# Panniers



## liberate (26 Apr 2009)

Hi, I'm looking for rear panniers, as best as I can judge these seem to be the ones to go for, Ortlieb Back Roller Classic Pannier - 20x2 Litres (40ltr tot).

Has anyone got any views on this such as cheaper alternatives or where these are going a good price.

Cheers........J


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## Randochap (27 Apr 2009)

Can't go too far wrong w/ the Ortliebs.

All about bike Luggage.


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## Crankarm (27 Apr 2009)

liberate said:


> Hi, I'm looking for rear panniers, as best as I can judge these seem to be the ones to go for, Ortlieb Back Roller Classic Pannier - 20x2 Litres (40ltr tot).
> 
> Has anyone got any views on this such as cheaper alternatives or where these are going a good price.
> 
> Cheers........J



Search is your friend................... Loads has been written on panniers.

Instead of the Ortliebs I would recomment the Vaude Aqua Back Plus which are better. They have hard durable plastic backs making them very robust indeed. They also have a waterproof outer pocket which is very handy. I have the Orlitebs you mention but then bought the Vaude as they are easier to get on with and are more robust. The Vaudes are also easier to close as they have buckles on the side of the bag to secure the roll top.

http://www.vaude.com/epages/Vaude-d...hen&Locale=en_IN&NavSignature=1,7&PageSize=99

If in London you can get them from Two Wheels Good in Crouch End or Stoke Newington. There aren't that many shops that do them but they are good, very good. As I say better they are better than the Ortlieb Roller Classics which are good but the Vaudes are just better. I can sell you the Ortliebs if you want? They are in yellow and as new. I have the front Roller Classics in yellow as well so a full set. Make me an offer.


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## jags (27 Apr 2009)

my buddy has the vaude they look great he's quiet happy with them ,
i have the ortlieb bikepacker plus ,im quiet happy with mine ,main thing is i reckon there both 100% waterproof great quality,proberly last a lifetime.so basically buy either you won't go wrong,
and if you can get the vaude at a good price from crankarm ,snap them up bargains like this dont come around to often.


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## andym (27 Apr 2009)

What jags said - only with a working shift key. 

The hard plastic back on the Vaudes adds a fair bit of extra weight whether the extra durability compensates for the extra weight is debatable. And the Ortlieb roll top isn't exactly difficult. On a scale of difficulty if tying shoelaces comes at 10 then they'd be a 5.

If you want a cheaper alternative check out the own brand panniers from Edinburgh bike or Wiggle.


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## stephenjubb (27 Apr 2009)

View attachment 2799



£55 postage free, similar I think to Ortliebs. excellent panniers

http://www.cyclesense.co.uk/products.php?plid=m24b139s74p6320


Application - to be mounted both to the bicycle's rear carrying rack.

Securo 680 - PVC-coated polyester fabric. Less durable than Cordura, but thanks to an ideally smooth surface is easier to maintain clean and completely water-proof.

Dry are made to be used where water is the dominant element. They dread no downpours or crossing rushing streams. Coated on both sides, the Securo 680 material not only doesn't leak water, but it doesn't absorb it at all! The pannier panels are welded, which is why there is no problem with leaks on the seams, as there aren't any seams. Additional advantages of the Dry series include the attractive price, low weight and very large capacity.

Material: Securo 680
Capacity: 60 litres (whole set)
Weight: 1650 g (whole set)



Construction:

· Capacious main chamber, 
· Stiffening from the side of the wheel with non-breakable polypropylene board 3 mm in thickness w shape memory,
· Seams precisely welded, completely water-proof, 
· Tight, rolled closing, 
· Nylon non-breakable clamps, 
· Fluorescent elements visible even at 600 m,
· Comfortable handle for carrying, 
· Steel fittings (hooks), with double zinc-coating, 2 mm in thickness, 
· Well performing load-bearing system.

Dimensions:

· Base width - 27 cm,
· Width - 38 cm,
· Height after triple roll-up - 42 cm, 
· Thickness - 16 cm, 
· Spacing of hooks - 21.5 cm
Weight	1650g (whole set)
Sold in	pairs


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## wyno70 (27 Apr 2009)

I've been trying to get either the ortliebs or the vaude's. The only UK stockists I could find of the vaude's either didn't have the, in stock or would order from Germany. lowest price I could get anyone down to was £110.

Ortlieb Back Roller classics are stocked pretty much everywhere. JE james currently have them at £67 and Evans have a 'won't be beaten on price pledge'. Evans price for the Ortlieb's is £87.99, so I just got myself some Ortliebs from Evans at £67.99 which for me is worth the £50 price saving whether they are easier to use or not!

Marvellous! Thats another £50 to spend on some more bike gear then!


