# Little ole wine drinker me (us?)



## Joey Shabadoo (28 May 2020)

As I mature, I have outgrown the ales of callow youth and progressed onto wine - red wine, proper grown up wine. But alas I know nothing about it so tend to buy according to what bottle has the nicest label. This has led to mixed results, unsurprisingly.

So, let this be a thread where those who know, educate and those who don't know, experiment. Tell us what you're going to imbibe, where you got it (so others can find it) and let us know the results.

Last night I had this £6.50 job from Lidl






Very nice it was too. Not overly rich but smooth and very more-ish. Will get again.


Tonight I shall be trying this, an £11 effort from Lidl again.


----------



## fossyant (28 May 2020)

I'm with you there. I tend to stick to Aussie reds, which is boring but I like them.


----------



## glasgowcyclist (28 May 2020)

My favourites are Montepulciano d’Abbruzzo, Valpolicella Ripasso and Chianti. There’s not a great difference whether you get them in Lidl or Waitrose.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (28 May 2020)

This was very nice, again from Lidl





Lidl again - ok, nothing special






Morrisons - very nice and would certainly buy again


----------



## wisdom (28 May 2020)

Try 19 crimes it's an amazing wine around £8.00 a bottle.
Theres 3 varieties and they are all excellent.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (28 May 2020)

wisdom said:


> Try 19 crimes it's an amazing wine around £8.00 a bottle.
> Theres 3 varieties and they are all excellent.


Aye, I've heard of that but also mixed reviews. I tried Jam Shed and thought it was a bit meh


----------



## Spiderweb (28 May 2020)

Porta 6 my new favourite red.
https://www.majestic.co.uk/wines/porta-6-15006


----------



## ozboz (28 May 2020)

T


----------



## ruffers (28 May 2020)

I found this a lovely tipple. Will definitely buy again.





This is also a great drop to try, normally buy between £6 & £7

Going to enjoy reading this thread 🍷🍷🍷


----------



## Gunk (28 May 2020)

If you like the Yellow Tail Shiraz, try this...


----------



## ruffers (28 May 2020)

Gunk said:


> If you like the Yellow Tail Shiraz, try this...
> 
> View attachment 525737



thanks I’ll give it a whirl.


----------



## Gunk (28 May 2020)

ruffers said:


> thanks I’ll give it a whirl.



The Yellow Tail Chardonnay is very good.


----------



## fossyant (28 May 2020)

Yellow Tail wines are good.


----------



## stephec (29 May 2020)

French Red for me, Cote du Rhone, Chateau Neuf du Pape, or a Claret/St Emillion.


----------



## ruffers (29 May 2020)

Got this today from Aldi, think it was £3.99 if I remember rightly, lovely drop 👍🏻


----------



## Gunk (29 May 2020)

stephec said:


> French Red for me, Cote du Rhone, Chateau Neuf du Pape, or a Claret/St Emillion.



I love St Emillion, I’ve got a very nice 1993 Premier Cru ready for daughters 18th later this year.

it’s been laid down for 18 years so fingers crossed it’ll taste OK, I’ll update you in November


----------



## ruffers (29 May 2020)

Gunk said:


> I love St Emillion, I’ve got a very nice 1993 Premier Cru ready for daughters 18th later this year.
> 
> it’s been laid down for 18 years so fingers crossed it’ll taste OK, I’ll update you in November



I presume it’s getting drunk either way? I hope it’s nice and worth the wait, lovely gesture to keep it for your daughters 18th 🎉 🍾


----------



## Salty seadog (29 May 2020)

Whatever red you get allow it to breath. Open it at least an hour before you drink it.


----------



## Goldenretriever (29 May 2020)

That takes me back, on one of her school trips my oh said I'll bring you a present. One good bottle of St Emillion grand cru says I expectantly. Lovingly saved till christmas day when I opened and left to breath, it had corked and I tipped the whole bottle down the sink. Never been so disappointed. Tend to drink Malbec or Rjoha or a nice New Zealand sauvignon blanc. Best bottle we ever had was a St Emillion about 1990 20 miles from the village and cost us then I think £ 18-20, was like nectar.


----------



## Salty seadog (29 May 2020)

My uncle and his partner have lived their whole lives in the drinks business. From importing and moving around the whole of the countries supply of a popular larger to a high end off licence in London and all in between.


----------



## Gunk (29 May 2020)

Goldenretriever said:


> That takes me back, on one of her school trips my oh said I'll bring you a present. One good bottle of St Emillion grand cru says I expectantly. Lovingly saved till christmas day when I opened and left to breath, it had corked and I tipped the whole bottle down the sink. Never been so disappointed. Tend to drink Malbec or Rjoha or a nice New Zealand sauvignon blanc. Best bottle we ever had was a St Emillion about 1990 20 miles from the village and cost us then I think £ 18-20, was like nectar.



You can still get a decent bottle from Super U for about €15


----------



## Goldenretriever (29 May 2020)

That was in a small restaurant so obviously more expensive. I loved those camping holidays in France with trips to Auchan and all the other supermarkets. One year we even had a small winery between the gite and local village, filled a polybin and gave our livers a bit of a hammering! Not totally sensible.


----------



## ruffers (29 May 2020)

Goldenretriever said:


> That was in a small restaurant so obviously more expensive. I loved those camping holidays in France with trips to Auchan and all the other supermarkets. One year we even had a small winery between the gite and local village, filled a polybin and gave our livers a bit of a hammering! Not totally sensible.



enjoyable and memorable though


----------



## Goldenretriever (29 May 2020)

Worth every penny, we always celebrated our wedding anniversary during our holidays. Always nice to have one really memorable meal that lingers in the memory


----------



## ruffers (29 May 2020)

Goldenretriever said:


> Worth every penny, we always celebrated our wedding anniversary during our holidays. Always nice to have one really memorable meal that lingers in the memory



wisest words I’ve heard all day, it’s what life is all about and always great to have another bottle and reminisce over


----------



## philtalksbx (29 May 2020)

wisdom said:


> Try 19 crimes it's an amazing wine around £8.00 a bottle.
> Theres 3 varieties and they are all excellent.


