# Adding a window to a garage advice !?



## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

Morning all,

The Garage is no more. Long live the man cave 🤣

I’m thinking of adding a window for some more natural light. It would need to be installed to the left of the personnel door in picture 1 - between the door and the internal brick pillar: approx where the red tool boxes are currently. Both to catch the majority of the light - and the fact it’s not a fully free standing garage - due to half overlapping the house itself.







Just spoken to my neighbour - who’s a window / conservatory / patio door blah blah guy (And has replaced various stuff very well for me previously) and he’s suggested a 450mm wide, small double glazed window with top opening and frosted glass [Only one other house could possibly see in this window - but clear might look like a front room window: irrespective…..🤔]

And he’s also said he wouldn’t think I’d need / to apply for planning permission: just whack a lintel in above and ‘slap it in’.

I’ve had a measure up and it would end up being positioned approx where I’ve deftly 😂 overlayed said new window on second picture.






Having never done such a task - any thoughts, advice or suggestions welcomed on any of the above 🙏

Ta.


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## I like Skol (2 Jan 2023)

A couple of points;


Re: planning permission. Ask your local council BEFORE doing anything. They may well ask a few questions then agree no official application is required. If so get it in writing, either a confirmation letter or copies of emails etc and keep them. Much easier this way when Mr & Mrs awkward new neighbour from 3 doors up start trying to cause trouble in a year or two!
Security. You are adding an additional entry point to your bike store, are you sure you want to do this?
Effectiveness. A small window where you suggest will give limited additional light and ventilation. It might be possible and more effective to install 1 or more Velux type roof windows if this is an option? Lots more light and ventilation on a hot day, but probably more expensive to install?
EDIT: With the roof windows you may find you hardly ever need to put the lights on except at night time.


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## ebikeerwidnes (2 Jan 2023)

As far as planning permission is concerned - bear in mind that, if you ever decide to sell the house (or your children do after you .....) then having that letter can help
Many years ago I was selling my first house and the 'lady' trying to buy it wanted every i dotted and every t crossed - and wanted to define the exact colour they were dotted and crossed in

WHole thing fell through when I 'failed' to get a recepit for a sewer repair because it was a whole area type sewer and was the responsibility of the water company - hence not receipt

If we had had the slightest alteration to anything she would have wanted details of the planning permission signed by Jesus and initialled by Moses

If you get one of that type then the more documentation the better - so getting a probably useless letter to confirm things can help a lot later on


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## numbnuts (2 Jan 2023)

I like the roof window idea ^^^


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

@I like Skol

Firstly; Thankyou very much for plenty to chew on. In the first instance I’ve taken a quick video of proposed window position and outlook to send to Council and seek their opinion. Might turn out to be not only sound advice. But very much a deciding factor depending on what it potentially then turns into…..

Secondly. This is certainly not a forever home. We’re over spaced: but Mortgage free and soon as last sprog finishes Uni - will be looking to downsize and free up capital for retirement. So the idea of the ‘cheap’ window was for 85% light / nicer feel in there while messing around. And 15% in the hope of some extra airflow. (Will expand on this shortly).

Whilst a roof window is a better idea for sure. The cost will unlikely increase value of house and the benefits won’t be gained by me for too long…..(?)

On the extra light issue [And the fact a roof window may negate needing any electrically powered lights at times in summer]: i today have installed two small vents in the garage door to aid airflow. Aside from whether they work or not the extra light from two tiny vents is amazing.
So to some degree I do wonder if the small proposed window will provide further ‘amazement’. Especially as the window will face the sun for a large portion of the day….











The garage isn’t free standing. *See pics in original post and above. And the exposed parts are single skin. I’m pretty sure the garage is being insulated and kept warm when the outside is then colder. Because of its location - I also feel it’s quite stagnant in terms of wind directed at it. And that’s where the moisture stems from…..

So the vents added today [Placed high to provide weather protection from outside overhang and to be placed above the car that’s normal parked infront of garage on driveway], having an air brick or two fitted; along with ***a small openable window - were aimed at the light improvement - and 20% at helping or hopefully eradicating the minor condensation I do suffer at very cold times.

Is that logical in itself Ref air movement ?

To be honest the condensation issue is very minor. And very infrequent. Literally less than a handful of times a year at very low level / floor only - that soon clears. It’s gaining an amount of cheap light that’s primary. My window guy can supply and fit cheaply. And we’re CE1090 / Structural Steel supply accredited at my Engineering based work. So any lintel would be cost free. And backed up by correct paperwork.

