# Make your bike more Horse Friendly....fit a bell



## y2blade (13 Aug 2013)

I've added a "Ding-Ding" bell.

It's flipping brilliant for letting Horses and their riders know I'm approaching ...stops the "silent surprise" appearance that makes some horses jump when cycles pass.

I know this because we have Horses....... silent cycles coming past can really make some horses spook.

Chris


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## ianrauk (13 Aug 2013)

Don't need or want a bell.
I have a voice that says 'Hello, cyclist coming by'


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## y2blade (13 Aug 2013)

Good man.


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## uclown2002 (13 Aug 2013)

Not a chance of fitting a bell!

As above, "Cyclist coming through" works for me.


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## Mr Haematocrit (13 Aug 2013)

I have a Zipp hub


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## Hill Wimp (13 Aug 2013)

ianrauk said:


> Don't need or want a bell.
> I have a voice that says 'Hello, cyclist coming by'


 

Somehow i just cannot see a bell on your bike, it just wouldn't go somehow


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## y2blade (13 Aug 2013)

Fair enough, a lot around our way say nothing.


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## ianrauk (13 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I have a Zipp hub


 


aka The Chainsaw....


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## uclown2002 (13 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> Fair enough, a lot around our way say nothing.


 

I was the same before I startled horse while passing wide very slowly.


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## shouldbeinbed (13 Aug 2013)

I much prefer a friendly hello to an impersonal dingy ding.


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## Ben M (13 Aug 2013)

Do you ding it in triplicate?


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## Saluki (13 Aug 2013)

If you are passing me on one of my horses, please don't ring your bell as I don't really want to die aboard 1/3 ton of ex racehorse. A nice cheery "Hello, I'm passing on a bike" or "hi, coming past" is a bit nicer.
I had a cyclist sneak past, no bell, no call out, nothing. He was a bit pissed off when my horse let fly with both barrels catching him in the shoulder. I was a bit pissed off after being carted over the road and scraped off under a branch and then having to walk 5 miles home sans horse as he careered off down the road without me.

Seriously people. Call out 'hello'. Don't ring a bell or honk a horn. Not all horses are a bombproof as riding school horses.


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## Ben M (13 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> If you are passing me on one of my horses, please don't ring your bell as I don't really want to die aboard 1/3 ton of ex racehorse. A nice cheery "Hello, I'm passing on a bike" or "hi, coming past" is a bit nicer.
> I had a cyclist sneak past, no bell, no call out, nothing. He was a bit ****ed off when my horse let fly with both barrels catching him in the shoulder. I was a bit ****ed off after being carted over the road and scraped off under a branch and then having to walk 5 miles home sans horse as he careered off down the road without me.
> 
> Seriously people. Call out 'hello'. Don't ring a bell or honk a horn. Not all horses are a bombproof as riding school horses.



If it is likely to behave like that, have you considered that it might not be a good idea to ride that horse on the roads?


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## Dave 123 (13 Aug 2013)

Make your horse more biker friendly.
Give it to Findus.


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## y2blade (13 Aug 2013)

Dave 123 said:


> Make your horse more biker friendly.
> Give it to Findus.


 


You took your time.


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## Saluki (13 Aug 2013)

Ben M said:


> If it is likely to behave like that, have you considered that it might not be a good idea to ride that horse on the roads?


He is fine with artics, busses, tractors with or without trailers, vans, cars, kids on rollerskates, sweet wrappers, dogs, pheasants leaping out of the undergrowth, he is not keen on bikes, or bell noises its a funny pitch for horses. Most comp horses are a bit jumpy, not much fun competing on a plodder. My ex boss would point out that horses were on the roads first. Like bikes and pedestrians, they have a right to be on the road.
He is one of my comp horses and I have to get from field A to field B and until they invent teleportation I don't have much choice.

Is it just too much to ask for a cyclist to call out a 'hello'. I always do when passing horses.


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## the_mikey (13 Aug 2013)

Noisy freewheel does the trick for me, also I slow down and ask the rider "is it safe to pass?"


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## MontyVeda (13 Aug 2013)

IMO, the bell is one of the best bits of kit I've purchased... more for peds on the shared use paths than for horses as i don't see many of those. Why people feel a bell is impersonal i really don't know... _ding ding_ is just as friendly, if not more so, than shouting 'HELLO I'M A CYCLIST!" from 20 feet away.

