# Courier employees??



## Kevin Alexander (8 Jul 2016)

Just wondering if there are any courier drivers here as I find it amazing there was courier would leave a parcel in a garden.

My parcel has went missing after the driver left the item on my doorstep.

Fair enough the company is resenting but what would possess someone to be there negligent 

Rant over


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## ColinJ (8 Jul 2016)

Ha - an Amazon courier yesterday claims to have delivered my parcel to a non-existent neighbour! Well, the neighbour might exist but the address that he is supposed to live at does not so I am having a problem finding which neighbour it is!

Oh, and I was in all day waiting for the parcel, a few feet from the front door. The courier did NOT come to the door ...

I once had a parcel containing a £50 webcam left on my front step. The step was right next to the pavement since the house had no garden or yard.


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## Garry A (8 Jul 2016)

I'm sitting in waiting for a delivery that may or may not come today or tomorrow. From now I will not be buying from anyone unless they can give me a delivery date and a time window. Hate having my time wasted, I'm doing dishes and washing instead of pedalling.


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## jonny jeez (8 Jul 2016)

Garry A said:


> From now I will not be buying from anyone unless they can give me a delivery date and a time window. Hate having my time wasted, .


You could always go to the shop yourself and just buy it.

Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding. We complain about corruption, environmental impact, social values and yet we want everything, yesterday, for half the price, delivered at our convenience with a lovely bag of sweets to boot

How do we expect firms to maintain costs under those sorts of demands...without something having to give?


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## Globalti (8 Jul 2016)

Anybody who has ever driven a delivery van would be fuming at the OP; I did it once and it was the most stressful, exhausting job I've ever done. And that was before cell phones, satnav or online shopping and I'm sure drivers' lives are timed to the minute nowadays so the pressure to get rid of the package and get moving must be immense. A frustrated drop is a huge pain in the wotsit because it means you've got to try again later or the next day.

It's grossly unsound environmentally as well; British roads are clogged solid with almost empty vans racing around delivering parcels to people who want that stuff in 24 hours for a fraction of the shop price.


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## Chris S (8 Jul 2016)

Apparently the last leg of the delivery from the depot to the delivery address accounts for about 50% of the total cost. Having to repeat it wipes out any profit so couriers go to extreme lengths to avoid it.


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## Globalti (8 Jul 2016)

The demand for instant delivery has created a massive free market for couriers; I have no idea of the size of this "industry" but I'm sure it has burgeoned in recent years from the most basic level of the person with a car and some time to spare through the small local firms to the nationals. I do know that a certain amount of rationalisation has taken place at the national level so that many courier cos simply act as agents for TNT, who own the vehicles and do the distribution. Even Manchester's famous Curry Mile is turning slowly into a Kebab Mile as Syrians and Iraqis edge the Asians out; one Syrian guy told me Asians are moving into the courier business because it's growing, unlike Indian food, which is shrinking.


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## Roadrider48 (8 Jul 2016)

I have no complaints about any courier service as such.
But, it has happened to me twice that when the item doesn't turn up and you check the tracking in the evening it says that I was out and they couldn't deliver.
That is a complete lie, because those two times I was at home all day.
And just to rub salt in the wound it says they left a card. But I had no card.
I do use couriers a hell of a lot and those two instances do sort of pale into significance.


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## Kevin Alexander (8 Jul 2016)

Globalti said:


> Anybody who has ever driven a delivery van would be fuming at the OP; I did it once and it was the most stressful, exhausting job I've ever done. And that was before cell phones, satnav or online shopping and I'm sure drivers' lives are timed to the minute nowadays so the pressure to get rid of the package and get moving must be immense. A frustrated drop is a huge pain in the wotsit because it means you've got to try again later or the next day.
> 
> It's grossly unsound environmentally as well; British roads are clogged solid with almost empty vans racing around delivering parcels to people who want that stuff in 24 hours for a fraction of the shop price.




Don't see why. I'm paying a for a £500 power meter to be delivered in a safe and proper manner. Not to be left unattended in my garden. That is not their policy.

They are paid to deliver. If I am not in leave a card and I will rearrange for a day I am in or I will collect from the depot.

My parcel was delayed so I couldn't take the day off with short notice .

This companies policy is do not leave with a neighbour or unattended and always get a signature. Not my rules. Their employers.


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## e-rider (8 Jul 2016)

Roadrider48 said:


> I have no complaints about any courier service as such.
> But, it has happened to me twice that when the item doesn't turn up and you check the tracking in the evening it says that I was out and they couldn't deliver.
> That is a complete lie, because those two times I was at home all day.
> And just to rub salt in the wound it says they left a card. But I had no card.
> I do use couriers a hell of a lot and those two instances do sort of pale into significance.


