# Bridleway permission.



## GuyBoden (30 Apr 2020)

Legally, I thought cycling was allowed on bridleways, but a local bridleway has been closed and a sign added warning cyclists not to use it. I presume this is due to the locals fearing the spread of covid-19 by cyclists. This is at Arley Hall Cheshire.


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

Do you mean a regular *public* bridleway, with a normal blue sign? (as opposed to a byway, B.o.a.t. , or private track that is opened at owner's discretion, etc ...)


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## MontyVeda (30 Apr 2020)

Ask your local council?

Looking on Google Maps (link)... I can't see any bridleways marked around Arley Hall, so it's likely not a bridleway (although Google isn't definitive)


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## ColinJ (30 Apr 2020)

Was the sign erected by the council or by the people who live there? 

I ordered my MTB just before the 2001 foot and mouth epidemic. All the bridleways closed the day before I got it. It was about 6 months before I got to ride it offroad!


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## NorthernDave (30 Apr 2020)

Has it officially been closed or has a local busy body put up an official looking but meaningless notice?

Someone put laminated notices up on the towpath of the Leeds-Liverpool canal the other week with the West Yorkshire Police logo on telling cyclists to stay home - the police removed them.

Check with the PROW officer at the relevant council, but cycling is allowed on bridleways.


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## Ming the Merciless (30 Apr 2020)

Yep can only be closed by an order from the secretary of state. It is a public highway. It’d be like me closing a local road. You are perfectly entitled to ignore the signs.


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## Phaeton (30 Apr 2020)

Identify it on https://www.rowmaps.com/ then screenshot the relevant map so we can see.


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## Drago (30 Apr 2020)

There are some local bridleways that cross Forestry Commission land near here. The FC have erected "no cycling" signs at either end where it enters and exits their land, but it has no legal status.

If it is a genuinely designated bridleway you can cycle upon it. As aforementioned, it can be closed by order of the SoS (who delegates these powers to local officers) but there is no legal mechanism to keep it open but restrict the type of traffic upon it - it's either open to all legal traffic, or it's closed. No shades of grey.


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## ChrisEyles (30 Apr 2020)

Public bridleways definitely OK to cycle on. 

This is a really good resource for planning routes: 

https://maps.the-hug.net/

Basically free OS maps - you can check if it's a Public Right of Way here (long dashed green line). 

It's actually really difficult to legally close or redirect a public right of way (I've had to do it for tree safety reasons on land I manage once or twice, lots of forms and an obligation to fix the problem and re-open the right of way asap). 

Unfortunately I wouldn't be surprised if local wallies have taken it on themselves to shut footpaths/bridleways. I recently had some locals being very vocally unhappy at me for cycling on a bridleway a couple of miles from my house... we had a good discussion about govt/police guidance and dynamic risk assessment which kind of took the wind out of their sails a bit, but there is a lot of knee-jerk disproportionate fear around at the moment as well as the sensible kind.


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## Deleted member 23692 (30 Apr 2020)

There is no legal mechanism for public rights of way to be closed because of Corona virus. The only way to close a right of way is through a Temporary Traffic Regulation Order, and they cannot cannot cover human plagues, just for livestock as in F&M, swine, bird flu etc.

A good few folk are taking it upon themselves to illegal close routes through their property during the current pandemic. without authorisation. The problem is whether rights of way Officers are allowed out to investigate, as that journey would be classed as non-essential


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## Deleted member 23692 (30 Apr 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> Yep can only be closed by an order from the secretary of state. It is a public highway. It’d be like me closing a local road. You are perfectly entitled to ignore the signs.


Not so. Any Highway Authority, or organisation with delegated powers from Highway Authorities (such as a National Park) can issue a TTRO. The only time the SoS is needed is for authority it to extend it past the initial 6 month period, and that is just a formality


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## ChrisEyles (30 Apr 2020)

^^^ I dunno, going a bit OT here, but having managed national parks and nature reserves around the South West IME it's very challenging indeed to obtain a long term re-direction, let alone closure of a PROW!


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## Bonefish Blues (30 Apr 2020)

Our community has done this on a public footpath. I think they are idiots and I'm embarassed to be associated with such behaviour.

(as in, crafted a 'Polite' notice...)

I understand someone was seen smiling on the path, or somesuch outrage


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## Deleted member 23692 (30 Apr 2020)

ChrisEyles said:


> ^^^ I dunno, going a bit OT here, but having managed national parks and nature reserves around the South West IME it's very challenging indeed to obtain a long term re-direction, let alone closure of a PROW!


That depends on the reason - if it's a temp closure to enable works to be undertaken then it's a straightforward application form and payment. A permanent change (diversion, extinguishment etc) is far more involved, costly and time consuming, and keeps me busy and entertained.

