# Stop Killing Cyclists....



## ozboz (10 Feb 2017)

http://road.cc/content/news/216837-...-protest-calling-increased-investment-cycling

Mmmm , may go to this ,


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## Drago (10 Feb 2017)

Nothing will change.


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## Lonestar (10 Feb 2017)

.....and less of car is king bull5h1t.


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## subaqua (10 Feb 2017)

Treasury dept will be empty on Saturday. 

In the week I would be there . But a Saturday NAH


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## Drago (10 Feb 2017)

Have the Treasury been out killing cyclists then?


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## RoubaixCube (10 Feb 2017)

Drago said:


> Have the Treasury been out killing cyclists then?



Well they certainly haven't been treasuring us thats for sure


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## subaqua (10 Feb 2017)

Drago said:


> Have the Treasury been out killing cyclists then?


Indirectly maybe


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## jefmcg (10 Feb 2017)

I'm going. Doesn't matter if the treasury is empty, if it makes the news.

@ozboz - I'm coming in from Twickenham. Should we go together (acknowledging that I am slow, you may have to wait for me to catch up)?


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## subaqua (10 Feb 2017)

jefmcg said:


> I'm going. Doesn't matter if the treasury is empty, if it makes the news.
> 
> @ozboz - I'm coming in from Twickenham. Should we go together (acknowledging that I am slow, you may have to wait for me to catch up)?


Not as much as if it was on a weekday . But if you want to try well done.


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## ozboz (10 Feb 2017)

jefmcg said:


> I'm going. Doesn't matter if the treasury is empty, if it makes the news.
> 
> @ozboz - I'm coming in from Twickenham. Should we go together (acknowledging that I am slow, you may have to wait for me to catch up)?



Ok , @jefmcg no problem , Im as slow as anyway ! only got one leg firing !!
What time and where to meet up ?


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## jefmcg (10 Feb 2017)

ozboz said:


> Ok , @jefmcg no problem , Im as slow as anyway ! only got one leg firing !!
> What time and where to meet up ?


Serious? OK. Midday outside the Cricketers on Richmond Green?

I'll be one of the few bad tempered, middle-aged Australian women on a Giant road bike there. Shouldn't be too hard to find.


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## ozboz (10 Feb 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Serious? OK. Midday outside the Cricketers on Richmond Green?
> 
> I'll be one of the few bad tempered, middle-aged Australian women on a Giant road bike there. Shouldn't be too hard to find.


Ok , no prob s


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## mjr (10 Feb 2017)

Drago said:


> Nothing will change.


Yeah, just like previous ones. I mean, Blackfriars Bridge is exactly the same as when we marched/cycled on it calling for its layout to change(!) 

Good luck and thanks to those who go. Sorry I won't be at this one.


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## Lonestar (11 Feb 2017)

Theres a lot of dangerous cycle lanes which are with the added (bonus?) of being dangerous for pedestrians as well.


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## Drago (11 Feb 2017)

mjr said:


> Yeah, just like previous ones. I mean, Blackfriars Bridge is exactly the same as when we marched/cycled on it calling for its layout to change(!)
> 
> Good luck and thanks to those who go. Sorry I won't be at this one.



Ah, i see. there's a problem with cyclists being killed outside the Treasury Department, and a 'die in' there will bring about much needed change?


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## mjr (11 Feb 2017)

There's a problem with the government not giving walking and cycling its fair share of the transport budget, which gives an ideal excuse to politicians who are happy to compromise infrastructure until it's arguably worse than nothing.

Cycling spend is not even proportionate to the current use, and nowhere near on track to meet the UN target of 20% by 2025. Campaigning has changed other things, so let's give it a go at this.


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## jefmcg (11 Feb 2017)

ozboz said:


> Ok , no prob s


It's snowing. 

Seriously reconsidering .....


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## steveindenmark (11 Feb 2017)

You cannot give this much credability, when the spokesperson drags out facts from thin air.

"Stop Killing Cyclists spokesperson Caspar Hughes said: “Air pollution is poisoning millions of people in the UK, whilst traffic carbon emissions are contributing to the climate emergency. Road danger means most people do not feel safe cycling on UK roads, which means they lack life-saving physical exercise.”

He added: “There is now an urgent health crisis which is costing the NHS billions. It is now crucial that our national cycling infrastructure gets its fair share of national infrastructure investment.”


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## jefmcg (11 Feb 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> You cannot give this much credability, when the spokesperson drags out facts from thin air.
> 
> "Stop Killing Cyclists spokesperson Caspar Hughes said: “Air pollution is poisoning millions of people in the UK, whilst traffic carbon emissions are contributing to the climate emergency. Road danger means most people do not feel safe cycling on UK roads, which means they lack life-saving physical exercise.”
> 
> He added: “There is now an urgent health crisis which is costing the NHS billions. It is now crucial that our national cycling infrastructure gets its fair share of national infrastructure investment.”


