# Isn't this the most beautiful bike ……. ever?



## Crankarm (4 Nov 2014)

http://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater-rohloff/

I'm going to have to go and lie down in a darkened room ……………… oh it is dark .


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## Brandane (4 Nov 2014)

Beautiful price too .


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## shouldbeinbed (4 Nov 2014)

Tis nice.


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## KneesUp (4 Nov 2014)

I do love the Stoater, but I am not convinced by the Rolhoff, and the belt drive even less. Fortunately there is one with proper gears too. It's a lovely thing, but I'm not sure it does much - apart from look nicer, weigh less and flex less - than my old hack.

I'd have one in a heartbeat


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## smokeysmoo (4 Nov 2014)

Nope! Disc brakes and sloping top tubes make me want to 

This on the other hand is a real contender  IMO anyway


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## TheCyclingRooster (4 Nov 2014)

Hi Crankarm. Beauty is very definitely in the eyes of the beholder - in this case it is you.
That is one hell of a lot of money for what appears to be a modified version of the Carrera Vituoso frame and loaded with alternative kit to that which most people would invest in.
I can see the belt drive system being fraught with issues from 'Road Crap' and almost certainly not a Winter steed.


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## screenman (4 Nov 2014)




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## young Ed (4 Nov 2014)

smokeysmoo said:


> Nope! Disc brakes and sloping top tubes make me want to
> 
> This on the other hand is a real contender  IMO anyway


now i DO like that!

as for OP, i don't like the aesthetics of belt drive and also i don't like the gear change i much, much prefer STI levers
Cheers Ed


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## smokeysmoo (4 Nov 2014)

screenman said:


> .


I've actually just been sick in my mouth


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## young Ed (4 Nov 2014)

screenman said:


>


nah, she looks too scary! 

on the other hand for the OP it is a nice frame and if i could have a new set of wheels and a ultegra or durace groupset to fit to it, then yes i do like it
Cheers Ed


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## young Ed (4 Nov 2014)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've actually just been sick in my mouth


looks like a triathalon or possibly but probably not a TT bike
Cheers Ed


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## screenman (4 Nov 2014)

smokeysmoo said:


> I've actually just been sick in my mouth



The same that Jackson is so in the past.

Just kidding every bike looks good to me, but I do like the aero look, by that I do not mean full of holes.


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## Crankarm (4 Nov 2014)

Brandane said:


> Beautiful price too .



There are limitless funds this afternoon.

Anyway you can't put a price on true beauty.

The clean lines and simplicity of the Stoater have a timeless beauty and quality; elegant without being vulgar.


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## Crankarm (4 Nov 2014)

I had a feeling that this thread would produce some strong opinions and emotions. Judging by the last few posts I think I was right.


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## screenman (4 Nov 2014)

young Ed said:


> nah, she looks too scary!
> 
> on the other hand for the OP it is a nice frame and if i could have a new set of wheels and a ultegra or durace groupset to fit to it, then yes i do like it
> Cheers Ed



Says the guy who wants to own a Land Rover.


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## TheDoctor (4 Nov 2014)

Nice looking bike, but not my cup of tea.


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## Cycleops (4 Nov 2014)

Nice in a simplistic sort of way. I understand the Rohloff hubs are the best but the Genesis with the Shimano Alfine hub would be a more affordable solution if you like that style, plus it's a grand a and a half less. http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/adventure/urban-cross/day-one-alfine-di2


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## derrick (4 Nov 2014)

Crankarm said:


> http://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater-rohloff/
> 
> I'm going to have to go and lie down in a darkened room ……………… oh it is dark .


NO.


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## PeteXXX (4 Nov 2014)

**MODS**

THIS THREAD CONTAINS BIKE PORN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## derrick (4 Nov 2014)

PeteXXX said:


> **MODS**
> 
> THIS THREAD CONTAINS BIKE PORN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


No it don't.


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## srw (4 Nov 2014)

victor said:


> I like the sloping top tube, because it creates a more relaxed, touring geometry, which is generally my preference. I share others' reservations about the belt drive, though.


Relaxed?! Crikey - I'd hate to see what you think of as aggressive. The riding position is arse-in-air - hopeless for anything other than fast riding. You need about two inches of steerer tube available so that you can adjust the height.


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## fossyant (4 Nov 2014)

My bike is better !


