# Correct nutrition



## Lien Sdrawde (31 Jul 2013)

I have recently increased my riding to between 100 - 130 miles per week, with most rides starting within an hour of getting home at 16.30. 
I'm surprised how varied my energy levels feel between many of my rides and I wondered if my nutrition was to blame?

My diet / exercise has been aimed at weight loss and at 20kg lighter than the start of this year, I feel good about this. My lunch is pretty much always a Morrisons salad comprised of couscous, tomato, sweetcorn, beetroot and is usually about 12.30.

Breakfast is always 3 weetabix.

Evening meal is usually based around good portions of chicken / fish with rice, veg etc etc (no naughty stuff).

I live in a fairly hilly area and for some bizarre reason head straight for them. I use 'Zero High 5' as my drinks on the bike and have recently been taking out a couple of fig rolls.

All tips greatly appreciated. Neil


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## Judderz (31 Jul 2013)

Try having a banana or two, nuts or the like around 3-3.30pm


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## Lien Sdrawde (1 Aug 2013)

Thanks. Will try that.


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## skyair (1 Aug 2013)

a bit more protein would help your muscles to


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## Hacienda71 (1 Aug 2013)

You will always get the odd day when you are a little fatigued. I would eat a bannana before the ride and take one with you or a flapjack or similar if you are riding over 30 or 40 miles at a time.


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## Andy_G (1 Aug 2013)

Im like you in some ways, i generally go 50% carbs 35% protein 15% fat as a guide line with about 2000 cals a day monday - friday and pig out more weekends, like this i seem to have more energy and after a 60-70 mile ride i dont ache.


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## Ningishzidda (2 Aug 2013)

I do about 80% dead animal parts, 10% dead plants and 10% living plants.


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## dan_bo (2 Aug 2013)

Hacienda71 said:


> You will always get the odd day when you are a little fatigued. I would eat a bannana before the ride and take one with you or a flapjack or similar if you are riding over 30 or 40 miles at a time.


 
I prefer banarnaranas to bannanas. More of a mouthful.


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## Snapper88 (2 Aug 2013)

I find two bananas some peanut butter & milk blended together works well for me. Being a beekeeper I also add some honey but thats just for a little taste


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## VamP (2 Aug 2013)

It's probably not nutritionally related. It's normal to build up fatigue. Take rest days when you feel (really) tired.


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## Julia9054 (2 Aug 2013)

I am assuming from your post that you are riding before your evening meal? Personally, I need to eat every 4-5 hours whether cycling or not! If I tried to cycle having last eaten a small lunch at 12.30, I'd fall off my bike before I reached the end of the road!
My favourite post work, pre cycle snack is a crunchy peanut butter sandwich. Salty, sweet and packed full of energy. Come to think of it, that's what I eat when I get back from my ride too!


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## 400bhp (2 Aug 2013)

By a shed load of nuts/dried fruit. Leave them at work and snack on them all day.


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## 400bhp (2 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> It's probably not nutritionally related. It's normal to build up fatigue. T*ake rest days when you feel (really) tired*.


 

Nah


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## VamP (2 Aug 2013)

400bhp said:


> Nah


 

You ride 7 days a week?


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## 400bhp (2 Aug 2013)

yep, sometimes.


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## redcard (2 Aug 2013)

Lien Sdrawde said:


> I have recently increased my riding to between 100 - 130 miles per week, with most rides starting within an hour of getting home at 16.30.
> I'm surprised how varied my energy levels feel between many of my rides and I wondered if my nutrition was to blame?
> 
> My diet / exercise has been aimed at weight loss and at 20kg lighter than the start of this year, I feel good about this. My lunch is pretty much always a Morrisons salad comprised of couscous, tomato, sweetcorn, beetroot and is usually about 12.30.
> ...



Breakfast around 400 calories
Lunch around 400 calories, if that
Chicken around 200, rice around 150, veg probably 150 max

So you're eating 1300 calories a day, burning probably around 600?

Figures don't add up.


