# What supps do you take?



## 7anceArmstrong (4 May 2019)

Hi all, I'm 45 so obviously my body needs more help than it did once upon a time. With that in mind I take a few supps which, hopefully, help physiologically not just as a placebo.

I currently take:-
Q10
Magnesium
Turmeric
Cod liver oil
Bcaa's 

Not including protein etc etc. 

Anyone anything they would like to recommend? Either for cycling or my currently hellish depression.


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

Get tested by your GP and then add vitamin D (as almost everyone who doesn’t spend all day in hot sunshine is deficient). Get a full bone profile done too (ie calcium)


----------



## screenman (5 May 2019)

Scones.


----------



## screenman (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Hi all, I'm 45 so obviously my body needs more help than it did once upon a time. With that in mind I take a few supps which, hopefully, help physiologically not just as a placebo.
> 
> I currently take:-
> Q10
> ...



Are you I training for an event?


----------



## Ming the Merciless (5 May 2019)

Baked beans on toast


----------



## Milzy (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Hi all, I'm 45 so obviously my body needs more help than it did once upon a time. With that in mind I take a few supps which, hopefully, help physiologically not just as a placebo.
> 
> I currently take:-
> Q10
> ...


Do you think you’re really benefiting though? Seems expensive.


----------



## Heltor Chasca (5 May 2019)

Supps? Suppositories?


----------



## Rusty Nails (5 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Get tested by your GP and then add vitamin D (as almost everyone who doesn’t spend all day in hot sunshine is deficient). Get a full bone profile done too (ie calcium)



I found out, following persuasion from my wife a couple of years ago, that daily vitamin D did help my mildly depressive or SAD moods, through the darker months. I still don't like those months but they don't get me as down as they used to. That's the only supplement I take.


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

Milzy said:


> Do you think you’re really benefiting though? Seems expensive.



Nah, less than a fiver a week for the above. The focus its giving me helps to motivate me to be honest.

Beans on toast is a staple meal for me.

Sups = supplements
Not training for an event.

Thanks guys.


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

Ref vit D suggestion, thanks guys.


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

Rusty Nails said:


> I found out, following persuasion from my wife a couple of years ago, that daily vitamin D did help my mildly depressive or SAD moods, through the darker months. I still don't like those months but they don't get me as down as they used to. That's the only supplement I take.


I take it for muscle and joint issues


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Nah, less than a fiver a week for the above. The focus its giving me helps to motivate me to be honest.
> 
> Beans on toast is a staple meal for me.
> 
> ...


Presumably with plenty of fruit and veg too


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Ref vit D suggestion, thanks guys.


But do get tested before taking and discuss dosing with GP
If you’re taking a fortified cod liver capsule, it’ll contain a small dose already


----------



## Ian H (5 May 2019)

I know of at least one pensioner who just rides his bike.


----------



## derrick (5 May 2019)

Ian H said:


> I know of at least one pensioner who just rides his bike.


Me. 
Never taken pills unless prescribed by the doctor.


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

I only take the ones ‘prescribed’ (recommended)


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

Ian H said:


> I know of at least one pensioner who just rides his bike.




That's the beauty of life, we are all different. 

A second or two may not matter to others , but to me, it does. Not for any "good" reason, but I don't need one.


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> That's the beauty of life, we are all different.
> 
> A second or two may not matter to others , but to me, it does. Not for any "good" reason, but I don't need one.


Your almost namesake liked ‘supplements’ too for those gains


----------



## derrick (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> That's the beauty of life, we are all different.
> 
> A second or two may not matter to others , but to me, it does. Not for any "good" reason, but I don't need one.


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

Wow, who knew wanting to get faster was so funny.....


----------



## Ming the Merciless (5 May 2019)

If you want to get faster then train. A magic pill to do that does not exist.


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Wow, who knew wanting to get faster was so funny.....


I think the prevailing view is that training makes you faster...not supplements...unless you're a certain disgraced ex pro...


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> If you want to get faster then train. A magic pill to do that does not exist.


Epo might give you a boost...but that's an injection not a pill (and not really magic, its moa is well understood)


----------



## derrick (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Wow, who knew wanting to get faster was so funny.....


Nothing funny in wanting to go faster. No legal pill will do that for you. You need to train harder to go faster.