Thoughts ongoing still welcomed 😎


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## MichaelW2 (2 Jan 2023)

Consider a long, narrow window, high up. It frees up space for storage, prevents theft by fat bastards .


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

ebikeerwidnes said:


> As far as planning permission is concerned - bear in mind that, if you ever decide to sell the house (or your children do after you .....) then having that letter can help
> Many years ago I was selling my first house and the 'lady' trying to buy it wanted every i dotted and every t crossed - and wanted to define the exact colour they were dotted and crossed in
> 
> WHole thing fell through when I 'failed' to get a recepit for a sewer repair because it was a whole area type sewer and was the responsibility of the water company - hence not receipt
> ...



Thankyou.

Point taken on this - and as my last post: I’m on it !


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

MichaelW2 said:


> Consider a long, narrow window, high up. It frees up space for storage, prevents theft by fat bastards .



Garage is alarmed and on CCTV. We’ve had no trouble in 20 years. But I’d think if someone was going to come in - it would be from front / garage door - not around the back and smashing / coming through a 450mm small window. 

Small / narrow was my thoughts too though 👍


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## PaulSB (2 Jan 2023)

I can't comment on the practicalities, planning etc. but will ask a question. Have you considered the aesthetics? To me if the tiny window you've illustrated is to scale it looks all wrong. My reaction as a possible buyer would be "why on earth did someone put a window in there?"

Roof windows would probably give much better light and better aesthetics. I think what you're proposing detracts from the property and probably won't give much benefit.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

PaulSB said:


> I can't comment on the practicalities, planning etc. but will ask a question. Have you considered the aesthetics? To me if the tiny window you've illustrated is to scale it looks all wrong. My reaction as a possible buyer would be "why on earth did someone put a window in there?"
> 
> Roof windows would probably give much better light and better aesthetics. I think what you're proposing detracts from the property and probably won't give much benefit.



Size is a hard one. Doesn’t want to look like a slit in a castle to fire arrows out of. On the other hand I’m not sure I want / it would look right; being the size of a front room window. Despite the space being there…

And I agree somewhat on potential ‘looks’. But as earlier reasonings - a dormer isn’t happening. So perhaps I do nothing and leave as is 🤷‍♂️

***Being on my phone / without having a clue how to properly project a window on my photo didn’t help I’m sure. Height would be more like this. And size wise: this as a minimum, or slightly wider….

Thanks for your thoughts. Valid. And good to hear it from others points of view…..👍


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## Jameshow (2 Jan 2023)

If you window guy is decent he will be fensa registered so can fit it for you without building control needing to be involved. 

I would go larger too say 900hx600w


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

Jameshow said:


> If you window guy is decent he will be fensa registered so can fit it for you without building control needing to be involved.
> 
> I would go larger too say 900hx600w



Interesting. Great info - and duly noted Thankyou.

My guy opposite is the owner. Of a long standing and very busy company. Be amazed if he wasn’t registered in that case: because I know he gets involved in all sorts of alterations - but he never offered up he was….!

I’ll somehow mock up a frame of your suggested size and see what I think. Bigger initially worried me. But I’m guessing frosted glass will help make it look like it’s a garage - and not part of the house 😳 Afraid I’m not great at visualising stuff like this….

Cheers for your thoughts 🙏


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## Gwylan (2 Jan 2023)

Interesting. We've had humidity problems recently. 
I'll nick the air vents idea.

What about a couple of courses of those glass bricks? Gets the light in and a couple of vented bricks would do the job.


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## MontyVeda (2 Jan 2023)

I'd be using the top and bottom of the back window to define the height... and how about two? 




Twice the price, twice the light, not as clumpy looking as one big window or as out of place as a smaller odd sized window.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

Gwylan said:


> Interesting. We've had humidity problems recently.
> I'll nick the air vents idea.
> 
> What about a couple of courses of those glass bricks? Gets the light in and a couple of vented bricks would do the job.



Sorry. Perhaps I used the wrong term. I think your humidity is likely better than my condensation 👍

Although louvres are ideally running the wrong way to have them forming a hood / by running horizontally: I was a little hampered by the vertical ridges in the door.

So they effectively went on 90 degrees turned, but up high to get the weather protection from the roof overhang.

Each Louvre I did by buying a plain louvred section for the outside. And a matching size slotted / vent closure for the inside.

Good luck !

Outside:





Inside:





Inside - close up:


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

MontyVeda said:


> I'd be using the top and bottom of the back window to define the height... and how about two?
> 
> View attachment 673133
> 
> ...



