# No longer being updated.



## jowwy (16 Dec 2021)

Anybody built any or have any on their property. I'm thinking of using a gabion structure to bring the levels of the garden up, as it slopes away slowly from the house...

This is what im thinking of, so i can also plant up the middle of the gabion too....it will be 9.2mtrs x 300mm x 300mm. The baskets wil cost me around £57 per 3m length........and then what ever i fill it with on top of that cost.


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## midlife (16 Dec 2021)

We have 3 as part of some benches, took way more rocks and stones to fill them than I thought !


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## jowwy (16 Dec 2021)

midlife said:


> We have 3 as part of some benches, took way more rocks and stones to fill them than I thought !


any pictures


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## midlife (16 Dec 2021)

I’ll take one when I get home. It’s just the supports for a bench but I was just commenting on the sheer volume of stuff required to fill them.


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## jowwy (16 Dec 2021)

midlife said:


> I’ll take one when I get home. It’s just the supports for a bench but I was just commenting on the sheer volume of stuff required to fill them.


yeh but the one im doing is only going to be 300mm high ( 30cm) and 300m wide ( 30cm ) also the middle will be full of soil for planting........so hoping the big stones we use to face the front of the gabion wont be too much, as the rear of the gabion will be chippings for drainage as you wont see the back end as it will be cover in soil and grass

i may use these to face the front and then use chippings in behind


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## Tail End Charlie (16 Dec 2021)

I used some last year. They are 60x60x200 cm. I decided on gabions for two reasons, I had a bit of a bank to hold back and a load of rubble from some building work which I needed to hide/ use up. I used some York stone and granite sets to face it, which worked well.

They were from gabionbaskets.co.uk who dealt with my order swiftly. I went for 4mm wire, rather than the standard 3mm, for peace of mind. One tip though, pay extra for the coils to hold them together, these make assembling them much easier and finishes them off quite neatly IMO.


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## All uphill (16 Dec 2021)

I do like a gabion. Personally I would fill them with local stone and earth and encourage wildlife and wildflowers to colonise them.


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## Randomnerd (16 Dec 2021)

Awful, ugly articles. 
Retaining wall in dry stone every time. Will last a lifetime, take up way less space and never rot, rust, sink.


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## Tail End Charlie (16 Dec 2021)

Randomnerd said:


> Awful, ugly articles.
> Retaining wall in dry stone every time. Will last a lifetime, take up way less space and never rot, rust, sink.


I know where you're coming from, but to build a good dry stone wall takes some skill, whereas gabions are dead easy, which even a muppet like me can't get wrong.
Exhibit A, a wall I did at my place. It looks OK, but I'm under no illusions that whatever stability it has is due to what's behind it.


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## jowwy (16 Dec 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> I know where you're coming from, but to build a good dry stone wall takes some skill, whereas gabions are dead easy, which even a muppet like me can't get wrong.
> Exhibit A, a wall I did at my place. It looks OK, but I'm under no illusions that whatever stability it has is due to what's behind it.
> View attachment 622455


Cant see any gabions in that picture…..lets keep it on topic fellas


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## lazybloke (17 Dec 2021)

I remember my civil engineering mates learning about gabions. The texts said they had a coefficient of friction of 1, meaning they could NEVER move.

With assumptions like that it's no wonder the occasional structure collapses.
See also short-sighted design decisions like tunnel linings with only a 100 year design life.


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## Randomnerd (17 Dec 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> I know where you're coming from, but to build a good dry stone wall takes some skill, whereas gabions are dead easy, which even a muppet like me can't get wrong.
> Exhibit A, a wall I did at my place. It looks OK, but I'm under no illusions that whatever stability it has is due to what's behind it.
> View attachment 622455


A muppet can make the gabion face look really awful without trying. Should at least be coursed and follow the walling rules for strength and aesthetics. Anyhow, we have been told off by the OP for not adhering to his instructions. He will be telling us to start our own thread soon. Maybe I will, and post a how-to video on basic stone-laying?
(Just to push his patience to the very limit…your wall is well-coursed and only compromised in one or two spots by a running joint; for retaining, and as a general rule “length in, strength in”, meaning the shorter face of the stone facing and the stone pointing ”length in”. And hide any foundation at subsoil level!)

Oh, his hair is on fire now. 

Whenever we’ve been asked for gabions, I’ve always managed to convince the client otherwise. I’ve a ready supply of photos from all over Yorkshire of the most massive retaining walls holding back incredible volumes of soil. in the OPs case he’s retaining hardly anything and has already let Kevin McLeod make up his mind for him, but for proper land stability, the friction and skill in walling far outweighs the speed and convenience of gabions.


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## Tail End Charlie (17 Dec 2021)

Randomnerd said:


> …your wall is well-coursed


Thanks, I'm happy with that!


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## Adam4868 (17 Dec 2021)

Just to de rail the thread a little more 😁 I allways fancied having a go at dry stone walling. Was booked on a course before Covid struck so obviously got put off.


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## T4tomo (17 Dec 2021)

Randomnerd said:


> A muppet can make the gabion face look really awful without trying. Should at least be coursed and follow the walling rules for strength and aesthetics. Anyhow, we have been told off by the OP for not adhering to his instructions. He will be telling us to start our own thread soon. Maybe I will, and post a how-to video on basic stone-laying?
> (Just to push his patience to the very limit…your wall is well-coursed and only compromised in one or two spots by a running joint; for retaining, and as a general rule “length in, strength in”, meaning the shorter face of the stone facing and the stone pointing ”length in”. And hide any foundation at subsoil level!)
> 
> Oh, his hair is on fire now.
> ...


