# Fixed/fixed or Fixed/free hub?



## Fab Foodie (14 May 2016)

Thinking of having wheels built for me new fixed wheeler.
Something I hadn't thought about was on a flip-flop hub which sprocket types to have.
In the past I just ran a single fixed. I've never run a freewheel which seemed to only have the benefit of flying down hills but lacks the fixed benefits on the propulsion side.
I've also been told that a freewheel can be fitted to the fixed side of really necessary but it's lacking a bit of thread.

In terms of gearing I'm thinking 44:17 approx 70" as a start (in my youth I ran 75" in London and could climb Ditchling beacon on it). I could then put a 16 or 18 on the other side at a later date. Tell me is 1t difference the max for a given chain length or is 2t possible?

I'm a lot older than them and am now in Oxfordshire so flattish with some lumpy parts nearby. Group rides average around 13mph.

Advice welcome to this fixed returnee!

Cheers FF


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## Venod (14 May 2016)

I ran 44:17 fixed for a couple of years its about 68" with 23mm tyres ideal for the flatish terrain and still manageable on moderate lumps, @100 rpm it gets you 20mph, an average of 13mph should be no problem, but the cadence would be a bit low for me about 65rpm, but may suit you.

I am thinking about building another fixie just need the right frame with track ends, I was quite tempted yesterday at the Planet X sale, a Holdsworth branded one for £50 but too heavy, they had another Holdsworth 531 but £800, I was also tempted by a Titus Titanium MTB frame for £300.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (14 May 2016)

Fixed/fixed every time for me. As you've said most free wheels will fit fixed with no issues.


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## Fab Foodie (14 May 2016)

Afnug said:


> I ran 44:17 fixed for a couple of years its about 68" with 23mm tyres ideal for the flatish terrain and still manageable on moderate lumps, @100 rpm it gets you 20mph, an average of 13mph should be no problem, but the cadence would be a bit low for me about 65rpm, but may suit you.
> 
> I am thinking about building another fixie just need the right frame with track ends, I was quite tempted yesterday at the Planet X sale, a Holdsworth branded one for £50 but too heavy, they had another Holdsworth 531 but £800, I was also tempted by a Titus Titanium MTB frame for £300.


Thanks.

I'm going to run 28c Tyres on 23mm rims.

As I weigh in at 95kg the frame weights not too much of an issue (and I'm a Holdsworth fanboy) so it was just the job to complete my cycling line-up. It's only for occasional use so I can't justify spending more ... Apart from trying to justify some blingy Handbuilts :-)


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## Sharky (14 May 2016)

Fab Foodie said:


> Tell me is 1t difference the max for a given chain length or is 2t possible?


If a true track end, you must have at least 1" fore/aft movement, but this will absorb a 2" variance in chain length or a variance of 4 teeth in sprocket sizes. Currently have 13t fixed & 17T on one of my bikes. The 13t was for an early season TT and too lazy to take off. The 17t is a SS free sprocket, giving me a 68" for normal riding.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (14 May 2016)

Fab Foodie said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I'm going to run 28c Tyres on 23mm rims.
> 
> As I weigh in at 95kg the frame weights not too much of an issue (and I'm a Holdsworth fanboy) so it was just the job to complete my cycling line-up. It's only for occasional use so I can't justify spending more ... Apart from trying to justify some blingy Handbuilts :-)


This changes things even more into the favour of fixed/fixed. Unless you have or are willing to spend serious money on a White Inds or equivalent, cheap ones are terrible in constant use and even worse when not - seizing up or losing drive is not uncommon.


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## 4F (16 May 2016)

Fab Foodie said:


> Tell me is 1t difference the max for a given chain length or is 2t possible?
> Cheers FF



I run fixed / fixed with a 48 up front with 16 and 18 on the rear so yes 2 teeth is possible.


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (16 May 2016)

4 teeth delta on my All City Nature Boy


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## User19783 (16 May 2016)

Hi ff
I've got 4 fixed wheel bikes, with different gearing, and I can easy do wantage chain hill on any of my fixed wheel bikes, 

If you like, you can try one, and we could go up and down and around botley, 
Just for fun

Pm me if like.


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## Ian H (16 May 2016)

Double-fixed for me. 43x17/18. Mostly 18 these days in Devon. But I do also ride gears. 
The drop-outs on my frame (forward-facing 38mm as specified) would take a two tooth difference.


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## TheDoctor (17 May 2016)

My fixed has 15T fixed and 17T free IIRC. That's on sloping road dropouts, and I could have gone wider - plenty of room in the dropouts still.
Admittedly, I mostly ride on the freewheel side...


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## Venod (17 May 2016)

Fab Foodie said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I'm going to run 28c Tyres on 23mm rims.
> 
> As I weigh in at 95kg the frame weights not too much of an issue (and I'm a Holdsworth fanboy) so it was just the job to complete my cycling line-up. It's only for occasional use so I can't justify spending more ... Apart from trying to justify some blingy Handbuilts :-)



What frame are you using ? did you get a Planet X Holdsworth ? if so whats your opinion ?


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## Fab Foodie (17 May 2016)

Afnug said:


> What frame are you using ? did you get a Planet X Holdsworth ? if so whats your opinion ?


Yep I did. Not totally unwrapped but it feels pretty weighty and from what I can see so far, nicely made. Will post photos when I've checked the frame size is OK and fully unwrapped it to start the build. :-)


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## ttcycle (2 Jun 2016)

Definitely F, F imho as SS, think my plan is to have a 2 tooth difference on the yet to be sorted bike.



