# Atrial fibrillation and cycling



## marzjennings (29 Sep 2018)

Anyone here been diagnosed with atrial fibrillation and are still cycling for either touring, sport or leisure? After a weird week I dropped by the Doc today and she thinks I have AFIB. EKG confirmed something is irregular and she's recommended a couple of cardiac specialists to go see to confirm her diagnosis, find out why at 49 I've developed AFIB and hopefully get back on the mend. Appointment for Monday with the specialist.

Has any recovered from AFIB and got back on the bike? And does anyone currently ride with AFIB?

I have a new bike being built as I was planning some long distance rides in 2019, and a garage full of road, off-road and cruisers. Worried that I may to jack it all in and take up something slower, like knitting or bowling.


EDIT: I may have answered my own question by searching through old CC threads, seems a lot of people have dealt with and are dealing with some major heart issues and are still getting the miles in. Nice. Maybe I don't have to ebay off my bikes yet.


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## ColinJ (29 Sep 2018)

I developed a very irregular heart rhythm when I suffered a massive pulmonary embolism in 2012. The doctors told me that the clotted pulmonary artery was bulging against one side of my heart, which probably wasn't helping. The problem was pretty horrible back then - it felt like I had a bird trapped and freaking out in my chest! 

It gradually got better over the following year or so and I was able to start cycling again but at first I couldn't exert myself much without bring on AFIB again and once it had started it could go on for hours so I became very cautious about over-exertion.

I still get the problem if I push myself to my limits but I can usually get away with short bursts to about 90-95%. 

I still occasionally get random bouts of AFIB which can last an hour or two. They are not pleasant but I am used to them so I don't panic. I get shortness of breath during those episodes. I try to relax and wait for them to pass.

AFIB can cause dangerous clotting so sufferers may have to take anticoagulants to reduce the risk of that happening, but I am already on them for the original clotting problem so I didn't have any extra treatment.

Obviously, listen to your doctor, but hopefully you will be able to still ride your bike fairly energetically. Racing might be out of the question though - I remember a couple of pros retiring early because of AFIB.

Good luck!


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## MartinQ (29 Sep 2018)

ColinJ said:


> I developed a very irregular heart rhythm when I suffered a massive pulmonary embolism in 2012. The doctors told me that the clotted pulmonary artery was bulging against one side of my heart, which probably wasn't helping. The problem was pretty horrible back then - it felt like I had a bird trapped and freaking out in my chest!
> 
> It gradually got better over the following year or so and I was able to start cycling again but at first I couldn't exert myself much without bring on AFIB again and once it had started it could go on for hours so I became very cautious about over-exertion.
> 
> ...



^^^^^^^^^^^
Wot he said. Get yourself checked out (as you are) and see if they can find a reason. 

Although if you're on the tall side (~6ft4) and you're giving your bikes up for free (including postage), I'd err on the safe side and post them all to me now. Get your knitting needles ready :-).


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## CXRAndy (29 Sep 2018)

I had Lone AF several years ago. Started one night and continued into next day .165bpm laid down. I was admitted into ITU and prescribed intravenous drugs to slow down my heart after digitalis didn't work. 

I had drugs for several months, but felt fine, so asked to come off drugs. I was given a heart monitor for 48hrs to record my heart whilst doing normal activities including cycling. Heart came back normal. Came off drugs but was advised to take aspirin and statins, which I have done since. I had heart scans, x-ray and ultrasound to check heart. 

Never want it back and those who have ongoing issues you have my sympathy.