+1 on 19 Crimes - introduced by a mate in the hotel trade that I consider quite knowledgable.


----------



## mistyoptic (31 May 2020)

Spiderweb said:


> Porta 6 my new favourite red.
> https://www.majestic.co.uk/wines/porta-6-15006
> View attachment 525693


That's a cracker! We now can buy it in our local Sainsbury and we have also bought it in Portugal - cheaper, surprisingly ;-)
There is a nice white in the same range


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (3 Jun 2020)

Tonight's treat, from Waitrose


----------



## ruffers (3 Jun 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> Tonight's treat, from Waitrose
> View attachment 527163


Any good?


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (3 Jun 2020)

Dunno yet, it's a little early (even for me)


----------



## ruffers (3 Jun 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> Dunno yet, it's a little early (even for me)



🤣🤣🤣 medicinal or testing purposes are ok I’ve been told 👀👀👀


----------



## Electric_Andy (3 Jun 2020)

My partner only drinks Merlot and Tea. She likes the Barefoot Merlot best (£6 usually). I've bought her more expensive bottles before as a treat but she always goes back to that one as her favourite


----------



## ruffers (3 Jun 2020)

Electric_Andy said:


> My partner only drinks Merlot and Tea. She likes the Barefoot Merlot best (£6 usually). I've bought her more expensive bottles before as a treat but she always goes back to that one as her favourite



I’ve had that in the past, it is really nice.


----------



## SafetyThird (3 Jun 2020)

I'm partial to big rounded red wines, anything from Barossa valley is usually a good bet, Barossa Ink, as mentioned further up the thread, is one I discovered recently and am partial to. Couple of years ago I discovered an app called Vivino, you can take a photo of a wine label and it'll give you reviews of the wine. Handy when you're stood in a supermarket and have no idea what to choose. Once you've drunk some and given them ratings, it'll suggest other wines for you to try. I think it cost a couple of quid but it's certainly saved me money.


----------



## jayonabike (4 Jun 2020)

Opened this tonight. I do love a Shiraz and this one is spot on👍🏻


----------



## johnblack (5 Jun 2020)

I'd like to reccommend this little beauty


----------



## jayonabike (5 Jun 2020)

I ordered 6 bottles from the whisky exchange, all under a tenner a bottle I’ve drunk four and they all have been wonderful


----------



## albal (7 Jun 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> As I mature, I have outgrown the ales of callow youth and progressed onto wine - red wine, proper grown up wine. But alas I know nothing about it so tend to buy according to what bottle has the nicest label. This has led to mixed results, unsurprisingly.
> 
> So, let this be a thread where those who know, educate and those who don't know, experiment. Tell us what you're going to imbibe, where you got it (so others can find it) and let us know the results.
> 
> ...


 I,d be interested in how that Barolo went down? Decent price.


----------



## albal (7 Jun 2020)

Was in cuneo,Italy last December working. Nipped into a small place for some food, restaurants? Remember them? 
Waiter recommendation was this. Nebbiolo. Wow! Lovely and rich, had x3 glasses. They were selling bottles for around £30.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (7 Jun 2020)

albal said:


> I,d be interested in how that Barolo went down? Decent price.


Nice, but I've had better for less. Very rich.


----------



## Chris S (7 Jun 2020)

Wine is better for middle-aged people, it gets you drunk on fewer calories.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (8 Jun 2020)

ruffers said:


> Any good?


Pretty bland


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (10 Jun 2020)

wisdom said:


> Try 19 crimes it's an amazing wine around £8.00 a bottle.
> Theres 3 varieties and they are all excellent.








Tonight's accompaniment to the mince. Very nice, slips down easily. I can see me getting this again.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (17 Jun 2020)

Tonight's effort. Chosen via the "nice label" method


----------



## Shadow (22 Jun 2020)

Just found this thread and might dip in more frequently!


Gunk said:


> I love St Emillion, I’ve got a very nice 1993 Premier Cru ready for daughters 18th later this year.


Do you have more than one bottle?
Where has it been stored the last 20+ years?
Do you know the producer?
I ask these because '93 was a rubbish year in St Emilion generally; it should have probably been drunk years ago, but it might just be ok, depending on your answers. Apologies for the bad news but better knowing now than being disappointed in november.
I could suggest getting something from her birth year (2002) however this was also a rubbish year in europe generally. Apart from Burgundy which, if you can find anything, will be outrageously expensive. Other options could be champagne or dessert wines, again neither will be cheap. Apologies for more bad news.
So, my sensible alternative for your daughter's 18th would be to get a good bottle of something you know _she_ likes*. Talk to your local merchant, they should be the wine equivalent of your LBS - friendly and helpful.


----------



## Gunk (22 Jun 2020)

Shadow said:


> Just found this thread and might dip in more frequently!
> 
> Do you have more than one bottle?
> Where has it been stored the last 20+ years?
> ...



it's actually a 1995 Chateaux Canon







And I've also got this one for my son (this has turned out to be better vintage, although I paid the same for each)






Both have been wrapped in brown paper and stored in a dark dry cool place. I'll let you know on the 6th November what the Chateaux Canon is like! (she prefers Gin so I'll buy her a nice bottle and we'll guzzle the wine)


----------



## Shadow (22 Jun 2020)

Much better, you chose well. The Canon may be a little past its peak but will still be hugely smooth and enjoyable. The Beychevelle will be excellent. (But when are you planning to drink it?).