I don't use couriers much but had exactly the same thing - they pretend they called and left card when in fact they didn't. Also had empty boxes delivered when I wasn't home and couriers claim stuff was stolen after delivery (being left in the garden)!
I now factor in all this nonsense when deciding whether to buy online or just visit a shop locally


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## MarkF (8 Jul 2016)

Globalti is right, when I ran a business I used to use couriers every day, even big company drivers with "good" conditions, a secure job and a regular salary were some of the most stressed out people I've ever met. For the current day "associates" using their own vehicles and struggling to earn the minimum wage, you can multiply that stress many times. Their payers will no doubt have terms and conditions by which their drivers must abide by, in reality they'll put them under such intense pressure that they can't comply, it's a terrible industry, dangerous too, as cyclists we can't now recognise courier vehicles and go into high alert mode.


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## mjr (8 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> [...] Their payers will no doubt have terms and conditions by which their drivers must abide by, in reality they'll put them under such intense pressure that they can't comply, it's a terrible industry, dangerous too, as cyclists we can't now recognise courier vehicles and go into high alert mode.


The industry is pretty rotten. I wish more retailers offered a choice of which couriers were used. I've had several near-misses with Yodel vans driving along cycle tracks so I'd pay extra to avoid them, among others. DPD seem to be well-behaved and UKMail have got better.

We haven't been able to recognise courier vehicles for years now. Plenty of couriers use hired vans whose markings are often pretty subtle (Northgate) and the hire firms act as liability shields for some of the worst-behaved courier drivers (after all, if you've got to put some of your drivers into hire vans, why would you pick the best drivers?).


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## MarkF (8 Jul 2016)

mjray said:


> The industry is pretty rotten. I wish more retailers offered a choice of which couriers were used. I've had several near-misses with Yodel vans driving along cycle tracks so I'd pay extra to avoid them, among others. DPD seem to be well-behaved and UKMail have got better.
> 
> We haven't been able to recognise courier vehicles for years now. Plenty of couriers use hired vans whose markings are often pretty subtle (Northgate) and the hire firms act as liability shields for some of the worst-behaved courier drivers (after all, if you've got to put some of your drivers into hire vans, why would you pick the best drivers?).



Agree, but now more courier drivers are in regular hatchbacks than vans, I go into high alert around any commercial vehicle tbh.


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## Globalti (8 Jul 2016)

I would just add that as a 20 year-old driving somebody else's beaten-up van I didn't give a toss about much; I fancied myself as a bit of a whizz kid driver and took some pretty stupid risks. This gives me an insight into today's van drivers.


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## ColinJ (8 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> You could always go to the shop yourself and just buy it.
> 
> Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding. We complain about corruption, environmental impact, social values and yet we want everything, yesterday, for half the price, delivered at our convenience with a lovely bag of sweets to boot
> 
> *How do we expect firms to maintain costs under those sorts of demands...without something having to give?*


By being efficient and making proper use of modern logistical technology?

I actually think that there would be a much smaller environmental impact from one van delivering 50 parcels than 50 people driving into city centres to go shopping! And if the vans are clogging up the streets then think what the individual cars would be doing. You can bet that most of the people not buying online are not going to the shops on foot, by bike or even by bus or train.

I saw a supermarket delivery van doing its rounds when I was out on my bike last night. When the driver opened the back I could see that it contained at least 100 plastic crates of shopping. That's an awful lot of car journeys saved.

The last few deliveries from different companies gave me detailed tracking and each time I got a text message on the morning of the delivery giving an hour's window for the delivery. Each was made 20-30 minutes into that hour.

I think the best solution is what a lot of companies are doing now which is to offer to deliver parcels to local shops or post offices.


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## ColinJ (8 Jul 2016)

ColinJ said:


> I once had a parcel containing a £50 webcam left on my front step. The step was right next to the pavement since the house had no garden or yard.


*SOMETHING BLOODY SPOOKY HAS JUST HAPPENED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*  

I have not used or even thought about that webcam for years. I once lent it to a friend who kept it for a year and then returned it a few years ago. I posted about it above and immediately heard a knock at my door. My friend was standing there ... "_Any chance that I could borrow your webcam again?_"


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## jefmcg (8 Jul 2016)

ColinJ said:


> I once had a parcel containing a £50 webcam left on my front step. The step was right next to the pavement since the house had no garden or yard.


Pah! £50? That's nothing. Parcelforce once left an iMac on my front door step. It was ironic, because I had a phone call saying "I don't want to come home and find it on my door step", "Oh, that won't happen".

Strawberry iMac, so quite along time ago. Back in the "good ol' days" before Yodel. I am not sure it has actually got any worse.


Edit:



ColinJ said:


> *SOMETHING BLOODY SPOOKY HAS JUST HAPPENED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!*
> 
> I have not used or even thought about that webcam for years. I once lent it to a friend who kept it for a year and then returned it a few years ago. I posted about it above and immediately heard a knock at my door. My friend was standing there ... "_Any chance that I could borrow your webcam again?_"



Please, no. I do not want to see that iMac again!!!


