# Struggling To Make Any Gains



## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

I have been cycling quite a lot since May last year, I have done 30 miles every single week minimum since then and more recently I have been doing 50 plus miles a week and over 100 for a couple of those weeks. 

I don’t seem to be getting any better though could it be that cycling just isn’t for me? I put in a lot of effort and I’m always out there doing it and I just don’t get much faster and can’t really go much further.

I ride my MTB mostly on road for 98% of my training and I do have a drop bar bike I intend to start using soon it’s a Zwift machine at the moment.

When I started again in May I was doing 10-11mph averages and I managed to get up to high 13’s by October but since then I’ve struggled to get to 12mph averages. No matter what I do I can’t seem to be able to do more than around 30 miles in one ride.

There’s people I know who cycle and they don’t put in half the effort week by week as I do but they are quite a lot faster than me and can knock out 50/60 mile rides without much issue. 

Its frustrating I want to get good at cycling and I’m putting about all the hours in I possibly can but it isn’t happening.

I do suffer from an illness which effects my ability to absorb nutrients but with all the effort I put in surly I should be getting better at cycling?

On the plus side I have gone from about 87kg down to 75kg so it hasn’t all been in vain.

Should I give up?

My Strava https://www.strava.com/athletes/9164675


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## vickster (22 Mar 2018)

Don’t give up. The cold weather sucks, harder to ride through cold air and in cold wind but you’ll reap the rewards for persevering in the spring and summer. Get on the roadbike, no need not to. Dump the computer game  Join a club

Most are slower in winter, some of us aren’t worried about speed. Focus on time in the saddle, then distance, speed has too many variables


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## Lavender Rose (22 Mar 2018)

Yes, the MTB will suck a lot of your 'gains' I found switching to Hybrid and then a road bike made me enjoy it so much more - I felt faster and that I could achieve more.

I do other exercise as well as cycling which helps make me faster. Maybe try another activity as well? x


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## derrick (22 Mar 2018)

Ditch the mountain bike, get on your road bike, Join a club or ride with others that will be a big help. just keep going.


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## Joffey (22 Mar 2018)

Get out on your road bike, you'll have immediate gains.


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## kingrollo (22 Mar 2018)

me too !

Just console your with.......errr.....actually....well something or other !


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## I like Skol (22 Mar 2018)

Crikey! Lots of things to discuss from your post.....
1st, what makes you think you are slow and why do you want to go faster?
I think I am pretty quick for a non-competitive rider who doesn't train. I typically ride with averages around 15-17mph on my commuter hybrid and road bikes. Probably would be a bit slower than that on my MTB with knobbly tyres on so I guess 13-15mph on an MTB road ride? This sounds just like you so I would say you are really pretty quick in reality.
Who are these people who are quicker than you? Do they ride with you? Do they ride similar bikes to you? How are you judging 'faster'?

My guess is they are all riding fast road bikes when you are on a knobbly shod MTB or you are just being wound up by their BS claims.... "Oh yeah, We always average 22mph, even up hill"

Get your Kona Jake out on the roads on some fat slick tyres and see your speeds jump, that bike should put a smile on your face everytime you turn the pedals. Also focus on enjoying your rides and worry about the speed another time. It is supposed to be fun and if you ain't enjoying it then you won't keep it up.

How tall are you? losing 12kg is a hell of a drop and if you are forcing weight loss and not eating properly/sufficiently then you will be struggling for speed and stamina anyway. You can't knock out big miles when you are starving yourself. I'm 6' 1" and 96kg so I'm not a lightweight but I have the power to beat a lot of people up the hills. There is always a risk that any weight loss you achieve might actually be loss of muscle so be careful if you are ruthlessly trying to get the pounds off.


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## ozboz (22 Mar 2018)

Would your illness be Coeliac ?
if it is there are ways around it , 
but keep it up , your doing as good as I am speed wise , I get all kinds of riders bomb past me ,even little kids on 3 wheelers ! 
, 
as said , a hybrid with 700 c wheels and low resistance tyres will help big time ,


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## vickster (22 Mar 2018)

ozboz said:


> Would your illness be Coeliac ?
> if it is there are ways around it ,
> but keep it up , your doing as good as I am speed wise , I get all kinds of riders bomb past me ,even little kids on 3 wheelers !
> ,
> as said , a hybrid with 700 c wheels and low resistance tyres will help big time ,


He has a drop bar, no need for a hybrid, a tyre change might help tho depending


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## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

Thanks for all your thoughts and advice.

I think I will be faster on the road bike but I was wanting to be faster on the mountain bike first so I could compare to how I started.

One lad I work with did a 14.9 average on his MTB on a similar route to me but he’s only 18 I’m 32 so I’m not to worried about that

There’s 2 blokes I work with who cycle but they are elitists don’t give me any encouragement and anything I achieve doesn’t count to them for one reason or another! I always ride on my own as for some reason they don’t want to include me. Basically I want to be able to kick their asses on the bike but I’m way off one of them occasionally rides his MTB at over 14mph average and describes it as a “relaxing ride”

The weight loss is just a bi product of my cycling its not why I do it and my eating habits have not really changed.


