# Older Bickertons? Any Good for a 10 mile round trip with an occasional scenic detour?



## Sheffield_Tiger (22 Apr 2014)

Considering a folder once again and a Bickerton seems like it could be a savvy buy as a project..

How do they compare to something like a Brommie for a 5-mile each way commute (slightly hilly but do-able on a 3-speed nexus) but with the odd 10-20 mile detour on a nice evening when the mood takes me?


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## sreten (24 Apr 2014)

Hi,

My budget folder can do a 10 to 15 mile round trip no real problem.
However turning 10 miles into 30 miles occasionally it doesn't do.
Comfort issues rear their head if I try too much mileage in a day,
whilst their are no issues doing a reasonable mileage on it.

So I don't. I ride my other bike for the longer rides.

rgds, sreten.


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## Brommyboy (24 Apr 2014)

Get hold of 'Daisy, Daisy' by Christian Miller. She rode her Bickerton across America. The Bickerton steers itself towards potholes, etc, has two different sized wheels (16" & 14") and dismantles very small, but does not fold as well as the Brompton, nor ride as well. It is much lighter to carry.


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## byegad (24 Apr 2014)

The ride on an early Bickerton was... erm... well... flexible. They have a lot of give in the handlebars and feel very 'soft'. That said, if you like the feel 10 miles round trip would be fine.


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## seadragonpisces (24 Apr 2014)

I have a Bickerton with some rust on various parts, needs gears and brakes doing too, siezed up, but if you collect it you can have it. I was going to do it up as a project but have given up, am too busy dealing with the sale and completion of my house. I live in Datchworth, Herts.

I think the bike is more suited those slightly more vertically challenged (less than about 5' 9ish). I can best equate the experience of riding one to a Raleigh Chopper in my opinion.

Send me a PM if you are interested


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## TheDoctor (29 Apr 2014)

seadragonpisces said:


> I have a Bickerton with some rust on various parts, needs gears and brakes doing too, siezed up, but if you collect it you can have it. I was going to do it up as a project but have given up, am too busy dealing with the sale and completion of my house. I live in Datchworth, Herts.
> 
> I think the bike is more suited those slightly more vertically challenged (less than about 5' 9ish). I can best equate the experience of riding one to a Raleigh Chopper in my opinion.
> 
> Send me a PM if you are interested


You have PM!!


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## TheDoctor (29 Apr 2014)

Tried to PM you but couldn't. I'd love a Bickerton, and I'm just up the road from you.
PM me?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (30 Apr 2014)

seadragonpisces said:


> I have a Bickerton with some rust on various parts, needs gears and brakes doing too, siezed up, but if you collect it you can have it. I was going to do it up as a project but have given up, am too busy dealing with the sale and completion of my house. I live in Datchworth, Herts.
> 
> I think the bike is more suited those slightly more vertically challenged (less than about 5' 9ish). I can best equate the experience of riding one to a Raleigh Chopper in my opinion.
> 
> Send me a PM if you are interested



That's a very generous offer....I'm a little too far away to make that practicable however but thanks all the same. Although it looks like you do have interest in the machine!


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## spark303 (9 May 2014)

I rode a Bickerton on a ~15-20 mile round trip commute for a few months before getting my Brompton. 

The ride is incredibly disconcerting - scary some might say! Although I never actually had any problems, the amount of flex around the hinge on the main tube (along with the constant creaking noises) made me think the thing would snap in half at any minute. Apparently they were renowned for coming undone at the hinge while you were riding along. Luckily mine has the later hinge design that you can push shut with your foot as you're riding - I had to do that a few times...






Fun to ride though


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## seadragonpisces (22 May 2014)

TheDoctor said:


> You have PM!!


 
Hi 'TheDoctor' I have started a conversation with you, given some detail. I thgouht you could just message someone, sorry I havent used this feature in a long time. To save time I will give you my email here too seton.watson@gmail.com


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## T4tomo (23 May 2014)

I followd one for a while the other day, it didn't have bend a lot as it was ridden. I don't know why Bickerton bothered with the suspension parts as the frame as enough vertical give in it to give most mountain bikes a run for their money.