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## ayceejay (2 Aug 2013)

It is my understanding that a body requires a minimum of calories just to get through the day, 1300 might be close to your minimum: it is not the same for every body. Obviously, if you are active you need to fuel this activity over and above your minimum otherwise your body will use its own intelligence to survive and this is not a good thing. Using emergency food is not the way to go and I think you should not just count calories but consider their source and have carbs/fat/protein at every meal (any protein in Weetabix?). Eating carbs with fat and/or protein will slow down its absorption.
I feel a lecture coming on so I will stop there.


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## Julia9054 (2 Aug 2013)

"Eating carbs with fat and/or protein will slow down its absorption."
What is the science behind this statement please ayceejay?


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## ayceejay (2 Aug 2013)

I will try to answer that in full in the morning Julia.


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## VamP (3 Aug 2013)

400bhp said:


> yep, sometimes.


 

I think you're just being mischievous


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## VamP (3 Aug 2013)

redcard said:


> Breakfast around 400 calories
> Lunch around 400 calories, if that
> Chicken around 200, rice around 150, veg probably 150 max
> 
> ...


 

You've added up some made up numbers and are surprised they don't balance?


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## 400bhp (3 Aug 2013)

No I'm not, ask some of the lads here. I only don't cycle 7 days a week because of family commitments.


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## Lien Sdrawde (3 Aug 2013)

ayceejay said:


> It is my understanding that a body requires a minimum of calories just to get through the day, 1300 might be close to your minimum: it is not the same for every body. Obviously, if you are active you need to fuel this activity over and above your minimum otherwise your body will use its own intelligence to survive and this is not a good thing. Using emergency food is not the way to go and I think you should not just count calories but consider their source and have carbs/fat/protein at every meal (any protein in Weetabix?). Eating carbs with fat and/or protein will slow down its absorption.
> I feel a lecture coming on so I will stop there.


 

I don't mind a lecture - and i'll try and learn from it. Thanks to all for the tips. Peanut butter is on tomorrows shopping list for sure. Neil


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## ayceejay (3 Aug 2013)

If you go to this site (http://healthyeating.sfgate.com) you will find fairly simple information on how the body absorbs and utilizes food, my (over)simplification is that the body absorbs carbohydrates fats and protein to provide energy but absorbs them in different ways. What is not stated here is how successful a mixed diet is in sustaining the energy flow, which was the point I was making but so far I have not found anything on the interweb to back this up in any way that might be considered 'scientific' but I am still looking.
You might want to experiment to find out what suits you best but I think you will feel a difference if as well as your porridge you have an egg and some fruit. Also, since you are already buying peanut butter (fat and protein) try it alone before your ride then try it with honey then try the honey alone and see if you notice any difference.


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## redcard (3 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> You've added up some made up numbers and are surprised they don't balance?



It's really not that hard to work out calories in Weetabix, it's right there on the side of the box.

Eating healthy and losing weight is mostly common sense - something you may be lacking if that post is anything to go by.


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## VamP (3 Aug 2013)

redcard said:


> It's really not that hard to work out calories in Weetabix, it's right there on the side of the box.
> 
> Eating healthy and losing weight is mostly common sense - something you may be lacking if that post is anything to go by.


 

OK Einstein. How did you work out the rest of it? Did you count the milk? Where on Earth does 600 calorie daily burn come from?

I might not have very much common sense, but what does that say about you?


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## redcard (3 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> OK Einstein. How did you work out the rest of it? Did you count the milk? Where on Earth does 600 calorie daily burn come from?
> 
> I might not have very much common sense, but what does that say about you?



Work out the calories yourself, you'll see my estimates are accurate.

The 600 calorie burn comes from my own experience of riding 25 miles a day for the last 18 months.

How many calories do you think he's burning?


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## VamP (3 Aug 2013)

redcard said:


> Work out the calories yourself, you'll see my estimates are accurate.
> 
> The 600 calorie burn comes from my own experience of riding 25 miles a day for the last 18 months.
> 
> How many calories do you think he's burning?


 
Seeing as you're estimating his portion sizes your estimate is accurate +/- 50%. I.e. a total guess.

His BMR will be 2000 to 3000 per day. As to his other activities, you are again guessing. By piling guesses on top of guesses you are arriving at nothing but noise.