----------



## The Jogger (5 May 2019)

D3
K2
Magnesium 
Probiotics 
B Complex
Apple Cider Vinegar 
B12
Multi Vit


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

The Jogger said:


> D3
> K2
> Magnesium
> Probiotics
> ...



Many thanks.

Hard work, training will get you so far, but diet etc will increase any potential you may have. Surprised you guys didnt know that?


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

vickster said:


> I think the prevailing view is that training makes you faster...not supplements...unless you're a certain disgraced ex pro...




Froome? Wiggo? Contador etc etc etc......or the only man who ever cheated, Lance?


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Froome? Wiggo? Contador etc etc etc......or the only man who ever cheated, Lance?


I don’t believe there is actually incontrovertible truth about Froome and Wiggins. Contador barely heard of him

I’m sure plenty others cheated but none appear to be as odious as LA


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Many thanks.
> 
> Hard work, training will get you so far, but diet etc will increase any potential you may have. Surprised you guys didnt know that?


You’ve not mentioned diet in your OP though?


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

Barely heard of El Pistolero? wow......


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

vickster said:


> You’ve not mentioned diet in your OP though?




Sorry, i presumed that went without saying.......


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Barely heard of El Pistolero? wow......


I don’t follow pro cycling (dull, I prefer to ride my own bikes ) . The lovely scenery made watching a bit of the TDY this weekend bearable


----------



## vickster (5 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Sorry, i presumed that went without saying.......


Why do you need supplements then when you should get what you need from your diet (Vit D being an exception in non sunny climes). Unless you’re deficient due to an absorption issue?


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (5 May 2019)

vickster said:


> I don’t follow pro cycling (dull, I prefer to ride my own bikes ) . The lovely scenery made watching a bit of the TDY this weekend bearable




Oh, i do that too, 210 miles last week...... But rather than waiving my e-penis id prefer to swap tips like Turmeric/Kale etc etc Many thanks all (Even...)

Anyway, ive utilized the ignore button, and would welcome any sensible input, this is, after all, the T F and H sub.


----------



## The Jogger (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Many thanks.
> 
> Hard work, training will get you so far, but diet etc will increase any potential you may have. Surprised you guys didnt know that?


A very general reply as there are so many views on diets. Low carb high fat, low fat high carb etc etc. I thought you might be a bit more specific, no?


----------



## Blue Hills (6 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Get tested by your GP and then add vitamin D (as almost everyone who doesn’t spend all day in hot sunshine is deficient). Get a full bone profile done too (ie calcium)


Seem to remember this in the news a while ago and the medical arguments seemed convincing, ie - not hypochondria. Since it seems to be recommended that this is taken continuosly, seems best to buy in bulk for economy.
Anyone got any good sources?
On the general issue of supplements, with a small number of exceptions. i generally consider them pointless and even dangerous in that they are a distraction from just eating a well balanced diet of real food.


----------



## davidphilips (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Many thanks.
> 
> Hard work, training will get you so far, but diet etc will increase any potential you may have. Surprised you guys didnt know that?



That is very good advice, There are 3 things required to get faster on a bike,training, rest and a good diet, thing about diet is that if you training a lot then perhaps upping your protein intake and even adding some supplements that some one not training a few hours a day may not need.

Only advice i would offer is to take protein (even a glass of milk or an egg) as soon as you stop on the bike and within the first hour at least and try to take protein every few hours, i offer this as my view and what i do, good luck with the training and remember to put on suncream.


----------



## CXRAndy (6 May 2019)

screenman said:


> Scones.


----------



## ColinJ (6 May 2019)

Blue Hills said:


> Seem to remember this in the news a while ago and the medical arguments seemed convincing, ie - not hypochondria. Since it seems to be recommended that this is taken continuosly, seems best to buy in bulk for economy.
> Anyone got any good sources?


Get vitamin D3 in combination with vitamin K2. Yes, you ought to be able to get all vitamins except perhaps D from your diet but in most countries now K2 content of food is MUCH lower than it was for our ancestors. It mainly comes from animal products and animals get it from what THEY eat, which has changed significantly and not for the better. Vegans would have to be very careful in what they eat.

