# Best Tour De France riders in history?



## Cyclisme (25 Jul 2011)

Hello, over the summer i have chosen to write a report on the greatest cyclists to ride the Tour de France. I want to make sure \i choose the best cyclists.




I came across the article below, are these generally considered the best?




http://www.infobarrel.com/The_Greatest_Tour_De_France_Winners
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## Cheddar George (25 Jul 2011)

Well this one could run and run. 

Without doubt you have to be one of the best to be a multiple winner. However, in terms of the "greatest cyclists to ride the Tour de France" there are some that have never even won it (in my opinion), climbers such as Virenque. It's an achievement just to finish so you have to take your hat off to the likes of George Hincapie. Armstrong came back from cancer and Lemond came back from being shot there's hundreds of great stories, look up Charly Gaul climbing a frozen alpine pass and having to be thawed out half way up !!

Good luck choosing a short list


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## Cyclisme (25 Jul 2011)

Wait, Greg Lemond was shot? I'll have to look that one up, very interesting.

I'm thinking of reporting on 5 different cyclists but I'm not to sure what makes them the best Tour de France riders? The obvious answer is to just choose the riders that won the most but there are so many other factors like adversity and raw talent.


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## Cheddar George (25 Jul 2011)

Yup ! i believe Greg is still walking around full of lead shot today !!

You have to choose between the obvious "greats" Merckx/Anquetil/Hinault/Indurain/Armstrong or writing about lesser riders with a more interesting story. Indurain was a great all round rider, fast time trialler and climbed fantastically for a big man but does not have a very interesting back story.


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## Cheddar George (25 Jul 2011)

Federico Bahamontes ! 

Won the Tour de France, one of the greatest climbers of all time ....... but couldn't descend and would wait for the rest to catch him up at the top.


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## Dave Davenport (25 Jul 2011)

Cheddar George said:


> Federico Bahamontes !
> 
> Won the Tour de France, one of the greatest climbers of all time ....... but couldn't descend and would wait for the rest to catch him up at the top.




Andy Schelcks' not one of his 'descendents' his he?

(I'll get me coat)


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## just jim (25 Jul 2011)

Cyclisme said:


> Hello, over the summer i have chosen to write a report on the greatest cyclists to ride the Tour de France. I want to make sure \i choose the best cyclists.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Just for yourself? For schoool/ university? Just wondered....


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## Cyclisme (25 Jul 2011)

just jim said:


> Just for yourself? For schoool/ university? Just wondered....



For school. It has to be related to a summer event. Seeing as the Tour is one of the biggest sporting events of the summer I have decided to right about the best to ever compete in it.


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## Noodley (25 Jul 2011)

Plenty of stories from this year's tour to fill a report!!


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## Rhythm Thief (25 Jul 2011)

Raymond Poulidor is one of the best, in my book. He had a very long career for a pro rider and consistently finished second, which is still pretty good. He just had the misfortune to happen to be racing at the same time as Anquetil.


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## ohnovino (25 Jul 2011)

Even the greats need team-mates to help them out, so any list of the best riders should include some of the super-domestiques: riders like Jens Voigt or George Hincapie, who may not be Tour winners but who's work-rate and determination go a long way to deciding the end result.


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## NickM (25 Jul 2011)

Here are some names you could research:

Michel Pollentier
Bjarne Riis
Richard Virenque
Lance Armstrong
Alexandre Vinokourov

They all got outstanding results.


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## Noodley (25 Jul 2011)

Just copy and paste the article you linked to, then go and enjoy your holidays!


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## Cyclisme (25 Jul 2011)

ohnovino said:


> Even the greats need team-mates to help them out, so any list of the best riders should include some of the super-domestiques: riders like Jens Voigt or George Hincapie, who may not be Tour winners but who's work-rate and determination go a long way to deciding the end result.



True. I am thinking on just writing about the winners of the Tour but i will certainly give an honourable mention to the workhorses.


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## Cyclisme (25 Jul 2011)

NickM said:


> Here are some names you could research:
> 
> Michel Pollentier
> Bjarne Riis
> ...



Vinokourov was done for doping wasn't he? Would it be morally corrupt of me to include him?


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## Smokin Joe (25 Jul 2011)

The top three contenders for best Tour rider of all time are;

1/ Eddy Merckx
2/ Eddy Merckx
3/ Eddy Merckx

No one else comes close.


