# Cyclist down



## Blackandblue (13 Nov 2008)

A3, London, just west of Oval tube station.

White road bike (minus front wheel). Emergency services in attendance and somebody on a stretcher.

Not immediately apparent what other traffic was involved in the accident but it appeared to have happened alongside a left turn. 

Hope they're OK.


----------



## hackbike 6 (13 Nov 2008)

Only appeared,it could have been anything.


----------



## bryce (13 Nov 2008)

The hairs on the back of my neck stand up when I see this thread title.

Hope he/ she's ok.


----------



## Jake (13 Nov 2008)

ooo me too, around 10.30am


----------



## magnatom (13 Nov 2008)

User1314 said:


> This is a horrible anecdote - could be the incident. I go through there every morning.
> 
> http://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=10933.0




I've added my piece to that thread. Very nasty. As for the guy with the newspaper.....


----------



## Jake (13 Nov 2008)

yikes very bad and graphic. hope he is ok, sounds like they got to him quick and off to hospital sharpish. golden hour and all that.


----------



## HLaB (13 Nov 2008)

magnatom said:


> I've added my piece to that thread. Very nasty. As for the guy with the newspaper.....




Thats a very scary thread , I hope the bloke on the Bianchi makes a full recovery and I hope it wasn't too traumatic for clarion. I don't know what to say about that muppet with the newspaper either


----------



## hackbike 6 (13 Nov 2008)

I've read that it's terrible.


----------



## BentMikey (13 Nov 2008)

Awful isn't it? According to Lee's theory of driving and riding it can't possibly be the truck driver's fault. Bollocks to Lee, the driver overtook Clarion and then part overtook the rider he took out, according to Clarion.


----------



## Eat MY Dust (13 Nov 2008)

I'm pretty sure if I had witnessed this whole incident that the HGV driver would have had to have surgery to remove his newspaper from his ar*e. WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE!!


----------



## Rhythm Thief (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Awful isn't it? According to Lee's theory of driving and riding it can't possibly be the truck driver's fault. Bollocks to Lee, the driver overtook Clarion and then part overtook the rider he took out, according to Clarion.



In fairness to Lee (and without wishing to divert this thread from its original point; I hope the guy makes a full recovery), he's never said that lorry drivers never cause incidents such as this one. I don't think any of the lorry drivers who use this forum would try and exonerate this particular driver from blame.
I'd certainly be interested to meet the tit who was waving the newspaper about ... where do they find these idiots?


----------



## hackbike 6 (13 Nov 2008)

User3143 said:


> You have no class



Whether BM has class or not isn't really the point here is it lee?


----------



## summerdays (13 Nov 2008)

I think if I had witnessed this I would be a complete wreck ... but it sounds as if Clarion will be a good witness. And I think the assult should be reported - to hit some and whilst they were on the phone to the emergency services - what were they thinking of.


----------



## Jake (13 Nov 2008)

User1314 said:


> I'm normally through there around 7.45 am eastbound.



way too early, still asleep at that time


----------



## magnatom (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Awful isn't it? According to Lee's theory of driving and riding it can't possibly be the truck driver's fault. Bollocks to Lee, the driver overtook Clarion and then part overtook the rider he took out, according to Clarion.




I must admit, I don't think these comments help in this thread BM. If you want to continue that discussion I think it would be better to create a thread for it, in the green wheelie bin......


----------



## skwerl (13 Nov 2008)

User3143 said:


> I think it is though hackbike. As RT has pointed out I have never actually said that cyclists are only to blame, only that they should ride with a bit of awareness in relation to HGV(not saying this is what happened in this incident)
> 
> Yet BM writes ''according to Lee's theory..'' ''...Bollocks to Lee..'' deluded BM.
> 
> Hope the guy makes a full recovery and continues cycling



I agree with Lee here. BM is discounting his opinion before he's even had a chance to give it. Not really fair is it?


----------



## BentMikey (13 Nov 2008)

Not exactly unjustified though. Lee does come across to me like the newspaper driver in topics on here. Maybe now he will see why I'm so scathing of him.


----------



## magnatom (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Not exactly unjustified though. Lee does come across to me like the newspaper driver in topics on here. Maybe now he will see why I'm so scathing of him.




Maybe, I'm not exactly Lee's biggest fan, but not in this thread please. Lets keep it on topic!


----------



## BentMikey (13 Nov 2008)

OK, fairy nuff. More on topic, if I were ever in a situation like this, let me just say quite how much the person I'd want there would be Clarion. Even if I didn't know him personally, he's always been a gent of note online.

Oh, and there's another interesting Clarion yacf topic in the same forum, entitled 911 - he's had a bad two days.


