# New MTB needed



## rich p (30 Jun 2018)

My trusty old Dawes is going to be passed on to a needy youngster so I'm going to need a new one. 
I'm 5'7" and probably shrinking. 
Is any wheel size suitable or would a smaller one be better?
Up to a £1000 for a hardtail, I'm thinking. Any advice or recommendations?


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## Crackle (30 Jun 2018)

They're all going to be quite different to your old Dawes now Rich. The established wheel sizes these days are 27.5, 29 and 27.5/29 plus. XC bikes are likely to be 27.5 but the geometry will be entirely different to the Dawes. Higher wider bars, slacker angles, better suspension, stiffer axles, 1x drivetrains, clutch mechs, hydraulic brakes, it'll be like coming from a Morgan to a Ferrari. Also, you'll get an 'All Mountain' full susser for that money and it won't be a bag of shyte either.

Presumably this is just for off road, South Downs type stuff?


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## Venod (30 Jun 2018)

Crackle said:


> XC bikes are likely to be 27.5



I agree he is going to find modern MTB's a big improvement over his old Dawes, but I thought the best XC bikes were 29's. I realise they are available with 27.5 wheels, don't know if you can buy a new 26 inch wheel anymore, but a lot of people still prefer the smaller wheels for ease of handling and less weight. 

I think the OP should try a few with different sized wheels and see what he prefers.

https://www.bike-components.de/blog/en/2017/04/29er-a-must-have-for-every-xc-trail-rider/


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## Crackle (30 Jun 2018)

Afnug said:


> I agree he is going to find modern MTB's a big improvement over his old Dawes, but I thought the best XC bikes were 29's. I realise they are available with 27.5 wheels, don't know if you can buy a new 26 inch wheel anymore, but a lot of people still prefer the smaller wheels for ease of handling and less weight.
> 
> I think the OP should try a few with different sized wheels and see what he prefers.
> 
> https://www.bike-components.de/blog/en/2017/04/29er-a-must-have-for-every-xc-trail-rider/


Yes you're right, my mistake. Pure XC is the domain of 29er's now, long and relatively low.


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## rich p (30 Jun 2018)

Crackle said:


> They're all going to be quite different to your old Dawes now Rich. The established wheel sizes these days are 27.5, 29 and 27.5/29 plus. XC bikes are likely to be 27.5 but the geometry will be entirely different to the Dawes. Higher wider bars, slacker angles, better suspension, stiffer axles, 1x drivetrains, clutch mechs, hydraulic brakes, it'll be like coming from a Morgan to a Ferrari. Also, you'll get an 'All Mountain' full susser for that money and it won't be a bag of shyte either.
> 
> Presumably this is just for off road, South Downs type stuff?


Yes, I'm not intending to do anything dangerous or too technical. 
I've sat on a 29er and it felt like I was getting vertigo.
I'll try a few types in the local shops next week. We've got some good independents and Evans and Halfords.


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## Cycleops (30 Jun 2018)

You'd have to go a long way to get better value than this:
https://www.decathlon.co.uk/rockrider-920-mountain-bike-275-id_8366869.html
Sram 1x drive & Currently two hundred quid off.


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## Pale Rider (30 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> I've sat on a 29er and it felt like I was getting vertigo.




Wheel size is, in theory, irrelevant to fit because it has no bearing on the relationship between the three points of contact - saddle, pedals, handlebars.

Put another way, that's why Bromptons work for people of all sizes.

However, the experience of my local bike shop is that shorter people generally find 29er mountain bikes 'too big'.

Mountain bike tyres are deeper section than they used to be, which adds to the impression of height.


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## Crackle (30 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> Yes, I'm not intending to do anything dangerous or too technical.
> I've sat on a 29er and it felt like I was getting vertigo.
> I'll try a few types in the local shops next week. We've got some good independents and Evans and Halfords.


Maybe but a lot of them may feel quite strange compared to the Dawes. The feeling should be more of sitting 'in', than on. I shall have a peruse and come up with some suggestions.


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## Nigeyy (30 Jun 2018)

I'm going to be following this thread with interest; the last mtb I bought new was a 2011 Giant Trance (which I love) that is a 26er. Even back in 2011, the 26 was on its way out and I got a great deal on the bike which sealed the deal. As someone who isn't technically skilled nor racing, it was (and is) fine for me, and is still more than a bike than I am capable of. The geometry is slacker than I was used to from bikes back in the 90's, and the handlebars not as wide as they are now, and it does have a triple crank.