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## young Ed (4 Nov 2014)

screenman said:


> Says the guy who wants to will own a Land Rover.


whats that, is a land rover scarier, or is ultegra and durace too modern and hightec compared to a landy?
Cheers Ed


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## Fab Foodie (4 Nov 2014)

Cycleops said:


> Nice in a simplistic sort of way. I understand the Rohloff hubs are the best but the Genesis with the Shimano Alfine hub would be a more affordable solution if you like that style, plus it's a grand a and a half less. http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/adventure/urban-cross/day-one-alfine-di2
> 
> View attachment 60878


If I was commuting, that would be my weapon of choice ....


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## ianrauk (4 Nov 2014)

Not even close to *THIS* bike


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## Fab Foodie (4 Nov 2014)

Money no object?
Then for me the light Blue 953 custom on this page is the most beautiful bicycle I have ever seen. In the flesh it's stunning right down to it's Sterling Silver badge ....
http://www.bicycles-by-design.co.uk/gallery

To be honest I'd have large flange hubs tho'but ....


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## Soltydog (4 Nov 2014)

Crankarm said:


> http://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater-rohloff/
> 
> I'm going to have to go and lie down in a darkened room ……………… oh it is dark .


No mention of crank length in the geometry. Wonder if it's one size fits all, because that's my experience of belt drives & it isnt 175mm 
For me curly Hetchins is the ultimate bike porn 



Don't know what they are like to ride, but they look amazing


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## dan_bo (4 Nov 2014)

Stop fawning and buy it you tart.


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## Fab Foodie (4 Nov 2014)

ianrauk said:


> Not even close to *THIS* bike


Agreed.


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## Dirtyhanz (5 Nov 2014)

The nicest bikes I have seen lately are vanilla bikes 5 year waiting list I think a few years ago it would have all been Italian bikes but now the American builders are so good


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## biggs682 (5 Nov 2014)

smokeysmoo said:


> Nope! Disc brakes and sloping top tubes make me want to
> 
> This on the other hand is a real contender  IMO anyway



apart from the straight forks thats got to be close

but yes the shand does look nice


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## steveindenmark (5 Nov 2014)

How can it be? Its white.


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## Elybazza61 (5 Nov 2014)

Now I like this;







And It will be mine(well the frame anyway) today

Just got to work out how I can afford to kit it out now but at least I can take my time and get stuff as cheap as possible as it won't see any action until the spring.


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## Dogtrousers (5 Nov 2014)

Just from an aesthetic point of view, am I alone in finding STI style shifters monstrous? 

Now, seeing that the Shand has a (grotesque) gear changer separate from the brake levers, why does it still have huge hideous brake levers? There are no complex cable pulling cams and so forth to accomodate any more, so Why not some nice svelte aero levers? 

I wondered the same about Di2 when I saw it. Now it's all electronicified and miniature, why the ugly levers?


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## User169 (5 Nov 2014)

TheCyclingRooster said:


> I can see the belt drive system being fraught with issues from 'Road Crap' and almost certainly not a Winter steed.


 
Two of my colleagues use belt-drive bikes as all-year commuters. One is a Santos race bike set-up with Rohloff and the other a Trek single speed. Neither have had ever any issues with them and I don't think they need any maintenance other than the occasional wipe down.


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## Elybazza61 (5 Nov 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> Just from an aesthetic point of view, am I alone in finding STI style shifters monstrous?
> 
> Now, seeing that the Shand has a (grotesque) gear changer separate from the brake levers, why does it still have huge hideous brake levers? There are no complex cable pulling cams and so forth to accomodate any more, so Why not some nice svelte aero levers?
> 
> I wondered the same about Di2 when I saw it. Now it's all electronicified and miniature, why the ugly levers?



That Shand is shown with TRP hydraulics so all the fluid gubbins is in those levers.
Oh and apparently those belts can be a pain in the arse to maintain.


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## Dogtrousers (5 Nov 2014)

Elybazza61 said:


> That Shand is shown with TRP hydraulics so all the fluid gubbins is in those levers.
> .


Ah, I see.

They're still horrible though.


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## ianrauk (5 Nov 2014)

TheCyclingRooster said:


> I can see the belt drive system being fraught with issues from 'Road Crap' and almost certainly not a Winter steed.



