# Horses and flashing front lights.



## User (12 Nov 2017)




----------



## deptfordmarmoset (12 Nov 2017)

Possibly the rider doesn't know how the horse is going to react - they can be hard to predict - and she simply thanked you because you took care and it ended well.


----------



## Lonestar (12 Nov 2017)

At times I cover my flashing front light when appropriate as not to distract motorist so I'd probably do the same if need be.


----------



## NorthernDave (12 Nov 2017)

If I'm running one of my proper lights on either pulse or flash, I always tilt it down or cover it approaching horses as you never know how they'll react.
I've also had thanks from the riders for doing it.


----------



## Dave 123 (12 Nov 2017)

I only ever have my rear (light) on pulse.

As a former epilepsy sufferer they don't make me feel good.


----------



## MontyVeda (12 Nov 2017)

I'm not a fan of flashing front lights... the closer to strobing the worse they are. 

If @User9609 had approached me on my bike and covered it in the same manner, i'd have thanked him too.


----------



## T4tomo (12 Nov 2017)

Yes they are awful lights and horses hate them. You don't need 26 billlion nano watts to be seen.


----------



## PeteXXX (12 Nov 2017)

I don't use my front light on strobe, especially at dusk. I would imagine that it could quite easily freak a horse out!
Also, car drivers then know that I'm on a bike, and act accordingly i.e. target practise! 
A steady light will give horses time to adapt to your approach, and drivers aren't sure if I'm on a bike, a motorbike or a car with one light out.


----------



## steveindenmark (13 Nov 2017)

As an ex horse owner I can well imagine a horse would not like the strobe light. Why should horses be different to some motorists.


----------



## PaulSB (13 Nov 2017)

These lights have the potential to distract and disturb me so I'm sure the same could apply to horses. I frequently find myself briefly thinking about what is coming towards me when I see either a steady or strobe high powered light approaching and directed in my general sight line. Yes there is benefit in this but I think the downsides are greater.

I shall probably get shouted at for this but I feel too many cyclists use these lights incorrectly. I own a relatively high powered light which I used to use to flood the *road *in front of me when riding on three miles of unlit country lanes during my commute. The light was focused downwards toward the road and in such a position would give me at least 40-50 feet illumination across the whole of my side of the road. The upward overspill and a second steady low level light were perfectly adequate to ensure I was visible to oncoming traffic.

I've lost count of the number of cyclists I've seen with these high powered lights pointing straight ahead in well lit areas, either flashing or solid at a height which is at best distracting to other road users. For me this has the potential to create danger rather than reduce it.

Bike lights have two purposes, to help the rider see the road and to tell other road users this is a cyclist in front of or approaching me. As such lights need to be positioned appropriately in the correct positions and sending the right message. If the light in question needed to be covered it was poorly positioned or overly powerful for the purpose. Lighting up like Blackpool illuminations is not the answer.

Rant over


----------



## Drago (13 Nov 2017)

Were the horses displaying lights?


----------



## Globalti (13 Nov 2017)

Never mind the flashing light - you should have asked: "Fancy swopping?" and when the rider replied: "Oh no, thank you!" you should have retorted with a leer: "I wasn't talking to you; I was talking to your horse!"


----------



## gavroche (13 Nov 2017)

Do horses pay road tax?


----------



## jefmcg (13 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5037725, member: 9609"]Is it likely these lights could freak a horse out ?[/QUOTE]
They freak me out. 

Please don't use "high intensity pulsing front lights".

(TMNs to many above, I just want to add my voice)


----------



## oldstrath (13 Nov 2017)

jefmcg said:


> They freak me out.
> 
> Please don't use "high intensity pulsing front lights".
> 
> (TMNs to many above, I just want to add my voice)


Horses freak me out, but that doesn't stop people riding the things.


----------



## MontyVeda (13 Nov 2017)

I can spot steady lights from a considerable distance. Flashing lights are unnecessary... although i do have one of my rear lights on flash mode if it's hoofing it down with rain.


----------



## Sixmile (13 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5037725, member: 9609"] as we passed the woman said 'thankyou so much for that' may be she was just thanking me for slowing down but I sort I think she was meaning the light?[/QUOTE]

Or maybe she was talking to the horse?


----------



## jefmcg (13 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5038150, member: 9609"]I have only had one a week, did't realise there was so much opposition to them, the horse bit seemed a pretty obvious one to me hence why I covered it. However as a driver I think they are brilliant, you spot them in poor light at a considerable distance and know in an instant that its a cyclist.[/QUOTE]
I don't know why I don't like them, I just find them deeply unpleasant. I either turn off or just stop and wait if someone has a light brightly flashing near me. Less likely to bother me while driving, because headlights are typically brighter than even very bright bike lights, so the effected is muted.

Something to think about: could your lights trigger an epileptic fit in someone who was sensitive? That wouldn't be true of a little knog blinky, but a very bright light lighting up the surrounds then darkening then brightening again might. 

