# Horrible scene, Greenhow Hill, Pateley Bridge



## ColinJ (15 May 2015)

I had been out to Harrogate today for my stepdaughter's graduation ceremony. Afterwards, she, her husband, her mum (my ex) and I went out for a celebration meal in Nidderdale. We were in good spirits after the meal and I suggested driving back by a scenic route. So, we were heading up the steep ascent out of Pateley Bridge on the way over to Grassington and I had just commented on how dodgy the descent was and that there had been many serious accidents involving cyclists there when suddenly the driver of a 4x4 towing a caravan ahead of us braked hard and stopped.

We pulled up and got out to see what the problem was and saw a cyclist lying unconscious in the road. He looked in a very bad way. I felt as though I had jinxed the poor man. 

A couple from another car ran over to him and were trying to decide what to do. The driver of the 4x4 was already on his phone to the emergency services. I went forward and the driver asked if I would take over the call while he tried to help the cyclist.

The man at the call centre was just trying to do his job, but I was getting frustrated with the delay that his questions were causing. I told him that it looked very serious but he insisted on trying to narrow down the exact location, asking for names of nearby buildings and so on. I told him to just get the emergency services on the way. It was on the B-road from Pateley Bridge to Grassington, about 1 mile up the hill. A quick look at an OS map would show exactly where that is - there would be no confusion from that description.

Anyway ... eventually a police car arrived and I passed the call over to one of the 2 police officers. The other joined the helpers who had got the victim in the recovery position.

Some people had gone up the hill to stop traffic coming down towards the scene. I went down the hill to explain to other stranded drivers what was happening and to try and keep the road clear for the ambulance when it arrived. I was just explaining to a young woman that an ambulance was on its way when it came tearing up the hill towards us, overtaking the stationary traffic. I motioned to her to pull forwards to the nearside verge but she panicked and instead reversed back out into the road, forcing the ambulance to stop. It was all very stressful ... 

Everything seemed to be taking forever, though it was probably only a few seconds delay here and there. We got her forwards out of the way and then the ambulance got through to the accident scene. 

I had already been thinking that it looked like the Yorkshire Air Ambulance might be needed when I heard it in the distance. It suddenly shot overhead and the pilot did a loop around the scene, trying to find a safe place to land. The terrain was not ideal, but he managed to put the chopper down in a field not too far from the victim.

At that point, one of the police officers came down the line of stationary vehicles, thanked us for our help and suggested that we all u-turned and head back down the hill to find alternative routes away since our help was no longer needed and we could not continue up the hill.

I am not 100% sure what happened, but I don't think a vehicle was involved. The incident took place on a very steep, tight, treacherous-looking bend so it might have been due to rider error, or it could have been caused by some problem with the road surface or with the bike.

I'm really hoping that the injuries were not as serious as they looked and that the rider makes a full recovery. If he does, I will try to contact him and explain to him what happened.

Strangely enough, I washed three bags worth of surplus clothes only yesterday and donated them to a Yorkshire Air Ambulance collection. I thought then what a great job it does and how we should all support such services.

Let's be careful out there, folks ...


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## classic33 (16 May 2015)

At least you helped out, there's many that wouldn't have done what you did.


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## outlash (16 May 2015)

Kudos Colin. When I was up there for the tour last year, I did that descent into Pateley Bridge and I hated it, I can easily see how people could get over-confident going down there. 

Tony.


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## Twinks (16 May 2015)

Sorry you had to encounter such a dreadful situation on an otherwise happy occasion. The Yorkshire Air Ambulance are fantastic, I saw them put down on the Snake Pass a couple of weeks ago when a motor cyclist had a serious accident, they actually put down on the road which is narrow and winding with a steep bank on the side, you wouldn't have thought there was room for the rotors, it was amazing. Also watched them come to the rescue of another motor cyclist on a narrow pass up in the Lake District. He looked in a very serious state and I suspect if he would have had to wait for an ambulance it would have been too late. Have done many sponsored horse rides to raise funds for them in the past, a very worthwhile cause but it's a shame that they should need charity funding. We none of us know when we might need their help.


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## Sara_H (16 May 2015)

Sounds very stressful indeed. 

Hope you're ok too. 

The Air ambulance does indeed do a fab job. Amazing that it's funded by charitable donations really.


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## Drago (16 May 2015)

Another point that might cheer you up. Most force call centres use one of two pieces of software to log calls. Once your name and very basic details are taken and they have his 'save' then the dispatch desk or control room can see the job as it emerged and allocate troops to it immediately while the call handler takes further details, such as trying to further tighten up on the locationnqith a house number or landmark. Further questioning might sound like dithering, but it does nothing to slow the response as that is independent of the call handler.

