# Maffetone Method.



## Trevrev (13 Aug 2012)

So, after a suggestion on here i've decided to give the above a go.
I've just completed the recommended "2 week carbohydrate intolerance test", where you completely stop eating any carbs for 2 weeks, then slowly re-introduce them, to find which ones cause you any grief. The ones that bother you in anyway, you know to steer clear of in future.
The first week was very tough, felt quite weak, but the second week, i've never had so much energy. It seems a shame to start eating carbs again. But it is only a test, and not a diet.

Now onto the exercise side of things. Basically you start with 180 heart beats per minute, minus your age, and depending on your fitness give, or take another 5 or so beats per minute.

So, with my HR monitor dusted off, i need to keep my HR below 140 beats per minute while cycling and running.
I've been doing this for about two weeks now, and at first it felt so, so slow. But now i've got into it, riding and running at such a reduced pace, it's so relaxing, and enjoyable.

I can now run 5 and 10K without wanting to die at the end of it. My cycle ride to work is just so enjoyable, all because i've slowed down. And it's only a few extra minutes added. I can deal with that!
And i'm burning the fat off. I was 22% fat now i'm 19.6%. Assuming the scales are working properly!

I'm giving this a try, due to the amount of injuries i've had of late, where i've just been over doing it.
I'm enjoying my running again, and my tum has got flatter. LOL.

In fact i think i'm turning into a hippy, i'm that relaxed!


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## MattHB (13 Aug 2012)

Cutting out the bodies main fuel seems dangerous to me!


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## Trevrev (13 Aug 2012)

If you read the thread, you re-introduce carbs back into your diet. Although i'm only going to eat good carbs from now on. Cut out all the shoot.
Your body will adapt to burning fat, making that the main fuel for energy.
Infact, i've never felt better!


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## MattHB (13 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> If you read the thread, you re-introduce carbs back into your diet. Although i'm only going to eat good carbs from now on. Cut out all the s***.
> Your body will adapt to burning fat, making that the main fuel for energy.



I did read it, it was really, as you put it, it seeming a shame to start eating carbs again. It's an interesting idea though, I'm not sure I'd stay upright though.


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## Trevrev (13 Aug 2012)

MattHB said:


> I did read it, it was really, as you put it, it seeming a shame to start eating carbs again. It's an interesting idea though, I'm not sure I'd stay upright though.


 

Well so far, i feel really good for it.
Just leaving out all the sweet sugary stuff and bread. I feel like a new man!


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## The Jogger (13 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> Well so far, i feel really good for it.
> Just leaving out all the sweet sugary stuff and bread. I feel like a new man!


 
I take you're still off the carbs or do you eat pasta at the min?


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## Trevrev (14 Aug 2012)

The Jogger said:


> I take you're still off the carbs or do you eat pasta at the min?


I'm just adding carbs very slowly back into my diet. One at a time to find out what ones affect me. So far it's only been potatoes that have made me feel crap.
But mainly, i've just been adding fruit. I'll get on to the pastas next week.

Oh, i did have oats made with water this morning, and so far so good!
I'll add milk at a later date.


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## lulubel (14 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> Now onto the exercise side of things. Basically you start with 180 heart beats per minute, minus your age, and depending on your fitness give, or take another 5 or so beats per minute.
> 
> So, with my HR monitor dusted off, i need to keep my HR below 140 beats per minute while cycling and running.


 
If I did that I wouldn't even be able to walk up a lot of the hills around here, never mind ride (or even push) my bike up them.


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## Arsen Gere (14 Aug 2012)

Can you be sure the way you feel is due to the lack of carbs or the reduced effort by working to a lower heart rate ? May be the only way to find out is to reintroduce your old regime once you have sorted out your carbs and report back ? Either way it is a fun experiment.


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## LosingFocus (14 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> So far it's only been potatoes that have made me feel crap.


Interested in how you qualify this. What about potatoes makes you feel "crap"? Is it being bloated? Being lethargic? feeling sick? Having the sh!ts? Being bunged up?


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## Rob3rt (14 Aug 2012)

Potatoes make me feel crap too.................. if all I eat is potato rosti for a week


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## Trevrev (14 Aug 2012)

Arsen Gere said:


> Can you be sure the way you feel is due to the lack of carbs or the reduced effort by working to a lower heart rate ? May be the only way to find out is to reintroduce your old regime once you have sorted out your carbs and report back ? Either way it is a fun experiment.


 

My wife done the two week test also, and had the same boost in energy levels as i did. She doesn't exercise. So i feel something was happening, due to fat burning. But, unfortunately we need to start back on carbs. Now it's the long process of trying a different carb each day to find out what ones have a bad effect on us.