Aa for my illness I had my colon completely removed due to having ulcerative colitis about 5 years ago, more details in my welcome thread on that 


https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/new-here-my-cycling-story.227180/


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## I like Skol (22 Mar 2018)

Sounds like you are doing great then. Don't beat yourself up over others BS and concentrate on enjoying your rides.


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## si_c (22 Mar 2018)

As @I like Skol has already been said, a whole lot of stuff going on here! 

I think you are doing much better than you think you are. You've lost quite a bit of weight, so chances are you're running a calorie deficit, which is going to impact how hard you can ride. Secondly, 12-13mph on an MTB, in Winter is pretty good, you want to look at your average speeds month by month, rather than ride by ride, and see how you're improving that way. So when May comes around, look at your average speed for May this year with last, and I can guarantee you'll see a big improvement.

In winter, the cold air means it's actually harder to ride than during summer. My average speed has historically been about 1-2mph lower in winter than it is in summer, so you need to keep that in mind, my speed starts to tail off from around the end of October until around now when it starts to warm up! I think you'll find that as the spring and summer come around that your speed will go up noticeably. A lot of people put their bikes away when the weather gets cold, so well done on keeping going through winter!

As for comparing yourself to people from work, it's great to have goals, and I've found that riding with people who are stronger than me is a good way to encourage improvement, but you do run the risk of getting disheartened! 

If I can give a bit of advice, just get out and enjoy your rides, don't worry too much about how you are riding and how fast, just enjoy being outdoors. If you really want to punish yourself and raise your fitness, the turbo trainer and zwift are actually great ways of doing it. Do an FTP test (this will hurt) and do some of the workouts, say a from the 4week ftp builder plan. Do this in addition to your regular outdoor rides, which you can consider "active recovery" , it'll hurt a lot if you're doing it right, but it's focused training and will actually help a lot.

Lastly, get out on the road bike, it's feeling all sad and lonely in the house!


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## Drago (22 Mar 2018)

I'm with Skol - its good to have targets and strive to improve, but don't lose sight of the fact that cycling is simply a fun thing to do!

Try this;

Instead of looking at average speeds etc, create some sectors on your favourite rides and time yourself. Nothing too long, maybe a mile, say that junction by the post box to the wonky telegraph pole at the tip of the hill? That sort of thing. 

Once you know your typical average time for these sectors, start attacking them. Its psychologically quite rewarding to make an improvement, even of just a second. You won't beat your best time every ride, but by trying you will improve, you'll get fitter, your average speed will rise.

Small, realistically attainable goals. Suddenly, before you know it, you're getting better.

I'm working towards running a 5 minute mile. For most of my runs - anywhere from 3 to 9 miles - I just wobble round trying not to look like I'm about to die. However, if I'm feeling good then the final mile is the one I push. I've a long way to go yet, but I'm down to 6:04, and every week or two sees a few seconds shaved off.

In summary, enjoy your ride, but when on one of your imaginary short sectors go hell for leather for a mile, and then back off and enjoy the ride. Short, sharp, easily attainable.

Let me know if you ever come up Salcey Forest way and i''ll join you for a lap or two.

Good luck.


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## vickster (22 Mar 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Sounds like you are doing great then. Don't beat yourself up over others BS and concentrate on enjoying your rides.


This, ignore the Work nobbers 

Or find a ride buddy who's slower than you...works for me...maybe less so for @jefmcg


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## Jody (22 Mar 2018)

I would just ride and enjoy what you are doing. No point in looking to deep into stats as you don't know how long the other people have been riding. There are so many variables to average speeds that I would just concentrate on pushing as hard as you feel comfortable and the gains will come to you. You might be both doing a similar loop on MTB's but a light weight carbon hard tail on semi slicks at high pressure is going to be a lot quicker than a 6" full suss on low pressure draggy nobblies. Add to that wind resistance, how you feel on the day, diet, training regimes etc and you can see where the times differences come from.

I like Drago's idea for concentrating on segments. It adds fun and helps push out of your confort zone

You have only been riding a year so don't beat yourself up and keep at it!


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## mjr (22 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> I have been cycling quite a lot since May last year, I have done 30 miles every single week minimum since then and more recently I have been doing 50 plus miles a week and over 100 for a couple of those weeks.
> 
> I don’t seem to be getting any better though could it be that cycling just isn’t for me? I put in a lot of effort and I’m always out there doing it and I just don’t get much faster and can’t really go much further.


Well, you're probably not going to be winning many all-comers races, but as for whether it's for you: are you enjoying it?



Lozi said:


> There’s people I know who cycle and they don’t put in half the effort week by week as I do but they are quite a lot faster than me and can knock out 50/60 mile rides without much issue.
> 
> Its frustrating I want to get good at cycling and I’m putting about all the hours in I possibly can but it isn’t happening.


