# Stupid frikin' new tyres suck



## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

Three rides, two punctures. 15 miles each ride. Damp muddy roads.
Both on the rear, both just between sidewall and middle. 
Nothing obvious in the road.
Obviously nothing to stop them penetrating the tyre

They are *Continental Ultra Sport II Folding Road Tyre
*
I read the reviews and they seemed positive.

Got them on sale but wish I hadn't 

Will be putting the Schwalbe Marathons back on tonight. They are bullet proof.

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

Yep, cheap for a reason unfortunately, summer use maybe ok
There are options in between summer rollers and Marathon sluggers (at least the plus option)


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## biggs682 (11 Jan 2018)

oh dear @Rooster1 that's not good or fun


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## derrick (11 Jan 2018)

I think the clue is in the name.


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

derrick said:


> I think the clue is in the name.


Folding ?


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## I like Skol (11 Jan 2018)

Ha Ha!

Similar experience of Continental road tyres for me too - Damn tyres tale

I gave mine away in the end!


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

Rooster1 said:


> Folding ?


Sport mebbe


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## derrick (11 Jan 2018)

Rooster1 said:


> Folding ?


Ultra sport 11


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

I like Skol said:


> Ha Ha!
> 
> Similar experience of Continental road tyres for me too - Damn tyres tale
> 
> I gave mine away in the end!



If only there had been a forum with buying advice on such matters. I mean, why do I use this forum if I can't be bothered to look at the advice. Feeling very stupid and .... deflated. oh well, it's only money.


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

Ah, number two's - I get it.


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## derrick (11 Jan 2018)

Rooster1 said:


> Ah, number two's - I get it.


Mostly Ultra Sport.


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

You could have wasted less money on the rigid version at Ribble


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## dave r (11 Jan 2018)

Bad luck! I've been using these http://www.wiggle.co.uk/schwalbe-durano-plus-performance-rigid-road-tyre-1/
4500 miles last year, 1 puncture, farmer had been hedge cutting, and one tube failure, a very old tube split at the site of a previous puncture.


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

dave r said:


> Bad luck! I've been using these http://www.wiggle.co.uk/schwalbe-durano-plus-performance-rigid-road-tyre-1/
> 4500 miles last year, 1 puncture, farmer had been hedge cutting, and one tube failure, a very old tube split at the site of a previous puncture.




ARHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

And no issue with the non folding version of these (in 32s)

Folders come in a 25mm

http://www.wiggle.co.uk/schwalbe-durano-raceguard-dual-compound-folding-road-tyre/


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## derrick (11 Jan 2018)

At the end of the day it's a bit of bad luck, i have used light weight tyres and got away with it for thousands of miles, then used gaitor skins and found them puncturing after a few hundred miles. some times you get away with it sometimes you don't.


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

dave r said:


> Bad luck! I've been using these http://www.wiggle.co.uk/schwalbe-durano-plus-performance-rigid-road-tyre-1/
> 4500 miles last year, 1 puncture, farmer had been hedge cutting, and one tube failure, a very old tube split at the site of a previous puncture.



they look good


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## Rooster1 (11 Jan 2018)

I think I had a total of about three punctures all last year, 5k on rough roads.


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## derrick (11 Jan 2018)

User said:


> I think the clue is 'Continental'.....


Conti's are great, the miles i do i can't complain.


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

User said:


> I think the clue is 'Continental'.....


Little experience of their tyres although the new yet to be ridden bike wears gatorskins (and I have a pair to replace some Vittorias once worn)

However, their tubes are hateful based on my experience of half a dozen of the valves!


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## bpsmith (11 Jan 2018)

I was using Continental GP4000S tyres. No punctures in 5k miles. Replaced them with Vittoria Corsa G’s, which are amazing too.

When I put the carbon wheels away for the Winter, I stuck the original wheels on. They came with Ultra Sport II’s, which I have literally only done 200 miles on.

