# Back tyre for wet rock



## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

Could somebody please recommend one?

Preferably something discounted! It can have a wire (non-folding) bead because I never get punctures, not off-road, anyway.

Ta


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## Motozulu (21 Nov 2012)

I'd rather have the one for the front tbh  I can cope with me @rse end being all over the shop but last time I lost the front on wet rocks it was a hospital job 

You get time to recover a rear end - most front end losses end painfully though.


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## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

I take your point but it's worn out! Original one from 2004 when I bought the bike...


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## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

Problem is it's worn out! Not changing it for the sake of it...

Tho I have been guilty of that on occasion!


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## Motozulu (21 Nov 2012)

Just wet rock with mixed trail? I'd be interested myself in the answer to this as that is exactly what I'm riding at the moment.


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## MattHB (21 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> Could somebody please recommend one?
> 
> Preferably something discounted! It can have a wire (non-folding) bead because *I never get punctures*, not off-road, anyway.
> 
> Ta


 
shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh


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## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

MattHB said:


> shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh


 
_Superstition_ has 13 letters! More than a coincidence?





























(yes - _coincidence_ has 11... )


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## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

Motozulu said:


> Just wet rock with mixed trail? I'd be interested myself in the answer to this as that is exactly what I'm riding at the moment.


 
It's only wet rocks that need extra grip, I reckon. I can ride most other conditions with virtually anything.





Any _tyre_...


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## lulubel (21 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> It's only wet rocks that need extra grip, I reckon.


 
I suspect you'll find there is no tyre that will grip wet rock.


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## 3narf (21 Nov 2012)

lulubel said:


> I suspect you'll find there is no tyre that will grip wet rock.


 
Yes, I concur.

However: I suspect *SOME TYRES WILL BE BETTER THAN OTHERS.*

**


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## Motozulu (21 Nov 2012)

Possibly - but tbh I've trawled the forums on the same subject and got pretty much a different answer everytime - with some even rubbishing what another had recommended - therefore...good luck!


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## GrumpyGregry (21 Nov 2012)

what sort of rock?


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

*WET* rock. *WET* rock.


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## GrumpyGregry (22 Nov 2012)

Wet slate, wet shale, wet granite, wet sandstone, wet chalk, wet limestone, etc, etc.. all very different surfaces with different requirements from a tyre.

Me? I go for something with Black Chilli compound from Conti. My budget may be different to yours though.


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## black'n'yellow (22 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> Yes, I concur.
> 
> However: I suspect *SOME TYRES WILL BE BETTER THAN OTHERS.*


 
no they won't...


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## lulubel (22 Nov 2012)

GregCollins said:


> Me? I go for something with Black Chilli compound from Conti. My budget may be different to yours though.


 
Have my MK ProTection tyres got black chilli compound? They weren't much use the other day when it was drizzling and everything had a fine coating of water. (Not that I'm complaining because I don't expect tyres to grip on wet rock - my running shoes don't either - but I am curious.)


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

black'n'yellow said:


> no they won't...


 
Of course they will. Do you expect a slick city tyre to grip as well as a nobbly enduro tyre? If it does, we're all doomed.


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## black'n'yellow (22 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> Of course they will. Do you expect a slick city tyre to grip as well as a nobbly enduro tyre? If it does, we're all doomed.


 
On wet rock, you'll probably find that a 'slick city tyre' will have a better chance of sticking to wet rock than a knobbly - because there will be more rubber in contact. But it's irrelevant, because if the surface in question is slippery, then no tyre on the planet will give you grip on it.


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

I mean wet rocks, not a wet pavement. Of course a slick tyre (with grooves) grips better on a smooth, wet surface; otherwise we'd all have nobbly tyres on our road bikes.

As this is the *mountain biking* section, I assumed most people would understand that I was asking for advice relating to a wet, rocky, technical environment (ie my local trails). Patently, some compounds and tread patterns will be better than others in this situation.


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## Cycleops (22 Nov 2012)

On wet rock you're on a hiding to nothing!


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## MacB (22 Nov 2012)

Despite the OPs annoying habit of putting in lots of blank lines ahead of a weak punchline I rather think others are being a tad harsh here. It was a legitimate question and this thread has quickly become indicative of the sort of threads you find when you do a search for this type of information.