Gunk said:


> ...stored in a dark _dry_ cool place...


...take care opening, the cork will have dried out, tending to deposit all sorts of cork bits which are just a pain to remove from the glass; it will not affect the taste.
Both something to look forward to. I finished off the last red wine from last century just a couple weeks ago, most enjoyable.


----------



## Gunk (22 Jun 2020)

The Beychevelle will opened Feb 2023


----------



## Shadow (22 Jun 2020)

Gunk said:


> The Beychevelle will opened Feb 2023


I admire your patience.


----------



## Shadow (23 Jun 2020)

*Zinfandel *
- grape variety mostly found in USofA (read California), usually full-bodied, high ABV and full on fruit.
- for those of you who like this style of wine, look out for wines made from *Primitivo*, usually from southern Italy, and have a similar taste profile altho maybe not quite so full on. Reason? They are the same grape variety.


----------



## Shadow (24 Jun 2020)

jayonabike said:


> I ordered 6 bottles from the whisky exchange, all under a tenner a bottle I’ve drunk four and they all have been wonderful


The Whisky Exchange is a well-respected retailer offering customers a good range of quality product at fair prices. 

As for the wines you chose, I can only comment on the Mezzogiorno. A good producer, maybe a co-operative?, in Sicily. I have not tried this *Nero d'Avola* (one of Sicily's signature red grapes), however, the *Fiano* I have drunk at a local restaurant and it is very good value. Fiano is one of southern Italy's good white grape varietals, providing good flavours.


----------



## Shadow (25 Jun 2020)

jayonabike said:


> I do love a Shiraz and this one is spot on


Even though this is not Shiraz, you might consider it as an alternative to _any_ beef dish you enjoy.

Which brings me to today's tip. I am not a fan of supermarket's selections generally, as I would always recommend a visit to your local wine merchant. However, if you are willing to pay a little more than rock bottom, you will find it very rewarding to try their own label better quality wines. e.g the Taste The Difference range by Sainsburys, the Tesco Finest range etc. Usually good quality, good value and often a bargain.


----------



## Shadow (6 Jul 2020)

2017 Geyerhof Zweigelt
(Kremstal, Austria)




For those who like to make purchasing decisions based on labels, what do you think?
Label is not to my taste but I try hard _not_ to be influenced by labels.

Geyerhof is the producer, *Zweigelt *is the grape variety, from the Kremstal region; have no idea what Stockwerk refers to. Juicy blackcurranty fruit, mid to high acidity with no overpowering tannin (this means it is refreshing and works well with rich or creamy or fatty food), good depth, 12% abv. The opposite of a big, beefy barossa shiraz. If you like pinot noir or cru beaujolais, you would enjoy this. About £13.

It was excellent with lamb (with courgette, red pepper, shallot and mushroom) kebab. Delicious.


----------



## bitsandbobs (7 Jul 2020)

stock = vine 
werk = work


----------



## Shadow (28 Jul 2020)

2014 Château Vessière
Costières de Nîmes, France



Not the most helpful main label. So, look at the secondary label.




This is where a little knowledge is a good thing. The Costières de Nîmes (basically meaning the Nîmes hillsides) appellation covers an area around the southern Rhône Valley bordering Languedoc. Therefore, grape varieties are predominantly *Grenache *with some or all of *Syrah, Mourvedre, Carignan and Cinsault* blended in. Very similar to southern Rhône wines like better Côtes du Rhône, Châteauneuf du Pape, Gigondas etc. However, as it is less well known, for a similarly priced bottle, you are likely to get a better wine, offering great value. This was about £12. Absolute bargain. And as the last line states, wonderful with grilled or roasted meat.

The white and rosé from this producer are even better but sadly no longer imported into the UK. The red is now hard to find too. But do look out for wines from this region.


----------



## Shadow (6 Aug 2020)

Fancy a crisp, dry white in the warmth of summer? This is one for you:




2019 Domaine Morin Langaran Picpoul de Pinet
These are full-flavoured yet dry to bone dry and crisp, refreshing wines from the south of France, a little west of Montpelier. (Note the embossed cross symbol of the Languedoc on the neck.) Grape variety is *PIcpoul *(sometimes seen as Piquepoul). 13% abv. Superb with anything edible from the sea, also works well as an apero. Around £9.00 to £12.00, this was £10.50. Good value. Highly recommended.


----------



## Shadow (24 Aug 2020)

A couple from the weekend




White on the left, made from *Pecorino *grapes. (Yes, there is a cheese of the same name). Terre di Chieti is a sub-region of the Abruzzo region. Like many Italian whites, it might seem a little bland at first but works well with food and has enough body and freshness as an aperitivo. Fine with our tomato, mozzarella and basil salad. Becoming trendy, with good reason!
Red on the left from *Montepulciano *grapes in Abruzzo, as stated obviously on the label. Much more well-known in the UK and is a good standby for almost anything, if you enjoy red wine. Medium bodied, bold dark fruit flavours, not overly tannic. Drunk on friday with friends accompanying lasagna and again on saturday with marinated lamb and vegetable kebabs. Tasty.
Both around £9.50.
(p.s. 1969 is NOT the vintage! Prob year the _Cantina _was established.)


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (24 Aug 2020)

Enjoying these tips. Am I likely to see these wines in any supermarkets?


----------



## Shadow (24 Aug 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> Enjoying these tips. Am I likely to see these wines in any supermarkets?


