# Wtf........ put weight on?



## Mark82 (8 Aug 2010)

Well before I started my regime (lol) I weighed myself 1 week on I put on a stone???? I have been eating all the right things and none stop cycling, how the hell has that happened....?? Weighed myself same spot same scales.... New scales needed maybe?


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## Garz (8 Aug 2010)

Scales can sometimes be inaccurate however only by say 1-2lbs. Have you been eating sensibly or just stuffing your face like I do sometimes after a ride when I'm starving?

I put some weight back on recently due to incorporating 5-a-side football once weekly and letting the diet slip a bit. My fitness levels are the same but the football and sprinting have edged some muscle on and this weighs more than water/fat.

Would also be handy knowing your leg dimensions before your regime as you may have beefed up the legs since..


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## Mark82 (8 Aug 2010)

My diet has never been better tbh eating properly not over eating no matter how tempting, obviously more fluids but only when needed and only when on rides? .? As for leg measurement wound I measure just the calves and thighs? And would I measure relax or tense????


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## carpiste (9 Aug 2010)

I just started on the diet/training.First 2 weeks I lost 14 lbs,and was well chuffed.Just weighed myself tonight and this week only lost 1lb !
Eating well,no different to previous 2 weeks so I guess im building up muscle with the cycling,which is getting easier 
Maybe I just need to go up a level with the cycling?


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

A pound would be quite acceptable because of you building muscle as well as losing fat.... but to put on a stone, by doing everything right.????? Something's not right?


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## jimboalee (9 Aug 2010)

I will lay odds you have looked on the internet and found a kCals/hour value for cycling. I will lay more odds that you have indulged in that number of calories.



Those websites only serve to keep people going back to Weightwatchers, Slimmers' World, Rosemary Conman and all the other 'pay through the nose' reducing classes.



How far do you ride? Do you ride a 100 km Audax every day? If you don't ride as far as this, you only need to eat about a quarter of the published number on top of your Basal Metabolic Rate.



If you are only riding for about two hours each day, there is no real need to eat anything extra.


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## slugonabike (9 Aug 2010)

Even if you had been stuffing your face every day, a full stone is still pretty extreme in a week! I think you might be correct in wondering whether your scales are knackered.


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

yes I'm sure, not seen any cal guide lines or cycling charts for cals I cut all the shoot out my diet and eating as per a diet plan set by my doc to the letter so there's no over eating what so ever.... ? Scales really must be wrong


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## screenman (9 Aug 2010)

Blimey you must have eat 49,000 calories more than you needed. Muscle takes a long time to build up to any significant weight gain I would have thought.


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## phil_hg_uk (9 Aug 2010)

I assume you got off your bike before you got onto the scales


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## walker (9 Aug 2010)

Although gaining a stone is excessive your weight gain is down to your training. your body is now storing more calories and water to supply when your exercising. this is normal and will flatten out later down the line. this is stored in the muscles and with the gain in muscle it all adds up, but we are only looking at around 5-7lb. but everybody is different and can be affected in different ways. 
My advice is to have a 1-2 day rest tehn get back on the bike.


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## Rob3rt (9 Aug 2010)

carpiste said:


> I just started on the diet/training.First 2 weeks I lost 14 lbs,and was well chuffed.Just weighed myself tonight and this week only lost 1lb !
> Eating well,no different to previous 2 weeks so I guess im building up muscle with the cycling,which is getting easier
> Maybe I just need to go up a level with the cycling?



If you lost 14 lbs in 2 weeks, something is wrong! Thats not sustainable, 7lbs a week is ridiculous weight loss, have you been weighing yourself at the same time of day, i.e. preferably in the morning, naked after going to the toilet? Even if you are a big guy you shouldnt be dropping 7lbs in a week. Which you have probly come to realise since you can only just shift 1lb a week (which is a normal amount of weightloss, 1-2lbs is acceptable). Unless you are pretty much in trim then muscle gain should hardly dent weight loss figures, muscle takes longer to build than fat does to burn. 

To put this in context, I've been cycling and running about 5 months seriously, lost over 2 stone, and my muscle mass has hardly increased at all (definintion has obviously improved, but actual measurements of thigh size etc, actually have decreased slightly due to fat loss), yet I'm a pretty strong cyclist for a non-racing type.


