# Whats your chainring size/s ?



## lay (22 Aug 2013)

Like i'm REAL specific on what ring size i use

42 / 53 - then a 23/21/19/18/17/16/15/14/13 (shimano)

I ask because some people ride, and I hate them: 50T chainrings (compact c.sets), admitedly, they're usefull for weekend cyclists imo...

If i get to really hilly/mountainous areas i will put a 39T on...

But this is the basis of my discussion; 

I find, i can never get the same gear, generally, to ride about the same speed as people who ride them...

AND IT DRIVES ME CRAZY...

OK - i know you can get similiar gear ratios etc etc ive heard that MANY times but theirs nothing like a 53 T for racing on..

I once bought a road bike that got me back into cycling and it was great a alu-framed Raleigh, big down tube, nice & stiff but the 1st thing to be changed, YES the chainset ! 

Thoughts........??????


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (22 Aug 2013)

Cool story bro


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## Ben M (22 Aug 2013)

I don't get your point. You are saying that when you are riding with someone with a compact, you can't match their speed? That's surprising, because your ratios are pretty close together.

Just vary your cadence, perhaps.


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## Mapster1989 (22 Aug 2013)

I live in Sheffield. A compact is my friend!


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## mattobrien (22 Aug 2013)

What really bugs me is people who ride doubles and then have 13t as their smallest cog on their cassette. It's only 4 revolutions of the wheel for one pedal stroke, where a compact with a 50-11 ratio will have 4.5 revolutions 

I just find these folk too low geared to keep up with me when I am on the compact 

Don't get me started about when I am on 53-11


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## Mapster1989 (22 Aug 2013)

lay said:


> Like i'm REAL specific on what ring size i use
> 
> 42 / 53 - then a 23/21/19/18/17/16/15/14/13 (shimano)
> 
> ...


 
I'll not ask you what you think about those who ride fixed... we'll be here all week!


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## lay (22 Aug 2013)

Maps' dont start me mate...what happened to brakes and gears ???? lolz.....


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## oldfatfool (22 Aug 2013)

Or those of us who ride a triple


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## Mapster1989 (22 Aug 2013)

oldfatfool said:


> Or those of us who ride a triple


Oooooo. If @lay had his way, that word would be censored on this forum.


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## lay (22 Aug 2013)

No, triples are ok that way you can ride a 42 

lol


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## 4F (22 Aug 2013)

48 fixed


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## cyberknight (22 Aug 2013)

Spin to win


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## Archie_tect (22 Aug 2013)

My old Dawes was a 52/39 with a rear freewheel 5 speed 11-25... it was fine when I was 22. Now it has a 5-speed 12-32 cassette it's still not as low as I need to get up the Ryals without keeling over.


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## thegravestoneman (22 Aug 2013)

Up until recently 54/42 on a 24/13 now on 50/39 on 25/12 I believe, I want my 54 back!


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## Deleted member 23692 (22 Aug 2013)

Mines 50/39/30 with a 11-25t on the back.. I pity those who ride a 12t small cog 

It's an outrage


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## ColinJ (22 Aug 2013)

I'm not exactly sure what the point of this thread is but just to annoy lay ... 

On my Basso, I use a 52 rather a 53. I might just be excused for that, but it is used with a 14-tooth smallest sprocket.

It is part of a triple chainset, but I decided to be annoying with the middle ring too, and swapped that for a 39.

Oh, and the 30-tooth little ring has been replaced by a 26! 

*Sorry! *


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (22 Aug 2013)

< races on a compact.


To hell with me now?


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## Cyclopathic (22 Aug 2013)

I ride with a double up front comprised of a 72 and a 26 and on the back it goes from about 5 teeth on the small cog up to god knows what. I can't stand anybody who uses anything else. There's something wrong with 'em.


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## jowwy (22 Aug 2013)

Sabbath is 50/39/30 with a 12/30 cassette (10 speed)

Defy 4 is 50/39/30 with a 12/26 cassette (8 speed)

Jamis dakota 29er comp is 42/32/22 with a 12/36 cassette (10 speed)


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## Andrew_P (22 Aug 2013)

With a specially made 11-6 on the back


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## Milzy (22 Aug 2013)

lay said:


> Like i'm REAL specific on what ring size i use
> 
> 42 / 53 - then a 23/21/19/18/17/16/15/14/13 (shimano)
> 
> ...


