# Hernia mesh concerns



## Bill Gates (2 Nov 2019)

I've been offered an operation for a double hernia and the procedure includes placing a mesh over the open hernia. Then they use sutures, tacks or surgical glue to hold the mesh in place. Over time, the tissue should grow into the small pores in the mesh and strengthen the muscle wall. This creates scar tissue that strengthens the hernia site. Most mesh repairs are permanent, meaning the implant remains in the body for the rest of the patient’s life.

Now the problem is potential side effects that no one told me about at the hospital. Nearly one-third of people who undergo hernia surgeries experience some sort of complication, with excessive pain being the most frequent complaint, according to one study.

Up to 170 000 patients who have had hernia mesh operations in the past six years could be experiencing complications, yet NHS trusts in England have no consistent policy for treatment or follow-up with patients.

Around 570 0000 hernia mesh operations have taken place in England over the past six years, figures from NHS Digital show. Leading surgeons think that the complication rate is between 12% and 30%, meaning that between 68 000 and 170 000 patients could have been adversely affected in this period.

Patients who had had hernia mesh operations told the programme about being in constant pain, unable to sleep, and finding it difficult to walk or even pick up a sock. Some patients said that they felt suicidal.

When I phoned the hospital to discuss this with the surgeon he postponed the operation and gave me another consultative appointment. I cancelled this and have withdrawn from the waiting list. The hernia causes me no discomfort or pain so I'm going to see how it goes.

Anyone had this operation and if so, how's it going?


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## welsh dragon (2 Nov 2019)

This problem has been in the news quite a lot over the last couple of years. If it works, it works well however if it gods wrong then the results can leave the sufferer in agony and literally leaves them disabled. This applies to a lot of women , I'm not sure how it affects men to.be honest.

I was under the impression that treating conditions that require the use of mesh should be not undertaken if it is at all possible. There is an alternative operation however surgeons prefer the mesh method as it is a relatively quick and cheap operation.

Personally I would never have it implanted. However I think you would be better of getting some independent advise. A second opinion might be the way to go.

On the other hand, if it aint broke then I wouldn't fix it either..I'd leave well alone.


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## Rocky (2 Nov 2019)

I've not had this surgery but there is a Cochrane Review on it. These reviews bring together a range of researchand draw conclusions from these multiple studies. I'm not sure how familiar you are with medical statistics but here is the link:

https://www.cochranelibrary.com/cdsr/doi/10.1002/14651858.CD011517.pub2/full

The abstract, as you can probably see, concludes: _Mesh and non‐mesh repairs are effective surgical approaches in treating hernias, each demonstrating benefits in different areas. Compared to non‐mesh repairs, mesh repairs probably reduce the rate of hernia recurrence, and reduce visceral or neurovascular injuries, making mesh repair a common repair approach. Mesh repairs may result in a reduced length of hospital stay and time to return to activities of daily living, but these results are uncertain due to variation in the results of the studies. Non‐mesh repair is less likely to cause seroma formation and has been favoured in low‐income countries due to low cost and reduced availability of mesh materials._

The findings are summarised as: _hernias are out-pouchings of an organ through the body wall that normally contains it; in this review, we refer to the bowel or its surrounding fatty tissues protruding through the abdominal wall in the groin region. This is a very common medical problem, affecting 27 out of every 100 men. These hernias can cause significant discomfort, and can occasionally become so tightly stuck that the blood supply can be cut off (strangulation), requiring emergency surgery. The curative treatment of hernias is surgical repair, which can be closed with sutured techniques (non-mesh repair) or with a fine mesh to promote tissuegrowth to strengthen the previously weak area (mesh repair). Mesh repair is becoming increasingly popular in many countries, particularly in conjunction with laparoscopic (key-hole) surgery._

That would suggest that you will be fine but it is worth discussing with your GP, who should be able to interpret this review and make the appropriate re-referral.

(BTW I'm not clinically qualified - I'm a social scientist.........and we all know how much use they are).


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## Cycleops (2 Nov 2019)

Medical science is always evolving and if there are know problems then I'm sure it will come up with a better alternative in the fullness of time.
If it isn't giving you any discomfort I think the thing to do is hang on and watch developments. The complications rate is not very encouraging. I know someone who did have the operation and he had no ongoing problems.
I just hope things work out for you.


