# FNRttC - new London startpoint?



## dellzeqq (15 May 2012)

I'm open to suggestions. I'm not convinced of the need for a change, but I think we should consider it.

Here's the brief
- near to rail termini. Victoria is by far the most popular. Anywhere within the circle line is up for consideration, but bear in mind that all the London rides go south, southwest or east
- a bit of shelter from the rain - HPC scores on this
- 24 hour toilets in the offing
- decently lit
- safe - by which I mean safe for one or two people to hang around, and safe to get to and away from
- mega. As in people roll up and say 'wow'

So far I've come up with
- Smithfield
- underneath the railway bridge outside the NFT (the critical mass startpoint)
- More London

feel free to say that you want to keep it at Hyde Park Corner


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## GrumpyGregry (15 May 2012)

I do this ride that starts from a coffee stall at Victoria Station, sets off, jumps a red light, does some pavement cycling, and then hangs about "underneaf de arch-hez" for ages while some old geezer talks bollards and socialism, and gets tec'd off with some people on the ride who then have to ride at the back.

I like it that way.


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## srw (15 May 2012)

More London's a private enclave, isn't it? That would give the same issues as Paternoster Square, or anywhere close to St Paul's - which otherwise would be good.

How about St Mary Axe, between Lloyds and the Aviva tower. It's notionally private, but of an older vintage and less likely to be beset by security guards.

I don't mind HPC, but the lighting's not ideal - especially since they switch the floodlights off about 10 to midnight.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

Hyde Park? Sloane Square - been done before? Marble Arch - for archy tecs like Greg? Euston Station? We don't need lighting for a night ride.
Ah - St Pauls! "Occufri"


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## dellzeqq (15 May 2012)

we used to go through More London (doing a turn and a half around City Hall) without any problems - but I suppose there's always the risk

hhmmm....St Mary's Axe sounds good.


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## arallsopp (15 May 2012)

St Mary Axe is good, but the temptation to treat the footings of the Gherkin as a velodrome is way too strong for me to refuse whenever I pass.


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## ianmac62 (15 May 2012)

For what it's worth - and I realise I am a very recent joiner to these rides - I like HPC because everyone in the universe knows where it is / has heard of it - and so, when dining out on tales of midnight bike riding, starting with "I meet some friends at midnight at Hyde Park Corner ... " just sets the right tone.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

I forgot to add that More London is less fun. Those rills, or whatever fanciful name they are, will only lead to tears and a few wet ar$es, handlebars, saddles etc. I bet.


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## deptfordmarmoset (15 May 2012)

ianmac62 said:


> For what it's worth - and I realise I am a very recent joiner to these rides - I like HPC because everyone in the universe knows where it is / has heard of it - and so, when dining out on tales of midnight bike riding, starting with "I meet some friends at midnight at Hyde Park Corner ... " just sets the right tone.


 
Well, it managed to confuse AnythingButVanilla and me, who arrived early and thought that Hyde Park Corner was the corner of Hyde Park. Meanwhile everybody rolled up to the arch out of sight!


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## theclaud (15 May 2012)

If it ain't broke...

A plea for HPC from this end. As in the west, and from those of us coming from afar. It's very handy to have somewhere that's a stone's throw from Paddington, and HPC is easy to find for newbies from either Paddington or Victoria. The only downside is the lights going out and the lack of khazis. But then the toilets at More London are grim anyway. I treat Victoria (or a beer with User482 at the Mad Bishop & Bear) as the social and practical preamble, and HPC as the "official" start. It looks the biz.


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## ianmac62 (15 May 2012)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> Well, it managed to confuse AnythingButVanilla and me, who arrived early and thought that Hyde Park Corner was the corner of Hyde Park. Meanwhile everybody rolled up to the arch out of sight!


 
Ah, I was careful to say "everyone ... knows where it is / has heard of it".

I would add that the first time I turned up, I'd made a total mess-up with calculating the train times into Euston and arrived at HPC at ten o'clock. Felt a perfectly safe place for the next hour-and-a-half. Entertaining too with pedestrians, in-line skaters, etc.


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## User10571 (15 May 2012)

Mar Blarch?

Horse Guards Parade - albeit that's a bit gravelly.


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## Davywalnuts (15 May 2012)

I think, the biggest question would be, how late or on time will I be on these rides with more of London to navigate through on a Friday night...

When I say I, I do mean both of my thighs, both say HPC is good still. Toilets, well Hyde Park is there... Lights, we all have them and its all very public and safe in my mind.


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## Wobblers (15 May 2012)

theclaud said:


> If it ain't broke...
> 
> A plea for HPC from this end. As in the west, and from those of us coming from afar. It's very handy to have somewhere that's a stone's throw from Paddington, and HPC is easy to find for newbies from either Paddington or Victoria. The only downside is the lights going out and the lack of khazis. But then the toilets at More London are grim anyway. I treat Victoria (or a beer with User482 at the Mad Bishop & Bear) as the social and practical preamble, and HPC as the "official" start. It looks the biz.


 
Wot she said.

It's easy to get to from most of the terminus stations. That said, I've still managed to get lost once or twice getting there! I shudder to think what would happen were it somewhere else...

As for poor lighting, well, the FNRttC isn't exactly short on lumens. TimO or myself would be more than happy to throw some illumination onto the subject!


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

Davywalnuts said:


> I think, the biggest question would be, how late or on time will I be on these rides with more of London to navigate through on a Friday night...
> 
> When I say I, I do mean both of my thighs, both say HPC is good still. Toilets, well Hyde Park is there... Lights, we all have them and its all very public and safe in my mind.


Now you're talking about the 'Royal wee' Davy. What about the bit just beyond the BBC at Aldwych - by the Church there? Marble Arch, as User10571 mentions, obviously has some problem deep in the zeqq psyche...because there is loads of gathering space around there. A promenade through the three thousand sets of traffic lights along Oxford St could be in order (if the digging is finished) or, Park Lane has a big bus lane, in order to get everyone rolling.


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## srw (15 May 2012)

Underneath the horse's head



Horse sculpture at Marble Arch, London by zoer, on Flickr
(Utterly horrible - a fine match for the rest of the "art" around Hyde Park. A one-trick sculptor - he had a show at an opera festival in Sussex a couple of years ago)

Speaker's corner? Appropriate for a bunch of argumentative so-and-sos.


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## thom (15 May 2012)

Innovate or die !

Well maybe not. There's much to say for HPC but for the rides going east, another possibility close to More London is the Jubilee Market at Borough Market. It is completely covered:





(stalls do get removed overnight I'm pretty sure). There are market toilets (although would need to check not locked). It is right beside London Bridge Train station, there are several great pubs (for those who require assistance), it sits beside the splendid Southwark Cathedral (and the Shard) and for the Southend ride you'd get to go over Tower Bridge at the start !

Perhaps another location is worth an experimentation for one of the smaller, longer and faster rides if going east. I can remember rides taking about an hour to get to London bridge with punctures and traffic diversions. It would help give more time for cycling outside built up areas.


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## PaulRide (15 May 2012)

I think HPS is as close to ideal as you'll get, even though it's slightly inconvenient for those of use travelling up from the SE. Horseguards could be tricky - one LFGSS rider was apprehended by a baffled constable when he placed his bike upside down on the gravel, retreated to a suitable distance and took a photo of his bike for the brilliant Bicycle Tag of Bike game.




SUSPECT SEEN ACTING
SUSPICIOUSLY ON HORSE GUARDS PARADE
SUSPECT WAS SEEN TO DUMP A PUSH
CYCLE AND WALK OFF AND APPEARED TO
BE STANDING AND CROUCHING BEHIND THE BOLLARD
NO OFFENSES DISCLOSED, NO TRACE, ONE
SATISFACTORY STOP


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## PaulRide (15 May 2012)

By which I do, of course, mean HPC.


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## dellzeqq (15 May 2012)

nobody's passed comment on my NFT suggestion. Shelter, toilets, lighting, safe start, nice view, nearer to Kings Cross, and, given that you don't need a pre-meeting point, not that much further from Paddington or Marylebone.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

srw said:


> Underneath the horse's head
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I like that horsey! And the Bubble family, which was Davy's first modelling gig.
How about meeting at The Globe Theatre - surely a landmark steeped in heritage. "Wanna make a ride to the Coast? Join in here..." that sort of thing.