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## Bobby Mhor (29 Sep 2018)

Recently diagnosed with it, I noticed something amiss a week before I had to see a cardiologist on another matter, tested and now taking something for it.
Still putting the miles in and not deviating from anything I did before.
My chest HRM was showing crazy readings at the time. 
If you count Fort William to Inverness as touring, yeah and plans to do more this year.
(nothing grand though)


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## Houthakker (29 Sep 2018)

Echo the above. At about 55 I started with infrequent attacks, sometimes they would go on their own after a while, couple of times needed hospital treatment. Was given sone tables I could take if I had an attack which usually worked, but was advised to have an ablation to laser off some of the nerve endings in the heart. First two didn't work as well as hoped but am hoping that the third one (Jan this year) has done the trick. Have been cycling all they way through it apart from a couple of weeks after each op, much to the concern of SWMBO who would rather I sat in an armchair. Helps that my cardiologist is a triathlete though cos every time she said to him "He'll need to take it easy now and stay off the bike" he replied"No, just carry on doing exactly what you were before. It might be uncomfortable but AF won't kill you" 
Good luck with yours.


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## Brandane (29 Sep 2018)

Houthakker said:


> AF won't kill you


My cardiologist said the same; BUT.... AF can cause the formation of blood clots, and THEY can kill you.


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## Brandane (29 Sep 2018)

@marzjennings .....
My history (shortened version!)....
I used to get irregular heart rhythms as far back as I can remember; when playing sports at school they would come on - but would go away as suddenly as they had come on, usually after about a minute or two of resting. I assumed that they were normal at the time, and as they never caused me any real problems I didn't tell anyone about them.. This went on for all of my adult life, very occasionally (maybe 3 or 4 episodes per year). Each time was only a matter of a minute or two, and then straight back into normal rhythm.

Until one afternoon in 1999, aged 37, when I was in the Police. Luckily I was in the Police Office at the time and not out trying to tame some angry Buckfast fueled lunatic... The AF kicked off and I did my usual - went for a seat and waited the customary minute or two - but no, this time it didn't stop. After half an hour I went to the duty Sergeant who got a car in to take me to hospital. I was rigged up to the heart monitor machine and that's when I was diagnosed with the AF.. The AF lasted until about 8am the next morning then suddenly reverted to normal again.

I was put on Flecainide Acetate, 2 x 100mg per day, which cured the problem. A few years later they added 1 x 1.25mg per day of Bisoprolol (a beta blocker). My eldest brother has the same condition and is on the Flecainide but not the Bisoprolol - but he has a blood thinning drug to take, which I don't. Nearly 20 years now, I am still on the same medication. No repeat episodes, but if I forget to take my meds then I sometimes get a wee blip from my heart to remind me!

As for cycling - it hasn't stopped me. Recently did 500 miles over 7 days from the SW corner of Scotland to the NE corner. I am not fast, but I can put in the miles. I put this down to the fact that my heart rate is regulated by meds, so it might be that it is like driving a car fitted with a restrictor of some sort. I could of course be wrong and it's just that I'm an old duffer! Whatever, I still enjoy cycling at MY pace. If you do intend to knock yourself out by trying to imitate the pro's, then it might be an idea to have a talk with your Doc first..

There is now an op they can do to correct AF, involving a laser. I spoke to my Cardiologist about this but she said there were risks attached and that since my meds were doing the job, I should stick with that.

Good luck and hope it all works out..


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## ColinJ (29 Sep 2018)

Ha, bloody _typical _- I developed a mild AFIB this morning! I can feel that my pulse is slightly irregular and I am a tad short of breath. I will still go out on my bike today but I will do an easier ride than I had planned before the AFIB came on. If my heart settles down, I'll extend the ride. If it gets worse, I'll give up and come home.


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## marzjennings (29 Sep 2018)

MartinQ said:


> ^^^^^^^^^^^
> Wot he said. Get yourself checked out (as you are) and see if they can find a reason.
> 
> Although if you're on the tall side (~6ft4) and you're giving your bikes up for free (including postage), I'd err on the safe side and post them all to me now. Get your knitting needles ready :-).


Hey let me get buried first . But I am 6'4" and if the news from the Doc is total shite I may indeed dm you for a delivery address.


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## marzjennings (29 Sep 2018)

Many thanks for all the truly inspiring stories, given me some real hope that my riding days are not over.