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## User33236 (8 Jul 2016)

I had a rather expensive DSLR left behind the front wheel of my car once and no note through the door. Luckily I was observant that evening and didn't end up reversing over it coming off the drive.


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## jefmcg (8 Jul 2016)

ColinJ said:


> I saw a supermarket delivery van doing its rounds when I was out on my bike last night. When the driver opened the back I could see that it contained at least 100 plastic crates of shopping. That's an awful lot of car journeys saved.


It's even better than that with ocado.


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## mustang1 (8 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> You could always go to the shop yourself and just buy it.
> 
> Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding. We complain about corruption, environmental impact, social values and yet we want everything, yesterday, for half the price, delivered at our convenience with a lovely bag of sweets to boot
> 
> How do we expect firms to maintain costs under those sorts of demands...without something having to give?


I demand a Ferrari at half the price the currently sell at. Heck, I DEMAND it!!! Yet Ferrari does not give me this deal. It is not the consumer demanding it, it is the supplier giving it and the consumer opting for the supplier that gives the best deal/service.


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## User33236 (8 Jul 2016)

User13710 said:


> You did? Oh dear .


Oops should have said "didn't"


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## I like Skol (8 Jul 2016)

Royal Mail once messed up a delivery for me. Just some car parts from Ebay but the postie knew we were happy for stuff to be left in the paper recycling bin at the back of the house with a note through the door. The problem this time was that it was dustbin day and the bin was at the kerbside in front of the house. We got home that evening to find a note saying the parcel was in the blue bin and a nice empty blue bin!
To add insult to injury when I complained to Royal mail they did refund the cost of the item (after jumping through many hoops and much form filling) but refused to pay the delivery cost! I ended up being about £3.99 out of pocket because of a technicality. Their rules are that they only pay the value of the goods where as I argued (unsuccessfully) that due to their stupid negligence I had paid an amount and got nothing so they should redress that loss.


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## Gert Lush (8 Jul 2016)

As a Royal Mail employee, watching these couriers doing things such as these really annoys me. If I did anything like that, they could easily find out it was me who delivered the parcel and I'd get in serious shoot. I was delivering once and saw a Yodel driver walk up to a house and through the packet over the fence into the garden and leave. I let them know when I delivered a parcel to them 10mins later.. 

The standards are completely different for RM compared to the couriers out there.


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## Kevin Alexander (8 Jul 2016)

Im happy for a neighbour to be left the parcel but don't leave in a garden that has 2 paths leading to a park/other estates, thats irresponsible and asking for some tea leaf to come and help him/herself.

Or put it in the wheelie bin.


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## jonny jeez (8 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> I demand a Ferrari at half the price the currently sell at. Heck, I DEMAND it!!! Yet Ferrari does not give me this deal. It is not the consumer demanding it, it is the supplier giving it and the consumer opting for the supplier that gives the best deal/service.


Why would you supply, if not to a demand.?

Supply and demand, first rule of retail..second rule, never talk about retail.


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## jonny jeez (8 Jul 2016)

ColinJ said:


> By being efficient and making proper use of modern logistical technology?
> 
> I actually think that there would be a much smaller environmental impact from one van delivering 50 parcels than 50 people driving into city centres to go shopping! And if the vans are clogging up the streets then think what the individual cars would be doing. You can bet that most of the people not buying online are not going to the shops on foot, by bike or even by bus or train.
> 
> ...



I agree about the drop off at shops and depots, but we are too lazy and want same day drop off ,min our back garden between the hours of 2.22 and 2.28 cos that when neighbours has finished and before the corrie omnibus starts... Besides, this, its not one truck delivering 50 items. 

Even with the best organisational systems in the world, we then want it all sent back...the same day, at no extra cost, then a few other sizes, or colours sent out , for most of them to be sent back again. Makes one person driving to the shopping centre and trying it first look suddenly quite efficient.

I'm making a general point on the demands of society and our inherent laziness though, not really arguing with your counter.


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## MarkF (8 Jul 2016)

Gert Lush said:


> The standards are completely different for RM compared to the couriers out there.



Yeah, worse in my experience, I opened my front door just as a postie was pushing through my letterbox a "Sorry you were out" card, that made for an interesting conversation...............


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## Drago (8 Jul 2016)

Our postman is a woman, and to ensure she continues to take care of my small parcels (fnarr fnarr) I buy her a bottle of rosé each Christmas. Shes on first name terms with everyone in the village and the Royal Mail would probably get a visit from a lynch mob if they tried to take her off our round.


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## I like Skol (8 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> Yeah, worse in my experience, I opened my front door just as a postie was pushing through my letterbox a "Sorry you were out" card, that made for an interesting conversation...............


