# long term cough, doctors can't find anything wrong



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

I've had a cough for getting on for 2 years, the medics have pretty much given up. Cycling doesn't particularly seem to make it worse, although commuting in cold weather is not great on the throat. I did try staying off the bike for a month or so but there was no real improvement.

I've been back and forth to the doctor, got referred to an ENT consultant, had many and various tests and treatments none of which have helped. I've had a chest X-ray, camera up my nose and down my throat, allergy test, all negative. CT scan showed a slight inflammation of some sinuses, but nothing that he would recommend surgery for. 

I think the reason I cough is because there is a continual drip of mucus from the back of my nose or sinuses (post-nasal drip) which runs down into my throat and have to cough up. Some nights I'm awake with coughing fits and in the mornings I sound like a heavy smoker, without the enjoyment of having had the fags first. 

Any suggestions welcomed, this is getting me down.


----------



## Mo1959 (28 Feb 2015)

Have you had the flu jab? My dad swears he has had a permanent cough since he started taking it.


----------



## albion (28 Feb 2015)

I'm like a canary to irritants so I can safely inform you that GP allergy tests can be too narrow.

I'd contemplate your sleeping arrangements and damp.


----------



## Turbo Rider (28 Feb 2015)

Stings the back of your throat if you hold your nose at the wrong angle, but clears everything IME. Have a blast if you haven't already...


----------



## Lilliburlero (28 Feb 2015)

albion said:


> I'd contemplate your sleeping arrangements and damp



We had trouble with damp a few years ago. My daughter and I both developed coughs and mine was so bad that I used to pass out.... very scary.

All is well now after sorting the damp problem out.


----------



## midlife (28 Feb 2015)

I guess you have been on Nasonex ?

Shaun


----------



## Arrowfoot (28 Feb 2015)

OP, if you can manage it, try and take 2 weeks holiday in a warm place like Spain. Bring along new clothes, toiletries ( new brand etc) Sinus does weird things. 

Suggesting this route as you have spent 2 year with the medical fraternity.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

Mo1959 said:


> Have you had the flu jab? My dad swears he has had a permanent cough since he started taking it.


I have had a flu jab the last few years, paid for by work. Do you mind me asking what your dad's cough is like, i.e. dry or chesty like mine?


----------



## Mo1959 (28 Feb 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> I have had a flu jab the last few years, paid for by work. Do you mind me asking what your dad's cough is like, i.e. dry or chesty like mine?


Seems to be more chesty, ie producing some mucus.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

Arrowfoot said:


> OP, if you can manage it, try and take 2 weeks holiday in a warm place like Spain. Bring along new clothes, toiletries ( new brand etc) Sinus does weird things.
> 
> Suggesting this route as you have spent 2 year with the medical fraternity.


Thanks, I've had a couple of 2-week summer holidays in hot bits of France since I've had the cough, but not tried the new clothes etc. 
Not being a massive clothes buyer, Mrs. W may suspect something!


----------



## Crackle (28 Feb 2015)

I have a nasal drip and I take a sinus spray for it. Initially Beconnaise, now flixonase. I never had a cough but I was constantly clearing my throat. My sinuses now are quite vulnerable during colds etc and are a slight mess now, just kept under control.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

midlife said:


> I guess you have been on Nasonex ?
> 
> Shaun


Not Nasonex, but other steroid-based nasal sprays, the last one was Nasofan (fluticasone), I think the previous one was fluticasone as well.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

albion said:


> I'm like a canary to irritants so I can safely inform you that GP allergy tests can be too narrow.
> 
> I'd contemplate your sleeping arrangements and damp.


It's certainly worse overnight and in the mornings, but I just put this down to build up of mucus while I'm asleep. Should I be thinking about new mattress/pillows etc?


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

Lilliburlero said:


> We had trouble with damp a few years ago. My daughter and I both developed coughs and mine was so bad that I used to pass out.... very scary.
> 
> All is well now after sorting the damp problem out.