And then there's the likes of me, who can do 50/60 miles OK (as long as I can have a good sleep at some point) but I'm slower than you. Does that mean I'm bad at cycling? Oh well, I don't care what you think - I'm having fun, enjoying the view, going places, experiencing stuff 



Lozi said:


> I do suffer from an illness which effects my ability to absorb nutrients but with all the effort I put in surly I should be getting better at cycling?


Maybe you're overdoing it. Are you still under specialist care and can you consult them about it?


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## gbb (22 Mar 2018)

30 miles a week....its not a lot really (without meaning to discourage or put you down) .
Most of us will settle to an average and it won' change much for years without some serious work. For about 8 to 10 years I averaged 15 to 16 average on 50 mile rides on a roadbike, it never varied much. Only when I started really pushing, seriously, did it slowly edge up.(mind I was probably 45 to 50 by then)

What distances are each ride ?..is it one 30 miler or a few shorter rides a week

Do you commute by bike ?, I always found that a great opportunity to push things along on shorter rides.

In short, more miles, harder pace, more frequent rides but not too frequent at first (don' overdo it in other words, let yourself recover)...theres no shortcut IME but you sound as though you have the desire, use it while its there.

As said up post, winter doesn' help, it' harder to get muscles going, spring and summer will see you improve anyway.


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## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

Thanks for all your reply’s very informative and a lot to take in!

There are a few segments I have been attacking recently but I cant Maintain a big effort for as long as I would like, I guess that will improve.

It’s interesting all has been said about winter I have been riding in the dark and feeezing cold for most of it so I can see now that’s got to be a big factor, maybe it will improve with the weather I did creep back towards 13’s this week.

I’m not under eating at all or actively trying to lose weight if I stopped cycling tomorrow I would probably pile it all back in a month I think I’m towards the higher end of ideal weight for my height now.

The reason I cycle is to try and gain fitness after a few years of operations and horrible health and also I’m all about the numbers, if it wasnt for Strava and mileage goals I wouldn’t be on the bike at all it’s all about trying to achieve something for me. 

Illness wise I feel the best I have since I became ill the cycling etc seems to help that.

I’m doing minimum 50 miles a week now sometimes over 100 I did 133 a few weeks ago, my rides are generally minimum 10 miles but often around 15-20. The max I do in one go is around 30 as that’s as far as I seem to be able to go.

My goal for the summer is do a 14mph average on one of the regular local routes and achieve a 50 mile ride. The only reason I’d like to beat my eliteest colleagues is because there attitude towards me doing more miles than them is pretty poor because I don’t wear the lycra etc i don’t count. Would be satisfying to get quick considering they laugh at the prospect of that!

I have started doing zwift workouts etc and did perform an FTP test (was horrible lol) I have to say 30 mins of zwift I feel like I’ve done 2 hours outside on the road lol

I guess I’ll keep plugging away and get the road bike out when the weather perks up maybe it will all come good lol


Thanks


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## vickster (22 Mar 2018)

Why not go join a local club?


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## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

vickster said:


> Why not go join a local club?





The only couple I know of one of them seems very serious all really fast guys and one of the local shops does group rides etc but there idea of a slow pace is around 16mph average lol


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## vickster (22 Mar 2018)

@biggs682 is near you, maybe he can help


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## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

That’s really hilly compared to what do I did a 32 mile ride a couple weeks ago that was 1565ft elevation gain I think I’d be literally dead after your route lol

Your experience is interesting as most people say it never gets easier you just get faster.


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## si_c (22 Mar 2018)

Overall, sounds to me like you're doing fine! You've got a good attitude, and as a numbers guy, I totally get why you find that motivating. Just keep doing what you're doing. Set yourself small achievable goals, like @Drago said, and you'll find yourself coming along in no time. Especially with the good weather around the corner, I find that endlessly motivating to get out!


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## Soltydog (22 Mar 2018)

Drago said:


> I'm with Skol - its good to have targets and strive to improve, but don't lose sight of the fact that cycling is simply a fun thing to do!



Top advice 

Riding with a good club will help improve your average speed, it's easier in a group if you are drafting others & your speed will easily increase by 2mph with the same effort, then you get used to get riding at that pace & you'll soon find you are riding a little faster on your own.
It's easy to get bogged down with stats, speed, distances etc, but as Drago says above all make sure you just enjoy your cycling. I'm on now on average 2-3mph slower (maybe more) than I was 2 years ago, but I'm enjoying my cycling more. I used to go out chasing KOMs etc on Strava & be so down when I got home when I'm not got PBs


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## BianchiVirgin (22 Mar 2018)

Yes keep at it! When I started out on MTB about 18 months back I literally walked at least all of the hills with the group I was starting with. It's a slog but a few months later I was riding them all. 

You're winning despite the fact the numbers may not immediately show it. A long distance on any MTB is not easy either so when you change to the road bike you'll be flying.