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## Brandane (29 Sep 2018)

marzjennings said:


> my riding days are not over.


They are absolutely NOT! The staff at the cardiology unit of Inverclyde Hospital are always amused when I turn up for my occasional check-up (VERY occasional; must be at least 5 years since the last one) having cycled the hilly route from home to get there (15 miles each way, but that's a lot to non cycling nurses!). Then they make me do an excercise ECG .


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## ColinJ (29 Sep 2018)

I nipped out this afternoon and did 24 km with 700 metres of climbing (15 miles, 2,300 ft) despite AFIB making my heart wibble away. I used a low gear and took my time on the steep stuff but at least I got my sunny ride in. I'm enjoying a big mug of coffee now despite the fact that I think that coffee can make the AFIB last a bit longer. You only live once, eh? 

(But obviously, get the go-ahead from your doctor(s) for whatever you plan to do!)


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## gazza1 (6 Oct 2018)

I was diagnosed with afib about 20yrs ago, I am now 60. They tried to reverse it with cardio version, which is a electric shock administered with the paddles to the chest. They try 3 times and that’s it. Didn’t work for me. I have been a runner all my life and lived quite happily with afib, with very little noticeable impact on my everyday life. I take warfarin daily and have regular blood checks. I only started monitoring my hr about 5 or 6yrs ago and found that my hr would escalate to around the 250 mark when doing a fartlek. Thought this was a bit high, so saw a consultant who told me that this was no problem and to carry on with training.
Present day. I gave up running due to injury and am now cycling and push myself a lot harder than when I was running. I feel I am fitter than I ever was and have no problems doing hard intervals on the bike. I am in the process of sorting out a heart rate monitor to use with my iPad and bkool. That’s another story. But as far as afib goes, keep training and don’t worry about it.


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## Houthakker (7 Oct 2018)

Brandane said:


> My cardiologist said the same; BUT.... AF can cause the formation of blood clots, and THEY can kill you.



Echo that. Forgot to say they put me on Rovoroxaban which is anticoagulant, Easier to manage than Warfarin apparently.


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## ColinJ (7 Oct 2018)

The British Heart Foundation have produced a useful booklet on AF(IB), available HERE.


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## MartinQ (7 Oct 2018)

Houthakker said:


> Echo that. Forgot to say they put me on Rovoroxaban which is anticoagulant, Easier to manage than Warfarin apparently.



Maybe for some people, I clotted again on Rivaoxaban so back on the warfarin :-). Ho hum ...


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## ColinJ (7 Oct 2018)

MartinQ said:


> Maybe for some people, I clotted again on Rivaoxaban so back on the warfarin :-). Ho hum ...


Right, well that has confirmed my choice not to make the change to NOACs! 

I am getting along fine on Warfarin, but having to go back to venous blood sampling recently is a bloody pain in the ar...m!  I'm sure that you will be having the same experience? The nurse told me that all of the test strips for the fingerprick tests have been recalled nationally. Sounds like a serious cockup in the supply chain. It makes me wonder whether the machines had been misreading for some time?


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## MartinQ (7 Oct 2018)

ColinJ said:


> Right, well that has confirmed my choice not to make the change to NOACs!
> 
> I am getting along fine on Warfarin, but having to go back to venous blood sampling recently is a bloody pain in the ar...m!  I'm sure that you will be having the same experience? The nurse told me that all of the test strips for the fingerprick tests have been recalled nationally. Sounds like a serious cockup in the supply chain. It makes me wonder whether the machines had been misreading for some time?



Yeah. TBH I don't really think the particular anticoag a biggie either way. As long as you're "happy" with things as they are, no reason to change. I'd heard about the recall, but have always done the Hancock method and never done home checking so it passed me by. I'm on the higher range now (3-4) and had a 5+ a couple of checks ago. Nothing compared to the 15+ I once had - I was rather proud of that :-).


