# Sewing machine - why would I want more than 16 stitches?



## annedonnelly (13 Dec 2022)

I'm planning to treat myself to a new sewing machine. I've been to our local sewing shop which has a wide range and lots of experience and I know that I want something from the Brother Innovis range. At the lower end of the range the machine comes with 16 stitch types, and it goes up from there - 50, 60, 80, etc.

The machine I have now and have used on and off for years is a 1960s Singer. Absolutely solid little machine but it only does straight stitches. And I've managed ok with that. I've made curtains and clothes on it.

So it feels as if 16 stitch types will be more than enough for me. I'm not planning to do anything fancy. I'm not likely to want to make clothes. I want to do some curtains in the New Year and I want to be able to do free motion stitching but the basic Brother does that.

So any thoughts why I should consider the machines with more stitch options and a few extra functions. I don't want to get features that I'll never use but equally I don't want to find in six months time that I really need that extra stitch and regret my choice.


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## Speicher (13 Dec 2022)

I have got a Brother Innovis 35, mid range I think. Looking at the stitch guide there are 70 stitches, of which 25 are, in my opinion, decorative, and I have not used them. That would leave about 45 that are useful.

There are seven buttonhole styles. Fifteen stitches does not sound like very many.

Do you know the model number of the one you are looking at?


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## oldwheels (13 Dec 2022)

My mother was a seamstress and during war years had a good sideline making and altering clothes.
Latterly when I got married she made a wedding dress for my wife to be from a length of material and a pattern.
All this was done on a hand driven Singer bought about 1940 tho’ it may have been earlier so you do not really need a fancy machine.
We mostly used overlockers in our business but I still have 2 fairly old Singers and a Brother which is virtually unused as it was bought for a project which never got off the ground.
The Brother has all the bells and whistles but I have used it for hemming trouser legs and I think a zig zag stitch is better looking and for areas likely to have stress should be stronger.
Unless cost is a factor I would go for the higher range of stitches as you never know what may turn up later.


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## Speicher (13 Dec 2022)

I would keep the Singer for curtains, btw.


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## Speicher (13 Dec 2022)

I know that you will be purchasing your new machine from your local shop. I bought mine from Jaycotts, you can look at the Brother models on their website and compare the number of stitches/features.

https://jaycotts.co.uk/collections/brother-sewing-machines

Personally I would avoid the very basic one which seems to be aimed at people new to sewing. I think you would find that very basic, and not versatile enough.

My current machine closely resembles the Innov-is A80. Their "offer" at the time included a "sew table" but not all the free motion accessories.

nb Edited to change the model number.


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## Speicher (13 Dec 2022)

I am sure there are people on this forum whose partners do a lot of sewing
@fossyant
and @EltonFrog who sews lovely shirts


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## annedonnelly (13 Dec 2022)

Speicher said:


> I know that you will be purchasing your new machine from your local shop. I bought mine from Jaycotts, you can look at the Brother models on their website and compare the number of stitches/features.
> 
> https://jaycotts.co.uk/collections/brother-sewing-machines
> 
> Personally I would avoid the very basic one which seems to be aimed at people new to sewing. I think you would find that very basic, and not versatile enough.



The 15 and the A16 both have 16 stitches. The A16 has more electronics but the features are more or less the same.

I just can't imagine why I'd want such a variety of stitches especially as I don't plan to make clothes. Extension tables are available for all the models if I decide I need one. I'd think that will be more useful than any number of buttonhole stitches!

And yes I'll hang on to the Singer though it's a 99K which is the small model so not ideal for bigger jobs.


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## winjim (13 Dec 2022)

I know very little of sewing machines but my wife has just bought a Brother Innovis 15 as the next step up from the very basic machine she's been using for a while. It was recommended to her by the people in the very good local shop we've got and she seems happy with it so far. She's also got a Brother 2104D overlocker and between the two machines she can do everything she wants to for now.

I think the main factor is budget TBH although as with everything there's also the learning curve to factor in.


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## fossyant (13 Dec 2022)

I've lost count of the machines my wife has now


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## Speicher (13 Dec 2022)

winjim said:


> I know very little of sewing machines but my wife has just bought a Brother Innovis 15 as the next step up from the very basic machine she's been using for a while. It was recommended to her by the people in the very good local shop we've got and she seems happy with it so far. She's also got a Brother 2104D overlocker and between the two machines she can do everything she wants to for now.
> 
> I think the main factor is budget TBH although as with everything there's also the learning curve to factor in.





annedonnelly said:


> The 15 and the A16 both have 16 stitches. The A16 has more electronics but the features are more or less the same.
> 
> I just can't imagine why I'd want such a variety of stitches especially as I don't plan to make clothes. Extension tables are available for all the models if I decide I need one. I'd think that will be more useful than any number of buttonhole stitches!
> 
> And yes I'll hang on to the Singer though it's a 99K which is the small model so not ideal for bigger jobs.