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## Sittingduck (15 May 2012)

Although I only do 4 or 5 of these a year, I'd like to pitch in and say that HPC for me has to be the one! As TC mentioned - if it ain't broke...


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> nobody's passed comment on my NFT suggestion. Shelter, toilets, lighting, safe start, nice view, nearer to Kings Cross, and, given that you don't need a pre-meeting point, not that much further from Paddington or Marylebone.


Why are toilets important when folk are busy pissing all over Clapham Common within the first tranche of a ride down South? And lo! It's dark in the park.
(I'm hopeless at the niceties of life...)


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## rb58 (15 May 2012)

As Thom says, Borough Market might be good. Although it's very lively round that way on a Friday Night, which could be good and bad..... Me, I like HPC. It has gravitas.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

rb58 said:


> As Thom says, Borough Market might be good. Although it's very lively round that way on a Friday Night, which could be good and bad..... Me, I like HPC. It has gravitas.


Take no notice of Thom - he's just 'grooming' as he lives about a brake block away from the proposed start point at Borough. (Unless he's volunteering 'all round his' for pre-ride refreshments, of course!)


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## StuartG (15 May 2012)

Nice thing about HPC is we only get disturbed by a few errant late _cyclistas_ on their way home who sensibly show no interest in the gathering horde.

Whereas on the South Bank we would be amongst _people _even _tourists_ which would inevitably mean having to react with _live human beings_. Some of us are not ready for that. Stick to our own, stick with HPC. Toilets are for wimps.


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## dellzeqq (15 May 2012)

toilets are good. Let me tell you.

I'm struck by Thom's point regarding the rides to the east. Whitstable would be cleverererer from the South Bank (I'm not too persuaded by Borough Market because it's mostly locked down at night)


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## Wobblers (15 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> nobody's passed comment on my NFT suggestion. Shelter, toilets, lighting, safe start, nice view, nearer to Kings Cross, and, given that you don't need a pre-meeting point, not that much further from Paddington or Marylebone.


 
For the benefit of us provincial types, just what is a NFT?

And does it bite?


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## dellzeqq (15 May 2012)

sorry - National Film Theatre


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## deptfordmarmoset (15 May 2012)

I like the idea of using the South Bank but then I'm biased - it's closer for me and I don't really feel at home in those westermostly bits of London.


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## hatler (15 May 2012)

I like HPC. It has both grandeur and just a slight tinge of eccentricity about it. And it's where No 1 London is, so if we're riding from London to the coast we can only make that claim if we start from there.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

hatler said:


> I like HPC. It has both grandeur and just a slight tinge of eccentricity about it. And it's where No 1 London is, so if we're riding from London to the coast we can only make that claim if we start from there.


Sound reasoning, Rob. None of this etheral, airy-fairy stuff that is knocking about. No:1 London. It has the "Je ne sais ou" about it.


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## GrumpyGregry (15 May 2012)

hatler said:


> I like HPC. It has both grandeur and just a slight tinge of eccentricity about it. And it's where No 1 London is, so if we're riding from London to the coast we can only make that claim if we start from there.


The No. 1 London argument does it for me.

Though we could hack a lot of folk off by starting at Charing? Don't be cross, from whence all is measured or by gathering outside the Downing Street gates (tee hee) The embarrassing safety talk would go down a storm there.


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## clarion (15 May 2012)

The only setting which has the proper grandeur for a ride led by dellzeqq is York Minster.

If we could either remove it to That London, or do all the FNRs to say, Hull, Hornsea, Bridlington, Scarborough, Whitby, Robin Hood's Bay, Redcar etc (and a cheeky cross-Pennine dash to Morecambe  ), we'd have the answer!


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## ChrisBailey (15 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> nobody's passed comment on my NFT suggestion. Shelter, toilets, lighting, safe start, nice view, nearer to Kings Cross, and, given that you don't need a pre-meeting point, not that much further from Paddington or Marylebone.


 
As somebody who comes into Waterloo, the NFT would be perfect, but I have been no issues with HPC.


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## GrumpyGregry (15 May 2012)

GregCollins said:


> from whence


 


User13710 said:


>


oh dear. oh dear me. oh dear me no. 

*hangs head in same*

I blame the Merlot the lovely Helen gave me.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> That's what we in the grammar police always say, 'Cherchez le vin et la femme.'


Well, it is a good 'spot', Jen. but curiosity killed the pleonasticat and, apparently, Greg has no need to blame it on Helen and 'her' (as if) wine.  Shakespeare, Smollet, Defoe, Defriends, Debacle etc - everyone was at it! Little Miss Muffet had a whey with words, or was that Kurds? I dunno - it has been a long day and it is time to finish. Wherever - it needs to be somewhere rainproof I reckon, as it is as black as Newgate' Knocker here in N.Lon.
Here.


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## martint235 (15 May 2012)

1849686 said:


> Provincial? You're Scottish.


Yeah whole different country. We'd never allow you to be a province. Our provinces have style and class! Just look at Lancashire 

On the topic. I like HPC but I could also see the NFT working, there's also an arch further down towards Waterloo where we might get in the way of fewer people but then you'd have to navigate the Waterloo roundabout to get east.


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## User10571 (15 May 2012)

GregCollins said:


> .....Though we could hack a lot of folk off by starting at Charing? Don't be cross, from whence all is measured .....


Popular misconwhatsit. Unless I'm mistaken road distances are measured from the statue of Charles I (which used to be located at the site of the Elanor Cross) on the south side of Trafalgar Sq # Whitehall.
As attested by Adrian upthread.


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## Wobblers (15 May 2012)

1849686 said:


> Provincial? You're Scottish.


 
Might I refer you to my signature line?

Anyway, I don't think anyone would want to claim Birmingham as the centre of the universe, far less the Black Country...


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## slowmotion (15 May 2012)

HPC is unbeatable as a venue. Kicking off into the swirling traffic adds a real sense of anticipation. I think it's quite magical.


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## ceepeebee (15 May 2012)

[QUOTE 1849887, member: 1314"]First choice, The Mirch Marsala in Tooting!

If we are north of the river I like the idea of Smithfield Market. Easy enough to get to from Paddington, Kings Cross, Euston (left and left again). And it's minutes from the Jerusalem (who have excellent toilets to go with their pork sandwiches).[/quote]
As much as the thought of pre-ride welsh rarebit from st John fills me with the deepest of joy, I have to say hpc gets my vote. It's kinda iconic now.


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## thom (15 May 2012)

There are parts around the Tower of London that offer spectacular starting points too but I think are low on loo options so no worse or better than HPC.
1) Tower Hilll Terrace on the West side of the Tower - slight downside is accessing the main road. There is a pedestrian crossing that can be used to stop the traffic safely though. But there is ample space, the Tower, the river etc. but worth checking because I can't be sure there is rain cover. Indeed, please note Legge's Mount (item 29) which I presume is where Simon keeps his Colnago when out of the country and is just accross the moat from said meeting point.
2) In front of the Guoman Tower Hotel, on the river, just east of Tower Bridge at the entrance to St Katherine's dock, views galore. Rain cover available under Tower Bridge and a couple of places around the Hotel. There's a cunning way to cross the Highway safely if going to Southend.
There are plenty of nearby wateringholes willing to take your money if you show up slightly early.


Yes I have a cheeeky vested interest in Borough, but it is characterful and there are 2 areas with plenty of space which definitely don't get locked up. My feeling is it's not too rowdy there really. Probably similar to anywhere on the southbank, like NFT, which is also good. There are public loos in the station if the market's do end up locked.

Like I said before, it might be interesting just to give an eastern location a go for one of the smaller speedy rides. I don't think you really know how things pan out until you try.

For a map of London loos, look no further... :
http://www.toiletmap.co.uk/


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## thom (15 May 2012)

martint235 said:


> Yeah whole different country. We'd never allow you to be a province. Our provinces have style and class! Just look at Lancashire
> 
> On the topic. I like HPC but I could also see the NFT working, there's also an arch further down towards Waterloo where we might get in the way of fewer people but then you'd have to navigate the Waterloo roundabout to get east.