----------



## magnatom (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> OK, fairy nuff. More on topic, if I were ever in a situation like this, let me just say quite how much the person I'd want there would be Clarion. Even if I didn't know him personally, he's always been a gent of note online.
> 
> Oh, and there's another interesting Clarion yacf topic in the same forum, entitled 911 - he's had a bad two days.




Aye, it almost sounds like it is made up it is that crazy. Obviously that's not the case as he is a seasoned poster and well known over there.


----------



## hackbike 6 (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Not exactly unjustified though. Lee does come across to me like the newspaper driver in topics on here. Maybe now he will see why I'm so scathing of him.



Is this because you don't agree with the way Lee cycles?

I don't either but he has never criticised me for the way I cycle so I will give him the benefit of the doubt..

The trouble is BM is you won't be swayed in your beliefs on how to cycle and I even get told how to cycle by people who have been cycling for two minutes.We all think we are great at what we do but some of us have been doing it a very long time.(I could be the worst cyclist in the world or the best)OK I make mistakes poor positioning blah blah blah.I have made a point of buying a bike and riding in it in heavy Bangkok traffic with it and I have become a cocky know it all cyclist a bit like you.(I am confident I must admit) Actually I was just desperate for a bike to ride here.

I understand your point about primary and I must admit in Bangkok I have been using it a bit,but don't I really need it as the drivers over here are nicer.Though it's like a firking madhouse.


Drivers in England scare me (most are idiots)(not all of them)so im happy to be bullied into the gutter.(if that's what turns them on) I can act as well.(or at least I think so.)

You may think it's wrong but it's all I know.

P.S Another point is I never criticise people on here for holding primary,primary all the time isn't always the correct choice,neither is secondary.

Im only trying to make a point,please don't take this too badly thankyou.

I never asked to watch your videos but you wanted to watch mine.So why was that?

Yes I have known about the doorzone for the last 30 years im not a numpty am I?


----------



## BentMikey (13 Nov 2008)

Blimey Hackers, here's a hug. Don't be so sensitive, I think you've taken strain and imagined abuse where there's none. Your riding might be less than ideal, but then so is mine. I enjoyed watching your riding and your decisions, mostly because I could learn from all the good stuff you did.

I seem to recall you riding in one video with some excellent anticipation and avoidance of an impending left hook, was that right?


----------



## hackbike 6 (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Blimey Hackers, here's a hug. Don't be so sensitive, I think you've taken strain and imagined abuse where there's none. Your riding might be less than ideal, but then so is mine. I enjoyed watching your riding and your decisions, mostly because I could learn from all the good stuff you did.
> 
> I seem to recall you riding in one video with some excellent anticipation and avoidance of an impending left hook, was that right?



It was never meant as an insult mate although it seems like I cant put myself across properly.

Oh and im not trying to sway you in the "right way" to cycle it would be as bad as you doing the same to me.

Thanks for the last remark,that was just luck...lucky he blew his horn before he did his trick.

Im too cycling passive to ride primary in England although I do love cycling in foreign countries.Bangkok did scare me a bit but even how manic it's been,it's been very good.


----------



## Rhythm Thief (13 Nov 2008)

BentMikey said:


> Not exactly unjustified though. *Lee does come across to me like the newspaper driver in topics on here.* Maybe now he will see why I'm so scathing of him.



No he doesn't. He comes across to me as a bloke who rides a bike and drives a lorry and doesn't have the "two wheels good, four wheels bad" mentality that some posters here have occasionally exhibited. (That's not aimed at you, BM, by the way.)


----------



## Joe (13 Nov 2008)

Horrible story
Hope Bianchiman makes a full recovery.
Just read both of Clarion's incident threads and he does indeed seem to be a saint! Hope he gets some well deserved trouble free riding


----------



## Butterfly (13 Nov 2008)

magnatom said:


> Aye, it almost sounds like it is made up it is that crazy. Obviously that's not the case as he is a seasoned poster and well known over there.



It certainly isn't made up. He's been very shaken by both these incidents, really upset, to the extent that I'm seriously considering riding out 30 minutes early tomorrow so I can ride the first part of his commute with him and keep him going. Mind you, it would slow him down a lot if I did.

(I'm his partner).


----------



## clarion (13 Nov 2008)

It's been a pretty unpleasant couple of days. Last night's comedian was just a runty blowhard, but I was pretty scared at the time, and I went home a different way in case there were three blokes waiting in the dark to attack me.

This morning - well, I'm blushing at some of the descriptions of my actions. I just did what I thought was right, and I hope someone would do the same for me. The Aussie guy who also witnessed it was great, and we helped keep each others' spirits up. The lass who stopped had more sense than me, and actually checked the victim. We ought to look after each other on the road.