However, my ht is a 1996 Mongoose (back when they made decent frames) Rockadile that I've upgraded and upgraded, and I know it's had its last upgrade as decent 26 straight steerer forks are now getting to be relatively rare. And I'm assuming the next ht I'll be buying will be a more slack geometry, wider bars, 1x drive, thru axles, etc... (though I swapped over to hydraulic brakes a time ago now). And in a sort of way I'm looking forward to it as I see all of those things as incremental improvements that Crackle mentioned.

Rich P, hopefully you will post your impressions when you get your new ride and the differences you notice. I will definitely be interested!

Bit of a side note here: I've been riding off road since around 1991, and still ride some of the same places I used to ride. I remember the 90's versions of mtbs with no front suspension or really poor front suspension, more road like geometry, bad rim brakes, low and long stems, and narrow handlebars. I certainly recall some obstacles I used to find much more challenging than I do now as I just seem to float over them with no trouble at all, and feeling comfortable doing so (and this is with a 2011 bike!). While you can certainly argue that making things easier can remove the fun, I just think it means it gives you more confidence in tackling stuff you wouldn't have done back in 1991. I'm looking forward to trying the next iteration!


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## Venod (30 Jun 2018)

Cycleops said:


> Sram 1x drive





Nigeyy said:


> the next ht I'll be buying will be a more slack geometry, wider bars, 1x drive, thru axles, etc



The 1x drive on my Cannondale has just been swapped out for a double, I am much happier with the gearing now.


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## ChrisEyles (30 Jun 2018)

I love my 90s rigid Marin.... But I love my more modern HT even more. 

Have fun!


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## theclaud (30 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> Yes, I'm not intending to do anything dangerous


Yeah right. I've seen you ride back from the pub. Perhaps you should consider a Fat Bike for stability...


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## Crackle (30 Jun 2018)

And weight bearing.....


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## theclaud (30 Jun 2018)

Crackle said:


> And weight bearing.....


Cruel. And this thread was on such a helpful track.


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## rich p (30 Jun 2018)

Cycleops said:


> You'd have to go a long way to get better value than this:
> https://www.decathlon.co.uk/rockrider-920-mountain-bike-275-id_8366869.html
> Sram 1x drive & Currently two hundred quid off.


I rode last week with a young bloke on a 1x drive who said he found the gearing was fine on the ups but ran out downhill. He was no expert, in fairness though.


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## rich p (30 Jun 2018)

theclaud said:


> Yeah right. I've seen you ride back from the pub. Perhaps you should consider a Fat Bike for stability...



As my old mate used to say...

...Pah!


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## Levo-Lon (30 Jun 2018)

very nice bike here
https://www.halfords.com/cycling/bi...go-29er-mens-mountain-bike-16-18-20-22-frames


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## ChrisEyles (30 Jun 2018)

Those voodoo bizangos do seem to get rave reviews everywhere, if you're looking for a 29er rather than 27.5


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## Levo-Lon (1 Jul 2018)

Rutland have a summer sale upto 40% off


https://www.rutlandcycling.com/bike...ct&gclid=CMmk-eWk_dsCFUGMhQodZ1MNGg&gclsrc=ds


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## Cycleops (1 Jul 2018)

ChrisEyles said:


> I love my 90s rigid Marin.... But I love my more modern HT even more.
> 
> Have fun!


Give me a nineties rigid any day. Great to ride and cheap as chips.


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## Nigeyy (1 Jul 2018)

I can definitely see huge value in those 90's bikes. And let's face it, people did still mountain bike even when (gasp!) they didn't have suspension and they did have fun. If you hit things right you can find an absolute bargain, and smiles per mile and cost per mile can be unbeatable.

But.... I'll be honest. Given a choice between a reasonably specced modern mountain bike and even an absolute top of the line 90's bike, I know I'd want to ride the modern bike, every day of the week. Perhaps it's to do with me getting older and not wanting my fillings shaken or my back getting jostled 



Cycleops said:


> Give me a nineties rigid any day. Great to ride and cheap as chips.


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## Heltor Chasca (1 Jul 2018)

ChrisEyles said:


> Those voodoo bizangos do seem to get rave reviews everywhere, if you're looking for a 29er rather than 27.5



The above came a very close second to the Cube Acid I have. At the same me, Cube were offering high specs for incredible value. I got it in a sale too so the only disadvantage now is that I have no reason to sell it on, because it wouldn’t be cost effective however I looked at it. Very comfy.


