# Group Rides - Birmingham



## Trek_Girl (5 Jul 2020)

Hello is anyone here from Birmingham or the Midlands and would be interested in arranging group rides?


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## Milkfloat (5 Jul 2020)

I go out with a couple of different groups from Warwick / Leamington on a regular basis, you are welcome to come along, although it might be a bit far to travel. You can also take a look at your local club for when they start riding post lockdown. Finally, although they are also not riding now, Breeze rides are supposed to be pretty good, so you could check there.

Where about in Brum are you?


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## alicat (5 Jul 2020)

Welcome @Trek_Girl. What sort of cycling do you do?


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## mjr (5 Jul 2020)

Milkfloat said:


> You can also take a look at your local club for when they start riding post lockdown. Finally, although they are also not riding now, Breeze rides are supposed to be pretty good, so you could check there.


Most non-BC clubs are back riding in sixes or less now.

In case you didn't know, Breeze rides are female only (at least officially), which some don't like.


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## Trek_Girl (5 Jul 2020)

alicat said:


> Welcome @Trek_Girl. What sort of cycling do you do?


Well it's just casual cycling at the moment via canal towpaths with a little bit of road on an MTB


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## alicat (5 Jul 2020)

Ask in your local bike shop. They are likely to know who organises that sort of ride local to you.


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## vickster (6 Jul 2020)

Are British Cycling doing their social rides yet? Breeze rides exist for women too.
https://www.letsride.co.uk/

They are...

Birmingham https://www.letsride.co.uk/rides?find_type=/rides&location=Birmingham&lat=52.48624299999999&lng=-1.890401000000001&permitted_gender=true&has_booking_spaces=true&radius=10&with_rides=3&date_from=06/07/2020&date_to=06/10/2020

Heres a 30 miler at 10am next Saturday for example https://www.letsride.co.uk/rides/saturday-base-layer-86
or shorter on Sunday https://www.letsride.co.uk/rides/ride-out-from-handsworth-13
another on Sunday but more road oriented https://www.letsride.co.uk/rides/flab-social-rides-birmingham-west

Ladies at the end of the month https://www.letsride.co.uk/rides/summer-breeze-gor5l

just sign up and give it a go (mostly free)

Cycling UK (formerly CTC) also run rides, but may not be back up yet given the restrictions on group sizes


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## mjr (6 Jul 2020)

vickster said:


> Are British Cycling doing their social rides yet? [...]
> 
> Cycling UK (formerly CTC) also run rides, but may not be back up yet given the restrictions on group sizes


British Cycling have allowed rides since 4 July... but I know one club that has said they're not restarting in 2020.

CUK has allowed rides in sixes for weeks now - but some groups seem to be struggling for organisers, partly due to their generally older leadership and some going off on postponed tours.


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## Rock bus (6 Jul 2020)

Milkfloat said:


> I go out with a couple of different groups from Warwick / Leamington on a regular basis, you are welcome to come along, although it might be a bit far to travel. You can also take a look at your local club for when they start riding post lockdown. Finally, although they are also not riding now, Breeze rides are supposed to be pretty good, so you could check there.
> 
> Where about in Brum are you?


I’m Leamington as well! Which ones do you ride with?


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## Trek_Girl (6 Jul 2020)

vickster said:


> Are British Cycling doing their social rides yet? Breeze rides exist for women too.
> https://www.letsride.co.uk/
> 
> They are...
> ...



Thanks


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## Milkfloat (6 Jul 2020)

Rock bus said:


> I’m Leamington as well! Which ones do you ride with?


RLSCC and Kenilworth Wheelers, but mainly with an independent group. Yourself?


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## PaulSB (7 Jul 2020)

mjr said:


> British Cycling have allowed rides since 4 July... but I know one club that has said they're not restarting in 2020.
> 
> CUK has allowed rides in sixes for weeks now - but some groups seem to be struggling for organisers, partly due to their generally older leadership and some going off on postponed tours.



It's certainly true BC have sanctioned club organised rides since July 4th to a maximum of six. What needs to be taken account of are the guidelines BC require affiliated clubs to follow and the "disciplines" which have to be employed which make club rides impossible.

This all falls on to committees run by volunteers. Producing and publicising club guidelines to members is simple, policing and ensuring adherence to these is impossible. How can club officers ensure only six members ride and then at two metre spacing?

The guidelines BC have issued mean, to my mind, no UK club can currently run "official" rides. BC is following government guidance, which is fine, but the reality is many club friends are simply organising themselves. I'm glad to say our guys seem to be sticking to the six rule, the same can't be said for other northwest clubs.


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## mjr (7 Jul 2020)

PaulSB said:


> This all falls on to committees run by volunteers. Producing and publicising club guidelines to members is simple, policing and ensuring adherence to these is impossible. How can club officers ensure only six members ride and then at two metre spacing?


How can clubs ensure "guidelines" (effectively rules) are followed at any time? Is reasonable best efforts no defence in BC's domain?



> The guidelines BC have issued mean, to my mind, no UK club can currently run "official" rides. BC is following government guidance, which is fine, but the reality is many club friends are simply organising themselves. I'm glad to say our guys seem to be sticking to the six rule, the same can't be said for other northwest clubs.


What guidelines are you thinking of? https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/a...s-reintroduction-of-club-and-group-activity-0 looks as weak as any, at first glance.