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## Boris Bajic (22 Aug 2013)

Fixed, it's a 50, because that was the larger ring on it at the time. The sprocket varies according to mood.

Geared, it's 53/39 on the road bike. At the rear is a fairly standard 10-speed running 12 to 23.

It sounds as if the OP has a decent spread of gears and ought to be able to match most people on most road bikes.

As this is an important topic, I took the trouble to consult with God, Allah and other deities minor and major. They all abhor triples, apart from Ganesh who likes a little singletrack MTB action and Buddha who is keen on touring with fully-loaded front and rear panniers... But you know what Buddha can be like with technical stuff and gearing.

God (and all his pals) say that proper bicycles ought to have 53/39 at the front. They were going to put that in the Holy Scriptures, but they sort of got sidelined with rules about morality, diet and murder.


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## Boris Bajic (22 Aug 2013)

Andrew_P said:


> View attachment 28184
> 
> 
> 
> With a specially made 11-6 on the back


 
Do I see a cotter pin?

How very, very old-school...

I have cotterless cranks on my 82-tooth chainring.


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## Hacienda71 (22 Aug 2013)

My Carlton is 52-42 front 13-18 rear.  Not so good in the proper hills even for nutters.:troll:


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## Venod (22 Aug 2013)

When I was younger, so much younger than today I never needed gearing help in any way, but now these days are gone and the legs are not so self assured now I find I've changed my gears to smaller than before.

Was 52/42 with a 13-21 or 13-24

Now 50/34 with a 12-30

Thing is I don't seem to have slowed a lot, the cadence has gone up over the years, I think I developed the higher cadence from a lot of MTB.


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## MickeyBlueEyes (22 Aug 2013)

lay said:


> I find, i can never get the same gear, generally, to ride about the same speed as people who ride them......
> 
> Thoughts........?????



Do you mean you ride faster than someone you are out with if they are running a compact and you get really miffed off because you have to keep slowing down to match them ? 

If so, I'll come for a ride out with you on my measly 50-34. I wonder if you would still be able to read what it says on the back of my jersey after we've been out for 10 minutes ? The big letters may help..... A little bit...... :-)


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## GrasB (22 Aug 2013)

oldfatfool said:


> Or those of us who ride a triple


Yeah MTFU & get a triple... a real triple! 36/48/64


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## classic33 (22 Aug 2013)

oldfatfool said:


> Or those of us who ride a triple


Like a 42-52-62, with an 11 - 24 on the rear & 50% on top provided by the hub gear.



Andrew_P said:


> View attachment 28184
> 
> 
> 
> With a specially made 11-6 on the back


What does that equate to, given there's teeth missing. Nice to see toe clips & straps in use.


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## GrasB (22 Aug 2013)

classic33 said:


> Like a 42-52-62, with an 11 - 24 on the rear & 50% on top rovided by the hub gear.


What sized rear wheel?


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## classic33 (22 Aug 2013)

GrasB said:


> What sized rear wheel?


27 inch


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## GrasB (22 Aug 2013)

classic33 said:


> 27 inch


ISO please


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## classic33 (22 Aug 2013)

GrasB said:


> ISO please


Put this way, if I replace the tyre I ask for a 27inch tyre.


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## Tigerbiten (22 Aug 2013)

I've a double/double setup on the front of my bent trike, double chainrings on a Schumpf High Speed Drive.
It works out to be 38/53/95/132.5.
A 20" ( 50-406) wheel on the back with a 21 tooth sprocket on the Rohloff.
I've ended up with 24 unique gears and a total range of just over 1800% ..........


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## classic33 (22 Aug 2013)

GrasB said:


> ISO please


Check here http://www.ctc.org.uk/cyclists-library/components/wheels-tyres/tyre-sizes


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## Buzzinonbikes (22 Aug 2013)

I rock a 54/52 because I am well ard and have massive gonads...


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## edindave (22 Aug 2013)

Always liked the look of this...


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## YahudaMoon (22 Aug 2013)

oldfatfool said:


> Or those of us who ride a triple


 

Or even better/worse (depending how big you are)

A triple compact 46/34/24, 11-25t on the back, or a quiche, well I think they nicknamed them 'quiche' anyway?


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## downfader (22 Aug 2013)

Whats going on..? People are getting rather snobby about 53T setups imo. Hear it a lot on Eurosport when MAMILs tweet the show, LOL.