You can get K2 from fermented products such as natto (fermented soya bean curd, which most westerners find pretty disgusting!) but I just buy a D3/K2 supplement. D3 helps the body extract calcium from food, and K2 is used to control where the body deposits it. Without vitamin D3 you will suffer calcium deficiency (brittle bones etc.). With D3, but no K2, calcium will end up where you really don't want it i.e. instead of in bones and teeth, it could end up causing havoc in organs and arteries.

Read about it in Vitamin K2 And The Calcium Paradox: How a Little-Known Vitamin Could Save Your Life. (Kindle edition currently only £1.24.) It is very convincing.

I get my D3/K2 here.


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (6 May 2019)

Many thanks , apologies for my spikiness.


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

Blue Hills said:


> Seem to remember this in the news a while ago and the medical arguments seemed convincing, ie - not hypochondria. Since it seems to be recommended that this is taken continuosly, seems best to buy in bulk for economy.
> Anyone got any good sources?
> On the general issue of supplements, with a small number of exceptions. i generally consider them pointless and even dangerous in that they are a distraction from just eating a well balanced diet of real food.


I just buy 100 x D3 from Holland and Barrett (25ug, as 'prescribed' by rheumatologist, on special is usually around £8-10


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

Turmeric? Nah. BCAAs? If you're getting enough protein then I can't fathom why you'd need those. Can't really comment on the others but vit D is a good idea, as @vickster rightly says a majority of the population is deficient, but that's general health rather than training.

I personally think that most of these supplements are like bike upgrades. Unlikely to do much good or much harm but if you feel like they're helping then whatever floats your boat. Just avoid some of the wackier herbal stuff which can actually be harmful.


----------



## huwsparky (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Many thanks.
> 
> Hard work, training will get you so far, but diet etc will increase any potential you may have. Surprised you guys didnt know that?


But taking suppliments for something you're not deficient in doesn't really constutute an improvement in diet. Boosting a vitamin you don't need any more of Is pointless.


----------



## Ming the Merciless (6 May 2019)

Pills aren't diet, why are you being cagey about what you eat?. You must have identified you are deficient to start taking these pills. Did you doctor recommend them? You should be able to get pretty all from your diet before you turn to pills. Vitamin D just get outside and go for a walk every lunch time during your working day. Vitamin k2 you want to be eating corn feed animals, Jarlsberg cheese is also an excellent source.


----------



## ColinJ (6 May 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> Vitamin D just get outside and go for a walk every lunch time during your working day.


From about Mar to Sept in the UK - yes. Oct to Feb - no!



YukonBoy said:


> Vitamin k2 you want to be eating corn feed animals.


Actually, that's the problem!

You want NON-corn fed animals; animals feeding on lush grassy meadows, and most are NOT these days.


----------



## Ming the Merciless (6 May 2019)

ColinJ said:


> From about Mar to Sept in the UK - yes. Oct to Feb - no!
> 
> 
> Actually, that's the problem!
> ...



Oops that's what I meant, wrong way round!


----------



## Blue Hills (6 May 2019)

ColinJ said:


> Get vitamin D3 in combination with vitamin K2. Yes, you ought to be able to get all vitamins except perhaps D from your diet but in most countries now K2 content of food is MUCH lower than it was for our ancestors. It mainly comes from animal products and animals get it from what THEY eat, which has changed significantly and not for the better. Vegans would have to be very careful in what they eat.
> 
> You can get K2 from fermented products such as natto (fermented soya bean curd, which most westerners find pretty disgusting!) but I just buy a D3/K2 supplement. D3 helps the body extract calcium from food, and K2 is used to control where the body deposits it. Without vitamin D3 you will suffer calcium deficiency (brittle bones etc.). With D3, but no K2, calcium will end up where you really don't want it i.e. instead of in bones and teeth, it could end up causing havoc in organs and arteries.
> 
> ...


Musing - could vitamin D be added to beer without affecting the taste?


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

Blue Hills said:


> Musing - could vitamin D be added to beer without affecting the taste?


Why would you?


