# Collision with a Car



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

I'm a long time lurker on the cyclechat site.

I thought I should share my recent crash with you.

*warning it is a bit graphic and there is some blood*
http://vholdr.com/node/83183

Cycling through Datchet on Sunday afternoon I was hit from the front by a car while I was crossing a mini roundabout.
I was doing 20mph at the time and seem to have been thrown <or more like cartwheeled> 5-6 metres, before landing hard on my face.

Practically everybody stopped and a passer by calmly took charge while the emergency services were called.

The police attended and took details while the paramedic took me to Wexham Park Hospital, Slough to be checked over and patched up.

I had taken a large hit to the head and face, the helmet had cracked and left quite an impression and lump on my forehead.

The bike didn't come off too well. The front wheel was smashed.
I will be collecting the remains of it from Windsor Police station later today, so should be able to see the total extent of the damage. I am assuming it will be a write off.

I may pull the video if the police decide they need it for evidence. But they have plenty already. They said they had matched my paint to that of the car, unsuprisingly.  I think it is good for people to see what happened.

The driver was beside himself. I guess he had only looked for approaching cars and was probably looking at the black Audi as he entered the roundabout.

I was pretty lucky to escape with such relatively minor injuries. I didn't look too pretty on Monday, but the facial bruising is healing quickly. I still have quite a decent black eye and what may be a scar to the lip. The usual road rash to the knee and elbow, along with skinned knuckles on my left hand and a couple of sore fingers on my right.

I had just bought the HD Cam and helmet a couple of days earlier and this was the first test ride!

I am a CTC member and have started the insurance claim via their claims advice line. I have been taking lots of photos as the bruises come out.

Anyhow, I survived, relatively intact.
I hope it doesn't take too long to get a new bike.

Take care out there.

Andy


----------



## Riding in Circles (23 Apr 2010)

Glad you are not too badly hurt, someone needs to have a chat with that fellow about wearing sandals and socks though.


----------



## gaz (23 Apr 2010)

Oh my god that looked bad. (i don't like blood as well)
I'm pleased to hear your healing ok and best of luck with getting it sorted!!


----------



## Bollo (23 Apr 2010)

F*U*C*K!

Not much can be said about that, apart from to be thankful that the injuries weren't much worse. Hope you heal up quickly and the insurance/police don't mess you around.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Catrike UK said:


> Glad you are not too badly hurt, someone needs to have a chat with that fellow about wearing sandals and socks though.



He he, 

he was very good. He quickly took charge. I definitely owe him a pint.


----------



## Bollo (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> He he,
> 
> he was very good. He quickly took charge. I definitely owe him a pint.


Real Ale I'll bet


----------



## MacLean (23 Apr 2010)

Oh man, just shows how quickly it can go pair shaped....


Did the driver say anything to you, or exchange any words?


How does your confidence feel about getting back on a bike?


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Bollo said:


> F*U*C*K!
> 
> Not much can be said about that, apart from to be thankful that the injuries weren't much worse. Hope you heal up quickly and the insurance/police don't mess you around.



I have used the CTC insurance people previously.
I was knocked off six months ago by a car that didn't see me and went into the side/rear of me!

They have very good solicitors who know how to apply pressure to the insurance companies.


----------



## Vikeonabike (23 Apr 2010)

Andy Glad you're ok....keep us informed.....


----------



## mr_cellophane (23 Apr 2010)

That is terrible. It looks like you nearly missed him, but that is probably due to the camera being on the right hand side. Says something for the strength of the camera if it kept filming but your helmet cracked.
Who was the idiot who looks like they try to help you up. They need some basic First Aid lessons. Still glad you aren't too badly hurt and not much blood loss.
Poor driving from the Mondeo who doesn't look like he slowed down and the black Audi who should have given way - but as he must have see you coming would have "known" that anyone on his right should have to give way.
Nice scratch and dents in the side of the Mondeo so obviously not a careful driver !


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

MacLean said:


> Oh man, just shows how quickly it can go pair shaped....
> 
> 
> Did the driver say anything to you, or exchange any words?
> ...



I haven't been on a bike since, but the confidence feels ok.
We shall see how I feel when I get the bike replaced.

My previous crash, which was more from behind did result in me feeling a sort of feeling of dread for a while. Especially slowing down for a turn if there was a car behind me. I kept expecting to be scooped up by the bonnet. I guess it's the primitive parts of the brain trying to stop you making the same mistakes.

I didn't speak much to the driver. But he was mortified.
It was just a normal nice old couple on their way back from Sunday lunch.
They made a simple mistake and have to deal with what happened to someone as a result of that.

The police said they would be prosecuting and they have a copy of the complete video.


----------



## redjedi (23 Apr 2010)

OW!!

Glad you're not too badly hurt, or put off cycling.

Fingers crossed for a swift recovery, payout and nice shiny new bike.


----------



## Matthames (23 Apr 2010)

I am glad you are ok. Looks nasty and could of been a whole lot worse.


----------



## robz400 (23 Apr 2010)

Heavy crash! I had a very simalar one a month ago on my motorbike. Its that classic angle where we get hidden in the blind spot caused by the cars pillers. 

Hope your healing ok! 

The socks and sandles did make me laugh though


----------



## darthpaul (23 Apr 2010)

woah thats nasty! Glad you are ok.


