# Beta Blockers, Propranolol.



## zootnanook (31 Mar 2013)

I have been taking Propranolol for a few years now which was prescribed to me by my doctor for the prevention of migraine headaches but since I took up cycling I have looked into the beta blocker and it slows the heart and blocks the effects of adrenaline, my resting heart rate is around 45 - 50 bpm and I struggle to reach 135 bpm when climbing a steep hill. Does anyone else use this drug and have any advice on weather its good or bad. I will consult my own GP before I stop using it but was just wondering what others experiences were ?


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## SpokeyDokey (31 Mar 2013)

zootnanook said:


> I have been taking Propranolol for a few years now which was prescribed to me by my doctor for the prevention of migraine headaches but since I took up cycling I have looked into the beta blocker and it slows the heart and blocks the effects of adrenaline, my resting heart rate is around 45 - 50 bpm and I struggle to reach 135 bpm when climbing a steep hill. Does anyone else use this drug and have any advice on weather its good or bad. I will consult my own GP before I stop using it but was just wondering what others experiences were ?


 
Yes I use this drug - in conjunction with Carbimazole and Levothyroxine; basically a block and replace treatment for an over-active Thyroid.

More permanent treatment due when I can face up to it! (Radio-iodine treatment).

Basically the beta-blockers suppress heart rate in my case to stop it going into a permanent high rate of knots.

When using them I found that they basically suppressed my ability to climb and hike in the mountains - they put a lid on the amount of oxygen you can get around your system. Basically you feel knackered before you ought to!

Prior to a long hike I stop taking them for a few days and I perform much better. I am not recommending this to anyone but it's just what I do.

I hate the damn stuff tbh.


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## derrick (31 Mar 2013)

I was on bisoprolo, another beta blocker after a heart attack but they made me feel tired very quickly, had a word with the doc and he took me of them after about a month, feel so much better without them, but i would not stop taking them without the doctors say so. have a word with your doctor.


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## Fab Foodie (31 Mar 2013)

I take Atenolol after cardiac stenting and find that I can ride fairly well amongst peers of similar age and weight that don't take B-blockers.


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## deptfordmarmoset (31 Mar 2013)

Fab Foodie said:


> I take Atenolol after cardiac stenting and find that I can ride fairly well amongst peers of similar age and weight that don't take B-blockers.


Atenolol screwed me up good and proper when I changed to a nearer GP practice. They took my blood pressure and found I was extremely hypertensive. An initial dose of Atenolol dropped my BP for a while but it shot up shortly afterwards. Double the dose, same problem. Double it again. At this stage I could no longer get hold of enough adrenaline to get me through work - I was a pro double bass player and you really need a touch of adrenaline to get through a gig. I ended up only able to do one gig a week - I'd go out on a Friday and felt completely dead for the rest of the weekend. One gig a week is the end of a career.

It turns out that I have a severely constricted artery to my right kidney which, to judge by the scan images when they failed to put a stent in, was probably congenital. In crude terms, the kidney is starved of blood and tells the heart to send more blood which doesn't get there so it tells the heart to send more, etc, etc. A doctor friend advised trying a calcium channel blocker (they gave me felodipine) which doesn't suppress adrenaline and works by dilating blood vessels. Though it's not ideal, I've found it ''liveable'' compared to living death by atenolol. 

Now, I've no idea whether slightly dilated blood vessels might help for migraines but I would ask your GP for advice.


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## Albert (1 Apr 2013)

I take bisoprolol among other things and have had no adverse side effects. Talk to your specialist if possible, your GP might not be as "on the ball" re: how different drugs combine. I know that my GPs aren't.


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## shouldbeinbed (1 Apr 2013)

I used to be on propranolol for migraines and rode/functioned perfectly well on it. I'd have no qualms going back on but my attacks are clustered so I take a prescription knock em down early immigran type drug now rather than something constantly whether I need it or not day to day.


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## SpokeyDokey (1 Apr 2013)

shouldbeinbed said:


> I used to be on propranolol for migraines and rode/functioned perfectly well on it. I'd have no qualms going back on but my attacks are clustered so I take a prescription knock em down early immigran type drug now rather than something constantly whether I need it or not day to day.


 
Do you have clusters of Migraines or Cluster Headaches? Just out of interest.

