# Been hit by a car whilst riding in a cycle lane...



## JimboIchi (13 Oct 2015)

Hi, I'm new to site and was hoping to see if anyone has had this happen and what I can do about it. I was riding down a cycle lane in Bradford and the traffic was slow to stationary, so I was passing all the cars on the inside. I was going slowly enough to check if any cars were indicating left, especially as I approached junctions, but as I passed the cars, another car which was part of the oncoming traffic turned right into their drive way which I didn't see until I hit the side rear of the car and then somersaulted completely over it. I was out for about 20 seconds and an ambulance was passing so was lucky to be helped so quickly. I was too dazed to speak to the person driving the vehicle but the ambulance took their details for me. My bike is a complete write off, along with my helmet, trousers and left shoe. Then I was taken off to A & E where they gave me the all clear.

I've never been involved in this type of accident, so is it a simple thing of calling the drivers insurance company and claiming, or should I be taking any other action. The police didn't arrive at the scene and claimed they couldn't find me in A & E so have just spoke with them on the phone. They gave me an incident number and said that I should just speak with the driver but am concerned that I may blow a fuse as they nearly killed me. Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thanks for reading.


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## LocalLad (14 Oct 2015)

Get your own legal advice. If you just go to their insurance company you probably won't get a full pay out.

And write down everything you remember right now...otherwise you will forget...every detail you can remember.

And when looking at a claim, tot up every loss...if you need a hospital appointment, will you pay to park? Claim it. Will you lose time at work?...


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## Smurfy (14 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> The police didn't arrive at the scene and claimed they couldn't find me in A & E so have just spoke with them on the phone. *They gave me an incident number and said that I should just speak with the driver* but am concerned that I may blow a fuse as they nearly killed me.


The highlighted bit doesn't sound right to me. You have been to A&E, so I'm assuming you have been injured. I'm pretty sure the police should be taking more interest when it is clear an injury has occurred. Surely when a collision occurs, the driver should be breathalysed, did that happen?

With respect to the circumstances, if the cycle lane was marked, the turning vehicle maybe ought to have expected non-stationary traffic on the other side of the queue. Was it a cycle lane, or a bus lane too? Do you have a google street view link? Was it one of those ghastly cycle lanes with give way markings for cyclists at side roads?

Others will be along soon with more experience and help. Get well soon!


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (14 Oct 2015)

Just reread the OP. Unless you're injuries were very slight there should be an accident book created.


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (14 Oct 2015)

Reg, just updated my post after reading it properly. It's still early!


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## vickster (14 Oct 2015)

@classic33 pulled together a what to do in an accident guide...I just can't remember where it is

Contact Slater & Gordon or another specialist 'cycle accident' solicitor e.g. http://www.bottonline.co.uk/compensation/bicycle-accident-claims?gclid=CIzN_4-xwcgCFWjmwgodvWQFwQ or http://www.cycle-sos.co.uk to deal with the 3rd party insurer. Don't do it yourself and don't contact the driver until you've sought legal advice. Do you have any sort of legal advice service through work or your home/car insurance, might be able to advise too

If you have any cuts and bruises, take photos before they heal. If you weren't injured, the solicitor can help you get your kit fixed. I wonder if the no win no fee injury big guys will want to take the case if no injuries beyond cuts and bruises but ask

Don't throw any of the damaged clothing away and take photos too

And write everything down as mentioned

Unfortunately, the process may be quite slow, although if the driver admits liability quickly and it's a relatively low amount to replace everything, it may be swifter. Get advice from the solicitor about replacing your bike (you'll need to get an LBS report stating its a write off)

Hope it all works out


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## buggi (14 Oct 2015)

If your injuries are not serious the police will do very little now I'm afraid. There is no point them breathalysing the driver as they will just say they had a drink after. As said, you need someone to fight your corner for compensation now so contact a solicitor. Slater and Gordon I believe are the place to go, they do work for a CTC members. In fact if you are CTC or British cycling member you will have free legal cover. 

Then put a complaint in to the police. It is bollox they couldn't find you. Talk to the CTC for advise anyway... They are compiling a dossier on lack of police action.


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## Mrs M (14 Oct 2015)

Any witnesses come forward?
Hope you get things sorted.
Best wishes for a speedy, full recovery.


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (14 Oct 2015)

It's not a lack of police action, it's a lack of resources. When there aren't enough resources to attend 999 calls the odds of turning up to slight injury RTC'S are slim. It doesn't make it right but it's not actually the Cops fault.


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

@JimboIchi, search for Accident Advice for the piece mentioned by @vickster.
Been in a similar posistion as regards the police, so some numbers not normally given out available.

Which cycle lane?

This is the piece mentioned above
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/accident-advice.151618/


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

You'll have a three way fight on your hands, the most important of which is that you get yourself right first. The other two take a back seat.
BRI will have you on record as being treated there, which will aid in proving what you claim. Helpful for one of the other battles, against the drivers insurance.

