# Obnoxious cycle shop owners.



## Sore Thumb (2 Mar 2013)

I went into a lbs today to look at a cycle jacket. 
I have had a very nice jacket for a couple of years and the zip broke yesterday, so I thought I had better get a new one.

The one in the shop is nearly a year old and has been on the sale rack for at least two months. I know this because I have seen this jacket a few times when I have popped in for other items.

So obviously they have been unable to sell the jacket.

It's the colour I want and my size but they have reduced it to £68. 
I know I can get the jacket online for £43. 
But though I would buy it from the lbs if I could get it a little cheaper.

So I asked the assistant that if she could do me a good deal I would buy the jacket.

She went to ask the owner who was dealing with another customer.

He came over but quite obviously not in a good mood. The utter contempt of his manner was obvious. 
He was been very nice to the other customer, but because I had asked for a reduced price his attitude has changed.

He offered me a further £2 off. When I said no he snatched the jacket off the counter and said no way.
His attitude towards me was terrible, it was like I had spat in his face.

He then went of to previous customer and was nice as pie to them.

I said to the assistant that there was no way I would buy that £66 pound for something that was a year old and they you could obviously not sell when I can get it only e for £43. 
I did not mind buying it for more than the online price but £68 pound as a discount and a further £2 off for me asking is just a joke.

Well he has lost more than that for his attitude. I bought a lot if stuff over the years from that lbs, but not anymore. I will never set foot in that shop again. 

Completely obnoxious and rude lbs owner!!


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## shouldbeinbed (2 Mar 2013)

There is one near me where customers seem to be an inconvenience, particularly to the younger of the family duo and their technical knowledge is a bit suspect too if my experience of buying a C2W bike that I could only get from them is anything to go by.


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## compo (2 Mar 2013)

Sore Thumb said:


> It's the colour I want and my size but they have reduced it to £68.
> I know I can get the jacket online for £43.
> But though I would buy it from the lbs if I could get it a little cheaper.


 
Perhaps the shop owner gets fed up with people going in to his shop and quoting online prices at him all the time in an attempt to beat him down on price. This doesn't excuse his rudeness though.


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## G3CWI (2 Mar 2013)

It's a bit odd. Went into an lbs near me for a new wheel. I knew that Halfords had them at £49.99 but wanted to give the lbs the trade. Their very similar wheel was £65. As soon as I mentioned the Halfords price he quite rudely said "get it from them, we don't sell rubbish". At the same time a family was in and I heard he quoting £1000 for a frame. No idea what that was about but I saw them in Halfords later. The Halfords wheel has lots of good reviews. I might have been willing to spend a bit more if the Lbs had bothered to explain the advantages of their product. The other day they sold me the wrong size ball bearings. I can't see them lasting much longer unless they get their act together. Sad really but I don't feel that I owe them a living.


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## G3CWI (2 Mar 2013)

compo said:


> Perhaps the shop owner gets fed up with people going in to his shop and quoting online prices at him all the time in an attempt to beat him down on price. This doesn't excuse his rudeness though.



I am sure that's the case but they need to look at how they do business. They have a potential customer in front of them. Their sales pitch needs to convince the customer of some advantages of buying local. Local shops need to adapt to survive.


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## Peteaud (2 Mar 2013)

We have a large bike shop near that was so rude to us in the past we have never set foot in again, and never will.

The 3 others i use have all been great.

The main one we use is also the one thats getting to sell me the roubaix when i can afford it.

And the smaller lbs have said they will try to price match online stores if they can. All my clothing is bought from them so i can try on etc.


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## yello (2 Mar 2013)

I wish I had an LBS to be rude to me.


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## screenman (2 Mar 2013)

In 45 years of cycling and a lot of money spent nothing like this has ever happened to me.


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## Boris Bajic (2 Mar 2013)

If he really does run a poor shop, he'll be out of business within the year.

If he's an OK guy whom you caught at a bad moment and elicited an inappropriate reaction from, then I imagine he'll be OK.

Similarly, there might have been something about your manner (or that of some other customer) that irked him.

These things happen. That's life.

I'm in no doubt that at the momnent the Internet shopping experience is sweeping all before it like the Wermacht in the summer of 1941 in the Steppes.

One day it might wipe retail right off the High Street. Then we'll be up a Bad Creek in a Bad Canoe with no paddle when we want a tweak of this, or advice about that or some spacers but we're not sure which ones...

By then it will be too late. All we have is bollocksy boutique cycle shops with coffee while you wait and anything as long as it's Camagnolo and shelves full of Carbon-fibre Gofarkyourself Irrelevance. 

I use my LBS as much as I can afford to and ask him to match (or approach) the Internet price where I think he'll be glad of the opportunity. Sometimes he matches, sometimes he gets close and sometimes I have to buy online.


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## Andy_G (2 Mar 2013)

When i went back to my lbs for my free 6 week service where i bought my Domane from, i droppped it off and the attitude from the sales guy who also done the servicing was crap, i booked it in a week before and they said it would take 30 mins and said i could wait, but when i said id hang around he moaned saying "it will take atleast an hour because hes the only one that can do it", i dont know if he was digging at the two schoolboy sales lads who was more interested in proping up the shelves i dont know.
But after spending over £2000 id expect better service and attitude, they say the High Street is dying but can you blame it when shops employ kids who know naff all, but say thay race and know it all about bikes.


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## MrJamie (2 Mar 2013)

It's crazy that they can afford such bad customer service, when I believe bike shops are struggling and must rely quite a lot on word of mouth. The one time I went to LBS's looking for help as a total newbie, the first was unhelpful, the second was great, so when casual cyclist friends ask obviously I always mention the second.

On the plus side, it leaves you feeling guilt free about paying less and buying online


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (2 Mar 2013)

There's one in Rochdale, they have a sign at the entrance...WE DO NOT ALLOW BIKES IN HERE, or something of that ilk.

It's on a very busy main road, they haven't anything to lock to. I was in the process of wanting a winter bike as my Brompton had slid from underneath me on a roundabout near the shop in question.

I half folded the Brompton and went in, the look I got from them was disgraceful and their attitude was awful. I didn't buy a bike from them but got it the same night from lbs.

I thought they'd be out of business soon, but 2 years later they're still there.


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## eck (2 Mar 2013)

One of the (now defunct) LBSs near where I used to live had an interesting take on customer service.
A typical exchange would go something like this:
Potential customer, "Good day to you, Mr Nice Bike Shop Man, would you happen to have a [insert obscure component of your choice]?"
Mr Nice Bike Shop Man, "No."
Potential customer, "Well thank you, and goodbye."

Mr Bike Shop Man never, ever said, " Sorry, I don't have one today, but I'd be happy to get it for you by Tuesday" or "I'm afraid I don't have that exact component, but I do have this that may be suitable."
In the words of the great song by The Band, "No was all he said".


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## The Brewer (2 Mar 2013)

A LBS who has a website was asking nearly double instore for some pedals. I mentioned the online price and it was price matched.

I know its hard at the moment for shops to compete, but sorry if they want my custom they better be competively priced as we're all skint


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## Mapster5 (2 Mar 2013)

Sore Thumb said:


> I went into a lbs today to look at a cycle jacket.
> I have had a very nice jacket for a couple of years and the zip broke yesterday, so I thought I had better get a new one.
> 
> The one in the shop is nearly a year old and has been on the sale rack for at least two months. I know this because I have seen this jacket a few times when I have popped in for other items.
> ...


Careful what you say on here about local bike shops you might get banned and certainly don't say anything good about Halfords


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## Sore Thumb (2 Mar 2013)

compo said:


> Perhaps the shop owner gets fed up with people going in to his shop and quoting online prices at him all the time in an attempt to beat him down on price. This doesn't excuse his rudeness though.




I did not quote any on line price to them until they had said a firm no and turned his back to me. It was a parting shot from me as I left.

So he was obnoxious to me before this.


