# front wheel lift - unintentional



## upandover (4 Sep 2010)

Hi guys,

I've just bought a new mountain bike this afternoon (I have two road bikes), and have just taken it out on the bmx course next to my house. I've been on it with my hybrid before, but the new bike handles differently.

On the steeper sections, I'm having great trouble keeping the front wheel on the ground, with it lifting i reckon 1-3 inches off, to the point where I'm having to stop. (in fact, the time I tried to push through it, i couldn't keep the balance up with wheel up so much and didn't leave enough room to get my foot out in time!  )

I've had it happen on very steep hills on road to a small extent, but nothing like this. I was leaning forward as much as I could. I've have the saddle quite high, perhaps more a road bike style high, but will lower it, and ensure it's better tilted. I'm not sure though whether this is simply something I'll learn to manage, or whether I'm missing something? Should I simply be standing up at this point? I wonder if it's simply that being rather heavy I overbalance the bike easily if it's more angled for downhill?

Any advice would be much appreciated.

Thanks, 
Steve

ps- the bike is a rock rider 8.1.


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## lukesdad (4 Sep 2010)

A couple of points maybe to think about ( although I m not familiar with the bike ). Climbing out of the saddle will help as it will put your weight forward helping to keep the front wheel down but, in the wet, you may lose traction. A few mods. will help, if you have riser bars fit flat ones, bar ends fitted just slightly angled above the horizontal and a longer stem will all serve the same purpose of getting your weight forward.


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## upandover (5 Sep 2010)

Thanks, participially for the riser bars tip. I'v noticed the angle is just that which would be pulling the wheel of the ground when I pull on them climbing, I might try changing the angle, and experimenting with some bar ends. I've also changed the angle of the saddle, as I realised that sitting on it properly on the flat, I was actually learning backwards slightly.

Thanks for the tips. I'll keep practising too, and imagine that will make quite a difference. I did try the same ramp again and didn't fall off this time!

Cheers
Steve


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## spence (6 Sep 2010)

Not familiar with your bike but a quick look on bikeradar they seem to like it. They describe it as old school xc with narrow bars a longish stem anyway which should giving a weight forward position. If that’s true and yours is as described I’d suggest that the wheel lift is due to your actual position ie weight too far back. Sit further forward on the saddle when climbing, actually right on the tip, lean forward and drop your elbows a little.

Keep the risers, will give you more overall control especially if as described they are already on the narrow side.


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## Globalti (6 Sep 2010)

Thinking back to my early MTB days I do remember that the front wheel used to lift a lot until I learned about weight transfer. My other mistake was that I rode around with the tyres so soft that when I braked they actually crept around the rims!

Get the sitting position sorted out - saddle should be slightly tilted up at the nose so that your weight is shared between your sit bones and the bit between your legs.


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## RedBike (8 Sep 2010)

Sit as far forward on the saddle as you can get, right on the nose, hold the handlebars by the end caps/sides and pedal smoothly. 

The bike will only tip backwards if your weight (center of gravity) is back behind the rear wheels axle,
If you're pulling on the handlebars or if you stamp on the pedals) 


It would have to be a VERY steep incline before the saddle is further back than the rear axle. So if you're sat on the nose of the saddle your center of gravity shouldn't be lifting the front wheel. 

If you hold the handlebars by the ends instead of by the grips then you wont naturally 'pull up' as you pedal. 

If you keep the power delivery smooth then your rear wheel will have more traction and the front wheel wont be inclined to wonder about as much.


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## Tim Bennet. (8 Sep 2010)

It's all about weight transfer and technique. Don't go messing with the bike for now.

Learn to pedal smoothly while sitting and try not to pull up on the bars like you do on a road bike. Try to relax the arms and shoulders.

It won't be long before you can't even remember you had a problem.


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## ColinJ (8 Sep 2010)

Globalti said:


> Thinking back to my early MTB days I do remember that the front wheel used to lift a lot until I learned about weight transfer.


Ditto. It can be hard to find the right compromise between keeping the front end down and maintaining traction at the back but it does come with experience. Not using the lowest possible gears on the MTB can also help but if you need them, then you need them!



Globalti said:


> My other mistake was that I rode around with the tyres so soft that when I braked they actually crept around the rims!


I was guilty of that one too! I once descended a 16% road in Hebden Bridge at high speed, braked at the bottom, and turned onto a flat road where my front valve ripped out due to tyre/tube creep. I ended up falling off my bike and rolling in front of a car coming the other way. Fortunately the driver was paying attention and managed to stop in time! 



Globalti said:


> Get the sitting position sorted out - saddle should be slightly tilted up at the nose so that your weight is shared between your sit bones and the bit between your legs.


I don't agree with that advice at all! I've had people telling me how my saddles 'should' be since I first got back on a bike at the age of 33. That 'bit' between _my_ legs doesn't like any weight on it whatsoever and having my saddle pointing up or even level has me totally numb within minutes. I go for the most level saddle position that I can tolerate, and no more than that.


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## GilesM (9 Sep 2010)

As several people have already mentioned, don't adjust the bike, it's just a technique thing, I remember having the same problems when switching from the road to mtb, recently I took a friend to Glentress for his first trip there, he borrowed my hardtail, he had some real problems with the front wheel lifting to start with, I don't ever remember having the problem with that bike. Just keep the weight over the bars, and try not to pull on them as you might do on a road bike, and keep the pedal pressure as even as possible, if you suddenly increase the pressure as your strongest leg is pushing down, the front is very likely to lift, especially if you are in a granny gear.


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## marzjennings (9 Sep 2010)

Stand up and get your weight over the front wheel. On a BMX course with many changes in gradient you really need to standing and constantly shifting your weight fore and aft to keep your wheels on the groud. You are not going to clear the whole course sitting down. Dropping the saddle will only push your weight further back and make it even easier the lift the front wheel off the groud and as others have said you don't need to mess with your bike just the way you ride. 

Not the best picture to show it, but you'll see how riders stand and adjust body position in relation to the bumps..


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## upandover (9 Sep 2010)

Thanks Guys, I've left the bike as it is, just adjusting the saddle as I normally would (I don't like it completely flat either Colin). I've been playing a bit more and getting the hang of it, as well as changing the way I climb hills, as suggested. Commuting on it yesterday gave me 20 odd miles to feel the difference from my road bikes, which helped as lot, as well as understanding the gear ratios better for a smoother ride and most important not pulling on the bars, makes a big difference.

Helpful picture Marz, thanks. Now to get out to cannock of somewhere for fun! Such a different feel, I do love it.

Steve


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## lukesdad (9 Sep 2010)

I ll shut up then, 20 years of racing and I obviously don tknow what I m talking about


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## upandover (9 Sep 2010)

lukesdad said:


> I ll shut up then, 20 years of racing and I obviously don tknow what I m talking about



it was your advice I was following.


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## Kirstie (15 Sep 2010)

To avoid wheel lift on short sharp climbs, stay seated, keep your elbows close in to the body and pull back and down on the bars as you increase the pressure on the pedals up the climb.

Works every time!


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