Had one single ride between Christmas and New Year and got two punctures. It’s technically one really, as I couldn’t find the cause when replacing first tube. After the second puncture, in freezing heavy rain, we found the cause nestled very neatly between the inner and outer of the tread. It was the exact size of the tyre thickness and so wasn’t visible until flexed significantly.

These tyres have no puncture protection it appears, after looking after the event. There’s me the bling that I could use them for chill out rides over the Winter. Another set for the Turbo at best.


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

Don’t think I’ve ever had them on a car, but I’ve had many cars!


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## Banjo (11 Jan 2018)

Another vote for Durano Plus I have done lots of miles on them without a single problem as yet.

Cheap Tyres are cheap for a reason. I bought some Michelin Lythion 2 tyres cheap and suffered fairy visits almost every ride.


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## mgs315 (11 Jan 2018)

Banjo said:


> Another vote for Durano Plus I have done lots of miles on them without a single problem as yet.
> 
> Cheap Tyres are cheap for a reason. I bought some Michelin Lythion 2 tyres cheap and suffered fairy visits almost every ride.



Funny that. I’ve had 25c Lithion 2s for 6 months now running 80psi wet and 95-100 dry and not a sniff of a puncture. I’ve hit some sodding large south London potholes with them on my commutes too.

I guess tyres really are the definition of YMMV eh?


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## RoubaixCube (11 Jan 2018)

Ive ran the 25mm 4 seasons all year round. Only had one puncture that was caused by 'cyclist error' when I went over a very very gnarly pothole i didn't see. Probably not a 'puncture' puncture but the innertube exploded nonetheless (Impact puncture) re-tubed and got rolling again.


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## Mr Celine (11 Jan 2018)

User said:


> I think the clue is 'Continental'.....



Yes, look at the shocking state of this GP4000s after only 4500 miles on the front followed by 5500 miles on the rear. 







One puncture in 10000 miles, binned due to the visible patches of zero tread. 

Other Continental tyres may not be this lucky.


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## MrPie (11 Jan 2018)

Shall never, ever and I mean ever, put Conti’s on any of my bikes. Even if they are giving them way. Utter crapshoot.


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## Aravis (11 Jan 2018)

Towards the end of last year I tried a pair of Continental Ultra Sport II (non-folding) 700x28s. To me they look more like 35s, but they seemed perfectly adequate. In fact, after almost 1000 puncture-free miles they were almost unmarked, but then one of them exploded a sidewall an hour after finishing a ride. So now I have a plentiful supply of tyre boots, and a single newish-looking tyre which I can't imagine ever using again.


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## mrbikerboy73 (11 Jan 2018)

I reckon I've had a good 5000+ miles from my GP 4000s and hardly any punctures. Got some Gatorskins on my winter bike and they've not been so puncture resistant but I put that down to the riding conditions.


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## mustang1 (11 Jan 2018)

£11? Cant go wrong!


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## vickster (11 Jan 2018)

mustang1 said:


> £11? Cant go wrong!


Well maybe if you need £11 of inner tubes to get you home


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## mustang1 (11 Jan 2018)

vickster said:


> Well maybe if you need £11 of inner tubes to get you home


Yeah!
I was saying it with a hint of sarcasm as it reminded me of a few people who curse me for not buying the cheapest option of various items.


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## bpsmith (11 Jan 2018)

Buy cheap, buy twice, as the saying goes. You’d never buy these twice, that’s for sure.


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## mustang1 (12 Jan 2018)

derrick said:


> Conti's are great, the miles i do i can't complain.


yeah ditto... conti gp4000 is my go-to tyre, been using for years. 25mm. Roll well, comfortable, good reliability. IDK how long mine last, i never checked, but i guess about 1 or 2 years (6000km +/- 2000).


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## bpsmith (12 Jan 2018)

mustang1 said:


> yeah ditto... conti gp4000 is my go-to tyre, been using for years. 25mm. Roll well, comfortable, good reliability. IDK how long mine last, i never checked, but i guess about 1 or 2 years (6000km +/- 2000).


I agree, it’s not every Continental tyre, it’s the particular Ultra Sport variant that is poor.