Like Globalti, we do have a normal postman who is pretty good and while not on 1st name terms we always say hello if we pass in the surrounding streets. When he is on holiday then all bets are off as far as standards of service go (Not calling the other guys though as it is probably some other highly stressed postie that is being almost forced to cover parts of this round in addition to doing his regular walk!)
[QUOTE 4357222, member: 45"]I'd you've not signed for a parcel and find it on your doorstep, what's stopping you calling the company and saying the parcel hasn't been delivered?[/QUOTE]
Honesty, decency, morals, not wanting dirty tricks like that done to yourself so why do it to others.... need I go on?


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## Gert Lush (8 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> Yeah, worse in my experience, I opened my front door just as a postie was pushing through my letterbox a "Sorry you were out" card, that made for an interesting conversation...............



Not that interesting really. The amount of times that's happened to me when I've already knocked twice and they didn't answer the door.


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## User16625 (8 Jul 2016)

Can you claim back the £48.5 million next day delivery fee from Amazon for an oxygen tank if it gets lost or whatever on the way to the International Space Station? Probly left with a neighbor so would actually have to land on the moon to click and collect.


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## Kevin Alexander (8 Jul 2016)

[QUOTE 4357222, member: 45"]I'd you've not signed for a parcel and find it on your doorstep, what's stopping you calling the company and saying the parcel hasn't been delivered?[/QUOTE]

Nothing but I'm an honest person and don't want to get anyone in trouble for not doing their job. I expect him to do his job properly but importantly I just want my goods


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## Profpointy (8 Jul 2016)

[QUOTE 4357222, member: 45"]I'd you've not signed for a parcel and find it on your doorstep, what's stopping you calling the company and saying the parcel hasn't been delivered?[/QUOTE]

the same thing that stops you shoplifting, doing a runner fro a restaurant, o breaking into your neighbours' homes


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## Kevin Alexander (8 Jul 2016)

Profpointy said:


> the same thing that stops you shoplifting, doing a runner fro a restaurant, o breaking into your neighbours' homes



Exactly


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## rivers (8 Jul 2016)

I try to have as many parcels delivered to work as I can. I live in a flat and I don't trust my neighbour.


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## User32269 (8 Jul 2016)

Profpointy said:


> the same thing that stops you shoplifting, doing a runner fro a restaurant, o breaking into your neighbours' homes


CCTV?


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## Lonestar (8 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> Globalti is right, when I ran a business I used to use couriers every day, even big company drivers with "good" conditions, a secure job and a regular salary were some of the most stressed out people I've ever met. For the current day "associates" using their own vehicles and struggling to earn the minimum wage, you can multiply that stress many times. Their payers will no doubt have terms and conditions by which their drivers must abide by, in reality they'll put them under such intense pressure that they can't comply, it's a terrible industry, dangerous too, as cyclists we can't now recognise courier vehicles and go into high alert mode.



Not complaining but now I try for click and collect all the time.I don't want to hassle my neighbours and there never seems to be a time when I catch the courier...I have a real art of missing them as they come round generally when I'm at work.It's a shame there isn't a better system when you could actually arrange a time instead of a random delivery/

Bit like a recent hospital appointment I had.Hospital sent me a text saying they cancelled it and rearranged for a week later only for the fact I couldn't make it as I'm working.Surprise,surprise.


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## Kevin Alexander (9 Jul 2016)

I had a delivery today and the courier wants me to phone him about parcel going awol but don't think it'd appropriate since I've informed the company and the bike shop on ordered it from. 

This time he left with a neighbour as instructed via a phone call


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## User32269 (9 Jul 2016)

I have been a delivery driver in the past and it can be a complete nightmare!
100+ parcels to drop, and you also have collections to make at specified times as the van empties. It's a hard job.
Given the amount of variables during your average day, it is nigh on impossible to give specific times for delivery.
I would always try hard to leave packages with neighbours and post a card. Drivers who return to the depot with lots of failed deliveries, or worse didn't have room for their collections, wouldn't last long. 
It's like a lot of jobs, looks simple to those who don't have to do it.


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## Kevin Alexander (9 Jul 2016)

odav said:


> I have been a delivery driver in the past and it can be a complete nightmare!
> 100+ parcels to drop, and you also have collections to make at specified times as the van empties. It's a hard job.
> Given the amount of variables during your average day, it is nigh on impossible to give specific times for delivery.
> I would always try hard to leave packages with neighbours and post a card. Drivers who return to the depot with lots of failed deliveries, or worse didn't have room for their collections, wouldn't last long.
> It's like a lot of jobs, looks simple to those who don't have to do it.



I'm not saying it's an easy job but would you of left a parcel in a garden with no card?

That's my complaint


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## User32269 (9 Jul 2016)

Kevin Alexander said:


> I'm not saying it's an easy job but would you of left a parcel in a garden with no card?
> 
> That's my complaint


No, I wouldn't. 
Point was aimed more at people expressing the desire for getting deliveries at a specified times.


