# Garmin Edge 605 Route Planning



## charlie999 (11 Jul 2008)

Hi,

I have been looking at the Garmin 605 Bike GPS and quite like the sound of it. My question is as follows:

Is it possible to sit at your PC with the software that came with it (or any other come to think of it) and plan a route to then upload to the device and then follow it? I know it says you can store routes you have done before but can you plan them in the first instance.

I presume you could navigate from where you are now to a destination and it would pick the best route like a TOMTOM device but I would like to sit at home plan a route in a big circle finishing where I left off knowing the distance before hand. I could then take the bikes out into the country have a good ride ending up back at the car relaxing in the thought that I would not get lost and had not had to go further than planned.

Hope someone can help.

Charlie


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## Will1985 (11 Jul 2008)

charlie999 said:


> Hi,Is it possible to sit at your PC with the software that came with it (or any other come to think of it) and plan a route to then upload to the device and then follow it? I know it says you can store routes you have done before but can you plan them in the first instance.



Yes - make them on mapmyride.com and then upload them.


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## RedBike (11 Jul 2008)

> I presume you could navigate from where you are now to a destination and it would pick the best route like a TOMTOM device



I don't think it will. 

I have the Legend (a lower end model). You can type in the name of a major town/city (villages aren't always listed) and it will show you which direction to travel in. But unlike tomtom It doesn't actually tell you which roads to take. You can't enter a postcode or a streetname etc. 

As for getting lost. It plots your route on a map. So it's easy to see where you've been and where you currently are in relation to where you started.


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## Bollo (11 Jul 2008)

Ooooooh. Now this is a question.

First of all, DON'T rely on the built in route-planning. Its seems to be based on their standard road nav algorithms and will quite happily direct you along the nearest motorway if that's what it thinks is quickest. To be honest, autorouting for bikes is not a goer for anything other than emergencies.

Now to route mapping on PCs. You can use a third party program or web site and download the gpx files to the Garmin BUT these will not align exactly with the Garmin's internal representation of roads and other features. So, when you are following your route while riding, the indicated route may not overlay properly on your position. Worse, at junctions the instructions can be confused, resulting in U-turns aplenty.

To make sure your PC planned route matches the route you'll follow on the Garmin, you need to use the supplied Mapsource program. This uses the same map representation as the 605/705 unit so everything stays aligned and you'll get reliable directions. The bad news is that Mapsource appears to have been written for Windows 3.1 (ask your dad), and the vector-based maps are almost impossible to follow at any level of detail. By that I mean its very difficult to work out what part of any map you're looking at, as they don't contain the same detail that you take for granted on an OS map.

The good news is that the autorouting between selected points in Mapsource is very good, so you don't need to select many points on a route to get what you want. I work by drawing up a route in Tracklogs (memorymap or an online tool will do the same), loading it into mapsource and then 'tracing' it in mapsource to download to my 705. Now that's another story.............(search on 705, Garmin or similar to find a thread about this)

This all sounds horrendous, but the value I get from the nav capability (I usually ride alone on unfamiliar routes) make the effort worthwhile. 
Hope this helps.


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## andrew_s (11 Jul 2008)

Bollo said:


> First of all, DON'T rely on the built in route-planning. Its seems to be based on their standard road nav algorithms and will quite happily direct you along the nearest motorway if that's what it thinks is quickest. To be honest, autorouting for bikes is not a goer for anything other than emergencies.


If it directs you along a motorway, it's probably because you haven't told it you are on a bike.
I've found my 60CSx can be quite reasonable for bike autorouting. Earlier in the year it picked quite decent bike routes into and out of Rouen, and into Le Havre ferryport from the north.
You can't expect it to know much about cycle tracks, but it did a good job of avoiding main roads.


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## Bollo (12 Jul 2008)

andrew_s said:


> If it directs you along a motorway, it's probably because you haven't told it you are on a bike.
> I've found my 60CSx can be quite reasonable for bike autorouting. Earlier in the year it picked quite decent bike routes into and out of Rouen, and into Le Havre ferryport from the north.
> You can't expect it to know much about cycle tracks, but it did a good job of avoiding main roads.


