# Tent recommendations



## LouiseL (17 Aug 2010)

Hello,

I am a complete camping novice- I've never camped in my life even as a kid so please be patient. 

I'm looking into cycle touring in France next year and camping seems to be the cheapest option (excluding the initial outlay). I thought I'd start with the big item first-what tent? I've done a lot of looking (on the 'net only at the moment) and am drawn towards the Terra Nova Laser. The tent will be just for me plus gear. Has anyone any experience of this tent in any of its various incarnations. My initial feeling is that the Laser would be fine size wise but that the Laser competition or photon could be a bit cramped. Whilst I'm not looking to hold a party in the tent I do need to consider that if it rains several evenings on the trot I could potentially be spending a lot of time in it. I am but a weak and feeble female so tent weight is a big issue for me. 

The other tent that caught my eye is the Big Agnes seedhouse SL2. Its bigger but packs smaller -presumably due to its mesh inner tent (would that be a tad chilly say in Scotland) but weighs more at 1.6kg. The Laser is 1.24kg so I think that's about a Lb difference( I'm showing my age- I have to keep playing with bags of sugar when talking in Kgs or it's meaningless). That isn't much on its own but the extra would need to be bourne in mind along with the weights of my other kit decisions.

Any comments or other suggestions gratefully received.

I'll be getting to sleeping bags/mats later....


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## snorri (17 Aug 2010)

LouiseL said:


> Terra Nova Laser. The tent will be just for me plus gear. Has anyone any experience of this tent in any of its various incarnations.


I have used a Laserlite (one person tent) for several tours now and am fully satisfied with it and consider the space adequate for my height of 177cm.. I tour with four panniers and a bar bag, and usually leave the panniers in the porch area between the inner and outer tent, so am able to get all my gear off the bike and under cover at night and still leave room to lie down.
Terra Nova seem to keep changing the specs and names of their tents, but when i bought the Laserlite it was advertised as a 1+ person , 3 season backpacking tent, all in weight 1.14Kg.
I had a Terra Nova Solar before, and found it satisfactory too, but it began to suffer from fair wear and tear so I changed to the Laserlite which is a little lighter, but still adequate for summer usage.


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## RoadMing (17 Aug 2010)

Depending on how many of you are going, ie, if more than just yourself I would most definately consider a Hilleberg Nammatj GT. http://www.hilleberg.se/default-e.HTM

Very light weight, will sleep 2 with space to spare and has room for your bikes in the porch area. A BIG winner is the fact that it packs away amazingly easily, better than any other tent I have used.

They are not cheap, but you get what you pay for with tents. First time campers can be put off by a bad experience in a poor quality tent on their first trips. To a degree this tent is an investment.

Have fun !

*
*


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## Joe (17 Aug 2010)

I used the Laser Competition for the first time on my recent Spain/France tour and was quite impressed. It is LIGHT. The material is scary thin but seems very robust and the whole thing is well constructed. It took a few nights before I figured out how best to pitch it (in terms of tension etc) but I also had no particularly adverse weather to test it.

In terms of size it was fine for me (5ft 9). I can sit up in the centre and like Snorri I kept four panniers between the inner and outer and still had room to get in and out. I didn't risk cooking in the porch with my whisperlite, but sat in there with the stove outside when it was raining which was fine.

The pegs (whilst light) are not much use and I'd recommend replacing them. The only thing I don't like is fitting the waterproof hood which is really fiddly and time consuming. Could also do with a pocket in the inner for valuables but it really is designed with weight in mind so I can understand it's ommission.

If you're worried about weight it's a really good option imo and I can't imagine it letting you down. Hard to say whether the extra room of the Laser would be worth it for you...


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## jay clock (17 Aug 2010)

The difficulty is that it needs a big commitment to and outlay OR buy cheap and light! I have now got my bits down to

Decathlon T2 Ultralight Pro tent. 1.8kg, says 2 people but that would be very snug. They were £80, currently down to £60. Buying online can be done in theory but not ideal. The built in ground sheet is better quality than some (my North Face essentially has the same material as the fly sheet, so I had to carry an extra ground sheet, making total weight well over 3.3kg.) I added a couple of these half along the side of the flysheet to allow me to peg the fly more tautly outwards http://www.rvops.co.uk/clingons-1944.html A trip to Deckie is WELL WORTH IT for all sports stuff!

I have PHD designs Minim sleeping back. Obscenely pricey. But VERY light. I have a silk liner too which I like and it adds flexibility. If I do slightly cooler touring, I may have to go for ANOTHER PHD bag!

Sleeping mat, it depends what you can stand, but I never got on with Thermarest. I now have an Exped Downmat 7 which is fantastic. Bear in mind that mats offer insulation from cold ground as much as they offer comfort. Reviews of the Downmat here http://www.trailspace.com/gear/exped/downmat-7/

I also have a Decathlon ultralight inflatable pillow. Under a fiver, amazingly good if used with a pillowcase and wrapped in a fleece. I am fussy about pillows!

my reports on all this are here http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/doc/page/?o=RrzKj&page_id=104184&v=4B

CGOAB is a great place to look too!

Happy touring


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## andrew_s (17 Aug 2010)

A problem with the TN Laser on a bike is that the carbon end poles are quite long (55cm ish) and are not quick to remove / reinstall in the outer.
That would probably mean you'd have to carry the tent along the top of the rack with the end poled poking out the back in a somewhat vulnerable manner.

Laser Comp poles end are about 45cm


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## LouiseL (17 Aug 2010)

Hi,

Thanks for the replies.

RoadMing- I have had a good look at the Hilleberg tents as I have heard very good things about them. Their only downside for me and my planned tent usage is the weight. The lightest is the Akto at 1.6Kg and that is the only one I could realistically consider. The fact that they are expensive wouldn't be an issue- as you say it would be an investment and I think you tend to get what you pay for. It's similar in internal size to the Laser Competition but that only weighs 0.92Kg so as a female carrying all her own gear there is just no contest between the 2. If I were going on one of those expensive holidays where they cart all your stuff for you from one stop to the next each day then the Nammatj GT would have been just the ticket as weight would not matter.

Good to hear that the Terra Nova brand is reliable in the case of the various Laser tents. I will have a good look at the Laser Competition now as a result of your remarks Joe. Thanks. I hadn't appreciated that you could fit 4 panniers in the "porch space" and still be able to get in and out which is why the Laser looked a better option. I'm only a shortass so headroom and length is unlikely to be a problem. I use 2 panniers (front sized but carried on the rear) and a bar bag usually and hope to be able to strap tent plus bedding bits to the top of the rear rack. If this is going to be a problem with the Laser as Andrew S suggests then the Competition is looking favorite so far.

Joe- I saw your thread about your trip. Those cols with 4 panniers, a bar bag and a tent! OMG my legs hurt just thinking about it! Chapeau mate.

Jay Clock- Thanks for the sleeping kit recommendations I will check them out along with the website you recommended. LIGHT is good for me! Your tent at 1.8Kg is too heavy though. 

Thanks again for all your help everyone. It's very much appreciated.