----------



## Sh4rkyBloke (23 Apr 2010)

Yikes - you can thank your lucky stars you came out alive !! I was tensing up myself as the car approached, and you did the same byu the sound of it... the "nnnnnnnnnnnng" just before they hit you as the realisation set in.

Glad to hear you're doing (raelatively) okay. Hope you get things sorted quickly.

PS - Great vid, btw!!


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

mr_cellophane said:


> That is terrible. It looks like you nearly missed him, but that is probably due to the camera being on the right hand side. Says something for the strength of the camera if it kept filming but your helmet cracked.
> Who was the idiot who looks like they try to help you up. They need some basic First Aid lessons. Still glad you aren't too badly hurt and not much blood loss.
> Poor driving from the Mondeo who doesn't look like he slowed down and the black Audi who should have given way - but as he must have see you coming would have "known" that anyone on his right should have to give way.
> Nice scratch and dents in the side of the Mondeo so obviously not a careful driver !



The camera itself didn't take any hits, but it looks like a tough little thing.
http://vholdr.com/ 

The passenger got to me first, but I think she just held my arm to let me know she was there. I don't remember anybody helping me up as such. It also seemed better to stay down, I didn't need much encouragement.

I didn't notice the dents on the car. I will have to have another look.

I know I made a couple of new ones. I marked the bumper and the bonnet.


----------



## the reluctant cyclist (23 Apr 2010)

Oh my gosh - that made me go cold! 

What a terrible thing to happen - so glad you are okay though

Get well soon.


----------



## Rob3rt (23 Apr 2010)

Damn........... glad you are okay!


----------



## Mike! (23 Apr 2010)

That's a nasty one, i bet you're glad you had a helmet on though 

Wishing a speedy recovery and hope you feel ok about cycling again.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Sh4rkyBloke said:


> Yikes - you can thank your lucky stars you came out alive !! I was tensing up myself as the car approached, and you did the same byu the sound of it... the "nnnnnnnnnnnng" just before they hit you as the realisation set in.
> 
> Glad to hear you're doing (raelatively) okay. Hope you get things sorted quickly.
> 
> PS - Great vid, btw!!



I'm quite proud of the camerawork. But I certainly don't want to do another take. 

The video goes on for quite a while and you can see the downed bike in the background and the arrival of the paramedic.

It's great to be able to see the details of what happened. 
I only remember the initial hit and then the ground approaching my face at high speed.

If you watch the video slowly, it looks like I spin all over the place. 
There is a frame where I am upsidedown looking at the Audi driver who is looking back at me through his side window....


----------



## MacLean (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I haven't been on a bike since, but the confidence feels ok.
> We shall see how I feel when I get the bike replaced.
> 
> My previous crash, which was more from behind did result in me feeling a sort of feeling of dread for a while. Especially slowing down for a turn if there was a car behind me. I kept expecting to be scooped up by the bonnet. I guess it's the primitive parts of the brain trying to stop you making the same mistakes.
> ...




Ive thankfully not been in any rta involving other cars so am not familliar with it, but what are they prosecuting him with? Dangerous driving or not enough attention or something whats he likely to get???

BTW Glad your okay, and you didnt even brake any bones?!


----------



## Bman (23 Apr 2010)

I dont know what to say, just


----------



## scotbiker (23 Apr 2010)

That was awful. Glad you are well and on the mend.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

MacLean said:


> Ive thankfully not been in any rta involving other cars so am not familliar with it, but what are they prosecuting him with? Dangerous driving or not enough attention or something whats he likely to get???
> 
> BTW Glad your okay, and you didnt even brake any bones?!



I'm amazed I didn't break anything.
I felt sure my nose must have broken.
That is the hardest I have ever been hit in the face.

I'm not sure what the charge will be. I am waiting for the paperwork from the police. I have posted the officer who is handling it a copy of the unedited footage.

The officer phoned me on the night of the accident. He had gone to the hospital to speak to me but I had already left. They had interviewed the driver, taken photographs and measurements of the scene, matched paint etc and taken my bike to the station for storage.

I will update as things progress.


----------



## PK99 (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I'm a long time lurker on the cyclechat site.
> 
> I thought I should share my recent crash with you.
> 
> ...




Ooch!

I had a similar SMIDSY on wednesday. Driver did a u-turn and immediate right across me into a junnction, after getting stuck at a level crossing in motspur park (SW London).



Bike is not good and most of me seems to be working with the help of heavy duty painkillers but his car will need new bonnet & wing and repairs to both doors on the offside! Plus i felt no guilt at lying in the middle of a very busy junction for 30 minutes or so at rush hour

Observations about my crash and your video:

1 In each case the driver was 100% at fault by failing to give way.

2 In each case we both failed to cycle defensively. 
I assumed (as did the driver who hit me) that gridlocked traffic meant the yellow cross-hatched junction was, and would remain, empty. I would normally have slowed to almost a stop before crossing the hatched junction despite having right of way. i did slow, but not as much.

In your case, going through a roundabout at 20mph gives no margin of error if the oncoming driver makes the predictable mistake.


----------



## leyton condor (23 Apr 2010)

Glad you are still alive and I wish you a speedy recovery and a nice new bike.


----------



## Origamist (23 Apr 2010)

Hope you heal up quickly, Andy. 

At 9/10 secs, when you say "Jesus" it's horrible viewing - that split second when you know you're ****ed.

I feel uncomfortable, empathetic and voyeuristic watching that collision.