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## TheDoctor (7 Jun 2014)

I've now got the Bickerton from @seadragonpisces (and what a nice bloke he is!)
For all of it being a somewhat-seized project I put some air in the tyres and went up the road on it. Sure, the brakes could do with a fettle, and new cables and tyres wouldn't go amiss, but it rides well.
Once I've fettled it I shall take it for a longer ride and see how I go. I see no reason why a 10 mile ride should be out of the question, to (finally!!) answer the OP.


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## seadragonpisces (10 Jun 2014)

TheDoctor said:


> I've now got the Bickerton form @seadragonpisces (and what a nice bloke he is!)
> For all of it being a somewhat-seized project I put some air in the tyres and went up the road on it. Sure, the brakes could do with a fettle, and new cables and tyres wouldn't go amiss, but it rides well.
> Once I've fettled it I shall take it for a longer ride and see how I go. I see no reason why a 10 mile ride should be out of the question, to (finally!!) answer the OP.


 
Thanks Tony (same to you).
Glad you like the bike and am pleased it is going to a good home.
Have fun


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## TheDoctor (19 Jun 2014)

Here it is. It's not getting much attention at the moment, as I have a Carlton project too!
It seems Bicks were made not far from me, firstly Codicote and then Welwyn, so I'll have to ride it out there.
Not sure I've taken one of my bikes back to its birthplace before...


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## Ridgeways (4 Mar 2017)

The answer really depends upon how you set the bike up and how you ride it. The best part of Bickertons is their adaptability, and it is strange that so many people set them up as a sort of chopper-style monster, which will always be a practical headache and wobble all over the place. You can, however, set them up exactly as a racing or touring bike ought to be, respecting the optimum positions of Handlebars, cranks and saddle.

You have to be aware of how close pedals are to the ground when cornering, and you have to accept that you must never get out of the saddle – but with decent gearing you should never have to anyway.

I have ridden my own somewhere between 10 and 15 thousand miles over much of the world, in all weathers, and on all sorts of roads and dirt tracks, carrying everything I needed for self-sufficiency. For long-distance travelling when you want to use other forms of transport from time to to time [buses, trains, planes, cars, boats etc] there is nothing to equal them, even though some pretenders are more rigid and a more efficient ride.

For short every day commutes though, a stronger case could probably be made for the Brompton as a more easily folded item, and sacrificing light weight for more robustness in urban conditions.


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## velovoice (4 Mar 2017)

Ridgeways said:


> The answer really depends upon how you set the bike up and how you ride it. The best part of Bickertons is their adaptability, and it is strange that so many people set them up as a sort of chopper-style monster, which will always be a practical headache and wobble all over the place. You can, however, set them up exactly as a racing or touring bike ought to be, respecting the optimum positions of Handlebars, cranks and saddle.
> 
> You have to be aware of how close pedals are to the ground when cornering, and you have to accept that you must never get out of the saddle – but with decent gearing you should never have to anyway.
> 
> ...


Just checking you realise this thread is nearly 3 years old....?


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## Ridgeways (4 Mar 2017)

Yes, I did realise that it was an old thread. Was that against the rules? Apologies if so; was trawling through topics I could meaningfully respond to, in order to get past the initial post count barrier, and it gave an opportunity to post relevant information others could respond to if interested.


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## raleighnut (5 Mar 2017)

Ridgeways said:


> Yes, I did realise that it was an old thread. Was that against the rules? Apologies if so; was trawling through topics I could meaningfully respond to, in order to get past the initial post count barrier, and it gave an opportunity to post relevant information others could respond to if interested.


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## velovoice (5 Mar 2017)

Ridgeways said:


> Yes, I did realise that it was an old thread. Was that against the rules? Apologies if so; was trawling through topics I could meaningfully respond to, in order to get past the initial post count barrier, and it gave an opportunity to post relevant information others could respond to if interested.