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## Freelanderuk (8 Oct 2018)

ColinJ said:


> Right, well that has confirmed my choice not to make the change to NOACs!
> 
> I am getting along fine on Warfarin, but having to go back to venous blood sampling recently is a bloody pain in the ar...m!  I'm sure that you will be having the same experience? The nurse told me that all of the test strips for the fingerprick tests have been recalled nationally. Sounds like a serious cockup in the supply chain. It makes me wonder whether the machines had been misreading for some time?



Why have they being recalled , my inr results have been jumping all over the place and I have had to go every week to have it checked, this has been happening for the last couple of months, due at Dr's again Thursday for check so will make a point of asking
Cheers


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## ColinJ (8 Oct 2018)

Freelanderuk said:


> Why have they being recalled , my inr results have been jumping all over the place and I have had to go every week to have it checked, this has been happening for the last couple of months, due at Dr's again Thursday for check so will make a point of asking
> Cheers


I don't know, but my numbers seem better since going back to the old tests. I have another on Thursday myself so I'll ask for more info too.


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## MartinQ (8 Oct 2018)

Freelanderuk said:


> Why have they being recalled , my inr results have been jumping all over the place and I have had to go every week to have it checked, this has been happening for the last couple of months, due at Dr's again Thursday for check so will make a point of asking
> Cheers



I think this is it
https://jdrf.org.uk/news/important-notice-accu-chek-test-strip-recall/
but check with your docs, rather than believing what you read online :-)


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## ColinJ (8 Oct 2018)

MartinQ said:


> I think this is it
> https://jdrf.org.uk/news/important-notice-accu-chek-test-strip-recall/
> but check with your docs, rather than believing what you read online :-)


Blimey, that was a potentially life-threatening cock-up! 

Now that they know about the problem it is just a nuisance for all concerned. It is obviously a lot more work to take venous samples and ship them off to a lab for testing than to just put a drop of blood on a test strip in a machine and wait 20 seconds for a result.

I'm not a big fan of having needles stuck in my arm but the last few times the person wielding the needle did at least know what she was doing so I hardly felt it. I had one a few years back though who didn't have a clue - she missed the vein and wiggled the needle about for several seconds trying to find it ... that was nasty and damn painful!


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## MartinQ (8 Oct 2018)

ColinJ said:


> Blimey, that was a potentially life-threatening cock-up!
> 
> Now that they know about the problem it is just a nuisance for all concerned. It is obviously a lot more work to take venous samples and ship them off to a lab for testing than to just put a drop of blood on a test strip in a machine and wait 20 seconds for a result.
> 
> I'm not a big fan of having needles stuck in my arm but the last few times the person wielding the needle did at least know what she was doing so I hardly felt it. I had one a few years back though who didn't have a clue - she missed the vein and wiggled the needle about for several seconds trying to find it ... that was nasty and damn painful!



Yeah, I still remember when I had the cannula for my first ct scan .... ouch.


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## ColinJ (8 Oct 2018)

MartinQ said:


> Yeah, I still remember when I had the cannula for my first ct scan .... ouch.


I hated them - the back of the hand is so delicate!


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## david k (28 Oct 2018)

I've had AF fairly severe, treated with an ablation.

Consultant told me to exercise but not to push to hard, he said people think they are doing well doing marathons but he advises against such activities. 

It suits me as I can feel ill if I push to hard, walking and steady cycling is fine, regardless of time and distance, I just try not to raise my HB too much


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## ColinJ (8 Nov 2018)

ColinJ said:


> I am getting along fine on Warfarin, but having to go back to venous blood sampling recently is a bloody pain in the ar...m!  I'm sure that you will be having the same experience? The nurse told me that all of the test strips for the fingerprick tests have been recalled nationally. Sounds like a serious cockup in the supply chain. It makes me wonder whether the machines had been misreading for some time?


I just had another INR blood sample taken and had a chat with the nurse. She said that they had noticed that machine readings had started to get erratic. Then they had one patient whose INR was given by the machine as a very high 8 so they took a venous sample and had that tested in the lab. The correct result was a scary 13!!!! Shortly after that the test strips were recalled. They are hoping that the situation will be resolved soon.