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## classic33 (9 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> You could always go to the shop yourself and just buy it.
> 
> Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding. We complain about corruption, environmental impact, social values and yet we want everything, yesterday, for half the price, delivered at our convenience with a lovely bag of sweets to boot
> 
> How do we expect firms to maintain costs under those sorts of demands...without something having to give?


What's it cost the company to cover an item that goes missing, and as a result requires replacement.

A Royal Mail habit is to put parcels in wheelie bins. Neighbour lost two iPads after such a delivery on bin day.


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## Kevin Alexander (9 Jul 2016)

odav said:


> No, I wouldn't.
> Point was aimed more at people expressing the desire for getting deliveries at a specified times.



Yeah think its a lot more complex that just driving around and dropping parcels off, my mate does it and has a go at me all the time if I'm not in as it causes problems but i can't take time off work every time I get a parcel and my work is funny about personal items.

Luckily courier company and bike company have been understanding and sending a replacement out next week.


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## User32269 (9 Jul 2016)

Kevin Alexander said:


> Yeah think its a lot more complex that just driving around and dropping parcels off, my mate does it and has a go at me all the time if I'm not in as it causes problems but i can't take time off work every time I get a parcel and my work is funny about personal items.
> 
> Luckily courier company and bike company have been understanding and sending a replacement out next week.


Pleased your getting replacement.

Everybody wants things yesterday at the cheapest price possible. When it comes to the delivery, rather than pay a realistic price - and a realistic wage to a professional courier - it's a race to the bottom. Big Eric with his Astra estate crammed full of your expensive goodies is cheap...but....


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## e-rider (9 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> Yeah, worse in my experience, I opened my front door just as a postie was pushing through my letterbox a "Sorry you were out" card, that made for an interesting conversation...............


I did some temp work for RM some years ago - in my bag of mail were loads of 'sorry you were out cards' pre-addressed - I just delivered them with the rest of the mail - no attempt was made to deliver the parcels
Also, at the beginning I was paid for the hours I worked delivering mail, but it didn't take long before they started paying me for the hours they thought it should have taken me to deliver the mail e.g I spent 5 hours delivering mail - they paid me 3 hours! So I quit!


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## Kevin Alexander (9 Jul 2016)

odav said:


> Pleased your getting replacement.
> 
> Everybody wants things yesterday at the cheapest price possible. When it comes to the delivery, rather than pay a realistic price - and a realistic wage to a professional courier - it's a race to the bottom. Big Eric with his Astra estate crammed full of your expensive goodies is cheap...but....



i think my guy was agency or sub contracted


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## toffee (9 Jul 2016)

Gert Lush said:


> As a Royal Mail employee....
> 
> The standards are completely different for RM compared to the couriers out there.



Are they?

They left my parcel under the door mat the other day in full view of the street. My daughter just avoided standing on it when she left the house. The didn't bother knocking.

Derek


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## MarkF (9 Jul 2016)

e-rider said:


> I did some temp work for RM some years ago - in my bag of mail were loads of 'sorry you were out cards' pre-addressed - I just delivered them with the rest of the mail - no attempt was made to deliver the parcels
> Also, at the beginning I was paid for the hours I worked delivering mail, but it didn't take long before they started paying me for the hours they thought it should have taken me to deliver the mail e.g I spent 5 hours delivering mail - they paid me 3 hours! So I quit!



The RM left a "Sorry you werre out" card card last week for my son, he took time off work to go to the parcel collection office the following day as the card instructed him to do, this is 1970's a set-up where the staff seem to be as slow as possible. Anyway.........the parcel had been left 2 doors away with neighbour.


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## Gert Lush (9 Jul 2016)

e-rider said:


> I did some temp work for RM some years ago - in my bag of mail were loads of 'sorry you were out cards' pre-addressed - I just delivered them with the rest of the mail - no attempt was made to deliver the parcels
> Also, at the beginning I was paid for the hours I worked delivering mail, but it didn't take long before they started paying me for the hours they thought it should have taken me to deliver the mail e.g I spent 5 hours delivering mail - they paid me 3 hours! So I quit!



Things have changed since then I imagine. The only time you can pre-write a p739 (the red ones) card are when the house either uses call and collect or you aren't allowed to knock on the door because of either aggressive dog/person.

I'd have quit too but in my office that doesn't happen, you get paid until your time whether you finish then or not.



toffee said:


> Are they?
> 
> They left my parcel under the door mat the other day in full view of the street. My daughter just avoided standing on it when she left the house. The didn't bother knocking.
> 
> Derek



Let me change what I said because I'm only me, not the postman for everywhere. 'The standards are completely different in my office.' If I'd done that, I'd get at least a bollocking and if I'd done it more than once or twice, I'd probably get sacked.

The way to solve these things are to make a complaint, the postman won't do it again. Unless they're stupid, which wouldn't surprise me 

Just don't complain that your post is wet when it's been raining. Nothing can stop that and there are frequent complaints about that.

