# Motorist gets arsey with cyclists, gets thumped



## Peowpeowpeowlasers (23 Aug 2012)

....is more how I see this having happened.

http://velostage.com/cyclists-sought-after-alleged-assault/

Generally I'm not into stereotypes but the instant someone gets out of their car to "have a word", you know the person is a dick.


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## Peter Armstrong (23 Aug 2012)

Why the driver feels the need to stop to tell then not to cycle side by side in beyond me, Only one side of the story, hard to know what realy happened.

Its legal and ok to ride side by side isnt it?


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## Rob3rt (23 Aug 2012)

Oh no......... a two abreast debate in the making. Quick answer, use your common sense!


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## Drago (23 Aug 2012)

It's not always appropriate, but it's totally lawful. It's not terribly safe two gexateaight side-by-side, cos if one rider has a problem he'll likely take the other rider with him. Thus the outside rider is best riding with their front wheel level with the inside riders rear.

And who made this driver the arbiter of who should and shouldn't pursue a lawful activity? He'd overtaken them and was on his merry way, so why did he need to stop for a chat with a 6'2" heavily built cyclist?

There could be another side to this, but the driver chose to start the confrontation and more fool him for not being as high up the food chain as he thought. I would say its funny, but this is how the likes of Kenneth Noye kill people - you gain nothing whatsoever from starting an argument with another road user and have a lot to lose if it gues sideways.


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## numbnuts (23 Aug 2012)

It's not a war as in “them and us” we have to share the road so common sence on both parts is needed.


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## MissTillyFlop (23 Aug 2012)

Drago said:


> It's not always appropriate, but it's totally lawful.


^^^^^^^ this.


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## Peter Armstrong (23 Aug 2012)

Rob3rt said:


> Oh no......... a two abreast debate in the making. Quick answer, use your common sense!


 
I dont think laws are made with common sense


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

OMFG. That sounds awful. The poor man.

Lime green cycling gear with a white bike


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## Cyclopathic (23 Aug 2012)

numbnuts said:


> It's not a war as in “them and us” we have to share the road so common sence on both parts is needed.


This common sense, rational approach to the situation isn't going to get us anywhere. It is obvious to me from the account given that the cyclists were acting in self defense and used tha absolute minimum force necessary to protect themselves from being killed. 
The fact that the driver was in a BMW seems not to be in dispute nor the fact that he remonstrated with the cyclist. Combined with the fact that one of the cyclists was wearing lime green the notion of self defense is irrefutable.


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

The other cyclist was clearly a ninja, along with his ten ninja mates the driver failed to see in their peleton. You don't f*ck with da ninja's.

[srsly]Having safely passed the riders it's seems bloody minded to actually stop and finger wag at them. However, their are too many unknowns from the story to know what really happened, clearly the driver will underplay his part in the incident; "So, then your Honour, I told them "to get out of the f*ckin way you c*nts..." not very likely, eh?.[/srsly]


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## Kiwiavenger (23 Aug 2012)

> The motorist had been driving a black BMW car in the direction of South Muskham.


 
i'd want to kick it regardless of the drivers attitude! joking

as an aside when i see bikes being ridden badly i will mutter something under my breath in the car (the missus is more vocal) but wouldnt stop, get out and confront the cyclists! even when riding i wont say anything (unless they pavement hop and put me in danger) apart from watch it or something similar and then teach by example.


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## BSRU (23 Aug 2012)

What sort of idiot confronts a "well built" 6ft2in cyclists dressed in Lycra


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## snorri (23 Aug 2012)

wheres_my_beard said:


> OMFG. That sounds awful. The poor man.
> Lime green cycling gear with a white bike


 
Quite appalling. 
I blame these cycling forums on the internet, they all have space devoted to Kit and Clothing, but when did you last see a Style section?


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

Someone call the Police. The Style Police.


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## 4F (23 Aug 2012)

The motorist had been driving a black BMW 

=
I am a cock and despite you lot riding within the rules of the highway code you have slowed my progress down therefore it is my right to get out of car and act like a tit further delaying my progress.


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## perplexed (23 Aug 2012)

wheres_my_beard said:


> OMFG. That sounds awful. The poor man.
> 
> *Lime green cycling gear* with a white bike


 
I thought Nibali was on the pro-cycle challenge thingy in America?


