# Family Cycle Rides v Strava-ists!



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Myself and the family frequently use the excellent traffic-free cyclepaths around Chester and along the River Dee (_Route 5 & NCN 568_). It great to see loads of other families using them too, whether it's pushing babies in prams, walking the dog or giving the kids a first taste of cycling in a safe environment, it all goes to help promote a healthy lifestyle.

I also like to use the cyclepath when I'm out for a more strenuous ride, particularly in the winter months. There's a good deal of long distance visibility on the route due to it's relatively flat elevation and so when the coast is clear I try and up the pace to get some intervals in but _only _if there's no one around. However, I've found that the cycleway is also frequented by a type of Strava-esque Time Trialist faction who seem to think thery're on the track at Manchester Velodrome and appear to have no thought for other users, other than a shouted "On your right!" or "Coming through" before whizzing passed at 30+km/h. As the path goes through Chester there are numerous entries to it from parks, roads, houses, schools etc increasing the chances of meeting a pedestrian or young cyclist and potential for a "coming together". I recently witnessed a young lad on a scooter appear up some steps literally seconds after a tool sporting tri-bars shot passed at heaven knows what speed. This was in the middle of the afternoon.

I always slow down and give a ping on the bell well in advance of pedestrians/dog-walkers/pram-pushers, most of whom appreciate the care and attention shown them although I have noticed a few scowled looks which I put down to some of my fellow cyclists usually regarding them as an inconvenience in their goal for Strava Immortality.

So take care out there, of yourself and fellow path users, (_I've hit a pedestrian who unexpectedly veered in front of me and it hurt. Both of us), _they could be the cyclists of the future.

Thanks

ps Next one who races passed me when I've with the kids demanding we clear a path _WILL _be making a quick trip into the river!


----------



## mjr (28 Oct 2015)

Not clever admitting your assault ahead of doing it... but I agree that strava shouldn't be encouraging racing on such paths.


----------



## Katherine (28 Oct 2015)

It's similar on the Bridgewater Canal path. There are some busier popular sections where you have to slow down. 

I always ask nicely if I can get past when there is a family group in the way and thank dog owners who keep good control of their dogs and go carefully around the rest. 

When I'm a pedestrian and I hear a ping of a bell, I keep walking but close to the side so a bike can easily get past but some expect you to stop completely so that they don't have to slow down which is a bit selfish.


----------



## Flying Dodo (28 Oct 2015)

A big problem is the fact that Strava have refused outright to block completely the ability to log times on any shared use paths, which would stop a large proportion of the racers, as they'd have no incentive. Sustrans tried to get them to block out the NCN routes and Strava refused.

What you used to be able to do was flag a path or road as dangerous, and then it wouldn't show up, but then earlier this year Strava changed their procedures, and provided you click to acknowledge you recognise the section has been flagged, you can still see the list & times of riders. Which is crazy, as it means effectively you can race on a flagged section and still log a time.


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

mjray said:


> Not clever admitting your assault ahead of doing it... but I agree that strava shouldn't be encouraging racing on such paths.


Not so much an assault more a refusal to move, resulting in them either stopping or exiting the path and entering the river via the relatively steep bank! But I take your point!


----------



## Big Dave laaa (28 Oct 2015)

Subotai72 said:


> Myself and the family frequently use the excellent traffic-free cyclepaths around Chester and along the River Dee (_Route 5 & NCN 568_). It great to see loads of other families using them too, whether it's pushing babies in prams, walking the dog or giving the kids a first taste of cyclign in a safe enviroment, it all goes to help promote a healthy lifestyle.
> 
> I also like to use the cyclepath when I'm out for a more strenuous ride, particularly in the winter months. There's a good deal of long distance visibility on the route due to it's relatively flat elevation and so when the coast is clear I try and up the pace to get some intervals in but _only _if there's no one around. However, I've found that the cycleway is also frequented by a type of Strava-esque Time Trialist faction who seem to think thery're on the track at Manchester Velodrome and appear to have no thought for other users, other than a shouted "On your right!" or "Coming through" before whizzing passed at 30+km/h. As the path goes through Chester there are numerous entries to it from parks, roads, houses, schools etc increasing the chances of meeting a pedestrian, young cyclist and potential for a "coming together". I recently witnessed a young lad on a scooter appear up some steps literally seconds after a tool sporting tri-bars shot passed at heaven knows what speed. This was in the middle of the afternoon.
> 
> ...