----------



## Bristol Dave (23 Apr 2010)

Glad you're healing nicely. 

BD


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Origamist said:


> Hope you heal up quickly, Andy.
> 
> At 9/10 secs, when you say "Jesus" it's horrible viewing - that split second when you know you're ****ed.
> 
> I feel uncomfortable, empathetic and voyeuristic watching that collision.



I showed it to people at work and it seems to make very uneasy viewing, especially for drivers. 
I think it may be the way the camera puts the viewer right on the bike takes them right down with me.
They realise what it can be like.


----------



## Origamist (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I showed it to people at work and it seems to make very uneasy viewing, especially for drivers.
> I think it may be the way the camera puts the viewer right on the bike takes them right down with me.
> They realise what it can be like.



Yep, it's graphic POV material that brings home to people how vulnerable cyclists are. It's just a shame that it often needs film of a tangled, bloody mess to humanise cyclists in the eyes of a proportion of motorists. 

I hope/suspect a Careless Driving charge will follow.


----------



## HLaB (23 Apr 2010)

eek Andy, that sounded/ looked horific, I'm glad you are OK. I can't see any mitigating facts for the driver (its not like his visibility was blocked), I hope they throw the book at them.


----------



## Origamist (23 Apr 2010)

HLaB said:


> eek Andy, that sounded/ looked horific, I'm glad you are OK.* I can't see any mitigating facts for the driver (its not like his visibility was blocked),* I hope they throw the book at them.



Possibly, A-pillar, but that is no excuse or "looked, but failed to see".


----------



## Davywalnuts (23 Apr 2010)

OMG!! I cycle through there all the time, my back yard so to speak.

Well I am glad your well and Alive! Great video quality. 

However I didnt realise there was also someone else on here from Staines, hello!


----------



## jonny jeez (23 Apr 2010)

gaz said:


> Oh my god that looked bad.



Yep, those Sandals were HORRIFIC!



AndyB said:


> It was just a normal nice old couple on their way back from Sunday lunch.
> They made a simple mistake and have to deal with what happened to someone as a result of that.



Joking aside, I hope you are ok now..you seem to have a fantastic attitude toward the whole thing. I would love to think that I could be so undertanding in that position...well done

Bet you are glad you had a camera strapped on...and a lid I guess

Swift Recovery Andy


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

HLaB said:


> eek Andy, that sounded/ looked horific, I'm glad you are OK. I can't see any mitigating facts for the driver (its not like his visibility was blocked), I hope they throw the book at them.



Yeah, I know I was going fairly quickly, but I had a clear view at the point I went into the roundabout. He was a good distance back from the give way line at that point.

Watching the video, he doesn't seem to slow at all until after the impact.
I think even if I had been doing 10mph or even stopped completely, he would still have collected me on the front of the car.


----------



## NigC (23 Apr 2010)

OMG, that's a real nasty one! Glad to hear you're mending OK 

As a driver, I'm always scared that pillar will block my view of something important. That certainly doesn't excuse anyone from not doing what needs to be done TO see what needs to be seen.

It's only ever a problem when approaching roundabouts, so if anyone ever sees me driving and moving backwards and forwards like my neck is on elastic, I'm making sure I can see everything.

Hope the aftermath doesn't take too long to sort out


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

jonny jeez said:


> Yep, those Sandals were HORRIFIC!
> 
> 
> 
> ...





I can definitely recommend the cameras. They are invaluable to putting together just what happened sometimes.

They also take very good photos which is great for when you are riding through interesting places. There is no need to hunt for your camera, as you already have thousands of fairly decent photos, especially running at 1080p!


Plus even though it was very bad, it was cool to have caught it on film, which maybe able to be used to do some good if it makes a few more drivers think a little longer and look out for us. I'm focusing on the positive aspects.


----------



## Browser (23 Apr 2010)

Arrgghhh! Huddy blell that looked nasty, one of those definite sphincter-test moments if I ever saw one! Reminds me of the only off I've ever had with a car, nice old couple coming back from wherever at lighting-up time, pulled from a side road into a main, looking past me to the cars way behind me and I merged into the oncoming lights. Horrid feeling when at the point of no return and you know there's nowt you can do.


----------



## HaloJ (23 Apr 2010)

Fwah! Cripes that's nasty. Really glad to hear that you're ok!


----------



## 2Loose (23 Apr 2010)

Stunned that you are not broken into little bits! So glad you say you are ok.
Footage is brilliant btw, nice camera.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Davywalnuts said:


> OMG!! I cycle through there all the time, my back yard so to speak.
> 
> Well I am glad your well and Alive! Great video quality.
> 
> However I didnt realise there was also someone else on here from Staines, hello!



It's one of my favourite rides after work.
Up towards Datchet, through Eton, past Windsor Castle and then through the Great park before turning back towards Egham and Staines.

I sent you a PM.


----------



## BentMikey (23 Apr 2010)

Very glad you're OK Andy!! You've been missed on here btw.


----------



## Jezston (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB: hope you get better and back on a bike soon!

Showed this to a driving colleague of mine who happened to enter my office while I was watching - think he'll definitely be paying extra attention on the roads tonight!

Mind if we publicise it further?


----------



## MacB (23 Apr 2010)

Glad you're ok and you seem to be handling it all very proficiently.

