# Loophole for insurers over E-bikes.



## Cycleops (20 Mar 2021)

This came up on my Google news feed. It could be your E-bike may not covered if it's stolen. Might be wort checking your policy.
https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money...-claim.html?ito=native_share_article-masthead


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## numbnuts (20 Mar 2021)

Yeah I read that couple of days ago, anything to get out of paying up


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

Thanks for posting Cycleops- will be checking our policy later today!


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

If they had read the policy documents, it clearly stated that motorised vehicles accept garden ones were not covered. It isn't a loophole.


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

It's clearly stated on page 264...


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

Archie_tect said:


> It's clearly stated on page 264...




Slight exaggeration there i think.


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

welsh dragon said:


> Slight exaggeration there i think.


Page 263?


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

Archie_tect said:


> Page 263?




That's better


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## figbat (20 Mar 2021)

welsh dragon said:


> If they had read the policy documents, it clearly stated that motorised vehicles accept garden ones were not covered. It isn't a loophole.
> 
> View attachment 579473


This is such a common theme. People failing to read T&Cs and then getting upset when they fall foul of the very T&Cs they agreed to. There’s a similar thing at the moment with Netflix, who are clamping down on account sharing across households. “It’s not FAIR!!!” opine the ignorati, yet there it is in the contract they agreed to.


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## Eric Olthwaite (20 Mar 2021)

I don't think it's a loophole. On the other hand, insurers must be aware of this as a growing issue, and it's a bit disappointing they don't seem to be taking the initiative of alerting their policy holders, and giving them the opportunity to pay a little bit more for ebike cover.


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

One of the T&Cs in our building contract documents was a requirement for site meetings to include bacon sandwiches and tea in the morning or a selection of fresh cream cakes and tea in the afternoon. That was rigorously enforced.


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

Eric Olthwaite said:


> I don't think it's a loophole. On the other hand, insurers must be aware of this as a growing issue, and it's a bit disappointing they don't seem to be taking the initiative of alerting their policy holders, and giving them the opportunity to pay a little bit more for ebike cover.




Is it the insurers to do that? That would set a prescident surely. It Is the policy holders duty to make sure they know what they are buying. After all when you buy a kettle its up to you to make sure it's suitable for your needs not the manufacturer or the seller.


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

People will soon walk away from insurers who try to enforce bad terms.


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

Archie_tect said:


> People will soon walk away from insurers who try to enforce bad terms.




Not bad terms. READ THE DOCS. Simple.

There are plenty of specialised insurers who insure Ebikes. I have one (that reminds me I have to renew it) that gives reasonable cover, liability insurance etc.


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## Cycleops (20 Mar 2021)

welsh dragon said:


> Not bad terms. READ THE DOCS. Simple.


Yeahbut how many do? Not trying to excuse those that don’t but it is a fact. If you have things which you not sure about you need to ask the question.


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## DCLane (20 Mar 2021)

My bikes in the bike storage are insured - for theft in and out of home - but only up to an agreed limit - I've read the t&C's and paid extra to alter bits. If they were all taken I'd lose a lot but it's more likely a thief would take the one(s) that are easiest and leave the bike's that are multi-locked. 

So I have a cheap unlocked one by the door just in case. 

However, to get to that they'd have to already gone through two locks and not been picked up by several security systems.


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## welsh dragon (20 Mar 2021)

Cycleops said:


> Yeahbut how many do? Not trying to excuse those that don’t but it is a fact. If you have things which you not sure about you need to ask the question.




Exactly. YOU need to ask. Don't assume.


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## ebikeerwidnes (20 Mar 2021)

I had this problem with Tesco Home Insurance several years ago - I was just renewing and rang to check a few things and just checked what locks etc were needed for the bikes - both are ebikes. The person on the other end of the phone was very helpful and immediatly said that ebikes are not covered - said it came up quite a bit and gave me the policy wording
It doesn't mention ebikes - just said bikes are covered as long as they are not motorised - which they interpreted as not including ebikes

So - a £1000 ebike is not covered but a £2000 road bike IS covered - that was a few years ago - it may have changed

so - nowadays I always ring up and specifically check - and make a note of the date and time of the call because it forms part of the contract if they ever get awkward in the event of a claim.

Just to be clear - this was Tesco - but things may have changed by now so it is worth checking!


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## dave r (20 Mar 2021)

DCLane said:


> My bikes in the bike storage are insured - for theft in and out of home - but only up to an agreed limit - I've read the t&C's and paid extra to alter bits. If they were all taken I'd lose a lot but it's more likely a thief would take the one(s) that are easiest and leave the bike's that are multi-locked.
> 
> So I have a cheap unlocked one by the door just in case.
> 
> However, to get to that they'd have to already gone through two locks and not been picked up by several security systems.



I like your thinking.


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## byegad (20 Mar 2021)

figbat said:


> This is such a common theme. People failing to read T&Cs and then getting upset when they fall foul of the very T&Cs they agreed to. There’s a similar thing at the moment with Netflix, who are clamping down on account sharing across households. “It’s not FAIR!!!” opine the ignorati, yet there it is in the contract they agreed to.


Yes, but!
Some years ago some geek with nothing productive to do looked at the agreements you sign up to with a new computer, microsoft, or apple, have one, as does every app and service you sign up for. It amounted, at a normal reading speed, several days worth of reading. Even if you have good comprehension of the technical terms. So nobody does it. 

Reading insurance policies, in detail, is not so arduous, but I'd bet 99.9% of people do not read every word.


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## classic33 (20 Mar 2021)

welsh dragon said:


> Is it the insurers to do that? That would set a prescident surely. It Is the policy holders duty to make sure they know what they are buying. After all when you buy a kettle its up to you to make sure it's suitable for your needs not the manufacturer or the seller.


But if you give make and model to the insurance company and the accept that, they'll have agreed to insure it.


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## Archie_tect (20 Mar 2021)

I always back up phone calls with an email- I don't rely on anything said on the phone.


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## CXRAndy (20 Mar 2021)

Id rather spend my money decent security at home and out n about


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## kynikos (20 Mar 2021)

Real world test:
Download and open policy schedule/product information - 45 seconds
Search for bicycle - 0 instances - 10 seconds
Search for bike - 0 instances - 10 seconds
Search for cycle - bingo - <10 instances - 3 minutes to read and digest what's covered:
Unlimited number with a max individual limit of £3,000. Worldwide cover for theft, loss or damage provided (blah blah re security).
(and includes electrically assisted pedal cycles that are not legally required
to pay Vehicle Excise Duty for road use).

So pretty clear and less than 5 minutes...


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## ebikeerwidnes (20 Mar 2021)

classic33 said:


> But if you give make and model to the insurance company and the accept that, they'll have agreed to insure it.


Maybe not - if I put my bike down as "Raleigh Motus" and then had to claim - they would probably try to say that that is not enough of a description and I had not made it clear it was an ebike - but their T&C does makes it clear that anything with a motor is not covered.
They will claim that it is my responsibility to check and not their problems to know every make and model of bike and to know which are ebikes

Although - of course - if I make the slightest mistake on the claim form or when I take out the policy then they will jump on it

You have to make sure they have no way out!


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## richtea (20 Mar 2021)

Here's what our Post Office Gold home insurance says (my emphasis):
_Bicycles - covers your bicycle(s) that are worth more than £1,000 against being lost, stolen or damaged *as long as the bike(s) are listed on your Policy summary*._

I specifically write 'electric' and the model for any avoidance of doubt, i.e.:
- Electric bicycle - Orbea Gain D50 + value

Their doc comes back with that exact wording. Bingo!


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