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## willem (17 Aug 2010)

I assume from your original post that this is for solo use, and that you are prepared to spend some money. I also agree that going light weight is the way to go, and the more so the older you get. As for tents, there are a couple of really good solo tents and they all have their pros and cons:
The TN Laser is one of them. It is not the most spacious one, and it is not the last one that wil be blown off the mountain, but it is a good and light tent.
The Hilleberg Akto is the Granddaddy of this category, and it is a bit larger and a bit heavier, but it will also be the last one to be blown of that imaginary mountain.
The Helsport Ringstind Light is another Scandinavian quality offering, at the same weight as the Akto, but quite a bit more spacious (and taller). Nearly as bombproof as the Akto, but probably not quite.
The Vaude Power Lizard, brand new design, very light and spacious, but not very tall. Last month in Norway the one I saw was flapping rather a lot in the wind.
MSR Hubba HP (only get the HP version). Good ventilation, light, a bit narrow, but great volume. Inner first pitching in US style.
Avoid mesh inner tents. You will freeze in the UK.
If you want a tent that you can also use for two (just), and that is still very light, I think the MSR Hubba Hubba HP or the Ringstind 2 are the most interesting.

Sleeping bags: PHD are probably the best. Alpkit Pidedream is a decent imitation for rather less.
mattress: Thermarest Neoair for the summer, very light at 410 grams, and very compact, but too cold below about 5 degrees. For that, the new Exped Synmat Basic is the lightest (and cheapest) alternative at 660 grams (down to minus 5, I would guess). I think it represents the sweet spot for most cyclists as it will be fine at higher altitudes or in Spring and Autumn. For really cold weather there is the heavier and bulkier Exped Downmat.
It is important to keep sleeping gear compact, as it will have to go inside the panniers. With compact stuff, you can easily avoid front panniers and lowrider rack (2-2.5 kg, empty, and at least 100 pounds - use that money to buy lighter and more compact gear instead).

Pannier bags. Here too go lightweight. The lightest high quality bags I know are the new special edition Ortlieb Plus panniers sold by this German internet shop: http://www.outdoorwo...et_lang&lang=en They lack the superfluous interior pocket, and as a result they are cheaper and lighter (about 1350 grams a set for the rear ones, the weight on the shop's website is erroneoulsy higher). Completely waterproof and bombenfest.

Stove. I like alcohol/meths stoves for easy availability of fuel. Classic is the Trangia 27 UL HA (get the right version, and not the cheaper heavier one). It is excellent for real meals, but on the heavy side. The Clikstand is a lighter alcohol stove. If you want to use gas, your problem is that the French use a different standard for the cannisters. The new Primus Express Duo (mark the DUO) is not yet on their site but I have had one in my hands in a shop, and it will use both Coleman Primus etc threaded canisters and the French Camping Gaz click cannisters (not the puncture type, for that Edelrid make adapters). The Trangia 27 UL HA pots are separately available, and are extremely light with much better heat dispersion than Titanium. Burner, a pot and a frying pan, a grip and a windscreen would be about 320 grams together. DO not cook inside the tent. Tents are highly flammable, and these stoves give off dangerous levels of CO.
Enjoy
Willem


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## MockCyclist (17 Aug 2010)

LouiseL said:


> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for the replies.
> 
> ...


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## MockCyclist (17 Aug 2010)

Oops: Now I see how easy it is to duplicate someone's post ! Anyway, here's my intended reply:

I also have the TN Laser Comp and it's ok for me at 1.75m. Four panniers fit in the "porch", bar bags lives in with me, but you can't really do much else in the tent but lie down and rest.
The whole package including poles fits into my pannier, I prefer that to strapping things to the rack.
The supposedly optional waterproof hood is a bit fiddly. I take three small foldback paper clips and use those to clip the hood around the hoop instead of trying to use the shoelace cords which failed very early on.

I toured with someone with an Akto once, there's no doubt it's a superior quality tent, heavier, a shade more room I think, and quicker to erect. Waterproof hood is built in. I'd still pick my TN for the weight saving though.


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## Dave Davenport (17 Aug 2010)

For a first time tour in Europe I don't see the point in spending more than £50 to £80 on a tent (you could get away with £20). We're heading to Portsmouth to get the ferry to Bilbao in about an hour and our trusty Vango which we paid £75 for four years ago is going to be home for the two week trip back.


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## RoadMing (17 Aug 2010)

LouiseL said:


> RoadMing- I have had a good look at the Hilleberg tents as I have heard very good things about them. Their only downside for me and my planned tent usage is the weight. The lightest is the Akto at 1.6Kg and that is the only one I could realistically consider. The fact that they are expensive wouldn't be an issue- as you say it would be an investment and I think you tend to get what you pay for. It's similar in internal size to the Laser Competition but that only weighs 0.92Kg so as a female carrying all her own gear there is just no contest between the 2. If I were going on one of those expensive holidays where they cart all your stuff for you from one stop to the next each day then the Nammatj GT would have been just the ticket as weight would not matter.



Hi Louise,

I have to admit to never actually reading the quoted weight of the Nammatj, but I have to say, I am astounded as to how light it actually is when packed away, the poles and pegs are very light, perhaps visit a stockist and see in the flesh. I don't think you'd have any issues carrying it on a rack at all. I would stress again the ease of packing it away, which is always a biggy when space saving is paramount. For me it ticks all the boxes, I carry it on the bottom of my rucksack when trekking on foot and I find it lighter, or perhaps easier to handle than my other tent, Force ten Vortex, which is considerably smaller. It also dries very quickly.

Ok, I'll climb off my Hilleberg soapbox now and await my cheque from their PR dept!


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## willem (17 Aug 2010)

This is an interesting discussion, because Louise has clearly indicated that she means business about going pretty light. I thoroughly agree that lighter is better, and Louise has given her highly plausible reasons for it. If this is what you want, then clearly you have to take that stance on each and every gear decision. This is what I lately have been doing with my own gear, and it has brought great weight reductions. At the same time, the law of diminishing returns is kicking in. How much comfort are you prepared to give up for how much weight reduction? I have achieved great reductions with my sleeping equipment, with my cooking gear, and with my clothing. In part I achieved this by leaving stuff at home, and in part by getting fancy lightweight stuff like a PHD sleeping bag. I have not yet bought a solo tent (we have several larger tents in the family, and it seemed a bit of a waste to buy yet another, even if lighter). So that is why I am interested. I know the Laser Competition is about the lightest, and that would make a real difference. But do I want to sleep in something that is little more than a body bag? And do I want to sleep in something that is not as robust as the Nammatj 3 GT that my wife and I sleep in, or my son's 2.6 kg Helsport Rondane 3 that I borrowed for my recent Norway trip? I don't know yet. The seduction of a light tent like the Laser Competition is almost irresistable, but I have seen enough of them to know it would be horribly cramped. How do I bend my old bones to get inside at all? Would a Helsport Ringstind 2 Light at 1.7 kg but so much more space not be far more sensible? I would notice the difference in weight, but it would not be that much compared to the Rondane. Is the tent not one of those areas where a little bit more weight really adds a lot of comfort?
Willem


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## LouiseL (17 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> Would a Helsport Ringstind 2 Light at 1.7 kg but so much more space not be far more sensible? I would notice the difference in weight, but it would not be that much compared to the Rondane. Is the tent not one of those areas where a little bit more weight really adds a lot of comfort?
> Willem



Hi I really do agree with you on this Willem which is why my initial thoughts were towards the bigger but "only" a Lb heavier Laser rather than the lighter and smaller Laser Competition. However I have been told by Andrew S that the pole length of the Laser is awkward for carrying on a rack compared to the Competition and the Akto whilst undoubtably likely to be much more comfy than the Comp isn't bigger enough to justify the additional weight penalty _for me._ I equate it to being able to carry another item eg the mattress " for free". I am prepared to put up with a flappy, noisy plastic coffin to sleep in for ease of portage as once I'm asleep I won't notice! I don't relish the thought of spending a long evening stuck it it if it's raining though- but that would hold true anyway and even with a slightly bigger sturdier feeling tent.