I too have being using the GP4000S and had no punctures in 5k miles. Plenty of marks on tread where there were clear near misses. Only swapped to the Vittoria as fancied the gum walls.

The Ultra Sport are not in the same league as the GP4000S. Zero puncture protection in that tyre.


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## Mo1959 (12 Jan 2018)

I didn't have any better luck with the GP4000S. 2 punctures within a few weeks which put me off them. Shame, as I liked the way they felt on the bike. It's probably more down to luck than anything, but I've had less deflations with Schwalbe and Vittoria tyres on my bikes.


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## raleighnut (12 Jan 2018)

bpsmith said:


> I agree, it’s not every Continental tyre, it’s the particular Ultra Sport variant that is poor.
> 
> I too have being using the GP4000S and had no punctures in 5k miles. Plenty of marks on tread where there were clear near misses. Only swapped to the Vittoria as fancied the gum walls.
> 
> The Ultra Sport are not in the same league as the GP4000S. Zero puncture protection in that tyre.


For real zero protection Conti tyres you need these,

https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/continental-gp-supersonic-folding-tyre/

I think the innertube weighs more.


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## Levo-Lon (12 Jan 2018)

derrick said:


> Ultra sport 11




Well you cant claim false advertising ?. It says ultra sport 2 and he had 2 punctures.
Not a good choice for this weather..in fact not a good choice for most things


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## Rooster1 (12 Jan 2018)

My negative review was published
http://www.wiggle.co.uk/continental-ultra-sport-ii-folding-road-tyre/


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## bpsmith (12 Jan 2018)

raleighnut said:


> For real zero protection Conti tyres you need these,
> 
> https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/continental-gp-supersonic-folding-tyre/
> 
> I think the innertube weighs more.


Very nice!


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## SkipdiverJohn (12 Jan 2018)

This is partly a by-product of the recent road cycling obsession for weight reduction at any cost. When I used to cycle a LOT of miles, i.e. before I owned a car, I used to run no-nonsense Michelins in 26" x 1 1/4" and 26" x 1 3/8" sizes and I was not plagued by punctures. I still got the odd one, and they were highly irritating, but generally the tyres held up well. 
However, I bought tyres based on functionality. I didn't think I must save a whole half an ounce of weight by buying the skinniest and lightest constructed tyre in the shop. The roads are also arguably in a worse state of repair than they were, and are not kept swept as efficiently, so if anything, cyclists should be beefing their tyres up for increased reliability - not trying to slim them down for marginal gains in weight and rolling resistance. That 0.1 mph speed gain is going to be right out of the window if you then spend 10 minutes doing a roadside puncture repair that you would have avoided needing at all if you'd fitted sturdy tyres not flimsy ones.


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## I like Skol (12 Jan 2018)

Mo1959 said:


> It's probably more down to luck than anything,


I have argued this exact point vociferously in the past when people have come on the forum to decry a particular model of tyre. I always maintained that the frequency of penetration punctures is down to several factors, including the following;

Conditions of use. If you regularly ride through glass strewn subways, behind the hedge trimming tractor or past the pin & tack factory then your odds will increase.
Paying attention. Regardless of where you ride, if you watch out for patches of broken glass, other larger debris like screws & bolts and keep out of the gravelly bits around traffic islands and other no-mans land areas that the cars don't go but always seem tempting for a cyclist to keep out of the way of the traffic, then you will reduce your chances of suffering.
Luck. For any given tyre there will always be someone who claims to have ridden for years, covering XX thousands of miles on a certain tyre model without ever experiencing a single puncture. Rider B who covers the same area with the same tyres may curse the tyres very existence due to repetitive deflations on an almost daily basis! While some of this may be down to non-penetration causes or installation errors, statistically given a large enough sample you would expect a few of these strikingly polar experiences due to the pure randomness of the puncture event. Neither extreme is a true indication of the tyres robustness.
Tyre choice. Thicker, tougher tyres will be less likely to puncture than a gossamer thin racing tyre, this is an undeniable mechanical truth, but unless you are operating at the very ends of the spectrum of lightweight-solid you might not actually be able to notice much difference between tyres spread across the middle ground due to the massive variation in the other points above.
My opinion has since changed and I will now join the crowds in condemning a particular tyre. I am happy to occupy the middle ground. A puncture is a minor inconvenience and only a small delay to any journey, so if it happens 2, 3, 4 times a year over a distance of 4000 miles then I won't complain and don't find it necessary to resort to the tyre choice of the terminally afraid, a Marathon plus. However, my experience of the Continental tyres was shocking! A puncture every 100 miles on the bike they were supplied on and when transferred to my commuter a puncture within 2 miles. Some tyres just are not fit for purpose, unless that purpose is to only ride around a swept indoor track.....