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## djmc (25 Jul 2011)

If you want characters who were exemplary both on and off the bike, how about Gino Bartali who as well as winning the TDF in 1938 and 1948, during the Second World War was engaged in an operation issuing forged papers for Jews and enemies of the Fascists at great risk to his own life. This only emerged after he died. Then François Faber who won the tour in 1908u3. he fought in the first world war was killed when he went over the line to rescue an injured fellow soldier. One of the resumés of the riders of the tour that I have describes him as "A giant of a man in every way".


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## Alessandro Petacchi (25 Jul 2011)

Smokin Joe said:


> The top three contenders for best Tour rider of all time are;
> 
> 1/ Eddy Merckx
> 2/ Eddy Merckx
> ...



Can't argue with that,mind you Hinault was a hard barsteward also.


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## hennbell (25 Jul 2011)

If you are talking just the Tour de France and none of the other grand tours or classics then only one name need be mentioned and it should be named seven times.

Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !
Lance Armstrong !


If you are talking best cyclist ever, then others enter the competition.


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## Bicycle (25 Jul 2011)

All those in the linked article look good.

Most are before my time, so they are just reported legends.... 

I liked Big Mig in his day just for being a sort of clockwork monster who could destroy other riders when he needed to.

Because of my age (perhaps) I just loved it when Marco Pantani won the tour and I loved some of his exploits in years when he didn't win. He was just absolute mustard going up big hills.

Zabel and (sp?) Abdujaperov impressed for their ruggedness.

Fignon was always the one who looked as if he'd shown up for the wrong event but still did a pretty fabutastic job. 

Who was the guy out of the East German sports academies who always looked as if he was climbing in the big ring and didn't care? he was good value too.


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## Bicycle (25 Jul 2011)

Smokin Joe said:


> The top three contenders for best Tour rider of all time are;
> 
> 1/ Eddy Merckx
> 2/ Eddy Merckx
> ...




I think your three nominations are all members of the same family.

Under Rule 14 Paragraph 7, it clearly states that you can't nominate three members of the same family.

Apart from a Schlek.


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## Chris.IOW (25 Jul 2011)

Marco Pantani would be good value to include, great climber/rider and an interesting story away from cycling too.

How about though, instead of writing about the Winners, who always get mentioned, why not write about the nearly men of the Tour, people like Jan Ulrich who never managed to get past Armstrong for a win.


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## Bicycle (25 Jul 2011)

Jan Ullrich... That's the guy!

He's the big German I mentioned in my post but I forgot his name.


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## Smokin Joe (25 Jul 2011)

hennbell said:


> If you are talking just the Tour de France and none of the other grand tours or classics then only one name need be mentioned and it should be named seven times.
> 
> Lance Armstrong !
> Lance Armstrong !
> ...


I wouldn't agree with that.

Armstrong won seven tours because he turned from a professional cyclist to a professional Tour de France rider. He rode little else for much of his career and what he did ride was in preperation for the tour. The likes of Merckx and Hinault rode, and rode to win, from March to October. When they lined up for the start every July they were carrying the stresses and strains from hard fought classics and stage races in their legs.

If Merckx had had Armstrong's racing program he'd still be winning tours now.


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## Monsieur Remings (25 Jul 2011)

Cheddar George said:


> Yup ! i believe Greg is still walking around full of lead shot today !!
> 
> You have to choose between the obvious "greats" Merckx/Anquetil/Hinault/Indurain/Armstrong or writing about lesser riders with a more interesting story. *Indurain was a great all round rider, fast time trialler and climbed fantastically for a big man but does not have a very interesting back story.
> *



I'm very interested in the heart condition he had as a child? If anyone can shed anymore light on this then I would be pleased. Imagine it must be due to having an abnormally low heart rate...


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## johnr (25 Jul 2011)

What about concentrating on Cavendish? As you're finding out, it is very hard to discuss 'greats' in cycling without drugs references. There's an article in another part of the forum about how this year's tour was slower up the Alps - but was better (drugs free) for it.

Cavendish is in mid-career, but destined to be one of the best of all. Like Cadel Evans, he's generally accepted to be drugs-free. There is plenty on the internet about how he got to the top, and how he stays there.

We may be moving into an era when we can trust cycling results. If so, Cavendish will have spanned the end of one period and set the highest standards for next. Well worth celebrating. He'll be getting his place in the house of lords about the time you leave college.