Thanks for all your recommendations for the other gear which I will have fun checking out. 

I already use Ortlieb classic rollers as panniers and the Ortlieb barbag. Totally waterproof (where my gore overshoes were not). Ace bit of kit and worth their weight in gold! My tour companions panniers although brand new let in loads of water and broke!

As for stove recommendations I need to look into that as well. Alcohol fuelled is the only sort I fancy unless someone has a compelling argument against. I like simple and easily available. Are you saying I could use a Clickstand burner with the trangia pots etc and the windshield in a sort of mix and match arrangement which would work out lighter than the Trangia 27 kit (which I think was 720g for the lightest version from memory with the mini being 330g ). Sorry to be thick about this but I've only ever stayed at youth hostels with the bike and done no camping so I really haven't a clue!


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## Crankarm (17 Aug 2010)

I bought a Vaude Taurus Ultralight 2 weighing 1.9kg for my 3 week tour of the Pyrenees on my Brompton in 2004. It was brilliant. Just right for one although a two person tent. Porch was large enough to stow my bike and some luggage, the rest in the tent with me. It kept me dry in some quite heavy rain and was rock solid in strong wind. But I guess it will be too heavy for the OP. If weight is such an issue for the OP why doesn't she just carry her credit card and stay in Formula1 or cheap hotels or auberges? This way she would probably be fine with just a small pair of panniers and bar bag on her bike.


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## willem (17 Aug 2010)

Hi Louise,
I can see your arguments. If you want something bigger for not much more weight, I think the Vaude Power Lizard is the one to look at if you are not too tall (but my friend who used one in Norway is actually one of these tall Dutchmen and he thinks it is fine). It is 1.1 kg. The Helsport Ringstind light 1 is the same weight as the Akto, but a lot and I mean a lot, bigger. You choose. The MSR Hubba Hp at 1.4 kg does not have more floorspace, but almost vertical walls and a high roof with apparently relatively good ventilation. As for packed size, I keep my tent outside the panniers, because the tent is bound to be wet and dirty. The Helsport Rondane packs very small (short pole pieces), and the same applies to the Ringstind.
As for alcohol stoves, you are dead right that the Trangia 27 is heavy. But it is also a very good stove for cooking nice real meals from fresh ingredients. I at least am not going to countries like France or Italy to only eat freeze dried ready meals. See here for the Clikstand, with some as yet unanswered questons on my part: http://www.hikinginf...passaround.html The Caldera Cone is another even lighter alcohol stove, but also even less suitable for real food. These are stoves for US weekend warriors who hike into the mountains for a long weekend, taking freeze dried meals that they only need to dissolve in water and heat (grrrrr...).
Hard choices, but I am sure your trip will be great, whatever you choose. And you are dead right that quality camping gear is an excellent investment. And camping is so beautiful. Enjoy,
Willem


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## willem (17 Aug 2010)

As for hotels etc: the weight penalty for camping with light gear is some 3 kg at most: 1 kg for a sleeping bag and mattress, just over 1 kg for a tent, and just under 1 kg for stove, pots and fuel. So there is no reason not to camp, provided you keep it light.
Willem


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## andym (17 Aug 2010)

LouiseL said:


> Hi I really do agree with you on this Willem which is why my initial thoughts were towards the bigger but "only" a Lb heavier Laser rather than the lighter and smaller Laser Competition. However I have been told by Andrew S that the pole length of the Laser is awkward for carrying on a rack compared to the Competition and the Akto whilst undoubtably likely to be much more comfy than the Comp isn't bigger enough to justify the additional weight penalty _for me._ I equate it to being able to carry another item eg the mattress " for free". I am prepared to put up with a flappy, noisy plastic coffin to sleep in for ease of portage as once I'm asleep I won't notice! I don't relish the thought of spending a long evening stuck it it if it's raining though- but that would hold true anyway and even with a slightly bigger sturdier feeling tent.



I have a LaserLarge (which I assume is larger than the Competition) Yes the poles are a bit long, so it doesn't fold down really compact, but I manage to fit the tent lengthwise on my rack without too much trouble. The extra room more than makes up for any inconvenience on the carrying front. So I wouldn't rule out the Laser on this ground alone.

I must admit that my trade-off would be the other way round: if you gave me the choice between a tent that is easy to carry but a pain in the arse if you are stuck in it on a rainy day vs a tent that is slightly bulkier (as is the LaserLarge) but more spacious I would go for the more spacious.

Having said all of that I'm a bit intrigued by some of the thinking coming out of the US where there seems to be a bit of a tendency back towards light, well-ventilated single-skin tents. OK a "well-ventilated" tent is not what you want in the Scottish Highlands, but if you are only planning to cycle in the summer in warmenr countries then there could be something in it.

I also have a certain amount of sympathy with Dave Davenport's view. If you have never camped before, it may make more sense to get something cheaper (and inevitably a bit heavier) so you can work out what you want in your _next_ tent. I know that sounds a bit wasteful (although if the tent is in good nick you can probably eBay it). But most of us work out through a process of trial and error what works for us and what doesn't work. Decathlon do good medium weight tents (and I would highly recommend their "ultralight" range of sleeping bags and sleeping mats). 



> As for stove recommendations I need to look into that as well. Alcohol fuelled is the only sort I fancy unless someone has a compelling argument against. I like simple and easily available. Are you saying I could use a Clickstand burner with the trangia pots etc and the windshield in a sort of mix and match arrangement which would work out lighter than the Trangia 27 kit (which I think was 720g for the lightest version from memory with the mini being 330g ). Sorry to be thick about this but I've only ever stayed at youth hostels with the bike and done no camping so I really haven't a clue!



Bear in mind though, that while alcohol is easier to get hold of, gas can be more efficient (especially if you get one of the newer generation of heat exchanger stoves from Jetboil or what's theirnames in Sweden), so on a longer tour gas may be a lighter alternative. (I know I will bring down the wrath of the Trangia Taliban on my head for saying this but) also there are plenty of lighter alternatives to Trangias (eg Caldera cone) have a look at backpackinglight.co.uk for the alternatives. There's nowt wrong with Trangias, and there are lots of happy campers with them, but consider the alternatives too. And when it comes to alternatives, IME a wood gas stove is well worth considering - again check out backpackinglight.co.uk


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## willem (17 Aug 2010)

In real life the weight differences between stove types are paled into significance by the logistics of fuel acquisition. How sure can you be that you can find your fuel the next days, or do you need to buy it now, just in case? This is where alcohol shines (in France). Wood is even lighter, unless you need to hoard it because supplies are insecure. I have a 1 litre bottle of alcohol for my stove in a Bikebuddy under the down tube of my bike.
W


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## andym (17 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> In real life the weight differences between stove types are paled into significance by the logistics of fuel acquisition. How sure can you be that you can find your fuel the next days, or do you need to buy it now, just in case? This is where alcohol shines (in France). Wood is even lighter, unless you need to hoard it because supplies are insecure. I have a 1 litre bottle of alcohol for my stove in a Bikebuddy under the down tube of my bike.
> W




As with everything in life there are swings and roundabouts. My experience in France is that alcohol is most easily available in litre bottles. At a rough guess a litre of alcohol probably weighs as much as, if not more than, a couple of gas cylinders. So there's no knock-out winner.