Nope, set for the most minor of minor roads and its quite happy to send me on the M3 if there's no alternative. The 605/705 does not have a bike-specific nav option. All you can do is set a _preference _for minor roads, which doesn't seem to make much difference, in the UK at least. Even so, there are A roads that I'll happily cycle along and race-track B roads that I wouldn't touch with yours. There's no way a basic route finder can know which roads are cycle-friendly and which will have you listening for the engine tone of every passing car.


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## charlie999 (12 Jul 2008)

Thanks for the replies they have been very helpfull. I have just ordered my Edge 605 and should have it on Tuesday all being well. In the mean time I have been playing about at mapmyride.com a brilliant site if it all works. Internet Explorer keeps locking up when using it though anyone else having that trouble?

Is there another site that does the same to upload to an egde does anyone know?

Regards Charlie


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## charlie999 (15 Jul 2008)

I have just taken delivery of my new Garman edge 605 and am a bit dissapointed with the maps. They are very very basic. I live in the midlands (UK) on a housing estate but the maps only show the main road and a motorway near me.

I am guessing and hoping that I am wrong that this is a basic map that comes with the device and if you want more detailed then you must buy it!!

Does anyone have an idea what could be wrong?

Charlie


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## Bollo (15 Jul 2008)

charlie999 said:


> I have just taken delivery of my new Garman edge 605 and am a bit dissapointed with the maps. They are very very basic. I live in the midlands (UK) on a housing estate but the maps only show the main road and a motorway near me.
> 
> I am guessing and hoping that I am wrong that this is a basic map that comes with the device and if you want more detailed then you must buy it!!
> 
> ...



Hole in one (or yellow jersey?). Sorry about not mentioning it but I agree that Garmin are a little coy about maps. The base maps are trousers, even for car use, so you're pretty much compelled to supplement them with another map product if you're serious about navigation. You've got a choice of the road maps or the 'topo' maps, which also show _some_ OS-like features and contour lines. Have a look on Garmin's web site to decide which one is fit for your purpose, then shop around. Garmin 'protect their investment' in the maps, so there's plenty of codes and unlocking. It can be daunting, but Garmin's telephone support is very good in my experience. Also, don't buy from the Garmin shop for the maps, as there's plenty of deals on the interbob.

I have the topo, but the extra info over the full road maps is quite frankly a waste of time for road bikery.

I believe you can get third party maps from other sources, but this looked like more trouble than its worth.

I think the concept of use for the 605/705 is training aid first with the _option _of proper navigation second. I'm guessing the nav and training components of the software have been welded together from separate devices. Its annoying, as the 605 and 705 are good, but they could have been great with a little more development on the nav side.

Hope you get it set up ok.


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## charlie999 (16 Jul 2008)

Bollo thanks for the reply. I have ordered the maps for the UK and Ireland. I have shopped arround and got a reasonable price I think.

Anyway in the mean time today I had it on in the car on the way to work just to try and find my way arround etc (You know what its like to ge a new toy!!!) The basic map that is on only has a few roads but I used the motorways today so they were visible. The GPS track was slightly out to the maps.

Is that right do you think?
Will it get better with the map pack?

God I hope so will be devastated if not as I dont think my OCD will cope!!!

Regards Charlie


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## Bollo (17 Jul 2008)

charlie999 said:


> Bollo thanks for the reply. I have ordered the maps for the UK and Ireland. I have shopped arround and got a reasonable price I think.
> 
> Anyway in the mean time today I had it on in the car on the way to work just to try and find my way arround etc (You know what its like to ge a new toy!!!) The basic map that is on only has a few roads but I used the motorways today so they were visible. The GPS track was slightly out to the maps.
> 
> ...



