# Rim Brakes to Disk Brakes



## Alan Farroll (1 Jun 2014)

Hi,

I have a hard tail 29 er (It is actually a specialized crosstrail sport hybrid but its a hybrid that really leans towards a mountain bike) - it has rim brakes. What if I wanted to change to disk brakes? Is it possible? Is it difficult? How much would it cost? I think there are mounting holes on front and back hubs but not sure.

Thanks

Regards

A Farroll


----------



## Chris Norton (1 Jun 2014)

If you have mounts for the disc brakes on the frame and fork then it's probably new wheels and the brakeset. If you don't have the mounts then it's new bike.


----------



## Alan Farroll (1 Jun 2014)

Chris Norton said:


> If you have mounts for the disc brakes on the frame and fork then it's probably new wheels and the brakeset. If you don't have the mounts then it's new bike.


I think I have mounts on the frame and front fork but how can I be sure exactly? What am I looking for? Why do I need new wheels?

Thank you


----------



## MikeW-71 (1 Jun 2014)

You are looking for a pair of posts in the rear non-drive side chainstay and the same at the bottom of the forks on the left side. The disc calipers will mount to them. I'll hazard a guess that most rim-braked Hybrids will not have them, or will only have them on the fork.

You'll need new wheels because your current hubs will not have disc mounting points.


----------



## KneesUp (1 Jun 2014)

You can have disc mounts fitted if you want them but don't have them - for example http://www.cyclesinmotion.co.uk/shop-custom-bike-builds/

Obviously the easiest way to get them on the front is to swap the forks - a new bike is a bit drastic!


----------



## Cameronmu917772 (1 Jun 2014)

some one want to give me a penny here lol 
if its a new bike you need i have a kona for sale at 850 
200ml travel on the front with a hope t6 hydro brake 203ml rotor. 8" travel on the back  the 26x2.50 wheels aren't great on the road tho lol


----------



## Alan Farroll (2 Jun 2014)

There are, what look like, mounting lugs with holes on the non-chain side of both the fork and rear frame of bike. I take it this a good thing in regards to my question?

So what would I need? How much would it cost? Thing is apart from the rim brakes it really is a good bike. I have replaced the hybrid tires with cycle cross tires to be more mountain bike than hybrid. I can't afford to buy a new mountain bike at present either.

A Farroll


----------



## Cameronmu917772 (2 Jun 2014)

Alan Farroll said:


> There are, what look like, mounting lugs with holes on the non-chain side of both the fork and rear frame of bike. I take it this a good thing in regards to my question?
> 
> So what would I need? How much would it cost? Thing is apart from the rim brakes it really is a good bike. I have replaced the hybrid tires with cycle cross tires to be more mountain bike than hybrid. I can't afford to buy a new mountain bike at present either.
> 
> A Farroll


your wheels will need replaced because there won't be any ware to attach your disks to on the hub. secondly you will need to find a set of brakes you want. then check your shifters. on older and avarge priced bikes the shifter housing and brake leaver are one unit. so you may need to get new shifters as well. so you would be best to replace the gear cables while your there. 
what year is the bike? or can you upload a spec sheet?


----------



## Alan Farroll (2 Jun 2014)

Cameronmu917772 said:


> your wheels will need replaced because there won't be any ware to attach your disks to on the hub. secondly you will need to find a set of brakes you want. then check your shifters. on older and avarge priced bikes the shifter housing and brake leaver are one unit. so you may need to get new shifters as well. so you would be best to replace the gear cables while your there.
> what year is the bike? or can you upload a spec sheet?


 
Thanks again so far. Here is a specification I found online.

http://www.evanscycles.com/products/specialized/crosstrail-sport-2010-hybrid-bike-ec019786#features

I changed the tyres for these - 40c size
http://www.tredz.co.uk/.Schwalbe-Smart-Sam-700c-Tyre_51690.htm

Regards

Alan


----------



## HovR (2 Jun 2014)

If your bike is exactly the same as the one in the picture you linked to, then the frame and fork are disc compatible. To double check compare your bike to these pictures:

You'll need a mounting point on the fork, which will either be a post mount like this, or an IS mount like this. Both will work. You will also need a mount for the rear on your frame. It will be an IS mount and look something like this, although it may be positioned inside the rear triangle.

As for wheels, they will need to be disc compatible also. They need to have the six mounting holes to fit the actual disc to the hub. These can be seen here. If your bike does not have these, you will need to either get new hubs laced on to your existing rims, or purchase a new disc compatible wheelset.

When it comes to picking the actual brakes, you have two real options: hydraulic or cable actuated. Cable will be cheaper, but will require more adjustment. I'd advise against going for cheap cable disc brakes, as they tend to be pretty naff. Avid BB7's are a good choice. BB5's will be slightly cheaper, but most people recommend spending the extra cash and going for the model up.