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## Crankarm (27 Apr 2009)

wyno70 said:


> I've been trying to get either the ortliebs or the vaude's. The only UK stockists I could find of the vaude's either didn't have the, in stock or would order from Germany. lowest price I could get anyone down to was £110.
> 
> Ortlieb Back Roller classics are stocked pretty much everywhere. JE james currently have them at £67 and Evans have a 'won't be beaten on price pledge'. Evans price for the Ortlieb's is £87.99, so I just got myself some Ortliebs from Evans at £67.99 which for me is worth the £50 price saving whether they are easier to use or not!
> 
> Marvellous! Thats another £50 to spend on some more bike gear then!



Surely the difference between £87.99 and £67.00 is £20.99 not £50?


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## chris667 (28 Apr 2009)

Personally, at the quality end of the spectrum, I like Carradice. Handmade by a woman in Lancashire, IMO one of only a few cycling items that can justify the price it sells for.
Anything with a repair service has to be the best way to go.


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## samid (28 Apr 2009)

chris667 said:


> Personally, at the quality end of the spectrum, I like Carradice. Handmade by a woman in Lancashire, IMO one of only a few cycling items that can justify the price it sells for.
> Anything with a repair service has to be the best way to go.


I like Carradice too (got a longflap, a super-c bar bag, and super-c rear panniers) but I found that their panniers are not really waterproof. Got into a downpour last weekend, and at least one of the panniers got wet inside, mostly at the bottom, probably from the spray from the wheels. Easy to prevent with dry bags but still a point to consider.


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## Bodhbh (28 Apr 2009)

chris667 said:


> Personally, at the quality end of the spectrum, I like Carradice. Handmade by a woman in Lancashire, IMO one of only a few cycling items that can justify the price it sells for.
> Anything with a repair service has to be the best way to go.


Not sure how much it applies to the other brands, but one thing I like about the Ortliebs is they are modular and all the spares are easily available. If the attachment hooks start wearing abit, no problem they're a couple of quid. A puncture patch seems to fix any holes appearing (not that that's happened often, once a one came off full of beer bottles and skidded down the road then was full of beer and broken glass).

Does anyone bother carrying attachment spares on tour? Seems a fairly likely point of faliure, the hooks going or somesuch, but in practice..?


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## liberate (28 Apr 2009)

Thanks all, for the your feedback looks like the Ortliebs have it on price though at the present..John


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## wyno70 (28 Apr 2009)

I was referring to the difference between the ortliebs at £67.99 and the vaude at £110, so yes, technically a difference on £42.01, but hey, as it's going to be spent on more gear, lets call it £50!


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## samid (28 Apr 2009)

Bodhbh said:


> Not sure how much it applies to the other brands, but one thing I like about the Ortliebs is they are modular and all the spares are easily available. If the attachment hooks start wearing abit, no problem they're a couple of quid. A puncture patch seems to fix any holes appearing (not that that's happened often, once a one came off full of beer bottles and skidded down the road then was full of beer and broken glass).



For the record, Carradice attachment spares are available separately, and can be easily replaced.


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## johnb5271 (28 Apr 2009)

samid said:


> I like Carradice too (got a longflap, a super-c bar bag, and super-c rear panniers) but I found that their panniers are not really waterproof. Got into a downpour last weekend, and at least one of the panniers got wet inside, mostly at the bottom, probably from the spray from the wheels. Easy to prevent with dry bags but still a point to consider.



You will find that if you re-wax them they will become 100% waterproof again, I did and there is a terrific difference in them since, water just runs of them again. no leaks and when the panniers are dry they are breathable unlike the Plasticy type bags that trap the moisture inside the bag.


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## samid (28 Apr 2009)

johnb5271 said:


> You will find that if you re-wax them they will become 100% waterproof again, I did and there is a terrific difference in them since, water just runs of them again. no leaks and when the panniers are dry they are breathable unlike the Plasticy type bags that trap the moisture inside the bag.


Maybe... problem is, those panniers are brand new - this was my 2nd ride with them, both rides overnights. FWIW - I do like the breathability. Last year I toured in mostly drizzling but constant rain for a week with a "plasticy" bar bag and a Longflap on the rear - the bar bag behaved exactly as you write, was wet inside at the end of each day even though the plastic was obviously waterproof, while the Longflap stayed dry. That was what made me choose Carradice panniers over others this year when I bought them. But you could be right, maybe it is an issue of bad waxing and I should re-wax them even though they are new.


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## Bodhbh (28 Apr 2009)

samid said:


> For the record, Carradice attachment spares are available separately, and can be easily replaced.


Ah yes, I did have a look on their website b4 posting but seems I was looking in the wrong place.