I've found that the alignment between tracks and the map is very good with the decent maps, so don't worry too much about this. When you're navigating using a track it will count you down in seconds and distance to junctions (as long as the map recognises it as a road change) and this can get quite spooky when the junction is well hidden.


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## charlie999 (19 Jul 2008)

OK the maps have come on a Micro Sd card slotted in and booted up a treat. I cant wait to go for a ride. They on line so Bollo I think you were again right.

Can anyone tell me how I can get the Garmin Training centre to show the same maps so when I look at how I have done it will be in better map detail rather than the base maps.

Regards Charlie


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## dodgy (19 Jul 2008)

There are some incorrect messages being posted in this thread. First of all, the 605 and 705 allow the user to configure the unit for car/motorcycle bicycle or pedestrian - you'll find that in Settings ---> Routing and you can also further configure to avoid either or both of unpaved roads and major streets.

I find the autorouting is very good (lots more info on my site below), and despite the fact that I live near a convenient motorway junction and many of my routes head along the direction it travels (I live on the Wirral, look on Google maps to see what I mean) I have never once had my 705 attempt to route me down it, no matter how hard I've tried, it simply would never do it.

You can design routes on your PC using web-based applications such as MapMyRide, bikeroutetoaster and others, but I prefer to use Garmin's Mapsource with appropriate mapping. If you want to use Mapsource, you'll need to buy a mapping product on DVD - *do not buy the SD card version of any software*, you will not be able to use it on your PC. You have to spend a little more to get the DVD version of the software for PC installation, you can then send various maps to your 605 or 705.

As I said, more info in the link below.

Dave.


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## charlie999 (19 Jul 2008)

Dodgy,

Thanks for the input very helpfull. Unfortunatelly I have just recieved my maps on memory card not the DVD so I an stuffed. Never mind.

Your site looks good I will have a good look through at my leisure.

Charlie


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## dodgy (19 Jul 2008)

Bollo said:


> Ooooooh. Now this is a question.
> 
> First of all, DON'T rely on the built in route-planning. Its seems to be based on their standard road nav algorithms and will quite happily direct you along the nearest motorway if that's what it thinks is quickest. To be honest, autorouting for bikes is not a goer for anything other than emergencies.
> 
> ...



Hi bollo,

Reading your post above I would hazard a guess that you're using Garmin's Topo map? That might explain the poor experience you're having with autorouting. To fully exploit the autorouting capabilities of the Garmin Edge 605 and 705, you need Garmin City Navigator (Europe) 2008. Garmin's Topo map is neither one thing nor the other, it doesn't come anywhere close to matching an OS map (as you've already said) and it doesn't carry the detail required for address searching and autorouting that City Navigator 2008 has (be careful, older versions of City Navigator lack autorouting, too).

Dave.


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## charlie999 (23 Jul 2008)

Hi,

Posted this on another thread but only had one reply. Just in case anyone is subscribing to this thread and you can help. Enough waffle here goes!!!

_"Hi,_

_I have a Garmin edge and use mapmyride.com to plan routes and then download them so I can upload to my Edge 605. The routes seem very accurate and very very easy to do._

_My question is what file format is the best to use crs or tcx or even a gpx file? I have been using a tcx file. If my route has water stops on it they dont appear on the garmin and when you set up a field to show "Distance to destination" it stays blank the entire journey. There is another field on the route page I think that says "Distance to Go" but this does not seem to be a field that you can set up on other pages. I want the map page to show two fields one with distance to water stops and one distance to destinaation._

_Any ideas?"_

Charlie


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## Bollo (23 Jul 2008)

dodgy said:


> Hi bollo,
> 
> Reading your post above I would hazard a guess that you're using Garmin's Topo map? That might explain the poor experience you're having with autorouting. To fully exploit the autorouting capabilities of the Garmin Edge 605 and 705, you need Garmin City Navigator (Europe) 2008. Garmin's Topo map is neither one thing nor the other, it doesn't come anywhere close to matching an OS map (as you've already said) and it doesn't carry the detail required for address searching and autorouting that City Navigator 2008 has (be careful, older versions of City Navigator lack autorouting, too).
> 
> Dave.



