# Olympic RR **spoilers**



## Noodley (25 Jul 2012)

Men's event starts at 10am on Saturday. Can Cav take Gold?

Women on Sunday.


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## ColinJ (25 Jul 2012)

I'd like him to and I wouldn't bet against him, but anything can happen in bike racing ...

There is an interesting preview of the road race course here.


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## beastie (25 Jul 2012)

It's a hard course to pick a winner on isn't it. If it's a Sprint then it could be Cav, Goss, Sagan, Greipel or Boonen. Sagan, Gilbert + Boonen are most likely to feature if it's a small selection, say 20 or so. Then add in Roleurs taking a punt on the way back to the mall. 

I have a cheeky five on Taylor Phinney.


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## BrumJim (25 Jul 2012)

Filled more with blind hope and jingoistic fervour than carefully considered analysis, I'd say Cavendish. Why?
1) Cav has been loosing weight for this one.
2) Flat finish
3) He is with Team Sky, and therefore has been preparing himself and the team specifically for this all year.
4) He wants it more than anyone.

I think that team GB will ensure that the peleton takes Box Hill fast enough to ruin the legs of the pure sprinters but slow enough not to drop Cavendish, and then will pull the peleton along as fast as possible on the run into London, leaving only the fittest of sprinters capable of putting in that final spurt. Team GB will then launch the missile from a long way out (relatively speaking), about the same distance as on the Champs-Élysées 2012, leaving people like Sagan and Griepel too far behind and too stretched to make up the distance before the finish.


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## lukesdad (25 Jul 2012)

I think the breaks will go early, the countries without sprinters will want to split it up. With only 5 in ateam nobody will want to use their men up, so it's hard to see who will do the chasing. Germans or Aussies maybe ? But they won't be confident against Cav. So it'll be down to 4 Brits of which 2 have their eye on the tt.


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## beastie (25 Jul 2012)

lukesdad said:


> I think the breaks will go early, the countries without sprinters will want to split it up. With only 5 in ateam nobody will want to use their men up, so it's hard to see who will do the chasing. Germans or Aussies maybe ? But they won't be confident against Cav. So it'll be down to 4 Brits of which 2 have their eye on the tt.



Wiggins owes Cav from the TDF, I expect a massive pull a la the Worlds.


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## mr Mag00 (25 Jul 2012)

going to watch saturday and have tickets for sunday at boxhill. i do think wiggins tbh, and the womens race?


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## benb (25 Jul 2012)

I reckon Cav gold, Froome silver, and Wiggins bronze.


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## beastie (25 Jul 2012)

User said:


> I'm not so sure Wiggins "Owes" Cav anything, Cav got well paid to follow team orders..
> just to see things from a different angle, why wouldn't the new TDF champion fancy on olymplic road race gold, history making can make a big difference to ones plans, especially as this could be possible his last games..


Yes and no. I think Cav riding without a leadout thru most of the tour was done on the understanding that he would have the GB team working for him in the Olympics.


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## Noodley (25 Jul 2012)

The GB team will be ridng for Cav, that is a given.


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## siadwell (25 Jul 2012)

Is there a definitive list of teams anywhere?

I've been looking at http://www.london2012.com/cycling-road/athletes/event=cycling-road-men-road-race/index.htmx where you can filter by country. I can see that GB and Australia, for example, are fielding a team of five, but does that mean that riders from smaller countries, such as Algeria, are going to be Billy Nomates?


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## Steve H (25 Jul 2012)

My heart definitely says Cav. He wants it so much and has a really strong team around him. I wouldn't underestimate Box Hill many times over though - no problem getting over the first few times, but I think there will be break-aways and attacks coming from the teams / individuals who aren't pure sprinters.

If it comes down to a bunch sprint, I don't think Cav will go too early. On the final sprint in Paris last weekend he went very early, but I think this was more from the momentum he managed to carry into the final corner and the element of surprise he launched on his rivals.

If its not Cav, I'd have an each-way bet on Boonen or Sagan.


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## ColinJ (25 Jul 2012)

siadwell said:


> Is there a definitive list of teams anywhere?


Men's RR start list (by name and by country). Women's RR start list (by name and by country). 


siadwell said:


> I've been looking at http://www.london2012.com/cycling-road/athletes/event=cycling-road-men-road-race/index.htmx where you can filter by country. I can see that GB and Australia, for example, are fielding a team of five, but *does that mean that riders from smaller countries, such as Algeria, are going to be Billy Nomates?*


In theory, yes, but if you remember what happened in Sydney - Kazakh Vinokourov rode with his German Telekom team-mates Ullrich and Klöden. Trade team loyalties may kick in if personal and national interests cannot be served. Sometimes all 3 can be served at the same time!


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## siadwell (25 Jul 2012)

Thanks. Just the job Colin.


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## Scoosh (25 Jul 2012)

(GB Team Captain ?) David Millar has already said that there could well be alliances formed on the road, where teams with similar desires (eg. GB, Germany, Oz, NZ, who all want a sprint finish) will work together to make that happen - as happened in Copenhagen, where Germany, Australia and GB all worked together to get to the sprint finish (where the best man won )

Obviously, other alliances will form to prevent it !

There could also be the possibility of eg Austria (Bernie Eisel), Canada (Ryder Hesjedal) becoming 'honorary team GB' to help their trade-ream mates. 

David Millar and the rest of team GB will be pulling as many strings/calling in favours etc to get Cav 'loaded and fired' at the right time. 

I also think that this is another one of David Brailsford's Projects: Project Beijing Track; Project TdF; Project Olympic RR. If form is any indicator .... 

Either way, it should be a cracker ! 

What TV coverage is there ?


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## Get In The Van (25 Jul 2012)

Sagan has a slight disadvantage in that he is a one man team, i don't think he'll be allowed to breakaway and if he does will be chased down by other teams.
however if he can keep his nose clean ride on the wheels of the other favourites then hes in with a shout.


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## Chuffy (25 Jul 2012)

Get In The Van said:


> Sagan has a slight disadvantage in that he is a one man team, i don't think he'll be allowed to breakaway and if he does will be chased down by other teams.
> however if he can keep his nose clean ride on the wheels of the other favourites then hes in with a shout.


You know what, just reading that makes me want to grow a monobrow and learn Slovenian. Prejsť Sagan, pódium dievčatá plakať, ak pán Cav vyhrať!


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## lukesdad (25 Jul 2012)

The Belgians swiss and French may well want to make it a a race of attrition similar to a spring classic. I would't be surprised to see a very select group off the front on the last couple of circuits of box hill.
The way to counter a break I would have thought would be for the Brits to put a man to sit on any break


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## Cheddar George (25 Jul 2012)

Team GB will be riding for Cavendish, just as they did in the worlds. I still find the Team SKY/GB trade team/national team an incredible situation, after watching Geraint Thomas perform in the 2011 TdF for his "trade" team he is then allowed to give it a miss the next year so he can have a go for an olympic medal on the track, . The downside is having a national team sponsored by Murdoch.


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## toby123 (25 Jul 2012)

It's just fascinating, I'm going to be there and I'm really looking forward to it. I think that the winner will be the one that crosses the line first.


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## PpPete (25 Jul 2012)

Wondering if a break doesn't form on the first few laps of the Box Hill circuit they might not send Froomey up the road to try and build a break - which he then does his best to destabilise later. Given all the speculation around, that could mess with a load of people's heads?


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## zimzum42 (25 Jul 2012)

They should have built a massive ramp on The Mall to ensure a spectacular 'mountain top' finish


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## ColinJ (25 Jul 2012)

zimzum42 said:


> They should have built a massive ramp on The Mall to ensure a spectacular 'mountain top' finish


Aren't there any multi-storey car parks nearby?


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## YahudaMoon (25 Jul 2012)

Anyone else looking forward for the female beach volley ball or is it just me ?

I know what I'll be watching over mens cycling


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## zimzum42 (26 Jul 2012)

YahudaMoon said:


> Anyone else looking forward for the female beach volley ball or is it just me ?
> 
> I know what I'll be watching over mens cycling


Not really, volleyball is a bit crap

You do know there is free porn on the internet, right?


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## Noodley (26 Jul 2012)

PpPete said:


> Wondering if a break doesn't form on the first few laps of the Box Hill circuit they might not send Froomey up the road to try and build a break - which he then does his best to destabilise later. Given all the speculation around, that could mess with a load of people's heads?


 
I'd have thought they would be more inclined to use Millar in a break.


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## perplexed (26 Jul 2012)

If it does come down to a huge bunch sprint, then my grubby fiver would be on Cav.

But it's the potential for attrition on Box Hill that worries me. I'm tempted to have a cheeky tenner on Mr. Sagan. He's no team, but that didn't stop him winning stages in the TdF.


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## bridgy (26 Jul 2012)

Does anyone know roughly what time they will finish on Saturday?


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## siadwell (26 Jul 2012)

Scoosh said:


> What TV coverage is there ?


 
Aunty Beeb has Olympic programming most of Saturday on BBC1. Coverage of the RR could be a bit patchy. According to TV Guide:
9:30-11:30 "also the chance to see the early stages of the men's cycling road race"
11:30-13:00 "updates on the men's cycling road race"
13:15-16:45 "conclusion to the men's cycling road race"

BBC Sport Interactive Freeview 1 has solid coverage between 10:45 and 13:15.

BBC Olympics 3 (only on Sky?) appears to cover the whole thing 9:50 to 16:25.

Full listings at http://www.tvguide.co.uk/default.asp?systemid=10&cTime=7/28/2012 12:00:00 PM&thisTime=12&thisDay=7/28/2012&catColor=


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## Scoosh (26 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> I'd have thought they would be more inclined to use Millar in a break.


Catch is that Millar is the Team Captain on the road, so presumably needs to be around most of this troops ...


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## siadwell (26 Jul 2012)

bridgy said:


> Does anyone know roughly what time they will finish on Saturday?


 
The Mall - FINISH 3.40pm (according to approx times at http://www.gosurrey.info/olympic-road-cycling/race-times/)


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## bridgy (26 Jul 2012)

siadwell said:


> The Mall - FINISH 3.40pm (according to approx times at http://www.gosurrey.info/olympic-road-cycling/race-times/)


 
Thanks!


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## VamP (26 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> You know what, just reading that makes me want to grow a monobrow and learn Slovenian. Prejsť Sagan, pódium dievčatá plakať, ak pán Cav vyhrať!


 
erm... wrong language!??

Seeing as he and I were born in the same country I fancy myself a bit of an expert on this


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## Cheddar George (26 Jul 2012)

VamP said:


> erm... wrong language!??
> 
> Seeing as he and I were born in the same country I fancy myself a bit of an expert on this


 
Give Chuffy a break, he was busy sorting out the flags for the olympic football at the time.


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## Chuffy (26 Jul 2012)

VamP said:


> erm... wrong language!??
> 
> Seeing as he and I were born in the same country I fancy myself a bit of an expert on this


Preklet bodi za to, kot viseče!
What fool puts languages beginning with SL side by side on Google Translate?


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## fimm (26 Jul 2012)

Thank you for the link, ColinJ.
One thing we can be sure of is that the GB team will be very, very familiar with the route...
Interesting discussion, everybody, particularly the bits about trade teams coming into play too.


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## PpPete (26 Jul 2012)

Scoosh said:


> Catch is that Millar is the Team Captain on the road, so presumably needs to be around most of this troops ...


 
Precisely, and Millar in a break is "known quantity" to most of the riders anyway, whereas Froome perhaps less so. 
Box Hill may not be that big or that steep (by pro-peleton standards) but in his current form Froome may still be able to explode off the front?
Half of the peleton might just think there was a chance he was after personal glory and, if they have the legs, go after him.

Would be a risky tactic, especially with no radios.

Will they have the motorbikes with the chalk boards giving the time gaps ?


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## smutchin (26 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> In theory, yes, but if you remember what happened in Sydney - Kazakh Vinokourov rode with his German Telekom team-mates Ullrich and Klöden. Trade team loyalties may kick in if personal and national interests cannot be served.


 
Colombia and Norway each have two Sky men on their team...

To work out Cav's chances, I think you have to look at which teams will be hoping for a sprint finish, and which will prefer to get a man away in a break. As lukesdad says, Belgium and France fall into the latter category. Italy too, I think. And you can expect the whole of the Slovakian team to be in any escape group.

Of the ones hoping for a sprint finish, as well as GB, there's Germany, Australia, USA. Probably Norway and Spain too, though they could go either way. That's probably enough people chasing down to ensure a sprint finish, isn't it?

d.


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## smutchin (26 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> You know what, just reading that makes me want to grow a monobrow and learn Slovenian. Prejsť Sagan, pódium dievčatá plakať, ak pán Cav vyhrať!


 
I don't think he speaks Slovenian...


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## ColinJ (26 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> I don't think he speaks Slovenian...


We've covered that one!


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## PpPete (26 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> And you can expect the whole of the Slovakian team to be in any escape group.






smutchin said:


> Of the ones hoping for a sprint finish, as well as GB, there's Germany, Australia, USA. Probably Norway and Spain too, though they could go either way. That's probably enough people chasing down to ensure a sprint finish, isn't it?


It's enough people for sure.... but if they are smart, they'll all wait around for Sky GB to do the chasing.


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## smutchin (26 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> We've covered that one!


 
Note to self: read whole thread before making smartarse replies.

d.


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## raindog (26 Jul 2012)

PpPete said:


> It's enough people for sure.... but if they are smart, they'll all wait around for Sky GB to do the chasing.


Trouble with that is, if GB fail to chase down the break and those other nations don't have someone in the break themselves, then they won't get a medal either.


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## PpPete (26 Jul 2012)

raindog said:


> Trouble with that is, if GB fail to chase down the break and those other nations don't have someone in the break themselves, then they won't get a medal either.


 
Of couse but how likely is GB not chasing ?


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## Chuffy (26 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Note to self: read whole thread before making smartarse replies.
> 
> d.


Especially as Sagan can say "My room, half an hour. Bring a friend" in any damn language he chooses.


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## Noodley (26 Jul 2012)

PpPete said:


> Of couse but how likely is GB not chasing ?


 
depends if David Millar is in the break or not...


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## srw (26 Jul 2012)

PpPete said:


> Would be a risky tactic, especially with no radios.


Which is exactly why it won't happen. We saw exactly the tactics GB will use during the TdF - allow a few hotheads to go into a break, control the speed of the peloton from the front with a five-man group, bring back the break with a few miles to go and then launch into the very well-drilled leadout train.

No-one with a sniff of a chance to win will be allowed more than a handful of minutes ahead of the main bunch.


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## User169 (26 Jul 2012)

Box Hill...