Get what you know down on paper and keep all receipts, even bus tickets. Which for the day in question will serve two purposes. The obvious one that money was spent by you. The less obvious being they'll back up what you said about being at A&E (there's only six/seven services that actually pass the BRI) and when you were there.


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## Globalti (14 Oct 2015)

Incontinentia Buttocks said:


> It's not a lack of police action, it's a lack of resources. When there aren't enough resources to attend 999 calls the odds of turning up to slight injury RTC'S are slim. It doesn't make it right but it's not actually the Cops fault.



Spot on. On a weekday night in east Lancashire there are 22 officers on duty. At start of the shift around half of those will go straight to relieve colleagues on some long-term job and can be considered out of action for the shift. If the general public actually knew how few Police there are on duty there would be a mass breakdown in law and order. Luckily the Police have technology like ANPR to help them create an impression of effectiveness, aided by numerous Police-Camera-Action TV shows in which the Bobbies get their man.


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## Justinslow (14 Oct 2015)

Sorry to hear about your crash, just out of interest what are your views of wearing your helmet as you say you were knocked out, not wanting to start a fire here, just genuinely interested?


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## MarkF (14 Oct 2015)

When did it happen and where? I don't believe the police saying that they "couldn't find you", there are only 19 cubicles, a computer system clearly showing your exact location and a fully functioning tannoy system, if that is their attitude, you'll need all the legal help you can get.


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## Spinney (14 Oct 2015)

Justinslow said:


> Sorry to hear about your crash, just out of interest what are your views of wearing your helmet as you say you were knocked out, not wanting to start a fire here, just genuinely interested?


*Moderator Message:*
This will be a distraction from the main point of the thread, which is helping the OP make a claim for his bike. This is not the place for _any_ discussion of helmet wearing.

Jimbolchi - if (and only if) you are interested in discussing whether or not you were wearing a helmet and/or whether or not it helped in your accident, you can reply to @Justinslow on this thread:
https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/the-cyclechat-helmet-debate-thread.187059/
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Jimbolchi - hope you get things sorted. There is some good advice above.


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## midlife (14 Oct 2015)

If you hit the rear of the car then almost all of the car must have driven across the cycle path?

Shaun


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## Justinslow (14 Oct 2015)

Spinney said:


> *Moderator Message:*
> This will be a distraction from the main point of the thread, which is helping the OP make a claim for his bike. This is not the place for _any_ discussion of helmet wearing.
> 
> Jimbolchi - if (and only if) you are interested in discussing whether or not you were wearing a helmet and/or whether or not it helped in your accident, you can reply to @Justinslow on this thread:
> ...



Ok fair point, I did say I didn't want to start a fire over it! But am still genuinely interested in hearing @JimboIchi's views. Thanks.


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

Justinslow said:


> Ok fair point, I did say I didn't want to start a fire over it! But am still genuinely interested in hearing @JimboIchi's views. Thanks.


Wether he was or wasn't isn't of any use after the fact. And until he gets better legal help, if I were him, knowing what I know now, I'd refuse to put the answer up here. Along with any questions about what he was wearing.

He currently has a three way fight on his hands. The most important of which is getting himself right, first and foremost. That includes getting himself back to riding in traffic again.


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## bikingdad90 (14 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> so I was passing all the cars on the inside. I was going slowly enough to check if any cars were indicating left, especially as I approached junctions, but as I passed the cars, another car which was part of the oncoming traffic turned right into their drive way which I didn't see until I hit the side rear of the car and then somersaulted completely over it



Sorry to play devils advocate and if I have misunderstood but if the car had indicated and begun to manoeuvre over one lane of traffic to turn into their drive and you came up the inside (passenger side) of the lane and hit the back of the car the argument from the drivers insurance is going to be along the lines of you were hidden from view and should of anticipated the danger so although you have a damaged bike you are actually at fault as you hit him? 

Regardless of blame, driving standards, filtering method etc I do hope you get your bike fixed and get better soon!


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## Milkfloat (14 Oct 2015)

chris harte said:


> Sorry to play devils advocate and if I have misunderstood but if the car had indicated and begun to manoeuvre over one lane of traffic to turn into their drive and you came up the inside (passenger side) of the lane and hit the back of the car the argument from the drivers insurance is going to be along the lines of you were hidden from view and should of anticipated the danger so although you have a damaged bike you are actually at fault as you hit him?
> 
> Regardless of blame, driving standards, filtering method etc I do hope you get your bike fixed and get better soon!



The insurance company can say what they like - but they would be very wrong and would lose. Would you or the insurance company say the same if the vehicle in question cut across a dual carriageway with filtering traffic? Why should it e different with a bicycle in a bicycle lane?


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## Banjo (14 Oct 2015)

Its the drivers responsibility to check all lanes are clear before turning right.
If its going to turn into a legal claim the OP is probably better not posting anything here just take the advice to seek a solicitor specializing in cycle stuff before doing anything else. 