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## Levo-Lon (1 Jul 2018)

Heltor Chasca said:


> The above came a very close second to the Cube Acid I have. At the same me, Cube were offering high specs for incredible value. I got it in a sale too so the only disadvantage now is that I have no reason to sell it on, because it wouldn’t be cost effective however I looked at it. Very comfy.



I nearly got one but the Marin deal was too good to miss even tho my budget got beat to death


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## I like Skol (3 Jul 2018)

Hi Rich. Late to the party as always, but as one old(ish) guy to another oldie, I suggest you think VERY carefully before getting a 1x set-up. IMO and based on just the small amounts of tinkering I have done on my son's new 1x11 rig I think you will miss the versatility of more than one chainring for all activities.


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## Nigeyy (3 Jul 2018)

But.... but.... but..... isn't that why you have a separate bike for each different activity?  



I like Skol said:


> Hi Rich. Late to the party as always, but as one old(ish) guy to another oldie, I suggest you think VERY carefully before getting a 1x set-up. IMO and based on just the small amounts of tinkering I have done on my son's new 1x11 rig I think you will miss the versatility of more than one chainring for all activities.


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## Crackle (3 Jul 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Hi Rich. Late to the party as always, but as one old(ish) guy to another oldie, I suggest you think VERY carefully before getting a 1x set-up. IMO and based on just the small amounts of tinkering I have done on my son's new 1x11 rig I think you will miss the versatility of more than one chainring for all activities.


The trouble is avoiding one these days, unless he builds his own.


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## Crackle (4 Jul 2018)

I'm struggling to come up with some ideas for you. The reason being is most manufacturers have moved towards trail setups now. It's hard to avoid long travel suspension and slack angles etc... I know you didn't like it but I'd look again at 29ers for an XC bike. They don't all do sizes appropriate for us shorter riders but they do exist. If you were closer you could borrow mine. Anyway, in the absence of an actual concrete recommendation, here's a load of reading you could probably have found yourself........

https://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/article/best-mountain-bikes-under-1000-45346/
https://magazine.bikesoup.com/the-best-hardtail-mountain-bikes-for-under-pound1000
https://www.rutlandcycling.com/cont...ikes-under-163-1000-our-picks-for-my2018.aspx


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## rich p (6 Jul 2018)

I've had a look in Evans today and they had a few 2x that looked possibilities. I'll post links when I'm sober and see what you think.


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## theclaud (6 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'll post links when I'm sober


How long do you think we've got?


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## I like Skol (6 Jul 2018)

Why wait, just purchase the one that takes your fancy right now......


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## I like Skol (6 Jul 2018)

theclaud said:


> How long do you think we've got?


More to the point, how long has he got? He's a little older than us you know.


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## rich p (6 Jul 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Why wait, just purchase the one that takes your fancy right now......


I take your point! I know little about mtb's compared with road bikes and I found it difficult to see a massive difference between £400 and £800 bikes. Maybe you get what you pay for? They were also too busy for me to have the patience to hang around for long enough to speak to any staff. 
I needed to hurry off to get a new mankini.


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## dan_bo (6 Jul 2018)

theclaud said:


> How long do you think we've got?


Hahaha


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## I like Skol (6 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I found it difficult to see a massive difference between £400 and £800 bikes.


Be careful!

My BIL bought a mountain bike a year or two ago and asked my advice. I obviously steered him towards a GT as I know and trust the brand andas there was two of the bikes I was suggesting already in my household I knew they were half decent. He went into Evans and bought a Norco for about £50 less than I was suggesting.
I just serviced it today and it is like a TANK! Honestly, it makes me think BSO when I rode it and it is ridiculously heavy. I can't remember what the price was but it would have been about the £400+ mark and it makes my wife's GT feel like a Pinarello in comparison. Wife's GT Avalanche Elite was £580 well spent pounds and I would almost guarantee you would have fun on it.


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## rich p (6 Jul 2018)

I took photos of 2 Norcos so thanks for the heads up.
I also looked at a Cube Attention SL and a Scott Scale 770


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## rich p (7 Jul 2018)

Sizing?
At 5' 7, 170 cm, the various size guides suggest a 16 inch frame.


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## Crackle (7 Jul 2018)

15/16 sounds about right to me. The difference in the prices above will probably be down to forks, mostly. As aminimum, try to get air forks, not Suntour, although their Raidon are ok. Rockshox xc30 and 28 are ok but not air forks, a little heavy and a bit boingy, so go for air and pay the extra.


