# Help me find a decent rucksack!



## twinkle (12 Aug 2008)

I'm a newbie commuter and am still getting into my groove with regular cycling. I have a 4 mile commute each way and lots of hills and no proper cycle gear yet so I'm often put off by my inability to carry stuff securely or stop myself getting soaked so I end up getting the bus. I debated buying panniers but I'm not using my bike regulary enough yet to warrant the expense plus I don't have access to a bike shed at work and would have to carry the pannier bag a fair way to my office. 

Having mulled it through I think a decent cycle rucksack is what I need and 20-25l in size would be perfect (I'm only 5ft so can't have anything huge!). As I'm a newbie I don't no decent brands or where best to buy from so I was hoping that some of you could maybe point me in the right direction?

I've considered a *Berghaus Twentyfourseven 25* or 20 but I'm not sure if that's more of a walking sack as it doesn't have a frame or such a great air flow system. My other thought is a *Deuter Superbike Rucksack 2008* but it's pricey (£54) and I only want to go to that expense if I'm assured it's worth it.

Thanks for reading! I look forward to heraing from you!


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## zimzum42 (12 Aug 2008)

The Deuter bags are great! Lots of useful pockets and so on, great water bag system, and a rain cover. very sturdily made too....


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## John the Monkey (12 Aug 2008)

The Edinburgh Bike Co-Op's own brand bags were well reviewed in the last Cycling Plus mag - made by Vaude, apparently.

e.g. http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebw...5&f_SortOrderID=1&f_bct=c003154c003119c003128


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## Wolf04 (12 Aug 2008)

John the Monkey said:


> The Edinburgh Bike Co-Op's own brand bags were well reviewed in the last Cycling Plus mag - made by Vaude, apparently.
> 
> e.g. http://www.edinburghbicycle.com/ebw...5&f_SortOrderID=1&f_bct=c003154c003119c003128



Excellent quality, though the zip on the top pocket came away. They replaced it without any fuss and without query or receipt.


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## gbb (12 Aug 2008)

I have no experience of those particular rucksacks twinkle, but is see the Berghaus has a 'Comfortable Flow back system.'
I assume this may be similar to my PolarOne rucksack, which has two padded bits that sit on your back. Cos they're raised, air can flow between them...and down your back. The benefit is obvious...less contact area with your back...less heat buildup.
My old rucksack was just a common or garden one...and it was like having an electric fire strapped to you. 
The airflow is better with the new one...you still get hot....but not as bad.


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## srw (12 Aug 2008)

Think again. Rucksacks are horrible things on a bike, which make your back hot and sticky and unsettle your balance. For much less than £54 you could get a pair of cheap panniers with shoulder straps.

You don't need to carry much, anyway - just a change of clothes.


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## yello (12 Aug 2008)

Deuters and Vaudes both do good cycle orientated rucksacks.

But are you really really sure a pannier is not a better option? It's no more weight to lug a pannier than a rucksack, it depends what you put in it. I have found through experience that rucksacks are uncomfortable when riding and a pannier is a far more convenient (if slightly more naff!) option.


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## domtyler (12 Aug 2008)

Go for the rack and panniers, ruck sacks will constrict your movement and breathing on a bike which is why you don't see that many people wearing them.


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## fossyant (12 Aug 2008)

If you have a Decathlon - the Forclaz Air 25 is good ! Waterproof cover, pockets, extra straps, etc and air cooling on the back. Been using mine daily for the past year !


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## goo_mason (12 Aug 2008)

I have a Berghaus Freeflo 30+10 and for the summer and the road bike I bought a Deuter Race EXP Air.

I'd highly recommend both. The Berghaus is a bigger beast and best suited to a more upright riding position, as it's not so easy to see past if you're bent down in a roadie riding style. I use that on the MTB.

The Deuter is smaller and lighter (though can surprisingly hold quite a lot), and with its streamlined shape it's ideal for not obscuring your view as you look over your shoulder.

Both have water reservoir pockets and built-in rain covers, as well as air-flow backs, plenty of pockets, expansion zips and good sternum and waist straps.


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## wafflycat (12 Aug 2008)

Go for rear rack and panniers. It is far, far better to carry a load this way than by using a rucksack. Honest.


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## Notsoblue (12 Aug 2008)

I swapped my old Lowe rucksack for a Crumpler Cheesy Disco courier bag. Depending on how much you want to carry I think they're great. They've got quite a range;

http://www.crumpler.eu/?categroy=Laptop_Bags&page=products&category=2

I chose mine because it has a removable 15" laptop insert, but there are smaller ones available. Courier bags don't hold as much as rucksacks but I find them far more comfortable, the strap accross the chest doesn't restrict my breathing as much as a rucksack.