It does look like one of those where the drivers given a quick glance, knows the junction and has decided to create his own rolling advanced stop line to ensure he gets on as fast as possible. People just don't seem to register cyclists in the same way. From not seeing them at all to confusing them with a pedestrian or totally misjudging travelling speed. There are a few that just bully there way out re cyclists but they are few and far between and this guy seems to fall into the first category.


----------



## Davywalnuts (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> It's one of my favourite rides after work.
> Up towards Datchet, through Eton, past Windsor Castle and then through the Great park before turning back towards Egham and Staines.
> 
> I sent you a PM.



PM received and returned thanks!

Really funny as I do the reverse route!!


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

BentMikey said:


> Very glad you're OK Andy!! You've been missed on here btw.



Thanks for that.
I will stick around this time.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Jezston said:


> AndyB: hope you get better and back on a bike soon!
> 
> Showed this to a driving colleague of mine who happened to enter my office while I was watching - think he'll definitely be paying extra attention on the roads tonight!
> 
> Mind if we publicise it further?



I think it could do some good if more people saw it.
I have a much better quality HD copy on youtube, but it is currently private.
I was waiting until I spoke to the police about whether it might be used as evidence etc.

I might pop into Staines police station on my way home and see what they suggest.


----------



## Mad Doug Biker (23 Apr 2010)

Well, at least the driver stopped instead of just speeding away as though you didn't exist.

If there is a blind spot in the front of a car like that, then why do the car companies still design cars like that?? maybe we should start some sort of campaign to try and get them to change it!!

It's blatantly a design flaw!


Ok, so you will never make a design that is totally foolproof, but I'm sure that improvements COULD be made somewhere!!


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> Well, at least the driver stopped instead of just speeding away as though you didn't exist.
> 
> If there is a blind spot in the front of a car like that, then why do the car companies still design cars like that?? maybe we should start some sort of campaign to try and get them to change it!!
> 
> ...



Yeah it amazes me how much they bang on about how good the visibility *above* the windscreen is. Like the Astra's oddly named "panoramic" window. Whilst leaving two huge gaping blindspots to the front.


----------



## Simba (23 Apr 2010)

All I can say is ouch, that was scary. Hope you are healing well.


----------



## addictfreak (23 Apr 2010)

Ouch!

One of those moments that when it happens to you seems to go in slow motion, you can see it coming but theres nothing you can do. Just hope for the best!

Glad you werent to badly hurt. How was the bike?

You were also remarkably calm (or was it shock) I would have had a few choice words to say.

What was the driver think of? And he should get at least 6 months for wearing those sandals and another 3 for wearing socks with them.


----------



## slowmotion (23 Apr 2010)

I hope you are mending fast. Best wishes.


----------



## Mad Doug Biker (23 Apr 2010)

I have now realised, this isn't REALLY a cycling forum, it's a branch of The Fashion Police hiding under a cycling decoy!!

Seriously though, I'm glad you are ok and I bet you were thinking when airbourne

'Oh, this is going to hurt!'.


----------



## Mark_Robson (23 Apr 2010)

Wow Andy I sat there cringing, waiting for the inevitable collision. I'm glad that you survived relatively unscathed. 
BTW what's wrong with wearing socks with your sandals?


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

Mad Doug Biker said:



> I have now realised, this isn't REALLY a cycling forum, it's a branch of The Fashion Police hiding under a cycling decoy!!
> 
> Seriously though, I'm glad you are ok and I bet you were thinking when airbourne
> 
> 'Oh, this is going to hurt!'.



I had just begun to assemble those words in my mind as the tarmac approached and then hit my face at high speed. 
It all happened very quickly and I guess I was focused on checking myself.

Then I start feeling bad for the person who hit me... 

I'm actually glad I had the helmet on. I don't doubt that it would have been very much worse if that hadn't taken some of the hit. I hadn't worn one for a couple of years. This one was three days old and mainly there to mount the camera....


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

I've removed the link temporarily until I check with the officer who is dealing with the case... after advice at the local police station.

I will keep you updated.


----------



## Mad Doug Biker (23 Apr 2010)

LUCKY!!

I have worn a helmet for years and never needed it.

In fact, I have fallen without a helmet when I was faffing about, rambling/climbing down a small cliff and I fell off and landed BADLY on my forehead from about 4 meters (or more, I don't really know, only a rough estimate from a witness).
Blood everywhere, but I was fine, thus proving that there isn't anything important in my head worth protecting in the first place!! 

Actually, when I 'landed' (I felt like the pilot of a plane crashing), I was more concerned that the camera I had over my shoulder was ok, and then I started to wonder when it had started to rain.
Turns out it was the blood from my forehead dripping right in front of my eyes! 

I made a point of never cleaning the camera, and it was covered in dried blood for quite a long time afterwards (I'm odd like that).


----------



## D-Rider (23 Apr 2010)

Ouch! Uncomfortable viewing, Andy, but thanks. Hope your recovery continues well!


----------



## NigC (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I had just begun to assemble those words in my mind as the tarmac approached and then hit my face at high speed.
> It all happened very quickly and I guess I was focused on checking myself.
> 
> *Then I start feeling bad for the person who hit me...*
> ...



From what you're saying, it sounds like the driver was genuinely and completely sorry for a stupid mistake.

It might sound odd to some people, but I think I'd prefer to be hit by a complete moron (as long as they didn't get away with it). At least you can focus some anger on them while you're recuperating and then smile like a Cheshire Cat when they lose their licence.