You are right, but the cost difference between a skilled dry stone waller and DIY gabions is massive, and in this instance he isnt holding back a huge weight, so the quicker easier solution is appropriate

The OP would be well advised to take time and care on what the face looks like and once installed its damn hard to fix / change, and to realise this is a discussion board, topics will meander at will. Like a river they can be coaxed to a certain course but never directed.

Lovely bit of walling in your avatar @Randomnerd - its dying art.

Edit to say, if t'garden slopes away from t'ouse, then will anyone even see the face side? unless there is a path or something around the far side of the garden, so maybe.


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## Bonefish Blues (17 Dec 2021)

Randomnerd said:


> Awful, ugly articles.
> Retaining wall in dry stone every time. Will last a lifetime, take up way less space and never rot, rust, sink.


Tyres for the eco choice


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## Tail End Charlie (17 Dec 2021)

Adam4868 said:


> Just to de rail the thread a little more 😁 I allways fancied having a go at dry stone walling. Was booked on a course before Covid struck so obviously got put off.


Similarly I was going to do a course, but decided hedge laying was more useful for me, so did that instead.


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## mistyoptic (17 Dec 2021)

We used these pre-formed bricks as an easier option. They come from Marshall’s iirc and have a locking tab at the back, so each layer sits back slightly


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## Tenkaykev (17 Dec 2021)

That's a coincidence. I'm not a Civil Engineer but follow the Practical Engineering YouTube Channel. The last upload was all about retaining walls, and why they collapse.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--DKkzWVh-E


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## Bonefish Blues (17 Dec 2021)

Mine are always fine - I guess it helps I've got a restraining order and shoot


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## Gillstay (17 Dec 2021)

I would just do a simple dry stone wall. its easy esp after a bit of practice. Will look much better.


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## Randomnerd (17 Dec 2021)

T4tomo said:


> You are right, but the cost difference between a skilled dry stone waller and DIY gabions is massive, and in this instance he isnt holding back a huge weight, so the quicker easier solution is appropriate
> 
> The OP would be well advised to take time and care on what the face looks like and once installed its damn hard to fix / change, and to realise this is a discussion board, topics will meander at will. Like a river they can be coaxed to a certain course but never directed.
> 
> ...


Not sure it's a prohibitive cost. 
Say 5m2 with footings. If the stone is on hand, expect a good waller to charge £50 per m2. Barrow it to his/her fingertips and make him/her tea and biscuits. 
Two wallers would have it done in a day, and you get to watch. 
This notion that craft workers are untouchably expensive needs debunking, or the skill will die. Too many wallers have climbed the greasy pole and now call themselves designers. FFS. It is only stacking stone.


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## PaulSB (19 Dec 2021)

Tail End Charlie said:


> I know where you're coming from, but to build a good dry stone wall takes some skill, whereas gabions are dead easy, which even a muppet like me can't get wrong.
> Exhibit A, a wall I did at my place. It looks OK, but I'm under no illusions that whatever stability it has is due to what's behind it.
> View attachment 622455


I've attempted a couple of small walls in my garden. I wish they'd come out looking as good as this. Well done.

I've learned what a gabion is. I thought their purpose was to retain soil, rocks etc. in places where slippage could be a problem and in watercourses to protect a river or stream bank.


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## presta (19 Dec 2021)

Whenever I see gabions the first thing I think is how long will it take for that cage to rust away. They just look too temporary for my taste. Then I wonder how much long term settlement adds to the load on the cage over time.


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## jowwy (19 Dec 2021)

presta said:


> Whenever I see gabions the first thing I think is how long will it take for that cage to rust away. They just look too temporary for my taste. Then I wonder how much long term settlement adds to the load on the cage over time.


Cage is galvanised steel, so 35 to 50yrs in hard soil conditions, 75+ if soil is good


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## nickyboy (19 Dec 2021)

Randomnerd said:


> Awful, ugly articles.
> Retaining wall in dry stone every time. Will last a lifetime, take up way less space and never rot, rust, sink.


Agree...I am getting prices for a 20m x 1.5m retaining wall atm. Gabions are ugly things so no way. It'll be those stackable concrete blocks faced with some natural stone. Dry stone would be great but the price would be off the scale


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## berty bassett (19 Dec 2021)

I worked on one of the biggest gabion walls in Northants - I can remember it being 6 cages deep and god knows how many cages long - looked flipping ugly when done in my opinion 
Far better to have those stackable blocks with the lip at the back , no cement involved , doesn’t take up as much space , the matting that you can use in between the blocks is hidden and look nice - maybe dear but get what you pay for


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## jowwy (4 Jan 2022)

having done quite a bit of research and pricing over the xmas break...i've decided to go with sleepers, to keep in line with all the other timber structures i've built throughout the garden.....

so another end of 2022 project to add to the list, as i want to enjoy the garden this year, before i start tearing it up again


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## Drago (5 Jan 2022)

Aye Jowwers, same as wotmI have planned. Seasoned oak sleepers are surprisingly inexpensive, less damaging to the environment, and will outlast me.


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## jowwy (5 Jan 2022)

Drago said:


> Aye Jowwers, same as wotmI have planned. Seasoned oak sleepers are surprisingly inexpensive, less damaging to the environment, and will outlast me.


sleepers here are coming in at £29.29 for 2.4mtrs x 200mm x 100mm and i would need around 12........