Especially so as the average Joe's understanding of PRoW Legislation is usually incorrect


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## PeteXXX (30 Apr 2020)

This is a screeie from OS. 
HTH


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## fossyant (30 Apr 2020)

It will be some local busybody. Our local farm just has a notice not to touch the animals or fences/gates and has left the gate open that runs through it's farmyard, which is the sensible approach. Other busy body's put up signs like no cycling. Ignore them. Just check OS Mapping (on line) and it will show you if it's a bridleway.


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## fossyant (30 Apr 2020)

Ah, cross post - use it ! Bloody Arley Hall - stuck up nobbers.


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## Slioch (30 Apr 2020)

We've got muppets around here putting similar signs up on a quiet country lane (has a mixture of tarmaced and non-tarmaced sections, so isn't much used by vehicles other than the locals) . It's a public highway. There's a few houses/farms along that lane, but all set back from the road so any risk from a passing cyclist/walker is minimal.

But I bet the idiots are still visiting the local supermarkets for their weekly shop though, where they are putting themselves at real risk.

Being an awkward bugger, I'm now riding that lane 3 or 4 times a week, but I haven't been confronted yet.


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## pawl (30 Apr 2020)

There is an area near me of open and woodland which has a permissive footpath.This is closed by the owner on two occasions a year Boxing Day and what they call the glorious twelfth for a shoot.As I understand it permissive paths can be closed at any time by the owner of the land.I assume permissive bridelway if there is such a thing would be the same

I believe local authorities have information regarding public rights of way.


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## Slioch (30 Apr 2020)

Get orf moy laaaand!


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## tom73 (30 Apr 2020)

Cycling UK have this advice on blocked off ROW during current lockdown. 
https://www.cyclinguk.org/blog/take-action-help-keep-our-rights-way-network-open-everyone
Like others have said if it's not official then ride along nothing to see here


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## Venod (30 Apr 2020)

The main Bridleway runs from the PO then North of the Hall and past The Ashes is this the one that has notices on it, if so ignore them.


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## Drago (30 Apr 2020)

bear in mind of course that the OS themselves are at great pains to point out that their maps should not be used as evidence of a right of access or a routes definitive status. The most authoritative source is your local councils GIS mapping, which most make available online.


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## Ajax Bay (30 Apr 2020)

https://www.streetmap.co.uk/map.srf...ty/Town/Village]&searchp=ids.srf&mapp=map.srf


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## HLaB (30 Apr 2020)

Unless the law has been updated as I believe it has in Scotland:



> A permissive path, permitted path, permitted bridleway or concessionary path is not a public right of way. It is a path clearly signed as a permissive that a landowner allows the public to use. This may be for walkers, riders, cyclists, or any combination. However there is no statutory right of access. Importantly, the landowner can impose conditions on use e.g. no dogs.



If its not signed as permissive legally I think you can ignore it.


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## Deleted member 23692 (30 Apr 2020)

Drago said:


> bear in mind of course that the OS themselves are at great pains to point out that their maps should not be used as evidence of a right of access or a routes definitive status. The most authoritative source is your local councils GIS mapping, which most make available online.


Not strictly correct.. only the Definite Map (and Statement) is legal proof positive, and there is one sealed copy of that per surveying authority. Digital versions and photocopies of the THE map are have no legal standing.

Some authorities have gone full digital, but they are few and far between


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

"No outsiders"


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## MontyVeda (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> "No outsiders"


Similar outside Scorton last week... _Scorton is Closed! Stay at Home!!_


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

"We can afford to live in a nicer place than you, in your horrible Bovis suburban rabbit hutches. Now sod orf!"


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## Ajax Bay (30 Apr 2020)

Drago said:


> The most authoritative source is your local councils GIS mapping, which most make available online.


And for Arley Hall Route 020/BR1/6, here is East Cheshire's best: https://maps.cheshireeast.gov.uk/ce...llTraffic_LINE_CURRENT&s=25000.00&bm=oscolour


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> "No outsiders"


Did you take that on a recent ride, Mr Zilla?


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## Venod (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> "No outsiders"


I can't believe it says welcome on the same sign.


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

matticus said:


> Did you take that on a recent ride, Mr Zilla?


No, sent by a friend in Leeds.


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## tom73 (30 Apr 2020)

I can understand signs being put up an main routes to say the coast or the dales which have seen people driving from all over the place on mass with no thought for anyone. But local footpaths that most of the time only people near by or local enough even know about then no.
If everyone keep each other safe it's fine some are not however playing my the rules which is making everyone turn on each other.


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> No, sent by a friend in Leeds.


Jolly good 
(I googled it to see if it was an actual public R-of-W ... and failed!)


