keep it in the bowl and fold it instead. Each time, bring the edge to the center, then rotate the bowl a bit, then bring the edge to the center etc. I always do my bread this way, simply because it also containerizes the mess. About 10 minutes of folding is usually enough to develop the dough.


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## Tail End Charlie (23 Jan 2021)

Reynard said:


> No need to knead the dough. Keep it in the bowl and fold it instead. Each time, bring the edge to the center, then rotate the bowl a bit, then bring the edge to the center etc. I always do my bread this way, simply because it also containerizes the mess. About 10 minutes of folding is usually enough to develop the dough.


I'll give that a whirl, although I do generally like a good bit of kneading and pummelling, gets all the frustrations out!


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## Reynard (23 Jan 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> I'll give that a whirl, although I do generally like a good bit of kneading and pummelling, gets all the frustrations out!



Hmm, indeed.  

Although I save my frustrations for splitting firewood.


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## CharlesF (23 Jan 2021)

Reynard said:


> No need to knead the dough. Keep it in the bowl and fold it instead. Each time, bring the edge to the center, then rotate the bowl a bit, then bring the edge to the center etc. I always do my bread this way, simply because it also containerizes the mess. About 10 minutes of folding is usually enough to develop the dough.


That’s similar to my method, 10 folds wait 30 minutes repeat the 19 folds until four rounds are complete. Then cover the bowl and in the fridge overnight. Takes longer but better bread at the end.


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## Tail End Charlie (23 Jan 2021)

Reynard said:


> Hmm, indeed.
> 
> Although I save my frustrations for splitting firewood.


Hence I need to knead, as my cutting firewood involves pressing a lever and button, which doesn't quite hit the spot!


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## glasgowcyclist (24 Jan 2021)

Well @figbat , that is a marvellous dough.

I've just eaten mine, which rose like a hot air balloon. I had pressed the dough out wide and thin so the rise took me by surprise. 

I thought I would try something different from the standard Italian and did a Scottish topping of blue cheese and black pudding. Boy was it good!😋


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## figbat (24 Jan 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well @figbat , that is a marvellous dough.
> 
> I've just eaten mine, which rose like a hot air balloon. I had pressed the dough out wide and thin so the rise took me by surprise.
> 
> ...


You’re welcome (although Mariella gets the credit really). In fact I’m doing a Zoom class with her in a couple of weeks on the subject of pizza dough - the one I did above was a test-run so I could have some questions or areas to work on.

Yours looks awesome!


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## Colin Grigson (30 Jan 2021)

My son and I started these at 05.00hrs this morning ... like proper bakers !. Our very first attempt at baking bread and we couldn’t be more pleased with the result - taste gorgeous.


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## jayonabike (30 Jan 2021)

Baking this morning, first was baguettes then a small white loaf


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## figbat (30 Jan 2021)

jayonabike said:


> Baking this morning, first was baguettes then a small white loaf
> View attachment 571237
> 
> View attachment 571238


A proper-coloured baguette. 👍🏻


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## figbat (31 Jan 2021)

I resuscitated my criminally-abused sourdough starter and threw together a last minute dough using Wessex Mill’s ‘Wessex Cobber’ flour - a favourite of mine. Overnight proving didn’t look promising as it barely rose, but a good knock-back and second prove in a warm place seemed to suggest it was still viable so into the oven and, ta-daaaah!


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## figbat (31 Jan 2021)

figbat said:


> I resuscitated my criminally-abused sourdough starter and threw together a last minute dough using Wessex Mill’s ‘Wessex Cobber’ flour - a favourite of mine. Overnight proving didn’t look promising as it barely rose, but a good knock-back and second prove in a warm place seemed to suggest it was still viable so into the oven and, ta-daaaah!
> View attachment 571356


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## Tail End Charlie (31 Jan 2021)

With sour dough, can you knock back more than once, as with "normal" yeast? I had a loaf proving, but forgot about it and it slumped back down. I've baked it now, but for the future does a second knock back work?


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

In part because of change to our food intake over the last 4 years, to reduce ‘food miles’ and improve the nutritional benefits, we were considering baking our own bread, indeed, had used a ‘bread machine’ to enable this during the last 2 years.
Wholly as a result of looking at this thread, we made a change this week and yours truly has become ‘a baker of bread!’
It’s only the first try to be fair, and did involve a ‘mix’ from the Bacheldre Watermill range, promising ‘just add water’ (well, and some butter too actually) and a recent stand mixer purchase.
I have to say, the methods was fraught with fear for me, as I hold dearly to my being a semi-perfectionist outlook.
Whilst not being perfect, the above was absolutely wonderloaf.. er wonderful, and I’m itching to make another.... and then another, and another.
Does this mean I’m hooked...?
It was delicious, with a squashed avocado and tomato.


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> View attachment 571896
> 
> View attachment 571897
> 
> ...



Welcome to the world of hand-baked bread. 

I will say that it's one of these things where you really do "learn by doing" but it's ever so worthwhile. Actually, Bacheldre Mill flours are really nice, I really dig their rye.

One tip I will give you is. when doing the bulk ferment and final proof, to watch the dough and not the clock.

Yeast is a funny beastie, and temperature, humidity, atmospheric pressure etc can change the way it reacts. So just keep an eye on it. It really does help to use the same bowl and tin each time (for the same mix), and then you get the hang of when the dough is ready for the next stage.

Oh, and the fridge is a useful tool if you need to slow a galloping dough down.


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

Thanks @Reynard that’s interesting, I’m certain we’ll do this one again, although I have others in the cupboard.
I proved in the oven at 50c as the house wasn’t’ warm’.
I think this one is a little over done, but tasty nonetheless, so more to learn!
Why Reynard btw, is it fox related..?


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> One tip I will give you is. when doing the bulk ferment and final proof, to watch the dough and not the clock.
> 
> Yeast is a funny beastie, and temperature, humidity, atmospheric pressure etc can change the way it reacts. So just keep an eye on it. It really does help to use the same bowl and tin each time (for the same mix), and then you get the hang of when the dough is ready for the next stage.
> 
> Oh, and the fridge is a useful tool if you need to slow a galloping dough down.


All of this!! I'd also add that the flour and even water quality and type can play a part, plus the whim of the yeast who can sometimes be vindictive as well as generous.

However, as I have said many times to many people, bread is the simplest thing in the world to make - people have been making it for millennia - all it needs at its most basic is flour and water. For a typical white loaf you need flour, water, yeast and a pinch of salt. The ratio of flour to water is important in order to get a dough you can handle and here is where the flour can make a difference and different flours - even different batches of the same flour - can absorb water differently. Having started as a basic baker and simply following a recipe I am now embroiled in the world of % hydration levels, but this is not required learning. As @Reynard said, watch the dough and do-learn-do. For a decent crust, put a shallow tray at the bottom of the oven whilst it is pre-heating then when you put the loaf in to bake pour boiling water into the tray and close the door. The steam raises humidity in the oven causing sugars in the dough to migrate to the surface and dissolve, which then caramelise to form the crust.

When I tell people I bake bread a common response is "I don't have a bread maker" to which I respond "all you need is a mixing bowl, some hands and an oven".


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> Thanks @Reynard that’s interesting, I’m certain we’ll do this one again, although I have others in the cupboard.
> I proved in the oven at 50c as the house wasn’t’ warm’.
> I think this one is a little over done, but tasty nonetheless, so more to learn!
> Why Reynard btw, is it fox related..?



My kitchen usually runs at about 18 degrees, and I just leave the dough on the counter in its bowl inside a clear plastic bag. A cooler bulk ferment, while it takes longer, will give you more flavour. 

Ah, I've been using Reynard as an internet handle since the mid-ish 90s (back in my uni days as an engineering undergrad) - it's racing car related.


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

Also to add, proving can be fraught. I now almost always prove overnight in a cool place - currently the garage which is integrated into the house but gets pretty cool (a fridge will also do and my baking tutor uses her doorstep!). Slower proving generally means more yeast-infused flavour and also means you can use less yeast. I see no reason not to knock-back and re-prove a collapsed dough - it is certainly worth a try as you have little to lose.

Having got consistent with simple bread doughs I moved on to enriched doughs and now make things like panettone, stollen, various iced or swirled buns (cinnamon, Chelsea etc), English muffins, focaccia, pizza - I'll have a go at anything!


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> All of this!! I'd also add that the flour and even water quality and type can play a part, plus the whim of the yeast who can sometimes be vindictive as well as generous.
> 
> However, as I have said many times to many people, bread is the simplest thing in the world to make - people have been making it for millennia - all it needs at its most basic is flour and water. For a typical white loaf you need flour, water, yeast and a pinch of salt. The ratio of flour to water is important in order to get a dough you can handle and here is where the flour can make a difference and different flours - even different batches of the same flour - can absorb water differently. Having started as a basic baker and simply following a recipe I am now embroiled in the world of % hydration levels, but this is not required learning. As @Reynard said, watch the dough and do-learn-do. For a decent crust, put a shallow tray at the bottom of the oven whilst it is pre-heating then when you put the loaf in to bake pour boiling water into the tray and close the door. The steam raises humidity in the oven causing sugars in the dough to migrate to the surface and dissolve, which then caramelise to form the crust.
> 
> When I tell people I bake bread a common response is "I don't have a bread maker" to which I respond "all you need is a mixing bowl, some hands and an oven".



A good starting point is 600g of white flour, 360g of water, 12g (salt 2% of flour) salt and however much yeast you need. For me, it varies according to how much time I have on my hands. I also add a tablespoon of vegetable oil as it helps the bread to keep.


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> A good starting point is 600g of white flour, 360g of water, 12g (salt 2% of flour) salt and however much yeast you need. For me, it varies according to how much time I have on my hands. I also add a tablespoon of vegetable oil as it helps the bread to keep.


Agree - good basic recipe. I sometimes also add a teaspoon of sugar, particularly if it's a quickie dough.
A rule of thumb says that the more fat you add the softer the bread will be, so you can make a dough using part or all milk and if you don't want a hard crust cover when removed from the oven to allow condensation to soften the crust.

Another tip (I am on a roll now - pun intended - as I am a chemist by training so have studied the science of baking to some extent) - the process by which bread stales is not principally of drying out, it is caused by the crystallisation of various molecules in the bread over time. To revive a day-or-two-old loaf or baguette simple sprinkle with a little water, wrap loosely in foil and bake for 15 minutes or so (dependent on size). You should end up with a nice, fresh crusty bread again. In fact I sometimes do this with bread I have bought anyway, even on the day of purchase. The heat and moisture reverses the crystallisation reaction.


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

Wow, thanks so much for all the guidance @Reynard @figbat thats great, if a little daunting 😅
I’m not put off though, I’m stunned at the quality of this attempt, and will do much more!
thanks again 👍😃


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> Wow, thanks so much for all the guidance @Reynard @figbat thats great, if a little daunting 😅
> I’m not put off though, I’m stunned at the quality of this attempt, and will do much more!
> thanks again 👍😃


Keep at it! It's one of those things that seems to be stigmatised as difficult but it really isn't. Besides, even if you manage to get it wrong what have you lost - some flour and a bit of yeast. I've been baking 'seriously' for about 5 or 6 years now and I still worry that it won't turn out right, sometimes because the whole family is relying on it coming out OK in order to have their next meal. So far nothing has come out inedible and despite my self-criticism about appearance or small details, it has all disappeared.

I'm back into sourdough baking again - now that is a _really _fickle beast! But so satisfying to get right.


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Feb 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> With sour dough, can you knock back more than once, as with "normal" yeast? I had a loaf proving, but forgot about it and it slumped back down. I've baked it now, but for the future does a second knock back work?




Yes. So long as the yeast has food to consume, it'll produce gas to lift the dough. However, this isn't endless so you may not get away with a 3rd or 4th knocking back and each rise may be less than before.


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Keep at it! It's one of those things that seems to be stigmatised as difficult but it really isn't. Besides, even if you manage to get it wrong what have you lost - some flour and a bit of yeast. I've been baking 'seriously' for about 5 or 6 years now and I still worry that it won't turn out right, sometimes because the whole family is relying on it coming out OK in order to have their next meal. So far nothing has come out inedible and despite my self-criticism about appearance or small details, it has all disappeared.
> 
> I'm back into sourdough baking again - now that is a _really _fickle beast! But so satisfying to get right.



Hrmph... Baking a frisbee is definitely a rite of passage...


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> Hrmph... Baking a frisbee is definitely a rite of passage...


The answer is in marketing - you baked an artisan unleaven flatbread.


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

Thanks again everyone! One question about my loaf today, is it a little over cooked, and does the texture look right? I ask because I think I could have removed the loaf from the oven maybe 4 to 5 minutes earlier, but then the dough may not have cooked inside.
Also, for whole meal or a grain loaf, would the proving/cooking times vary?
Thanks
SnG


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> Thanks again everyone! One question about my loaf today, is it a little over cooked, and does the texture look right? I ask because I think I could have removed the loaf from the oven maybe 4 to 5 minutes earlier, but then the dough may not have cooked inside.


To some extent it's a matter of taste. Yes, it's 'well done' but then this is _de riguer_ with artisan loaves and, to me, preferable to a pale loaf. The crumb looks OK to me too. For a 500g loaf (that is 500g of flour) I'd expect something like 40 minutes in the oven set pretty high (I'm usually at at least 200°C, sometimes higher if seeking proper artisanity). I've never had a loaf come out un-baked in the middle, but a simple tap-the-bottom test will usually tell you. Also I tend to take the loaf out of its tin (or off of its tray if free-form) for the last 10 minutes or so, so allow an all-over crust to develop. And slash-cutting the top will also help it rise uniformly, develop a crust and prevent unplanned cracks appearing down the sides or anywhere else (there is a phenomenon called 'oven spring' where the loaf rises quickly in the first few minutes; it also develops a dried crust quickly though so if you haven't slashed it on top the crust can form and then get burst by the swelling dough beneath it).



stoatsngroats said:


> Also, for whole meal or a grain loaf, would the proving/cooking times vary?


They might - as advised up-thread, keep an eye on it. Heavily seeded flours or those with a high wholemeal proportion may need a little less water-to-flour ratio and may also rise slower. Cooking times are, for me, about the same but generally the loaf comes out 'when its done', something you will develop an eye/nose/ear for with time.


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

Also forgot to mention I have used beer as the liquid in the dough too, but be careful not to use anything too hoppy as the bitterness really concentrates in the crust. Goes well in a dark bread though (eg rye).


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

@figbat ah, that’s great, I understand, thanks.
I’ve just changed my shopping order from the single 500g ‘mix’ to 1.5kg of flour, both white and wholemeal and some yeast, as I’m too good for the baby steps 😂 thanks to you and @Reynard
We’re alco-free, so will leave that for the time being, but thanks for all your help.


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

The first loaf I ever made turned out like the best white loaf I had ever bought; I wish I'd known I could do this years ago! If a duff one happens then don't beat yourself up, try and work out what happened and move on to the next one.

I use flour from the Wessex Mill - it is local to me, makes a lot of different varieties and is available in local farm shops and other outlets. I also like that it says on the back of each bag which farms supplied the wheat - it is all local and from fields I doubtless rode past as it was growing.


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## stoatsngroats (3 Feb 2021)

Thanks @figbat 
I agree about buying from local suppliers, we really do try to do this. Our local farm shop has a couple of different flours, but we’re not able to get out until Tuesday and we have a Sainsbury delivery booked at the weekend, so thought I’d add these in.
In future, we’ll look at the local suppliers in preference.
The ones I have ordered are Doves Farm, rather than the generic (genetic?) ones!


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

And another thing (sorry, it keeps coming to me) - when you first mix your flour and water, give it a good old kneading but if it looks too wet or dry you can correct with flour or water at this stage. However don't be too quick to correct as the flour absorbs the water and so what seems like a wet dough to start with may come back to you. Equally a slightly dry-looking mix may come together when fully worked together. If a dough is a bit tacky you can make it easier to handle on a damp surface and with damp hands - either water or a little oil. Using flour as an anti-stick agent will also work but will also add flour to your dough. Wetter doughs are better suited to contained baking (in a shaped tin) whereas a drier dough can be shaped free-form and baked on a tray.


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## figbat (3 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> Thanks @figbat
> I agree about buying from local suppliers, we really do try to do this. Our local farm shop has a couple of different flours, but we’re not able to get out until Tuesday and we have a Sainsbury delivery booked at the weekend, so thought I’d add these in.
> In future, we’ll look at the local suppliers in preference.
> The ones I have ordered are Doves Farm, rather than the generic (genetic?) ones!


Yeah, it's all good.


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> or those with a high wholemeal proportion may need a little less water-to-flour ratio



I’ve always worked on the opposite principle; wholemeal flour needs a higher hydration ratio than simple white.

@stoatsngroats Everyone’s kitchen and oven are different, you’ll need to get used to what works best for you in *your* environment.

I generally bake my big sandwich loaf (550g flour) at 180C for 35 minutes and I know it’ll be spot on. I’ve never relied on the tapping-the-bottom method as it seems too vague to me. If I’m at all worried about a loaf, I’ll use a food thermometer to check the middle. So long as it is at 91C I know it’s properly baked inside, the only reason to bake any longer is to affect the crust/finish.

For the clearest, down to earth explanations of everything related to baking, I heartily recommend subscribing to Jack Sturgess’s YouTube channel. He knows his stuff, doesn’t try to make it sound like a black art and gives you all his knowledge, no holding stuff back like some do.

Here’s his simple yeasted loaf from start to finish. Well worth doing, even if you have made lots of bread before: 
View: https://youtu.be/UlaXqK7C67g
. I often go back to it.


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> The answer is in marketing - you baked an artisan unleaven flatbread.



I dunno... Even my friend's chooks refused to eat it, it was that bad...


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## Reynard (3 Feb 2021)

I also find that the more wholegrain is in your dough, the more water it needs. Typically, a white bread works well at 60% hydration, that is 60% by weight the weight of your flour. A wholemeal bread tends to want around 65%, sometimes a little more.

If you do find that your dough is too wet, no need to panic. It's easily remedied by throwing in a handful of rolled (porridge) oats, as oats are brilliant at sucking up unwanted moisture. Plus it's nice in bread anyway, so I'll throw some in, just because.

I also like using chapatti (atta) flour - it's 80% extraction, so effectively the same as the half-and-half bread you can get. Makes a lovely loaf, and if you shop around, a 10kg sack can be had for a fiver.

My oven (electric fan) has vents in the door, so I have to bake bread in a clay pot, else the crust sets too quickly and then I get exploded and wonky loaves. Benefit of that is that the moisture in the loaf generates enough steam to give good oven spring. A 600g loaf takes about 45 minutes; 25 mins at 230C (the highest it will go) with the lid on, then the remaining 20 mins at 200C with the lid off.


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## figbat (6 Feb 2021)

Simple white crusty loaf, just out of the oven.

Started at around 11pm last night. 500g strong white flour, 7g dried yeast, ‘some’ salt (I tend to do this by hand), and enough water to make an easy-to-handle dough (turned out to be about 250 ml I’d guess).

10 minutes of kneading with a dough hook in the stand mixer, into a lightly-oiled bowl, covered with a disposable shower cap and left in the garage overnight.

Massive overnight prove was knocked back and folded a few times, roughly shaped and dropped into a lightly-oiled loaf tin and 2nd-proved in a warm place for around an hour. Again, huge rise so a deep slash lengthways across the top and into the oven at 200°C with a boiling water bath for 40 minutes, out of the tin for the final 10.

Sounds hollow, is firm all over and as it cools it is making a light “crackling” sound, which is always a good sign of a decent crust.

This will be lunch today.


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## stoatsngroats (6 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Simple white crusty loaf, just out of the oven.
> 
> Started at around 11pm last night. 500g strong white flour, 7g dried yeast, ‘some’ salt (I tend to do this by hand), and enough water to make an easy-to-handle dough (turned out to be about 250 ml I’d guess).
> 
> ...


Looks great! I’ve done another ‘mix’ this week, which was delicious, and I’m looking forward to another later today before our flour and yeast delivery arrives late tomorrow.


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## figbat (6 Feb 2021)

Also, to add, I always cool loaves on a raised rack as they give off a fair amount of water as they cool which condenses on any nearby surfaces - on a low cooling rack this leads to a wet surface underneath the loaf which could cause a soggy bottom.


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## stoatsngroats (6 Feb 2021)

@figbat ahh that’s interesting, I have that exact rack, which I’ll use in future, thanks for all your help and guidance and that to @Reynard too.
It’s certainly becoming an interesting time, and I have even noticed that our oven maybe cooking hotter than set, which may help a little too. Plenty of interest from Mrs SnG too, and we’ve had some wonderful bread this week.
Here’s hoping it’ll only get better, similar to yours and Reynards 😀


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## figbat (7 Feb 2021)

Pastry today. I made a simple savoury mince mix (onion, carrot, minced beef, stock cubes, stout [see beer thread], seasoning), stirred in some parboiled diced Maris Pipers then made a hot water crust pastry, filled, egg-washed and in the oven for around 45-50 minutes.












Nom!


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## stoatsngroats (7 Feb 2021)

Nom nom


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## Reynard (7 Feb 2021)

Aaaargh, now I'm wanting pasties! 

I did pick up a kilo of beef mince yesterday on yellow sticker, so...


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## figbat (7 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> Aaaargh, now I'm wanting pasties!
> 
> I did pick up a kilo of beef mince yesterday on yellow sticker, so...


I’ve done them before with a shortcrust pastry but the hot water crust really works well.


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## Reynard (7 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> I’ve done them before with a shortcrust pastry but the hot water crust really works well.



As does rough puff pastry. Which is what I'll use, as I've got some sitting in the fridge that needs using up.


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## Colin Grigson (13 Feb 2021)

A no knead loaf made with my son, started yesterday. The dough was very wet , 375ml water : 500g flour so nightmarish to shape and transfer to the cooking cloche - but ... the bread is tasty and great consistency - very moist indeed. I’ll try again next week now I know what I’m up against .


