# Old mtb to tourer conversion, need a little advice.



## SafetyThird (17 Jun 2020)

I have a 20-something year old Trek 6000 which has, at various times, been my play bike, commuter bike, exercise machine and London transport alternative. I really don't see myself doing any real mountain biking stuff in the foreseeable so the bike has become my exercise and grocery shopping bike. I'm returning to cycling after a long lay off and have a road bike for long/club/fast/race type rides but as I'm into hiking/backpacking I'm considering doing some longer tours and have just picked up the France en Velo book which has fired my imagination for a possible holiday next year.

While I have it set up for reasonably comfy riding with luggage, I think the frame is too small really and I would benefit from a frame that's larger and has the appropriate mounts for panniers and mudguards and to get a solid fork in case I want to put on front panniers too and preferably steel in case I need to braze mounts on. I've recently picked up a bargain Shimano dynohub front wheel to experiment with dynamo lights and usb charging and I'm looking at some trekking bars to add a few hand positions.

I guess the big question is, is it worth getting something like an old 80's mtb or touring frame and moving all the components over to create a specific touring type bike? The bike has recently had new chain/cassette and a full service from the local shop. It has Shimano STX 7 speed components & Sugino Impel cranks. if I did, I'd put in a new bottom bracket given the age and possibly a new headset.

Thoughts?


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## All uphill (17 Jun 2020)

SafetyThird said:


> I have a 20-something year old Trek 6000 which has, at various times, been my play bike, commuter bike, exercise machine and London transport alternative. I really don't see myself doing any real mountain biking stuff in the foreseeable so the bike has become my exercise and grocery shopping bike. I'm returning to cycling after a long lay off and have a road bike for long/club/fast/race type rides but as I'm into hiking/backpacking I'm considering doing some longer tours and have just picked up the France en Velo book which has fired my imagination for a possible holiday next year.
> 
> While I have it set up for reasonably comfy riding with luggage, I think the frame is too small really and I would benefit from a frame that's larger and has the appropriate mounts for panniers and mudguards and to get a solid fork in case I want to put on front panniers too and preferably steel in case I need to braze mounts on. I've recently picked up a bargain Shimano dynohub front wheel to experiment with dynamo lights and usb charging and I'm looking at some trekking bars to add a few hand positions.
> 
> ...


Lovely bike which would make an excellent tourer, but if it's too small to be comfortable on long days then something has to change.

Worth asking at any local bike shops or recycling projects to see if they have a larger frame. Transferring the components is simple (if you have access to bike tools), if not it would not be expensive to buy a chain whip, headset press, and a crank puller.

Good luck!


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## SafetyThird (17 Jun 2020)

I have all the tools to strip/build the bike, I've built a couple of road bikes up from components in the past so that's not a problem.


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## Rusty Nails (17 Jun 2020)

Nothing wrong with that frame, but looking at that seatpost you could do with a larger frame for touring. 

Do you need front suspension? Better options for front panniers if you go for a solid fork.

Putting out a wanted ad in this forum, or in the Retrobike forum, would I am sure, get you a suitable good quality mtb frame.


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## SafetyThird (17 Jun 2020)

The frame is certainly sound but as you can see, it's a bit short for road touring and the drop to handlebars is a bit more than I'd like. Yep, would definitely like a solid fork for the option of front panniers. I'll throw the idea onto retrobike and see what happens. I'm not in a rush for this, but if that's the way I go, I have plenty of time to look for a suitable frame/fork.


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## Drago (17 Jun 2020)

That looks like a superb all-road tourer. I'd changethe forks for some rigids too but that aside, if it's decent to ride, comfy, and carries your luggage then you're doing just fine.


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## SafetyThird (17 Jun 2020)

The drop to the bars is more than is comfortable for longer trips, leading to neck ache and I'd end up with a very long stem I think if I didn't change the frame. That was my main issue.


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## HobbesOnTour (17 Jun 2020)

I'd always say that number one on a list of priorities for a touring bike is to be comfortable for long days in the saddle, so if you've decided that your current bike isn't then a similar bike in a more suitable size is the way to go.

I've a 20+ year old Trek 810 Sport converted for touring.