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## Alex321 (5 Jan 2022)

jowwy said:


> sleepers here are coming in at £29.29 for 2.4mtrs x 200mm x 200mm and i would need around 12........


Totally off topic, but I've been wondering about buying one or two of those for turning. You'd get 8 bowls (8") out of each of those (16 if you made them 3" deep), and an 8" oak bowl blank is going to cost at least £10.


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## T4tomo (5 Jan 2022)

Drago said:


> Aye Jowwers, same as wotmI have planned. Seasoned oak sleepers are surprisingly inexpensive, less damaging to the environment, and will outlast me.


They are also surprisingly heavy. I remember years ago making a raised bed against a wall out of them, I only needed 3, when the chap forklifted the 2nd into the back of the Volvo (think it might have been an S70 back in the day) we looked at each other as the suspension settled and I decided to come back for the 3rd in a separate trip. The 2nd one was decided well seasoned.

Get them dropped as close to construction site as possible. They are easy to build with though, like lego just cross your joints if more than 1 layer. You can drill and hidden peg them quite easily for additional stability / security.

@Alex321 - might make things taste / smell of creosote though and potentially sticky to turn / sand?


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## jowwy (5 Jan 2022)

T4tomo said:


> They are also surprisingly heavy. I remember years ago making a raised bed against a wall out of them, I only needed 3, when the chap forklifted the 2nd into the back of the Volvo (think it might have been an S70 back in the day) we looked at each other as the suspension settled and I decided to come back for the 3rd in a separate trip. The 2nd one was decided well seasoned.
> 
> Get them dropped as close to construction site as possible. They are easy to build with though, like lego just cross your joints if more than 1 layer. You can drill and hidden peg them quite easily for additional stability / security.
> 
> @Alex321 - might make things taste / smell of creosote though and potentially sticky to turn / sand?


yeh im wondering whether to go with 1.2mtr lengths instead of 2.4s for ease of use.........i do everything solo and it could be a heavy job. already have to lift 4.8mtr 6x2s onto the pergola structure solo and they are damn heavy too


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## T4tomo (5 Jan 2022)

I did mine solo and used 2.4, but there was only 1 full length to lift, and I manoeuvred them around with a sack barrow, so one end was effectively on wheels, and choose the lightest one to be the top layer "face". I was 25 years younger than now mind. A longer length might be more stable if you need 2 layers, but half lengths are defo easier to manhandle.


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## jowwy (5 Jan 2022)

T4tomo said:


> I did mine solo and used 2.4, but there was only 1 full length to lift, and I manoeuvred them around with a sack barrow, so one end was effectively on wheels, and choose the lightest one to be the top layer "face". I was 25 years younger than now mind. A longer length might be more stable if you need 2 layers, but half lengths are defo easier to manhandle.


i will be laying 3 rows......but will be 200mm wide and 100mm deep, so 3 layers will give me the 300mm i'm looking to raise the garden. i will also be rebaring the first row into the ground and then screwing each row together with 200mm sleeper bolts.

if its still unstable i will drive this into the floor for added support


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## Alex321 (5 Jan 2022)

T4tomo said:


> @Alex321 - might make things taste / smell of creosote though and potentially sticky to turn / sand?


You can get untreated Oak ones (e.g. https://timbuild.co.uk/collections/railway-sleepers/products/oak-railway-sleepers-south-wales) - not that they use creosote any more, but other treatments wouldn't be much better.


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## T4tomo (5 Jan 2022)

jowwy said:


> i will be laying 3 rows......but will be 200mm wide and 100mm deep, so 3 layers will give me the 300mm i'm looking to raise the garden. i will also be rebaring the first row into the ground and then screwing each row together with 200mm sleeper bolts.
> 
> if its still unstable i will drive this into the floor for added support
> 
> View attachment 625085


i'm not a structural engineer , but given the amount of additional joining to each other and bars into the soil base, and the fact you are laying them on face rather than on edge, I can't see it moving anywhere, so half lengths will be much easier to handle and arguably a nice aesthetic face as more "brick" shaped


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## jowwy (5 Jan 2022)

T4tomo said:


> i'm not a structural engineer , but given the amount of additional joining to each other and bars into the soil base, and the fact you are laying them on face rather than on edge, I can't see it moving anywhere, so half lengths will be much easier to handle and arguably a nice aesthetic face as more "brick" shaped


yeh exactly what i thought....still costly though lol, but i use the garden a lot in summer, especially during the last two years, thats for sure


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## jowwy (8 Jan 2022)

Did a few calculations over the past few days and it works out that doubling up on 6x2s @4.8mtr lengths, works out half the price of sleepers…….so ive got 10 lengthe on order to arrive this week and going to get this project started next week end now, so it can all settle reasy for seasing in march.


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## jowwy (9 Jan 2022)

Did a few hours in the garden and got the first double row of 6x2 timbers in for the retainer………..only used 3 6x2s @4.8mtr lengths so far, so thats £69 ( got a few mtrs of those left to make the steps) compared to £132 if id use 6x4 sleepers @2.4mtrs


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## jowwy (9 Jan 2022)

Just ordered 54 bags of topsoil……hopefully they will arrive this week while its dry, so i can stack them on the lower deck.


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## jowwy (10 Jan 2022)

Ok


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## jowwy (11 Jan 2022)

Got another delivery of 6x2s today….my timber yard are happy with me thats for sure. So got enough now to do the deck roof, the retaining wall and to face all my planter boxes, so they look chunkier.

