# What did we learn from this year's Tour?



## Hont (26 Jul 2016)

1. Stage 12. Chris Froome should give up any aspirations for a post-cycling career in Triathlon.
2. Stage 19. Apparently some French riders still do the Tour.
3. Stages 2, 4, 5, 10+. Peter Sagan's barber does not believe in marginal gains.
4. Stage 21. Germans still feel the need to charge into Paris.
5. Stage 15. Jarlinson Pantano isn't a type of pasta flour
6. Any stage. Franck Schleck's wages will be tax free as no-one can convince the Luxembourg Tax authorities that he was actually at the race.


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## Supersuperleeds (26 Jul 2016)

7. Any Stage. Quintana doesn't attack


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## Apollonius (26 Jul 2016)

You don't need a sprinter if you are going for GC.


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## cyberknight (26 Jul 2016)

To win you need to buy up anyone who has a chance in GC for your domestiques


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## Crackle (26 Jul 2016)

Frank Schleck was at the race! Who knew.


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## MichaelW2 (26 Jul 2016)

warm beer is marginally more effective than cold champaigne.


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## rich p (26 Jul 2016)

cyberknight said:


> To win you need to buy up anyone who has a chance in GC for your domestiques


Really?
Who do you think would have beaten Froome as a team leader from Sky?


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## rich p (26 Jul 2016)

It would be nice to see a French winner one day but has Bardet got it in him? Maybe.
Adam Yates is even better than I thought. 
I was wrong to predict Quintana as the winner - no surprises there then
Peter Sagan is a beast
Nibali is a tosser - don't ask, he just pisses me off
Cav read my 'Cav' thread, and it inspired him to win 4 more stages ...
Pinot - see Nibali comments
Carlton Kirby is a horse's arse


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## Pro Tour Punditry (26 Jul 2016)

cyberknight said:


> To win you need to buy up anyone who has a chance in GC for your domestiques





rich p said:


> Really?
> Who do you think would have beaten Froome as a team leader from Sky?



I'm glad you asked...


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## rich p (26 Jul 2016)

Marmion said:


> I'm glad you asked...


I'm agog.
I'm thinking Stannard or Rowe, waddya think?


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## cyberknight (26 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> Really?
> Who do you think would have beaten Froome as a team leader from Sky?


chance of gc = chance of placing highly , not necessarily winning assuming they had a team riding for them rather than busting a gut for froome.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (26 Jul 2016)

cyberknight said:


> chance of gc = chance of placing highly , not necessarily winning assuming they had a team riding for them rather than busting a gut for froome.


Who then?


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## Crackle (26 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> Really?
> Who do you think would have beaten Froome as a team leader from Sky?


No one but Poels would be in with a damn good chance of a high GC. He was 3 minutes down in the last ITT but probably not going full out. he's definetly reaching that GT age as well. Henao dropped off a bit but again, team duties may be why. Both would command a GT tilt in another team.


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## Crackle (26 Jul 2016)

Mind you Poels was nowhere in the first TT._ Slopes off to see if he's ever done a good TT._


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## Crackle (26 Jul 2016)

yeah, he's not very good at ITT's, unless they're in Belfast.


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## screenman (26 Jul 2016)

I see the tour as a team event, the best team gets their man in the top spot at the end.


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## rich p (26 Jul 2016)

Crackle said:


> yeah, he's not very good at ITT's, unless they're in Belfast.


Didn't he win one in an early season race this year? I'll go and look!


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## rich p (26 Jul 2016)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Volta_a_la_Comunitat_Valenciana


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## Crackle (26 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Volta_a_la_Comunitat_Valenciana


Yeah, lumpy one. He can do them it seems.

I may have to think of another GT contender for my 2018 CC world tour team. Raising the finance now if anyone wants to donate?


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## nickyboy (26 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> Really?
> Who do you think would have beaten Froome as a team leader from Sky?



Not sure that is the way. You buy the Sky domestiques (or similar) to be your domestiques by paying them more. Then you recruit Tom Dumoulin, get him to lose a few kgs while not wrecking his TT.

I reckon you'd be in with a good shout, particularly in a TT-heavy Tour


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## Pro Tour Punditry (26 Jul 2016)

nickyboy said:


> Not sure that is the way.