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## tom73 (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> No, sent by a friend in Leeds.



Wonder what Theakstons would have to say about it ? Not a great advert for them.


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## All uphill (30 Apr 2020)

This is annoying now, and I worry that these miserable sods will try to make closures permanent. Brambles grow very quickly in summer and local authorities have a lot on their minds just now.

I take my hat off to those of you who continue to assert the right to use them.


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

How easy is it to carry a petrol hedgetrimmer on a bike?


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> How easy is it to carry a petrol hedgetrimmer on a bike?


I think you could remove a sign-or-two with bike-portable kit


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## wormo (30 Apr 2020)

One of the rights of way through Arley Hall has been closed to cyclists for a few years. I wonder if it is this bridleway.


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## MontyVeda (30 Apr 2020)

All uphill said:


> This is annoying now, and I worry that these miserable sods will try to make closures permanent. Brambles grow very quickly in summer and local authorities have a lot on their minds just now.
> 
> I take my hat off to those of you who continue to assert the right to use them.


As I understand it, it's the landowner who's responsible for maintaining access (eg, cutting back brambles) on rights of way through their land?


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## Deleted member 23692 (30 Apr 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> As I understand it, it's the landowner who's responsible for maintaining access (eg, cutting back brambles) on rights of way through their land?


It depends if it's undergrowth or overgrowth: Landowner is responsible for overgrowth, Highway Authority does the undergrowth.


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## classic33 (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> How easy is it to carry a petrol hedgetrimmer on a bike?


Easy enough


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## Ajax Bay (30 Apr 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> "No outsiders"





matticus said:


> (I googled it to see if it was an actual public R-of-W ... and failed!)


I think the image is of the footpath dropping down to the Woolpack in Esholt. It is a (RoW) footpath "Bradford North80", not a bridleway, fwiw.


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

Ajax Bay said:


> I think the image is of the footpath dropping down to the Woolpack in Esholt. It is a (RoW) footpath "Bradford North80", not a bridleway, fwiw.


In that case, I shall park my bike on the road while I toss that sign over the wall!


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## Mfezela (30 Apr 2020)

I carry this with me occasionally. Bought recently and only chose it because Screwfix are open and it's cheap.

https://www.screwfix.com/p/irwin-jack-straight-pruning-saw/8168k


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## ColinJ (30 Apr 2020)

I remember where @GuyBoden is talking about now. He suggested it as a little diversion on one of my annual Cheshire forum rides. The secluded properties down there look seriously expensive. I think it is a case of some wealthy toffs trying to keep plague-ridden riff-raff away from them!


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## Notafettler (30 Apr 2020)

matticus said:


> Do you mean a regular *public* bridleway, with a normal blue sign? (as opposed to a byway, B.o.a.t. , or private track that is opened at owner's discretion, etc ...)


Private tracks or to be more precise WERE called permissive ways. Farmers got paid for allowing them. All funding was cancelled.....I would guess 8 years ago. Around here only 1 farmer closed his permissive paths (the so called I farm for the environment farmer). All the others left there's opened. Waymarkers and maps still there. I assume some allowed cyclist but none around here.


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## Notafettler (30 Apr 2020)

ChrisEyles said:


> ^^^ I dunno, going a bit OT here, but having managed national parks and nature reserves around the South West IME it's very challenging indeed to obtain a long term re-direction, let alone closure of a PROW!


Offhand I can think of 5 redirection around here. All marked in pink writing on a black board. With the original footpath number and the new one.
They put a yellow sign at the start and finish of the footpath. Telling people that there has been an application to move it. If I can remember rightly they have an enquiry with a judge. The person who wants to move the footpath/bridleway generally wins if no one against turns up.
Ordnance survey have to be told about the move. Lots have not been added to ordnance survey maps.
In one area ordnance survey dont have some footpath (not just redirected ones) on the maps but are clearly marked with council waymarkers. Large metal poles with the appropriate waymarkers on.


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## Notafettler (30 Apr 2020)

pawl said:


> There is an area near me of open and woodland which has a permissive footpath.This is closed by the owner on two occasions a year Boxing Day and what they call the glorious twelfth for a shoot.As I understand it permissive paths can be closed at any time by the owner of the land.I assume permissive bridelway if there is such a thing would be the same
> 
> I believe local authorities have information regarding public rights of way.


The funding was removed from permissive paths years ago in England and a few years later in Wales. They can close them permanently


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## Jody (30 Apr 2020)

There have been all sorts of tactics used round here in the last few weeks. From residents in the peak district putting anti vandal paint on gates/handles, traps laid on trails, trails damaged, signage ripped down and "official" looking police notices of closure which aren't from the police.