Will add some pictures tmrw when its sunnier outside.


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## jowwy (12 Jan 2022)

So last eveining i did the new fronts to the planter boxes in 6x2 timbers…..

so its gone from this



to this…….so from two small boxes, to one huge box with chunkier timber


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## jowwy (13 Jan 2022)

Second row fitted and secured, just need the steps to be put in now and then start filling


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## jowwy (13 Jan 2022)

60 bags arrived in the end….so 5 free


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## jowwy (14 Jan 2022)

Sand and chippings coming some time today - so should have the ground ready for topsoil this weekend


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## jowwy (14 Jan 2022)

So the step is now in and i have starting filling up the first 150mm of the slope


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## jowwy (16 Jan 2022)

More work today as i squared up and extended the gravel path that use to be grass, but just stays boggy in the winter as no sun gets to that area……..so some more 6x2s cut and 40 unwanted slabs and 20 edge stands was smashed up to help fill the void, before more pea gravel is added, before some decorative stuff is added to the top.


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## jowwy (25 Jan 2022)

more timber ordered today, to finish all the surroundings......also started the small deck extension on the side for the kitchen/eating area


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## jowwy (26 Jan 2022)

Picked up the deckboards earlier, so plan is to get the deck finished on the weekend, then start building the surrounding planter boxes for privacey………its all slowly coming together.


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## jowwy (2 Feb 2022)

Finished the new planter boxes earlier….

so they have gone from this



to looking like this





Will get them all refilled now with topsoil and compost, ready for the new plants in spring/summer. Just got to do the one on the right side of the pergola now, to match them up.


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## Colin Grigson (2 Feb 2022)

jowwy said:


> Finished the new planter boxes earlier….
> 
> so they have gone from this
> 
> ...


Looking better all the time jowwy


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## jowwy (2 Feb 2022)

Colin Grigson said:


> Looking better all the time jowwy


Its getting there grig……im hoping to be done before summer kicks in, so i can just sit and enjoy it this year.


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## jowwy (8 Feb 2022)

The build up of the garden is starting to take shape now as i have filled with the gravel and have now started to add the soil, sharp sand and compost


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## jowwy (11 Feb 2022)

Another 50+ bags of topsoil just arrived......garden is looking flatter now, but this weekends weather forecast means i will be staying well inside


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## jowwy (24 Feb 2022)

Nearly ready for seeding now - on tuesday i added 1000ltrs of topsoil and 400ltrs of sharp sand , last night i added 700ltrs of compost, with another 700ltrs in the car to be added this evening........will seed it all now on the weekend


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## Roseland triker (24 Feb 2022)

jowwy said:


> Nearly ready for seeding now - on tuesday i added 1000ltrs of topsoil and 400ltrs of sharp sand , last night i added 700ltrs of compost, with another 700ltrs in the car to be added this evening........will seed it all now on the weekend
> 
> View attachment 632482


Gosh !!! There's an artic fox in your garden....


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## CharlesF (24 Feb 2022)

That's looking superb, really good use of the space. looking forward to the next picture.


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## Milkfloat (24 Feb 2022)

jowwy said:


> Nearly ready for seeding now - on tuesday i added 1000ltrs of topsoil and 400ltrs of sharp sand , last night i added 700ltrs of compost, with another 700ltrs in the car to be added this evening........will seed it all now on the weekend


It looks really nice and all those lovely nutrients you have added is going to promote a lot of growth. Is it not a bit early for seeding as I thought you need a ground temperature of over 10 degrees? I have a lot of bare patches that a visiting dog created in my lawn that I am itching to repair but have been holding off for warmer weather.


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## jowwy (24 Feb 2022)

Milkfloat said:


> It looks really nice and all those lovely nutrients you have added is going to promote a lot of growth. Is it not a bit early for seeding as I thought you need a ground temperature of over 10 degrees? I have a lot of bare patches that a visiting dog created in my lawn that I am itching to repair but have been holding off for warmer weather.


no you can start seeding now and they will stay doormant for upto two months, but as the ground warms, they will start to germinate and the grass will start to grow ready for mid/late spring........


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## Milkfloat (24 Feb 2022)

jowwy said:


> no you can start seeding now and they will stay doormant for upto two months, but as the ground warms, they will start to germinate and the grass will start to grow ready for mid/late spring........
> 
> View attachment 632511


Every day is a school day. I always seem to wait until it is too late, just so I am not too early. I might create a mix of sand, seed and compost and chuck some down over the next few weeks.


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## jowwy (24 Feb 2022)

Milkfloat said:


> Every day is a school day. I always seem to wait until it is too late, just so I am not too early. I might create a mix of sand, seed and compost and chuck some down over the next few weeks.


exactly what i have been adding to the last few inches in the rebuild, i also use the same grass seed from the same supplier all the time, so i know what's growing out there.......just carried through 6 x 70ltr bags of compost from the car to the back garden now. Damn heavy too, but will all be worth it.

especially when i add the solar light network from the new solar project.


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## jowwy (2 Mar 2022)

Timber prices finally going down.......about time


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## Colin Grigson (2 Mar 2022)

jowwy said:


> Timber prices finally going down.......about time


I forecast the price peak being at exactly the time I put the roof on our new house - typical


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## jowwy (2 Mar 2022)

Colin Grigson said:


> I forecast the price peak being at exactly the time I put the roof on our new house - typical


Some timber here has now dropped nearly 60% in price……. 2x1 timber @4.8mtrs was 7.91 a length, now down to 3.47


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## AuroraSaab (3 Mar 2022)

Good to hear. We need to replace some of the cladding on our shed and garage. Priced up the timber at the end of last summer and it was a lot more than expected. Hopefully once the weather improves we can actually order some.