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## Crackle (7 Jul 2018)

Oh and I've ridden a Cube Attention in the past. Decent bike but my overriding memory of it was it was quite short in the top tube, even for me, so I didn't like it.


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## Sittingduck (7 Jul 2018)

Hello

Am watching this it’s interest as I am in a similar position... got it down to a shortlist of 2 or 3.

I rode a Marin bobcat trail 4 or 5 with a single chainring at a trail centre this week and am not sure about the 1x setup either . This MTB lark is like an alien world I must say. Confusing set of options available but pleased this has pointed me in some kind of direction to research. Well done all and Rich good luck with whatever you decide upon!


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## fossyant (7 Jul 2018)

You need a HB160. Simples. Nothing else will do.


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## rich p (7 Jul 2018)

fossyant said:


> You need a HB160. Simples. Nothing else will do.


Is that a bike?


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## Nigeyy (8 Jul 2018)

It's a pencil. Make sure you get the softer lead for more technical trails. And a rubber thing at the top for erasing mistakes. A really short stubby one would tend to suggest it's been really used so I'd avoid it (though if it has a sharp point, it's been well maintained).



rich p said:


> Is that a bike?


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## fossyant (8 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Is that a bike?



Just google it - Hope HB160.


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## Sittingduck (9 Jul 2018)

Have you sobered up yet Rich?
Been super close to pulling the trigger a couple of times yesterday...
Love the look of the Marin Nail Trail 6 but think I want a 2x chainring. Diamondback Lumis might be a dark horse or a Cube Acid/LTD, arrrgh too many choices!


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## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

Sittingduck said:


> Have you sobered up yet Rich?
> Been super close to pulling the trigger a couple of times yesterday...
> Love the look of the Marin Nail Trail 6 but think I want a 2x chainring. Diamondback Lumis might be a dark horse or a Cube Acid/LTD, arrrgh too many choices!


Not yet Ducky. I need to have a look at some more but Crax slightly put me off the Cubes, possibly unjustifiably!
That Lumis looks a possibilty. Too much choice.
I've decided on a 2x and 27.5" wheels.


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## Sittingduck (11 Jul 2018)

Hi Rich. I threw caution to the wind and ordered an Orange Clockwork on Monday night and it turned up this very day. Gonna try it out quickly this afternoon before the match! 27.5 and 2x10. Looks like a peach, ironically.

I have had a Cube road bike in the past and fancied something different. Although the Marin was desirable too the 1x was a turnoff and happily got a Clockwork 120 with Rockshox Recon for 765 quid thanks to a Sale and a 10% discount on top.

Hopefully your search goes well, will give you some feedback on the new steed asap!


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## fossyant (11 Jul 2018)

Wrong answers.

Hope HB160. Slight issue is you might need to sell the wife, or rob a bank.


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## Crackle (13 Jul 2018)

Sittingduck said:


> Hi Rich. I threw caution to the wind and ordered an Orange Clockwork on Monday night and it turned up this very day. Gonna try it out quickly this afternoon before the match! 27.5 and 2x10. Looks like a peach, ironically.
> 
> I have had a Cube road bike in the past and fancied something different. Although the Marin was desirable too the 1x was a turnoff and happily got a Clockwork 120 with Rockshox Recon for 765 quid thanks to a Sale and a 10% discount on top.
> 
> Hopefully your search goes well, will give you some feedback on the new steed asap!


That's as good a recommendation as any Rich. I like Orange. Orange Clockwork 120, cool too. Actually....

See, I'm being positive. I realise my propensity to be negative, though not as negative as Bollo...


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## rich p (21 Jul 2018)

I've bitten the bullet too now, @Sittingduck
A Scott Aspect 710. I've only ridden it home on the roads as yet. Blimey those disc brakes are something else though.


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## Crackle (21 Jul 2018)

Oh I wouldn't have bought that one.....


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## I like Skol (22 Jul 2018)

Good component spec, should be a blast 

Did they not have any left in adult sizes?


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## rich p (22 Jul 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Good component spec, should be a blast
> 
> Did they not have any left in adult sizes?


Less far to the ground when I fall off Skolly...


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## Heltor Chasca (22 Jul 2018)

Very nice. Apart from maybe the paint job, tyres and the saddle, it is an almost identical version of my Cube Acid. Drop outs and rack/mudguard mounts the same too. Uncanny.


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