Which fact do you argue with?


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## jefmcg (11 Feb 2017)

Just preempting, because I am off for a ride.

https://www.rcplondon.ac.uk/projects/outputs/every-breath-we-take-lifelong-impact-air-pollution


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## mjr (11 Feb 2017)

User said:


> Yeah - I'd be interested in what facts @steveindenmark thinks are dragged from thin air...


You cannot give this much credibility when he quotes without saying where he's got it from... unless Caspar's popped over to Denmark for a chat?


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## steveindenmark (11 Feb 2017)

40,000 die each year but the millions it is damaging is speculation.

Life saving physical exercise? Most of the people I know do no physical exercise at all, but are perfectly fine. I am not doubting that physical activity can help your health. But I do doubt that if I stop exercising, that I will fall down dead.

Its just a bit sensationalist for my liking.


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## ozboz (11 Feb 2017)

Peddled up there today with @jefmcg , ( nice to meet you by the way ! ) there was an xlnt turnout despite the weather , we did the playing dead bit whilst observing the minute silence for the cyclist victims of road deaths, 
At the end of the day it was an awareness rally , so no harm done but maybe good comes from, it , plus got 20+ miles maybe on new roadie , and good workout for leg ,


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## mjr (11 Feb 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> Life saving physical exercise? Most of the people I know do no physical exercise at all, but are perfectly fine. I am not doubting that physical activity can help your health.


So those who do physical activity are more than perfect? 

Some of the numbers may be speculative... or as it's usually called: estimates.


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## Drago (11 Feb 2017)

User said:


> Stop trolling Drago...



Who's trolling me?


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## ozboz (11 Feb 2017)

Drago said:


> Who's trolling me?



No never , well maybe a little bit


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## Milkfloat (11 Feb 2017)

User said:


> Yeah - I'd be interested in what facts @steveindenmark thinks are dragged from thin air...



I would argue, in that there London, that the air is quite thick, not thin.


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## jefmcg (13 Feb 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> 40,000 die each year but the millions it is damaging is speculation.


London breached its legal limits for toxic air for the entire year in the first five days of 2017.

Millions live in London, and in those boroughs affected. The air is polluted almost every day. Millions are breathing in this poisonous air. I think that can be summarised to "poisoned" for a press release (or whatever you are quoting: you still haven't said)



> Life saving physical exercise? Most of the people I know do no physical exercise at all, but are perfectly fine. I am not doubting that physical activity can help your health. But I do doubt that if I stop exercising, that I will fall down dead.


Well, I certainly would put more credence in your anecdata than I do in almost every health authority in the world.
Physical inactivity a leading cause of disease and disability, warns WHO

Thanks for straightening me out on that.


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## steveindenmark (14 Feb 2017)

Jef. I am not straightening you out on anything. I am just expressing an opinion. Most of the people I know do not exercise and manage perfectly well. Thats all i was saying.

I just thought that "Life saving physical exercise" was guilding the lily, somewhat.


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## subaqua (14 Feb 2017)

User said:


> Oh dear... @steveindenmark has just been comprehensively pwned...



I have been taking a big interest in the figures. even on a Sunday the PM2.5 being measured , with the other nasties, put the figures into "unhealthy" . OK its factored number and I don't know the actual micrograms per metre cubed figure but thats horrendous .


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## jefmcg (14 Feb 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> Jef. I am not straightening you out on anything. I am just expressing an opinion. Most of the people I know do not exercise and manage perfectly well. Thats all i was saying.
> 
> I just thought that "Life saving physical exercise" was guilding the lily, somewhat.


You were accusing someone of being "sensationalist" when they were in fact reflecting the views of the WHO. 

Denying that people die of inactivity because the people around you are fine makes you seem like this guy.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E0a_60PMR8


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## bigjim (14 Feb 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Denying that people die of inactivity because the people around you are fine makes you seem like this guy.


I don't think Steve was saying that. He said people that don't exercise. Activity is a different thing. The people doing fine are probably active in their normal daily lives. My Gran lived well into her 90s. She ran a post office and was on her feet all day and still behind the counter in her 90s. My aunt was a Nun in Ireland, died peacefully at 95. Her duties were to cook and feed the homeless. Up at 5 every day to look after them plus all the singing and praying. Never stopped. Again still doing this in her 90s. But no exercise just got on with the day. You don't need to cycle or run etc. Hence cycling is not particularly life saving. Especially if you do an hour then sit on your arris for the rest of the day.