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## Rooster1 (12 Jan 2018)

I have been through many many sets of tyres and I pay great attention to their wear and tear and what I ride on.
For example:
- I check tyres for nicks and holes, no matter how new they are - a cut in a tyre will be no end of trouble.
- I (try) and buy decent inner tubes that don't perish
- I look after my wheels and rim tape.
- When I get a puncture I take time to figure out the cause - I don't just slap another inner tube in and hope for the best
- I avoid potholes (although I got a double blow out one time as it was unavoidable)
- I try and buy decent tyres, I read the reviews.

Last year I had hardly any punctures using
*Mavic Yksion 700c Folding Road Tyres (25c)* for the summer and some. 4000 miles of wear.
*Schwalbe Marathon Plus Smartguard Rigid Road Tyres in winter (25c) *1000 miles of wear. These are HEAVY and add about a KILO to my ride.

I saw what I thought were decent tyres in a sale but they have turned out to be a nightmare.


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## confusedcyclist (12 Jan 2018)

To add ancedotal evidence to the thread, I have ultra sport IIs and don't recall any punctures at all, it's fair to say I've ridden more than 3 leisure rides on them too. That said, they wouldn't be my first choice for harsh winter roads, just a budget tyre for commuting in semi-decent conditions. I have also had similar experiences with Schwable Luganos which usually get the same complaints.


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## Globalti (12 Jan 2018)

It must be down to luck or where you ride. I use Veloflex Open Corsas, which have a file pattern tread and soft compound so are unbelievably grippy in dry, wet or even on ice or snow and they are super-lightweight with cloth sidewalls, so they ride really smoothly. I'd be more than happy to exchange the amazing grip and comfort for a few extra punctures but I don't suffer more than 2-3 punctures a year. I ride entirely on quiet rural roads and always stick to the clean part of the road so maybe if I lived in a city the story would be different.


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## Rooster1 (12 Jan 2018)

*Important note: *For about 50% of the 15 mile ride where I got the punctures, there has been (on Monday this week) extensive* hedge trimming* by a tractor. This results in lots and lots of splinters all over the road. I can see the debris. This explains alot BUT I would expect the tyre in question to cope with this.

In better news, I just did the same ride and made it back puncture free, on the Schwalbes. I can still see the hedge debris!

@Fnaar hedge trimming


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## Dec66 (12 Jan 2018)

My Cube Peloton came shod with Conti Ultra Sport II's.

I had six p*nct*res on the first three rides (30-40 miles each), including three on the third ride (I was rescued on that occasion by a kind fellow giving me his spare tube, as I'd used my two spares).

They were binned off and replaced by Vittoria Rubino Pros.

I kept the Conti tyres for the turbo trainer, when I get one. They have all the p*nct*re resistance of wet tissues.

Gatorskins are far better, as I believe are the GP4000's. The Ultra Sport II's, however, are cack.


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## cyberknight (12 Jan 2018)

I cant see the issue , listed on the conti website as a racing tyre, not a tyre for commuting/general riding so comparing them to marathons etc is chalk and cheese.
Summer tyres for summer rides, not mid winter .


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## the_mikey (12 Jan 2018)

Continental ultra sport 2's look good, but they're not the lightest and have no puncture protection whatsoever. Michelin Dynamic sport also have similar good looks but zero puncture protection, and are equally as cheap.