I bet if the driver had seen you at the last minute and managed to hit the brakes in time, that would have been all the wake-up call he needed for many years driving to come. Now he's had the wake-up call plus and then some!


----------



## Camgreen (23 Apr 2010)

Looked brutal Andy, glad you're okay.


----------



## Mark_Robson (23 Apr 2010)

NigC said:


> From what you're saying, it sounds like the driver was genuinely and completely sorry for a stupid mistake.
> 
> It might sound odd to some people, but I think I'd prefer to be hit by a complete moron (as long as they didn't get away with it). At least you can focus some anger on them while you're recuperating and then smile like a Cheshire Cat when they lose their licence.
> 
> I bet if the driver had seen you at the last minute and managed to hit the brakes in time, that would have been all the wake-up call he needed for many years driving to come. Now he's had the wake-up call plus and then some!


+1


----------



## fossyant (23 Apr 2010)

Glad you are OK (ish)..... heal quick.


----------



## Origamist (23 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I showed it to people at work and it seems to make very uneasy viewing, especially for drivers.
> I think it may be the way the camera puts the viewer right on the bike takes them right down with me.
> They realise what it can be like.



On reflection, the vid would make a good DfT Think! advert/campaign - far more hard hitting than the recent bank heist film. I'd send it to them when you're feeling better and the investigation is over.


----------



## Ian Johnson (23 Apr 2010)

Hi Andy. Just seen the pic you sent me, thats healing bloody fast ..made of tough stuff us Wiganers


----------



## shippers (23 Apr 2010)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> Well, at least the driver stopped instead of just speeding away as though you didn't exist.
> 
> If there is a blind spot in the front of a car like that, then why do the car companies still design cars like that?? maybe we should start some sort of campaign to try and get them to change it!!
> 
> ...




I've not seen the vid- been taken down, but I assume the bit of car that's in the way is the A-frame, the edge of the windscreen.
If you see crash tests, you see how vital it is in stoppin the driver getting squished. Don't know if it could really be designed out- you would end up with a thinker pillar somewhere else.

Reminds me of my off 2 months ago. Someone else knocked off on wednesday in Headingly.


----------



## addictfreak (23 Apr 2010)

NigC said:


> From what you're saying, it sounds like the driver was genuinely and completely sorry for a stupid mistake.
> 
> It might sound odd to some people, but I think I'd prefer to be hit by a complete moron (as long as they didn't get away with it). At least you can focus some anger on them while you're recuperating and then smile like a Cheshire Cat when they lose their licence.
> 
> I bet if the driver had seen you at the last minute and managed to hit the brakes in time, that would have been all the wake-up call he needed for many years driving to come. Now he's had the wake-up call plus and then some!



Nice sentiments, and easy to make when injury has been slight. I dont doubt for one moment that it was an accident. But this stupid mistake could so easily have cost a life or seriously affected someones quality of life.


----------



## AndyB (23 Apr 2010)

I can hopefully put the link back up tomorrow.
I just need to confirm with the officer who is handling the case and he went off duty at 4pm.

The officers at Staines station suggested that I should probably not make it public until I have checked with him.

He starts early tomorrow so I will be on the phone first thing.

Thanks for all the positive messages.

Much appreciated.

BTW
I agree with Origamist that this video would make an excellent advert.


----------



## magnatom (23 Apr 2010)

Hi Andy. 

Great to have you back on here, terrible that it is under these circumstances. I was lucky enough (if you can say that!) that Andy let me see the video before he posted it on here. 

It really did shock me. Not because it was particularly graphic, a bit of blood, sure, but nothing horrible to look at. It was the inevitability of the crash just after Andy had entered the roundabout. It sent shivers down my spine!  That is a feeling I really don't want to feel in real life!!

Glad you are on the mend Andy and its great that you are so pragmatic about it. It is certainly good that the driver is remorseful, as they should be. It will be interesting to see what course of action the police suggest.

I also agree that this video is an excellent advert for why drivers should be more observant/not use mobiles/not try and cut in before a cyclists etc. How about the CTC?

Having seen the full length video, I must add my congratulations to the chap with the sandels. He really was top notch in how he dealt with the incident and with Andy. He is very deserving of a beer, or six!!


----------



## jonny jeez (23 Apr 2010)

magnatom said:


> Hi Andy.
> 
> It really did shock me. ... It was the inevitability of the crash just after Andy had entered the roundabout.



I felt the same, especially when you hear the noise that Andy makes as soon as he knows its gonna hurt and there is nothing he can do to stop it.

Once again Andy...I'm really inspred by your attitude to the whole thing.


----------



## Tynan (23 Apr 2010)

it's funny how those capable herberts appear at accidents, the two serious accidents I've had that hurt me both had someone that really knew what to do

not sure i want to see the vid


----------



## fossyant (23 Apr 2010)

Be prepared for a long drawn out battle with the third party insurers... I don't have a polite word to say......... they are happy to pay out £xxxxx to fix a car, but not £xxxx to fix a person...... bar stewards the lot...........


----------



## Ian Johnson (23 Apr 2010)

magnatom said:


> Having seen the full length video, I must add my congratulations to the chap with the sandels. He really was top notch in how he dealt with the incident and with Andy. He is very deserving of a beer, or six!!



+1


----------



## Norm (23 Apr 2010)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> If there is a blind spot in the front of a car like that, then why do the car companies still design cars like that?? maybe we should start some sort of campaign to try and get them to change it!!
> 
> It's blatantly a design flaw!


