# Cycling vs Anti Depressant drugs



## Bigtallfatbloke (15 Jul 2007)

Wish I had been prescribed cycling instead of pills for years...oh but then again the docs & med companies dont make any cash out of cycling


----------



## Keith Oates (16 Jul 2007)

I try to use pills as little as possible, not so much the cash but the fact that the body may not let you stop using them!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## Mortiroloboy (16 Jul 2007)

IMO Cycling _is_ an anti depressant  certainly keeps me sane! LOL!


----------



## dmoan (16 Jul 2007)

My GP actually recommended yoga and exercise (rather than medication) 5 years ago - very progressive, I thought!


----------



## barq (17 Jul 2007)

I think cycling helps massively, but the pills _can_ have their place too. The only difficulty I ever had was with tricyclics which took away my desire to cycle (the irony!). That didn't seem a good thing so eventually I discontinued them. I was lucky to have found a good GP who was happy to adopt a reasonably holistic approach.

The cycling is now part of my prevention routine. It's nice to hear other people having similar experiences.


----------



## Blue (18 Jul 2007)

barq]I think cycling helps massively said:


> have their place too. .



An interesting point backed up by medical studies done in USA in the 80's & 90's.

It was found that regular exercise improved *mild to moderate *anxiety or depression by the production of endorphins, the development of positive coping strategies and improvement in self-esteem, self-concept and body image.[/i]


----------



## Monty Dog (18 Jul 2007)

Having suffered from a prolonged absence from work a few years ago due to stress-related illness, one of my coping-strategies was spending time on the bike. It gave me the time and space to rationalise some of my thought processes. My GP was pretty understanding and encouraged me to get out, knowing I was a keen sportsman - however, I don't think he realised that as a virtual full-time cyclist, I was regularly stacking up 300-500 miles per week. I'm still taking a mild dose of anti-depressants - I've tried weaning myself off, but suffer from mood-swings if I don't. FWIW Even when taking a moderate dose, I don't think they had any impact upon my performance.


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (18 Jul 2007)

thats where I'm at. Been on the pills for 5 years or more..lost my job....was hospitalized for a while...gave up...got fat....became an absolute pratt to all who love me....then on eday I woke up and decided to walk out to the garage and get on my old mtb....still pedalling.


----------



## chris42 (19 Jul 2007)

Bigtallfatbloke said:


> thats where I'm at. Been on the pills for 5 years or more..lost my job....was hospitalized for a while...gave up...got fat....became an absolute pratt to all who love me....then on eday I woke up and decided to walk out to the garage and get on my old mtb....still pedalling.



Good on ya Big!
Similar situation here and I take no pills after 2 years of seroxat!


----------



## barq (19 Jul 2007)

I've been pill free for a few years now and cycling has a lot to do with that. However I also recognise that for many people pills work very well, or that cycling on its own isn't enough.

I never reacted well to the pills. SSRIs tipped me over into being bi-polar on several occasions so I got given various tricyclics all of which had nasty side effects. What a relief to have discovered cycling. Might sound a bit OTT, but its the best thing I ever did! I've now had several years of pill-free good health.

Good to hear your story though Bigtallfatbloke - keep pedalling.


----------



## jacob (20 Jul 2007)

had problems with depresion myself,2 months off work.It was all made worse because I self presribed alcohol:confused:Mate in pub inspired me by riding lejog and sold me his bike afterwards !To cut a long story short,cycling has helped turn mmy life around


----------



## jacob (20 Jul 2007)

had problems with depresion myself,2 months off work.It was all made worse because I self presribed alcohol:confused:Mate in pub sold me his bike never looked back


----------



## longers (20 Jul 2007)

I can't comment on any prescribed medication for depression but cycling has definately helped steady this ship. I would definately have been popping pills.


----------



## Elmer Fudd (20 Jul 2007)

Same here, had been off cycling for a while apart from work commute but then lost job, so moved 200 miles away from home. Back on the pills at the mo but amazing how good you feel about yourself when out on the bike. 
Or is it because you are more thinking about what you are doing rather than "what's gone wrong with my life ?"