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## DCLane (23 Aug 2012)

From the article:

"The second cyclist was around 5ft 8ins tall and slightly built. He was wearing lime green cycling gear and was riding a white bike."

/runs and hides my lime green Castelli jersey and green & white helmet plus the white Secteur.

For the style police - I have _my own style_


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

BMW Assclown said:


> _I am a cock and despite you lot riding within the rules of the highway code you have slowed my progress down therefore it is my right to get out of car and act like a tit further delaying my progress._


 
LOL


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## PK99 (23 Aug 2012)

Peowpeowpeowlasers said:


> ....is more how I see this having happened.
> 
> http://velostage.com/cyclists-sought-after-alleged-assault/
> 
> Generally I'm not into stereotypes but the instant someone gets out of their car to "have a word", you know the person is a dick.


 
in the report it does not say the driver got out but that the cyclist opened the car door - does that make the cyclist a dick?


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

Replace "gets out" with "stops", then. Intentionally or not the driver created a confrontation when it was avoidable. I would be reluctant to stop after passing a stranger, let alone 2, to have a word about their actions, as people don't like this, and I would like to avoid being punched if possible.


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## dodgy (23 Aug 2012)

"Both were white and aged in their late 20s or early 30s. One was around 6ft 2ins tall and well-built. He was wearing black cycling gear and riding a black bike"

White, wearing black kit, in their 20s and 30s, on a black bike, athletic/well built. Doesn't exactly narrow it down much!


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## MissTillyFlop (23 Aug 2012)

PK99 said:


> in the report it does not say the driver got out but that the cyclist opened the car door - does that make the cyclist a dick?


Yes.


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## Dragonwight (23 Aug 2012)

Hulk Smash.


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## PK99 (23 Aug 2012)

wheres_my_beard said:


> Replace "gets out" with "stops", then.* Intentionally or not the driver created a confrontation when it was avoidable*. I would be reluctant to stop after passing a stranger, let alone 2, to have a word about their actions, as people don't like this, and I would like to avoid being punched if possible.


 
Much the same could be said about cyclists who get arsey about drivers' actions ( eg may of MathewT's videos)


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## Scruffmonster (23 Aug 2012)

If only the driver had been wearing a camera. "You're going to be on YouTube"


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## 400bhp (23 Aug 2012)

PK99 said:


> Much the same could be said about cyclists who get arsey about drivers' actions ( eg may of MathewT's videos)


 
You mean those actions that potentially put cyclists in danger.


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## 400bhp (23 Aug 2012)

Scruffmonster said:


> If only the driver had been wearing a camera. "You're going to be on YouTube"


 
You need to hold your nose whilst saying that.


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## Lee_M (23 Aug 2012)

dodgy said:


> "Both were white and aged in their late 20s or early 30s. One was around 6ft 2ins tall and well-built. He was wearing black cycling gear and riding a black bike"
> 
> White, wearing black kit, in their 20s and 30s, on a black bike, athletic/well built. Doesn't exactly narrow it down much!


 
course it does, its the Man from Milk Tray!


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## Scruffmonster (23 Aug 2012)

400bhp said:


> You need to hold your nose whilst saying that.


 
Hahahahaha

Too true. It's like the moment a camera gets mounted the voice changes accordingly. Similar to when someone comes out of the closet... Overnight voice transplant*.

*(Mass generalisations, no harm intended yadda yadda yadda)


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

OOOOH, Get HER!!


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## jdtate101 (23 Aug 2012)

dodgy said:


> "Both were white and aged in their late 20s or early 30s. One was around 6ft 2ins tall and well-built. He was wearing black cycling gear and riding a black bike"
> 
> White, wearing black kit, in their 20s and 30s, on a black bike, athletic/well built. Doesn't exactly narrow it down much!


yep loved that bit. That description covers about 90% of the male cycling population.


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## PK99 (23 Aug 2012)

400bhp said:


> You mean those actions that potentially put cyclists in danger.


 
No, that is why I pointed to Mathews posts , where he gets arsey with drivers who have not put him in danger


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## User6179 (23 Aug 2012)

Do we know if the BMW had a private plate?


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## alans (23 Aug 2012)

Peter Armstrong said:


> Its legal and ok to ride side by side isnt it?