Good luck with the essay, whatever you choose.


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## Chris.IOW (26 Jul 2011)

1477707 said:


> He did win it in 1997 and was runner up to his team leader Bjarne Riis the year before.



Oh yes, forgot about 1997.

Memory issues, does anyone have a dunce hat? I'll be sat in the corner.


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## Trickydicky (26 Jul 2011)

Jonny Hoogerland


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## lukesdad (26 Jul 2011)

For best entertainment value the French still rate Kelly, as do I and would add Lucien Van Impe to the list of candidates.


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## monnet (26 Jul 2011)

Rhythm Thief said:


> Raymond Poulidor is one of the best, in my book. He had a very long career for a pro rider and consistently finished second, which is still pretty good. He just had the misfortune to happen to be racing at the same time as Anquetil.



And then Anquetil retired and he had the misfortune to ride against Merckx! Unluckiest rider in Tour history?


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## Paulus (26 Jul 2011)

For me it would be Jacques Anquetil
Eddy Merckx
Marco Pantani
There are many others of course, but Anquetil, and Pantani have stories to there life other than racing, and Eddy is just the greatest.


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## Bicycle (26 Jul 2011)

He was an absolute wonder in the saddle (and out of it) when there were big hills.

Many cheated in those days and he blew them into the weeds.

I still think fondly of his impact on stage racing.

Top man. Top racer. Top climber.

Sad end.


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## NickM (28 Jul 2011)

Smokin Joe said:


> Armstrong won seven tours because he turned from a professional cyclist to a professional Tour de France rider.


Not forgetting that he also had outstandingly fine medical support.


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## NickM (28 Jul 2011)

johnr said:


> ...it is very hard to discuss 'greats' in cycling without drugs references...


Oh, I don't know - you might like to look at the careers of

Charly Mottet
Edwig van Hooydonck
Lucho Herrera
Greg Lemond
Chris Boardman

Although if I were you, I wouldn't bother at all with the period from 1991 to 2010. There wasn't much real racing taking place then; it was more a spectacle than a sport.


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## Noodley (28 Jul 2011)

NickM said:


> Although if I were you, I wouldn't bother at all with the period from 1991 to 2010. There wasn't much real racing taking place then; it was more a spectacle than a sport.



True.


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## BSRU (28 Jul 2011)

Cyclisme said:


> Wait, Greg Lemond was shot? I'll have to look that one up, very interesting.



I thought Greg Lemond was stabbed in the back by Bernard Hinault.


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## dellzeqq (28 Jul 2011)

lukesdad said:


> For best entertainment value the French still rate Kelly, as do I and would add Lucien Van Impe to the list of candidates.


I'd go for Kelly as well. Didn't he win the Green Jersey four times? You can't knock a man who throws up on the rider next to him before attacking......and his 'back pocket' was one of the sharpest tools in the business.

Louison Bobet is a good one. His brother's book is worth a read. http://www.amazon.com/Tomorrow-We-Ride-Jean-Bobet/dp/187473951X


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## threebikesmcginty (28 Jul 2011)

Monsieur Remings said:


> I'm very interested in the heart condition he had as a child? If anyone can shed anymore light on this then I would be pleased. Imagine it must be due to having an abnormally low heart rate...



Massive lung capacity too.


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## Sir Humphrey Appleby (29 Jul 2011)

I'd say Jens Voigt, 39(?) and still dominating the Tour and also one of the most likeable riders around.

You have to base it on who they were up against and what their team was like, Armstrong was against weaker riders with a dominant team. Perhaps try LeMond and Hinault?

[media]
]View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZMkZN-PGCo[/media]


Also Coppi was pretty good, lost a few years to the war, had Bartali and was still pretty successful. In a POW camp too.


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## HonestMan1910 (30 Jul 2011)

No nominations for Robert Millar - KOTM 1984 and 4th overall, not bad for a scrawny wee boy from Glasgow 

http://en.wikipedia....i/Robert_Millar


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## andrew_s (31 Jul 2011)

Somebody wins the mountains jersey every year, and most of them don't qualify for "greatest tour rider" consideration unless you are looking for a list somewhere over the hundred rider mark.
Being Scottish doesn't get you any extra points.


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## DaveC (11 Aug 2011)

Merckx, he won on all types of terrain. He was peerless.


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## GrumpyGregry (11 Aug 2011)

If it is greatest winners then the OP's list has 'em covered.