Of course not! I was just checking, as you seemed to be "answering" a question and I wasn't sure you realised the OP may not be around anymore to see your response. More information about Bickertons and people's experience with them always good and welcome. In fact, I may just page my partner, who toured round Provence and climbed Mount Ventoux last year on his.... @Flying Dodo


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## Blue Hills (5 Mar 2017)

Ridgeways said:


> Yes, I did realise that it was an old thread. Was that against the rules? Apologies if so; was trawling through topics I could meaningfully respond to, in order to get past the initial post count barrier, and it gave an opportunity to post relevant information others could respond to if interested.


Yes - well said - I never understand why folk are "told off" for posting on old threads. After all it is "on topic" and therefore likely to seamlessly add to the knowledge on a particular topic for folk searching for the subject or just happily coming across it.

Folk are also now and again told off on forums for not searching for a subject before asking a question!

Can't win


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## Ridgeways (5 Mar 2017)

velovoice said:


> Of course not! I was just checking, as you seemed to be "answering" a question and I wasn't sure you realised the OP may not be around anymore to see your response. More information about Bickertons and people's experience with them always good and welcome. In fact, I may just page my partner, who toured round Provence and climbed Mount Ventoux last year on his.... @Flying Dodo



Thank you - a relief I haven't blotted my copybook so soon! If your partner is interested in touring Bickertons, I have begun posting some old photos of mine on a Bickerton Facebook site; it is going to take awhile before I catch up with converting slides of my travels to digital format, but at least I have made a start.


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## velovoice (5 Mar 2017)

I wouldn't go so far as to say he is interested in "touring Bickertons", more like... he is interested in confounding expectations.  He's busy hauling carloads of stuff to the tip today but I'll mention this thread to him this evening.


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## jefmcg (5 Mar 2017)

Blue Hills said:


> Yes - well said - I never understand why folk are "told off" for posting on old threads.


I don't think people are "told off". I do it to point out a thread is old so people don't spend time posting a detailed and helpful response to someone who solved their problem years ago.


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## Blue Hills (5 Mar 2017)

fair point, but little is new under the sun. Someone will have the same issue.


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## jefmcg (5 Mar 2017)

Blue Hills said:


> fair point, but little is new under the sun. Someone will have the same issue.


And fair point to you .... but it is possible that no one will ever again consider riding 25 miles on a early Bickerton.


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## jefmcg (5 Mar 2017)

@TheDoctor - Do you still have the beast above? ^^^^^


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## Ridgeways (5 Mar 2017)

jefmcg said:


> And fair point to you .... but it is possible that no one will ever again consider riding 25 miles on a early Bickerton.



The earliest Bickertons were in fact the best – the greatest problem lay in the misperceptions of most users, who failed to see them as serious bikes and set them up as ridiculous ‘chopper style’ contraptions, for which they were ill-suited. That is not to overlook certain design weaknesses in the mass-produced version. Harry Bickerton himself explained to me that his designed construction techniques could not be practically realised in production-line conditions, so that the compromise design inevitably failed to perform according to the originating design specs.

I, for one, having good reasons for confidence in my own Bickerton [admittedly extensively modified and re-built according to the original design concepts of its inventor, and incorporating some of his hand built prototypes], am still considering riding it rather more than 25 miles to complete it’s round-the-the-world travels.

Fact is, I have gone on several long distance trips in company with conventional cycles, and have left many of those trailing in the distance behind me – not because I am super-fit, but because the bike was better equipped for the job. As an example, on the London to Brighton ride I took part in one year [cannot for the life of me think what year that was], and not racing at all [not my thing], I finished well in the foreguard of participants, having ridden past most of those struggling to push their conventional bikes up the final hills on foot. I had the advantage of super low gears, possible because of the small wheel size.


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## Blue Hills (5 Mar 2017)

Ridgeways said:


> Harry Bickerton himself explained to me that his designed construction techniques could not be practically realised in production-line conditions,


Interesting bikes, and I'm old enough, as a young kid, to remember those TV adverts - but isn't that a failure of design?


