# Ibuprofen gel for knee pain



## malcermie (31 Jan 2014)

My sixty nine year old knees are starting to ache after twenty or so miles on my road bike, has anyone tried ibuprofen gel on these joints? I seem to remember reading somewhere that it can help, apart from that I feel as fit as a flea!


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## Rob3rt (31 Jan 2014)

Used to apply it to knee injuries when running, it was just about as effective as taking a couple of ibuprofen pills IME.


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

You may aswell put salad cream on your knees for all the good it does.


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## Ganymede (31 Jan 2014)

I use the stronger version for shoulder pain, and it's effective. The regular stuff was referred to by a doctor I know as "practically homeopathic" so I always use the extra-strength variety.


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## Hacienda71 (31 Jan 2014)

I would have thought that using gel rather than taking it orally would be better for your digestive tract.


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## GrumpyGregry (31 Jan 2014)

I've used it when running/refereeing, especially in the rugby seven's season, and found it very effective.

Not tried the salad creme though.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (31 Jan 2014)

What happened the glucosamine you were going to start taking?


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> You may aswell put salad cream on your knees for all the good it does.


Give us some more info on that please.


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## AndyRM (31 Jan 2014)

I've used it and found it effective. Don't bother with branded stuff (Ibuleve for example) - ASDA's own brand is stronger and way cheaper


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> Give us some more info on that please.


Info on what salad cream to use?


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Lead researcher Dr Andrew Moore, of the Nuffield Department of Anaesthetics at the University of Oxford says.

"What we know does work is topical non-steroidal anti-inflammatory gels like ibuprofen. There is pretty good evidence that they work well and are pretty safe.

Where as one of our experts says salad cream.

I would say get it checked and take the advice of an expert, preferable one who cycles.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> Info on what salad cream to use?


No why you made the statement, just interested in what you use to back up your advice.


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

Just that I've used the said product and it did nothing for me.


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## Ganymede (31 Jan 2014)

A friend of mine is a professional bassoon player of mature years. Bassoon players tend to get a condition of the shoulder which eventually needs surgery. He was scheduled for surgery some months ahead on the NHS and used strong Ibuleve on it every day (I don't know how many times a day). He went in for the pre-op checkup and they said he didn't need the op any more.

Obviously this is anecdotal and totally unscientific (ie how badly did he need the op in fact, etc) and doesn't prove anything, but it is a true story.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> Just that I've used the said product and it did nothing for me.


Not very scientific then, and of course how do you know if you did not use it the pain would have gotten worse.


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## Dan B (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> Info on what salad cream to use?


I am reliably informed that It Has To Be Heinz


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

The only difference between taking tablets and using cream is how it gets into your system, I.e., they are both systemic which means they both go into the blood stream. You could apply on your skin anywhere and get the same therapeutic levels.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

bromptonfb said:


> The only difference between taking tablets and using cream is how it gets into your system, I.e., they are both systemic which means they both go into the blood stream. You could apply on your skin anywhere and get the same therapeutic levels.


Would there be a time difference in how long they took to work, would you also please let us have the source of your information.


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## Dan B (31 Jan 2014)

I've used ibuprofen gel on knees (and other joints) post-injury, especially where there was swelling - anecdotally it made a difference. How much of that was the ibuprofen itself and how much was due to the healing effects of massaging it in, I don't know, but I know enough other skaters who swear by it.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

Dan B said:


> I've used ibuprofen gel on knees (and other joints) post-injury, especially where there was swelling - anecdotally it made a difference. How much of that was the ibuprofen itself and how much was due to the healing effects of massaging it in, I don't know, but I know enough other skaters who swear by it.


Medical fact....the medicine has to get into your systemic system to work, I.e., it doesn't work locally like heat cream, it's all in your head.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (31 Jan 2014)

You could always seek to find the cause of the pain and correct that. Masking the symptoms doesn't cut it


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

bromptonfb said:


> Medical fact....the medicine has to get into your systemic system to work, I.e., it doesn't work locally like heat cream, it's all in your head.