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

ColinJ said:


> Get vitamin D3 in combination with vitamin K2. Yes, you ought to be able to get all vitamins except perhaps D from your diet but in most countries now K2 content of food is MUCH lower than it was for our ancestors. It mainly comes from animal products and animals get it from what THEY eat, which has changed significantly and not for the better. Vegans would have to be very careful in what they eat.
> 
> You can get K2 from fermented products such as natto (fermented soya bean curd, which most westerners find pretty disgusting!) but I just buy a D3/K2 supplement. D3 helps the body extract calcium from food, and K2 is used to control where the body deposits it. Without vitamin D3 you will suffer calcium deficiency (brittle bones etc.). With D3, but no K2, calcium will end up where you really don't want it i.e. instead of in bones and teeth, it could end up causing havoc in organs and arteries.
> 
> ...


Why isn’t the dose stated? Unless I’m blind (there’s a lot of waffle on the product page)

And why if the evidence is so convincing are there no extensive Pubmed resources etc when looking for information on this? Just sites selling the products?


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Why isn’t the dose stated? Unless I’m blind (there’s a lot of waffle on the product page)
> 
> And why if the evidence is so convincing are there no extensive Pubmed resources etc when looking for information on this? Just sites selling the products?


The only thing I know about vitamin K is they give it as an injection to newborn babies but I can't remember why.

Or it's slang for ketamine...


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

winjim said:


> The only thing I know about vitamin K is they give it as an injection to newborn babies but I can't remember why.
> 
> Or it's slang for ketamine...


Apparently for clotting 
https://www.guysandstthomas.nhs.uk/...maternity/vitamin-K-and-your-newborn-baby.pdf


----------



## gbb (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> Hi all, I'm 45 so obviously my body needs more help than it did once upon a time. With that in mind I take a few supps which, hopefully, help physiologically not just as a placebo.
> 
> I currently take:-
> Q10
> ...


Depression apart, at 45 to 50 I was my fittest ever without any meds, supplements etc and riding 150 miles a week including a hard/fast 50 miler so assuming you're not suffering any physical ailments, eat well and you should be ok..
I used to find if I could muster myself in dark mood times, a bike ride gave me a huge lift anyway but as others have said, check vitamin D. SAD syndrome used to be a bad thing for me, a light lamp helped, I'd never considered vitamin D but I sympathise, it's not nice at all.


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Apparently for clotting
> https://www.guysandstthomas.nhs.uk/...maternity/vitamin-K-and-your-newborn-baby.pdf


That's the one. I really should know since I consented to it less than two months ago...


----------



## Blue Hills (6 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Why would you?


Pretty obvious i would have thought vickster.

Try to minimise pills - have shuddering memories of a long ago evening class social where some person took out a small, ok not so small tin, and proceeded to talk us through what all the odd!y coloured pill supplements were for. Her demo was followed by a deathly silence.


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

Blue Hills said:


> Pretty obvious i would have thought vickster.
> 
> Try to minimise pills - have shuddering memories of a long ago evening class social where some person took out a small, ok not so small tin, and proceeded to talk us through what all the odd!y coloured pill supplements were for. Her demo was followed by a deathly silence.


I passed a jolly evening a while ago by arguing with an acquaintance on facebook about the merits of turmeric. He's an alternative health practitioner. It was interesting to see the pseudoscientific mind at work, he showed all the classic fallacies. At one point he posted a photo of his lovely embossed certificates. I offered to post mine...


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

Blue Hills said:


> Pretty obvious i would have thought vickster.
> 
> Try to minimise pills - have shuddering memories of a long ago evening class social where some person took out a small, ok not so small tin, and proceeded to talk us through what all the odd!y coloured pill supplements were for. Her demo was followed by a deathly silence.


I don’t follow? The vit d pills are tiny

Oh and alcohol actually impairs the absorption of B vitamins, A, D, E and K...plus a bunch of other minerals and useful stuff so mixing with booze may not be sensible practice

https://www.livestrong.com/article/375909-what-are-the-effects-of-alcohol-in-vitamins-minerals/


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (6 May 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> Pills aren't diet, why are you being cagey about what you eat?. You must have identified you are deficient to start taking these pills. Did you doctor recommend them? You should be able to get pretty all from your diet before you turn to pills. Vitamin D just get outside and go for a walk every lunch time during your working day. Vitamin k2 you want to be eating corn feed animals, Jarlsberg cheese is also an excellent source.



