# Thoughts about road bike weight



## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

A lighter bike is generally a good thing right? To what degree is this important though?

I'm looking at endurance bikes as a first road bike. Researching now and hoping to buy when I see a good deal in the next 3-6 months.

I like Trek as a brand but I'm certainly not set on it. I'm not sure they're the best value for the spec. The Domane is a nice looking bike but it's almost 10kg.

Now I'm overweight myself so it seems a bit daft to obsess about bike weight but also I could do with all the help I can get going up those hills. There are other bikes with similar specs that are around 8kg. Would that weight saving make a real difference to me?


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (18 Sep 2020)

Nope


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## si_c (18 Sep 2020)

A lighter bike is lighter. That's about it, it means you have less to carry up a hill with you. That being said if you consider the _system_ weight - i.e. you and the bike, it doesn't matter too much. Gearing is more important.

The Domane is a good bike - I'm presuming that you are looking at the AL series of bikes rather than the carbon fibre - but 10kg is about par for the course for any aluminium framed road bike. The frame itself is a small proportion of the weight - for example Trek's Emonda SLR frameset weights about 1.2kg including forks and the Domane AL frameset weighs about 2.3kg. The rest of the weight difference is in the wheels, drivetrain and finishing kits. A good set of wheels and tyres can save nearly 1kg alone - and thats what the top end bikes use to get to their low weights.

Trek as a brand are a bit more expensive than others but I've had a number of them over the years and they always fit me well which is a key consideration for me and I've never been dissatisfied. They also offer a lifetime warranty on their frames for the original owner which is very nice to have.


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## HarryTheDog (18 Sep 2020)

I think the OP has looked at the bike radar SL6 review , the bike was fitted with 32mm tyres so came in at 9.5Kg. I googled further and the 2019 SL9 was 7.57kg. My road bikes are all shod with 25mm apart from the tandem which has 32mm. In my googling a few sites said the domaine overall was a couple of 100g over other bikes at a similar price point.
I find lighter bikes feel nicer to throw around but there are other factors ( tyres being a huge performance/feel factor)


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

si_c said:


> A lighter bike is lighter. That's about it, it means you have less to carry up a hill with you. That being said if you consider the _system_ weight - i.e. you and the bike, it doesn't matter too much. Gearing is more important.
> 
> The Domane is a good bike - I'm presuming that you are looking at the AL series of bikes rather than the carbon fibre - but 10kg is about par for the course for any aluminium framed road bike. The frame itself is a small proportion of the weight - for example Trek's Emonda SLR frameset weights about 1.2kg including forks and the Domane AL frameset weighs about 2.3kg. The rest of the weight difference is in the wheels, drivetrain and finishing kits. A good set of wheels and tyres can save nearly 1kg alone - and thats what the top end bikes use to get to their low weights.
> 
> Trek as a brand are a bit more expensive than others but I've had a number of them over the years and they always fit me well which is a key consideration for me and I've never been dissatisfied. They also offer a lifetime warranty on their frames for the original owner which is very nice to have.



I've actually been looking at carbon fibre (SL4/SL5) but I'm still open to ideas. The frame weight for that appears to be 1365g. Want to spend a decent amount and not regret the choice.


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

HarryTheDog said:


> I think the OP has looked at the bike radar SL6 review , the bike was fitted with 32mm tyres so came in at 9.5Kg. I googled further and the 2019 SL9 was 7.57kg. My road bikes are all shod with 25mm apart from the tandem which has 32mm. In my googling a few sites said the domaine overall was a couple of 100g over other bikes at a similar price point.
> I find lighter bikes feel nicer to throw around but there are other factors ( tyres being a huge performance/feel factor)



I've taken the weight from the Trek website as they come. The SL4 is 9.87kg with 32mm tyres according to that.


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## Milkfloat (18 Sep 2020)

A lighter bike is certainly nice on a stiff climb, but at all other times aero is far more important, add on to that rolling resistance and you have the two main factors. After that to me weight and colour are most important.