I don't know horses, but surely if they get startled by a bell, or a cyclist who says nothing... how do they react to the noise of a car or truck?

edit... question probably answered above


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## 400bhp (13 Aug 2013)

Bell = No


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## Saluki (13 Aug 2013)

Horses can hear the engine noise fairly well and it gradually gets louder. Bikes are nice and quiet and the horse thinks that something is sneaking up on them from behind. All my lot are quite happy when a bike approaches them from the front as they can see something.

Horses are animals that other animals eat and will sneak up on them quietly and then pounce and kill. I realise that Norfolk doesn't have much in the way of lions and tigers and bears (oh my) but that fear is hardwired in to a horse.


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## the_mikey (13 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> IMO, the bell is one of the best bits of kit I've purchased... more for peds on the shared use paths than for horses as i don't see many of those. Why people feel a bell is impersonal i really don't know... _ding ding_ is just as friendly, if not more so, than shouting 'HELLO I'M A CYCLIST!" from 20 feet away.


 

Bells just seem to antagonise people around here or stir up indignation. I find it's much easier to just slow down and politely say "just passing on your left", and then "thank you" when I've safely passed them.


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## MontyVeda (13 Aug 2013)

maybe it's a northern thing... people don't have a problem with me slowing down, ringing my bell and saying _thank you_ as i pass


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## buggi (13 Aug 2013)

personally i prefer to use my voice. wouldn't a bell startle a horse, hardly the sort of noise it's used to??


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## Profpointy (13 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> He is fine with artics, busses, tractors with or without trailers, vans, cars, kids on rollerskates, sweet wrappers, dogs, pheasants leaping out of the undergrowth, he is not keen on bikes, or bell noises its a funny pitch for horses. Most comp horses are a bit jumpy, not much fun competing on a plodder. My ex boss would point out that horses were on the roads first. Like bikes and pedestrians, they have a right to be on the road.
> He is one of my comp horses and I have to get from field A to field B and until they invent teleportation I don't have much choice.
> 
> Is it just too much to ask for a cyclist to call out a 'hello'. I always do when passing horses.




Horses shouldn't be on the road, they don't even pay road tax ,
..er ,,,oh, hang on...


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## Cuchilo (13 Aug 2013)

I wouldn't ding a bell behind a horse and was the first thing I removed from my bike after dinging two police bikes for taking up the whole road 
I would give a very wide berth at a very slow pace past them rather than shouting out or spooking them in any way .


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## ufkacbln (14 Aug 2013)

Profpointy said:


> Horses shouldn't be on the road, they don't even pay road tax ,
> ..er ,,,oh, hang on...


 
.... Horses do have emissions though


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## Globalti (14 Aug 2013)

Bells are a good non-threatening way of warning horse riders and pedestrians but older folk sometimes don't hear them so I've given up on bells and find that just a vocal "bike behind" warning is effective.


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## deptfordmarmoset (14 Aug 2013)

I'm no horse psychologist, but if you use your voice and preferably get the rider to exchange a couple of words ( e.g. ''Ok to come past?''), the horse has a chance of knowing that you're there but not a threat. To me, it seems preferable to using a bell. 

Meanwhile, how to make your friend more bike horsey:


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## y2blade (14 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> Horses can hear the engine noise fairly well and it gradually gets louder. Bikes are nice and quiet and the horse thinks that something is sneaking up on them from behind. All my lot are quite happy when a bike approaches them from the front as they can see something.
> 
> Horses are animals that other animals eat and will sneak up on them quietly and then pounce and kill. I realise that Norfolk doesn't have much in the way of lions and tigers and bears (oh my) but that fear is hardwired in to a horse.


 


EXACTLY.


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## y2blade (14 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> He is fine with artics, busses, tractors with or without trailers, vans, cars, kids on rollerskates, *sweet wrappers*, dogs, pheasants leaping out of the undergrowth, he is not keen on bikes, or bell noises its a funny pitch for horses. Most comp horses are a bit jumpy, not much fun competing on a plodder. My ex boss would point out that horses were on the roads first. Like bikes and pedestrians, they have a right to be on the road.
> He is one of my comp horses and I have to get from field A to field B and until they invent teleportation I don't have much choice.
> 
> Is it just too much to ask for a cyclist to call out a 'hello'. I always do when passing horses.


 


Hang on..he's ok scary Sweet wrappers blowing about in the wind....I thought you said he was an Ex-Race horse?