It seems a lot of people are feeling empowered to be their own police force.


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## Notafettler (30 Apr 2020)

tom73 said:


> . But local footpaths that most of the time only people near by or local enough even know about then no.
> If everyone keep each other safe it's fine some are not however playing my the rules which is making everyone turn on each other.


Not strictly true. People drive from the cities to use footpaths. I used get trains from Manchester to various areas around to go walking.
Offhand Clitheroe, Sowerby bridge and ...Can't remember.


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## Drago (30 Apr 2020)

Many people are being proprietorial twits.


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

I don't know who's worse: the idiots flouting the lockdown (plenty around here) or the NIMBYs taking advantage of the situation to vandalise rights of way. They can all go in the same cell, as far as I'm concerned.


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## Notafettler (30 Apr 2020)

Jody said:


> There have been all sorts of tactics used round here in the last few weeks. From residents in the peak district putting anti vandal paint on gates/handles, traps laid on trails, trails damaged, signage ripped down and "official" looking police notices of closure which aren't from the police.
> 
> It seems a lot of people are feeling empowered to be their own police force.


Nobody has tried that on round here. I have heard of farmers telling people off for trespassing. Although I also no one farmer telling someone off for not trespassing. She was dog sitting and was walking the dog. Farmer stopped checked she was local and said she should be walking the dog in his field? I was standing in the entrance to one of his fields, the dog running around in it, saw him driving round the field called her in. He stopped and said leave her be she is enjoying herself. Then punished he me like he does every one he catches trespassing. He talked crap to me for half an hour before letting me go. 
The big landowner round here just waived and smiled at me when he drove past me cycling on his land. Lots of locals walk up his private road exercising there dogs. 
Looks like I am lucky most of the farmers don't seem to care that much. Come to think of it there's a miserable get farmer who knows everyone uses his woods to cycle/walk as the bridleway next to is in a very bad state all the time. I suspect he might not be happy if he knew I was cutting up all the fallen branches and fallen trees in his woods! At the same time though I do go round cutting the ivy of his big trees. So many trees get pulled down by ivy.


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## Drago (30 Apr 2020)

And throw in an assortment of hand weapons before closing the cell door.


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## Bonefish Blues (30 Apr 2020)

Jody said:


> There have been all sorts of tactics used round here in the last few weeks. From residents in the peak district putting anti vandal paint on gates/handles, traps laid on trails, trails damaged, signage ripped down and "official" looking police notices of closure which aren't from the police.
> 
> It seems a lot of people are feeling empowered to be their own police force.


...and the fact is they don't know - aiui as long as the exercise duration exceeds the duration of travel, all's well.


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## Phaeton (30 Apr 2020)

Red are Footpaths, Fushcia are Bridleways, further details can be found at https://www.rowmaps.com/datasets/CH/


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## Glow worm (30 Apr 2020)

I've not noticed any new signs around here going up. There is quite a good network of footpaths, and I'm relieved to say from a cycling point of view- bridleways too.

What is happening increasingly during all this, despite all the public rights of way available locally, some people are using private field margins for their walks. Off lead dogs emptying themselves in the wheat and barley.

I wish the landowners would be more pro-active in telling them to pi$$ off. It's the worst possible time of year in terms of wildlife disturbance. Ground nesting birds don't stand a chance, and those nesting in previously undisturbed hedges are also at risk.

I put a barn owl box up in a landowners field a few years so back, in a very quiet spot, away from roads and paths, and people and dogs are now regularly strolling past it. I even saw one lot having a picnic under the tree the box is in. That's another season gone.

Joe public doesn't seem to understand any of this or simply doesn't care.


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## rogerzilla (30 Apr 2020)

And dog poo bags hanging from trees at eye level?


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## Glow worm (30 Apr 2020)

Notafettler said:


> At the same time though I do go round cutting the ivy of his big trees. So many trees get pulled down by ivy.


Ivy does no harm to trees and is a vital source of nectar for many insects at times of year when food sources are scarce- (it flowers when there are few other nectar sources around in autumn) it can even sometimes be their only food source (just watch the bees around ivy on a sunny October day- it's amazing). The berries are also a very important food source for birds later on. Its also brilliant bat roosting habitat and provides shelter for many species of insects and birds. It's basically good stuff. If you can resist the urge to rip it down, please do.


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

Glow worm said:


> What is happening increasingly during all this, despite all the public rights of way available locally, some people are using private field margins for their walks. Off lead dogs emptying themselves in the wheat and barley.
> <snip>


I was wondering if this would come up. Tricky.

The Sustrans route i commute on is now like an exercise track for all sorts of people I've never seen before. It's slow progress. Quite a few civilians have taken to the adjacent field; if they hadn't done this we'd have immense difficulty in staying 2m apart (even 1m!) in the morning. Tricky ...