 
It is legal,in fact I've not yet met a driver who is NOT riding siding by side,even when he is solo


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## addictfreak (23 Aug 2012)

Peter Armstrong said:


> Why the driver feels the need to stop to tell then not to cycle side by side in beyond me, Only one side of the story, hard to know what realy happened.
> 
> Its legal and ok to ride side by side isnt it?



Probably for the same reason that certain cyclists feel the need to tell drivers how to drive their cars.

But as you quite rightly say, we are only getting one side of the story.


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## wheres_my_beard (23 Aug 2012)

Eddy said:


> Do we know if the BMW had a private plate?


 
455 C10WN.

Possibly.


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## 400bhp (23 Aug 2012)

Eddy said:


> Do we know if the BMW had a private plate?


 
R55 3OL3


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## 400bhp (23 Aug 2012)

addictfreak said:


> But as you quite rightly say, we are only getting one side of the story.


 
No, we are getting a story with no sides. We like to live in la la land speculate here


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## Col5632 (24 Aug 2012)

Haha this thread has made me laugh, amount of people (who dont cycle) who say to me you shouldnt be riding side by side and i quickly tell them that there is nothing wrong with it and only when on a narrow road or the driver really cant get pass to i move over and let them past


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## Peowpeowpeowlasers (24 Aug 2012)

PK99 said:


> in the report it does not say the driver got out but that the cyclist opened the car door - does that make the cyclist a dick?


 
Well spotted, however, in my defence I'll still say that anyone who stops to "have a word" is a dick.


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## Matthew_T (24 Aug 2012)

Drago said:


> And who made this driver the arbiter of who should and shouldn't pursue a lawful activity? He'd overtaken them and was on his merry way, so why did he need to stop for a chat with a 6'2" heavily built cyclist?


Exactly. I can understand if someone felt they could 'take me on' as I am 5'6'' and weigh sub-9 stone.

I think that the driver has just explained to the cops his side of the story to make himself look good, and that the cyclists will look bad if they say anything otherwise.

It does sound (from the drivers POV) that the cyclists were way over the top with the car kicking and "opened drivers door and punched driver in face" actions.


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## Matthew_T (24 Aug 2012)

PK99 said:


> No, that is why I pointed to Mathews posts , where he gets arsey with drivers who have not put him in danger


I have learnt the error of my ways now and havent posted such things in a while. Just look at my channel. The most recent post is a SMIDSY at a roundabout with a dozzy driver who could have easily taken me out. Before that I just have videos of club rides. I dont upload much nowadays.


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## Crankarm (24 Aug 2012)

If the scenario was reversed ie the cyclists had made a complaint to police would it have been taken as seriously? Maybe, but maybe not. Kicking a BMW if this is what actually happened is a serious offence. It might even be on Crime Watch.


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## Mugshot (24 Aug 2012)

Peowpeowpeowlasers said:


> Well spotted, however, in my defence I'll still say that anyone who stops to "have a word" is a dick.


Really? Anyone?


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## Col5632 (25 Aug 2012)

Matthew_T said:


> I have learnt the error of my ways now and havent posted such things in a while. Just look at my channel. The most recent post is a SMIDSY at a roundabout with a dozzy driver who could have easily taken me out. Before that I just have videos of club rides. I dont upload much nowadays.


 
Very glad to hear it Matthew


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## PK99 (25 Aug 2012)

Peowpeowpeowlasers said:


> Well spotted, however, in my defence I'll still say that anyone who stops to "have a word" is a dick.





Peowpeowpeowlasers said:


> Well spotted, however, in my defence I'll still say that anyone who stops to "have a word" is a dick.


 
Would that include the many camera cyclists who show themselves stopping to "have a word" ?


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## wheres_my_beard (25 Aug 2012)

This is my uber- analysis of what "went down":

It starts off relatively fine:

- Side by side riding - OK, with discretion
- Overtaking cyclists - OK, if safe to do so

Yes, the cyclists could have gone single file, but are not obliged to if the road conditions do not warrant it.




Highway Code said:


> You should ...never ride more than two abreast, and ride in single file on narrow or busy roads and when riding round bends


 
I'm not sure if a single car makes a road "busy" or not, and that stretch of road is not narrow.