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## stoatsngroats (13 Feb 2021)

Still learning, but this is my first white loaf without using a ‘Mix’, just Doves flour,yeast, water, and a little salt.
I did a Doves wholemeal which could have had more proving, but was tasty nonetheless.
Since we started trying this, I’ve worked out that my oven runs hotter than the temperature dial, so we adjust a little the time and indicated temperature, which seems to have reduced the top burning.
It’s still early days, but we’re enjoying the task 😀


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

stoatsngroats said:


> View attachment 573696
> 
> Still learning, but this is my first white loaf without using a ‘Mix’, just Doves flour,yeast, water, and a little salt.
> I did a Doves wholemeal which could have had more proving, but was tasty nonetheless.
> ...


Your tiling is exactly how I want mine done! The bread looks good too.

I am in the middle of a Napoletana pizza-making course; made the dough last night and we‘ll be shaping, topping and baking later today. There were lots of hints and tips about dough last night though, and even though this is a pizza course, it was stated that this is just dough - use it however you wish. Anyway, a couple of things:

- salt should be 2% of the flour by weight. If you have to correct a wet dough by adding flour, don’t forget the extra salt!
- the water/flour ratio largely defines the bread type. Typical loaf ~65-67%, ciabatta ~70-75% and focaccia at a wet 80%
- the higher the protein level (‘strength’) of the flour, the longer it needs to autolyse (absorb the water). 12-14% ideal for pizza (mine is at 15% so a little high but with a long overnight prove should be ok).
- longer time, cold water and low yeast level is best; the use of lots of yeast and warm water allows a rapid result at the expense of structure and flavour.


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## stoatsngroats (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Your tiling is exactly how I want mine done!


.
😀 it’s been done well, and looks great![/QUOTE]



figbat said:


> I am in the middle of a Napoletana pizza-making course;


Definitely this is a little too early for me!

Thanks for the info, I’ll keep checking back to this thread as we progress, it has been a help so far!
👍


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## Colin Grigson (13 Feb 2021)

My colleague’s wife makes these iced gingerbread at Christmas, Valentines etc..., she’s very clever to do such intricate and delicate work. I always think it’s a shame to eat them.


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Your tiling is exactly how I want mine done! The bread looks good too.
> 
> I am in the middle of a Napoletana pizza-making course; made the dough last night and we‘ll be shaping, topping and baking later today. There were lots of hints and tips about dough last night though, and even though this is a pizza course, it was stated that this is just dough - use it however you wish. Anyway, a couple of things:
> 
> ...


And here‘s the money shot


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## stoatsngroats (13 Feb 2021)

@figbat looks like a proper Neapolitan! 👍👏👏👏👏👏


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## Colin Grigson (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> And here‘s the money shot
> View attachment 573747
> 
> View attachment 573748


That’s one of the best pizza I have ever seen


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

Colin Grigson said:


> That’s one of the best pizza I have ever seen


It’s the best I’ve ever eaten - amazing to realise I made it! I used the recipe and techniques posted upthread somewhere, with live advice, tips and guidance. This was achieved in a conventional oven on a regular baking tray using no special equipment or ingredients; the dough is just flour, water and yeast, the sauce is tinned tomatoes, olive oil, salt and sugar, the cheese is M&S cow mozzarella and the basil is... well, basil. All prepared by hand, no machines or mixers needed.


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## jayonabike (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> And here‘s the money shot
> View attachment 573747
> 
> View attachment 573748


That looks wonderful


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## jayonabike (13 Feb 2021)

My favourite, a simple white loaf. Kneaded by hand, proven 3 times (twice in a bowl then again once shaped in the tin) 
In the oven on its highest heat for 10 minutes with a tray of boiling water underneath then lower the temperature to 180c till it’s done. I make this 2 or 3 times a week.


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

jayonabike said:


> My favourite, a simple white loaf. Kneaded by hand, proven 3 times (twice in a bowl then again once shaped in the tin)
> In the oven on its highest heat for 10 minutes with a tray of boiling water underneath then lower the temperature to 180c till it’s done. I make this 2 or 3 times a week.
> View attachment 573756
> 
> View attachment 573755


Can’t beat a classic farmhouse loaf! I have been making more of these recently which has exposed the limitations of my ageing, cheap bread knife which struggled to start cutting a hard crust so I have a new Robert Welch one on order.


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## Colin Grigson (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> It’s the best I’ve ever eaten - amazing to realise I made it! I used the recipe and techniques posted upthread somewhere, with live advice, tips and guidance. This was achieved in a conventional oven on a regular baking tray using no special equipment or ingredients; the dough is just flour, water and yeast, the sauce is tinned tomatoes, olive oil, salt and sugar, the cheese is M&S cow mozzarella and the basil is... well, basil. All prepared by hand, no machines or mixers needed.


If I could produce that, I would eat it everyday for breakfast, lunch and dinner for the rest of my life - what more could a man want ?. Well done to you, you have my upmost respect


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## Reynard (13 Feb 2021)

Colin Grigson said:


> My colleague’s wife makes these iced gingerbread at Christmas, Valentines etc..., she’s very clever to do such intricate and delicate work. I always think it’s a shame to eat them.
> View attachment 573707



I make proper Lebkuchen (various varieties), but man, I've no patience to decorate them like that. Mine are a bit more, euhm, agricultural when it comes to the decoration  Basically, just a glaze and hundreds & thousands...


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## Reynard (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Your tiling is exactly how I want mine done! The bread looks good too.
> 
> I am in the middle of a Napoletana pizza-making course; made the dough last night and we‘ll be shaping, topping and baking later today. There were lots of hints and tips about dough last night though, and even though this is a pizza course, it was stated that this is just dough - use it however you wish. Anyway, a couple of things:
> 
> ...



Yup, so right about the 2% salt per flour weight.

Basically, the salt, as well as adding flavour, acts as a "handbrake" for the yeast. Too much salt and your bread won't rise because the salt will kill the yeast, and not enough, and it will take off at a gallop. The 2% gives you just the right balance.

A bread-in-a-hurry (which for me uses 5g of yeast for 600g of flour) is still going to taste way better than bought. Most recipes on the side of a flour bag want 14g i.e. 2 tsp for 500g flour. That's a dough you want to be watching like a hawk!


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

Colin Grigson said:


> If I could produce that...


If I can, I’m pretty sure you and anyone else can!


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## figbat (13 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> I make proper Lebkuchen (various varieties), but man, I've no patience to decorate them like that. Mine are a bit more, euhm, agricultural when it comes to the decoration  Basically, just a glaze and hundreds & thousands...


Same here - my bakes tend to be functional but not pretty. I make a Lebkuchen recipe most years around Christmas and having experimented with chocolate and icing variations have settled on the simple, classic thin icing glaze. One of the companies I work with send us Lebkuchen at Christmas and they are delicious - slightly spongier than mine with chopped nuts in. 😋


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## Reynard (13 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Same here - my bakes tend to be functional but not pretty. I make a Lebkuchen recipe most years around Christmas and having experimented with chocolate and icing variations have settled on the simple, classic thin icing glaze. One of the companies I work with send us Lebkuchen at Christmas and they are delicious - slightly spongier than mine with chopped nuts in. 😋



A thin glaze works best IMHO - unless you are making a house, and then you really do need the thicker icing that uses egg white. I use a mix of brandy and lemon juice and just a little water in the glaze.

I have at least a couple of hundred different recipes for Lebkuchen btw, some of them going back to the 19th century.  It never ceases to amaze me how by varying the proportions of the ingredients, you can get so many different flavours and textures. I make one type with candied ginger in it, and it's lush 

Although most of them *don't* have ginger in them at all. The flavour comes mainly from a mix of cinnamon, clove and black pepper.


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## Always Cross (13 Feb 2021)

I made Gino’s ciabatta loaves today very tasty also baklava as I keep bees I used honey instead of sugar in the syru.


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## Reynard (13 Feb 2021)

Oooooh, baklava! 

Haven't made that for a while... Keep meaning to, as I still have loads of foraged walnuts left, but the trouble is, they're just so nice to snack on.


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## Always Cross (14 Feb 2021)

I‘m afraid my cooking is tasty but never quite looks that pretty.


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## jayonabike (14 Feb 2021)

Rosemary & garlic Focaccia just out of the oven.
To go with the baked Camembert starter for Valentines Sunday lunch


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## Colin Grigson (14 Feb 2021)

jayonabike said:


> Rosemary & garlic Focaccia just out of the oven.
> To go with the baked Camembert starter for Valentines Sunday lunch
> View attachment 573895


That looks perfect  - any chance of a recipe please ?


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## jayonabike (14 Feb 2021)

Thanks
I got it off an app I use
Search for Kneady on the App Store
I highly recommend this app, some fantastic recipes and every one I’ve baked has come out wonderful


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## Colin Grigson (14 Feb 2021)

jayonabike said:


> Thanks
> I got it off an app I use
> Search for Kneady on the App Store
> I highly recommend this app, some fantastic recipes and every one I’ve baked has come out wonderful


Thank you Jay


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## Reynard (18 Feb 2021)

Tłusty Czwartek (fat Thursday) here today. So, doughnuts... Filled with home made plum butter.


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## Tail End Charlie (18 Feb 2021)

Reynard said:


> Tłusty Czwartek (fat Thursday) here today. So, doughnuts... Filled with home made plum butter.
> 
> View attachment 574571


I've never made doughnuts, but may have to rectify that, they look delish.


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## figbat (18 Feb 2021)

Another sourdough loaf but this time using techniques and processes learned in the recent pizza dough course.

I did maths before starting, working out how much flour, water, starter and salt to use for a 65% hydration - assuming the starter is at 100% hydration. This gave:

500g strong white flour
200g starter
290ml water
12g salt.

I mixed the flour and water to autolyse for a while before adding the starter and salt. I folded three times every 30 minutes then left overnight. This morning I gently folded again, put into a loaf tin and allowed to rise in a warm place. I then slashed and baked at 220°C with a steam bath for 25 minutes, removed from the tin and did another 15 minutes at 200°C.




It has risen more than my previous sourdough loaves and has a more open, less dense structure. Made a lovely bacon sarnie!


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## Reynard (18 Feb 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> I've never made doughnuts, but may have to rectify that, they look delish.



They were good. There's not that many of them left... 

And really, they're no more faffy than making buns.


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## MichaelW2 (18 Feb 2021)

My Swedish crispbread dough is rising overnight. Needs to be baked twice tomorrow.


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## MichaelW2 (19 Feb 2021)

MichaelW2 said:


> My Swedish crispbread dough is rising overnight. Needs to be baked twice tomorrow.



Possibly too thick. They are a bit chewy rather than crispy even after 2nd bake but a lot tastier than riveta.


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## figbat (27 Feb 2021)

Another new technique learned today - Dutch oven method. It’s all a bit of a faff but it turns out a good loaf.


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## Always Cross (27 Feb 2021)

How do you use the Dutch oven cold into a hot oven, start from cold oven, heat Dutch oven in the oven first?


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## glasgowcyclist (27 Feb 2021)

figbat said:


> Another new technique learned today - Dutch oven method. It’s all a bit of a faff but it turns out a good loaf.



For sourdough, dutch oven is my preferred method and is no faff at all. (At least it isn’t for me but I’ve done it a hundred times.). It creates the perfect environment for a good rise and crust.



Always Cross said:


> How do you use the Dutch oven cold into a hot oven, start from cold oven, heat Dutch oven in the oven first?



My pot (minus lid) goes into the oven when I switch it on to heat up. When my dough is ready to bake, I transfer it to the pot in a silicone sheet, then pour some water between the sheet and the pot to create plenty of steam and drop the lid on before putting it back in the oven.

I have a more detailed description of my routine somewhere in this thread with photos of each step. When I find it I’ll link it here.

Edited to add: here’s the post.. https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-bakers-thread.228233/post-6009614


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## Reynard (27 Feb 2021)

I bake my breads in a clay pot because my ancient fan oven has vents in the door and it makes the crust set too quickly otherwise.

Pot, lid and all, goes into a cold oven, and then gets heated up as the oven pre-heats. Otherwise there's a danger of it shattering. Need to be careful when plopping the dough out of the banneton and into the pot, but to be honest, it's not faffy. You just get used to it I suppose. I take the lid off halfway through the bake.


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## figbat (27 Feb 2021)

I shaped and 2nd-proved in a colander lined with a well-floured tea-towel (I don’t have a banneton), then turned that out onto a sheet of baking paper to be slashed on top. The pot and lid were pre-heated to as hot as the oven would go, then the slashed bread was lifted and gently dropped into the pot and back in the oven - no water added. 20 minutes with the lid, 25 without - temp lowered when the lid off.

Great crust which was not as impenetrable as an oven-baked loaf. This was a low-yeast, long-prove dough but with yeast rather than sourdough.


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## Always Cross (28 Feb 2021)

I got this from Lakeland I could never get a round loaf to hold it’s shape without it flattening out. I know how to tighten the dough for the final proving but doesn’t work for me. With this thing I final prove in that slash it the straight In the oven


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## jayonabike (1 Mar 2021)

Couple of french baguettes just out of the oven in time for lunch


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## figbat (1 Mar 2021)

Pizza tonight. I went full authentic with this one, using San Marzano tomatoes and fior di latte, just so I could see what difference it makes. It was very nice, but I’m not sure I can justify the extra expense vs regular tinned tomatoes and regular mozzarella.


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## jayonabike (3 Mar 2021)

Baked a Dutch oven boule for the first time today
Still to hot to cut but looks and smells wonderful


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## RoubaixCube (4 Mar 2021)

Im new to baking -- New as in never having done it since leaving secondary school some 20 years ago so please excuse the kitchen fire....

Im looking for a tried and tested flapjack recipe if any of you are willing to share. Ive already had a google around and have bought some ingredients and i have adapted this here recipe for mega portions as I did go overboard buying 20 odd different types of seeds and dried fruit to put in .

Instructions are pretty clear, its a case of knocking out the first batch, taste testing and deciding if it needs more of one thing or less of the other. My parents want a nibble too so naturally ive had to cut down some of the syrup and sugar thats going into the mix. Im toying with the idea of cutting out some of the butter too but thats what the taste test is for.

At the moment my own recipe is an extra 50% of most things on that recipe linked apart from the syrup and sugar which i have cut down on...

180g butter,
150g Sugar
2&1/2 TBS Syrup
375g rolled oats
100g mixed seeds
100g mixed fruits

------

And yes, I hear you say _"Why not use honey instead of Syrup??"_ -- Sadly mum likes to talk *a lot* about how hard life would be with diabetes and to cut down all sugar (while she herself throws back shots of Lucozade and raisins...) so sweet things like honey and syrup are generally banned in this house unless its for her own approved consumption. Please dont ask me why... She'll say something is too sweet then I'll come back from a ride to find shes eaten all of what she was complaining about. She is just quirky like that  -- Its what i have to live with.


Please o'baking gods of CC, bestow upon me your knowledge and expertise.


::EDIT::

I didnt actually go with any of the suggested measurements

175g butter
90g sugar
1tbs syrup
230g oats
100g mixed seeds
125g mixed fruit - sultanas, apricots & cranberry's

Turned out quite well.


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## RoubaixCube (6 Mar 2021)




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## RoubaixCube (6 Mar 2021)




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## LeetleGreyCells (6 Mar 2021)

I‘ll leave this here for your critique


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## smokeysmoo (6 Mar 2021)

I've only just seen this thread so here's a few of Miss Smoo's creations from this year.

See never fails to amaze us with her bakes, and if you'd like to see more you can find her on Instagram as mollys.baking, or click HERE to go to straight to her account 

Oh and the photography is all her own work too 

Olive Oil Cake





Neapolitan Swirl Biscuits





Battenberg Cake




Viennese Lemon Curd Biscuits




Poppy Seed Sourdough Rolls




Sourdough Loaf (made with homemade starter)


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## Reynard (6 Mar 2021)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've only just seen this thread so here's a few of Miss Smoo's creations from this year.
> 
> See never fails to amaze us with her bakes, and if you'd like to see more you can find her on Instagram as mollys.baking, or click HERE to go to straight to her account
> 
> ...



Those look good. And the photography is banging too. 

Err, Miss Smoo can't lob over some of those viennese biscuits by any chance?


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## annedonnelly (6 Mar 2021)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've only just seen this thread so here's a few of Miss Smoo's creations from this year.
> 
> See never fails to amaze us with her bakes, and if you'd like to see more you can find her on Instagram as mollys.baking, or click HERE to go to straight to her account
> 
> ...


I take it you have to test all these creations!!


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## IaninSheffield (6 Mar 2021)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've only just seen this thread so here's a few of Miss Smoo's creations from this year.
> 
> See never fails to amaze us with her bakes, and if you'd like to see more you can find her on Instagram as mollys.baking, or click HERE to go to straight to her account


Has she submitted her application for GBBO yet?


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## smokeysmoo (6 Mar 2021)

annedonnelly said:


> I take it you have to test all these creations!!


You better believe it


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## figbat (6 Mar 2021)

The battenberg reminded me of a bake from a few years ago. Made in celebration of the queen’s 90th birthday, for a village celebration we had. I give you the Britainberg...


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## Tail End Charlie (7 Mar 2021)

figbat said:


> The battenberg reminded me of a bake from a few years ago. Made in celebration of the queen’s 90th birthday, for a village celebration we had. I give you the Britainberg...
> View attachment 577403


That is top work. I can't work out how it's done either.


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## Tail End Charlie (7 Mar 2021)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've only just seen this thread so here's a few of Miss Smoo's creations from this year.
> 
> See never fails to amaze us with her bakes, and if you'd like to see more you can find her on Instagram as mollys.baking, or click HERE to go to straight to her account
> 
> ...


In all the years I've baked sourdough loaves, I have never got one to look like that last one, and boy, have I tried.


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## figbat (7 Mar 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> That is top work. I can't work out how it's done either.


I drew it all up first, working out what cuts to make and how to assemble it. I then baked two sponges, one red, one blue. Each was cut into the predetermined shapes. Using a tin lined with baking paper and then white marzipan I laid it down from the bottom, laying each strip and separating with buttercream. I had had the idea for a while and just went at it one day, with no idea if or how it would work out. It turned out a well as I could ever have imagined and was the talk of the village party.

For the same event I also made a ‘full English’ gala pie; hot water crust pastry, sausage meat filling with boiled eggs running through it, topped with bacon and surrounded by a tomato jelly. Sadly this stuck in the tin and got a bit messed up on removal, so we ate that at home.


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## Reynard (7 Mar 2021)

figbat said:


> I drew it all up first, working out what cuts to make and how to assemble it. I then baked two sponges, one red, one blue. Each was cut into the predetermined shapes. Using a tin lined with baking paper and then white marzipan I laid it down from the bottom, laying each strip and separating with buttercream. I had had the idea for a while and just went at it one day, with no idea if or how it would work out. It turned out a well as I could ever have imagined and was the talk of the village party.
> 
> For the same event I also made a ‘full English’ gala pie; hot water crust pastry, sausage meat filling with boiled eggs running through it, topped with bacon and surrounded by a tomato jelly. Sadly this stuck in the tin and got a bit messed up on removal, so we ate that at home.
> View attachment 577527



That gala pie...


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## Reynard (7 Mar 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> In all the years I've baked sourdough loaves, I have never got one to look like that last one, and boy, have I tried.



On the flip side, at least your marmalade doesn't fall through the holes...


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## Tail End Charlie (7 Mar 2021)

Reynard said:


> On the flip side, at least your marmalade doesn't fall through the holes...


Yes, I've often wondered about the practicalities of having breakfast with bread like that, doesn't stop me trying though. That said, I'm quite happy with my sourdough bread and indeed, marmalade is my preferred topping! Together with a coffee, bliss.  I actually go to sleep every night looking forward to having my brekkie.


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## Reynard (7 Mar 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> Yes, I've often wondered about the practicalities of having breakfast with bread like that, doesn't stop me trying though. That said, I'm quite happy with my sourdough bread and indeed, marmalade is my preferred topping! Together with a coffee, bliss.  I actually go to sleep every night looking forward to having my brekkie.



I'm a tea, toast and marmalade girl in the mornings. 

Actually, marmalade making is on the agenda for tomorrow. I have a batch of fruit (tangerine, sweet orange & seville orange) cut, cooked and waiting to meet up with some sugar.


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## smokeysmoo (7 Mar 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> In all the years I've baked sourdough loaves, I have never got one to look like that last one, and boy, have I tried.


She got 2 from the first batch of sourdough she made, and not having anything to use for the Dutch oven method she heated the trays first and put a baking tray with water in to create the steam, beginners luck? I don't know but they tasted great 

The next sourdough loaves she made after buying a casserole dish to use the Dutch oven method, but she used a different recipe and wasn't as pleased with the results, they still tasted great but it's definitely a dark art that she'll have to keep tweaking as she goes, which probably about sums baking up in general I suppose


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Mar 2021)

I thought I'd switch from sandwiches to rolls for lunch this week and made these on Monday. 

They are from this BBC Good Food recipe, although I switched the water for milk.

I’m really happy with them, soft and fluffy inside. I might leave them in a wee bit longer next time for a darker crust.


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## Dave 123 (17 Mar 2021)

Since becoming a Dog owner again I seem to have not had much time to bake...

I’ll have to remedy this.


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## glasgowcyclist (28 Mar 2021)

I haven’t made these for a while but with Easter around the corner it seemed like a good excuse.

Hot cross buns...






My only mistake was to warm the golden syrup glaze too much so that it’s become almost like a skin.


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## CanucksTraveller (28 Mar 2021)

A rare interlope into the baking thread, but I had a try at some savoury scones earlier. These are mustard, Stilton and spring onion, they turned out really well and they're quite moreish.


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## glasgowcyclist (28 Mar 2021)

CanucksTraveller said:


> A rare interlope into the baking thread, but I had a try at some savoury scones earlier. These are mustard, Stilton and spring onion, they turned out really well and they're quite moreish.
> View attachment 581070



Those look bloody marvellous. What’s the recipe?


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## CanucksTraveller (28 Mar 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Those look bloody marvellous. What’s the recipe?


Thank you! Here you go... 