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## jowwy (3 Mar 2022)

AuroraSaab said:


> Good to hear. We need to replace some of the cladding on our shed and garage. Priced up the timber at the end of last summer and it was a lot more than expected. Hopefully once the weather improves we can actually order some.


Yeh im rebuilding my shed in the summer……last summer it was double the cost of what i priced the year before


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## Hicky (7 Mar 2022)

About time ref timber...I might build little legs a playground.


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

Got the tv and solar generator running today…..charging my tool batteries, ipad, phone and running the TV all off a 100watt solar panel


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

Also got the huge roof over the first 4m x 4.2mtr deck


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

And got the structure on the second deck ready for the roof…..which will be covering the kitchen area


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

Also the garden is now covered in grass too


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## Colin Grigson (26 Jun 2022)

jowwy said:


> Also the garden is now covered in grass too
> 
> View attachment 650595



That grass looks fantastic


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

Colin Grigson said:


> That grass looks fantastic



Yeh the grass is a real love of mine…..it gets cut to 25mm twice a day as to not stress the grass. Helps keep weeds down and also means your never cutting more than a 3rd of the grass length.


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## Alex321 (26 Jun 2022)

jowwy said:


> Yeh the grass is a real love of mine…..it gets cut to 25mm twice a day as to not stress the grass. Helps keep weeds down and also means your never cutting more than a 3rd of the grass length.



Twice a day?????

Surely you mean twice a week.


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## PK99 (26 Jun 2022)

jowwy said:


> Yeh the grass is a real love of mine…..it gets cut to 25mm* twice a day* as to not stress the grass. Helps keep weeds down and also means your never cutting more than a 3rd of the grass length.



Twice a day!


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

Alex321 said:


> Twice a day?????
> 
> Surely you mean twice a week.



No….twice a day, around 9am and again at 5pm, it also gets cut with a manual cylinder mower…and a worx battery strimmer for the edges.


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## PK99 (26 Jun 2022)

jowwy said:


> No….twice a day, around 9am and again at 5pm, it also gets cut with a manual cylinder mower…and a worx battery* strimmer for the edges.*



A brick mowing strip at lawn level, rather than grassing right up to the raised edges would have done away with the trimming chore.


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2022)

PK99 said:


> A brick mowing strip at lawn level, rather than grassing right up to the raised edges would have done away with the trimming chore.



I quite like the strimming, also the timber edge is above the grass level, so wouldnt be able to get the mower over it………this was how it looked back in march


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## jowwy (3 Jul 2022)

Been building an outdoor sofa using two single bed matresses and waterpoof material. The second matress hasnt been covered yet. But it will be a super comfy addition to the deck.


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## jowwy (7 Jul 2022)

Now we are getting there………


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## fossyant (7 Jul 2022)

jowwy said:


> Now we are getting there………
> 
> View attachment 651849



Handy with the staple gun, not the sewing machine ?👍


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## jowwy (7 Jul 2022)

fossyant said:


> Handy with the staple gun, not the sewing machine ?👍



The left hand one was done with a sewing machine, the right hand one, is being stripped and redone by the sowing machine lol……


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## fossyant (7 Jul 2022)

jowwy said:


> The left hand one was done with a sewing machine, the right hand one, is being stripped and redone by the sowing machine lol……



All good then. My Mrs is a bit of an expert - she's a bugger for being perfect (got through a few rounds of sewing bee applications a few years back)..


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## jowwy (7 Jul 2022)

fossyant said:


> All good then. My Mrs is a bit of an expert - she's a bugger for being perfect (got through a few rounds of sewing bee applications a few years back)..



My mrs aint bad and learning all the time……shes currently going through a 2nd rebuild of our indoor sofa as she learns new tricks and tips from the tube lol


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## jowwy (9 Jul 2022)

First spring onion out of the greenhouse….


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## jowwy (17 Jul 2022)

tomatoes coming along lovely in the greenhouse


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## jowwy (31 Jul 2022)

The privacey wall nearly finished, to stop the curtain twitchers looking down on the deck. Also stops the rain coming in and gives me a nice place to store the ladders and hide the solar cables that go upto the office.


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## jowwy (4 Aug 2022)

Privacey panel now added to the left with polycarb to allow light in, but no wind and rain


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## bikingdad90 (4 Aug 2022)

Looking good @jowwy. Will you be putting polycarb on the right hand side of the main screen or slatting it up?


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## jowwy (4 Aug 2022)

how it looks looking down the garden….the screen is basically sandwich between the slats front and back.


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## Colin Grigson (5 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> how it looks looking down the garden….the screen is basically sandwich between the slats front and back.
> 
> View attachment 655729
> 
> ...



That looks beautiful Jowwy - very relaxing !


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## Milkfloat (5 Aug 2022)

Colin Grigson said:


> That looks beautiful Jowwy - very relaxing !



You can tell he lives in Wales - in England that beautiful lush grass would be brown stubble with cracks in the mud.


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## jowwy (5 Aug 2022)

Milkfloat said:


> You can tell he lives in Wales - in England that beautiful lush grass would be brown stubble with cracks in the mud.



Not had rain here in weeks, but i have a big water butt and a hosepipe…….