Hi D,

You're right, I am using the topo maps. After reading your post I went away and had another play with some interesting results. Just setting the routing to 'Bicycle' will still direct you on motorways. ALSO setting the 'Avoid major roads' options will avoid motorways except of a stretch of the M3 near Winchester under certain circumstances. I'm guessing this is either some sort of error in the tagging of this section of the M3 or the routing algorithm just can't cope with its 'Berlin Wall' nature. The M3 drops to two lanes at this point (between J8 and J9) so that might explain it. My big gripe with the 705 here is that the documentation is shocking and doesn't give any real indication of the effect of either the 'Bicycle' or the 'Avoid major roads' option. Is an 'A' road major? Is a dual carriageway major but single carriageway minor. The 'manual' doesn't say.

I think you've pegged the topo maps, they're certainly not up to off-road navigation. I only got them because I wanted a view of possible gradients on the route. I can imagine someone who'd bought them for mountain-biking or general hiking would be a bit pissed off. There's no indication of rights-of-way and the 'paths' data is sketchy at best - more of this later. However, my version of the topo maps (V2 I think) DOES support full autorouting and address searches - honest!

That's the techy stuff - now my gripe against the general concept of autorouting for cycling. The classification of a road is only ever a rough guide to its suitability for cycling, and there's no way the basic rules used by the route search algorithms can get this. Here's a real example.....

My occasional 'full' commute takes me from Winchester through a place called Alresford. There are three basic route choices.
(a) Along the A31 - a fast dual carriageway
(B) Along the B3047 - a narrow single lane road bordered by high hedgerows
(c) Along NCN23 on an unclassified open road alongside the river Arle.

Option (a) is ok, but not a huge amount of fun. The road has reasonable sightlines so would be safe enough to ride despite the high traffic speeds.
My mate refers to Option (B) as the 'road of death' and he travels along it in a Mondeo! High speeds, tight bends and little passing space for cars. I've done it once on a bike - never again.
Option (c) is beautiful - makes you glad to be alive and on a bike.

Suppose I choose to let the 705 lead the way from my house. If I uncheck the 'Avoid Major Roads' option, it'll take me along Option (a). If I check this option (the choice that most cyclists would use), it picks (B). Option (c) is a no go, as the Garmin Topo Map has not captured the section of NCN 23 path/bike-track under the M3 J9 roundabout and on to Easton.

You can see from this example that the autorouting reverses the order that I'd choose for these routes. I can appreciate that it might be more suitable for different areas (for example it works quite well around my parents in Lincs, as road classification pretty much ties in with how busy/fast/safe any road is) but around here, local knowledge and/or research is usually the best guide.

I don't post often, but when I do...............


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## dodgy (23 Jul 2008)

Bollo, I'm confident you wouldn't have any of that bad routing if you had City Navigator 2008. When I allow my unit to autoroute me, it takes me away from all major roads and will even prefer to route me via residential areas than put me on an 'A' road. I also have Garmin Topo GB v2 and though you're right that it has autorouting, it simply does not have the knowledge of the smaller roads. If I switch my 705 to the Topo map and attempt to autoroute somewhere, the 705 will simply say "join the A540" but won't tell me how to get there, this is because the Topo maps have rudimentary detail on non arterial routes. Sorry to say that there is a dearth of information at the retailer over map choice and it often means that customers end up buying the wrong map...

Dave.


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## Stick on a Giant (30 Jul 2008)

Dodgy, I see on your website you say to get the DVD not micro-SD card - if I've got a card reader on my PC, could I use that to access it? And do I really need to access it on my PC, if I use mapmyride or similar to create the route in the first place?


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## dodgy (30 Jul 2008)

Stick on a Giant said:


> Dodgy, I see on your website you say to get the DVD not micro-SD card - if I've got a card reader on my PC, could I use that to access it? And do I really need to access it on my PC, if I use mapmyride or similar to create the route in the first place?