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## PaulB (26 Jul 2012)

The Olympics, after the TdF will be about as scintillating as the Charity Shield is to one of the participating sides, each of which have done the hard part getting there which renders the event a major anti-climax. It'll be like a pre-season friendly after your team has won the European Cup.


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## Get In The Van (26 Jul 2012)

I did hear that there are no race radios for the riders, so they can't rely on that to see how far a break (if there is one) is ahead, will be pure team tactics between riders as they ride. in that aspect Sagan has it easy as he rides to suit himself, no team orders, no looking after another rider, without this he can cause a lot of mischief if he wants


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## rich p (26 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> Especially as Sagan can say "My room, half an hour. Bring a friend" in any damn language he chooses.


 I noticed that Sagan spoke fluent Italian in all his interviews. I don't know if he does English too but the polyglotism of the riders is impresive.


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## Chuffy (26 Jul 2012)

rich p said:


> I noticed that Sagan spoke fluent Italian in all his interviews. I don't know if he does English too but the polyglotism of the riders is impresive.


And Wiggy's fluent French. No, 'tis against nature and I'll be throwing turnips at him on Saturday. Freak.


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## Steve H (27 Jul 2012)

Top level cycling is clearly a team event. Wiggins would have had a very different time in the Tour if he didn't have such a strong team riding for him. Cav has a great chance of winning the Olympic Road Race this weekend, but if he is successful, this will not just be down to his own strength, but also the strength of the team he is riding with.

Therefore, why does only one individual get the Gold medal in this event? Why doesn't the whole team get a medal? There are many team events where the whole team get medals - rowing, football, relay events etc. Not sure why Olympic Road Race Cycling isn't classed as a team event.


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## Noodley (27 Jul 2012)

Because it's not a team event.


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## Steve H (27 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> Because it's not a team event.


 
Guess I was arguing that for the Olympics it should be classed as a team event.

For the Pro Tour, I can understand it being the individual who crosses the line who is the sole winner. That's why a lot of the domestiques get paid - to help their sprinters and GC riders to win.

But in the Olympics where they aren't paid to be there, and they are part of the country team where the aim of the majority of riders is to get one of their team mates across the line first rather than getting themselves across the line first, I think it should be classed as a Team Event.


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## Strathlubnaig (27 Jul 2012)

maybe with no race radios then froome will casually go off in front and claim ignorance afterwards


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## Boris Bajic (27 Jul 2012)

bridgy said:


> Does anyone know roughly what time they will finish on Saturday?


 
Look out for a fat lady opening her mouth and inhaling deeply.

Tradidionally, this happens just before something is over.


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## Boris Bajic (27 Jul 2012)

Delftse Post said:


> Box Hill...


 
That looks more like a tall Australian swimmer than a Manx missile.


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## psmiffy (27 Jul 2012)

If - god forbid - that a frencman wins - is there a French Lesley Garrett that can be summoned to sing the Marseillaise at the medal ceremony in revenge for what they did on Sunday


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## iLB (27 Jul 2012)

psmiffy said:


> If - god forbid - that Peter Sagan wins - is there a French Lesley Garrett that can be summoned to sing the Marseillaise at the medal ceremony in revenge for what they did on Sunday


 
but he ain't french ?


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## lb81 (27 Jul 2012)

Cavendish on the BBC sport website this morning...
_"It's doable," he said. "I couldn't do it if I was doing this alone but I need four of the strongest bike riders in the world to help me. "And I have got four of the strongest bike riders in the world to help me."_
_"We were out training today [Thursday] and it was like 'Oh my God this is the dream team'. Hopefully we can put that into practice and deliver the results,"_
_"We have got four Tour de France stage winners in the team, first and second in the general classification and the British champion._
_"They are incredibly loyal guys, incredibly patriotic guys and really want to do this."_
And then Wiggins with my favourite quotes, love these...
_"It's going to be difficult and it's a long race as well but I think other teams will be looking at us and thinking, 'How are we going to compete with these guys?'._
_"And we're just sitting here not really worrying about the rest, we're just concentrating on ourselves."_


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## Strathlubnaig (27 Jul 2012)

psmiffy said:


> If - god forbid - that a frencman wins - is there a French Lesley Garrett that can be summoned to sing the Marseillaise at the medal ceremony in revenge for what they did on Sunday


what THEY did ? The lassie is from englandshire, hardly the French's fault she canny haud a tune


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## Cheddar George (27 Jul 2012)

OK, so the mens road race seems straightforward, team GB riding as a team to get Cav in for the sprint. Anybody got any information on the women ? The last i heard was that it was not a happy situation within the team.


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## siadwell (27 Jul 2012)

siadwell said:


> Aunty Beeb has Olympic programming most of Saturday on BBC1. Coverage of the RR could be a bit patchy. According to TV Guide:
> 9:30-11:30 "also the chance to see the early stages of the men's cycling road race"
> 11:30-13:00 "updates on the men's cycling road race"
> 13:15-16:45 "conclusion to the men's cycling road race"
> ...


 
Further to this, Freesat EPG is now showing 24 dedicated live Olympic HD channels. 
Alas, there's apparently a problem with Humax Freesat+ boxes that prevents these channels being recorded.


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## totallyfixed (27 Jul 2012)

There are 2 gold medals up for grabs this weekend in cycling, one of them is on Sunday, little wonder the women get less coverage than the men going by this thread. As an attempt to redress the balance I'm going to say Vos for the win with a dust up for the minor placings. In both races I feel a crash could affect the outcome more than is usual due to narrow roads and not riding in their normal trade teams.


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## Chuffy (27 Jul 2012)

totallyfixed said:


> There are 2 gold medals up for grabs this weekend in cycling, one of them is on Sunday, little wonder the women get less coverage than the men going by this thread. As an attempt to redress the balance I'm going to say Vos for the win with a dust up for the minor placings. In both races I feel a crash could affect the outcome more than is usual due to narrow roads and not riding in their normal trade teams.


I don't know much about women's racing, but I get the impression that our team isn't quite as happy and well drilled as the mens.


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## iLB (27 Jul 2012)

I think you are better off blaming the UCI and mainstream media for the lack of coverage for womens cycling than this thread.


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## smutchin (27 Jul 2012)

Cheddar George said:


> OK, so the mens road race seems straightforward, team GB riding as a team to get Cav in for the sprint. Anybody got any information on the women ? The last i heard was that it was not a happy situation within the team.


 
My money is on Marianne Vos for the women's race - really going out on a limb with that one! Or maybe Giorgia Bronzini.

I don't know anything about discord in the GB women's team (I don't know a lot about women's pro cycling at all, tbh), though I've heard that Nicole Cooke isn't the most popular rider, being a bit of an individualist à la Thomas Voeckler. Lizzie Armitstead, Lucy Martin and Emma Pooley all ride on the same pro team, so you'd expect they'll get along fine and be well drilled.

d.


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## totallyfixed (27 Jul 2012)

Not blaming this thread, more that it is symptomatic of what is wrong with women's sport and the media generally. Sexism in this country [and others] is alive and well as witnessed by both media coverage and the discrepancy in distance between the men and women in the road race. Cycling needs to catch up with athletics and swimming [to name two of the more mainstream sports] in equality when it comes to endurance events. Don't want this to be a rant but my better half gets frustrated by this.


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## smutchin (27 Jul 2012)

totallyfixed said:


> little wonder the women get less coverage than the men going by this thread.


 
I'm happy to discuss the women's race but I'm coming from a position of lack of knowledge - as iLB says, the lack of coverage doesn't help (and yes, I agree the lack of coverage is very disappointing, to put it mildly). Apart from the Brits, I know about the likes of Marianne Vos, Giorgia Bronzini, Judith Arndt and a few others, but beyond that... not a lot.

Perhaps someone who follows women's cycling can help us with a few pointers?

d.


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## VamP (27 Jul 2012)

Not sure if someone hasn't already posted, but these are the bikes they'll be on. Aggregation of marginal gains indeed.


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## smutchin (27 Jul 2012)

This just about sums it up, really...



> Cycling News
> 
> July 29, Olympic Women's Road Race: London 140km
> 
> There's nothing to see here.


 
http://www.cyclingnews.com/2012-olympic-games/olympic-womens-road-race


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## iLB (27 Jul 2012)

VamP said:


> Not sure if someone hasn't already posted, but these are the bikes they'll be on. Aggregation of marginal gains indeed.


 
Ahh very interesting, thanks for posting. There was a picture in Tuesday's Equipe of Brad back out training in the UK, riding that bike, clearly not a Pinarello but I couldn't work out what and why.


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## iLB (27 Jul 2012)

It does seem slightly odd that you would switch bikes though.


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## marinyork (27 Jul 2012)

siadwell said:


> Further to this, Freesat EPG is now showing 24 dedicated live Olympic HD channels.
> Alas, there's apparently a problem with Humax Freesat+ boxes that prevents these channels being recorded.


 
Just to be crystal clear for this as the combined reach of virgin, freesat and sky is quite large and will include a lot on this forum

Virgin media channel 550 onwards.
Freesat channels 151-174

When off air they show what the schedule is.


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## smutchin (27 Jul 2012)

iLB said:


> It does seem slightly odd that you would switch bikes though.


 
A couple of reasons spring to mind...

1. They don't own their race bikes, they ride what they're given. Therefore, unless their trade team has the same supplier as their national team, they'll ride a different bike depending on who they're riding for.

2. Presumably the Olympics aren't bound by the same rules regarding commercial availability of equipment as Pro Tour events, hence they can get specialist non-commercial framebuilders to knock them up something more exotic.

Do they actually ride Pinarellos all the time while riding for Sky anyway? I'm reading the Reg Harris biog at the moment and it mentions that he had sponsorship deals with Raleigh but actually rode rebadged Claud Butler frames. Does that kind of thing not still go on in the pro peloton?

d.


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## VamP (27 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> A couple of reasons spring to mind...
> 
> 1. They don't own their race bikes, they ride what they're given. Therefore, unless their trade team has the same supplier as their national team, they'll ride a different bike depending on who they're riding for.
> 
> ...


 
Apparently it's development of a frame that Wiggins used to ride on track, and he really likes it... maybe another reason why they're on them. Developing the frame to road form will not have been cheap I am sure. The frames alone are rumoured to be worth £10 000.


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## fimm (27 Jul 2012)

A couple of (slightly contradictory, in my view) articles on the British team for the women's road race from the BBC here:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18968367
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/wales/18861508
Women's cycling seems to me to have a similar profile to women's football - i.e. a bad one. And there are a lot fewer women racing, from what I gather (I don't race as a cyclist myself). I was talking to someone who did a lot of timetrialling and she said that basically there were 3 or 4 women who were likely to turn up to local events who were good, and if they didn't turn up she had a good chance of a podium.


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## VamP (27 Jul 2012)

fimm said:


> A couple of (slightly contradictory, in my view) articles on the British team for the women's road race from the BBC here:
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18968367
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/wales/18861508
> Women's cycling seems to me to have a similar profile to women's football - i.e. a bad one. And there are a lot fewer women racing, from what I gather (I don't race as a cyclist myself). I was talking to someone who did a lot of timetrialling and she said that basically there were 3 or 4 women who were likely to turn up to local events who were good, and if they didn't turn up she had a good chance of a podium.


 

I would agree that the gap at grass roots level racing between men's and women's cycling is enormous. It seems to have far more to do with participant numbers than differences in physiology.


----------



## ColinJ (27 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> This just about sums it up, really...
> 
> 
> > Cycling News
> ...


That's a little bit unfair because the previous page for the men's RR says exactly the same thing!


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2012)

Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.


----------



## Farky (27 Jul 2012)

I'm just getting my clobber ready...;o)


----------



## Paul_L (27 Jul 2012)

BBC Olympics 3 is on Sky channel 452 to save anyone else taking 10mins to find it! The other Olympics channels are in the same place.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (27 Jul 2012)

I find it hard to keep up with the arithmetic, but the Olympic cycling RR will never be a fair contest, the set up grossly favours certain nations such as GB, Bel, USA and others by allowing them large teams, such as the 5 in team GB, while other nations get to field 1 single rider, eg Canada and the Slovaks. Not sure how this can ever be a level playing field with that going on. Would be a lot better if the Olympic folks just said, "send 3 riders each" and leave it at that.
It sucks.


----------



## srw (27 Jul 2012)

Read the UCI website - like all sports riders and nations have to qualify, and the best nations get more riders.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (27 Jul 2012)

srw said:


> Read the UCI website - like all sports riders and nations have to qualify, and the best nations get more riders.


I cannot find the link now but there was something that came out just before the end of the Giro going through it all, Canada qualifies for 3 spots but the IOC in their infinite and unflinchingly fair way of doing things decided that Canada only deserved 1 and they took 2 to use to dole out to other nations "that deserved more spots".
I mean, Morocco has 3 riders.....name a Moroccan cyclist, quick....


----------



## ColinJ (27 Jul 2012)

So... Given that the men's road race starts at 10:00, which implies getting up no later than 07:00(ish), do the team skip the opening ceremony and get an early night?


----------



## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Strathlubnaig said:


> I mean, Morocco has 3 riders.....name a Moroccan cyclist, quick....


 
So hang on, weren't you were demanding more fairness and a greater range of cyclists from more countries a few posts back but now you don't like it if you haven't heard of the riders from a particular country...?


----------



## Keith Oates (28 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> So... Given that the men's road race starts at 10:00, which implies getting up no later than 07:00(ish), do the team skip the opening ceremony and get an early night?


Yes, it was reported recently that the cycling RR team would not be included in the opening ceremony. I suppose BW went straight to bed after ringing the opening bell!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> So hang on, weren't you were demanding more fairness and a greater range of cyclists from more countries a few posts back but now you don't like it if you haven't heard of the riders from a particular country...?


No, you are taking my words out of context, the point is, nations with little or no UCI presence are being given 2 slots, whereas a nation like Canada has lost 2 slots and been given only 1. Fairness would be everyone gets the same number of slots regardless of their pro team presence.
Buddy further up stated that 'the best countries get the most riders' which to my mind seems a little unfair and kind of unolympic, it immediately puts certain nations at a huge disadvantage.


----------



## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> So... Given that the men's road race starts at 10:00, which implies getting up no later than 07:00(ish), do the team skip the opening ceremony and get an early night?


They wanted Wiggins to be present last night but he said he needed an early night so they gave him the bell ringing thing at the beginning so he could get off to bed. I assume the other four weren't in the parade either.


----------



## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

Strathlubnaig said:


> I cannot find the link now but there was something that came out just before the end of the Giro going through it all, Canada qualifies for 3 spots but the IOC in their infinite and unflinchingly fair way of doing things decided that Canada only deserved 1 and they took 2 to use to dole out to other nations "that deserved more spots".
> I mean, Morocco has 3 riders.....name a Moroccan cyclist, quick....