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## steve292 (18 Sep 2020)

I've got a 2020 Domane SL5. This one. It's a fantastic bike to ride, and as others say it would be easy to knock a kilo or more off with aftermarket kit, albeit expensive. If you are carrying excess weight yourself, and are not fit enough to do the bike justice the money is better spent on good food and a training program if performance matters most to you


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## steve292 (18 Sep 2020)

Fr'instance i've just bought 2 GP5000 tyres to replace the originals, each tyre is 295g as opppose to the 410g of the originals. 200g off the weight, not that I bought the tyres for the saving. I'm just replacing the originals with a better (IMV) tyre due to wear, and a sidewall cut


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## MrGrumpy (18 Sep 2020)

wheels , wheels , wheels. If you want to notice a real difference IMO , that`s where to spend money. A decent set of wheels can transform a bike.


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

steve292 said:


> I've got a 2020 Domane SL5. This one. It's a fantastic bike to ride, and as others say it would be easy to knock a kilo or more off with aftermarket kit, albeit expensive. If you are carrying excess weight yourself, and are not fit enough to do the bike justice the money is better spent on good food and a training program if performance matters most to you



Fitness is improving (did a 74km ride on Sunday) as is weight. Desperate to keep up the training over winter so as not to lose the progress I have made. I'm sure it would be a big upgrade from my hybrid just got to figure out if it's right for me.


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## RoubaixCube (18 Sep 2020)

Heavier bikes make for good training. Think of it as an extra layer of resistance and cardio training that will make you sweat more and burn more energy getting it up to speed, going up hills on it will also mean extra cardio from all the expletives you'll be shouting.

different strokes for different folks but sometimes its good to start off on an absolute dog of a bike so that when you get more fitter and get yourself a better bike, it will feel like more of a reward because you put in the time and effort to earn it.

With that said Ive seen racing snakes in full club attire doing laps on halfords Carrera bikes that are quoted to be slightly over 11kg. So there is methods to the madness apart from just having a cheaper entry level bike to thrash around on and run into the dirt.


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## steve292 (18 Sep 2020)

MrGrumpy said:


> wheels , wheels , wheels. If you want to notice a real difference IMO , that`s where to spend money. A decent set of wheels can transform a bike.


Yes, quite so. I have priced up a set of wheels from Light-bycycle that would take off over a kilo. But that comes at a price, in this case about £600
But I still maintain that to get yourself fitter and lighter should be the main aim, if you do want to see a quantifiable increase in performance.


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## si_c (18 Sep 2020)

Dan77 said:


> I've actually been looking at carbon fibre (SL4/SL5) but I'm still open to ideas. The frame weight for that appears to be 1365g. Want to spend a decent amount and not regret the choice.



Ah for the Carbon bike - just get it, you won't be disappointed. The SL5 has the isospeed system which sounds like a bit of a gimmick but it does smooth out small bumps in the road nicely, it's definitely noticeable and makes the ride much more comfortable - really good for an endurance focused bike. I'd go for the SL5 over the SL4 as 105 is much better than Tiagra shifting wise and the 105 hydraulics brakes are first class. Also the SL5 has a better gear range so go figure.

If you want to ride over winter then get some mudguards fitted by the shop - the Bontrager NCS mudguards work very well with the Domane as to be expected from the same brand and I'd budget a bit of money for replacing the tyres as @steve292 says the stock tyres are OK but not brilliant - they lack great puncture protection and are a bit heavy.

Stock wheels have always been OK for me from Trek - and I'm a fairly heavy rider - but if you want to upgrade later this is where I'd start.

Overall I'd suggest getting down to your local Trek dealer and organising a test ride - if you've had your eye on it for a while which it seems like, then that's the only way to confirm whether it's the bike for you. You could always buy a cheaper or lighter bike online but you'll always be left wondering....

Edit to add: White is the only colour I'd get the SL5 in


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## Sterlo (18 Sep 2020)

Now I really hate you, 74km on a HYBRID. Mine was that heavy I was lucky to get to the end of the road. I agree with every one else on here re the losing some weight yourself, I've lost just over a stone in the past 2 or 3 months and feel so much better for it (more to go yet hopefully). My times are also becoming quicker. A good bike helps but cut as much down from you as you can.