For those of you who don't know what these numbers mean - INR stands for International Normalised Ratio, a measure of the clotting time of blood. 'Normal' blood has a value of 1.0. I am medicated to try to get my blood into a therapeutic range of 2.0 - 3.0. Some people with artificial heart valves might be aiming for 2.5 - 3.5. The higher the number, the more 'bleedy' you are. If my INR were 2.5 then my blood would take 2.5 times longer to clot than a typical person's. You can see why 8 is potentially a serious problem. As for 13 ... an injury which would have bled for 5 minutes in the typical person, would bleed for over an hour in that _over_-anticoagulated person. For example, an otherwise minor head injury might cause dangerous bleeding on the brain.


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## Freelanderuk (8 Nov 2018)

My range is 2 to 3 and my readings have been all over the place alately , I asked about the dodgy test strips and there answer was it only affects readings over 5 ,mine are usually under my range


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## ColinJ (8 Nov 2018)

Freelanderuk said:


> My range is 2 to 3 and my readings have been all over the place alately , I asked about the dodgy test strips and there answer was it only affects readings over 5 ,mine are usually under my range


I think that nobody should be relying on important medical test equipment only being half-unreliable! Apart from which, I don't believe that - my readings were sometimes much higher than usual AND sometimes much lower than usual before they stopped using the machines here. Mysteriously, since going back to venous testing the readings have settled down again!


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## Freelanderuk (8 Nov 2018)

I can only report what I was told ,they are still using the test strips and little machine in my surgery will ask again when back next week ,I have been on warfarin since 2002 when I had a stroke


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## ColinJ (8 Nov 2018)

Freelanderuk said:


> I can only report what I was told ,they are still using the test strips and little machine in my surgery will ask again when back next week ,I have been on warfarin since 2002 when I had a stroke


Oh - I thought that it was a nationwide recall. Anyway, no harm in making sure.

The problem in my case was that the clinic started messing with my dosage to deal with the spurious readings. I had been stable for nearly 3 years so I couldn't understand why things had suddenly went wrong, but then the recall happened and all became clear. 

Now I am back on the original dose and the readings have returned to normal.


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## Freelanderuk (9 Nov 2018)

That's good that all is back to normal, when I first started on it I had to travel 15 miles to the local hospital to have blood taken for the inr reading this was then phoned threw to the surgery where I then gad to make an appointment to get my readings and recommend dose of warfarin, what a faf and used to take about 3 days

When they take your blood do they do a test straight away and give you your readings as I don't think my surgery could do thst


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## ColinJ (9 Nov 2018)

Freelanderuk said:


> That's good that all is back to normal, when I first started on it I had to travel 15 miles to the local hospital to have blood taken for the inr reading this was then phoned threw to the surgery where I then gad to make an appointment to get my readings and recommend dose of warfarin, what a faf and used to take about 3 days
> 
> *When they take your blood do they do a test straight away and give you your readings as I don't think my surgery could do thst*


No. I have the sample taken at the local health centre and they ship it off to a clinic in Huddersfield which does the tests for the whole area. They are very quick. I normally get a letter from them the following afternoon, so it should arrive in about 3 hours. If the results require a change of dose then they phone as well. It is a good system, but obviously getting instant results from the machine was better. (And I prefer having a small needle stuck in a finger, rather than a larger one in my arm, though the nurse yesterday said that some patients (bizarrely!) refuse to have their fingers pricked and demand that the needle goes in the arm!)


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## cuberider (31 Dec 2018)

Having suffered from 2 episodes of AF in the mid 90's and given digoxin, I was surprised to get a third late on Christmas Eve. Went to A&E and was sent home 3 or 4 hours later after an ECG, blood tests, a chest x-ray and 2 bisoprolol tablets which worked quickly. I followed it up with a GP appointment today, who said to hold back on cycling "unless I could hold a conversation while doing it" and keep off the alcohol for now. It seems that a few people I know suffer from it which I wasnt aware of until now.