----------



## laurence (21 Jul 2007)

the problem i have is that when down, or on my way down, i don't want to cycle. i know that if i ride and have one small incident (not climbing a hill well, getting tired quickly, etc) then i'll just want to throw the bike away.

i signed up to do the brit cyclosportive mainly to get me riding... and it worked, even though my mood on the day darkened like the sky and i gave up half way after small niggles with the organising of the event got to me. it did make me want to ride though... and i've ridden better since as i enjoy it now.

i did a stress management course as part of my treatment and one thing that came up was breathing problems - this has been a big part of me not enjoying riding. i still have the problem - my mind gives up and causes panic, making me hyperventilate. it may be part asthma too, my last doctor wasn't interested in that.

must admit i want to get off the pills. if anyone saw the Stephen Fry programme recently there was a great quote by someone who said that medication made you "letterboxed". you didn't experience the lows, but you didn't get the highs either - and i think this is a problem with me. i've also given up writing since the meds as it seems my mind can't run free.

while things at home (and, less so now, work) are really strained i'll keep up the pills, but i am looking at riding more as a form of therapy.

another thing that has helped me is birdwatching! i have become a member of the WWT and visit the wetlands centre in Barnes as an escape. this may sound strange too, but i have often sat and chatted to swans in richmond park and on the Thames. there is something calm about them. i recently had one see off a goose that bothered me as i sat and chatted to him while he preened. the same swan recently let me feed its six cygnets, almost by hand, allowing me to sit on the bank as they swam inches away with the parents not bothered by my presence. other 'humans' were approached by the parents so they didn't get too close. did that swan recognise me? did i sense something in me? i have no idea, all i do know is that another park visitor remarked that they'd never seen anyone get that near to, very recently hatched, cygnets before.

good luck to all those with problems. my your wheels run true.

L


----------



## Elmer Fudd (21 Jul 2007)

laurence said:


> watched the Stephen Fry programme recently there was a great quote by someone who said that medication made you "letterboxed". you didn't experience the lows, but you didn't get the highs either.


Totally agree, love Billy Connoly, Lee Evans, have i got news for you. At the mo with the pills they only raise a smile not the guffaws of laughter as usual


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (21 Jul 2007)

there is nothing strange about bird watching( although I tend to concentrate on the two legged blonde variety)

Bill Oddie I believe has had real issues with depression in his life and he dealt with it (at least partially I heard) via bird watching.

His bird watching is my cycling...each to his own...whatever works .

...I say don't get annoyed if you don't feel like riding...just ride on your good (better) days...concentrate on the bird watching if thats what floats your boat...ride when you are in the mood...take it one step at a time. JMHO.

You mentioned getting off the pills...you proabablyknow already but that needs to be done very gradually. I have done it both ways (slow & Quick) and believe me slow is best.


----------



## fossyant (23 Jul 2007)

Getting out on the bike certainly helps me too - not on tablets, but work's been driving me nuts, hence jacking it in last week - hit the bike most days since and keeping it up until something new turns up (should be in a new job within a week or so) - but want a job I can commute to - my last two have been too far away, so I've set a goal of a job within 12 miles - 30/40 minute commute is ideal. Sitting in traffic jams for 60-90 minutes each way is soul destroying !


----------



## Blonde (24 Jul 2007)

I've watched this thread with interest as I had depression for many years on and off before I started cycling. I would say, in general, yes, exercise, especially outdoors is great for mental health, but, depending on the specifics of your mental and physical state at the time, it can take over and become just another factor which is not helping, especially if you use it as a crutch and become emotionally dependent on it. ie - That's when you get down if you can't get out on the bike because of poor weather or illness.