If you are not planning to sew clothes, then yes 16 will be enough. If you do decide to make, or alter, clothes, then that should be enough choice. As @winjim says the more complex the machine, the steeper the learning curve. 

I think when I bought my machine about seven years ago, there was not the range available. My machine has enough overlock/zigzag stitches for my needs, which is mainly clothes and clothes alterations. 

I had my previous machine for twenty-five years, and the stitch change knob got stiffer and stiffer. Servicing it did not help. There was no local sewing shop selling machines. Jaycotts were very helpful.

If you keep the Singer, it might cope better on straight stitching through very thick fabrics.


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## MichaelW2 (13 Dec 2022)

I got a Janome model for Mrs L. It has direct gear drive rather than belt drive, so can tackle tougher, thicker fabrics. About 16 stitches I think.


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## fossyant (13 Dec 2022)

Mrs has a Janome computer embroidery machine, janome computerised overlocker, janome normal overlocker, a cheap overlocker and another basic janome sewing machine.

She also has a Brother Innovis 4000D (embroidery) and a Toyota Oekaki quilting machine.



Is that 8, FFS.


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## alicat (13 Dec 2022)

MichaelW2 said:


> I got a Janome model for Mrs L. It has direct gear drive rather than belt drive, so can tackle tougher, thicker fabrics. About 16 stitches I think.


At the risk of derailing the thread, do you know the model @MichaelW2? I'm apt to push my machine to the limits and I fear I've overdone it...


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## alicat (13 Dec 2022)

fossyant said:


> Is that 8, FFS.


Perhaps it's N+1 like bikes!


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## fossyant (13 Dec 2022)

alicat said:


> Perhaps it's N+1 like bikes!



Got some catching up


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## annedonnelly (13 Dec 2022)

Speicher said:


> I had my previous machine for twenty-five years, and the stitch change knob got stiffer and stiffer. Servicing it did not help. There was no local sewing shop selling machines. Jaycotts were very helpful.
> 
> If you keep the Singer, it might cope better on straight stitching through very thick fabrics.


Yes I'm lucky to have a local shop where they'll demo the machines. Basically they said that Brother is the most reliable brand - they don't get them coming back to be repaired like they do for the other models.

I'm going to do my research now and then see what deals they have after Christmas.

The Singer is struggling a bit at the minute. Probably 'cos my neighbour dropped it in the street  I need to have a good look at it.


alicat said:


> Perhaps it's N+1 like bikes!


I suspect all hobbies have that potential 😄


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## Jameshow (13 Dec 2022)

fossyant said:


> I've lost count of the machines my wife has now



Not as many as your bikes I reckon!🤣🤣🤣


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## Jameshow (13 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> Yes I'm lucky to have a local shop where they'll demo the machines. Basically they said that Brother is the most reliable brand - they don't get them coming back to be repaired like they do for the other models.
> 
> I'm going to do my research now and then see what deals they have after Christmas.
> 
> ...



Daughter has basic singer and it's started to struggle to sew two thickness of cotton without snapping the thread.


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## EltonFrog (14 Dec 2022)

Speicher said:


> I am sure there are people on this forum whose partners do a lot of sewing
> @fossyant
> and @EltonFrog who sews lovely shirts



Thanks for mench, though I’m no use to you as far as machines go. All I know is, it’s a Janome, I think it does half a dozen or so stitches, quite basic but new, ( in as much it was never used when we got it). It’s got knobs and dials, no digital controls or display.


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## annedonnelly (14 Dec 2022)

Jameshow said:


> Daughter has basic singer and it's started to struggle to sew two thickness of cotton without snapping the thread.



Sounds like that needs looking at. A modern Singer or a classic one? Mine's slightly younger than this one, but a little older than me

Mechanically there's not much to mine so servicing it is pretty straightforward.


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## MichaelW2 (14 Dec 2022)

alicat said:


> At the risk of derailing the thread, do you know the model @MichaelW2? I'm apt to push my machine to the limits and I fear I've overdone it...



4400


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## Tenkaykev (14 Dec 2022)

I’ve just read the whole thread ( sorry ) with fascination, not having any knowledge of sewing or sewing machines 🤔


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## Hebe (14 Dec 2022)

I have a Juki, about 10 years old I think. It has more stitches than I need but I like some of the non stitch type functionality like auto stitching in of ends and thread cutting. Those might be standard functionality by now.


