# Any winter advice? I plan on doing the Fred Whitton in 2020.



## nlmkiii (25 Nov 2019)

Hi all!

Hopefully this post isn't too long and drawn out. The devil is in the detail as they say, so just want to give all the info.
I am entering the ballot to the Fred Whitton (fingers crossed I make it), but I want to start training now as I'm aware of how tough it will be. So I'm hoping for advice on how to approach the winter!

I'm not terribly concerned about finish time, but I am desperate not to walk any of it!

My current fitness level is:

Weight 94kg - I'm fairly muscular, so 78kg would be a theoretical lean minimum, but realistically I hope to get to 86kg by the date of 2020 Fred.
FTP 278 measured using a ramp test - I think it's lower than that in reality, as my build lends itself well to the shorter challenge of ramp. I would estimate 250-260.
I did a couple of 100milers with friends this year, and they didn't feel challenging (although partly because we went at the pace of the slower riders)
I did a 75mile ride with 2700m of climbing in just under 7 hours. It blew my doors off, but that doesn't tell the whole story. I had been told it would be sunny, so didn't bring extra clothing and it ended up being cold and rainy... I also trained quite hard the week before and was still feeling it a bit on the day (not a lot, but the legs weren't perfect)... I also mispaced myself awfully, riding way too hard at the start. If I did that same ride again today, I think it would feel comfortable

I've just bought a dumb trainer for indoor training through winter (currently using Zwift). An Elite Turbomuin with the crappy sensor. I plan on getting proper power meter in a couple of months, but the sensor is adequate to train with for now.
Zwifting is great as it allows me to ride many hours late at night (I did my first 100miler on it yesterday, starting at 7pm and finishing at 12.30am!!)

A big issue... I live in Norfolk!!! We don't have hills. I can't realistically get out to find a proper hilly ride more than twice between now and the Fred (and even that may be pushing it). 
There are a couple of very short steep hills near me. 300m at 13% ... 500m at 5.4% ..... (both on my doorstep) and 200m at 15% ..... 600m at 7% (both 10 miles away). I don't mind doing reps of them.

Any advice on what I really need to do would be great!


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## Venod (25 Nov 2019)

I have never ridden the Fred Whitton so can't comment on that particular ride, but living in Yorkshire I am used to a few hills, get plenty of time on any hills and make sure you have the right gearing with one lower gear than you think you will be happy with, spin up the hills seated rather than honking for a long distance, change your trainer for a smart trainer and you could ride the route from GPS files, I have just ridden Hard Knott and Whinlatter in the garage !


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## PaulSB (25 Nov 2019)

In Lancashire we ride a lot of climbs but I still know plenty of people who have to train hard to achieve the Fred Whitton.

My advice would be repeats, lots of them, on your local climbs. Also try to find a cycle specific spin class. To be honest though you've got nothing locally to match the climbs, not hills, you're going to encounter.

The alternative is a smart trainer.

Good luck.


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## nlmkiii (26 Nov 2019)

Yeah it's hard being in Norfolk. Everything is flat


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## Ming the Merciless (28 Nov 2019)

Hill repeats in a higher gear. Try an hours worth if you can. Gradually try and increase the number of repeats in the hour. On the turbo intervals to increase your threshold. Most of the hills of Fred Whitton are no more than 20 mins but are steep. So practice holding a high power output for 20-30 mins or so on the turbo. FTP a perfect measure of what you want to increase, as working at your FTP uphill works fine for the length of climbs. Took me about 8 hours back in 2012. Enjoy.

P.S. The 13% is the better choice else the Lakeland passes may be a shock.


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## CXRAndy (28 Nov 2019)

You dont need hills to train for hills. You need the correct gearing to be able to spin up all the hills. Then hills become slopes. I use a triple setup which if I needed, a small gearing of 28t crank and 40t cassette cog. I use this to ride up mountain climbs. I weigh about the same as you, so know about being slow up hills. But I do get up them in relative comfort because of my gearing.

Training, ride lots of long distances at a high cadence, 85+rpm in zone2 heart rate. This will build a big endurance base. The high cadence is to preserve your legs for longer on big rides.