Hi,

You won't be able to access the SD card mapping from your PC. Being able to use the Garmin mapping on the PC is an advantage because it's a much more elegant solution than desiging routes on bikeroutetoaster et al and putting them on your Edge. But yes, if you use mmr or similar, you can use the SD card mapping just fine.

Dave.


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## Stick on a Giant (30 Jul 2008)

Cheers Dave, any thoughts/knowledge about using the Memory Maps CDs for route planning? I think if I buy one 'real' map, I can borrow someone else's to get the rest of the country! How would that transfer over on to the 705 with Navigator loaded?
I'm thinking of getting the 705 but as you can probably tell, I don't really know what questions to ask, so sorry if they seem really dumb!


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## dodgy (31 Jul 2008)

No problem about the questions!

Memory Map is a great product, however, it isn't fully compatible with the Edge 705 or 605. You can still design a route on MM and put it on your Edge (you'll have to do it manually as I don't think MM properly 'talks' to the Edge yet), but you won't be able to put the MM maps on your Edge.

I always tell people that if they are going to buy an Edge 705, by far the most formidable package is the Edge 705 with City Navigator 2008 *DVD version NOT the SD card version of City Navigator.*

Desiging routes on the PC with City Navigator 2008 is an abolute breeze, I know you can use MapMyRide and bikeroutetoaster (and many many others), but once you've used City Nav 2008 on Mapsource, you won't go back.

Dave.


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## charlie999 (31 Jul 2008)

Dodgy,

City Navigator 2008 DVD version. Does this install maps onto the Garmin training centre or does it put a totally new interface on?

Charlie


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## dodgy (31 Jul 2008)

Yes, if you install City Nav on your PC, you will be able to use the mapping in Training Centre and in Mapsource.

Dave.


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## charlie999 (1 Aug 2008)

Dodgy,

Do you get the Distance to Destination & Time to Destination field working with the DVD version?


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## charlie999 (2 Aug 2008)

OK one last question before I spend some money.

I have located *"GARMIN MAPSOURCE CITY NAVIGATOR EUROPE v.9 DVD"* on Ebay and it looks to be the right money. When you look at compatible products it does not list the Edge 605 or the 705 come to that. When I go to the garmin home page it lists some Citiy navigator DVD's for the Edge 605 but not the Europe one. I think it lists Switzerland maps as being OK. Is this just a typo or is there a difference?

The other point is will I be able to plan a route in detal putting in water stops and all that jaz then upload it to my Edge 605 with ease and accuracy?

Forgive me if this has been answered but its a lot of money and I want the water stops and such like to be able to be added accurately and with ease.

I am doing a charity bike ride next year you see of 100 miles and I want to plan the route with all the drinks stops so I can set up the Edge 605 to display miles to go to each stop and the final stop.

Regards Charlie


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## dodgy (2 Aug 2008)

charlie999 said:


> Dodgy,
> 
> Do you get the Distance to Destination & Time to Destination field working with the DVD version?



The field on the 705? Yes, I get told how far and the ETA to destination.

Dave.


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## dodgy (2 Aug 2008)

charlie999 said:


> OK one last question before I spend some money.
> 
> I have located *"GARMIN MAPSOURCE CITY NAVIGATOR EUROPE v.9 DVD"* on Ebay and it looks to be the right money. When you look at compatible products it does not list the Edge 605 or the 705 come to that. When I go to the garmin home page it lists some Citiy navigator DVD's for the Edge 605 but not the Europe one. I think it lists Switzerland maps as being OK. Is this just a typo or is there a difference?



Put it this way, my copy of the same title in bold above works on my 705. I noticed a few copies of it sold for about £25 on ebay recently, that's very cheap, possibly copies.



> The other point is will I be able to plan a route in detal putting in water stops and all that jaz then upload it to my Edge 605 with ease and accuracy?