A lot depends also on how much cooking you are going to do. IME if you are a lazy sod and only want to boil water for coffee in the mornings then a single gas cylinder will last for ages. If you do a lot of cooking then easy availability if going to be more of an issue, and buying alcohol by the litre much less of an issue. 

If you do go for gas, get an adapter for camping gaz puncture cartridges (whatever psmiffy says about M. Bricolage).


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## P.H (17 Aug 2010)

For a tiny weight penalty, the TN Voyager Superlight (1.54kg) would seem like luxury compared to the Lasers;

http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/Product_Type/Tents/Superlite_Tents/Voyager_Superlite_Green.html

If you buy any TN tent, did you know you can get a 30% trade in?

http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/Product_Information/Tent_Trade_In.html


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## jay clock (17 Aug 2010)

fwiw it is worth my Decathlon tent packs down TINY. 40cm and fits fine in my Ortliebs


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## willem (18 Aug 2010)

Interesting Terra Nova offer indeed. Thier Voyager ul is a very nice tent, and it is extremely stable in high winds. The bad news is that it is an uncompromisingly "inner first" pitching tent. That means that when it rains when you are pitching it or when you are taking it down, the inner will get wet. My Hilleberg and Helsport tents have inner and outer connected, so you can pitch both together. If it rains when you need to take it down, you can disconnect the inner, and take it down separately. By the way, the Tarptent Scarp is another possibility.
Willem


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## TwoInTow (18 Aug 2010)

Quick hijack - Jay Clock, I read your journal on CGOAB and see that you also live in Winchester. I also see that you are very fit! I, sadly, am not, but am looking to increase my rides. I wonder if I could PM you and get some suggestions for good rides around here? 100Km ones are too much for me at the moment, so maybe I'm just beneath your league, but I thought you might know!

Back on the tents: Like the OP I am a total novice camper and did my first tour this summer. We invested in a Hilleberg for us and a cheaper thing from Blacks for the kids. The difference in quality was _huge_. The ventilation in the Hilleberg was great, so there was very little condensation in the mornings, and it was totally comfortable to be in even on the day when it rained all morning, and all 4 of us had to sit in there and play cards. The kids' tents suffered from loads of condensation and for some reason it was really difficult to tension the tent so that the outer wasn't touching the inner anywhere by mornings. Eventually we got the hang of it, but you had to be super careful, whereas the Hilleberg just seemed to _work_. Also, the tent got very stuffy really quickly... As the kids were kind of rough with the tent, I'm happy to have got a cheap one for them, but also very happy to have taken the plunge on an expensive one for us.


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## willem (18 Aug 2010)

I am similarly impressed by Hilleberg (but Helsport is as good, and almost as expensive). Our Keron 4 GT family tent survided 10 years of abuse, and a lot of sunshine (with more rest and play days family tents are not taken down as often, so get a much higher UV exposure). After those ten years some zippers were beginning to fail, but what killed it was the UV damage to the flysheet. I think that was a good run for the money. Now that the kids have their own tents, we bought a smaller Nammatj 3 GT for ourselves (my wife does not share my weight obsession). Again, the quality is fantastic, and even the roughest weather means nothing to it.
Willem


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## 3tyretrackterry (18 Aug 2010)

I appreciate peoples attitude towards weight but will 700-1000 grams really make that much difference and also is it worth paying the sometimes vast amounts of money needed to save this weight.
I have followed this thread but will freely admit to not having massive experience with cycle camping though have carried my home on my back enough times to hopefully have some valid input

has the OP considered some of the adventure racing tents if she really needs lightweight and what about a goretex or similar bivvy bag or hooped bivvy. 

i am asuming the tour is a fairly steady one no super massive climbs or long hard days in saddle as it is the OP first tour so it maybe wiser to try a cheaper slightly heavier tent to make sure she knows what she wants. If i have read wrong i apologise.
It is not my aim to cause an argument just put an idea or two into the mix

also is the tour solo or with a group and to the OP you have a year plus to prepare so you may not need to go as light as possible.( am trying to be diplomatic here)


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## Ticktockmy (18 Aug 2010)

I also use the Terra Nova Laser competition, I find it a idel tent for my Cycle touring and also for backpacking. When I first bought it and erected it in my garden,I thought OMG that will never stand a spiders fart let alone any really storms. How wrong it has proven, I have used it all through last winter, it has stood you to snow high winds and hard rain, and never let me down. its bad points at its dammed noisey, as it flaps about because the Material is so thin. the Pegs that come with it are ok if camping on a smooth lawn. A nice point is that it fits inside of my pannier ok. If I am going to a campsite which I am using as a base from which I will cycle out from each day I use a Vaude Hogan which is slightly more bulky, but has more room and and has to travel on top of my panniers. but that too seems to be bomb proof.
Hope that helps Tent wise


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## willem (18 Aug 2010)

My view is that in temperature Europe you can go down to about 13 kg without feeling deprived of important comforts. You could still have a spacious tent like the Helsport Ringstind 2 Light, a stove and pots/pans for cooking fresh food, clothing that is warm enough until late autumn and at some elevation in the summer. You would also have some decent looking clothing for when you are not cycling. Below 13 kg you will have to downsize to a much smaller tent, take a more Spartan cooking system, and leave home some of the clothing. If you do all that, 11 kg is quite easily achievable. However, I for one am not convinced I want to give up the comforts brought by those last 2 kg.
Willem


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## andrew_s (18 Aug 2010)

Another option along the lines of the Laser Comp / Akto / Power Lizard is the Tarptent Scarp 1


Entrance both sides, between the Laser Comp and Akto in weight, available from www.sackundpack.de in germany if you don't want to order from the US


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## P.H (18 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> The bad news is that it is an uncompromisingly "inner first" pitching tent. That means that when it rains when you are pitching it or when you are taking it down, the inner will get wet.


That was my major concern when I bought a inner first TN Solar 2.2 three years ago.  In practice it's been a complete non issue.  The inner tent material (Same as the Voyage UL) has some moisture resistance and with a bit of planning is only exposed for seconds.  The advantages of a geodesic design and a taught inner far outweigh any perceived disadvantages.  Just try and pitch away from those flapping tunnel tents


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## Crankarm (18 Aug 2010)

P.H said:


> For a tiny weight penalty, the TN Voyager Superlight (1.54kg) would seem like luxury compared to the Lasers;
> 
> http://www.terra-nov...lite_Green.html
> 
> ...





Wow!! A 30% trade in brings the prices of their tents back down near to earth.

For my money on a first tour it would be a Decathlon or Vaude tent. Good quality at affordable prices.

If the OP is touring in summer then she might well be ok with an £18 tent from Argos.


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## Crankarm (18 Aug 2010)

Blacks have a tent sale at the moment

http://www.blacks.co.uk/product/092611.html#bvReviewMain

Given that the holiday season is coming to an end there will be lots of good quality tents to be had cheaply. Get one now ready for next year would be my advice.


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## rich p (19 Aug 2010)

For 2 people this is a great tent and a good price

http://www.terra-nova.co.uk/Product_Type/Tents/Clearance_Tents/Laserlarge_3_GREEN_END_OF_LINE.html


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## Ticktockmy (19 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> My view is that in temperature Europe you can go down to about 13 kg without feeling deprived of important comforts. You could still have a spacious tent like the Helsport Ringstind 2 Light, a stove and pots/pans for cooking fresh food, clothing that is warm enough until late autumn and at some elevation in the summer. You would also have some decent looking clothing for when you are not cycling. Below 13 kg you will have to downsize to a much smaller tent, take a more Spartan cooking system, and leave home some of the clothing. If you do all that, 11 kg is quite easily achievable. However, I for one am not convinced I want to give up the comforts brought by those last 2 kg.
> Willem



I normally for my European touring try to get my kit pannier start wieght at 10 kgs, which is the same as my backpacking kit wieght . Then I look at what extras I might want to include or if I want to take my Lazer or want to use my Hogan, which pushes the wieght up a little. but for sure I try to Keep the kit below 15 Kgs.