Maybe Jimbo can be arsed to explain the numbers for you here since he seems to enjoy doing that, sadly I really cant be bothered because there are so many guides, studies, books etc out there already, you need to do some reading though by the sounds of it.


Good Luck with your weight loss.


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## alecstilleyedye (9 Aug 2010)

an even simpler solution: ditch the scales and keep with the exercise and healthy eating.

judge 'weight loss' by how your clothes fit. shirts that feel baggier and needing a belt for a pair of trousers that previously fitted well without are indicators that things are going the right way.

as jimbo said, beware of any device that tells you how many calories you've burned; they rely on speed/distance with weight factored in, but don't take account of the route (up/down hill) or if the ride was a breeze for a fit individual that barely broke sweat or a real challenge for someone who's pretty unfit. 

even between devices, there's too much variance. i've known differences of 200kcal from the same ride with different devices (bike comp and gps tracker).


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

That's just it even in a week I had to tighten my belt an extra hole.. lol... so something not right, as for getting off my bike before weighing myself... lol good one :-) as for the process of weighting, first thing in the morning, b@ll@ck naked, dump piss even brush my teeth first.. lol so I do the same every time I weigh myself.. maybe I should ditch the scales and get the docs to do it once a month?


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## Rob3rt (9 Aug 2010)

Wouldnt waste a GP's time to get weighed. Buy a set of new scales from argos if yours are sketchy, put them in the same place every time you use them (on a hard floor) and keep note of trends, not absolute values.


If clothes fitting is an indicator, 2 stone loss has caused me to have my 34 waist jeans etc fitting normal, to actually falling down without a belt (which I had to get an extra hole added too to account for the weight loss).  The sense of accomplishment is tarnished by having to pull my pants up constantly, hah


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## phil_hg_uk (9 Aug 2010)

Get some decent scales I had a similar erratic weight measurement problem a couple of years ago and I found that it was the scales, they would give a different reading everytime I got on them. I tried loads of sets from argos before I found some that gave consistant readings. 

Also as Rob3rt says put them in the same place everytime, I tend to weight myself on a monday morning.

I find that I lose around an pound a week most weeks as long as I stick to around 2600 cals and get around 100 miles of cycling in per week, which is fine by me as there is more chance of weight staying off if I can change my eating/exercising habits and keep it that way.


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## TheBoyBilly (9 Aug 2010)

Loads of good advice for you in this thread mate. Jimbo will sort you out, lol. Regarding the scales, ColinJ of this parish recommended Salter scales from Argos that calculate your BMI (I don't think that will impress too many mind) but perhaps more importantly will give you your Base Metabolic Rate as a starting point for your calorie intake calculations. I bought a set of said scales for IIRC £29.99. Good value.

Bill


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

The missus works in the docs, that's not a problem


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## slugonabike (9 Aug 2010)

Or forget the scales completely and just measure yourself once a month? 

edited typo


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

Take it You had her as well then Pmsl... no in Nottingham


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## carpiste (9 Aug 2010)

Rob3rt said:


> If you lost 14 lbs in 2 weeks, something is wrong! Thats not sustainable,



Mate, I`ve been to the docs, and he seems to think it is normal,as do others, to lose a lot of weight in the first days of any diet.This,however,is an initial loss and he told me not to expect the same to happen the following weeks.This has been confirmed in the fact I only lost a pound last week.
I`ve not changed anything in respect of eating/exercise last week so assume that some weight is added as a result of muscle build up.Maybe its just a metabolism thing.I`m no doctor but happy that mine has advised to continue along the same path and I will(eventually) reach a healthy weight.


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## ColinJ (9 Aug 2010)

TheBoyBilly said:


> Regarding the scales, ColinJ of this parish recommended Salter scales from Argos that calculate your BMI (I don't think that will impress too many mind) but perhaps more importantly will give you your Base Metabolic Rate as a starting point for your calorie intake calculations. I bought a set of said scales for IIRC £29.99. Good value.


Either my bad memory is even worse than I thought it was, or you've got that wrong!    I think BMI is a load of old crap so I would never suggest a product that made a feature of it. Any chance of a link to what I said?

I do remember commenting on somebody saying that they wanted to buy scales to display body fat percentage and I said that those things weren't accurate so don't bother.


