# Why...



## classic33 (4 Oct 2009)

do companies that operate HGV's seem to feel that "Time For Action" isn't of any benefit to them.

Large or small, the companies spoken to seem to feel that we, cyclists, are not worth getting involved with. Given the reason for it being started I'd have thought the chance to be seen as acting in a responsible manner regarding the operation of their vehicles would have been jumped at.
The Road Haulage Association don't even want to know that someone is willing to try & help sort the problem with them.

Any ideas why.

New thread started rater than hijack time for action.


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## ttcycle (5 Oct 2009)

Maybe there is no business viablity for them ie there is no profit and it takes one of their trucks out of action in their minds? Call me a cynic...call me anything...lol

TBH - depends who you contact as well really as some people are more interested in the issue than others - who have you been contacting in the companies as it depends what their focus is on? 

Have you tried corporates like supermarkets etc as they'll want to up their 'green and ethical' credentials even if it is a load of surface sh*te. Worth trying and thanks for giving it a shot!


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## classic33 (5 Oct 2009)

Local haulage companies, some operating the length of the country. Multi nationals & even the supermarkets. With no real response. The usual of saying that their chosen charity/society is the one they are focusing on was expected, but not even that.

All pointed towards the thread, Time For Action.


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## ttcycle (6 Oct 2009)

Classic33 - at least it's an avenue that's been exhausted- big companies aren't usually qucik to jump and help small grassroots campaigns - ie your 'brand' is not large enough to be a publicity pull for us. 

Best to use time, energy and resources plugging away somewhere else. Again, thanks for trying but if they're not willing to help...not a lot that can be done.


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## thomas (6 Oct 2009)

Why not try *ASDA*? They have just raised over a million quid for bike club (cycling youth charity - helped by CTC), their CEO has just done lands end to John.,..

Was a short thing in the CTC magazine. It seems that as a company they have been interested in raising money for cycling (no doubt to sell their cheap bike range)...but they may be willing to help out.

I reckon part of the reason a lot of companies aren't interested is partly it doesn't make them money, but potentially, this project could do no good. If the press aren't interested then it may well be a waste of time for them. Yes, it may get a bit of interest on youtube or whatever and help a handful of people, but not get any national attention.

If you could get someone like ASDA on board they no doubt have a massive PR department who would want to get the story told.


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## Origamist (6 Oct 2009)

Cemex have done work to improve in this area. That said, that was after Cynthia Barlow, bought RMC shares (now Cemex) and attended their AGM where she demanded they do more to reduce the threat their vehicles were posing to cyclists. 

See RoadPeace for more info.


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## ttcycle (6 Oct 2009)

Those are options to consider Classic33 - 

However a correction Thomas - plans with this campaign are to spread it nationally and not for it just to be a youtube phenomenon.


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## Fab Foodie (6 Oct 2009)

Maybe the Daily Wail would like to run a story...

Hauliers don't give a kufc about bikes under their trucks

You know the kinda thing.


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## thomas (6 Oct 2009)

ttcycle said:


> However a correction Thomas - plans with this campaign are to spread it nationally and not for it just to be a youtube phenomenon.




Correction? I never said it was just for youtube. I said that if the national press aren't interested it would no doubt be quite limited in effect (eg. just a few videos on youtube).

If I ran a large haulage company I would hardly give up a lorry for the day for something which possibly wouldn't benefit me at all. That is why I suggested ASDA. They have already done things to support cycling, so presumably would be interested in more projects. They are a massive supermarket so will presumably have a massive PR department and would be interested in making any good work they do very public. The more public the project is, the more interest there will be in it and the more benefit it will produce.


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## classic33 (6 Oct 2009)

Its not about giving up a wagon for a day, even simply asking them if they would be prepared to display the sign as shown on earlier pages of "Time For Action" has brought no real response.


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## CotterPin (6 Oct 2009)

thomas said:


> Why not try *ASDA*? They have just raised over a million quid for bike club (cycling youth charity - helped by CTC), their CEO has just done lands end to John.,..
> 
> Was a short thing in the CTC magazine. It seems that as a company they have been interested in raising money for cycling (no doubt to sell their cheap bike range)...but they may be willing to help out.
> 
> ...




I guess this would find him:

Andy Bond
CEO
ASDA
ASDA House
Southbank, 
Great Wilson Street 
Leeds 
LS11 5AD 

Does anyone have the time to draft and send a short letter? Worth a punt as Thomas suggested. I'd write it but I am not sure I am as heavily involved in the proposed campaign to be able craft a persuasive argument.


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## classic33 (7 Oct 2009)

thomas said:


> Why not try *ASDA*? They have just raised over a million quid for bike club (cycling youth charity - helped by CTC), their CEO has just done lands end to John.,..
> 
> Was a short thing in the CTC magazine. It seems that as a company they have been interested in raising money for cycling (no doubt to sell their cheap bike range)...but they may be willing to help out.
> 
> ...



ASDA tried, but the response was that it would be forwarded to someone-else. Some-one else never got back in touch.

However, with a bit of research in the next few days a new lot will be sent out. Same questions, different approach.