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## VamP (14 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> He is fine with artics, busses, tractors with or without trailers, vans, cars, kids on rollerskates, sweet wrappers, dogs, pheasants leaping out of the undergrowth, he is not keen on bikes, or bell noises its a funny pitch for horses. Most comp horses are a bit jumpy, *not much fun competing on a plodder*. My ex boss would point out that horses were on the roads first. Like bikes and pedestrians, they have a right to be on the road.
> He is one of my comp horses and I have to get from field A to field B and until they invent teleportation I don't have much choice.
> 
> Is it just too much to ask for a cyclist to call out a 'hello'. I always do when passing horses.


 
What kind of competition?

We have an eventer in our family. He not highly strung, but then he is twice the size of yours  He found snow drifts quite scary last winter


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## PJ79LIZARD (14 Aug 2013)

A bell or shout will be ok in my opinion, it's better than nothing. Last week I was out riding we were walking down a country lane the horse had obviously switched to auto pilot, a guy in his mid 50's on his bike came up behind in stealth mode came by not a murmur, I hadn't heard anything, the horse hadn't either til she caught sight of him out the corner of her eye, she then jumped like you or I would if startled. I was lucky shes golden, as another horse on a different day could have bolted or crabbed straight into them. Personally that's why I like a clicky free hub, a horse will soon pick that up from some distance away.


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## GrumpyGregry (14 Aug 2013)

ianrauk said:


> Don't need or want a bell.
> I have a voice that says 'Hello, cyclist coming by'


"Excuse me, rider, may I pass please?" is preferred round here and, iirc BHA/CTC advice. As is maintaining the conversation with the rider as you enter the horses field of vision so it hears you coming. Bell is specifcially advised against.

But Jocasta will be texting and Jemima has her ipod on listening to Katy Perry, or some such, and their step-mum is on the big out-of-control hunter you passed 500 metres back, and their Dad, further down the road, will just swear at you cos he drives a Audi and hates cyclists, and the guys/gals who exercise the local racing string don't speak English, and then the oncoming 4x4 just steams through regardless, scattering everyone, so sometimes it is a waste of breath.


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## GrumpyGregry (14 Aug 2013)

Ben M said:


> If it is likely to behave like that, have you considered that it might not be a good idea to ride that horse on the roads?


Do you sometimes swerve to avoid potholes or other things outside your control?
Would you be happy for a driver to suggest it might not be a good idea to ride your bike on the roads as a result?

Equestrians, like us, have a right to be there. Regardless of how highly-strung their mount is. We need to ride accordingly.


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## Mr Haematocrit (14 Aug 2013)

I have seen threads such as these before and a common theme is that they seem to be started by people who ride Horses as well as Bikes.
I am not being critical of these threads but am curious to know, based on the position of being both a Horsey type and a cyclist... do you also post on horse forums advise on how to act around cyclists?


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## madferret (14 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I have seen threads such as these before and a common theme is that they seem to be started by people who ride Horses as well as Bikes.
> I am not being critical of these threads but am curious to know, based on the position of being both a Horsey type and a cyclist... do you also post on horse forums advise on how to act around cyclists?


 
Nay..........


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## hopless500 (14 Aug 2013)

Ben M said:


> If it is likely to behave like that, have you considered that it might not be a good idea to ride that horse on the roads?


 
 Not the horse's fault. It was spooked by someone trying to sneak past. The most placid of horses isn't going to be happy if something suddenly appears alongside that they didn't know was there. #bloodyhorses have just as much right to be on the road as #bloodycyclists


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## hopless500 (14 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> He is fine with artics, busses, tractors with or without trailers, vans, cars, kids on rollerskates, sweet wrappers, dogs, pheasants leaping out of the undergrowth, he is not keen on bikes, or bell noises its a funny pitch for horses. Most comp horses are a bit jumpy, not much fun competing on a plodder. My ex boss would point out that horses were on the roads first. Like bikes and pedestrians, they have a right to be on the road.
> He is one of my comp horses and I have to get from field A to field B and until they invent teleportation I don't have much choice.
> 
> Is it just too much to ask for a cyclist to call out a 'hello'. I always do when passing horses.


 

hear hear.


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## hopless500 (14 Aug 2013)

Profpointy said:


> Horses shouldn't be on the road, they don't even pay road tax ,
> ..er ,,,oh, hang on...


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## MontyVeda (14 Aug 2013)

buggi said:


> .... wouldn't a bell startle a horse, hardly the sort of noise it's used to??