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

si_c said:


> Ah for the Carbon bike - just get it, you won't be disappointed. The SL5 has the isospeed system which sounds like a bit of a gimmick but it does smooth out small bumps in the road nicely, it's definitely noticeable and makes the ride much more comfortable - really good for an endurance focused bike. I'd go for the SL5 over the SL4 as 105 is much better than Tiagra shifting wise and the 105 hydraulics brakes are first class. Also the SL5 has a better gear range so go figure.
> 
> If you want to ride over winter then get some mudguards fitted by the shop - the Bontrager NCS mudguards work very well with the Domane as to be expected from the same brand and I'd budget a bit of money for replacing the tyres as @steve292 says the stock tyres are OK but not brilliant - they lack great puncture protection and are a bit heavy.
> 
> ...



Thanks for your advice. I'm tempted to get a bike before winter really kicks in and get a turbo trainer and stick it on there for the winter while I punish my hybrid that I have just bought mudguards for on the commute. Then just get the nice bike outside on decent weather weekends until spring.


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## si_c (18 Sep 2020)

Dan77 said:


> Thanks for your advice. I'm tempted to get a bike before winter really kicks in and get a turbo trainer and stick it on there for the winter while I punish my hybrid that I have just bought mudguards for on the commute. Then just get the nice bike outside on decent weather weekends until spring.


That's definitely an option - although I'd highly recommend getting out on the cold dry days in winter. On those days you don't overheat at all and on a good bike with clear roads it's a lot of fun.


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

Sterlo said:


> Now I really hate you, 74km on a HYBRID. Mine was that heavy I was lucky to get to the end of the road. I agree with every one else on here re the losing some weight yourself, I've lost just over a stone in the past 2 or 3 months and feel so much better for it (more to go yet hopefully). My times are also becoming quicker. A good bike helps but cut as much down from you as you can.



It's what Trek call a fitness hybrid so it's not too bad. 35mm tyres and weighs in at 12.5kg I think.
I've lost about a stone too in the last few months and continually breaking my PBs.....even managed 4 (pretty uncontested) KoMs.


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## rogerzilla (18 Sep 2020)

On a long ride, you really feel extra bike weight. I've done many rides > 100 miles and the ones where I could barely pedal by the end were always on heavier touring bikes. I still had some left in the tank when I used a far lighter fixie (the fixed gear also helps). I've done the same ride 3 times on a tourer, 3 times on a light fixie and once on a lightweight medium-ratio 3-speed. The latter would have been easier had I not been riding off-pace and unfed (long story involving my mate's broken cleat).


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## Grant Fondo (18 Sep 2020)

Dan77 said:


> A lighter bike is generally a good thing right? To what degree is this important though?
> 
> I'm looking at endurance bikes as a first road bike. Researching now and hoping to buy when I see a good deal in the next 3-6 months.
> 
> ...


My rigid MTB is 10kg so i think you can go lighter if you have the cash. Also have 7.5kg endurance bike and 9kg gravel and quite hilly to west of where i live, endurance easily the best in this terrain, possibly because I am no Roglic


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## si_c (18 Sep 2020)

rogerzilla said:


> On a long ride, you really feel extra bike weight. I've done many rides > 100 miles and the ones where I could barely pedal by the end were always on heavier touring bikes. I still had some left in the tank when I used a far lighter fixie (the fixed gear also helps). I've done the same ride 3 times on a tourer, 3 times on a light fixie and once on a lightweight medium-ratio 3-speed. The latter would have been easier had I not been riding off-pace and unfed (long story involving my mate's broken cleat).



There is a big difference between a lightweight fixed gear and a touring bike - could be 4 or 5 kg potentially. I'd argue that a 10kg road bike with appropriate gearing vs a 7kg road bike with for the average rider isn't particularly noticeable over even reasonable length rides.

Both my road bikes are in the region of 9kg so not light weight by any means, once you add in my weight I doubt I'd notice it if the bike lost a couple of kg - I certainly haven't in the past when I was lighter and riding a much lighter bike than normal. For endurance, gearing and comfort beat weight up to a certain point, obviously if you're riding an 18kg bike you will notice the weight.



Grant Fondo said:


> My rigid MTB is 10kg so i think you can go lighter if you have the cash. Also have 7.5kg endurance bike and 9kg gravel and quite hilly to west of where i live, endurance easily the best in this terrain, possibly because I am no Roglic



Wirral's not hilly


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## HMS_Dave (18 Sep 2020)

My road bike weighs 23kg's. It's an elephant bike and i ride it on the road.


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## wafter (18 Sep 2020)

In absolute isolation and all else being equal, a lighter bike is always better.