If you are competing, or aiming towards a specific goal, you can end up pushing higher and higher, and the cycling then becomes another source of anxiety or stress. The adrenal glands and other areas the endocrine system don't differentiate between physical stressors (cycling) and mental stressors such as work, home life, etc - you still produce the same stress hormones; adrenalin, cortisol, etc. in your body as a response. If you are under stress at home or work on top of intensive cycling/training, this really depletes your already depressed immune system, which in turn aggravates the depression - a vicious circle. Also, if you have any issues with eating disorders or self-image, cycling and the lifestyle that surrounds it, can be another aggravating factor. Of course if you do have this problem you'll probably think cycling is great, as you can use it as another tool to lose more weight or punish yourself further. 

Finding a balance is the most important thing. There is more to life than cycling, and to become too focussed on one specific thing is not helpful for anyone, especially anyone with mental health problems. It is best to have several other things you can also turn to for enjoyment, as well as a really strong support network - another thing that seems to suffer if you spend too much time on the bike away from family and friends.


----------



## Blonde (24 Jul 2007)

Laurence, you sound like you're finding some peace which is making you feel good, but cycling or walking on your own can be rather lonely. Being with others is a hugely important thing for all human beings, but especially if they struggle with depression. Are you in a cycling club? Is the WWT a club/group that actually meet? If not, maybe you could join a bird watching, walking or cycling club/group that does - that way you'd be mixing your interests with some social activity (away from home/work) and getting the best of both worlds.


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (24 Jul 2007)

..wise words Blonde.

I find that I tend to get really focused on one thing and blitz it. For years that was a high pressure sedatory job. Cycling is like a breath of fresh air and I am loving it. However I fear the winter and the long dark days without riding...that's when I will fall back on my other hobby ...home recording...which is unfortunatly not so energetic.

My experience (& please forgive me talking about myself so much...it's just that that is all I know about) has been that I actively avoided groups and socializing...I hated it. I avoid bright lights and loud noises as well...supermarkets etc. All I did was hide out in my cave...so to speak.

Cycling has broken that barrier...given me a reason to go out. I can avoid people still very easily if I want to still but more and more I find myself wanting to get more of a social life again...so i suppose a combination of pills, exercise, close support (my family are my rock) and fresh air and sunshine all play a huge part in recovery.

I was taught all about the flight and fight syndrome the human body goes through in stress factors....my natural reaction to stress is to panic, run then stop, turn around and fight....but there came a point when I did none o f those and simply lay down and gave up.
I think Cycling allows me to get those reactions out of myself....Fight the hills and the distance and the bonk etc....but I am also being given a chance to run away...sorry it's sounding weird...and deep...not ment to be...I think you point about not pinning all your hopes on one thing (i'e Cycling) is extremely valid.

..on th esubject of support...I found the internet very helpful in that respect. I hang out on a recording engineers forum as well and those guys have helped my through some dark periods.


----------



## giant man (24 Jul 2007)

Don't fear the winter man. Carry on riding throughout the year Bigtallfatbloke, get yourself an old winter hack and ride man! Some bib tights and suitable jacket and you're set. Better than not riding that's for sure.


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (24 Jul 2007)

absolutly ...I am looking for some winter gear at the moment (size is a problem though) ...I reckon that if I have th egear it will take away any excuse I have not to ride...


----------



## col (24 Jul 2007)

My experience (& please forgive me talking about myself so much...it's just that that is all I know about) has been that I actively avoided groups and socializing...I hated it. I avoid bright lights and loud noises as well...supermarkets etc. All I did was hide out in my cave...so to speak.