I've seen several horse drawn sleighs with plenty of bells on them.


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## Nigel-YZ1 (14 Aug 2013)

I just say hello and have a good chat while I'm passing. No fuss required.
Just have to watch out for the people whose penis is insulted by having both a cyclist and a horse in the way of their progress at the same time.


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## PJ79LIZARD (14 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I have seen threads such as these before and a common theme is that they seem to be started by people who ride Horses as well as Bikes.
> I am not being critical of these threads but am curious to know, based on the position of being both a Horsey type and a cyclist... do you also post on horse forums advise on how to act around cyclists?



And what advice would that be? On a bike your in total control which is not the case on a horse. I don't see how a horse can put a cyclist in danger by approaching them unawares.


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## wait4me (14 Aug 2013)

ianrauk said:


> Don't need or want a bell.
> I have a voice that says 'Hello, cyclist coming by'


 
Same here and I usually get a "Thank-you" in return


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## Arjimlad (14 Aug 2013)

I start talking, singing or whistling, as soon as I am within human earshot of the horse, then say good morning or whatever to the rider as I pass by.

That way the horse can hear that I am catching it up, and that I am a person.


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## gaz (14 Aug 2013)

If you want to make your bike horse friendly, get this

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfyC6NJqt2o


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## Spinney (14 Aug 2013)

gaz said:


> If you want to make your bike horse friendly, get this
> 
> View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfyC6NJqt2o







some people have too much time on their hands


of course, posting on chat forums while supposed to be working is different...


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## Mr Haematocrit (14 Aug 2013)

PJ79LIZARD said:


> And what advice would that be? On a bike your in total control which is not the case on a horse. I don't see how a horse can put a cyclist in danger by approaching them unawares.


 
I'm not aware of what advise could be given to a horse rider if any, although I expect someone who rides both bikes and horses would have a better understanding that myself.
If you are not in control of a horse imho you should question if you should have it in public as its a powerful animal which you need to be in control of for your safety, the safety of others and the safety of the horse.

Understanding the challenges other road users have to ensure that we share the road in a safe manner, based on the information I have gained in threads such as this I slow down to ensure that I am not threatening to the animal give it lots of space and announce my presence vocally. 
I and some friends came across a horse being ridden at quite a pace through some remote trails which we ride my MTB on. The pace suggested that the owner did not expect to come across anyone and when she did, the horse reacted in what I perceive as being extreme fear/shock having never seen any other horses react in this manner. The result was that one of my friends and the horse rider ended up on the floor looking less than comfortable... 
In the same manner that threads likes this educated me, Im sure that many horse riders are not aware of the challenges facing cyclists in different environments which is why I asked the question


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## Trickedem (14 Aug 2013)

Arjimlad said:


> I start talking, singing or whistling, as soon as I am within human earshot of the horse, then say good morning or whatever to the rider as I pass by.
> 
> That way the horse can hear that I am catching it up, and that I am a person.


I was given similar advice by a very experienced CTC cyclist. Horses recognise the human voice and don't see it as a threat, a bell is an alien sound to them.


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## Dave 123 (14 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> You took your time.


 

You can't rush these things!


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## y2blade (14 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I have seen threads such as these before and a common theme is that they seem to be started by people who ride Horses as well as Bikes.
> I am not being critical of these threads but am curious to know, based on the position of being both a Horsey type and a cyclist... do you also post on horse forums advise on how to act around cyclists?


 

You mean along the lines of:

_What is it with these awful Lycra clad shouty types on Pushbikes? _
_Why don't they just use a nice civilized bell (as we do to summon the hired help) when they are approaching us?_
_It would be awfully nice of them to let us, and more importantly the Horsey know the "fast, silent, whooooshy" thing is about to pass._
_Furthermore I do wish they would not leave their gel wrappers littering our roads and hedgerows!_

That was a joke^^^ A half truth if you will. 

No I don't post on any horsey forums, I don't wear Jodhpurs.


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## hopless500 (14 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I'm not aware of what advise could be given to a horse rider if any, although I expect someone who rides both bikes and horses would have a better understanding that myself.
> *If you are not in control of a horse imho you should question if you should have it in public as its a powerful animal which you need to be in control of* for your safety, the safety of others and the safety of the horse.


No-one can ever be 100% in control of a horse as they are not 100% predictable. It is a large animal with a very small brain.
I don't think, however, that that justifies not being allowed on the roads. You could draw an analogy with a car being a large (metal) animal controlled by a very small (human) brain. In both cases the animal, be it horse or car, has the potential to do the unexpected.