I often ride 53/39T 12-25 on the racelight. On the Jake it was a triple 50/34/28T iirc... Never had a problem with speed or efficient power output on the Jake in the middle ring and often passed other riders. Spinning was winning....


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## JoeyB (22 Aug 2013)

I ride a standard double but I had to change the rear cassette from an 11/25 to an 11/28 to give me SOME help up hills. A compact feels like riding my MTB.


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## downfader (22 Aug 2013)

JoeyB said:


> I ride a standard double but I had to change the rear cassette from an 11/25 to an 11/28 to give me SOME help up hills. A compact feels like riding my MTB.


 

28 on the back helps. My new bike will have a 30 iirc to cope with the hills.


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## JoeyB (22 Aug 2013)

downfader said:


> 28 on the back helps. My new bike will have a 30 iirc to cope with the hills.


Yup it gave me two extra climbing gears and so far I haven't had to walk up a hill.


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## Shut Up Legs (22 Aug 2013)

What really bugs me is people who make such a big deal about cyclists using different gear ratios, and tag 50T chain ring users as "weekend cyclists" . You use whatever's comfortable for you to use. Cadences vary a lot between cyclists, and so gear ratios vary accordingly.


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## dave r (22 Aug 2013)

I do most of my riding on fixed, with brakes front and back, with a 46x18 68inch gear, I have a geared best bike with a 50/42 on the front and 12-27 on the back, I'm a commuter, a weekend cyclist and some times a club cyclist.


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## goody (22 Aug 2013)

I've got compacts on both my road bikes and yes I am a weekend cyclist. This weekend I'm doing a 300K Audax and a couple of weekends ago I rode about 450 miles to Paris and back. Maybe I should man up and get a 'mansize 53-39' and for hilly rides put a mtb cassette on and hope no one notices because they're so impressed by the size of my huge ring.


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## slowmotion (23 Aug 2013)

50/39/28
11/28
Do I hear shocked silence?


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## HLaB (23 Aug 2013)

I recently switched my 53/39 for a 50/34 (before the Marmotte) & my 52/38 compact bike is rip and they cant be mixed (camp & shimano). I prefer the middle ground 38/52 but overall i dont find it makes much difference in a group, a 34/48 cyclocross has been fine or entire rides in the 38 or 39. Some of thestrongest riders I know ride compacts, fixies and full doubles, does it really matter :-/


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## HLaB (23 Aug 2013)

slowmotion said:


> 50/39/28
> 11/28
> Do I hear shocked silence?


As long as its on a bike, its perfectly fine by me ;-)


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## Roadrunner78 (23 Aug 2013)

50/36 ------ 12-28 Changed the inner ring. I do prefer the 39/54 but this works. I believe campy did the 50/36 setup.


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## ufkacbln (23 Aug 2013)

a single 34/85 on the front and a 16 on the back, giving 28 gears

Schlumpf HSD paired with Rohoff hub


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## srw (23 Aug 2013)

Ffoeg said:


> Mines 50/39/30 with a 11-25t on the back.. I pity those who ride a 12t small cog


Only 50? Pah.
53/40/28 and 11-34 on the tandem. I look down on those with only 2 chainrings - usually from the top of the hill we've just climbed.


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## pauldavid (23 Aug 2013)

lay said:


> Like i'm REAL specific on what ring size i use
> 
> 42 / 53 - then a 23/21/19/18/17/16/15/14/13 (shimano)
> 
> ...




LIKE I''M REAL SPECIFIC ABOUT MY RING SIZE TOO!


For instance, about 6:05 this morning my ring was much bigger than I would ave liked it be. (Based on nothing but my pain threshold and experience I would suggest about 8 cm dilated)

All seems back to normal now but it's probably best to avoid trap 4 until about lunchtime.


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## Rob3rt (23 Aug 2013)

FFS


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## shaun o'shea (23 Aug 2013)

50/36 11/23 on my scot summer faster rides and 50/34 11/28 on my dolan for climbing training rides in winter.


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## Psycolist (23 Aug 2013)

I get very uncomfortable talking about ring size. Its a very personal issue, good luck to those wishing to discuss it, but l will keep that info to myself.


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## Booyaa (23 Aug 2013)

44 on the front and 12/32 on the back. Suits me just fine.