Keep all receipts for buses taxis, parking etc.


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

@Banjo, It might be worth adding that part about what you say and where to the list.


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

@JimboIchi, hope you're not feeling too sore today. Keep an eye on your vision. Any noticible difference, get yourself seen again.


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## bikingdad90 (14 Oct 2015)

@User I agree with your comment and did not witness the collision however the point I was trying to make was that if the driver could not see the bicycle and rider as it was obscured or hidden from vision because he was filtering along the inside and proceeds because they believe it is clear and appears initially safe to proceed and then has a subsequent collision. The liability is a little bit less clear in my eyes as the manoeuvre went from perceived safe to unsafe and based on the description written by the OP it would hint to the car almost completing the turn and then the cyclist hitting the rear of the car (rather than the bonnet or front) as he/she saw the danger but failed to take action in time. The drivers insurance may argue that cyclist is in the wrong for cycling poorly up the inside. However I would say it is 100% driver fault if the OP had gone over the bonnet or hit the front of the car as the driver should of seen the danger and is a clear case of SMIDSY!

In essence what I am trying to see if how can a driver be at fault entirely for something which they cannot see or possibly know was there upon starting a turn which is different to looking and not acknowledging an 'object' which is clearly visible.

@Banjo is probably right, that the insurance may argue the toss on this one.


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## glasgowcyclist (14 Oct 2015)

chris harte said:


> @User I agree with your comment and did not witness the collision however the point I was trying to make was that if the driver could not see the bicycle and rider as it was obscured or hidden from vision because he was filtering along the inside and proceeds because they believe it is clear and appears initially safe to proceed and then has a subsequent collision. The liability is a little bit less clear in my eyes as the manoeuvre went from perceived safe to unsafe and based on the description written by the OP it would hint to the car almost completing the turn and then the cyclist hitting the rear of the car (rather than the bonnet or front) as he/she saw the danger but failed to take action in time. The drivers insurance may argue that cyclist is in the wrong for cycling poorly up the inside. However I would say it is 100% driver fault if the OP had gone over the bonnet or hit the front of the car as the driver should of seen the danger and is a clear case of SMIDSY!
> 
> In essence what I am trying to see if how can a driver be at fault entirely for something which they cannot see or possibly know was there upon starting a turn which is different to looking and not acknowledging an 'object' which is clearly visible.
> 
> @Banjo is probably right, that the insurance may argue the toss on this one.




If you're going to drive your car across other lanes of traffic, the onus is on you to ascertain the way is clear.

GC


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## Markymark (14 Oct 2015)

You are not poorly cycling up the inside if in a cycle lane but the if driver's view is obscured then the druver drove across a lane without knowing if it is ckear. The HC does nott say look if it's cklear but if you can't see, farkit just go anyway it'll be the other persons fault.


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## Andy_R (14 Oct 2015)

chris harte said:


> @User I agree with your comment and did not witness the collision however the point I was trying to make was that if the driver could not see the bicycle and rider as it was obscured or hidden from vision because he was filtering along the inside and proceeds because they believe it is clear and appears initially safe to proceed and then has a subsequent collision. The liability is a little bit less clear in my eyes as the manoeuvre went from perceived safe to unsafe and based on the description written by the OP it would hint to the car almost completing the turn and then the cyclist hitting the rear of the car (rather than the bonnet or front) as he/she saw the danger but failed to take action in time. The drivers insurance may argue that cyclist is in the wrong for cycling poorly up the inside. However I would say it is 100% driver fault if the OP had gone over the bonnet or hit the front of the car as the driver should of seen the danger and is a clear case of SMIDSY!
> 
> In essence what I am trying to see if how can a driver be at fault entirely for something which they cannot see or possibly know was there upon starting a turn which is different to looking and not acknowledging an 'object' which is clearly visible.
> 
> @Banjo is probably right, that the insurance may argue the toss on this one.


The OP wasn't filtering. He was using the ycle lane. The outside lane was stationary, the inside lane (cycle lane) wasn't. The driver, as has been previously said, failed to adequately check that the cycle lane was also clear of oncoming traffic before crossing it.


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## bikingdad90 (14 Oct 2015)

Opps. I missed the cycle lane bit as he didn't mention it in the post but in the title so missed it. I retract what I say as it is complete tosh!


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## vickster (14 Oct 2015)

chris harte said:


> Opps. I missed the cycle lane bit as he didn't mention it in the post but in the title so missed it. I retract what I say as it is complete tosh!


Best delete the posts then so as not to confuse or offend anyone


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## glasgowcyclist (14 Oct 2015)

vickster said:


> Best delete the posts then so as not to confuse or offend anyone



That would make the remaining posts look odd, best leave everything alone as he's made it clear where his error was.