It isn't, but richiepoo's question of


rich p said:


> Really?



was in response to


cyberknight said:


> To win you need to buy up anyone who has a chance in GC for your domestiques


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## oldroadman (26 Jul 2016)

screenman said:


> I see the tour as a team event, the best team gets their man in the top spot at the end.


Correct. All professional racing is a team sport with an individual winner. Job of the team is to try and ensure the individual winner is their protected rider. Quite simple, really. Not! If it was, there would be a few of us a bit better off than we are today...


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## Pro Tour Punditry (26 Jul 2016)

oldroadman said:


> Correct. All professional racing is a team sport with an individual winner. Job of the team is to try and ensure the individual winner is their protected rider. Quite simple, really. Not! If it was, there would be a few of us a bit better off than we are today...


I'm not sure there is a relationship between "the job" and "earnings".


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## brommers (26 Jul 2016)

nickyboy said:


> Then you recruit Tom Dumoulin


I heard that Sky have been eyeing him up for quite a while.


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## Saluki (27 Jul 2016)

This year's tour taught me that I really must think about a new cushion on my end of the sofa. My saddle is more comfortable than my cushion.


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## rich p (27 Jul 2016)

screenman said:


> I see the tour as a team event, the best team gets their man in the top spot at the end.


You don't say! 
Quick, fire off an email to Sir Dave, he may not have thought of that marginal gain


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## screenman (27 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> You don't say!
> Quick, fire off an email to Sir Dave, he may not have thought of that marginal gain



It seems that some do not see it that way.


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## rich p (27 Jul 2016)

screenman said:


> It seems that some do not see it that way.


Really? Who?
Most posts are about Sky hoovering up the best domestiques to do just that.


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## screenman (27 Jul 2016)

rich p said:


> Really? Who?
> Most posts are about Sky hoovering up the best domestiques to do just that.



So the best team wins, who would have thought that. 

Why don't you have a look, I am busy.


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## Starchivore (27 Jul 2016)

I learned that ITV4 have unforgivably meddled with the classic opening theme tune of the highlights by including some sort of bizzare swishing noise as the images change. I thought I was going mad the first time I heard it but it really is there.

Otherwise I thought the ITV4 highlights programme was really excellent throughout, balanced really well.


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## oldroadman (27 Jul 2016)

Marmion said:


> I'm not sure there is a relationship between "the job" and "earnings".


Funny you should say that....
Hopefully the days of fighting to get paid/share of the money are more or less past, although I still hear of riders and staff not getting their pay and/or waiting months/going to court/UCI to get money that's due. There are still a few "operators" out there. I just hope women's racing does not have to go through this rubbish quite so much as it grows into a bigger sport.


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## rich p (27 Jul 2016)

screenman said:


> So the best team wins, who would have thought that.
> 
> Why don't you have a look, I am busy.


I did look but couldn't find anyone in this thread who didn't think it was a team effort, which is why I asked.
Still, hey ho.


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## Nibor (27 Jul 2016)

I learned that I think joining the tour with no intention of completing it and taking 4 stage wins is a little unsportmanlike


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## HF2300 (27 Jul 2016)

Nibor said:


> I learned that I think joining the tour with no intention of completing it and taking 4 stage wins is a little unsportmanlike



Unsportsmanlike because it robs others of potential wins?

Assuming you're referring to Cav, it's far from clear that he joined the tour without intending to complete it; in fact, if you take his (fairly from the heart) interviews at face value, he would far preferred to have completed and only abandoned reluctantly when it became clear his Olympic performance was at risk. That's in contrast to many in the past, particularly sprinters, who have started GTs while clearly having no intention of finishing; a tradition that goes back many years.

While if he hadn't been there clearly the wins would have gone to someone else, it's arguable that if you're going to measure yourself against the best you should be capable of winning irrespective of who's there.


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## Buddfox (27 Jul 2016)

Judging by the reluctance of the top 10 riders to challenge each other in the final week (and the exceptions came about as much because of the misfortune of others than because of the boldness of any rider that moved up on GC), I'd say they were all just pretty knackered at that point and unable to do anything dramatic.