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## ziggys101 (2 Mar 2013)

My local LBS is pretty good, when looking for my last bike I asked him if he could get close to deals I'd seen online he tried but couldn't get near, so I didn't buy from him but because he tried and was helpful i have bought nearly everything else I have bought for the bike from him, he always gives me a small discount. If the service is right then I dont mind paying a little extra for it.


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## ianrauk (2 Mar 2013)

Mapster5 said:


> *Careful what you say on here about local bike shops you might get banned* and certainly don't say anything good about Halfords


 
Why do you say that?
No one has ever got a ban for having a bad experience with a bike shop and posting about it on here.


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## Sore Thumb (2 Mar 2013)

The jacket is probably still going to be for sale in his shop for the next year anyway.
He will probably be forced to drop it to the price I was prepared to pay in the next few months.

He's just lost more money by not offering me the deal due to the fact I will never buy from him again and anyone cyclist that ask me where the good cycle shops are, I will tell them not to go to his. 
So he will probably loose hundreds now rather than a few quid.


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## Nebulous (2 Mar 2013)

I very determinedly don't add up what I spend on bike stuff, but my lbs gets a reasonable chunk of it. Even my local Halfords gets a bit.
Its a bit like this, if it is a planned purchase I shop around and get the best deal I can, generally online. There are quite a lot of times though when I want it now. Examples would be fettling my bike, deciding something needs replacing and buying it. Online prices are no good if I want my bike back together in half-an-hour.


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## subaqua (2 Mar 2013)

i use whatever source i can for parts clothing etc. depends how quickly i want it.mostlyt the price in the LBS is as near as dammit same as online anyway.

a dive forum (the) i frequent has people bemoaning poor service form dive shops ( LDS) so it could well be any enthusiast


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## Pale Rider (2 Mar 2013)

Given the thread title, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Spa Cycles in Harrogate.



Actually, I rather like the guy.


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## Dave 123 (2 Mar 2013)

We used to run a small garden centre, The amount of people coming in and asking for raffle prizes was alarming. The final straw was giving 3 away in a morning that I'd taken NO money, but spent over a grand in cash on stock. The 4th person came in... "have you a raffle prize for the local school....?"
I answered with "No, sorry". There then followed a discussion and I explained what had gone on that morning, and that schools are funded from taxes. He saw my point in the end.
Maybe your man was having a bad day, too mant requests for discount?
But you're right, he didn't have to be rude.


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## mickle (2 Mar 2013)

To be fair - it can be very difficult to retain a cheerful disposition when faced with a near constant stream of penny pinching price matchers - Interspersed with people wasting your time by trying on items from your stock only to go away and buy on-line.


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## G3CWI (2 Mar 2013)

mickle said:


> To be fair - it can be very difficult to retain a cheerful disposition when faced with a near constant stream of penny pinching price matchers - Interspersed with people wasting your time by trying on items from your stock only to go away and buy on-line.



...so you have to adapt to the trading environment or go extinct.


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## inkd (2 Mar 2013)

G3CWI said:


> ...so you have to adapt to the trading environment or go extinct.


As a local bike chain has near me with a good internet sales site. I went into my LBS asked for an item they had on offer online but had sold out, It costs me around a fiver in petrol to get to my LBS, Got home and ordered on their website with free postage, got it 3 days later from one of their other stores. http://www.hargrovescycles.co.uk/ Excellent service from them and not the closest to me.


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## nickyboy (2 Mar 2013)

The LBS business model seems a bit of an anachronism these days. Bit like the ironmongers. Low stock turns, extensive inventory range, ease of comparison with online pricing. And unfortunately a lot of owners who are bike enthusiasts but don't grasp the modern expectations regarding customer service

Fast forward 10 years I do wonder how many LBS will exist selling bikes and components. I think the following will survive and proseper:

1) Specialist LBS selling high end products or niche products for which customers will travel long distances and will appreciate the specialist advice
2) Big chain stores offering a "retailing experience" much like going to a supermarket 
3) LBS who concentrate on service and repair

And all the rest of the business will be online


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## gb155 (2 Mar 2013)

I was told I was too fat for a trek 6700 mtb (at 25 stone) after the shop had sold it to me.

This was done on a busy Saturday afternoon 

Guess what, I've never ever set foot in there since and when friends ask about it I'm happy to share my experience 

Vote with your feet, it's, sadly, the only way!!!


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## MontyVeda (2 Mar 2013)

G3CWI said:


> ...
> The other day they sold me the wrong size ball bearings. I can't see them lasting much longer unless they get their act together. Sad really but I don't feel that I owe them a living.


 
Years ago (95ish) there was a new cycle shop in Lancaster called Cycle 2000... it was a massive shop, loads of nice bikes and accessories, and they also offered secure bike parking for £1 a day (they had that much space)....

anyway, I went in for some headset bearings as I was doing up my first MTB, and the bloke tried to sell me an entire headset for £22. I told them i didn't need an entire headset, just the loose bearings, but he told me "you can't buy loose beatings." which was obviously bull.

I told the bloke, who clearly thought he was the _be all and end all_ of bicycle repair, that I've bought loose bearings many times before, for about 50p a set... he told me i was talking out of my **** so I left, never to return again.

I went to the next nearest LBS and bought said loose bearings for 68p.

Cycle 2000 didn't last very long.. can't think why.


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## beastie (2 Mar 2013)

nickyboy said:


> The LBS business model seems a bit of an anachronism these days. Bit like the ironmongers. Low stock turns, extensive inventory range, ease of comparison with online pricing. And unfortunately a lot of owners who are bike enthusiasts but don't grasp the modern expectations regarding customer service
> 
> Fast forward 10 years I do wonder how many LBS will exist selling bikes and components. I think the following will survive and proseper:
> 
> ...


 
I would have thought most LBS would see the value in service and repair. It's a growth market.
The LBS in Penrith Arragons cycles has a busy service section with 4 guys working. It's very popular with locals and they also do emergency repairs for people on C2C.

Another thing they do is run a ladies social ride , training rides and a Triathlon club. I expect the club members are more likely to use the store than not.


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## TonyEnjoyD (2 Mar 2013)

gb155 said:


> I was told I was too fat for a trek 6700 mtb (at 25 stone) after the shop had sold it to me.
> 
> This was done on a busy Saturday afternoon
> 
> ...


Sadly I agree, and more people are doing that these days.
The LBS I use I have bought all 3 of my CTW bikes from and received excellent advice and support.

They are and old family business and support us at work with events we run insofar as charity rides.

Recently I advised a budding new cyclist to go see them and ask for one of two people (the owner or head mech) but she just asked a young lad which type of bike was best for her needs, an he just gave her a couple if brochures.
Off she toddled to another LBS, got good verbal advice and bought from them instead.

I did let the recommended LBS owner know what happened, and has given all her non-technical staff customer service training and told them to never - ever- fob a customer off again and to seek further information for the customer no matter how busy they may be.

Sometimes, staff will let you down.


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## topcat1 (2 Mar 2013)

why don't you take the jacket to the dry cleaners and get the zip replaced?


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## Herbie (2 Mar 2013)

Sore Thumb said:


> I went into a lbs today to look at a cycle jacket.
> I have had a very nice jacket for a couple of years and the zip broke yesterday, so I thought I had better get a new one.
> 
> The one in the shop is nearly a year old and has been on the sale rack for at least two months. I know this because I have seen this jacket a few times when I have popped in for other items.
> ...


 
you don't get if you don't ask....its always worth asking for a discount...you did the right thing in walking away...shop owner sounds a right plonker...gonnae name and shame the shop?


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## slowmotion (2 Mar 2013)

It can't be easy being on the High Street in any retail sector these days. My guess is that the LBS will survive if it gives a personalised service, eg, a one month free service for a bike bought there. You don't get that from a shed in the middle of nowhere that crams a bike into a box with the rear mech, bars etc in plastic bags for you to sort out, and sends it off to get mashed by the carrier. I went there four years ago. The local LBS had the same bike on sale for £40 less than the on-line site that I returned the knackered one to. They set it up, and adjusted it a month later. There was no need for me to haggle.