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## Ben M (9 Aug 2010)

Ignore the scales, what you need to pay attention to is the mirror and your fitness.


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

Bmi in my opinion is wrong as it only takes into account the height to weight ratio and not the persons build, as I said in a previous thread both me and my cousin are 6.3 he is built like a bean pole and I have have the shoulder width 1/3 larger than his ????? But our ideal weight is 13 half stone.... I'd look I'll if I was 13 stone and he'd look fat... Bmi my arse... :-)


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## walker (9 Aug 2010)

Rob3rt said:


> If you lost 14 lbs in 2 weeks, something is wrong! Thats not sustainable, 7lbs a week is ridiculous weight loss,




Depends how big you are to start with, it is possible


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## Mark82 (9 Aug 2010)

Very true, if its there to lose you can lose that much easy,


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## Rob3rt (9 Aug 2010)

walker said:


> Depends how big you are to start with, it is possible



Of course its possible he has done it. But trying to dodge the offensive, it doesnt sound like a sensible weight loss to me unless you were pretty big.

But if his doctor says its okay, who am I to argue. Im an engineer, not a sports nutritionist.


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## TheBoyBilly (9 Aug 2010)

Sorry Colin, I wasn't suggesting you recommended those particular Salter scales for their BMI reading. I mentioned that you recommended them more for the other info they give and what good value they were. I will try to find your post.

Bill

Edit: Sorry ColinJ it wasn't you at all, it was Martok who gave the recommendation, i've just found his post...oops! An excellent set of scales mind.


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## potsy (9 Aug 2010)

Easy mistake to make-

Colin-





Martok-






Sorry Col,couldn't resist


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## ColinJ (9 Aug 2010)

Potsy - I think you got the wrong picture of Martok. Here's the one you want...


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## screenman (9 Aug 2010)

My weight is still coming off weekly, now down by 4 stone or 25 kilo. My muscle bulk is steadily increasing, 150 si ups and 150 press ups per day 6 days a week plus other bit is doing this. Anyway back on point, many are saying muscle weighs more than fat, so come on how much more?

How about this, what weighs the most a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers? 

Maybe building muscle just hold the fat in place better.

I also read this fine article,

For a natural bodybuilder females can lay down 1/2 lb of dense muscle per month. A male 1 lb of muscle per month. These studies conclusively show factual data unless enhanced with supplementation. I am not talking about scale weight, or adopoise tissue. For more information on muscular

 enhancement and major muscle growth, search this website for many muscle repair / testosterone boosters that can help you with the goal of muscular hypertrophy.

Sorry guys I would say if you are not losing weight then you are likely to be putting in more calories than you are using, not turning into the Hulk over night.

Here is another of my night time readings.

_Summary: Muscle density is 1.06 g/ml and fat density is (about) 0.9
g/ml. Thus, one liter of muscle would weight 1.06 kg and one liter of
fat would weight 0.9 kg. In other words, muscle is about 18% denses
than fat. This should not be confused with the "energy density" of
muscle and fat, which may be where you got the 3x figure that you
mention in your question."_

Please remember I am a PDR instructor not a health expert, my only claim is that I have lost 25 kilo in the last 6 months.


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## Banjo (9 Aug 2010)

If you are overweight and trying to slim down I dont understood the idea of not weighing yourself.I lost 4 stone last year and weighed every friday morning.

If weight didnt come off for a week or two i would up the exercise and cut the calories a bit until it started coming down again. The extra weight of gained muscle only becomes an issue when you get close to your ideal weight.


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## TheBoyBilly (10 Aug 2010)

There's a lot of truth in what you say there Banjo. What you are in effect doing is tricking your body out of getting used to a fitness/diet regime and the plateau effect. Funnily enough that's why the occasional 'blip' in having a few jars or overeating doesn't really do much damage - when you get back on track your body has to get used to another regime all over again.

Bill


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## screenman (10 Aug 2010)

Brilliant Banjo, that is exactly how I lost mine, it is also my feeling about the muscle being heavier bit. In other words you should be losing weight far quicker than you can build muscle, if you are over weight that is.