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## jdtate101 (23 Aug 2013)

On the Road bike :53/39 QRings with 11-28.....it's a bit lumpy round my way and I'm not a featherweight climber.
On the TT Bike: 53/38 QXL Rings with 12-25. (Sometimes change this to an 11-23 for flat TT's)
On the CX bike: 46/36 with 12-27


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## Beebo (23 Aug 2013)

I win, you can close the thread now.


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## Milo (23 Aug 2013)

24 on the front and 32 on the back.


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## pplpilot (23 Aug 2013)

Milo said:


> 24 on the front and 32 on the back.


 

just how fast would you need to spin on the flat just to stay upright!


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## Milo (23 Aug 2013)

Yea it's a nice low gear to have. I ride a tourer though so it makes sense when laden can't say I ever really use that gear otherwise. I nearly put a 34t cassette on but don't think the derailleur could cope.


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## Shut Up Legs (23 Aug 2013)

My lowest gear on the Vivente tourer is 30 front 34 rear. But I've only ever used it at Mt Dandenong, about 15km from where I live, which has 2 roads with 28-30% grades .


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## gaz (23 Aug 2013)

Who cares? Just go and ride your bike


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## Milzy (23 Aug 2013)

Who rides on a strong mans ring?


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## DiddlyDodds (24 Aug 2013)

I am the only one that has no idea how many teeth on either the front sprockets or rear cassette.

I just get on and push the peddles until I get to the speed I want, and if i get to a hill I peddle harder.

Perhaps I should count them so next time I am struggling up a hill I will know how many teeth I am actually struggling on.


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## GrasB (24 Aug 2013)

classic33 said:


> Check here http://www.ctc.org.uk/cyclists-library/components/wheels-tyres/tyre-sizes


I know that 27" is nominally 630, however people also refer to 622 tyres as 27" (being almost exactly 27" on mid-width 32-622 tyres) & there's also the re-invented 650b (584 or 27.5er in MTB speak) standard which is referred to as 27" in some parts. Keeping to ISO sizes simply illuminates confusion.


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## sackville d (24 Aug 2013)

On DA 7700 cranks I have TA chainrings 51/38 and 12/25 at the back.I like to think of it as semi semi compact.My hack has 53/39 and 11/23 and there is a compact lurking about but opportunity to get much use from it has been thin on the ground tho use of one has been a bit of an eyeopenerI must be just very easily pleased.


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## cyberknight (24 Aug 2013)

pplpilot said:


> just how fast would you need to spin on the flat just to stay upright!


Sounds like a perfect gear for pootling with my kids, my subway has a triple with a large range on the back and if i ride anything more than the granny ring and a 30 on the back my 6 year old cant "win" the race


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## slowmotion (24 Aug 2013)

I have 50/39/28 on the front and 11 to 28 on the back. That's stretching the capacity of the Shimano 105 mech. but it seems to work OK. It isn't at all "hard" but it just about gets me up hills without walking.


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## on the road (24 Aug 2013)

I ride a 53/39 on the front and 11-25 on the back, 39/25 is good enough to get me up most steep hills if slowly.


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## Sittingduck (24 Aug 2013)

34-50, 39-52 & 30-39-50... what's your point??


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## uclown2002 (24 Aug 2013)

on the road said:


> I ride a 53/39 on the front and 11-25 on the back, 39/25 is good enough to get me up most steep hills if slowly.


 
That suggests there are some steep hills you can't get up?


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## Stonechat (24 Aug 2013)

Likewise I am on original that cam with the bike
48-38-28

And 8 gears from 30 to 11 on the back


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## on the road (24 Aug 2013)

uclown2002 said:


> That suggests there are some steep hills you can't get up?


[re-write]39/25 is good enough to get me up *all* the steep hills *that I've come across* if slowly[/re-write]


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## goody (3 Sep 2013)

I tried Bushcombe Lane last Sunday, I was visiting the brother in law in Prestbury. Probably not best to try after two pints and no warm up but had to get off twice and walk, the steepest bits are over 20% and on one of the bends approx 30%. I've got 34-50 and 11-25. Now I've seen it I think I could probably do it on a good day. I can see why he had a triple on his last bike it's pretty hilly down there went out for a ride on Monday and climbed 10,005 feet.