Yes, it's a temptation to try on a pair of shoes there and buy them online. That's pretty low though, isn't it? Go to somewhere that says that they will price match, but don't skulk around in the shadows like the fraud that you will be.


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## Moodyman (2 Mar 2013)

Pale Rider said:


> Given the thread title, I'm surprised no one has mentioned Spa Cycles in Harrogate.
> 
> 
> 
> Actually, I rather like the guy.



Spa are wonderful and even the grumpy guy is kinda likeable.

My first dealings with them were a few years ago over the phone. I tried their price match promise against an eBay site. They were the cheapest bike shop for the product I wanted but said they don't price match vs ebay but I kept persisting and the guy said 'well buy it from eBay' and hung up. That taught me for being a tight arse. 

Since then I've visited the shop quite often thinking I know exactly what I want and they've always sold me something cheaper and better. Their honesty and knowledge is worth it for me to pass several local shops to get there.


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## slowmotion (2 Mar 2013)

^^^^^ Yes.

Spa have always given me excellent advice, and you certainly don't pay top dollar.


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## avalon (3 Mar 2013)

Having worked in retail and the cycle industry in the distant past, I can understand the frustration of shop owners who are constantly being asked to give big discounts, often to the point at which they would be selling at a loss. It does seem to me that the only way to survive is to provide a good back up and repair service and be friendly with it. That way people will keep coming back and won't mind paying a bit more than they do on line. Also on line advertising of the services you are offering would help to attract more customers as many bikes that are bought on the internet are not ready to ride and could do with being set up properly before they're used. Often things like wheel cones, headsets, gears and lubrication need sorting out and a trained bicycle mechanic could have everything sorted within an hour.


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## fudgepanda (3 Mar 2013)

I bought my first bike in (ahem) about 40 years last year and ended up buying from my LBS. Actually it was somebody else's LBS as it was about 8 miles away but the principle is the same. This particular place is a worker's co-op and I'd say it showed. I've dealt with more enthusiastic salespeople but both the lads I spoke to seemed to know their stuff and the advice they gave made sense. Before I bought I'd had a look at quite a few different bikes and couldn't understand what the differences were between different gear sets. This was explained and I understood more about what I was buying. Because of this I'll go back again, as I do for servicing which, incidentally, is free for the first three services. As with many enthusiast led pastimes there are different levels of knowledge and expertise. Personally, partly because I have no interest in it, I intend to ride it as much as I can and spend as little time fixing or servicing it as possible and because of that I need a competent and reliable LBS. I'm sure there are plenty on here who will be happy buying a bike on line and then assembling it in the kitchen, but I'm not. I have bought the odd piece of clothing on line but that was a large bike shop anyway.


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## screenman (3 Mar 2013)

He does not want penny pinching tight whats its as customer, must say I am the same with my business and have been successful for over 39 years. You would not last a second asking me for discount as well my customers know.


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## Pikey (3 Mar 2013)

It sounds like I am spoilt or living in a backwater pocket of decent customer service looking at some of the above.

The lbs in Melksham by Avon tyres and even the local halfords are both outstanding. The former actually seemed quite happy to check my bike over and give me a bit of insurance advice after some git knocked me off on the roundabout just up the road from them, even turned me down when I tried to pay for the service too.


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## Pikey (3 Mar 2013)

topcat1 said:


> why don't you take the jacket to the dry cleaners and get the zip replaced?



Get some quotes from online dry cleaners first though...


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## Cycleops (3 Mar 2013)

It is not only bike shops that are going through a challenging time at present. You only have to look at the high street and see all the famous names that are no more. The ones that survive will be as nickyboy said, specialist 'concept' stores, chain stores (like Halfords) and shops that concentrate on repairs plus service. But you can understand the frustration of certain shop owners constantly being asked to drop prices, it is after all their livelihood and you are asking is for is for them to take a pay cut. But in the end it will be horses for courses.


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## Pedrosanchezo (3 Mar 2013)

I personally choose to use both LBS and online for my purchases. I can get advice from both sources also.

I do not feel i have to give my money or custom to the LBS in order to support the local community. I buy what i see as the best value for money. If that is online then so be it. It sometimes is at one of two LBS's i frequent. In my case though both are over 10 miles away and with a young child this can be a military op to get there. 

Lets be honest, the LBS staff and owners probably do all their shopping at Tesco and Asda's. Who's to say they don't buy their kids christmas gifts from Argos or online?? It's simply cheaper and the average Joe cannot afford to pay for everything locally in order to support the local shops and stores. The difference in cost would be significant.

With the low costs and services available online, the LBS (and many other small business') will be a minority in the not so distant future. The big chains will survive because they can also compete online.


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## youngoldbloke (3 Mar 2013)

I just hate it when you visit a shop and ask for an item only to be told it does not exist, never has, and theyv'e never stocked them, when all the time you've got the broken one at home in the shed. On one laughable occasion - leather toe straps! Hardly inspires confidence in their knowledge and expertise.


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## Sore Thumb (3 Mar 2013)

avalon said:


> Having worked in retail and the cycle industry in the distant past, I can understand the frustration of shop owners who are constantly being asked to give big discounts, often to the point at which they would be selling at a loss. It does seem to me that the only way to survive is to provide a good back up and repair service and be friendly with it. That way people will keep coming back and won't mind paying a bit more than they do on line. Also on line advertising of the services you are offering would help to attract more customers as many bikes that are bought on the internet are not ready to ride and could do with being set up properly before they're used. Often things like wheel cones, headsets, gears and lubrication need sorting out and a trained bicycle mechanic could have everything sorted within an hour.




I did not mind him saying no to my request for a discount. 

However I did mind his attitude. I don't care if he was having a bad day he should be pleasant to customers if he wants the business.

I work in the NHS and I can't have a bad day and be rude to my patients/customers. Even if I am having a bad day I have to be nice. It's not about me it's about the patients.

Should be similar in business.

He will have to learn that if he wants to continue to survive in this current climate then he will need to learn a bit of customer care.

Gone are the days when you had enough business to turn customers away.


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## Hip Priest (3 Mar 2013)

I can't really contribute to this thread because the owners and staff at both my local shops are great. He said smugly.


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## avalon (3 Mar 2013)

Sore Thumb said:


> I work in the NHS and I can't have a bad day and be rude to my patients/customers. Even if I am having a bad day I have to be nice. It's not about me it's about the patients.
> 
> Should be similar in business.


 I agree, if you are providing a service in any kind of business, you should provide it with courtesy and manners. (Maybe somebody should tell that to the staff at Heathrow Airport).


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## Cycleops (3 Mar 2013)

avalon said:


> I agree, if you are providing a service in any kind of business, you should provide it with courtesy and manners. (Maybe somebody should tell that to the staff at Heathrow Airport).



You can't legislate for human nature.


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## bianchi1 (3 Mar 2013)

"I work in the NHS and I can't have a bad day and be rude to my patients/customers. Even if I am having a bad day I have to be nice. It's not about me it's about the patients.

Should be similar in business."


Slight difference that generally you choose freely to go to a bike shop, while I can't remember the last time I used the nhs for fun. The fact nhs staff are polite, despite their "customers" having to be there is more of a credit to them and their attitude.

In the industry that I work in (catering) the largest driver in improving service and attitude has been the Internet, specifically tripadvisor. It somewhat focuses the mind when you realise that a customers bad experience can suddenly be all over the web.


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## G3CWI (3 Mar 2013)

bianchi1 said:


> Slight difference that generally you choose freely to go to a bike shop, while I can't remember the last time I used the nhs for fun.


 
I was amused to see a notice this week in A&E at Macclesfield thanking me for "choosing" to go to that hospital. Strangely I cant recall the ambulance crew asking if I had a preference...


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## nickyboy (3 Mar 2013)

Cycleops said:


> It is not only bike shops that are going through a challenging time at present. You only have to look at the high street and see all the famous names that are no more. The ones that survive will be as nickyboy said, specialist 'concept' stores, chain stores (like Halfords) and shops that concentrate on repairs plus service. But you can understand the frustration of certain shop owners constantly being asked to drop prices, it is after all their livelihood and you are asking is for is for them to take a pay cut. But in the end it will be horses for courses.