I think that roundabout can be avoided - just go along Belvedere Road/Upper Ground and turn onto Stamford St at your convenience.


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## redfalo (15 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> nobody's passed comment on my NFT suggestion. Shelter, toilets, lighting, safe start, nice view, nearer to Kings Cross, and, given that you don't need a pre-meeting point, not that much further from Paddington or Marylebone.


 
Well, I really like HPC. If it is supposed to be nearer to King's Cross - why not meet directly at King's Cross. After the new ticket hall has been openend, the square between King's Cross and St Pancras is quite nice. However, it's rather far to Paddington, of course, Not so sure about the safe start as well.

Maybe Lincoln's Inn Fields? There's a loo, at least (perhaps closed at night?), but no shelter.


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## mmmmartin (15 May 2012)

HPC for me. It ain't broke........


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## User10571 (15 May 2012)

mmmmartin said:


> HPC for me. It ain't broke........


Despite my earlier suggestions, mmmmmartin (and others) seem to have it right.
HPC works on so many levels.


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## StuAff (15 May 2012)

HPC for preference, still. As (usually) I'm the one coming from furthest south of the river, I certainly wouldn't mind somewhere nearer Waterloo, and anything that avoids navigating the lunacy of the HPC roundabout is a good thing. But, as a start point, HPC just works. Plenty of room. No numpty pedestrians getting in the way. And, as our leader is so fond of a ride 'story', there are few places with a better start.

That said, might I suggest for Whitstable we give the South Bank a dry run? I've just had a look at the road closures around Buck House & my usual route to the Arch (and our normal route east, of course) is thoroughly SNAFUd.


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## style over speed (15 May 2012)

I like HPC, but otherwise would vote for trafalgar square


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## srw (15 May 2012)

I have to admit that I don't much like HPC. It's a gloomy, windswept place on a hair-raising traffic roundabout. It's not London. London at night is a place of streetlights, hustle and bustle, warmth and humanity, buildings and intrigue. HPC is dark, quiet, on a back route between places. It's got too many reminders of vainglorious empire militarism, too much dodgy public art, not enough buildings. It's cold, it's wet, it's windy.

I don't say that purely because I seem to act as an angel of doom on these rides...
(So far I've experienced the last appearance of Planet Sweet; Junecember atop Ditchling on the 2011 genteel ride; Brighton in the ice in october, and User482's tumble near Emsworth after floods in Sutton)


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## StuAff (15 May 2012)

srw said:


> I have to admit that I don't much like HPC. It's a gloomy, windswept place on a hair-raising traffic roundabout. It's not London. L*ondon at night is a place of streetlights, hustle and bustle, warmth and humanity,* buildings and intrigue. HPC is dark, quiet, on a back route between places. It's got too many reminders of vainglorious empire militarism, too much dodgy public art, not enough buildings. It's cold, it's wet, it's windy.
> 
> I don't say that purely because I seem to act as an angel of doom on these rides...
> (So far I've experienced the last appearance of Planet Sweet; Junecember atop Ditchling on the 2011 genteel ride; Brighton in the ice in october, and User482's tumble near Emsworth after floods in Sutton)


London's warmth and humanity is frequently not evident on a Friday night, AFAIK.
And you're not an angel of doom.....


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## srw (15 May 2012)

I'd invite you to pop up to the City. London's warmth and humanity is very evident on a Friday night...


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## theclaud (15 May 2012)

srw said:


> I have to admit that I don't much like HPC.* It's a gloomy, windswept place on a hair-raising traffic roundabout.* It's not London. London at night is a place of streetlights, hustle and bustle, warmth and humanity, buildings and intrigue. HPC is dark, quiet, on a back route between places. It's got too many reminders of vainglorious empire militarism, too much dodgy public art, not enough buildings. It's cold, it's wet, it's windy.


 
I'm with Slowmo on the roundabout. I don't envy DZ his traffic-blocking role there, but I think we cut rather a dash as we swoop off_ en masse_.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

StuAff said:


> HPC for preference, still. As (usually) I'm the one coming from furthest south of the river, I certainly wouldn't mind somewhere nearer Waterloo, and anything that avoids navigating the lunacy of the HPC roundabout is a good thing. But, as a start point, HPC just works. Plenty of room. No numpty pedestrians getting in the way. And, as our leader is so fond of a ride 'story', there are few places with a better start.
> 
> That said, might I suggest for Whitstable we give the South Bank a dry run? I've just had a look at the road closures around Buck House & my usual route to the Arch (and our normal route east, of course) is thoroughly SNAFUd.


 
Yeh - you can do the 'dry run' Stu.


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> Yeah right, and they believed the earth was flat


Bit like Adam then...


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

[QUOTE 1849887, member: 1314"]First choice, The Mirch Marsala in Tooting!

If we are north of the river I like the idea of Smithfield Market. Easy enough to get to from Paddington, Kings Cross, Euston (left and left again). And it's minutes from the Jerusalem (who have excellent toilets to go with their pork sandwiches).[/quote]
You're probably at Mirch Marsala when most of the night rides leave anyway, User! On 1st June, bring a hipster satchel full of samples to distribute to the shivering gathered masses - wherever they may be. Yum yum - can't wait!


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## Aperitif (15 May 2012)

StuAff said:


> London's warmth and humanity is frequently not evident on a Friday night, AFAIK.
> And you're not an angel of doom.....


Hmmm...


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## StuAff (15 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Yeh - you can do the 'dry run' Stu.


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## slowmotion (15 May 2012)

theclaud said:


> I'm with Slowmo on the roundabout. I don't envy DZ his traffic-blocking role there, but I think we cut rather a dash as we swoop off_ en masse_.


As Adrian pointed out, it can't be easy for our Glorious Leader to kick off the gig at HPC, but he has a Cloak of Invincibility......and bowels of steel. Remember his imperious march into the path of a speeding artic. near Clapham Southside? I shudder at the memory. Anyway, to my mind, HPC has a sense of grandeur, history and occasion. The "drop" into the traffic is a great buzz too. Slipping quietly out of an NCP in Victoria just doesn't cut the mustard. Sorry.


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## Mice (15 May 2012)

hatler said:


> I like HPC. It has both grandeur and just a slight tinge of eccentricity about it. And it's where No 1 London is, so if we're riding from London to the coast we can only make that claim if we start from there.


 
I like HPC for its iconicness too. As far as I know one of the Lions in Trafalgar Square is where all the mileages to London were measured - so any sign in the UK to London has one of the lions as its destination (not sure which one). HPC has the cyclists version of that, for me. Just in case this hasnt been posted anywhere else http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18072905 hahahaha!

Needless to say Your DZness as long as the FNRttCs continue, if you want to move the start point then so be it. But there is something fabulously surreal about joining a group of cyclists in the semi dark and not really knowing til the halfway stop with whom you are cycling.....!

Mice


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## User10571 (15 May 2012)

Mice said:


> I like HPC for its iconicness too. As far as I know one of the Lions in Trafalgar Square is where all the mileages to London were measured - so any sign in the UK to London has one of the lions as its destination (not sure which one). HPC has the cyclists version of that, for me. Just in case this hasnt been posted anywhere else http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18072905 hahahaha!
> 
> Needless to say Your DZness as long as the FNRttCs continue, if you want to move the start point then so be it. But there is something fabulously surreal about joining a group in the semi dark and not really knowing til the halfway stop with whom you are cycling.....!
> 
> Mice


Word.


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## theclaud (15 May 2012)

slowmotion said:


> As Adrian pointed out, it can't be easy for our Glorious Leader to kick off the gig at HPC, but he has a Cloak of Invincibility......and bowels of steel. *Remember his imperious march into the path of a speeding artic. near Clapham Southside?* I shudder at the memory. Anyway, to my mind, HPC has a sense of grandeur, history and occasion. The "drop" into the traffic is a great buzz too. Slipping quietly out of an NCP in Victoria just doesn't cut the mustard. Sorry.


