# Glucosamine & Chondroitin



## ianrauk (9 Apr 2012)

Does any one on here take Glucosamine & Chondroitin supplements?
A friends suggested I get some for my achey knees.


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## sheddy (9 Apr 2012)

BM


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## ColinJ (9 Apr 2012)

My sister reckons that the supplements help hers. She has stopped and started them few times and says that she can tell the difference. It could just be the placebo effect, of course.

I take Glucosamine sulphate (I can't afford the more expensive stuff) and have been doing so for over 10 years. My dodgy hips have not got dodgier at the rate I expected so perhaps the supplements are working for me? TBH, I don't want to stop them for 6 months to find out! 

I had my sore hips x-rayed about 15 years ago and the signs of arthritis were already there. My dad's hips both packed up before he was 60 and I was keen not to suffer the same fate.


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## lukesdad (9 Apr 2012)

I used to Ian but to be honest I didn t think they did much, not the best recomendation comming from me I know


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## stumpy66 (9 Apr 2012)

Glucosamine with cod liver at the same time is what i take, seems to help. I ran out and felt my knees etc were worse aftera while.


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## Flying Dodo (9 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Does any one on here take Glucosamine & Chondroitin supplements?
> A friends suggested I get some for my achey knees.


 
My knees slowly starting aching over a period of time around 5 years ago. My dad suggested Glucosamine as he said it helped his joints, and I realised after about 6 weeks of starting to take it, I didn't have the aches any more. So I've kept taking it.


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## ianrauk (9 Apr 2012)

Cheers Adam and everyone.
I have ordered a tub to see if they help any.


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## ColinJ (9 Apr 2012)

stumpy66 said:


> Glucosamine with cod liver at the same time is what i take, seems to help. I ran out and felt my knees etc were worse aftera while.


Oh yes - I also take Cod Liver Oil supplements. (There are plenty of good reasons for taking those.)


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## GrumpyGregry (9 Apr 2012)

stumpy66 said:


> Glucosamine with cod liver at the same time is what i take, seems to help.


this, along with a multivitamin tablet, every day.

may be a placebo but it is one I'm happy to pay for.


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## bicyclos (9 Apr 2012)

I used to have clicky knees or should I say they used to click now and again when walking/cycling and suffer abit with them being sore. I have found that for me glucosamine optiflex with chondroitin was better than cheaper sulphate brands for some reason and take mine with flaxseed oil.


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## The Brewer (9 Apr 2012)

Mrs B's always had clicky knees so read the thread to her. Interested she took my tablet and then saw Bicyclos's avatar

She's going to give them a try


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## snorri (9 Apr 2012)

I was aware of the onset of achey knees when cycle touring last summer. Everything was fine whilst cycling, but the problem arose when climbing stairs in hotels in the evening, no problem when camping.
Been wondering if I should do some exercises after cycling or trying some supplements. I've never done exercises since school days and that was quite some time ago.


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## machew (9 Apr 2012)

It may work for you, it may not. However a trial in 2008 was published and found
Dietary Supplements Glucosamine and/or Chondroitin Fare No Better than Placebo in Slowing Structural Damage of Knee Osteoarthritis


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## DougieAB (10 Apr 2012)

Have tried Glucosamine along with Codliver Oil. Stiffness in the hips seems to come and go so not yet convinced that it makes a difference. Adding Yoga to the mix to help me learn a range of stretching exercises.


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## oldfatfool (10 Apr 2012)

I take the Glucosamine sulphate, cod liver oil and a multivit. Don't think my hip as been clicking as much this winter but then it hasn't been as cold.


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## fossyant (10 Apr 2012)

I've tried it - it takes a while for it to work - didn't help my shoulder though - still borked !


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## Kiwiavenger (10 Apr 2012)

I take glucosamine and cod liver oil tablets, my joints click to high almost all the time (I can tense my legs up and click hip to toes!) glucosamine stops this happening, I ran out a while back and the clicking started again! Am back on them in preparation for my major ride to lands end in a few weeks time.