GC


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## JimboIchi (14 Oct 2015)

Hi, some really good points being raised and I get there are 2 sides to the argument. I did hit the rear left hand side of the car but the speed at which she pulled into the driveway suggested she did not attempt to check the lane and I really had no chance of avoidance. I saw her coming in so I would probably have hit the front passenger side door had I not swerved to the right at the last minute The cycle lane is clearly marked and it was still day light so I think if she had looked left before pulling completely in she could have seen me easily. She took advantage of a gap being left by another car and whipped in, probably whilst thanking the other driver and not looking down the lane. 
I've taken the suggestion of seeking legal advice so if they take my case then I'll get a better idea of liability. At the end of the day I just want to buy a new bike. I commute everyday and go on social rides twice a week so feel a bit lost without it. 
Thanks again for all the advise.


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## JimboIchi (14 Oct 2015)

YellowTim said:


> The highlighted bit doesn't sound right to me. You have been to A&E, so I'm assuming you have been injured. I'm pretty sure the police should be taking more interest when it is clear an injury has occurred. Surely when a collision occurs, the driver should be breathalysed, did that happen?
> 
> With respect to the circumstances, if the cycle lane was marked, the turning vehicle maybe ought to have expected non-stationary traffic on the other side of the queue. Was it a cycle lane, or a bus lane too? Do you have a google street view link? Was it one of those ghastly cycle lanes with give way markings for cyclists at side roads?
> 
> Others will be along soon with more experience and help. Get well soon!


The ambulance were on a radio to the police and because there felt my injuries were minor the police were happy to meet me later in A & E as they were too busy at the time of the accident to attend. When I called the police the following morning they told me the driver had been to the station to prove her license and insurance. What I think is funny is that they said they came to the A & E (i was there from roughly 6.30pm to 11.30pm) and couldn't find me.
No bus lane purely a cycle lane 

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place...1!3m1!1s0x487be3d2753c90a5:0x29090010a2a5d6f6


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## Smurfy (14 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> The ambulance were on a radio to the police and because there felt my injuries were minor the police were happy to meet me later in A & E as they were too busy at the time of the accident to attend. When I called the police the following morning they told me the driver had been to the station to prove her license and insurance. What I think is funny is that they said they came to the A & E (i was there from roughly 6.30pm to 11.30pm) and couldn't find me.
> No bus lane purely a cycle lane
> 
> https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place...1!3m1!1s0x487be3d2753c90a5:0x29090010a2a5d6f6


I'm not a legal expert, but my feeling is that the driver should have been more careful in crossing a line that indicated another separate lane of traffic was present. And if that is where they live then they should be well aware that there is a cycle lane outside their front door.


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## MarkF (14 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> The ambulance were on a radio to the police and because there felt my injuries were minor the police were happy to meet me later in A & E as they were too busy at the time of the accident to attend. When I called the police the following morning they told me the driver had been to the station to prove her license and insurance. What I think is funny is that they said they came to the A & E (i was there from roughly 6.30pm to 11.30pm) and couldn't find me.
> No bus lane purely a cycle lane
> 
> https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place...1!3m1!1s0x487be3d2753c90a5:0x29090010a2a5d6f6



They are bullshitting regarding A&E, you enter the system as soon as you are accepted in and are then *always *easily located in the hospital, never mind A&E.

I know that very road very well, it's reasonably steep so I am surprised that you didn't see the potential for an accident? But the driver should have had a good view too, it's an uncluttered wide road and you would have been visible above the cars. Yellow Tim makes a very good point, she knows that the lane is there and has not taken care to ensure that is was safe to cross it.


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## HLaB (14 Oct 2015)

A couple of years ago I arrived in London too early for a party and went for a cycle round the block. Big mistske! When I approached one junction it was jammed solid so I slowly filtered through and made the mistake of finding my self on the left. Saw a supermarket entrance coming up on my left as I approached a gap, so I slowed to a crawl in anticipation of someone being a muppet and doing what I think the OP is describing. Good job I did as someone was a muppet! I'd been in the gap for about 2-3secs when someone cut through the traffic to turn right into the supermarket and took my bike's front wheel out.
I didn't push things through but put it in the hands of the British Cycling solicitors and circa 16months later the driver's insurance paid out. Apart from a golf ball sized bruise on my shoulder after a bit of bonnet surfing luckily there was no serious injury. Injury seems to be the main issue, over a year after the collision I was sent for a medical, after it was carried out things were sorted in days!


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## PK99 (14 Oct 2015)

MarkF said:


> T*hey are bullshitting regarding A&E, you enter the system as soon as you are accepted in and are then always easily located in the hospital, never mind A&E.*
> .



Not so. My wife was "lost from the system" and left on a trolley for several hours with a fractured pelvis @St George's Tooting as Nurses repeatedly tried and failed to find her.


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## classic33 (14 Oct 2015)

PK99 said:


> Not so. My wife was "lost from the system" and left on a trolley for several hours with a fractured pelvis @St George's Tooting as Nurses repeatedly tried and failed to find her.


I think he means the A&E at BRI. I've been in more times than I want to. That's how I know the numbers of bus services passing the A&E.