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## Rob3rt (3 Aug 2013)

Add 3 generous servings of sausages per week and at least double your cake intake!


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## VamP (3 Aug 2013)

400bhp said:


> No I'm not, ask some of the lads here. I only don't cycle 7 days a week because of family commitments.


 
Just because it's possible does not mean it's optimal. But I suspect you know that, hence why I asked about your mischievousness.


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## 400bhp (3 Aug 2013)

:sigh: I was joking with my initial post.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (3 Aug 2013)

"Correct nutrition" then guessing portion sizes and calorie burn? Dub yaa tee eff?


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## Rob3rt (3 Aug 2013)

Let's bring this back to reality.

Eat like a normal person. Ride your bike a bit. No need for anything fancy.


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## lukesdad (4 Aug 2013)

Have we found out how many rides a week make up this 100-130 miles yet ?


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## lukesdad (4 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> You ride 7 days a week?


Not unusual, back in the day everyone I knew rode 7 days a week, I still do for probably half the year.


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## amaferanga (4 Aug 2013)

Easy to ride 7 days a week, but pretty daft to train 7 days a week unless at least one of those days is a recovery ride.


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## lukesdad (4 Aug 2013)

amaferanga said:


> Easy to ride 7 days a week, but pretty daft to train 7 days a week unless at least one of those days is a recovery ride.


 Quite so, but have we determined who is riding and who is training . Or are we just working from assumptions ?


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## Hill Wimp (4 Aug 2013)

Rob3rt said:


> Let's bring this back to reality.
> 
> Eat like a normal person. Ride your bike a bit. No need for anything fancy.


 


At last some sense hurrah


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## amaferanga (4 Aug 2013)

lukesdad said:


> Quite so, but have we determined who is riding and who is training . Or are we just working from assumptions ?


No idea.


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## ayceejay (4 Aug 2013)

lukesdad said:


> Quite so, but have we determined who is riding and who is training . Or are we just working from assumptions ?


I agree this is often the cause of confusion here, although


> _Eat like a normal person. Ride your bike a bit_


is good advice for a normal person who is worrying too much it doesn't help an aspiring athlete. That being said a serious athlete in training for an event or two should be more serious about nutrition than the cod science served cold here.


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## redcard (17 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> Seeing as you're estimating his portion sizes your estimate is accurate +/- 50%. I.e. a total guess.
> 
> His BMR will be 2000 to 3000 per day. As to his other activities, you are again guessing. By piling guesses on top of guesses you are arriving at nothing but noise.



The point of my post was to provoke the OP into giving more accurate information so he may be given appropriate guidance, not to get the thread sidetracked with worthless one-upmanship, which is what you attempted to turn it in to.


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## VamP (17 Aug 2013)

redcard said:


> The point of my post was to provoke the OP into giving more accurate information so he may be given appropriate guidance, not to get the thread sidetracked with worthless one-upmanship, which is what you attempted to turn it in to.


 
More noise.


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## bozmandb9 (18 Aug 2013)

Lien Sdrawde said:


> I have recently increased my riding to between 100 - 130 miles per week, with most rides starting within an hour of getting home at 16.30.
> I'm surprised how varied my energy levels feel between many of my rides and I wondered if my nutrition was to blame?
> 
> My diet / exercise has been aimed at weight loss and at 20kg lighter than the start of this year, I feel good about this. My lunch is pretty much always a Morrisons salad comprised of couscous, tomato, sweetcorn, beetroot and is usually about 12.30.
> ...


 
You don't mention your vital stat's Neil, but I'd say it sounds like you're not eating much. I'd recommend little and often, and major on protein and fats, minimise carbs, especially refined. So for example between meals eat nuts, or avocados (both examples of very healthy fats). Avoid pototoes pasta and the like. I've used this strategy over 7 years to cut my bodyfat from over 30% to around 10%, I've also found it's helped me in many other ways, it tends to keep my energy more level, and I'm never hungry.

Other thing is make sure you're drinking enough, dehydration will cause fatigue, and if you wait till your thirsty it's too late!