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## Lozi (22 Mar 2018)

Thanks guys when I started the thread I felt like I was really failing but maybe I’m not, maybe I’m expecting to much to be up to the pace of guys who have been riding many years in under 1 year.. there was a lad I knew who took up cycling and within months he was on pace with the quick guys at work without doing that many miles, or at least it seemed that way at the time maybe I just focus on negatives lol

I have never riden in a group so maybe when I get my road bike out (cyclocross bike with road tyres) I will find a group to ride with! Maybe the “slow” 16mph average Baines Racing (local shop) group rides aren’t as far away as I think when you consider drafting?


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## biggs682 (22 Mar 2018)

@Lozi i presume you are Towcester way ? I am over in Wellingborough .

You are more than welcome to come and join me on a ride or two either on the mtb or the road bike , but be warned i can go out quite early but do go out some evenings .

But imho i wouldn't worry about when i am out on one of my retro road bike i normally only average a max of 15 mph and quite often slower but i do stop often for pictures and a snoop around .

thanks @vickster


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## HLaB (22 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> The only couple I know of one of them seems very serious all really fast guys and one of the local shops does group rides etc but there idea of a slow pace is around 16mph average lol


I would worry too much about that, they're riding in a group and if not on the front they are doing 75% of the work; on their own they'll probably be struggling to 15mph. When I joined my first club the guidelines were 15mph and I held off until I could comfortably achieve that on my own. I wished I had joined earlier though as I quickly found out 15,16,17mph etc was relatively easy in a pack and the solo 15mph was harder.


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## PaulSB (22 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> The only couple I know of one of them seems very serious all really fast guys and one of the local shops does group rides etc but there idea of a slow pace is around 16mph average lol



There are as others have said many different factors so I’ll just mention my own experience which may help.

1. Always enjoy it. You seem to have the right approach and to enjoy your riding. Stay focused on enjoyment

2. Winter riding is always tougher for everyone no matter their ability. When the weather improves you will suddenly see the benefits of all those hard winter rides.

3. Get on your road bike. In my experience one reaches a point when the bike limits what one can achieve. Your MTB is probably holding you back.

4. Join this second group. Riding with a bunch is easier physically, the miles fly past and you won’t notice your speed.

5. Let this group know what you want to achieve. If you struggle to begin with if they are a decent bunch they wil help you. If they don’t help find a group or club that will

6. Moving up a level will spur you on just through the adrenaline of trying to keep in there. 18 months ago I made the jump to a faster, stronger group in my club. The average speed I was used to but this group also chucks in 5-6000 feet of climbs. I struggled for a month but soon found myself holding on. I’m still one of the last up the climbs but then I’m 20 years older than the majority. Challenge yourself in a group.

7. It is true that the only way to get better is to keep riding. It never stops hurting, you just go further and faster!!!

Good luck. I’d wager when the sun shines you’ll be back here to tell us how well the rides are going.


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## steveindenmark (23 Mar 2018)

"I want to get good at cycling"

I dont really know what that means.

Fast does not equate to good in my book. I have seen a lot of fast riders who are terrible cyclists. How they have stayed alive so long is a wonder.


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## biggs682 (23 Mar 2018)

steveindenmark said:


> "I want to get good at cycling"
> 
> I dont really know what that means.
> 
> Fast does not equate to good in my book. I have seen a lot of fast riders who are terrible cyclists. How they have stayed alive so long is a wonder.



To me i would rather have a couple of hours in and off the saddle trundling along stopping every so often for a look at the view or have a poke around something i have come across en route .

The guys & gals that want to go quicker and not stop are fine just let them go and do it , and how true are there figures


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## buzzy-beans (23 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> On the plus side I have gone from about 87kg down to 75kg so it hasn’t all been in vain.



I am one of those who knows exactly which route I am taking each and every time I go out, I also know exactly what distance it is and I know exactly what my fastest time has been and each and every time I attempt to push myself up onwards and through the black mist despite the fact that I am 69 years old. It is something I have always done in any physical one on one sport I have been involved in be that squash, swimming, cross country etc.

Some days when I go out I soon know when my entire self isn't in the correct frame of mind to crack a good time and that troubles me, it also quite often results in me giving up and simply returning home.

So why do I do it, well I so enjoy getting that buzz, that tingly feeling of achievement and knowing in my heart of hearts that my age hasn't won the battle of slowing me down!

But each to their own.


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## fungalcycle (23 Mar 2018)

If you keep pushing yourself you will soon start hating bicycling. Relax, throw those stupid counters away and any system that "measures" you, and try to just enjoy yourself along with the bike.
The choice of the bike may be a wise functional decision, but given what you have, you know better what you have more fun on. That is what will keep you on the bike more and longer.
If on the other hand you just chose bicycling for exercise alone, I suggest you give it up and get a gym card. It is like single-handing sailing in the southern oceans. You don't do it for exercise.
After a year and some months in crutches getting back on the bicycle is not prescribed by the bio-medical-industrial complex. I don't mind limping, but I couldn't live without wheels, and that is not a wheelchair.

Your relation to "the bike" is something that grows when it is the right bike and it is tuned well. It becomes part of your body and doesn't feel like exercise anymore. You get to the point where you get up from bed and need to use the restroom and feel like getting there with the bike.