A friend commutes on a Trek belt drive year round in all weathers for the past couple of years and hasn't had any trouble. It certainly can be a winter steed.


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## benb (5 Nov 2014)

Just for the paint job:


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## Bodhbh (5 Nov 2014)

I really like the bike from the OP, the looks and the fact you can do a bit of everything on it...but seriously, is that how you shift with a Rohloff on drops - with a grip shifter in the middle of the bars? I would rather stick with STIs.


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## Mrs M (5 Nov 2014)

Soltydog said:


> No mention of crank length in the geometry. Wonder if it's one size fits all, because that's my experience of belt drives & it isnt 175mm
> For me curly Hetchins is the ultimate bike porn
> 
> 
> ...


Nice, my young 83 year old neighbour had a Curly Hetchins in his youth, work of art.


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## srw (5 Nov 2014)

No. To all of the bikes in the thread. They're just bikes - tools for a job. To be beautiful, a bike has to be ridden. A bike without a rider is like a Giotto locked away in a safe - of no aesthetic value.


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## Fab Foodie (6 Nov 2014)

benb said:


> Just for the paint job:


I nearly put that as another fave! Fab rig!


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## Fab Foodie (6 Nov 2014)

Mrs M said:


> Nice, my young 83 year old neighbour had a Curly Hetchins in his youth, work of art.


Can't see what the fuss is about ... hate that curly stay stuff ....


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## slowmotion (6 Nov 2014)

Belt drives are designed for far higher belt speeds than anybody is going to get on a bike. Yes, Gates are one of the best manufacturers, but my guess is that the friction transmission losses are way, way higher than a conventional chain.

I think....


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## Crankarm (10 Nov 2014)

slowmotion said:


> Belt drives are designed for far higher belt speeds than anybody is going to get on a bike. Yes, Gates are one of the best manufacturers, but my guess is that the friction transmission losses are way, way higher than a conventional chain.
> 
> I think....



Dunno ……… but a chain needs to be kept and clean and lubed. A belt just needs to be kept clean. A chain with a full chain guard Pashley style would be good, but you can't do that on a road bike with deraillieur gearing, hence an IHG such as a Rohloff. Belt with a full cover would be good.

You haven't seen how fast I can pedal so belt drive would be ideal.


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## Hover Fly (28 Dec 2014)

Fab Foodie said:


> Can't see what the fuss is about ... hate that curly stay stuff ....


"like something off a fairground" as my father used to call them.


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## Hover Fly (28 Dec 2014)

slowmotion said:


> Belt drives are designed for far higher belt speeds than anybody is going to get on a bike. Yes, Gates are one of the best manufacturers, but my guess is that the friction transmission losses are way, way higher than a conventional chain.
> 
> I think....



Bute the belts used by Gates aren't normal flat or Vee belts but toothed belts, so less tension and a lot less friction. Moon Bunny has a belt-driven Woodrup, and it would tempt me, if I wasn't so attached to the bike I have now.


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## Drago (28 Dec 2014)

I've had a blast on a Trek Soho and it was a great, if expensive, bike. The belt drive didn't seem to bring any detriment, and a lot of benefits.


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## vernon (23 Jan 2015)

TheCyclingRooster said:


> I can see the belt drive system being fraught with issues from 'Road Crap' and almost certainly not a Winter steed.



Your anticipation of problems is ill founded. I've got a belt drive Rolhoff hubbed bike and retensioned the belt for the first time at 4,000 miles. It's coped with all weathers and road crud from metalled and unmetalled roads with no discernable wear. In fact the only maintainence that my bike has required in 4,500 miles is the replacement of a set of brake pads and replacement tyres plus an annual oil change of the hub gear oil - all in all half an hour's attention.


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## shadow master (23 Jan 2015)

Crankarm said:


> http://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater-rohloff/
> 
> I'm going to have to go and lie down in a darkened room ……………… oh it is dark .


No.


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## stevenshand (24 Jan 2015)

Elybazza61 said:


> Oh and apparently those belts can be a pain in the arse to maintain.



Not sure I'd agree with that. There's literally nothing to maintain. Assuming the bike is designed to use the belt (chanline very good, stiff enough rear end and reliable system for tensioning the belt) there should be no maintenance other than keeping it clean. I have to confess on my beltdrive commuter I haven't cleaned it since I built it up last April!