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## PJ79LIZARD (14 Aug 2013)

Mr Haematocrit said:


> I'm not aware of what advise could be given to a horse rider if any, although I expect someone who rides both bikes and horses would have a better understanding that myself.
> If you are not in control of a horse imho you should question if you should have it in public as its a powerful animal which you need to be in control of for your safety, the safety of others and the safety of the horse.
> 
> Understanding the challenges other road users have to ensure that we share the road in a safe manner, based on the information I have gained in threads such as this I slow down to ensure that I am not threatening to the animal give it lots of space and announce my presence vocally.
> ...



A horse is an animal with its own mind, so regardless of how well any animal is trained it is not a robot. It may do something one day unexpected, that can not be helped. That's why I said your not in total control.


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## Saluki (14 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> Hang on..he's ok scary Sweet wrappers blowing about in the wind....I thought you said he was an Ex-Race horse?


Sweet wrappers are terrifying things. They lay there all quiet and nice like and then a car passes them and they dance about on the breeze. I have known many a horse startled by sweet wrappers and leaves blowing around their hooves. Silly things, horses really. I have a horse who is not nearly as brainy as my bike, bless him.

I have had a lot of failed race horses both off the flat and hurdlers, they make excellent event horses after a bit (a lot) of training. I haven't chatted much with the local horsey set. The few I have spoken too seem to be a bit up themselves, I might just have encountered the snotty minority though.


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## GrumpyGregry (14 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> Sweet wrappers are terrifying things. They lay there all quiet and nice like and then a car passes them and they dance about on the breeze. I have known many a horse startled by sweet wrappers and leaves blowing around their hooves. Silly things, horses really. I have a horse who is not nearly as brainy as my bike, bless him.
> 
> I have had a lot of failed race horses both off the flat and hurdlers, they make excellent event horses after a bit (a lot) of training. I haven't chatted much with *the local horsey set.* *The few I have spoken too seem to be a bit up themselves*, I might just have encountered the snotty minority though.


Normal for Norfolk England?


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## VamP (14 Aug 2013)

GregCollins said:


> Normal for Norfolk England?


 
Not in my experience. All the horsey people I know are skint enthusiasts.


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## GrumpyGregry (14 Aug 2013)

Fair comment. The horsey folk at work and church are all skint enthusiasts.

Socially though, not in my experience. But then I move in circles above my weight.

For me it is about 80% posh folk : 20% skint enthusiasts overall. It changes to about 60% posh : 40% skint if I rate posh skint people as skint rather than merely posh. And one or two of the 60% have very strange moral compasses.


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## VamP (15 Aug 2013)

Sounds like you know too many people


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## buggi (17 Aug 2013)

Globalti said:


> Bells are a good non-threatening way of warning horse riders and pedestrians but older folk sometimes don't hear them so I've given up on bells and find that just a vocal "bike behind" warning is effective.


 Apparently not. checked with my friend who has 7 horses. she said a bell is an unfamiliar noise and can spook the horse. please pass wide and slow and call out. horses are used to voices and it doesn't spook them. Also, she said cyclists are the most careful around her so well done you lot! (apart from one idiot she encountered that shot past her horse, there's always one!  )


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## buggi (17 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> I've seen several horse drawn sleighs with plenty of bells on them.


 yes, but they are trained to ride with them, most horses haven't heard one.


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## MontyVeda (17 Aug 2013)

buggi said:


> yes, but they are trained to ride with them, most horses haven't heard one.


Seeing as it's all down to training, maybe the trainers should put some effort into getting their horses used to the sound of a bell?


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## BigonaBianchi (17 Aug 2013)

No bells for me...just Friendly hi good morningetc..
Then when eye contact made I pass wide.


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## buggi (18 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> Seeing as it's all down to training, maybe the trainers should put some effort into getting their horses used to the sound of a bell?


yesterday at work, a driver suggested that all the cyclists walk off site, just so the drivers didn't have to bother to look left for cyclists coming through a contraflow on site (i run the cycle group which is why they suggested it to me). I suggested that they didn't walk off site, under any circumstances, just because the drivers can't be arsed to look left. I would suggest you show the same courtesy to horses, it's a damn lot of effort to get a horse used to a bell just because you can't be arsed to speak up.