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## steveindenmark (15 Feb 2017)

Thanks Jim. That is exactly what I was saying. 

But I am sure Jef will find something to cut and paste that will prove us both wrong.


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## Milzy (15 Feb 2017)

bigjim said:


> jefmcg said:
> 
> 
> > Denying that people die of inactivity because the people around you are fine makes you seem like this guy.
> ...


I see the point you're trying to make but I believe if you do run/cycle regularly you'll have more resistance to heart disease and cancers etc than just having a busy day on your feet.
You can't win anyway if you drop lots of weight and have low body fat some knobber will say you should be a jockey.


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## bigjim (15 Feb 2017)

Milzy said:


> I see the point you're trying to make but I believe if you do run/cycle regularly you'll have more resistance to heart disease and cancers etc than just having a busy day on your feet.
> You can't win anyway if you drop lots of weight and have low body fat some knobber will say you should be a jockey.


I don't agree but it's our perogative. Much of good health is what you eat so a busy life with good food is an essential IMO. It's a fine line in so called exercise. Too much of it and you can have joint damage and a decreased immune system. Look at nature. It's usually the slow moving lanquid creatures that are long lived. Elephants, Tortoise, whales, Turtles. The frenetic ones, Big cats, Squirrels, Dogs, Flies. Don't last long.


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## theclaud (15 Feb 2017)

Big cats are not frenetic, either!


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## summerdays (15 Feb 2017)

User13710 said:


> That's very odd reasoning indeed. Think about it. Do you believe that if elephants speeded up they wouldn't live as long; or if squirrels slowed down they would live longer?


I don't know... there is something floating around in the back of my head about heart beats and animal size from doing biology at school though I'm sure 20 (cough) years later things have moved on from then. Not saying that an individual could change their heartbeat just something was linked?


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## psmiffy (15 Feb 2017)

A friend of mine never does any exercise - he believes that he has only got a finite number of heartbeats


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## davidphilips (15 Feb 2017)

read some where that the average life expectancy of a Spitfire pilot in the war was 4 weeks wonder with ever increasing conjested roads will there be a time when someone forecasts the average life expectancy of a commuter cyclist, lol hope if they do it will be 100 + years.


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## jefmcg (15 Feb 2017)

psmiffy said:


> A friend of mine never does any exercise - he believes that he has only got a finite number of heartbeats


There's an argument to that. Exercise reduces your resting heartbeat, so a fit person will have fewer heartbeats per year than an unfit one.


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## bigjim (15 Feb 2017)

User13710 said:


> That's very odd reasoning indeed. Think about it. Do you believe that if elephants speeded up they wouldn't live as long; or if squirrels slowed down they would live longer?


I don't think it's odd reasoning at all. Why would you say that? It's actually factual. The slow moving animals in general live longer. What is the longest living bird? The Albatross. The one that spends it's life floating on thermals rather than flapping like crazy. Think about it. Plus my cat is pretty frenetic when it wants to be. As I said, my opinion. Which I think I'm still entitled to last time I looked.


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## jefmcg (15 Feb 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> Thanks Jim. That is exactly what I was saying.


You questioned someone saying that exercise is lifesaving for the uk population on the basis that you know people who don't seem to need it. I also knew many lifelong smokers. None of them had lung cancer. That does not prove anything.

Oh, and stop calling me jef.


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## bigjim (15 Feb 2017)

User13710 said:


> Of course, you are entitled to believe anything yparrow lives loger than



I didn't say I believed anything. I said look at nature. You are coming across as a bit of a niusance. One of those forum lurkers/trolls just looking at picking an argument for the sake of it. Lots of your type about. Best to be ignored really as nothing positive to contribute.


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## Blue Hills (15 Feb 2017)

Drago said:


> Have the Treasury been out killing cyclists then?


fair point in a way.

And surely the Treasury doesn't decide where to spend money.

It's a policy matter.

It's the transport department, they should be targetting.


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## Blue Hills (16 Feb 2017)

User said:


> Actually, on a lot of things it does. Even though it may be the policy area of another department, the Treasury normally has to agree significant expenditure items - particularly capital expenditure.
> .


But it doesn't initiate the spending decision?


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## ozboz (17 Feb 2017)

Myself and @jefmcg were at the rally last Sunday , I came across this photo today on a London Cyling Site , you can see @jefmcg 
's red giant in the foreground and her legs !
Zoom in to the middle ground and theres me with my hi viz goalie jumper with a big #1 on my back !


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## jefmcg (17 Feb 2017)

Regretting my choice of socks


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## ozboz (18 Feb 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Regretting my choice of socks



Hahaha.


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