My 2 cents then Motozulu had it right and I'd aim for traction on the rear and grip on the front. B&Y is also correct in that nothing will grip well on wet rock and Greg is correct in assessing that the type of rock would make a difference as well. The smoother and shinier the less likely it will be to attain grip.

After that it's a case of shopping around and reading reviews, there are too many variables about riding style and terrain to overly rely on others recommends. It's a pain because few of us can afford to work our way through dozens of tyres to find the right combo. I'd spend the money on getting a front tyre that really does what I need and then go for cheap and cheerful on the back. Or at least I would if I wasn't so anal that the mismatching of the tyres would give me grief, so I end up spending the dosh at both ends


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

If I was going to avoid wet rock, there would be no point in me going out at all!


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## Cycleops (22 Nov 2012)

[quote="MacB, post: 2166498, 

My 2 cents then Motozulu had it right and I'd aim for traction on the rear and grip on the front. [/quote]



Aren't they the same thing?


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## GrumpyGregry (22 Nov 2012)

once we've figured out the definitive "what tyre for xxx conditions off-road" we can move on to the Arab-Israeli conflict.


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

The blank lines are me taking a deep breath. Avoids the frustration causing me to lose my sense of humour.

Can somebody please close this thread? Nobody here has any experience of riding in wet, rocky conditions.


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## Dan151 (22 Nov 2012)

Have a knobbly upfront then a less aggressive tire on the rear. Sometimes its not the tire its the style of riding that can make a difference. Try shifting your weight a bit and see if it makes a difference. Or go faster


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## GrumpyGregry (22 Nov 2012)

lulubel said:


> Have my MK ProTection tyres got black chilli compound? They weren't much use the other day when it was drizzling and everything had a fine coating of water. (Not that I'm complaining because I don't expect tyres to grip on wet rock - my running shoes don't either - but I am curious.)


Mountain King's II's are, by conti's own description, the swiss army knife of mtb tyres. Jack of all trades. Master of none? The tread pattern is not one that would be my first choice to use on slick wet rock, too knobbly, too sparse, even with black chilli.

For wet rock the nearer I can get to a slick tyre in a tacky compound the better. But rides aren't like that where I ride.

and I feel you can't judge a tyre from anyone until is is scrubbed in thoroughly.


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## GrumpyGregry (22 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> The blank lines are me taking a deep breath. Avoids the frustration causing me to lose my sense of humour.
> 
> Can somebody please close this thread? *Nobody here has any experience of riding in wet, rocky conditions*.


Want to bet on that?


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## Dan151 (22 Nov 2012)

GregCollins said:


> Want to bet on that?


 
The rocks I ride over, either on the DH course of the red trail at Hamsterley, must be fakes made out of plastic then


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## black'n'yellow (22 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> Nobody here has any experience of riding in wet, rocky conditions.


 
Speak for yourself. I have enough experience of riding on wet rocks to realise that no tyre will give you any grip on it.


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## 3narf (22 Nov 2012)

Dan151 said:


> The rocks I ride over, either on the DH course of the red trail at Hamsterley, must be fakes made out of plastic then


 
As happens so often on web forums, you miss the point.

You had the time to write a sarky comment, but you didn't have time to say what tyres you use and what your experiences of them were...


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## dan_bo (22 Nov 2012)

Something soft like a high roller?


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## Dan151 (22 Nov 2012)

3narf said:


> As happens so often on web forums, you miss the point.
> 
> You had the time to write a sarky comment, but you didn't have time to say what tyres you use and what your experiences of them were...


 
on wet rocks it really doesn't make a difference what tires you use but just so you sleep well tonight on my boardman ht pro i have conti mountain kings and on my V10 I run a maxxis high roller on the rear and a maxxis minion on the front.


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## MacB (22 Nov 2012)

Cycleops said:


> [quote="MacB, post: 2166498,
> 
> My 2 cents then Motozulu had it right and I'd aim for traction on the rear and grip on the front.


 
Aren't they the same thing?[/quote]

You're probably right but it's how I tend to think of it, not being an engineery type. What I was trying to say was that I'd go for whatever worked best for grip for me on the front and then something knobblier on the rear and accept the back may slide out more on rocks and roots.