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## Lien Sdrawde (20 Aug 2013)

bozmandb9 said:


> You don't mention your vital stat's Neil, but I'd say it sounds like you're not eating much. I'd recommend little and often, and major on protein and fats, minimise carbs, especially refined. So for example between meals eat nuts, or avocados (both examples of very healthy fats). Avoid pototoes pasta and the like. I've used this strategy over 7 years to cut my bodyfat from over 30% to around 10%, I've also found it's helped me in many other ways, it tends to keep my energy more level, and I'm never hungry.
> 
> Other thing is make sure you're drinking enough, dehydration will cause fatigue, and if you wait till your thirsty it's too late!


 
Many thanks. Ive increased my input of food cosiderably since first posting this thread - as a result my rides feel a lot stronger.
At 52 yrs old (1.85m) i've dropped from 108kg to a just about 90kg since March. The last two weeks ive dropped 1kg having eaten quite a lot of pasta / potatoes etc as I was using this as a source of energy (carbs) and also taking flapjacks on runs, which have inluded in the last ten days rides of 60, 40, 35, 35, 30, 25, 25, and 15 miles.
Ive tried porridge (yuk) and put raisins in it (still yuk) so a good alternative is needed - also have started using peanut butter with jam sandwiches which are really tasty.

Thanks to all as i'm definately stronger than I was but know I still have a way to go to improve - especially with strength on hills. Neil


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## Ghost Donkey (20 Aug 2013)

Lien Sdrawde said:


> Many thanks. Ive increased my input of food cosiderably since first posting this thread - as a result my rides feel a lot stronger.
> At 52 yrs old (1.85m) i've dropped from 108kg to a just about 90kg since March. The last two weeks ive dropped 1kg having eaten quite a lot of pasta / potatoes etc as I was using this as a source of energy (carbs) and also taking flapjacks on runs, which have inluded in the last ten days rides of 60, 40, 35, 35, 30, 25, 25, and 15 miles.
> Ive tried porridge (yuk) and put raisins in it (still yuk) so a good alternative is needed - also have started using peanut butter with jam sandwiches which are really tasty.
> 
> Thanks to all as i'm definately stronger than I was but know I still have a way to go to improve - especially with strength on hills. Neil


 
If porridge is a problem and you like the taste and texture of cereals like Wheetabix you could try milled flax/pumpkin/hemp seeds or a combination of them in porridge. They add extra nutrients and alter the texture.


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## michaelcycle (28 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> It's probably not nutritionally related. It's normal to build up fatigue. Take rest days when you feel (really) tired.


 
^^^^ Good advice in my view although I think it is _partly_ nutrition related.

If you are dieting then you are in a calorie deficit. A calorie deficit is a stressor on the body. Cycling (in other words exercise) is another stressor. Work is a stressor...you see where I am going with this.

Stress accumulates with time and leads to over reaching. Over reaching can then lead to over training.

Rest a little and eat a bit more generally if necessary.

You'll be golden.


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## michaelcycle (28 Aug 2013)

ayceejay said:


> If you go to this site (http://healthyeating.sfgate.com) you will find fairly simple information on how the body absorbs and utilizes food, my (over)simplification is that the body absorbs carbohydrates fats and protein to provide energy but absorbs them in different ways. What is not stated here is how successful a mixed diet is in sustaining the energy flow, which was the point I was making but so far I have not found anything on the interweb to back this up in any way that might be considered 'scientific' but I am still looking.


 
I think the point is that if you eat a balanced meal the effect on blood sugar (glycaemic index / load) will be different. So for example if you are consume nothing but sweets at one sitting then you are consuming a lot of sugar (simple carbs) which then causes a burst of energy. However, this causes insulin to flood from the pancreas to regulate the supply leading to a blood sugar crash later on - the blood sugar level rollercoaster. If you eat a balanced meal this does not generally happen and you maintain consistent energy levels.

This said, there are times when having the ability to have short bursts of energy are good or you need to top up glycogen levels and therefore simple carbs can be a good thing - hence the use of jelly babies or maltodextrin energy drinks on longer rides etc.


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