Have got an appointment to make with a cardiologist, and intend to do a little light cycling, and maybe walk a bit more until then. Its a bad time of year to go tee-total though!


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## 12boy (8 Jan 2019)

I too have AFIB, although mine is asymptomatic. I was having a problem with standing up after sitting or crouching then taking a few steps and passing out and the resulting tests discovered the AFIB. I'm almost 70 and it is likely if I don't get killed on a bike or in a car I will ultimately stroke out. If I do have a stroke I hope it is fatal and not one that leaves you half paralyzed or unable to speak or think clearly. For the time being I do everything I always have, although I don,t have the stamina I once did. As Woody Allen once said...."I am not afraid to die, I just don't want to be there when it happens.


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## ColinJ (8 Jan 2019)

12boy said:


> I too have AFIB, although mine is asymptomatic. I was having a problem with standing up after sitting or crouching then taking a few steps and passing out and the resulting tests discovered the AFIB. I'm almost 70 and it is likely if I don't get killed on a bike or in a car I will ultimately stroke out. If I do have a stroke I hope it is fatal and not one that leaves you half paralyzed or unable to speak or think clearly. For the time being I do everything I always have, although I don,t have the stamina I once did. As Woody Allen once said...."I am not afraid to die, I just don't want to be there when it happens.


Aren't you taking anything (warfarin etc.) to reduce the risk of a stroke?


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## 12boy (9 Jan 2019)

I take a 350 mg aspirin daily. When I am 75 the doc said I'll need to go on warfarin, coumadin or something stronger than aspirin.


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## ColinJ (9 Jan 2019)

12boy said:


> I take a 350 mg aspirin daily. When I am 75 the doc said I'll need to go on warfarin, coumadin or something stronger than aspirin.


I'd ask for a second opinion on that - not much point in putting off taking a more effective medication until 75 if you end up having a devastating stroke before then! 

Take a look at THIS ARTICLE. (Maybe your stroke risk is less than you hinted at though, in which case aspirin might well be the right choice anyway.)


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## 12boy (9 Jan 2019)

Because I am only 69, get a couple of hours of vigorous exercise daily, have low cholesterol, don't smoke ( since 1989), and I am not obese, I am in the low risk category. Apparently when 75 even if all the above is still true, I am in the higher risk category by virtue of age alone, and Warfarin is in the future. As that great English poet, Sir Mick Jagger, once sang "what a drag it is getting old". But not as big a drag as not getting old. Thanks for the article, though.


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## ColinJ (9 Jan 2019)

12boy said:


> Because I am only 69, get a couple of hours of vigorous exercise daily, have low cholesterol, don't smoke ( since 1989), and I am not obese, I am in the low risk category. Apparently when 75 even if all the above is still true, I am in the higher risk category by virtue of age alone, and Warfarin is in the future. As that great English poet, Sir Mick Jagger, once sang "what a drag it is getting old". But not as big a drag as not getting old. Thanks for the article, though.


Well, good luck with it!

I am getting on okay with the warfarin so I'll stick with it. (I tried stopping after my first illness but got ill again 4 months later so I am on it for life now.)


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## mojames (24 Jan 2019)