Im not, care to show me where ive been "cagey"? , diet has been done to death elsewhere, with plenty of knowledge out there already.

I watch my macros etc etc so there isnt much more that can be done on that front (in my humble opinion). Ref being deficient, no, i dont know about your health care but my GP has "all on" scripting the correct meds for an infection, let alone doing extensive bloodwork. Appreciate your input.

Getting the vibe some of you guys think im looking for peds etc, im not, at all. Supplementation ,for some, yields real world results.

Anyway, thanks again, for those that have given up time to offer suggestions.


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

Surely one can't advise on supplements without knowing details of the diet. Because what are you supplementing?


----------



## vickster (6 May 2019)

winjim said:


> Surely one can't advise on supplements without knowing details of the diet. Because what are you supplementing?


And may just be pi$$ing out whatever is being taken if not deficient?

Get tested privately? Could save a fortune in the long run


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (6 May 2019)

winjim said:


> Surely one can't advise on supplements without knowing details of the diet. Because what are you supplementing?




I guess thats one way of looking at it, would be a hella long post mind.


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> I guess thats one way of looking at it, would be a hella long post mind.


Yes it would. That's why 'dietician' is a protected title.


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (6 May 2019)

See Creatine is a supp, but has nothing to do with diet.


----------



## winjim (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> See Creatine is a supp, but has nothing to do with diet.


Of course it does. You have a dietary intake of creatine.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/26874700/


----------



## Ming the Merciless (6 May 2019)

7anceArmstrong said:


> See Creatine is a supp, but has nothing to do with diet.



If you eat meat or fish it is in your diet anyway


----------



## 7anceArmstrong (6 May 2019)

See boys, youve taught me something there.

Once again, thank you.


----------



## ColinJ (6 May 2019)

vickster said:


> Why isn’t the dose stated? Unless I’m blind (there’s a lot of waffle on the product page)
> 
> *And why if the evidence is so convincing are there no extensive Pubmed resources* etc when looking for information on this? Just sites selling the products?


There are _many _of them - I have read scores of published articles.

Start the clock...

Google "academic articles k2"

Stop the clock. (3 seconds.)

2nd search result ....

"_The use of vitamin D and vitamin K2 together as an approach to osteoporosis treatment may significantly reduce morbidity and mortality. This approach may rival bisphosphonate treatment without the side effects associated with the use of this medication, along with reducing vascular calcification and its complications._"


----------



## CXRAndy (7 May 2019)

I started taking creatine, but for me couldn't tolerate it. I suffered quite severe dizzy spells, These started after day 1 and subsided immediately after stopping usage.

The supposed benefit of creatine is to increase explosive short burst power


----------



## vickster (7 May 2019)

ColinJ said:


> There are _many _of them - I have read scores of published articles.
> 
> Start the clock...
> 
> ...


May...
Not ‘has been proven’?

The same google search gives me that one article, one more below and a bunch of stuff on astronomy?

https://jandonline.org/article/S2212-2672(16)30005-3/fulltext

As an omnivore, it is likely I get enough Vit K and the article states lots more research is needed

Anyhow thanks (esp for the sarcasm) but work beckons


----------



## ColinJ (7 May 2019)

vickster said:


> May...
> Not ‘has been proven’?
> 
> The same google search gives me that one article, one more below and a bunch of stuff on astronomy?
> ...


That was the 3 second search. I will give links to (say) 10 academic articles later to help you or anybody else who values their health to learn more about the subject.

Vitamin K comes in 2 forms - K1 and K2. As an omnivore (or any other 'vore') you ARE very likely to get enough K1 in your diet. (If you were not getting it then your blood would not clot so you would effectively become a haemophiliac.)

We are talking about K2, which has a different role in the body. There used to be a theory (by doctors, scientists, researchers, people who actually work in the field, NOT people selling supplements) that there was not a problem with humans getting enough K2 because there is a mechanism in the body for K1 (which, as stated above, there is plenty of) to be converted to K2. Further research has now shown that in humans this is an inefficient process and most of the K2 thus produced is not bio-available. Animals such as cows with very different digestive systems to us are very good at producing bio-available K2, given the right diet themselves.