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## Ajax Bay (12 Jan 2018)

the_mikey said:


> Continental ultra sport 2's look good, but they're not the lightest and have no puncture protection whatsoever. Michelin Dynamic sport also have similar good looks but zero puncture protection, and are equally as cheap.


Here's a comparison between Michelin-Pro-4-service-course-vs-Continental-Ultrasport-ii-vs-Michelin-Dynamic-sport-2015
I have just replaced a Michelin-Pro-4-service-course 25-622 which had done 5187km on the rear (I think this shows good endurance). Had a puncture on Friday (101km) and after a clean and careful inspection a small 'farthing' sized patch of threads was visible. New tyre time (Continental GP4000S II).
Grip, Durability, Robustness/puncture'protection', rolling resistance, weight, cost.


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## Alan O (12 Jan 2018)

What I find interesting about this discussion is that it reminds me just how much tyre technology has improved in the past couple of decades.

When I rebuilt my old bike in 2016, my 27" wheels limited my tyre choice, but I managed to find a pair of Ultra Sport II for a very good price. And I thought they were great - the profile with a thicker tread part was impressive, the rubber compound seemed nicer than I was used to, the near-slick tread was really good with excellent grip, and rolling seemed very smooth with little resistance. In short, they were much nicer than the tyres I'd used in the past - and I'd never heard of puncture protection.

I've actually only ridden a couple of hundred miles on them (without a puncture), because I found some 27" Gatorskins to use instead, and the second bike I built got a pair of 27" Marathons (original Greenguard). The Ultra Sport tyres are now on a fixed-gear bike I'm building - but as I say, this old fogey thinks they're pretty good for the money.


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## boydj (12 Jan 2018)

I find Conti GP 4 Seasons a very robust tyre, as well as being lightweight and grippy. I can't remember the last time I punctured one.


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## cyberknight (13 Jan 2018)

Ajax Bay said:


> Here's a comparison between Michelin-Pro-4-service-course-vs-Continental-Ultrasport-ii-vs-Michelin-Dynamic-sport-2015
> I have just replaced a Michelin-Pro-4-service-course 25-622 which had done 5187km on the rear (I think this shows good endurance). Had a puncture on Friday (101km) and after a clean and careful inspection a small 'farthing' sized patch of threads was visible. New tyre time (Continental GP4000S II).
> Grip, Durability, Robustness/puncture'protection', rolling resistance, weight, cost.


linky no worky


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## Sharky (13 Jan 2018)

raleighnut said:


> For real zero protection Conti tyres you need these,
> 
> https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/continental-gp-supersonic-folding-tyre/
> 
> I think the innertube weighs more.



Great tyres - have had 20mm supersonics on my TT bikes for a few seasons. Not a great mileage and always good tarmac, but no visits from the .........


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## youngoldbloke (13 Jan 2018)

User46386 said:


> Op you should have got something like a Continental Gatorskin Hardshell. *Buy cheap, buy twice.*
> 
> Here this is what you need http://www.wiggle.co.uk/continental...ource=google&utm_term&utm_campaign=UK_PLA_Com


 *Buy cheap, buy twice. *I don't get this - so often quoted. What if these tyres had been bought at list price (24.95 at Wiggle). Would they somehow be better? Same as 'you get what you pay for' it just doesn't make sense nowadays when everything is discounted sooner or later. I NEVER buy at RRP, you can always find a discount somewhere. BTW I've used Ultra Sport IIs, and found them no more or less prone to punctures than any other tyre, likewise Lithion 2s - bought at discount of course.


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## raleighnut (13 Jan 2018)

Sharky said:


> Great tyres - have had 20mm supersonics on my TT bikes for a few seasons. Not a great mileage and always good tarmac, but no visits from the .........


Wait til you do get one, they don't half go down quickly being such a small volume tyre. Generally wrecks the tube too, multiple pinch flats by the time you managed to 'twig' that something is amiss and stopped. Never 'wrecked' the tyre though but the tube has been 'toast'.