It's a thought but I don't think the house is particularly damp, no damp walls, central heating etc.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

Turbo Rider said:


> View attachment 80986
> 
> 
> Stings the back of your throat if you hold your nose at the wrong angle, but clears everything IME. Have a blast if you haven't already...


Thanks, I'll certainly give it a go.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

I should add, it started after I had a couple of summer colds one after the other. Like the tail end of a cold that never clears up.


----------



## subaqua (28 Feb 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> I should add, it started after I had a couple of summer colds one after the other. Like the tail end of a cold that never clears up.


I had something similar back in 2010. after i had been pushing myself too hard in work. early starts late finishes not eating properly too much beer. the missus made me go to the docs and he too couldn't find anything wrong- had allergy tests ( very very comprehensive ) went for chest x rays and had a visit to the chest specialist who put me through a good hard COPD test ( and said afetr first test that nothing wrong with lungs) noticed it in the july just before we went on holidays

I took life easy for a few months and let batteries recharge ( started back on the bike properly after a 20 year layoff) and the cough went by december. 

I didn't realise stress could do that to you till it happened. it knocked me for six as i used to go diving to relax but the cough made diving difficult so couldn't relax and vicious circle


----------



## albion (28 Feb 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> It's a thought but I don't think the house is particularly damp, no damp walls, central heating etc.


Try a spring clean with fresh sheets and duvet covers.

I'm actually sensitive to seasonal damp so suggest you also time that when the day has been 100% sun with low humidity.


----------



## wheeliebin (28 Feb 2015)

It could be stress-related, I know that stress can affect the immune system, and I have a bit of history on that front.


----------



## ColinJ (28 Feb 2015)

You've already had lots of tests, so hopefully the doctors would have spotted if it were the kind of nasty illness that @gbb had!


----------



## gbb (28 Feb 2015)

ColinJ said:


> You've already had lots of tests, so hopefully the doctors would have spotted if it were the kind of nasty illness that @gbb had!


Sounds like you have taken the right steps wheeliebin, thats a good start.
CTscan and xray of the head or chest ?
Camera down the throat..into the lungs or windpipe ?
Mine was chest, and a CT scan of the chest should quite clearly show pleurisy or pneumonia and my TB showed up on xrays, bronchioscopy will allow them to check for deep rooted infections.
I'd suffered with night sweats, incredible lethargy, long term cough.
If ypure not suffering tiredness, sweats, temperatures, its probably not infection based on my experience, for what thats worth.
Hope you find some resolution, it is debilitating and fustrating when you get something that wont shift.


----------



## Venod (28 Feb 2015)

Turbo Rider said:


> View attachment 80986
> 
> 
> Stings the back of your throat if you hold your nose at the wrong angle, but clears everything IME. Have a blast if you haven't already...



I got it wrong, it gave me the worst sore throat ever, had to get some ice cream down to relieve it.


----------



## Turbo Rider (28 Feb 2015)

Afnug said:


> I got it wrong, it gave me the worst sore throat I ever, had to get some ice cream down to relieve it.



I've made the same mistake, but it's a mistake I've repeated since because it sure does clear everything in it's way. I take the sore throat as the lesser of two evils. Huge dilemma though.


----------



## doog (1 Mar 2015)

the missus has this long term cough, despite all the tests and being told she's doesnt have asthma etc etc when she uses our daughters inhaler the cough goes away ...... their (the docs) answer was to simply use the daughters inhaler


----------



## SatNavSaysStraightOn (2 Mar 2015)

Quick question? do you have high blood pressure and if so, are you on rampiril?


----------



## wheeliebin (2 Mar 2015)

SatNavSaysStraightOn said:


> Quick question? do you have high blood pressure and if so, are you on rampiril?


No, blood pressure is OK, not on rampiril.