Humans need to get it as K2 in their diet and not rely on their K1->K2 process. As an omnivore in 1900 you definitely WOULD have been getting enough in your diet because the animals that you ate (or which produced the dairy products and eggs that you ate) were feeding on high quality grass outdoors. These days, however, most people get animal products from animals that are fed a poorer diet which means that their K2 production is way down on what it would have been in past centuries. That in turn means that humans are often not getting enough K2.

K2 deficiency has repeatedly been shown to lead to poor quality bones and calcification in soft tissues. Osteoporosis and vascular disease have increased as K2 consumption has decreased.

As I mentioned previously, fermented products do contain more vitamin K2 and certain foreign cheeses are still made from milk of a high enough quality that they contain appreciable amounts of K2. So, it is POSSIBLE to get K2 from diet alone (that is the natural way!) but you need a natural diet to do so. That doesn't mean meat, milk, cheese, and eggs - it means HIGH QUALITY meat, milk, cheese, and eggs from animals not stuffed with corn pellets and spending most of their lives indoors. Most meat products, dairy and eggs now are NOT high quality.

The fermented soya product natto is a delicacy in certain parts of Japan. Where they eat it, they eat a LOT of it. It contains massive amounts of K2. Research has shown that it is rare for women in those parts of Japan to suffer from osteoporosis and the rates of heart disease and stroke are also lower. In the parts of Japan where they do not eat natto, osteoporosis is much more common. Japanese researchers have investigated that.

Anyway, I have things to do too. I'll put up links to 10 examples of interesting research later.


----------



## ColinJ (7 May 2019)

I forgot that I have deleted my bookmarks to lots of interesting articles on K1, K2, clotting etc. (I got a bit obsessed with the subject when recovering from my DVT/PEs in 2012/13 and thought it would be better for me to give myself (and everybody on the forum! ) a break from the subject.)

It is taking me too long to find them all again, but I have found this article that explains in proper technical detail what I was saying in my previous post. This link will take you to one search on PubMed which returns 24 results for 'vitamin k2 and atherosclerosis'. This one returns lots of results for 'vitamin k2 and osteoporosis'.

Obviously only medical professionals or biochemists are going to understand the detail in those articles but I find it possible to get a good idea of what they are about by skimming through and then concentrating on the conclusions.

One thing I forgot to mention that there are various forms of K2! I take the one that comes from (or is synthesised to be identical to the one that comes from) natto - MK-7.

There seems to be growing interest in the medical profession about vitamin K, which is now starting to be seen as important as vitamin D. It hasn't really caught the attention of the general public yet though so I do my little bit to tell people about it. It is certainly worth you spending an hour reading about it and making your own mind up!


----------



## The Jogger (8 May 2019)

Colin, how much K2 do you take?


----------



## ColinJ (8 May 2019)

The Jogger said:


> Colin, how much K2 do you take?


100 mcg (micrograms) a day combined with 25 mcg of D3.

If there was enough in Dutch cheese that I could eat then I would do that instead but I worked out that I would need to eat about 150g a day!

4 large eggs a day would also be about right but you would have to be sure that the hens were eating the right food themselves. Free range isn't enough - they could be running around out in the open but eating corn/soya pellets!


----------



## The Jogger (8 May 2019)

I take 200mcg K2 and 5000 iu D3
Aldi have free range organic eggs, which I think would be a good source.


----------



## ColinJ (8 May 2019)

Yes, if you were careful to eat enough of the right foods of the right quality then you would be okay without supplements. I just look on them as insurance.

I certainly would NOT take extra iron, vitamin C etc. because they are very easy to get from a decent diet.

I do take a few other supplements which I might talk about later, but I have things to do now.


----------



## davidphilips (29 May 2019)

ColinJ , Many thanks for the imfo on K2 bought them from natures best (on sale at present) and intend to keep taking them, would be very interested in the other few other supplements that you take or can recommend, after reading up on k2 they seem well worth a few pence a day thanks again and safe cycling. .


----------



## ColinJ (29 May 2019)

davidphilips said:


> ColinJ , Many thanks for the imfo on K2 bought them from natures best (on sale at present) and intend to keep taking them, would be very interested in the other few other supplements that you take or can recommend, after reading up on k2 they seem well worth a few pence a day thanks again and safe cycling. .