Anyway, that's how I feel about it.


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## Lozi (23 Mar 2018)

Thanks for the offer @biggs682  one of the blokes at work who cycles is from Wellingborough way and I always here him say there’s some good routes over there.

I will rephrase the “good at cycling” line, I want to get fast at cycling!

Each to their own when it comes to why you cycle but without the numbers I wouldn’t do it I enjoy pushing myself to go further or faster I would not enjoy going out and cruising about especially on my own maybe that would be different with somebody else but if the miles weren’t logged it would feel to me like I’ve wasted my time. Like I say each to their own.

Group rides seem to be a good idea many people on this thread have mentioned so I will let ok into that. I know Silverstone circuit (which is only a couple miles from me) put on cycling sessions around the circuit sometimes maybe I’ll do them.

Thanks again it’s good to hear other people experiences!


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## vickster (23 Mar 2018)

A group ride isn’t just a ride around a racing circuit 

I think as said upthread 30 miles a week won’t make you a stronger or faster cyclist, Zwift might get you fitter but it is very unlikely to make you faster on the roads. A lighter bike on slick tyres might help a bit, I’m pretty much the same on any bike tho, probably because I ride the same heavily trafficked roads

Avoiding anywhere with traffic, lights, junctions is also key to getting a higher average speed. Go out early or late when there’s less traffic

Seriously, try a club, go out with a 15mph group that has a no drop rule. I’m sure somewhere locally there’ll be a ride going out early on Sat or Sun. Get the bike off the turbo and try (look up the basics of group riding first tho)


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## I like Skol (23 Mar 2018)

I really can't over emphasise the effect of riding in a group for helping you increase your speed & distances. It isn't just the drag of being in other's slip stream but the atmosphere of the group ride that pulls you along mentally. The distraction of talking to other riders, watching how other riders ride, passing & being passed and focussing on other riders position in relation to you just takes your mind of the speed, distance and tiredness that normally fills your mind and stops you performing at your best.

Go out and ride a 100 miles on your own and it is a huge distance! Go out and ride that with a large group or on one of the charity/sportive type events and the day just flies by and before you know it you are at the end of a great day and 'how did that happen?' 100 miles under your belt.


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## mgs315 (23 Mar 2018)

Here here for group riding. Going with a group that may appear to go pretty quick isn’t actually as daunting as it seems once you start pedalling. Especially if the group is seen as one of the entry level groups as it’ll cater for a wider ability set of riders. This will help a lot if you aren’t too strong at climbing too as they’ll hang about or assist you up those hills. Also on the flat you’ll be surprised how easier it can be to keep up if you’re sheltered in the wind.

Whilst I can find a blast of 25-30 miles at 15mph or so solo pretty damn knackering, the same distance and pace is vaguely noticeable when sheltering in a group having a chat. Even more so when it’s windy out! 

It’s also when I’m after a bang for buck session I prefer to go solo as I can knacker myself quicker!


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## Lozi (23 Mar 2018)

You say 30 miles a week (I do more than that now) won’t make you a stronger or faster cyclist but I was definitely stronger and faster after doing that for 6 months. Obviously if I spent 1000’s on a new bike etc I would be moving faster but I personally wouldn’t be faster the bike would.

I wasn’t really much faster last time I rode my road bike for some reason but I expect that to be different now.

The race circuit ride is not a race it is just a few hours of fun for people without traffic so I think that would be pretty good. What worries me about the clubs is I don’t wear all the gear and they all do I guess, I don’t even wear a helmet currently so I’d probably have to buy one (I know this splits opinion)


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> You say 30 miles a week (I do more than that now) won’t make you a stronger or faster cyclist but I was definitely stronger and faster after doing that for 6 months. Obviously if I spent 1000’s on a new bike etc I would be moving faster but I personally wouldn’t be faster the bike would.



Pretty much. This is a problem with any sport where equipment makes a tangible difference.



> I wasn’t really much faster last time I rode my road bike for some reason but I expect that to be different now.



Keep in mind that when changing from one bike to another, or adjusting your position on the bike, it will take some time to adapt and to gain the confidence you had before again - this could result in a loss of speed. I wasn't massively quicker moving from an MTB to a road bike, in part because my position was relatively aggressive to start with.



> The race circuit ride is not a race it is just a few hours of fun for people without traffic so I think that would be pretty good. What worries me about the clubs is I don’t wear all the gear and they all do I guess, I don’t even wear a helmet currently so I’d probably have to buy one (I know this splits opinion)



Don't worry about clothes. Seriously. The first 100mile ride I did, I did in Nike running shorts, a t-shirt and a big hoodie, you don't need it to ride your bike. There is an argument that dedicated cycling gear is more comfortable - and I'd certainly agree with that point - but it is not necessary.

As for helmets, wear one if you want, don't wear one if you don't, there is no real evidence either way - there is a helmet thread on this forum in the advocacy and safety section, but be aware there are strong opinions - however some organisations putting on rides may require one as a condition of entry, so as with any Ts&Cs you have to abide by them if you want to play.