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## jowwy (8 Aug 2022)

My next project……rebuild the front of this beast


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

Just put the sprinklers on, give the garden a good soaking in this heat………i live in wales before i get slammed, no hose bans here.


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## fossyant (14 Aug 2022)

Our water butt is in use with the greenhouse - pond pump ensuring the tomatoes and onions get water.

No ban here but washing water has been going on the front garden and hose used on back plants - not watering the lawn. That will just get washing water.


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## Randomnerd (14 Aug 2022)

Go on. I'll bite. 
Does it matter which country you live in? You seem quite happy with your bright green grass, and not entirely oblivious to the selfish senselessness of having green lawn stuff in a drought. Crack on. Get mowing. Entirely pointless, and an utterly narcissistic waste of time.


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## classic33 (14 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> Just put the sprinklers on, give the garden a good soaking in this heat………i live in wales before i get slammed, no hose bans here.
> 
> View attachment 657261


Welsh Water have a hosepipe ban coming in on the 19th August.


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## dave r (14 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> Just put the sprinklers on, give the garden a good soaking in this heat………i live in wales before i get slammed, no hose bans here.
> 
> View attachment 657261



Our lawns have been left alone as has most of the garden, I'm just using a watering can on plants that are struggling, I'll compose a casualty list next spring and then replace anything that hasn't come back.


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

classic33 said:


> Welsh Water have a hosepipe ban coming in on the 19th August.



Yeh in pembrokeshire……..long long long way from were i live


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

Randomnerd said:


> Go on. I'll bite.
> Does it matter which country you live in? You seem quite happy with your bright green grass, and not entirely oblivious to the selfish senselessness of having green lawn stuff in a drought. Crack on. Get mowing. Entirely pointless, and an utterly narcissistic waste of time.



Yes it does…….we are served by welsh resourvoirs not english ones and ours are currently fine. we also get our fair bit of rain, which keeps our resourvoir topped up quite well.

also theres no drought in wales and only in a few parts in england…….should scotland stop using thier water because you cant use yours?? I mean they havent had a heat wave like the south of the UK, but was you happy basking in the sun, while they were getting pissed on from above???

i mean, should we not use water because there are droughts in india and Ethiopia or was you quite happy using yours when that was happening???


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## Rusty Nails (14 Aug 2022)

dave r said:


> Our lawns have been left alone as has most of the garden, I'm just using a watering can on plants that are struggling, I'll compose a casualty list next spring and then replace anything that hasn't come back.



+1

I quite like the Outback look in a garden.


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## fossyant (14 Aug 2022)

We rob most of our water from Cumbria. That's even wetter than Manchester.


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

Maybe i should switch my air conditioner off, because some cant afford their electric too….or i shouldnt drive because some cant afford the petrol/diesel. I mean when do we stop doing things in case we upset others….

sheeesh.


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## postman (14 Aug 2022)

My moan at the moment is the waste of water on football pitches.Poor footballers mightfall down on hard grass.


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

postman said:


> My moan at the moment is the waste of water on football pitches.Poor footballers mightfall down on hard grass.



what if its grey water being stored by the clubs and not drinking water????


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

Rusty Nails said:


> +1
> 
> I quite like the Outback look in a garden.



I like looking at a nice green lawn, which i spent months building, laying and seeding……no drought were i live, no hosepipe bans, so i will use the water i pay for to keep my lawns and plants alive, until i am told otherwise by my water company.


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## dave r (14 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> I like looking at a nice green lawn, which i spent months building, laying and seeding……no drought were i live, no hosepipe bans, so i will use the water i pay for to keep my lawns and plants alive, until i am told otherwise by my water company.



I'll have a nice green lawn when this is over, the grass dies on top, the underground roots are fine, it will come back when its a bit cooler and wetter, I've seen this before, I can wait.


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## jowwy (14 Aug 2022)

dave r said:


> I'll have a nice green lawn when this is over, the grass dies on top, the underground roots are fine, it will come back when its a bit cooler and wetter, I've seen this before, I can wait.



Good for you……like i said, no drought or bans were i live In wales.

Should it matter what country we live in??? Straight answer is yes it should. Thats why we have diffferent governments in each of the four countries and that there are 4 reservoirs in wales that still feed the midlands, so we are already doing our bit to keep little england topped up with water……so when it rains tmrw and tuesday, just remember that wales is doing their bit to help you all.


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## Scoosh (14 Aug 2022)

MOD NOTE:
A number of posts have been Deleted because this thread has strayed into personal abuse and OT arguing.

Keep it nice and calm and it can continue.

Thank you.


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## T4tomo (15 Aug 2022)

Its best not to water when the sun is out, do it either first thing or last thing. 

Watering tip two, don't water to often otherwise the roots just mill about near the surface rather than driving themselves deeper in search of water.


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## jowwy (15 Aug 2022)

lets move on from the water issue.......i will post more updates on the rebuild as i go along

Cheers All who like the updates


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## PaulSB (15 Aug 2022)

T4tomo said:


> Its best not to water when the sun is out, do it either first thing or last thing.
> 
> Watering tip two, don't water to often otherwise the roots just mill about near the surface rather than driving themselves deeper in search of water.



Very true. It's a common error to give plants too much TLC as they quickly adapt to ideal conditions and then fail in tougher times. Too much watering is the most frequent error.


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## fossyant (15 Aug 2022)

That reminds me, time to pop some feed on the lawn now we have a little rain.


