# Off roading with shoes attached to pedals



## Steve H (24 Apr 2010)

I've recently got into cycling and although I have a cheapish mountain bike, I've been mainly cycling roads, tow paths and SusTran greenways. As I got more into it I bought some cycling shoes with SPD cleats and new pedals.

All was fun and I have been enjoying being attached to the bike - it seems to give a smoother, more powerful pedal stroke.

However just been off roading today on a much more technically demanding trail. Plenty of deep grooves in the trail and lots of rocks and boulders to navigate. Being attached to the pedals was just too much for me. I took quite a few tumbles and in the end just tried to keep my feet balanced on the pedal but not clipped in.

Am I stupid trying to mountain bike properly with these kind of pedals, or is it simply that I'm such a beginner and that actually with a bit more fitness and riding experience its perfectly fine to mountain bike whilst attached to the pedals.

I'd appreciate the advice. Thanks.

Steve


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## numbnuts (24 Apr 2010)

I MTB with clipless pedals and I’m an old fart  if you come to a difficult bit just unclip one foot, you can still pedal with the middle part of the shoe, it works for me


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## gaz (24 Apr 2010)

I went down some technical sections on my hard tail with SPD-SL's that was freaking awesome.. especially when the table tops came, so much control over the rear of the bike.


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## lukesdad (24 Apr 2010)

Its about confidence. Gaz is right. Not only is it about power in your pedal stroke,its about being attatched to the bike to give you the control. When your off road forget about being snapped in, If you do come a cropper your feet will soon snap out. Your much more likely to have a big one if you try to unclip before you come off.If your doing it properly you shouldn t have time to think about it anyway

When its wet you need those cleats. Dont ride on top of them unless you want very bruised shins and smashed ankles.

What spds are you using?


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## spence (24 Apr 2010)

Keep at it, build confidence and you'll wonder what you were worrying about. When you crash and you will you'll unclip without even noticing.
Got to the point now where I have to be clipped in, can't ride "properly" otherwise.


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## Steve H (25 Apr 2010)

Thanks guys. Sounds like the consensus is clearly that using the clipless pedals is ultimately the best place to be.

I think I just need to get myself a lot more off-road riding experience first. Taking so many tumbles on one trip (even though at low speed) is simply going to kill my confidence.

Think I will need to switch back to regular pedals for a month or so, and ride a lot more off road. Then when I've got the basics in better shape, I can put the clipless pedals back on again.



> What spds are you using?



I have Shimano M424 SPD Pedals and dhb M1 MTB Shoes from Wiggle.co.uk.

Thanks

Steve


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## GrumpyGregry (25 Apr 2010)

SPD's take practise to get used to, persevere with them, back the tension on the springs off, and practise clipping in and out. It soon becomes second nature.

When mountain biking, if you ain't fallin' off you ain't tryin' hard enough. Not actually true but you get the drift, learn to love, and laugh at, 'offs' as they are a fact of life off road.


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## lukesdad (25 Apr 2010)

Steve dont switch back, youd be better off slowly building up the level of terrain your riding. Have you got a local ride thats fairly easy but you can do a few little detours where you can practice you tech skills. Stick with SPDs you wont regret it.


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## Kirstie (25 Apr 2010)

It does depend on the type of SPDs you have. The really cheap 15 quid a pair ones will jam up at the slightest hint of mud and dust. If you pay a bit more for the more stripped down SPDs then they don't tend to jam in the mud.

For British mtbing I much prefer eggbeaters. They take more looking after than SPDs because you need to inject grease into them once in a while, but they shed mud much better than SPDs and you can get into them 4 ways rather than the 2 of SPDs. They are far more reliable in terms of performance as long as you look after them.

The biggest mtb I have ridden (freeride with northshore, airs, drops and jumps and alpine style riding) I did on flats and pins with skate shoes. I wouldn't dare ride anything like that on SPDs because of the need to bail at short notice.


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## GrumpyGregry (25 Apr 2010)

iirc Shimano have two basic mtb style spd mechanisms. One derives from old style xtr's and the other from the DX BMX style spd+platform pedals. The DX variants are much more open and thus less prone to jamming with mud. CRC were selling one of variants recently for £18.ymmv.


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## Kirstie (25 Apr 2010)

The non-platform SPDs come in different versions. The more expensive kind are more stripped down and are less prone to jamming.