 
I was expecting it to be T-boned by a crop duster to some urgent Bernard Herrmann strings.


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## slowmotion (15 May 2012)

theclaud said:


> I was expecting it to be T-boned by a crop duster to some urgent Bernard Herrmann strings.


My reaction at the time was a flash of the "wrong side of the highway" scene in Trains, Planes and Automobiles, complete with The Grim Reaper in the cab.


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## ianmac62 (15 May 2012)

Mice said:


> Just in case this hasnt been posted anywhere else http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-18072905 hahahaha!
> 
> Mice


 
and the follow up: "One afternoon last year I walked up the road to my house to discover a man urinating on my driveway. Like a good, responsible, British citizen, I pretended it wasn't my house and walked on past."


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## AKA Bob (16 May 2012)

What about the St Martins in the Field or outside the National Gallery both in Trafalgar Square. Large open space late opening coffee shops and food shops, WCs and all pretty central and the right side of things to avoid problems with road closures in The Mall


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## rb58 (16 May 2012)

Or Bow Church on Cheapside. Leaving to the sound of Bow Bells, so a proper Cockney ride.....


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## Aperitif (16 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> What about the St Martins in the Field or outside the National Gallery both in Trafalgar Square. Large open space late opening coffee shops and food shops, WCs and all pretty central and the right side of things to avoid problems with road closures in The Mall


The Trafalgar Square toilets were clean, tidy and to be commended when I inspected them a few weeks ago. All the urinals in a lion, and three booths occupied, but the fourth was empty...


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## ianrauk (16 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> What about the St Martins in the Field or *outside the National Gallery both in Trafalgar Square*. Large open space late opening coffee shops and food shops, WCs and all pretty central and the right side of things to avoid problems with road closures in The Mall


 

That is a very good call


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## clarion (16 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> The Trafalgar Square toilets were clean, tidy and to be commended when I inspected them a few weeks ago. All the urinals in a lion, and three booths occupied, but the fourth was empty...


 
That's as rare as rocking horse poo


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## Aperitif (16 May 2012)

clarion said:


> That's as rare as rocking horse poo


No. Sebastian & Coe have designated these toilets as Olympic Legacy Site #1 and the visiting public will be regaled with their cleanliness. 'Locog' are sponsoring them and will take the 'Nelson Riddle' out of one in the best possible fashion.


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## thom (16 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> No. Sebastian & Coe have designated these toilets as Olympic Legacy Site #1 and the visiting public will be regaled with their cleanliness. 'Locog' are sponsoring them and will take the 'Nelson Riddle' out of one in the best possible fashion.


Tif, that's not true. Nothing can take the p*ss better than you.


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## Aperitif (16 May 2012)

thom said:


> Tif, that's not true. Nothing can take the p*ss better than you.


Not you as well! I popped over here from the other thread where 'Tight Northern Wad' and 'Quackers' are debating the semantics and content of breakfast. (Any fule kno' that anything goes, at any time if one is a proper cyclist - "Food is fuel")
- they both have it so wrong I wouldn't be surprised if they were associate advisors to Nicholas Clegg esq. And, don't come over here, Anthony. All we need is a bit of 'toilet duck' and we'll all be down the pan.
Anyway, Thom, what say you to Trafalgar Square? It would be good publicity for the FNRttC - one sure way to get 'column inches' just by turning up.


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## GrumpyGregry (16 May 2012)

I refuse to p1ss inside a monument to imperialism and the exploitation of others.

P1ss on it? Another matter entirely, liable to end in arrest.


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## User10571 (16 May 2012)

I like the idea of Trafalgar square, particularly as the Charles 1st statue is the datum for measuring road distances, but I have a feeling it is one of those areas of public land that are now 'privately' owned and policed by wardens of some sort.
A couple of years ago Charlotte-of-another-place and company were told they weren't allowed to take publicity photographs in Trafalgar Square for her TRAT ride, by someone in a uniform who clearly should never have been allowed anywhere near one.


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## Aperitif (16 May 2012)

GregCollins said:


> I refuse to p1ss inside a monument to imperialism and the exploitation of others.
> 
> P1ss on it? Another matter entirely, liable to end in arrest.


Don't bring politics into ride starts ref...otherwise you'll have to cart religion into it as well.


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## thom (16 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Anyway, Thom, what say you to Trafalgar Square? It would be good publicity for the FNRttC - one sure way to get 'column inches' just by turning up.


It's probably ok to try if road closures cause problems. 
Somehow I was under the impression we deliberately avoided it because when going east, we eschew the shorter route of charging down the Mall to Admirality Arch and T square before getting to Embankment.

I can't think of rain cover though and of all the places suggested, I think this can be the most likely to get passing attention, wanted and unwanted. But it is safe - CCTV blanket coverage - and it is spectacular. Sometimes you might find you overlap with other events in the square.

If you're trying to find a more eastern location for Whitstable, Southend, Harwich rides etc., it doesn't really help that much.
For the southern rides, well I guess you can go along Whitehall, past HoP and along the embankment to Battersea park, which is actually pretty nice but the route from HPC probably won't be effected in that case.


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## srw (16 May 2012)

User10571 said:


> I like the idea of Trafalgar square, particularly as the Charles 1st statue is the datum for measuring road distances,


 
Not according to the BBC, who are Always Right.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/content/articles/2005/08/15/charingcross_feature.shtml


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## velovoice (16 May 2012)

srw said:


> Not according to the BBC, who are Always Right.
> http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/content/articles/2005/08/15/charingcross_feature.shtml


"... the actual point for measuring the distance to and from London is located at Charing Cross, Westminter."
"The original cross was... where the statue of King Charles I now stands. A plaque can be found on the floor behind the statue stating that mileage distances on road signage are still measured from this point."

Now both statements can't be right, can they?


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## srw (16 May 2012)

Goshdarnit. Outpedanted.


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## dellzeqq (16 May 2012)

thankyou for reminding me of the Clapham Artic - although veterans may remember van on the A3, which was far, far scarier...

I don't know why I didn't think of Trafalgar Square, but, having thought about it for a bit, and refreshed my memory with a look at google maps I think it would be jumping out of the frying pan in to the fire. The traffic to the south of the Square is very, very difficult to predict. I don't think it would be practical to break the flow. We'd almost separate as we got away down Northumberland Avenue, and I'm with Claudine and Slo'mo' in thinking that it's nice to get away with a bit of a swing. Having said that - I'm tired of HPC. It's a nice place to meet, but the start is fraught.

I'm struck by the (not entirely unanimous) support for HPC. My current thought is this. The ride to Whitstable will have an experimental start. Like srw I'm fond of the City, but one has to accept that there are disadvantages - it's very easy to get lost, there are very few public spaces, it's really not clever for the Brighton and Felpham runs (Tooting High Street is a dream compared to Borough High Street).

I'm a big fan of the More London, Tower Bridge, Butlers Wharf area, having seen it come from nothing to its stylish present, but, again, it's no good for Brighton and Felpham, and it's not fun to get to from Paddington, Victoria or even Waterloo.

Kings Cross/St. Pancras is pretty fancy, but I suppose I have to take in to account that the biggest wodge of riders comes from the south, southeast and west, and (I may have got this wrong) there's no obvious space for the signing in and the safety talk.

So, for the moment, I'm pondering the South Bank as a one-off. I'm going to have to pop up there for a bit of recce, but, taking the rides in turn...

It adds half a mile to Brighton and Felpham, although it effectively does away with the Fulham Road Variation.

It shortens the Whitstable and Southend rides by two miles (before you start measuring, bear in mind that we take a lengthy tour along the Embankment. we can schlepp along the riverside for a bit, and maybe go under Tower Bridge for an architectural diversion.

If people don't like it we'll revert to HPC - but after six years I would like at least to try a new start point.


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## User10571 (16 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> thankyou for reminding me of the Clapham Artic - although veterans may remember van on the A3, which was far, far scarier...
> 
> .....


 
Royal Mail artic descending Reigate Hill FTW?
Screaming weegie in tow....


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## theclaud (16 May 2012)

1850923 said:


> For Easterly rides, what about Tower Hill? Historic location. There's cover where the ticket booths are. The defunct entrance for the Tower Subway for someone to lecture us on.