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## stevenshand (24 Jan 2015)

Soltydog said:


> No mention of crank length in the geometry. Wonder if it's one size fits all, because that's my experience of belt drives & it isnt 175mm



The crank arms are 170 on the x-small and small, 172.5 on the medium, 175 on large and x-large. And of course you can specify whichever size you need at time of order if that doesn't work for you.


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## ufkacbln (24 Jan 2015)

slowmotion said:


> Belt drives are designed for far higher belt speeds than anybody is going to get on a bike. Yes, Gates are one of the best manufacturers, but my guess is that the friction transmission losses are way, way higher than a conventional chain.
> 
> I think....



I have two Strida (Mk1) and the problem is the belt slipping if you try and pedal too hard


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## stevenshand (24 Jan 2015)

Cunobelin said:


> I have two Strida (Mk1) and the problem is the belt slipping if you try and pedal too hard



I suspect that the belt is incorrectly aligned or is too loose. Obviously that shouldn't happen. I ride a singlespeed beltdrive and a lot of my riding is in a relatively hilly area. That means a lot of out of the saddle grinding up hills and I have had not a single issue of belt slippage.


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## vernon (25 Jan 2015)

Cunobelin said:


> I have two Strida (Mk1) and the problem is the belt slipping if you try and pedal too hard



I think that the teeth on the belt of the Strida are a lot smaller than those on the Gates Belt Drive belt and are more likely to slip. Furthermore there's a snubber wheel which stops the belt from rising clear of the rear sprocket and slipping. Slipping simply does not happen even on the rare occasions that I am out of the seat of my fully laden belt drive tourer trying to overcome gravity on hills.


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## stevenshand (25 Jan 2015)

vernon said:


> I think that the teeth on the belt of the Strida are a lot smaller than those on the Gates Belt Drive belt and are more likely to slip.



Ah, I didn't realise the Strida wasn't using a Gates belt. Is it using the Continental belt?


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## Alan Frame (27 Jan 2015)

My personal favourite:


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## Ed Phelan (30 Jan 2015)

OP's bike is beautiful, very nice and simplistic look. It's just so pristine, I want to take it off road and ruin it completely.


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## vernon (3 Feb 2015)

Here's some nice lug work from my favourite bike builder


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## HorTs (4 Feb 2015)

The OP's link does look nice but I don't like the look of the fork - it looks unbalanced with the rest of the bike.


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## derrick (4 Feb 2015)

Crankarm said:


> http://www.shandcycles.com/bikes/stoater-rohloff/
> 
> I'm going to have to go and lie down in a darkened room ……………… oh it is dark .


Bit of a bodge with the gear changing.


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## Ed Phelan (5 Feb 2015)

vernon said:


> Here's some nice lug work from my favourite bike builder


Damn that's some beautiful work! I love the orange frame. Got a link to more of this stuff?


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## vernon (5 Feb 2015)

Ed Phelan said:


> Damn that's some beautiful work! I love the orange frame. Got a link to more of this stuff?



I certainly do: https://www.flickr.com/photos/woodrup_cycles/

And here's a further sample of the lug work. The 'S' is the maker's mark of Kevin Sayles the frame builder at Woodrup.


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## ianrauk (5 Feb 2015)

Stunning ^^


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## Gatters (5 Feb 2015)

Vernon you have an eye for quality


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## vernon (5 Feb 2015)

Gatters said:


> Vernon you have an eye for quality



My Woodrup is lugless apart from a false lug at the top of the seat tube with my initial cut out.





@Mice was smitten by it so much that she bought one for herself.


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## Gatters (6 Feb 2015)

Now that IS nice, mmm yes


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## Ed Phelan (10 Feb 2015)

vernon said:


> I certainly do: https://www.flickr.com/photos/woodrup_cycles/
> 
> And here's a further sample of the lug work. The 'S' is the maker's mark of Kevin Sayles the frame builder at Woodrup.
> 
> View attachment 79029



Thanks! This stuff is indeed gorgeous


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## simongt (18 Feb 2015)

That Stoater is a nifty looking piece of kit, even @ £3500ish. Not convinced by the Rolhoff though 'cos, yes it weighs no more that a dereilleur set, BUT all that weight is at one end, rather than being spread along the rear axle / bottom bracket line. But, it does say a lot for the carbon fibre belt drive eh - ?


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