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## stewlewis (25 Apr 2010)

The 424 pedals are by far my faves.
As mentioned, loosen the cleat tension screws, infront of the cleat clip on the pedals, don't take em all the way out.

The 424 are great you can use them unclipped and the clip pedal will flatten under foot.

Stick with them though, there's no going back from SPDs for me. Just the thought of childhood BMX bear trap in shins scares me enough.

The 424s are the same as Shimano 520s with a lightweight resin cage.

http://www.cyclingcloseouts.com/images/products/large/PD6465.jpg


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## Steve H (25 Apr 2010)

Wow - such strength of opinion! I don't think I dare take the clip-less pedals off now!

Not sure the type of pedals is going to make any difference to me whatsoever though. What I lack is balance. And as a 6'5, 18 stone bloke, I have a high centre of gravity.

I think the key to success is going to be getting plenty of miles in so I get a lot more strength in the legs and lose a few pounds.

I also like the advice of building up the technicality of the terrain gradually. Think I bit off a bit too hard a course yesterday. I need to build it up steadily.


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## GilesM (26 Apr 2010)

Steve, as everyone else has mentioned, stick with the SPDs, they really are the business, you can try reducing the spring tension a wee bit, make sure you can't pull the cleat off the pedal when riding normally, but make it easy to bail out if needed, after a while you will release your feet from the pedals instinctively, I had an over the bars moment about a year ago, some how my feet realeased and I managed to jump off the bike as I was going over and land on my feet, no idea how, pure instinct and a good bit of luck. Just stick with it, you'll soon get used to the pedals and your off road skills will improve. I ride Shimano XTRs, they are expensive, but bullet proof, and clipping in and out is so easy and smooth, however much mud there is. If you are having a few too many falls, you could always consider a bit of body armour, it could help build you confidence.

I agree with Kirsty about some riding, I wouldn't ride highish and narrow north shore with SPDs, that could end in tears.


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## GrumpyGregry (26 Apr 2010)

M647, M424, M545 are all a combination of a traditional mtb spd mechanism and a platform, perfect for free ride, unlike old style platformless spuds, Unclip and keep pedaling, not always easy with xtr and similar. 

These spud+platforms are darned handy as well for those gnarly bits of real life, on the street, in the mountains, outside the trail park, when you want/need to ride unclipped for a bit (or aren't wearing spd shoes)

best of both worlds imo. unless you want to all tourist/commuter and use M324's

Steve, 'high centre of gravity' LOL fwiw I'm 3 inches shorter and a bit lighter than you - and as clumsy as a drunk when sober. I use 647's off road. Stick with it.


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## RedBike (26 Apr 2010)

I can't ride without spds, they compensate for so many bad habits. Without spds my feet bounce off the pedals and I can't bunnyhop the bike.


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## MikeO (26 Apr 2010)

Hi Steve, I fitted some SPD's to my bike, managed to last a week without a tumble. Didn't do any off-road with them, just a short ride into work. I got a false sense of security with them, and thought yep, i've got these things sussed...How wrong I was lol !

The problem that I had is that I work as a postie, and that from about 9.50am till about 2pm each day, i'm riding my Royal Mail 'Boneshaker'...fine...until the ride home on my new Specialized Rockhopper with my nice shiny chrome Shimano SPD's

I stopped at a set of lights, rode across to the bit of road just before the island...and totally forgot I had my feet locked into my SPD's...what a horrible feeling that was...and a bus had only just passed me, I was quite lucky to say the least...a couple of people looked over in horror, but to tell the truth I was so embarrassed I couldn't get to my feet quick enough !!

My wife said...I knew you'd have an accident with them pedals, she was right though. I then ordered some DMR V12 Flat pedals, and I must say they stick like glue, I love them. I loved riding with my SPD's, I will go back to them, but probably when I get a little more experience, and only off-road.


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## fossyant (26 Apr 2010)

Clipless is the only way......XT SPD's on my MTB and Fixed.... and if they can resist 'fixed' riding then they are the danglies.....

Look on a road bike.....nuf said...........


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## maurice (26 Apr 2010)

Just to go against the flow... I ride clipless all the time, mtb and road, but that was after getting used to mtb'ing with normal flat pedals. I've seen lots of people start using spd's before they've picked up basic mtb skills and the results are painful to watch.