Sent from my LT15i using Tapatalk 2


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## Becs (10 Apr 2012)

Probably does no harm, but a lot of it won't get absorbed/get to the right place so you need a really high quality one to ensure enough active ingredient gets to where it's supposed to. Cod liver oil's not a bad idea


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## Panter (11 Apr 2012)

Been taking glucosamine chondroitin & cod liver oil for a few Years now for my knackered old knees.
I really don't know if it helps, I suspect it probably doesn't but (hopefully) it can't do any harm


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## screenman (11 Apr 2012)

I was diagnosed with arthritis 12 years ago, losing 4 stone seemed to help the knee's a lot.


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## VamP (11 Apr 2012)

Have you had your achy knees diagnosed Ian? My right has just started to hurt like hell, and I am off to the physiotherapist tomorrow. I really, really do not want to make it worse or make the recovery last any longer than neccessary.

The trouble with glucosamine supps is that it's such a difficult thing to evaluate if it's helping or not. I have some at home, but as I don't much believe in them I don't even get the placebo effect benefit.


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## ianrauk (11 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> Have you had your achy knees diagnosed Ian? My right has just started to hurt like hell, and I am off to the physiotherapist tomorrow. I really, really do not want to make it worse or make the recovery last any longer than neccessary.
> 
> The trouble with glucosamine supps is that it's such a difficult thing to evaluate if it's helping or not. I have some at home, but as I don't much believe in them I don't even get the placebo effect benefit.


 

Haven't seen a doc or physio yet but planning to if I get it again, as it's the first time I have had this problem.
It's just the one knee, my right also.
I have been taking Voltarol and that helps kill the pain.

Looking at an internet diagnosis (I know, I know) it looks like I am suffering from Chondromalacia Patellae (Which is basically irritation/wearing/damage of the soft cartilage under the knee cap. Quite a common cyclist/runners problem apparently. Have stayed off the bike this week to let it all calm down and seems to be much better now, but won't risk a bike ride until at least sunday. It all kicked off when I did a 200k audax on a brand new bike a couple of weeks back. Have bought a knee brace to keep the patella in line and am also looking at booking a bike fit session to see if that helps.

Let us know how you get on.


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## VamP (11 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Haven't seen a doc or physio yet but planning to if I get it again, as it's the first time I have had this problem.
> It's just the one knee, my right also.
> I have been taking Voltarol and that helps kill the pain.
> 
> ...


 

My symptoms also broadly support that diagnosis, but knees are complex things. 

I took four days off over Easter but 65 miles yesterday had me in pain again, and it's still sore now.

I'll report back what the physio says.


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## Judderz (11 Apr 2012)

Just a heads up, if you are on any medication, check there are no side effects of mixing the 2, I was taking Glucosamine but I'm also a warfarin user, and this has major side effects if mixed.


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## MisterStan (11 Apr 2012)

GregCollins said:


> this, along with a multivitamin tablet, every day.
> 
> may be a placebo but it is one I'm happy to pay for.


+1


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## lukesdad (11 Apr 2012)

An update on my knee and the attention is being focused on flat feet and one leg considerabley shorter than the other going to see a foot doc a week on friday. Ive got a vulkan knee brace which seems to be helping, but after a couple of hours the kneecap starts to ache. Also using Fenbid Gel Ice packs and a magnetic knee strap.


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## ianrauk (11 Apr 2012)

lukesdad said:


> An update on my knee and the attention is being focused on flat feet and one leg considerabley shorter than the other going to see a foot doc a week on friday. Ive got a vulkan knee brace which seems to be helping, but after a couple of hours the kneecap starts to ache. Also using Fenbid Gel Ice packs and a magnetic knee strap.


 

Just bought one of these to see if it helps any






Hoping it's not needed.

Well fingers crossed you can sort your problem.
You can get shims for flat feet/one longer then t'other cant you?


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## lukesdad (11 Apr 2012)

Im looking into the wedges, but wont do anything till ive seen the specialist. The thing I find with the brace is it keeps everythin g straight specially on the good days when its feeling better than it is. Reminds me I shouldn t attempt anything I shouldn t.


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## accountantpete (11 Apr 2012)

As Becs says above - research suggests that very little G & C gets absorbed so the more pricey products contain greater quantities in the hope that a bit might.