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## Profpointy (18 Aug 2013)

buggi said:


> yesterday at work, a driver suggested that all the cyclists walk off site, just so the drivers didn't have to bother to look left for cyclists coming through a contraflow on site (i run the cycle group which is why they suggested it to me). I suggested that they didn't walk off site, under any circumstances, just because the drivers can't be arsed to look left. I would suggest you show the same courtesy to horses, it's a damn lot of effort to get a horse used to a bell just because you can't be arsed to speak up.



Mmm, bear in mind the OP wanted us (cyclists) to jingle our bells, now we seem to be debating the merits of training horses not to be spooked by bells. At the risk of introducing another beast, isn't the tail wagging the dog now' or summat?

That said, I agree with the sentiment, and us all being sensible; live and let live and all that


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## MontyVeda (18 Aug 2013)

buggi said:


> ....
> I would suggest you show the same courtesy to horses, it's a damn lot of effort to get a horse used to a bell just because you can't be arsed to speak up.


 
you're missing my point, possibly deliberately.

Why would anyone instinctively know what does and doesn't spook horses.. we didn't all have one as a child. I suggested the rider/trainer take some responsibility in preparing their animals for life in the modern world... but clearly that's too much 'effort'.


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## ClichéGuevara (18 Aug 2013)

I'm perhaps over cautious, but I slow down and move as wide as I can. Offering a cheery 'hello' as I approach, making sure I get eye contact from the rider as I slowly pass when it's safe, watching the horse all the time. I've had a little experience horse riding, and I think some non-riders under-estimate how difficult it can be when a horse spooks.

Personally, I much prefer someone to talk to me instead of dinging a bell. Some I ride with ding the bell like crazy at people walking on single track roads, they mean it in a well mannered way, but it does make me cringe.


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## GrasB (18 Aug 2013)

Saluki said:


> Horses can hear the engine noise fairly well and it gradually gets louder. Bikes are nice and quiet and the horse thinks that something is sneaking up on them from behind. All my lot are quite happy when a bike approaches them from the front as they can see something.


One thing I've learnt is to get a nice loud freewheel & at the first hint of a horse being seen stop pedalling. 
A few weeks back I was doing about 35-40mph on my low racer as I spot what I think is a horse rider behind hedge on a bend. I simply feather the brakes & freewheel round the corner. Yes it was a horse rider, so I sit up as best I can & put my glasses on my forehead. Our conversation goes like this:
Me: Hello.
Horse rider: I like you!
Me: Oh?
HR: We could hear you a long way off.
Me: Yeah?
HR: Yes, he could hear that clicking & wasn't so startled by your appearance.
Me: Good 
HR: He's still uneasy though.
Me: Shame 
HR: Well, it's an unusual thing isn't it.
Me: Yes
HR: Take care 
Me: Bye 
The reason for my one word answers was because I was gasping for breath. The horse rider understood I could manage about one word before gulping in my next breath & did their best to give me opportunity to say something.


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## Ticktockmy (18 Aug 2013)

Ben M said:


> If it is likely to behave like that, have you considered that it might not be a good idea to ride that horse on the roads?


Horses are fear and flight animals, no amount of training will prevent them from becoming skittish if someone sneaks up on them. I know when I am out cycling and another cyclist bombs past, sometimes I jump with surprise. it does not take much effort to just call out Coming by about 30 feet behind a horse and it rider. or indeed another cyclist or walker.


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## Ticktockmy (18 Aug 2013)

Profpointy said:


> Horses shouldn't be on the road, they don't even pay road tax ,
> ..er ,,,oh, hang on...


I was not aware that anyone paid Road tax. all the years I have been driving I never paid Road Tax.:-)


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## ianrauk (18 Aug 2013)

Was out cycling today... as one does.
Approached a horse, so decided to freewheel a bit and say hi to let horse and rider know I was there. The rider turned the horse round to face me rather then let me come past.
First time I have encountered that.


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## buggi (18 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> you're missing my point, possibly deliberately.
> 
> Why would anyone instinctively know what does and doesn't spook horses.. we didn't all have one as a child. I suggested the rider/trainer take some responsibility in preparing their animals for life in the modern world... but clearly that's too much 'effort'.


because its common sense. if you ring a bell behind a pedestrian, it often startles them (to the point where you normally end up crashing into them because they run all over the place like a startled rabbit). Hence it would seem reasonable that if a rational human being is spooked by a bell, then so would a prey animal would be.