The more common software is actually the oldest, called STORM (no qualms mentioning it as it's well in the public domain) and can be really finniky when selecting a location and I'd bet Users charisma that's the software suite that was being used.

I hope you're ok. Sounds an unpleasant scene to come across.


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## ufkacbln (16 May 2015)

Good for you, it can be traumatic for the first aiders and bystanders. TAke time for yourself to put this event in order


Can I bring up a quick learning point, not to divert the thread, but to comment on the Ornance Survey and Emergency Services


For some bizarre reason the Ordnance Survey grid reference is no longer used by the Emergency Services - they need post codes for their responses, equally they no longer use Ordnance Survey maping

The software used does not recgnise this format. There was a big campaign a few years ago by the Ramblers, CTC and others, but as far as I am aware this is still the case

This is the reason why they have to locate by postcode or landmark


Note: See above, Drago posted similar as I was typing


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## Drago (16 May 2015)

We still use the OS system in SAR, and our mapping systems are a good tier above the dibble ones. Again, as with the selection of STORM itself, the address gazeteer is cheaper, and it's all well and good... until someone calls 999 from a middle of a field or 20 miles up an unclassified road.


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## young Ed (16 May 2015)

crikey! not good...
well done for stopping and helping out, i've only come across 2 or 3 accidents so far with all but one whilst i was on the bike and i have always stopped and made sure services are on their way and then checked the injured parties are in a stable condition and i check out wounds/injuries etc and try to slow any major blood flows if possible. then i keep a constant eye on the injured whilst i wait for proper services to arrive and once they've said they are happy to take over i leave them to it.

being partially first aid trained but also knowing what to do just from experience (although not an expert by any means) i hope i can help in some way shape or form
Cheers Ed


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## Drago (16 May 2015)

Got some Dsshcam footage of Young Ed...


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xMtR1ClBBPQ


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## ColinJ (16 May 2015)

It was horrible. I am trying not to think about the actual injuries, but after seeing at least 
4 other unconscious cyclists lying at the roadside on the Tour de Yorkshire sportive recently, this is starting to make me more nervous about cycling. Precisely why I do not normally come into this section of CC!

I have to say that most of the people at the scene were very helpful and/or patient. There was just one young driver who tried to overtake the long queue of stationary vehicles. I blocked his way and explained why I could not let him proceed. He just accepted it and went back down the hill.

Now that I have had time to think about it, I am sure that the emergency services were indeed despatched pretty quickly judging by when they arrived. It is just that everything seems to be happening so slowly in such a situation.

One or two of the people at the scene seemed to know what to do but I felt pretty out of my depth. I squeezed the cyclist's hand and told him that help was on its way but I am pretty sure that he would not have known what was happening. If the final outcome is really bad, then at least he didn't suffer. Stilll, bloody hell - what a terrible thing to happen on a lovely evening ride in the sunshine!


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## Twinks (16 May 2015)

ColinJ said:


> It was horrible. I am trying not to think about the actual injuries, but after seeing at least
> 4 other unconscious cyclists lying at the roadside on the Tour de Yorkshire sportive recently, this is starting to make me more nervous about cycling. Precisely why I do not normally come into this section of CC!



Try to keep it in perspective @ColinJ, it's a terrible, terrible thing to have happened and to have witnessed but how many hundreds of thousands of cyclists are out there on the roads every single day without incident. We can't take all the risks out of life without taking the pleasure out of it too. Try not to dwell on it and in time you will find it easier to find that perspective. Go easy on yourself. A trauma for all involved.


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## Mrs M (16 May 2015)

Well done to you for doing the right thing.
Sounds like you did a lot to help and very importantly kept calm during a very frightening, stressful experience for all concerned.
Just shows we really have no idea what's just around the corner.
Hope you are ok and that the man makes a good recovery.
Take care.