On January 6th I went out for a 2 hour ride and whilst making my way on a flat road 6 miles from home, I was having heart palpitations for around a minute or so.
I've had the odd one before but for this episode to last so long, was unnerving. They eventually stopped as I slowed my pace right down but my HR was increasing. I thought that it might correct itself on the journey home. After an hour at home the HR didn't come down, in fact, it went up to around 170 bpm. 
My partner drove me to A&E and I was admitted for two days. I was given a 23 hour infusion which brought my HR back to normal. I had 2 ECG's and the
X-RAY and Echocardigraph were all clear.
The consultant told me I had an Atrial Flutter and obviously I was keen on what he thought may have triggered the episode.
He told me that my white blood cell count was slightly raised and that I had an underlying infection which was a possible contributor and for this he put me on Antibiotics. He also thought that the amount of alcohol I consumed on New Years Eve, contributed. Now, I very rarely drink, I probably have a couple of bottles of beer once in a blue moon. On this particular night, I drank 3 large Gins, 4 beers and two glasses of Champagne over a period of around 7 hours.
Believe me, that will never happen again. I was surprised though to think this would have an effect 5 days later.
I was given the all clear, told to rest for four weeks and discharged without any meds. The consultant said he had no reason as to why I can't go back to carrying on the way I did on the bike. He did say he'd like to do a check up in three months.
The thing is, due to my work commitments, I don't get out on the bike as regularly as I used to. The last two years or so, I will often go without riding for up to two weeks and then when I do, I go out hard.
Also, I like coffee, I'll have maybe four or five a day. Now after that small drama, I've restricted it to just one 'Proper' coffee in the morning and then the rest are decaf.

As from next week I'm back on the bike and I'll admit that I'm nervous about it. Be sure that I'll be building it back up slowly.


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## cuberider (24 Jan 2019)

I was advised to give up alcohol if I could, which I have, but no cause was found. Should have been seeing an electro physiologist in late February, but that has now been put back to April, so apart from the drink, it's business as usual, although my lovely wife would like to bubble wrap me


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## busdennis (28 Jan 2020)

Time for me to join this thread as the AF fairy has visited me in the last week. Im 48 and fairly fit and have been racing cyclocross all winter. It lasted 36 hours which started with fast AF (pulse 166) which was sorted in ED over 8 hrs with medication (beta blocker and anticoagulant) and i was discharged in AF (pulse rate now 70 to 80) to see if i self reverted or needed a cardioversion. I reverted spontaneously without more treatment.

Im a nurse in the NHS so know a little but im no expert. 3 DR's ive spoken to have all given me different advise but i went with the one who said it was OK to stop the beta blocker to see what happened with my HR and stop the anticoagulant as my VARS risk of stroke was zero.
It was also OK to keep on cycling has im keen to start training for the Majorca 312 which ive already entered but no real fast stuff for a while until i see the cardiologist. Will report what happens but ive got 150 miles in so far

Finally a local cyclist has been in contact with me who has had AF weekly for over six months who has seen a private cardiologist provided by work, hes been fitted with a loop recorder but he also his on no medication. It does seem that there is a variation on treatment depending on who you see


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## GuyBoden (4 Dec 2022)

My wife has done some work with the Stroke association, they have produced an informative leaflet about AF.

I'm thinking of asking my GP to check for the condition with a simple 10min ECG test.

https://www.stroke.org.uk/sites/default/files/publications/atrial_fibrillation_and_stroke_guide.pdf

"There are different types of heart rhythm problem (arrhythmia), and atrial fibrillation is the most common. Around 1.4 million people in the UK have AF. It’s a major risk factor for stroke, and around 20% of all strokes are caused by AF."


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## All uphill (4 Dec 2022)

GuyBoden said:


> My wife has done some work with the Stroke association, they have produced an informative leaflet about AF.
> 
> I'm thinking of asking my GP to check for the condition with a simple 10min ECG test.
> 
> ...



Thanks for that, Guy, a very useful reminder.

I've had the occasional flutter over the last twenty years; maybe ten times per year. Cutting out coffee and alcohol helped and reducing my salt intake has made a big difference and now I can go months with no symptoms. 

A couple of weeks ago I fancied a hot coffee mid ride and enjoyed it; lying in bed that night my heart was fluttering for the first time in months - it took me a while to make the link.


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## ColinJ (4 Dec 2022)

All uphill said:


> I've had the occasional flutter over the last twenty years; maybe ten times per year. Cutting out coffee and alcohol helped and reducing my salt intake has made a big difference and now I can go months with no symptoms.


I had forgotten that alcohol used to sometimes give me the flutters. I haven't drunk any for 10 years so that has helped.