What you said BTFB has hit the nail on the head for me too im afraid,ihad some bad periods where i wouldnt even go to our corner shop,my wife did all the time,but thankfully marie has been very understanding,this was mainly caused by a bad incident that happened some time ago.it comes and goes sometimes bad sometimes not,i was also on pills but found that exercise did help,but that was a few years ago and i found it too easy to hang out in my cave(as you put it) Im now at the stage of preparing my long hidden away bike and making sure i have everything that i need ,so i can get on it,but i keep coming up with excuses of something else needed before i get going with it,ill get there though


----------



## laurence (24 Jul 2007)

Blonde said:


> Laurence, you sound like you're finding some peace which is making you feel good, but cycling or walking on your own can be rather lonely. Being with others is a hugely important thing for all human beings, but especially if they struggle with depression. Are you in a cycling club? Is the WWT a club/group that actually meet? If not, maybe you could join a bird watching, walking or cycling club/group that does - that way you'd be mixing your interests with some social activity (away from home/work) and getting the best of both worlds.



maybe, but i do have an incredibly low opinion of the human race... i'd rather be with birds, cats, deer, etc.

the riding is a release. out there it's just me, if i fail then I fail, no-one else and when i do well it's MY achievement.

thw WWT is the wildfowl and wetlands trust. i go there to relax, listen to the birds, watch them play, etc. i also go on members' walks. it's a bit like cycling - you might meet someone and strike up a conversation for a time, then go your own way. the brotherhood of the road, or the hide.

if there are people i like to be with, then i'll be with them, but after a day of being with people, talking to strangers on the phone, mixing with colleagues, i can do with the quiet.

one of my other 'hobbies' is going to gigs. there i am alone in a crowd. people come to watch the band and i can escape. it'a also a form of peace, the music blocks out the world and i can be lost in it.

the thought of mixing with people fills me with dread... not just because of the acute shyness, but because i will get fed up with people and want to escape even more. people tend to drive me away from people.

L


----------



## piedwagtail91 (24 Jul 2007)

i have to agree. i'd been doing well and got off the medication, just riding and doing a season long ctc competition with my local group.then i started going out with a racing club as well and the rot set in.i'd not wanted to race but sort of drifted into the training, but found myself increasing the pils because of the stress of the bit and bit and the race getting nearer. it got to the stage where i was on the top dose and was too doped up to hold a wheel, so decided it was pretty pointless and gave up before things got out of hand again. i took the road bike apart and sold some of the bits to distance myself from racing to feel safe.within three weeks (which was all the time i had before the next ctc event which i wanted to do "clean") i'd got off the medication again and felt a lot better just in time for the ride.i wasn't brilliant and had cut down too quickly,but things were a lot better,especially after the event.


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (25 Jul 2007)

...I had no idea so many others were having issues as well..I wish you all well.

On the club/race thing...

...I have still not joined a club and there are several reasons:

1) It seems to be 90% racing/TT's etc...and that to me shouts "Pressure!" & pressure is not good for me anyway.

2) Organized rides are exactly that organized...on set dates & times etc they don't allow me to drift...do my thing at my pace....in my own way.

3) The social side of things is bound to involve alcohol, which is fun but I am making a serious effort to avoid it as part of my desire to be bigtallthinfitbloke, and because it does not mix well with the pills. I also feel 'out of sorts' in groups and would probably end up not going to the club nights anyway.

....Touring is therefore where it is 'at' for me. I get to do what i like when I like. There are no targets, no pressure, nobody to be judged against....just me, my bike a tent and a country lane.


----------



## Blonde (25 Jul 2007)

piedwagtail91 said:


> i have to agree. i'd been doing well and got off the medication, just riding and doing a season long ctc competition with my local group.then i started going out with a racing club as well and the rot set in.i'd not wanted to race but sort of drifted into the training, but found myself increasing the pils because of the stress of the bit and bit and the race getting nearer.


Yes, that was exacty my point - everything must be in balance and over focussing on one particular aspect of life and putting pressure on yourself about it, is a really bad thing for anyone with a history of stress, anxiety or depression and especially anyone with self-esteem issues. 

I still think that one of the main reasons/causes or at least compounding factors associated with depression, is feeling alone or somehow removed from other people, and that to recover you need close human contact and a strong support network of people you can trust and maybe actually talk to about how you are feeling. This is of course why sometimes some kind of psychotherapy can be helpful, as you are unburdening yourself to another human being. People who live isolated lives are more likely to be depressed - it's why elderly single people can be particularly at risk and really benefit from social activity and particulaly from human touch, in the form of massage - hand massage is particularly good for older people as it is gentle and not at all invasive of privacy.