275g self raising flour
1 tsp bicarb
1 heaped tsp mustard powder
Half a tsp of fine sea salt
60g of very cold butter (I put it in the freezer for 20 mins)
210ml buttermilk 
3 normal sized spring onions, finely sliced. 
100g Stilton, crumbled up. 
1 beaten egg
Poppy seeds

Sieve the dry ingredients together and stir, grate the butter in, then work them together with fingers until crumbly, like you're making shortcrust. 
Pour in the buttermilk, spring onions and Stilton, and mix lightly with a fork until only just combined, try not to overmix. 
Bring the dough together into a ball with floured hands, put it on a baking paper lined sheet and flatten it by hand to make a thick disc (a good inch thick). I shapes the edges into a tidy circle with a wooden spatula. 
Slice the disc into 6, like a pizza, then just drag the slices out slightly with your knife so they're about 1cm apart. (See pic). 
Brush with egg and sprinkle with a handful of poppy seeds. Into the oven at 190 to 200 for about 20 to 25 mins. 
The slices meet up again in the oven and it ends up like a tear and share bread.


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## annedonnelly (29 Mar 2021)

I made hot cross buns too.





Also cheese scones but they weren't as successful as @CanucksTraveller's so no photo!


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## JtB (2 Apr 2021)

Instead of hot cross buns, a loaf with cinnamon and mixed fruit - delicious.


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## Reynard (2 Apr 2021)

Mmmmm, that looks good.


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## numbnuts (2 Apr 2021)

Mince pies, yes I know they should have been hot cross buns, but I don't follow rules


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## Reynard (2 Apr 2021)

numbnuts said:


> Mince pies, yes I know they should have been hot cross buns, but I don't follow rules
> View attachment 581922



Mince pies go down well *any* day of the year as far as I'm concerned


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## Reynard (2 Apr 2021)

Well, someone's got to go traditional, so it may as well be me LOL (I didn't bake a Babka this year though, as no Easter basket...)


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## CanucksTraveller (3 Apr 2021)

It's my wife's birthday, she doesn't like birthday cake so I've baked some scones for a cream tea.


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Apr 2021)

I’m experimenting with a new (to me) method of bread making that I saw on a Paul Hollywood programme. He was talking to Jim Lahey in New York about his no-knead, long fermentation technique, which looked to produce lovely bread so I am giving it a try.

I briefly mixed the dough yesterday at 4pm and left it overnight, knocking it back and shaping it at 9.30am today. It’s very wet, at 75% hydration so gets done in a dutch oven. It came out of the oven about 20 minutes ago and I’m hoping to cut into it by 2pm or so.

I can’t wait!⏱

Photo to follow...


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Apr 2021)

Well!

While I was hopeful of a good result, this bread is phenomenal; the crust, the flavour, I haven’t baked anything better than this.

A few years ago we had a lovely holiday in Sant’ Agnello, Sorrento, and the hotel had fresh breads every morning from the local panificio. I had a particular favourite which I would gorge on every day and, ever since returning, I have searched for a recipe that would reproduce the flavour, colour and the thin, chewy crust of that loaf.

I think I’ve finally found it.











This was only an experiment so I used half quantities, that’s why it’s such a small boule.
Next week I will do the full sized version but will bake it in my pullman tin with the lid.

Roll on next weekend!


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## Colin Grigson (3 Apr 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well!
> 
> While I was hopeful of a good result, this bread is phenomenal; the crust, the flavour, I haven’t baked anything better than this.
> 
> ...


That looks fantastic 
Any chance you could post the recipe please


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## Reynard (3 Apr 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I’m experimenting with a new (to me) method of bread making that I saw on a Paul Hollywood programme. He was talking to Jim Lahey in New York about his no-knead, long fermentation technique, which looked to produce lovely bread so I am giving it a try.
> 
> I briefly mixed the dough yesterday at 4pm and left it overnight, knocking it back and shaping it at 9.30am today. It’s very wet, at 75% hydration so gets done in a dutch oven. It came out of the oven about 20 minutes ago and I’m hoping to cut into it by 2pm or so.
> 
> ...



I've done that of a time or two. It's one of those you think is never going to turn out, but it always does... The dough is near enough pourable, like a batter, but gives a damn good loaf.


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Apr 2021)

Colin Grigson said:


> That looks fantastic
> Any chance you could post the recipe please



https://www.nigella.com/recipes/guests/jim-laheys-basic-no-knead-bread

**Note that I did not follow the method of resting the dough in floured towels, I used a silicone sheet inside a banneton. Doesn’t matter how much I flour a towel, it never comes away cleanly from the dough and usually damages it. When the dough was ready to bake, I inverted the banneton over another silicone sheet and use that to lower the dough into the pot I baked it in.


*INGREDIENTS*
Yields: One 10-inch / 25cm round loaf

METRIC

400 grams bread flour
8 grams table salt
1 gram instant or other active dry yeast
300 grams cool (55-65°F / 12-18°C) water
wheat bran or cornmeal or additional flour for dusting

*METHOD*
Basic No-Knead Bread is a guest recipe by Jim Lahey.
Equipment: A 4½- to 5½-quart heavy pot

In a medium bowl, stir together the flour, salt, and yeast. Add the water and, using a wooden spoon or your hand, mix until you have a wet, sticky dough, about 30 seconds. Make sure it’s really sticky to the touch; if it’s not, mix in another tablespoon or two of water. Cover the bowl with a plate, tea towel, or plastic wrap and let sit at room temperature (about 72°F / 22°C), out of direct sunlight, until the surface is dotted with bubbles and the dough is more than doubled in size. This will take a minimum of 12 hours and (my preference) up to 18 hours. This slow rise - fermentation - is the key to flavor. 


When the first fermentation is complete, generously dust a work surface (a wooden or plastic cutting board is fine) with flour. Use a bowl scraper or rubber spatula to scrape the dough onto the board in one piece. When you begin to pull the dough away from the bowl, it will cling in long, thin strands (this is the developed gluten), and it will be quite loose and sticky - do not add more flour. Use lightly floured hands or a bowl scraper or spatula to lift the edges of the dough in toward the center. Nudge and tuck in the edges of the dough to make it round.
Place a cotton or linen tea towel (not terry cloth, which tends to stick and may leave lint in the dough) or a large cloth napkin on your work surface and generously dust the cloth with wheat bran, cornmeal, or flour. Use your hands or a bowl scraper or wooden spatula to gently lift the dough onto the towel, so it is seam side down. If the dough is tacky, dust the top lightly with wheat bran, cornmeal, or flour. Fold the ends of the towel loosely over the dough to cover it and place it in a warm, draft-free spot to rise for 1 to 2 hours. The dough is ready when it is almost doubled. If you gently poke it with your finger, making an indentation about ¼ inch deep, it should hold the impression. If it doesn’t, let it rise for another 15 minutes.
Half an hour before the end of the second rise, preheat the oven to 475°F / 245°C, with a rack in the lower third position, and place a covered 4½ - to 5½ -quart / 4¼ - 6¼ litre heavy pot in the center of the rack.
Using pot holders, carefully remove the preheated pot from the oven and uncover it. Unfold the tea towel, lightly dust the dough with flour or bran, lift up the dough, either on the towel or in your hand, and quickly but gently invert it into the pot, seam side up. (Use caution - the pot will be very hot) Cover the pot and bake for 30 minutes.
Remove the lid and continue baking until the bread is a deep chestnut color but not burnt, 15 to 30 minutes more. Use a heatproof spatula or pot holders to carefully lift the bread out of the pot and place it on a rack to cool thoroughly. Don’t slice or tear into it until it has cooled, which usually takes at least an hour.


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## Colin Grigson (3 Apr 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> https://www.nigella.com/recipes/guests/jim-laheys-basic-no-knead-bread
> 
> **Note that I did not follow the method of resting the dough in floured towels, I used a silicone sheet inside a banneton. Doesn’t matter how much I flour a towel, it never comes away cleanly from the dough and usually damages it. When the dough was ready to bake, I inverted the banneton over another silicone sheet and use that to lower the dough into the pot I baked it in.
> 
> ...


Thank you - I must try this


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## bluenotebob (5 Apr 2021)

A couple of things that I've been making often recently .. 

A focaccia with Comté cheese, tomatoes and oregano (sometimes with finely chopped red onion in the dough, sometimes with halved stoned black olives - and sometimes with Reblochon, or Palet de Géant cheese). 

There are lots of different types of focaccia in Italy - I'm told this one resembles an Apulian-style focaccia.









And some spelt rolls .. 320g of spelt flour makes 12 small rolls (20 mins at 210C).

My neighbours' kids love these .. and so do I.


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## Reynard (5 Apr 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well!
> 
> While I was hopeful of a good result, this bread is phenomenal; the crust, the flavour, I haven’t baked anything better than this.
> 
> ...



I made one rather than my usual everyday loaf.

Good job I watch the dough, not the clock, as the damn thing decided to gallop away rather merrily... 

I do everything in the mixing bowl, degassing with a spatula, simply to avoid all the mess in transferring, and only pouring the dough into a very well-floured banneton for the final proof.

Mine is currently cooling. Will go nicely with minestrone soup for lunch tomorrow.


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## RoubaixCube (8 Apr 2021)

Dad was expecting to cook dinner. He rushed me to use the kitchen early so we ended up having an early dinner...







I had absolute zero confidence in myself and dad probably had less than zero but this lot was gone in less than 30mins so it was an amazing achievement.

First ever pasta bake with lean mince, peppers, mushrooms and an onion. chedder, mozzarella & a dusting of Parmesan when fresh out of the oven.

It was missing a cheese or white sauce in between though.

My next bake is a lasagne so im stepping up my comfort level.


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## RoubaixCube (17 Apr 2021)

Used the left over ingredients from a failed lasagne and made pasta bake #2 'creamy edition'

Pretty much a _'half lasagne'-- _used up the rest of the sauces and followed a suggestion to have a few slices of Emmental cheese with a thick layer of white sauce in the middle and some at the top. It was good!


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## figbat (18 Apr 2021)

I made a batch of overnight ‘pizza’ dough (600g flour) knowing I had a BBQ today, but not quite sure what to do with it. I toyed with making individual flatbreads or a large focaccia but in the end went with two large flatbreads (as big as our oven will accommodate) and cut them into pieces for sharing.

They turned out lovely - baked ahead of time then wrapped in foil and kept warm - this also helps soften them rather than being crusty.


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## MntnMan62 (19 Apr 2021)

Made my first loaf of bread today. Sourdough. Didn’t rise enough but it tastes great.


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## Poacher (19 Apr 2021)

MntnMan62 said:


> Made my first loaf of bread today. Sourdough. Didn’t rise enough but it tastes great.
> 
> View attachment 584665
> View attachment 584666


Straight in with a sourdough! Total respect!


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## MntnMan62 (19 Apr 2021)

Poacher said:


> Straight in with a sourdough! Total respect!



Ok, I did cheat a little bit. A neighbor gave us some starter. So we've been feeding the starter for months now. My wife has always made the bread but this time around I decided it was time for me to see how it's done. So, I definitely had a little help.


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## Tenkaykev (21 Apr 2021)

Asking for advice for a friend ( well, Mrs Tenkaykev )
I've had a Panasonic bread maker for a few years and have been mostly very pleased with the results. It's encouraged me to experiment with the recipes provided with the machine and I've been trying out baking bread without using the machine.
Now Mrs Tenkaykev has taken an interest and likes to bake, usually all by hand but occasionally using the machine. Her loaves tend to be a bit "compact " is the best way of putting it. I'm posting a photo of the latest effort, complete with the recipe and would be grateful for any advice on improving the final product.
First the recipe that she used:

500g flour in the ratio 70/30 strong wholemeal / strong white
350ml warm water
1 teaspoon instant yeast ( Doves Farm )
1 teaspoon molasses
1 1/2 tablespoons good quality oil
1 teaspoon Marmite
1/2 teaspoon Ascorbic Acid

Here's the result: This one was made in the bread machine, but a hand made loaf came out very similar


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## Reynard (21 Apr 2021)

The higher the amount of wholemeal flour in a loaf, the more compact it will be - nature of the beast. That's because the husks of the grain cut the strands of gluten, which means the dough can't expand quite as much as one made from white flour, as it's not as elastic.

Only way around that is to drop the amount of wholemeal in the loaf - most of my loaves are around 30% wholegrain, which I find is a good compromise. There's no hard and fast rule really, just play around with the ratio of flour till you get something that works.


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## Tenkaykev (21 Apr 2021)

Reynard said:


> The higher the amount of wholemeal flour in a loaf, the more compact it will be - nature of the beast. That's because the husks of the grain cut the strands of gluten, which means the dough can't expand quite as much as one made from white flour, as it's not as elastic.
> 
> Only way around that is to drop the amount of wholemeal in the loaf - most of my loaves are around 30% wholegrain, which I find is a good compromise. There's no hard and fast rule really, just play around with the ratio of flour till you get something that works.


Many thanks, I’ll pass that on 👍


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## IaninSheffield (21 Apr 2021)

Tenkaykev said:


> Asking for advice for a friend ( well, Mrs Tenkaykev )
> I've had a Panasonic bread maker for a few years and have been mostly very pleased with the results. It's encouraged me to experiment with the recipes provided with the machine and I've been trying out baking bread without using the machine.
> Now Mrs Tenkaykev has taken an interest and likes to bake, usually all by hand but occasionally using the machine. Her loaves tend to be a bit "compact " is the best way of putting it. I'm posting a photo of the latest effort, complete with the recipe and would be grateful for any advice on improving the final product.


Agree with @Reynard's point about wholemeal/white flour ratio. Taking that a stage further, how do loaves with no wholemeal flour come out of the machine? If they're also somewhat 'compact', then some part of the machine's cycle might be sub-optimal and either not fully developing the gluten, or not allowing long enough for a good rise.


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## Tenkaykev (21 Apr 2021)

IaninSheffield said:


> Agree with @Reynard's point about wholemeal/white flour ratio. Taking that a stage further, how do loaves with no wholemeal flour come out of the machine? If they're also somewhat 'compact', then some part of the machine's cycle might be sub-optimal and either not fully developing the gluten, or not allowing long enough for a good rise.


If I use all white flour then they are often too large and “airy” in texture, especially near the top crust.


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## IaninSheffield (21 Apr 2021)

Tenkaykev said:


> If I use all white flour then they are often too large and “airy” in texture, especially near the top crust.


Cor blimey! That's going to take some unpicking! Maybe the machine's default rising time is too long, but that won't help with a dough with too much wholemeal, for the reasons Reynard set out.
It's going to take some experimentation to find the ideal proportions of ingredients to make the breads you like ... plenty of bread to enjoy during the process though. Even a less than perfect homemade loaf is better than many supermarket breads.

Hand making is definitely the way to go though. This young feller-me-lad is a bit brash (for an old codger like me), but he definitely knows his bread and I've learned quite a bit from his vids. His YT portfolio is quite extensive, but this trio is a helpful starter 
View: https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL23nszfeBoFn7qw_SrSJtIJSula87n46v


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## Reynard (21 Apr 2021)

The other option is to let the machine take care of the elbow grease side of things, and do the rest by hand.

One of the best lessons I learned was to watch the dough and not the clock. A machine is only as good as its programming, but yeast is a living organism, sensitive to temperature, humidity and atmospheric pressure, and even the same recipe can behave differently on different days.


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## mistyoptic (21 Apr 2021)

Tenkaykev said:


> Asking for advice for a friend ( well, Mrs Tenkaykev )
> I've had a Panasonic bread maker for a few years and have been mostly very pleased with the results. It's encouraged me to experiment with the recipes provided with the machine and I've been trying out baking bread without using the machine.
> Now Mrs Tenkaykev has taken an interest and likes to bake, usually all by hand but occasionally using the machine. Her loaves tend to be a bit "compact " is the best way of putting it. I'm posting a photo of the latest effort, complete with the recipe and would be grateful for any advice on improving the final product.
> First the recipe that she used:
> ...


Not used to seeing bread recipes with no salt. Are you relying on the Marmite for salt provision?


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## Colin Grigson (2 May 2021)

Homemade energy bars .... ridiculously healthy ingredients


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## C R (7 May 2021)

Haven't baked much recently, but today baked a big batch of barbari

See if you can tell which is mine, without checking the image metadata.


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## glasgowcyclist (7 May 2021)

C R said:


> Haven't baked much recently, but today baked a big batch of barbari
> 
> See if you can tell which is mine, without checking the image metadata.
> 
> ...


I’ve never heard of barbari before. Tell me more...

(I’ll guess yours are in the first photo.)


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## Reynard (7 May 2021)

Turkish / middle-eastern bread, I'd hazard a guess...

Going to throw some naan together to go with tonight's curry.


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## figbat (7 May 2021)

C R said:


> Haven't baked much recently, but today baked a big batch of barbari
> 
> See if you can tell which is mine, without checking the image metadata.
> 
> ...


Must know more!!


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## C R (7 May 2021)

Barbari comes from the area around the Afghanistan/Iran border. In Farsi nun barbari means literally the bread of the barbarians, and is the most popular bread in Iran according to Wikipedia.

It is fairly easy to make though for a long time I couldn't get it right, until I found out that it needs to be baked in a very hot oven. You can find loads of recipes online, mine is as follows.

300ml water
3 cups white bread flour
1 ½ tsp salt
1 tsp sugar
A squirt of olive oil
¾ tsp quick yeast

Mix and knead as usual, I use a breadmaker for this. I leave it to raise for two and a half hours, then knock back, split into four parts and let relax for a bit.

In the meantime put a pizza stone in the oven and let it warm up to maximum temperature, and prepare a flour wash, I use 3 parts water 1 part flour.

Take one of the dough parts and stretch to a rectangular shape by hand, to a thickness of between five and ten mm. Press with your fingertips lengthwise to form the lines you can see, press as much as you can without breaking the dough. Lift from the surface to make surely it isn't stuck. Brush with the wash and sprinkle with sesame seeds. Now lift the bread onto the stone, and bake for about 10 minutes. Repeat for the rest of the dough.

@glasgowcyclist was correct, mine are the first photo.


----------



## Tenkaykev (7 May 2021)

mistyoptic said:


> Not used to seeing bread recipes with no salt. Are you relying on the Marmite for salt provision?


Sorry for the late reply, I think that marmite is the salt source.


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## BrumJim (21 Jun 2021)

Father's Day baking with my son. Using weekendbakery.com and trying their cinnamon bun recipe:





























Very, very tasty. Highly recommended.


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## Reynard (21 Jun 2021)

BrumJim said:


> Father's Day baking with my son. Using weekendbakery.com and trying their cinnamon bun recipe:
> View attachment 595117
> 
> View attachment 595118
> ...



If you like the Lotus biscuits, I highly recommend their recipe for Speculaas


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## BrumJim (21 Jun 2021)

Reynard said:


> If you like the Lotus biscuits, I highly recommend their recipe for Speculaas


I know. You've mentioned them before. Working out what to do without the moulds.


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## Reynard (22 Jun 2021)

BrumJim said:


> I know. You've mentioned them before. Working out what to do without the moulds.



The moulds are a faff.

Just make balls the size of a walnut, put them on a greased and lined baking sheet and squash them. They will spread a bit, so give them a bit of space. In my oven, they take about 10 mins at 170 C (fan) - you may want to tweak this a little.

The alternative is to roll the dough into a log, wrap in cling film, cool till very firm and then cut into slices about 4mm thick.


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Jul 2021)

Talking on the other thread about overnight doughs got me hankering for another of the Jim Lahey variety so I started it last night. Having had trouble previously getting the floured towel off the dough without degassing it, I thought of another option; using my Lékué silicon bowl/mould.

I could ferment the dough as usual in the big glass bowl, shape it the next morning and then transfer it to the Lékué. The only problem is that the silicon mould isn’t as steam-tight as a pot so I used tin foil to seal the thing better. It was an experiment but I’m glad to say it worked well.

I mixed the dough at 21:25 last night, leaving it covered in the kitchen.

Next morning it was a wonderful, bubbly, wobbly mass.






At 10:40 I shaped it into a boule and transferred it to the Lékué.





By 12:35 it was nearly doubled in volume and it went into the oven with the extra tinfoil sealing the end gaps to keep the steam inside as much as possible.

After 30 minutes I removed the foil and opened the mould to start colouring the bread.





10 minutes later I took the mould away completely to let the bread bake on the stone and properly darken.

I was happy with the colour after 50 minutes of baking.





I listened to it crackle and pop, desperate for it to cool so I could cut it.

My word, what a smashing loaf, so full of flavour.





I think my total hands-on time was about 10-12 minutes, it did most of the work itself just developing flavour overnight while I slept. Easy peasy.


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## IaninSheffield (5 Jul 2021)

Never tried a no-knead bread but, inspired by @glasgowcyclist, I thought I'd give the Jim Lahey method a try. I've also never tried baking bread in a pot before, mainly because I didn't think I had one ... but then remember I had a rarely used, large metal casserole languishing at the back of a cupboard.




Oh my! Such taste!

I wouldn't necessarily recommend it as an 'easy' loaf - the high hydration dough takes a bit of wrangling. After the overnight prove and a quick 4 'folds', I gently placed it onto semolina'd parchment paper for the 2nd prove. The paper allowed me to easily lower it into and when baked, remove it from the casserole. Got this tip from here:


View: https://youtu.be/NNmJMHa1QWA?t=224​

I think it might have been slightly better for a couple of minutes more in the oven with the lid off, but after this success, the casserole dish and I have agreed not to remain such strangers.


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## glasgowcyclist (5 Jul 2021)

IaninSheffield said:


> I think it might have been slightly better for a couple of minutes more in the oven with the lid off



When mine was the colour of your finished loaf I baked it for another 15 minutes.
I was nervous at getting the crust a dark chestnut colour as that was way beyond my normal cue for taking it out of the oven, but the flavour of that crust is soooo intense.


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## BrumJim (6 Jul 2021)

IaninSheffield said:


> Never tried a no-knead bread but, inspired by @glasgowcyclist, I thought I'd give the Jim Lahey method a try. I've also never tried baking bread in a pot before, mainly because I didn't think I had one ... but then remember I had a rarely used, large metal casserole languishing at the back of a cupboard.
> 
> View attachment 597490​
> Oh my! Such taste!
> ...