In my opinion, go back to flats for a little while. Also never ride one foot clipped out - if you don't commit fully you're a lot more likely to fail.


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## AndyM78 (27 Apr 2010)

I keep a set of flats and a set of cleats i the shed, if i'm riding down the pub or going for a hack i use the flats so you can dab a toe when you need to but if i'm out for the day its spd's all the way. After you've got used to them its hard work without em!!


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## ultraviolet (27 Apr 2010)

i think it matters what kind of trails your riding; classic XC and SPD's are great, but, you start doing very technical trails and having both feet fixed to the bike and it can be a big problem


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## hotmetal (2 May 2010)

I've got a pair of casual non-bike-looking grey suede Shimano shoes and a pair of race shoes, both with cleats, so all my bikes have Crank Bros Candys or similar. If I'm going to the shops/work/pub the grey shoes do fine on my hack. When hitting the mountainbike area of Bracknell (Swinley) Forest, or on my road bike, the race shoes come out. However, the lads I ride with are getting into ever more gnarly trails and have converted to flats, so I'm considering some platform pedals with clips in the middle (Mallets) for my Jekyll when we're going more tech or gravity than old school xc. 

Years ago all my xc was done with XT platform pedals and the old style of clips/straps. I've not ridden off-road without some sort of clip or clipless system since 1990, I think I can remember slipping off the pedals and clouting my family jewels on the top tube too many times. If you want an idea of 'Pavlovian conditioning', "a couple of achers" is deterrent enough from riding with flat pedals IMO. But like I say, the DH and jump brigade are all on flats now, so I reckon platforms with clips is the way forward.


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## Steve H (3 May 2010)

Well - you'll be pleased to know that I stuck with the clip-less pedals. We went out again today and did some off-roading over on Baildon Moor near Bradford. The terrain was a little bit easier than last week, but still quite challenging for me. I just tried to attack the tougher bits a bit more. The extra momentum just helps to ride out the bumps a bit more and makes it a bit easier to balance.

There were a couple of bits where I got off and walked, because either it was too steep (uphill) or just too bouldery, but overall an excellent session. 2 hours well spent!


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## Cubist (3 May 2010)

Always worth persevering. I lost a bit of confidence since I broke my vertebrae last year, but it's coming back now, and now I can ride in daylight and actually see where I'm going.....!!!!

Steve

There's a couple of MTB clubs near you , one meets in Brighouse, (sorry, don't have details, but I seem to remember they meet at the Boy and Barrel) or there's Pedalsport that meet at Elland Cricket Club on a Thursday at 7pm. Rides out for a couple of hours ranging from Serious to Seriously Sociable (ie ride at the pace of the slowest, aim to have fun not be a hero!)


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## frank9755 (7 May 2010)

I use SPDs with platforms. As a relative beginner at mountain biking, I always unclip either one or both feet and flip the pedals over before a difficult bit. 

I was out in Wales with some friends last weekend. Two of the guys were very experienced but one was similar to me. He stayed clipped in all the time and had perhaps five painful falls over the weekend! None ended in a real injury but they could have done. 

If clipped in all the time I would certainly have had a couple of falls too. Until my skills and experience improve I'm going to carry on unclipping for the more hazardous bits.


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## speshy (13 May 2010)

I ride the purbecks in dorset.. plenty of big hills...
clipped in is the only way to go ..... imho


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## marzjennings (13 May 2010)

ultraviolet said:


> i think it matters what kind of trails your riding; classic XC and SPD's are great, but, you start doing very technical trails and having both feet fixed to the bike and it can be a big problem



I find it's the opposite, the rockier the trail the more I like to know my feet aren't going to be thrown off the pedals. Even for downhill I prefer to be clipped in. The only time I ride flats is for hitting the jumps where I may want to bail mid flight.


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## Steve Austin (14 May 2010)

I rode bmx and then MTB for a good ten years without anything more than a good set of grippy pedals and some trainers. I always swore that clipped pedals was a silly idea.
After finally relenting and buying some clip pedals, i can't imagine ever riding unclipped again.
jumps, black runs, wet dry, its always in clips


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## lukesdad (15 May 2010)

Don t think he s quite ready for black runs yet Steve BTW I use time atac love em.


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## Scrawf (2 Jun 2010)

Its quite scary.....


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