However:

- Stopping to confront other road used - potential for inflamming emotions/ frustrations
- Kicking Car - Criminal Damage
- Punching someone in the face - Assault, possibly Aggrevated Assault as the victim had to be pulled from his car

For me although the driver is clearly the legal victim in this situation (edit) - _if his account is accurate_, I can't help feeling that it could have been avoided by not stopping in the first instance. Much in the same way that cyclists who confront drivers angrily open themselves to further malice.




Highway Code said:


> You should... not allow yourself to become agitated or involved if someone is behaving badly on the road. *This will only make the situation worse*. Pull over, calm down and, when you feel relaxed, continue your journey.


 
This applies to both parties, and could have a avoided this needless confrontation and bad press for all.

So in short, it seems that not only the driver, but the two cyclists, are infact dicks. And the two cyclists are quite rightly going to face criminal charges hopefully.

I look forward to your well considered critiques!


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## Hip Priest (25 Aug 2012)

We don't know what happened, but I'm certainly not going to side with a person who allegedly assaulted someone simply because they favour the same mode of transport as I.


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## TonyEnjoyD (25 Aug 2012)

wheres_my_beard said:


> OMFG. That sounds awful. The poor man.
> 
> Lime green cycling gear with a white bike



Must be ex army.....Major Faux Pas


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## wheres_my_beard (25 Aug 2012)

TonyEnjoyD said:


> Must be ex army.....Major Faux Pas


 
I didn't realise we knew his name and rank.


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## GrumpyGregry (25 Aug 2012)

sounds like three dicks found themselves sharing the same road space with inevitable consequences.


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## CopperCyclist (25 Aug 2012)

I always like investigating assaults. You take the victims statement, to find that they are a completely upstanding member of the community, and the assault was utterly unprovoked, occurring without warning from a total drunken stranger. Oh, and they definitely weren't drunk, just 'merry'.

If you catch up with the stranger, you then find out from them that actually, they were simply minding their own business, doing nothing when for no reason, a drunk stranger came up and tried to punch them, so in self defence they hit them, whilst shouting 'I say!' before managing to run away. Oh, and hey definitely weren't drunk, just 'merry'.

Then you watch the CCTV and see two very drunk idiots, posturing up to each other for a good few minutes before performing a decent impression of either a) two windmills built too near each other in a hurricane or b) an Olympic swimmer practising front crawl the only way possible whilst standing, with no access to water. One of said drunken idiots then comes out ahead on points, and gets to stagger off proudly, whilst the other picks up the pieces of his wounded pride, and in an attempt to justify the whole situation, decides to report the matter to the police.

Ok, I shouldn't be so cynical, but in ten years of watching CCTV I've been surprised just ONCE, and actually congratulated the victim in that matter for possibly being the only 100% accurate and truthful statement I've ever taken!


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## Banjo (27 Aug 2012)

If the guy got out of the car and threatened the cyclists then possibly fair enough but attacking him in his car was just gratuitous violence IMHO. The driver was an ar$ehole but unless he got out and approached them they should have rode on.

Lime Green and White is completely unforgivable anyway...


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## PK99 (27 Aug 2012)

Banjo said:


> I. The driver was an ar$ehole but unless he got out and approached them they should have rode on.
> 
> ..


 
Why was the guy an ar&ehole? He may well have been a cyclist who wanted to give good advise to other cyclists.


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## Part time cyclist (27 Aug 2012)

Had some moron in a white van this morning shouting at me on a roundabout, that I should be using a cycle path and not the road , twat.....


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## Drago (27 Aug 2012)

Copper Cylist is bang-on target. 9 out of 10 assaults I've picked up over the years were nothing of the sort. Most of them are shoving matches or various degrees of fisticuffs into which both parties willingly enter with gusto and the loser decides to phone the dibble. It's quite rare that a person is genuinely innocent.


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## User16625 (28 Aug 2012)

To me it seems that the BMW driver was an irritated pedantic banker who wanted to take on a couple of roiders on bikes. Must have been fun to watch.


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## steveindenmark (28 Aug 2012)

The "Double standards" on here always make me smile.

It is not ok for driver to stop and tell cyclists not to ride 2 abreast but it is ok for a cyclist to tell a driver not to use a phone whist driving (We have had that one on here).

There will always the odd occasion when someone gets walloped because there is just as many Dic#head cyclists as there are Dic#head drivers at the end of the day.

In this case the driver was thicker than the cyclists. Why get confrontational with your mouth when you have a 100mph, metal box to be confrontational with? 