Fascinated by the idea of no-knead bread. Surely that's like decaffeinated coffee? What is the point in making bread if you don't take out the frustrations of life on the dough for 15 minutes?

Might give it a go, though. Just have to wait until I'm in a good mood.


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## Reynard (6 Jul 2021)

BrumJim said:


> Fascinated by the idea of no-knead bread. Surely that's like decaffeinated coffee? What is the point in making bread if you don't take out the frustrations of life on the dough for 15 minutes?
> 
> Might give it a go, though. Just have to wait until I'm in a good mood.



Ah, that's where firewood chopping comes in handy...


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## glasgowcyclist (31 Jul 2021)

I’m looking for some information please; does anyone have any reliable recipes for using a bread machine to bake a long-fermented dough?

A friend has been using a machine for years and has no oven but he’d like to try to achieve a tastier loaf using, say, a poolish. I’ve had a search around the usual forums but what I have been finding is recipes that use the machine for kneading and resting but with the final bake done in an oven.

Anyone got any ideas?


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## C R (31 Jul 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I’m looking for some information please; does anyone have any reliable recipes for using a bread machine to bake a long-fermented dough?
> 
> A friend has been using a machine for years and has no oven but he’d like to try to achieve a tastier loaf using, say, a poolish. I’ve had a search around the usual forums but what I have been finding is recipes that use the machine for kneading and resting but with the final bake done in an oven.
> 
> Anyone got any ideas?


Some machines have the capability of creating a user defined program, so you can set the duration of each phase. Ours has that capability, but with the limitation that the program total duration can not exceed 24 hours. Not sure if that would be good enough. 

Alternatively, if your friend are OK to do all the other steps by hand, the bread makers have a bake mode, where they just bake. Usually you have a choice of duration, but not of temperature, at least in ours, maybe a proper posh expensive one has more capabilities.


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## jayonabike (1 Aug 2021)

When I bake bread I knead by hand. The wife has just bought a fancy food mixer and it comes with a dough hook which I want to try. How quick will the mixer take compared to kneading by hand?


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## IaninSheffield (1 Aug 2021)

jayonabike said:


> When I bake bread I knead by hand. The wife has just bought a fancy food mixer and it comes with a dough hook which I want to try. How quick will the mixer take compared to kneading by hand?


Having done it both ways, I don't recall much of a time difference. When using a machine, you don't have the same immediate 'feel' for the dough, although what you do have is two free hands to be getting on with something else. 👐


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## glasgowcyclist (1 Aug 2021)

C R said:


> Some machines have the capability of creating a user defined program, so you can set the duration of each phase. Ours has that capability, but with the limitation that the program total duration can not exceed 24 hours. Not sure if that would be good enough.
> 
> Alternatively, if your friend are OK to do all the other steps by hand, the bread makers have a bake mode, where they just bake. Usually you have a choice of duration, but not of temperature, at least in ours, maybe a proper posh expensive one has more capabilities.


I'll check to see what he has. He has zero experience of kneading, so I might have to show him how it's done.


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## glasgowcyclist (1 Aug 2021)

jayonabike said:


> When I bake bread I knead by hand. The wife has just bought a fancy food mixer and it comes with a dough hook which I want to try. How quick will the mixer take compared to kneading by hand?



I got a lovely Kitchen Aid stand mixer as a Christmas present and although it's good for kneading, it's not ay better than doing it by hand. As IaninSheffield says, it does free you up to do other things, maybe measuring out the other ingredients you want to add to the dough. 

I prefer using my hands as I can feel the dough getting to the correct consistency. It's much more enjoyable too!


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## Tail End Charlie (1 Aug 2021)

This is a new one for me. Earlier this year I bought two black chokeberry bushes as I rather liked the way the stems had been twisted together and thought they would look great in a pot. At the time they were covered with buds which later blossomed into white blossom and looked fantastic. 






Been watering diligently and the white blossom has turned into black berries, (which also looks stunning). Loads of them. So I Googled recipes and found one which looked interesting so I gave it a whirl. It's an upsidedown cake and the batter part has equal quantities of flour and oatmeal. All the recipes mentioned how astringent chokeberries are, so I carefully followed them (which is unusual for me).





Had to try a slice and it was delicious, I don't especially like sweet things, so the fruit is ideal for me, there is a harshness to it, but the sugar that is in counters it well. Apparently it gets better the second day, time well tell, well tomorrow will, on that one. Had some leftover topping from a previous cake (soured cream, mascarpone and a bit of sugar) which married well with it. There's easily enough on the bushes for another one over the next week or so.




I've now decided to plant the bushes in the ground, with a wire support to hold them up, as in my experience, plants and especially fruit do better in the ground.


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## John the Monkey (22 Aug 2021)

Some flatbread - unleavened, so super easy and quick to make;





The last decent loaf I've made recently - this was going to be sourdough, but the pre-ferment barely bubbled. Rather than waste it, I added it to a "normal" 75% wholemeal recipe and made this;


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## simongt (22 Aug 2021)

Just back from a week in Dundee, the GLW's home town. Brought a stack of Scotch, steak, Balmoral pies for the freezer , plus a supply of individual fruit pies for me and friends who rave over them . Can't get anything even near them in England, even trying local bakers to give them a go, but they can't do them at a cost effective price; 97p. each. Shame.


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## RoubaixCube (27 Aug 2021)

Oatmeal and raisin berry cherry cookies. My 3rd attempt.






Berries from Lidl's berry and cherry mix and cranberry and raisin mix


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## glasgowcyclist (28 Aug 2021)

My second go at a ciabatta recipe, with a little more success in the shaping. I still find this the trickiest part.


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## John the Monkey (31 Aug 2021)

Had my first acceptable results from the "scrapings" sourdough starter method. Had to change my baking schedule/method a bit, but happy with these and starter feeds are a lot less wasteful now!

Seeded white loaf;




...and a Pain de Campagne type loaf (baked as a batch of two) made to use up my wholemeal flour;





Oven spring isn't quite as good as my old method, but good enough.


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## Tail End Charlie (2 Sep 2021)

Been making a few clafoutis recently, using different fruits. Basically whisk up some egg yolks and sugar, fold in some whisked up egg whites and bake. Love the end result, because it bakes the mix differently depending on the level so you end up with a custardy base, a runny middle, with almost a spongy top. So far I've used, blackberries, raspberries and plums (all from the garden). The blackberry one was my favourite. 





I realise it would have been helpful to take a photo of the inside to show what I mean, but I forgot.


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Sep 2021)

Anyone else here have the bread book "Crumb" by Richard Bertinet? If not, I don't recommend it. 

I made his pain de mie loaf the other day, although instead of making traditional 2 x 1lb tin loafs I made a single large bloomer.






Excellent for sandwiches, fluffy soft inside, with very little crust to speak of but way too salty for my tastes. The recipe (with 500g flour) calls for a whopping 20g of salt. My usual practice is always follow a recipe to the letter on the first go, then adjust subsequent bakes as required. I have since discovered that the 20g is a misprint and should only be 10g. 

It seems there are numerous errors within the book, so if you have it you might want to take a look at this page where he lists them and the corrections. CRUMB........whoops.... erratum.... - The Bertinet Kitchen Cookery School 

Thirteen errors is a lot! As well as the many mistakes, the recipes are poorly written, requiring the reader to flip back to earlier references for instructions on different stages. All too messy and not something you want to be doing with doughy hands. I've made some lovely bread from it but the constant toing and froing within the book makes it too much of a faff so I haven't used it as much as I'd have liked. I prefer a self-contained recipe with everything I need to know in one place.


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## Reynard (8 Sep 2021)

Well, 10g is the typical 2% salt.

I've a few books on bread, albeit not that one, but I don't really use them. I've found by trial and error what works for me and tend to stick to it.


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Sep 2021)

Reynard said:


> Well, 10g is the typical 2% salt.



That’s the measurement I am used to but who was I to contradict the famous French baker? I also thought the 20g of caster sugar, which I wouldn’t normally use, would balance it somewhat. 

I think I’ll trust my gut in future.


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## Reynard (8 Sep 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That’s the measurement I am used to but who was I to contradict the famous French baker? I also thought the 20g of caster sugar, which I wouldn’t normally use, would balance it somewhat.
> 
> I think I’ll trust my gut in future.



Just because someone's famous, doesn't mean what they put their name to is good. 

Salt isn't there just for flavour. It also acts as the "handbrake" on the yeast and stops it from galloping out of control. Too much salt and you risk killing the yeast.

I sometimes put a heaped teaspoon of sugar in when activating the dried yeast, usually when the yeast has been open for a while and has lost some of its "oomph". It does help the flavour along just a bit, especially in the crust.


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## figbat (12 Sep 2021)

Technically not baking, but we’re having homemade curry tonight and I fancied some bread to go with. I knocked together a simple 60% hydration bread dough this morning, using about half the normal yeast and let it prove all day. Then I stretched it out on a floury work surface, cut into portions and cooked in a hot pan - I kept the lid on to keep the moisture in to help keep them soft.

They look the part, tasting to come in a few minutes.


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## glasgowcyclist (12 Sep 2021)

figbat said:


> Technically not baking, but we’re having homemade curry tonight and I fancied some bread to go with. I knocked together a simple 60% hydration bread dough this morning, using about half the normal yeast and let it prove all day. Then I stretched it out on a floury work surface, cut into portions and cooked in a hot pan - I kept the lid on to keep the moisture in to help keep them soft.
> 
> They look the part, tasting to come in a few minutes.
> View attachment 608848
> ...


They look fab!


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## Reynard (12 Sep 2021)

They'd be good with my home made hummus!


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## figbat (12 Sep 2021)

I can report they were lovely! Reviewed by the family as “the best flatbreads you’ve made”, which is not a bad review as I have made quite a few, but I do agree with them!

I may move on to some enhancements next time - herbs, spices or even some kind of stuffing.


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## C R (12 Sep 2021)

figbat said:


> I can report they were lovely! Reviewed by the family as “the best flatbreads you’ve made”, which is not a bad review as I have made quite a few, but I do agree with them!
> 
> I may move on to some enhancements next time - herbs, spices or even some kind of stuffing.


Could you expand a bit on your baking method?


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## figbat (12 Sep 2021)

C R said:


> Could you expand a bit on your baking method?


Sure. Put the biggest pan I could find on the hob and heat to a medium-high level (number 7 of 9 on our induction hob). Having previously stretched the breads into individual portions I waited until the pan was properly hot then simply dropped a single bread in and put the lid on. I checked after a minute or so how it was doing underneath then flipped it over when the bottom had that slightly mottled/charred effect. About the same time on the other side where the bubbles that had formed on side 1 caught the charring and that was that. Probably 2-3 minutes per bread. I let them cool a little on a rack before stacking them all together while still a little warm to help retain the softness. Wrapped the pile in a tea towel ahead of eating. Next time I would serve them warm if used with a hot meal.


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## C R (12 Sep 2021)

figbat said:


> Sure. Put the biggest pan I could find on the hob and heat to a medium-high level (number 7 of 9 on our induction hob). Having previously stretched the breads into individual portions I waited until the pan was properly hot then simply dropped a single bread in and put the lid on. I checked after a minute or so how it was doing underneath then flipped it over when the bottom had that slightly mottled/charred effect. About the same time on the other side where the bubbles that had formed on side 1 caught the charring and that was that. Probably 2-3 minutes per bread. I let them cool a little on a rack before stacking them all together while still a little warm to help retain the softness. Wrapped the pile in a tea towel ahead of eating. Next time I would serve them warm if used with a hot meal.


Thank you, great idea, a sort of surrogate tanoor.


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## Tom B (19 Sep 2021)

figbat said:


> Sure. Put the biggest pan I could find on the hob and heat to a medium-high level (number 7 of 9 on our induction hob). Having previously stretched the breads into individual portions I waited until the pan was properly hot then simply dropped a single bread in and put the lid on. I checked after a minute or so how it was doing underneath then flipped it over when the bottom had that slightly mottled/charred effect. About the same time on the other side where the bubbles that had formed on side 1 caught the charring and that was that. Probably 2-3 minutes per bread. I let them cool a little on a rack before stacking them all together while still a little warm to help retain the softness. Wrapped the pile in a tea towel ahead of eating. Next time I would serve them warm if used with a hot meal.




Pretty much how I do mine, but I add a few Nigella seeds and brush with garlicky melted butter.

They're delicious with a slow cold proved dough (couple of days) or sour dough.


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## bluenotebob (27 Sep 2021)

Here’s something I haven’t made for a while – a cheese & onion cornbread.

It’s straightforward – flour and polenta, a couple of eggs, buttermilk, melted butter, a smallish red onion, cheese (I used a mature Comté – but Cheddar would be fine), plus sugar, salt and baking powder – however it creates a small mountain of washing-up.

Best left until cool (it tears easily if cut when warm). Delicious on its own and it also works well as a _scarpetta_ – to soak up sauce etc.


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## jayonabike (7 Oct 2021)

The wife made her Christmas cake, I made a few sausage rolls.


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## C R (7 Oct 2021)

Some banana bread last night, pretty much all gone after breakfast


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## jayonabike (11 Oct 2021)

White loaf just out of the oven plus a steak & mushroom pie I made for Sunday lunch yesterday


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## CharlesF (11 Oct 2021)

@jayonabike Recipe for the steak pie, please. Looks too good not to share!!


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## Venod (11 Oct 2021)

Finally used some of the Blackberries we picked a few week back, no apples available, so added two small pears to the mix, tastes good.


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## Leedsbusdriver (11 Oct 2021)

An easy to make boiled fruit cake.


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## jayonabike (12 Oct 2021)

CharlesF said:


> @jayonabike Recipe for the steak pie, please. Looks too good not to share!!


I’ll try and post up the recipe after work later


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## figbat (14 Oct 2021)

Cinnamon babka, baked this morning after proving the dough overnight and assembling first thing. I’ve done a couple of these before - a family favourite.


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## annedonnelly (14 Oct 2021)

figbat said:


> Cinnamon babka, baked this morning after proving the dough overnight and assembling first thing. I’ve done a couple of these before - a family favourite.



A family favourite? You've a lucky family. Looks fantastic. can just imagine the smell as it's baking!


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## figbat (14 Oct 2021)

annedonnelly said:


> A family favourite? You've a lucky family. Looks fantastic. can just imagine the smell as it's baking!


The difficult part was giving it time to cool before diving in!

I came across the recipe a few years ago and have made it a few times. My kids aren’t great with various inclusions in cakes and buns (no fruit, no nuts etc) but cinnamon is a winner. It was interesting when they did a chocolate version on GBBO - I plan to give that a try too.


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## figbat (16 Oct 2021)

Cheaty baking - ready-made puff pastry combined with surplus pears from my parents’ harvest glut = pear turnovers. Plus two jam turnovers for the I-don’t-like-cooked-fruit daughter (ironic given that jam is exactly that!).


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## Reynard (16 Oct 2021)

Those look good @figbat 

Nothing wrong with using ready made puff pastry.  It's one of the "cheats" I tend to use. 

P.S. Pickled pears are very nice with cheese and cold cuts


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## figbat (16 Oct 2021)

Reynard said:


> Those look good @figbat
> 
> Nothing wrong with using ready made puff pastry.  It's one of the "cheats" I tend to use.
> 
> P.S. Pickled pears are very nice with cheese and cold cuts


Some kind of chutney was also mooted, but it looks like the remainder of the pears and the accompanying apples are going in crumbles.😋


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## Reynard (16 Oct 2021)

figbat said:


> Some kind of chutney was also mooted, but it looks like the remainder of the pears and the accompanying apples are going in crumbles.😋



There's a Polish bake called a "placek" which is the generic term for a rich sponge (it uses sour cream) topped with fruit. Apples and plums are more typical, but it's very nice with sliced pears as well. A drop of almond extract in the batter doesn't go amiss when using pears.


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## figbat (16 Oct 2021)

Reynard said:


> There's a Polish bake called a "placek" which is the generic term for a rich sponge (it uses sour cream) topped with fruit. Apples and plums are more typical, but it's very nice with sliced pears as well. A drop of almond extract in the batter doesn't go amiss when using pears.


Pear and almond - classic combo. Another option was a pear and frangipane tart, but pear crumble is possibly my favourite crumble (rhubarb runs it close).


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## Reynard (16 Oct 2021)

figbat said:


> Pear and almond - classic combo. Another option was a pear and frangipane tart, but pear crumble is possibly my favourite crumble (rhubarb runs it close).



I'm more of an apple-and-quince-crumble kind of girl. Quince pears add a lovely, fragrant and slightly citrusy note to the apples. And a bit more of a bite, as bramleys will cook right down to a fluff.


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## annedonnelly (21 Oct 2021)

I've been craving a Bakewell tart for a while.


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## figbat (21 Oct 2021)

I love a good Bakewell! I keep meaning to try a pudding version, with a slightly less well done, ‘sloppier’ frangipane and possibly a flaky pastry, although the traditionalists may frown. It’s one of those dishes with various ‘proper’ versions, depending where you look.


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## figbat (24 Oct 2021)

I made this as a practice ahead of my annual Christmas baking bonanza. It’s a panettone dough but I made it around 60% of the normal size, as it’s a practice and only me and the wife eat it, hence I did it in a loaf tin rather than the panettone tin, which it would have struggled to fill. Booze-soaked fruit is the only ‘flavouring’ - I had intended to add some Christmassy spices but forgot, so another practice will have to happen!


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## figbat (24 Oct 2021)

Inside…


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## bluenotebob (24 Oct 2021)

figbat said:


> Inside…



That looks stunning ! Well done ! 

Also good in-flight cycling food - I wonder how many more kilometres you could cycle after one slice of that ? - another 30 or 40?


----------



## figbat (24 Oct 2021)

bluenotebob said:


> That looks stunning ! Well done !
> 
> Also good in-flight cycling food - I wonder how many more kilometres you could cycle after one slice of that ? - another 30 or 40?


It also makes a great bread and butter pudding substrate (should any get left over).


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## figbat (29 Oct 2021)

More Christmas practicing. Tonight is biscotti. One almond and cherry and t’other hazelnut and chocolate chip. Proper ‘ard they are!


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## glasgowcyclist (29 Oct 2021)

figbat said:


> More Christmas practicing. Tonight is biscotti. One almond and cherry and t’other hazelnut and chocolate chip. Proper ‘ard they are!
> View attachment 615607
> 
> View attachment 615608
> ...





Ooh, I could just go a few of those with some vin santo to dip them in!


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## C R (2 Nov 2021)

A molete today, managed to get a reasonable rise.


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## Eziemnaik (7 Nov 2021)

Quickish foccacia for breakfast


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## Tom B (7 Nov 2021)

C R said:


> A molete today, managed to get a reasonable rise.
> View attachment 616116



Would you mind sharing recipe / instructions for that one?


----------



## figbat (7 Nov 2021)

A few amaretti this morning.


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## C R (7 Nov 2021)

Tom B said:


> Would you mind sharing recipe / instructions for that one?


Of course, here goes. 

Recipe
270ml warm water
3 cups strong white flour 
1.5 tsp sugar 
1.5 tsp salt 
Squirt of olive oil, I don't measure the oil, but at a guess I would say 1tbsp
3/4 tsp yeast, you can use maybe 1/2 tsp yeast and raise for longer, which gives a bit more flavour, but I find the rise less predictable 

Method 
Mix and knead as per usual method, I use a breadmaker to mix, knead and rise, and pour out once the dough raises to 3/4 of the tin, to knock back and shape as a ball, then let relax for about an hour. 

For baking I use a baking stone, heat the stone in the oven to 180C, place the dough on the stone and bake until the crust looks right. To avoid the shape flopping during transfer I place the dough on a baking sheet after shaping. 

For the one in my post above I put a bowl with water in the oven while baking. It took longer to get to the right colour, but the crust was crispier, and the flavour seemed to develop more.


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## figbat (7 Nov 2021)

For crustiness I put a small baking tray at the bottom of the oven whilst it is preheating and then when I put the bread in to cook I pour boiling water from a kettle into the hot tray.

The science of it, as I understand it, is that sugars in the dough dissolve in the moisture on the surface and then caramelise to form the crust.


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## C R (7 Nov 2021)

figbat said:


> For crustiness I put a small baking tray at the bottom of the oven whilst it is preheating and then when I put the bread in to cook I pour boiling water from a kettle into the hot tray.
> 
> The science of it, as I understand it, is that sugars in the dough dissolve in the moisture on the surface and then caramelise to form the crust.


Do you put the tray on the oven "floor" or on a rack near the bottom?


----------



## figbat (7 Nov 2021)

C R said:


> Do you put the tray on the oven "floor" or on a rack near the bottom?


Usually on the floor.


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## Tom B (7 Nov 2021)

C R said:


> Do you put the tray on the oven "floor" or on a rack near the bottom?



When I bake bread at work I throw half a mug of boiling on the bottom of the oven bottom because there is only one shelf (hey it was a £89 cooker). It doesn't seem to come to any harm


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## annedonnelly (7 Nov 2021)

Bake with Jack always says to bake with steam. My fancy new cooker has a setting for that & a depression in the base to pour the water in.


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## glasgowcyclist (7 Nov 2021)

Baking with steam prevents a crust forming too early, allowing the dough to rise to its full potential without bursting Along a seam or weak point.


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## Reynard (7 Nov 2021)

Same principle as baking in a pot.

I can't use steam cos my oven door's got vents in it.


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## figbat (7 Nov 2021)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Baking with steam prevents a crust forming too early, allowing the dough to rise to its full potential without bursting Along a seam or weak point.


And this is what slashing is also for, allowing the dough to rise and expand. I use a very sharp blade to make a decent, deep slash to allow a good rise.


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## Reynard (7 Nov 2021)

figbat said:


> And this is what slashing is also for, allowing the dough to rise and expand. I use a very sharp blade to make a decent, deep slash to allow a good rise.



Or, you can put your bread seam side up, and let it expand that way. Works best with a boule if you shape it in the same way you do vienna rolls.