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## The_Weekend_Report_Guy (14 Oct 2015)

Man..!! This brings a lot of bad memories..! Same situation last year for me.. About a year from it now... You are lucky I had surgery, 3 months in bed.. 5 without much activity.. 

My advice? get a lawyer.. Insurance companies will eat you alive and somehow make you responsible for getting hit. 

Best of luck to you..! 

My story? Look for the one called a year after on my blog..


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## The_Weekend_Report_Guy (15 Oct 2015)

HLaB said:


> A couple of years ago I arrived in London too early for a party and went for a cycle round the block. Big mistske! When I approached one junction it was jammed solid so I slowly filtered through and made the mistake of finding my self on the left. Saw a supermarket entrance coming up on my left as I approached a gap, so I slowed to a crawl in anticipation of someone being a muppet and doing what I think the OP is describing. Good job I did as someone was a muppet! I'd been in the gap for about 2-3secs when someone cut through the traffic to turn right into the supermarket and took my bike's front wheel out.
> I didn't push things through but put it in the hands of the British Cycling solicitors and circa 16months later the driver's insurance paid out. Apart from a golf ball sized bruise on my shoulder after a bit of bonnet surfing luckily there was no serious injury. Injury seems to be the main issue, over a year after the collision I was sent for a medical, after it was carried out things were sorted in days!



A year after my accident I am still waiting.. My lawyer says don't expect nothing before June 2016... On the bright side since they already accept that the insurance part is guilty and responsible they gave me a one time advance payment and a check for the bike repairs.. Oh this is going to be deducted from the final payment.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

I'll be two years in February. I've got to see the expert in December for a third time. Hopefully, that will report will say the leg is as recovered as it's going to be and we can make a settlement offer. Whether it'll be accepted or not is a different matter! 
However, I have a shoulder injury now which may be a result of the accident so if the expert feels it is, lord knows as I might need surgery at some point next year!

I haven't had anything yet, including loss of earnings etc. not that I've chased it. The bike was undamaged

OP, hope you get settled quickly, it can be rapid if the other party accept liability without quibble and there are no lasting injuries


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## MichaelW2 (15 Oct 2015)

It is standard practice for drivers and their insurance companies to deny that anything ever took place. You need some evidence, such as a police report, ambulencemen report or witness statement, identifying the car and driver.
Photo evidence is useful, esp taken at the time, or even later on to show similar road conditions, right of way, visibility, signage.
When claiming ensure that you claim for all damaged accessories as well as the bike eg helmet, gloves, bag, lights, clothing. If you have made any bike upgrades, even premium tyres, make sure that the replacement bike on insurance has them.


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## shouldbeinbed (15 Oct 2015)

I would suspect that the driver that left the gap flashed or waved the oncoming vehicle in without considering the cycle lane at all - I've seen it happen and been flashed to turn right myself and indicated to the driver flashing me the cyclist coming up on their inside. I know the Institute of Advanced Motorists and all proper advice, codes etc do not advocate 'you' flashing or indicating someone as it is enticing them to make a manoeuvre that is not yours to entice - because things like this happen. People have got into the dangerous mindset that 'oh s/he's flashed me, I'll put the car in gear, brain in neutral and on I go. Oh crud theres a cyclist - pedestrian - mother and pram that I've just run over, but its not my fault because that car 50 yards up the road and still driving away gave me permission to go so what else was I supposed to do'

*rant over* but it is why I filter up the right of stationary traffic when there is sufficient room to do so safely, cycle lane on the left or not.

as a matter of interest @JimboIchi does the cycle lane just have the solid painted lines carrying on regardless or is there a give way instruction either in the lane that you could (should?) have observer or from the road that the vehicle crossed inappropriately? I imagine not for a residential driveway & I'm not casting aspersions, just wondering how it could play out as it goes further.

Best of luck getting restitution and your bike fixed, don't let it drop and keep a diary of aches & pains and any differences you begin to feel in yourself, get to the GP at the first hint of a niggle, not only for a paper trail for litigation/appropriate compensation but for your own long term good, which is a hell of a lot more important and valuable to you.
I was left hooked half way across a junction in a cycle lane by a car that approached from behind on a perfectly clear road, they seem to have decided there was room to get round me rather than wait the nanoseconds for me to clear their turn path - never got a thing out of it but a perma-kaput knee (several operations later and now waiting to be old enough to have it replaced), as they went through the back of me, carried on at speed and were way out of sight before I'd even thought about trying to sit up.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

There was never any denial from the driver in my case. Liability was accepted very quickly. It's the nature of injury and recovery that is taking so long. Plus the long wait for expert appointments and reports!