My wife has Cluster Headaches and was diagnosed about 10 years back and they are the most awful things imaginable - they rate as the absolute limit of pain that a human can experience.

She originally thought they were migraines but the Neurologist who eventually became involved finally diagnosed them as CH's. She is quite an 'expert' on them now.

http://www.migrainetrust.org/factsheet-cluster-headache-10908

http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/cluster-headaches/Pages/Introduction.aspx

Some years ago, before diagnosis, I woke up at about 2pm in the morning, there was a horrible wailing noise coming from the garden - it turned out to be my wife literally smashing her head on the patio in an attempt to make the pain go away.

Some sufferers have been known to push their fingers into their eye sockets in an attempt to get at the pain.


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## david k (3 Apr 2013)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Yes I use this drug - in conjunction with Carbimazole and Levothyroxine; basically a block and replace treatment for an over-active Thyroid.
> More permanent treatment due when I can face up to it! (Radio-iodine treatment).
> Basically the beta-blockers suppress heart rate in my case to stop it going into a permanent high rate of knots.
> When using them I found that they basically suppressed my ability to climb and hike in the mountains - they put a lid on the amount of oxygen you can get around your system. Basically you feel knackered before you ought to!
> ...


 
been there mate, had RAI about 3 years ago


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## shouldbeinbed (3 Apr 2013)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Do you have clusters of Migraines or Cluster Headaches? Just out of interest.
> 
> My wife has Cluster Headaches and was diagnosed about 10 years back and they are the most awful things imaginable - they rate as the absolute limit of pain that a human can experience.
> 
> ...


I'd been diagnosed by my GP as cluster migraines and treated for the last 20 years as that, but your wife's experience and a quick skim of the first article is absolutely spot on for me, invariably over my left eye starting 4-5am and I can only describe it as feeling like having a railway spike driven into my head & through my eyeball, the pain is literally sickening. I can totally empathise with her banging her head and the eye socket thing, I bash the heels if my hands onto my head & press up on my sockets at the bridge of my nose as hard as possible, it often feels like there is an immense pressure building and building in there and you'll do anything to vent or try to shift it, logic goes straight out of the window. My wife has found me on several occasions curled up in the shower in the early hours whimpering like a dog with it as hot as I can bear it, pressed directly onto my head just trying to spread the pain about, to the point where I've scalded my scalp and forehead and just not noticed until the headache dies down.

It could explain why I get one or two in each spate that just overwhelm whatever medication I've been prescribed to routinely suppress or individually attack them.

Does she get low level regular headaches in the meantime between the cluster ones?


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## SpokeyDokey (3 Apr 2013)

shouldbeinbed said:


> I'd been diagnosed by my GP as cluster migraines and treated for the last 20 years as that, but your wife's experience and a quick skim of the first article is absolutely spot on for me, invariably over my left eye starting 4-5am and I can only describe it as feeling like having a railway spike driven into my head & through my eyeball, the pain is literally sickening. I can totally empathise with her banging her head and the eye socket thing, I bash the heels if my hands onto my head & press up on my sockets at the bridge of my nose as hard as possible, it often feels like there is an immense pressure building and building in there and you'll do anything to vent or try to shift it, logic goes straight out of the window. My wife has found me on several occasions curled up in the shower in the early hours whimpering like a dog with it as hot as I can bear it, pressed directly onto my head just trying to spread the pain about, to the point where I've scalded my scalp and forehead and just not noticed until the headache dies down.
> 
> It could explain why I get one or two in each spate that just overwhelm whatever medication I've been prescribed to routinely suppress or individually attack them.
> 
> Does she get low level regular headaches in the meantime between the cluster ones?


 
No, she does not get low level headaches at all.

You may need referring to a specialist - in our experience 3 GP's had no idea what my wife was going through.

Cluster headache suffers usually do a strange 'dance' when they are having an attack - pacing back and forth in a odd jittery fashion.

Some poor souls have these attacks every day of their lives - must be a nightmare.

Attacks are linked to the sufferers circadian rhythm - some people have them every day at the same time. Offer people have them every Spring, Autumn or both.

My wife has hers every 18 months for about 6 weeks at a time. Every attack starts at 1am on the button.