----------



## Eziemnaik (10 Nov 2021)

Chocolate fondant


----------



## glasgowcyclist (28 Nov 2021)

This pain de mie has become my favourite sandwich loaf. The focaccia is for my wife but she might let me have a bit since I baked it.


----------



## C R (28 Nov 2021)

@glasgowcyclist, do you have a link for the recipe of the loaf? Looks interesting. Our children have been asking for molete for their sandwiches, so made another one today, going for the arty farty look.


----------



## figbat (5 Dec 2021)

More Christmas practicing. Still in search of a centrepiece cake that isn’t Christmas cake. I’ve done panettone and stollen before but these have limited family appeal. Today’s effort is this, a babka done in a ring tin and using mixed spice in place of cinnamon.





Very pleased with how this has turned out - it looks suitably impressive and for the final one I plan to maybe drizzle with icing and do some icing holly leaves and berries for the centre.

All assuming it cuts and eats ok and gets the family seal of approval. Update to follow…


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 Dec 2021)

I've had another go at a ciabatta and out came these two monsters. I used half quantities too.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 Dec 2021)

C R said:


> @glasgowcyclist, do you have a link for the recipe of the loaf?



Sorry @C R , I thought I had already done this. There isn’t an online version I can find so I’ll type it up for you after dinner. 👍


----------



## Reynard (5 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> More Christmas practicing. Still in search of a centrepiece cake that isn’t Christmas cake. I’ve done panettone and stollen before but these have limited family appeal. Today’s effort is this, a babka done in a ring tin and using mixed spice in place of cinnamon.
> View attachment 620694
> 
> 
> ...



In Poland, the centrepiece cake for Christmas is a Makowiec - which is a yeasted "swiss roll" filled with a mix of poppy seeds, fruit, nuts and honey.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 Dec 2021)

@C R The recipe is for 2 medium tin loaves but I keep it as one large 2lb loaf.

Here it is:
Ingredients - 
150g full-fat milk
200g cool water
500g strong white bread flour
7g yeast
20g caster sugar
10g fine sea salt
50g unsalted butter

Mix all the ingredients in a bowl and knead on slow speed for 4 minutes, then increase to medium for 10-12 minutes until dough comes away cleanly from the sides of the bowl.

Shape into a ball and leave in a bowl to rest for 1.5 hours or until double in volume.

Divide the dough in half and shape into balls.

Heat oven to 230°C.

Put a ball of dough in each tin and cover, leaving them to prove until the dough has reached the top of the tin.

Place tins in the oven and quickly mist with water spray before closing the door.
Bake for 20-25 minutes until golden brown.

(I do my single, large loaf for ~35 minutes.)


----------



## figbat (5 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> More Christmas practicing. Still in search of a centrepiece cake that isn’t Christmas cake. I’ve done panettone and stollen before but these have limited family appeal. Today’s effort is this, a babka done in a ring tin and using mixed spice in place of cinnamon.
> View attachment 620694
> 
> 
> ...


I can confirm, it cuts and eats more than ok - it is delicious! I have made cinnamon versions as a loaf before but this one is every bit as good. A really light texture sponge with gooey spiced swirls through it, which caramelise to chewy and crispy bits on the outside. I think this is our centrepiece cake.


----------



## Colin Grigson (11 Dec 2021)

Individual apple pies … following a gift box of apples


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## figbat (11 Dec 2021)

Another babka. Still cooling so I haven’t cut it yet. For this one I used ground ginger in the dough and the filling is a mix of butter, soft brown sugar, ground ginger and finely-diced stem ginger soaked in syrup. I then glazed it with the syrup from the stem ginger jar.


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## Colin Grigson (11 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> Another babka. Still cooling so I haven’t cut it yet. For this one I used ground ginger in the dough and the filling is a mix of butter, soft brown sugar, ground ginger and finely-diced stem ginger soaked in syrup. I then glazed it with the syrup from the stem ginger jar.
> View attachment 621514


The word ‘Babka’ means ‘grandmother’ here …. would you be able to point me to a recipe please - my Slovak wife is drooling here and would like to try


----------



## figbat (11 Dec 2021)

Colin Grigson said:


> The word ‘Babka’ means ‘grandmother’ here …. would you be able to point me to a recipe please - my Slovak wife is drooling here and would like to try


This is the one I use. I just substitute the spices and nuts for different flavours.
https://realfood.tesco.com/step-by-step/how-to-make-babka.html


----------



## figbat (11 Dec 2021)

And by the way, this ginger one is as awesome as the previous cinnamon ones and mixed spice one!


----------



## Colin Grigson (12 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> This is the one I use. I just substitute the spices and nuts for different flavours.
> https://realfood.tesco.com/step-by-step/how-to-make-babka.html


Thank you figbat - appreciated


----------



## Reynard (12 Dec 2021)

I'm going to have a crack at that as well. 

It's totally different from the traditional Polish babka that I usually bake for Christmas and Easter, but it really tickles my fancy.


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## figbat (16 Dec 2021)

One from the archives. This is a Christmas gala pie I made for a family gathering a couple of years back. The centre is sausage meat, wrapped in bacon, surrounded by turkey mince with a jelly made with stock, wrapped in hot water crust pastry.


----------



## Colin Grigson (18 Dec 2021)

Biscuit and cookie baking session with the children, we wanted to make up some gift boxes for our long suffering neighbours (our new house build is disruptive to the usual tranquility they enjoy) and now we’re off to deliver


----------



## alchurch (18 Dec 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> And at the other end of the scale, soda bread, which is incredibly easy and quick to make.
> 350 ml buttermilk (or just add two tbsps lemon juice to ordinary milk, full fat is best and leave for 15 mins)
> 500g plain flour (or whatever mixture of flours you want)
> 1 tsp salt, 1 tsp bicarbonate of soda
> ...


Mine turned out very dense, similar to a scone in texture


----------



## alchurch (18 Dec 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> This is true, without adding strong white flour both flours will give a very dense loaf (which some people prefer of course). They both need more water than usual aswell.


My spelt rises ok,1 1/2 tsp yeast to 350g flour. It does not seem to keep for long though


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## C R (18 Dec 2021)

Banana bread again, I'm starting to think that our children let the bananas go brown on purpose so that I make them into bread.


----------



## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2021)

slchurch said:


> Mine turned out very dense, similar to a scone in texture


Yes, it's not a light and airy loaf, but I wouldn't say dense. Mind you I prefer heavier breads.


----------



## Tail End Charlie (19 Dec 2021)

slchurch said:


> My spelt rises ok,1 1/2 tsp yeast to 350g flour. It does not seem to keep for long though


That's largely the reason I started baking my own bread, when a bought loaf lasts ages before going off and a homemade one doesn't, it tells you something about the "extras" that are in them. I like to know what I'm eating.


----------



## Reynard (19 Dec 2021)

A home made loaf can keep really well too - it's all in the method.

Long fermentation gives you a better-keeping loaf, as does throwing in a tablespoon or so of vegetable oil into your dough - lean, fast-baked breads will go stale very quickly.

Also, wrap your bread in a tea towel. That helps it keep, too.


----------



## figbat (19 Dec 2021)

Agreed - sourdough loaves always last well too. And if any bread is a bit stale then 10-15 minutes in the oven, wrapped loosely in foil with some water sprinkled on will revive it.


----------



## Reynard (19 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> Agreed - sourdough loaves always last well too. And if any bread is a bit stale then 10-15 minutes in the oven, wrapped loosely in foil with some water sprinkled on will revive it.



Failing that, there's always bread & butter pudding!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (19 Dec 2021)

I made some batons (can't really call them baguettes) to make garlic bread to accompany tonight's dinner.

I don't know if they'll last that long though!


----------



## figbat (25 Dec 2021)

So here’s the final effort - best so far (EIIDSSM):








Also on the menu is a modern interpretation of the classic torrone di morte - usually done with hazelnuts and a hazelnut chocolate filling, this one uses the ubiquitous Biscoff biscuits (cream sandwich ones) and spread:




And another fusion dessert - tiramisu meets the Black Forest:




…served with lightly-sweetened whipped cream laced with cherry brandy.


----------



## Reynard (25 Dec 2021)

That chocolate thing with the density of plutonium looks really good...


----------



## figbat (25 Dec 2021)

Reynard said:


> That chocolate thing with the density of plutonium looks really good...


It is VERY rich!


----------



## Reynard (25 Dec 2021)

figbat said:


> It is VERY rich!



I can well imagine... But I bet it's good, tho


----------



## figbat (9 Jan 2022)

Today is a simple oat cookie two ways - one ‘regular’ and one with a raspberry jam centre. Good, solid crowd pleasers.




I did also throw together some suet dumplings to go on top of my made-up IKEA meatball stew - no pictures though, all gone!


----------



## IaninSheffield (9 Jan 2022)

figbat said:


> Today is a simple *oak* cookie two ways - one ‘regular’ and one with a raspberry jam centre


----------



## figbat (9 Jan 2022)

IaninSheffield said:


>


Oops! Wooden you know it, I’ve fixed it.


----------



## benb (10 Feb 2022)

Reynard said:


> That chocolate thing with the density of plutonium looks really good...



Depleted chocolate. It has its own gravitational field by the look of it. Yum.


----------



## figbat (10 Feb 2022)

benb said:


> Depleted chocolate. It has its own gravitational field by the look of it. Yum.


More like I do, now that I have consumed it. You certainly only need a small slice at a time.


----------



## Dave 123 (22 Feb 2022)

I’





ve not posted here for a while…
A seeded loaf with 25% rye and 50% milk.
Soft and sweet!


----------



## benb (23 Feb 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I made some batons (can't really call them baguettes) to make garlic bread to accompany tonight's dinner.
> 
> I don't know if they'll last that long though!
> 
> View attachment 622833


Excellent "ears" in the crust.
Please share recipe for these.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 Feb 2022)

benb said:


> Excellent "ears" in the crust.
> Please share recipe for these.



Yikes, I can't remember which one that was but I will check my notes when I get home.


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## Tom B (6 Mar 2022)

I know there are quite a lot of bread bakers on here. So I've been messing around largely unsuccessfully trying to make home made barm cakes.

Now there is a whole world of discussion about what a barm cake is and it's called different things across the country. Let's not get into that argument. I just go with whatever the locale preference is wherever I am.

I'm in Lancashire so it's a barm cake today...

It's a light floury fluffy bread bun, open textured inside, soft with a thin light crust, it will squash if squeezed. It cannot be described as crispy or having any sort of bite and only a light chew. They're a light golden on top and usually white at the sides. They can come stuck together but usually these days don't.

They're best bought daily from local bakeries and nothing from a Supermarket, Warburton's or large bakery gets near it. A propper barm needs to be kept covered or at least in a paper bag as it will dry out in a few hours.

Historically I think they was made from the yeasty foam from the top of beer brewing (barm), hence the name barm cakes.

I've tried several times to replicate them. But always end up with something too crusty, too chewy too dense.

I'm thinking they're going to have only a brief kneed, high water content, a long prove and a low temp cook but I can't get it anywhere near.

Any offers

This is something like...


----------



## Tom B (6 Mar 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I made some batons (can't really call them baguettes) to make garlic bread to accompany tonight's dinner.
> 
> I don't know if they'll last that long though!
> 
> View attachment 622833





benb said:


> Excellent "ears" in the crust.
> Please share recipe for these.



Did you remember?


----------



## figbat (6 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> I know there are quite a lot of bread bakers on here. So I've been messing around largely unsuccessfully trying to make home made barm cakes.
> 
> Now there is a whole world of discussion about what a barm cake is and it's called different things across the country. Let's not get into that argument. I just go with whatever the locale preference is wherever I am.
> 
> ...


Try using milk as well as water. Also, I would still knead them well and I would probably tend to a lower hydration, as more water tends to lead to a more open structure (eg ciabatta and baguettes use a very wet dough). You could try to bake with a foil cover (maybe for the last few minutes or so) and when they come out, cover with a clean tea towel or something so they they soften with the evaporated steam that comes off.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (6 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> Did you remember?



Yes, although I’ve still to find it as I have been on holiday until today. Heading out again shortly for the rest of the day but I’ll have a look when I get back.


----------



## Tom B (6 Mar 2022)

figbat said:


> Try using milk as well as water. Also, I would still knead them well and I would probably tend to a lower hydration, as more water tends to lead to a more open structure (eg ciabatta and baguettes use a very wet dough). You could try to bake with a foil cover (maybe for the last few minutes or so) and when they come out, cover with a clean tea towel or something so they they soften with the evaporated steam that comes off.



I think the covering bit is a good idea. I've tried milk and it just added more colour.

I'll grab one the next time the shop is open and take some images as I'm not sure I'm doing a good job explaining. But I want quite an open texture, not so much as a cibatta, and certainly not as resilient as a cibatta but more so than the commercial barm cake.


----------



## figbat (6 Mar 2022)

We found a pack of hot cross buns at the back of the freezer - they have probably been there for years! Anyway, they seemed Ok but a bit stale, and we had an egg surplus and some cream in the fridge…. so hot cross bun and butter pudding it is then!


----------



## Cirrus (6 Mar 2022)

Cinnamon and Apple Babka, I’ve done some chocolate ones in the past but really pleased with how this came out..


----------



## IaninSheffield (6 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> I know there are quite a lot of bread bakers on here. So I've been messing around largely unsuccessfully trying to make home made barm cakes.
> 
> Now there is a whole world of discussion about what a barm cake is and it's called different things across the country. Let's not get into that argument. I just go with whatever the locale preference is wherever I am.
> 
> ...


Although the baker in the following calls her product 'Scottish Morning Rolls', I think they're more like the barm cakes you're looking for. Scottish Morning Rolls are rather different, to me at least.

Perhaps give her recipe a try?


View: https://youtu.be/CEyBxubfiZ8


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## Tom B (6 Mar 2022)

Certainly pretty different from what I've tried in terms of method and if not what I'm looking for will likely accommodate some bacon well enough.

I'll report back.


----------



## figbat (6 Mar 2022)

Cirrus said:


> Cinnamon and Apple Babka, I’ve done some chocolate ones in the past but really pleased with how this came out..
> 
> View attachment 634110


Ooh, a fellow babka baker! Nice, I haven’t incorporated fruit yet, might have a think about how to do that.


----------



## Tom B (7 Mar 2022)

Cirrus said:


> Cinnamon and Apple Babka, I’ve done some chocolate ones in the past but really pleased with how this came out..
> 
> View attachment 634110



I don't like cinnamon. I think years of being force fed apple and cinnamon xyz at primary school put me off it. I think the school cook only knew cinnamon based deserts (and Manchester tart with wholemeal flour pastry)

Babbka with raspberry or plum jam for me.... I've not had it for years. I think it's one of those things that tastes better when it's someone else's. Like cheese on toast, crisps and chips.

Jam babbka dusted with fine sugar is like a healthy doughnut.


----------



## Tom B (7 Mar 2022)

I'm on a baking spree.... Can you tell?

Does anyone have issues with Aldi dry Yeast? I keep it in the fridge, and it just seems slow despite having a 12 month date.

I'm sure it's just the same as any other prepack dry yeast and put in Aldi's box. But I'm starting to loathe it.


----------



## figbat (7 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> I'm on a baking spree.... Can you tell?
> 
> Does anyone have issues with Aldi dry Yeast? I keep it in the fridge, and it just seems slow despite having a 12 month date.
> 
> I'm sure it's just the same as any other prepack dry yeast and put in Aldi's box. But I'm starting to loathe it.


I always use Dove's Farm and it always does OK, straight out of the fridge too (and I never wake it up, but I do tend to do long prooves). My baking teachers advocate using fresh vs dried but I can't be bothered with the faff of it, finding a source, keeping it alive etc.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (7 Mar 2022)

figbat said:


> ... I can't be bothered with the faff of it, finding a source,



My local Morrisons bakery staff are happy to give me some if I ask, and usually for pennies.


----------



## figbat (7 Mar 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> My local Morrisons bakery staff are happy to give me some if I ask, and usually for pennies.


Yeah, I have heard such tales but also heard that recently some places have stopped doing this as there is the requirement to mark it with allergen information, which is an overhead that's not worth it.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (7 Mar 2022)

figbat said:


> Yeah, I have heard such tales but also heard that recently some places have stopped doing this as there is the requirement to mark it with allergen information, which is an overhead that's not worth it.



I've never heard of that. They weigh a lump of it on the scales and the machine prints the requisite sticky label identifying the contents to be attached to the clingfilm wrapping. I must admit I've never checked to see what it said, beyond 'x grammes fresh yeast : 30p'.


----------



## Tom B (7 Mar 2022)

IaninSheffield said:


> Although the baker in the following calls her product 'Scottish Morning Rolls',
> 
> Perhaps give her recipe a try?
> 
> ...






Tom B said:


> Certainly pretty different from what I've tried in terms of method and if not what I'm looking for will likely accommodate some bacon well enough.
> 
> I'll report back.



First slow effort















I left the second batch to prove a bit longer... Big mistake.

They need to be a bit bigger than the 90mm recommend in the video and they needed the damp muslin after cooking.

When I win the lottery the first thing I will buy for my barn conversion kitchen will be a proving cabinet


----------



## Proto (7 Mar 2022)

This morning I wondered if this thread was still alive as I prepared ingredients for a spelt loaf I’m making, looked at ’New Posts‘ and there it is!

Anyway, here we go. More photos to come.


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## glasgowcyclist (7 Mar 2022)

@Tom B & @benb

I tend to play about with recipes and don’t always record the adaptations I make. However, I’m pretty sure that for the batons you asked about, I used Gino D’Acampo’s ciabatta ingredients list and then shaped them following Richard Bertinet’s baguette shaping method.

If you don’t want to do an overnight biga, you can adjust the recipe accordingly and do it all on the day. Flavour will still be good but not quite as good as starting the night before.

Hopefully the attached photo of the recipe is readable for you.


----------



## Tom B (7 Mar 2022)

Had a bash at a jam babbka today too after the posts above reminded.

The outcome reminded me that I should

A) reduce the jam in a pan first
B) firm the roll in the fridge before shaping
C) not cut all the way through
D) not enlist the help of a 4 year old to lift it into the pan
E) the jam burns if you let it.

F) despite all the above it still tastes great.

"But most of all don't enlist the help of a 4 year old for delicate bit

It's probably been about 10years since I did one


----------



## Reynard (7 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> Had a bash at a jam babbka today too after the posts above reminded.
> 
> The outcome reminded me that I should
> 
> ...



If I might make a suggestion...

Swap the jam for powidła i.e. plum butter. It's not as runny, less sweet and is actually a traditional filling for these in Poland. Readily available in the Polish aisle in supermarkets, but also really easy to make.


----------



## Tom B (7 Mar 2022)

Reynard said:


> If I might make a suggestion...
> 
> Swap the jam for powidła i.e. plum butter. It's not as runny, less sweet and is actually a traditional filling for these in Poland. Readily available in the Polish aisle in supermarkets, but also really easy to make.



Sounds like a good idea. Im fond of plum. Grandma used to make some sort of plummy conserve with plums from a random tree in a field near her house and damsons never tasted anything like it since.

I have a huge jar of Nutella that Ive toyed with using too. Ideas for things to do with Nutella are welcome. Beyond pancakes and putting it on Maryland choc chip cookies (that'll change your life almost as much as Stilton on Celery Sticks with a sprinkle of salt)


----------



## Reynard (7 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> Sounds like a good idea. Im fond of plum. Grandma used to make some sort of plummy conserve with plums from a random tree in a field near her house and damsons never tasted anything like it since.
> 
> I have a huge jar of Nutella that Ive toyed with using too. Ideas for things to do with Nutella are welcome. Beyond pancakes and putting it on Maryland choc chip cookies (that'll change your life almost as much as Stilton on Celery Sticks with a sprinkle of salt)



Mmmm yes, well home made damson jam is one of life's little pleasures... 

If you can get a good supply of plums, then plum butter is so easy. 

Wash and stone the fruit and cut into quarters. Weight the fruit, and then weigh out half the amount of sugar. Put the plums in a pan with a few tablespoons of water, and then cook until the fruit is soft. When the fruit is cooked, slowly add the sugar and stir till dissolved. Then, let the mixture cook on a low heat until it is really thick. The fruit butter is ready when a wooden spoon dragged through the mixture will leave a clean channel in the bottom of the pan. Just be careful to watch the mixture as it thickens, as it can catch, so regular stirring required. N.B. This is also a good way of using up excess cooking apples. 

Nutella? Chelsea bun dough, and swap the fruit, butter and spice for chocolate spread, don't glaze, but drizzle melted chocolate on top. Maybe add some chopped nuts in as well?


----------



## Ratchet Cat (13 Mar 2022)

Sourdough loaves and hot cross buns are cooling.


----------



## Tom B (14 Mar 2022)

Tom B said:


> First slow effort
> View attachment 634192
> View attachment 634196
> 
> ...



Update on Barm Cake quest... Had a chat with the woman in the local bread bakery.

She told me she hand rolls (so the video technique is right) all of hers, but there is no first prove, she just proves them all in one. 

Suggests 4oz would be a good weight of dough but she's does it "rack-oth-eye" 

If baking muffins (I'm not) turn them mid cook.

If the baby ever allows me to sleep I'll give it a go.


----------



## Ratchet Cat (20 Mar 2022)

Wholemeal and seeded loaves cooling. I've got a new oven😀


----------



## Tom B (3 Apr 2022)

Not much dough action of late but Had a few beers last night. Dug some dough pucks out of the freezer and knocked a few of these out.

Clearly had a bit more whiskey while making than I thought as this morning I found the frozen garlic in the fridge, the dry parsley in the freezer with the garlic olive oils and the fresh garlic in the herb rack.

Jolly delicious from what I remember. 

(Essentially a garlic bread Neapolitan style pizza type thing with crumbled blue cheese and out of date mozzarella)


----------



## glasgowcyclist (3 Apr 2022)

A wee bit of practice ahead of Easter weekend to test a new (to me) hot cross bun recipe.

I can report that they taste as good as they look.


----------



## Reynard (3 Apr 2022)

I've just made a fresh 

Don't suppose you could wang a couple over?


----------



## Tom B (4 Apr 2022)

Oh forgot I had a bash at these a few weeks ago.