All of the emergency services behaved impeccably. Most of my treatment has been covered by my private insurance and costs incurred by the provider are a not insignificant part of the claim


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## mick1836 (15 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> Hi, I'm new to site and was hoping to see if anyone has had this happen and what I can do about it. I was riding down a cycle lane in Bradford and the traffic was slow to stationary, so I was passing all the cars on the inside. I was going slowly enough to check if any cars were indicating left, especially as I approached junctions, but as I passed the cars, another car which was part of the oncoming traffic turned right into their drive way which I didn't see until I hit the side rear of the car and then somersaulted completely over it. I was out for about 20 seconds and an ambulance was passing so was lucky to be helped so quickly. I was too dazed to speak to the person driving the vehicle but the ambulance took their details for me. My bike is a complete write off, along with my helmet, trousers and left shoe. Then I was taken off to A & E where they gave me the all clear.
> 
> I've never been involved in this type of accident, so is it a simple thing of calling the drivers insurance company and claiming, or should I be taking any other action. The police didn't arrive at the scene and claimed they couldn't find me in A & E so have just spoke with them on the phone. They gave me an incident number and said that I should just speak with the driver but am concerned that I may blow a fuse as they nearly killed me. Any advice would be very much appreciated. Thanks for reading.



If YOU didn't see the car until you hit it what chance had the car driver on seeing you?

Yes, the car driver should have been more vigilant but cyclists should ride more defensively and in my opinion wear lighter coloured clothing to be seen more easily, YES the driver of a motor vehicle may be at fault but that won't help you if you are


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## CopperCyclist (15 Oct 2015)

Keeping my points short:

1. You could have avoided the collision... Watch for those gaps forming which always entice cars across and have your speed ready to slow...

2. However, the dual carriageway analogy is correct, it's still the drivers ultimate responsibility and you will most likely win at court...

3. Which is why you shouldn't contact the driver directly - contact a solicitor.

4. Police are unlikely to attend minor injury RTCs. They've been cut to ribbons - sorry, that's the way it is - there simply isn't enough 'bums on seats' anymore. ALL of us would like to do more - we can't. Unless the funding situation is turned around, it's not going to happen. Look on the bright side, when the government get their way and stay privatising it, you may get a dedicated G4S employee investigating. 

5. 90 percent of the time I attend A&E and ask to see "the person brought in for (this incident)" we are shown straight through - but occasionally I have got "I can't disclose any details about whether we have anyone of that name or not. No I'm afraid I can't check to see if anyone of that name wishes to see you - next please!". 

Hope you get well soon and get it all sorted through the victims insurance without too much fuss. 

PS Should you discovery a more serious lasting injury, or a lack of insurance from the driver, that's the point to recontact police. I can only repeat, asking for anything else in this climate is like asking the NHS if one of their doctors can spare an hour to give you a back massage for a pulled muscle. Would it help - certainly. Would the doctor do it if they had the time? Probably. Are they ever going to have that spare hour - no chance.


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## bozmandb9 (15 Oct 2015)

Love this forum! Recovering from injury and told by fellow cyclists effectively, it's your fault, be more careful!

Of course we all know we have to ride defensively, and expect some motorists to do stupid things. Doesn't really help to have it rubbed in when we get knocked off anyway.

As for 'if you can't see him how can he see you'... well I despair. Let's all just give motorists a medal for knocking us off. Obviously it will always be our fault!

Anyway, you've had good advice. Put the matter into the hands of a competent specialist solicitor, look after yourself, get well soon!


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## shouldbeinbed (15 Oct 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> Love this forum! Recovering from injury and told by fellow cyclists effectively, it's your fault, be more careful!
> 
> Of course we all know we have to ride defensively, and expect some motorists to do stupid things. Doesn't really help to have it rubbed in when we get knocked off anyway.
> 
> ...


wuh?


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## Origamist (15 Oct 2015)

mick1836 said:


> If YOU didn't see the car until you hit it what chance had the car driver on seeing you?
> 
> Yes, the car driver should have been more vigilant but cyclists should ride more defensively and in my opinion wear lighter coloured clothing to be seen more easily, YES the driver of a motor vehicle may be at fault but that won't help you if you are



Spare us the cyclist death fantasies and by all means upload film of your impeccable defensive riding. There are dozens on this forum happy to offer "advice" as to how you could improve YOUR cycle craft.

OP, hope you fully recover and good luck seeking redress.


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## Sara_H (15 Oct 2015)

vickster said:


> There was never any denial from the driver in my case. Liability was accepted very quickly. It's the nature of injury and recovery that is taking so long. Plus the long wait for expert appointments and reports!
> 
> All of the emergency services behaved impeccably. Most of my treatment has been covered by my private insurance and costs incurred by the provider are a not insignificant part of the claim



The driver in my case pleaded guilty in the criminal case but the insurance company are still playing silly buggers. 
It took them a full year to pay an interim payment for part of the bike repair cost (they haven't paid the full repair cost) and they are challenging absolutely everything even down to bus fares in the time I was too injured to ride. 
Now 15 months on, solicitor says it may take years.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

It's my injury ultimately that's holding up the process...no settlement has yet been discussed with the other side. It seems to take weeks if not months for the experts being paid hundreds to produce a report to actually do so...and I've got to wait over two months for an appointment, so I expect it'll be at least February before the report is prepared!