I have found that actively seeking out social activuty, cycling companions and joining CTC or other groups to cyle with has a helped a lot. I enjoy social cycling, not every single weekend - I need to do my own thing as well, but variety is important to keep you motivated and stop you becoming obsessed with one type of cycling or one aspect of life. My social life off the bike does not revolve around drinking and hasn't since my student days. I enjoy simply visting people in their homes, chatting and having them over to ours for meals and I go out to the theatre and concerts with my loved one and friends and chat about it afterwards. Maybe I am boring, but that's what I enjoy and I find it helps keep me from feeling isolated, lonely and depressed. I think that if you avoid social activity it's a real shame, because you are missing out on a hugely important aspect of human life. Our ability to communicate and share culture is what makes us uniquely human! I'm not knocking t'net as a useful tool for expression and for human contact, but there really is no subsititute for real life!


----------



## col (25 Jul 2007)

...I had no idea so many others were having issues as well..I wish you all well

It is a surprise how many people are actually affected by this sort of thing to me too,i suppose its easier to talk more freely to the pc screen about something that isnt normally mentioned to your mates face to face?


----------



## Blonde (25 Jul 2007)

For me 'tis the opposite - that's why I waited a while and thought about it before saying anything on the internet. I have talked to friends and family about this very private matter, but a wider audience including possibly one's employers and future employers, is not the easiest place to talk about this IMO. However, because I think it should be discussed more and not a taboo subject, as it is so common, I think people should know about the condition and what they can do to help. Afterall, it's the employers that loose out when people go on sick, as they have to advertsie for temps or replacements, then train them etc, so they can't just ignore it. If depression and mental health was not such a hidden issue, perhaps employers could actually help people (by being more flexible about working hours, leave, job shares etc. and even having counselling available to staff like many Universities do) before it gets to that stage so that they don't have to quit work and then it will cost employers (and the NHS) less.


----------



## piedwagtail91 (25 Jul 2007)

a lot of good stuff being said by blonde, just read your post on page 2 and fully agree.i'm past the stage of caring what people think and have a couple of mates in two different clubs who both know where i'm at.
if someone asks me why i'm on the bike and not working i tell them, if they don't like it it's not my problem!
if people with depression went round with a bandage on their head others who don't understand it or just what it can do to you might be more understanding.
the only time problems arise is when they ask me if i want to go on long tours ,which i can't afford to do.


----------



## Hugo15 (25 Jul 2007)

Been lurking on this thread for the last few days. Had quite a stressful time over the last six months. Got promoted into doing a job that involved managing a team, 2 of whom were new to the company and the other two were new to their roles. I was trying to keep things going and get the team established. Just ended up working longer and longer hours and getting increasingly depressed. Got to the stage where I was struggling to get out of bed to go to work. After struggling on for months I finally admitted to myself that I could not continue like this and evaluated what I was doing. Although I felt I had been dealt a tough hand, people management isn't what motivates me, I am much happier being a spreadsheet jockey (and much better at it!). Fortunately my employer has been good and has let me change my role and has recruited someone to take on the management responsibilities. I ended up taking the management role as it is what I thought I should be doing rather than what I really wanted to do (I had doubts before accepting the role) - a big lesson leaned here.

Blonde's comments about not over stretching yourself as well also struck a chord. My mate persuaded me to enter a couple of sportives at the same time the stuff was going on at work. I originally wanted to do the middle distances (usually around 80 miles) but he persuaded me to enter the 115 miles ride on the White Rose Classic. This pushed me to a distance I had never been near before and resulted in my escape route from work starting to become a chore as I crammed in the training. I managed to complete the WRC and have a great sense of achievement for getting round, but I couldn't say that I enjoyed the ride and I didn't see much scenery as I stared at the tarmac 2 feet in front of my front wheel. Again another valuable lesson learned.