Ended up massively overproofed as I waited for the oven to warm up. Doh


----------



## Tom B (4 Apr 2022)

Today's effort - never put mash in bread before


----------



## Reynard (4 Apr 2022)

Tom B said:


> Today's effort - never put mash in bread before



As in potato?

Having leftover mash is a great excuse to make potato bread...  I use a variant of the Hairy Bikers' recipe.


----------



## Tenkaykev (4 Apr 2022)

Reynard said:


> As in potato?
> 
> Having leftover mash is a great excuse to make potato bread...  I use a variant of the Hairy Bikers' recipe.


Would Smash work? asking for a friend...


----------



## Reynard (4 Apr 2022)

Tenkaykev said:


> Would Smash work? asking for a friend...



I suppose it would, in a pinch. 

I'm more of a Maris Piper gal myself.


----------



## Tom B (4 Apr 2022)

Reynard said:


> As in potato?
> 
> Having leftover mash is a great excuse to make potato bread...  I use a variant of the Hairy Bikers' recipe.




Yup. The recipe called for 2 Tbsp of instant mash as an improver to give softer fluffier crumb. I'm not so sure. Going to try it without next time.

I find it impossible to gauge the amount of potato for making mash. The excess get thrown in the freezer and I make potato cakes for eating with butter, bacon and poached eggs at least weekly. They're known as patapatas in my house because my little lad pat's them out.


----------



## Reynard (4 Apr 2022)

Tom B said:


> Yup. The recipe called for 2 Tbsp of instant mash as an improver to give softer fluffier crumb. I'm not so sure. Going to try it without next time.
> 
> I find it impossible to gauge the amount of potato for making mash. The excess get thrown in the freezer and I make potato cakes for eating with butter, bacon and poached eggs at least weekly. They're known as patapatas in my house because my little lad pat's them out.



Have to say, the Hairy Bikers' potato bread recipe is lovely, both in flavour and texture. Although I don't make the mash from scratch, I just throw in whatever mash is knocking around in the fridge and make a loaf accordingly.

I know what you mean. Other than the bread, I turn excess mash into gnocchi - add an egg and lots of black pepper to the potato and mash it all up with a fork, then gradually work in enough flour to make a soft (but not sticky) dough. Then it's "proceed as usual" for any kind of fresh pasta. So much nicer than anything shop bought.


----------



## Tenkaykev (4 Apr 2022)

Reynard said:


> Have to say, the Hairy Bikers' potato bread recipe is lovely, both in flavour and texture. Although I don't make the mash from scratch, I just throw in whatever mash is knocking around in the fridge and make a loaf accordingly.
> 
> I know what you mean. Other than the bread, I turn excess mash into gnocchi - add an egg and lots of black pepper to the potato and mash it all up with a fork, then gradually work in enough flour to make a soft (but not sticky) dough. Then it's "proceed as usual" for any kind of fresh pasta. So much nicer than anything shop bought.


The Gnocchi method sounds intriguing, something for me to try next time we have mash 👍


----------



## Reynard (4 Apr 2022)

Tenkaykev said:


> The Gnocchi method sounds intriguing, something for me to try next time we have mash 👍



Best to cook them in small batches in well-salted boiling water. They're done when they float to the top. I usually have a pot of sauce simmering away on the next hob, so just drop them into the hot pasta sauce.

The trick is not to overwork the dough, so your that gnocchi will stay light and fluffy. Otherwise they'll end up with the doughy texture of bought ones. Umm, and keep the board well-floured.


----------



## Tenkaykev (4 Apr 2022)

Reynard said:


> Best to cook them in small batches in well-salted boiling water. They're done when they float to the top. I usually have a pot of sauce simmering away on the next hob, so just drop them into the hot pasta sauce.
> 
> The trick is not to overwork the dough, so your that gnocchi will stay light and fluffy. Otherwise they'll end up with the doughy texture of bought ones. Umm, and keep the board well-floured.


Thank you, I've cut and pasted your advice into my notes app 👍


----------



## annedonnelly (15 Apr 2022)

The latest hot cross bun recipe from Bake With Jack.







The fruit wasn't evenly distributed in the dough so some of the buns were harder to shape than others. But the bonus is that the mis-shapes have more fruit. 😄 I didn't have any marmalade so I glazed them with apricot jam. And I'm not very good at piping crosses.


----------



## Reynard (15 Apr 2022)

It's what they taste like that matters. Aesthetics is... not necessary.


----------



## Ratchet Cat (16 Apr 2022)

The buns look delicious.


----------



## C R (16 Apr 2022)

Haven't posted for a while, as I haven't done anything new. With Easter approaching I went looking for a recipe for rosca, as I've never been happy with my attempts. I found one which I wasn't sure about, as I thought it didn't have enough liquid, but went with it anyway, and I'm glad I did, as it came out as I remembered it should be.

Ready to go into the oven





Out of the oven 





Got a good rise





I used the breadmaker to mix and knead, which worked well, though maybe slightly overkneaded. The children didn't mind, almost all gone in a day.


----------



## Ratchet Cat (16 Apr 2022)

That looks interesting. Can you post a link to the recipe please?


----------



## annedonnelly (16 Apr 2022)

Ratchet Cat said:


> The buns look delicious.



Only fault is where the cross is a bit thick you get a dry, chewy bit. But can't complain about the actual buns. I'm looking forward to another with a pot of tea later.


----------



## Ratchet Cat (16 Apr 2022)

The more you make, the more you get to test
You have to make lots more until you get them perfect. I'm still perfecting my sourdough bread


----------



## Tom B (17 Apr 2022)

C R said:


> Haven't posted for a while, as I haven't done anything new. With Easter approaching I went looking for a recipe for rosca, as I've never been happy with my attempts. I found one which I wasn't sure about, as I thought it didn't have enough liquid, but went with it anyway, and I'm glad I did, as it came out as I remembered it should be.
> 
> Ready to go into the oven
> View attachment 640325
> ...




Looks really good and not something I'm familiar with. Did you use and online recipe?


----------



## C R (17 Apr 2022)

Ratchet Cat said:


> That looks interesting. Can you post a link to the recipe please?





Tom B said:


> Looks really good and not something I'm familiar with. Did you use and online recipe?


Rosca is a circular egg bread, similar to brioche, but not as fluffy. It is a Galician Easter tradition given by godparents to their godchildren in Easter Sunday.

The link is here:

https://feiraco.es/gl/receitas-e-vida-saudable/receita-rosca-pascua-leite-feiraco/

Google translate does a reasonable job, but the method in the recipe is not very well explained. This is how I made it.

*Ingredients*

570g strong bread flour

150ml milk, preferably whole milk

60g butter

1 yeast sachet, if using fresh 10g, and activate with 100g flour and 100ml milk

4 large eggs, plus one for the wash

100g sugar

Pinch of salt

Glacé cherries to decorate

Juice and grated peel of one lemon, or anise liquor if you can get it

*Method*

If using live yeast, activate an hour in advance.

Mix the flour with the yeast, and gradually add the liquid ingredients to make the dough, leaving the lemon an butter until last. Knead well, and leave to raise until at least double in size.

Knock back, divide in two an form a circle with each part. Leave to rest, you may need to keep pulling the circle out, as it tends to close on itself as it relaxes. After 45 minutes or so, paint with egg wash, decorate wit the cherries if desired, and bake at 180C for about 25 minutes.

I used the breadmaker for mixing and kneading because I am lazy.

ETA, I just realised that my instructions weren't all that clear either. Where I said to mix the flour with the yeast, that's when to add the sugar.


----------



## Tenkaykev (17 Apr 2022)

Tom B said:


> Looks really good and not something I'm familiar with. Did you use and online recipe?



`


C R said:


> Rosca is a circular egg bread, similar to brioche, but not as fluffy. It is a Galician Easter tradition given by godparents to their godchildren in Easter Sunday.
> 
> The link is here:
> 
> ...



We recently purchased an ActiFry air fryer and Mrs Tenkaykev decided to see if she could bake a cake in it ( with the paddle removed ). It came out very similar in shape, though the pan is domed at the bottom so it’s “ upside down “ being flat at the top.


----------



## C R (17 Apr 2022)

Tenkaykev said:


> `
> 
> 
> We recently purchased an ActiFry air fryer and Mrs Tenkaykev decided to see if she could bake a cake in it ( with the paddle removed ). It came out very similar in shape, though the pan is domed at the bottom so it’s “ upside down “ being flat at the top.



Sounds interesting, does it work for bread too?


----------



## Tenkaykev (17 Apr 2022)

C R said:


> Sounds interesting, does it work for bread too?



Not tried it for bread, we have an old Panasonic bread maker that's still going strong. We're impressed with the Actifry, though the cooking suggestions that come with it are a bit naff. As the results look like a giant doughnut that has been sliced in half, we're planning on baking two cakes and putting them on top of each other flat side to flat side with some sort of filling. That would look like a giant doughnut.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 Apr 2022)

My first attempt at shortbread (from a Mary Berry recipe). Taste good👍


----------



## annedonnelly (23 Apr 2022)

Recipe I found on the Doves Farm website using malthouse flour but I used Bake with Jack's method.


----------



## bluenotebob (24 Apr 2022)

I wish I had a kitchen worktop as clean and tidy as @annedonnelly ..

Here's my 'every day' bread - a multi-cereal loaf (as it's also malty, I guess you could call it a granary loaf). 

600g of flour (50% Francine's multi-cereal flour and 50% organic T-150 flour, which is the closest to wholemeal flour that I've found after nearly 30 years of looking for it in France). I knock a couple of these out every week.


----------



## figbat (24 Apr 2022)

bluenotebob said:


> …(as it's also malty, I guess you could call it a granary loaf).


Nice loaf, but strictly you can’t call it a granary loaf since Hovis have registered Granary as trademark.

Nice granary-style loaf though! 😉


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## annedonnelly (24 Apr 2022)

I buy the Malthouse flour because it's similar to granary.


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## glasgowcyclist (4 May 2022)

Now that I have retired (🥳) and am no longer restricted to weekend baking, I thought I’d do a couple of 1/2 size loaves. First is a crusty, plaited white and the second is a coriander, olive and onion bread. The second one didn’t rise as well but is very tasty.


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## figbat (4 May 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Now that I have retired (🥳) and am no longer restricted to weekend baking, I thought I’d do a couple of 1/2 size loaves. First is a crusty, plaited white and the second is a coriander, olive and onion bread. The second one didn’t rise as well but is very tasty.
> 
> View attachment 643157



That’s a very neat plait!

Inclusions in dough do tend to hamper proving; I tend to try for a long, slow prove but accept that the bread will likely be denser.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 May 2022)

figbat said:


> That’s a very neat plait!
> 
> Inclusions in dough do tend to hamper proving; I tend to try for a long, slow prove but accept that the bread will likely be denser.



Thanks, it was a simple 3-strander. 

The other dough was a horrible to work with. The addition of the chopped onions and olives introduced a lot of moisture, making it a sticky mess and almost impossible to shape. Next time I’ll using kitchen roll to pat dry the onion and olives before kneading them in after the first prove. Flavour was a winner with everyone.


----------



## Reynard (4 May 2022)

Hmmmm, wouldn't it just be easier to add less water? Saves on the faffage... 

DAMHIKT


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Hmmmm, wouldn't it just be easier to add less water? Saves on the faffage...
> 
> DAMHIKT



It was a recipe I’d never tried before and I always follow it as written when trying it for the first time.

It was the fact that the added ingredients were fairly wet which caused the problem during the second bout of kneading. They simply did not want to remain inside the dough and constantly slipped straight back out with every manipulation.

I’ve had this with a fruit loaf but to a much lesser extent, which I attribute to drying the soaked fruits before incorporating them.


----------



## Reynard (4 May 2022)

Mmmmmmok. 

I don't tend to use recipes much. I have a basic formula I've worked out, and then just adapt as necessary. 

Fruit escapage is a right PITA if you've got a very buttery dough...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 May 2022)

Well I had another go at that coriander, olive and onion loaf with improved results. I dried the filling ingredients on kitchen paper and, instead of kneading them into the dough, stretched the dough out to a large rectangle then scattered the onion and olives evenly across it. Then I rolled it up neatly and cut it in half to make two loaves. It was much easier to handle this way and I definitely got a better rise this time. The cuts on top are made by scissors.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (6 May 2022)

This retirement malarkey is great fun! I've got time to bake midweek _and_ do new stuff.

This is something I found on an app called Kneadly so I thought I'd give it a try: Pane Bianco.






Essentially it's a dough that's covered with sun-dried tomatoes, garlic, mozzarella and basil, then rolled into a long sausage, slashed open and baked in a figure of eight. 





We had it for dinner 😋


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## annedonnelly (13 May 2022)

I pre-ordered this which was released last week.





The company have accidentally sent me two copies and say I can keep both. Obviously I don't need both. Does anyone want a free copy? Happy to send for postage costs. I expect it'll be a standard parcel price - about £3.30 I think.


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## Tom... (13 May 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> I pre-ordered this which was released last week.
> View attachment 644440
> 
> 
> The company have accidentally sent me two copies and say I can keep both. Obviously I don't need both. Does anyone want a free copy? Happy to send for postage costs. I expect it'll be a standard parcel price - about £3.30 I think.



I'd love to take this please, will make a small donation to charity too


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## annedonnelly (13 May 2022)

Tom... said:


> I'd love to take this please, will make a small donation to charity too



Smashing @Tom... Send me a PM with your address. I have to go to the post office tomorrow so can send it then.


----------



## C R (13 May 2022)

Just a simple white loaf to have with soup.


----------



## Dave 123 (15 May 2022)

I’ve not posted on here for a while, though I have been baking.

Today I made a couple of sourdough loaves.

600g 00 pizza flour 
400g whole meal 
400 ml water
300 ml milk
15 g of coarse sea salt 
A big glob of runny honey.

After mixing I let the dough rest and then stretched and folded for 6 times on 6 occasions.

I then chucked it in a cool airing cupboard for 3 hours.

I lit the BBQ. The gauge was reading 450°c. Two casserole pots went in to pre heat.

I shaped the dough and put it on baking parchment.

I took my sharp slashing knife and some ice cubes to the bbq.

Slashed the top, lifted the lid and bunged a couple of ice cubes in, then put the dough in X2.

40 minutes on very very hot (4/500°c) 

Then 10 minutes with the lid off.


----------



## John the Monkey (16 May 2022)

I've been trying overnight, no knead loaves - they have been surprisingly good so far, although the original recipe must use a flour that's more tolerant of high hydration than my usual (Walk Mill Strong White) is, because my first attempts were an unbakeable mess - I've reduced the hydration and the below works for me;

Basically;

600g Strong White Flour
360g water
1/4 tsp Femipan Red yeast
12g salt

Mix to dough & leave for about 12 hours.
Remove from bowl and shape, then preheat oven (I use a cast iron dutch oven) to 230c
Once oven is hot enough, slash the dough, put in the dutch oven & bake 30 mins lid on, 15 mins lid off.

Makes a decent loaf, and is low faff enough to do whenever.


----------



## Reynard (16 May 2022)

John the Monkey said:


> I've been trying overnight, no knead loaves - they have been surprisingly good so far, although the original recipe must use a flour that's more tolerant of high hydration than my usual (Walk Mill Strong White) is, because my first attempts were an unbakeable mess - I've reduced the hydration and the below works for me;
> 
> Basically;
> 
> ...



If it's an american recipe, then that would explain it - US flours need more water than those in the UK.

Although if you end up with a dough that's too sloppy, work some porridge oats into it. Oats are great at sopping up excess moisture.


----------



## figbat (16 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> If it's an american recipe, then that would explain it - US flours need more water than those in the UK.
> 
> Although if you end up with a dough that's too sloppy, work some porridge oats into it. Oats are great at sopping up excess moisture.



And even an apparently unhandleable dough will still give a good result. A typical focaccia dough can be very wet - to handle a wet dough you can use wet hands or oily hands for kneading and bath in flour for final handling and shaping... and simply put up with the 'rustic' shaping you'll get!


----------



## Reynard (16 May 2022)

figbat said:


> And even an apparently unhandleable dough will still give a good result. A typical focaccia dough can be very wet - to handle a wet dough you can use wet hands or oily hands for kneading and bath in flour for final handling and shaping... and simply put up with the 'rustic' shaping you'll get!



Ah yes... Those wet doughs that you just have to "plop" into a tin because that's as good as it's going to get.


----------



## figbat (16 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Ah yes... Those wet doughs that you just have to "plop" into a tin because that's as good as it's going to get.



I have a recipe for focaccia that's almost a batter rather than a dough - I effectively pour it into the baking tray. Higher hydration tends to lead to a more open structure, but will usually need a shape-holding tin or it'll slump.


----------



## Reynard (16 May 2022)

Funny you should mention focaccia. That's on the agenda here for tomorrow, as a branch has become accidentally detached from my large rosemary shrub this afternoon, and it'd be a shame to waste the bounty...


----------



## Tom B (16 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Funny you should mention focaccia. That's on the agenda here for tomorrow, as a branch has become accidentally detached from my large rosemary shrub this afternoon, and it'd be a shame to waste the bounty...


 
Let us know how you get on / a pic.

I've never managed an entirely satisfactory focaccia. But then I find few bought focaccia are much to write home about. 


...Maybe I just don't like it.


----------



## Reynard (17 May 2022)

Never had much luck making it either, but then it's something I haven't done that often anyway.

Might try the Hairy Bikers' version, their recipes generally are usually near enough spot on.


----------



## John the Monkey (17 May 2022)

figbat said:


> And even an apparently unhandleable dough will still give a good result. A typical focaccia dough can be very wet - to handle a wet dough you can use wet hands or oily hands for kneading and bath in flour for final handling and shaping... and simply put up with the 'rustic' shaping you'll get!



Maybe I should have persevered - one thing with these low effort bakes is that it doesn't feel like such a disaster when they go wrong (because there's not been a huge amount of effort sunk into them).


----------



## Tom B (17 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Never had much luck making it either, but then it's something I haven't done that often anyway.
> 
> Might try the Hairy Bikers' version, their recipes generally are usually near enough spot on.



That's actually one of the ones I've tried.

Wasn't impressed... But feel free to prove me wrong. It's probably one of the few breaddy things I don't like.


----------



## Reynard (17 May 2022)

Tom B said:


> That's actually one of the ones I've tried.
> 
> Wasn't impressed... But feel free to prove me wrong. It's probably one of the few breaddy things I don't like.



Actually, it was very, very nice - how authentic is was, I really don't know, but there's not much left... 

Although admittedly I only used Si & Dave's recipe as a rough guide, as it's much like my own everyday bread. The main difference was in the rest of the method after the bulk ferment, and the subsequent bake.

Having said that, I loaded up the dough itself with garlic and fresh rosemary from the garden, and did use a good Spanish evoo. Plus I used a flour mix that's 50% strong white and 50% atta as that's what's currently in my bread flour bin, and I used less yeast so that I could just leave it to get on with itself while I did other things. Oh yeah, and I baked it on a pizza stone.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (22 May 2022)

I made half a dozen nice, soft and fluffy white rolls but before I could take a photo my wife had scoffed one.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 May 2022)

I made two sun-dried tomato loaves but one with olives (left) and the other with rosemary (right).

There was another buttered slice but guess what … yep, my wife scoffed it.


----------



## Reynard (23 May 2022)

Not sure whether to  or to  @glasgowcyclist

So I've given you a  and say that my parental unit is much the same as your OH...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (23 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Not sure whether to  or to  @glasgowcyclist
> 
> So I've given you a  and say that my parental unit is much the same as your OH...



To be fair, it was her loaf but I’d only turned my back to pick up my phone for the photo when she stuffed it in her gob.


----------



## Reynard (23 May 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> To be fair, it was her loaf but I’d only turned my back to pick up my phone for the photo when she stuffed it in her gob.



Instant approval!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (27 May 2022)

I reckon these loaves are going to rise well...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (27 May 2022)

Finished articles are (L to R), Olive & Onion Bloomer, Oregano and Feta, and Oregano & Sesame. The two tin loafs are 1lb versions.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (31 May 2022)

By popular demand (from my wife) I made another olive & onion loaf plus a classic wee cheese & chilli for me.


----------



## C R (31 May 2022)

Daughter 2 half term handiwork


----------



## Reynard (31 May 2022)

Chapeau that girl! Looks fabby! 

More importantly, is there any left?


----------



## C R (31 May 2022)

Reynard said:


> Chapeau that girl! Looks fabby!
> 
> More importantly, is there any left?



Not much.


----------



## Reynard (31 May 2022)

C R said:


> Not much.



... is the correct answer.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (1 Jun 2022)

I've had better results (in terms of rise) from my cheese scones in the past but these still taste fab.







Recipe is from Delia Smith's Complete Cookery Course.


----------



## annedonnelly (3 Jun 2022)

I've had bother with a couple of fruit cakes not cooking properly so to test the oven I decided to go back to basics with a Victoria sponge. Or rather a coffee version.




I'd forgotten how much I love coffee cake


----------



## Dave 123 (5 Jun 2022)

More bbq sourdough cooking.
I thought they may be a little under done as I needed to get them off so I could cook a bbq.
Fortunately they were just about spot on!


----------



## Tom B (6 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> By popular demand (from my wife) I made another olive & onion loaf plus a classic wee cheese & chilli for me.
> 
> View attachment 647088



How much cheese and chilli did you put in?

I've been trying to get a cheese and chilli something like good for ages. They never seem to pack the punch of a commercial loaf. I think I wimp out on the chilli.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (6 Jun 2022)

Tom B said:


> How much cheese and chilli did you put in?
> 
> I've been trying to get a cheese and chilli something like good for ages. They never seem to pack the punch of a commercial loaf. I think I wimp out on the chilli.



I used 75g of Somerset Crunch Cheddar (from Morrisons) and 6-8 slices of jalapeños (jar of Freshbona from Lidl, decent heat). Bear in mind that’s for a small, 1lb loaf not a standard 2lb.

I cube the cheese fairly small, maybe 3mm and add a good grating of fresh parmesan, plus a little more on top just before baking.