A lighter bike is easier to manouver when you're not riding, dragging through the house, lifting into the car or over gates, while it also feels more responsive to directional changes / over rougher terrain when out of the saddle. IME these areas are where you'll notice the difference most, from my experience of my three bikes (lightest 9.5kg, heaviest just shy of 14kg). The differences aren't "night and day" in use, although picking up the 9.5kg road bike after moving the 14kg shopper about can be a bit of a shock!

As you've already twigged the contributions of lighter bikes to climbing and acceleration are far lower; with a 2kg difference on the bike constituting maybe a 2-3% difference in overall system mass with the rider etc accounted for, so unless you're ultra-competitive, in the real world this is next to meaningless.

Other issues to consider are longevity and safety; judging by the feedback from a couple of respected pundits it seems that this year a lot of manufacturers have put the brakes on the seemingly unending quest for lightness at all costs, instead choosing to add a bit more meat to their CFRP framesets to improve strength. Personally I'd happily sacrifice a few hundred grams for a frame that gives greater peace of mind.

As usual a lot of the driving force behind the perpetual quest for lightness is nothing more than marketing; a fabricated and often largely arbitrary construct designed to give the consumer something quantitative to fixate upon and allow them to talk themselves further up the price range in the name of grams saved as an easy metric to compare bike to bike. All this despite the fact that mass is effectively a largely irrelevant factor for most riders, when considered within the confines of how the bike will be used and within the typical range of bike masses within a given type (road, touring etc) available within a particular price range.


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## Magpies (18 Sep 2020)

si_c said:


> I'd argue that a 10kg road bike with appropriate gearing vs a 7kg road bike with for the average rider isn't particularly noticeable over even reasonable length rides.



+1 - IMO the wheels and gearing make much more difference than weight to speed & comfort in the 7-11kg range, unless you are a budding TdF rider. As mentioned several times above - the bike's weight is only a small fraction of the system weight.


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## Dan77 (18 Sep 2020)

This has been really useful to get people's opinions. I'll do a little more research and then look at trying a bike if that's possible with the current supply shortages. The Domane is definitely a good possibility. Thanks all.


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## oreo_muncher (18 Sep 2020)

Dan77 said:


> A lighter bike is generally a good thing right? To what degree is this important though?
> 
> I'm looking at endurance bikes as a first road bike. Researching now and hoping to buy when I see a good deal in the next 3-6 months.
> 
> ...


I have the trek al2 domane bike and it's amazingggg. Very smooth ride. I wish I could have the sl6 domane or slr6 domane but it's more on the pricey side. It's better value than specialised allez bikes. Better components than Cannondale. If you get Canyon- which is good value but you break it and need repairs you'll most likely have to send it back to the factory to get it fixed because they don't really have the parts in the UK (that's what I've been told by some bike shops when I asked about their thoughts on Canyon).


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## boydj (18 Sep 2020)

As a beginner, I doubt if you would notice the difference between an 8kg bike and a 10kg bike, even on hills. I'd suggest looking for a decent second-hand bike to start out, or a new bike with a reasonably good frame and fairly basic components. This will let you go through the learning curve for cycling on the road, build up some cycling fitness, and get the cycling habit properly established.

Once you've got the cycling bug, then you can look at upgrades (tyres & wheels first) or a newer, better bike.


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## Kajjal (18 Sep 2020)

More important is a well maintained bike that fits you and suits how you want to ride. My carbon gravel bike is very good on or off road and I do notice it being lighter but more important is it works well for me and is very reliable.


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## itboffin (18 Sep 2020)

My cervelo R5 was 6.2kg it’s now 7.3 after swapping from campag with 1kg wheel set to stock ultegra but the gears now are far more useable than the super lightweight setup oh and I’ve lost 14kg so it really is now down to less weight on the bike.

at 6.2 it felt like it could break at any point I like the more planted feeling and 7kg is hardly a heavyweight


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## Ming the Merciless (18 Sep 2020)

Lighter bikes are slower downhill


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## PaulSB (18 Sep 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> Lighter bikes are slower downhill


Heavier riders are faster downhill


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## Blue Hills (19 Sep 2020)

boydj said:


> As a beginner, I doubt if you would notice the difference between an 8kg bike and a 10kg bike, even on hills. I'd suggest looking for a decent second-hand bike to start out, or a new bike with a reasonably good frame and fairly basic components. This will let you go through the learning curve for cycling on the road, build up some cycling fitness, and get the cycling habit properly established.
> 
> Once you've got the cycling bug, then you can look at upgrades (tyres & wheels first) or a newer, better bike.