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## ColinJ (11 Apr 2012)

My right knee is normally a bit stiff for the first few miles but on a recent forum ride I noticed that it was a lot worse than usual. Eventually, I worked out that my 3/4 length bibshorts were causing the problem. It was a chilly morning and I had the legs pulled down as far as they would go. Unfortunately, the extra tension in the fabric was pulling the kneecap away from its normal position. Once I pulled the leg of the shorts up an inch or two, the tension was relieved and the knee discomfort went away.


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## Yellow Fang (12 Apr 2012)

I've been taking some triple strength glucosamine + chondroitin tablets for a while, but I am not sure they are really doing anything. My uncle swears by them.


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## VamP (12 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Let us know how you get on.


 

Just back from physio. He nailed it inside 10 minutes when a jab with his finger had me writhing on the floor.

Inflamed lateral hamstring tendon, suspected cause lower back imbalances and possibly not quite nailed bike postion. Treated Tortured me for 30 minutes with brutal thumb digs along the said tendon and hamstring band above, as well as my lower back, prescribed course of NSAIDs, hot/cold treatment and intensive (4 daily sessions) hamstring stretches. Back to see him next Tuesday, and he's organising a session where I will get videoed riding my road bike on a turbo, to see where the bike position imbalances might be kicking in.

Feel positive we're doing the right things, fingers crossed this will get resolved.

Minimum 2 weeks off bike though


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## ianrauk (12 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> Just back from physio. He nailed it inside 10 minutes when a jab with his finger had me writhing on the floor.
> 
> Inflamed lateral hamstring tendon, suspected cause lower back imbalances and possibly not quite nailed bike postion. Treated Tortured me for 30 minutes with brutal thumb digs along the said tendon and hamstring band above, as well as my lower back, prescribed course of NSAIDs, hot/cold treatment and intensive (4 daily sessions) hamstring stretches. Back to see him next Tuesday, and he's organising a session where I will get videoed riding my road bike on a turbo, to see where the bike position imbalances might be kicking in.
> 
> ...


 

Interesting reading.
May be a good idea for me to book an appointment.
How much did it cost you?


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## VamP (12 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Interesting reading.
> May be a good idea for me to book an appointment.
> How much did it cost you?


 
These guys charge 88 squids an hour, but I'm new to the area a and went with a local recommendation. To be fair they're very good. My GF paid 40 quid and hour in Romford about a year ago, and said the guy was also fantastic.

Also check whether you have insurance? I haven't


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## henshaw11 (13 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> These guys charge 88 squids an hour, but I'm new to the area a and went with a local recommendation. To be fair they're very good. My GF paid 40 quid and hour in Romford about a year ago, and said the guy was also fantastic.
> 
> Also check whether you have insurance? I haven't


 
As a matter or curiosity - I *might* need one in the near future - who was it you went to?


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## VamP (13 Apr 2012)

Active8 Rehab in Chertsey. I have been told to ask for Tom or Chris as being the best knee guys. I saw Chris. Excellent guy, knows his shoot, but by his own admission, Tom is more experienced in dealing with cycling specifically. Tom will be involved in the bike session video analysis.


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## ianrauk (17 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> Active8 Rehab in Chertsey. I have been told to ask for Tom or Chris as being the best knee guys. I saw Chris. Excellent guy, knows his shoot, but by his own admission, Tom is more experienced in dealing with cycling specifically. Tom will be involved in the bike session video analysis.


 

How's the knee VamP?

Mine? Well the pain from the knee has totally disappeared at last.
I wore the knee brace over the weekend as I was doing (bendy knee) house stuff, gardening, washing car, cleaning windows etc).. and it did seem to help.

I am so tempted to jump on the bike tomorrow for the commute but will stay off the bike at least until thursday and may do the short and easy commute to see how it goes. I will then be away for a few days so no bike anyway until at least next Wednesday. Think it will be good time for whatever it was to completely heal.

I did actually find that the (new) bike that gave me the knee pain, the saddle was 3-4 cm's higher then my usual 109% fit. So pushing hard on a 200k audax was not terribly good for the knee.