More than a design flaw, many modern designs are actually illegal. Manufacturers use a clause that allows secondary pillars for opening quarter-lights to exclude the width of a second pillar from the calculations as to the amount of view they are allowed block.



AndyB said:


> It's one of my favourite rides after work.
> Up towards Datchet, through Eton, past Windsor Castle and then through the Great park before turning back towards Egham and Staines.
> 
> I sent you a PM.


Not sure where the accident happened but that's pretty normal hunting ground for me and Hotmetal, who also lives over towards Datchet.



magnatom said:


> It really did shock me. Not because it was particularly graphic, a bit of blood, sure, but nothing horrible to look at. It was the inevitability of the crash just after Andy had entered the roundabout. It sent shivers down my spine!  That is a feeling I really don't want to feel in real life!!


I was thinking of your tanker when reading the OP.



AndyB said:


> The police attended and took details while the paramedic took me to Wexham Park Hospital, Slough to be checked over and patched up.


You survived Wexham Park? Blimey, congratulations on that. 

Get good quick, Andy, and hope to catch you at a tea stop sometime.


----------



## Stephenite (24 Apr 2010)

Glad you are relatively ok, mate.

Horrible vid tho. It wasnt the blood at all. But like Magnatom said the predictability of it after you realised a collision was unavoidable.

Shown it to a few guys at work and it made an impression.

Shocking driving. You say they were a nice couple but mistakes like that kill people and need to be treated appropriately.

Get well, and get a new bike soon.


----------



## Mad Doug Biker (24 Apr 2010)

Norm said:


> More than a design flaw, many modern designs are actually illegal. Manufacturers use a clause that allows secondary pillars for opening quarter-lights to exclude the width of a second pillar from the calculations as to the amount of view they are allowed block.



And people wonder why I don't like cars....


----------



## Mad Doug Biker (24 Apr 2010)

shippers said:


> If you see crash tests, you see how vital it is in stoppin the driver getting squished.



So as long as th Oh so precious driver is ok, then they can make a design that squishes everyone else instead??


----------



## hackbike 666 (24 Apr 2010)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> And people wonder why I don't like cars....




Cars are ok but unfortunately people who drive them aren't always.

Hope you can get over this nightmare AndyB.

Sounds bloody awful and no doubt it is.


----------



## PBancroft (24 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I've removed the link temporarily until I check with the officer who is dealing with the case... after advice at the local police station.
> 
> I will keep you updated.



Didn't see the video, but from what you and other people say you are a very lucky person indeed. As nice and as apologetic as the driver may have been, I hope that they are taken off the road at least temporarily.


----------



## AndyB (24 Apr 2010)

Ok, I spoke to the officer.
He said if he owned the footage he would keep it as evidence.
But the case is pretty clear cut and as I have the video and it is mine, he can't say I shouldn't put it online.

So I think that's as near to ok as I will get.

Here is the link: http://vholdr.com/node/83183


----------



## PBancroft (24 Apr 2010)

Blimey. I'll repeat what I said before - you are a very lucky person indeed to still be walking around after that.


----------



## AndyB (24 Apr 2010)

fossyant said:


> Be prepared for a long drawn out battle with the third party insurers... I don't have a polite word to say......... they are happy to pay out £xxxxx to fix a car, but not £xxxx to fix a person...... bar stewards the lot...........



I have the same CTC solicitor who handled my previous accident, six months back. She did a very good job and things were settled within a few months.
I was lucky to have a good, independent witness in that case too. Not something you always get.

I can imagine things being much harder without people to back you up, especially has human memory is so fallible.

This one seems very clear cut, so should be no major hurdles <touch wood>.
The police are satisfied that I was on the roundabout etc, they measured and photographed the scene and said these would be available to the insurance. I also seem to have a whole crowd of witnesses.

Stay safe,

Andy


----------



## yello (24 Apr 2010)

That really is horrific footage to watch Andy. Made worse by the sense (and one that you must have had 10 fold!) of what is about to happen. Seeing the car move forward and _knowing_ you're going to hit it. I'm darned pleased you came out of it relatively unscathed.

To change tack a little, in hindsight do you think there's anything you could have done to avoid the incident? (Short of not having gotten on the bike that morning!) Was there any tell tale signs that you recall, any spider-sense or uncertainty about that car? I think if you have any insights, or things you'd do differently next time, it'd be really really useful if you could share them.

It's my biggest fear at junctions... if I can't make eye-contact with a driver (for whatever reason), I become uncertain as to their intentions... and even when I DO make eye-contact, I'm not always sure!


----------



## MacB (24 Apr 2010)

yello said:


> That really is horrific footage to watch Andy. Made worse by the sense (and one that you must have had 10 fold!) of what is about to happen. Seeing the car move forward and _knowing_ you're going to hit it. I'm darned pleased you came out of it relatively unscathed.
> 
> To change tack a little, in hindsight do you think there's anything you could have done to avoid the incident? (Short of not having gotten on the bike that morning!) Was there any tell tale signs that you recall, any spider-sense or uncertainty about that car? I think if you have any insights, or things you'd do differently next time, it'd be really really useful if you could share them.
> 
> It's my biggest fear at junctions... if I can't make eye-contact with a driver (for whatever reason), I become uncertain as to their intentions... and even when I DO make eye-contact, I'm not always sure!



sort of answering for him, I'm sure Andy knows he could have been riding more defensively. But it's also easy to be lulled into a false sense of security. Clear day, light traffic, good visibility and also the fact that the driver really shouldn't be doing what they did even if a cyclist wasn't there. Plus riding in a super defensive manner is very mentally tiring.