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## jowwy (15 Aug 2022)

I wonder when its thundering down with rain for days on end, does the grass think “wow, too much water, me roots wont go deep enough if the rain dont stop, tell it to stop raining”

dear me, talk about telling a granny how to suck eggs….sheeesh


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## Tail End Charlie (15 Aug 2022)

People also over estimate how much rain is needed. I reckon that it can rain for 24 hours and yet it'll hardly go more than an inch below the surface.


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## PaulSB (15 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> I wonder when its thundering down with rain for days on end, does the grass think “wow, too much water, me roots wont go deep enough if the rain dont stop, tell it to stop raining”
> 
> dear me, talk about telling a granny how to suck eggs….sheeesh



You clearly know very little about growing plants, if you knew much at all you would understand why that is such a very silly statement.


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## CharlesF (15 Aug 2022)

Hey guys, play nicely, this a tread about building stuff in the garden, not horticulture.


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

CharlesF said:


> Hey guys, play nicely, this a tread about building stuff in the garden, not horticulture.



Totally agree…..but the usual few want the thread shut yet again, cause they always think they know better.

cheers charlie


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

Im going to say this one last time and hopefully it will hit home with some.

This is a thread about the rebuild of my garden, which quite a lot of people have liked on this forum and have asked me to keep it updated. Which i am doing to the best of my ability, but some members make it very challenging.

Now, if your not happy with the thread, dont like seeing nice lush green grass in a small corner of wales or you think you can do better. Then do me a favour and ignore the thread. You doing me, the thread or the forum any good by hanging around and having snide digs or snide comments.

Hope this helps and have a good day all.


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## Tail End Charlie (16 Aug 2022)

Sorry, but I thought I was making a helpful comment to anyone who might be reading this thread and thinks that just because it has rained for a bit, then they don't need to water their plants.


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## Randomnerd (16 Aug 2022)

A thread isn't your private property.
You opened with a request for gabion advice. I've been in the stone game all my working life, and gave some advice. You just ignored it. And then called us out for having a chat about walls in "your" thread. Paul, who has recently commented, has been in horticulture I think, all his working life. You call him out for correcting your ill-informed post. 
Would it really hurt you that much to realise some people do actually know more about something than you?
Surely a forum is a place where we share stuff so we can all learn a bit more about life?
Or do you just all want us to blow smoke up your ass and tell you how brilliant your garden is? I mean, I am sure (certain) you are very proud of it, but it's just a garden.
If you post your bright green lawn in a time of the longest drought in Europe for decades and naively think you can get away with it (I mean, you definitely know you're shaking the tree), and can't see a bigger picture...well, you really are unique.
And that passive aggressive way you end your posts doesn't help, does it? Is there no room in your world for reflection?


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

PaulSB said:


> You clearly know very little about growing plants, if you knew much at all you would understand why that is such a very silly statement.



my greenhouse full of fruit, veg would beg to differ........but everyones an expert hey


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## PaulSB (16 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> my greenhouse full of fruit, veg would beg to differ........but everyones an expert hey



44 years in commercial horticulture gives me some knowledge. Roots perform two basic functions, to collect water, oxygen and nutrients from the soil and transport these into the plant and support and "anchor" a plant in place.

Lawn grasses are low growing, shallow rooting perennials which require water at a very shallow depth in the soil.

Many plants are deeper rooting and if these are regularly watered incorrectly they can suffer. Deep rooting plants which find the water needed near the surface may fail to produce a deep root system. In times of drought their roots will not be deep enough to tap into moisture deeper in the soil. With a shallow root system the plant could be unstable. Watering plants in open ground needs to be thorough and soak the soil to a significant depth.

Anything I grow on my allotment is thoroughly watered prior to planting out and gets one further watering. Nothing more.

Too much TLC isn't a good idea.


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

PaulSB said:


> 44 years in commercial horticulture gives me some knowledge. Roots perform two basic functions, to collect water, oxygen and nutrients from the soil and transport these into the plant and support and "anchor" a plant in place.
> 
> Lawn grasses are low growing, shallow rooting perennials which require water at a very shallow depth in the soil.
> 
> ...



I wasnt watering plants…..


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## PaulSB (16 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> I wasnt watering plants…..



Sorry? When grass cease to be a plant? Anyway I was trying to help you understand why your heavy rain remark was pretty silly.

No matter. I know nothing


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

PaulSB said:


> Sorry? When grass cease to be a plant? Anyway I was trying to help you understand why your heavy rain remark was pretty silly.
> 
> No matter. I know nothing



My heavy rain comment was tongue in cheek, because obviously grass cant talk……But who cares.

its my garden, my water, i’ll do what i want with it and no forum member is going to tell me otherwise. Ive done a fine damn job over the last 6 months of building my garden solo and i be damned if i have people on here put me down over it……..

This is my last post on the water issue, as i am not falling foul of the mods yet again in my own thread, which may stop me from updating it.

Have a nice day.


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## PK99 (16 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> My heavy rain comment was tongue in cheek, because obviously grass cant talk……But who cares.
> 
> its my garden, my water, i’ll do what i want with it and no forum member is going to tell me otherwise. Ive done a fine damn job over the last 6 months of building my garden solo and i be damned if i have people on here put me down over it……..
> 
> ...



It is not *your *thread, it is *a thread you started. *That is the way forums work. If you want ownership - start your own forum!

Why is it that whatever thread you get involved in descends into an argument?


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

PK99 said:


> It is not *your *thread, it is *a thread you started. *That is the way forums work. If you want ownership - start your own forum!
> 
> Why is it that whatever thread you get involved in descends into an argument?