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## youngoldbloke (13 Jan 2018)

User46386 said:


> They werent bought at list price though, most things are discounted all the time. Its what the public expects.
> Even though everything is still discounted _theres still a continuum between the cheapest and the most expensive_.
> If OP had come on here and asked for a decent tyre with puncture protection he wouldnt have been recommended those ones.


- this is true, but it is not necessarily true that the more you actually pay the better/more puncture resistant the tyre will be, so 'buy cheap buy twice' is not really appropriate - as I said, would the tyres have performed any better at list price - of course not. If you are saying it's likely a more expensive (on list) tyre specified as puncture resistant would actually perform better, that might be true of course (but it may not be).


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## Alan O (13 Jan 2018)

youngoldbloke said:


> ... as I said, would the tyres have performed any better at list price - of course not.


Yeah, but it's blindingly obvious that that's not what "Buy cheap, buy twice" means - nobody is suggesting that _paying a higher price for exactly the same thing_ will make it better!


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## SkipdiverJohn (13 Jan 2018)

User46386 said:


> The tyres with the best puncture protection tend to be the more expensive ones.



Not sure that's necessarily true. CRC are supplying Schwalbe LC @ £9.99 and LC+ @ £13.49, and from what I'm able to glean from postings neither of those has a bad reputation for getting p*nctures. On the LC+, Schwalbe rate it as level 5 out of 6 protection, only 1 below the flagship M+ tyre.


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## youngoldbloke (13 Jan 2018)

Alan O said:


> Yeah, but it's blindingly obvious that that's not what "Buy cheap, buy twice" means - nobody is suggesting that _paying a higher price for exactly the same thing_ will make it better!


My point is that they are not 'cheap' tyres - mid range might be a better description. If they had been purchased at full list price would "Buy cheap, buy twice" still be the comment? IME there actually are people who believe the more you pay for a product (the same product) the better it somehow becomes.


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## Alan O (13 Jan 2018)

youngoldbloke said:


> IME there actually are people who believe the more you pay for a product (the same product) the better it somehow becomes.


I've certainly never met anybody that stupid.


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## Ajax Bay (13 Jan 2018)

cyberknight said:


> linky no worky


Thank you. I have edited the post to provide the correct link:
Compare/continental-ultra-sport-ii-2015-vs-michelin-dynamic-sport-2015-vs-michelin-pro-4-service-course-2014


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## bpsmith (14 Jan 2018)

I had another spin on my Ultra Sports today. They’re actually pretty quick and handle nicely too tbh. Puncture protection is my only convern and they don’t pretend to be any good in that respect.


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## DRM (14 Jan 2018)

Rooster1 said:


> Three rides, two punctures. 15 miles each ride. Damp muddy roads.
> Both on the rear, both just between sidewall and middle.
> Nothing obvious in the road.
> Obviously nothing to stop them penetrating the tyre
> ...



Last year I bought a Verenti Technique Sora equipped bike for winter use, it came with 28mm Ultra Sport 2's, on the first ride the rear tyre split across the width of the tyre, after a bit of complaining to Wiggle they agreed to replace them at cost, when the replacements came, I noticed that the tyres supplied with the bike looked like cheap copies, compared to the new ones which came boxed up, the rubber looked cheaper & soft, the Continental Ultra Sport logos looked like an imitation (just in silver ink, Continental not printed in orange) and the tread moulding on them looked rough, again like a bad copy, the replacements have, so far been good, despite being obviously not as good as the Grand Prix 4000S 2's on my best bike, having used the bike a lot, both at home & in France, it makes me wonder if Continental have them made to two different standards, for aftersales and also for supply with new bikes, made down to a price.


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## Milzy (14 Jan 2018)

Rooster1 said:


> Three rides, two punctures. 15 miles each ride. Damp muddy roads.
> Both on the rear, both just between sidewall and middle.
> Nothing obvious in the road.
> Obviously nothing to stop them penetrating the tyre
> ...


I had them stock with a bike. Did about 500 miles no issues then changed to Michelin.


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## mjr (14 Jan 2018)

cyberknight said:


> I cant see the issue , listed on the conti website as a racing tyre, […]


Are races won by puncturing?