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## Glow worm (30 Apr 2020)

matticus said:


> I was wondering if this would come up. Tricky.
> 
> The Sustrans route i commute on is now like an exercise track for all sorts of people I've never seen before. It's slow progress. Quite a few civilians have taken to the adjacent field; if they hadn't done this we'd have immense difficulty in staying 2m apart (even 1m!) in the morning. Tricky ...



I'm avoiding all tracks and cycle paths which are narrow these days. I realise that isn't always possible everywhere and we are blessed with plenty of space here in rural East Anglia.


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## matticus (30 Apr 2020)

Glow worm said:


> I'm avoiding all tracks and cycle paths which are narrow these days. I realise that isn't always possible everywhere and we are blessed with plenty of space here in rural East Anglia.


If I'm doing "a ride", then that's become my strategy too!

I'm being a bit stubborn on the morning commute, people should realise that there are still folks commuting, on weekdays, at 0730. They've got all day to walk their dog etc, or go for a stroll with earphones blocking out the world! /END slight rant :P

(we're getting off-topic, but I think we've more than answered the OP  )


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## Ming the Merciless (30 Apr 2020)

Ffoeg said:


> Not so. Any Highway Authority, or organisation with delegated powers from Highway Authorities (such as a National Park) can issue a TTRO. The only time the SoS is needed is for authority it to extend it past the initial 6 month period, and that is just a formality



Either way the closure notice including the relevant order under which it’s been closed would need to be displayed. You can’t just stick up a notice saying closed due to CoronaVirus. Not a valid reason.


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## Phaeton (30 Apr 2020)

We have a closure on a Bridleway near us, the bridge was unsafe I reported it at the beginning of September last year, in October they put a 21 day restriction on it so the bridge could be removed. but once removed the weather was bad, remember all the floods so by January they still hadn't been able to get heavy plant in there to put a new bridge up. I went past last week & the bridge is still no there, you can get around it but that field floods regularly, I found on Nottinghamshire website https://www.nottinghamshire.gov.uk/...ws/temporary-closure-of-scrooby-bridleway-no1 so if your Bridleway is legitimately closed there should be an order somewhere


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## GuyBoden (30 Apr 2020)

I'll be keeping away from this bridleway, I doubt if the gates will be reopened and the signs removed until the current plague attitude has subsided.


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## Slioch (30 Apr 2020)

GuyBoden said:


> I'll be keeping away from this bridleway, I doubt if the gates will be reopened and the signs removed until the current plague attitude has subsided.



Don't assume the signs will be removed in a timely manner.

Months after the foot & mouth episode in 2001 there were still "keep out cos' foot & mouth" signs everywhere. I lived in Scotland at the time and was a hillwalker, and there were a lot of estates that were obviously keen to continue to deny the "right to roam" and keep the great unwashed off the hills. I became a phantom ninja sign ripper-upper for a while back then.


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## Ming the Merciless (30 Apr 2020)

Take some cutters and take the signs down.


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## Phaeton (30 Apr 2020)

GuyBoden said:


> I'll be keeping away from this bridleway, I doubt if the gates will be reopened and the signs removed until the current plague attitude has subsided.


I'd be doing exactly the opposite of they are there illegally I'd be making sure I went through as often as I could


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## Glow worm (30 Apr 2020)

Notafettler said:


> Come to think of it there's a miserable get farmer who knows everyone uses his woods to cycle/walk as the bridleway next to is in a very bad state all the time. I suspect he might not be happy if he knew I was cutting up all the fallen branches and fallen trees in his woods!



Sorry, this has been bothering me all evening (I don't get out much - especially at the moment) I don't know what the particular gripe you have with the landowner is, clearly, but please consider avoiding the woods to ride through and 'cutting up stuff ' at the moment at least. It is now the most critical time of year for nesting birds and they're hammered enough as it is.


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## Notafettler (1 May 2020)

Glow worm said:


> Sorry, this has been bothering me all evening (I don't get out much - especially at the moment) I don't know what the particular gripe you have with the landowner is, clearly, but please consider avoiding the woods to ride through and 'cutting up stuff ' at the moment at least. It is now the most critical time of year for nesting birds and they're hammered enough as it is.




Dead trees as on the ground. You need to reread what I have said. I have no gripe with landowners.


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## Notafettler (1 May 2020)

Glow worm said:


> Sorry, this has been bothering me all evening (I don't get out much - especially at the moment) I don't know what the particular gripe you have with the landowner is, clearly, but please consider avoiding the woods to ride through and 'cutting up stuff ' at the moment at least. It is now the most critical time of year for nesting birds and they're hammered enough as it is.