I find the route out towards Neston much better for faster cycling. Much better visibility and less access points to worry about. If the path is being used by families or walkers, there's much more time to slow and pass them safely, especially early on a Sunday morning which is when I usually use it. Like you I find the Chester route far too cluttered.


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Katherine said:


> It's similar on the Bridgewater Canal path. There are some busier popular sections where you have to slow down.
> 
> I always ask nicely if I can get past when there is a family group in the way and thank dog owners who keep good control of their dogs and go carefully around the rest.
> 
> When I'm a pedestrian and I hear a ping of a bell, I keep walking but close to the side so a bike can easily get past but some expect you to stop completely so that they don't have to slow down which is a bit selfish.


I noticed that most dog-walkers stop and restrain their dogs and I appreciate that to the point that I'll slow right down to walking pace; after all I don't want to hurt the dog. Or myself!


----------



## Jody (28 Oct 2015)

mjray said:


> but I agree that strava shouldn't be encouraging racing on such paths.



Most paths of this type round here have been flagged a dangerous on Strava. 

Would people not just go back to a stop watch without Stava?


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Flying Dodo said:


> A big problem is the fact that Strava have refused outright to block completely the ability to log times on any shared use paths, which would stop a large proportion of the racers, as they'd have no incentive. Sustrans tried to get them to block out the NCN routes and Strava refused.
> 
> What you used to be able to do was flag a path or road as dangerous, and then it wouldn't show up, but then earlier this year Strava changed their procedures, and provided you click to acknowledge you recognise the section has been flagged, you can still see the list & times of riders. Which is crazy, as it means effectively you can race on a flagged section and still log a time.


 I noticed that the other night. I only have Strava set to default to my own PRs so I'm not interested in KOMs (_not that I'd get one!_) but on checking to see if I'd improved upon a segment (_ironically enough it was on part of the path I mentioned in the OP, when I had a 5km stretch along the River Dee with not a single other person on!_) only to find that I had to agree to some Hazard Policy to see the leaderboard. It kind of makes flagging any segments an exercise in futility.


----------



## Jody (28 Oct 2015)

Flying Dodo said:


> What you used to be able to do was flag a path or road as dangerous, and then it wouldn't show up, but then earlier this year Strava changed their procedures, and provided you click to acknowledge you recognise the section has been flagged, you can still see the list & times of riders. Which is crazy, as it means effectively you can race on a flagged section and still log a time.



Thanks for that. Just got a load of flagged segments back 

edit: Won't show them on the app but when you log into your dashboard. I can see why sections are being flagged. Some shared paths have KOM times over 30mph


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Jody said:


> Most paths of this type round here have been flagged a dangerous on Strava.
> 
> Would people not just go back to a stop watch without Stava?


 I imagine people would just start using another application/website that _doesn't _offer the facility to flag segments.

I'm not having a pop at Strava either, it's just that I happen to use it. I've always found it quite useful to track my progress and enjoy a bit of competitive, virtual riding (_distance in a month, biggest climbs etc)_ with work colleagues who live around the country.

 Other cycling applications are available


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Big Dave laaa said:


> View attachment 108332
> 
> 
> I find the route out towards Neston much better for faster cycling. Much better visibility and less access points to worry about. If the path is being used by families or walkers, there's much more time to slow and pass them safely, especially early on a Sunday morning which is when I usually use it. Like you I find the Chester route far too cluttered.


 Great coffee shop at the Mickle Trafford end though!


----------



## Dogtrousers (28 Oct 2015)

Shared use path generally means walking pace for me, or at least slow enough to stop on a sixpence. Children and dogs are unpredictable - be prepared to stop and wait.

There's a nice shared use path near me that I use as the final few km of long rides, just before I get home, so I'm knackered anyway and winding down. If I want to make quick progress, I ride on the road.


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Dogtrousers said:


> Shared use path generally means walking pace for me, or at least slow enough to stop on a sixpence. Children and dogs are unpredictable - be prepared to stop and wait.
> 
> There's a nice shared use path near me that I use as the final few km of long rides, just before I get home, so I'm knackered anyway and winding down. If I want to make quick progress, I ride on the road.


 I'll admit to not doing walking apce but I've ridden the route so many times I'm familiar with all the pedestrian access points and ride at a sensible, stoppable pace coming up to them. Kids & dogs are a definite snails-pace pass. It's great to see the kids out on their bikes and I wouldn't want to be responsible for putting them off cycling due to the terrifying spectacle of 15 stone of bike rider hurtling at them out of nowhere!