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## young Ed (16 May 2015)

rest assured @ColinJ that you did everything you could and couldn't have handled it better, many people would have panicked and run about like a headless chicken with out a clue what to do only making matters worse! even though there are many people that claim that they would keep calm and be fine in such a situation and blood doesn't affect them etc when actually plonked in the middle of it all in real life they turn out near on useless

hoping for a good strong, speedy recovery for the poor chap on the bike. hopefully it won't turn out to be the worst case. but either way i'm sure you made that tough moment just that bit easier for the poor chap even if he wasn't quite sure what was happening, the worst thing when you are the injured in such a case is to feel alone or ignored. the best thing is to have a brave person like you @ColinJ to comfort you 
Cheers Ed


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## ScotiaLass (16 May 2015)

Well done for helping out 
I hope it's not too traumatic for you...things like that do stay on your mind for a long time.
I'm glad you spoke to the cyclist even if you thought he couldn't hear you. Often patients recall hearing someone speak to them, so reassuring them in a calm manner can do more than you think.


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## ufkacbln (16 May 2015)

Any expert will tell you that your ability is compromised by the equipment and facilities that you have and that the idea of someone rushing to the scene and saving lives by performing heroic feats is restricted to Holby City and Casualty scripts

Most of us can use common sense to make someone feel better and more comfortable, and making sure that help is on its way



Reflect honestly on your actions and ask yourself these questions:

1. Was there anything I did that made the patient worse?
2. Was there anything I did that improved the patient's chances?
3. Overall were my actions beneficial

Preventing further injury, or the injury of others by controlling traffic and stopping that young driver , obtaining help and just being there are all positives, and I simply cannot see any negative aspect to your actions

.. and even if the worst outcome happens, the relatives will have the knowledge that their loved one was not alone on a bleak moor, but in the company of someone who cared, and you have no idea how important that small fact is


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## pawl (16 May 2015)

ColinJ said:


> It was horrible. I am trying not to think about the actual injuries, but after seeing at least
> 4 other unconscious cyclists lying at the roadside on the Tour de Yorkshire sportive recently, this is starting to make me more nervous about cycling. Precisely why I do not normally come into this section of CC!
> 
> I have to say that most of the people at the scene were very helpful and/or patient. There was just one young driver who tried to overtake the long queue of stationary vehicles. I blocked his way and explained why I could not let him proceed. He just accepted it and went back down the hill.
> ...


W


young Ed said:


> rest assured @ColinJ that you did everything you could and couldn't have handled it better, many people would have panicked and run about like a headless chicken with out a clue what to do only making matters worse! even though there are many people that claim that they would keep calm and be fine in such a situation and blood doesn't affect them etc when actually plonked in the middle of it all in real life they turn out near on useless
> 
> hoping for a good strong, speedy recovery for the poor chap on the bike. hopefully it won't turn out to be the worst case. but either way i'm sure you made that tough moment just that bit easier for the poor chap even if he wasn't quite sure what was happening, the worst thing when you are the injured in such a case is to feel alone or ignored. the best thing is to have a brave person like you @ColinJ to comfort you
> Cheers Ed





Sara_H said:


> Sounds very stressful indeed.
> 
> Hope you're ok too.
> 
> The Air ambulance does indeed do a fab job. Amazing that it's funded by charitable donations really.





ColinJ said:


> I had been out to Harrogate today for my stepdaughter's graduation ceremony. Afterwards, she, her husband, her mum (my ex) and I went out for a celebration meal in Nidderdale. We were in good spirits after the meal and I suggested driving back by a scenic route. So, we were heading up the steep ascent out of Pateley Bridge on the way over to Grassington and I had just commented on how dodgy the descent was and that there had been many serious accidents involving cyclists there when suddenly the driver of a 4x4 towing a caravan ahead of us braked hard and stopped.
> 
> We pulled up and got out to see what the problem was and saw a cyclist lying unconscious in the road. He looked in a very bad way. I felt as though I had jinxed the poor man.
> 
> ...


Well done Colin.


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## ColinJ (16 May 2015)

I was just searching for news. All I could find was a short report from North Yorkshire police saying that the cyclist had been taken to hospital with serious head injuries.

I found another report saying that a cyclist died after crashing into a tree on the descent in 2013. It is on the Way Of The Roses cycle route so a lot of cyclists will ride it. I checked the website for the route and it does warn about this descent ...



Way of the Roses website said:


> Unfortunately, going down Greenhow Hill has caught a few cyclists out and NYCC and Sustrans have produced a leaflet to let you know what lies in store. Have a look at this video too ...
> 
> 
> 
> Please don't underestimate this demanding hill and remember that descending in the wet can impair your braking.



I have a vague recollection that @vernon had a near miss on that descent a few years ago?


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## vernon (16 May 2015)

ColinJ said:


> I have a vague recollection that @vernon had a near miss on that descent a few years ago?