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## brommers (27 Jul 2016)

Nibor said:


> I learned that I think joining the tour with no intention of completing it and taking 4 stage wins is a little unsportmanlike


Nothing new. Kittel and Greipel done the same in the Giro earlier this year


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## nickyboy (27 Jul 2016)

HF2300 said:


> Unsportsmanlike because it robs others of potential wins?
> 
> Assuming you're referring to Cav, it's far from clear that he joined the tour without intending to complete it; in fact, if you take his (fairly from the heart) interviews at face value, he would far preferred to have completed and only abandoned reluctantly when it became clear his Olympic performance was at risk. That's in contrast to many in the past, particularly sprinters, who have started GTs while clearly havng no intention of finishing; a tradition that goes back many years.
> 
> While if he hadn't been there clearly the wins would have gone to someone else, it's arguable that if you're going to measure yourself against the best you should be capable of winning irrespective of who's there.



I also feel a bit uncomfortable about this. It's easily fixed of course by saying that your Stage podium finishes only count if you make it to Paris, otherwise other riders shuffle up the order. Or you could use a bit more carrot and a bit less stick and have a few more sprint stages towards the end of the race

The problem with this is injury withdrawals. Seems fair enough to keep a Stage win if you fall off and injure yourself subsequently. But how to differentiate between real and fake injuries?


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## Chromatic (27 Jul 2016)

screenman said:


> So the best team wins, who would have thought that.
> 
> Why don't you have a look,* I am busy.*



Glad the post referendum dip has been reversed!


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## screenman (27 Jul 2016)

Chromatic said:


> Glad the post referendum dip has been reversed!



Unfortunately not earning a penny, it is as quiet as quiet can be in this business at the moment.


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## oldroadman (27 Jul 2016)

HF2300 said:


> Unsportsmanlike because it robs others of potential wins?
> 
> Assuming you're referring to Cav, it's far from clear that he joined the tour without intending to complete it; in fact, if you take his (fairly from the heart) interviews at face value, he would far preferred to have completed and only abandoned reluctantly when it became clear his Olympic performance was at risk. That's in contrast to many in the past, particularly sprinters, who have started GTs while clearly having no intention of finishing; a tradition that goes back many years.
> 
> While if he hadn't been there clearly the wins would have gone to someone else, it's arguable that if you're going to measure yourself against the best you should be capable of winning irrespective of who's there.


One word - Cipollini.


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## Supersuperleeds (27 Jul 2016)

Another thing we have learnt - ITV coverage isn't the same without Phil


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## HF2300 (27 Jul 2016)

oldroadman said:


> One word - Cipollini.



Exactly so.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (27 Jul 2016)

Supersuperleeds said:


> Another thing we have learnt - ITV coverage isn't the same without Phil


Who?


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## Hont (28 Jul 2016)

Supersuperleeds said:


> Another thing we have learnt - ITV coverage isn't the same without Phil


Not the same, but much better.

Oh and one I forgot...

7. Stage 21. Gary Imlach still hasn't finished sucking that lemon.


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## SWSteve (28 Jul 2016)

9 Greipel still hasn't attended the appointment to get the dentures arranged


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## Apollonius (28 Jul 2016)

I was reasonably impressed that the BBC (the Breakfast bit I see anyway) gave some time to covering the Tour. It looks as if policy these days at the BBC is to big-up anything that might be on the BBC (like the newt strangling from Tadcaster) and then speculate on what might happen if there was any football. Even test cricket barely gets a mention. Admittedly, their interest is largely in when a British rider is successful, and they have all the naive nationalism of a Brexiteer, but there was some coverage, even if they couldn't pronounce the names of all those filthy foreigners out to do us down. (Mollema was a big challenge.)
Very good coverage in the Times too.


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## Hont (28 Jul 2016)

Apollonius said:


> even if they couldn't pronounce the names of all those filthy foreigners


They're not alone there though. I think ITV4, or was it Radio 5 or maybe it was Eurosport (anyway one of them) brought in a cycling Journo for his comments (I think it was Jeremy Whittle but you can probably guess I'm not too reliable on this one) and he pronounced everyone's name completely different from the commentators.


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## coffeejo (28 Jul 2016)

Ned and David both pronounced Movistar differently. One pronounced the "mov" so it rhymed with the "cov" of Coventry. The other said "mow" as in mow the lawn.


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## brommers (28 Jul 2016)

coffeejo said:


> Ned and David both pronounced Movistar differently. One pronounced the "mov" so it rhymed with the "cov" of Coventry. The other said "mow" as in mow the lawn.


I'm not going to lose any sleep about that.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (28 Jul 2016)

brommers said:


> I'm not going to lose any sleep about that.


Neither you should "Brow-merz" "Broh-mers" "Brew-mirs"


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