 
Smart LBS owners will adapt and survive (how about a Kwikfit type repair and maintenance business for bikes?) Those that just get frustrated by online competiton will go out of business. 

Realistically, for the majority of LBS, the future is repair and maintenance. The market for top end niche products is too small and stand alone LBS can't afford to become a branded retail chain

All those ironmongers went out of business because they failed to adapt when B&Q etc came on the scene. And that was before the online revolution


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## SS Retro (3 Mar 2013)

3lbs in our town 2 really good customer focused, one an utter and complete arse went in a few months go with rear wheel and new ss freewheel.
Me; "can you change this for me pls mate"
Lbs;_ "NO"_
Me; "oh why not"
lbs;_ "because we don't fit parts we don't supplie ourselves "_
Me; "ok do you have a free wheel removal tool I can purchase"
lbs_; "NO"_
Me; "ok no worries will go up the road to ... .... (other lbs) you obviously don't need the business" (said in sarcastic tone)
lbs;_ "Yeah mate cause there probably used to dealing with poncey singlespeed wheels" _
Me; walked out laughing at the utter f*%$^@g cock.

Went up the road.
"yeah buddy no problems be ready by lunch time only be a fiver."

The third lbs only been open 3 years but never been in till the other day just for a nose, the owner was spot on had a good chat about wheel building and other things he couldn't have been nicer even though I said I was only in nosing not buying.


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## r80 (3 Mar 2013)

There are two bike shops in my town, one sells Merida's and one Specialized. I know Merida own 49% of Specialized so the bikes are very similar. I went into the LBS and asked for some specialized bar tape, and upon mentioning I owned a Merida his mood instantly changed. He must have realised I was a customer of the other LBS and spent the rest of our discussion insulting my bike and me in a backhanded way. If I was spending more than eight quid I probably would have have left and gone across town.


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## stevede (3 Mar 2013)

I love discussions like this and the way some people in business treat their customers, when it's so easy to get right, (and wrong).

I remember when I first started work after leaving school, in a small retail business. My then bosses father said (& I remember like it was yesterday), " treat every customer the same, and in a way you would like to be dealt with yourself. They may not be your biggest customer today lad, but you never know what tomorrow brings". I believe it's stood me in good stead since.

I try to chose the businesses I buy from on the same basis. If I get good service I'll deal with them. I'm not afraid to walk away if not.

On the basis of price & discount. If appropriate, I'm happy to ask for a discount, usually a polite "is that the best you can do me on that"? I'm constantly amazed at the discounts people will offer from a simple friendly question. Some people are actually too eager to give money away. If it's what I want and available, I'll happily buy at the full price, but you have to ask sometimes. 

My business sells products which are far from unique. I always encourage people to pick up the phone and talk to me about price, but equally, I tell them that sometimes the answer will be "that's the best I can do". Both buyer and seller will always have their walk away point.

Now lets move away from the "price" and think about "value". Does what I am buying (and where I am buying it from) represent good "value"? If it does, pay the money, if not (as the OP) then there's potentially a discussion to have, but it should never be unpleasant from either side. I personally am happy to pay a little more than online from a local business if their advice & service "adds value". Many of my customers pay a small premium over what is available elsewhere because of the value we add, and service we offer as a business.

The point about people is absolutely key. My pal & I went to a LBS a couple of weeks ago, where I had received good service a number of years ago. The young lad we spoke to was not unpleasant in any way, but not overly helpful and we left empty handed. Goods subsequently bought online. A fresh requirement this Saturday just gone, and may pal suggested we go back. I suggested otherwise but was overruled. Dealt with by 2 different people and the experience was totally different. We spent a fair few quid between us and I already plan to go back very soon for some additional bits.

Let's remember also that the LBS is a business and has bills to pay. It's perfectly feasible that the jacket they had actually cost them more than the current online sales price and they weren't prepared to sell at a loss. A shrewd business person however would realise this, be aware that their stock was non moving and possibly be willing to barter.

Only time will tell if their business is a success.

Best regards

Steve


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## Andrew_P (3 Mar 2013)

I have the Evans main warehouse 5 mins drive away from work, I will only use them in extreme emergency, even if you just go in there and buy £5 bottle of oil when you get to the till they have to ask if you have shopped there before, then take your postcode and address really pishes me off, if I want them tracking purchases I should be free to choose with a loyalty card or some such. Also cheeses me off that they put huge security barcode stickers over the instructions.

Secondly they told me that I shouldn't be using my mid range Shimano RS80 to commute on when I took it in there to be trued, when challenged what is the differnce between riding at the WE and commuting that makes the RS80 "unsuitable" they couldn't answer me.


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## Accy cyclist (3 Mar 2013)

i bought a Scott bike from a dealer in Blackburn 12 years ago. They still sell mainly Scott bikes,so when i was in the other month i mentioned that i bought mine from there, and how pleased i was with it's performance over the years. The shop assistant just said "Is there anything you want or can i carry on with my repairs"? Totally brushing aside my comments!
Another time i was in there trying on a jacket that i'd had my eye on he said "You've tried that jacket on the other week, are you going to buy it or just keep trying it on"!
What is wrong with these people?


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## Star Strider (3 Mar 2013)

I know of at least one shop where the owner is nice to the local road club who shop almost exclusively with him and incredibly arsey with anyone else.

And yes he is expensive, not by internet standards but by that of other LBS in the county who offer a much better service and a better range of kit up to and incuding frame building.

I shall not name names but Mr Arseys shop is in the south of the county in the county town and the three other shops who are actualy nice to people are to the north of the county in another city.


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## addictfreak (3 Mar 2013)

There's a shop near me that I use occasionally, if I need something in a hurry. The owner is a nice guy and always has time for a chat, and his prices are pretty reasonable. I have asked him to price match items available on line in the past, he said no and said he gets asked the same question quite often. He told me he simply can't compete with some of the on line prices.


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## matthat (3 Mar 2013)

I could write war and peace about what I think of Formby Cycles(merseyside)!! Needless to say I went to another nearer shop with a less bling shopfront but better well established business called MOSSCROPS (Southport) who i could also write war and peace about but in a good way! I now live 30 miles away from Mosscrops but will always pop in and say Hi to the owner and see if he has anything i'm after at the current time.Now looking for new LBS in South Liverpool!!


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## Brandane (3 Mar 2013)

I wanted to use my LBS; I really did. It was good to have an LBS, but unfortunately it is one of the many that have gone under.

The problem I found was that it was a small shop, and understandably did not carry a wide range of stock. If you wanted anything out of the ordinary, then it was never in stock. He would always offer to order it and promise that it would be available for the start of the following week.
That is all very well, but I can log on to any of a number of sites which will deliver exactly the part I am looking for, to my door, within 2 days normally. They are probably the same sites as my LBS would have used to get my part, and then added on his percentage as he has to make a profit.

I really don't know the answer. I would hate to see the end of the LBS, but they have to be competitive, and it must be hard when you are up against bulk buyers with low overheads.


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## jazzkat (3 Mar 2013)

bromptonfb said:


> There's one in Rochdale, they have a sign at the entrance...WE DO NOT ALLOW BIKES IN HERE, or something of that ilk.
> 
> It's on a very busy main road, they haven't anything to lock to. I was in the process of wanting a winter bike as my Brompton had slid from underneath me on a roundabout near the shop in question.
> 
> ...


Oh boy....'that' shop! I had dealings with them many years ago. Totally trashed a wheel for me replacing bearings (I was a newby and should have done it myself) It has a terrible reputation in the area and I found out later that the local cyclists stay away. I think it stays open selling kids bikes for christmas.



matthat said:


> I could write war and peace about what I think of Formby Cycles(merseyside)!! Needless to say I went to another nearer shop with a less bling shopfront but better well established business called MOSSCROPS (Southport) who i could also write war and peace about but in a good way! I now live 30 miles away from Mosscrops but will always pop in and say Hi to the owner and see if he has anything i'm after at the current time.Now looking for new LBS in South Liverpool!!