TheDoctor said:


> Admittedly, I mostly ride on the freewheel side...



Pfffttt...c'mon get those legs a-spinnin.'


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## TheDoctor (2 Jun 2016)

If my legs were spinning they'd be easily confused with doner kebabs.


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## Fab Foodie (2 Jun 2016)

ttcycle said:


> Definitely F, F imho as SS, think my plan is to have a 2 tooth difference on the yet to be sorted bike.
> 
> 
> 
> Pfffttt...c'mon get those legs a-spinnin.'


What gear inches will you be running?


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## ttcycle (2 Jun 2016)

Old fixed that's too big frame wise was 46,16. Too high I reckon as I'm not as strong as I was so it's a tad grindy.

If the new frame can take it 48,18 but it might only work with 46, I can't remember if the closest to 48,18 was a 17 or 19 sprocket but that with 16 on other side.


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## Fab Foodie (2 Jun 2016)

ttcycle said:


> Old fixed that's too big frame wise was 46,16. Too high I reckon as I'm not as strong as I was so it's a tad grindy.
> 
> If the new frame can take it 48,18 but it might only work with 46, I can't remember if the closest to 48,18 was a 17 or 19 sprocket but that with 16 on other side.


Ta!
I used to ride 42 x 15 in London ... but that was more than 30 years ago ... and 6" less waist measurement!


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## ttcycle (3 Jun 2016)

Crikey..


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## Venod (28 Sep 2016)

I have now got a fixie, swapped it for my MTB, I am not keen on the wheels so I am looking to build some, plenty of low profile rims to choose from but small flange fixed/free or fixed/fixed hubs are a bit scarce (Campag too much for this build).

Any recommendations wheel wise.


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## Tim Hall (28 Sep 2016)

User said:


> These?


Something mangled your link, so I got a picture of a bear and a 404 error.

Did you mean these: http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/miche-primato-track-hubs-small-flange-pair/


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## Ian H (28 Sep 2016)

Track hubs may not have much in the way of bearing protection. I think the latest hub I bought was from hubjub.co.uk.


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## Venod (28 Sep 2016)

User said:


> These?



Yes I thought they looked decent, but I am looking for double sided to start with, I have seen some Novatec from China, anybody used this fixed hub, I have some Novatec hubs and they are fine, but they do make a wide range from very cheap to reasonably affordable.


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## 3narf (28 Sep 2016)

Rohloff_Brompton_Rider said:


> This changes things even more into the favour of fixed/fixed. Unless you have or are willing to spend serious money on a White Inds or equivalent, cheap ones are terrible in constant use and even worse when not - seizing up or losing drive is not uncommon.



Shimano DX freewheels are excellent if you can find them, and cheap. My first one did 7000+ with no issues (teeth wore but still usable); I bought a 2nd hand one to replace it a couple of years ago and it's still fine.


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## Lonestar (28 Sep 2016)

I ride 50x17.


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## dave r (28 Sep 2016)

Lonestar said:


> I ride 50x17.



I'm on 44x18 on 165 cranks


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## Lonestar (28 Sep 2016)

dave r said:


> I'm on 44x18 on 165 cranks



I can't run a higher say 15 cog on the back...probably a good thing...as it's a 5 allen bolt fitting the cog on.More fun on the Limehouse - Forest Gate route as opposed to the Mile End Road route.


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## dave r (28 Sep 2016)

Lonestar said:


> I can't run a lower say 15 cog on the back...probably a good thing...as it's a 5 allen bolt fitting the cog on.More fun on the Limehouse - Forest Gate route as opposed to the Mile End Road route.



I'm mostly riding in Coventry and in rolling Warwickshire countryside


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## Lonestar (28 Sep 2016)

dave r said:


> I'm mostly riding in Coventry and in rolling Warwickshire countryside



Aye more hilly I know.


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## Fab Foodie (28 Sep 2016)

Afnug said:


> I have now got a fixie, swapped it for my MTB, I am not keen on the wheels so I am looking to build some, plenty of low profile rims to choose from but small flange fixed/free or fixed/fixed hubs are a bit scarce (Campag too much for this build).
> 
> Any recommendations wheel wise.


DCR.

I'm having my fave 23mm H Plus Son Archetype rims in Silver: http://dcrwheels.co.uk/products/rims/700c-rims/
... and these Zenith hubs as they look more 'classic! .... http://dcrwheels.co.uk/products/hubs/zenith-eco-hub-2/

H Plus Son also do a classic box section rim which was very tempting if I was making a classic build, but mine will be a buggers-muddle of classic and modern!


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## Venod (28 Sep 2016)

Fab Foodie said:


> DCR.
> 
> I'm having my fave 23mm H Plus Son Archetype rims in Silver: http://dcrwheels.co.uk/products/rims/700c-rims/
> ... and these Zenith hubs as they look more 'classic! .... http://dcrwheels.co.uk/products/hubs/zenith-eco-hub-2/
> ...



I have some H Plus on Novatec hubs which I built for 10 speed, the hubs have been faultless, so I have ordered some small flange Novatec track hubs from China, I am going to build them with with Mavic open pro rims or ones with a similar profile.


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## keithmac (29 Sep 2016)

I like my freewheel, can coast at 22 mph down hills which is well above my top cadence (17mph is comfortable on the flats..).


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## tyred (11 Nov 2016)

I have a fixed/free hub in my Carlton and I must confess I have never, ever swapped the wheel around to ride it freewheel so I guess that was a bit if waste of money buying that hub!


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