It all comes down to a pile of ifs, buts and maybes


----------



## Tinuts (24 Apr 2010)

Ooh, I felt for you there. 

The only time I've ever hit the road face first was entirely my own fault: I misjudged one of those solid metal raised barriers (the sort that lower to let traffic over) and my pedal caught it as I passed. Bike stopped very suddenly and I went over the bars straight into the road. Very painful so I appreciate how you feel. The pics were pretty gruesome too. I now treat that barrier with a lot of respect every time I pass it!

Anyway, I'm glad you've not suffered any personal breakages as a result of that horrible looking fall and I wish you a speedy recovery - and a new bike at someone else's expense! I've found the CTC lawyers to be very helpful in that respect.

Glad the camera held up too! Your footage is another excellent example of the benefits of wearing one: Evidence!


----------



## martynjc1977 (26 Apr 2010)

Awesome footage, and glad your injuries aint that bad, it could have been a lot worse. Am now wanting a camera just in case i need evidence should anything happen to me.


----------



## Armegatron (26 Apr 2010)

Owch - glad your recovering ok.


----------



## Amanda P (26 Apr 2010)

I had an argument with a car back in August. I'd like to learn from it - but I still have no memory at all of what happened. Eyewitness testimony being the unreliable thing it is, I still haven't heard a cogent explanation, and probably never will.

Now I use a camera most days.

I really hope this film gets seen by as many people as possible.


----------



## Barbelier (26 Apr 2010)

OMG! Only just seen this!
Very glad you weren't more seriously injured.

Even more alarming because I cycle along that road pretty often. One of my favourite training routes takes me through Burnham Beeches, Taplow, round Dorney Lake, Eton Wick, Eton, Datchet, round Windsor Gt Park, back up to Datchet, round the Queen Mothers Resevoir and back home via Fulmer and Farnham Common. Mind you, I'd probably would only have been doing 10 mph and be on the brakes at that point. Wouldn't have stopped the accident, but I maybe I wouldn't have flown as far as you did!

Hope you make a speedy recovery and you are successful in any action you have to take against the driver (sounds like you have plenty of evidence and witnesses on your side).


----------



## Will1985 (26 Apr 2010)

Just seen this - I had flashbacks of my own collisions with cars seeing that. That moment before impact must be the same for everyone where you know what's going to happen.

Get well soon.


----------



## beanzontoast (26 Apr 2010)

I've not been on the forum for a day or three - only seen this a few mins ago. 

Sickening footage (with or without the blood!). My best wishes to you for a full recovery mate.


----------



## Arch (26 Apr 2010)

I don't think I can watch this (partly my laptop being slow, but mostly out of squeamishness), but I'm glad you're relatively ok, and I hope it all works out easily for you....


----------



## ComedyPilot (26 Apr 2010)

FFS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That could so easily have been your chips cashed in!!

Glad you are (reasonably) ok.


----------



## Panter (26 Apr 2010)

Only just seen this, made me feel quite ill as the accident unfolded 

Glad you're Ok-ish, get well soon.


----------



## AndyB (26 Apr 2010)

yello said:


> That really is horrific footage to watch Andy. Made worse by the sense (and one that you must have had 10 fold!) of what is about to happen. Seeing the car move forward and _knowing_ you're going to hit it. I'm darned pleased you came out of it relatively unscathed.
> 
> To change tack a little, in hindsight do you think there's anything you could have done to avoid the incident? (Short of not having gotten on the bike that morning!) Was there any tell tale signs that you recall, any spider-sense or uncertainty about that car? I think if you have any insights, or things you'd do differently next time, it'd be really really useful if you could share them.
> 
> It's my biggest fear at junctions... if I can't make eye-contact with a driver (for whatever reason), I become uncertain as to their intentions... and even when I DO make eye-contact, I'm not always sure!



I have looked at video, trying to second guess myself and see what I would do differently. My speed was a factor in how far I flew, but I had what looked like a clear run? The car that hit me was too far back for any eye contact at the time I started going around the roundabout. I guess a car could do that sort of thing at any T-junction?

By the time he crossed over the give way, I was infront of him, so even if I had stopped, he would probably have scooped me up regardless.

His speed was significant too, he doesn't appear to slow down and if anything seems to be accelerating, maybe to try to get on before the black Audi who was already entering the roundabout at that time?

However had I not been doing 20, i may have been looking at a shattered leg as my left pedal had gouged out a chunk of foam from the bumper and the crank arm had been bent inwards so that it now strikes the chain stays! If my foot had been clipped in...?

My cycling glasses sustained a crack and four deep gouges in the left lens from the road surface. I have also split the hard soles of my cycling shoes horizontally just behind the toe box but in front of the SPD cleat!

I walked past the location yesterday and it is a very elongated roundabout, like a stretched X shape. It was a good 6m from the impact point to where I landed.

Location is here on google maps.


----------



## Globalti (28 Apr 2010)

Ouch! That's dramatic, I felt the pain! You must be pretty sore.