Just goes to show, when we bought Mrs Jk's newest bike we had great help and advice from Formby cycles.


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## matthat (3 Mar 2013)

jazzkat said:


> Oh boy....'that' shop! I had dealings with them many years ago. Totally trashed a wheel for me replacing bearings (I was a newby and should have done it myself) It has a terrible reputation in the area and I found out later that the local cyclists stay away. I think it stays open selling kids bikes for christmas.
> 
> 
> Just goes to show, when we bought Mrs Jk's newest bike we had great help and advice from Formby cycles.


I had great advice at sale! But after sale and warranty issues well that's another story! 
Not been in for 3yrs now!!


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## Rohloff_Brompton_Rider (3 Mar 2013)

jazzkat said:


> Oh boy....'that' shop! I had dealings with them many years ago. Totally trashed a wheel for me replacing bearings (I was a newby and should have done it myself) It has a terrible reputation in the area and I found out later that the local cyclists stay away. I think it stays open selling kids bikes for christmas.
> 
> 
> Just goes to show, when we bought Mrs Jk's newest bike we had great help and advice from Formby cycles.


Ahh so it wasn't just me they don't like the look of then? It's a fair sized shop, you'd think they'd want more custom, observable old gits.


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## Herr-B (3 Mar 2013)

When I was looking for a bike through cyclescheme I visited all the lbs, one had a young adult on the computer who told me to 'have a look on their website', rather than around their showroom - will never go there again. One told me that through the scheme I must use the RRP and add their admin few - their cash (or finance through them) price was roughly 40% discount across the board - never used again, and not recommended to bro-in-law who used them and regretted it just a couple of weeks later. Another didn't stock anything below a grand that didn't only have a Sora groupset. Two were quite helpful - out of these two I've since used one for repairs after I cross threaded a pedal to replace the crank - he could not source the part at a reasonable price but when I said I could get it from Ribble for a lot cheaper he told me to order it and he'd fit it for about 25 quid.

Velosport in Cleethorpes, I will use you again and recommend you.


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## inkd (3 Mar 2013)

As Stevede mentioned, I was bought up to "speak how you expect to be spoken to"


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## geo (3 Mar 2013)

Not read all this thread but a positive word for my local (well not so local as its 20 mile away ) bike shop. Jack Parker cycles in Burscough cant do enough to help always a friendly ear a very experienced cyclist and fair prices for servicing and kit. Not the biggest shop around but in my opinion a very very good LBS and well worth the trip whenever I need anything.


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## snorri (3 Mar 2013)

Accy cyclist said:


> i. The shop assistant just said "Is there anything you want or can i carry on with my repairs"? Totally brushing aside my comments!


 
Reminds me of the day I was in my LBS for some spare part or other when I mentioned to the owner that I had done a LEJOG on the bike I had bought from him a year earlier. I don't know of anyone else locally who has done a LEJOG with a locally purchased bike so thought my achievment might have been of interest, instead he gave a grunt and looked at me as if to say what did you do that for? Anyway, I know he is pathetic on customer relations and won't improve now so I continued to give him my business.


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## matthat (3 Mar 2013)

geo said:


> Not read all this thread but a positive word for my local (well not so local as its 20 mile away ) bike shop. Jack Parker cycles in Burscough cant do enough to help always a friendly ear a very experienced cyclist and fair prices for servicing and kit. Not the biggest shop around but in my opinion a very very good LBS and well worth the trip whenever I need anything.


I have window shopped there and yes very helpful.


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## 400bhp (3 Mar 2013)

LOCO said:


> Secondly they told me that I shouldn't be using my mid range Shimano RS80 to commute on when I took it in there to be trued, when challenged what is the differnce between riding at the WE and commuting that makes the RS80 "unsuitable" they couldn't answer me.


 
Very very true.

Perhaps the roads change form in the week.


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## Moodyman (3 Mar 2013)

400bhp said:


> Very very true.
> 
> Perhaps the roads change form in the week.



True to some extent, but it also depends how and where you commute.

I carry two heavy panniers and ride on crappy urban roads. My weekend rides involve smoother country roads with no luggage, racks or mudguards


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## nickyboy (3 Mar 2013)

Brandane said:


> I really don't know the answer. I would hate to see the end of the LBS, but they have to be competitive, and it must be hard when you are up against bulk buyers with low overheads.


 
Answer = supply something you can't buy online

Repairs, specialist niche products and advice to go with, products with local affiliations like bike club discounts
Everything else leave to online retailers


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## fudgepanda (3 Mar 2013)

LOCO said:


> Secondly they told me that I shouldn't be using my mid range Shimano RS80 to commute on when I took it in there to be trued, when challenged what is the differnce between riding at the WE and commuting that makes the RS80 "unsuitable" they couldn't answer me.


I know you described the Shimano RS80 as mid range, but.....er......I must admit I'm not actually sure what one is. Anyway, isn't mid range what you really need for commuting? If you have the cycling equivalent of a Ferrari then you'd probably want to save it for high days and holidays rather than expose it to the grind of commuting. But, I think that perhaps this is a trap many who are supposed to advise us fall into. If you should read a car magazine you'll probably find that, for instance, that the FIAT Panda is best with the normal 1.2 petrol engine, whereas the 500 is best with the 0.9 litre turbo engine. They are jumping to conclusions about "our" own needs. A Panda is quite a utilitarian kind of car, a bit like a hybrid. But I have a hybrid yet it comes with Deore gears which I believe are quite a fair way up the Shimano pecking order. Does that mean that because I have a hybrid I've got to have the lowest price/quality gears?


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## Hicky (4 Mar 2013)

bromptonfb said:


> Ahh so it wasn't just me they don't like the look of then? It's a fair sized shop, you'd think they'd want more custom, observable old gits.



I took my lads rear wheel in one day to have it trued as he somehow managed to buckle a 20inch mtb wheel!
Well he looked at it "I'll have a go but that is knackered pal", alarm bells start ringing as I've seen much worse in my youth(by me).....anyway, came back the next day was charged. NO difference in the wheel.
Miserable and useless, PC no parking for cars or bikes!!


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## youngoldbloke (4 Mar 2013)

fudgepanda said:


> I know you described the Shimano RS80 as mid range, but.....er......I must admit* I'm not actually sure what one is*.


Remember ....... Google is your friend. (OK, to save your clicks, RS80 is a Shimano 700c wheelset).


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## Lanzecki (4 Mar 2013)

fudgepanda said:


> I know you described the Shimano RS80 as mid range, but.....er......I must admit I'm not actually sure what one is.


 
20 secs on wiggle : http://www.wiggle.co.uk/?s=rs80


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## pplpilot (4 Mar 2013)

There's a local bike shop near me that unless you have £3000+ to spend they treat you like something they trod in. When I first went shopping for my first road bike I went there, needless to say I've never been back, condescending toss pots kinda reminded me of the 'Not the nine o'clock' news sketch but bike based -


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## tadpole (4 Mar 2013)

youngoldbloke said:


> I just hate it when you visit a shop and ask for an item only to be told it does not exist, never has, and theyv'e never stocked them, when all the time you've got the broken one at home in the shed. On one laughable occasion - leather toe straps! Hardly inspires confidence in their knowledge and expertise.


Spoke tool in a "serious" Bike shop In Taunton


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## Lanzecki (4 Mar 2013)

tadpole said:


> Spoke tool in a "serious" Bike shop In Taunton


 
That reminds me. 

"Do you have a Spoke key please? I need a 4mm" "No-one of any quality has made a wheel that needs 4mm" "Best tell Shimano that" As I walk out. 

Halfords had the key.... 

There are people like this in all walks of life, I have a local gentlemans outfitters that looks on you like dirt unless you are dressed as a country gent with the correct head wear. He just seems to dislike people. But he's been there for 40 years. I guess the customer base is very loyal and enjoys that kind of abuse. 

I'll walk into my LBS happily, the owner greets everyone, and while you may have to wait for a while to get served, you will get served. 