I was pointing out that despite him being a miserable get he didn't mind people using a short cut through his wood to avoid a difficult bridle way. I cut up stuff on the floor.


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## Phaeton (2 May 2020)

Came across this today whilst out, wasn't intending to ride down this particular Bridleway but after seeing this I






made sure that I did & reported it to the LA


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## Ming the Merciless (2 May 2020)

Good man


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## lazybloke (2 May 2020)

Struggled to follow a poorly marked footpath today (on foot, no bike) and was challenged by a farm-labourer type. He seemed helpful enough when i asked the best way on to the road i was trying to reach.

Nope- bloody liar was having me on - according to local authority maps (checked when i got back home). Cheeky git.


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## Venod (2 May 2020)

I came across my first closed path yesterday, its not a public footpath, but a National Trust permissive path, thay had erected a wooden contraption so it was impossible to negotiate the stile, the iron gate at the side was easy to lift the bike over and climb over.

I don't understand why this path is closed its hardly used by anyone, its a tractor track ie wide for most of its length, I cycled it as I didn't fancy the road detour, I never saw a soul as expected and usual.


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## Slick (4 May 2020)

HLaB said:


> Unless the law has been updated as I believe it has in Scotland:
> 
> 
> 
> If its not signed as permissive legally I think you can ignore it.


We don't really have the same issues up here due to the freedom to roam act which isn't new. 

https://www.apidura.com/journal/freedom-to-roam-in-scotland-everything-you-need-to-know/


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## simon.r (4 May 2020)

FWIW the 1968 Countryside Act allows cyclists to use bridleways:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Countryside_Act_1968


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## Phaeton (4 May 2020)

Phaeton said:


> Came across this today whilst out, wasn't intending to ride down this particular Bridleway but after seeing this I
> View attachment 519340
> 
> 
> made sure that I did & reported it to the LA


Had a reply from the LA, basically nothing they can do as they cannot travel to look at it, I've replied they surely have photographic evidence so no travel required & they could either ring or email the landowner.


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## Drago (4 May 2020)

That's funny. When I reported fly tipping last week our LA went out to look at it the very next morning (the guy phoned me afterwards, turns out it's a retired Bobby I know from way back).

Tell them South Northants council are visiting such reports without issue, and ask what is their justification for not doing so?

Their duty to ensure the route remains open is a statutory one, and that duty has not been repealed due to the current situation. I appreciate things might take longer due to changes in working practices etc, but they have a legal duty to act. Other organisations with legal obligations, such as trumpton, dibble, and even refuse collection, are still operating largely as normal.


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## matticus (4 May 2020)

Of course they can bloody travel to look at it. Ask them if their bins are being emptied!

Pathetic excuse (unless they've all just been paralysed in some hideous group traffic accident...  )


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## Drago (4 May 2020)

Perhaps they were all cycling to work when they turned a corner and collided with a tree stump that had been dumped, and have all been hospitalised?


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## straas (4 May 2020)

Fairly sure the gates through arley hall have always said no cycling?


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## straas (4 May 2020)

Just looked on google maps - one end had "footpath only" (the little green sign on that miniature house) and both ends are gated:


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## ExpatTyke (4 May 2020)

Phaeton said:


> Came across this today whilst out, wasn't intending to ride down this particular Bridleway but after seeing this I
> made sure that I did & reported it to the LA



I've noticed quite a few gateways locally have had barrels or farm machinery dumped in front of them, presumably to prevent parking.

I've not seen any signs "closing" paths or bridleways, but I've been sticking to the roads recently - I rode a small section of the Strawberry Line a few weeks ago and got off of it as quickly as possible due to the congestion.


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## Venod (4 May 2020)

straas said:


> Just looked on google maps - one end had "footpath only" (the little green sign on that miniature house) and both ends are gated:


Is that what the OP is referring to, according to OS maps there no public footpaths or bridleways through the hall, there is a bridleway round it.


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## Phaeton (4 May 2020)

Had another reply from LA, 

"Contacting the landowner is my intention, unfortunately we do not have access to all of that information when working from home so have to find a work-a-round. We will do our best"

Still disappointed it's clearly showing big holes in their procedures


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## uphillstruggler (4 May 2020)

Phaeton said:


> Had another reply from LA,
> 
> "Contacting the landowner is my intention, unfortunately we do not have access to all of that information when working from home so have to find a work-a-round. We will do our best"
> 
> Still disappointed it's clearly showing big holes in their procedures



or that they don't want to create waves.


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## Deleted member 23692 (4 May 2020)

uphillstruggler said:


> or that they don't want to create waves.