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## ColinJ (17 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> I did actually find that the (new) bike that gave me the knee pain, the saddle was 3-4 cm's higher then my usual 109% fit. So pushing hard on a 200k audax was not terribly good for the knee.


That's a massive change in saddle height and especially to then go straight out and ride a 200 km audax - not very sensible! Why did you change the saddle position by so much in one go?

I get more knee problems by having the saddle too low but I suppose you might have had it so high that your leg was straightening out too much at the bottom of each pedal stroke.


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## ianrauk (17 Apr 2012)

ColinJ said:


> That's a massive change in saddle height and especially to then go straight out and ride a 200 km audax - not very sensible! Why did you change the saddle position by so much in one go? *It was a new bike and I just guessed the saddle height.*
> 
> you might have had it so high that your leg was straightening out too much at the bottom of each pedal stroke. *This is what I think.*


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## ColinJ (17 Apr 2012)

Oops - well, you won't make that mistake again!

This from the guy who guessed how to set up the SPD cleats on a new pair of shoes and buggered his knees in 20 hilly Yorkshire miles ...  (They hurt for about 2 weeks after that.)


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## Garz (18 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Looking at an internet diagnosis (I know, I know) it looks like I am suffering from Chondromalacia Patellae (Which is basically irritation/wearing/damage of the soft cartilage under the knee cap. Quite a common cyclist/runners problem apparently.


 
I had this happen over the weekend. The pivotal point must have been planing the doors for the wife and going up/down steep stairs carrying the doors seems to have exaggerated it. I reckon it's from swelling in that area, and it's the same knee I damaged just over a year ago playing football.

I have rested a few days now and it seems to have gone back to normal, but worrying nonetheless.


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## ianrauk (18 Apr 2012)

Garz said:


> I had this happen over the weekend. The pivotal point must have been planing the doors for the wife and going up/down steep stairs carrying the doors seems to have exaggerated it. I reckon it's from swelling in that area, and it's the same knee I damaged just over a year ago playing football.
> 
> I have rested a few days now and it seems to have gone back to normal, but worrying nonetheless.


 

Get a knee brace.
They really do help when doing all about the house stuff.


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## VamP (18 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> How's the knee VamP?
> 
> Mine? Well the pain from the knee has totally disappeared at last.
> I wore the knee brace over the weekend as I was doing (bendy knee) house stuff, gardening, washing car, cleaning windows etc).. and it did seem to help.
> ...


 
Wow, big saddle height difference - fingers crossed that's your reason right there!

I saw Chris for the second time yesterday, he was really pleased that all the manipulations he had done with my back was still clearly apparent, i.e. my back hadn't assumed the old stiffness back. He manipulated the lateral hamstring band again, and what had me rolling on the floor last week was just mildly uncomfortable. He also admitted he was pressing quite a bit harder this time round.

We agreed that I would try how the knee felt with the looser anatomy not restricting it so much, so I rode in this morning - really easy ride with a 5 minute block of threshold thrown in to test the knee (this is the intensity that was causing problems before - not easy riding). 

Still not entirely trouble free, but a lot better than before.

Another session on Friday - fingers crossed we're beating this. The good news is there's nothing wrong with the knee per se, it's a muscle/tendonal imbalance brought on by poor posture mainly.


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## ianrauk (18 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> Wow, big saddle height difference - fingers crossed that's your reason right there!
> 
> I saw Chris for the second time yesterday, he was really pleased that all the manipulations he had done with my back was still clearly apparent, i.e. my back hadn't assumed the old stiffness back. He manipulated the lateral hamstring band again, and what had me rolling on the floor last week was just mildly uncomfortable. He also admitted he was pressing quite a bit harder this time round.
> 
> ...


 
This is really good news.

It's peeing down with rain here and if it's the same then I won't commute tomorrow and will wait until next Wednesday. I am climbing the bloody walls though. This is the longest time I have been off the bike since I came back to cycling 6 years ago


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## fossyant (18 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> I did actually find that the (new) bike that gave me the knee pain, the saddle was 3-4 cm's higher then my usual 109% fit. So pushing hard on a 200k audax was not terribly good for the knee.