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## Lozi (23 Mar 2018)

Yeah I have a flouro MTB top I wear and some gloves but other than that I just wear normal stuff, I figured a helmet may be required for some rides I should have one I guess for that reason at least.

I just looked at the club in my town who I thought were pro and it seems they actually do cater for all sorts so I might give them a go.

Thanks all


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## I like Skol (23 Mar 2018)

si_c said:


> however some organisations putting on rides may require one as a condition of entry, so as with any Ts&Cs you have to abide by them if you want to play.


I have a helmet tucked away in a dark cupboard just for that very reason. It seems bizarre when I say it but I occasionally pay good money to join rides on open public roads where I am forced to wear a helmet as part of the conditions of entry! 

EDIT: I only wear it once or twice a year


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

I like Skol said:


> I have a helmet tucked away in a dark cupboard just for that very reason. It seems bizarre when I say it but I occasionally pay good money to join rides on open public roads where I am forced to wear a helmet as part of the conditions of entry!
> 
> EDIT: I only wear it once or twice a year



Same, I have an MTB helmet I sometimes wear when out MTBing with Mrs C, who can be quite irrational sometimes about helmets.


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## I like Skol (23 Mar 2018)

si_c said:


> Same, I have an MTB helmet I sometimes wear when out MTBing with Mrs C, who can be quite irrational sometimes about helmets.


Yebbut, didn't you manage to fall off on the bimble to Scarborough?


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Yebbut, didn't you manage to fall off on the bimble to Scarborough?



That wasn't a fall, and I wasn't bimbling! I made the decision that if I was going to go sideways into a ditch at speed that I'd rather do it whilst not attached to the bike. Of course the going sideways and the ditch were out of my control.


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## mjr (23 Mar 2018)

biggs682 said:


> The guys & gals that want to go quicker and not stop are fine just let them go and do it , and how true are there figures


Not very true. If you want to increase your average speed, the easiest way is to minimise the time you spend between flat-out and your autopause threshold. There are limits to how high you can set your autopause to before the competition sites complain, so the safer approach is to charge up to every junction, emergency stop at the latest possible moment, then sprint back up to full speed as soon as you can - which will be fine until you misjudge "the latest possible moment"  and then it will hurt. Lots. And yet, I still see people cycling like that. I expected it to die off (hopefully not literally) once Strava wasn't new, but there seem to be more Straviots every year. It's nice there are more people cycling but crikey!



Dogtrousers said:


> Try not to compare yourself with others. There's always someone faster. You are infinitely faster than someone sat on a settee eating crisps.


Some say that if it's not on Strava, it didn't happen, so no-one is sat on a settee eating crisps. 



Lozi said:


> Each to their own when it comes to why you cycle but without the numbers I wouldn’t do it I enjoy pushing myself to go further or faster I would not enjoy going out and cruising about especially on my own maybe that would be different with somebody else but if the miles weren’t logged it would feel to me like I’ve wasted my time. Like I say each to their own.


I'm a bit worried by that in at least two ways: firstly, you've been ill, so at least try to compare your numbers with some sort of acknowledgement of that - I don't know if there are communities on Strava for illnesses which might help; secondly, we are all ultimately on a long slide into the grave  so at some point, further or faster is probably going to stop unless you go out with a bang, which ain't exactly good either - and if you stop cycling when it's not further or faster any more, you'll probably slide faster, so I hope before then you find other reasons to ride.



Lozi said:


> What worries me about the clubs is I don’t wear all the gear and they all do I guess, I don’t even wear a helmet currently so I’d probably have to buy one (I know this splits opinion)


There are some that are all the gear and probably more that are "all the gear and no idea", but there are also plenty which wear whatever (mix of lycra, old-fashioned and nothing in particular in the one I ride with - and sometimes we've worn capes, sackcloth, wellies, cardboard, ...  )

As for helmets, Cycling UK Member Groups are not allowed to force (some have tried but HQ seem to act on complaints), CUK Affiliates and I think Sustrans groups are discouraged (but some still do), Cyclenation groups mostly don't and British Cycling clubs aren't required to except for mass start racing, but I've only seen ones that force, although I think they're still not allowed to force time triallists but there have been repeated attempts to change it so that may have changed. That's just the current summary from memory. If anyone has updates or wants to discuss it, please post on https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-cyclechat-helmet-debate-thread.187059/


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## biggs682 (23 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> Thanks for the offer @biggs682  one of the blokes at work who cycles is from Wellingborough way and I always here him say there’s some good routes over there.



Yeah some quite nice routes this way , the offer is always there if you fancy a change of scenery


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

mjr said:


> Not very true. If you want to increase your average speed, the easiest way is to minimise the time you spend between flat-out and your autopause threshold. There are limits to how high you can set your autopause to before the competition sites complain, so the safer approach is to charge up to every junction, emergency stop at the latest possible moment, then sprint back up to full speed as soon as you can - which will be fine until you misjudge "the latest possible moment"  and then it will hurt. Lots. And yet, I still see people cycling like that. I expected it to die off (hopefully not literally) once Strava wasn't new, but there seem to be more Straviots every year. It's nice there are more people cycling but crikey!