Edit: I feel even saying 'in my office' is probably not the best because there are some people in there who want to rush through and maybe do these things. So I'm going to minimise these things down to me. I wouldn't do it and it's against the rules for other people to do it and if they do then a complaint should be made. Even if it gets 'em in the shoot.


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## Gert Lush (9 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> The RM left a "Sorry you werre out" card card last week for my son, he took time off work to go to the parcel collection office the following day as the card instructed him to do, this is 1970's a set-up where the staff seem to be as slow as possible. Anyway.........the parcel had been left 2 doors away with neighbour.



That happens a lot unfortunately. 50/50 who's mistake it was. Sometimes the postman forgets to tick the left with neighbour box and sometimes the customer doesn't read it properly.


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## classic33 (9 Jul 2016)

Gert Lush said:


> That happens a lot unfortunately. 50/50 who's mistake it was. Sometimes the postman forgets to tick the left with neighbour box and sometimes the customer doesn't read it properly.


I'd prefer them to at least try to knock. A "missed parcel" is now a 40 mile round trip when the Royal Mail can't be bothered trying to deliver. The card is so much lighter and easier carry from the van than the actual parcel.

Who pays for my time wasted, waiting on a card saying they were unable to deliver, because I wasn't in?


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## Profpointy (9 Jul 2016)

As a city boy, who works for a living, I think it'd be a lot easier (for me), if they didn't bother delivering at all, but just pinged you an email saying "it's at the depot" - and keep the depot open till, I don't know 9pm or whatever. More convenient for the customer, and a good bit cheaper for the couriers I dare say.

Fair enough, you still need home delivery for a 3 piece suite / ton of bricks or whatever, but for normal size parcels,home delivery per se is not that useful a thing for many people.

One snag with couriers generally, is that their customers are the sellers not the recipients, so all the nuisance at the receipt end doesn't really figure in the transaction. One of them, I think UPS was a huge nuisance to deal with as the nearest depot to Bristol was supposedly Birmingham, and as a working man I can hardly take a half day to await delivery of a modest parcel.


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## Gert Lush (9 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> I'd prefer them to at least try to knock. A "missed parcel" is now a 40 mile round trip when the Royal Mail can't be bothered trying to deliver. The card is so much lighter and easier carry from the van than the actual parcel.
> 
> Who pays for my time wasted, waiting on a card saying they were unable to deliver, because I wasn't in?



But why would they take it out to not deliver it? I don't know if you live in a rural location where it's different but if I have to carry your parcel in the bag while I deliver 100-200 houses for one loop then why would I not try and deliver it? Honestly I want people to be in because it makes my bag lighter and easier to carry. Also, 90% of parcel are now needing a doorstep scan so they are all 'trackable'. If you postman/woman is constantly not delivering then they will know due to his amount of undelivered parcels. 

No one will pay you for your time sadly. But if you ring up, you can ask for a redelivery so negating the need for you to do the 40mile round trip. You do not need to go to the office to collect it. With that option you have, I think, 18 days from first delivery attempt to collect it so you can have as many redeliverys within 18 days as you want before they return it to sender. 

Again, these things shouldn't be happening so if you can prove that they are not actually knocking or evening bringing you the parcel, make a complaint. Stop it from happening. No point sitting there letting it happen and wanting it to change.


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## classic33 (9 Jul 2016)

Parcel contained something bought on here. Van pulled up outside, driver got out, card in hand. Card through the letterbox, no attempt made to either press the bell or knock. My only alert was the dog going nuts as he shut the gate on his way out.
Parcel had to be picked up in Leeds, local sorting office having closed.


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## ColinJ (9 Jul 2016)

ColinJ said:


> Ha - an Amazon courier yesterday claims to have delivered my parcel to a non-existent neighbour! Well, the neighbour might exist but the address that he is supposed to live at does not so I am having a problem finding which neighbour it is!
> 
> Oh, and I was in all day waiting for the parcel, a few feet from the front door. The courier did NOT come to the door ...


Mystery solved ... the courier delivered the parcel to a 'neighbour' - yeah, right, since when is someone living more than a hundred metres away down a side street a neighbour! The man from that house came round and knocked on my door just now. 

(The email notification about leaving the parcel at the neighbour's house did not mention the name of the street, just a house number, so I naturally assumed that it was nearby on THIS street! )


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## mustang1 (9 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> Why would you supply, if not to a demand.?
> 
> Supply and demand, first rule of retail..second rule, never talk about retail.



Well this is what you wrote:
_Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding_

And now you're writing
_Why would you supply, if not to a demand.?_

So idk what you mean.


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## jonny jeez (9 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> Well this is what you wrote:
> _Do you not think that we are all being far too demanding_
> 
> And now you're writing
> ...


Yes, that's right, you are suggesting its the suppliers fault, I suggest it's the demand. If we didn't demand it, they wouldn't supply it.