----------



## Tenkaykev (6 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I used 75g of Somerset Crunch Cheddar (from Morrisons) and 6-8 slices of jalapeños (jar of Freshbona from Lidl, decent heat). Bear in mind that’s for a small, 1lb loaf not a standard 2lb.
> 
> I cube the cheese fairly small, maybe 3mm and add a good grating of fresh parmesan, plus a little more on top just before baking.



I know it's not " proper " baking as such, but when I first got a bread machine I tried various ready mixed bags. There was a Cheese and Chilli one that I used to get from Waitrose which was very good. I used to chuck a palmful of mixed herbs into the mix and that worked really well.


----------



## annedonnelly (10 Jun 2022)

Fougasse from Bake With Jack




Don't know what it tastes like but it looks fancy


----------



## Reynard (10 Jun 2022)

Just got a honey & caraway seed rye in the oven for a friend's birthday gift.

She prefers a loaf of bread to a birthday cake...


----------



## glasgowcyclist (10 Jun 2022)

I forgot to post this bread I made last week. I was after something different and came up with a caraway seed, fennel seed and ground coriander loaf. (When I googled it later, I discovered I wasn’t the first.)

By ‘eck it’s a terrific flavour combination.

I shall be making this again. Lots.

(The miniature loaves are little taste testers I give to neighbours to see if they like it, then I'll make a normal one if it gets approval.)


----------



## Tom B (11 Jun 2022)

Reynard said:


> Just got a honey & caraway seed rye in the oven for a friend's birthday gift.
> 
> She prefers a loaf of bread to a birthday cake...



She sounds like a sensible sort. My Mrs doesn't feel the bread love


----------



## Reynard (11 Jun 2022)

Tom B said:


> She sounds like a sensible sort. My Mrs doesn't feel the bread love



Oh yeah, deffo.  

Especially if the bread is accompanied by a nice piece or two of cheese. In this case, Dolcelatte and Chaource.


----------



## Gwylan (12 Jun 2022)

Our favourite is Annadamma. Found the recipe in The Bread Bible.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (12 Jun 2022)

My attempt at some Italian biscuits; biscotti all'uovo con marmellata (l did half with fig jam and half with apricot).
A Gino D'Acampo recipe.






[Now posted in the correct thread]


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Jun 2022)

Just as a follow up to those biscotti 👆, and in case anyone is thinking of making them, they don’t have any snap to them. They are slightly soft, with a texture and flavour more akin to a fig roll.

They were very nice though and the 32 biscuits lasted all of three days.


----------



## T4tomo (15 Jun 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> Fougasse from Bake With Jack
> View attachment 648383
> 
> Don't know what it tastes like but it looks fancy



they look good - who is Jack? will he share his recipe?


----------



## T4tomo (15 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I forgot to post this bread I made last week. I was after something different and came up with a caraway seed, fennel seed and ground coriander loaf. (When I googled it later, I discovered I wasn’t the first.)
> 
> By ‘eck it’s a terrific flavour combination.
> 
> ...



That sounds good, I chuck fennel seeds into lots of things with good results. the mini ones look very cute - posh restaurant bread territory!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Jun 2022)

T4tomo said:


> they look good - who is Jack? will he share his recipe?



He’s Jack Sturgess, often seen on Sunday Brunch. 

https://www.bakewithjack.co.uk/ has a lot of his recipes but he also has a youtube channel with loads of fantastic tips and techniques. Maybe the fougasse recipe is on there or in his recent book: Bread Every Day.


----------



## T4tomo (15 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> He’s Jack Sturgess, often seen on Sunday Brunch.



Ah I'm a Saturday Kitchen loyalist, I will have a look.


----------



## annedonnelly (15 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> He’s Jack Sturgess, often seen on Sunday Brunch.
> 
> https://www.bakewithjack.co.uk/ has a lot of his recipes but he also has a youtube channel with loads of fantastic tips and techniques. Maybe the fougasse recipe is on there or in his recent book: Bread Every Day.



Yes, it's from the book.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (15 Jun 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> Yes, it's from the book.



Oh good.

I’ve dropped lots of hints about the book so I’m hoping to get it for Fathers’ Day.


----------



## T4tomo (15 Jun 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> Yes, it's from the book.



I've found his pumpkin fougasse on his website so may give that a whirl (potentially sans pumpkin) to complement my usual repertoire.


----------



## annedonnelly (15 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Oh good.
> 
> I’ve dropped lots of hints about the book so I’m hoping to get it for Fathers’ Day.



Always nice to get something you want...


----------



## annedonnelly (23 Jun 2022)

Today's recipe from Bake with Jack - soft flour tacos


----------



## glasgowcyclist (28 Jun 2022)

A wee tear & share garlic bread.


----------



## mistyoptic (28 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> A wee tear & share garlic bread.
> 
> View attachment 650812


Not sure I’d share that 😉


----------



## Reynard (28 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> A wee tear & share garlic bread.
> 
> View attachment 650812



That'd gone down a treat alongside tonight's pasta and meatballs in a tomato and basil sauce


----------



## T4tomo (29 Jun 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> A wee tear & share garlic bread.
> 
> View attachment 650812



wow that looks awesome


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 Jul 2022)

I bought Jack Sturgess's book, Bread Every Day, yesterday and had a go at his beetroot, raisins and rosemary loaf. It's still cooling down so no idea of the taste yet but it smells amazing.


----------



## Gwylan (4 Jul 2022)

Gosh! What ratios are you using for that. 
Do you find the Schwalbe better than the Continental?


----------



## Tom B (4 Jul 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> A wee tear & share garlic bread.
> 
> View attachment 650812



When I am king of the world you will be my baker!


----------



## glasgowcyclist (4 Jul 2022)

Gwylan said:


> Gosh! What ratios are you using for that.
> Do you find the Schwalbe better than the Continental?



It's about 65% hydration, with ... 

Oh, hang on, you've posted in the wrong thread, haven't you! 😂


----------



## Ratchet Cat (5 Jul 2022)

I think I will give that beetroot loaf a go. We've got a glut of home grown beetroot.🐱


----------



## annedonnelly (5 Jul 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I bought Jack Sturgess's book, Bread Every Day, yesterday and had a go at his beetroot, raisins and rosemary loaf. It's still cooling down so no idea of the taste yet but it smells amazing.
> 
> View attachment 651513



It's on my list of ones to try :-)


----------



## glasgowcyclist (5 Jul 2022)

Ratchet Cat said:


> I think I will give that beetroot loaf a go. We've got a glut of home grown beetroot.🐱





annedonnelly said:


> It's on my list of ones to try :-)



Be warned, it’s fairly messy with all that beetroot and juice.

My kitchen looked like a slaughterhouse at one point.


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## Gwylan (5 Jul 2022)

Re beetroot! I'm a baby boomer. Early years after the war 
School had a garden. Did gardening most afternoons. Ate what we grew.

Beetroot were the bane of my young life. They grew we ate them. In those days it was boil it or pickle it. 
A classmate's father provided meat. He could and did tell us who out of the herd or flock we were eating. Usually boiled to get that special grey colour to infuse everything our "food criminals" cooks produced.


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## Reynard (5 Jul 2022)

I'm not the biggest fan of beetroot. But it *does* make a good chutney...


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## CharlesF (5 Jul 2022)

Mmmm, hot beetroot with a thick white sauce, bliss.


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## figbat (5 Jul 2022)

Loaf looks great - I love beetroot; I had a fantastic borscht in Moscow.


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## Tenkaykev (6 Jul 2022)

Lo and behold, this weeks veg box contains a jar of Biona organic beetroot. I love beetroot, with a cheddar so mature that your mouth thinks you're chewing razor blades.


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## glasgowcyclist (7 Jul 2022)

A seeded bloomer this time.





It's another Jack Sturgess recipe although he splits his dough into two bloomers but I made one huge one instead.


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## Ratchet Cat (9 Jul 2022)

I'm using up a lot of ingredients today.
So far I've prepared 2 sourdough loaves for baking tomorrow, baked a garlic focaccia and a wholemeal loaf 
Chocolate beetroot cake is baking in the oven. I haven't started on the beetroot bread as I've run out of white bread flour!🐱

The freezer will be full, but so will my tummy.😺


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## ricknmorty28 (11 Jul 2022)

I love freshly baked goodies that are made at home, you cant get better than that!


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## Dave 123 (16 Jul 2022)

An overnight prove , lit the bbq at 7 this morning


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Jul 2022)

I saw these cinnamon buns on Nadiya's programme last night and had a bash at making them. They are very tasty and addictive. 🐷






(I left off the dusting of icing sugar.)


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Jul 2022)

I’m having a go at her pretzel buns now…. Will post shortly.


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## glasgowcyclist (22 Jul 2022)

Here they are (I ate one straight away).


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## glasgowcyclist (8 Aug 2022)

My daughter dropped a big hint by sending me a picture of a blueberry and lemon babka so I had a go at it today. 







I followed the temperature instructions but didn't adjust for a fan oven so the crust got quite dark very quickly. For the remainder of the time I put some foil over it and dropped the temperature. 


Tastes great but no noticeable lemon flavour.


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## Dave 123 (27 Aug 2022)

More sourdough bbq fun


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## Gwylan (27 Aug 2022)

Dave 123 said:


> View attachment 658900
> 
> 
> View attachment 658901
> ...



Oh! Very nice. Well done


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Sep 2022)

Anyone tried making croissants?

This is my first (perhaps last!) attempt, due to go in the oven in about an hour.


----------



## annedonnelly (4 Sep 2022)

They look very impressive already!


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## figbat (4 Sep 2022)

Croissants are one of those things that you make once to see if you can, then buy them. Same with puff pastry.


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Sep 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> They look very impressive already!



Thanks, I thought I’d post a photo while they still looked decent and before I wreck them!


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Sep 2022)

figbat said:


> Croissants are one of those things that you make once to see if you can, then buy them. Same with puff pastry.



They were my wife’s idea. Having got to this stage, I told her, “I don’t care how good they taste, I’m not going through that faff again.”


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## glasgowcyclist (4 Sep 2022)

Well, they look more like Michelin men than elegant croissants but I'm happy with these.


----------



## simongt (4 Sep 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well, they look more like Michelin men than elegant croissants but I'm happy with these.


The point being that they look and probably taste a lot better than the clones you see in most shops & bakeries.


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## Gwylan (5 Sep 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Well, they look more like Michelin men than elegant croissants but I'm happy with these.
> 
> View attachment 659991



Well done. It's half a day of your life you won't get back. But it is a great achievement.


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## Gwylan (5 Sep 2022)

Have Lidl and Aldi given up doing bread flour? Has not been in either for some time.
Was very well priced, unlike the others.

Always seems odd to me how they mysteriously seem to have similar offers.


----------



## C R (5 Sep 2022)

Gwylan said:


> Have Lidl and Aldi given up doing bread flour? Has not been in either for some time.
> Was very well priced, unlike the others.
> 
> Always seems odd to me how they mysteriously seem to have similar offers.



Aldi haven't had bread flour for about five months now, which is a pain. OTOH Tesco had Allinson's strong for £1.50 for a 1.5kg bag, so I bought two .


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## Reynard (5 Sep 2022)

I took advantage of several clearance offers in Tesco a year and a half ago when they were shifting the catering-sized bags that were available during lockdown. I wasn't going to say no to bread flour that worked out at 25p per kilo, so am well stocked up. 

Picked up a mix of 80%, white and rye.


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## Gwylan (6 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> I took advantage of several clearance offers in Tesco a year and a half ago when they were shifting the catering-sized bags that were available during lockdown. I wasn't going to say no to bread flour that worked out at 25p per kilo, so am well stocked up.
> 
> Picked up a mix of 80%, white and rye.



Maybe I'll cycle around the 3 stores in town, do a price comparison then pounce. Well pounce on the cafe and plan my purchasing strategy.

Aldi gone very long on Corn oil I see.


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## annedonnelly (6 Sep 2022)

When it was difficult to buy flour early in the pandemic I got a couple of sacks from Shipton Mill and I've continued buying from them. It's not mega cheap but last time I ordered I noticed that it hadn't gone up since my first purchase in 2020.


----------



## Reynard (6 Sep 2022)

Gwylan said:


> Maybe I'll cycle around the 3 stores in town, do a price comparison then pounce. Well pounce on the cafe and plan my purchasing strategy.
> 
> Aldi gone very long on Corn oil I see.



I also take advantage of the "green bins" in Tesco where they sell clearance / end of line / damaged goods. Last week I picked up a bag of white rye and a bag of kamut for 99p each.


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## Ratchet Cat (6 Sep 2022)

No bread flour in Lidl or Aldi here either.
I've been going to Sainsbury's or Morrisons.


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## Gwylan (6 Sep 2022)

Ratchet Cat said:


> No bread flour in Lidl or Aldi here either.
> I've been going to Sainsbury's or Morrisons.



Morriston are rather expensive for flour in my èxperience


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## Reynard (6 Sep 2022)

Gwylan said:


> Morriston are rather expensive for flour in my èxperience



If it's cheap you're after, look for atta / chapatti flour in the supermarket. It's 80% extraction. Slightly lower in protein than strong bread flour, but I love to mix it half and half with strong white. Makes great-tasting bread, and is especially good for naan and pitta. 

Typically priced at around £5 for a 10kg bag.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (7 Sep 2022)

I made these Puff-Puffs yesterday, apparently very popular in Nigeria, The Gambia and other west African countries. A lovely Gambian woman gave me her recipe and this was the result. 






It's effectively a doughnut batter that you can flavour as you please, typically with cinnamon or similar. Impossible not to eat them all!🐷


----------



## C R (7 Sep 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I made these Puff-Puffs yesterday, apparently very popular in Nigeria, The Gambia and other west African countries. A lovely Gambian woman gave me her recipe and this was the result.
> 
> View attachment 660253
> 
> It's effectively a doughnut batter that you can flavour as you please, typically with cinnamon or similar. Impossible not to eat them all!🐷



Look a bit like buñuelos.


----------



## Poacher (7 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> If it's cheap you're after, look for atta / chapatti flour in the supermarket. It's 80% extraction. Slightly lower in protein than strong bread flour, but I love to mix it half and half with strong white. Makes great-tasting bread, and is especially good for naan and pitta.
> 
> Typically priced at around £5 for a 10kg bag.



I wish someone would tell my local Asian supermarket, where the lowest price of a 10Kg bag of atta flour is £13.74!
https://www.falcononline.co.uk/rice-flour-grains?cat=251&size=415&product_list_order=price

I expect the price of bread flour in Lidl will increase, but the last bags I bought, on 1/8/2022, were 75p for 1.5 Kg, white and wholemeal.
50p per Kg versus 1.37? Hmmm, decisions, decisions!
Best bargain lately has been fairly short shelf life strong brown flour at Morrison's at 35p for 1.5Kg!


----------



## Reynard (7 Sep 2022)

Poacher said:


> I wish someone would tell my local Asian supermarket, where the lowest price of a 10Kg bag of atta flour is £13.74!
> https://www.falcononline.co.uk/rice-flour-grains?cat=251&size=415&product_list_order=price



I buy mine in Tesco 

Admittedly won't need to buy any for a while though.


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## Reynard (7 Sep 2022)

C R said:


> Look a bit like buñuelos.



Or pet-de-nonne, or faschingskrapfen...


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## Poacher (7 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> I buy mine in Tesco
> 
> Admittedly won't need to buy any for a while though.



Tesco website was down earlier, but now shows Elephant brand at £9 per 10 Kg.
Worth having a clubcard, which reduces the price to £6.50.
https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/search?query=atta


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## Reynard (7 Sep 2022)

Poacher said:


> Tesco website was down earlier, but now shows Elephant brand at £9 per 10 Kg.
> Worth having a clubcard, which reduces the price to £6.50.
> https://www.tesco.com/groceries/en-GB/search?query=atta



That's the stuff I buy - in a large pink & white bag. It's gone up a fair bit since I last bought any (I snagged two bags, so will last me a fair while), but the clubcard offers always come in handy.


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## figbat (7 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> Or pet-de-nonne, or faschingskrapfen...



Or gulab jamun.🤤


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## Reynard (7 Sep 2022)

figbat said:


> Or gulab jamun.🤤


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## Reynard (7 Sep 2022)

Just come back from Tesco (Ely), and they have their own brand atta flour in stock at £5.50 for the 10kg sack. So worth looking around if you've got more than one Tesco locally.

Other than that, no bags of bread flour of any kind bigger than 1.5kg.


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## Gwylan (8 Sep 2022)

Poacher said:


> I wish someone would tell my local Asian supermarket, where the lowest price of a 10Kg bag of atta flour is £13.74!
> https://www.falcononline.co.uk/rice-flour-grains?cat=251&size=415&product_list_order=price
> 
> I expect the price of bread flour in Lidl will increase, but the last bags I bought, on 1/8/2022, were 75p for 1.5 Kg, white and wholemeal.
> ...



Where is your Morissons! 1985?


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## Gwylan (8 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> Just come back from Tesco (Ely), and they have their own brand atta flour in stock at £5.50 for the 10kg sack. So worth looking around if you've got more than one Tesco locally.
> 
> Other than that, no bags of bread flour of any kind bigger than 1.5kg.



Not the Canton one then?


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## Poacher (8 Sep 2022)

Gwylan said:


> Where is your Morissons! 1985?



As already mentioned, short shelf life (best before end of this month), reduced from original £1.39 to 35 p for quick sale.
No worries, it'll be used!
They also had (lots of) 500gm bags of organic quinoa flakes, BB mid November, reduced from £4.25 to £1.07.
I only bought one because I wasn't sure what to do with it!


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## Reynard (8 Sep 2022)

Poacher said:


> As already mentioned, short shelf life (best before end of this month), reduced from original £1.39 to 35 p for quick sale.
> No worries, it'll be used!
> They also had (lots of) 500gm bags of organic quinoa flakes, BB mid November, reduced from £4.25 to £1.07.
> I only bought one because I wasn't sure what to do with it!



Short date isn't an issue - will still be good for a year or two yet. 

Multigrain bread.  I love adding wheat, rye or oat flakes to my breads, so why now quinoa?


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## Julia9054 (17 Sep 2022)

Ukrainian makoviy rulet with the addition of apples. Škoda for scale. Please come round and help me eat it!!!


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## Reynard (17 Sep 2022)

Julia9054 said:


> Ukrainian makoviy rulet with the addition of apples. Škoda for scale. Please come round and help me eat it!!!



Ooooooo, poppy seed cake!


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## Julia9054 (17 Sep 2022)

Reynard said:


> Ooooooo, poppy seed cake!


. . . . the size of a Brompton wheel!!!!


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## Reynard (17 Sep 2022)

Julia9054 said:


> . . . . the size of a Brompton wheel!!!!



Good lord!!! 

You do know that it's a "must have" for Christmas...


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## Tom B (18 Sep 2022)

There is local Germanic/ Bavarian bakery near me

http://pretzelandspelt.co.uk/

Angelica started selling flour during lockdown and I've been buying it in 15kg sacks ever since.

It's from nelstrops who also sell online

http://www.nelstrop.co.uk/collections/all

I use their empress green which doesn't seem to be on the website, for most things.


Pretzel and Spelt advertised some pretzel buns on the Facebook this week, I tried one on the way to work and meant to get some more yesterday, bit I turned up too late....

So I made some this morning.. with a overnight dough.

Not as shiny as the pros, and I'd lost my lame so the cuts arnt as good, but not bad for a first efforts and they taste good :-)

Made pizza last night too.


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## glasgowcyclist (9 Oct 2022)

I made some cinnamon swirls today. 
Sorry, I ate two before I remembered to take a picture .

Vanilla frosting made with butter, cream cheese, vanilla and icing sugar. Needed more cinnamon but a lovely soft bun nonetheless.


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## Reynard (9 Oct 2022)

I made an apple and ginger upside down cake.


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## Tom B (10 Oct 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> ....Needed more cinnamon but a lovely soft bun nonetheless.



Nothing ever needs more cinnamon... Vile stuff :-p. Tastes like primary school pencil sharpenings.


I made a steamed jam pudding. It lasted about 1 min after being turned out before it was gobbled up. I've been challenged to to a chocolate one, with a chocolate sauce instead of jam. But not sure how I'm going to do the sauce.


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## figbat (10 Oct 2022)

Tom B said:


> Nothing ever needs more cinnamon... Vile stuff :-p. Tastes like primary school pencil sharpenings.
> 
> 
> I made a steamed jam pudding. It lasted about 1 min after being turned out before it was gobbled up. I've been challenged to to a chocolate one, with a chocolate sauce instead of jam. But not sure how I'm going to do the sauce.



Chocolate and butter, with some golden syrup maybe. Melt together, probably best to cool a bit before using with the pudding batter.


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## Reynard (10 Oct 2022)

Tom B said:


> Nothing ever needs more cinnamon... Vile stuff :-p. Tastes like primary school pencil sharpenings.
> 
> 
> I made a steamed jam pudding. It lasted about 1 min after being turned out before it was gobbled up. I've been challenged to to a chocolate one, with a chocolate sauce instead of jam. But not sure how I'm going to do the sauce.



There is a pudding that you just make the batter, and while it cooks in the oven, separates out into a sponge and a chocolate sauce in the bottom. Forgotten what it's called though. I suspect Mr Google might have the answer.


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## annedonnelly (10 Oct 2022)

Reynard said:


> There is a pudding that you just make the batter, and while it cooks in the oven, separates out into a sponge and a chocolate sauce in the bottom. Forgotten what it's called though. I suspect Mr Google might have the answer.



I think there's a lemon version too. Something like this one.


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## Reynard (10 Oct 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> I think there's a lemon version too. Something like this one.



Oh, I'd forgotten about the lemon version...


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## figbat (10 Oct 2022)

Or the melting middle puddings which you cut into and chocolatey gooeyness oozes out.


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## Reynard (10 Oct 2022)

Chocolate fondant puddings... 

Oh so naughty, but oh so gooooooooooooooood.


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## C R (10 Oct 2022)

There was a recipe we tried once where the batter separated into three layers when cooked. The one we made was custard flavour I think. Must find the recipe again.