If your bike currently has an all-in-one shifter and brake lever setup (i.e. they are one complete unit on the bar with a single clamp, as seen here) then going for cable discs will most likely be cheaper, as you can use the existing shifter brake lever setup, and hence not have to replace your shifters.

The other option is hydraulic discs. These require less maintenance, and tend to provide more stopping power and better modulation. If your bike currently has all-in-one shifter and brake levers, then you'll have to replace your shifters in order to use the hydraulic brake levers, adding extra cost on to the already more expensive hydraulic disc brakes.

If you don't have the mounts for the disc or calipers, then it'll probably end up costing a fair bit in order to replace the fork/hubs to make them disc compatible (could reach the £150 mark easily). If that's the case you'll have to decide whether it's worth spending that amount of money on the bike to you. If not, then it may be time to start saving for a dedicated mountain bike!

If your frame doesn't have the mounts, but the fork does, you could always put discs on the front end only.


----------



## HovR (2 Jun 2014)

KneesUp said:


> You can have disc mounts fitted if you want them but don't have them - for example http://www.cyclesinmotion.co.uk/shop-custom-bike-builds/
> 
> Obviously the easiest way to get them on the front is to swap the forks - a new bike is a bit drastic!



The link you posted is unfortunately for steel bikes only. I'm not aware of anyone who will fit disc mounts to an aluminium frame like the Crosstrail. I'm sure you could get it done, but it would probably cost more than a new disc compatible frame.


----------



## Alan Farroll (3 Jun 2014)

thank you so much everyone for your feedback. I am going to source the components I need and price the task. It is sounding quite expensive though. It might not be cost effective considering you can get a 27.5 inch Carerra for under £300 at the moment with disk brakes.

Thanks again everyone. It is appreciated.

Alan


----------



## Custom24 (3 Jun 2014)

Why do you want disc brakes? What's wrong with your rim brakes specifically?


----------



## Cameronmu917772 (4 Jun 2014)

Alan Farroll said:


> thank you so much everyone for your feedback. I am going to source the components I need and price the task. It is sounding quite expensive though. It might not be cost effective considering you can get a 27.5 inch Carerra for under £300 at the moment with disk brakes.
> 
> Thanks again everyone. It is appreciated.
> 
> Alan


you can get a set of cheap rims on ebay 40 quid say. remember though they won't be winning you any comps lol you can normally source some new hydro callipers and leavers cheap enough as well. some folk get a new bike and up grade there shimanos and such so really your prob talking under 100 pounds. thing is if your V's are set properly you will normally find that there is no point in upgrading unless your traveling at speed or riding in wet boggy terrain.


----------



## Acesand8s (4 Jun 2014)

The stopping power for hydrolic disks being better is not true, its about the same, if anything less. The maintenance that you do need you wont be able to do at home or without fluid, it is by far cheaper to do cable disks, and is especially better on a bike that is not MTB as the advantages of hydrolic dwindle away. If you have plenty extra money ($200+ now and 20-50$ [USD] per year) than fine, but otherwise BB7s are much easier to deal with on your own.


HovR said:


> If your bike is exactly the same as the one in the picture you linked to, then the frame and fork are disc compatible. To double check compare your bike to these pictures:
> 
> You'll need a mounting point on the fork, which will either be a post mount like this, or an IS mount like this. Both will work. You will also need a mount for the rear on your frame. It will be an IS mount and look something like this, although it may be positioned inside the rear triangle.
> 
> ...


----------



## Cameronmu917772 (7 Jun 2014)

Acesand8s said:


> The stopping power for hydrolic disks being better is not true, its about the same, if anything less. The maintenance that you do need you wont be able to do at home or without fluid, it is by far cheaper to do cable disks, and is especially better on a bike that is not MTB as the advantages of hydrolic dwindle away. If you have plenty extra money ($200+ now and 20-50$ [USD] per year) than fine, but otherwise BB7s are much easier to deal with on your own.


if one is to become extravagantly arsy the variables are so far apart from each other you couldn't fit it on a spread sheet. take into consideration the terrain, rotor size, speed, temperature, weather, wind speed, brake surface, tyre tread, tyre size tyre pattern, tread depth, sight of person, weight of person, hight of person, sintered pads to make and model of brake calliper oh and leaver and how the tension is set ................................. (think i may fall asleep) so i will just say a lot of things. 

the question my friend was indeed ''What if I wanted to change to disk brakes? Is it possible? Is it difficult? How much would it cost?''
also may i ask what info are you basing this statement on? 
The stopping power for hydrolic disks being better is not true, its about the same,


----------



## Acesand8s (7 Jun 2014)

Cameronmu917772 said:


> if one is to become extravagantly arsy the variables are so far apart from each other you couldn't fit it on a spread sheet. take into consideration the terrain, rotor size, speed, temperature, weather, wind speed, brake surface, tyre tread, tyre size tyre pattern, tread depth, sight of person, weight of person, hight of person, sintered pads to make and model of brake calliper oh and leaver and how the tension is set ................................. (think i may fall asleep) so i will just say a lot of things.
> 
> the question my friend was indeed ''What if I wanted to change to disk brakes? Is it possible? Is it difficult? How much would it cost?''
> also may i ask what info are you basing this statement on?
> The stopping power for hydrolic disks being better is not true, its about the same,


Ok, as all variables meant the same when you switch on the same bike and ride the exact same trails, i found that because my fluid pressure would max out at an unknown psi, I was able to stop sooner and with cable disks, which i switched back to. There are many advantages to hydraulic discs, stopping power is not one of them. I can endo on flat land with either, downhill the total power definitely depends on pads, and whatnots, but in my case the mechanical proved equal. Admitingly better control with hydraulics, the expence of time spent and money with a snagged tube housing was not worth it for me. Imo, if you are going from rim to disc you should try mechanical first, as they will be worlds better than rim brakes. BB7s are more or less the best mechanicals you can get.


----------



## MikeW-71 (18 Jun 2014)

Acesand8s said:


> Admitingly better control with hydraulics,


That is the advantage of hydraulics, humans can modulate lever pressure better than they can modulate lever travel.


----------



## Acesand8s (20 Jun 2014)

MikeW-71 said:


> That is the advantage of hydraulics, humans can modulate lever pressure better than they can modulate lever travel.


Agreed. I did say just IMO. Its all about how close you come to perfect brakes vs time and money convenience.


----------



## 02GF74 (21 Jun 2014)

This is what Wiggle say:

Hydraulic disc brakes are lighter, more reliable, feel better and are more powerful than cable actuated disc brakes.


----------



## Psycolist (27 Jun 2014)

I may be being cynical, but as wiggle are likely to make appx 10 times as much money from you buying hydro brakes, OF COURSE THEY WILL RECOMEND THEM.
My own experience with disc brakes is
a) hydraulics were much more difficult to 'feel' how much pressure to exert on the levers, resulting in less accurate braking distances
b) cable operated disc brakes gave back more 'feel' but braking distances were greater than with a good rim brake therefore being less efficient
As well as these experiences, I found discs to be much more effected by moisture, to need more fiddling, maintenance and money, without really giving any true benefits.
I.M.H.O....Spend your hard earned on 'good quality' levers, cables, inner and outer, and pads, and spend time and care setting them correctly, If you do that I'll bet the performance increase will be enough for you to stop fretting about all the phaffing about involved in switching to discs.
Of course, if you are a gadget gatherer, then go gather, but I am sticking to my rim brakes that I have reverted to thanks.
P.S. I still use a square taper BB too. Call me a dinosaur if you want, but I know what I like, and I like what I know !
         I'd rather be riding than fettling


----------



## Cameronmu917772 (28 Jun 2014)

how can anyone not use a hydro affectively? its pressure regulated less pressure less braking :S


----------



## Kins (28 Jun 2014)

I swapped my commuter from V's to mechanical cable disc and it was great. Only swapped the front. Really don't need two disc brakes on a commuter imo. Was a £20 Clarks that worked fine with my Shimano shifter/brake pod.


----------



## Psycolist (28 Jun 2014)

Cameronmu917772 said:


> how can anyone not use a hydro affectively? its pressure regulated less pressure less braking :S


I was , as I thought, lucky to be gifted a front disc set up from the Avid stable. Never being one to look a gift horse in the mouth, what ever that is supposed to mean, I bought a front disc wheel from fleabay. As I had no experience with hydraulic brakes, I popped along to my local friendly mechanic who helped me fit and set up the kit. From the very first time I rode with it fitted, I didn't like it. Very hard to attenuate the retardation, it almost worked too well, and I felt increasingly dissatisfied with the useability or consistency. I kept it on for around 150 miles before I removed it. The comment about 'less pressure, less braking' IMHO is much more relevant to rim brakes.
My other experiences with hydra brakes has been on other family members bikes, one a Scott and the other a Canondale. In both cases the front disc was like an on/off switch in the dry, creating some very hairy moments, leaving me unwilling to even touch the front lever. The rears were more useable, but in damp/wet conditions, I found both bikes to be unreliable in the amount of retardation offered, according to the level of water around. Sometimes, despite heavy rain, the brakes would still give good performance, then on another day, moist air as a result of mist for example, the braking distances were much longer.
I just don't feel that the useability of hydraulic brakes is as good , reliable or consistent as my good old fashioned rim brakes.
I can only speak as I find. Like I said, I'm a dinosaur, I like what I know and know what I like. And its only my opinion. My son and daughter always require Hydra brake set ups whenever they look for a new or replacement bike. Each to their own !


----------



## Egon Belmontie (2 Jul 2014)

I always prefer my bike kitted out with V brakes, if you buy a decent set of pads and adjusted correctly they will do you just fine, in all weather and surfaces.


----------