 
Like your thinking. String 'em up first if they look like trouble - saves having to shoot 'em and leave in a ditch later.

Or is that not it?


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## dellzeqq (16 May 2012)

srw said:


> Goshdarnit. Outpedanted.


there's always a chance The User will turn up......


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## srw (16 May 2012)

As it happens I was riding along the South Bank this morning (Upper Ground), and what struck me was quite how nasty the road surface is. There are sections of cobbles in sleeping policemen which are falling apart, and the tarmac is one large mend.

But there are a couple of parks (although the one under the Eye is being dug up at the moment), and if you can penetrate through to the river some good views.

As a daytime commuting route it's useful. At night - I'm not so sure.


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## martint235 (16 May 2012)

srw said:


> As it happens I was riding along the South Bank this morning (Upper Ground), and what struck me was quite how nasty the road surface is. There are sections of cobbles in sleeping policemen which are falling apart, and the tarmac is one large mend.


I'd forgotten about that. The surface could easily become a problem particularly if it was wet. I started avoiding it while I was still commuting to Westminster it was that bad. I preferred to mix it on the Waterloo roundabout.


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## thom (16 May 2012)

1850923 said:


> For Easterly rides, what about Tower Hill? Historic location. There's cover where the ticket booths are. The defunct entrance for the Tower Subway for someone to lecture us on.


 
This is one of the places I suggested before: Tower Hilll Terrace, which is after all next to Legge's Mount !

One place in the city with space I think is the Guildhall. There is a toilet next door too but it is true that the city is hard to navigate around.

It is interesting just how conservative the general opinion is on this !


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## thom (16 May 2012)

martint235 said:


> I'd forgotten about that. The surface could easily become a problem particularly if it was wet. I started avoiding it while I was still commuting to Westminster it was that bad. I preferred to mix it on the Waterloo roundabout.


It shouldn't be a big deal though - you can get off it away from the roundabout pretty quickly.


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## dellzeqq (16 May 2012)

martint235 said:


> I'd forgotten about that. The surface could easily become a problem particularly if it was wet. I started avoiding it while I was still commuting to Westminster it was that bad. I preferred to mix it on the Waterloo roundabout.


interesting. I know Upper Ground and not thought of it as a problem. Then again...I zip along Clink Street.

I'm looking at Upper Ground until just before Blackfriars Bridge Road, then south, then east along Southwark Street (the traffic lights across Blackfriars Bridge Road being set up in a safe way) then Sumner Street, Park Street (sorry mmmmartin) and along Clink Street to Tooley Street. If it's wet we might go down Marshalsea Road, Long Lane and Abbey Street.


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## User10571 (16 May 2012)

So who is going to be posted on HPC duty?

To go and collect all those who, despite your assiduous instructions, will inevitably be waiting under a tumbleweed covered arch at midnight.


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## ianrauk (16 May 2012)

1851161 said:


> I was wondering who was going to volunteer for that one.


 

Some one very tall......


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## thom (16 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> interesting. I know Upper Ground and not thought of it as a problem. Then again...I zip along Clink Street.
> 
> I'm looking at Upper Ground until just before Blackfriars Bridge Road, then south, then east along Southwark Street (the traffic lights across Blackfriars Bridge Road being set up in a safe way) then Sumner Street, Park Street (sorry mmmmartin) and along Clink Street to Tooley Street. If it's wet we might go down Marshalsea Road, Long Lane and Abbey Street.


 
Certainly it is a good idea to avoid the sets of traffic lights on Borough High St. going from Southwark St. to Tooley St.


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## AKA Bob (16 May 2012)

Another idea maybe the Duke of York steps? Lots of space and won't get in peoples way and easy escape without too much grief.


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## User10571 (16 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> Another idea maybe the Duke of York steps? Lots of space and won't get in peoples way and easy escape without too much grief.


And there's a bar in the adjacent ICA


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## dellzeqq (16 May 2012)

thom said:


> Certainly it is a good idea to avoid the sets of traffic lights on Borough High St. going from Southwark St. to Tooley St.


absolutely - there's a lot of traffic going south, even at a quarter past midnight


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## srw (16 May 2012)

1851305 said:


> You really ought to get a mobile phone. They are brilliant for such eventualites.


 But they make it difficult to find escort services - don't you usually have to find a phone box for those?


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## dellzeqq (16 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> Oh no, it's taken me a year to learn the route from Victoria to HPC, and now I'm going to have to start all over again!


not at all. Get off at Clapham Junction, take the lift, go to platform 10, take the first train to Waterloo - and it's a walk to the NFT


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## thom (16 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> absolutely - there's a lot of traffic going south, even at a quarter past midnight


Out of curiousity, I just pootled around there (left leg peddling only for now). That way also means you avoid about 8 sets of lights, so although it winds a bit it likely would be quicker.
Going east you pass the back of Tate Modern, you can spot St Pauls, the Rose Theatre, the FT, the Clink, the remains of the Bishop of Winchester's palace, the Golden Hinde Replica and Southwark Cathedral. The BFI area is pretty good too. Early arrivals can practice stunts on the bmx/skateboard ramps when the bars stop serving.


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## hatler (16 May 2012)

StuAff said:


> HPC for preference, still. As (usually) I'm the one coming from furthest south of the river, I certainly wouldn't mind somewhere nearer Waterloo, *and anything that avoids navigating the lunacy of the HPC roundabout is a good thing.*


 
I overcome this (coming from Waterloo) by crossing Westminster Bridge, round Parliament Sq, then along Birdcage Walk, across the front of Buck House then down Constitution Hill. All you have to do then is get in the RH lane as you approach HPC and when the lights go green you push effortlessly onto the centre of HPC.

Aside from anything else, this way you get a magical view of the river from Westminster Bridge, cycle past the mother of all Parliaments and the clock tower, then amble along relatively quiet gas lit streets until you get to HPC. Mrs and small hatler were both struck by the magnificence of this route when we joined the start of the recent Felpham ride.


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## marinyork (16 May 2012)

I don't mind where it starts although there is some land next to King's Cross and St Pancras stations these days up Pancras Road and there is also King's Cross Boulevard. Although why you'd want to start it that far north I'm not sure.


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## hatler (16 May 2012)

Mice said:


> I like HPC for its *iconicness* too.


 
Iconicity ?


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## hatler (16 May 2012)

Changing (or varying) the starting point will doubtless result in a significant increase in e-mail/text traffic. Is that something you really want ?

Ref the excitement/buzz/fear when setting off from HPC, as a participant I rather enjoy it.
On the one occasion when I arrived at midnight plus 30 seconds it seemed a natural thing to do to join DZ as a joint Moses parting the traffic waves. The traffic hold up thing is quite a feat for a single bod, but could be eased if three or four did this as a team. If the masses were organised beforehand I reckon we could get 300 cyclists onto the roundabout in one traffic light phase. Rank them up five deep and 60 abreast.


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## Flying Dodo (16 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> Kings Cross/St. Pancras is pretty fancy, but I suppose I have to take in to account that the biggest wodge of riders comes from the south, southeast and west, and (I may have got this wrong) there's no obvious space for the signing in and the safety talk.


 
There's a massive area in front of the new entrance at Kings Cross, which would easily accommodate 100+ cyclists. Handy for me, as I can just walk across from St. Pancras.

Alternatively, now that the last protestors have been evicted, how about Parliament Square, or St Paul's Cathedral?


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## ianmac62 (16 May 2012)

Edging off topic, I know, but the Eleanor Cross we passed on Saturday morning within a couple of miles of the start of Adam's training ride was the one referred to in the quoted BBC article as "Hardingstone" (Edward and Eleanor's stopping point was Delapre Abbey, now the Northamptonshire Record Office). The roundabout which we went under on a bike path is known as The Queen Eleanor Roundabout.


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## User10571 (16 May 2012)

srw said:


> But they make it difficult to find escort services - don't you usually have to find a phone box for those?


My number is in most of the boxes of which you speak.


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## mcshroom (16 May 2012)

I'd personally prefer HPC, although Kings Cross would be a lot easier for me. As long as it's not too difficult to get to from Euston I wouldn't mind anywhere though.