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## MontyVeda (18 Aug 2013)

buggi said:


> because its common sense.* if you ring a bell behind a pedestrian, it often startles them (to the point where you normally end up crashing into them because they run all over the place like a startled rabbit)*. Hence it would seem reasonable that if a rational human being is spooked by a bell, then so would a prey animal would be.


 
you're either joking, or clutching at straws.


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## shouldbeinbed (19 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> IMO, the bell is one of the best bits of kit I've purchased... more for peds on the shared use paths than for horses as i don't see many of those. Why people feel a bell is impersonal i really don't know... _ding ding_ is just as friendly*, if not more so, than shouting 'HELLO I'M A CYCLIST!" from 20 feet away.*


 
barring the fact no sane person would be shouting anything so inane as *this*, I have a lovely Monty Python Mr Gumby mental image now.


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## shouldbeinbed (19 Aug 2013)

MontyVeda said:


> Seeing as it's all down to training, maybe the trainers should put some effort into getting their horses used to the sound of a bell?


 
why add unnecessary complication?

Given that bells are a comparative rarity, certainly when compared to possession of a working human voice, why not advise cyclists to use their voices as they are something that both a horse and its rider(?) do not need special training to 'get' and are both already immediately familiar with.

It is more effective to both alert the pair to our presence; albeit not by bellowing 'hello, I'm a cyclist' Gumby style from distance; but in a more common sense and helpful manner as described by numerous people on the thread of a greeting and commentary as to what our approach & passing action will be, to allow the rider to warn us to do something else or rein the horse accordingly, rather than them guess our intent from a unidirectional dingy noise and us hope that we're doing the right thing.

Joggers etc passing horses don't carry a bell, why run the risk of confusing the poor horse by giving different modes of humans overtaking it different modes of salutation to use.


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

I'd like to think My thread has been a success.
It has got people thinking/talking about Horses...rather than just slagging them off for being on *"YOUR*" road


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## ianrauk (19 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> I'd like to think My thread has been a success.
> It has got people thinking/talking about Horses...r*ather than just slagging them off for being on "YOUR" road*


 


Really?
I have never heard a cyclist slag off horses/horse riders. 

But I will... How about clearing up all the Horse crap in the roads. It's a menace.


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

ianrauk said:


> Really?
> I have never heard a cyclist slag off horses/horse riders.
> 
> But I will... How about clearing up all the Horse crap in the roads. It's a menace.


 

You don't go on BikeRadar do you? 
How about looking where you are going? I manage to avoid horse carp on the road..why can't you? 

Ding ding


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

ianrauk said:


> Really?
> I have never heard a cyclist slag off horses/horse riders.
> 
> But I will... How about clearing up all the Horse crap in the roads. It's a menace.


 
It's not really though is it.

Also, just try to picture the logistical and safety issues presented by your suggestion.


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> It's not really though is it.


It can be though can't it.


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

Not really. unless you eat it


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

Mugshot said:


> It can be though can't it.


 
Only if you ride like a moron.


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## Nigel-YZ1 (19 Aug 2013)

Compared to a 12"x12"x3" pothole a bit of poo is nothing to worry about... Unless you have no mudguards and are cycling with your mouth open


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

Nigel-YZ1 said:


> Compared to a 12"x12"x3" pothole a bit of poo is nothing to worry about... Unless you have no mudguards and are cycling with your mouth open


Really, I would have thought it could be a little slippy too.


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> Only if you ride like a moron.


Do you really actually think that?


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

Mugshot said:


> Really, I would have thought it could be a little slippy too.


 

If you can't see/avoid a fresh one you shouldn't be on the road......a pre-flattened one is no problem.


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

Mugshot said:


> Do you really actually think that?


 
Do you have a problem avoiding obstacles, potholes, road furniture, cars? Or are you just being a wind-up merchant?


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> If you can't see/avoid a fresh one you shouldn't be on the road......a pre-flattened one is no problem.


Does that apply to potholes too, I see you liked Nigel-YZ1s' post about them?


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> Do you have a problem avoiding obstacles, potholes, road furniture, cars? Or are you just being a wind-up merchant?


 


I think he's just being the latter.


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> I think he's just being the latter.


 
I sure hope so. Imagine how perplexing going off-road would be for him otherwise.


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

y2blade said:


> I think he's just being the latter.


No.
Little busy to reply properly but I will get back to you, but in the mean time if you honestly believe that horse poo is always easily avoidable and the only danger it represents is a bit going in your mouth you're being more than a little silly.