I think most BC clubs have non-distanced chain gangs riding unannounced, some even starting their customary days/times/places. Maybe this was BC's intention if they issued unworkable requirements. I'm glad to hear at least one BC club is doing better.


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## Rock bus (7 Jul 2020)

Milkfloat said:


> RLSCC and Kenilworth Wheelers, but mainly with an independent group. Yourself?


have pmd you


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## PaulSB (8 Jul 2020)

mjr said:


> How can clubs ensure "guidelines" (effectively rules) are followed at any time? Is reasonable best efforts no defence in BC's domain?
> 
> What guidelines are you thinking of? https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/a...s-reintroduction-of-club-and-group-activity-0 looks as weak as any, at first glance.
> 
> I think most BC clubs have non-distanced chain gangs riding unannounced, some even starting their customary days/times/places. Maybe this was BC's intention if they issued unworkable requirements. I'm glad to hear at least one BC club is doing better.



From your own link go to this one: https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/zuvvi/media/The_Way_Forward_03-07-20.pdf - and see points 2.1 to 2.5, pages 10 and 11. As a committee we accept the requirements, understand them and could publish guidance but we do not feel able to take responsibility for ensuring they are adhered to. We have faith in our membership to adhere to the guidelines but there are potential problems - for example one extra rider turns up making seven. Realistically is he going to be turned away? Of course not. If I was there and had undertaken to be on the ride and ensure guidelines were observed could I turn away a friend? Just how hard would that be?

The club is affiliated to BC and we gain many benefits from this without which we could not run the club, the two key ones being insurance and membership administration (a huge benefit). Through genuine error we once had our affiliation suspended for five weeks till changes were made to comply. Those five weeks were difficult to say the least. In our view morally the club should not be organising rides and practically the risk of losing affiliation, insurance and admin is too great. Other clubs may disagree.

Speaking personally I feel BC have taken the easy way out, permit group riding and dump all the responsibility on to local, amateur, unpaid volunteers who do their best to run a club for the benefit of many cyclists. It doesn't please me as an individual.


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## mjr (8 Jul 2020)

PaulSB said:


> From your own link go to this one: https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/zuvvi/media/The_Way_Forward_03-07-20.pdf - and see points 2.1 to 2.5, pages 10 and 11. As a committee we accept the requirements, understand them and could publish guidance but we do not feel able to take responsibility for ensuring they are adhered to.


OK. Where does it say anyone expects clubs "to take responsibility for ensuring they are adhered to" rather than making best efforts in good faith for following the guidelines? After all, it does say "Participants need to take personal responsibility" but only that clubs "must consider safety".



> We have faith in our membership to adhere to the guidelines but there are potential problems - for example one extra rider turns up making seven. Realistically is he going to be turned away? Of course not. If I was there and had undertaken to be on the ride and ensure guidelines were observed could I turn away a friend? Just how hard would that be?


Why turn them away? Split into a 3 and a 4, as suggested in point 1.2.6.



> The club is affiliated to BC and we gain many benefits from this without which we could not run the club, the two key ones being insurance and membership administration (a huge benefit).


We've discussed that in the past, so instead of repeating here and heading off-topic in a second way, I'll just link back to https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/question-for-clubs.234522/ and https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/non-members-continuing-to-ride-with-club.253079/post-5805148 about the insurance and enforcement, and suggest that membership admin seems like needless bureaucracy outside of racing, although it's what I'd expect from a funded arm of government like BC.


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## PaulSB (8 Jul 2020)

mjr said:


> OK. Where does it say anyone expects clubs "to take responsibility for ensuring they are adhered to" rather than making best efforts in good faith for following the guidelines? After all, it does say "Participants need to take personal responsibility" but only that clubs "must consider safety".
> 
> 
> Why turn them away? Split into a 3 and a 4, as suggested in point 1.2.6.
> ...


I feel you have difficulty in understanding if one is applying guidelines to club rides it is necessary to ensure they are adhered to. If a cycle club choses to put on rides in the current climate that club has a responsibility to ensure the guidelines are policed and adhered to - a social responsibility above all. To publish guidelines and if they are not followed simply take the approach of "well we published guidelines" is inadequate and irresponsible. Please read point 1.4.

Today I passed a group of nine riders from a very well known northwest club. Six in club kit. These riders sent out a clear message to anyone who saw them, it was "we don't care, we know better etc." I wouldn't want the public or other riders to see this attitude publicly displayed by our club. It sends out a very poor message about our sport. Hence the need to ensure guidelines are adhered to.

Just to cover your point re membership admin. Most cycle clubs collect membership fees. This is the membership admin service which BC provides. Very simply BC provides a facility for each member to pay by debit or credit card. These payments are then forwarded to the club bank account. Prior to using this service it was necessary to collect cash, cheques, bank transfers, PayPal etc. from our members, record the payments, bank cheques and cash and so on. Our membership secretary now has literally one click to perform per member to process the member's payment. If you can offer a simpler and more effective method of collecting payments from 200+ individuals I look forward to reading about it.


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## Chris S (8 Jul 2020)

Trek_Girl said:


> Hello is anyone here from Birmingham or the Midlands and would be interested in arranging group rides?


There is a Birmingham Cycling group on Facebook that frequently organises rides.
The most recent was on July 4th through the Netherton Tunnel.


View: https://www.facebook.com/events/276675736722526/

There will probably be more soon.


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