Found it
https://www.recipetineats.com/magic-3-layer-custard-cake/


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## Dave 123 (10 Oct 2022)

Not bread, but I thought you lot would be interested in this-

Today I went on a cheese making course at River Cottage. No sign of Hugh, but an enjoyable day taught by Marcus Ferguson.

I made Caerphilly and Camembert. The ricotta we were supposed to make was minimal.


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## Dave 123 (23 Oct 2022)

Mixed seed sourdough fresh out of the bbq.

We had a new kitchen fitted the week before last. My starter sulked in its holiday environment, despite being fed. I’ve been feeding it with finest rye flour all week.


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## C R (31 Oct 2022)

Made empanadas yesterday


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## Always Cross (1 Nov 2022)

Sourdough in a tin using a halegon oven cooked for 30 mins at 200c took out of tin too pale at the botttom so put it back in upside down for 10 mins could be tastier but only took 6 hours. Fed the starter twice as i hadn use it for a while it lives in my fridge.sourdough starter is about 60 years old. I got it from my local Italian baker who brought over from Italy when he came here. It looks like bread dough not a runny one. I’ve tried runny starters but they never work well for me. I’ve kept this one alive myself for about 10 years.


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## Julia9054 (1 Nov 2022)

I put my sourdough starter in the freezer when I went on holiday in the summer. I haven't revived it and I'm back to baking with yeast.
It's very freeing. I realise now that I'd become a slave to the bloody thing


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## figbat (1 Nov 2022)

Julia9054 said:


> I put my sourdough starter in the freezer when I went on holiday in the summer. I haven't revived it and I'm back to baking with yeast.
> It's very freeing. I realise now that I'd become a slave to the bloody thing
> View attachment 666598



I was the same - feeding the damned thing all the time, having to either use the discard to make stuff we really didn't need, or throwing it away. Whilst I loved the results of using it, it was quite high maintenance.

For bread I now use a low yeast, long-prove where possible which turns out something better than the typical high yeast, forced-prove methods. Approximately 1/4 of the 'normal' yeast amount and proved overnight in a cool place (usually my garage - my Italian baking guru puts hers in the boot of her car).


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## C R (1 Nov 2022)

The traditional way I heard told in Galicia was to keep some dough from one bake to the next in a cool place, no feeding or discarding. Then mix in with the next dough and let leaven for 18 to 24 hours.


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## figbat (1 Nov 2022)

C R said:


> The traditional way I heard told in Galicia was to keep some dough from one bake to the next in a cool place, no feeding or discarding. Then mix in with the next dough and let leaven for 18 to 24 hours.



Yeah, but again this does force you to keep baking. Sourdough works best when you have a continuous demand for baking. For occasional demand it can be done but it's a faff. I love that I can do it, but I became a slave to it.


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## Reynard (1 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> I was the same - feeding the damned thing all the time, having to either use the discard to make stuff we really didn't need, or throwing it away. Whilst I loved the results of using it, it was quite high maintenance.
> 
> For bread I now use a low yeast, long-prove where possible which turns out something better than the typical high yeast, forced-prove methods. Approximately 1/4 of the 'normal' yeast amount and proved overnight in a cool place (usually my garage - my Italian baking guru puts hers in the boot of her car).



This is what I do. With a long bulk ferment, it's very sourdough-like.

Haven't used sourdough since lockdown 1 where yeast seemed to be made of unobtanium. Although the discard makes very good pancakes and waffles...


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## C R (1 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> Yeah, but again this does force you to keep baking. Sourdough works best when you have a continuous demand for baking. For occasional demand it can be done but it's a faff. I love that I can do it, but I became a slave to it.



Of course, that was the time that each house baked once a week for their own consumption. However, I imagine that you could keep the lump of dough in the freezer until you want to bake again.


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## glasgowcyclist (1 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> feeding the damned thing all the time, having to either use the discard to make stuff we really didn't need, or throwing it away



There is a way to avoid those problems: employ the scrapings method. 

For sourdough I only make enough starter for whatever I am baking. There might be 2 or 3g of starter left in the tub (it would be 1/2 a tsp at best) and I put that back in the fridge until I next need it. Then, 24 hours ahead of time, I'll top that up with only enough flour and water for the bake. There's still enough activity in the scrapings to create a bubbling starter for the next day. 

This way I don't waste anything. 

If it's going to be several weeks before the next bake, I will freeze it.


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## Always Cross (1 Nov 2022)

Mine has lived up to 6 weeks in the fridge without touching it I would need to feed and discard because of the length of time asleep. If I use it every couple of weeks I take it out of the fridge the night before baking (i have 100g in the fridge always) I feed it 60g water and 120g flour, the next day I take 100g from this that goes in the fridge for next time. So I don’t waste any. I like to bake it quick as if I leave it to prove too long it gets too strong a taste and the wife doesn’t like it. I have left in the fridge to prove over night I had good results from that but the taste was too strong.


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## T4tomo (1 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> my Italian baking guru puts hers in the boot of her car



if she drives like typical Italian isn't that going to shake the dough up a bit?


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## Always Cross (1 Nov 2022)

My best bread recently has been the tin recipe from Bake with Jack Ive been making 3 tin loaves at a time to save electric then cut them in half and freeze.


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## C R (1 Nov 2022)

Granary rolls to have with stew tonight. Nothing fancy just ready made granary flour.


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## Julia9054 (1 Nov 2022)

C R said:


> Of course, that was the time that each house baked once a week for their own consumption.


That's what I do. The problem is that my house consists of only 2 people and the other one doesn't really like bread. Home made bread doesn't really keep so my solution is to bake rolls and put them in the freezer. I can get out enough for my own consumption each morning.


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## C R (1 Nov 2022)

Julia9054 said:


> That's what I do. The problem is that my house consists of only 2 people and the other one doesn't really like bread. Home made bread doesn't really keep so my solution is to bake rolls and put them in the freezer. I can get out enough for my own consumption each morning.



Home baked bread is very popular at our place, the rolls above are all gone. Unfortunately I'm the only one that likes sourdough, so I've given up on keeping a starter going.


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## Tom B (3 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> I was the same - feeding the damned thing all the time, having to either use the discard to make stuff we really didn't need, or throwing it away. Whilst I loved the results of using it, it was quite high maintenance.
> 
> For bread I now use a low yeast, long-prove where possible which turns out something better than the typical high yeast, forced-prove methods. Approximately 1/4 of the 'normal' yeast amount and proved overnight in a cool place (usually my garage - my Italian baking guru puts hers in the boot of her car).




The low yeast long prove method is what I use for pizza dough and general bread. 

Mine proves in the fridge for 20-36 hours.. I've even left or a few days knocked it back and proved again at room temp.

I use the ingredients at stadlers made pizza calculator with reduced salt.


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## glasgowcyclist (3 Nov 2022)

Tom B said:


> I use the ingredients at stadlers made pizza calculator with reduced salt.



What does this bit mean? I can’t figure it out.


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## Tom B (4 Nov 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> What does this bit mean? I can’t figure it out.



Sorry..

https://www.stadlermade.com/how-to-make-neapolitan-style-pizza-dough/

https://www.stadlermade.com/pizza-calculator/

I use that base dough process / calculator for lots of bread base mixes.

I find it too salty even for pizza so knock off some salt.


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## figbat (4 Nov 2022)

I’ve posted it before, but this recipe always gives me great results. I have done baking lessons with the author who is passionate about authentic Italian recipes; the dough recipe can be used for any bread required. You can adjust the hydration level according to needs if needed.


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## Tom B (5 Nov 2022)

figbat said:


> I’ve posted it before, but this recipe always gives me great results. I have done baking lessons with the author who is passionate about authentic Italian recipes; the dough recipe can be used for any bread required. You can adjust the hydration level according to needs if needed.



I cant really disagree with anything in that recipe and reasoning.

Its why i use a nice thick floor tile in the oven for pizza type breads and i make sure is is damn hot.

My oven will go over 250 and when its hot with the tile in i put the gratin mode on to really get the tile hot.
The difference the tile makes is immense. 

I recently tried an american recipe with loads of sugar in the dough and tomato base sauce.... it was vile.


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## Tom B (8 Nov 2022)

I suffer from an hereditary inability to judge the number of potatoes for mash so usually end up with bits of mash in the freezer. This has lead to my lad being brought up on a diet of potato cakes!

He's potato cake (and poached egg).habbit has now reached the point I'm making mash to make potato cakes. He refuses shop bought potato cakes as rubbish and yuk!

So yesterday I made potato cakes in triplicate.

Then I made raspberry and white chocolate scones, but did them as drop scones as that seems trendy at the moment.


Baking of the lowest order I know


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## figbat (8 Nov 2022)

My Italian baking teacher was recently in Italy and posted a picture of some typical Neopolitan sweet pastries called biscotti all'amarene. Initially developed as a way of using up leftovers, they are sweet pastry wrapped around a sponge cake centre, which is mixed with black cherry jam. The whole lot is topped with royal icing. I knew I had to try it!

I found this recipe (in Italian but I used a digital translator) and had a go. It involves:

make a 'pan di Spagna' sponge (a fat-free sponge like a genoise) - this is done the day before to give time to cool and dry
make a sweet crust pastry - the method in the recipe is unlike any I have done before for pastry, going against all accepted wisdom of pastry making (the butter and sugar are creamed first, then a load of eggs added, then the flour)
make the filling by crumbling the cake and adding cocoa, black cherry jam and an egg yolk to make a kind of cakey paste - shape to an oval log
roll out the pastry, place the filling log on it and wrap
make the icing with egg whites and icing sugar, top the wrapped log
decorate with strained black cherry jam
cut into slices and bake
The results are a bit messy (especially compared to the recipe pictures!) but very tasty. Quite a big lump to eat, but I could see it as a good mid-afternoon treat in a cafe with an espresso, to see you through to a late evening dinner.




I was left with a reasonable amount of pastry and icing so I knocked up some kind of cookies using blobs of black cherry and strawberry jam (and a few plain).




A good learning experience; the pan di Spagna, the creaming method for pastry etc. I might modify them in future - perhaps add some actual black cherries to the mix, perhaps kirsch-soaked ones, and I would handle the decoration differently. Maybe make them a little smaller too!


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## Dave 123 (13 Nov 2022)

A few weeks ago I told you about the cheese making course I attended.

Last night we tried the Caerphilly. Mushroomy, nutty, creamy, soft and mellow.

It was a thumbs up from Lisa and my in laws


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## Tom B (16 Nov 2022)

Having done the cheese making course is this now something you can do at home?


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## Dave 123 (16 Nov 2022)

Tom B said:


> Having done the cheese making course is this now something you can do at home?



I will need a digital thermometer for greater accuracy.

Some starter bacteria and some rennet.

https://cheesemakingshop.co.uk/product-category/cultures/

https://cheesemakingshop.co.uk/product-category/calf-rennet/


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## Poacher (17 Nov 2022)

Bought a bag of a dozen eating apples for 50p at last Saturday's Stickney car boot. What to do, crumble? Nah!
Roll of puff pastry from Lidl and tadah! Tarte tatin. Only used five of the apples.





Bonus baking: used the leftover pastry and four Linda McCartney red onion and rosemary sausages to make eight sausage rolls.
Yes, I know there are only six in the photo!


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## glasgowcyclist (17 Nov 2022)

Poacher said:


> Yes, I know there are only six in the photo!



Hmm, I wonder why… 🤔


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## Dave 123 (19 Nov 2022)

3 for me, one for a present


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## Julia9054 (19 Nov 2022)

Spelt is my current flour of choice. Because the dough is slacker and more difficult to work, I have acquired these silicone moulds instead of letting my buns freeform.




(two gone already. Yum)


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## glasgowcyclist (19 Nov 2022)

Julia9054 said:


> Spelt is my current flour of choice. Because the dough is slacker and more difficult to work, I have acquired these silicone moulds instead of letting my buns freeform.
> View attachment 668459
> 
> (two gone already. Yum



I’ve got the top right mould too for making little rolls. The only think I dislike about it is the holes; if the dough is wetter than normal it oozes through and makes it tricky to remove them,


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## Always Cross (20 Nov 2022)

Busy this afternoon 4 loaves to fill the oven and a banana cake while the oven was still hot


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## Tom B (26 Nov 2022)

Can anyone point me in the direction of a nice not too fruity fruit loaf recipe that might also work in a bread maker. I'm not a fan but my neighbour has asked me to make them something ideally they could do I'm their bread maker.

They want something like you buy from supermarkets. More bready than cakey.


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## Reynard (26 Nov 2022)

In that case, any fruited bun recipe should work well enough, and just bake as a loaf rather than individual buns.


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## annedonnelly (26 Nov 2022)

The instruction book that came with my breadmaker has recipes for fruit bread. I'd be surprised if theirs doesn't too.

This isn't the model I have but I bet most of the recipes work in all breadmakers.


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## glasgowcyclist (6 Dec 2022)

Pagnotta con Finocchietto
(Farmhouse loaf encrusted with fennel seeds)





Time slows when you're waiting for bread to cool. ⏳


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## T4tomo (6 Dec 2022)

Dave 123 said:


> A few weeks ago I told you about the cheese making course I attended.
> 
> Last night we tried the Caerphilly. Mushroomy, nutty, creamy, soft and mellow.
> 
> It was a thumbs up from Lisa and my in laws



How do you make Welsh cheese?
Carefully.


That look very very good @Dave 123


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## Tom B (9 Dec 2022)

Had a bucket of cold proved dough in the fridge for nearly a week, it was about to crawl out of the bucket and run off, so I knocked it back tossed in a touch of fresh yeast and a sniff of sugar, balled it out and then made pizza.

The plan was eat 3 and freeze the rest (another 3 or 4 out of view) hence the slightly underdone appearances.

But the missus has claimed the rest for the early crew's lunch at work tomorrow.


Again Baking of the lowest order... Plan was to make some pretzels but I didnt have time.


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## Dave 123 (10 Dec 2022)

A salvage operation this morning. It seems like Putin has been at my bbq gas!

I knew it was running low, but after 15 minutes the temperature was dropping.

I turned the (new) oven on. I’d not baked in there yet.

So the loaves came off the bbq, out of the casserole pots, on to a tray and in the oven on 280°.

One has come out fairly normal, the browner one is harder crust with a glazed look. Both treated the same…. Who knows!?


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## glasgowcyclist (10 Dec 2022)

Dave 123 said:


> in the oven on 280°



That’s a very high temperature. Do you normally bake at that temp?


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## Dave 123 (10 Dec 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> That’s a very high temperature. Do you normally bake at that temp?



In the bbq I do, the lowest I get that to is 300°. But the loaves are in a Dutch oven.


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## glasgowcyclist (10 Dec 2022)

Dave 123 said:


> In the bbq I do, the lowest I get that to is 300°. But the loaves are in a Dutch oven.



Even being in a Dutch oven that till seems rather high but the important thing is whether you are pleased with the result.


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## Dave 123 (10 Dec 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> Even being in a Dutch oven that till seems rather high but the important thing is whether you are pleased with the result.



I am.

They just about salvaged. Just a slither along the bottom that’s a bit doughy.


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## oldwheels (11 Dec 2022)

Tom B said:


> Can anyone point me in the direction of a nice not too fruity fruit loaf recipe that might also work in a bread maker. I'm not a fan but my neighbour has asked me to make them something ideally they could do I'm their bread maker.
> 
> They want something like you buy from supermarkets. More bready than cakey.



I use an ordinary white loaf recipe and before the second kneading cycle bung in a measure of currants or raisins. The measure is the same one as used to measure the flour.
I sometimes add some ground cinnamon but this is not necessary.
The breadmaker has helped a lot to reduce my electricity bill as well.


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

It’s been a busy 3 days here in preparation for Christmas. Today’s finale is this chocolate babka, which will be our centrepiece cake.









Made as a garland rather than the usual loaf, as a nod to the festive season.


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

These Italian hazelnut biscuits ‘baci di dama’ also appeared. Traditionally these are sandwiched with chocolate but I prefer to serve them as little individuals like this.


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

Some mince pie crumbles…


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

This is a pan di Spagna - a kind of shortcut Genoise sponge. It is actually an intermediate step on the way to the final product, but until I get home in about half an hour I don’t have a picture of the outcome, so here’s the teaser - wonder if anybody will guess what the end point is?


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

I also put together a kind of cheesecake to use up some leftover mascarpone cream I made a while ago for a tiramisu. I made a Biscoff biscuit base, covered with a thin layer of Biscoff spread (it’s a thing), topped with the mascarpone cream and sprinkled with crumbled Biscoff biscuits. Sadly no picture but it tasted really good!


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## Reynard (23 Dec 2022)

I just baked an oat & rye bloomer for a friend's Xmas pressie. She prefers one of my breads to go with her cheese & chutney instead of a posh box of crackers...


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## C R (23 Dec 2022)

First ever attempt at making mince pies at C R Manor. Daughter 1 made the pastry and I assembled and baked the things, the looks are up to my usual rustic standards, but they taste nice enough.


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## figbat (23 Dec 2022)

figbat said:


> This is a pan di Spagna - a kind of shortcut Genoise sponge. It is actually an intermediate step on the way to the final product, but until I get home in about half an hour I don’t have a picture of the outcome, so here’s the teaser - wonder if anybody will guess what the end point is?
> View attachment 672096



So, the pan di Spagna gets crumbled up and mixed with cocoa, black cherry jam and an egg yolk to make the filling for these biscotti all’amarene. This time I also added some chopped dried cherries that I had soaked overnight in cherry brandy. The filling is encased in pastry and topped with royal icing.


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## annedonnelly (23 Dec 2022)

You deserve a rest after all that @figbat


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## figbat (26 Dec 2022)

figbat said:


> It’s been a busy 3 days here in preparation for Christmas. Today’s finale is this chocolate babka, which will be our centrepiece cake.
> View attachment 672091
> 
> 
> ...



Tried it yesterday - another triumph! Fudgey chocolateness swirled through a moist cakey bread. Very decadent!


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## Julia9054 (28 Dec 2022)

Just baked this. Christmas present from my son - a soda bread style mix to which you add 330ml of beer.


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## annedonnelly (28 Dec 2022)

I had a soda bread recipe that included beer. I think it was ok but as a non-drinker I didn't know what to do with the rest of the bottle


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## C R (28 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> I had a soda bread recipe that included beer. I think it was ok but as a non-drinker I didn't know what to do with the rest of the bottle



Another loaf?


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## Reynard (28 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> I had a soda bread recipe that included beer. I think it was ok but as a non-drinker I didn't know what to do with the rest of the bottle



Belgian-style carbonnades of beef


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## annedonnelly (28 Dec 2022)

@Reynard Next time I have some spare I'll send it to you. I don't eat beef either!


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## Reynard (28 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> @Reynard Next time I have some spare I'll send it to you. I don't eat beef either!



Trouble is, I'm teetotal too.


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## Ratchet Cat (28 Dec 2022)

You could always add the beer to pancake batter.


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## figbat (28 Dec 2022)

Ratchet Cat said:


> You could always add the beer to pancake batter.



Or tempura style batter.


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## Tom B (30 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> I had a soda bread recipe that included beer. I think it was ok but as a non-drinker I didn't know what to do with the rest of the bottle



While I've never been tee total I'm not a big drinker. It was making things with ale that got me drinking ales.

Now I don't really like things with ale and beer in them and detest red wine sauces. But do like the odd (usually the odder the better) bitter.


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## Dave 123 (31 Dec 2022)

Focaccia to take to the in laws tonight


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## glasgowcyclist (31 Dec 2022)

I’ve got some pizza dough resting in the fridge from yesterday. We’ll be having that tonight.
Hers will be spinach and ricotta while mine will be black pudding and blue cheese. Cannae wait!


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## Dave 123 (31 Dec 2022)

glasgowcyclist said:


> I’ve got some pizza dough resting in the fridge from yesterday. We’ll be having that tonight.
> Hers will be spinach and ricotta while mine will be black pudding and blue cheese. Cannae wait!



Black pudding and blue cheese? Interesting. I might give that a whirl.

My blue cheese pizza is Stilton and artichoke.


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## Julia9054 (2 Jan 2023)

Latest Christmas baking themed present. Molds for making bagels


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## Reynard (2 Jan 2023)

Although bagels are not that difficult to shape tbh... 

Having said that, those bagels look like just the thing to go with the job lot of lox I picked up on yellow sticker Saturday teatime


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## Julia9054 (2 Jan 2023)

Yeah - I wouldn’t have bought them myself but they are a fun present.
Al got a Danish cook book so we just had them with home made gravlax


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## Reynard (2 Jan 2023)

I make gravlax too, but using the Hairy Bikers' recipe from their 12 days of Christmas book. OK, gravlax is for life, not just for Christmas LOL!  Actually got half a side of salmon (another YS acquisition) curing in the fridge at the moment. Because I ran out of freezer space...


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## CanucksTraveller (Saturday at 20:43)

I'm not much of a baker but I had a lot of Stilton to use up after Christmas so I made this Stilton and prosciutto scone. (It's one round cut into 8 individual ones and separated, but they kind of loosely join back up in the oven).
Very tasty.


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## Reynard (Saturday at 21:01)

Ummm, leftover cheese? What's that?  

Actually, that looks rather lovely @CanucksTraveller - would be lovely buttered, served on the side of a nice bowl of soup.


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## CanucksTraveller (Saturday at 23:38)

Reynard said:


> Ummm, leftover cheese? What's that?
> 
> Actually, that looks rather lovely @CanucksTraveller - would be lovely buttered, served on the side of a nice bowl of soup.



Thank you Reynard! I have no plans for soup but I do have plans for butter. 

You wouldn't believe the amount of cheese left over, someone bought too many varieties.


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## Reynard (Saturday at 23:46)

CanucksTraveller said:


> Thank you Reynard! I have no plans for soup but I do have plans for butter.
> 
> You wouldn't believe the amount of cheese left over, someone bought too many varieties.



Ummm, guilty as charged, your honour. You should see my fridge then...


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## Dave 123 (Yesterday at 19:06)

Tonight was za’atar chicken, labneh and flatbread from the bbq


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