My bike also has a rack for which I have a pair of Ortlieb panniers that I use if I have to carry more to work than just my laptop. I keep shower supplies and some clothes at work that need to be ferried back and forth every now and again.


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## biking_fox (12 Aug 2008)

I use a Karrimore Ridge which is 30L.

the important thing is to make sure whatever pack you buy has a waist and chest straps. This takes the weight off the shoulders.

I'm not impressed by any of the back airvent systems, they make a slight difference but you'll still get sweaty. The best I've ridden with was a BigPack which had a mesh against the back and the actual sack curved away and wasn't touching at all. Thsi reduced the volume of the bag though. 

Another useful feature is side compression straps, which pull the rucksack into a compact shap no matter what it's carrying. this enables you to see behind you and stops the bag swaying off balance.

The balance is the issue I disliked with paniers. If you only carry enough stuff to require one panier, then the bike is off balance.


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## goo_mason (12 Aug 2008)

I'm sweaty down my back regardless of whether I'm wearing a rucksack or not, so airflow backs make no difference to me - but I mentioned them in case the prospective user doesn't sweat like he's in a sauna all the time 

I would say that the mesh backing and the large gap between my back and the lumpy contents of the rucksack does help comfort-wise though.


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## twinkle (12 Aug 2008)

Thanks for all the replies- you've given me some really helpful food for thought! I work from home a couple days a week and have to lug in quite a lot of books and things, as well as my gym kit, when I do cycle in so I'd need pretty big panniers. As my mountain bike is only little (as I'm only little) I'm not sure what size of rack/bag I'd need and if that would unsteady me once loaded. The edinburghbicyclecooperative bag looks good- we have a store locally so I may take my bike in to try the bag and also have a chat with them about a suitable rack and panniers. I'm still veering towards a rucksack as I see them as more versitile as I can use it on other occasions too like hill walking and days I take the bus. As a lady I obviously glow instead of sweating (haha!) so I don't need to worry too much about a dripping back!


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## lycradodger (12 Aug 2008)

twinkle said:


> I work from home a couple days a week and have to lug in quite a lot of books and things, as well as my gym kit, when I do cycle in so I'd need pretty big panniers. As my mountain bike is only little (as I'm only little) I'm not sure what size of rack/bag I'd need and if that would unsteady me once loaded.



I'd second(/third/fourth, whatever) panniers. Particularly if you've a heavy load - they will be way comfier, and are generally more spacious than any rucksack that is designed for cyling. I commute regularly with one pannier and have never noticed a problem with balance. I'd probably be more concerned about an overly large rucksack waving about high up on my back - from the sounds of it you would need something way bigger than the 20/25 litre ones being mentioned above.

Panniers come in pairs anyway, so just use two rather than overloading one and you will have no issues with balance.

Ideal solution might of course be panniers for the bike AND a larger rucksack for walking/hiking - if you're a true lady then surely you will want as many bags as possible...?


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## PatrickPending (12 Aug 2008)

I've had a deuter raxce x bag for 5 years now - its seen a lot of use (use it every day on my commute)has a mesh type thing to keep the main bag away from your back - so my back doesn't get sweaty - great for long rides if you dont have to carry too much


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## Bug (12 Aug 2008)

I have one of the Edinburgh Cycle Co-Op ones and it's probably seen me over 5000 miles on my back and still as good as new.

The whole pannier/rucksack debate is more individual preference than some would have you believe. Personally I find the airflow system on my rucksack is more than good enough to prevent a sweaty back. As opposed to "srw" above, I find that panniers unsettle my balance more than a rucksack does.


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## domtyler (12 Aug 2008)

Quite a few people have now said that panniers have upset the balance of their bikes, I find it extraordinary as I frequently carry heavy loads using panniers and have never noticed my balance being effected by this. I carry my daughter to nursery on the child seat and she can have an unsettling effect as she is perched high up above the bike. The panniers are designed to place the load low down though so lowering the centre of gravity which actually improves balance over an unweighted bike.

I would be interested if those people who have said that panniers have unbalanced them could enlighten me as to the specifics, i.e. have they been carrying large loads on top of the rack or just used one pannier instead of balancing over the two etc.


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## biking_fox (12 Aug 2008)

Dom - 1 panier (not rack top) because I've only got 1 bags worth of stuff. And carrying 1 panier is quite hassle enough, 2 would be a major pain, as opposed to a rucksack which leaves the hands free for opening doors, fishing out passes / money etc etc. Could I have carried on riding with it, and become accustomed. Yes of course. but it just didn't seem to offer any benefits greater than the inconvenience, so I went back to the rucksack.

Maybe it's partly the bike set-up, I can imagine that a stiff MTB with squishy tires on might not notice the effect as much as alu roadbike.


Racktop bags do work well if you've only a small amount of stuff - sweat free back, and little balance alteration.