I upgraded the wheels to incorporate a hub dynamo in the front and to make it more future proof went from a 7speed freewheel to a cassette.

If I was to start again, I'd probably go 8 speed as 7 speed cassettes can be tricky to find with a high teeth count.

I changed out the BB and the front crankset as well - more for the practice rather than anything else. I'm not mechanically minded and it was a great way to get to understand my bike.

I like an upright position so used a long stem (threaded steerer). I tried out butterfly bars but they didn't agree with me.

I also got a new seatpost as the grips on the saddle clamp were worn and I didn't fancy a break on a long tour. 

After that, racks front and back, no need for specific braze ons on the fork. (Previously I toured on a hybrid with front suspension and a low rider rack - u shaped clamps and locked suspension was fine).

I've used 2 XL bottle holders and improvised one underneath the downtube to hold a fuel bottle.

It took me a while, but I finally added proper mudguards and they make a big difference in wet weather.

For a stand I use a clickstand - light and strong and a godsend for loading up the bike.

I also changed out the pedals and later added toe clips.

There's a very strong argument to be made for taking an old MTB and kitting it out for touring. For the spend you can end up with something that is perfect for your needs much cheaper than an off the shelf tourer.

I can use tyres up to 2,5 inches wide with no hassle increasing my scope for exploring.

No matter where you go there are many, many of these types of bikes so spares are easy and cheap to come by (but like I said, 7 speed cassettes can be a bit tricky). Indeed, if I suffered a serious frame defect I could easily and cheaply get another frame and transfer my components across. 

Personally, I think an old MTB is less attractive to thieves too.

I took about two years to build up my bike to where I wanted it to be. I didn't have a lot of money so every purchase was well thought out. Every trip added to the learning experience.

Just one final comment; I had already a few tours under my belt when I bought my bike so I had a fair idea what I was going to do with it. My idea of "touring" evolved significantly from what I thought I'd like to what I actually do enjoy. Had I listened to the guy in the bike shop before my first self supported tour I'd have bought a bike that would be pretty unsuitable for what I do now.

Good luck!


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## SafetyThird (18 Jun 2020)

thank you very much, that's really useful information and certainly backs up a lot of what I've been thinking. The upright riding position is definitely the thing that's missing so I think I'm not set on finding a more suitable frame and moving things over. 

I'd not thought about 7 speed cassettes being hard to find these days, do you have to change the derailleur as well as the shifter to move up to an 8 speed setup?

That's a lovely looking bike and I love how it fits your purposes so perfectly.


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## DCBassman (18 Jun 2020)

SafetyThird said:


> do you have to change the derailleur as well as the shifter to move up to an 8 speed setup?


No. The shifter on there will almost certainly do eight speed. If it's as recent as an RD-M310, it will do 9, mine does! Worked also with Sora road shifters. I had a freehub wheel and an 11-34t cassette on mine. It's now 9-speed with 12-36, still using that unaided rear mech!
If you decide to sell the frame on, and I'm assuming it's alloy, then if it's a 17 or 18", PM me, because all my Trek 800 Sport components would simply transfer, including the rigid fork. All these Trek frames of that era had much the same geometry, sus or rigid.
Edit: and you're not too far away!


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## HobbesOnTour (18 Jun 2020)

SafetyThird said:


> thank you very much, that's really useful information and certainly backs up a lot of what I've been thinking. The upright riding position is definitely the thing that's missing so I think I'm not set on finding a more suitable frame and moving things over.
> 
> I'd not thought about 7 speed cassettes being hard to find these days, do you have to change the derailleur as well as the shifter to move up to an 8 speed setup?
> 
> That's a lovely looking bike and I love how it fits your purposes so perfectly.


You're very welcome!
I wouldn't like to give advice on someone else's bike - I'm pretty sure my friction shifter would have needed an upgrade to 8 speed - but I never checked it out and I'm far removed from an expert but @DCBassman has rebuilt his trek so he knows what he's talking about.
The derailleur should not need replacing, unless, perhaps going for a big jump in teeth. It will need to be adjusted, though.
As regards cassette availability I was in the Netherlands at the time so that may have been a factor. Have a look online at the major bike stores or eBay. That will give a good idea on availability. Be careful on eBay to only use well established sellers - there can be knock offs.
Simply put, there are more 8 speed options more readily available but it's not that big a deal. 