----------



## wheeliebin (2 Mar 2015)

doog said:


> the missus has this long term cough, despite all the tests and being told she's doesnt have asthma etc etc when she uses our daughters inhaler the cough goes away ...... their (the docs) answer was to simply use the daughters inhaler


Interesting, some of the various attempted treatments I have had include 2 different inhalers (at different times). These did provide some temporary relief from the cough symptoms, although it never went away entirely.


----------



## SatNavSaysStraightOn (2 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> No, blood pressure is OK, not on rampiril.


Rules that one out then! A side effect if ramipril is that it can make you cough constantly. Everyone missed it with me resulting in lung and throat damage for me. They had just put it down to my asthma. It wasn't. I now have a rate form of tracheomalacia and mild bronchiectasis needing a saline nebuliser each day.


----------



## wheeliebin (2 Mar 2015)

gbb said:


> Sounds like you have taken the right steps wheeliebin, thats a good start.
> CTscan and xray of the head or chest ?
> Camera down the throat..into the lungs or windpipe ?
> Mine was chest, and a CT scan of the chest should quite clearly show pleurisy or pneumonia and my TB showed up on xrays, bronchioscopy will allow them to check for deep rooted infections.
> ...


CT scan of head, sinuses in particular.
Camera up nose and down the throat but not into the lungs.
X-ray of chest.
I'm not suffering from tiredness or sweats/temperatures, so I'm tending to think it is either a reaction to something in the environment or an auto-immune type condition.
Thanks, debilitating and frustrating are definitely the words. Couldn't cycle to work today I was coughing so much this morning.


----------



## SatNavSaysStraightOn (2 Mar 2015)

Can you conduct an unscientific experiment on yourself and stay off all dairy for 1 week?
And I mean all dairy... 

You may find symptoms clear up.

I suggest it because I'm allergic to dairy and one of the issues I had before the allergy became anaphylactic shock was the dripping mucus down the back of the throat. I appreciate it isn't an easy option but worth a shot in the dark despite the difficulties involved in excluding all dairy from your diet for 7 days.


----------



## wheeliebin (2 Mar 2015)

ColinJ said:


> You've already had lots of tests, so hopefully the doctors would have spotted if it were the kind of nasty illness that @gbb had!


I certainly hope they would have spotted anything. A bit scary sitting in the doctors when you see the "coughing for more than a month...?" notices.


----------



## vickster (2 Mar 2015)

Have you had a CT scan of your chest/lungs? Might be worthwhile to rule out anything that might show up on such a scan

I think a lot of the so called sinus sprays etc can cause problems in themselves too with longer use

Are you being seen at a specialist hospital like the Royal Brompton, might be worth a referral to a tertiary centre


----------



## wheeliebin (2 Mar 2015)

SatNavSaysStraightOn said:


> Can you conduct an unscientific experiment on yourself and stay off all dairy for 1 week?
> And I mean all dairy...
> 
> You may find symptoms clear up.
> ...


Thanks, I will definitely give it a go. I guess not having problems with dairy in the past doesn't mean I couldn't develop an intolerance or allergy?


----------



## SatNavSaysStraightOn (2 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> Thanks, I will definitely give it a go. I guess not having problems with dairy in the past doesn't mean I couldn't develop an intolerance or allergy?


You wouldn't necessarily know about issues with dairy because you will have had it on your diet from the word go so live with the symptoms often without knowing they were even there until they raise this ugly head.

For me I found out I was initially intolerant to cow's dairy just because it took me longer to recovery from coughs, cold and flu than others and it was always worse for me than others. My gp told me that staying off dairy whilst suffering these conditions with my asthma would make my asthma easier to control and then clear up more quickly. It worked. After a particularly bad chest infection lasting 6 weeks I finally got the all clear to go back onto dairy and did. I ended up in a&e! That rules cow's dairy out of my diet. I went to goat's milk, butter, cream & yogurt quite hesitantly but was fine with it for around 10 years and then started having problems with it as well... That's when the allergy developed. Full blown anaphylactic shock now. Not great.