Agree - that doesn't really make a great deal of sense.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

raindog said:


> Agree - that doesn't really make a great deal of sense.


Glad it's not just me then, but anyway, lets hope it's a good exciting race today and not too one sided.


----------



## defy-one (28 Jul 2012)

I'm here. Corner of brompton road and fulham road. Good crowds. 09:12


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

totallyfixed said:


> In both races I feel a crash could affect the outcome more than is usual due to narrow roads and not riding in their normal trade teams.


 
There was a little snippet on tv last night; Team GB training on the route. I was surprised just how narrow some of the roads are. Hopefully all will exercise good sense and we'll not see repeats of broken collar bones.


----------



## BrumJim (28 Jul 2012)

Off to Walton Bridge soon. Peleton due past at 10:45.


----------



## MichaelM (28 Jul 2012)

My arse is parked comfortably in front of the tv - that's my whole day sorted :-)


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

I'd watch the tv too but they're not just covering the cycling; beach volleyball at the moment. Not interested.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Was that a weird start?


Sent from my lounge


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Was that a weird start?


 
Yep, think so. Countdown and flag drop (McQuaid) out of sync, caused a little confusion.


----------



## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Guess a false start balances itself out over 200k!


Sent from my lounge


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Anyone know what bbc hd channel is covering the road race on virginmedia


Sent from my lounge


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Got to say, for me, this is nostalgic and fabulous.... central London, clear roads, bikes. I'm remembering going out for a ride early (5am-ish) on summer mornings.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Bernie and Uran riding at the back. Any chance they'll lend some support to Team GB? Uran could be useful on Box Hill and Bernie obviously in the lead out.


----------



## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

I just discovered that the entire race is live on BBC3. That normally doesn't come on air until 19:00 so one of the BBC children's channels has probably been sacrificed for the duration of the Olympics. 

Is this a neutralised start, or are the riders just agreeing to a truce until they get out of London?


----------



## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Anyone know what bbc hd channel is covering the road race on virginmedia
> 
> 
> Sent from my lounge



It's on the red button


Sent from my lounge


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

They've already had a wee stop!


Sent from my lounge


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Darn it, they've switched to judo (France have some medal chances in that)

Ah well, got to see Richmond Park at least


----------



## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

I reckon a lot of the conversations between the riders are going along the lines of 'so, what have you been up to since I last saw you a fortnight ago'.


Sent from my lounge


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> Darn it, they've switched to judo (France have some medal chances in that)
> 
> Ah well, got to see Richmond Park at least


 
can you watch on bbc web site, or is that for UK only?


----------



## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Dog in the road!


Sent from my lounge


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Dog in the road!


_Spot The Braincell_, eh! Take a whacking big dog to an event like this and let it loose ... 

The spectators spilling out into the road are making me nervous now!


----------



## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

stupid dog owner and then a stupid pedestrian.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> can you watch on bbc web site, or is that for UK only?


 
UK only. Judo over, they've switched to rowing.


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

how are you guys watching this? Got any links?


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

I'm watching using 'the red button' on NBC on virginmedia in the uk


Sent from my lounge


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Kudos to the single rider who took the right hand path at the huge fountain, it would have been awesome if he had taken the lead!


Sent from my lounge


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

raindog said:


> how are you guys watching this? Got any links?


 
I've got it on

http://www.oleoletv.com/watch/live/...94310/july-28-2012/cycling-road-race-men.html

Not the best feed, and in some flavour of Arabic, but it's a start.


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

OK it's on France2 now


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

But for how long??? It switched from France3 and they were moving around. Expect it to switch to judo again. Note also that coverage switches back to France3 at 13H


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Nice to see the BMC team helping each other out


Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded saddle, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## MrGrumpy (28 Jul 2012)

watching it live on the blue button right now, on freeview and none of your fancy freesat/sky/virgin HD nonsense


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded saddle, low profile DFS 2000 model.


 
I'm hoping you don't have to take a dump this afternoon!


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

It's on: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/2012/live-video/p00w2rlr


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## david k (28 Jul 2012)

is the breakaway one that can last? commentators seem to thnk so but i feel ts way too early to worry


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> I'm hoping you don't have to take a dump this afternoon!



Hmm... My daughters nappies look pretty big, and I've slimmed down a lot...


Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded saddle, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

The lack of a distance counter and time gaps in the screen is slightly irritating.

Gap at 4mins 30 to the "rear of the peloton". Since when have time gaps been referenced against the back of the race!


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

The poor commentators don't seem to know any more than we do!


______________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

It's on SKY 452. (I never read all the posts there, so if you already know - ignore)


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> But for how long??? I


They keep giving updates, that's fine for me for the first couple of hours. Doubt if that much of importance will happen for a while yet.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

The Guardian are doing live updates at 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2012/jul/28/olympic-road-race-mens-cycling-live?newsfeed=true

__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

aJohnson said:


> It's on: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/olympics/2012/live-video/p00w2rlr


 
Was watching on iplayer then it just stoped! and switched to somthing else. Nearly had a heart attack trying to find the cycling again.

Go team Eritrea, Canada and Korea (they have nice colours)


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Either that American is tiny, or that Swiss fella is HUGE!


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

I'm not so sure the spectators on the hill are experienced with bike races. Too many leaving it very late to take photos and not stepping completely back of the road surface. Seen a few near misses.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

raindog said:


> They keep giving updates, that's fine for me for the first couple of hours.


 
We've different priorities I suspect! I'm enjoying the images, remembering roads I've cycled etc.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

It crazes me that people take such risks to grab what will invariably be a shite photo. Leave it to the professionals and enjoy the moment you're in!


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## summerdays (28 Jul 2012)

Kids have commandeered the TV for the moment  and are watching the gymnastics ... I give them 10 mins more and then I will get it back again - by force if neccessary!


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Either that American is tiny, or that Swiss fella is HUGE!
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


He's HUGE


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> I'm enjoying the images, remembering roads I've cycled etc.


I've never ridden round there, but I agree, it's fantastic to see them blasting round the English countryside.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

This is the first time i have watched a live cycle race, and it's killing me that i can't fast forward to the finish and find out who won.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

lordloveaduck said:


> He's HUGE



The little fellow just reached up and patted the Swiss chap, he looked like he wanted something from his dad 


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## BrumJim (28 Jul 2012)

Just back from Walton Bridge. Support was MASSIVE!! 2-3 deep all along the road, and all well behaved.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> The little fellow just reached up and patted the Swiss chap, he looked like he wanted something from his dad
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


Love those Kodak moments


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

I haven't seen any CC Kit yet. Where are you all.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Who is responsible for the screen labels ie putting graphics of miles and distance on screen.
Some one poke them with a pump.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Oh no! Two riders not getting up after that crash 


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## BrumJim (28 Jul 2012)

Reminded me of a game of Jack Straws.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

starting to get a bad feeling about this.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

I feel sorry for the ones with no support team


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

lordloveaduck said:


> I feel sorry for the ones with no support team



Is there no neutral car?


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Is there no neutral car?
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


 
I don't know. I never even knew there was such a thing!

Has some one cocked up doing the black board with the times?


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## ade234uk (28 Jul 2012)

lordloveaduck said:


> Who is responsible for the screen labels ie putting graphics of miles and distance on screen.
> Some one poke them with a pump.


 
I know it's doing my head in. They said the Team GB have got people placed around the course with boards showing them the time gaps.
Did someone from the BBC not get some advice about this.

From a viewers point of view the distance to go and time gaps would have been great.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

I can't get a sense of perspective as i do not know the area or which point they are on, on the map.
It does put a damper on things.


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## Stephenite (28 Jul 2012)

Just like watching the TdF! Blue skies, beautiful countryside - whilst here it's grey sky and drizzle. Fantastic turnout of the brits (and others) spectating.


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Stephenite said:


> Just like watching the TdF! Blue skies, beautiful countryside - whilst here it's grey sky and drizzle. Fantastic turnout of the brits (and others) spectating.


 
Forecast is for rain starting from tomorrow


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

I wish Jamaica had a cycle team. They would probably blooming fastastic


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Arg, I fell asleep!


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

lordloveaduck said:


> Forecast is for rain starting from tomorrow



Ladies racing tomorrow, I'm looking forward to it as none was shown on itv4 for Le Tour.


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## kevin_cambs_uk (28 Jul 2012)

I thought the olympics were a waste of money, but after watching the opening ceremony yesterday and watching the cycling today I have changed my mind....
I wish I was there at the course watching it all happen


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

How long does this go on for?


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

kevin_cambs_uk said:


> I thought the olympics were a waste of money, but after watching the opening ceremony yesterday and watching the cycling today I have changed my mind....
> I wish I was there at the course watching it all happen



This


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

lordloveaduck said:


> How long does this go on for?



Till 4pm I think.


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Is all the footage provided by the bbc? I mean, is the Eurosport footage from different cameras?


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> starting to get a bad feeling about this.



That's no moon...


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Right then, I'm off to do something else. I've no interest in swimming, fencing, judo, rowing or gymnastics and all my web feeds have died or been closed down. Back in a few hours!


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

Do the teams have race radio? I don't see ear pieces and I saw Wiggins going back to talk to the team car when some attacks were going in.

Guys looks cool as..!


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## MrJamie (28 Jul 2012)

As a newbie to watching cycling on TV, the virtually non-existant commentary is terrible. Ive got no idea who anyone is or whos in the best position to win it in the end. Turned it off now for the F1 qualifying though :/


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

no team radios.

I hope they have better information on time gaps than we do!


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

MrJamie said:


> As a newbie to watching cycling on TV, the virtually non-existant commentary is terrible. Ive got no idea who anyone is or whos in the best position to win it in the end. Turned it off now for the F1 qualifying though :/


 
The commentary is good. Hugh Porter and Chris Boardman are very good ex pros who have many years of commentating and expert summarising experience.

What is poor is that the data on time gaps is missing, which is making it hard for the commentators as well.

Remember on an event that lasts 6 hours you can't talk constantly.


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

I'm a bit nervous about this not coming back for a sprint. Too many bloody good riders up the road for my liking, and I'm not convinced we've got a plan B...


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

I'm 'watching' on text, they seem to have no firm ideas on gaps either. Latest guess was around 3:50 to the leading group, and around 20 seconds to the Nibali/Gilbert group.I hope Team GB have it under control because it seems a balancing act at the moment.

The difficulty seems to be getting Cavendish through the Box Hill laps without letting the breaks get away, and keeping that gap to the leading group manageable.


----------



## srw (28 Jul 2012)

1:16 to Gilbert et al, 1:45 to the field.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Leaders have about 2 mins over peloton with GB at the front.

There are 2 smaller groups in between.

GB have brought the gap down by nearly 2 mins on last 2 circuits. Reckon it'll all come back together again in next circuit. Then cue next break away.

Stannard looks knackered though, which is a worry when they hit the flat.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

I think they will all come together again prior to the long flat finish, should not be too much of an issue, the Germans should benefit from the tow they have had though.


----------



## srw (28 Jul 2012)

1:12 and 1:32. Odds on Cavendish.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Got tv coverage back now; Team GB seem to bringing it back, won't be long. If they're all together after the Box laps, you've got to fancy them to control it from there on in. Fingers crossed.


----------



## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

It seems the commentators are trying to make it interesting for new non cycling viewers. GB have this under control at the moment. It's a bit like watching the air crew when you hit turbulence. If they're not panicking it's OK. When Nibali went away GB never flinched. They know what they are doing.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

SoloCyclist said:


> It's on SKY 452. (I never read all the posts there, so if you already know - ignore)



Also on Eurosport from 2.15 - hopefully with decent commentary and information...

d.


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

SoloCyclist said:


> If they're not panicking it's OK.


 
That's the advantage of being able to watch on tele! You can see any response. A text coverage just can't give that amount of detail you can see.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Also, there's good live info on time gaps on the Rabobank iPhone app.


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Also on Eurosport from 2.15


 
Cheers for that. I'll queue that up ready in case they switch back to judo or whatever here!


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

And on twitter - @inrng is retweeting time gaps from people on the course.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

decent time check summary here too
http://www.london2012.com/cycling-road/event=cycling-road-men-road-race/


----------



## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Also on Eurosport from 2.15 - hopefully with decent commentary and information...
> 
> d.



The course looks a touch flooded. :-) there's a couple of girls in boats.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

SoloCyclist said:


> The course looks a touch flooded. :-) there's a couple of girls in boats.



It's the Schlecks trying out their new strategy. 

(Always add 15 minutes to advertised start times on Eurosport...)


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

I see Bernie Eisel is sat just in front of Cav.

Old habits die hard! He must think thast GB have got the right plan, so if he sits with Cav, he must think he's in the right place...


----------



## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

I've written it on here before checking my post and changing it to GB.


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

Uncle Mort said:


> Chris Boardman just referred to them as "the Sky Team".


 
Yeah, I heard that too! Must be hard not to though...

I flicked to Eurosport hoping for some better commentary, but they seem to be cycling in speedos and goggles...


----------



## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Uncle Mort said:


> Chris Boardman just referred to them as "the Sky Team".


 
I'm pretty sure one of the French commentators here did too. Understandable really, so soon after the TdF.


----------



## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

Nice move by PG 

Andrew


Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Surely too early, even for Phil Gil?

Boonen has been very quiet so far, as have Sagan, and EBH. Hmmm...

Can't rule out Cancellara yet either. Or Evans. 

d.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Uncle Mort said:


> I really like those Belgian jerseys, but I don't think we'll be seeing any on the podium.



Belgium definitely win the Best Jersey contest. IWOOT. 

d.


----------



## thom (28 Jul 2012)

perplexed said:


> I see Bernie Eisel is sat just in front of Cav.
> 
> Old habits die hard! He must think thast GB have got the right plan, so if he sits with Cav, he must think he's in the right place...


Austria have just 2 guys in the race, neither with a realistic chance but even so, it's maybe a bit unseemly. 
http://www.london2012.com/cycling-road/athletes/country=austria/index.html
Perhaps it's a payback of sorts for the Wegelius episode.


----------



## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

He has done similar before and it has paid off it seems.

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Surely too early, even for Phil Gil?
> 
> Boonen has been very quiet so far, as have Sagan, and EBH. Hmmm...
> 
> ...


Boonen won't attack while Gilbert is out there.
After doubting the ability of GB to control this, a bunch sprint has looked inevitable for a while now so I reckon EBH and Sagan have no other option than to keep their powder dry until a sprint.


----------



## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

Last climb now, should get interesting from here .....some more colours starting too mix at the front of the peloton


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

Thom, what was the Wegelius episode?