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## Crankarm (19 Aug 2010)

rich p said:


> For 2 people this is a great tent and a good price
> 
> http://www.terra-nov...ND_OF_LINE.html




Blimey ................. £270 for a tent with only a single year of statutory rights as guarantee. The price is down from £450 mind. TN tents may be good, I don't know, but they are way over priced IMHO. TN expressly state that clearance items do not benefit from an extended warranty. Hmmmmm ............ a bit fishy.


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## rich p (19 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> Blimey ................. £270 for a tent with only a single year of statutory rights as guarantee. The price is down from £450 mind. TN tents may be good, I don't know, but they are way over priced IMHO. TN expressly state that clearance items do not benefit from an extended warranty. Hmmmmm ............ a bit fishy.




Pricey , I agree, but mine has been nothing but a success - light, spacious and a decent porch.


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## smeg (19 Aug 2010)

The Hilleberg tents are too expensive, seems the only ones that recommend them are the ones that own them seemingly justifying their expensive purchase. Some of the offerings from Vango aren't bad at all if you're on a budget. My new Sprite tent (Mountain Hardwear) only weighs around 1.5kg which I got for £100. Most of the unnecessary weight, whether backpacking or cycling (being similar) will likely be from elsewhere, too many and wrong choice of clothes being packed being the most common, too much and wrong sort of food on you is another. Synthetic sleeping bags are bulky and heavy funsters as well, a decent down bag is a must. You need to take into account the weight of everything not just the tent being my point.



RoadMing said:


> Depending on how many of you are going, ie, if more than just yourself I would most definately consider a Hilleberg Nammatj GT. http://www.hilleberg.se/default-e.HTM
> 
> Very light weight, will sleep 2 with space to spare and has room for your bikes in the porch area. A BIG winner is the fact that it packs away amazingly easily, better than any other tent I have used.
> 
> ...


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## willem (19 Aug 2010)

You are dead right that the tent is only a small part of the weight. Clothing is indeed far heavier, and people do not seem nearly as concerned. Perhaps the most annoying part is the panniers. Ortlieb classic backrollers for example are 1900 grams a set, which is ludicrous if you compare it to the about 1350 gram of the new special edition plus series offered by this German webshop: http://www.outdoorworks.de/index.php?site=index.html&prod=7337&vid=86748&function=set_lang&lang=en There are many other opportiunities to save weight (perhaps we should share our discoveries and tricks).

As for Hilleberg tents. Yes I agree they are too expensive, compare for example their EU prices with those in the States. On the other hand, the quality of design and execution is in a different league - I think I sometimes need that. I am prepared to pay for that. 
Willem


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## rich p (19 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> You are dead right that the tent is only a small part of the weight. Clothing is indeed far heavier, and people do not seem nearly as concerned. Perhaps the most annoying part is the panniers. Ortlieb classic backrollers for example are 1900 grams a set, which is ludicrous if you compare it to the about 1350 gram of the new special edition plus series offered by this German webshop: http://www.outdoorwo...et_lang&lang=en There are many other opportiunities to save weight (perhaps we should share our discoveries and tricks).
> 
> As for Hilleberg tents. Yes I agree they are too expensive, compare for example their EU prices with those in the States. On the other hand, the quality of design and execution is in a different league - I think I sometimes need that. I am prepared to pay for that.
> Willem



I may have misread that special edition weight but it says 29.65 ozs which converts to 1.7kg per pair?


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## Aperitif (19 Aug 2010)

rich p said:


> I may have misread that special edition weight but it says 29.65 ozs which converts to 1.7kg per pair?



1.68459kg. This is an interesting thread. My Titanium tourer gets 'nearer'...


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## willem (19 Aug 2010)

The weight on that site is incorrect. They quote the weight for the normal Plus Series, and not for this cheaper and lighter no frills version.
Willem


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## MontyVeda (21 Aug 2010)

I've picked up some great advice today here... (spent the last 5 hours just reading!)

...as for the tent advice, I'm a tight fisted northerner and any tent that costs more than £50 is way over the odds.

How about the (currently named), Highlander Glen Orchy (they say 2 man it's a one man really), under 50 qwid, packs up to 45cm x 17cm (ish) wieght = not much, available at amazon, got one this summer and am happy with it (i'm 6'2"). Just be aware that the thicker your matress/mat, the less foot space yet get! 

Quick to pitch and it opens at each side, so those hot summer mornings, instead of getting out of the tent at 6am coz the sun is too high, just open both sides a tad and a nice through draft you will have... tent bliss!

If money is tight or like me, you just begrudge spending loads of dosh on a couple of poles and some nylon and a few bits of string that you're going to use maybe twice a year for few nights, it's worth every penny.

BTW, Hello!


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## MontyVeda (22 Aug 2010)

...Also, if you're taking a 'standard' dome tent with longer poles, these can always be fastened to the frame rather than going in the pack bag; greatly reducing pack size.


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## doog (22 Aug 2010)

MontyVeda said:


> I've picked up some great advice today here... (spent the last 5 hours just reading!)
> 
> ...as for the tent advice, I'm a tight fisted northerner and any tent that costs more than £50 is way over the odds.
> 
> ...





Im totally with you on this. My tent was slightly more and weighs in at over 3kg but hey ho! my bike is probably 3kg lighter than most. My tent has a massive porch, is luxurious and will last me years.....I could spend a few hundred pounds more and save 1.5kg on my tent...however any touring cyclist 'could' spend the same few hundred in making their bike lighter but would they hell!!!







I see people touring on 'tanks' yet fretting about the weight of the tent





Its swings and roundabouts...


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## willem (22 Aug 2010)

Why not have both a light tent and a light bike? Lighter bikes usually like to be loaded more lightly in any case. Of course there is a comfort level I would not want to go below (a Terra Nova Laser is not really for me), but 1.5-2 kg gets you a sufficiently roomy tent for one (Helsport Ringstind Light 1 or 2, MSR Hubba HP or Hubba Hubba HP, just to name some examples. If you take less, you do not need as large a porch. I need a porch for wet raingear, shoes, and maybe one bag. The other bag can go inside the tent.
Willem


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## quidditys_shore (22 Aug 2010)

just ordered myself this from argos

tent



only £15 if in stock or £21 delivered. it gets good reviews & is also know as a tiger paw tent.

i wasnt thinking of touring but at this price i am now! now just have to find somewhere to camp that i can manage to get too! LOL (only doing 5 miles each way for commute at the minute!)


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## Crankarm (22 Aug 2010)

MontyVeda said:


> I've picked up some great advice today here... (spent the last 5 hours just reading!)
> 
> ...as for the tent advice, I'm a tight fisted northerner and any tent that costs more than £50 is way over the odds.
> 
> ...



Top post.


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## Crankarm (22 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> Why not have both a light tent and a light bike? Lighter bikes usually like to be loaded more lightly in any case. Of course there is a comfort level I would not want to go below (a Terra Nova Laser is not really for me), but 1.5-2 kg gets you a sufficiently roomy tent for one (Helsport Ringstind Light 1 or 2, MSR Hubba HP or Hubba Hubba HP, just to name some examples. If you take less, you do not need as large a porch. I need a porch for wet raingear, shoes, and maybe one bag. The other bag can go inside the tent.
> Willem



Of course the law of diminishing returns applies. 