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## domtyler (12 Aug 2008)

Okay, thanks for responding BD! 

I guess if you have to handle the pannier bags off the bike a fair bit then they might be more annoying to use?


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## HLaB (12 Aug 2008)

twinkle said:


> Thanks for all the replies- you've given me some really helpful food for thought! I work from home a couple days a week and have to lug in quite a lot of books and things, as well as my gym kit, when I do cycle in so I'd need pretty big panniers. As my mountain bike is only little (as I'm only little) I'm not sure what size of rack/bag I'd need and if that would unsteady me once loaded.


Personally for lugging about books and things I'd use panniers as well as the comfort thing, I actually feel more stable with the weight on the bike, lower down rather than on my back and find they can hold more than a rucksack. But each to our own I read the C+ review of the CoOp backpack and they rated it.


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## BentMikey (12 Aug 2008)

Backpacks/messenger bags are OK, and fine for shorter journeys and lighter loads. As soon as you go longer distances and heavier loads, panniers, saddlebags, or a tailfairing are much much better options.


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## Jo25 (12 Aug 2008)

Hi twinkle,

I use the berghaus 24seven 25 for my 8 mile round trip commute and to be honest, its totally fine for me. Its a good bag, nice water compartment and useful pockets. The shape of the bag means that the straps don't restrict my breathing (as some have said rucksack do) and the airflow system works reasonably well, though as I have a steep climb, I do tend to 'glow' quite a lot on the way to work. I don't find it restricts me in any way, though I do only usually carry clothes and food, so nothing too heavy most days. Having said that, I have never used panniers....


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## zimzum42 (12 Aug 2008)

panniers are good, but they make nice bikes look crap.....

if you've got a racing bike, the last thing you want is panniers, it's like using a ferarri to tow a caravan.....


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## goo_mason (12 Aug 2008)

I've never tried panniers because they're impractical for me at the mo; I have to carry the bike down 5 flights of stairs and then try and squeeze it and me through a narrow door. There'd be no room with panniers on the side of the bike, and there's no way I could carry the panniers off-bike until I got down and outside.

There's no 'ground floor' for me to put the bike down and wheel it out of the door either - the steps continue down to the door (which opens outwards), under it and down to the Close outside - so it's a door on a stair in effect.

They'd just be too awkward. Of course, I might consider them on the MTB if I ever moved flat. But I'd never sully the sleek looks of my SCR2 with panniers


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## Plax (12 Aug 2008)

twinkle said:


> Thanks for all the replies- you've given me some really helpful food for thought! I work from home a couple days a week and have to lug in quite a lot of books and things, as well as my gym kit, when I do cycle in so I'd need pretty big panniers. As my mountain bike is only little (as I'm only little) I'm not sure what size of rack/bag I'd need and if that would unsteady me once loaded. The edinburghbicyclecooperative bag looks good- we have a store locally so I may take my bike in to try the bag and also have a chat with them about a suitable rack and panniers. I'm still veering towards a rucksack as I see them as more versitile as I can use it on other occasions too like hill walking and days I take the bus. As a lady I obviously glow instead of sweating (haha!) so I don't need to worry too much about a dripping back!



As a fellow lady that has used both panniers and rucksack, you'll probably find that you'll glow quite happily regardless of what luggage device you choose (I find it's my sport's bra that contributes to my glowing back ). 

I was quite happy to use a rucksack, but it really does make you overheat in the summer. I have switched to panniers now and much prefer them. I also have a carradice barley saddle bag which you can fit quite a bit into, and tend to put my clothes and lunch in a single pannier (I used to leave a weeks worth of clothes at work in my locker, but I had to give that up for a lab worker as I'm a pen pusher and have an office, grumble grumble). I've never found that a single pannier unbalances the bike, although I do alternate which pannier I use.


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## HJ (12 Aug 2008)

goo_mason said:


> I've never tried panniers because they're impractical for me at the mo; I have to carry the bike down 5 flights of stairs and then try and squeeze it and me through a narrow door. There'd be no room with panniers on the side of the bike, and there's no way I could carry the panniers off-bike until I got down and outside.
> 
> There's no 'ground floor' for me to put the bike down and wheel it out of the door either - the steps continue down to the door (which opens outwards), under it and down to the Close outside - so it's a door on a stair in effect.
> 
> They'd just be too awkward. Of course, I might consider them on the MTB if I ever moved flat. But I'd never sully the sleek looks of my SCR2 with panniers



I used carry a rucksack for years, then I discovered panniers, way better, but then I only have to carry mine down 3 flights of stairs, but thats nae bother (get it back up after a hard ride can be). My wife has found a simpler solution, she just buzzes and I have to go down and fetch the panniers up for her, she can carry her own bike though...