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## Gert Lush (9 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> Parcel contained something bought on here. Van pulled up outside, driver got out, card in hand. Card through the letterbox, no attempt made to either press the bell or knock. My only alert was the dog going nuts as he shut the gate on his way out.
> Parcel had to be picked up in Leeds, local sorting office having closed.



I don't understand how you know that happened if you had no alert apart from the dog? If you saw him get out why didn't you go to the door and if you didn't you can't prove that he didn't do it? Not saying it didn't happen but sounds odd from the way you wrote it. Did you make a complaint? 

As in closed down? Or closed for the day? I don't get why it would go back to a different office. Maybe things happen different up north.


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## classic33 (9 Jul 2016)

Gert Lush said:


> I don't understand how you know that happened if you had no alert apart from the dog? If you saw him get out why didn't you go to the door and if you didn't you can't prove that he didn't do it? Not saying it didn't happen but sounds odd from the way you wrote it. Did you make a complaint?
> 
> As in closed down? Or closed for the day? I don't get why it would go back to a different office. Maybe things happen different up north.


Only saw him leaving, not arriving. Straight into the drivers seat of the van, no-where near the back of it.


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## Gert Lush (9 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> Only saw him leaving, not arriving. Straight into the drivers seat of the van, no-where near the back of it.



That doesn't necessarily mean anything but it does point towards your theory.


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## Drago (9 Jul 2016)

Is it true that some kind of stealth ninja training is essential for courier staff?


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## I like Skol (9 Jul 2016)

Drago said:


> Is it true that some kind of stealth ninja training is essential for courier staff?


I did some household deliveries once, I was told on more than one occasion that I had the knock of a debt collector


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## jefmcg (9 Jul 2016)

I like Skol said:


> I did some household deliveries once, I was told on more than one occasion that I had the knock of a debt collector


"Only relatives, or creditors, ever ring in that Wagnerian manner" - Oscar Wilde


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## mustang1 (9 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> Yes, that's right, you are suggesting its the suppliers fault, I suggest it's the demand. If we didn't demand it, they wouldn't supply it.


Yes, and I am demanding a cheaper Ferrari, but they are not supplying me with one.


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## MarkF (10 Jul 2016)

Gert Lush said:


> That happens a lot unfortunately. 50/50 who's mistake it was. Sometimes the postman forgets to tick the left with neighbour box and sometimes the customer doesn't read it properly.



"Happening a lot" would surely lead to somebody looking at the system, it's failing. Have the boxes on front & rear, top or bottom, make it hard to tick the wrong box...........


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## Andrew_P (10 Jul 2016)

Reading this thread is like reading my mailbox on Wednesday when people who ordered something on Sunday night are moaning it hasn't arrived and demanding their "Free Postage" is refunded! Or they are off on holiday in ten minutes if it is not here by then I want my money back. Or I have taken a day off work it hasn't arrived you owe me a days pay. Or it was for a Birthday present on Tuesday I want a refund. Then you have the I never received crew who some might be telling the truth but experience will tell me that some see an opportunity to freeload! In fact Royal Mail even have a blacklist.

Please take time not to batter the poor sod on the other end of the phone\email who is in-between you and the courier!!

Also bear in mind even the worst of the carriers hit 98%+ on time delivery.


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## jonny jeez (10 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> Yes, and I am demanding a cheaper Ferrari, but they are not supplying me with one.


But if enough of us do, they will.

Right now, (despite your wishes) there is no demand for a CHEAP Ferrari, a cheap Ferrara would not be aspirational, desirable, exclusive or sexy. If you want a cheap car that is not desirable, aspirational or sexy, you have many other manufacturer to choose from (many of whom try to shift their brand by producing a desirable and sexy model...and it's never cheap because cheap isn't exclusive) If there were sufficient demand, you can bet your euros that tha Ferrari would produce one.

One day, if laws change and autonomous vehicles become common place, you will find Ferrari making family hatchbacks...then your dreams will come true.


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## jonny jeez (10 Jul 2016)

User13710 said:


> That's not always true though. I recently bought a new bed online from John Lewis. As it happens I am at home a lot of the time, but if I'd had a full-time job I would have had to take a half day, at least, off work to be at home for the promised delivery. Which, incidentally, didn't happen - and almost didn't happen again the following day. That severely dented my idea that making a large purchase from the likes of John Lewis (which is a first for me) would guarantee good service. Not every home delivery is a result of 'laziness'.


Sure but most are.

I have a friend who is disabled and relies heavily on home delivery, it changes her life.

But I also have many other friends and folk I know who demand it in the way that I describe.

Let me ask you, did you pick bed online, or did you go to a store and try it out first, then opt for home delivery? If so you weren't being lazy at all, just arranging delivery, which would need to be sorted either way.