You will _not_ find any of these _specific_ wines from _these_ producers in a supermarket in the UK. However, you should find these _styles_ of wines quite easily. A quick search shows even a pecorino available in waitrose, majestic, sainsburys ('taste the difference' range) and tesco ('finest' range)


----------



## BoldonLad (24 Aug 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> As I mature, I have outgrown the ales of callow youth and progressed onto wine - red wine, proper grown up wine. But alas I know nothing about it so tend to buy according to what bottle has the nicest label. This has led to mixed results, unsurprisingly.
> 
> So, let this be a thread where those who know, educate and those who don't know, experiment. Tell us what you're going to imbibe, where you got it (so others can find it) and let us know the results.
> 
> ...



Just come across this thread.

I have been drinking Red Wine for a number of (well, about 30) years.

Now, aged 72.

I am not sure I have learned much, but, on balance, I have enjoyed it (and, still do).

Rioja is probably my favourite, after drinking copious amounts of it whilst living in Spain and working in Gibraltar.

Barolo, I once had a very expensive experience with, but, it all ended well. On a first "date" with my now wife, took her to a rather smart restaurant. Trying to be clever, I asked the wine water to recommend a wine. He recommended an expensive Borolo. Not a situation in which wished to back down, I just hoped my Credit Card was good for it.

During an evenings drinking at a campsite in France, a fellow Brit gave me the tip that any bottle of French Red, with the word "Chateau" on the label, would be at least reasonable quality. I have tested this theory, but, since I have yet to find a bottle of Red which I would classify an "undrinkable", I am uncertain if the "tip" works.

Keep tasting, and, enjoy!


----------



## MontyVeda (24 Aug 2020)

Chris S said:


> Wine is better for middle-aged people, it gets you drunk on fewer calories.


...and generates far fewer trips to the loo than a 6 pack of beer 

That, along with fewer trips to the fridge, is the reason i began drinking red wine at home.

I tend to go for a shiraz, but they're not created equal. Some are like warm treacle , others are like vinegar 

I seldom pay more than £6 and on the odd occasion that i do, its taste doesn't justify the price. It's just a case of trial and error.


----------



## Shadow (25 Aug 2020)

Joey Shabadoo said:


> Enjoying these tips


My pleasure. You keep enjoying them, I'll keep providing them!


Joey Shabadoo said:


> Am I likely to see these wines in any supermarkets?


As I said upthread, supermarkets would not be my _first_ choice to find wine. If you wanted a new bike, would you go to Halfords or your LBS? I like to think of your local wine merchant as the wine equivalent of your LBS. The more you talk to them, the more helpful they can be.
(I do not like to denigrate supermarkets too much, they have done a fantastic job in improving the quality and choice of wines to the UK public; some of their products are very good, only much of their range is formulaic and dull).


----------



## Shadow (25 Aug 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> I seldom pay more than £6 and on the odd occasion that i do, its taste doesn't justify the price.


If this is what suits you, then fine. I hope your hit rate exceeds your misses!
However, remember that at £6.20 (it is very close to this figure), then 50% of that goes directly into HM Treasury's coffers, via Duty and VAT. After profit to the seller, shipping, bottles and labelling, this leaves very little for the grape farmer and/or producer. By paying only £2 more, almost all of this goes into improved quality of wine.


----------



## MontyVeda (25 Aug 2020)

Shadow said:


> ... By paying only £2 more, almost all of this goes into improved quality of wine.


what i was trying to say was... the more expensive wines tend to taste worse than the cheaper ones I purchase.


----------



## Shadow (14 Sep 2020)

It's been a couple of weeks since I've put an image up here but that does not mean I have not been drinking anything!





Very sad - this was my last (non-dessert) white wine from the last century. Clos Ste Hune is often considered to be the world's finest *riesling*. (And priced accordingly!) It requires cellaring, although is delicious young too. Some consider it austere, myself included, an acquired taste somewhat. I prefer the significantly cheaper Cuvée Frederick Emile from the same producer. Nonetheless, it is superb - powerful flavour, classic kerosene (in a good way!), seems slightly sweet at first but isn't, very long and dry as the proverbial bone. Needs food to be appreciated at its best - veal, chicken and pork work well, along with almost any veg, also proper Chinese and Thai dishes. But I would not waste this on my local chinese takeaway's chow mein! Like all good riesling, it has searing acidity, which means it works as a great counterbalance to any rich &/or creamy &/or fatty dishes.
Note the colour. It is a deep, deep golden yellow, the result of a few years maturation. It is maybe a touch darker in reality, it was difficult to achieve - see 'arty' image in 'My picture of the Day thread', which is obviously too dark!
This was drunk with last night roast chicken, roast potatoes and baked aubergine, courgette and red pepper, marinated in herbs for a while. Superlative.
The point of all this? You are missing out hugely if you do not try Alsace riesling - it is a wonderful thing. Expect to pay £12/13 and up.


----------



## oldfatfool (14 Sep 2020)

I used to be in the Times wine club and an elderly gent said as a rule of thumb said
Whatever wine you buy the first couple of quid would be bottle and shipping the next 20 - 30 quid would go on the actual quality of the wine, anything above was diminishing returns and the label. To an extent the likes of Lidl and aldi knock this apart, with some cracking wines under a tenner that would be 20+ in tesco etc. Wines on discount in big supermarkets tend to be selling still above or at best actual value.


----------



## raleighnut (14 Sep 2020)

Shadow said:


> My pleasure. You keep enjoying them, I'll keep providing them!
> 
> As I said upthread, supermarkets would not be my _first_ choice to find wine. If you wanted a new bike, would you go to Halfords or your LBS? I like to think of your local wine merchant as the wine equivalent of your LBS. The more you talk to them, the more helpful they can be.
> (I do not like to denigrate supermarkets too much, they have done a fantastic job in improving the quality and choice of wines to the UK public; some of their products are very good, only much of their range is formulaic and dull).