The Weight Police might also catch any blatant offender ........


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## HelenD123 (22 Aug 2010)

quidditys_shore said:


> just ordered myself this from argos
> 
> tent
> 
> ...



I bought one of those last year as an introduction to touring and wasn't disappointed.	It's a fantastic buy for the price. I hope you get out there and tour with it.


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## smeg (23 Aug 2010)

LouiseL said:


> As for stove recommendations I need to look into that as well. Alcohol fuelled is the only sort I fancy unless someone has a compelling argument against. I like simple and easily available. Are you saying I could use a Clickstand burner with the trangia pots etc and the windshield in a sort of mix and match arrangement which would work out lighter than the Trangia 27 kit (which I think was 720g for the lightest version from memory with the mini being 330g ). Sorry to be thick about this but I've only ever stayed at youth hostels with the bike and done no camping so I really haven't a clue!



Hmmm 720g for the lightest version? My gas stove weighs around 75g. Liquid fuel is heavy, there's risks of it leaking, gas canisters are compressed = more fuel for weight. Gas is safer, more control over it, would you want to use an alcohol stove in your tent porch in nasty weather? I certainly wouldn't. If the wind was blowing I doubt you could even light it to begin with. I've used an army hexi burner before (solid fuel blocks) they're crap as well + being heavy. They stink and make your pans black n' all


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## willem (23 Aug 2010)

That weight was including windscreen, two pots, and the frying pan. I think the Trangia is a very safe stove, because the fuel cannot explode, and the stove is extremely stable. I would not use any stove inside a tent, as they all give off quite a bit of carbon monoxide. At least the Trangia cannot easily be tipped over. The Trangia's advantage is its extremely good bad weather performance (I don't think there is anything better, and I have used many types), ease of cooking, and availability of fuel in many countries. The extra weight is in the 262 grams of the upper and lower windscreen. The burner itself is 110 gram. So in comparison to a gas cannister stove, think of it as a 300 gram windscreen. If you need cold weather performance, your light gas stove will not work, and you will need a heavier liquid feed one with a pre heating loop. These mostly weigh some 200-300 gram. The Trangia gas burner (with pre heating loop for cold weather) is 178 grams, which also rather closes the gap: 178+262=440 gram. A liquid stove gas stove like the Primus Easy Fuel Duo (for both tyes of cannisters) is 368 grams, plus windscreen. A Primus Spider is lighter, at 198 grams, plus windscreen.
So the differences are not nearly as large as you thought. They are largest (i.e some 250 grams) if you compare the spirit burning Trangia with top of the stove stoves.
Willem


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## smeg (23 Aug 2010)

Yes but my titanium pot and cup doesn't weight much. As for using gas in cold weather, how cold are we talking about here? Well below freezing obviously, I've use mine around zero degrees and just below.

I'd like to see you light a Trangia stove in a 50mph+ gusting wind up a mountain in the freezing cold & pouring rain!


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## willem (23 Aug 2010)

The weight of the Trangia pots is similar to many Ti pots: 80 grams for a 1 litre pot, and 80 grams for a 19 cm frying pan. In addition, aluminium disperses the heat much better (your steak will not get carbonated quite so easily), and uses significantly less fuel. Gas stove performance decline depends a lot on fuel composition. There are various mixes, and some are better at lower temperatures than others, but it is generally thought that liquid feed becomes interesting just above freezing. A spirit burner also has problems at such temperatures, but not as much. In addition Trangia do a preheating cup that solves much of this until much lower temperatures. In really cold weather only a petrol stove will do. Of all the stoves I have used in my life, the Trangia was the easiest to light and operate in bad weather. Its biggest drawback is the extra (windscreen) weight. There is no doubt that upright cannisters stoves are the lightest stoves. However, they also have their drawbacks, just like meths stoves.
Willem


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## ontheroadtofrance (23 Aug 2010)

Coleman Kraz X1 1 Person Lightweight Tent!


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## Ticktockmy (23 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> The weight of the Trangia pots is similar to many Ti pots: 80 grams for a 1 litre pot, and 80 grams for a 19 cm frying pan. In addition, aluminium disperses the heat much better (your steak will not get carbonated quite so easily), and uses significantly less fuel. Gas stove performance decline depends a lot on fuel composition. There are various mixes, and some ar ebeter at lower tem,peratures tahn others, but it is generally thought that liquid feed becomes interesting just above freezing. A spirit burner also problems at such temperatures, but not as much. In addition Trangia do a preheating cup that solves much of this until much lower temperatures. In really cold weather only a petrol stove will do. Of all the stoves I have used in my life, the Trangia was the easiest to light and operate in bad weather. Its biggest drawback is the extra (windscreen) weight. There is no doubt upright cannisters stoves are the lightest stoves. However, they also have their drawbacks, just like meths stoves.
> Willem



I use now only two stoves, a Colman’s F1 which is a nice little stove, which so far has worked well in most environments, it only drawback is it is unstable, so need to be handle with care, but great weight wise.
My other stove is a MSR II which is about 12 years old, still working well, seems to run on anything, even cooking Oil, but sounds like a jet engine when running. I have used most types of stove during my adventures, including most of the Trangia range the only problem is the fuel tastes awful  . However my favourite stove of all time ha to be my pocket primus, which I still have, but so hard to get hold of the Paraffin (Kerosene) in small amounts these days. and the fuel make everything taste Uggh that it comes in contact with.


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## Crankarm (23 Aug 2010)

willem said:


> The weight of the Trangia pots is similar to many Ti pots: 80 grams for a 1 litre pot, and 80 grams for a 19 cm frying pan. In addition, aluminium disperses the heat much better (*your steak* will not get carbonated quite so easily), and uses significantly less fuel. Gas stove performance decline depends a lot on fuel composition. There are various mixes, and some are better at lower temperatures than others, but it is generally thought that liquid feed becomes interesting just above freezing. A spirit burner also has problems at such temperatures, but not as much. In addition Trangia do a preheating cup that solves much of this until much lower temperatures. In really cold weather only a petrol stove will do. Of all the stoves I have used in my life, the Trangia was the easiest to light and operate in bad weather. Its biggest drawback is the extra (windscreen) weight. There is no doubt that upright cannisters stoves are the lightest stoves. However, they also have their drawbacks, just like meths stoves.
> Willem



Steak  ?? On the side of a mountain .................... 

Aren't Trangia stoves Duke of Edinburgh recommended kit?


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## andrew_s (23 Aug 2010)

If an alcohol stove is required, get the proper Trangia 27 (or 25) - the UL HA version is best.
The heat output of a meths burner is relatively modest, so an efficient wind shield is important. If you use gas you can just turn it up to full blast if the wind shield isn't good enough, but with a Trangia mini or one of the lightweight meths options that's not an option. 
The only other meths stove with a good wind shield is the Caldera Cone, but that limits you to a single size of pan (various versions of the stove are available), and it requires care when carrying.

Meths itself is a heavier fuel than gas. Plastic bottles are lighter than empty gas canisters, and you only need to carry what you are going to use, but even so gas is lighter if you are carrying more than 5 days or so of fuel.