I wanted a new co2 pump and a hand pump. I left with one pump that did both jobs. He got less money, but I will return willingly. Much more so then the local bike superstore. 

As has been said above, It's quality of service and niche services they can provide that the bike superstores cannot. Quality over price.


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## stevede (4 Mar 2013)

I appreciate that the OP's original post was not about a cheap price, quite the opposite, but as the thread has evolved a quality / service theme has followed.

Below is a quote from John Ruskin, he has another excellent one along a similar vane. I have them both pinned by my desk and can often be seen pointing at them when one of my colleagues is whinging about how they cannot compete on price. The quality mentioned could easily be the service offered as well as the actual product itself. Thought it was worth sharing.

19th Century entrepreneur John Ruskin once said:

“The bitterness of poor service lasts long after the initial sweetness of a cheap price,”

“There is always somebody in the world who can provide an inferior product or service at a cheaper price. Anyone who buys from this man becomes his lawful prey.”

Above all, never be afraid to sell value to customers and remember, that quality is not expensive – It is Priceless.


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## Svendo (4 Mar 2013)

bromptonfb said:


> Ahh so it wasn't just me they don't like the look of then? It's a fair sized shop, you'd think they'd want more custom, observable old gits.


I had a poor experience there too years ago. Went in to buy my first proper bike shoes and clip in pedals. Went and asked for advice, basically told 'they're over there'. Utterly disinterested in actual service, and completely missed the chance to suggest a range of products, and buy good will for the future. I did buy the cheapest shoes and pedals and have only been there twice since for little bits when had no choice, and not for years now.
Asked about the shop with local bike clubs and riders occasionally and consensus is he and his son are miserable gits!


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## redcard (4 Mar 2013)

Willy Bain's in the south side of Glasgow. Doesn't sell bikes - just parts and repairs. Couldn't do enough when I went in for the first time. Asked me when I wanted my bike back, and felt he would keep the bill as low as he could. Spent a lot of time on my bike and gave a lot of useful advice. 

Not so local, but definitely my LBS.


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## Nebulous (4 Mar 2013)

Appropriate news item from BBC.

I haven't watched the video, just read the article but it shows how some people can break through the retailing doom and gloom.


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## MacB (4 Mar 2013)

@nickyboy has made a couple of 'to the point' contributions on this thread, taking it slightly further it really is all about the business model. A LBS is a middleman for everything but service, it's only in that area that they can out compete an internet supplier. Their USP is the value they add and that covers the entirety of the face to face, and aftercare, experience. Their business model should account for that and staff need to be employed and trained accordingly. If the owner's the problem then they are in the wrong business.

I get tired of being told I should feel sorry for the little business and the big nasty internet retailers stomping on them. When in reality they are both just different flavours of middlemen taking a cut of the pie.


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## fudgepanda (4 Mar 2013)

Lanzecki said:


> 20 secs on wiggle : http://www.wiggle.co.uk/?s=rs80


Er, yes. You and youngoldbloke are both correct, I could have checked google or wiggle but I was mid-post and have difficulty single tasking, let alone multi tasking. But thanks for the info anyway. I will look elsewhere next time.


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## Lanzecki (5 Mar 2013)

fudgepanda said:


> Er, yes. You and youngoldbloke are both correct, I could have checked google or wiggle but I was mid-post and have difficulty single tasking, let alone multi tasking. But thanks for the info anyway. I will look elsewhere next time.


 
I only had the link because I had to look them up as well. Fancy carbon alloy stuff. Spawn of the devil.


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## markharry66 (5 Mar 2013)

I have two local bike shops near me. One I used to use for service and repair of all my bikes until they were rude to me they are in Welling after being told why should I be pushed to the front of repair que (never expected to be just wanted to know when I would get my bike back). I use the one in sidcup, friendly, good advice, fair pricing vs rude and insulting think I will not be using that one ever again.


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## subaqua (5 Mar 2013)

this brings back a childhood memory of going into the LBS (W Stevenson- sadly no longer where it was in the tin shack) in my home town and asking for the multiple visor things the BMX riders of the day used. he wasn't too poleased to be asked - " do you have any rip offs ? "


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## fudgepanda (7 Mar 2013)

Lanzecki said:


> I only had the link because I had to look them up as well. Fancy carbon alloy stuff. Spawn of the devil.


Being relatively new to this cycling business I tended to think of Shimano as only making gears and the like.....until I remembered that my cycling shoes are also Shimano. And then the more I thought about it I remembered that the brakes on my bike are also Shimano. Personally I think bicycles should be made of old railway track and made in a shed by a man called Bert. Alloy? New fangled rubbish. And as for carbon, not spawn of the devil, but beelzebub himself


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## Bill-H (9 Mar 2013)

I went into my lbs asked if he could get near to online price for my bike he said yes then when I told him price he couldn't do it so I cheekily asked how much to build Internet bike quoted £25 pound so I offered the Internet price plus £20 then plus £25 as I would have had to pay that anyway I have since used this shop for everything he will try and match prices if he can I do tend to still use him if he can't . I get great service and always good advice from him and two staff members


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## Peteaud (9 Mar 2013)

tadpole said:


> Spoke tool in a "serious" Bike shop In Taunton


 
K, RC, or TBC ?

Hope not the last 2 because they have both been ok with me.


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## tadpole (11 Mar 2013)

Peteaud said:


> K, RC, or TBC ?
> 
> Hope not the last 2 because they have both been ok with me.


King's


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## Cyclopathic (11 Mar 2013)

I'm just starting out as a self employed bike mechanic so I'm happy to read here that a lot of people are willing to pay a little extra to have an analogue shopping experience. I thoroughly sympathise with the op and other people who have had bad experiences though. I have often been into bike shops and felt like an inconvenience or that I was wasting their time because I was very much a budget shopper and not able or willing to pay out huge amounts for stuff speced way beyond what I needed.
Having said that I am finding that attitudes seem to be changing for the better and lbs owners seem more willing to spend time explaining things and ensuring people get what they need not what the vendor wants to sell. As I try to build my own customer base I think the interaction with the customers is almost as important as the quality of my work (and I only say that because the quality of my work has a bearing on the safety of my customers). I know what it's like to feel belittled in a bike shop and it is something that I do not want to make my customers feel. Firstly because it's not nice and secondly out of enlightened self interest. I want them to come back and I want them to tell other people to come to me.
Mechanics not retail is the main thrust of my work but I will sell the odd thing and work out a price based on what I paid for it, what it costs in retail outlets and what it costs on line but I hope that I would never treat anyone the way the op was treated and that I would take the time to explain why I was more expensive and hope that I offered enough of a service to compensate for that. I also hope that I'd realise when I'd priced something way too high or if I might have to sell it for a fair bit less than I'd hoped because it was so cheap elsewhere. A third of the total price over the odds is just too expensive and I wouldn't expect anyone to pay. I wouldn't.
I think that there is room for the internet and the lbs because a good lbs is a godsend. When in the past I've found an lbs that really took care of me I have tended to use them a lot and happily so. 
Finally I'd add that it must get shop owners down to be constantly used as a show room where people can come along and look at the goods to make a decision and then go and buy it online. As I understand it on line buying comes with a lot of protection and you can send items back up to a week after their arrival for a full refund, no questions asked which is what they should do rather than using an lbs as if it was argos (and then ordering from home). 
Sorry for the long winded post guys.


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## uclown2002 (11 Mar 2013)

I asked Boneshakers in Harrogate to replace a free hub body, that wasn't working properly on wheels I had custom made from them at a cost of £250-£300. This was about 16 months after purchase.
When I picked the bike up I was informed that they were unable to fit a new one as the part supplied wasn't quite right. So they thought it would be a good idea without consulting me to give the hub a 'service'. When I picked the bike up they charged me £30 for the 'service' and also told me that it probably wouldn't change the way the hub was behaving. I remarked (in a non-confrontational calm manner) that £30 was therefore a complete waste of money. The mechanic, as he was processing my credit card, answered that it was also a complete waste of workshop time then!!