I remember when Bulgarian Wine first made it's appearance in the UK, the local Off-Licence (on the corner of Allandale Rd and Francis St i Stoneygate so a bit posh) had an 'open evening' wine tasting that the owner invited me to. So I duly turned up and there were half a dozen 'serving wenches' in traditional Bulgarian costume from the Importers doling out glasses of the various wines.






Anyway one of them gave me a 1/4 glass of the cheapest (well I was wearing Jeans, Baseball boots, a T-shirt and my Bike Leather) the owner spotted this and came rushing over all apologetic and gave me a full glass of the 'Oak Aged' Cabernet Sauvignon saying "try this" and when I'd finished that replenished my glass saying '"It's good this innit" and he was right, I ordered a couple of cases (well it was only a couple of quid a bottle once the promo discount had been applied) which quite shocked the girl who'd given me the 1/4 glass but she didn't know that I bought a couple of bottles of Single Malt every week from the shop along with my 'Old Holborn' baccy and probably 2 or 3 bottles of wine (we made a lot of Wine and Beer at home though too)


----------



## figbat (14 Sep 2020)

I have a few bottles in usually - nothing that old and nothing for keeps but usually a varied mix of all colours, mostly NZ, Spain, SA, Italy, bit of France, occasional South American.

Memorable favourites over the last few years:
Shiraz Viognier Reserve From Western Cape, South Africa
Picpoul de Pinet from Languedoc
Appassimento from Puglia (a Merlot blend)
Various Albariños (I can still remember the first time I had this, in a seafood restaurant in Galicia - any time I drink it I am transported straight back there).

In fact looking back over my wine ordering history I realise just how much I/we have drunk!


----------



## Eziemnaik (3 Oct 2020)

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41598-017-08080-0
Why expensive wine is usually better than the cheap one


----------



## Gunk (7 Nov 2020)

As my daughter turned 18 yesterday, we opened the bottle of Chateau Canon 1995 I bought the day she was born, luckily it wasn’t corked and was very agreeable.


----------



## stephec (7 Nov 2020)

Can anyone here confirm something that I read a few years ago please? 

And that was - really good quality red wine doesn't give you a hangover.


----------



## mistyoptic (7 Nov 2020)

stephec said:


> Can anyone here confirm something that I read a few years ago please?
> 
> And that was - really good quality red wine doesn't give you a hangover.


It’s because you can’t afford to drink as much of it 🤣


----------



## Shadow (9 Nov 2020)

Gunk said:


> As my daughter turned 18 yesterday, we opened the bottle of Chateau Canon 1995 I bought the day she was born, luckily it wasn’t corked and was very agreeable.


Hope your daughter enjoyed it too! And appreciated your sentiment. No reason why it should have been corked. 'Very agreeable'? I would have hoped it was a bit more than just 'agreeable'!
And may we ask what you had to eat with eat?


----------



## Gunk (9 Nov 2020)

Shadow said:


> Hope your daughter enjoyed it too! And appreciated your sentiment. No reason why it should have been corked. 'Very agreeable'? I would have hoped it was a bit more than just 'agreeable'!
> And may we ask what you had to eat with eat?



Spag Boll


----------



## Shadow (10 Nov 2020)

stephec said:


> And that was - really good quality red wine doesn't give you a hangover.


_All _alcoholic drinks will give you a hangover if you consume enough of them!!!
However, most better quality wines - red and white - tend to have less sulphur dioxide added; some will not add SO2 at all. This is commonly used in winemaking to act as a preservative. There are roolz as to how much may be added. Sulphites cause headaches/hangovers among other reactions.


----------



## stephec (10 Nov 2020)

Shadow said:


> _All _alcoholic drinks will give you a hangover if you consume enough of them!!!
> However, most better quality wines - red and white - tend to have less sulphur dioxide added; some will not add SO2 at all. This is commonly used in winemaking to act as a preservative. There are roolz as to how much may be added. Sulphites cause headaches/hangovers among other reactions.


Thanks. 😊


----------



## Teamfixed (10 Nov 2020)

We subscribe to 'Naked wines'.
We have a box of red wine, gin and other nice stuff that they throw in arriving this week. We have always been impressed by the standard of wine (all comes from smaller independent producers)
However if Aldi are still doing Cote du Rhone villages for 5.99 it's a massive bargain!


----------



## figbat (10 Nov 2020)

Teamfixed said:


> We subscribe to 'Naked wines'.
> We have a box of red wine, gin and other nice stuff that they throw in arriving this week. We have always been impressed by the standard of wine (all comes from smaller independent producers)
> However if Aldi are still doing Cote du Rhone villages for 5.99 it's a massive bargain!


I am also a Naked Angel and have the Xmas box coming this week too. I’ve been a member for several years now and have not yet had a bad bottle - some I have preferred over others but they’ve all been decent examples of their type.


----------



## Shadow (10 Nov 2020)

About time I posted again, so here are a couple of examples of an appellation every wine-drinking cyclist should be familiar with!











The Terrasses was bought in the UK (£10.50), is from an excellent producer with a good visitor operation. The Ferme St Pierre was bought at the winery (€11), a *Grenache*, *Syrah *and *Carignan *blend, a good producer yet a more rustic set-up with no visitor facilities, down to earth, yet happy to welcome visitors. 
Again, because Ventoux is not widely known to the general UK populace as a wine region, they are bargains. Both of these were excellent, full-bodied, earthy and smooth. Both would have kept for a few more years no problem if I had not been so thirsty. Perfect fare for this time of year with food like beef casserole.