No, it's because they (and I mean we) are not classed key staff, and a trip to inspect the obstruction and subsequent meet the LO are currently considered a non-essential journey. 

It's really that simple.


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## Phaeton (4 May 2020)

Ffoeg said:


> No, it's because they (and I mean we) are not classed key staff, and a trip to inspect the obstruction and subsequent meet the LO are currently considered a non-essential journey.
> 
> It's really that simple.


In which case they should be furloughed & not responding at all to reports OR they should either have access to all that they require to be able to carry out their work from home. Even if that means a single person should travel into work to provide the information the rest of the team needs, as it would appear their current infrastructure which we have paid for is not fit for purpose.


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## Drago (4 May 2020)

Ffoeg said:


> No, it's because they (and I mean we) are not classed key staff, and a trip to inspect the obstruction and subsequent meet the LO are currently considered a non-essential journey.
> 
> It's really that simple.



If work can not reasonably be conducted from home, it is still lawful to travel in order to get to work or to discharge ones work. There is nothing in the legislation that restricts journeying for work purposes to essential personnel only.


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## Deleted member 23692 (4 May 2020)

Phaeton said:


> In which case they should be furloughed & not responding at all to reports OR they should either have access to all that they require to be able to carry out their work from home. Even if that means a single person should travel into work to provide the information the rest of the team needs, as it would appear their current infrastructure which we have paid for is not fit for purpose.


Really? They should be laid off because they can't undertake a very small part of their job?


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## classic33 (4 May 2020)

Ffoeg said:


> Really? They should be laid off because they can't undertake a very small part of their job?


If their work is in PROW's/access, that's a major part of the job. Acting on reports of deliberate obstructions.

At least it was when I applied for a job within the local PROW's department. Ability to travel to remote locations came high on the list.


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## matticus (4 May 2020)

is this going to be the new excuse for everything in UK plc, replacing the well-tested "Elf n Safety"?

_Sorry mate, we can't fix that - non-essential work, innit?_


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## uphillstruggler (4 May 2020)

Ffoeg said:


> No, it's because they (and I mean we) are not classed key staff, and a trip to inspect the obstruction and subsequent meet the LO are currently considered a non-essential journey.
> 
> It's really that simple.



Fair enough point but surely the Council should have contact details? I don’t really see the need to meet them and chat when there is photographic evidence to support the call.

Don’t get me wrong, with everything going on atm, it may not be high op on the agenda but the lack of contact details is a bit amateurish


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## Phaeton (4 May 2020)

uphillstruggler said:


> Fair enough point but surely the Council should have contact details?


They do have the contact details, but they do not have access to the contact details as they are held in the office but they are 'working' from home, how you do that when you haven't access to the resources you need is another matter.


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## uphillstruggler (4 May 2020)

Phaeton said:


> They do have the contact details, but they do not have access to the contact details as they are held in the office but they are 'working' from home, how you do that when you haven't access to the resources you need is another matter.



true, but in my companies case, we have an administrator who can access the details required and pass them on.

I would have imagined that you would have access to the information required for the job even if you are remote.

I'm not having a dig, I just cant see how it can be that difficult to have remote access.


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## Phaeton (4 May 2020)

uphillstruggler said:


> true, but in my companies case, we have an administrator who can access the details required and pass them on.
> I would have imagined that you would have access to the information required for the job even if you are remote.
> I'm not having a dig, I just cant see how it can be that difficult to have remote access.


Hence my suggestion that if they cannot do their job they should be furloughed, I also suggested that 1 person in the team could safely work in the office & pass that information out to others if remote access wasn't available.


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## straas (5 May 2020)

matticus said:


> is this going to be the new excuse for everything in UK plc, replacing the well-tested "Elf n Safety"?
> 
> _Sorry mate, we can't fix that - non-essential work, innit?_




Sorry, but I absolutely despise this opinion.

I work in engineering / construction and the rate of deaths has sharply dropped since health and safety has been taken seriously.


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## matticus (5 May 2020)

No apology required - I think you've just misread me.


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## ozboz (5 May 2020)

I’d take it busy bods, my GF was riding on a Bridlepath in the Hampton area, two women walking their dogs , less than 2m apart began to give her a right ear bashing about Covid 19 restrictions ! 
She retorted , “well what would you expect !! , this is a Bridlepath and just in case you HAVN’T noticed , this is a Horse I’m riding ! 
Tapped the horse with her heels and “Ride on ! “


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## ozboz (5 May 2020)

straas said:


> Sorry, but I absolutely despise this opinion.
> 
> I work in engineering / construction and the rate of deaths has sharply dropped since health and safety has been taken seriously.