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## fossyant (14 Dec 2022)

Jameshow said:


> Not as many as your bikes I reckon!🤣🤣🤣



Only got 4 , and the Innovis 4000 and the Janome Computerised machines were £000's.


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## Vantage (14 Dec 2022)

I have 3. A basic starter up mini machine, a basic singer and an all the bells and whistles janome atelier 7. That thing has around 240 stitches. 
One thing the gents and ladies on the sewing forum all agree on is that of the countless billions of different stitch patterns available to us, most of us only ever use 3 or 4 of those at any time.
Generally, higher end machines have a great deal more muscle for sewing denim/leather etc or multiple layers ie quilting and so on. 
Ignore the number of stitches a machine has. Things like self threading, auto thread cut, locking stitches, variable foot pressure and so on are nice little treats to have.


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## Vantage (14 Dec 2022)

If you don't know of it @annedonnelly this is possibly the friendliest forum on the planet and the ladies here really know their stuff.


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## annedonnelly (14 Dec 2022)

Vantage said:


> If you don't know of it @annedonnelly this is possibly the friendliest forum on the planet and the ladies here really know their stuff.



Thanks, I'll take a look.


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## Reynard (18 Dec 2022)

Oooo, I have a Singer 99k (from 1941 according to the serial no) and I love it. Totally no frills, but sews brilliantly. Mine was a skip find, complete with case, instructions booklet and all the accessories. The foot control needs some tlc though, as it grinds a bit.

Otherwise, I use a 1960s gritzner-pfaff. It's a little bit more fancy, but still pretty straightforward. I have others I could use, but they seem to be dust traps... Mind, I only do soft furnishings and cat show drapes, no no real need for any of the fancy stuff.

@Jameshow - I'd suggest oiling and de-fluffing the works. If any of mine start snapping threads, could be the tension, as it needs to be adjusted for different fabric types. Also, cheap thread has a tendency to go ping - best I've found is the Gutterman range.


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## annedonnelly (18 Dec 2022)

@Reynard Listening to you I don't need a new machine at all! 

I've also got a 1904ish Frister & Rossman, but I've never even tried threading that. It's just a pretty ornament - £2 from a market; not as much of a bargain as your Singer


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## winjim (18 Dec 2022)

Reynard said:


> Oooo, I have a Singer 99k (from 1941 according to the serial no) and I love it. Totally no frills, but sews brilliantly. Mine was a skip find, complete with case, instructions booklet and all the accessories. The foot control needs some tlc though, as it grinds a bit.



You've got 99k problems but a stitch ain't one.


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## Jameshow (18 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> Sounds like that needs looking at. A modern Singer or a classic one? Mine's slightly younger than this one, but a little older than me
> 
> Mechanically there's not much to mine so servicing it is pretty straightforward.



New one. 

I need to take to a engineer.


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## Vantage (18 Dec 2022)

I've been lusting after an old 1940s singer for years. I've yet to hear of anyone disputing that their stitch quality is better than even the very best top end modern computerised machines.
It'd be nice to own a piece of history too. Not to mention, the older ones are gorgeous.


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## Jameshow (18 Dec 2022)

Vantage said:


> I've been lusting after an old 1940s singer for years. I've yet to hear of anyone disputing that their stitch quality is better than even the very best top end modern computerised machines.
> It'd be nice to own a piece of history too. Not to mention, the older ones are gorgeous.



You sorted your ebike motor out yet??


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## Vantage (18 Dec 2022)

Ah yes. There was nowt wrong with it. Just got knocked. Stuffed a load of new grease in there anyway just in case.


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## Reynard (18 Dec 2022)

annedonnelly said:


> @Reynard Listening to you I don't need a new machine at all!
> 
> I've also got a 1904ish Frister & Rossman, but I've never even tried threading that. It's just a pretty ornament - £2 from a market; not as much of a bargain as your Singer





Depends what you want to sew, I guess...  With the old Singers, the "extras" are done by the way of different foot attachments - I have one for auto hem and one for buttonholes, and a couple of others. Maybe worth poking around on the 'bay for a looksee?

I actually learned to sew on an 1898 hand-crank Hexagon with a shuttle bobbin rather than a spool. They do sew surprisingly well, particularly on heavier fabrics, though you can only go forwards and you're limited to one size of stitch.. Downside is that you can't get much thread on the shuttle, so on larger projects, you always seem to be winding thread...


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