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## mrBishboshed (3 Sep 2013)

Loving my compact with 28-12 rear cassette. Just right for someone new to road bikes wanting to build some fitness. And I've not had to walk up any of our puny hills in deepest darkest Essex. (Well not yet.)


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## KneesUp (4 Sep 2013)

It's hilly here. I have a 52/42 but am not man enough to ride it. So I'm getting a compact triple and (hopefully) riding more as a result.


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## TheJDog (4 Sep 2013)

It's baloney about having better spacing on a double, because, according to wisdom, if you can be on the big ring, you should be on the big ring or you look weak.

Riding with the same gearing as a pro rider is just daft, like putting the engine from a Fiesta in a Ferrari and wondering why it feels funny. 

If you're riding 53T with a 23 on the back, what's the point? Just suck it up and go compact.

Once you go compact, you'll never go back.


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## Rob3rt (4 Sep 2013)

I don't get it.....


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## Stonechat (4 Sep 2013)

Sorry - what is a compact - don't laugh have no idea


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## mrBishboshed (4 Sep 2013)

Stonechat said:


> Sorry - what is a compact - don't laugh have no idea


Women use them for touching up their make up.


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## mustang1 (4 Sep 2013)

My allez has a triple 52-42-30 with 12-25 or 12-26 cassette (depends what the lbs has in stock). I don't ride this bike now since it needs a repair.

My supersix has a 50/34 and ... Can't recall what cassette, but I don't ride that bike eityer .

The mares CX bike has 50/34 up front and IFK what at the back, but I know its a 2012 tiagra 9 speed so maybe 12-25?

I didn't know if I would like a 50/34 setup since a 42 ring is my favourite, but I've grown to accept, and mildly like, it.


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## TheJDog (4 Sep 2013)

Stonechat said:


> Sorry - what is a compact - don't laugh have no idea



If at least one person gets something from this inane thread, let it be you.

Your usual double chainring has two massive gears (usually something like 53/39) which are no use to a human when going up a hill. This arrangement also means that all the gears overlap, giving you only a tiny spread of useable gearing. A compact chainset has one fairly big gear (usually 50) and one much smaller (usually 34). This means you can still go fast on the flat, but you also have a chance of making it up a hill without giving yourself a prolapse.


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## Rob3rt (4 Sep 2013)

TheJDog said:


> If at least one person gets something from this inane thread, let it be you.
> 
> Your usual double chainring has two massive gears (usually something like 53/39) which are no use to a human when going up a hill. This arrangement also means that all the gears overlap, giving you only a tiny spread of useable gearing. A compact chainset has one fairly big gear (usually 50) and one much smaller (usually 34). This means you can still go fast on the flat, but you also have a chance of making it up a hill without giving yourself a prolapse.



I must not be human then because I do just fine on a standard double without resorting to pie plate sized cassettes! You can call me the beast!


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## goody (4 Sep 2013)

mustang1 said:


> My supersix has a 50/34 and ... Can't recall what cassette, but I don't ride that bike eityer .


Can I have it?


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## Stonechat (5 Sep 2013)

TheJDog said:


> If at least one person gets something from this inane thread, let it be you.
> 
> Your usual double chainring has two massive gears (usually something like 53/39) which are no use to a human when going up a hill. This arrangement also means that all the gears overlap, giving you only a tiny spread of useable gearing. A compact chainset has one fairly big gear (usually 50) and one much smaller (usually 34). This means you can still go fast on the flat, but you also have a chance of making it up a hill without giving yourself a prolapse.


Well I need all the help I get get to get up hills, being returned to cycling after 20 years , and retired early.
So 28 at the front and 30 at the back is my help. This is the toughest part I have climbed


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## Dusty Bin (5 Sep 2013)

lay said:


> OK - i know you can get similiar gear ratios etc etc ive heard that MANY times but theirs nothing like a 53 T for racing on..



Yes there is - there's 52, or 50. 50/11 will actually give you more gear inches than 53/12 - but it's rare you'll ever need a gear that big on the flat.


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## byegad (5 Sep 2013)

24-40-55 to 11-34 cassette.


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## uclown2002 (5 Sep 2013)

50/34 compact with 12-25 cassette. Gets me up all the steep hills round my area.

Hats off to those using a standard double!!


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## Deleted member 20519 (5 Sep 2013)

30/39/50 with a 12-28 cassette


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## mustang1 (6 Sep 2013)

goody said:


> Can I have it?