I work in Construction , your statement is true, but......
When I have worked on contracts where the completion dates were unattainable on a lot of occasions the H&S were let’s say relaxed ,
The worst was the Westfield at Shepherds Bush .
I would if possible like to see how many of the construction workers that were allowed to commute by PT actually caught the virus . A Gov worker I know refused to travel in to his work in London due to fact that the tube. route he has to take was crowded with what he said was Construction Workers :


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## Drago (5 May 2020)

straas said:


> Sorry, but I absolutely despise this opinion.
> 
> I work in engineering / construction and the rate of deaths has sharply dropped since health and safety has been taken seriously.


Absolutely. The local authorities have a _statutory duty _to keep these routes open. That duty has not been repealed, and the C-19 legislation is not higher law so does not usurp that duty.

It is clearly stated that if people cannot reasonably work from home they should go to work (unless they work in one of the business on the prescribed list) and work as normal, albeit maintaining distancing where possible and being mindful of hygiene.

There is nothing in the legislation that prohibits people other than "key staff" going to work. Indeed, I would contend that as they have a statutory legal duty to act, and failure to observe that duty is unlawful, they are indeed key personnel anyway. To wilfully neglect a statutory duty is misconduct ina public office, a serious offence, and being worried about C-19 is a mitigation, not a defence.

There is nothing in the legislation or any moral imperative that prevents councils from discharging their lawful obligations, and most other local authorities - including my own local one - are dealing with such matters, and actually doing so quite expeditiously.

Interestingly, most of the highways stuff is managed by contractors, in my local council Kier. Its utterly obscene that some council contractors are still taking the full public coin yet using this as an excuse to not even attempt to provide the contracted services.


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## mjr (12 May 2020)

matticus said:


> In that case, I shall park my bike on the road while I toss that sign over the wall!


Oh please go careful. We had flaming hell to pay locally when some kids (probably - it's a bit of a vandalism hotspot) bent some anti-cycling signs put up on National Cycle Route 1 by a misguided parish. Of course, cyclists were blamed for it, even though several cycle route signs were defaced at the same time (and as far as I know, still haven't been cleaned or replaced).


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## Drago (12 May 2020)

Your parish put up anti cycling signs on a cycling route? Proof the world has gone totally bonkers.


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## mjr (12 May 2020)

Glow worm said:


> I've not noticed any new signs around here going up. There is quite a good network of footpaths, and I'm relieved to say from a cycling point of view- bridleways too.


The anti-cyclist sign over at Coveney got some fame, but that's on a road (part of the National Byway AIUI) not a bridleway.
https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/ridiculous-sign-trying-stop-cyclists-18084476

View: https://mbasic.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=3430759480274745&id=1203376366346412


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## mjr (12 May 2020)

Drago said:


> Your parish put up anti cycling signs on a cycling route? Proof the world has gone totally bonkers.


Not my parish, but one nearby. Yes, totally bonkers. They were happy to take the thousands of pounds from cycling organisations to tarmac the route about 20 years ago, but I guess the NIMBYs took over since.

They've since been amended into a sort of share-with-care message but it was rather embarrassing for everyone involved.


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## ColinJ (12 May 2020)

I'm just waiting for someone in one of the local villages (less than 5 kms away) to tell me to '_keep in [my] own area_'. If they do, I will agree to it if the entire population of their village agree not to come into Todmorden to shop!


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## Ming the Merciless (12 May 2020)

Came across this on a walk today. No legislation to close public rights of way due to CoronaVirus is the summary.


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## Drago (12 May 2020)

ColinJ said:


> I'm just waiting for someone in one of the local villages (less than 5 kms away) to tell me to '_keep in [my] own area_'. If they do, I will agree to it if the entire population of their village agree not to come into Todmorden to shop!


I've been keeping close to home with my riding, orbiting my home village doing a loop of the surrounding villages, never more than perhaps a 2 mile radius from home. I've been glaring at some of the pitchfork wielding yokels and mentally daring them to say it to me, but despite looking like they really wanted to none have had the gumption yet to say it to me. Cant think why.


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## matticus (12 May 2020)

Drago said:


> I've been keeping close to home with my riding, orbiting my home village doing a loop of the surrounding villages, never more than perhaps a 2 mile radius from home. I've been glaring at some of the pitchfork wielding yokels and mentally daring them to say it to me, but despite looking like they really wanted to* none have had the gumption yet to say it to me. Cant think why*.
> 
> View attachment 521780


Probably your offensively revealing lycra shorts.


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## lazybloke (12 May 2020)

The shirtless poseur (look at my pecs!) who jogged past me the other day was panting far more than any cyclist i've seen during the entire lockdown.


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## CXRAndy (13 May 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> "No outsiders"


Is this Esholt where Amos's Woolpack was? 
I used to like going to Woolie back in my yoof


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