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## StuAff (16 May 2012)

hatler said:


> I overcome this (coming from Waterloo) by crossing Westminster Bridge, round Parliament Sq, then along Birdcage Walk, across the front of Buck House then down Constitution Hill. All you have to do then is get in the RH lane as you approach HPC and when the lights go green you push effortlessly onto the centre of HPC.
> 
> Aside from anything else, this way you get a magical view of the river from Westminster Bridge, cycle past the mother of all Parliaments and the clock tower, then amble along relatively quiet gas lit streets until you get to HPC. Mrs and small hatler were both struck by the magnificence of this route when we joined the start of the recent Felpham ride.


Indeed you do, that's the way I go. I didn't make it clear that I meant when our peloton leaves the Arch....


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## mmmmartin (16 May 2012)

The more I think about this, the more I cannot see a reason to change. And I think if we do start from somewhere else, there is a good chance that someone will have come in to London on the train and gone to HPC and be left there at midnight on their own, having missed the last train out of London. 
HPC is near to Charing Cross for me, and equidistant from other mainline stations, so is sort of fair for everyone. And who cares about toilets? We've all gone before, as it were, and there is a stop pretty early in the ride, mostly. And shelter is OK there, although if we were too worried about the need for shelter we'd not be planning to spend all night on the bike.....


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## sbird (16 May 2012)

London's not my manor but if variation of start points depending on the ride destination is up for consideration then does St. Paul's have any merit for the Saaarfend ride?


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## slowmotion (16 May 2012)

hatler said:


> Ref the excitement/buzz/fear when setting off from HPC, as a participant I rather enjoy it.


Likewise. I'm not an adrenaline junkie by any stretch of the imagination but that buzz is fun. I launch myself off a side road by the Apollo into five lanes of traffic on Hammersmith Broadway at least twice every weekend. It's like catching a big wave when surfing, they say. Once you make the decision to go.....no turning back. HPC has that dramatic start. Sorry, I'm just being selfish too. It's only twenty minutes away , and on good tarmac, unlike that ghastly road east of the Embankment.


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## Wobblers (17 May 2012)

slowmotion said:


> Likewise. I'm not an adrenaline junkie by any stretch of the imagination but that buzz is fun. I launch myself off a side road by the Apollo into five lanes of traffic on Hammersmith Broadway at least twice every weekend. It's like catching a big wave when surfing, they say. Once you make the decision to go.....no turning back. HPC has that dramatic start. Sorry, I'm just being selfish too. It's only twenty minutes away , and on good tarmac, unlike that ghastly road east of the Embankment.


 
Much as I like HPC, and its starting buzz, it's not an ideal launching point for that many cyclists. And I don't envy Dellzeqq his parting of the traffic routine. A more sedate start would certainly be different, and - who knows - we might prefer it. Certainly the South Bank offers an unparalleled London vista. I think we should try it. After all, it's not the location of the start that makes the FNRttC so wonderful.


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## Fab Foodie (17 May 2012)

McWobble said:


> Much as I like HPC, and its starting buzz, it's not an ideal launching point for that many cyclists. And I don't envy Dellzeqq his parting of the traffic routine. A more sedate start would certainly be different, and - who knows - we might prefer it. Certainly the South Bank offers an unparalleled London vista. I think we should try it. After all, it's not the location of the start that makes the FNRttC so wonderful.


 But it IS Sarf of the river and it IS that time of night ....


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## Fab Foodie (17 May 2012)

User10571 said:


> My number is in most of the boxes of which you speak.


And a good escort he is too (having used his services a few times)!


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## GrumpyGregry (17 May 2012)

Have we ever checked to see if some co-ordinated crossing button pressing would ease our exit?


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## Aperitif (17 May 2012)

GregCollins said:


> Have we ever checked to see if some co-ordinated crossing button pressing would ease our exit?



The 'TEC squad' should be at the front to create a road block perhaps. Last to leave they will automatically be at the back. What taxi driver is going to risk his cab against Davy's 64 cm relaxed thighs. It's already a hazard for passing cabbies as female passengers try to clamber out of windows at the sight of 'walnuts crackers, football shorts billowing expectantly. The threat of two intimidating bollards, astride a bike, would be more than his job's worth. Guv. 


Just as an edit: Keep your eyes peeled for any car with a Liverpool scarf fluttering from the window. Form a ring around the ride leader and be prepared to die for the cause. The poor bloke is in bother over in the football thread already!


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## threebikesmcginty (17 May 2012)

Oxford?


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## StuartG (17 May 2012)

Romford?
Unforgettable street entertainment and a neat little chicken shack!


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## swansonj (17 May 2012)

Ah, that stretch of concrete on the South Bank. Scene of Juliet Stevenson's new boyfriend hopping backwards in front of her in Truly, Madly, Deeply. Scene of High Grant's inarticulate declaration of love to Andie McDowell in Four Weddings. And scene of the first kiss my wife and I exchanged, 18 years ago (and I missed watching the Tour de France go up Ditchling Beacon in order to go on that date with her too).

I will willingly follow DZ wherever you choose. But for my own preference, I agree with others about the case for high iconicity. "Midnight at Hyde Park Corner, breakfast by the sea" has a ring to it that "Midnight outside the cinema under the bridge" doesn't. As was wisely said in another debate in another place:



> Setting aside the unusual start time, there the radical notion that rides should have a beginning, a middle and an end - that the beginning should have some moment about it, the end should be revelatory (and involve beer), and the middle should entertain, have an identity or character and not be frenetic.


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## clarion (17 May 2012)

We could start the Brighton rides on Sutton High Street #convenientforme


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## Fab Foodie (17 May 2012)

threebikesmcginty said:


> Oxford?


 Oh good call ...


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## Flying Dodo (17 May 2012)

I'd agree the main issue with HPC is the setting off, and the problem Simon has with stopping traffic. 

When I'm at the back, I've generally enouraged people in front to move off sharpish, but that doesn't seem to happen. Unfortunately, they tend to simply follow the riders in front, and not consider moving sideways more, to get into the stream of riders going round the roundabout.

I think the best solution would be to get the riders onto the road quicker, through Simon stressing in his safety talk the need for everyone to move onto the roundabout using the whole width of the lowered kerb and not just the bit by the lights.


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## caimg (17 May 2012)

*opens door*

What is this thread about? :/


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## Dan B (17 May 2012)

Flying Dodo said:


> I'd agree the main issue with HPC is the setting off, and the problem Simon has with stopping traffic.


I think the main issue with HPC is more that it's a very boring place to hang around if you get there early, but if the setting off is a problem I would be more than happy (having done it many many times for the skates that start in the same place) to add my body/bike to the roadblock. On skates we usually allow one blocker for each traffic lane, and almost never have trouble wth anything fatter than a moped trying to break through.


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## Aperitif (17 May 2012)

caimg said:


> *opens door*
> 
> What is this thread about? :/


Read the first post - it sometimes helps.
It might be an idea to forget all the searching for an ideal place and get real, with a decamp to the destination and a Night Ride to London, arriving at suitable points along the way. Much cheaper, more convenient and less crowded on arrival, also giving countryfolk a soupcon of what London in daylight is like!
And we could start from other locations...Colne General Hospital immediately springs to mind.


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## martint235 (17 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Colne General Hospital immediately springs to mind.


 Apart from the fact it doesn't have one (in fact the nearest A&E is now in Blackburn) why Colne General?


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## caimg (17 May 2012)

Thanks for the sarcasm Aperitif, funnily enough I had done that but the first post doesn't really specify apart from talking about potential meeting places...was just asking what for?

I have no idea what the acronym in the thread title stands for! Is it for the Night Rider event in June?


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## hatler (17 May 2012)

caimg said:


> Thanks for the sarcasm Aperitif, funnily enough I had done that but the first post doesn't really specify apart from talking about potential meeting places...was just asking what for?
> 
> I have no idea what the acronym in the thread title stands for! Is it for the Night Rider event in June?


Take a look at the sticky post immediately above this one. "FNRttC: About / Ride Registration". That'll explain all.