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

It's on Eurosport now, thankfully...


----------



## MrJamie (28 Jul 2012)

What time should they be finishing, id like to watch the sprint finish but need to go out first.


----------



## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

About an hour


----------



## thom (28 Jul 2012)

perplexed said:


> Thom, what was the Wegelius episode?


2005 WC, he (along with another guy) worked for Italy as opposed to the GB rider Roger Hammond because I think was in an Italian pro team. He has never been selected for GB since.


----------



## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

Maybe Millar will let Hedjesdal into team GB at the sprint then.


----------



## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

That leading group has some quality riders, and is big enough to do some damage if they start working well together.


----------



## perplexed (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> 2005 WC, he (along with another guy) worked for Italy as opposed to the GB rider Roger Hammond because I think was in an Italian pro team. He has never been selected for GB since.


 
Ah, right, thanks!


----------



## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Bernie Eisel is an honorary Brit for the next 50mins


----------



## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

Look like Cav's happy in his wheel


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Cubist said:


> That leading group has some quality riders, and is big enough to do some damage if they start working well together.



Cancellara is starting to edge into the box seat. GB really need to start closing this down. Maybe they worked too hard in the early part of the race...

d.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

i've just timed it at 59secs


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

froomes done


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Nearly there said:


> froomes done



I walked away and came back to Team GB down one! Why did Froome stop?


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

Have they left it too late?


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> I walked away and came back to Team GB down one! Why did Froome stop?
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


Just looks tired


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## gb155 (28 Jul 2012)

Cubist said:


> Have they left it too late?


Think so

Plus Froome is out now


Not good


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Can't see GB pulling this back now. Too many strong riders in the break.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Cubist said:


> Have they left it too late?


I hope not they did manage to pull it back in paris but everyone looks tired to me


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Cubist said:


> Have they left it too late?


hope i'm wrong but i'm beginning to think so.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Is Froome due to ride again over the next few days?


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

He's in the TT on Wednesday.

As is Wiggo, but i think Wiggins is prepared to sacrifice that for Cav.


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## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

If GB does not win it's because Millar's number is the wrong way round.


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## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

It's about time germany did their share at the front, Stannard can't do it on his own


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

The ba' looks burst :-(


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## RhythMick (28 Jul 2012)

Have a feeling TJVG will nick this one. He will want to prove himself after dragging the Aussie around France.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

who says England and Germany cant work together


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> He's in the TT on Wednesday.
> 
> As is Wiggo, but i think Wiggins is prepared to sacrifice that for Cav.



Thanks, makes sense to leave something in the tank I guess.


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## david k (28 Jul 2012)

the gap looks too big, too many top rider n the lead group, we appear to have messed t up..............or have we?


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## captainhastings (28 Jul 2012)

nice too see it is not cut and dried any way better viewing


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

This could be the biggest anti-climax ever If team Gb dont contest this


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

Constant time check would be nice. The break's starting to watch each other. Hope they make a bad mistake.

Crash


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Can Cav thrash himself silly or has he got other duties in the next few days?


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## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

That'll do it!!!! Sorry for the riders, but good news for GB!!!!


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

fark. Crash.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Arg, Cantalarro straight into the barriers!


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Time stats are pathetic. I'm in pieces here!


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

That changes everything, including the TT on Wed.


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## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

Time check ffs


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Doctors are trying to stop the poor guy from continuing.


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## threebikesmcginty (28 Jul 2012)

Poor old Fabbers, made a right balls up of that!


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

I appreciate that the bbc doesn't do sponsorship, but when there's a time sponsor we get to actually see the 'kin times!


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

Still saying 56 sec.


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## Cubist (28 Jul 2012)

If that 56 sec is right we're out of it


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## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

Team GB blown it? Go Stu 

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## asterix (28 Jul 2012)

captainhastings said:


> nice too see it is not cut and dried any way better viewing


 
If we knew what was going on!


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Lead group are starting to piss about and attack each other though. Could lead to a sudden decline in the time gap... but it doesn't seem like it.


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## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

Good coverage here in Foxtel . Dedicated channel.

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Is the Belgian still way out front? If not what happened to him?


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Is the Belgian still way out front? If not what happened to him?
> 
> Caught
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.




Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

just timed it at 53s.

All over.

Gutted.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Aushiker said:


> Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2



Thanks


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

A Valium effort indeed 


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Uran in the lead pair. If he wins it, that'll be interested when Team Sky get together again.


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## Christopher (28 Jul 2012)

NO NO not the druggie please!


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

There are some very tidy roofs in London.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Cav for bronze?


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

I think all the GB riders have dropped off the front.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Yup.


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Go Colombia!


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## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

Christopher said:


> NO NO not the druggie please!


That would be bad

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

My god Uran dozed off!


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## Christopher (28 Jul 2012)

Worst result possible. A proven drug cheat wins the race and indirectly makes a tyrant very happy.


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## asterix (28 Jul 2012)

Sorry for Cavendish..


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## Mr Haematocrit (28 Jul 2012)

what was wiggo and cav riding, they were not Dogma's


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## MichaelM (28 Jul 2012)

What way to end your career!

Gutted for GB though.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Silver and bronze for team sky


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## Christopher (28 Jul 2012)

Can't fault his tactics however


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## Aushiker (28 Jul 2012)

V for Vengedetta said:


> what was wiggo and cav riding, they were not Dogma's


Special designed bikes.

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Cav for bronze?


 
Were you watching the same race as everyone else?


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

YAY an old person won. There's hope for me still.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Were you watching the same race as everyone else?



I was torn between feeding my daughter and putting her down for a nap so wasn't able to fully concentrate!


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Christopher said:


> Can't fault his tactics however


 
Actually I think you can, for once: there was no Plan B at all. Perhaps Team GB should have been prepared to get a rider in the break - say, Stannard, who was the freshest rider.


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

LOL - did anyone here put money on Vino?


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## Keith Oates (28 Jul 2012)

Vinokourov winning is just about the worst thing that could have happened to cycling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Let the women show you how it's done


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

Without that crash Fab would've got that easy.


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## Mr Haematocrit (28 Jul 2012)

Aushiker said:


> Special designed bikes.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk 2


 
Wonder what that says about Dogma's as a race bike, first they build custom geometrys for Cav and others then the GB team decide not to use them.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Nice to see Fabian get a proper man hug 


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## lordloveaduck (28 Jul 2012)

Keith Oates said:


> Vinokourov winning is just about the worst thing that could have happened to cycling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


 
Why?


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## SoloCyclist (28 Jul 2012)

Poor Fabian :-(


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

The BBC coverage is bollocks


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Gotta feel for Fab.

He's already won the Derek Redmond award of 2012


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Nearly there said:


> The BBC coverage is bollocks



It's consistent - they consistently forgotten to slide up the fader when cutting to an interview!


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

Christopher said:


> Worst result possible. A proven drug cheat wins the race and indirectly makes a tyrant very happy.


 
I wonder if people would be like this if Millar won, probably not...


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## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

gb had one plan only, as stated above. I think the belgians had a plan A and a plan B with Gilbert up front, but then no one went with him later on, so that left them with the much hoped for "reel in the break and have a sprint finish".
I think the lack of the radios really showed how much these guys rely on them nowadays.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> It's consistent - they consistently forgotten to slide up the fader when cutting to an interview!
> 
> 
> __________________________________________________________________________________
> Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


Exactly whats that all about Eurosport was better


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## timmcp (28 Jul 2012)

Enjoyed the cycling, but absolutely disgusted about lack of graphics, time checks, leaders, etc, doesnt bode well for the time trial. Suppose we will have to wait until all the riders have ridden and what for the times.


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## Andrew_Culture (28 Jul 2012)

Just switched to beach volleyball. Prince Phillip's eyes must be out on stalks!


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Sent from settee #2 - steel & wooden frame, deep padded seat, low profile DFS 2000 model.


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Actually I think you can, for once: there was no Plan B at all. Perhaps Team GB should have been prepared to get a rider in the break - say, Stannard, who was the freshest rider.


If they'd done that and still got no medals, everyone would've said it was because they were a man short with Stannard up front in the break.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Id love to be a fly on the wall in the team area now


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Uran looked the wrong way entirely. For some very weird reason, I feel quite pleased for Vino.

Agree with FM though, I reckon TeamGB got that wrong. All the eggs in one basket as it were. Admitted, they were expected to dominate, they were being watched, the pressure was on them... but even so, by sticking to their plan they ruled themselves out of the medals. I'd stay clear of Cavendish for a couple of hours.... he'll not be full of the joys of spring.


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## srw (28 Jul 2012)

Nearly there said:


> The BBC coverage is bollocks


It's not the beeb, it's Olympic Broadcast Services. The beeb is a customer, and, I suspect, a mightily pissed-off one.


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> Uran looked the wrong way entirely. For some very weird reason, I feel quite pleased for Vino.
> 
> Agree with FM though, I reckon TeamGB got that wrong. All the eggs in one basket as it were. Admitted, they were expected to dominate, they were being watched, the pressure was on them... but even so, by sticking to their plan they ruled themselves out of the medals. I'd stay clear of Cavendish for a couple of hours.... he'll not be full of the joys of spring.


 
I think they should have put Millar in the breakaway in my opinion.


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

aJohnson said:


> I wonder if people would be like this if Millar won, probably not...


The difference between convicted cheat Millar and others like Vinokourov, Valverde et al is that Millar (eventually) owned up to what he had done, expressed deep regret, apologised to his fans, friends and family for what he had done and has worked hard for clean cycling ever since. Valv Piti moaned about his 'rights' being abused (how dare they do a DNA test on the blood reputed to be his stored in that dodgy doctor's fridge!), and denied everything. I don't remember Vino ever saying much about the illegal stuff he got up to either.


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## Smokin Joe (28 Jul 2012)

This might seem like hindsight, but having watched almost from the start it never looked on. Trying to control the race with only four riders was asking way too much.

As for the coverage, it wasn't only the lack of information but the director needs shooting. Switching away from the important moves the race became hard to follow at times.

Still, a very good race with a great finish. And good luck to Vino, he served his time and is perfectly entitled to be back where he is.


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## Nearly there (28 Jul 2012)

Oh look beach Volleyballs on


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## dragon72 (28 Jul 2012)

The commentators were just appalling. 
"Ghee-sink", "Hen-ey-oh" etc. 
Plus calling "Gry-'pell" in for 4th when he was 15 or so back? WTF?


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

If Germany had shared the work properly with GB there would've been a massed sprint and they would've had a good chance at a medal, maybe even gold, as it is they came away with nothing too - bit of a pathetic attitude imo. 
Oh well, bring on the girls tomorrow. 
What's the weather forecast over there?


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Greipel must be wondering what the point in coming to London was. Germany rode just hoping to pick up the scraps of GB's work. For all the complaining about GB not having a Plan B, Germany didn't have a Plan A.


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> This might seem like hindsight, but having watched almost from the start it never looked on. Trying to control the race with only four riders was asking way too much.


You can see why most of the other teams didn't want to give Cavendish an easy ride to a sprint finish, but did the Germans actually have any faith in Greipel or not? If they did, then they should have been prepared to do their full share of the work and the best sprinter would win at the end. They would probably have got a gold or silver medal out of it. Instead, they rode to stop Cavendish winning and in doing so lost any chance of a medal for Greipel.


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

Ha ha - you two beat me to it!


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## MrJamie (28 Jul 2012)

I feel a bit disappointed, it was the only thing in the olympics i cared about the result of at all. Ive not seen much cycling before, but i struggle to see why a team would want to lead the pack pretty much the entire race (or at least everytime i flipped channel ). I couldnt imagine Team GB controlling the pack the entire race and then dominating the sprint too, surely far too many rivals wanting to spoil those plans.


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## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

@ smokin joe ......At least team GB had 5 riders (4 plus cavendish).
sorry.... broken record etc.....


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## rowdin (28 Jul 2012)

We did'nt have enough riders for a plan b.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> For all the complaining about GB not having a Plan B, Germany didn't have a Plan A.


 
Actually, I think Germany's Plan A backfired too - to piggyback on Team GB!

But I do agree that Germany might have been a little more active in assisting. It could well have been to their advantage.


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## ComedyPilot (28 Jul 2012)

Dear Olympic Broadcaster - do you know what the F**K a clock is?

I bet you won't have Usain Bolt running for a few seconds without atomic-accurate timing.....................


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## ComedyPilot (28 Jul 2012)

At least GER tried, and Tony Martin (the rider, not the burglar-shooting farmer) spent about an hour doing turns


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## RAYMOND (28 Jul 2012)

bbc commentators were bad but i switched over to euro sport with the tour de france commentators,
great britain weren't at the races full stop.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

ComedyPilot said:


> At least GER tried, and Tony Martin (the rider, not the burglar-shooting farmer) spent about an hour doing turns


 
Yes, that's true, hope he's got enough left for the TT.


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## MrJamie (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> The commentary is good. Hugh Porter and Chris Boardman are very good ex pros who have many years of commentating and expert summarising experience.
> 
> What is poor is that the data on time gaps is missing, which is making it hard for the commentators as well.
> 
> Remember on an event that lasts 6 hours you can't talk constantly.


 I think my mistake was not understanding that the lack of time/graphics isnt normal, so the commentators were also lost 

As for talking for 6 hours, give a sport to Sky to cover, they can talk for 6 hours before an even even starts.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

I think that's harsh Raymond.

GB controlled the race as best they could. It worked in Copenhagen last year as it did in the Surrey Classic test event. But with smaller teams, no assistance from other teams with sprinters (Tony Martin's efforts aside), and too many quality riders in the break away, it wasn't to be.


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> The difference between convicted cheat Millar and others like Vinokourov, Valverde et al is that Millar (eventually) owned up to what he had done, expressed deep regret, apologised to his fans, friends and family for what he had done and has worked hard for clean cycling ever since. Valv Piti moaned about his 'rights' being abused (how dare they do a DNA test on the blood reputed to be his stored in that dodgy doctor's fridge!), and denied everything. I don't remember Vino ever saying much about the illegal stuff he got up to either.


 
True, I haven't heard much about Vino on the subject of doping. But he seems like a rider always giving it his all to win. I'd much rather a clean rider with a clean past win though.


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## lulubel (28 Jul 2012)

I think they should have sent Froome in the break. With all the talk about whether he was happy to play second to Brad in the TdF, it might have left the others wondering whether it was part of the team plan or whether he'd just decided to ignore the plan and go for gold on his own. It might have shaken things up a bit.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Were you watching the same race as everyone else?



I guess he was watching the same race as Hugh Porter, who placed Greipel in fourth. 

d.