Of the current crew....

Jens Voight would be on my list (even if he was involved with a certain Dr back in the day)
Big George Hincapie has had an 'interesting' career

and the psychology behind Mark Renshaw's participation with HTC is fascinating


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## hairingtons (12 Aug 2011)

I'd plump for Lemond as his story has absolutely everything. It was just a few years before I got into cycling, but it's the best story out there in my opinion.

He is certainly the greatest American rider there's ever been. I say that as someone who's first poster of a cyclist on their wall was Lance Armstrong winning the World Championships when I was 16. I discount Armstrong now though as I find it unthinkable that he didn't dope his way through his career. (Read 'From Lance To Landis'). 

Anyway, Lemond was the darling of American cycling as youngster. Sports Science was in it's infancy, but when tested by American Scientists he gave remarkable results. He showed the highest VO2 max ever recorded by a cyclist (bigger than Indurain later recorded with his huge lung capacity!) and it was thought that Lemond could dominate the Tour. He was simply off the scale.

He won his first Tour in 86, though could have won the year before but was ordered to ride for his captain Hinault, dropping back on a mountain stage to ride for Hinault, who won that year. Then in 86 Lemond was made co-leader with Hinault, but the duo raced mainly against each other as Hinault constantly attacked - even when Lemond was in yellow, and he had to be chased down by his own team mates.

He was the first American to win the Tour. 

In 87 he was shot in a hunting accident. It took him two years to recover and he carried shotgun pellets around in his body ever since. This would later impact on his ability, as the lead from the pellets took its toll.

However this did not stop him winning the Tour two more times, most famously by only 8 seconds over Laurent Fignon on the final time trial stage of the race in 89 - he was riding for a small team with barely any team strength and was not expected to challenge. This race is also interesting because Lemond used TT bars in the final time trial, no one had really done this before. 

I think you could go on and on with his story. But he's interesting because he was clean, he was the first American, he was a unique physical specimen, he brought Srort Science and new technology to the fore of cycling and he even became an expert in Sport Science himself later in his career; helping him as a leading voice against dopers in the sport.

In the world of could ofs and should ofs, Lemond could have won 6 or 7 TdFs himself easily, if there is such a thing as an easy Tdf victory!


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## Smokin Joe (12 Aug 2011)

Some odd choices on this thread, considering it is for the best TdF rider in history.


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## GrumpyGregry (12 Aug 2011)

very difficult to form an opinion on people you've not seen ride in the flesh.

best is a broad church.


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## normgow (12 Aug 2011)

I would say that it's impossible to compare riders of different eras. How do we know how the particpants of the the twenties or thirties who often rode on single freewheels, having to stop, turn the rear wheel round to obtain a different gear, raced up and down mountains on what were little more than gravel tracks, had to change their own tyres in the event of a puncture and had to overcome difficuties that today's riders couldn't imagine , would fare against the riders of today? 
Perhaps some would do well, others not so well but the opposite is also true. How many of today's stars would still be shining if they didn't get an armchair ride provided by their team-mates until it was time for them to go to work? How many would cope with stages of 300 sometimes 400kms?

To try to say who are the best ever TdF riders is really a hopeless task, how do we know how strong the opposition was? Was Roger Walkowiak who won in 1956 a more worthy winner than Lucien Aimar (1966) ?

This is an argument which can run forever and there will never be agreement.

In my opinion anyone who even reaches Paris qualifies as a giant of the road, whereas anyone who wins must be a giant of the human race.


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## raindog (12 Aug 2011)

Good post normgow. In fact, it doesn't really come down to "best", as already mentioned, that's impossible to calculate, it comes down to favourites in the end, and there's nowt wrong with that. I always had a soft spot for big Jan, and I just saw this today - seems he just enjoys riding bikes like the rest of us.......

"I just want to find the pleasure of cycling again," he continued. "Hobby races are a lot of fun. You ride along with like-minded people, talk about the course and bikes, give some advice... it's just cycling. Without having to talk about doping all the time!"
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ullrich-turns-to-cyclosportive-racing


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## GrumpyGregry (12 Aug 2011)

normgow said:


> In my opinion anyone who even reaches Paris qualifies as a giant of the road, whereas anyone who wins must be a giant of the human race.



or off their face on pot belge


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## monnet (12 Aug 2011)

GregCollins said:


> or off their face on pot belge



Isn't that reserved for the post Tour party in Paris? I've always wanted to know which 'leading Belgian pro' it was whose wife performed 'a memorable striptease' under the influence of pot belge and the team end of year party. 