----------



## Eziemnaik (13 Nov 2020)

For 2€ can't complain


----------



## mistyoptic (13 Nov 2020)

Another very important label for us


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (28 Nov 2021)

While in France a few months ago, I discovered a place called Bordeaux where they make wine apparently. T'was a wonderful visit - every cafe served a vin rouge better than the last one. So I've been experimenting since I came home. These are some of my favourites -










The Pitray is very nice. Very more-ish. Unfortunately, it's caused my fingertips to go numb.

Both available from Majestic wines.


----------



## CharlesF (28 Nov 2021)

Kadette is a great SA Pinotage!


----------



## stephec (28 Nov 2021)

The wines of Bordeaux are the finest in the world, they are that good they can sometimes tempt me to stray from the ale, and that takes some doing. 😊


----------



## Shadow (29 Nov 2021)

stephec said:


> The wines of Bordeaux are the finest in the world


Umm, debatable. The bordelaise make _some_ of the finest wines in the world but it is a huge region producing vast quantities, a lot at the bottom end is dross. There are plenty of folk in other regions who would argue _their _wine is the finest!



stephec said:


> they can sometimes tempt me to stray from the ale


Always good to have options!


----------



## Shadow (14 Dec 2021)

Roast Pork served at the weekend, so decided to go for a pinot noir:












2018 Wassmer Spatburgunder.JPG



__ Shadow
__ 14 Dec 2021





Spatbugunder is German for *Pinot Noir*. Decent pinot noir from almost anywhere, especially Burgundy, is now sadly out of my price range and I find inexpensive pinot noir either too sweet (e.g. Chile) or too thin and acidic (e.g. Romania)* and tend to be one dimensional. This cost £14.50, astonishing value for such a good wine. If you like pinot noir, Germany can be a good hunting ground. 
If you are prepared to pay £20 -25 for tasty pinot noir then south africa and canada both have excellent producers, although the latter can be a little difficult to find in the UK.
*this applies to my changing taste; if you enjoy pinot noir and want something inexpensive, chile. romania, moldova and south of france are all areas worth exploring.


----------



## Shadow (14 Dec 2021)

And to follow, a new recipe for apple cake, accompanied by a dessert wine from the Loire Valley:












211012 Fesles Bonnezeaux 1998.JPG



__ Shadow
__ 3 Dec 2021





Fesles is the producer, Bonnezeaux is the appellation, *Chenin Blanc* is the grape. Now 23 years old, originally bought while in france about 20 years ago, it had matured beautifully. The whole bottle had been consumed before being able to take a picture of it - a deep, deep golden colour. Very sweet obviously with layers of flavours coming through, balanced with a streak of acidity making it refreshing. On and on the flavours stayed in the mouth. I have had the fortune to drink some astonishingly good dessert wine over the years e.g. d'Yquem, Klein Constantia's Vin de Constance, ice wine from Canada, Tokaji from Hungary and this was the best I've ever had. Bliss.
I think chenin blanc is hugely underrated. It makes some of the driest wines you can taste to some of the sweetest and everything in between. The labels should make it abundantly clear what the sweetness level is. Its home is the Loire Valley, while excellent examples may be found in South Africa too. All good examples will have its signature acidity - this is a good thing - and this is what makes it able to live for so long, including dry ones too.


----------



## Profpointy (14 Dec 2021)

Chris S said:


> Wine is better for middle-aged people, it gets you drunk on fewer calories.



Not sure about that. I can drink maybe 5 pints of beer and be reasonably OK (obviously not fit to drive nor attend a business meeting) but if I drank 5 pints of wine I'd be totally blotto


----------



## Shadow (15 Dec 2021)

Next up, an expensive white:





Plain, classy label but it tells us nothing about what's in the bottle apart from where it originates (Ventoux in the Rhone Valley), not even its colour!, so turn it around :




where we learn it is white, capable of ageing. Stuff about independent estate and made in small quantities can be taken with a pinch of salt. But happens to be true in this case! Made from *Roussane *and *Clairette*, two of the usual Rhone white grapes although latter is not used much nor in great quantity in a blend. I drank this about 2 weeks ago which is only another 6 years beyond its ageing capability! It was very tasty with roast chicken and was as described, showing no sign of fading or deterioration. 
From autumn through winter, sometimes a full-bodied, full flavoured white is a good choice with certain food or folk who are not keen on full reds. Rhone whites do this. As would an oaked chardonnay or an oaky white rioja too.


----------



## Shadow (16 Dec 2021)

Today's tipple:




Attractive label but tells us nothing about what's in the bottle except it's an Italian red! Turn it around:




and we don't get much more beyond all the legal stuff. But this caught my eye _"made from slightly dried grapes"_. This is indeed used to increase flavour complexity - a case of a little knowledge goes a long way, so I bought it. This technique is used in more expensive wines, the most well-known being Amarone, a big, strong, multi-faceted wine from Veneto, basically a super-supercharged valpolicella.
Drank it with lasagna and thought bloody hell this is good. It would work well with any spag bol type dish, grilled red meats and rich casseroles.
Digging into their website, I discover this is a very clever, modern wine. Under new-ish rules, it is a multi-regional blend, hence "Rosso d'Italia" on the label as opposed to a specific region. Nero d'Avola from Sicily, Merlot from Veneto, oak aged Montepulciano from Abruzzo and part dried Primitivo from Puglia. There is no vintage indication so grapes could also come from different years. 
An absolute bargain at £8.00 from Sainsburys, Morrisons (£8.50) and Tesco in the UK. A stonking steal when on offer - e.g. now at Morrisons for £6.50!