----------



## Bigtallfatbloke (26 Jul 2007)

Square pegs and round holes


----------



## yello (26 Jul 2007)

> Our ability to communicate and share culture is what makes us uniquely human!



You are very wise Blonde. I have found your posts extremely worthwhile.

I consider myself a near-on natural born loner but I cannot go too long without some form of social interaction. The mood suffers otherwise. Cycling has been brilliant for me. I get physical exercise (which, I think we all agree, helps the mood) AND social contact. I tend to select rides according to needs - CTC ride for social emphasis, audax for exercise. Broadly speaking anyway. I might ride an audax as a social event, depends how I feel on the day!

I would like to pick up on the 'square pegs round holes' comment too, because I think your environment plays a part in your overall well being. I genuinely believe that most humans cannot actually handle the roles that we have created for ourselves - or had created for us. It is my honest belief that most of us are not suited to 9 to 5, 5 days a week plus associated stresses. So I do think you have to be honest with yourself and decide what you really want and see whether you are in the right place to get that. It may call for some very brave decisions. Decisions which, if you are suffering from depression, are extremely difficult to follow through on. It's a tragic paradox that those that need to make the efforts are the ones that have the lesser strength.


----------



## Yer Maw Mate Yer Maw (28 Jul 2007)

I tend to find that cyclist always say hello to each other and are willing to chat to other cyclist and help them out if they are having problems on the road, in no other outdoor activity have I found that like in jogging/running etc etc or down the gym.

I don't know why that is but cyclist just seem to be more of a friendly bunch are more thoughtful and can have empathy with others?

When your out on the bike you have the freedom to take in more things than you ever will in a car or jogging if you spot another cyclist stoped you can chat away about bikes and routes all day if you like...when can you ever do that with a jogger or a car driver?

Yeah cyclist are alright I cant remember how many times I have met old guys/gals round the west cost of Scotland that have told me about rides and races with well known professional cyclists and races that are famous that have left me gob-smacked like story's about Robert Millar and the Flying Scotsman all because your into cycling it really is a gift and blessing to be a cyclist.

Cycling and cyclist don't care if you have problems they like you just the same because your into cycling thats what I have found and I have had my fair share of problems like everyone else.


----------



## radger (31 Jul 2007)

I read this thread with interest, being another sufferer of depression. I was on fluoxetine for 4 years, but I took myself off it as the 'letterbox' effect was extreme - I was experiencing almost no emotions - and the GP practice I was registered at was a university one, so they were all very keen to prescribe as many drugs as you could swallow, but not to help address the causes. 

I was helped to come off the pills by the fact that after graduating I had a series of jobs that were based outside and meant I was in the air all day; and then I went travelling for a year. In the three years since then, I have noticed my emotional state beginning to deteriorate again.

Whilst exercise has helped, it's got worse in the past 8 months due to work stress increasing, my yoga teacher leaving and a separate health problem meaning I can't swim. One thing that has helped, and this will sound really ridiculous, is taking the time to wash my face properly - the whole cleanse, tone, moisturise shenanigans. I suppose it helps because it's connecting with myself in a positive way, rather than in the more usual spiral of self-loathing and recrimination.


----------



## bagpuss (31 Jul 2007)

*cycling vs anti drpressant drugs*

I had my first major bout of the "Black dog" in 1998 , my love of cycling was my light at the end of the tunnel . During 1999 I got back on my bike and got my self fit enough to ride the AUK 2000 events . It used it as a goal .Since then I have been bit by the black dog again . Again I used cycling as my light , and went touring in Austria ....what a fix that was . I am off the pills at the moment . I still ride every weekend {60/70 miles}and I 'am looking for a new target . Cycling does lift your mood , no need to bust a gut . Remember clinical depression will take up all your energy . I could sleep for 12/14 hours a day . So start off steady and set your self a target . I posted a topic else where on the forum about relighting the fire . Yes I need something to aim at ,before I get bit again .
Ps. Be kind to yourself .


----------