----------



## Fab Foodie (13 Nov 2008)

clarion said:


> It's been a pretty unpleasant couple of days. Last night's comedian was just a runty blowhard, but I was pretty scared at the time, and I went home a different way in case there were three blokes waiting in the dark to attack me.
> 
> This morning - well, I'm blushing at some of the descriptions of my actions. I just did what I thought was right, and I hope someone would do the same for me. The Aussie guy who also witnessed it was great, and we helped keep each others' spirits up. The lass who stopped had more sense than me, and actually checked the victim. We ought to look after each other on the road.


I was staggered by the events Clarion. I can't add more than's already been said, well played. Take it easy out there (and say hi to road by the Northern line for me).


----------



## downfader (13 Nov 2008)

clarion said:


> It's been a pretty unpleasant couple of days. Last night's comedian was just a runty blowhard, but I was pretty scared at the time, and I went home a different way in case there were three blokes waiting in the dark to attack me.
> 
> This morning - well, I'm blushing at some of the descriptions of my actions. I just did what I thought was right, and I hope someone would do the same for me. The Aussie guy who also witnessed it was great, and we helped keep each others' spirits up. The lass who stopped had more sense than me, and actually checked the victim. We ought to look after each other on the road.



No amount of training can help you in these situations imo and it seems you did the right thing.  I'm sure we all take our helmets off in respect. 

Dont feel bad about anything. You played an important role in helping the guy.


----------



## tdr1nka (13 Nov 2008)

Rest easy clarion, you did more than enough to help. 

I had two v. nasty instances some years ago that utterly lost me all my confidence in being safe on the roads and, rather shamefully but also much needed, I made a complete break from cycling for some five years.

With hindsight I should have never left the saddle for that long, but at least I got the bug back!

You carry on riding out there, and if all you did was the right thing, I still salute you.


----------



## wlc1 (14 Nov 2008)

Sounds like a cracking job to me...... 

He would have gone to KCH or Tommys from there and both are excellent at trauma so fingers crossed.

Nice to hear some praise for the LAS too. We get shafted daily and I'm not saying this to be controversial but I bet the crew loved a decent job. 

Sounds like you did ok on the phone etc. Well done praise where praise is due - it's not easy to see that and then be calm enough to make rational decisions and have clear thinking.


----------



## dondare (14 Nov 2008)

A very nasty incident which will certainly test the resilience of the victim. (And tested Clarion's patience, too, if I'd been there they'd have needed another ambulance for the paper man.) 
I certainly hope that whoever is looking into these cases notices that it's not always down to idiot cyclists. If the driver couldn't see the cyclist this time then there is a real problem with these vehicles which will not go away by putting a sticker on the back of the lorry or by educating cyclists.


----------



## Nigeyy (14 Nov 2008)

Clarion,

I hope it makes a difference to you to know that many people out here support you, and admire what you did. Thanks for your efforts, you sound like a really good person, and we need more people like you around.

Also, I know that confrontations -even with blowhards -can be particularly unpleasant. I've been abused for much less, and it's just so upsetting, even more so when you know they've acted completely unreasonably or not even followed the recognized rules of the road. You have to wonder how these people live, I have to guess in an extremely small minded frustrated way. Anyway, it just takes time to get over it.

In the meantime, a helmet mounted cam might be a good idea, or vary your commute route for a time. Keep on doing what you're doing, it does make a difference to the world and you make the world a more pleasant place. 

Have a virtual cuppa from me from across the pond, mate. Best wishes.



clarion said:


> It's been a pretty unpleasant couple of days. Last night's comedian was just a runty blowhard, but I was pretty scared at the time, and I went home a different way in case there were three blokes waiting in the dark to attack me.
> 
> This morning - well, I'm blushing at some of the descriptions of my actions. I just did what I thought was right, and I hope someone would do the same for me. The Aussie guy who also witnessed it was great, and we helped keep each others' spirits up. The lass who stopped had more sense than me, and actually checked the victim. We ought to look after each other on the road.


----------



## Mr Phoebus (14 Nov 2008)

Clarion, let me smear my hands with superglue and then give you all the man hug you can take.

Londinium is such a harsh mistress sometimes.
You're tough though, you can take it.


----------



## magnatom (14 Nov 2008)

Clarion, thanks for popping over. Butterfly, just to clarify (although I'm sure you know this) I was NOT suggesting that it was made up, just that it seemed so crazy (both incidents together). Thank goodness it happened to someone capable of handling it all.

Well done for your actions. B)


----------



## clarion (14 Nov 2008)

You're right, Magnatom, I've not been over here enough lately. But I guess I'm vain enough to want to know what folk are saying about me and the incident.