----------



## jefmcg (28 Oct 2015)

Subotai72 said:


> (_I've hit a pedestrian who unexpectedly veered in front of me and it hurt. Both of us),_


But you are still getting angry with riders who to your knowledge have never hit anyone?

Luke 6:41

(Hitting a pedestrian is always avoidable)


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

jefmcg said:


> But you are still getting angry with riders who to your knowledge have never hit anyone?
> 
> Luke 6:41
> 
> (Hitting a pedestrian is always avoidable)


Who said I was getting angry? Not angry at all, I was merely pointing out that shared use cycleways shouldn't really be used as Time trials traiing runs by Tony Martin Wannerbees. I would say that that any avoidance of incidents on that particular path are more down to pedestrains taking evasive action after having "Coming Through!" yelled at them (_which I have seen). _

Your holier than thou comment "Hitting a pedestrian is always avoidable" makes me angry because the implication is that I was in some way at fault (_evidence to which you are not party to as I've not divulged the details_) and post links to works of fiction as a way to back up your specious argument. I suppose you are right though, I could dismount and walk everywhere whilst pushing my bike, thereby removing any possibility of ever hitting a pedestrian whilst riding again.

Thanks for your input.


----------



## jefmcg (28 Oct 2015)

On a shared path, if you always make sure that the path user knows you are there (ie they have turned and made eye contact) or you give them wide enough berth that you will miss them even if they suddenly veer or you slow down to walking pace, then the only pedestrians you will hit are the ones who deliberately run at you, or come out of the bushes on the side at a run. Which happened to you? Edit: or a toddler on a balance bike wobbles into you. That one is hard to avoid 

(OK, so you are not angry, but you are upset enough to complain about it in a public forum and feel justified in threatening action to put them in the water. Please let me know when you are actually angry, you seem dangerous enough when calm)


----------



## andyfraser (28 Oct 2015)

Subotai72 said:


> I noticed that most dog-walkers stop and restrain their dogs and I appreciate that to the point that I'll slow right down to walking pace; after all I don't want to hurt the dog. Or myself!


I feel guilty when they stop and restrain their dog. I've slowed to walking pace so it feels like they've been restraining their dog for at least 5 minutes by the time I actual bimble passed.


----------



## mjr (28 Oct 2015)

Jody said:


> Most paths of this type round here have been flagged a dangerous on Strava.
> 
> Would people not just go back to a stop watch without Stava?


I'm told flagging no longer does much (edit: and it's been mentioned again this thread). I doubt all Stravidiots want to time-trial against themselves without the reward of a public leaderboard so it would probably stop a lot of it.


----------



## summerdays (28 Oct 2015)

jefmcg said:


> Edit: or a toddler on a balance bike wobbles into you. That one is hard to avoid


I had that last month, I was passing a school as they were coming out (I was on the road as lots of children walking and cycling coming towards me. I saw one child wobbling all over the place, so I stood still and said use your brakes, only for them to crash into me, though I'd guess she was about 6 or 7. I'm not sure she should have been on the road and there didn't seem to be an obvious adult with her.


----------



## Dogtrousers (28 Oct 2015)

summerdays said:


> I had that last month, I was passing a school as they were coming out (I was on the road as lots of children walking and cycling coming towards me. I saw one child wobbling all over the place, so I stood still and said use your brakes, only for them to crash into me, though I'd guess she was about 6 or 7. I'm not sure she should have been on the road and there didn't seem to be an obvious adult with her.


Throw her in the river. It's the only language they understand.


----------



## summerdays (28 Oct 2015)

Dogtrousers said:


> Throw her in the river. It's the only language they understand.


I know one of the staff there and she witnessed it, so I'm hoping that her parent got a message about her children not being under control.


----------



## Subotai72 (28 Oct 2015)

Dogtrousers said:


> Throw her in the river. It's the only language they understand.


He doesn't appear to mention a river...


----------



## Dirk (26 Feb 2016)

jefmcg said:


> (Hitting a pedestrian is always avoidable)


No, it's not.
I clipped a lad who ran out of some bushes on the Tarka Trail without looking - totally invisible until he was in my path. I don't know who was the most shocked! God knows what he was doing in there to begin with.