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## glenn forger (15 Oct 2015)

Aviva still haven't paid an interim payment to the poor rider who lost a leg to the skip lorry driver at Victoria.


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

Sara_H said:


> The driver in my case pleaded guilty in the criminal case but the insurance company are still playing silly buggers.
> It took them a full year to pay an interim payment for part of the bike repair cost (they haven't paid the full repair cost) and they are challenging absolutely everything even down to bus fares in the time I was too injured to ride.
> Now 15 months on, solicitor says it may take years.


The longer you wait, the less you'll settle for is the hope.


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## MarkF (15 Oct 2015)

mick1836 said:


> If YOU didn't see the car until you hit it what chance had the car driver on seeing you?



I know this road like the back of my hand and a struggle to see how both the cyclist and driver didn't see each other. The OP would have been able to see the car clearly for many 100's of metres before the collision, he is going downhill and the view is clear and uncluttered, alarm bells should have rung as soon as the car moved centrally. The car driver is to blame but it's better to debate the incident rather than just leaving it at that. I'd like to think that this would have ended with me just shaking my head if it had been me.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

classic33 said:


> The longer you wait, the less you'll settle for is the hope.


The solicitor has valued the claim and given me a range based on the earth report from March and on the assumption that I am recovered and pain free, which I'm not. Hence another trip to the expert, for him to say I am always likely to have some residual pain (as well as residual scar, numbness and skin discolouration which has already been reported). The tear in my shoulder of course complicates things further potentially if it felt to be a result of the accident! If we'd settled last year, this wouldn't have come to light!


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

Never easy is it?


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

classic33 said:


> Never easy is it?


It's just a bit tedious and I'd like it settled at some point not too far in the future. I just hope the other party are agreeable when we finally put a number to them!


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

First two offers made to me were for £70 and then £90. It was only a bike. Receipt from the shop for recent drivetrain renewal surprised them. Done just the month before.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

We are talking slightly higher numbers with me...I didnt get paid for 8 days for starters...


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

Still have mine on computer and got this piece from an explantion, that had to be sent, as the two stories differed
_
"If as said, I stopped on the road to let a bus approaching from behind pass me & then allowing him to leave Hebble Lane then I have no hesitation in saying he's lying. To stop with any vehicle behind purely to let it pass whilst riding a bicycle would be dangerous during the day. At night, with a bus approaching from behind simply stopping to allow it to make a L.H. turn across me, borders on the suicidal, I feel."
_
How many would stop at a junction to let a vehicle pass, when you know which direction the type of vehicle will be taking? Not what was done but what was said I'd done.


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

vickster said:


> We are talking slightly higher numbers with me...I didnt get paid for 8 days for starters...


Got more than that in the end. Solicitor dealing with it was the one who said it's only a bike. That's when I got one who dealt with cycling related cases to take over the case.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

I'm using LeighDay through British Cycling. As yet, they've not had to do any negotiation so I do t know how it'll play out of course. I'm dealing with a paralegal, she's fine although I assume if things get sticky her solicitor boss will get involved as required

I guess a damaged bike is easier to value than a damaged body


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

User said:


> Actually, it's the exact opposite. They tend to make early offers in the hope you'll settle for less.


So a first offer of £70 is high then?

That's having denied it ever happened in the first place.


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

User said:


> Try reading what I posted...


I did do, and replied with the first early offer made to me.


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## Pumpkin the robot (15 Oct 2015)

My case is about 15 months old now. I was off work for 51 weeks and have been on a phased return for the last 3 months and I am nearly back to working a 40 hour week, although nowhere near as quickly as I thought it would take to get to that point.
Getting interim payments was like getting blood from a stone. While I was off work I got 5 payments totalling 20k that will be deducted from the total payout at the end. The finacial worry has been one of the hardest parts of the whole process. Not knowing when the next payment would arrive or how much it would be (the payments varied from 2k to 6k) was a nightmare as I am the only earner in our household. Luckily I do not have a mortgage or loans to pay or it would have been even worse! I hate to imagine how people survive in that situation when there is no money coming in.
The injury is not healing as well as I or the physio and that will only drag the case out. At least now I have an income coming in that I can live on and keep our heads above water, but I do not expect the case to be settled for a year or two yet and still have no idea what sort of value the final payment will be.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

Yes, which was low in the hope you'd accept and settle quickly. That's what I understood from @User


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

User said:


> You've got it - but classic33 seems to have a problem with basic comprehension.


So £90 is high then? Final offer


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## classic33 (15 Oct 2015)

User said:


> It's higher than £70 - or is basic maths an issue for you too?


So you'd be happy with less than 5% of the cost of damage caused. Basic maths requiring a yes or no answer.