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## Rob3rt (10 Aug 2010)

Personally, I just see the whole "if you didnt lose enough weight it must be added muscle mass" as a form of enabling. Of course it not nice to just say, yup you didnt do as well as you should have this week. But quite frankly, maybe its just my mentality though, I'd rather be asked a few detailed questions and my approach scrutinized and then get help in actually addressing the issue rather than being told "its okay if you didnt lose weight, you are gaining muscle" because the rate of fat loss >>>>> rate of muscle gain.


I dont know the science or the mass densities of muscle vs fat, but in my experience, I've tried to gain weight (used to be a rugby player) by doing lots of weights, I used to squat up to 110kg for 8-10 reps (3 sets of) when I was 17-18 and deadlift 130kg for 6-10 reps (4 sets of) my bench press was always weak, no more than 55kg for 8 reps (4 sets of). I gained weight, very very slowly my apparent mass didnt change all that much visibly. Oh btw I was eating a hell of a lot of food to enable my strength and weight to gain in this stage. Gained something like half a stone in 6 months.

Ive also tried to lose weight, managing to drop 1-2lbs a week consistently while doing cycling and running with increased performance and also with some cycling and running specific resistance work included.


My conclusion based on MY experience, is that muscle gain due to activities such as running and cycling are far outweighed by the fat loss with a decent and controlled diet. Muscle gain shouldnt hinder weight loss, in these activities unless you are at a very low body fat percentage where you are teetering on your calorific requirement.

Of course everyone is different and it may not work out exactly the same for everyone, but the basic physiology is the same for everyone, its just the numbers that need altering.


Basically what I'm saying here, is if you are gaining weight whilst cycling or other cardiovascular activity and you arent at a low body fat percentage, then you should be looking at addressing either your diet, or your activity level rather than makng false assumptions.


Like Screenman, and like Ive said before I'm not a nutritionist, so this comes from my experience, and some from things I have read (but not in depth study)

To the OP, you need new scales most likely, thats pretty much the crux of it. lol


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## Rob3rt (10 Aug 2010)

screenman said:


> Maybe building muscle just hold the fat in place better.



To my knowledge, which may be wrong:

Increased muscle mass, means faster burning of fat, since you have more muscle and hence need more fuel. So if you systematically undereat then it will take from the fat. 

If you undereat by too much, and you dont have enough carbs to fuel, then some fat will be used, but some will also come from protein, i.e. your muscles will be broken down.


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## normskirus (10 Aug 2010)

Hi

The magic formula of eat less & exercise is true for anyone trying to lose weight. But the most important one of the 2 is to eat less. My weight is stable just now at about 12 and half stones, from a peak of almost 14 stones. And despite running, cycling & swimming it refused to drop. So I cut out a lot of my snacks (I could easily eat 4 chocy bars in a day), reduced my portions and reduced my alcohol intake. Voila in a year I reached my present weight. 

What really brought it home to me was that running at a moderate pace for half an hour only burns as much energy as a mars bar. A single bloody mars bar! And Mrs Normskirus has lost a shed load of weight over the past 6 months due to reduced calorie intake alone. 


So make sure after a long ride or lots of exercise dont over indluge. 

normskirus


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## Rob3rt (10 Aug 2010)

normskirus said:


> Hi
> 
> The magic formula of eat less & exercise is true for anyone trying to lose weight. But the most important one of the 2 is to eat less. My weight is stable just now at about 12 and half stones, from a peak of almost 14 stones. And despite running, cycling & swimming it refused to drop. So I cut out a lot of my snacks (I could easily eat 4 chocy bars in a day), reduced my portions and reduced my alcohol intake. Voila in a year I reached my present weight.
> 
> ...



One consideration, you dont just burn calories during the activity, but also in the few hours following, so you can also take that into account but its hard to estimate. I agree though everything is built on a solid nutritional base and activity alone wont do you justice.


BTW, Your display pic is ace, Im a ferret owner


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## walker (10 Aug 2010)

Rob3rt said:


> To my knowledge, which may be wrong:
> 
> Increased muscle mass, means faster burning of fat, since you have more muscle and hence need more fuel. So if you systematically undereat then it will take from the fat.
> 
> If you undereat by too much, and you dont have enough carbs to fuel, then some fat will be used, but some will also come from protein, i.e. your muscles will be broken down.



which is correct.

Each pound of fat burns 2 calories where each pound of muscle burns 7 calories


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