----------



## John the Monkey (26 Feb 2016)

Subotai72 said:


> I noticed that most dog-walkers stop and restrain their dogs and I appreciate that to the point that I'll slow right down to walking pace; after all I don't want to hurt the dog. Or myself!


Yup, although as a dog owner myself, I (personally) think that fido should be under control and confined to one side of any path that's in use by pedestrians and cyclists. Similarly, pedestrians shouldn't be walking shoulder to shoulder across the breadth of the path (they are "shared", after all).

There's one locally (the Wheelock Rail Trail) that's impassable on sunny afternoons because of pedestrians, dog walkers and other bimblers who seem unable to conceive of the idea that a shared use path might also be used by anyone wanting to move at a different speed to them; to pass them without needing to wait for them to actually notice that you're heading in their direction, &c &c. Fortunately, sight lines are good enough that this congestion is obvious from the entry to it, and it can be avoided by anyone willing to risk the sociopathy of the local motorists instead.


----------



## mjr (26 Feb 2016)

Dirk Thrust said:


> No, it's not.
> I clipped a lad who ran out of some bushes on the Tarka Trail without looking - totally invisible until he was in my path.


Could you not ride further away from the bushes or have they let the bushes encroach on the trail too far?


----------



## Tin Pot (26 Feb 2016)

Dirk Thrust said:


> No, it's not.
> I clipped a lad who ran out of some bushes on the Tarka Trail without looking - totally invisible until he was in my path. I don't know who was the most shocked! God knows what he was doing in there to begin with.



Holy Thread Resurrection Batman!


----------



## Jimidh (26 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> Could you not ride further away from the bushes or have they let the bushes encroach on the trail too far?


Maybe he was riding up the side of the path to leave room for other trail users?

Or maybe the lad ran right into the middle of the path just as he was passing.

Not everything is avoidable.


----------



## jefmcg (26 Feb 2016)




----------



## Tin Pot (26 Feb 2016)

jefmcg said:


>



I think I'd speed up if I saw that, not slow down.

You look very pretty though.


----------



## mjr (26 Feb 2016)

Jimidh said:


> Maybe he was riding up the side of the path to leave room for other trail users?


Maybe but if space is that tight, slow down.



> Or maybe the lad ran right into the middle of the path just as he was passing.


Right into the middle, without appearing at the side first... in other words, the bushes have grown out too far.



> Not everything is avoidable.


No, not always avoidable by us, but people seem too ready to dismiss things as such, rather than ride further out or slow down.


----------



## Jimidh (26 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> Maybe but if space is that tight, slow down.
> 
> 
> Right into the middle, without appearing at the side first... in other words, the bushes have grown out too far.
> ...



Don't know the area but could have been a downhill mountain bike trail and they ain't designed for going slow.


----------



## mjr (26 Feb 2016)

Jimidh said:


> Don't know the area but could have been a downhill mountain bike trail and they ain't designed for going slow.


It's the famous Tarka Trail. It's really not a downhill MTB trail. Much of it's canal side or former railway.


----------



## Dirk (26 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> It's the famous Tarka Trail. It's really not a downhill MTB trail. Much of it's canal side or former railway.


That just goes to show how how little you know about the area in question.
NONE of the Tarka Trail in North Devon is 'canal side'.


----------



## Dirk (26 Feb 2016)

Jimidh said:


> *Or maybe the lad ran right into the middle of the path just as he was passing.*
> 
> Not everything is avoidable.


EXACTLY!


----------



## mjr (26 Feb 2016)

Dirk Thrust said:


> NONE of the Tarka Trail in North Devon is 'canal side'.


They're still named rivers but I'd say they're canals diverting an old river course really.


----------



## summerdays (26 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> They're still named rivers but I'd say they're canals diverting an old river course really.


No, not canals, they normally have locks on those, I'd say estuaries.


----------



## mjr (27 Feb 2016)

summerdays said:


> No, not canals, they normally have locks on those, I'd say estuaries.


Suez canal? Or in England, I think the Bridgewater canal has none and there probably are more if you search.


----------



## summerdays (27 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> Suez canal? Or in England, I think the Bridgewater canal has none and there probably are more if you search.


Ok canals are man made, estuaries may be influenced by man but they did already exist.


----------



## Dirk (27 Feb 2016)

mjray said:


> They're still named rivers but I'd say they're canals diverting an old river course really.


What are you on about?
The Tarka Trail follows the sides of the Taw and Torridge estuaries - there ain't a canal or diverted river course anywhere in sight!


----------