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## ttcycle (7 Oct 2009)

Cheers for taking this on Classic33-let us know how you get on as it would be good to use the raised funds for something other than a HGV... crossing fingers and toes that there's a positive response!


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## Origamist (8 Oct 2009)

@Classic33. 

Could you post a copy of the letter/email that you are sending to companies - we might be able to offer advice.


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## classic33 (9 Oct 2009)

Hole Picking time. 
Writing these kind of letters I do a rough copy getting all(hopefully) relevant points on the origional & work it from there. A piece may be better worded, something can be missed out entirely. But this wouldn't be the final copy that would be sent.

All suggestions welcome for this new version. 


"Writing as a cyclist.
I'm wondering, would you be willing to help us get this campaining off the internet & onto the roads. Where it can best do its job. 

The opening post says what the aims are from the outset. To try & cut the number of injury & deaths caused when a cyclist & a lorry meet. See attachment. (Googled cyclist killed & lorry, returned over 16,000 results rather than single out one case.)

We have now reached the stage where we as cyclists are putting our money where our mouths are, in some cases time as well, towards the equipment needed. We have at present the following:

_OFFERS OF HELP FROM FORUM MEMBERS

ttcycle 
She has experience with community campaigns. Also has a broad sheet contact, and has two film-maker friends - she will contact them.

Magnatom 
knows a CEO of an Ad Agency

scouserinlondon 
He is in web marketing. Used to work for a trucking magazine. Still has contact with the editor and will call him, when there is a "clear campaign and idea". He is also happy to help with any promotion stuff you need to do, from SEO and PPC campaigns to any website, to laminating and flyering. 

Ben Lovejoy 
www.photographybybenlovejoy.com has offered his skills in still photography. He can also drive a 7.5 ton truck.

Plax 
has offered to help with campaigning 

Kaipath 
has shot videos before, he gives a link to one of them - I tried to copy the link, but it would not work on my computer. He says it is NSFW.

karlos_the_jackal 
(www.myolondon.com) He has offered advertising skills which includes clean graffiti, I think this means it washes off.

Jake
He edits videos, makes websites. He has got a film crew, (but they usually film people with not much on). 

GordyFaeEdinburgh
He would be happy to host the website. He would also be able to help put a web-site together.

Sh4rkybloke
He has put together a video see post No 215 on page 22 for the link.

Rhythm Thief
He may be able to find a lorry we can use, but will need to ask the relevant people.

Gabefleming
Is a journalist and website editor for Nursing Times, and is happy to write any promotional copy, script for the video, or press releases. Also experienced with social media and would be happy to help with promoting the initiative through facebook, twitter etc. 

Cotterpin
He has volunteered to hand out leaflets to cyclists at junctions. He also has contacts with the LCC. He would be happy to co-ordinate giving out cards at the roadside, with the possibility of this being across the country.

Nigelnorris
He has spare hosting capacity and is familiar with blog/forum set-up and administration. He says his skills are not up to building sites from scratch.

User3143
He has offered to be the victim/cyclist in the video. He is free every Thursday and Friday, and is half an hour from London by train._

With regards to the required HGV, as mentioned we are putting our money where our mouths are in contributing to raising the amount needed for the hire of the HGV. If there is any left over, or we fail to get the project as planned from the start of the ground then all money raised will be put into some of the other ideas raised on the thread. Most notably the sign for the back of the lorries. 

Any participation on your part can only put you in the positive spotlight. You have been made aware & are willing to try to work with cyclists to cut the number of such incidents. 

Progress to date can be followed at http://www.cyclechat.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=37713
OR if dubious about the link:
CycleChat.co.uk > Cycle Chat > Community > Campaigning & Public Policy > HGV / Cyclist Safety Campaign > Time For Action

Thanks for taking the time to read this. 

Yours"

In Italics a straight cut & paste from page 43 of Time for action, which would only list what we have to date no names.


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## ttcycle (9 Oct 2009)

Hey Classic 33 - just a quick log on tonight but have many pointers for this letter re persuasive negotiation - the impact isn't there at this point as there is no arguement built up to convince them.

I'll have a proper look at it at some point this weekend if I get the chance and post properly!


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## classic33 (10 Oct 2009)

It is only the starting letter, points picked out & be built on before the final letter. But at least someone is still reading & willing to help.

Thanks


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## ttcycle (10 Oct 2009)

Ok going to be brief with my reply but the best way to structure a letter/email to companies is in this kinda fashion:

Don't worry about listing who on the forum can do what as that can be summed up really easily and is not so relevant for a company.

Start off with something like: 

We are a group of cyclists that are working on a national campaign through a cycling forum to tackle the issues around deaths of cyclists with HGV involvement. The numbers stand at X statistic deaths so far this year.

A summary of what the issues are and how we intend to campaign on the issue - Mention firstly the video we are looking to produce - name the ones already out there and why they aren't effective ie dry/too long/preachy etc, other parts of the campaign involves ie talking to members of the cycling public, warning stickers on lorries and buses, attempting to link in with HGV community and cycling organisations and bodies- also highlight that their will be plans to write a press release for broadsheets/newspapers and tv news media.