Yes you will be able to do that.


> Forgive me if this has been answered but its a lot of money and I want the water stops and such like to be able to be added accurately and with ease.


Quite understandable, I've said it before and will do so again now, there's simply not enough information at the retailer level to give people the confidence to buy the right maps. It seems Garmin are relying on Internet forums to do that job for them.


> I am doing a charity bike ride next year you see of 100 miles and I want to plan the route with all the drinks stops so I can set up the Edge 605 to display miles to go to each stop and the final stop.
> 
> Regards Charlie



Best of luck :?:

Dave.


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## charlie999 (2 Aug 2008)

Dave,

Thanks for all your help you seems like you know what your on about.

I have ordered it and await its arrival now with anticipation!

All I have to do then is sell the maps I bought on the SD card. I know I will lose a bit selling on ebay but thats life!!

I will report back when all is running.

Again thanks

Charlie


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## charlie999 (3 Aug 2008)

Ok correct me if I'm wrong. The Training centre software is just for analysing your rides and sending history and courses to and from the Edge.

The Mapsource software (which I have only just downloaded can you believe it penny had not dropped) is for planning the course in the first place, deciding which route to take etc.

The City Navigator DVD is basically the maps that are installed on your system that Training Centre & Mapsourse use instead of the bog standard and basic basemaps. How am I so far?

In readyness for the arrival of my new maps from far overseas I have been playing with the newly found Mapsourse software. I take it you use the route tool to merrily click away along the roads and then watch the route grow. Do you have to follow the roads at tighter intervals when the bends are there or will it follow them naturally like mapmyride does in the autorouting facility?

Charlie


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## Bigtallfatbloke (3 Aug 2008)

Oh man here we go again

http://www.cyclechat.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=15049

...actually if i could get a CHEAP ebay copy of the DVD it might make my GPS life more tolerable....but so far the SD card has been a nightmare. The auto routing, even when set for a bike and to avoid highways etc still fails to select even the most obvious and simple routes that can be seen on the ground in preference to motorways and faster roads, or even worse huge detours off into the nearest big town rather than a simple straightline route to the next waypoint. It does not see the smaller cycle routes at all. It is all but impossible to see the bigge rpicture clearly on this thing, I 100% need to use a paper map first. I am persevering on this learning curve, but I am unable to trust all this techno babble yet...if ever.


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## dodgy (3 Aug 2008)

charlie999 said:


> Ok correct me if I'm wrong. The Training centre software is just for analysing your rides and sending history and courses to and from the Edge.
> 
> The Mapsource software (which I have only just downloaded can you believe it penny had not dropped) is for planning the course in the first place, deciding which route to take etc.
> 
> The City Navigator DVD is basically the maps that are installed on your system that Training Centre & Mapsourse use instead of the bog standard and basic basemaps. How am I so far?


Yep, all spot on.


> In readyness for the arrival of my new maps from far overseas I have been playing with the newly found Mapsourse software. I take it you use the route tool to merrily click away along the roads and then watch the route grow. Do you have to follow the roads at tighter intervals when the bends are there or will it follow them naturally like mapmyride does in the autorouting facility?
> 
> Charlie



Mapsource has autorouting when coupled with an appropriate mapping product, City Navigator DVD 2008 Europe does have this autorouting.

(Just read BFTB comment after yours).

As long as you 'tell' the Edge and Mapsource that you are a cyclist (select the bike option in setup) you will not ever ever ever ever (repeat a trillion times) be sent down onto a motorway. If your Edge sends you down a motorway having installed City Navigator and configured as a cyclist, I will nail my left bollock to a piece of 4 by 2 and leave it there for the rest of my life.

Good luck,

Dave.


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## charlie999 (3 Aug 2008)

Dave,

Fantastic thats exactly what I wanted to hear. I will shut up now and just get on with it I think!

It dont make me a bad person but a small part of me is hoping I get sent down the M54 which is right by where I live!!!! LOL!!!

Regards Charlie


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