Not my head, I just like reading about this sort of subject. Which is why i was hoping you could give us a decent lead to the source of replies.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

Ibuprofen tablets typically 400 mg per dose, gel 125 mg per dose, therefore tablets give a much higher plasma level of active ingredient.


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> Not very scientific then, and of course how do you know if you did not use it the pain would have gotten worse.


That's what people say about various things. Don't get all silly and pedantic!


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## compo (31 Jan 2014)

Although good advice to get the cause of his pain diagnosed, the OP is 69 years old. I hope he has a better doctor than me who reckons that at 66 years old I am too old to cycle more than a couple of miles. I could see the OP's doctor suggesting he stops cycling if that is what is aggravating his knees rather than look for a proper cause and remedy for his pain.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> That's what people say about various things. Don't get all silly and pedantic!


it is not being silly or pedantic, why do you think the OP asked the question, to get good honest advice that is why.


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> it is not being silly or pedantic, why do you think the OP asked the question, to get good honest advice that is why.


I was being honest, those creams for pain do nothing. As a sufferer of arthritis from birth I can confirm this.
Nothing scientific in that!


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## Hacienda71 (31 Jan 2014)

Without wanting to get drawn into a tit for tat about this, a cursory google search shows a fair amount of research by reputable scientific sources that show the topical application of ibuprofen works including in cases of arthritis.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> I was being honest, those creams for pain do nothing. As a sufferer of arthritis from birth I can confirm this.
> Nothing scientific in that!


Well that seems to go against the medical profession then.


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## Dan B (31 Jan 2014)

bromptonfb said:


> Medical fact....the medicine has to get into your systemic system to work, I.e., it doesn't work locally like heat cream, it's all in your head.


I take your point, but I'm comparing with "no ibuprofen", not with "oral ibuprofen".


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## Roadrider48 (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> Well that seems to go against the medical profession then.


Personal experience....that's all.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

Dan B said:


> I take your point, but I'm comparing with "no ibuprofen", not with "oral ibuprofen".


Fair enough, but that's like saying my teeth don't rot if I use toothpaste.


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## ColinJ (31 Jan 2014)

Hacienda71 said:


> I would have thought that using gel rather than taking it orally would be better for your digestive tract.


A friend of mine almost died from a perforated ulcer caused by taking a lot of Ibuprofen, so that strikes me as a very valid point, assuming that the gels don't produce similar side-effects.


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## ScotiaLass (31 Jan 2014)

malcermie said:


> My sixty nine year old knees are starting to ache after twenty or so miles on my road bike, has anyone tried ibuprofen gel on these joints? I seem to remember reading somewhere that it can help, apart from that I feel as fit as a flea!


I've used the gel as I can't take the tablets due to stomach issues.
To be honest, I didn't find it helped much but I do have high levels of pain due to other issues.
For swelling, ice applied for no more than 20 mins at a time is fantastic....for pain, simple Paracetamol is very effective.

Edited to add: Everyone is different and it's always best to consult your GP


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## vickster (31 Jan 2014)

malcermie said:


> My sixty nine year old knees are starting to ache after twenty or so miles on my road bike, has anyone tried ibuprofen gel on these joints? I seem to remember reading somewhere that it can help, apart from that I feel as fit as a flea!



How about taking advice from your doctor? Have you been diagnosed with arthritis in your knees (through xray or MRI)? My specialist is very sceptical about such things helping. I have not inexpensive injections which seem to help, but I have clearly diagnosed damage. An anti-inflammatory gel can work for mild inflammation. Ice is another way to reduce inflammation in joints and is cheap. You could also try a heated gel pad, nice and soothing

Are your knees swollen or just creaky? Have you seen a sports physio and got a targeted exercise and stretching programme

Or do they only hurt when cycling....if so, the usual reply of, does the bike fit, is the saddle correctly positioning, ditto cleats/pedals

Voltaren gel is the one to use if you do though


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## Dan B (31 Jan 2014)

bromptonfb said:


> Fair enough, but that's like saying my teeth don't rot if I use toothpaste.


You eat it or smear it on?


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

Dan B said:


> You eat it or smear it on?