I take vitamin B-complex. I probably get most of the B-vitamins in my diet anyway, but it is 'insurance' again and the tablets are very cheap.

I also take cod liver oil and Glucosamine Sulphate. My dad was crippled by severe osteoarthritis in both hips by the time he was my age (early 60s) and I didn't want to end up like him. I was starting to get discomfort in my hips 30 years ago so it looked like I might be developing the same problem. After a year or two of increasing aches and pains I decided to try to reduce the wear and tear. At the time there appeared to be good evidence that the combination of cod liver oil and Glucosamine Sulphate could help to protect joints so I started on the supplements. I think that researchers have backtracked a bit now and are no longer recommending them***, but all I can say is that my aches diminished greatly and I am still very active at an age when my father was painfully hobbling about on two walking sticks so I don't want to stop taking the supplements to see what happens!


*** Actually, they still say that there _may _be _some _benefits - details HERE.



Arthritis.org article said:


> Chondroitin and glucosamine supplements alone or in combination may not work for everyone with osteoarthritis. However, patients who take these supplements and who have seen improvements with them should not stop taking them. Both supplements are safe to take long-term.


----------



## davidphilips (29 May 2019)

Many thanks Colin, really sorry about your dad, best wishes and thanks again.


----------



## ColinJ (29 May 2019)

davidphilips said:


> Many thanks Colin, really sorry about your dad, best wishes and thanks again.


Yes, he spent the last 25 years of his life in pain and unable to walk more than a few yards. He was going to have hip replacements but he had an unfortunate conversation with someone whose hip op had gone wrong and that was that - he refused to even consider it again!


----------



## Globalti (5 Jun 2019)

I only take zinc because there's strong evidence that it strengthens your immunity to viruses. Started taking it daily in August 2018 and I haven't had a cold since. But I am also fussy about washing hands on coming home and before sitting down at my desk and not rubbing my eyes.


----------



## Tiger10 (5 Jun 2019)

I am 55, fast as i have ever been or more and am totally clean unlike you dopers.


----------



## davidphilips (5 Jun 2019)

Tiger10 said:


> I am 55, fast as i have ever been or more and am totally clean unlike you dopers.



Lucky man and long may it continue, Same as yourself i never took and vitamins or supplements but as Collin says vitamins are cheap and after reading up i will start taking a few mentioned above, way i look at it is might be a waste of money but for the sake of a few pence a day it just may improve or even keep me in reasonable health longer, but know the old saying do your own research.


----------



## lane (5 Jun 2019)

Globalti said:


> I only take zinc because there's strong evidence that it strengthens your immunity to viruses. Started taking it daily in August 2018 and I haven't had a cold since. But I am also fussy about washing hands on coming home and before sitting down at my desk and not rubbing my eyes.



Started taking it mote recently with vit C and am on my second cold in three months - where do you get the good stuff from?


----------



## vickster (5 Jun 2019)

lane said:


> Started taking it mote recently with vit C and am on my second cold in three months - where do you get the good stuff from?


Food

https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/best-foods-high-in-zinc

Including dark chocolate


----------



## ColinJ (5 Jun 2019)

davidphilips said:


> Lucky man and long may it continue, Same as yourself i never took and vitamins or supplements but as Collin says vitamins are cheap and after reading up i will start taking a few mentioned above, way i look at it is might be a waste of money but for the sake of a few pence a day it just may improve or even keep me in reasonable health longer, but know the old saying do your own research.


But don't forget that you can overdose on some vitamins/minerals. I read that nobody should _routinely _take iron supplements for example. Even going OTT on otherwise healthy foodstuffs can cause problems ... For example, Brazil nuts are a great source of (essential) selenium and I love them, but I read recently that we should limit ourselves to about 4 kernels a day because of the risk of selenium poisoning.


----------



## lane (5 Jun 2019)

vickster said:


> Food
> 
> https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/best-foods-high-in-zinc
> 
> Including dark chocolate



I have been taking food for some time but have developed some unwanted side effects.


----------



## vickster (5 Jun 2019)

lane said:


> I have been taking food for some time but have developed some unwanted side effects.


You perhaps need less but better quality food


----------