Actually, correct that to 'I've always wanted to see the wife who performed...'


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## CobbledClassic (14 Aug 2011)

If I had to pick 5:
Merckx
Contador
Fignon
Pantani
Anquetil


Love them or loathe them, they were among the best and have some interesting stories to boot.


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## Hont (16 Aug 2011)

Just to throw a couple more into the mix...

Joop Zootemelk (can't be sure of that spelling). More Tours than anyone else (saving George Hincapie now) and he won overall in 1980 as well.

Erik Zabel (most green jerseys)

Lucien Van Impe (record polka dot jerseys until the ever-popular Virenque stole the crown) and overall winner as well


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## Toshiba Boy (18 Aug 2011)

Acknowledging how subjective such a task is, I can only come up with one name...

Merckx.

There so many stats to back his claim up, but let's leave it at the 1969 TdF, his first, aged 24, wins the Yellow (by almost 18 minutes!), and the Green and the Polka Dot (and the White if there had been one at the time).

Unbelievable.

Eddy, Eddy, Eddy.....


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## Alun (18 Aug 2011)

Toshiba Boy said:


> Acknowledging how subjective such a task is, I can only come up with one name...
> 
> Merckx.
> 
> ...



Can't argue with that !


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## oldroadman (18 Aug 2011)

Cyclisme said:


> Hello, over the summer i have chosen to write a report on the greatest cyclists to ride the Tour de France. I want to make sure \i choose the best cyclists.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



A very difficult thing to do as you are trying to compare riders over a 100 year period! The best option may be to look at the "modern" era (say the last 20 years), and see what you deduce.
For this exercise ignore who did or did not indulge in "preparation", because at times almost everyone had medical support - it's just that testing was not so sophisticated until quite recently.
Therefore it's reasonable to propose that whoever was on top would have been on top anyway, assuming a level playing field (i.e. everyone, or almost everyone, is "at it", or as today, it's a very clean peloton and slower average speeds reflect this).
That may be a more considered reflection. And no-one I know/knew is saying anything about stripping wives..


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## oldroadman (18 Aug 2011)

[QUOTE 1477745"]
The Cannibal
[/quote]

No disagreement with that. He won in the days when you rode a full season, not simply focussed on the TdF. Where are the Schlecks, for instance, at the Classics? Tommy Voeckler is a good modern example of a class rider who is racing properly all season, and still gets yellow at the Tour, or Phillipe Gilbert, winning hard stages.
Cipo was a great sprinter and strong rider, but showed no respect for the Tour simply packing when it got difficult. Not a great at that but not bad in the classics, at least.


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## monnet (18 Aug 2011)

Looking at the link posted by the OP, I think that is pretty conclusively the best Tour riders in history. 

Coppi - early part of his career robbed by the war and is still the Campionissimo
Anquetil - so good he opted not to ride the Tour one year in order to increase his earning power
Merckx - the absolute greatest (I think the only rival claim can come from Coppi, based solely on the years of his career lost)
Hinault - Statistically the closest to Merckx
Indurain - 5 straight Tours
Armstrong - makes the list as it's about the Tour. Was it Merckx who said 'Now you're a great of the TOur, but not of cycling'?

People like Fignon, Lemond et al were all great cyclists but never touched the above in terms of the Tour.


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## normgow (18 Aug 2011)

What about the years from 1903 to 1948? Were there no great riders in that era? How about Gino Bartali who won twice; with ten years and a world war in between?

How about Louison Bobet, the first to win three in a row? What about the "Touristes Routiers" who rode in the days before national teams and had to look after themselves with no support. Trying to find an hotel room after a 400km stage on roads like cart tracks must have been a real hoot. Not to menton eating, resting, tending any bodily ailments (probably not few) and fixing your bike for the next marathon stage. 

The Tour today is in many respects entirely different from those early races but with the common denominator that , as in any bike race, you have to press hard on the pedals.

I enjoy reading these different choices but please remember that the Tour didn't start with Lance Armstrong or Eddy Merckx or Jacques Anquetil or Fausto Coppi.

One big problem is that there are very few people alive who experienced the victories of these pre-war stars, I certainly don't, but they shouldn't be forgotten.


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