I don't recall specifically where I got my extra long stem, but again, online is your friend. I actually tried an adjustable stem as well but didn't trust it.

If you do sort your fork/fit issues....I used mine as a commuter & tourer for about 9 months. I used the old set of wheels for commuting and threw on my "good" touring wheels when heading off for a loaded jaunt. I had a chain for each set up. It also meant that for a 4:30am start a flat tyre wasn't that big a deal 

Good luck!


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## SkipdiverJohn (20 Jun 2020)

That Trek frame is tiny and looks way too small given the amount of seatpost sticking out. Small frames with short head tubes give inherently low handlebar positions. I'm not interested in head-down MTB racing, so when considering a bike I want the tallest head tube to give the most upright riding position. You'd be better off sourcing something like this 1994 Raleigh for the basis of a 26" MTB tourer:-






They had slack roadster-inspired geometry and long chainstays, which makes them very comfortable and stable bikes and if a rack is fitted, there will be enough heel clearance so not to kick your panniers. Transmission are relatively low end Shimano 6 x 3 with a 14-28 freewheel on the back and a 28/38/48 triple on the front. You'll lift the front wheel before running out of gears if climbing using the granny ring. They'll get up anything, albeit not very fast!

-


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## SafetyThird (20 Jun 2020)

Yep, that's why I want to change the frame for something bigger, yours looks just the sort of thing. Now I just need to find one.


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## SkipdiverJohn (20 Jun 2020)

SafetyThird said:


> yours looks just the sort of thing. Now I just need to find one.



I won't ride any other type of MTB apart from rigid 26'ers. Not a fan of either suspension or larger wheels. Pre-corona if you were savvy enough and kept your eyes open, you could expect to pick up a decent budget MTB such as a Raleigh Sabre/Ascender/Mustang etc for around £20-30 in decent enough condition that all it would need would be some air in the tyres, possibly a new inner tube or tyre at worst, and it would be ready to ride. I picked up a very nice Reynolds 531 framed hybrid for £20 two years ago, no-one else even put a bid in! The current situation is an overheating sellers market, with poor choice and prices silly. It's reminding me a bit of the pre-2008 financial crash residential property market, and we know how that ended don't we?.....
Unless you have a really urgent requirement to get a bike, it would make a lot more sense to wait until the autumn, when the coronacycling craze will have likely died down a lot and the supply/demand balance of used bikes will return to a more normal situation. I would still keep looking even now though, in case a bargain does turn up, but I wouldn't be too hopeful.


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## newfhouse (20 Jun 2020)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> That Trek frame is tiny and looks way too small given the amount of seatpost sticking out. Small frames with short head tubes give inherently low handlebar positions. I'm not interested in head-down MTB racing, so when considering a bike I want the tallest head tube to give the most upright riding position. You'd be better off sourcing something like this 1994 Raleigh for the basis of a 26" MTB tourer:-
> 
> View attachment 531137
> 
> ...


Looks familiar. It’s now my shopping / dump bike.


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## Blue Hills (20 Jun 2020)

SafetyThird said:


> I would benefit from a frame that's larger and has the appropriate mounts for panniers and mudguards and to get a solid fork in case I want to put on front panniers too and preferably steel in case I need to braze mounts on.



You don't necessarily need brazed on mounts for the fork.

Just a good solid steel fork.

Then you can fit these.

https://www.spacycles.co.uk/m2b38s215p2031/TUBUS-LM-1-Mounting-Set-T72100


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## SafetyThird (20 Jun 2020)

That's handy, thanks.


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## SkipdiverJohn (20 Jun 2020)

newfhouse said:


> Looks familiar. It’s now my shopping / dump bike.
> View attachment 531161



Most, if not all, of those late 80's and 90's era welded Raleigh 18-23 steel frames appear to have identical geometry and dimensions for a given size. Irrespective of what model they were sold as and in what colour, they are essentially all the same design.
The brazed frames were a bit different though, both in angles, wheelbase, and tube lengths. The welded ones are better dimensioned for tourer conversions, IMHO.


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