Yes i did 

I was braking from the hoods, hit a bump which transferred my weight forwards onto my wrists and the bars rotated forwards leaving me momentarily resting on the bars with my forearms. I managed to contort and regain a semblance of control and used a verge to scrub off the last few mph. 

I upgraded the brakes on my Galaxy to Froggleg CX callipers after that scare.

I had an extended rest in Pately Bridge to gather my wits.


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## CopperCyclist (16 May 2015)

ColinJ said:


> The man at the call centre was just trying to do his job, but I was getting frustrated with the delay that his questions were causing. I told him that it looked very serious but he insisted on trying to narrow down the exact location, asking for names of nearby buildings and so on. I told him to just get the emergency services on the way.



They probably work the same way ours do - as soon as they have even a general location, we are already on our way on blue lights, while they continue to ask question and question - so although it seems frustrating, it's not slowing down help getting to you


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## young Ed (16 May 2015)

Drago said:


> Got some Dsshcam footage of Young Ed...
> 
> 
> View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=xMtR1ClBBPQ



yep that's totally me! i'm not a skinny tall english lad in school clothes attending a serious accident (the opposite of peter griffin!)
Cheers Ed


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## Littgull (16 May 2015)

Colin 
A very traumatic incident as others have said. I think you were a terrific help and a comfort to the poor chap. The humanity and thoughtfulness in the posted replies brought me out in goose pimples. I would echo all the sentiments expressed.


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## glenn forger (16 May 2015)

Rider was lucky to have you there Colin. Good work fella.


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## Svendo (16 May 2015)

Sounds to me like you did a good job Colin. From my experience of being in the road awaiting an ambulance (albeit in different circumstances) the calm reassurance of someone telling help was on the way that was most welcome. And them letting me take the mickey out of them for being a MTBer! BTW he was Jim an off duty firefighter.


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## Arrowfoot (16 May 2015)

Well done Colin.

Was in a similar situation in trying to direct the ambulance. I too was online for quite sometime and it puzzled me with GPS, SatNav and all. I was later told that certain locations have issues with access and thus their attempt to keep the caller online until the ambulance finally arrives.

In the end, the Air Ambulance was involved and it was fantastic.There was a surgeon, a nurse and I was told they had the equipment to even do emergency open heart if they had to . I was impressed.


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## Drago (16 May 2015)

Gotta echo that. Despite being obviously upset and alarmed Colin did the humane thing and tried to bring comfort to a brother. That shows the quality of his character. Well done mate.


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## swansonj (16 May 2015)

Six years ago I called the ambulance for myself whilst lying at the side of the road with a broken femur (black ice + stupidity). In my not-entirely-at-my-best state, I gave the lady the wrong A road number - 245 instead of 246 or something. I then gave her a road name, which clearly didn't match on her system. Understandably, she wanted to be doubly sure she knew where I was and that I wasn't completely raving. So I ended up giving her every street name in the vicinity and describing my route there in detail -"you go through the traffic lights by the crematorium, then you go down the hill, then you come out of the trees...". Thank God for all emergency service personnel doing the job they are trained to do and doing it well, and for passing strangers like you Colin.


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## Pale Rider (16 May 2015)

I called 999 to what turned out to be a fatal accident involving a towed car and a toddler at a bus stop.

Not long after I started the call, the operator said: "Help is on its way," but continued to ask me questions.

I thought he meant someone else had already called it in, but he must have done what @CopperCyclist said above, despatched the police and ambulance before getting the full address from me.

The child was being attended to by others by the time I finished the call and wandered over.

Pleased about that because I wouldn't have fancied finding out how useless I would probably have been.

I recall seeing her bottom half which reminded me of a butcher's slab, lots of flesh but very little blood.

I also recall her breathing unevenly through her nose, almost snorting.

You didn't need to be a doctor to know she was in a bad way.

I decided to make myself useful by making sure the occupants of the car and towed car didn't attempt to flee the scene.

No worries there, the man in the towed car was making an odd keening sound and was walking around quickly in circles - reminded me of the 'headless chicken' description.

My suspicions he might leg it were raised by the nature of the area we were in, and the rough and ready nature of the towing rig - knackered old Fiesta on the end of an old piece of rope.

It turned out the man in the Fiesta was a known local n'er do well with convictions for car crime, petty thieving and the like.

The accident happened at a roundabout.

It looked to me as if he was being towed a bit too fast, and had probably driven over the rope as he cornered.

The car's lack of brakes and his lack of towing experience did the rest.


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## Hyslop (16 May 2015)

Well done Colin.