I was speechless. Needless to say I will never set foot in there again, and neither will any of my mates even if they giving their bikes away.

Conversely, the staff at the local Halfords branch have always been top class; so more inclined to buy bikes and stuff from them in the future.


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## bikepacker (11 Mar 2013)

I have cycled almost 100,000 miles in the last 10 years and tried out dozens of different saddles and positions. When it comes to them I know what suits me best, with that in mind I went into a lbs in Evesham because I wanted to see and buy a SMP (the one Mark Beaumont used) and this shop were listed as dealers. He obviously hadn't heard of the saddle and without asking a single question proceeded to lecture me saying; if I was having problems I had the wrong type of saddle and my postition was wrong.

My problem with this was I had never been in the shop previously or met the man, and due to my wife shopping nearby, I was in the car so he had never seen my bikes.


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## MontyVeda (11 Mar 2013)

Lanzecki said:


> That reminds me.
> 
> "Do you have a Spoke key please? I need a 4mm" "No-one of any quality has made a wheel that needs 4mm" "Best tell Shimano that" As I walk out.
> 
> ...


 
That reminds me...

walked into leisure lakes for a browse... young assistant walks past and i ask "Have you got any front pannier racks?"

He replied, "No, nobody uses front panniers."

I replied, "Well, apart from those who do... you know, for better weight distribution... it's handy on hills having some of the weight up front."

He repleid, "There aren't any hills around here."




now i've only lived in Lancaster for 40 odd years... so my local knowledge is obviously sketchy compared to some 16 year old nobber... but i'm almost certain i'd just walked up a hill to get to the fecking bike shop


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## glenn forger (11 Mar 2013)

Ha ha!


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## glenn forger (11 Mar 2013)

Anyone remember the old bike shop on St Benedicts in Norwich? Good service I suppose, but the couple who ran it were just breathtakingly rude, patronising, argumentative. It's a cafe now.


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## eck (11 Mar 2013)

glenn forger said:


> Anyone remember the old bike shop on St Benedicts in Norwich? Good service I suppose, but the couple who ran it were just breathtakingly rude, patronising, argumentative. It's a cafe now.


Aye, I remember them. I worked in Norwich in the mid 80s, and used the late Ted Henderson's shop when I could, he was a really nice guy. The son in the St Benedict's shop was ok though.


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## Grayduff (11 Mar 2013)

Finches in Reigate...Attentive, Honest, Knowledgeable and give a good discount


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## youngoldbloke (11 Mar 2013)

Often a pre-emptive strike works wonders - on one occasion browsing the bargain bits and pieces bin, looking for a seatpost, the bicycle boutique assistant asked if he could be of any assistance - 'I'm looking for a seat post' - he started to tell me there were all sorts of seatposts, sir, you probably want ..... ours tend to be _rather_ expensive..... '300mm, 27.2, 2cm plus layback, preferably carbon, cheap', I replied - we got on fine after that, and he found, and I left with a very fine, quite pricey, alloy seatpost, swapped from another customers new bike purchase, all for a tenner!


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## ayceejay (11 Mar 2013)

I was once in the book business. One day a chap came in and asked if I could order some academic books, academic books were supplied at a very small mark-up so the other bookshop in town had told him to get lost. I took his order and we talked about the subject a bit, he then produced a long list of general market books that he wanted and most were in stock. He would come back most Saturdays, five minutes before closing but I would stay open to allow him to spend at least £30 (1973). When I go to a bike shop I imagine myself as him with his attitude.


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## glenn forger (11 Mar 2013)

eck said:


> Aye, I remember them. I worked in Norwich in the mid 80s, and used the late Ted Henderson's shop when I could, he was a really nice guy. The son in the St Benedict's shop was ok though.


 
Cycled to Greece on a Peugeot Savoie I bought there, 1988.


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## Peteaud (11 Mar 2013)

tadpole said:


> King's


 
Dont use them myself.

Ralph coleman has always been good, and gives some good discounts.


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## tadpole (12 Mar 2013)

Peteaud said:


> Dont use them myself.
> 
> Ralph coleman has always been good, and gives some good discounts.


I've not used any in Taunton before, but I had a free hour and needed a shop that was open at 1630hrs on a Saturday. Kings were the only one open. I bought my spoke tool online, for a couple of quid including postage. I now have a not so local Bike shop called Woods of Hanham. Who is friendly, knowledgeably, and willing to help if you have a problem. for example a few weeks ago I bought a new chain, fitted it myself but could not get the gears to work properly, I managed to cycled to the shop, and despite him being really busy and inundated with work, he fixed the problem, at cost. So rather than by my new bike online I've ordered it through him, even then he gave me a good deal, some decent mudguards and a free service when I've had the bike a month.


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## matthat (13 Mar 2013)

Don't be buttered up with a free service after a month as thats standard on new purchases!! But other than that it sounds like you got some good service there!!


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## matthat (13 Mar 2013)

When i was a kid i used to use a little old shop in Tiptree called Furni Plus! The best bike shop in the world i reckon!! As a kid i really didn't understand the business economics of the world which is probably why its now closed down and also due to the fact that the owner would now be 75!! Proper greasy old building with tubs and pots of bits everywhere!! Aladdin's cave!!


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## Deleted member 20519 (13 Mar 2013)

ziggys101 said:


> My* local LBS* is pretty good, when looking for my last bike I asked him if he could get close to deals I'd seen online he tried but couldn't get near, so I didn't buy from him but because he tried and was helpful i have bought nearly everything else I have bought for the bike from him, he always gives me a small discount. If the service is right then I dont mind paying a little extra for it.


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## nickyboy (13 Mar 2013)

jazloc said:


>


kind of place that would ask you for your PIN number


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## Kestevan (14 Mar 2013)

My LBS owner (V cycles in Brighouse) is definately a "character"..... he's a bit like marmite.

Does do a good job though, and he's actually a nice bloke when you get past the rudeness, sarcasm and apparant disdain for customers


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## Richard A Thackeray (14 Mar 2013)

I'm very happy with my 'LBS'
Sadly I don't ride as much as I did, so don't go as often now.

I bought my last bike from there, Gary 'sized' me up by eye, & to his credit/experience, it's a superb fit, and feels just right.
I also bought my Dyna-Tech from ther back in 1994, Gary fettled the wheels, and they're still fine to this day (having only been tried once about 10 years ago)
He's also built cross-wheels for me in the past, and those have survived horribly rough/stoney courses.


Gary bought the shop from the previous owner, when he retired (Gary had worked there for years prior)

The shop? http://kendellcycles.co.uk/


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## Crankarm (15 Mar 2013)

There are some real tossers who work in bike shops though aren't there. There is one at Grafham Cycles which spoils it as pretty much all the others are ok. He's just got a real attitude. It's not as if he owns the place either, he's just an employee amongst many.


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## avalon (15 Mar 2013)

Part of the problem is that a lot of the people who work in cycle shops are not cyclist or people people, or they are "real cyclists''/ pro wannabes and anyone who is not "one of them'' is not worthy of their respect.


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## Kies (15 Mar 2013)

G3CWI said:


> ...so you have to adapt to the trading environment or go extinct.



This is the reality ... Adapt or go out of business. Every item has a mark up .... Sometimes it's worth selling a lost leader for that return business.
A smile and friendly manner goes a long long way


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## mickle (15 Mar 2013)

Kies said:


> Every item has a mark up .... Sometimes it's worth selling a lost leader for that return business.


No. It's not. Nor is it legal.


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## ianrauk (15 Mar 2013)

Crankarm said:


> There are some real tossers who work in bike shops though aren't there. There is one at Grafham Cycles which spoils it as pretty much all the others are ok. He's just got a real attitude. It's not as if he owns the place either, he's just an employee amongst many.


 

If customers think the guy has a poor attitude then surely the owner/management must too.