----------



## Shadow (27 Dec 2021)

The pleasures of a relaxed xmas day:






I would like to comment on 2 and 4 from the left:
2018 T Haag Riesling - a superb wine from an excellent producer, as was his father. Off dry to medium dry (about 4 or 5 on a scale of 1 to 9), it is not cloying because it has refreshing acidity. Delicious as an aperitif, especially if following with plenty more to drink as it s only 8.5% abv! Also excellent with ham, Thai and many spicy dishes. It is one of the wine world's bargains for one of the word's finest wines (many years ago these were considered as good as top notch claret). This was only £15.50 a few years ago. Forget about white wine needing to be dry and give this a go.
2017 Semillon - another bargain. Made by de Bortoli, a well-known and well-regarded Aussie producer, this was made for Tesco and is only £6 for half a bottle. Very sweet, streaking acidity, drink on its own or with fruit desserts or even as an aperitif in the summer.


----------



## Shadow (30 Dec 2021)

Yesterday's fun...





from the left:
2016 Court Garden Classic Cuvée Brut, England - a blend of chardonnay, pinot noir and pinot meunier; perhaps my favourite quality english sparkler of the moment, certainly providing better value than most; available directly from the producer or some independent wine stores in the UK.
2018 Domaine des Gerbeaux Pouilly Fuissé Champs Roux, France - 100% chardonnay, often good value from southern burgundy.
NV Nyetimber Classic Cuvée, England - the wine that put english wine on the map, still very good, yet expensive in my opinion.
NV Nyetimber Rosé, England - one of the most overrated and overpriced sparklers I've had the misfortune to drink; even though its well-made, has pleasant redcurrant and cherry flavour, it is short and acidic and you won't get much change from £40, *avoid*. (And the other 3 drinkers also disliked it).
2013 Nyetimber Blanc de Blancs, England - 100% chardonnay, well-made, good quality wine, brioche notes, not cheap.
2014 Cantina de Negrar Recioto della Valpolicella, Italy - a blend of corvina and molinara grapes but the most important aspect is that the grapes are left to dry for a few months to intensify the flavour. This is rich and sweet, a dessert wine, perfect with anything faintly to do with chocolate. Yum.


----------



## Joey Shabadoo (30 Dec 2021)

Some of my tipples of late -



























All very good but especially the Pinotage. So tasty I bought two cases for my customers.


----------



## Shadow (7 Jan 2022)

Maybe something a little different from all those big heavy xmassy reds: 




*Gruner Veltliner* from Austria. Anyone who likes sauvignon blanc should like this. It is fresh and fruity (like savvy b) but has greater texture, maybe slightly fuller and richer, so is good on its own and great with food. And makes it more interesting to folk like me! Anything you like to eat with savvy b will be fine with this. It has been on an upward trend the last few years, so once available at indies only, it can now be found easily.
These are two good examples, around the £10-12 mark. You will not find a poor example anywhere as the Austrians no longer export rubbish, although supermarket own label bottles may not be as good as slightly more expensive ones.
Usually found in tall, riesling or Alsace type bottles, like the one on the right, but don to let this put you off! I have no idea why the one on the left is in a burgundy shaped bottle, it is the only one I've seen.
I think some producers are experimenting with this grape in the southern hemisphere but have not tasted one. 
Highly recommended, try it!


----------



## Grant Fondo (7 Jan 2022)

Shadow said:


> Maybe something a little different from all those big heavy xmassy reds:
> View attachment 625379
> 
> *Gruner Veltliner* from Austria. Anyone who likes sauvignon blanc should like this. It is fresh and fruity (like savvy b) but has greater texture, maybe slightly fuller and richer, so is good on its own and great with food. And makes it more interesting to folk like me! Anything you like to eat with savvy b will be fine with this. It has been on an upward trend the last few years, so once available at indies only, it can now be found easily.
> ...


+1 on that recommendation  This £7.99 one from Waitrose is great for the cash.


----------



## Grant Fondo (7 Jan 2022)

As well as an (obviously ) nice label, this one from Naked Wines is good for 8 quid.


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

It has been 360 days since anyone added to this thread, I have been negligent. So going to show some bottles from last year that were of interest for one reason or another.

First up, july 1st is canada day, so it had to be this:




*2017 Hidden Bench Riesling* - From Ontario, Canada. Delicious, refreshing, great flavour with a steely minerality (this is a good thing!). Organic. Still very young, would keep for at least another 7 years, but not in my home. Only 10.5%. About C$25.00. (apx £15.00). Not available in UK.


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

Others in july:

*2020 Rickety Bridge Chenin Blanc*





*2020 Fontan Tattoo Blanc*





*2020 Guillaume Aurèle Rosé



*


Rickety Bridge - from South Africa, where the best chenin blanc is made outside of the Loire Valley. Much is cheap 'n' cheerful, some are very good. This was full bodied and well-rounded. Very enjoyable. £11.50.

Fontan - from Cotes de Gascogne, SW France. A classic case of the wine not living up to the label ! A blend of sauvignon blanc and gros manseng (GM). I am not a huge fan of savvy b, so bought this because I thought the GM would to its character. It did, but not enough!. Disappointing and overpriced. £11.50

Rosé - from Languedoc, S France. Made in the Provençal style. Light salmon pink, soft with good body and zesty. A blend of syrah, cinsault and grenache, all you would find in a provence pink. Excellent as an apero and with any summer food, like my fave Salade Niçoise! Very good. £9.25


----------



## PK99 (2 Jan 2023)

Gunk said:


> The Beychevelle will opened Feb 2023



Not long now....


----------



## PK99 (2 Jan 2023)

Why have I only just found this thread.....