Decent suggestion. And by then there might be better availability, even better pricing bargains on new bikes, particularly if out of season.


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## DCBassman (19 Sep 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> Lighter bikes are slower downhill


True! But similarly, marginal gains...


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## gzoom (19 Sep 2020)

Dan77 said:


> I like Trek as a brand but I'm certainly not set on it. I'm not sure they're the best value for the spec. The Domane is a nice looking bike but it's almost 10kg.



My biggest 'issue' with upgrading my 2011 Trek Madone is weight of current road bikes.

My Madone with DuraAce wheelset are both nearly a decade old now, the bike with 105 shifter + Ultegra mechs shift perfectly every time, and even after a recent 'off' everything still just works. The wheels still run true, and make the all important 'clack clack' noise when freewheeling to tell everyone your serious about your cycling .

The weight for the bike (58cm) including pedals + bottle cages.....7.8kg, and to my eye it still looks fantastic.












I've been thinking about upgrading (don't we all), and the 2020 Domane looks lovely, though actually surprisingly similar in profile to my 2011 Trek??

https://www.bikeradar.com/reviews/bikes/road-bikes/trek-domane-sl6-review/

But here is the real kicker, the cost of new bikes versus weight gains. Like you I was bought up with idea lighter = better, its the first thing I look at on any bike. I paid £750 for the Madone second hand back in 2013, the wheels were second hand for £300, so just over £1000 10 year ago. If I sold it now I would probably get £500 for it, a new Domane in decent spec is £3000+, so for a total cost increase of £2500 I get a bike a *weight 2kg+ MORE*

Now I get disc brakes weigh more, and aero weigh more, but paying so much extra cash for a heavier bike is something my brain cannot compute, the only option for me is to get a SLR branded frame, but than am into near five figure sums for a pedal bike.......Bare in mind my current Trek works perfectly and its still my legs which slows me down not the bike. Infact recently I've just hit my aim for the summer, to average 18mph over rolling terrain.

So instead of dropping £3k+ to swap out my decade old road bike for a *HEAVIER* new bike I've got old of a Ultegra crank set (used ofcourse), and will source some Ultegra shifters to put on my used bike with an aim of getting the weight down to 7.5kg, at which point that'll do me for next summer .

I think the 'best value' new bike is the Boardman 8.9 carbon, under £1k, lighter than a £3K Trek, with the money saved buy some good wheels (it really dose make a subjective difference!!) and your have change left over.

https://www.bikeradar.com/reviews/bikes/road-bikes/boardman-slr-8-9c-2020-review/


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## nickyboy (19 Sep 2020)

By all means spend your money in whatever you like but a bit of simple maths shows that for almost all cyclists, fitness gains are what make the difference, not bike weight reduction

Assume a cyclist weighs 80kg and has a 10kg bike. Reducing the bike weight to 8kg is going to be expensive but will only reduce the total weight by 2.2%. So you can reasonably expect to go that much quicker uphill but flat speed will be unchanged and you'll actually be a bit slower downhill

How hard is it to improve fitness by 2.2%? Not hard. Most recreational cyclists could do it in a few weeks. For example I was typical recreational cyclists going into lockdown. 3 months of reasonable effort and my power is up about 10% and weight is down 4%. Result is I'm quite a bit quicker but without any expenditure

So spend your money on whatever you like but the biggest gains by far come from improving fitness


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## gzoom (19 Sep 2020)

nickyboy said:


> my power is up about 10% and weight is down 4%. Result is I'm quite a bit quicker but without any expenditure



Though to be 100% sure of power gains you must have a power meter, which is 100% associated with expenditure .


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## Dan77 (19 Sep 2020)

nickyboy said:


> By all means spend your money in whatever you like but a bit of simple maths shows that for almost all cyclists, fitness gains are what make the difference, not bike weight reduction
> 
> Assume a cyclist weighs 80kg and has a 10kg bike. Reducing the bike weight to 8kg is going to be expensive but will only reduce the total weight by 2.2%. So you can reasonably expect to go that much quicker uphill but flat speed will be unchanged and you'll actually be a bit slower downhill
> 
> ...