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## ManiaMuse (28 Jul 2012)

Race was quite exciting imo, good mix of breakaways and the last lap provided good suspense as everyone shot off and GB/Germany did nothing. Glad Vinokorov won, I always admired his ballsy efforts in the mountains and I like the Astana/Kazakhstan colours. I hope he was racing clean.

Team GB - Fail and probably ruined chances in time trial as well
Germany - Equal fail but at least they didn't tire themselves out
Cancellara -  Hope he's alright

BBC coverage - AWFUL!!! No graphics, no timings, no summaries, no anything. Even the commentators were getting pissed off about the lack of information (although possibly made the race more exciting not knowing anything...) And there were a lot of pointless and unsteady camera angles (what was with all those shots of the treecover and the stupid slow-mos at the same corner every lap?), They could have at least taken a few tips from Eurosport or ITV.


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## RAYMOND (28 Jul 2012)

True paul but they never closed the gap.they had plenty of time but left it too late, maybe they were just a tad tired,or celebrated the tour too much?
maybe i/we are just gutted because we thought we was on a winner.


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## YahudaMoon (28 Jul 2012)

Federer in the final for the tennis then with ........ ?


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## Doseone (28 Jul 2012)

Shame it didn't happen. Watching the Czech beach volleyball team is helping to cheer me up. The lack of time gap info was baffling, but with hindsight it was probably best not to know.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> It's consistent - they consistently forgotten to slide up the fader when cutting to an interview!



Nice moment in the studio when they tried to bring Sue Barker into the conversation but instead we got a clueless producer going through the results and wondering who "COL" were... 

Ffs. 

d.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

RAYMOND said:


> True paul but they never closed the gap.they had plenty of time but left it too late, maybe they were just a tad tired,or celebrated the tour too much?



They'd been working on the front of the peloton all day. They were knackered. When Wiggo did his final turn on the front, the look on his face said it all - first time I've seen him look genuinely troubled in a race this season. 

Someone on twitter suggested GB's inability to control the race today is a good argument for smaller teams in the grand tours. Interesting thought. 

d.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Nice interview with Cav on BBC 1. Very humble, but he sounded distraught.


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## RAYMOND (28 Jul 2012)

We shouldn't knock our lads(me included) i guess we should get behind them winning or not.


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## montage (28 Jul 2012)

Unfortunate for Cav that the Germans were playing things a bit lazy there, also Cancellara had a brilliant shot at gold there - I think he was looking to attack on that corner and as a result hit it far too fast. Uran's attack was brilliant, but it is a shame he was such a muppet coming into the sprint, a pretty rookie error. Lucky for Vino really, opportunism payed off I guess, he played his cards right and circumstances allowed it to happen for him.

Wiggo now the favourite for Gold in the TT? Cancellara and Martin both appear to be injured....though Froome could be a dark horse, having backed off and appeared to have done less work today than Brad.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

lulubel said:


> I think they should have sent Froome in the break.



I reckon Millar would have been a good bet in the break. 

Back to the drawing board for Brailsford though - he'll get the tactics right next time, you can be sure of that. It's just a shame he'll have to wait four years for another opportunity. 

d.


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## Red Light (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> I think that's harsh Raymond.
> 
> GB controlled the race as best they could. It worked in Copenhagen last year as it did in the Surrey Classic test event. But with smaller teams, no assistance from other teams with sprinters (Tony Martin's efforts aside), and too many quality riders in the break away, it wasn't to be.



As Cav said in the post race interview "It seems most teams didn't mind not winning as long as we didn't win"


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

montage said:


> Froome could be a dark horse, having backed off and appeared to have done less work today than Brad.


 
I didn't think of that! And it's normally me that's the cynical one!

I recall thinking, when Froome dropped off, that I hadn't seen him on the front as often as I had seen Wiggins - I wonder if he didn't dig quite as deep as Wiggins did? Guess we'll never know that one.


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## lulubel (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> I reckon Millar would have been a good bet in the break.


 


Red Light said:


> As Cav said in the post race interview "It seems most teams didn't mind not winning as long as we didn't win"


 
That's why I think Froome would have been the best choice to send in the break. Everyone knows Sky have been holding him back to support Brad, and I don't think any of the teams would have let him stay up the front with the opportunity to win gold for GB. And if they did, and it turned out the way it did today .... it would have given him the opportunity to try and win gold for GB.

Plan B.


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## Mad Doug Biker (28 Jul 2012)

Irritated as I was by Team GB, I was just as irked by that Columbian guy being an idiot and loosing it!


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## dragon72 (28 Jul 2012)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> Irritated as I was by Team GB, I was just as irked by that Columbian guy being an idiot and loosing it!


losing
[irked]


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## Mad Doug Biker (28 Jul 2012)

dragon72 said:


> losing
> [irked]



Sorry, this iPad still has a habit of trying to correct things without me noticing.


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## RAYMOND (28 Jul 2012)

Was that the 2nd placed guy who kept looking behind in amazement that no expected charge was forthcoming, every few seconds, he may think in time that he could of got gold but was probably amazed to get silver.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Nice moment in the studio when they tried to bring Sue Barker into the conversation but instead we got a clueless producer going through the results and wondering who "COL" were...
> 
> Ffs.
> 
> d.


Yes that was very very embarassing but the guy Jake whatch-ma-call-it was rather patronising to the audience too - the lack of insight from him and the producer I think betrays a complacency in the BBC (effect of funding cuts ? ) but also what I think is more so the problem in that the target audience is the casual viewer, the Wimbledon audience if you like.
Regarding the lack of info regarding riders in the break and time checks, I wonder if that is part of the deal as regards the Olympic rules of the race, what with it being done without radios. It certainly makes it harder for team helpers to give info to the riders.
And bad luck to Fabian. Was the moto rider too close to him ? Did that crash slow the chasing peloton (I doubt it would have made a difference) ?
Chapeau Alexander : In Vino Veritas.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

RAYMOND said:


> Was that the 2nd placed guy who kept looking behind in amazement that no expected charge was forthcoming, every few seconds, he may think in time that he could of got gold but was probably amazed to get silver.


He was trying to watch Vino and got outsmarted.


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## RAYMOND (28 Jul 2012)

When the finish is that close i don't know why anyone looks behind..just go for it,if your going to get swamped your going to get swamped,don't watch em do it.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

RAYMOND said:


> When the fiish is that close i don't know why anyone looks behind..just go for it,if your going to get swamped your going to get swamped,don't watch em do it.


Um, it rarely works out like that, particularly when the guy behind is a better sprinter.


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## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Yes that was very very embarassing but the guy Jake whatch-ma-call-it was rather patronising to the audience too - the lack of insight from him and the producer I think betrays a complacency in the BBC (effect of funding cuts ? ) but also what I think is more so the problem in that the target audience is the casual viewer, the Wimbledon audience if you like.
> Regarding the lack of info regarding riders in the break and time checks, I wonder if that is part of the deal as regards the Olympic rules of the race, what with it being done without radios. It certainly makes it harder for team helpers to give info to the riders.
> And bad luck to Fabian. Was the moto rider too close to him ? Did that crash slow the chasing peloton (I doubt it would have made a difference) ?
> Chapeau Alexander : In Vino Veritas.


Yes that was a bit ameteurish, same guy was heard saying "Cav got 11th" when that was his race number.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

Strathlubnaig said:


> Yes that was a bit ameteurish, same guy was heard saying "Cav got 11th" when that was his race number.


Ah, I couldn't understand what that was about.


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## Farky (28 Jul 2012)

This is where I was


View: http://youtu.be/aVnMVueUiqE


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## david k (28 Jul 2012)

what could team GB have done differently?

the only thing can thnk of is chased down the breakaway group early and ride with them?


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## johnr (28 Jul 2012)

I've just complained to the BBC about the amateurishness of their coverage. I'll let you know if they reply. One suggestion - if you can't get time checks, give the catering staff stopwatches and mobile phones and stand them at strategic points.


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## Rezillo (28 Jul 2012)

ManiaMuse said:


> BBC coverage - AWFUL!!! No graphics, no timings, no summaries, no anything. Even the commentators were getting pissed off about the lack of information (although possibly made the race more exciting not knowing anything...) And there were a lot of pointless and unsteady camera angles (what was with all those shots of the treecover and the stupid slow-mos at the same corner every lap?), They could have at least taken a few tips from Eurosport or ITV.


 
TV comes from Olympic Broadcasting services - http://www.obs.es/hostbroadcasterrole.html I guess the BBC is in the same boat as everyone else.

John


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## ComedyPilot (28 Jul 2012)

Rezillo said:


> TV comes from Olympic Broadcasting services - http://www.obs.es/hostbroadcasterrole.html I guess the BBC is in the same boat as everyone else.
> 
> John


Ok, but will the same Olympic Broadcasting service provide footage of Usain Bolt et al running on a blank screen?

No.

We'll get 3 hours of build up, and 3 hours of post race analysis with [prominent watch manufacturer sponsor] timing and slow-mo footage, and gnat's cock-hair split second pics of the finish.

Timing could and should have been provided - it wasn't. And I think the idiot in control of that should be sacked.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Cavendish is not happy with the Aussies. From http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cavendish-misses-olympic-glory-in-mens-road-race



> However he also singled out the Australians for their race tactics. The Australians had Stuart O'Grady in the early break and never looked like joining forces with the sprinters' teams in a bid to set up their fast man Matthew Goss.


 
He might have a point because, other than O'Grady, I don't think I noticed the Australians. And it's not as if they had a weak team. Perhaps we shouldn't be too critical of Germany.


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## Erratic (28 Jul 2012)

Well, that was enjoyable, hats off to Wiggins for riding his lungs and legs out for Cav, true champion and Stannard was superb leading from the front for so long. It was a good race, despite the wrong outcome (for those of us who wanted Cav to win). Difficult to believe that Cav would think other teams would help them, felt there were too many riders in the break to let it go and GB should have been in it - hindsight and armchair tactical management hey...


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> I didn't think of that! And it's normally me that's the cynical one!
> 
> I recall thinking, when Froome dropped off, that I hadn't seen him on the front as often as I had seen Wiggins - I wonder if he didn't dig quite as deep as Wiggins did? Guess we'll never know that one.


First thing that occurred to me when he dropped off. He'd done much less work than the others and seemed to give up when it was clear that GB were chasing a lost cause. I sincerely hope Wiggy hands him his arse on a plate on Wedneday.

Germany were woeful and bone-idle (c*nts) with the honourable exception of Martin and one other bloke. Nice to see Eisel riding as our sixth team member. I thought Australia had a chap in the escape group (O'Grady iirc) so they at least had an excuse for not chasing.

Team GB did everything they could reasonably be expected to do and deserve no criticism from anyone.


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> I didn't think of that! And it's normally me that's the cynical one!
> 
> I recall thinking, when Froome dropped off, that I hadn't seen him on the front as often as I had seen Wiggins - I wonder if he didn't dig quite as deep as Wiggins did? Guess we'll never know that one.


 
Yeah I thought the same thing. Either he has a problem or he was saving most of his powder for the TT as I didn't notice him doing much. Very odd I thought.


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## broomwagon (28 Jul 2012)

No hills, no time checks and Hugh Porters commentary...Is he dyslexic and colour blind? Great crowds though


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## Norm (28 Jul 2012)

I think the criticism of Germany is a bit mis-directed, as they were at least near the front taking some of the heat. There were a lot of other good teams, and good individuals, in that pack which did not show their noses at all.

The Beeb's commentators seemed as hacked off with the OBS as anyone. Pathetic support services offered.


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Has Chris Froome gone down in a few people's estimations today? He has mine. Apart from a few stints at the front on the first couple of Box Hill climbs i didn't see him leaving nothing in reserve trying to catch the breakaway. Wiggo however, has surely jeorpardised his TT chances through his efforts today.


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

Froome's a w*nker in my view. There I've said it. Superb rider for sure, but forget his fake loyalty in the TDF. He did f*ck all today and has saved his powder for the TT (although perhaps I shouldn't blame him given his TDF compromises?).

No sod it, he's a mincing little weasel who will never be man enough to lead a team. I hope Wiggo and 2 others stick it to him on Weds.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

I reserve the right to change my mind if we get more info, but yes, agree. He's an ant-faced weasel....


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> Has Chris Froome gone down in a few people's estimations today?


He already went down in mine a couple of weeks ago as you can read in the TDF thread. I also said he reminded me of Virenque, and I wouldn't trust that sneaky little tw@t as far as I could throw him.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Poor ol' Froome-dawg..... 

Perhaps Team GB's plan was a good one... it just relied on _everyone_ playing their part


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> Froome's a w*nker in my view. There I've said it. Superb rider for sure, but forget his fake loyalty in the TDF. He did f*ck all today and has saved his powder for the TT (although perhaps I shouldn't blame him given his TDF compromises?).
> 
> No sod it, he's a mincing little weasel who will never be man enough to lead a team. I hope Wiggo and 2 others stick it to him on Weds.


 
Come on that's facile, we don't know anything about how he is feeling after coming second in the Tour de France. It's a tough race and I think he could be forgiven if it turns out it took its toll on him.
Had it come back together there would be no complaints. It's easy to pick on someone when things don't go your way but you are just guessing as to his TdF loyalty, whether he worked hard today or if he might have felt ill. In bike races, people often have roles that you don't see.


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## GlasgowGaryH (28 Jul 2012)

If it had been down to me I would not of concentrated all the resources on getting Cav to the sprint finish. I would of told Froomey to be up there in any break away but not work and when it all goes base above apex as it did then go for it. Its all hindsight though and everyone knew for a chance to win they had to get away from Cav as they had no chance if he was there for a sprint finish.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

> If it had been down to me I would not of concentrated all the resources on getting Cav to the sprint finish.


 
Is there anyone else that finds a certain irony in that remark?

Btw, not poking fun at you Fokker (which is why I removed your name from the quote) as I do think that was obviously Team GB's tactic. It's just not so long ago that people where crying the opposite.


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

Anyone know the reason for the bikes the riders use? Miller was on a Cervelo, Wiggins was on a blacked out bike(wasn't Pinarello).


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## Erratic (28 Jul 2012)

aJohnson said:


> Anyone know the reason for the bikes the riders use? Miller was on a Cervelo, Wiggins was on a blacked out bike(wasn't Pinarello).


http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/534102/bradley-wiggins-uksi-olympic-bike.html


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Didn't someone post a link on that before??? They're bikes designed by and built for Team GB specifically.... was Miller not using one?

Edit: cross post, link above ^^^


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

Fokker said:


> If it had been down to me I would not of concentrated all the resources on getting Cav to the sprint finish. I would of told Froomey to be up there in any break away but not work and when it all goes base above apex as it did then go for it. Its all hindsight though and everyone knew for a chance to win they had to get away from Cav as they had no chance if he was there for a sprint finish.