She uses Sumatriptan (which is also a Migraine treatment):

http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/cluster-headaches/Pages/Treatment.aspx

Tablets are a waste of time. They take at least 40 minutes to work by which time she is at her wits end.

Inhalers work in about 15 minutes and injections take about 2 mins. She uses the injections a lot - it's a bit of a battle to get a good stock from the GP as they are expensive.

Once the drugs have 'hit' you would be hard pressed to know how much pain she was in aminute or two beforehand.

She takes anti-nausea drugs (which occasionally make her sick!) to counteract any side effects of the Sumatriptan - these drugs totally flatten her though.

I'd go and get a good diagnosis if I were you,

Further reading - this is a first class resource:

http://www.clusterheadaches.com/

Good luck with getting your problem sorted!


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## Davidc (3 Apr 2013)

I've been on Bisoprolol since a heart attack 4 years ago, and it does have an effect on riding. The effect isn't severe and I can ride with similar ability people.

My GP gives the nod (but not formal agreement) to a week off if I'm doing a big ride. The formal version is, I'm told, that once you're on Beta Blockers you're supposed to be on them for life


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## Albert (4 Apr 2013)

Davidc said:


> The formal version is, I'm told, that once you're on Beta Blockers you're supposed to be on them for life


 
Correct.


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## Davidc (4 Apr 2013)

Albert said:


> Correct.


I've never understood why. Do you know?


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## deptfordmarmoset (4 Apr 2013)

I got off beta blockers - by switching to calcium channel antagonists - so there are exceptions.


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## Rob3rt (4 Apr 2013)

Albert said:


> Correct.


 
It depends why you are on them........ to be absolutelly awkward


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## david k (4 Apr 2013)

Rob3rt said:


> It depends why you are on them........ to be absolutelly awkward


true, i was on them then got sorted and come off, was surprised to read some people think you have to stay on them once you start, surely as you say it depends on why your on them in the first place


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## Fab Foodie (4 Apr 2013)

Albert said:


> Correct.


 Not totally, my Cardiologist thinks my stenting has worked so well that I should be able to come off B-blockers completely after some tests to confirm his thoughts.


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## Albert (6 Apr 2013)

Research has shown (we have had several lectures from different visiting consultants in out annual patient's heart conferences) that if you have had a heart attack many of the pills which are initially prescribed - beta blockers/statins etc - continue to have an ongoing protective function after the event, even though they are no longer required for their initial function due to the increased health of the patient. So, if there are no serious side effects, we are advised to continue with these medications in perpetuity.
I could stop all my pills tomorrow if I wanted to with no immediate ill effects - needless to say I haven't. The outcomes in this area are simply outstanding relative to other UK areas.


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## david k (6 Apr 2013)

sorry albert, are you talking about only after a heart attack? as this wasnt what was originally posted


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## sazzaa (12 Jan 2014)

Have been put on Propranolol for chest tightness, feeling a bit short of breath and slightly high blood pressure. Scared to get on the bike in case i get totally out of breath... Any advice? Am i being irrational?


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## vickster (12 Jan 2014)

When did you start taking them? What did your Dr say about cycling? Perhaps go slowly and with someone else if concerned. Or speak to the Dr

I have taken them for situational anxiety - have panic attacks on aeroplanes if it's bumpy  Albeit a very low dose, as I naturally have BP on the low side


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## sazzaa (12 Jan 2014)

vickster said:


> When did you start taking them? What did your Dr say about cycling? Perhaps go slowly and with someone else if concerned. Or speak to the Dr
> 
> I have taken them for situational anxiety - have panic attacks on aeroplanes if it's bumpy  Albeit a very low dose, as I naturally have BP on the low side


Didn't even think to mention cycling, stupidly... Been on them since Thurs and have to go back in a week or two. So far i'm not noticing any difference to symptoms..


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## vickster (12 Jan 2014)

I'd maybe wait until you see the Dr again

Most pills taken chronically take a bit longer to have an effect


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## sazzaa (13 Jan 2014)

Well, cycled in today, seemed slightly more of a struggle than usual and felt a bit more out of breath, but since I'm going on a snow holiday in a couple of weeks I need to have some level of fitness. Glad I didn't die!


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## vickster (13 Jan 2014)

Dying would not have been good, especially if you've already paid for the holiday!


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