Yep. The fitness and weight loss is happening regardless. Already dropped 7kg since I started at the end of May and most of that is since I've been pushing harder and further (since July).

I'm not going to obsess about bike weight but as I'm buying my first road bike and have a decent budget, it is one of the considerations.

Just looking at specs for the money I think I'd go for a Canyon but I don't want to make an expensive mistake. I can probably give a Domane a go at the LBS.


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## nickyboy (19 Sep 2020)

gzoom said:


> Though to be 100% sure of power gains you must have a power meter, which is 100% associated with expenditure .


That's true. But my main point is that, with a bit of effort I've produced the same effect as having a weightless bike with zero expenditure. Living in a very hilly area the effect is huge. 1.5mph quicker on average


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

PaulSB said:


> Heavier riders are faster downhill



If they can get up them to start with.


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## SkipdiverJohn (19 Sep 2020)

If you want to obsess about bike weights, make sure you are obsessing about real-world weights - that means with the frame in the size you actually ride, the tyres you want to fit, and a set of pedals and bottle cage fitted. A lot of bike manufacturers are very naughty with their weight figures, they quote for small frame sizes and without things like pedals fitted. An incomplete, unrideable bike is always going to weigh less than one that is fully functional.
A lot of people who buy a bike based on these false weight specs will actually find their bike could be a pound or more heavier in real life, once in a rideable condition. After all, you'll have a job riding anywhere without pedals, and if you're going more than a few miles, you are going to also need to be able to carry water.
Also the frameset weights mentioned further up the thread for AL are not really much lighter than a vintage full Reynolds 531 steel frame, so don't be fooled into thinking all modern road bikes are automatically lighter than old steel ones. In many cases they aren't.


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

Add 1kg for a couple of 500ml water bottles. Add 1/2 kg for puncture repair kit and spare tubes. Add 1/2 kg for mudguards. Add 200kg for the rider on top...


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## Cycleops (19 Sep 2020)

I’ve also got a Trek @gzoom , mine is 2007 so even older than yours but aluminium not carbon.





Picked up from under a heap of others down here for ten quid minus a rear wheel and with a broken rear mech. Nobody is really interested in these bikes here. Don’t know how much it weighs but feels light. Now my favourite bike which goes to prove the older models can still be great bikes to ride and provide similar performance.


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## Grant Fondo (19 Sep 2020)

si_c said:


> There is a big difference between a lightweight fixed gear and a touring bike - could be 4 or 5 kg potentially. I'd argue that a 10kg road bike with appropriate gearing vs a 7kg road bike with for the average rider isn't particularly noticeable over even reasonable length rides.
> 
> Both my road bikes are in the region of 9kg so not light weight by any means, once you add in my weight I doubt I'd notice it if the bike lost a couple of kg - I certainly haven't in the past when I was lighter and riding a much lighter bike than normal. For endurance, gearing and comfort beat weight up to a certain point, obviously if you're riding an 18kg bike you will notice the weight.
> 
> ...


Moel Famau is


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## si_c (19 Sep 2020)

Grant Fondo said:


> Moel Famau is


Haha, fair point, although that's South for me so I forgot about it


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## gzoom (19 Sep 2020)

@Cycleops I got hooked on Treks by this, a 2000 5500 USPS spec race bike with full DuraAce groupset. I did the LEJOG on it a few years ago with it, despite it having a proper double chainring (none of this compact/triple stuff), it was sublime.

Still the best bike I've ridden, they come up for sale sometimes at around the £700-800 mark, and weigh in at sub 7kg. I have to say they do make a £4k+ brand new Trek with a weight close to 10kg look very very very overpriced.


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

gzoom said:


> My biggest 'issue' with upgrading my 2011 Trek Madone is weight of current road bikes.
> 
> My Madone with DuraAce wheelset are both nearly a decade old now, the bike with 105 shifter + Ultegra mechs shift perfectly every time, and even after a recent 'off' everything still just works. The wheels still run true, and make the all important 'clack clack' noise when freewheeling to tell everyone your serious about your cycling .
> 
> ...



Two 750mL bottles of water and up to 9.4kg. Add a puncture repair kit, pump and spare tubes you are up to 10kg. Carry some food, up to 11kg. Plonk you on top up to 81kg or more etc..