I dunno if Froome would have been a credible candidate to sprint from a breakaway group, Geraint Thomas maybe if he wasn't on the track.


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

Erratic said:


> http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news/latest/534102/bradley-wiggins-uksi-olympic-bike.html


 
Ah I see, but Millar was riding a Cervelo :s

http://i.imgur.com/oeGZkh.jpg


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> I dunno if Froome would have been a credible candidate to sprint from a breakaway group, Geraint Thomas maybe if he wasn't on the track.


 
Millar would have been a decent candidate wouldn't he?


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## Paul_L (28 Jul 2012)

Fokker said:


> If it had been down to me I would not of concentrated all the resources on getting Cav to the sprint finish. I would of told Froomey to be up there in any break away but not work and when it all goes base above apex as it did then go for it. Its all hindsight though and everyone knew for a chance to win they had to get away from Cav as they had no chance if he was there for a sprint finish.


 
I think the only problem with that is that would have left Cav + 3 instead of +4 which over the Box Hill circuits wouldn't have worked.

The idea of a plan B might also be referred to as hedging your bets, and British Cycling don't do hedging their bets. The agree a plan and ride to it. Most of the time, it has to be said it works as well.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> Poor ol' Froome-dawg.....
> 
> Perhaps Team GB's plan was a good one... it just relied on _everyone_ playing their part


Yes, but Germany had exactly the same plan, ride for Greipel. Who would have guessed that their way of executing it was to not ride and win nothing?


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

Froome is bound to be saving himself a bit for the TT, I really don't know what some of you expect here. And that's exactly why it was a stupid idea to imagine that he should have been in the break. Even Wiggins sat up (relatively speaking) when he realised it wasn't going to happen.

And for those who don't get what I meant by a Plan B with Stannard, what I would have done is this: when it was clear that no-one else was going to help drive the peloton, (i.e. at the latest, 30ish km to go) and there was no chance of getting Cav to the front, I would have slowed the mass chase and sent Stannard up the road to bridge to the escape. He has the engine to do this, and was by far the freshest of the British riders having only done the Tour de Pologne (where he was awesome) not the TdF. Britain still might not have even got a medal, but that would have at least given the team more of a chance than we had be sticking to a plan that had already been found out.

The Olympic RR is always unpredictable - no-one expected Sammy Sanchez to win last time - and the limited team sizes always mean that individual riders or smaller countries can spring the unexpected. Colombia were a perfect example here and really a great demonstration of the eurocentrism that still characterizes expectations, with two riders in the break and yet no-one paid any attention to them until Uran jumped with 6km to go. Yet should we be surprised? Certainly those who have apparently been following Team Sky all season shouldn't be: both Uran and Henao have been riding both aggressively and intelligently for the team all year.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

Paul_L said:


> I think the only problem with that is that would have left Cav + 3 instead of +4 which over the Box Hill circuits wouldn't have worked.
> 
> The idea of a plan B might also be referred to as hedging your bets, and British Cycling don't do hedging their bets. The agree a plan and ride to it. Most of the time, it has to be said it works as well.


Also, Millar's role was to be road captain. Hard to do that when you're several minutes up the road from your team.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

aJohnson said:


> Millar would have been a decent candidate wouldn't he?


Agreed (though he's not as good sprinter as Geraint).


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Froome is bound to be saving himself a bit for the TT, I really don't know what some of you expect here. And that's exactly why it was a stupid idea to imagine that he should have been in the break. Even Wiggins sat up (relatively speaking) when he realised it wasn't going to happen.


Wiggins is the better bet for the TT and he was pulling his lungs out both before Froome dropped off and after. He had much more to gain than Froome by dropping off early (not forgetting that Froome was by far the stronger rider in the TdF...) but still bust a gut. Froome looked like someone taking care of himself. Would love to be a fly on the wall in the team hotel...


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## GlasgowGaryH (28 Jul 2012)

Anyone of us in the break would of been better than all over 1 minute behind is my point


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Whilst I personally won't offer a 'Plan B' (since I know nothing!), I'm just a little surprised that Team GB stuck so resolutely to the idea of getting Cavendish to a sprint finish when it seemed clear to some that it wasn't going to happen. Maybe TeamGB had decided they wanted Cavendish on the podium rather than any Team GB shirt? Whatever, as early as the 3rd or 4th ascent of Box Hill, it was being remarked that the breakaway was a strong one, and then when the Gilbert/Nibali group joined, it must have looked ominous to some (not me I hasten to add, I thought they could still be chased down, right up to maybe 20km to go). Perhaps the play had been played by that stage though, and they had to see it through??

I'm not being critical of the riders here, particularly not Wiggins as he seemed to ride himself into the ground, but I'm just surprised there wasn't more, um, on-the-road creativity I guess.


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## Smokin Joe (28 Jul 2012)

Everyone is being hugely unfair on Froome here. He ride his guts out in the tour and probably feels he could have won it given his head (as in last years Vuelta). Then after stepping back like a good team man and letting Wiggins take the glory he goes into the Olympic RR as a domestic for Cavendish. You can understand him feeling like a spare prick at a wedding and it is no surprise that he sat up when he realised he was chasing a lost cause. He has every right to save what he can for the TT, it's an individual event and he can ride for himself for once.

As for his looks, those sort of remarks are very mean and bitchy. I doubt many of the people making them are poster boys themselves.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

Info on the lack of info form OBS : http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/28/bbc-olympic-broadcasting-services-cycling
gps problem


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Everyone is being hugely unfair on Froome here. He ride his guts out in the tour and probably feels he could have won it given his head (as in last years Vuelta). Then after stepping back like a good team man and letting Wiggins take the glory he goes into the Olympic RR as a domestic for Cavendish. You can understand him feeling like a spare prick at a wedding and it is no surprise that he sat up when he realised he was chasing a lost cause. He has every right to save what he can for the TT, it's an individual event and he can ride for himself for once.
> 
> As for his looks, those sort of remarks are very mean and bitchy. I doubt many of the people making them are poster boys themselves.


If he felt awkward riding for Team GB and Plan A then he should have ducked out. Once in - it's all or nothing. Sitting up well before your team mates just looks like you're taking the piss.
As for looks, I'm gorgeous me. And he looks like a _shifty_ ant-weasel, which is even more unattractive.


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## Danny (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> If he felt awkward riding for Team GB and Plan A then he should have ducked out. Once in - it's all or nothing. Sitting up well before your team mates just looks like you're taking the piss.


He just looked shattered to me.


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## yello (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> As for looks, I'm gorgeous me. And he looks like a _shifty_ ant-weasel, which is even more unattractive.


 
TPIUWP....

...on 2nd thoughts, scrub that.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

yello said:


> TPIUWP....
> 
> ...on 2nd thoughts, scrub that. I think there's precedence


I have several. Which would you like?


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## dellzeqq (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> If he felt awkward riding for Team GB and Plan A then he should have ducked out. Once in - it's all or nothing. Sitting up well before your team mates just looks like you're taking the piss.


quite so. It's not as if there weren't other people available. 

Froome hopes to become a team leader. When that happens he's going to have to call on others. I don't think he's got the temperament for the job.

The course, particularly the circuit, was tight - ideal for a breakaway. Given the small size of the team I wonder if Plan A had more to do with a laudable desire to do right by Cav than (for want of a better word) practicality.


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## slowmotion (28 Jul 2012)

I'm not _au fait_ with road race tactics so the lack of timings didn't bother me. Purely as a piece of TV, I found the whole race simply wonderful to watch. BTW, didn't the English countryside look beautiful?


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Geraint Thomas maybe if he wasn't on the track.



I'm not exactly enamoured of the criticism of Froome in this thread. He is a top class rider and has proved himself a very loyal one. Anyone who thinks he didn't put in a good shift today clearly wasn't watching the same race as me. 

That said, we'd have won gold today with Geraint Thomas in the team - either in a break or as a lead-out man. The sooner he gives up the kiddie stuff and turns his full attention to grown-up cycling, the better. 

d.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> it is no surprise that he sat up when he realised he was chasing a lost cause. He has every right to save what he can for the TT



He sat up because he was spent. I don't know about anyone else but I watched the race from start to finish and I saw him doing some pretty long stints on the front, notably on Box Hill. He wasn't saving anything. 



> As for his looks, those sort of remarks are very mean and bitchy.



Quite. Low-grade contribution to the discussion. Not on.

d.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> He sat up because he was spent. I don't know about anyone else but I watched the race from start to finish and I saw him doing some pretty long stints on the front, notably on Box Hill. He wasn't saving anything.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I came in at 12ish, so perhaps I missed something? Otherwise it seemed to be mostly Millar, Stannard and Wiggy on the front.

And shifty ant-weasel from outer space seems like a pretty valuable contribution to me. If that approach works for Miss Marple, it's good enough for me.


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## fossyant (28 Jul 2012)

V for Vengedetta said:


> what was wiggo and cav riding, they were not Dogma's


GB team bikes from Secret Squirrel, been used before.

Missed the race, shame that drug cheat won. FFS why hasn't he been struck off....


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

fossyant said:


> GB team bikes from Secret Squirrel, been used before.
> 
> Missed the race, shame that drug cheat won. FFS why hasn't he been struck off....


He was. For two years. Not that he's ever admitted it.


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

fossyant said:


> Missed the race, shame that drug cheat won. FFS why hasn't he been struck off....


IIRC, he was actually caught for being a _blood_ cheat!


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## raindog (28 Jul 2012)

fossyant said:


> FFS why hasn't he been struck off....


because he's served his time FFS like everyone else who got caught.


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> I came in at 12ish, so perhaps I missed something? Otherwise it seemed to be mostly Millar, Stannard and Wiggy on the front.



I'm pretty sure I saw Froome on the front every time they went up Box Hill. 

It was a 250km race (ie longer than any TdF stage) and a five-man Sky team (ie not a nine-man team like they have in the TdF) were on the front nearly all the way, with occasional token contributions from the Germans. Not a single one of those boys gave anything less than 100%...

Except Cav, funnily enough. But by the time it was his turn to do his job, it was too late. 

Tbh, they'd probably have been better off if Cav had gone with the break. 

d.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> I'm pretty sure I saw Froome on the front every time they went up Box Hill.
> 
> It was a 250km race (ie longer than any TdF stage) and a five-man Sky team (ie not a nine-man team like they have in the TdF) were on the front nearly all the way, with occasional token contributions from the Germans. Not a single or of those boys gave anything less than 100%...
> 
> ...


Cav in the break would have been funny, that would really have messed with everyone's heads! Mind you, in all seriousness, would he have known how to ride a break? It's hardly his natural territory.
Yes, I know you didn't really mean it...


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> I'm not exactly enamoured of the criticism of Froome in this thread. He is a top class rider and has proved himself a very loyal one. Anyone who thinks he didn't put in a good shift today clearly wasn't watching the same race as me.


Totally agree - I didn't mean to come accross as criticising Froome there.


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

Sorry - I was a bit harsh on Froome wasn't I?

Slightly, more constructively ... I'm just not convinced he's as much of a team player as people think. Stage 11 (La Toussuire) he attacked his team leader - no ifs, no buts, no confusion. He gave an interview to L'Equipe stating he would like to be team leader, that he could win the tour and was frustrated. (This could not be good for team cohesion. Its similar to a footballer telling the Sun during a world cup "I want to be captain and take the penalties"). He did at least hold back on stage 17 (when Wiggo and everyone else looked spent). But the battle was already won and I personally think he still overacted the sitting up and offering a helping hand malarky, just to play to the cameras and show how strong he was. If he was a real, honest professional team player he would have just quietly paced his leader and got on with his job.

I watched all the race today. I think my understanding of racing is as sound as anyone else here. He did the least work of all team GB by some way and sat up early. Thats a fact - if you don't believe me then watch the whole race again. Yes he might have felt a bity off today, so perhaps we should give him the benefit of the doubt? Well see above and see how he rides on Wednesday...


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

I'm only half joking about Cav in the break - he looked fresh at the end of the Box Hill circuits and could easily have made the jump then sat on the back of the group, refusing to do his turn. It would have brought the whole race back together pretty quickly for a relatively small outlay of effort. 

GB's problem was being too rigid with their game plan. They didn't have the nous to adapt to the situation they found themselves in on the road (which is easy for me to say from the comfort of my sofa). It's all very well complaining about other teams taking a negative approach but hey, that's bike racing. Why would they help you if it means helping you win at their expense? As Cav said post race, they're a victim of their own success.

d.


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## david k (28 Jul 2012)

some good views making interesting reading.

i think in hindsight they should have closed sown the breakaway early on so they could control it, having said that they were only a minute off the group at the end so their tactics so nearly worked

still feel sorry for the guys


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> I watched all the race today. I think my understanding of racing is as sound as anyone else here. He did the least work of all team GB by some way and sat up early. Thats a fact - if you don't believe me then watch the whole race again.



Maybe my memory is playing tricks on me already but I'm sure he was on the front every time they went up Box Hill. 

d.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> IIRC, he was actually caught for being a _blood_ cheat!


Blood, M. Ferrari, buying race victories etc: details in french here : http://www.cyclisme-dopage.com/portraits/vinokourov.htm
but indeed not drugs (as far as my sketchy french goes)


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

I think it is all very well for us to say _so-and-so didn't do the right thing, didn't work hard enough, gave up too soon ..._

The truth is that we weren't there doing it, we were just watching on TV. I think what Tom Boonen said afterwards is quite illuminating:



> "We did everything we planned, I felt better than the results show. I'm a little disappointed I didn't get a medal," Boonen said at the finish line on The Mall. He blamed the lack of Belgians on the final podium on the difficulties in communicating without radios on a narrow course with thousands of screaming fans.
> 
> "It was so hard to communicate. You had to stick with your first plan because you can't tell anyone anything. The moment the break is gone, it's finished, you have to stick with the tactics you planned and can't say I feel good so wait for me. That's what changed the race I think.
> 
> ...


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Totally agree - I didn't mean to come accross as criticising Froome there.



Sorry, that wasn't aimed at you - I was only quoting you in order to agree with you re the G man. 

I have a bit of a soft spot for Geraint Thomas, who I think is potentially better than Wiggins and Froome rolled together. That kind of talent is completely wasted on the track. 

d.


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

Flying_Monkey said:


> And for those who don't get what I meant by a Plan B with Stannard, what I would have done is this: when it was clear that no-one else was going to help drive the peloton, (i.e. at the latest, 30ish km to go) and there was no chance of getting Cav to the front, I would have slowed the mass chase and sent Stannard up the road to bridge to the escape. He has the engine to do this, and was by far the freshest of the British riders having only done the Tour de Pologne (where he was awesome) not the TdF. Britain still might not have even got a medal, but that would have at least given the team more of a chance than we had be sticking to a plan that had already been found out.