At this point I should highlight that I ride offroad like such a wuss I've only gone down in slomo so far. I go slow enough that I'm generally able to pick a path around bits that I don't fancy. A decent MTBer would look at me and say my choice of tyres is immaterial as my riding doesn't require cutting edge performance....they might even throw in a line about how short a time it's been since I removed the stabilisers....I've had that one 4 times now from total strangers, or words to that effect


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## lulubel (22 Nov 2012)

It's a shame this thread has degenerated into mostly bickering because it's a relevant topic for most of us.



GregCollins said:


> Mountain King's II's are, by conti's own description, the swiss army knife of mtb tyres. Jack of all trades. Master of none? The tread pattern is not one that would be my first choose to use on slick wet rock, too knobbly, too sparse, even with black chilli.
> 
> For wet rock the nearer I can get to a slick tyre in a tacky compound the better. But rides aren't like that where I ride.
> 
> and I feel you can't judge a tyre from anyone until is is scrubbed in thoroughly.


 
I've found the MKs are pretty good in practically every condition I've come across, and I'm really pleased with the choice. They're even quicker than I expected on road, as long as they're pumped up reasonably hard, presumably because there are only 2 rows of "nobbles" making contact at a time.

I'd definitely agree that they don't work well on wet, smooth rock - the kind that's bedded into the ground - and I suspect the 32mm slicks I have on the Surly would give me more grip there. But since there's very little of that kind of rock on the trails I ride, I can live with it, and stay off the brakes/power and keep a straight line over it. The loose rock isn't much worse when wet than it is when dry, presumably because the tread on the tyres can settle in round it and "hold on" more easily.


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## GrumpyGregry (22 Nov 2012)

Dan151 said:


> *on wet rocks it really doesn't make a difference what tires you use* but just so you sleep well tonight on my boardman ht pro i have conti mountain kings and on my V10 I run a maxxis high roller on the rear and a maxxis minion on the front.


I can't agree. Whilst no tyres I've tried work supremely well on wet rocks some work better, noticeably better, markedly better, remarkably better, than others at, say, Nant Yr Arian.

Of course in real life, covering sensible distances outside the confines of the average trail centre you can be riding over a lot of different geology and your choice has to be a compromise. The last day of my autumn trans-cambrian I used mud tyres even though I had one stream bed style mountain side to ride down (it's wet 365 days a year, covered in slime and moss and is just bare rock otherwise). The descent was interesting but the rest of the day would have been miserable if I'd have gone for a tyre that suited that Welsh mountain side.

Ideally I'd say "Woman, meet me at grid reference such-and-such at 14:30 hours and make sure you have my spare wheels with you" but the lovely Helen would just give me a hard stare if I tried to pull that one....
























.... because she can't read maps.


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## Motozulu (23 Nov 2012)

Too many variables - someone could say..'fit these (insert tyre make here) I have never gone over on wet rock on these' but no two rock sections are the same are they? the one I split my knee open on is a gradual rock descent/steps that curves around with a 'wrong' camber towards the bottom and in the wet it mysteriously grows an instant, oily slime on it's surface. I could fit octopus arms around the wheels but if I take it too quick, distribute my weight wrongly or even look at the front brake lever I'm down.
Pick some tyres within your budget that you like the look of the tread on and ride the rocks accordingly, is my tuppence worth.


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## jonathanw (30 Nov 2012)

Bontrager Mud X's work for me on wet rock - most of the time !


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## MacB (30 Nov 2012)

jonathanw said:


> Bontrager Mud X's work for me on wet rock - most of the time !


 
I've seen enough recommends for these that I have them on my list of future purchases


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## Cubist (1 Dec 2012)

Bit of threadmining here, but earlier Greg asked what kind of rock, and it does make a difference. Local rock is millstone grit, and I can comfortably ride it on Schwalbes. Both bikes have Nic trailstar compound on them. I run tubeless to keep pressures low and grippier. I would hesitate to run a harder-wearing compound on any other type of rock. Cubester has Maxxix Minion DHF on his hooligan tool, 40A compound front, and claims never to be under-shod. 

Trails are rocky and wet at the moment, and although I wouldn't want to really rail a blashy rocky berm on anything, the Schwalbes have stood up to these sort of conditions pretty well. Here's some wet rock hardcore mincing :


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## 3narf (1 Dec 2012)

Useful reply- thanks.


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