Yeah OK


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## Cyclopathic (7 Sep 2013)

After reading the entire thread I have lost the will to live.


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## Uncle_Fluffy (7 Sep 2013)

48/38/28 with 14/28 cassette.


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## 4711 (9 Jan 2015)

hi guys and girls im new to this site so im not sure where to post this but i ride a cipollini speed track bike that i have modified for road ie brakes and water bottle and i ride a single speed set up 82 tooth front chainring and 16 or 17 tooth freewheel on rear depending on terrain 172.5 cranks when i figure out site or if someone can tell me how i will post pics .


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## fatjel (10 Jan 2015)

I have a 50/34 and a 50/34 cos that's how my bikes arrived


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## screenman (10 Jan 2015)

77, you just got to man up to it.


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## cyberknight (10 Jan 2015)

Both road bikes a reset up 50/36 , the commuter has an 8 speed 12-25 and the other has a 10 speed 11-28 .Suits me well enough .


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## ACS (10 Jan 2015)

50 - 39 - 30 with 11-32 on the commuter 9 speed

50 - 34 with 11-32 10 speed on the Audax


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## gavroche (10 Jan 2015)

52 42 30 and 11- 30 on my Allez

52 34 and 12-32 on my Giant.


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## Ian H (10 Jan 2015)

53/39 on the TT iron and the road bike. 46/36/26 on the Audax machine. 43 on the fixed. 44/32/22 on the mtb.


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## dodgy (10 Jan 2015)

Dullest thread ever*

Yes I know, coming into the thread to read it, then post something is optional. But it's still a dull thread.

Anyway. 50x23x33 42x89492309348209348234230482304 zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


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## jdtate101 (10 Jan 2015)

53/39 on the TT with 11-23
50/34 on the Roadie with 11-28
46 on the Fixed with a 17
46/36 on the Cyclocross with 11-28


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## rowdin (10 Jan 2015)

46/18.


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## 4711 (10 Jan 2015)

screenman said:


> 77, you just got to man up to it.


i started with a 61 then 72 then 77 and kept going faster have settled on 82 x16 giving me 138 inch gear ,it suits my low cadence ,high torque style of riding .ian bowdler .a top time trialist in the uk uses a 77 predominatly on his tt bike with gears and does very well with it. if you want to look further into this a rather underated lady called beryl burton rode in the uk in the 50s destroying tt records and nearly every body on a bike ,she sadly is deceased now but she too rode big gears ,not quite what we are talking now but from what i can ascertain ,57x14 ,you should look her up ,she had a book out called personal best ,fantastic reading ,youll see her times and speeds which you wont beleive ,female ,houswife , child .worked on farm all day .no aero equipt ,part time rider


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## screenman (10 Jan 2015)

Nik Bowdler, which is where I got my Willy waving number from.

In all honesty I have 5 bikes hanging up all ready to ride which I do often, I could not tell you what size chain rings any have on them though.


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## Elybazza61 (11 Jan 2015)

52/36 on the helium and 50/34 on the other two.Of those two the icarus will go the same as the helium as i like that combo but dunno yet about the planet x,that may go to a single cx chainset.


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## derrick (11 Jan 2015)

52-42 front 11-27 rear., Get's me where ever i need to go, struggle a little on the really big climbs, but every where else i fly, I was running 11-25 a while back but put the 27 on when we done them Yorkshire Dales


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## ufkacbln (11 Jan 2015)

Largest is the custom 85 on the Hurricane (42 gears) and the lowest is 34 on the Schlumpf / Rohloff Gekko


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## ChrisEyles (11 Jan 2015)

52/42 up front and 14-28 five speed at the back... the only improvement I could wish for would be an extra 32t sprocket at the rear for the really steep hills, but otherwise it's perfect for me, and at least it provides a good workout!


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## 400bhp (11 Jan 2015)

ChrisEyles said:


> 52/42 up front and 14-28 five speed at the back... the only improvement I could wish for would be an extra 32t sprocket at the rear for the really steep hills, but otherwise it's perfect for me, and at least it provides a good workout!



In what way is the workout different than a compact?


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## ChrisEyles (11 Jan 2015)

You could get the same gear ratios either way, and of course a modern cassette would give you narrower spacing. The biggest difference from a compact is that my old 1960s front derailleur won't work with a compact! Not sure my legs could tell the difference though...


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