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## Ridgeways (6 Mar 2017)

Blue Hills said:


> Interesting bikes, and I'm old enough, as a young kid, to remember those TV adverts - but isn't that a failure of design?



The production-line version? Yes. I don’t see that the original design concept was a design failure, just because assembly line workers could not reproduce what was essentially a craftsman’s job – except, I suppose, insofar as it was intended for mass production. I guess that is what you meant?

Still, for the great majority in normal use, they stood up well enough. Probably an instruction book would have helped a lot.

For serious use in rougher and laden conditions, the design modifications were fatal. Harry’s background was in aircraft engineering, and it was the epoxy laminating techniques used there that inspired his design. The worst design compromises when that construction technique was dispensed with, resulted in failures on the seat support stem, and on the front forks’ handlebar stem.

The central hinged joint was never good, but was easily improved.


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## Blue Hills (6 Mar 2017)

Yes, that's exactly what i meant ridgeways - if it was intended for mass production it should have been designed for that. Sounds like a good idea from the rest of your post to avoid any bike from an aero background. Mr dahon was also inspired, apparently, to go into bikes after an aero background. I have a dahon speed pro, wonderful fun bike in many ways but after my experiences with it i wouldn't want to go up in any plane mr dahon had had a hand in. The older i get the simpler i like my bikes.


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## Flying Dodo (6 Mar 2017)

jefmcg said:


> And fair point to you .... but it is possible that no one will ever again consider riding 25 miles on a early Bickerton.



Exactly!! There is just too much flex in the steering with the daft handlebars. As mentioned above by @velovoice, mine is now nicely converted with conventional bars, so no flex or nasty noises, and is fitted with Brompton wheels, including 8 speed rear hub so is fairly speedy. I did a nice 50 mile round trip last November, out into the Dutch countryside and didn't have any issues.


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## Ridgeways (6 Mar 2017)

I like my handlebars as they are [now], because I can carry a heavy rucksack on them, plus camera bag, in a very stable way. They are cut down pretty low anyway, and have hand-stops to rest against when leaning more forward, and the handlebar-end gear controls are less vulnerable and more convenient to use.

Gearing is 21 speed, 20" to 99", so goes as fast as I am capable of pedalling, while still suited for any hill or mountain I have ever climbed with it - fully laden. I have put a snap of it as avatar.


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## velovoice (7 Mar 2017)

I was behind a Bickerton with super tiny wheels going up Blackfriars Road yesterday. It was beautiful. I think the stem had been replaced as it was a long one like @Flying Dodo 's rather than ape-hangers. The weird thing was the rear wheel did not track exactly with the front - offset about an inch to the right.


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## TheDoctor (7 Mar 2017)

jefmcg said:


> @TheDoctor - Do you still have the beast above? ^^^^^


I do. I'm going to give it a bit of a fettle and probably sell it soon, as my bike collection is getting a little out of hand. I really don't need four folding bikes


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## Blue Hills (7 Mar 2017)

Possibly as well you aren't handy for this.

http://www.preloved.co.uk/adverts/show/116272317/saracen-2007-folding-bicycle.html


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## Flying Dodo (7 Mar 2017)

velovoice said:


> I was behind a Bickerton with super tiny wheels going up Blackfriars Road yesterday. It was beautiful. I think the stem had been replaced as it was a long one like @Flying Dodo 's rather than ape-hangers. The weird thing was the rear wheel did not track exactly with the front - offset about an inch to the right.



The rider might not have noticed that the locking lever had come undone, so that a small separation had taken place!


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## velovoice (7 Mar 2017)

Flying Dodo said:


> The rider might not have noticed that the locking lever had come undone, so that a small separation had taken place!


From what I could see - both while stopped at lights and then moving off - the lock looked okay and there was no visible movement in the main beam.


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## Ridgeways (16 Mar 2017)

Brommyboy said:


> Get hold of 'Daisy, Daisy' by Christian Miller. She rode her Bickerton across America. . . .



Just wanted to say thank you for the introduction. Have now got a copy and have started reading it.


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