(I have no issues with horses on the road BTW, far from it.)


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## Nigel-YZ1 (19 Aug 2013)

Having cycled for more years than I can remember I can honestly say I have never skidded on poo.


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

Nigel-YZ1 said:


> Having cycled for more years than I can remember I can honestly say I have never skidded on poo.


 


Same, Not had an issue on the motorbike either for that matter.


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## MontyVeda (19 Aug 2013)

shouldbeinbed said:


> why add unnecessary complication?
> 
> Given that bells are a comparative rarity, certainly when compared to possession of a working human voice, why not advise cyclists to use their voices as they are something that both a horse and its rider(?) do not need special training to 'get' and are both already immediately familiar with.
> 
> ...


 
There's a 4 miles shared use track between Lancaster and Glasson dock... it's regularly used my walkers, joggers, horse riders and cyclists... the vast majority of cyclists on that stretch are fairweather cyclists on their halfords/tesco/argos bikes, all of which are sold with a bell. I'd also put good money on the vast majority of those cyclists haven't read this thread, or even heard of cycle chat... I'd put even more money on the likelihood of them using their bells to alert those they are approaching, because that's what the bell is for.

It's already been pointed out to me by someone who knows more about horses that I do, that horses can be trained to get used to the noise of a bell... i suggested that might be a good idea, but...


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

Ok, I'll give you two real world scenarios.
This road is a little over a cars width and I take a primary position through there, on a recent run I was cycling through and approaching the passing place at the end when a car came round the corner and refused to yield, it came at me at speed and I was forced to the side, in my path was a nice big fresh dollop of horse poo.
This corner after a nice little downhill, go round the corner to be greeted by several nice big fresh dollops across primary and secondary, a veritable poo-fest.
Did I ride through either? No. Would a less experienced rider have gone through either? Maybe. Would that make them a moron? I think that would be a rather unfair suggestion to be honest. Should a less experienced cyclist be kept off the road? No.
Just so you know there are three stables within a stones throw of where I live and I regularly see horses when cycling and driving and I always treat them with respect and consideration.


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## y2blade (19 Aug 2013)

No kittens were harmed.


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

Mugshot said:


> Ok, I'll give you two real world scenarios.
> This road is a little over a cars width and I take a primary position through there, on a recent run I was cycling through and approaching the passing place at the end when a car came round the corner and refused to yield, it came at me at speed and I was forced to the side, in my path was a nice big fresh dollop of horse poo pothole.
> This corner after a nice little downhill, go round the corner to be greeted by several nice big fresh dollops potholes across primary and secondary, a veritable poo pothole-fest.
> Did I ride through either? No. Would a less experienced rider have gone through either? Maybe. Would that make them a moron? I think that would be a rather unfair suggestion to be honest. Should a less experienced cyclist be kept off the road? No.
> Just so you know there are three stables many potholes within a stones throw of where I live and I regularly see horses potholes when cycling and driving and I always treat them with respect and consideration.


 
FTFY

I think potholes are a menace and road users should all clean them up after themselves.


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

VamP said:


> FTFY
> 
> I think potholes are a menace and road users should all clean them up after themselves.


I'll save this for so you can look back on it and cringe in the future.
However, I'll humour you. If, in the scenarios I posted, I or somebody else had ridden into the pothole would you think of us as a moron, or would you suggest we shouldn't be on the road?
Also would you be so kind as to point out where I said that the horse muck should be cleared up? I think you may struggle. The point I am making is that, as pointed out by ianrauk, it can be a menace. Even if that doesn't involve me or somebody else hitting the deck having skidded on it, I don't really want to be eating it nor do I want it spattered up my back or over my bike.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (19 Aug 2013)

Anyone got an airzound?


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## VamP (19 Aug 2013)

Mugshot said:


> I'll save this for so you can look back on it and cringe in the future.
> However, I'll humour you. If, in the scenarios I posted, I or somebody else had ridden into the pothole would you think of us as a moron, or would you suggest we shouldn't be on the road?
> Also would you be so kind as to point out where I said that the horse muck should be cleared up? I think you may struggle. The point I am making is that, as pointed out by ianrauk, it can be a menace. Even if that doesn't involve me or somebody else hitting the deck having skidded on it, I don't really want to be eating it nor do I want it spattered up my back or over my bike.


 
I'm cringing already


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## Mugshot (19 Aug 2013)

I don't doubt that for a moment.


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