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## Cromcruaich (29 Apr 2009)

JE James sold out even though they still showing as in stock. Gf got the real mess about from them so last time they ever get used by me.


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## johnb5271 (29 Apr 2009)

Cromcruaich said:


> JE James sold out even though they still showing as in stock. Gf got the real mess about from them so last time they ever get used by me.



It seems everyone is having the same problem with this company, best to be avoided I think.

If you do an internet search for an item JE James comes up almost everytime when you click on the link and get to the item it was in a previous sale at a bargain price but no longer in stock. But you are now on their site and to all intents and purposes that is what they desire.

What they are doing is not illegal but it certainly is not in my opinion good business practice.

I have had this happen twice with this company, placed order, received confirmation email, received in one case a dispatch email and then a few days later an email to say that items were not in stock. On all occasions card was charged and I had a refund.

When I have ordered from Chainreaction, Bikeplus, Cyclebasket, Bike24.de card was charged only on dispatch.


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## Cockney Scot (29 Apr 2009)

reading through the replies it is interesting to see the variation in opinions. I think I will go for front and rear panniers to distribute the weight. This will also mean transfering the weight from the rear rack to the low slung panniers which hopefully will improve stability.
Whilst I am new to cycle touring I appreciate the advice on weight distribution as I have towed caravans for many years and am more than aware the effect of poor loading that can result. many thanks for all the feed back.


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## snorri (29 Apr 2009)

delt1c said:


> This will also mean transfering the weight from the rear rack to the low slung panniers which hopefully will improve stability.


I find it also makes the bike easier to handle when dismounted and manoeuvring it in to a parking place etc.


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## wyno70 (30 Apr 2009)

On the subject of JE James, why not simply use them to maximise Evans 'We will not be beaten on price'. You simply need to print off a copy of the web page, saying the item is in stock with another retailer and Evans will match the price.


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## Paul_Smith SRCC (30 Apr 2009)

Regarding pannier choice in popularity the two most that spring to mind are Ortlieb and Carradice, followed by Altura.

The modern 'Roll Top' closure designs are the most popular in the Ortlieb range as in theory they are more waterproof than the more traditional 'lid type' closure. All the Ortlieb panniers that have that design have the word 'Roller' in the description, where as the normal are called names like Bike Packer.

I am not saying that roll top closures in reality are indeed better, it is simply that in the Ortlieb range they out sell the lid closure with us by 8/1. The traditional styled lid type closure does in practice also make ideal weather resistant panniers, we have found that most who want the more traditional styling will often go for more traditionaly made panniers like Carradice Super C, if you want to know what I use then it is Carradice, they are 20 years old and still going strong. They are made of the tried and tested material 'Cotton Duck', the material itself is waterproof but the seams are not taped, so technically they can not advertise it as a waterproof pannier, 'Cotton Duck' is also about as durable as I have seen.

In practice however the material expands when wet closing the seams, I recall touring in the Picos De Europa one summer and carrying four litres of water in 2x 2ltr plastic bottles, one of which split emptying the entire 2lts into the pannier, which held the water like a bucket. I am not saying they are better than Ortlieb, both companies make a superb product, they are just different that's all, I doubt we will see many who have anything negative to say about either and rightly so.

Worth noting that front panniers can be used on the rear. Modern travel clothing and indeed cycle kit is such that it packs small and drys quickly, I have done two week tours using front panniers as rears and that was when I needed to carry cold weather kit as was going over the high Alps.

You will be surprised just how you can reduce the packing size, a trial run packing before you go is always a good idea. Modern clothing also helps as will dry overnight, aTravel Towel is very compact. Obvious things like clothing that packs up small and will dry overnight are also available, take enough tooth paste and soap for tour only etc, it is the little obvious things that really make a difference. I actually use small panniers front and rear, even for camping, for B & B or hotel tours front panniers on the rear is sufficient


Paul_Smith
www.corridori.co.uk


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## liberate (1 May 2009)

Hi, 

Thanks for all the feed back all very informative, I've opted for the Ortlieb rear panniers with a Heavy duty 35lt Ortleib dry sack to sit on top as I need to carry my mountaineering kit including mountain tent. All that and a 45lt rucksack, this climbing business is a weighty business!

Still I've ordered the Ortlieb panniers from JE James (gulp) before the feedback about JE James was posted here! I immediately called them and they say the order was going through, so fingers crossed.

I'll let you know how I get on.

John


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## andym (1 May 2009)

liberate said:


> I've opted for the Ortlieb rear panniers with a Heavy duty 35lt Ortleib dry sack



If it isn't too late, alpkit.com do some very good dry sacks - but I don't know whether they are as heavy-duty as the Ortliebs.