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## roadrash (2 Nov 2019)

like the dragon said upthread......if it aint broke , don't fix it


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## vickster (2 Nov 2019)

welsh dragon said:


> This problem has been in the news quite a lot over the last couple of years. If it works, it works well however if it gods wrong then the results can leave the sufferer in agony and literally leaves them disabled. This applies to a lot of women , I'm not sure how it affects men to.be honest.
> 
> I was under the impression that treating conditions that require the use of mesh should be not undertaken if it is at all possible. There is an alternative operation however surgeons prefer the mesh method as it is a relatively quick and cheap operation.
> 
> ...


I believe that the issue with women Is that the mesh developed for hernia was used for vaginal prolapse without undergoing further clinical trials

@Bill Gates maybe get a second opinion, privately if needed and take it from there. However, surgery should always be a last resort so if you have no symptoms, pain and it affects you not a jot, then stay away from the knife!
Look for hernia on here via the search function as there have been numerous posts over the years. Bearing in mind there are different types of hernia


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## lane (2 Nov 2019)

Had a hernia mesh repair in the early 90s. My hernia was a significant problem and preventing me doing activities. I have had no issues and no recurance. I guess it is balance of risk but in the same circumstances I would not hesitate. My understanding is that mesh makes recurance less likely which I would rate as important.


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## tom73 (2 Nov 2019)

Mrs 73 has seen and looked after many a hernia over the years inc pre and post op. 
She’s never known anyone have an issue with mesh repair. 
She too can’t see an issue of leaving it be if it’s not an issue.
Just keep an eye on it if in doubt see your GP.


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## Bill Gates (3 Nov 2019)

There is a class action in the USA over this mesh.

https://www.classaction.com/hernia-mesh/lawsuit/


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## JohnHughes307 (3 Nov 2019)

I had an umbilical hernia repaired with mesh about 12 years ago. That was private as my job gave me BUPA cover at the time. It worked but a number of medical professionals have remarked in the size of the scar and there is still one place (actually I side my navel 😲) where there is a sharp bit of mesh poking me and it is sometimes quite painful.


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## tom73 (3 Nov 2019)

Sounds like an old school surgeon the bigger the incision the better.


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## Illaveago (3 Nov 2019)

I have had the operation. It was a walk in and hobble out done under a local anesthetic .
I have had no problems as such from the mesh apart from a bit of a pulling type niggle which has now gone .
What I did have a problem with was blood draining down into my scrotum! 
It was agony! I went to my hospital and saw a female doctor who didn't know what to do apart from suggesting paracetamol.
I spent the next week walking around like John Wayne with my bits the size of a small melon, coloured a blackish purple covered in a damp flannel.
I think they now mention to patients that this can happen as one of the side effects. 
My friend had the same operation a month later and was fine with no side effects .


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## vickster (3 Nov 2019)

Bill Gates said:


> There is a class action in the USA over this mesh.
> 
> https://www.classaction.com/hernia-mesh/lawsuit/


If you have concerns, consult a specialist centre like the BHC before deciding whether to proceed or not and understand what the alternatives are if any 
https://www.hernia.org/


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## screenman (3 Nov 2019)

vickster said:


> If you have concerns, consult a specialist centre like the BHC before deciding whether to proceed or not and understand what the alternatives are if any
> https://www.hernia.org/



That is where I had mine done 20 years ago, out shopping the next day and on the bike two weeks after. Best £1,000 I have ever spent.


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## vickster (3 Nov 2019)

screenman said:


> That is where I had mine done 20 years ago, out shopping the next day and on the bike two weeks after. Best £1,000 I have ever spent.


Won't be a grand now though...maybe 3 or more


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## Levo-Lon (3 Nov 2019)

My friend had a mesh one and that burst open, they re-done it and removed his belly button for a better fit or something, he did have a fair bit of time off but its fine now with no pain.
Couple of years now


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## Proto (4 Nov 2019)

Yes, I’ve had an inguinal hernia repair with a mesh insert. Not a perfect result but satisfactory, and no ongoing pain.

My third repair, approx ten years ago. I first had my left side repaired nearly 40 years ago (I blame some heavy duty military lorry batteries). It failed again many years later and surgical team suggested a repair with mesh. Fairly sure I stayed in one night, home next day.

Everything went well, my only complaint is the groin has remained very slightly swollen, and there is some very minor numbness in the area of the incision. I’ve never had any pain, though, so I’m happy enough with the result.

edit: NHS, Churchill Hospital, Oxford.