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

No offer has been made to me beyond the original £1000 after about a month which was less than my loss of earnings

@Martin Archer my understanding is that lost salary is separate to any payment for personal injury so unless the amount received exceeds your loss of earnings and expenses, the final settlement for the actual injury will be paid on top. So the 20k won't be deducted per se, it just won't be included in the figure paid. There are bands for certain injuries based on historical payouts etc as I understand it, your solicitor should be able to give you an approximate ballpark of what they will propose as a settlement. What you will end up with depends on the other party and what you'll accept

Just found this again, gives a vague indication of the ranges of PI payouts

http://www.bottonline.co.uk/guides/how-much-compensation-claim-for-bicycle-accident#TABLE


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

User said:


> You've got it - but classic33 seems to have a problem with basic comprehension.
> 
> In personal injury cases you should avoid settling early as you only get one bite of the cherry (except in very specific circumstances where a court may allow a second claim). Insurers make a low, early offer in the hope you'll grab it rather than fight them. For example, in my case, they made offers in the first couple of years ranging from £1,000 to £7,000 ... before settling on the courtroom doorstep for over £25,000 after three and a half years.


What injury did you suffer?


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## vickster (15 Oct 2015)

Ouch! You were right to hang on


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## Pumpkin the robot (15 Oct 2015)

I am still quite a bit short on the wages front. They calculated what I received in wages 3 months prior to the accident and averaged it out for a week. As I am still not doing a full week or any overtime, the total is rising every week. The payments have not specifically been for wages, they have just said it is to be deducted from the final settlement.
At the moment, although I am working, it is hard. I am in pain for about 80% of the day. Its the same when I cycle, I can do the 100mile rides now, but I am in pain for most of it,where as before the accident I was happy to 200 mile rides without any problems.
I will not continue with the physical job I do at the moment for the next 25 years if I am going to be in pain and will have to look for an alternative occupation.


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## PK99 (16 Oct 2015)

> @Martin Archer my understanding is that lost salary is separate to any payment for personal injury so unless the amount received exceeds your loss of earnings and expenses, the final settlement for the actual injury will be paid on top. So the 20k won't be deducted per se, it just won't be included in the figure paid. There are bands for certain injuries based on historical payouts etc as I understand it, your solicitor should be able to give you an approximate ballpark of what they will propose as a settlement. What you will end up with depends on the other party and what you'll accept
> 
> Just found this again, gives a vague indication of the ranges of PI payouts
> 
> http://www.bottonline.co.uk/guides/how-much-compensation-claim-for-bicycle-accident#TABLE



the numbers in there accord pretty well with the payment i got following smidsy a few years ago - total 10k-ish for soft tissue back and knee injuries - recovery within a few months


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## Milkfloat (16 Oct 2015)

Sara_H said:


> The driver in my case pleaded guilty in the criminal case but the insurance company are still playing silly buggers.
> It took them a full year to pay an interim payment for part of the bike repair cost (they haven't paid the full repair cost) and they are challenging absolutely everything even down to bus fares in the time I was too injured to ride.
> Now 15 months on, solicitor says it may take years.



Every time they challenge anything simply add more costs on for your time, tell them you will do this as will you solicitor.


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## TheJDog (16 Oct 2015)

User said:


> Severe fracture of the right clavicle, dislocated right AC joint, dislocated right shoulder, fracture of C7 vertebra, crushed brachial plexus on the left and torn brachial plexus on the right.
> 
> Left with reduced range of motion in neck and right shoulder. Half the right clavicle had to be removed as it had shattered, and my right shoulder blade is permanently out of alignment. I have nerve damage in both arms, with permanent loss of sensation in two fingers on the left hand and pins and needles in the right. I've also got a permanent loss/reduction of sensation in part of my chest and issues with axillary nerves and sweat glands. I also have problems with fine motor coordination in my right hand.
> 
> ...



£25k is small beer for all that. I got £12k 20 years ago for having a part of my ear bitten off. Maybe criminal compensation cases are slightly different...


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## adamhearn (17 Oct 2015)

JimboIchi said:


> Hi, some really good points being raised and I get there are 2 sides to the argument. I did hit the rear left hand side of the car but the speed at which she pulled into the driveway suggested she did not attempt to check the lane and I really had no chance of avoidance.


In my opinion you were partially to blame. Given when the impact was the vehicle was in the lane prior to arriving so either you were not paying attention and potentially too fast. I'm sure that's not what you wanted to hear but that's how I read the situation and if it were two vehicles I'd expect a 50/50 claim.


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## Pumpkin the robot (17 Oct 2015)

If someone pulls across your lane, it is not a 50/50 claim, even if you are head down, it is the persons who is pulling across to ascertain if the road is clear, not just blindly go and hope anyone coming up the road stops for you.


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## Origamist (17 Oct 2015)

adamhearn said:


> In my opinion you were partially to blame. Given when the impact was the vehicle was in the lane prior to arriving so either you were not paying attention and potentially too fast. I'm sure that's not what you wanted to hear but that's how I read the situation and if it were two vehicles I'd expect a 50/50 claim.



Wrong. Next.


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