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## si_c (19 Sep 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> Two 750mL bottles of water and up to 9.4kg. Add a puncture repair kit, pump and spare tubes you are up to 10kg. Carry some food, up to 11kg. Plonk you on top up to 81kg or more etc..


Ha for me add 97kg, plus tools, pedals etc and total weight on a 9kg bike is about 110kg, versus 108kg on a 7kg bike.


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## gzoom (19 Sep 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> Two 750mL bottles of water and up to 9.4kg. Add a puncture repair kit, pump and spare tubes you are up to 10kg. Carry some food, up to 11kg. Plonk you on top up to 81kg or more etc..



Still doesn't change the fact a £4K+ brand new Trek road bike weighs nearly 33% more than a Trek road bike from 2000....Its similar to cars now weighing more than cars from 2000, the difference been car engine outputs have gone up to match/keep the power/ton ratio the same but as far as am aware most of us aren't generating any more power from our legs now compared to in 2000 .

eBikes do make up the difference in weight though .


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

gzoom said:


> Still doesn't change the fact a £4K+ brand new Trek road bike weighs nearly 33% more than a Trek road bike from 2000....Its similar to cars now weighing more than cars from 2000, the difference been car engine outputs have gone up to match/keep the power/ton ratio the same but as far as am aware most of us aren't generating any more power from our legs now compared to in 2000 .
> 
> eBikes do make up the difference in weight though .



or that the weight makes bugger all difference other than shortening the lifespan and cost.


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

gzoom said:


> Still doesn't change the fact a £4K+ brand new Trek road bike weighs nearly 33% more than a Trek road bike from 2000....Its similar to cars now weighing more than cars from 2000, the difference been car engine outputs have gone up to match/keep the power/ton ratio the same but as far as am aware most of us aren't generating any more power from our legs now compared to in 2000 .
> 
> eBikes do make up the difference in weight though .


Car weights going up is a scandal but that’s another thread.


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## fossyant (19 Sep 2020)

Wheels and tyres most important.


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## Ming the Merciless (19 Sep 2020)

si_c said:


> Ha for me add 97kg, plus tools, pedals etc and total weight on a 9kg bike is about 110kg, versus 108kg on a 7kg bike.



Indeed on a climb that takes an hour you might be 1 min quicker. On a 5 min climb, 3-5 seconds faster. Whoopee do.


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## HLaB (19 Sep 2020)

Listening to a podcast last night and the speaker said, if you can lose 2kg off the bike you'll gain seconds over 40km, but lose that same 2kg off the body you'll gain minutes 👍


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## nickyboy (19 Sep 2020)

HLaB said:


> Listening to a podcast last night and the speaker said, if you can lose 2kg off the bike you'll gain seconds over 40km, but lose that same 2kg off the body you'll gain minutes 👍


What a load of bollox. The only way this works is if the 2kg in bodyweight loss is accompanied by a substantial increase in fitness. Otherwise 2kg is 2kg


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## HLaB (19 Sep 2020)

nickyboy said:


> What a load of bollox. The only way this works is if the 2kg in bodyweight loss is accompanied by a substantial increase in fitness. Otherwise 2kg is 2kg


I think he put it down to change of body shape and a smaller cda.

It was this guy and he got a pretty impressive cv/ client base.

https://scientifictriathlon.com/podcast/


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## cougie uk (19 Sep 2020)

I do like how my summer bike feels after a winter of heavy tyres and full mudguards. 

Only thing is after 10 mins or so on the bike I've become accustomed to the weight. Same thing going back to the heavier winter bike. 

Weight isn't the be all and end all. Not sure I've even bothered weighing any bike of mine. 


You can't tell if you're bottles are full or not as you ride so that's a kilo to a kilo and a half that you'd never notice.


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## Ridgeway (19 Sep 2020)

Give me some aero vs weight saving any day (the chant of an unfit, over weight fella).

Pretty sure my bike now is about this -------------- heavy (honestly no idea) but i know i'm well over weight and well under fit however it's decently aero and on group rides is see the benefits in 80% of the riding, that uphill stuff however is only going to improve when my watts p/kg goes up.

Bike weight is not your only friend


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## BalkanExpress (20 Sep 2020)

The most important thing is to ride whatever makes you happy, especially if you are riding to get fit as this can be hard work and you will want to keep motivated.