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## Llama (1 May 2009)

RE Vaude panniers EBC stock them £109.99:

http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebw...7&f_SortOrderID=1&f_bct=c003154c003119c003126


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## liberate (1 May 2009)

andym said:


> If it isn't too late, alpkit.com do some very good dry sacks - but I don't know whether they are as heavy-duty as the Ortliebs.



thanks but just found out they're redesigning them and wont have a replacement until july... cheers anyway..j


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## andym (1 May 2009)

It's a bag with a rolltop closure - what's to redesign? [rhetorical question]


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## Cromcruaich (1 May 2009)

The ortileibs are heavier duty than the alpkit ones, however alpkit do a great drybag that doubles as a rucksack - really good.

Aldi we're doing dry bags for about a fiver, they were heavy duty as well. Mate had an ortlieb one and it was overkill and overpriced imo, though what I presume you are paying for is that it does have a strap system compatible with the panniers?


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## Cockney Scot (1 May 2009)

Panniers I am looking at getting are the Carradice CarraDry Front panniers, £49.99 at Evans Cycles and they will price match (have seen them cheaper). The intention is to pack the tent (not poles) in one front then cooking items (pots, cooker, plates etc in the oposite side. Whilst the panniers are water proof I will still be packing the items in dry backs as double insurance.
I was going to pack the sleeping bag in one of the fronts , but thinking logically I think it would be better to carry this in a dry bag on the rear rack, dont want to take any chances in case it gets wet. Then the rear panniers will have clothing, towels etc. It may even be possible that the sleeping bag and the mat will fit in one of the rears.


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## Cockney Scot (6 May 2009)

Just ordered the Carradice CarraDry Front panniers, and matching Carradice CarraDry Rear panniers from Evans cycles, next will be the Altura Orkney Bar bag which should match.
I did look at the Ortlieb range and yes they looked good but couldnt see what you were getting for the extra money.


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## Randochap (6 May 2009)

delt1c said:


> I did look at the Ortlieb range and yes they looked good but couldnt see what you were getting for the extra money.



Dry gear.


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## Cockney Scot (6 May 2009)

Randochap said:


> Dry gear.


Caradice Caradry is 100% waterproof as well, reports on line seem good so gear should still be dry, saying that I wouldnt put my sleeping kit or clothes stright into any bags, all will be sealed in dry bags first. Belt and braces practice.


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## Crankarm (6 May 2009)

delt1c said:


> Just ordered the Carradice CarraDry Front panniers, and matching Carradice CarraDry Rear panniers from Evans cycles, next will be the Altura Orkney Bar bag which should match.
> I did look at the Ortlieb range and yes they looked good but couldnt see what you were getting for the extra money.



These ones delt1c?

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/carradice/front-panniers-ec011401

They look good. Evans also say they are 100% waterproof - seam sealed and made from _600 denier polyester and reinforced PVC nylon_ very similar or the same as Vaude and Ortlieb so you should not have any probs keeping your gear dry .


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## Randochap (6 May 2009)

delt1c said:


> Caradice Caradry is 100% waterproof as well, reports on line seem good so gear should still be dry, saying that I wouldnt put my sleeping kit or clothes stright into any bags, all will be sealed in dry bags first. Belt and braces practice.



I wasn't necessarily casting aspersions on Carradice bags. I own Carradice saddle bags, including one I've had for 32 years. I also agree "double-bagging" important gear is smart.

The Ortliebs are very good panniers as well. All spare parts are readily available.


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## Cockney Scot (6 May 2009)

yep thats the ones, been doing a lot of research and searching and they seem to tick all the boxes, plus the fronts can be use front or rear


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## Randochap (6 May 2009)

delt1c said:


> yep thats the ones, been doing a lot of research and searching and they seem to tick all the boxes, *plus the fronts can be use front or rear*



As can most all panniers.


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## Cockney Scot (18 May 2009)

Well after waiting nearly 3 weeks still no sign of the caaradice carradry bags arriving, still on back order. So I have bitten the bullet and ordered a set of Ortlieb Bike Packer Plus from Evans Cycles, only had them in red but thats not a problem, they are on the rear so I dont see them. checked they are in stock. Hopefully they will be as good as everyone on here has said . Hope so as the rears whilst I got them for £99.99 are nearly as expensive as a full set of front and rears. Next thing is to get a front set of panniers for the summer, but its time to save again. Just got the Artlieb orkney Handlebar bag as well. 
*
*


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## Cockney Scot (19 May 2009)

Picked up a bargain today (at least think so) got a set of Ortlieb Front roller Clasics for £67.50 from Cycle surgery, and they are red so will match the rears. Just fitted them and added advantage is that they can also fit on the rear when I dont need the large panniers.


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