A liquid feed gas stove (i.e remote canister with preheat tube, used with the canister upside down except when lighting) works well in low temperatures, and does not suffer any fall off in performance as the canister gets used. It's pretty much essential to use liquid feed if the temperature is below zero (otherwise you'll never get to use the 2nd half of the gas), and it's advantageous any time the temperature is below 15 or so.
The Primus Easy Fuel Duo is a new one to me, but the Edelrid/Markill adapter is only 75g, so it's still lighter to use the Spider even if you do want to be able to use Camping gas canisters.


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## andym (23 Aug 2010)

andrew_s said:


> Meths itself is a heavier fuel than gas. Plastic bottles are lighter than empty gas canisters, and you only need to carry what you are going to use, but even so gas is lighter if you are carrying more than 5 days or so of fuel.



Yep there's no point comparing the weight of the stoves and windscreens when these are relatively minor compared to the wieight of the fuel.

Somewhere on the web there's a comparison of the relative efficiencies of different fuels. alcohol did surprisingly well - in that it's only after a fairly long trip that it's relative inefficiency starts to count against it.

As with everything else it's horses for courses. Short trip then probably alcohol has the advantage. Longer trip then _maybe_ gas. But I wouldn't go further than 'maybe'.


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## sgw (23 Aug 2010)

andym said:


> Somewhere on the web there's a comparison of the relative efficiencies of different fuels.



Here's one :- http://zenstoves.net/Fuels.htm


The whole site is very informative and very comprehensive :_

http://zenstoves.net/ :-


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## Crankarm (23 Aug 2010)

sgw said:


> Here's one :- http://zenstoves.net/Fuels.htm
> 
> 
> The whole site is very informative and very comprehensive :_
> ...



Thanks for the stove link. Superbly written .................


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## smeg (23 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> Steak  ?? On the side of a mountain ....................



Well if it's cold enough to make ones gas stove go all funny the steak wont go off, you'd probably use the whole canister of gas to cook the bloody thing though  I had a good fryup once up the side of a mountain near Kinlochleven, the black pudding was reduced in the Co-Op and the sausages are nice in Scotland. Mmmm yummy


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

http://www.blacks.co...alite-tent.html

http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/vaude_taurus_ultralight_tent.html

Blacks have the Vaude Taurus Ultralight tent on offer for £135.99, yes, £135.99 down from MRP £274.99, but normal going price is £199 - £249.00. It weighs 1.95kg and is a doddle to put up and take down.

I have one and it is really rather good. £64 off normal price can't be bad. I paid £199 for one back in 2004. It's still going strong.

Apparently Blacks have to get rid of all this seasons tents by this weekend so grab a bargain. Sign up to their discount/loyalty card and get a further 10% off. (I have no connection with or receive any commission from them).


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> http://www.blacks.co...alite-tent.html
> 
> http://www.ultraligh...light_tent.html
> 
> ...


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## thistler (26 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> Sign up to their discount/loyalty card and get a further 10% off. (I have no connection with or receive any commission from them).




Can you do this online or is it only available in the stores? I couldn't find it on the website...


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

thistler said:


> Can you do this online or is it only available in the stores? I couldn't find it on the website...




It was on their home page although can't now see it. All you have to do is supply your name and address, well that's all I had to do, but in-store.

Apparently you also get points/vouchers depending on the amount you spend a bit like a loyalty card plus further "exclusive" discounts ...... I just used it to get more off my spend on my stove purchases. If there are other benefits then great.

They now have another offer spend over £100 and get a £20 voucher. So the tent would be even cheaper £115.


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

The Vaude Taurus UL has a porch and the extra space inside using it as a one person tent means there's not a problem getting your luggage inside and still having space to spread out. A folded Brompton will fit in the porch area.

Two people with luggage might be a tight squeeze depending of course their size and how much luggage. For a couple it would be cosy.


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## doog (26 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> The Vaude Taurus UL has a porch and the extra space inside using it as a one person tent means there's not a problem getting your luggage inside and still having space to spread out. A folded Brompton will fit in the porch area.





I see Millets are doing that tent for the same price.....

http://www.millets.c...uct/092611.html


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## thistler (26 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> It was on their home page although can't now see it. All you have to do is supply your name and address, well that's all I had to do, but in-store.
> 
> Apparently you also get points/vouchers depending on the amount you spend a bit like a loyalty card plus further "exclusive" discounts ...... I just used it to get more off my spend on my stove purchases. If there are other benefits then great.
> 
> They now have another offer spend over £100 and get a £20 voucher. So the tent would be even cheaper £115.


I couldn't find where you sign up, it wasn't part of the homepage scrolling ads....but I did find a 15% off code so was able to get the tent for £115.59, and should also receive the £20 voucher, making the tent £95!!!  


Thanks so much for posting this - I was considering just getting a cheapie tent for now and upgrading next year but now I don't have to!!!


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

thistler said:


> I couldn't find where you sign up, it wasn't part of the homepage scrolling ads....but I did find a 15% off code so was able to get the tent for £115.59, and should also receive the £20 voucher, making the tent £95!!!
> 
> 
> Thanks so much for posting this - I was considering just getting a cheapie tent for now and upgrading next year but now I don't have to!!!



Wow!!!! 

I thought I did well yesterday, but you definitely get first prize today. You have definitely got an excellent tent for a hugely reduced price. As they say, don't look a gift horse in the mouth .............. Anyway I'm glad to have been able to help. 

This morning I was even talking myself into buying a second Taurus UL at those prices, one for me, one for the bike , but mine although 6 years old is still in excellent condition. It cost me £199.


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## doog (26 Aug 2010)

thistler said:


> I couldn't find where you sign up, it wasn't part of the homepage scrolling ads....but I did find a 15% off code so was able to get the tent for £115.59, and should also receive the £20 voucher, making the tent £95!!!
> 
> 
> Thanks so much for posting this - I was considering just getting a cheapie tent for now and upgrading next year but now I don't have to!!!





I purchased this tent for next year and like you got the 15% off




free delivery and touch wood the voucher.

I now have two tents...



a larger heavier one with a big porch and a smaller lighter one with a smaller porch...the appeal to me is the time to erect the thing, my present Vango Tornado 200 is a great tent but really is a good 20 mins to put up, im hoping the Vaude will be quicker!


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## vernon (26 Aug 2010)

doog said:


> I see Millets are doing that tent for the same price.....
> 
> http://www.millets.c...uct/092611.html



Possibly because Millets is part of the same retail group


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## Crankarm (26 Aug 2010)

doog said:


> I purchased this tent for next year and like you got the 15% off
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The VT UL will take you about 3 mins max 5 when you are familiar with it. I found it is actually self standing provided the ground sheet is pegged out at the corners. One doesn't really need the guy ropes, if it's a still warm evening, you are knackered and can't be bothered. Obviously it is better with them but it's not the end of the world. 10 minutes is ample time to have it pitched. You could probably have had supper be sitting with your feet up and feeling pretty pleased with yourself in the time it takes to pitch your Vango Tornado ........... which is probably a very fine tent in every respect as well.

Enjoy your VT UL. I would actually put it up when you receive it just to make sure everything is ok rather than wait until next year. You're probably going to do this anyway.


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## doog (27 Aug 2010)

Crankarm said:


> The VT UL will take you about 3 mins max 5 when you are familiar with it. I found it is actually self standing provided the ground sheet is pegged out at the corners. One doesn't really need the guy ropes, if it's a still warm evening, you are knackered and can't be bothered. Obviously it is better with them but it's not the end of the world. 10 minutes is ample time to have it pitched. You could probably have had supper be sitting with your feet up and feeling pretty pleased with yourself in the time it takes to pitch your Vango Tornado ........... which is probably a very fine tent in every respect as well.
> 
> Enjoy your VT UL. I would actually put it up when you receive it just to make sure everything is ok rather than wait until next year. You're probably going to do this anyway.