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## goo_mason (12 Aug 2008)

Hairy Jock said:


> I used carry a rucksack for years, then I discovered panniers, way better, but then I only have to carry mine down 3 flights of stairs, but thats nae bother (get it back up after a hard ride can be). My wife has found a simpler solution, she just buzzes and I have to go down and fetch the panniers up for her, she can carry her own bike though...



Maybe I can train the cat to behave like a pack mule...


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## wafflycat (12 Aug 2008)

goo_mason said:


> Maybe I can train the cat to behave like a pack mule...



Cat herders


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## rootes (13 Aug 2008)

I use a Vaude Splash Air 20+5 - great back pack bag - just the right size from most things...


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## tiswas-steve (27 Oct 2009)

Ive just purchased a veude juicy air 9 today from E-bay. ( great price !! ) Anyone know anything about said bag ?


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## Alan Whicker (27 Oct 2009)

I've got a Deuter airflow-type rucksack, which works very well for me. I've never really got on with pannier bags, but I have been know to strap a rucksack to a rear rack.

Deuter bags, by the way, are bombproof. I've also got a Deuter 40 Litre travel pack that's had some real abuse over the years and it still looks like new. Lowe Alpine and Tatanka are also 'unwearoutable'.


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## jonny jeez (27 Oct 2009)

Hi Twinkle (and as I’ve not seen you about here before…Welcome)

I personally don’t like panniers as they are too specific to bikes (I guess that's obvious). If I am going to spend cash I like to know that I may at least get more than one function from an item and so I opt for a rucksack every time.

The trick with a rucksack is to look for one with a really good, comfortable venting system on the back, the bit that sits on your back. I have a "Vaude Bike Alpin Air". it has a "frame" on the back that has a mesh panel stretched between the two sides of the frame, the mesh sits on your back and cool air flows between your back, and the rucksack. It proved perfect all summer and provided a great tool for walks in the park and picnics with the kids etc. It also looks pretty smart (rather than a little bag perched up on your shoulders)

I love my rucksack and would really recommend the "Air" system (or the brand). The alpin air comes in a few different sizes (I have the 30+5), is really adjustable (even to your torso height/size) with plenty of adjusters to enable the right fit. If you get one, do read the manual (that, coming from a bloke!!) as it explains how best to set the bag up for max comfort. The bag has tons of compartments for dirty washing, clean clothes, wet weather gear, repair kits, fleeces, Lights etc and it also has a few “secret” compartments for cash, jewellery (cufflinks for me) and the like. Best of all, it has a handy orange outer that you pull out of a bottom pouch when it rains, to keep everything perfectly dry (and this really works well)


Good luck with the commute, Hope you find what you’re looking for.

Jonny


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## Ivan Ardon (28 Oct 2009)

Uh - oh! Zombie thread re-incarnation!


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## jonny jeez (28 Oct 2009)

Ivan Ardon said:


> Uh - oh! Zombie thread re-incarnation!



Damn....Got me...I must check those post dates!!


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## ron4322 (28 Oct 2009)

Well, seeing as the thread has been revived, I might as well have my two pennyworth.

I think there is no single answer - it is a personal choice. I've tried small rucsacks - cheap ones but with proper waist and chest straps to keep the weight firmly supported against the body, so it doesn't swing about. Even so, I do not feel comfortable with the weight added to my back.

I now use a single pannier (on the left-hand side). When I ride I don't even know it is there - and occasionally find myself reaching back to check that it is still there. I don't experience any unbalance with having only one pannier. I don't know if a single pannier looks naff, and I don't care as I can't see it anyway.

I have a cheap rack (alloy one with a sprung clamp) - This is not very strong or secure, and I'm on the lookout for a stiffer and better quality replacement, but it hasn't let me down (yet). The pannier was approx £11 or £12, from Lidl as one of their specials (both local Lidls only had left hand panniers when I went in - I can only presume that the right side ones are more popular and they had already gone. This suited me as I wanted a left side one - I have a light on my offside seatstay). The Lidl pannier is a roll top type, made out of a sort of waterproof groundsheet material, with welded seams - I don't know how sturdy this will prove to be - but as I only load it lightly and not very often, I think it will be OK. I'm well pleased so far.

Edit: Also, it has a small handle, so you can just lift it off and carry it.


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## slowmotion (28 Oct 2009)

Well, it doesn't look very cool, but after a few commutes with a rucksac, I went the rack and pannier route. I can carry all kinds of stuff, if needed. Maybe 30 kilos with Ortlieb Back Roller Classics and a cheap aluminium rack. Total cost, maybe £110 from Wiggle, and you can use them for touring if you want to. The Ortliebs clip onto and off the rack in five seconds. 
I just hate the feel of a sac on my back when riding. BTW, that is just my personal preference....each to his/her own...


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