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## caimg (17 May 2012)

hatler said:


> Take a look at the sticky post immediately above this one. "FNRttC: About / Ride Registration". That'll explain all.



Ah cheers bud


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## CharlieB (17 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> Another idea maybe the Duke of York steps? Lots of space and won't get in peoples way and easy escape without too much grief.


I'm almost with that. It would normally offer easy access to The Mall, but for the status quo of closures.

Did anyone suggest St. Paul's? I'm too darned lazy to backtrack 8pp of posts.


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## Aperitif (17 May 2012)

CharlieB said:


> I'm almost with that. It would normally offer easy access to The Mall, but for the status quo of closures.
> 
> Did anyone suggest St. Paul's? I'm too darned lazy to backtrack 8pp of posts.


Yes, several times, Charlie.
Not sarcasm 'caimg' - but I might have expected your query to be"What does FNRttC mean?" or something along those lines. I hope you are now fully informed and will join in soon, perhaps.


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## StuartG (17 May 2012)

Re the HPC issues:

"Boring if you arrive early": Well don't arrive early. There is a party going on half a mile down the road at Platform 12 Victoria Station. A great venue as its served by the Circle Line which takes bikes and:

* Makes it easy for new members arriving at all London's mainlines stations serving the West, North and East to meet up with only the need for a tube map

* If its wet you keep dry and warm

* Its bright so the early roll call is easy plus last minute technicals and you won't get dropped before HPC

* The last minute dash to HPC is kinda interesting and the company makes it easier

As for the start: It's FNRttC's version of Le Man's dash. That's the point it forces people together and gets 'em moving fast. Any other venue is more likely to start with a dribble. But I agree it isn't fun for Del. For those of us too incompetent to be TECs could at least volunteer for Kamikase duty.


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## dellzeqq (17 May 2012)

caimg said:


> Thanks for the sarcasm Aperitif, funnily enough I had done that but the first post doesn't really specify apart from talking about potential meeting places...was just asking what for?
> 
> I have no idea what the acronym in the thread title stands for! Is it for the Night Rider event in June?


no - that starts at the Ally Pally, which is a thoroughly dumbass place to start a ride to Brighton


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## dellzeqq (17 May 2012)

swansonj said:


> But for my own preference, I agree with others about the case for high iconicity. "Midnight at Hyde Park Corner, breakfast by the sea" has a ring to it that "Midnight outside the cinema under the bridge" doesn't. As was wisely said in another debate in another place:


ah-ha. Very clever! 

Maybe I'm just suffering some kind of menopausal ennui, but, speaking personally, HPC was more fun when we were a band of bicycling desperados heading off in to the unknown, although I accept that for a few people each month, we are heading off in to the unknown. 

There is no doubt that HBC has 'iconicity'. For the eastward rides it has the tremendous advantage of a straight line for the first few hundred yards. And, again, for the eastward rides again it's easy to marshal down to the river, and, once at the river, all is well - indeed, given the view, all is wonderful. For the southward rides it's handily placed - Sloane Square is better placed, but Sloane Square is crowded and more difficult for the northern and eastern crew to get to.

Truth to tell I'm feeling a little abashed. I hadn't realised that people liked HPC quite as much as they do. 

This is what I've decided. It will be the NFT for one month only. Hopefully this will teach me a lesson, and we'll revert to HPC. But, if only for one month, I would dearly like to try something different. Indulge me, please.

I'm going to send an e-mail to all the people registered for the Whitstable ride, and require an answer from each of them. Anybody who doesn't answer will get a phone call....

Right, having sorted that out, I'll turn to the late LonJoG cancellation. Pass the surface to cyclist missiles.....

.


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## AKA Bob (17 May 2012)

Not wanting to be on the end of one of Simon's missiles!!

What about thinking outside the box and starting at the coast and heading to London especially Southend? Tully family will still be visited and would allow more 'Slag' drinking time at LMNHs!!!!!!!!!


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## martint235 (17 May 2012)

Unfortunately it wouldn't as LMNH have this weird idea of no beer before 11am. Boo Hiss!


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## Mice (17 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> FNRtWGAF


. 
Not sure what this means it just made me laugh out loud when I read it! (I'm slow!)

I'm sorry you have HPC ennui DZ - I hope it passes. And if it doesn't then whatever venue you pick will have us all bounding down to it before you can say "Bollard" . The FNRttCs are awesome to the rest of us who don't have a jot of admin to do, can turn up in time for the Safety Talk, to then laugh all the way to the Coast, in a smug "we can relax and enjoy the ride cos we're in good hands, this is an FNRttC" sort of way.

I did wonder if it would make any difference if we left HPC from the north west bit as it's not two sets of traffic lights next to each other; then I thought maybe if we left in three groups with a TEC at the front of each; then I started googling spaces of off road where we could regroup - Google maps is summat else, I found the bottom of Northampton Row and could imagine you doing the Safety Talk from Hungerford Bridge (or on the stairs); then I thought Pudding Lane (impossible to get to) then I thought Waterloo Station (it has rain cover up by the taxi rank/bus drop off bit) then I wondered what your recce list included that led you to HPC in the first place,  then, eventually I realised that there were far more competent FNRttCers and Cycling Commuters who would have a much better idea than me, the greatest one of course being you. So really, as long as you're happy, I don't give a monkeys where it starts (as long as I know where it starts!) 

Mice


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## User10571 (17 May 2012)

Mice's suggestion of the stairs has me thinking that we should convene outside some sort of grandiose building, ideally one with a balcony (preferably supported by columns - Ionic, let's say), from which the safety talk could be delivered.

There could be flags and draped fabrics.....

EDIT: Come to think of it, I might show some interest if the next batch of Friday's tops were to feature epaulettes.


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## User10571 (17 May 2012)

So is that it?
Have I killed the thread?
There was a distinct flow earlier. A rhythm. A _souplesse_, if you will.
And now, nothing. Zilch. Nada.

So which was it?
The drapes? Or the epaulettes?
I know! It was the balcony, wasn't it?
Or do I eat supper at a different time to the rest of you?

Hmm?


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## Tim Hall (17 May 2012)

They're all trying to live up to the epitome of Cycling Cool they fear may be thrust upon them, having seen the Poster Boy picture over in The Other Place.


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## User10571 (17 May 2012)

Ah! There you are.

If you're referring to what I think you're referring to, that was more wave, less salute.

Honest.

And I wasn't sufficiently colour coordinated to be mistaken as being in a uniform.


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## Aperitif (17 May 2012)

User10571 said:


> So is that it?
> Have I killed the thread?
> There was a distinct flow earlier. A rhythm. A _souplesse_, if you will.
> And now, nothing. Zilch. Nada.
> ...


I just popped into this thread from a mind-numbing (what's different?) day, and I wonder if your suggestion has got 'mileage', User10571?







Of course, this is some time in the future, when our designer cannot make up his mind about 'this year's colour' so decides to wear a swatch of each on his breast. Might stop the traffic though!


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## User10571 (17 May 2012)

ROTFLMAO!

What's weird is that you've 'shopped (quite accurately) what was in my brane.
(Other than the Audax stylee beard.....)

That's an entire Pantone® chart he's wearing, isn't it?


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## thom (17 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> DorNBRtWGAF


FNRFTCTLMNH


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## User482 (17 May 2012)

I seem to have missed the boat...

Anyway, I like HPC. It adds to the sense of occasion, and provides for easy access from Paddington, which is particularly important after one has indulged in a pre-ride sharpener with the greatly esteemed theclaud. Moreover, I've finally managed to navigate from Paddington to HPC and Victoria without going via Trafalgar square.


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## thom (17 May 2012)

User482 said:


> I seem to have missed the boat...
> 
> Anyway, I like HPC. It adds to the sense of occasion, and provides for easy access from Paddington, which is particularly important after one has indulged in a pre-ride sharpener with the greatly esteemed theclaud. Moreover, I've finally managed to navigate from Paddington to HPC and Victoria without going via Trafalgar square.


 
Both BFI bars, the Riverfront and Benugo's, are good places for romantic tete a tetes.


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## User10571 (17 May 2012)

1853312 said:


> This is a massed start ride Thom


Good man.
Reel him in.