 
Great idea Flying Monkey. The only problem is Stannard didn't have the engine or freshness today to close the gap down when he was pulling on the front. What makes you think he could have bridged the gap?


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Maybe my memory is playing tricks on me already but I'm sure he was on the front every time they went up Box Hill.
> 
> d.


 
Maybe mines playing tricks on me - I'm sure he wasn't there "every time"


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

ColinJ said:


> I think it is all very well for us to say _so-and-so didn't do the right thing, didn't work hard enough, gave up too soon ..._
> 
> The truth is that we weren't there doing it, we were just watching on TV. I think what Tom Boonen said afterwards is quite illuminating:


 
Yes I think this sums it up well. It all seemed to be in hand and just went away...


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## aJohnson (28 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> He did at least hold back on stage 17 (when Wiggo and everyone else looked spent). But the battle was already won and I personally think he still overacted the sitting up and offering a helping hand malarky, just to play to the cameras and show how strong he was. If he was a real, honest professional team player he would have just quietly paced his leader and got on with his job


 
That's something he did that I really disliked. Wiggins knew he had to keep going, but it was like Froome wanted to show off. He kept sitting up and waving Wiggins to hurry up.


----------



## zimzum42 (28 Jul 2012)

How much experience do the GB guys have riding without radios?

I wonder whether some of the other guys in the stage have a bit more experience of old skool racing pre-radios...


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

They need to learn how to ride without power meters too. The Sky strategy doesn't really work for long one-day races where racing instinct is worth a lot more than numbers on a screen. Vino proved that today. 

d.


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> Great idea Flying Monkey. The only problem is Stannard didn't have the engine or freshness today to close the gap down when he was pulling on the front. What makes you think he could have bridged the gap?


 
It is a very different thing to break and bridge than to pull the peloton at full pace. Other less powerful riders than Stannard managed to get across to the break today. Anyway, the argument is academic because that isn't what Team GB chose to do.


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> They need to learn how to ride without power meters too. The Sky strategy doesn't really work for long one-day races where racing instinct is worth a lot more than numbers on a screen. Vino proved that today.


 
I agree. This is also why Nicole Cooke is an Olympic champion when she can hardly seem to catch a break in the regular season, and why I think she is still our best hope of winning Gold in the women's race.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> They need to learn how to ride without power meters too. The Sky strategy doesn't really work for long one-day races where racing instinct is worth a lot more than numbers on a screen. Vino proved that today.
> 
> d.


I'd bet that experienced riders know well enough how they're going, even without SRMs. I think they're a bit of a red herring.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> He gave an interview to L'Equipe stating he would like to be team leader, that he could win the tour and was frustrated.


Froome's girlfriend claims that interview was done in Italian, translated to French and then to English. It's possible something was gained in the translation. Who knows ?


----------



## Kiwiavenger (28 Jul 2012)

Any news yet on Fabian? To be fair I really enjoyed watching it, cant swiftly catch the womens event tomorrow.

Sent from my LT15i using Tapatalk 2


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## tigger (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Froome's girlfriend claims that interview was done in Italian, translated to French and then to English. It's possible something was gained in the translation. Who knows ?


 
That is possible for sure. How reliable a witness is Michelle Cound?


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Froome's girlfriend claims that interview was done in Italian, translated to French and then to English. It's possible something was gained in the translation. Who knows ?


Not much if you read what she was saying on Twitter.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> Not much if you read what she was saying on Twitter.


Her tweet:
"Chris's L'Equipe interview was done in Italian, translated to French & now back to English… hope there weren't any mis-quotes…#*justsaying*"
Anyway, re. her reliability, well to make up a story about the language of an interview you'd need to be a fruit cake. Who knows ?


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Chuffy said:


> I'd bet that experienced riders know well enough how they're going, even without SRMs. I think they're a bit of a red herring.



The point is not about the individual riders but the team strategy. Sky approach racing as a numbers game, and that approach has been proven to work in big stage races. Whether or not the individuals are _able_ to ride on instinct, they just aren't _allowed_ to. Sky are the Stepford Cyclists.

Perhaps the writing was on the wall for today's race as long ago as this year's Paris-Roubaix, when Sky's team effort failed to reel in Tom Boonen's solo heroics.

d.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

And yes, I do realise I'm talking about Sky here as if they're interchangeable with GB...


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## crisscross (28 Jul 2012)

Okay, so that didn't go to plan.

But I enjoyed the spectacle and the scenery and the crowds. I doubt there have been that many spectators for a road race in England  Britain recently - seemed more than for the TdeF in London to me.

The TV coverage was pretty ropey all around. We have been spoilt for the last three weeks with incredible images and accurate info in France.

Personally I would have liked a GB'er in the break but that would probably have beem impossible for the Get Cav Gold brigade.

It was fun to see Cav let his PR cool slip on the BBC News interview "Do you not know anything about cycling???" - er, well probably not if the BBC has shipped in any pretty boy who can hold a mike and smile at the same time.

Brad tried his damndest but it wasn't going to happen for all the reasons listed above.

So where does it leave us for Wednesday, wounds to lick, but at least we look in better shape than two of the favourites.

So who's looking good for gold in the TT? Got to be Wiggo, if he can recover from this like he performed in France, day in day out.


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## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

thom said:


> Her tweet:
> "Chris's L'Equipe interview was done in Italian, translated to French & now back to English… hope there weren't any mis-quotes…#*justsaying*"
> Anyway, re. her reliability, well to make up a story about the language of an interview you'd need to be a fruit cake. Who knows ?


Ah, I wasn't questioning that the interview had been bounced around a bit. I was just suggesting that what he was reported to have said was actually what he did say. Her Tweets were pretty insistent that her man wuz robbed.


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## Strathlubnaig (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> They need to learn how to ride without power meters too. The Sky strategy doesn't really work for long one-day races where racing instinct is worth a lot more than numbers on a screen. Vino proved that today.
> 
> d.


Quote from the winner today .... "I study the race from the inside and I don't bother with what the directors tell me. Today, I think especially in the last 10km the fact that the major teams such as Germany didn't have radios played into my favor. If this had been a world championship, it would have been a sprint finish because the teams are more complete. But today was actually a calmer race because the limited number of riders and the fact that there were no team radios."


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## smutchin (28 Jul 2012)

Strathlubnaig said:


> Quote from the winner today .... "I study the race from the inside and I don't bother with what the directors tell me. "



You'd never guess that was his philosophy from the way he rides... 

d.


----------



## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> The point is not about the individual riders but the team strategy. Sky approach racing as a numbers game, and that approach has been proven to work in big stage races. Whether or not the individuals are _able_ to ride on instinct, they just aren't _allowed_ to. Sky are the Stepford Cyclists.
> 
> Perhaps the writing was on the wall for today's race as long ago as this year's Paris-Roubaix, when Sky's team effort failed to reel in Tom Boonen's solo heroics.
> 
> d.


Hmmmm. I know that Sky are big on the numbers, but I do think it's overplayed a bit. You can't, just can't, ride a race using your SRM as an audax routesheet. 'Ride 10km @ 76%. At TL, ride at 90% until L @ T' etc. Riders like Rogers and Uran were riding on instinct but that's as opposed to Team GB's Plan A, rather than Team GB riding by numbers.


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## Noodley (28 Jul 2012)

So, I was right all along that GB shoulda put Millar in the break to be able to control it, or have the option of having a plan other than a sprint for Cav. Millar would have out-Vino'ed Vino in the final stages.


----------



## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> So, I was right all along that GB shoulda put Millar in the break to be able to control it, or have the option of having a plan other than a sprint for Cav. Millar would have out-Vino'ed Vino in the final stages.


Master Tactician Noodley - your throne awaits.


----------



## Boris Bajic (28 Jul 2012)

To the neutral, it wasn't a bad race. 

I do like Millar (maybe more now than in Cofidis Superhero days) but I like the way Vino and the Columbian took their chance. Millar is not the rider he used to be and although Vino isn't either, he did have the speed of thought to take his chances. Had that been a 3-man break and stayed at the front, I still think it was Vino's.

I was worrying (but silently) before the race as the press and just about everyone with a UK Passport were assuming that Cav had it in the bag. For the neutral, there is a certain pleasure in seeing the favourite fall.

I hoped and hoped and hoped that the gold would come to the UK, but on reflection I think it was a good 'un.

And while we're on the subject of the RR, wasn't it a good course? Lovely weather too.


----------



## iLB (28 Jul 2012)

Interesting to compare how Millar and Froome look in terms of tiredness in the second video on this page http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18909585 if you are questioning Froome's commitment.


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## ColinJ (28 Jul 2012)

Boris Bajic said:


> And while we're on the subject of the RR, wasn't it a good course? Lovely weather too.


It was a better course than I expected it to be. It was hard enough without being stupidly hard.

I think it is a pity that the women are only going to climb Box Hill a couple of times.


----------



## Chuffy (28 Jul 2012)

iLB said:


> Interesting to compare how Millar and Froome look in terms of tiredness in the second video on this page http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/18909585 if you are questioning Froome's commitment.


May I refer you to my earlier cop-out - "I reserve the right to change my mind if we get more info". 

I know I'm probably being harsh, unfair and slightly irrational but there's just something about Froome that I don't like. And not just his alien ant-weasel fizzog.


----------



## zizou (28 Jul 2012)

Disappointed for Cavendish and for cycle sport generally in the UK, would have capped off a momentous week had he managed to get the gold.

However i feel even more sorry for Cancellara - tactically played a blinder, had 3 team mates to help him in the break away and looking so strong and comfortable. It looked like everything was being set up for what would have been an awesome spectacle of him turning the motor on and going for a solo break and going along the mall on his own.

What a disappointment the end turned out to be.... i used to really like Vino, if he had been clean that victory today would have capped off a great career and particularly the come back over the last year from his broken pelvis. But as an unrepentent cheat the victory just leaves a sour taste in the mouth.


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## thom (28 Jul 2012)

crisscross said:


> I doubt there have been that many spectators for a road race in England  Britain recently - seemed more than for the TdeF in London to me.


BBC highlights suggested it had the largest live audience ever for an Olympic event.


----------



## lordloveaduck (29 Jul 2012)

well tha's my weekend spoilt. Men on Saturday and Women on Sunday
Guess it's going to be another early morning ride, then get home in time
to bath, cook and lay out my supplies to keep me going through the race.

I may need to borrow a team car to keep me going


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## Danny (29 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> So, I was right all along that GB shoulda put Millar in the break to be able to control it, or have the option of having a plan other than a sprint for Cav. Millar would have out-Vino'ed Vino in the final stages.


I'd have put Millar in the break too, but I'm still not convinced he would have beaten Vino.


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## Crankarm (29 Jul 2012)

Of all the riders that could have won it had to be unrepentant doper Vinokourov. The rider I dislike the most in the peloton. In deed a very bad result. I hope he is clean. If it wasn't to be Cav's day which it clearly wasn't then Cancellara would have been a very worthy winner. I bet Cav is rather pissed off having scarificed quite a few sprint finishes on the TdF for helping Wiggo to the mailot jeune then not getting a medal let alone a gold as a break was allowed to get and stay away. I think he will now leave Sky which will be for the best.


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## asterix (29 Jul 2012)

Agree that he should not be in the team for the next TdF if a repeat win is their aim. He is not a TdF winner or a natural domestique. I'd love to see Wiggins do it again and if they have to replace both Froome and Cavendish to pull that off, so be it, IMO.

(And it is a pity the peloton didn't work for a winner who deserved it)


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## dellzeqq (29 Jul 2012)

The Beeb has apologised (sort of). 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/29/olympics-bbc-apology-cycling-coverage 

All they need to do now is to hire the ITV4 team and we'll get some decent coverage of the women's race


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## iLB (29 Jul 2012)

zizou said:


> However i feel even more sorry for Cancellara - tactically played a blinder, had 3 team mates to help him in the break away and looking so strong and comfortable. It looked like everything was being set up for what would have been an awesome spectacle of him turning the motor on and going for a solo break and going along the mall on his own.
> 
> .


 
You mean turning on the motor and dragging someone else to the line, see MSR and Tdf Stage one. Last night he said nothing broken but only 50/50 chance of starting the TT, I hope he does.


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## dellzeqq (29 Jul 2012)

I hope he does too. Despite the fact that you-know-who goes all silly every time he comes on the telly and talks about his new baby.....


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## thom (29 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> The Beeb has apologised (sort of).
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/29/olympics-bbc-apology-cycling-coverage
> 
> All they need to do now is to hire the ITV4 team and we'll get some decent coverage of the women's race


NOS, the Dutch broadcaster are responsible for the cycling broadcasting (but not the ropey commentary of course).
Here's the wider breakdown :

OBS Teams – Swimming, Diving, Synchronised Swimming, Water Polo, Modern Pentathlon - Swimming, Basketball, Equestrian, Fencing, Handball, Sailing, Shooting, Beach Volleyball, Wrestling
BBC – Boxing, Rowing, Canoe/Kayak - Sprint, Tennis, Football
YLE (Finland) – Opening/Closing Ceremonies, Athletics-Integrated/Track/Throws
SVT (Sweden) – Athletics-Jumps
SBS(Korea) – Archery, Taekwondo
Fuji TV (Japan) – Judo
TVE(Spain) – Canoe/Kayak - Slalom, Triathlon, Aquatics-Swimming Marathon
CCTV (China) – Modern Pentathlon, Badminton, Gymnastics, Table Tennis
*NOS (the Netherlands) – Cycling-Road Race, Time Trial, Athletics-Walks/Marathon*
STV (Slovakia) – Hockey
ICRT(Cuba) – Volleyball
ERT(Greece) – Weightlifting
VRT (Belgium) – Cycling (BMX, Track, Mountain Bike)

Taken from:
http://www.televisual.com/blog-detail/London-2012-the-broadcast-challenge_bid-317.html


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## dellzeqq (29 Jul 2012)

the pictures were fine. The lack of information was poor. The commentary was dire. And the commentary was a BBC thing through and through. I dare you to watch the Jill Douglas bit at the end without cringing. Vino couldn't disguise his contempt.


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## PpPete (29 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> The Beeb has apologised (sort of).
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2012/jul/29/olympics-bbc-apology-cycling-coverage
> 
> All they need to do now is to hire the ITV4 *Eurosport* team and we'll get some decent coverage of the women's race


 
FTFY


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## thom (29 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> Froome hopes to become a team leader. When that happens he's going to have to call on others. I don't think he's got the temperament for the job.