Ruling dairy out of my husband's diet has almost cured his snoring problem though! And we both can tell well he had eaten any dairy!


----------



## ColinJ (2 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> I certainly hope they would have spotted anything. A bit scary sitting in the doctors when you see the "coughing for more than a month...?" notices.


The first obvious symptom of my DVT/PE was incessant coughing. I put up with for weeks before seeing a doctor and then he missed what it really was. A second doctor picked up on it a few weeks further on but that was only after I collapsed, near death!

Hopefully your problem is nothing serious but keep on pressing the doctors to find what it is - you don't want to risk ending up like me or @gbb!


----------



## albion (2 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> CT scan of head, sinuses in particular....


How did you manage to get that done?

The only reason I knew a specialist was talking utter rubbish was that I had a window 20 years ago when my sinuses cleared and I could actually breath through my nose, be it in a mechanical non automatic manner, maybe because I never learned during my more severe asthma early years.

I got idiots telling me a 100% nasal blockage was physically normal. Its strange how one gets used to suffering because that is how it always has been. I even got to a point where I wondered if I would survive a nights non sleep. (can you actually drown in your sleep during apnea ?)


----------



## vickster (2 Mar 2015)

My mum's had a CTI, MRI and ultrasound of her sinuses over the last year. They can't find anything. She has a history of cancer, hence getting the tests done in a timely way and that we are relieved that they can't find anything (although she has lots of pain)


----------



## albion (2 Mar 2015)

Getting strong headaches alongside severe nasal congestion might also point to damp related conditions.
They were particularly bad for and likely linked to the headaches I used to get when each Salbutamol quick fix off after about 2 hours.

Wheezing alongside a headache maybe means oxygen depletion?
It was for me when young with asthma and I assume was the same with my severe nasal problems.


(headaches from coughing itself of course is something different, and for me feels a bit like a bruising headache)


----------



## gbb (3 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> *I certainly hope they would have spotted anything*. A bit scary sitting in the doctors when you see the "coughing for more than a month...?" notices.


 You're on their case so thats good, *but don't do what i did, accept the docs diagnosis if nothing improves.*
Excruciating pain out of the blue in my chest one night, so sever it put me on the floor literally in tears, so so painful every time i inhaled i hardly dared breathe. Ambulance called, a thorough examination followed (TBF the symptoms had gone by the time they arrived), heart, chest etc etc...nothing found. They did offer to take me to hospital for further investigations if i felt that was the right thing to do...but as it was a one off, i thought i'd pulled a muscle.
It turns out those symptoms are CLASSIC for pleurisy.

Went to the docs maybe 1 month later, tiredness, lethargy, persistant cough, night sweats...he gave me antibiotics for an infection.

Went to the drop in centre maybe another month later...she rollocked me rigid (in the nicest possible way) for not going back to the docs and suffering in silence and sent me to hospital for an immediate Xray. 

Ambulance staff missed pleurisy, doctor missed pneumonia, a partially collapsed lung and TB.


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

vickster said:


> Have you had a CT scan of your chest/lungs? Might be worthwhile to rule out anything that might show up on such a scan
> 
> I think a lot of the so called sinus sprays etc can cause problems in themselves too with longer use
> 
> Are you being seen at a specialist hospital like the Royal Brompton, might be worth a referral to a tertiary centre


No, only an X-ray of my chest, I guess a CT scan is more detailed.

I was being seen by an ENT consultant at a local hospital, who basically signed me off after he couldn't find anything significant wrong. Another trip to the doctor's it is then!