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## StuAff (17 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> ah-ha. Very clever!
> 
> Maybe I'm just suffering some kind of menopausal ennui, but, speaking personally, HPC was more fun when we were a band of bicycling desperados heading off in to the unknown, although I accept that for a few people each month, we are heading off in to the unknown.
> 
> ...


We'd definitely need a different point- or a somewhat more convoluted route east- that weekend anyway- Constitution Hill, The Mall, Spur Road all shut.. http://www.royalparks.org.uk/home/n...ws/park-road-closures-for-the-diamond-jubilee


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## StuAff (17 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> Not wanting to be on the end of one of Simon's missiles!!
> 
> What about thinking outside the box and starting at the coast and heading to London especially Southend? Tully family will still be visited and would allow more 'Slag' drinking time at LMNHs!!!!!!!!!


Rogerzilla of the other place does his FNRttSs (from, er, Oxford).....good idea though.


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## thom (17 May 2012)

1853312 said:


> This is a massed start ride Thom


I was just trying to help them out. Indeed the propinquity of QEH and NT bars gives other options with superior views.

Anyway, I'm curious as to how many people actually have much of a drink before these. Given the rides start well after closing hours, bar proximity is a moot point for most.


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## Wobblers (18 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> ah-ha. Very clever!
> 
> Maybe I'm just suffering some kind of menopausal ennui, but, speaking personally, HPC was more fun when we were a band of bicycling desperados heading off in to the unknown, although I accept that for a few people each month, we are heading off in to the unknown.
> 
> ...


 
Actually, I'm warming up to the idea of starting Somewhere Else. HPC is not the making of the FNRttC. Starting somewhere else adds to the sense of adventure. Why not the South Bank for rides heading eastwards? It can't be denied that it's a sufficiently spectacular backdrop.

Or you could always start from Birmingham...


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## thom (18 May 2012)

1853473 said:


> When did you last go to a pub Thom? They are open all sorts of hours these days.


How many decent pubs do you know open in central London after 11pm ? It's a question not asked to be competitive but because I genuinely want to know for future reference ;-)
BFI places shut at 11pm as do pretty much all places near the southbank apart from some actors drinking hole near the Old Vic. You can go up the OXO I guess but I doubt they'd let you in in Lycra, or that you'd want to go on a Friday night.
There are open all night places like SXL that might be more to your liking but I really have no idea what goes on there. Just that there often appear to be a surfeit of bald middle aged men in tight clothes in the queues...


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## martint235 (18 May 2012)

I think the Stage Door behind the Old Vic is open till one or 2 officially on a Friday. It's not what I'd call a hole though.


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## Aperitif (18 May 2012)

User13710 said:


> Ahem ... sounds familiar? (Depends what you mean by middle aged I suppose though.)


Yes shocking to think that Thom trawls the queues to niteries speculating the way he does...and a middle aged man's clothes do not start off tight, you barefoot Adonis - ones body tends to reside snugly, like the finest pre-talced inner tube.
So I have been told.


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## thom (18 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Yes shocking to think that Thom trawls the queues to niteries speculating the way he does...and a middle aged man's clothes do not start off tight, you barefoot Adonis - ones body tends to reside snugly, like the finest pre-talced inner tube.
> So I have been told.


The ride leaving the BFI will go under the Blackfriars rail bridge. Bankside Vaults is hard to miss on your left.
I'm sure you'll pick up something as you pass Tif - abuse maybe


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## Aperitif (18 May 2012)

thom said:


> The ride leaving the BFI will go under the Blackfriars rail bridge. Bankside Vaults is hard to miss on your left.
> I'm sure you'll pick up something as you pass Tif - *abuse maybe*


You mean I'll pick up a put-down?


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## theclaud (18 May 2012)

StuAff said:


> Rogerzilla of the other place does his FNRttSs (from, er, Oxford).....good idea though.


 
Well if that doesn't convince DZ, I don't know what will...


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## dellzeqq (18 May 2012)

StuAff said:


> Rogerzilla of the other place does his FNRttSs (from, er, Oxford).....good idea though.


nice touch, Stu!


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## theclaud (18 May 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> This is what I've decided. It will be the NFT for one month only. Hopefully this will teach me a lesson, and we'll revert to HPC. But, if only for one month,* I would dearly like to try something different. Indulge me, please.*
> .


 
Oh go on then. South Bank is fine by me. I can always go round the HPC roundabout a few times for fun on my way to the start.


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## Aperitif (18 May 2012)

Stu's only floating an idea...bit like he tried to do with his bike.


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## dellzeqq (18 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Stu's only floating an idea...bit like he tried to do with his bike.


with similar results


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## Aperitif (18 May 2012)

Roger. Zilla Black for you.


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## theclaud (18 May 2012)




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## AKA Bob (18 May 2012)

Dellzegg it may be worth considering the Southbank until mid September as from early July they start playing silly buggers again around Buckingham Palace for some low key sports event!!!!


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## dellzeqq (18 May 2012)

AKA Bob said:


> Dellzegg it may be worth considering the Southbank until mid September as from early July they start playing silly buggers again around Buckingham Palace for some low key sports event!!!!


right you are! Did you hear that we were accosted by two of your boys, who registered our Brommies. We mentioned that we were escorting you to John O'Groats. 'Gosh', they said, 'make sure you bring him back. We'd have half the workload without him, and we certainly wouldn't want that!!!'


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## dellzeqq (18 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Roger. Zilla Black for you.



oh, Teef! I've gone all tender.......

Stu - you're forgiven. Just don't do it again!


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## rb58 (18 May 2012)

Spotted several of these along Cheapside today...... It must be a sign [see what I did there...]


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## StuAff (18 May 2012)

Aperitif said:


> Stu's only floating an idea...bit like he tried to do with his bike.


Nope, I didn't float the idea, just as I didn't float in the ford.


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## AnythingButVanilla (18 May 2012)

Mice said:


> The FNRttCs are awesome to the rest of us who don't have a jot of admin to do, can turn up in time for the Safety Talk, to then laugh all the way to the Coast, in a smug "we can relax and enjoy the ride cos we're in good hands, this is an FNRttC" sort of way.


 
Although though I've done all of two, well one and a half, FNRttC's I felt safe on them even when I was all by myself in the dark and that was all down to the fantastic organisation by DZ and the TECS and waymarkers on the way to the beach. 

I don't really have any opinion on HPC other than it's easy for me to get to and most people have some idea of where it is. However, when I did the Southend ride the other week I was waiting with Deptford Marmoset at the gates to the park for a while as neither of us realised that the ride left from the big roundabout opposite and had we not crossed the road we may still be standing there wondering where everyone is


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## dellzeqq (19 May 2012)

well, that's my fault. I should be specific about the start point every month


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## StuartG (21 May 2012)

Hopefully as LonJoG heads north it will be unaffected? Otherwise Kirkstall Villas? (got loos, is iconic ...)


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## ianmac62 (21 May 2012)

LonJoG alternative? King's Cross. Will impress East Coast landladies en route.


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## dellzeqq (21 May 2012)

StuartG said:


> Hopefully as LonJoG heads north it will be unaffected? Otherwise Kirkstall Villas? (got loos, is iconic ...)


I think it will be fine. I'll do some checking, though

Whitstable mailing going out presently


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## TimO (29 May 2012)

I'm a bit late to this thread, but it's taking me several days to read through it in it's entirety (and tonight I'm backing up about 6.5TBytes of data to some external USB2 drives, so I've got a lot of spare time!)

HPC does have a certain something, but both directions that we use to leave are a bit of a hassle. Leaving southwards for Brighton, Bognor etc does give me a chance to use my rear light "laser of deth" to stop the traffic however. 

I think that it's certainly worth trying out a few other locations, and conceivably a different location appropriate to the destination could be used each month. The down side of using different start locations, is that inevitably some people won't read the emails and will turn up to the wrong location (and I *really* hope this never turns out to be me!)

Whilst arguably HPC is a little bit remote and quiet, that's why there's enough space for 100+ cyclists to hang around for half an hour, and then leave without mowing down too many pedestrians.


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