Holy Hellfire: I could grow Tomatoes in there come Summer 😂

Seriously: thanks for the time taken for that. Another idea in the mix. For better or worse 😎


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## Time Waster (2 Jan 2023)

Our garage has a wide and low window maybe starting 500mm from the ceiling in the garage. It is perhaps as wide as a original mini. It let's in light quite nicely but the garage is 19ft long so half is still dark and we need to keep the door open and light on to see at the far end. 

In your case you might not be able to have a wide window due to the structural pillar, but imho a wider window than a tall/ narrow window might offer better light and ventilation if possible. Even two smaller such windows might give a better light and ventilation effect.


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## TissoT (2 Jan 2023)

A lintel will be required in/outer skin.

Either: Angle iron or a 14mm flat bar depending on the size of the window 

Building Regs will definably be required unless you proceed without.


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## glasgowcyclist (2 Jan 2023)

sevenfourate said:


> I’ll somehow mock up a frame of your suggested size



You could save materials and effort by using broad masking tape if it’s just to get a visual estimate of how it would look.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

glasgowcyclist said:


> You could save materials and effort by using broad masking tape if it’s just to get a visual estimate of how it would look.



Ta ! 

Got some seriously sticky silver duct tape here ? That should stick long enough on an even cold / damp wall to get an idea I’d imagine 👍


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## chris667 (2 Jan 2023)

Apologies if this is obvious, but how about replacing the garage door with a UPVC door and window?

You'd probably need planning permission BUT I reckon a house with a self-contained home office is more useful than a house with a garage almost no modern cars fit in, especially if you're in a place where Londoners are looking to relocate to work from home. Cars are all fat these days - Range Rovers look like Austin Maestros on steroids.


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## fossyant (2 Jan 2023)

All I'll say, is windows add a theft break in point. I've a door and a window on the side of the garage, and they are barred and bolted shut.

As for humidity/damp, mine was really bad after the cold snap, everything was sweatting as it warmed up, so the old dehumidifier was switched on. Ours is detatched with plenty of ventilation - I don't bother heating it.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

chris667 said:


> Apologies if this is obvious, but how about replacing the garage door with a UPVC door and window?
> 
> You'd probably need planning permission BUT I reckon a house with a self-contained home office is more useful than a house with a garage almost no modern cars fit in, especially if you're in a place where Londoners are looking to relocate to work from home. Cars are all fat these days - Range Rovers look like Austin Maestros on steroids.



Agree on cars have grown but garages haven’t ! If I was a bit brighter I’d have bought somewhere with a double garage 🤦‍♂️ 

I’m not quite with you though….

Bricking it in you mean. Id certainly be ‘committed’ then ! A UPVC personnel sized single door, double opening doors or ?

Although no car in the garage these days. I would like easy access for push-bikes. And of course the pictured but covered motorbike….

Cheers.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

fossyant said:


> All I'll say, is windows add a theft break in point. I've a door and a window on the side of the garage, and they are barred and bolted shut.
> 
> As for humidity/damp, mine was really bad after the cold snap, everything was sweatting as it warmed up, so the old dehumidifier was switched on. Ours is detatched with plenty of ventilation - I don't bother heating it.



Mmmmmm. Personnel door is a new 5 latch UPVC frame / door affair. Garage is alarmed and on CCTV. Main up and over has additional locking security. 

I could easily make an internally (?) fitted window-bar grille at work for any additional window. 

Not sure any of that would make a blind bit of difference to a determined thief. Might deter an opportunist ?

Tell me about your dehumidifier ? Is it good ? How efficient / costly to run. Or negligible for its limited use ?


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## chris667 (2 Jan 2023)

How about something along these lines? Photo chosen at random - you could of course have whatever combination you like and certainly not the fake stained glass. Lots of room for a motorbike with the right door, and better security as a nice bonus.
EDIT - re: condensation - this is going to be a problem in any bit of the house you don't heat (you insulate the door to the garage, don't you?). If I was choosing doors for your application in my space, I'd have a stable door for working in nice weather and vents front and back for bad weather. Or if I was wanting to be comfy all year round I'd insulate it properly and heat it with the house.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

@Jameshow - for your reference. I just text my window man. This in reply:


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

chris667 said:


> How about something along these lines? Photo chosen at random - you could of course have whatever combination you like and certainly not the fake stained glass. Lots of room for a motorbike with the right door, and better security as a nice bonus.



Liking the doorbell to let me know the food wifey has knocked up for the ‘workers’ is ready for collection 🤣 I’ll put it to her….