 
Holy Moly - 3-4 cm difference. Christ.  I have to check/double/tripple check my heights. All bikes are spot on the same, the fixed is literally just a couple mm lower to aid spinning. 

That will be the cause !! 

Same goes when changing pedal systems - e.g. allow for difference in cleat height, hence slight differences between my two road bikes on Look, and the fixed/MTB on MTB SPD's.

Sould sort itself now you've rested it.


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## ianrauk (18 Apr 2012)

fossyant said:


> Holy Moly - 3-4 cm difference. Christ.  I have to check/double/tripple check my heights. All bikes are spot on the same, the fixed is literally just a couple mm lower to aid spinning.
> 
> That will be the cause !!
> 
> ...


 
Yeah silly thing to do.. should have double checked.

I'm a one cleat system all bikes type person.


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## fossyant (18 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Yeah silly thing to do.. should have double checked.
> 
> I'm a one cleat system all bikes type person.


 
The good news is it's a temporary problem. Youll be right as rain once the inflamation has gone. Oh and Volterol is magic - use the gel loads on my shoulder.


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## ianrauk (18 Apr 2012)

fossyant said:


> The good news is it's a temporary problem. Youll be right as rain once the inflamation has gone. Oh and Volterol is magic - use the gel loads on my shoulder.


 

Was taking the tabs.. and they worked wonders.


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## VamP (25 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Was taking the tabs.. and they worked wonders.


 

Are you back on your bike Ian? All good?

I did my regular commute (32 miles round) yesterday, nice and gentle, stayed in Zones 1 and 2 throughout (well mostly) lots of ice, lots of heat, lots of ibuprofen afterwards. No pain, no tightness, in fact no discomfort at all today. Another physio session this afternoon, I am thinking that he'll suggest slowly building up the loads and keep on top of the HIT/NSAID regime, and that we're back in business. Happy days. I am also adding a shed load of different stretches prescribed by the physio on a daily basis. This recovering from injury is bloody time consuming 

With a bit of luck I will just have lost April, but be back to regular training loads before end of May.


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## ianrauk (25 Apr 2012)

VamP said:


> Are you back on your bike Ian? All good?


 
Back on the bike for the first time in near 3 weeks.
Was for the morning commute. I took it nice and easy (with help of a headwind). I was a bit apprehensive about getting back on the bike as it's at the back of my mind that I may have done some serious damage. So took the easy downhill short route of 12 miles to work. I have all the power in my legs, it felt so good to be back riding. But I can feel the smallest amount of pressure on the knee. But this is probably more to the fact of getting the knee working again rather then the cycling. So a few hours down the line and have had no (bad) reaction. Tonight will be a harder test as my commute is literally all up hill. So see how I get on with that and throw some Voltarol down my neck when I get home just in case.

Like you, I have missed most of April's riding.
I am even under my yearly target on MyCyclingLog.

Great news about your knee... fingers crossed for both of us that we have put the troubles behind us.


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## VamP (25 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Back on the bike for the first time in near 3 weeks.
> Was for the morning commute. I took it nice and easy (with help of a headwind). I was a bit apprehensive about getting back on the bike as it's at the back of my mind that I may have done some serious damage. So took the easy downhill short route of 12 miles to work. I have all the power in my legs, it felt so good to be back riding. But I can feel the smallest amount of pressure on the knee. But this is probably more to the fact of getting the knee working again rather then the cycling. So a few hours down the line and have had no (bad) reaction. Tonight will be a harder test as my commute is literally all up hill. So see how I get on with that and throw some Voltarol down my neck when I get home just in case.
> 
> Like you, I have missed most of April's riding.
> ...


 
Not as far behind as I am - I am about 1000 miles behind where I would have liked to be, and in no position to claw it back. Still getting the knee right is a PRIORITY.