By the way, has anyone seen any press coverage of the collision - Evening Standard or local papers, for example?


----------



## Butterfly (14 Nov 2008)

magnatom said:


> Clarion, thanks for popping over. Butterfly, just to clarify (although I'm sure you know this) I was NOT suggesting that it was made up, just that it seemed so crazy (both incidents together).


 I know you weren't suggesting that, I just wanted to confim that.



> Thank goodness it happened to someone capable of handling it all.
> 
> Well done for your actions. :?:


Hear hear.


----------



## downfader (14 Nov 2008)

clarion said:


> By the way, has anyone seen any press coverage of the collision - Evening Standard or local papers, for example?



Nothing online.

If there was some of the planks on there... well you know how they get. :?:


----------



## alp1950 (15 Nov 2008)

clarion said:


> You're right, Magnatom, I've not been over here enough lately. But I guess I'm vain enough to want to know what folk are saying about me and the incident.
> 
> By the way, has anyone seen any press coverage of the collision - Evening Standard or local papers, for example?



Clarion- a couple of beautifully written pieces on your experiences. Very sobering accounts, probably because those of us who cycle on busy commuting roads have imagined ourselves in identical situations. Hopefully these events won't hit your confidence too hard - it looks as though you handled yourself well on both occasions. 

As for this thread on cycle chat: "off-topic & squabbling by page 2" observed Liz on YACF. My thoughts exactly & sadly not for the first time on CC. Might be time to take a close look at YACF.....


----------



## hackbike 6 (15 Nov 2008)

Well done Clarion nice one.


----------



## dondare (15 Nov 2008)

alp1950 said:


> As for this thread on cycle chat: "*off-topic & squabbling* by page 2" observed Liz on YACF. My thoughts exactly & sadly not for the first time on CC. Might be time to take a close look at YACF.....



Forums which discourage this get very boring.


----------



## PBancroft (15 Nov 2008)

Just in shock, partly because of the accident itself, and partly the newspaper guy.

EDIT: Regarding the squabbling, this forum does have an ignore feature. I find its therapeutic to make use of it


----------



## Fab Foodie (15 Nov 2008)

dondare said:


> Forums which discourage this get very boring.



Sorry to go OT here:
I thought the petty squabbling was a feature of this forum?
When C+ finally fell apart, those that wanted to continue the petty squabbling and ribald banter came here and those that didn't went to acf. Then they squabbled a bit with the proprietor and some dissenters set-up yacf. And it's good that they did.

For high quality inane bitchyness you need to visit the Green Wheely bin, if you've not posted on a thread in there you can't call yourself a true CC member...


----------



## dondare (15 Nov 2008)

Update: Downed cyclist has posted on YACF, with a broken pelvis but alive enough.
http://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=10933.90


----------



## HLaB (15 Nov 2008)

Thanks for the update.
Great to hear he's relatively OK, lets hope his injuries heal soon.


----------



## downfader (15 Nov 2008)

I hope he sues them for a s*** load of money. No way that should have happened, really. Very cool that he's ok!!


----------



## clarion (15 Nov 2008)

Thanks for updating there, dondare. I was about to do the same. So happy he's on the mend and got in touch. It felt weird when the road was reopened, and there was no sign of anything having happened. Nothing to do except get on the bike and ride to work. And I didn't know his name or even what hospital he went to. All I'd learned was the surname of the other witness. It just felt like an unended event.


----------



## Mr Phoebus (15 Nov 2008)

That's good news.

He's got a good Guardian Angel there, looking over his shoulder.
He wants to hang on to that one.


----------



## BentMikey (15 Nov 2008)

Squabbling? Not really on thsi topic. TBH, there's not much difference in the argy bargy between here and yacf, I think they're both great places filled with quality people and posters.


----------



## summerdays (16 Nov 2008)

I think its great news - it could of been so much worse. Now we just need an update next year to hear he is back on a new bike to complete the story. 

Well also a bit were the offending people end up being prosecuted.


----------



## just jim (16 Nov 2008)

That's fair gripping reading - what a relief he's going to be alright.

He seems to have felt the benefits of wearing a helmet!


----------



## dondare (16 Nov 2008)

just jim said:


> That's fair gripping reading - what a relief he's going to be alright.
> 
> He seems to have felt the benefits of wearing a* helmet!*



It was only a matter of time before that one came up.


----------



## Keith Oates (16 Nov 2008)

Sounds like a horrible accident but the important thing is that he came out of it fairly well. Must have been a rough time for the YACF member to have witnessed the whole thing.


----------



## Lazy-Commuter (17 Nov 2008)

Glad to hear that he's OK and what a lovely post he made to thank Clarion. Course, Clarion deserved it .. and more!!


----------