Yup. Yet another avenue to consider. Ta 😎


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## fossyant (2 Jan 2023)

sevenfourate said:


> Mmmmmm. Personnel door is a new 5 latch UPVC frame / door affair. Garage is alarmed and on CCTV. Main up and over has additional locking security.
> 
> I could easily make an internally (?) fitted window-bar grille at work for any additional window.
> 
> ...



We've got three dehumidifiers actually, by chance. The one in the garage was a screw fix one from many years ago - it uses about 200w - so 5 hours will cost 32p, around £1.20 a day if on all the time. Our others have a timer. It runs until the tank fills. Our others do also have a drain that you could run out under the garage door, but it doesn't need running all the time - I may forget to empty it and it can be off for a few days. They do fill up quickly. This one can't be adjusted below 60% humidity, which is fine (someone borrowed it and it came back with only on and off working, so no adjustment or timer). That's fine for controlling the garage, as it was in the 80's after the cold snap. Only use it a few days a week.

The newer one is for drying washing in the house.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

Thankyou very much @fossyant.

I’d did half heartedly / blindly look a while ago. Will have to look again now. 

Something mounted main door end with an outlet to pipe outside: and straight into the gulley drain infront of same door sounds ideal. And will require no thought from me 👍


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## SpokeyDokey (2 Jan 2023)

Left field thought - leave your money in the bank. It's not your forever home and I can't see a window adding any value to your house.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Left field thought - leave your money in the bank. It's not your forever home and I can't see a window adding any value to your house.



Great train of thought.

For not much money spent on a window - the enjoyment / quality gained with the time I spend in there can’t be measured though. ***Could be here a couple of years. But that alone doesn’t justify ‘thousands’ on a roof window imo. Few hundred on a window does….


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## Time Waster (2 Jan 2023)

There's a few types dehumidifiers. I think the desiccant based ones are not as efficient as the other main type. You can get very efficient ones nowadays that are like high efficiency led bulbs for electricity usage. Tanks can fill quickly initially and can be a PITA to pull out without sloshing water everywhere. Getting one with a drain is a good call. 

They can also provide a little bit of heat too. That's why they're a good call for drying clothes indoors. Ours is 15 plus years old donated from relatives. We may get a new one shortly since they're got a lot better since ours was made. All energy reduction helps right?


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## Mike_P (2 Jan 2023)

The desiccant dehumidifiers are for unheated buildings. Refrigerant dehumidifiers should be used where the temperature is at least 10 degrees centigrade. Have a desiccant in the metal bike shed.


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## sevenfourate (2 Jan 2023)

Mike_P said:


> The desiccant dehumidifiers are for unheated buildings. Refrigerant dehumidifiers should be used where the temperature is at least 10 degrees centigrade. Have a desiccant in the metal bike shed.



Fab info. Desiccant should be what I’m searching for them. Great 👍


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## fossyant (2 Jan 2023)

sevenfourate said:


> Thankyou very much @fossyant.
> 
> I’d did half heartedly / blindly look a while ago. Will have to look again now.
> 
> Something mounted main door end with an outlet to pipe outside: and straight into the gulley drain infront of same door sounds ideal. And will require no thought from me 👍



Only requires a small pipe, but I doubt you'd need to run it 24/7 (and would be costly). I'd suggest runnng it a 2/3 nights a week to keep any damp down, then just empty the container. I wasn't going to bother this year, but when the bikes, tools etc were dripping with the sudden change from minus 8 to plus 10, it soon clearer the moisture. Shouldn't need to be run when it's cold out, but best done when it's damp.


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## Jameshow (2 Jan 2023)

TissoT said:


> A lintel will be required in/outer skin.
> 
> Either: Angle iron or a 14mm flat bar depending on the size of the window
> 
> Building Regs will definably be required unless you proceed without.



Does fensa cover alterations as well as like for like windows. 

We had a window in our study replaced It was narrow and deep and went below desk level which was a pain so we had it modified to be wider and not as low.


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## TissoT (3 Jan 2023)

Jameshow said:


> Does fensa cover alterations as well as like for like windows.
> 
> We had a window in our study replaced It was narrow and deep and went below desk level which was a pain so we had it modified to be wider and not as low.



Fensa will cover if a window is taken out and replaced in the existing opening
So effectively Fitting of a Replacement frame/glazing of a new window.


Fensa wouldn't cover the Alteration work ie removing brickwork or adding lintel support.

The window company calls a building company to carry out the alteration work

I have a building company and often asked for window/patio door supports/Lintels Fitting etc.


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