Ask the people who get involved in the arguments…..like yourself.

i mean to be fair, i only posted a picture of my garden being watered and people took offence to it…..so i didnt start any of the arguments. I also didnt ask for any advice on watering plants, but people thought it right to give me some…..so maybe ask those people.


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## fossyant (16 Aug 2022)

It's still not rained here.


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

fossyant said:


> It's still not rained here.



Its pissed down here for nigh on two days and is doing so right now…….garden get a real good soaking and the plants too. I’ll bottle some up and send some over to you


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## jowwy (16 Aug 2022)

Heres the difference between where i live and my parents a few miles away, but still in wales. We have had two days of rain where i am and 10miles away where my parents live…..hardly a drop.

But i live nearly 1000ft higher up in the welsh valleys than they do….last night with the thunder and lightning it was pretty torrential for a good few hours and we have had some pretty heavy down pours today……my mate around 13 miles the other direction has been painting his fences.

My grass is that green now, it would make kermit the frog envious.


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## Chislenko (16 Aug 2022)

Just as an aside can someone explain why Ethiopia is the only country afforded a capital letter in this thread?


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## Alex321 (16 Aug 2022)

fossyant said:


> It's still not rained here.



It rained significantly yesterday here. Then today, it was just spitting rain on and off for most of the day - I could feel raindrops on my arms both ways on my commute, but didn't really get wet. Then about half an hour after I got home, it started raining steadily again, and still is.


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

Alex321 said:


> It rained significantly yesterday here. Then today, it was just spitting rain on and off for most of the day - I could feel raindrops on my arms both ways on my commute, but didn't really get wet. Then about half an hour after I got home, it started raining steadily again, and still is.



Yup, still raining when i got up at 6am and rain forecast till 10……..i wonder if @fossyant has had any yet???


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## fossyant (17 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> Yup, still raining when i got up at 6am and rain forecast till 10……..i wonder if @fossyant has had any yet???



We've had sprinkles, light rain here now. Will probably need to water the tomatoes in the growbag (outside). Time to pop some lawn feed (iron sulphate) down.


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

fossyant said:


> We've had sprinkles, light rain here now. Will probably need to water the tomatoes in the growbag (outside). *Time to pop some lawn feed (iron sulphate) down*.



I did that when it rained before the current dry spell, greens the grass up real well. Its still raining here, not stopped overnight and predicted to last til around 10am........

Might have to put a big roof over the garden, dont want it getting too much water


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## T4tomo (17 Aug 2022)

even had rain in Hertfordshire, the OH's lawn has greened up a treat.

tomatoes are just coming into crop too, very very tasty


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

T4tomo said:


> View attachment 657648
> 
> 
> even had rain in Hertfordshire, the OH's lawn has greened up a treat.
> ...



is that real grass??


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## T4tomo (17 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> is that real grass??



Jealous? 🤣


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

T4tomo said:


> Jealous? 🤣



not at all....just asking a question?

I mean i wouldnt want the environmentalists on here to start slating you for having plastic grass and destroying the bug population and anything else they may come up with. I mean a picture of real grass sent them over the edge.


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## T4tomo (17 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> not at all....just asking a question?
> 
> I mean i wouldnt want the environmentalists on here to start slating you for having plastic grass and destroying the bug population and anything else they may come up with. I mean a picture of real grass sent them over the edge.



its real enough as in you can touch it and it exists


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## fossyant (17 Aug 2022)

T4tomo said:


> its real enough as in you can touch it and it exists



Plastic then ! 

Just iron sulphated the lawns - just 1 watering can per lawn. Not done them this year, despite having a large amount of the stuff. Lasts ages. My hands now smell 'irony'.


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

fossyant said:


> Plastic then !
> 
> Just iron sulphated the lawns - just 1 watering can per lawn. Not done them this year, despite having a large amount of the stuff. Lasts ages. My hands now smell 'irony'.



Please tell me you filled the can from your water butt??


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## fossyant (17 Aug 2022)

jowwy said:


> Please tell me you filled the can from your water butt??



The tap.  Ps stopped raining ! The tap is bust on the water butt, so it's just for the greenhouse watering system.


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## jowwy (17 Aug 2022)

fossyant said:


> The tap.  Ps stopped raining ! The tap is bust on the water butt, so it's just for the greenhouse watering system.



quick - dont the hard hat and run for cover......,they will find you lol 

Still raining here, thats about 16hrs solid now


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## PaulSB (19 Aug 2022)

Drought declared in Wales after water levels plummet


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## jowwy (19 Aug 2022)

PaulSB said:


> Drought declared in South West Wales after water levels plummet


FTFY

In Pembrokshire, south west wales…..and parts of camarthenshire. Quite a fair distance from were i live, where this no hosepipe ban or drought declared…….

its rained were i live now for nearly 3 days and sometimes torrential. Because i live up in the mountains, not on the flatlands of pembroke………


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## jowwy (20 Aug 2022)

New door built for the man cave...just need to flip it, trim it and put the hinges and lock in place

I built it backwards so i could screw each length of timber to the from ( 4x1 timbers) then fix the braces and ledgers....


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## jowwy (21 Aug 2022)

Windbreak all finished…..2x1 slats double side with 10mm polycarbonate in between. To stop the wind and the rain


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## jowwy (25 Aug 2022)

All photos have now been removed from this thread and will no longer be updated going forward.

@Moderators please can you lock the thread. Thanks


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