Better a bike that weight a kilo or so more but which you want to ride even when it is cold and wet, than something lighter but which ends up on the shed all winter because it does not bring a spring to your step.

This is of corse totally subjective: try and get some test rides and go for the one that puts the biggest grin on your face.


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## StuAff (20 Sep 2020)

It's system weight that you need to think about, as others have stated. I've done a lot of climbing on bikes ranging from 12kg (and with a hinge in the middle) down to 7 or 8kg- and more often than not a fair weight of baggage as well. Not a problem with low enough gearing. Climbed Ditchling Beacon yesterday morning on the last stretch of the FNRttC from London. On my Litespeed, 9 or 10 kg at a rough guess, plus a pannier with all the usual spares etc, plus my work clothes (worked Friday night). Needed the 34x32 bottom gear, but that's what it's there for…


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## SkipdiverJohn (20 Sep 2020)

Ridgeway said:


> Give me some aero vs weight saving any day (the chant of an unfit, over weight fella).
> 
> Pretty sure my bike now is about this -------------- heavy (honestly no idea) but i know i'm well over weight and well under fit however it's decently aero and on group rides is see the benefits in 80% of the riding, that uphill stuff however is only going to improve when my watts p/kg goes up.
> 
> Bike weight is not your only friend



Overweight riders are inherently less aerodynamic than slimmer ones. I say that as someone who could lose a stone myself, although I'm never going to be fast regardless as I'm not built like a racing cyclist even if I was at optimum weight.
Losing weight off a bike may make no difference to it's aerodynamic performance, but losing weight off the rider always will, regardless of whether they ride an aero bike or an old-school steel one with round frame tubes.


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## boydj (20 Sep 2020)

Ridgeway said:


> Give me some aero vs weight saving any day (the chant of an unfit, over weight fella).
> 
> Pretty sure my bike now is about this -------------- heavy (honestly no idea) but i know i'm well over weight and well under fit however it's decently aero and on group rides is see the benefits in 80% of the riding, that uphill stuff however is only going to improve when my watts p/kg goes up.
> 
> Bike weight is not your only friend



You've got to be going pretty fast for aero to make much difference, given that most of the drag comes from the rider.


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## StuAff (20 Sep 2020)

boydj said:


> You've got to be going pretty fast for aero to make much difference, given that most of the drag comes from the rider.


Not so. Even at 10 mph half your power output is spent overcoming drag. And that drag increases as the cube of speed- in other words, to double your speed you need eight times the power. At 30 mph, 90% of a rider's effort is going into overcoming that drag.
https://www.bicycling.com/skills-tips/a22107504/aerodynamic-definition-in-cycling/


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## boydj (20 Sep 2020)

StuAff said:


> Not so. Even at 10 mph half your power output is spent overcoming drag. And that drag increases as the cube of speed- in other words, to double your speed you need eight times the power. At 30 mph, 90% of a rider's effort is going into overcoming that drag.
> https://www.bicycling.com/skills-tips/a22107504/aerodynamic-definition-in-cycling/



I'm aware of that, but how fast is an unfit, overweight guy going to be going? And only a small proportion of that drag is coming from the bike itself.


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## StuAff (20 Sep 2020)

boydj said:


> I'm aware of that, but how fast is an unfit, overweight guy going to be going? And only a small proportion of that drag is coming from the bike itself.


Depends on how unfit and overweight he is. If he puts the effort in, he will get less unfit and less overweight, and aero tweaks will help. As the saying goes, every little helps. Just adjusting your riding position and making sure clothing fits well can make a difference.
And as velomobile owners would point out, a big proportion of drag can come from the bike…


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## matticus (21 Sep 2020)

Biggest drag reduction?

- Getting in an aero POSITION. The bike itself is 2ry

So *bike *aero isn't the biggest gain, and the slower you go, the less effect *all *aero has. (So quoting drag numbers at 30mph just isn't relevant to normal amateur riders who aren't in a flat TT. Sorry Stu! x )


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## Colin Grigson (22 Sep 2020)

Just get the lightest bike you can, power to weight ratio is important in every facet of sport - I love my 7kg road bike and I would never ride a heavy cumbersome BSO half as much as I do with my lightweight - it’s just fun to ride instead of a drudge


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