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## cyberknight (15 Jan 2018)

mjr said:


> Are races won by puncturing?


If you puncture in a race then you have back up  , the extra grip, lower rolling resistance and flexibility of the tyre are the trade off you pay for less protection.


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## mjr (15 Jan 2018)

cyberknight said:


> If you puncture in a race then you have back up  , the extra grip, lower rolling resistance and flexibility of the tyre are the trade off you pay for less protection.


Only the higher levels of one-day and stage races, surely? A cat 4 standing by the roadside holding a wheel aloft may be there a rather long time and TCR participants aren't allowed backup.


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## youngoldbloke (15 Jan 2018)

mjr said:


> Are races won by puncturing?


Are races won on Marathon +? Reckon most serious race participants will be riding on tubs anyway.


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## cyberknight (15 Jan 2018)

mjr said:


> Only the higher levels of one-day and stage races, surely? A cat 4 standing by the roadside holding a wheel aloft may be there a rather long time and TCR participants aren't allowed backup.





youngoldbloke said:


> Are races won on Marathon +? Reckon most serious race participants will be riding on tubs anyway.


difference between average and good race tyres can be 1 minute over a race, let alone M+, even if you dont puncture your liable not to be in the mix unless of course your super fit to start with .


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## mjr (15 Jan 2018)

youngoldbloke said:


> Are races won on Marathon +? Reckon most serious race participants will be riding on tubs anyway.


False dilemma: there are tyres between Marathon + and Ultra Shoot II.


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## Ajax Bay (16 Jan 2018)

mjr said:


> Are races won by puncturing?





cyberknight said:


> the extra grip, lower rolling resistance and flexibility of the tyre are the trade off you pay for less protection





mjr said:


> False dilemma: there are tyres between Marathon + and Ultra Shoot II.


What exactly is the point you're trying to make @mjr ? What tyres would you recommend for racing which took account of your aversion to puncture risk yet offered the rider the "extra grip, lower rolling resistance and flexibility" which will make the difference between winning and not. What adjective other than 'racing' would you like Continental to use to describe their UltraSport tyres (please be polite). Given their apparent fragility, clearly not 'touring' or 'training'.


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## vickster (16 Jan 2018)

New (to me) Ti bike has 25mm Gatorskins, they felt absolutely fine on today’s maiden voyage (dry but v blustery) on appalling road surfaces around Epsom!


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## mjr (16 Jan 2018)

Ajax Bay said:


> What exactly is the point you're trying to make @mjr ?


The point I'm making is it depends on the racing so calling something a racing tyre doesn't necessarily mean @User's "wet fag paper" and I don't think @Rooster1's mistake was so obvious.



Ajax Bay said:


> What tyres would you recommend for racing which took account of your aversion to puncture risk yet offered the rider the "extra grip, lower rolling resistance and flexibility" which will make the difference between winning and not.


What aversion to puncture risk? I've various flexible less-protected tyres on various bikes in the shed (incuding some 80s/90s classics, but given I don't race at the moment (despite having a salbutamol inhaler), I'm probably not the best to ask. Even so, which tyre to recommend for racing would depend on the race, or do you think that the pros use the same tyres for Strade Bianche as the cobbled classics as the grand tour flat sprint stages? And that they're using the same as the endurance racers? And then you have CX and MTB and all the other disciplines - calling a bike part "racing" today is probably pretty close to meaningless!



Ajax Bay said:


> What adjective other than 'racing' would you like Continental to use to describe their UltraSport tyres (please be polite). Given their apparent fragility, clearly not 'touring' or 'training'.


Fragile would seem appropriate but that's hard to sell, so maybe flexible is a better euphemism. However, note that https://www.continental-tires.com/bicycle/tyres/race-tyres/ultra-sport2 puts it under the race tyre section, but with a heading of "Trusty training companion", the little bar diagram says it's suitable for "tour", while the "tyres with similar performance" box contains Gatorskins and Hardshells. Does anyone think it's honest marketing to call it a trusty training and touring tyre similar to the gators and hardshells?


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