Use Zwift to train for power, using lower cadences 60-70rpm, like riding up Alpe du Zwift. Sign up to Zwift training program to lift your FTP to supplement your long base rides

Dedicate about 80% to endurance and 20% power training

Diet, cut out virtually all fast sugars and use fats as fuel. Drink water not carb drinks whilst training. Over several months your body will adapt and be less reliant on fast carbs to fuel over several hours of riding. Come event day use fast carbs and sugars to keep your body topped up later into the ride. The re introduction of fast sugars will be like a turbo boost when feeling tired. But it requires you remove the sugars whilst training.

PS I live in Lincolnshire, I use Zwift and Trainer Road to train and then go to Tenerife in winter for some mountain climbing

Good luck Ive failed twice to get onto the event.


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## johnblack (11 Dec 2019)

One thing that improved my fitness and bike strength was cutting out leg weight training in the gym over winter for torque interval sessions, really noticed a difference in my strength and endurance, especially on steeper grinds. Especially when used in combination with more core strength exercises.


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## Milkfloat (11 Dec 2019)

My first Fred was a real eye opener to say the least. I went into it what I though was very prepared and had it been 200 miles on the flat I would have been fine. It was the hills that got me, especially towards the end. Although I had done plenty of climbs individually and done lots of long alpine climbs and those in the Canaries; I got destroyed by the steepness and relentless nature of climb after climb. Hardknott nearly killed me, I made it up without a putting a foot down, but it meant I was total broken for Wrynose and walked a fair section . My classic mistake was not preparing well enough for the climbing, going off too quickly at the start and also being over-geared. My second and last time, was still very tough, but no walking and no tears.


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## Ice2911 (2 Jan 2020)

nlmkiii said:


> Hi all!
> 
> Hopefully this post isn't too long and drawn out. The devil is in the detail as they say, so just want to give all the info.
> I am entering the ballot to the Fred Whitton (fingers crossed I make it), but I want to start training now as I'm aware of how tough it will be. So I'm hoping for advice on how to approach the winter!
> ...


I’m in Norfolk as well, I have signed up for a mad challenge this year as well final 12 stages of this years Tour de France the week before they race it. I’m working on the same things. If you were looking for some company to share the pain let me know. Which hills are you talking about? I’m in Norwich and a Eastern Avenue is the steepest probably alongside Gas Hill. I was heading out to the coast for a Roman Camp climb around West Runton for Hill repeats. I too have invested in turbo and Zwift. Good luck 😉


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## CXRAndy (6 Jan 2020)

If you haven't got any substantial hills nearby. Use a Turbo, pick a platform maybe Bkool and ride most of the FW hills. I tend to pick long climbs in Zwift and or select a long Trainer Road session and ride to power for a couple of hours. Or just select a huge gear and ride into the wind for as long as possible


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## Ice2911 (6 Jan 2020)

CXRAndy said:


> If you haven't got any substantial hills nearby. Use a Turbo, pick a platform maybe Bkool and ride most of the FW hills. I tend to pick long climbs in Zwift and or select a long Trainer Road session and ride to power for a couple of hours. Or just select a huge gear and ride into the wind for as long as possible


Thanks for this I am new to zwift. How do you find the long climbs?


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## CXRAndy (6 Jan 2020)

Ice2911 said:


> Thanks for this I am new to zwift. How do you find the long climbs?



Watopia has several, The Pretzel Kom, alpe du Zwift, and Volcano. The alpe will take a decent rider around 50-70mins. Its a direct copy of Huez ave 8% gradient.

There are also multi climb routes like 3 Sisters.

Goto Zwiftinsider for information on routes, climbs and levels.

If you're using a PC,. you can a hack program which allows you to choose pretty much any course to ride, even when not scheduled

Innsbruck has a copy of the world championship , thats a decent work out

Yorkshire has long low gradient climbs

What level are you on Zwift. If you've just joined some courses are restricted.

Good news, In about a week 'Tour of Zwift' events begin. These will be large events with potentially over 1000 riders on each race. You should be able to join any of these events.

Zwift app will give a time per day of these upcoming events


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