After talking about spreading the campaign nationally and via different media streams...

Then say we are currently raising funds to obtain a HGV - I am contacting you as we are looking to loan a HGV and possibly a driver though we have a driver from the forum for a day of filming:

a- this is a mutual business opportunity for you to promote your company in a national campaign by using a branded vehicle in our video.
b -this demonstrates your company's support of green transport means and ethical business practice which are important issues amongst your customers
etc etc along those kind of lines

Does that make sense classic 33 - I haven't got time at the moment to fully draft out a letter but if you get the letter written up and post again I can help you with it some more and edit it if you want!

Hope those pointers make sense!


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## thomas (12 Oct 2009)

classic33 what is the full letter (or an example of a full one?)...From what I read above, I wasn't really sure what it was all about.

What ttcycle wrote seems like a good start for a letter.


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## Speicher (12 Oct 2009)

I had not realised that I last up-dated that list of offers as long ago as 1st August - time flies .

It was done in order to help Magnatom keep track of kind offers of help in the early days of "Time for Action". It may be that some people would like their offers amended or changed for whatever reason. 

After I did that list, the subject got very complicated and I somewhat lost track of who would like to do what. Not sure of the best way to bring the list up to date. Should I start a new thread called "Offers of help" then people could pm me and I would be happy to alter it and up-date the offers. Or have you got other suggestions for amending it.


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## Rhythm Thief (13 Oct 2009)

I can't get a lorry through my job any more, since I left and am now working for a driving agency. But I am happy to drive an artic if we can get hold of one.


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## classic33 (13 Oct 2009)

thomas said:


> classic33 what is the full letter (or an example of a full one?)...From what I read above, I wasn't really sure what it was all about.
> 
> What ttcycle wrote seems like a good start for a letter.



What I put was the bare bones of a letter. Get everything thats been/being done to date on the matter & work it from there. Easier expand as I go along, but before sending the final copy.

Suggestions on letter content/context welcome.


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## ttcycle (13 Oct 2009)

Hi Classic33- you said that you'd contacted haulage comp before - do you have the letter/email and maybe we can work from that?

It's easier to make suggestions when we have something more solid to work with.


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## classic33 (13 Oct 2009)

As used on the contact forms on company websites.
Writing as a cyclist 
I'm wondering if you would be willing to help us get this campaign of the internet & onto the roads. Where it can best do its job. 
The opening post says what the aims are from the outset. To try & cut the number of injury & deaths caused when a cyclist & a lorry meet. See attachment.

We have now reached the stage where we as cyclists are putting our money, in some cases time as well, towards the equipment needed. What we are lacking however is a response from companies that operate HGV's. Even the Road Haulage Association will not answer on this one.

Why isn't certain as any participation on their part could only put them in the positive spotlight. The have been made aware & are willing to try to work with cyclists to cut the numbers. Unfortunately that’s not the case.

Progress to date can be followed at http://www.cyclechat.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=37713
OR if dubious about the link:
CycleChat.co.uk > Cycle Chat > Community > Campaigning & Public Policy > HGV / Cyclist Safety Campaign > Time For Action

Thanks for taking the time to read this.

Yours 

There's not always a lot of room on these forms. Some larger local companies have been informed over the phone.


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## ttcycle (15 Oct 2009)

brief points - I still feel there is no impact here - my original points about how to layout the letter still stand as there is no solid structured arguement as to why they should be involved really and letter also sounds apologetic almost for contacting them.

Final point is find a person-named contact those online forms will go into some generic inbox and will be deleted if not seen as relevant to the company.
Try find press officers or PR people, or customer satisfaction type people?


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## thomas (15 Oct 2009)

Just as an example, this isn't a letter, but a press release so the end out come of what you want is similar. I'm not saying this is the best press release but it did turn the benefit of a magazine exposure on one of my websites into a 5-10 minute segment on BBC radio, including an interview.

http://www.guessmyage.net/gma_press_release_13_09_08.pdf

I also helped co-write another press release, here:

guitar123.co.uk/pressrelease.pdf *(please don't link to this directly)*

That got us a meeting with a large magazine publisher, which publishes the majority of guitar related magazines in the UK.

I don't want to criticise you as you've taken the effort to write the letter, just wondering if the way the letter has been written maybe has effected the outcome. Maybe take a look at the two press releases...to some degree they helped get what was wanted, or at least closer to that.


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2009)

thomas said:


> Just as an example, this isn't a letter, but a press release so the end out come of what you want is similar. I'm not saying this is the best press release but it did turn the benefit of a magazine exposure on one of my websites into a 5-10 minute segment on BBC radio, including an interview.
> 
> http://www.guessmyage.net/gma_press_release_13_09_08.pdf
> 
> ...



My last post was the wrong one. That has been sent to the leaders of the three main parties in the UK + their respective ministers(transport, enviroment).
To date no response on this.

First posting of a letter type letter, was for anyone on here to chip in. Some people would word the same thing a different way. I started with a brief outline of what we were trying to do. In italics gave what we had to date. Then the links to the site, both for e-mail & physical letter. I'd have started from that & worked to a final draft copy.


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