A recent indulgence bought 10 years ago, opened for dinner with fellow winos...

Reputedly one of the best sweet whites in the World. And on this tasing, I would agree.


----------



## Spiderweb (2 Jan 2023)

I have these to enjoy, the Susana Balbo Tradicion is a lovely Malbec, the Zuccardi Q I have yet to try.
Cheers everyone 🍷


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

August comes around and plenty of fresh fruit around. A perfect end to a meal. 

*2011 Domaine de Durban Beaumes de Venise*




Muscat is the grape, from the southern Rhone Valley. Intense grape flavour. (Bizarrely, muscat wine is the only grape that tastes of grapes!). Excellent as an apero and as a dessert wine. Durban is a top prodcuer and also make red Beaumes de Venise. (White or pink is clasified as Cotes du Rhone). An underrated wine these days, it used to be the only sweet wine on a restaurant list in the UK. £9.25.

*2007 Gulfi Neroblejo



*

From Sicily and one of the island's top producers, made with 100% Nero d'Avola, _the _red grape of the island. Matured in new oak barriques, fresh and bold, not overpowering in spite of 14% abv, complex and very long. Reflects its sense of place. No signs of age at all. Quite superb. Sadly my last bottle. A bargain at £17.50. (Bought 10 years ago, so likely to cost much more these days!).

*2018 Le Roi Boeuf*







Had this in a lovely little restaurant in Calais in late september. Asking the staff if it was any good, it was recommended not just something they had bought too much of and were trying to offload to unsuspecting tourists. Asked for a sample which they gladly provided. An unusual blend of merlot, tannat and cabernet franc from the Landes region which is near Bordeaux. It would be perfect with Boeuf en Daube. Very good.


*
*


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

PK99 said:


> Bought 10 years ago, opened for dinner with fellow winos...
> 
> Reputedly one of the best sweet whites in the World. And on this tasting, I would agree.


Indeed. Not only is it one of the best _dessert _wines of the world, it is one of the best _wines _of the world. A classic. I am sure you would say it was not too young. However, it would have continued to develop and in another 20 years would be even better! Am glad you and your mates enjoyed and appreciated it...wish I could have joined you!



Spiderweb said:


> I have these to enjoy, the Susana Balbo Tradicion is a lovely Malbec, the Zuccardi Q I have yet to try.
> Cheers everyone 🍷


Susanna Blabo is not only regarded as one of the best winemakers in Argentina, also highly regarded around the world. That should be lovely. 
Zuccardi make good wines and was familiar with many of them about 5 to 7 years ago. Very good, just not to my taste.


----------



## PK99 (2 Jan 2023)

Shadow said:


> Indeed. Not only is it one of the best _dessert _wines of the world, it is one of the best _wines _of the world. A classic. I am sure you would say it was not too young. However, it would have continued to develop and in another 20 years would be even better! Am glad you and your mates enjoyed and appreciated it...wish I could have joined you!



Yep, it would have continued to develop. But, as with some Vintage port I have under the stairs (north facing flank wall = good temperature) I want to drink it not bequeath it!

I served the Constance with Tarte Tatin and Roquefort - a Homage to Napoleon and my Lancashire heritage.*


*Apple pie without cheese, is like a kiss without a squeeze.


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

PK99 said:


> I served the Constance with Tarte Tatin and Roquefort - a Homage to Napoleon and my Lancashire heritage.*
> 
> *Apple pie without cheese, is like a kiss without a squeeze.


Lovely. 

*Understood. My parents were both from Lancs.


----------



## Shadow (2 Jan 2023)

Which brings us to last week.

*2018 T Haag Schloss Lieser Juffer Sonnenuhr Riesling Kabinett*






German riesling - from the Mosel, only 8.5% abv. So had a glass or two while prepping veggies at 11.00…without any ill effect ! Still very young, another wine that did not last long enough in my ‘cellar’ to mature fully. Would be much better in 4 years time and lasting to at least 2033. Superb. £15.50.

*NV Cuvée Tradition Champagne Hostomme *





This has been my 'house' champagne for near on 20 years. 100% chardonnay. Just suits my palate. €27.00 cellar door/available in UK under Harrods own label £40.00.

*2015 Chateau Heritage Saint Elie*





Heritage - from Lebanon, blend of cabernet sauvignon and cinsault. Very dense and rich. Different from Musar. (And cheaper!). No signs of age, still young, easily good for another 7 years or so. Only available from independent and specialist delis. Was excellent with roast beef. Amazing value at £17.00.
Just suits my palate.


----------



## Grant Fondo (3 Jan 2023)

@Shadow has reminded me of a nice Turkish red .... fantastic with spicy Mezze and charcoal grilled lamb chops at my local emporium


----------



## Shadow (4 Jan 2023)

Grant Fondo said:


> @Shadow has reminded me of a nice Turkish red .... fantastic with spicy Mezze and charcoal grilled lamb chops at my local emporium
> View attachment 673313



Not familiar with this producer. 
However, the blend of Okuzgozu and Bogazkere work wonderfully together. Indigenous to Turkey and mostly found in the eastern region of Anatolia. Translated to english, they mean ox eye (or bull's eye) and throat burner, respectively. When made well, they can be super, big, long lasting wines. Your local emporium is serving you well !


----------



## T4tomo (4 Jan 2023)

PK99 said:


> and my Lancashire heritage.*
> 
> 
> *Apple pie without cheese, is like a kiss without a squeeze.



also the "thing" in Yorkshire.


----------



## MrGrumpy (4 Jan 2023)

This was rather tasty ! Was on offer at a neighbours Hogmanay party . It was finished !! Coto de Imaz reserva 2015 . I think it was Jeroboam size ?


----------