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## Andy in Germany (4 Nov 2019)

Bill Gates said:


> I've been offered an operation for a double hernia and the procedure includes placing a mesh over the open hernia. Then they use sutures, tacks or surgical glue to hold the mesh in place. Over time, the tissue should grow into the small pores in the mesh and strengthen the muscle wall. This creates scar tissue that strengthens the hernia site. Most mesh repairs are permanent, meaning the implant remains in the body for the rest of the patient’s life.
> 
> Now the problem is potential side effects that no one told me about at the hospital. Nearly one-third of people who undergo hernia surgeries experience some sort of complication, with excessive pain being the most frequent complaint, according to one study.
> 
> ...



I had this op in the UK in 1999 after an 18 month wait. It didn't hurt too much but failed a year later and I had to have a repeat in Germany. It took ten days, was repaired with nylon stitching and I haven't had a squeak since.

Thankfully I wasn't a resident in Germany so the NHS had to pay for their own mess.


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## CXRAndy (4 Nov 2019)

lane said:


> Had a hernia mesh repair in the early 90s. My hernia was a significant problem and preventing me doing activities. I have had no issues and no recurrence. I guess it is balance of risk but in the same circumstances I would not hesitate. My understanding is that mesh makes recurrence less likely which I would rate as important.



I had a mesh umbilical hernia repair late 90's. It was uncomfortable for a bit, but the repair was successful. Keeping weight under control to lower visceral fat helps with abdomen hernias


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## oldwheels (11 Nov 2019)

I have had two hernia ops. in the last six years, both with mesh. There have been no side effects apart from an issue mentioned by another poster with the second op. I was also doing the John Wayne walk with spectacular bruising. I went to our local A&E and got a consultant who seemed to know about this side effect and reassured me that the colouration would go away gradually. She also agreed with my observation that it would be a good idea to warn patients about this side effect which is apparently not uncommon.


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## kingrollo (2 Dec 2019)

Mesh repair no side effects - although it did give me grief for about a year if I over did it in the gym - go for it - especially as they are trying to stop doing these on the NHS - wait and you could end up having to pay.


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## Dave7 (7 Dec 2019)

I had a double groin hernia done 30+ years ago. Surgeon told me to have one then go for the 2nd one 12 weeks later........but I didnt listen.
I was in serious pain for 4 weeks, off work for 6 weeks. Took 12 months before I was comfortable but no problems since.
Mine was two BIG cuts but I believe its all micro now ???


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## Accy cyclist (22 Dec 2019)

I had my 'big' hernia done in July 2017 and the smaller one done about 6 months later. The big one got so big and bad i had to have it done,after 10 long years of putting it off. I had some burning sensation 2 days later which was very painful and worrying as i had a panic thinking i had internal bleeding or something. I went back to the hospital the following day and they checked me over and said it was just post op' pain. I had the smaller one done and it was painless. I use the 'ab crunch' machine at the gym. I haven't had any problems with the straining of the muscles around that area. I'd recommend having it done.


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## figbat (22 Dec 2019)

I had mine done around 1999, just one side. After the initial discomfort of the operation (around 2 weeks) it hasn’t given me a moment’s problem since. In fact I usually forget I have had it done - even the scar is largely invisible.


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## kingrollo (23 Dec 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I had a double groin hernia done 30+ years ago. Surgeon told me to have one then go for the 2nd one 12 weeks later........but I didnt listen.
> I was in serious pain for 4 weeks, off work for 6 weeks. Took 12 months before I was comfortable but no problems since.
> Mine was two BIG cuts but I believe its all micro now ???


Theres open or micro (laparoscopic or something) - I was told there wasn't much in it in terms of post op recovery. although labro in less invasive they are "in there" longer. 
I had open with Mesh - sure it was pretty painful for a week - then took it easy for a few weeks after that. Its very basic surgery - if it needs doing get it done.


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## Enigma2008 (26 Dec 2019)

I was diagnosed with a rh hernia just over two years ago. Have to say mine was troublesome, bulging and giving me significant pain when standing. The surgeon described the operation and use of mesh, have to say I just accepted the process and it's use as the norm. 
In and out in a morning, on the turbo eight days later. It's now two years and I've not experienced any discomfort whatsoever. I've trained and raced in the TT position many times since, no issues at all. 
Glad I had it done though we're all different and react differently. Best wishes to anyone in need of the op and season's greeting to all.