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## Fab Foodie (16 May 2015)

Drago said:


> Gotta echo that. Despite being obviously upset and alarmed Colin did the humane thing and tried to bring comfort to a brother. That shows the quality of his character. Well done mate.


This^^^^^
Well done Colin, not easy to keep a cool head and make a positive contribution to an unpleasant situation. I can't see that you could have done more. Good man.


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## Pat "5mph" (16 May 2015)

@ColinJ well done for keeping your cool, let's hope the poor cyclist recovers.


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## Ern1e (16 May 2015)

Well done Colin I think your actions where totaly correct imho, years ago I usedto work on a breakdown truck which at times had to go out to accidents involving vehicles so I know just how some of these look on arrival. This is one of those things you have to live with unfortunatly try not to dwell on the first sight you had and think about that at least you stopped one idiot from running into the people around the poor guy ! So again well done and hats of to you and at least it's good to know that some people still care enough to help their fellow men.


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## fimm (21 May 2015)

Well done Colin, hope you are OK.
Thank you for the information about how 999 calls work, Drago, Copper Cyclist.
The one 999 call I have made, my answer to "where are you?" was "on the island of Rum..." that was "fun" (not) trying to get the system to deal with that one... 

(This was some years ago. Someone had been taken ill, rather than an accident. Fortunately we were on the side of the island facing Mallaig, so we had good mobile phone reception! I eventually was called back by a nice policeman in Mallaig police station who did know where Rum was, and the coastguard helicopter was called in.)


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## darryll (26 Jun 2015)

ColinJ said:


> I had been out to Harrogate today for my stepdaughter's graduation ceremony. Afterwards, she, her husband, her mum (my ex) and I went out for a celebration meal in Nidderdale. We were in good spirits after the meal and I suggested driving back by a scenic route. So, we were heading up the steep ascent out of Pateley Bridge on the way over to Grassington and I had just commented on how dodgy the descent was and that there had been many serious accidents involving cyclists there when suddenly the driver of a 4x4 towing a caravan ahead of us braked hard and stopped.
> 
> We pulled up and got out to see what the problem was and saw a cyclist lying unconscious in the road. He looked in a very bad way. I felt as though I had jinxed the poor man.
> 
> ...


Hi Collin, I am personally envolved in an accident when I was biking on the 15th of May 2015. I was airlifted and admitted in the hospital following road traffic accident happened. I had no conciousness after the accident and lacerations from my lips, wound unto my head, fracture to my left clavicle, etc. and just recovering now from normalcy. I am just a starter bike rider bike with few groups from Harrogate, North Yorkshire. 

It seems your description above comes nearest to my situation and very glad if we can communicate further about this.( unless there are another accident during that day in the area) 

[Moderator note: personal details have been removed from this public post and sent to ColinJ by Personal Message]

Thank you.


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## ColinJ (26 Jun 2015)

darryll said:


> Hi Collin, I am personally envolved in an accident when I was biking on the 15th of May 2015. I was airlifted and admitted in the hospital following road traffic accident happened. I had no conciousness after the accident and lacerations from my lips, wound unto my head, fracture to my left clavicle, etc. and just recovering now from normalcy. I am just a starter bike rider bike with few groups from Harrogate, North Yorkshire.
> 
> It seems your description above comes nearest to my situation and very glad if we can communicate further about this.( unless there are another accident during that day in the area)
> 
> ...


Oh, wow - that's good news Darryll - I really feared that you might not have survived that horrible accident!

I am busy today and tomorrow, but I will contact you on Sunday if I have time.

I hope you make a good recovery from your injuries.


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## Soltydog (26 Jun 2015)

Glad your on the recovery path now @darryll & good news for @ColinJ too


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## ColinJ (12 Jul 2015)

I'm sorry, but I read some really tragic news this morning ... a cyclist was killed in what sounds like a very similar accident on the same bend on Friday afternoon - LINK.

I think it is time for a more strongly worded sign at the top of that hill. That's at least two dead cyclists and one dead driver in the past few years, and there may be more that I don't know about. On top of that, there have been horrible injuries, such as though suffered by Darryll.

Yes, it is ultimately the responsibility of each cyclist and driver to descend safely, but at least warn them "*PEOPLE DIE ON THIS HILL - SLOW DOWN!!!*"


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## Tynan (30 Jul 2015)

'was cycling with a friend' surely means not the accident you were at?

I've had some prangs over the years and when i was hurt or even unconcious, the smooth patter of the trained person was very very welcome in the moments or getting back to something vaguely close to with it again


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