SatNavSaysStraightOn said:


> You wouldn't necessarily know about issues with dairy because you will have had it on your diet from the word go so live with the symptoms often without knowing they were even there until they raise this ugly head.
> 
> For me I found out I was initially intolerant to cow's dairy just because it took me longer to recovery from coughs, cold and flu than others and it was always worse for me than others. My gp told me that staying off dairy whilst suffering these conditions with my asthma would make my asthma easier to control and then clear up more quickly. It worked. After a particularly bad chest infection lasting 6 weeks I finally got the all clear to go back onto dairy and did. I ended up in a&e! That rules cow's dairy out of my diet. I went to goat's milk, butter, cream & yogurt quite hesitantly but was fine with it for around 10 years and then started having problems with it as well... That's when the allergy developed. Full blown anaphylactic shock now. Not great.
> 
> Ruling dairy out of my husband's diet has almost cured his snoring problem though! And we both can tell well he had eaten any dairy!



It must be hard going to cutting out dairy altogether, but you have no choice. I started checking lists of ingredients yesterday while out shopping, and so much stuff has either milk/milk product as an ingredient, or if they don't it's on the "may contain..." list.


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

ColinJ said:


> The first obvious symptom of my DVT/PE was incessant coughing. I put up with for weeks before seeing a doctor and then he missed what it really was. A second doctor picked up on it a few weeks further on but that was only after I collapsed, near death!
> 
> Hopefully your problem is nothing serious but keep on pressing the doctors to find what it is - you don't want to risk ending up like me or @gbb!


Will do, another visit to the docs coming up.


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

gbb said:


> You're on their case so thats good, *but don't do what i did, accept the docs diagnosis if nothing improves.*
> Excruciating pain out of the blue in my chest one night, so sever it put me on the floor literally in tears, so so painful every time i inhaled i hardly dared breathe. Ambulance called, a thorough examination followed (TBF the symptoms had gone by the time they arrived), heart, chest etc etc...nothing found. They did offer to take me to hospital for further investigations if i felt that was the right thing to do...but as it was a one off, i thought i'd pulled a muscle.
> It turns out those symptoms are CLASSIC for pleurisy.
> 
> ...


That sounds horrendous gbb. Things are still bad with me but nothing on that scale, I will be going back to the doctor's ASAP though.


----------



## Red17 (3 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> I've had a cough for getting on for 2 years, the medics have pretty much given up. Cycling doesn't particularly seem to make it worse, although commuting in cold weather is not great on the throat. I did try staying off the bike for a month or so but there was no real improvement.
> 
> I've been back and forth to the doctor, got referred to an ENT consultant, had many and various tests and treatments none of which have helped. I've had a chest X-ray, camera up my nose and down my throat, allergy test, all negative. CT scan showed a slight inflammation of some sinuses, but nothing that he would recommend surgery for.
> 
> ...



Had almost the identical issues for the last few years - I've also had the x-rays, camera, asthma tests etc and the conclusion was that I'm allergic to something in the atmosphere but they have no idea what. The hospital claimed that about 50% of all coughs referred to them cant be traced to anything specific.

The only time it went completely was when I spent 3 weeks in Cornwall in the fresh air, and when I spent 5 weeks in hospital with a broken back. 

My cough seems to get a lot better in the winter and worse in the summer - I have a suspicion its all the pollution and dust in London, but as I need to work here there's nothing I can do about it.


----------



## SatNavSaysStraightOn (3 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> It must be hard going to cutting out dairy altogether, but you have no choice. I started checking lists of ingredients yesterday while out shopping, and so much stuff has either milk/milk product as an ingredient, or if they don't it's on the "may contain..." list.


seriously hard because there are some components that at first glance you would not think are derived from dairy.
Not to mention the really obvious one that Lactose Monohydrate is one of the 2 main tablet fillers (and tends to be the main one) so I have had the bizarre situation (back about 6 months ago just before my back went) were an antihistamine tablet left me in anaphylactic shock because it wasn't my usual one but was one somewhat larger and I didn't think twice about taking it! But a lot of medication is not available in any form other than tablet and I'm left with the problem of is it going to cause a problem... if I stick to certain brands I'm OK but it is difficult. And then there was the case of one of my inhalers - that was well ridiculous put bluntly. for 2 years I had been suspected of having sleep apnoea and even had a trial for a CPAP device... I was convinced the problem lay with one of my inhalers and in the end had to take matters in to my own hands. cutting a long story short, 1 of my inhalers, a capsule you put into the inhaler, had 2 ingredients, the drug I needed and a tablet filler - lactose monohydrate which I had been spraying directly into my lungs despite being allergic to it! the issues I was having were not sleep apnoea but actually anaphylactic shock each and every night!