I drink 2 mugs of coffee most afternoons. I don't know if giving those up would help with the occasional flutters that I still get. I don't get enough flutters to be able to notice a reduction immediately so I would have to have a couple of flutter-free months before I was sure. Maybe I will try. The thing is... I _like _drinking the coffee!


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## All uphill (4 Dec 2022)

ColinJ said:


> I had forgotten that alcohol used to sometimes give me the flutters. I haven't drunk any for 10 years so that has helped.
> 
> I drink 2 mugs of coffee most afternoons. I don't know if giving those up would help with the occasional flutters that I still get. I don't get enough flutters to be able to notice a reduction immediately so I would have to have a couple of flutter-free months before I was sure. Maybe I will try. The thing is... I _like _drinking the coffee!



Me too! I miss the coffee; dark chocolate and cocoa are my replacement addictions


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## presta (4 Dec 2022)

12boy said:


> I take a 350 mg aspirin daily.


My GP put me on aspirin when I was diagnosed, and cardiology quickly took me off it again.
A read of the European Society of Cardiology Guidelines for the diagnosis and management of atrial fibrillation will show you why:

_"*Aspirin monotherapy was ineffective for stroke prevention* compared with no antithrombotic treatment and was associated with a *higher risk* *of ischaemic stroke* in elderly patients. Overall, antiplatelet monotherapy is *ineffective for stroke prevention* and is potentially *harmful*, (especially amongst elderly AF patients), whereas DAPT is associated with a bleeding risk similar to OAC therapy. *Hence, antiplatelet therapy should not be used for stroke prevention in AF patients*."_


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## Jameshow (4 Dec 2022)

ColinJ said:


> I had forgotten that alcohol used to sometimes give me the flutters. I haven't drunk any for 10 years so that has helped.
> 
> I drink 2 mugs of coffee most afternoons. I don't know if giving those up would help with the occasional flutters that I still get. I don't get enough flutters to be able to notice a reduction immediately so I would have to have a couple of flutter-free months before I was sure. Maybe I will try. The thing is... I _like _drinking the coffee!



Last week I had no coffee for a day due to deli belly, I was goosed by 9.30pm!!


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## presta (4 Dec 2022)

ColinJ said:


> I drink 2 mugs of coffee most afternoons. I don't know if giving those up would help



"In this large, prospective, population-based community cohort study of more than 300 000 participants, each additional daily cup of coffee was associated with a 3% reduced risk of developing an arrhythmia; these associations were not significantly modified by genetic variants that affect caffeine metabolism. A mendelian randomization study leveraging a polygenic score to capture inherited caffeine metabolism patterns did not reveal evidence that caffeine consumption increases the risk of incident arrhythmias."

"Many clinicians continue to counsel patients with atrial or VAs to avoid all caffeinated beverages, particularly coffee, despite an absence of evidence to support this approach. If, in individual cases where a clear temporal association between arrhythmia episodes and caffeine intake is apparent, then avoidance is sensible. Large-scale population-based studies and randomized controlled trials suggest coffee and tea are safe and may even reduce the incidence of arrhythmia."


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## ColinJ (4 Dec 2022)

Yay... The coffees are on me!


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## 12boy (5 Dec 2022)

I saw this thread pop up and had some new info ....in March I had a "Watchman" procedure. Apparently on the upper left chamber of the heart there is a little structure that fills with blood but due to the AFIB doesn't empty properly and is the source of virtually stroke causing clots. The Watchman inserts a tiny umbrella like device into the structure, preventing blood from entering it. After 3-4 months the heart muscle grows over it. After a successful procedure the likelyhood of a stroke is about the same as when taking Xarelto or Plavix which are a couple of warfarin alternatives, which I was taking after age 72. I now only take one 81 mg aspirin daily and don't have to worry about bruising, bleeding from injuries, and brain bleeds anymore. I really did not like being on blood thinners and am glad I don't have to anymore.


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