Just had physio, basically he agreed with my assessment, and urges slowly slowly approach to building back up frequency, mileage and intensity. Then he pounded my tendon into agony (apparently that's a good thing) and sent me home to ice and anti-inflammatory it back to health


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## StuAff (25 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Back on the bike for the first time in near 3 weeks.
> Was for the morning commute. I took it nice and easy (with help of a headwind). I was a bit apprehensive about getting back on the bike as it's at the back of my mind that I may have done some serious damage. So took the easy downhill short route of 12 miles to work. I have all the power in my legs, it felt so good to be back riding. But I can feel the smallest amount of pressure on the knee. But this is probably more to the fact of getting the knee working again rather then the cycling. So a few hours down the line and have had no (bad) reaction. Tonight will be a harder test as my commute is literally all up hill. So see how I get on with that and throw some Voltarol down my neck when I get home just in case.
> 
> Like you, I have missed most of April's riding.
> ...


Excellent to see you two are on the mend!


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## ianrauk (25 Apr 2012)

StuAff said:


> Excellent to see you two are on the mend!


 

Cheers Stuey.
Though after tonights commute home it looks like I'm not out of the woods yet.
Still a niggling ache thing going on. So looks like I am going to have to book a Docs appointment.


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## Wobblers (26 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Cheers Stuey.
> Though after tonights commute home it looks like I'm not out of the woods yet.
> Still a niggling ache thing going on. So looks like I am going to have to book a Docs appointment.


 
Exactly how niggly is "niggling"? You _might_ be able to get away with some _very gentle_ cycling: choose to spin gears at least two lower than what you would usually, go very easy on the hills, don't try and race away from the lights and _absolutely no_ silly commuter racing... On the other hand, it can take cartilage 6 weeks to fully heal, so you may just need more time.

I get achey knees like yours if I'm not careful. I haven't found glucosamine or chondroitin to make any difference. On the other hand, a properly fitted bike does. The twinges in my knees almost completely disappeared once I got my Galaxy, which fitted better than the old steel mtb I was using before. I find it best to keep my knees warm, and take things easy if I feel any discomfort. Oddly enough, spending time off the bike doesn't make too much difference.


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## ianrauk (26 Apr 2012)

McWobble said:


> Exactly how niggly is "niggling"? You _might_ be able to get away with some _very gentle_ cycling: choose to spin gears at least two lower than what you would usually, go very easy on the hills, don't try and race away from the lights and _absolutely no_ silly commuter racing... On the other hand, it can take cartilage 6 weeks to fully heal, so you may just need more time.
> 
> I get achey knees like yours if I'm not careful. I haven't found glucosamine or chondroitin to make any difference. On the other hand, a properly fitted bike does. The twinges in my knees almost completely disappeared once I got my Galaxy, which fitted better than the old steel mtb I was using before. I find it best to keep my knees warm, and take things easy if I feel any discomfort. Oddly enough, spending time off the bike doesn't make too much difference.


 

Niggly enough to have a dull ache when I am putting power down either from the lights or accelerating. However I am not getting the stiff knee post cycle ride which I was when the problem first appeared. I have been spinning lower gears Andrew, have been in the 34 front ring rather then the 50 and been taking it easy. No silly extra mileage on the commute (not with this silly crap weather anyway) and no SCR.

I wore a brace this morning but whether it has made any difference? I don't know.
re G&C, I am fully aware that they may just have a placebo affect, but at the end of the day I'm not getting any younger so anything that can help the bones move that little bit easier is no bad thing.

So... got to work this morning and phones the docs to make an appointment.
Earliest appointment I could get was friday 4th...


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## Wobblers (26 Apr 2012)

ianrauk said:


> Niggly enough to have a dull ache when I am putting power down either from the lights or accelerating. However I am not getting the stiff knee post cycle ride which I was when the problem first appeared. I have been spinning lower gears Andrew, have been in the 34 front ring rather then the 50 and been taking it easy. No silly extra mileage on the commute (not with this silly crap weather anyway) and no SCR.
> 
> I wore a brace this morning but whether it has made any difference? I don't know.
> re G&C, I am fully aware that they may just have a placebo affect, but at the end of the day I'm not getting any younger so anything that can help the bones move that little bit easier is no bad thing.
> ...


 
If you feel that the G and C are helping, then definitely don't stop taking them!

If the pain is less, that sounds like a good sign - it sounds like you'll need to take it easier on the acceleration. One thing I've found that helps is keeping your knee warm (it helps keeping the joint properly lubricated with synovial fluid). Longs are the way to go.


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