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## Gert Lush (10 Jul 2016)

MarkF said:


> "Happening a lot" would surely lead to somebody looking at the system, it's failing. Have the boxes on front & rear, top or bottom, make it hard to tick the wrong box...........



There's different cards now for delivering to neighbour on.


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## mustang1 (10 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> *But if enough of us do, they will.
> 
> Right now, (despite your wishes) there is no demand for a CHEAP Ferrari*, a cheap Ferrara would not be aspirational, desirable, exclusive or sexy. If you want a cheap car that is not desirable, aspirational or sexy, you have many other manufacturer to choose from (many of whom try to shift their brand by producing a desirable and sexy model...and it's never cheap because cheap isn't exclusive) If there were sufficient demand, you can bet your euros that tha Ferrari would produce one.
> 
> One day, if laws change and autonomous vehicles become common place, you will find Ferrari making family hatchbacks...then your dreams will come true.



I could find one meeeelliion people (without even trying) who want a cheap Ferrari. It is FERRARI who do not want to sell their cars cheap (for the reasons you mention and I see theirs and your point), and they are the supplier!


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## jonny jeez (10 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> I could find one meeeelliion people (without even trying) who want a cheap Ferrari. It is FERRARI who do not want to sell their cars cheap (for the reasons you mention and I see theirs and your point), and they are the supplier!


The best selling car in the entire world only shifts 1.02 million models ...if you can find that many people without even trying ,then you are in the wrong business


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## classic33 (10 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> I could find one meeeelliion people (without even trying) who want a cheap Ferrari. It is FERRARI who do not want to sell their cars cheap (for the reasons you mention and I see theirs and your point), and they are the supplier!


How they going to fit it through the letterbox?


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## Freds Dad (10 Jul 2016)

I seem to get differing standards of delivery depending on the company delivering.
RM will leave with a neighbour and put a card through my door 
Parcelforce take the parcel to a local Post Office as it needs a signature and a neighbours signature isn't sufficent.
Yodel, DPL and other leave with neighbours and whoever Amazon use leave it at the local newsagent where they have a large cabinet that you enter a code into and a door opens with to reveal your parcel.

I've never had anything left in a wheely bin or thrown into the garden. Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones.


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## mustang1 (11 Jul 2016)

jonny jeez said:


> The best selling car in the entire world only shifts 1.02 million models ...if you can find that many people without even trying ,then you are in the wrong business



There are 7.3 billion people in the world. I could find 1 million who would like a cheap Ferrari, regardless of how many models are sold of a certain type.


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## jonny jeez (11 Jul 2016)

mustang1 said:


> There are 7.3 billion people in the world. I could find 1 million who would like a cheap Ferrari, regardless of how many models are sold of a certain type.


Go on ...do it...who knows you could be the next Enzo.

http://jobs.ferrari.com/cezannecv/RecruitmentWeb/BtInizio.asp?FUNID=350000001&LANGID=1033


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## jonny jeez (11 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> How they going to fit it through the letterbox?


perhaps there will be a demand for car sized letterboxes. You heard it here first!


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## PhilDawson8270 (11 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> How they going to fit it through the letterbox?



It would be the only parcel they DON'T leave on the driveway!


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## Starchivore (20 Jul 2016)

Not long ago I bought a refurbished laptop from a well-known site. I was given a one hour slot (with the option to change it in advance), and it arrived within that one hour slot. Their Trust Pilot reviews indicate this is a nearly-universal experience. So some companies seem to be able to do it.


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## growingvegetables (20 Jul 2016)

Starchivore said:


> .... some companies seem to be able to do it.


Here's how? https://www.theguardian.com/busines...shoulder-insecurity-of-internet-shopping-boom


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## subaqua (20 Jul 2016)

classic33 said:


> How they going to fit it through the letterbox?


Yodel would manage it if it had fragile do not bend on the package.


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## oldwheels (20 Jul 2016)

Many years ago I worked as a postie. Those were the days when a (dead) turkey could be posted with a label round it's neck at Christmas time. We had such a turkey that could not be delivered because nobody was ever at home and it was getting a bit ripe. Since it was on my walk (bike run actually but still called a walk) I was given a special assignment and told to get rid of it somehow and do not bring it back under any circumstances.After a scout around the house I discovered a bathroom window not secure at the top. Managed to squeeze the bird through and heard a splash as it landed. We never did hear what the residents thought when they next visited the loo!


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## raleighnut (20 Jul 2016)

oldwheels said:


> Many years ago I worked as a postie. Those were the days when a (dead) turkey could be posted with a label round it's neck at Christmas time. We had such a turkey that could not be delivered because nobody was ever at home and it was getting a bit ripe. Since it was on my walk (bike run actually but still called a walk) I was given a special assignment and told to get rid of it somehow and do not bring it back under any circumstances.After a scout around the house I discovered a bathroom window not secure at the top. Managed to squeeze the bird through and heard a splash as it landed. We never did hear what the residents thought when they next visited the loo!


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