3 to 5 minutes sounds ideal. I daresay I will use it in September when the camp sites thin out, kids go back to school and the sun comes back out!! (he says hopefully)


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## MighyG (27 Aug 2010)

thistler, what was the 15% off code ?

thanks


paul



thistler said:


> I couldn't find where you sign up, it wasn't part of the homepage scrolling ads....but I did find a 15% off code so was able to get the tent for £115.59, and should also receive the £20 voucher, making the tent £95!!!
> 
> 
> Thanks so much for posting this - I was considering just getting a cheapie tent for now and upgrading next year but now I don't have to!!!


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## Crankarm (27 Aug 2010)

Just been on the Blacks website as I decided to get one for my brother whose birthday it is in a few weeks and b****r me they are flippin' sold out . Would have been a cracking present as I never could have afforded to give something like that at anywhere near it's normal price. Oh well he's just got 2 cycling tee shirts now which were also from Blacks. S'pose I've had a good week with bargains from them.


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## battered (27 Aug 2010)

"I'd love to see you light a Trangia in a 50 mph wind in Scotland"

You can and I have. It's one of my favourite stoves, I've had one since before I was old enough to vote and it has *never* let me down. MSRs at 4x the price have, gas stoves have, the old Trangia may be slow but it never blows out or fails to light. You can use them in a tent too, with care. They are heavy though.

Those cheap tent links are fantastic looking, the Glen Orchy one is down to £35 and there are cheaper still. A French summer will hardly tax them too hard. That and a light bag and mat will see you right for very little weight.

You *can* get the Epigas pattern of gas cylinder in France, just as easily as in the UK. The pierce top Bleuet type are easier for sure, every supermarket has them, but outdoor shops all have Epigas.

Meths without colour and anti-drinking additive is widely available in France and dirt cheap. "Alcool a bruler" is about 1eu a litre in supermarkets.

I've been experimenting with meths stoves over the last couple fo days. My Trangia is hotter than a cheapo copy, and I'm going to try a cat stove and penny stove (almost weightless DIY jobs) for fun. I've made a pot stand from a couple of old bike spokes (a coat hanger would do as well) and a windshield can be made from ally trays like you get from the Chinese takeaway or an MSR windshield if you are flash. Use the Trangia burner here, maybe a hexy stove as backup, and you have a stove that weighs next to nothing. Cat stove or penny stove if you are really pinching grams and want to go a bit spartan.


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## thistler (28 Aug 2010)

MighyG said:


> thistler, what was the 15% off code ?
> 
> thanks
> 
> ...






S9jRAo, it expires tomorrow (29th)


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## doog (1 Sep 2010)

thistler said:


> S9jRAo, it expires tomorrow (29th)






Did anyone else order the Vaude Taurus, ultralight? I did but didnt get the £20 voucher for some reason. (Ive dropped them an e mail) Just wondering if using a discount code negated the voucher offer?


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## Crankarm (1 Sep 2010)

doog said:


> Did anyone else order the Vaude Taurus, ultralight? I did but didnt get the £20 voucher for some reason. (Ive dropped them an e mail) Just wondering if using a discount code negated the voucher offer?



The offer was spend over £100 and get a £20 voucher IIRC. They said it would be sent separately.

I tried to order one, but they were oos . So no tent and no voucher.


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## thistler (1 Sep 2010)

Crankarm said:


> The offer was spend over £100 and get a £20 voucher IIRC. They said it would be sent separately.
> 
> I tried to order one, but they were oos . So no tent and no voucher.



My tent arrived yesterday, no voucher but I also read that the voucher would be sent separately.  Let me know what they tell you, doog!


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## doog (1 Sep 2010)

thistler said:


> My tent arrived yesterday, no voucher but I also read that the voucher would be sent separately. Let me know what they tell you, doog!



will do

i see they are doing the Vaude Hogan ultralite for £120 and a 15% off code available...1.4kg but no porch



http://www.blacks.co...ght-1-tent.html


code is *a**ERUcV until 5/9*


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## doog (2 Sep 2010)

thistler said:


> My tent arrived yesterday, no voucher but I also read that the voucher would be sent separately. Let me know what they tell you, doog!





They contacted me back today and stated that due to the volume of orders they have received please allow up to two weeks for the voucher.


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## thistler (2 Sep 2010)

doog said:


> They contacted me back today and stated that due to the volume of orders they have received please allow up to two weeks for the voucher.


brilliant news!


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## thistler (10 Sep 2010)

I received 20 £1 vouchers in the mail today from Blacks - for some reason I assumed I would get a code or something to use online. There is no store near me, but it says they can also be used in Millets, so will have to check out their selection of trangia cookware.... 

I don't see an expiration date on them either.


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## doog (11 Sep 2010)

thistler said:


> I received 20 £1 vouchers in the mail today from Blacks - for some reason I assumed I would get a code or something to use online. There is no store near me, but it says they can also be used in Millets, so will have to check out their selection of trangia cookware....
> 
> I don't see an expiration date on them either.





yep I received 4 £5 vouchers. Well chuffed with the Vaude Taurus Ultralight as well, can get it up in a few minutes, loads of room inside and the porch is just right...really surprised at the weight diff between my Vango and this. I really didnt think I would notice a 1.4kg diff but this combined with the ease of use means the Vango is now for sale


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## Crankarm (12 Sep 2010)

doog said:


> yep I received 4 £5 vouchers. *Well chuffed with the Vaude Taurus Ultralight* as well, can get it up in a few minutes, loads of room inside and the porch is just right...really surprised at the weight diff between my Vango and this. I really didnt think I would notice a 1.4kg diff but this combined with the ease of use means the Vango is now for sale



It's a brilliant little tent, perfect for solo touring.

Blacks still have quite a few Hogans left. They are a bit larger and a tad heavier than the Taurus UL. They are priced at £120 down from £249.99. There were x5 in the Cambridge Blacks yesterday and they are still available on line so use a discount code and get even more off.


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## doog (12 Sep 2010)

Crankarm said:


> It's a brilliant little tent, perfect for solo touring.
> 
> Blacks still have quite a few Hogans left. They are a bit larger and a tad heavier than the Taurus UL. They are priced at £120 down from £249.99. There were x5 in the Cambridge Blacks yesterday and they are still available on line so use a discount code and get even more off.






I see they still have the hogan ultralights left as well...1.49kg for £120 minus your discount code. As far i can see they appear to be the Taurus without a porch, although they have a small canopy


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## Wardy (16 Sep 2010)

My tent since the late 70's has been a Robert Saunders Backpacker 2 with a weight of 1.7kg. However, since I've got older I value my comfort more than I do the weight penalty so I'm looking for a tent which will allow me to sit upright and not have to dodge an upright pole at the entrance.
I quite liked the look of the Vango Spectre 200 as it seemed good value for money and only 800g more in weight, but it's got no porch to speak of. I have a feeling that forking out loads of hard-earned dosh for an ultra-lightweight tent means you are probably going to have to replace it sooner than something a bit sturdier. I'm also a fan of the Trangia and *definitely* one for the Exped Downmat. The latter might be over a kilo, but it guarantees you a warm and comfy sleep. Make sure you get the later model which has the integral pump - an absolute doddle to inflate.


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