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## avalon (15 Mar 2013)

Kies said:


> This is the reality ... Adapt or go out of business. Every item has a mark up .... Sometimes it's worth selling a lost leader for that return business.
> A smile and friendly manner goes a long long way


I know, as someone who has worked in the cycle industry and as a customer that if you can't supply the goods the customer will go elsewhere, and elsewhere these days can be anywhere in the world. When I left school I worked as a bicycle mechanic for the biggest bike shop in town. I also had a Freewheel mail order catalogue and a lot of the parts that they had on sale I couldn't get from my boss who would want to sell me an alternative that I didn't want. So, I went to the competition where I didn't get a staff discount but I got what I wanted.
The point is, that if, as a dealer you can't always make a profit or buy at trade prices then sometimes it makes sense to sell at cost price or even at a loss to ensure future business from the customer, and the chances are, that if you are selling an expensive quality part at a good price, with a smile, the customer will come back again and again.


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## Boris Bajic (15 Mar 2013)

Logically, a shop not offering what customers wanted or needed would fold.

I do feel that some of the 'obnoxious' people in some posts here were just having a bad day or perhaps the customer wasn't aware that he came across as an Internet-fed know-all whose pound was going elsewhere whatever the answer.

There is also the aspect that with the wonderful but unlikely and unpredictable blossoming of road cycling from a minority sport to the new golf, a new breed of customer has arrived: Fed by endless road tests of Gucci stuff, wanting only the best and prepared to pay for that 'boutique' service. If this is happening (and one suspects it is in places) then it will shift things in the retail trade.

I suspect that most keen cyclists enjoy what I enjoy: A wonderful LBS who manages to increase our expectations to absurd levels with one excellent piece of service and then bring us down to reality with the occasional invoice that is 4% more than the Scot in us all thought it ought to be.

If my LBS went out of business, I'd almost feel the need for a wake.


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## youngoldbloke (15 Mar 2013)

I've given up on most of them locally as they have become little more than brand boutiques - all Specialized, or Trek/Bontrager - the choice that the traditional LBS gave has all but disappeared.


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## User16625 (15 Mar 2013)

avalon said:


> I know, as someone who has worked in the cycle industry and as a customer that if you can't supply the goods the customer will go elsewhere, and elsewhere these days can be anywhere in the world. When I left school I worked as a bicycle mechanic for the biggest bike shop in town. I also had a Freewheel mail order catalogue and a lot of the parts that they had on sale I couldn't get from my boss who would want to sell me an alternative that I didn't want. So, I went to the competition where I didn't get a staff discount but I got what I wanted.
> The point is, that if, as a dealer you can't always make a profit or buy at trade prices then sometimes it makes sense to sell at cost price or even at a loss to ensure future business from the customer, and the chances are*, that if you are selling an expensive quality part at a good price, with a smile, the customer will come back again and again*.


 
YEAH!! Unlike halfords the useless ****s. Why is it that some places sell downright rubbish and provide terrible service yet they not out of business? Just goes to show it doesnt matter how crap your service is so long as theres enough numpties out there that dont know any better.


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## nickyboy (15 Mar 2013)

RideLikeTheStig said:


> YEAH!! Unlike halfords the useless ****s. Why is it that some places sell downright rubbish and provide terrible service yet they not out of business? Just goes to show it doesnt matter how crap your service is so long as theres enough numpties out there that dont know any better.


 
Halfords are the number 1 bike retailer in the UK and have been for some years. They must be doing something right, so let's take a look at it.

Their target market is not cyclechat posters. Let them go to the specialist LBS. Their market is parents buying bikes for their kids AND people who feel entirely uncomfortable with the idea of setting foot in a LBS. There are loads of these people.

So why don't they want to set foot in a LBS? Well part of it is down to the whole "retail experience". They want something like going to Tesco. Nice layout, good lighting, reasonable (in their view) range of product, no personal relationship with the staff. No grumpy old guy who used to race 30 years ago looking down his nose at them. LBS are just too intimidating for someone who just wants to buy a bike.

Sure, maybe they would be ultimately better off going to a LBS to buy their bike but the problem is the LBS, not Halfords


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## subaqua (15 Mar 2013)

nickyboy said:


> Halfords are the number 1 bike retailer in the UK and have been for some years. They must be doing something right, so let's take a look at it.
> 
> Their target market is not cyclechat posters. Let them go to the specialist LBS. Their market is parents buying bikes for their kids AND people who feel entirely uncomfortable with the idea of setting foot in a LBS. There are loads of these people.
> 
> ...


 
I wasn't a cyclechatter when i had my 1st bike bought for me. bought from an LBS with a grumpy guy behind the counter. (TBF the internet wasn't available then) neither was I a cyclechatter when i got re bitten by the bug 10 or so yrs after learning to drive, went to a LBS no longer there ( Daycocks on Leytonstone High road) and a further 10 yrs on from that when i got properly back into cycling i looked at halfrauds and didn't like the attitude of the staff there trying to sell me something i didn't want. I went to a "supermarket" but a chain with a good pedigree in bikes - Decathlon. where the spotty yoof was enthusiatic about bikes and asked decent questions then made a good recommendation. which I ignored and bought the next model up. maybe that was hios sales plan , who knows but it was the 1st of several bikes for ME that i have bought from there.

maybe because i have a bit of prior knowledge and know when a bike is badly built , but wifey was clueless about halfords and she didn't like the place.


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## RWright (16 Mar 2013)

I went in a Specialized dealer in a larger town, my town only has one small shop. I had just stopped in to look around. It was very slow but no salesperson was up front when I went in. A guy wearing a shop shirt walked up and we briefly started talking and I told him I was just looking around. We just briefly chatted for a second and I spotted a Venge. I am sure most of you know them and would have know them by sight, but I knew of them but hadn't really paid much attention to them in photos I had seen. The flat black one that I saw immediately got my attention. They are a very striking bike to see in person, at least to me it was.

I said what is that? His reply was "a bicycle". I sold Motorcycles for quite a while and his statement was a painful reminder to me why we always tried to keep the grease monkeys at the back in the shop and not on the showroom floor. I have seen them do much more harm than good. I am not saying all of them are, but I will say that GOOD sales people make a huge difference.

After that little encounter I quickly brushed that guy off and continued to look around. The next guy was a good salesperson. He knew I was just kicking tires but he engaged me in some interesting conversation about new bikes and equipment. He is a mountain endurance rider probably not even 30 years old and I am a middle age overweight fitness road rider. He was a soft spoken, polite, informed, nice person that took time to listen as well. A crucial quality for a good sales person IMHO.

He made my trip to the store seem worthwhile even not buying anything. I have not really looked at DI2 very closely because of the cost vs. my skill level scenario. This guy sold me on it. I do feel like there could well be a UI2 somewhere in my future. I thought it was great. I didn't ride it but we did play around with it on the floor. I was really impressed. I didn't realize when they say push button they mean it. I though there would be some mechanical motion in there for some reason, the sales guy said a lot of people do. If I were a woman with small hands it would be top of the must have list. Even being a man with hands large enough to palm a basketball, I still want one.  My sales guy this day was a credit to the industry, even if he didn't sell me anything.


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## Pumpkin the robot (17 Mar 2013)

Grayduff said:


> Finches in Reigate...Attentive, Honest, Knowledgeable and give a good discount


I always used Pratts in Salfords, which, sadly, I recently found out is no longer there. The bikes in there never seemed to change, but his knowledge of bikes and mechanics was excellent.


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## Rupie (20 Mar 2013)

bikepacker said:


> I have cycled almost 100,000 miles in the last 10 years and tried out dozens of different saddles and positions. When it comes to them I know what suits me best, with that in mind I went into a lbs in Evesham because I wanted to see and buy a SMP (the one Mark Beaumont used) and this shop were listed as dealers. He obviously hadn't heard of the saddle and without asking a single question proceeded to lecture me saying; if I was having problems I had the wrong type of saddle and my postition was wrong.
> 
> My problem with this was I had never been in the shop previously or met the man, and due to my wife shopping nearby, I was in the car so he had never seen my bikes.


I've been into the shop I think you are talking about. Sometimes he can be completly the opposite and so helpfull and full of advice, you struggle to get out. I clearly depends on the day.


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