Niether he puts it on his knee's.


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## ColinJ (31 Jan 2014)

I misaligned a new cleat once and that buggered a knee in about 5 miles of riding, so I would suggest that you double-check your bike and cleat setup.

I was developing really painful knees 2 years ago (aged 56) and I put that down to wear and tear, but I have since lost 3.5 stone in weight and the pain has gone. If you are carrying extra weight, then getting slimmer would definitely help reduce the load on your joints.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

ColinJ said:


> I misaligned a new cleat once and that buggered a knee in about 5 miles of riding, so I would suggest that you double-check your bike and cleat setup.
> 
> I was developing really painful knees 2 years ago (aged 56) and I put that down to wear and tear, but I have since lost 3.5 stone in weight and the pain has gone. If you are carrying extra weight, then getting slimmer would definitely help reduce the load on your joints.



Have you tried picking up a 5 gallon container of water and carrying it around all day, well that is what carrying an extra 4 stone is like, been there and done it. Like Colin my knees feel far better without it.


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## ColinJ (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> Have you tried picking up a 5 gallon container of water and carrying it around all day, well that is what carrying an extra 4 stone is like, been there and done it. Like Colin my knee's feel far better without it.


I made that point to a skinny mate on a training camp - link!


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## fossyant (31 Jan 2014)

Volterol gel is very good. Went through loads before my shoulder got fixed. Taking a topical gel is better long term than tablets, as you are treating a localised area, rather than injesting it. That said I'm on quite a fair amount of ibuprofen tablets at the moment.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

fossyant said:


> Volterol gel is very good. Went through loads before my shoulder got fixed. Taking a topical gel is better long term than tablets, as *you are treating a localised area*, rather than injesting it. That said I'm on quite a fair amount of ibuprofen tablets at the moment.


Wrong, see my posts above.


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## screenman (31 Jan 2014)

bromptonfb said:


> Wrong, see my posts above.



It seems if you use a lot over a large area you are correct. However it does appear to work by absorption into a localized area as well. 

Mentholatum ibuprofen gel contains the active ingredient ibuprofen, which is a type of medicine called a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID). Ibuprofen is a simple painkilling medicine used to relieve mild to moderate pain and inflammation.

Ibuprofen works by blocking the action of a substance in the body called cyclo-oxygenase (COX). Cyclo-oxygenase is involved in the production of various chemicals in the body, some of which are known as prostaglandins. Prostaglandins are produced in response to injury and certain diseases and conditions, and cause pain, swelling and inflammation. Ibuprofen blocks the production of these prostaglandins and is therefore effective at reducing inflammation and pain.

When ibuprofen is applied to the skin (topical application) it is absorbed through the skin into the underlying tissues, where it reduces pain and inflammation in the local area.

Mentholatum ibuprofen gel can be used to relieve the pain of muscular and joint conditions such as sprains, strains, backache and rheumatism. It should be massaged gently into the affected area.

Ibuprofen is absorbed less into the bloodstream from preparations that are applied to the skin than from preparations that are taken by mouth (see end of factsheet), however absorption can still occur, particularly if large amounts are used on large areas. 


Read more: http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/seniors-health/medicines/mentholatum-ibuprofen-gel.html#ixzz2rzrKNjGk 
Follow us: @NetDoctor on Twitter | NetDoctorUK on Facebook


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (31 Jan 2014)

screenman said:


> It seems if you use a lot over a large area you are correct. However it does appear to work by absorption into a localized area as well.
> 
> Mentholatum ibuprofen gel contains the active ingredient ibuprofen, which is a type of medicine called a non-steroidal anti-inflammatory drug (NSAID). Ibuprofen is a simple painkilling medicine used to relieve mild to moderate pain and inflammation.
> 
> ...


A well documented placebo effect of applying a soft gel with other additives to local areas, the active ingredient ibuprofen still needs to be systemic. It is worth noting though that in a very recent double blind study of a 100 soldiers found that ibuprofen gel was as effective for soft tissue discomfort as 400 mg doses of tablets - this is a good thing as it means less active ingredient in your system for the same therapeutic effect.


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