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## GM (10 Jul 2021)

vickster said:


> Won't be a grand now though...maybe 3 or more




Thread revival...You're spot on, had mine done last Tuesday for £3200+200 for consultation. At least it's one less patient for the NHS 

There goes the new bike


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## Rocky (10 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> Thread revival...You're spot on, had mine done last Tuesday for £3200+200 for consultation. At least it's one less patient for the NHS
> 
> There goes the new bike


Here's wishing you a speedy recovery, GM. I hope all is well


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## Andy in Germany (10 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> Thread revival...You're spot on, had mine done last Tuesday for £3200+200 for consultation. At least it's one less patient for the NHS
> 
> There goes the new bike



Get well soon.

Just a tip: be careful who you hang out with over the next couple of weeks. I went on a train trip with several very good friends about a month after the OP and laughed so much I had to go to the bog and check I hadn't broken the stitching...


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## Accy cyclist (10 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> Thread revival...You're spot on, had mine done last Tuesday for £3200+200 for consultation. At least it's one less patient for the NHS
> 
> There goes the new bike



Sorry if you've explained before,but why did you go private for a hernia op'?🤔


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## GM (10 Jul 2021)

Accy cyclist said:


> Sorry if you've explained before,but why did you go private for a hernia op'?🤔




The way I looked at it was I would have had to wait at least two years before I would have even been seen by the NHS. Being 72 next week I've got a big bucket list to do!


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## Rocky (10 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> The way I looked at it was I would have had to wait at least two years before I would have even been seen by the NHS. Being 72 next week I've got a big bucket list to do!


Happy birthday for next week GM. Have a great time!!........perhaps the family will have bought you a new bike, after all


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## GM (10 Jul 2021)

Rocky said:


> Happy birthday for next week GM. Have a great time!!........perhaps the family will have bought you a new bike, after all




Thanks, ha ha! I think l've more chance of winning the lottery... But you never know, one lives in hope


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## lane (10 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> Thread revival...You're spot on, had mine done last Tuesday for £3200+200 for consultation. At least it's one less patient for the NHS
> 
> There goes the new bike



Good you got it done shame you have had to pay for it.


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## PaulSB (11 Jul 2021)

GM said:


> The way I looked at it was I would have had to wait at least two years before I would have even been seen by the NHS. Being 72 next week I've got a big bucket list to do!


I'm not a great fan of private health care though I would never criticise someone for choosing to use it.

I think this is a great reason to go private. Well done. 👏


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## bikingdad90 (11 Jul 2022)

Thread resurrection… I had a small umbilical hernia repaired on Saturday and now just over 48hrs post op. The swelling is starting to come through now along with the bruising. You don’t realise how much you use your abs for day to day activities and mundane things like blowing your nose!

Currently finding it a struggle to go between sitting up and lying down. Got a sick note for 3 weeks. Already bored of both positions, I’m not a good patient. Only concession is that I’m knackered from having a sit and a little chat with the wife and then need to sleep!!


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## Andy in Germany (11 Jul 2022)

bikingdad90 said:


> I had a small umbilical hernia



I always read that as "Unbiblical".

You have a theologically unsound Hernia.


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## Cycleops (11 Jul 2022)

Sorry to hear that @bikingdad90 . I'm sure you'll be fine given time.
Umbilical hernia, is that where your belly button protrudes? See it a lot here especially among women. They never seem to bother doing anything about it. I guess it gets uncomfortable, hence the op.


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## bikingdad90 (11 Jul 2022)

@Cycleops. It’s where a piece of the intestine sticks through a hole in the abdomen. In women it often occurs because of pregnancy and in men it’s usually because of a weak spot from the womb. 

In my case the hernia sack wouldn’t fully go back into the belly when lying or coughing so was at increased risk of growing and eventual strangulation. I lasted 3 years after it’s happened before seeking treatment, partly due to covid. 

The operation only takes about 40mins but it’s the going under general anaesthetic and then recovery that takes the time. Was in an out in an afternoon. It was open surgery as it was still small in size and done private but in NHS rates because of waiting times. 

@Andy in Germany I’d love to laugh but alas it hurts!!!


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## Andy in Germany (11 Jul 2022)

bikingdad90 said:


> @Andy in Germany I’d love to laugh but alas it hurts!!!



Ooops. Sorry. I've had three hernias, and I know how that feels. A couple of weeks after #3 repair I made the mistake of travelling on a train with a group of friends to from Munich to Vienna; I laughed so hard I actually had to go to the loo on the train to check I hadn't ruptured anything.


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