----------



## albion (3 Mar 2015)

I've never had any sign whatsoever of a food allergy but I suspect the principal of 1 allergy triggering sensitivity to other (food) stuff is exactly the same.
I still get hay fever type symptoms out and about, but that is also well damped down so as not to be the nightmare it once was. 

Each to their own, so ignore us and make sure its not a symptom of something like pneumonia, a partially collapsed lung etc which from my experience too, goes alongside breathing trouble.
Reminds me, check your temperature. Increased temperature was the main thing that, years ago, told my doctor I'd had likely gone down with pneumonia and a collapsed lung.


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

albion said:


> I've never had any sign whatsoever of a food allergy but I suspect the principal of 1 allergy triggering sensitivity to other (food) stuff is exactly the same.
> I still get hay fever type symptoms out and about, but that is also well damped down so as not to be the nightmare it once was.
> 
> Each to their own, so ignore us and make sure its not a symptom of something like pneumonia, a partially collapsed lung etc which from my experience too, goes alongside breathing trouble.
> Reminds me, check your temperature. Increased temperature was the main thing that, years ago, told my doctor I'd had likely gone down with pneumonia and a collapsed lung.


Thanks, I will check my temperature. I don't obviously have major chills or sweats but I sometimes feel that things aren't quite normal, like I have a slightly raised temperature. .


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

Red17 said:


> Had almost the identical issues for the last few years - I've also had the x-rays, camera, asthma tests etc and the conclusion was that I'm allergic to something in the atmosphere but they have no idea what. The hospital claimed that about 50% of all coughs referred to them cant be traced to anything specific.
> 
> The only time it went completely was when I spent 3 weeks in Cornwall in the fresh air, and when I spent 5 weeks in hospital with a broken back.
> 
> My cough seems to get a lot better in the winter and worse in the summer - I have a suspicion its all the pollution and dust in London, but as I need to work here there's nothing I can do about it.


I'm not alone then!

I'm not really sure whether mine is worse in winter or summer, coughing fits most mornings throughout generally. Pollution-wise I'm outside London, but not really in the countryside. I only really have 2 weeks away anywhere at a time so maybe not long enough to really see a difference.


----------



## wheeliebin (3 Mar 2015)

albion said:


> Getting strong headaches alongside severe nasal congestion might also point to damp related conditions.
> They were particularly bad for and likely linked to the headaches I used to get when each Salbutamol quick fix off after about 2 hours.
> 
> Wheezing alongside a headache maybe means oxygen depletion?
> ...



I know what you mean about coughing headache, I do get that sometimes when things are bad. I'm not sure what counts as severe congestion, I can breathe through my nose a lot of the time, but I am continually swallowing mucus from the back of my nose and coughing as a result.


----------



## Red17 (4 Mar 2015)

wheeliebin said:


> I'm not alone then!
> 
> I'm not really sure whether mine is worse in winter or summer, coughing fits most mornings throughout generally. Pollution-wise I'm outside London, but not really in the countryside. I only really have 2 weeks away anywhere at a time so maybe not long enough to really see a difference.



Its a real pain at times but I've sort of got used to it by now. Another thing I've noticed that tends to set me coughing is being in air conditioned buildings - especially in the summer when they have the cooling on.


----------



## wheeliebin (4 Mar 2015)

I tried some over the counter ones for a bit (can't remember which) but gave up as they didn't seem to be having a noticeable effect. The ENT doc also prescribed me Fexofenadine, but only a short course. Do you find they have an immediate effect, or is it worth trying them on a more long-term basis?


----------