I've seen a couple of people like this on my commute, the sad thing is despite rocking up to every junction with their back wheel floating into the air, they're still not that quick over distance, as they haven't worked out it's better to coast up to the junction and not have to stop at all.


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## mjr (23 Mar 2018)

si_c said:


> I've seen a couple of people like this on my commute, the sad thing is despite rocking up to every junction with their back wheel floating into the air, they're still not that quick over distance, as they haven't worked out it's better to coast up to the junction and not have to stop at all.


Depends if you're concerned about real speed or Strava average, surely?


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

mjr said:


> Depends if you're concerned about real speed or Strava average, surely?


When commuting, I want to get to work as quickly as possible with the least effort possible.


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## Ming the Merciless (23 Mar 2018)

si_c said:


> When commuting, I want to get to work as quickly as possible with the least effort possible.



I am the opposite. My cycle commutes often end up extended as I am enjoying the riding so much.


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## si_c (23 Mar 2018)

YukonBoy said:


> I am the opposite. My cycle commutes often end up extended as I am enjoying the riding so much.


I have trouble getting up in the morning, so I usually am running late. In the evenings I will extend it out and take the scenic route home, providing I've not got something else booked in.


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## roadrash (23 Mar 2018)

Ignore the nob eds that taunt you at work , (that's exactly what they are from your description of their behaviour) can I ask, as you say you only cycle for the numbers and to see improvement, what do you intend to do when you become as good as you can be, when there are no more improvements to be made ,you reach your limit so to speak,
personally I reached my limits some time ago and just simply accepted that others can cycle faster , and/or further than me, some less so, but it certainly doesn't mean there is no enjoyment in cycling for me , theres loads of it. I honestly hope you find what it is your seeking from cycling.


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## Lozi (23 Mar 2018)

@roadrash thats a good question, I guess ill just be a knob head to people who are struggling 

I’ll probably just carry on the main number I go for is miles covered so that is relevant no matter how fast or slow I am I set myself a goal of 1000 last year and I got 1255, this year I have set 2000 as my goal and I’m at nearly 800 already. I am not expecting to become a record breaking cyclist I just felt I should be abit further along than I am but it seems maybe not. As people have said winter has played its part on disheartening me.

I’d love to be able to do a sportif one day!


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## vickster (23 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> @roadrash thats a good question, I guess ill just be a knob head to people who are struggling
> 
> I’ll probably just carry on the main number I go for is miles covered so that is relevant no matter how fast or slow I am I set myself a goal of 1000 last year and I got 1255, this year I have set 2000 as my goal and I’m at nearly 800 already. I am not expecting to become a record breaking cyclist I just felt I should be abit further along than I am but it seems maybe not. As people have said winter has played its part on disheartening me.
> 
> I’d love to be able to do a sportif one day!


If you can ride 100+ miles a week, you can do a sportive, they come in lots of different lengths and toughness and none are a race


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## Lozi (23 Mar 2018)

vickster said:


> If you can ride 100+ miles a week, you can do a sportive, they come in lots of different lengths and toughness and none are a race



The full length for a sportive is usually 100 isn’t it? I can’t go more than 30 currently my legs start to give up at around 20


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## vickster (23 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> The full length for a sportive is usually 100 isn’t it? I can’t go more than 30 currently my legs start to give up at around 20


They have different lengths. Try slowing down and you’ll be able to go further. Stamina first then speed


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## PaulSB (24 Mar 2018)

TBH I’m now struggling with this. It seems the enjoyment and satisfaction you take from cycling is entirely from the statistics you achieve, distance, speed etc. I understand this in the sense I like to get better but it has nothing to do with why I cycle.

If all you want to do is go further faster these are your options:

1. Get on a road bike
2. Work out some challenging routes which will take 1.5 - 2 hours to ride
3. Ride these routes as hard as you can. Give it everything and be very, very tired when you get home.
4. Over the months you’ll go faster

This works for me when I have a challenge or target to achieve. I enjoy training to help me achieve something but it’s not my motivation for cycling.

To go further faster you simply have to train and push yourself hard.


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## buzzy-beans (24 Mar 2018)

Those many years back (at the age of 39) when I was entered into the London-Brighton and when I hadn't ridden any bike at all for 19 years and yet I had set myself what most people thought was the ridiculous target time of under 2.5 hours for the 54 miles.
All of my training during the 6 short weeks before the event were done against predetermined speeds/times over ever increasing distances so as to ensure my body was accustomed to the cadence rates.

As far as I am concerned speed can only come by having set and ruthlessly applied goals!


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## Julia9054 (24 Mar 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Yebbut, didn't you manage to fall off on the bimble to Scarborough?