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## Trevrev (14 Aug 2012)

LosingFocus said:


> Interested in how you qualify this. What about potatoes makes you feel "crap"? Is it being bloated? Being lethargic? feeling sick? Having the sh!ts? Being bunged up?


 
Feeling crap, as in very bloated, and very sleepy. The spuds were the second carb i introduced back into my diet. So, at the moment i've put a cross next to spuds as a no, no for the time being. Energy just seemed to drop off for a good hour. Can't even blame it on portion size or over eating.
Had my favorites tonight, baked beans! No ill effects so far, which is great. I've missed my baked beans.
Very interesting process, in my opinion.


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## Trevrev (14 Aug 2012)

I've also upped my mileage on the way home from work on my bike, due to the lower pace. I've gone from 7.5 miles to just under 10.
But tonight when i got home, i went straight out for a run, and it's the first time i've struggled to stay below 140 beats per minute.
It just seemed so much slower tonight! Must have been the heat. I'm usually an early morning runner.

The thing about this program, it's meant to make you feel good. It helps you find the food to eat that is kind to your body, if you eat something and it takes away your energy, then it's not good for you, so avoid it. That food may not have any effect on someone else.
And from an exercise point of view, it's trying to get exercise to be more enjoyable, it takes away the no pain on gain factor. And to be honest it's working for me.
I'm no longer trying to beat my best 10k time every run i do, i'm not coming back home wanting to keel over.
I can play with football with my kids, because i haven't got pulled muscles.
The heart rate thing has slowed me right down, and i'm loving it!


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## LosingFocus (15 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> Feeling crap, as in very bloated, and very sleepy. The spuds were the second carb i introduced back into my diet. So, at the moment i've put a cross next to spuds as a no, no for the time being. Energy just seemed to drop off for a good hour. Can't even blame it on portion size or over eating.
> Had my favorites tonight, baked beans! No ill effects so far, which is great. I've missed my baked beans.
> Very interesting process, in my opinion.


 
Sounds interesting indeed.


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## VamP (15 Aug 2012)

It does depend what your goals are ultimately, but you do know that Maffetone method has been shown to fail to produce the training results he has promised, don't you?

It may be a good way to stay healthy, but if you want to improve performance, you will need a high intensity component, as well as the low intensity stuff, which Maffetone believed (erroneously) would deliver improvements on it's own.

His method for identifying the correct training zone (age formula) is generic and highly likely to result in individuals working in entirely different HRmax percentage zones. HRmax is NOT directly correlated to either age or fitness.

I am not going to even comment on the carb experiment...


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## Arsen Gere (15 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> I've also upped my mileage on the way home from work on my bike, due to the lower pace. I've gone from 7.5 miles to just under 10.
> But tonight when i got home, i went straight out for a run, and it's the first time i've struggled to stay below 140 beats per minute.
> It just seemed so much slower tonight! Must have been the heat. I'm usually an early morning runner.
> .
> The heart rate thing has slowed me right down, and i'm loving it!


 
I usually allow 5-10 bpm for heat, I record the temperature against my training sessions. I can understand that high GI foods like potatoes would make you feel dopey, but an hour or two later it should be back to normal. Fructose can bypass the insulin response system so you should not get the same effect from fruit and some carb drinks.

I think Maffetone has his place to play in training but like most things taking only one aspect in isolation does not yeild best results. Long slow sessions have their place to play in training but you still need muscular endurance, lactic threshold and V02 max type stuff to get to optimal perfomance. Emphasising the aspect you need for your sport, whether you are a sprinter or randoneur.


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## VamP (15 Aug 2012)

Arsen Gere said:


> I usually allow 5-10 bpm for heat, I record the temperature against my training sessions. I can understand that high GI foods like potatoes would make you feel dopey, but an hour or two later it should be back to normal. Fructose can bypass the insulin response system so you should not get the same effect from fruit and some carb drinks.
> 
> I think Maffetone has his place to play in training but like most things taking only one aspect in isolation does not yeild best results. Long slow sessions have their place to play in training but you still need muscular endurance, lactic threshold and V02 max type stuff to get to optimal perfomance. Emphasising the aspect you need for your sport, whether you are a sprinter or randoneur.


 

I agree with this, but would add that Maffetone's USP is that the low intensity stuff is sufficient by itself. Which has not been supported by research.


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## Trevrev (15 Aug 2012)

VamP said:


> It does depend what your goals are ultimately, but you do know that Maffetone method has been shown to fail to produce the training results he has promised, don't you?
> 
> It may be a good way to stay healthy, but if you want to improve performance, you will need a high intensity component, as well as the low intensity stuff, which Maffetone believed (erroneously) would deliver improvements on it's own.
> 
> ...


 
Why not? I started the thread for feedback.