Steve


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## Peowpeowpeowlasers (28 Aug 2012)

PK99 said:


> Would that include the many camera cyclists who show themselves stopping to "have a word" ?


 
Many but not all of them.


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## Nigel-YZ1 (29 Aug 2012)

There's nothing wrong with black BMWs (apart from being a bitch to keep clean, and rip-off parts prices).

Just another idiot with a point to make against cyclists, and a pair of cyclists who decided GBH and vandalism was the way to deal with an idiot.


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## zizou (29 Aug 2012)

steveindenmark said:


> The "Double standards" on here always make me smile.
> 
> It is not ok for driver to stop and tell cyclists not to ride 2 abreast but it is ok for a cyclist to tell a driver not to use a phone whist driving (We have had that one on here).


 
How on earth is that a double standard? Complaining about someone doing something which is legal and safe (although sometimes inconsiderate of other road users) is not the same as complaining about someone doing something which is illegal and unsafe and puts other road users at danger!


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## 400bhp (29 Aug 2012)

Nigel-YZ1 said:


> There's nothing wrong with black BMWs (apart from being a bitch to keep clean, and rip-off parts prices).


 
And orange peel


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## Nigel-YZ1 (29 Aug 2012)

400bhp said:


> And orange peel


 
That too, lol. But not too bad on mine 
But my old Pug 306 looked like a photo of the moon!


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## BLUE(UK) (29 Aug 2012)

Hi, I am quite new to here so will therefore be dismissed as another 'know all'.
Without knowing the facts, we cannot really judge any of the people involved in this story. For all we know, the car driver could have got out of his car,blocking the escape route of the cyclist forcing them to stop and entered the cyclists 'personal space' in a threatening manner,potentially causing the cyclist to feel threatened for his life/wellbeing so keeping within his right to defend himself,he used a pre-emptive strike to allow himself room to get away from such danger. This is well above board and is within the law.
If indeed,the cyclist did open the door to strike the driver or did so through his window, the only excuse which would get him off was that the driver threatened to shoot/knife them and went to reach into his glove box at which point the cyclist had no chance of escaping and therefore tried to buy himself a bit of extra getaway time because he genuinely feared for his life.
It could be totally different to that and the cyclist is fully to blame, like i say, we don't know the facts.

I write the above having spent 15yrs in the security industry in volatile situations on every shift and whilst not proud of it, I have been arrested on many occasions and yet never charged even though what I had done many people would consider to be very serious offences. It's not what you do,but what you say.

Yes, I am 6' 2,do wear black cycling gear,riding a graphite bike and I am a large build etc but luckily I ride solo.


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## User16625 (29 Aug 2012)

BLUE(UK) said:


> Hi, I am quite new to here so will therefore be dismissed as another 'know all'.
> Without knowing the facts, we cannot really judge any of the people involved in this story. For all we know, the car driver could have got out of his car,blocking the escape route of the cyclist forcing them to stop and entered the cyclists 'personal space' in a threatening manner,potentially causing the cyclist to feel threatened for his life/wellbeing so keeping within his right to defend himself,he used a pre-emptive strike to allow himself room to get away from such danger. This is well above board and is within the law.
> If indeed,the cyclist did open the door to strike the driver or did so through his window, the only excuse which would get him off was that the driver threatened to shoot/knife them and went to reach into his glove box at which point the cyclist had no chance of escaping and therefore tried to buy himself a bit of extra getaway time because he genuinely feared for his life.
> It could be totally different to that and the cyclist is fully to blame, like i say, we don't know the facts.
> ...


 
Steroids are your friends mate. It helps that your trained in self defence etc too. But from the sound of it what you have done to people were out of fear for yours or others well being and therefore considered to be reasonable force.


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## BLUE(UK) (29 Aug 2012)

Hi, there's a few assumptions in your post. 
I don't know how you come to think that steroids/AAS are my friends, I'm guessing that you're stereotyping me? I've yet to embark down that avenue actually. 
Martial arts, i wasn't taught, I did spar with guys who trained in various arts and picked up tips but was never taught as such by doing classes. 

:-)


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## steveindenmark (30 Aug 2012)

Zizou, you are just as likely to be punched for doing something "Inconsiderate" as you are illegal, probably more so.

Whichever way you look at it, there are occasions where people should just mind their own business and get on with their own lives.

Steve


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