He should have had the helmet strapped to his leg if i recall!
I have switched Strava off because i don't like it confirming the fact that i am getting slower. I know that this is purely because i am not riding as much as i was 3 years ago. There are various reasons for that but only one person that can do something about it!


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## Lozi (24 Mar 2018)

That is essentially what I do although many of my rides are around an hour and I’m on a MTB.

I started this thread because after doing a year of constant efforts I don’t feel I have become much of a stronger cyclist, my only comparisons I can make are to people I know who manage to start cycling and with only being a weekend warrior after a few months they are a stronger cyclist (on a similar bike) than me so I thought it must just not be for me.

A few people on here have said oh 30 miles a week won’t help but I thought to do that constantly week in week out no fail was pretty good for somebody new, at first that’s all I could do physically and now I’ve managed to step it up somewhat. 

I’ve learnt from this thread that winter has played its part, riding in a group will help me improve, keep pushing and it might all come good and in general the cycling worlds answer to everything is buy a faster bike lol

I am putting in a lot of effort and I love the buzz I get when I get home and my legs are tingling etc from the effort! 

Just to clarify I am striving to be somewhere close to my peers on similar equipment and I know the 4 or 5 cyclists I know can do regular 14-15 mph averages on their mountain bikes, I don’t think for one second I’ll be faster than them but if I could dip into the 14 averages on my MTB I’ll be happy! I did a few 13.6-13.9’s in October but I can’t get near that now no matter how hard I try.

I will ride the road bike when it gets nicer out but even if I am faster on that is doesn’t solve the fact I’ve hit a brick wall in how fast I can go currently.

I say I started in May but I have owned my MTB since 2011 and riden it on and off over the summers but this is the first time I’ve given it a good go!


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## roadrash (24 Mar 2018)

As I alluded to in my first reply, it may be that you have reached the peak of what you can do for what ever reason , then again it may not, but if your gonna spend all your time trying to achieve what someone else can do ,even if they are being honest with you, while there is nothing wrong in that,you may find yourself disappointed, we are all different , some slower/some faster.
enjoy your cycling, concentrate on further instead of faster if you want a goal.


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## Julia9054 (24 Mar 2018)

I would swap to your road bike, set a baseline average speed on that and go from there. If getting faster is your aim (and i understand that), you will still be getting fitter but also practising the right technique. It will be more fun too as you are using the right tool for the job.


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## Lozi (24 Mar 2018)

roadrash said:


> enjoy your cycling, concentrate on further instead of faster if you want a goal.



That sound like a pretty good idea! I’m gunna keep trying but if it really doesn’t start feeling better I will do like you say just try for further instead!




Julia9054 said:


> I would swap to your road bike, set a baseline average speed on that and go from there. If getting faster is your aim (and i understand that), you will still be getting fitter but also practising the right technique. It will be more fun too as you are using the right tool for the job.



Yeah you are probably right I only did a few rides totalling 30 miles on my road bike when I got it in 2016 and it didn’t go that great so I gave up on it I need to get it back out! Maybe I’ll get on with it ok this time as I’m a fair bit stronger now and when I do drop back to the MTB I will get that inclusive 14 avg lol


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## nickAKA (28 Mar 2018)

Lozi said:


> That is essentially what I do although many of my rides are around an hour and I’m on a MTB.
> 
> I started this thread because after doing a year of constant efforts I don’t feel I have become much of a stronger cyclist, my only comparisons I can make are to people I know who manage to start cycling and with only being a weekend warrior after a few months they are a stronger cyclist (on a similar bike) than me so I thought it must just not be for me.
> 
> ...



I very rarely look at my average speed, there are just too many variables... Honestly, I doubt it's changed much at all. If you do the same rides out & back you should compare the overall times, and your local strava segments will tell you plenty about how you're doing over all.

Personally I'm more interested in how I'm doing on the climbs, they're my bete noir, and I can tell without looking at the stats how far I've come in the last 6 months (from practically nowhere). Average speed downhill & on the flats I'm rather 'meh' about, I'll worry about that when I can climb a bit...

Also bear in mind the law of diminishing returns when it comes to training. If you're doing the same distances / similar routes all the time, mix it up a bit. If you're on zwift, one night do a group ride, on another do a workout. Do an FTP test so you set the right difficulty then do a structured plan over 4-6 weeks, then do another FTP test. If you haven't improved maybe you health *is* holding you back... but you won't know until you do something truly measurable.

And most importantly, don't worry about what your 'mates' claim they can do, concentrate on enjoying it & being a better 'you'. There lies the road to happiness & fulfilment!


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## mjr (29 Mar 2018)

What they said. If you must compare, compare with your earlier self for now, to measure the change.


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## Ming the Merciless (29 Mar 2018)

You say you have been riding constant efforts. That mostly keads to a plateau in fitness, power, speed. Take a look into intervals where you work harder and ride faster for a period followed by easier pedalling then repeat. Fitness is the result of periods of stress, followed by periods of recovery. If you are not working hsrd enough to stress your body and cardio vascular systems, and equally not resting enough to recover afterwards, then you will not see fitness gains.


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