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## pkeenan (15 Aug 2012)

I think this sounds interesting, and look forward to reading how this is for you (@Trevrev) some time from now.
My Mum has, by medical advice, had to stop eating starchy foods - which I think essentially means she's cut out carbs. She's repeatedly told me of how much better she feels, not just in relation to the medical reason that prompted this, but in general - she feels healthier and livelier.
My Mum is not physically active, really - though knows her body (was a professional ballerina), and she knows this is doing her good, so there is obviously something to be said for what you are doing.

What I question is how it relates to increase of performance in a sporting discipline? It's been raised on this thread already, but it doesn't seem to address things as @Arsen Gere mentioned in post #17. 
I'm not trying to 'catch you (or anybody) out' - but would certainly appreciate some explanation in some sort of way, as I am interested to know more.


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## Trevrev (15 Aug 2012)

pkeenan said:


> I think this sounds interesting, and look forward to reading how this is for you (@Trevrev) some time from now.
> My Mum has, by medical advice, had to stop eating starchy foods - which I think essentially means she's cut out carbs. She's repeatedly told me of how much better she feels, not just in relation to the medical reason that prompted this, but in general - she feels healthier and livelier.
> My Mum is not physically active, really - though knows her body (was a professional ballerina), and she knows this is doing her good, so there is obviously something to be said for what you are doing.
> 
> ...


 
http://philmaffetone.com/180formula.cfm
Have a read.
The main reason i'm doing it, i don't compete in running or cycling. I just want to stay fit and healthy.
I like the idea of running slower, and burning fat.
But to be honest, the diet thing, i really find interesting.


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## VamP (15 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> Why not? I started the thread for feedback.


 

Bizarrely I answered this but now my answer is not here 


Anyways, what I'd said was that although I am not quallified to comment, I find the method of working out which carbs may be problematic for you non-objective, coming out of ketosis as you are there'll be so many strange feelings - good and bad - that I would not trust my ability to evaluate the impact of a single food group.


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## Arsen Gere (15 Aug 2012)

FWIW I read his book : http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Book-En...0655/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1345038683&sr=8-1 
Which was interesting a little repetitve but something else to consider.


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## lulubel (15 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> The thing about this program, it's meant to make you feel good. It helps you find the food to eat that is kind to your body, if you eat something and it takes away your energy, then it's not good for you, so avoid it.


 
This isn't always the case. If you've been depriving yourself for some time of something that your body needs, the first time you re-introduce it, your body can feel like it's shutting everything else down and practically sending you to sleep so it can focus all its energies on digesting the food.

I've experienced this a few times first hand because my diet was very bad for a while when I was younger. (When I first became vegetarian, my protein intake dropped extremely low. I felt fine, but as soon as I had a proper meal with plenty of protein, I'd be collapsed and nearly asleep within half an hour of eating it.)


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## LarryDuff (15 Aug 2012)

Why would you want to stop eating all carbs?

If I couldn't eat bread, spuds, pasta etc I don't think there would be any point in going on.


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## Trevrev (15 Aug 2012)

VamP said:


> Bizarrely I answered this but now my answer is not here
> 
> 
> Anyways, what I'd said was that although I am not quallified to comment, I find the method of working out which carbs may be problematic for you non-objective, coming out of ketosis as you are there'll be so many strange feelings - good and bad - that I would not trust my ability to evaluate the impact of a single food group.


 
Valid points, but as i've started the test, i really must see it through.
Ketosis is a strange thing thats for sure.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (15 Aug 2012)

LarryDuff said:


> Why would you want to stop eating all carbs?
> 
> If I couldn't eat bread, spuds, pasta etc I don't think there would be any point in going on.


Tis a bit of a strange one. Then you get those who are on proper ketogenic diets, different ball game entirely.


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## Trevrev (15 Aug 2012)

I totally love the idea of of getting all your energy from your body fat. It makes sense really. But that means being on a low carb diet all the time. You need to eat fat to burn fat, lots of protein. 
But, then on the other hand, too much protein is linked to certain cancers, and low carbing is meant to be very unhealthy after long periods. Depending on what website you're reading.


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## pkeenan (15 Aug 2012)

Trevrev said:


> I totally love the idea of of getting all your energy from your body fat. It makes sense really. But that means being on a low carb diet all the time. You need to eat fat to burn fat, lots of protein.
> But, then on the other hand, too much protein is linked to certain cancers, and low carbing is meant to be very unhealthy after long periods. Depending on what website you're reading.


 
Slightly amused that you say this, as on this thread (I'm sure you've read it, as it's a neighbouring thread!) the conversation is about the BBC Horizon episode broadcast this week, in which it talks about lowering the amount of protein. 

As you say, depends where your information comes from.


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