I had an accident at a similar speed a few years ago when I overtook a bunch of kids on BMXs and BSOs and one of them suddenly swerved across the road in front of me. I steered right, hit him, hit the pavement and somersaulted, clouting the back of my head on the ground hard enough to see stars for a second. Amazingly I was relatively unhurt but when I got home and examined the helmet I found that the shell had split right down the middle and the back strap was embedded in the inside of the shell, which had a flat on it textured with the ground it hit! Without the helmet I'm sure I'd have been hurt much more badly. 

As to your own accident, 12 years of motorcycling taught me to mistrust that kind of situation; I'd have been slowing and looking for eye contact with the car driver. The worst motorbike SMIDSYs happen when the bike is moving straight towards the other vehicle and presenting a small profile, which is only expanding slowly and not moving across the driver's field of vision. The human eye is excellent at detecting movement so when approaching this kind of situation I would always try to move across the driver's field of vision by moving out into a prominent position on the road while covering brakes and horn, sometimes hitting the headlight flasher for three or four seconds, looking for eye contact and watching the car's wheels for any sign of rotation. But in your situation I agree that even if you had stopped, that car might have been driven straight into you!


----------



## DrSquirrel (28 Apr 2010)

I know it's not best to talk about money - but are you looking at recouping costs for everything, bike (obviously), sunglasses, pedals, shoes+cleats, helmet, damaged cycling clothes? etc?


Images of the bike?



NigC said:


> It might sound odd to some people, but I think I'd prefer to be hit by a complete moron (as long as they didn't get away with it). At least you can focus some anger on them while you're recuperating and then smile like a Cheshire Cat when they lose their licence.



Yes yes yes! This is why SMIDSY is just such a pain in the arse! Not that arguing tends to get you anywhere.


----------



## hackbike 666 (28 Apr 2010)

I don't know why I avoided this thread...I really don't....so sorry that looked effing awful.


----------



## RyanW (28 Apr 2010)

That's just mental, how that driver didn't see you is, well i don't know what it is. Stupid.

Hope all goes well in recovery and get back on the bike ASAP. 

Ryan


----------



## hackbike 666 (28 Apr 2010)

What he said.


----------



## Norm (28 Apr 2010)

RyanW said:


> That's just mental, how that driver didn't see you is, well i don't know what it is. Stupid.


Unfortunately, whilst it is indeed stupid, the design of the road there forces drivers to be looking through the passenger side windows to check the traffic coming from Slough/Eton has stopped. As traffic from that direction is essentially proceeding along a straight bit of road, they often don't even realise that there is a roundabout there so don't stop. That leaves drivers coming from the direction of the station, as that Mondeo was, trying to check that they have a clear entry so they do not give their full attention to traffic from the direction which AndyB used.

Not trying to exonerate the driver, who should be facing "assault with deadly weapon", but the roads round there, including both the level crossings, need a re-think, IMO.


----------



## hackbike 666 (28 Apr 2010)

He's right....that's why I was ranting about Blackfriars Bridge the other day.


----------



## DrSquirrel (29 Apr 2010)

Norm said:


> Unfortunately, whilst it is indeed stupid, the design of the road there forces drivers to be looking through the passenger side windows to check the traffic coming from Slough/Eton has stopped. As traffic from that direction is essentially proceeding along a straight bit of road, they often don't even realise that there is a roundabout there so don't stop. That leaves drivers coming from the direction of the station, as that Mondeo was, trying to check that they have a clear entry so they do not give their full attention to traffic from the direction which AndyB used.
> 
> Not trying to exonerate the driver, who should be facing "assault with deadly weapon", but the roads round there, including both the level crossings, need a re-think, IMO.



The road is indeed bad, should be a junction instead of a RAB x10

Driver should be giving way to the right, so they should at least be going that way, if their vision was that bad to the left they should have slowed down a bit.

If you watch the black car from the mondeo's left... they both enter the RAB at the same time... possible car vs car collision?


Maybe Andy could see if the council will see about rectifying it?


----------



## Norm (29 Apr 2010)

drsquirrel said:


> If you watch the black car from the mondeo's left... they both enter the RAB at the same time... possible car vs car collision?


Indeed, I hadn't even spotted that the black Audi was moving forward when the accident happened (because I hadn't been brave enough to have watched that far into the video!).

However, that is exactly why I said that junction is terribly designed. The Mondeo driver was probably entirely focussed on taking priority over the Audi. 

We are programmed, when under pressure, to pay attention to things that present a danger. Andy, in that scenario, was no danger at all to Mr Mondeo, whereas Mr Audi was a significant danger. Mondeo Man's eyes might have seen Andy on his bike but the programming filtered out his presence.

Gruesome accident, very glad that Andy is telling the tale.


----------



## hackbike 666 (29 Apr 2010)

I spotted it but perhaps I had trepidation.


----------



## Bman (30 Apr 2010)

I had a similar situation today, I wasn’t sure this driver was going to stop, despite plenty of early indicating. 


View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXk4eUqAwDU


I would like to think I wouldn’t have reacted any differently if I hadn’t seen your video, Andy (in fact, in retrospect, perhaps I should have slowed down and let him go?).


----------



## JtB (30 Apr 2010)

AndyB said:


> I'm quite proud of the camerawork. But I certainly don't want to do another take.


Scary stuff there, really glad you're on the mend. The quality of your ContourHD camera looks really good, are you pleased with it?


----------



## hulver (12 May 2010)

Your video has been posted on another site now as well.

http://www.break.com/index/biker-crash-on-head-cam.html


----------