Not sure I can agree with that - people change and mature into roles when they are asked to. He is much younger, supremely talented and who's to say he can't use that talent to command teammates respect in due course.
Wiggo is a case in point - nobody seems to be bringing up his surliness which I'm sure irritated teammates in the past. Was it not 2009 that he was conspicuous by his absence from the Garmin train in Paris ? I could not have imagined Wiggins conducting himself so well as he did this year before he had the chance to.


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## thom (29 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> the pictures were fine. The lack of information was poor. The commentary was dire. And the commentary was a BBC thing through and through. I dare you to watch the Jill Douglas bit at the end without cringing. Vino couldn't disguise his contempt.


Actually for me the pictures could have been better - they missed the first chunk of the Mall sprint remember, the motos seemed consistently a bit too close to the riders and I'd like to know if Cancellara might have judged his turn in Richmond a bit better if the moto wasn't so close.
BBC commentary was bad but I've said before, it really irks me they are playing for a generic audience by providing personalities as pundits (McEnroe on cycling last night...?) and using the same stable of interviewers.
I did see the Vino interview - I thought that particular moment reflected more on Vino rather than Jill to be fair.


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## Strathlubnaig (29 Jul 2012)

Interesting take on the race from Ryder's perspective here
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/news/oly...-cycling-minus-medal--but-still-standing.html


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## Smokin Joe (29 Jul 2012)

One thing yesterday clearly showed is that racing without radios is the way to go. Forcing riders to think on the hoof and make it up as they go along makes for much more exciting racing.


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## tigger (29 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> One thing yesterday clearly showed is that racing without radios is the way to go. Forcing riders to think on the hoof and make it up as they go along makes for much more exciting racing.


 
Yeah me too - also what the OP said earlier - smaller teams too. It was an exciting last hour despite the result.


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## Flying_Monkey (29 Jul 2012)

Greipel says that the biggest problem was that the number of spectators everywhere on the course meant there was nowhere to pee...


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## zizou (29 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> One thing yesterday clearly showed is that racing without radios is the way to go. Forcing riders to think on the hoof and make it up as they go along makes for much more exciting racing.


 
It makes for different racing, not necessarily more exciting IMO - yesterday it meant alot of the riders in contention stuck with plan A and when that wasnt working out they didnt have the information to try something else, they just stuck with letting GB close things down to then try to capitalise on this when it came back together. One day races like this are much harder to control anyway and over the last few years i've never thought any of the monuments would have been improved and made more exciting if only race radios had been banned.


----------



## Pedrosanchezo (29 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> One thing yesterday clearly showed is that racing without radios is the way to go. Forcing riders to think on the hoof and make it up as they go along makes for much more exciting racing.


Certainly more exciting to watch. The TDF was pretty predictable and boring because team SKY dictated the pace and controlled the peloton. With smaller teams, and possibly no race radios, the race will likely be won by the form riders and those who have woken up feeling up for it that day. 
The TDF for example was won by the best team. They were unstoppable in their numbers and collective strength. 

I too feel a bit sorry for Cancelarra. He was looking very strong and will be a big miss should he miss Wednesdays TT. Wiggins should bag the gold. Fingers crossed.


----------



## zizou (29 Jul 2012)

Pedrosanchezo said:


> Certainly more exciting to watch. The TDF was pretty predictable and boring because team SKY dictated the pace and controlled the peloton. With smaller teams, and possibly no race radios, the race will likely be won by the form riders and those who have woken up feeling up for it that day.
> The TDF for example was won by the best team. They were unstoppable in their numbers and collective strength.


 
The last month or so showed that Wiggins, Sagan, Cavendish, Cancellara, Greipel, LL Sanchez and co are much more in form than Vino. Then there are a whole load of other riders like Chavanel, Boonen, Hesjedal (etc) above him too so he is a fair way away from being the fastest or strongest individual rider, even on the day. He won because he made the right tactical choices at the right time - i dont want that to sound like a criticism of him, it is meant to be praise. That is what makes cycling so interesting to watch - the "best" athletes / riders, even when they are at the absolute peak of their form, dont always win...cant say that about many other sports.


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## Pedrosanchezo (29 Jul 2012)

zizou said:


> The last month or so showed that Wiggins, Sagan, Cavendish, Cancellara, Greipel, LL Sanchez and co are much more in form than Vino. Then there are a whole load of other riders like Chavanel, Boonen, Hesjedal (etc) above him too so he is a fair way away from being the fastest or strongest individual rider, even on the day. He won because he made the right tactical choices at the right time - i dont want that to sound like a criticism of him, it is meant to be praise. That is what makes cycling so interesting to watch - the "best" athletes / riders, even when they are at the absolute peak of their form, dont always win...cant say that about many other sports.


I agree but on one day anything can happen. Consistency means much less compared to a complete tour. Any of these pro's could, in theory, potentially win a race day. They are all capable but i agree the favourites are just that for a reason. I was surprised Sagan didn't go with the breakaway as he done so many times in 2012, much to his success. I also expected Boonen to try something similar to Paris Roubaix but i understand he had several bike problems causing him to lose the front riders. 
Riders like Hesjedal could have planned to make a break as they are more than capable to start something but he even confessed after the race that he was in fact waiting for team GB to close the gap! It is becoming a bit to much like chess if your tactics depend greatly on another teams tactics. 
Full credit to Vinokurov for the effort (and tactics) he put in. Like or dislike the man, he put in one hell of a ride to win that race.


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## srw (29 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> the pictures were fine. The lack of information was poor. The commentary was dire. And the commentary was a BBC thing through and through. I dare you to watch the Jill Douglas bit at the end without cringing. Vino couldn't disguise his contempt.


The pictures were lousy - one bike at the front and one at the back, and a helicopter that couldn't see through the trees. The lack of information was the fault of the picture supplier. In the context the commentary (Porter and Boardman) was, as the Guardian said, heroic.

But then I was watching the uninterrupted race on Virgin Channel 576, and didn't see any of the generalist stuff - which is always lousy.


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## Andrew_Culture (30 Jul 2012)

Apparently the lack of information was down to spectators daring to use their mobile phones http://t.co/L0xYGoc1


__________________________________________________________________________________
Sent partially submerged beneath a cat.


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## VamP (30 Jul 2012)

I wonder to what extent the result was shaped by the number of Astana riders in the break (4). Kreuziger certainly said that he felt strong enough to chase at the end, but that he would have felt stupid to chase Vino.


----------



## BSRU (30 Jul 2012)

srw said:


> The pictures were lousy - one bike at the front and one at the back, and a helicopter that couldn't see through the trees. The lack of information was the fault of the picture supplier. In the context the commentary (Porter and Boardman) was, as the Guardian said, heroic.
> 
> But then I was watching the uninterrupted race on Virgin Channel 576, and didn't see any of the generalist stuff - which is always lousy.


I do not understand the problem described, GPS is a satellite system that transmits to Earth, with the required receiver you can receive this signal, it does not matter how many GPS receivers there are it does not affect the GPS signal. The GPS network is a US owned and has nothing to do with the phone networks.


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## srw (30 Jul 2012)

I suspect that the system relies on mobile phone technology to send a message with location information from the riders and the motorbikes to a central control centre. I know that car "black boxes" are beginning to use the same technology, and it's what you need to get "live" GPS positioning online.


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## Noodley (30 Jul 2012)

It all sounds a lot of bollox to me. They couldn't even get the number of times they did the box hill loop correct on the graphic! Or what number loop they were on. If only Dave Millar was in the break, he woulda kept everyone up to date by text.


----------



## Mr Celine (30 Jul 2012)

More on the technical excuses in  The Register.


----------



## Andrew_Culture (30 Jul 2012)

Mr Celine said:


> More on the technical excuses in  The Register.


 
Yup, German owned o2 did it to give the Germans an advantage


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## ColinJ (30 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Yup, German owned o2 did it to give the Germans an advantage


Yes, they failed using a lot less effort than they might otherwise have had to put in!


----------



## iLB (30 Jul 2012)

Still, at least cav did win something this weekend 
View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Utw-6yGOow&feature=sha


Post tour crit in Ninove, Belgium. 40K euros for the win
Edit: Gopro is on McEwens bike


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## Svendo (30 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> It all sounds a lot of bollox to me. They couldn't even get the number of times they did the box hill loop correct on the graphic! Or what number loop they were on. If only Dave Millar was in the break, he woulda kept everyone up to date by text.


I wondered about that, but isn't it because they did climb box hill nine times, but the final time they turned off to return to London before completing the loop, thus 8 loops and then final climb of box hill?


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## Noodley (30 Jul 2012)

Svendo said:


> I wondered about that, but isn't it because they did climb box hill nine times, but the final time they turned off to return to London before completing the loop, thus 8 loops and then final climb of box hill?


 
Possibly, but they were showing 3/8 loops for about 3 loops!


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## Chuffy (30 Jul 2012)

iLB said:


> Still, at least cav did win something this weekend
> View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Utw-6yGOow&feature=sha
> 
> 
> ...



These things are fixed in advance. If you're the guy who gets to win, how do you fake a convincing finish line celebration? I'd be too embarrassed.


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## marinyork (30 Jul 2012)

Andrew_Culture said:


> Apparently the lack of information was down to spectators daring to use their mobile phones http://t.co/L0xYGoc1


 
As was quite flippantly said elsewhere on the internet apart from tweets there seems to have been people absolutely hammering the network streaming live coverage when they were there! In a similarly irreverent manner mobile phone companies do indeed not get round to switching on new base stations for a while - it's true. o2 coverage gets hammered in a lot of busy public places. The timings seemed to be problematic well beyond the loop though.


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## lukesdad (31 Jul 2012)

lukesdad said:


> I think the breaks will go early, the countries without sprinters will want to split it up. With only 5 in ateam nobody will want to use their men up, so it's hard to see who will do the chasing. Germans or Aussies maybe ? But they won't be confident against Cav. So it'll be down to 4 Brits of which 2 have their eye on the tt.


 This.....


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## lukesdad (31 Jul 2012)

lukesdad said:


> The Belgians swiss and French may well want to make it a a race of attrition similar to a spring classic. I would't be surprised to see a very select group off the front on the last couple of circuits of box hill.
> The way to counter a break I would have thought would be for the Brits to put a man to sit on any break


and this.....just in case you hadn't noticed


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## smutchin (31 Jul 2012)

Oi, Brailsford, there's a man here you need to speak to...


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## lukesdad (31 Jul 2012)

smutchin said:


> Oi, Brailsford, there's a man here you need to speak to...


 lol


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## srw (31 Jul 2012)

lukesdad said:


> and this.....just in case you hadn't noticed


 


srw said:


> Which is exactly why it won't happen. We saw exactly the tactics GB will use during the TdF - allow a few hotheads to go into a break, control the speed of the peloton from the front with a five-man group, bring back the break with a few miles to go and then launch into the very well-drilled leadout train.
> 
> No-one with a sniff of a chance to win will be allowed more than a handful of minutes ahead of the main bunch.


 And this! I got the tactics spot-on - it's a shame they didn't work.

I know nothing at all about pro bike racing tactics.


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## Smokin Joe (31 Jul 2012)

srw said:


> And this! I got the tactics spot-on - it's a shame they didn't work.
> 
> I know nothing at all about pro bike racing tactics.


The difference in the tour was that you could allow the "hotheads" to bugger off up the road and get 30 minutes in front because they were two hours down on GC. The only ones you had to chase were the handful of contenders for the overall.

One day races are something else, every break is a threat.


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## lukesdad (31 Jul 2012)

Oi Noods, I thought you were Brailsford !


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## toby123 (31 Jul 2012)

Did all this affect the result? I'm a bit unclear on this.

BTW, the hill was done 9 times, but the loop wasn't fully done 9 times because they branched off towards Leatherhead after the 9th ascent and didn't complete that loop (because they weren't going back the way they came, i.e. via Dorking).


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## lukesdad (31 Jul 2012)

srw said:


> And this! I got the tactics spot-on - it's a shame they didn't work.
> 
> I know nothing at all about pro bike racing tactics.


 
but they didn't close the breaks down did they ?


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## Red Light (1 Aug 2012)

After the comments about the other teams not being bothered about winning as long as Cav didn't win, should the other teams be disqualified for "not using one's best efforts to win" as has happened in the badminton?


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## Risex4 (1 Aug 2012)

Red Light said:


> After the comments about the other teams not being bothered about winning as long as Cav didn't win, should the other teams be disqualified for "not using one's best efforts to win" as has happened in the badminton?


 
In the badders it was obvious. In the murky web of tactical cycling, every other team (*ahem* Germany) can put it down purely to their tactics going as wrong as GBs.


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## rich p (1 Aug 2012)

Greipel should be a bit pissed off. One of their places was taken by Robert Forster and Tony Martin dropped out early. He was left hoping GB would do the job for him.


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## Chuffy (1 Aug 2012)

rich p said:


> Greipel should be a bit pissed off. One of their places was taken by Robert Forster and Tony Martin dropped out early. He was left hoping GB would do the job for him.


I thought Robert 'Quads' Forstemann was doing a mtb event, not the road race? And yes, Greipel should be kicking himself and the team management.


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## rich p (1 Aug 2012)

Chuffy said:


> I thought Robert 'Quads' Forstemann was doing a mtb event, not the road race? And yes, Greipel should be kicking himself and the team management.


 You may be right Chuffy.


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## Chuffy (1 Aug 2012)

rich p said:


> You may be right Chuffy.


When have I ever been wrong? 
It was the French sprinter, Bourgain, who started the road race. He climbed off after 5km.


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## albion (1 Aug 2012)

Got to admit that I have gotten to admire Wiggins for his simple calm honest observations.

There has been none of the pretentious superstar self marketing crap.


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## smutchin (1 Aug 2012)

Chuffy said:


> I thought Robert 'Quads' Forstemann was doing a mtb event, not the road race? And yes, Greipel should be kicking himself and the team management.



The German road team was Greipel, Martin, Grabsch, Degenkolb, Seiburg. Grabsch is the only one who did a proper stint at the front. I don't recall even seeing Degenkolb at any point in the race.

You have to wonder why on earth Knees wasn't picked - maybe they feared he would want to help Cav.

d.


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## Chuffy (1 Aug 2012)

smutchin said:


> The German road team was Greipel, Martin, Grabsch, Degenkolb, Seiburg. Grabsch is the only one who did a proper stint at the front. I don't recall even seeing Degenkolb at any point in the race.
> 
> You have to wonder why on earth Knees wasn't picked - maybe they feared he would want to help Cav.
> 
> d.


Martin had a go before he dropped out.


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