Usual disclaimer: I don't know enough about photosensitive epilepsy to know for sure if a light is potentially dangerous. Just raising the possibility.


----------



## MontyVeda (13 Nov 2017)

There's a cyclist i've passed few times on my way to work who has his front light set to flashing an SOS. Am I supposed to ring mountain rescue or just ignore it?


----------



## MiK1138 (13 Nov 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> As an ex horse owner I can well imagine a horse would not like the strobe light. Why should horses be different to some motorists.


No Way a horse could steer, change gear and text his mate all at once not with those hooves


----------



## EasyPeez (13 Nov 2017)

steveindenmark said:


> Why should horses be different to some motorists.



Indeed. Both seem comfortable wearing blinkers when on the road half the time.


----------



## ozboz (13 Nov 2017)

My GF is a Horse person , I asked her about this , the answer was 'maybe ' some horses spook easily ,


----------



## LCpl Boiled Egg (13 Nov 2017)

They annoy the hell out of me but at least I can complain to the cyclist using the bloody thing, unlike the poor horse.


----------



## Apollonius (13 Nov 2017)

As far as I know, bike lights are made to be well outside the critical flash rate to disturb epileptics. Not sure about epileptic horses, but from personal experience horses go "Ah, yes, chainsaw, no worries, jog on. Oh my God a crisp bag PANIC!"


----------



## jefmcg (13 Nov 2017)

Apollonius said:


> As far as I know, bike lights are made to be well outside the critical flash rate to disturb epileptics.


Google told me that, but then a lot of these very bright lights come direct from China, and do they obey the safety standards?

Edit: from here it seems a legal bicycle light could trigger a seizure. Note - it's a bit contradictory, first saying that bike lights under 4 Hz should be safe, then saying strobe lights under 4 flashes/second (==4 Hz) might still trigger seizures. Oh, and if someone has a strobe flashing around 4 times per second near me, they should be grateful I have no idea how to land a punch, because I would want to punch them.


----------



## Ian H (13 Nov 2017)

One winter night I was riding to the pub—no street lighting, no moon. I became aware of a gradually increasing pulsing light. It got brighter until I was seeing the road ahead in stop-motion, whereupon the cyclist with just a stupidly powerful flashing front light passed me. Fortunately I was about to turn off; otherwise I would have had to stop and wait for him to disappear up the road.


----------



## Bollo (13 Nov 2017)

ozboz said:


> My GF is a Horse person , ...


Your girlfriend's a Centaur?!


----------



## jefmcg (13 Nov 2017)

Bollo said:


> Your girlfriend's a Centaur?!


My first read was "My GF is a Horse", so kudos for giving her more humanity than I did.


----------



## jefmcg (13 Nov 2017)

Of course there is a link between bright flashing lights and horses: Ecstasy


----------



## Katherine (13 Nov 2017)

You only need those bright lights when there are no street lights.
I put my hand over to cover mine when approaching cyclists or pedestrians from the opposite direction. I have often been thanked for doing this. 

When a cyclist is approaching me with a poorly positioned or too bright flashing light I have to put my arm up to block it or I am blinded, I often have to stop until they've passed. 

I actually find that the flashing lights are extremely hard to judge the speed and distance of the approach.


----------



## Ming the Merciless (13 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5038780, member: 9609"]he is actually morseing SAS, you're supposed to keep out of his way.[/QUOTE]

Surely SCS Special Cyclist Squadron


----------



## Tin Pot (13 Nov 2017)

This thread is very good.

I came here to rant, but I'm too busy crying with laughter.


----------



## Maenchi (13 Nov 2017)

count me in with 'don't agree with them' opinion and the  'cover my eyes' reaction.


----------



## andrew_s (14 Nov 2017)

Drago said:


> Were the horses displaying lights?



headlight








tail light


----------



## oldstrath (14 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5039293, member: 9609"]never thought about the epilepsy angle - so you could have a situation where you use a flasher to get the attention of an inbound truck, the driver has a seizure swerves across the road and its Goodnight Vienna - not good

Have just calculated the flash rate of mine - 3.5Hz (30 flashes in 8.55sec) so just under the requirement, but just.

Only had it on for 2.7 miles the night - seen nobody, no cars, horse riders just some cattle in a field.[/QUOTE]
Truck driver really ought to know by now that he has photosensitive epilepsy, and probably shouldn't be driving ,- the list of possible triggers is a ot longer than just bike lights. 

Having said that, I'm not really sure why one would use a flashing front light on unlit roads - surely a steady light is much better for seeing?


----------



## Tom B (14 Nov 2017)

T4tomo said:


> Yes they are awful lights and horses hate them. You don't need 26 billlion nano watts to be seen.



Was it just me that had to calculate how many watts 26 billion nanowatts is....

I arrived at 26.


----------



## EasyPeez (14 Nov 2017)

User13710 said:


> Horses wear blinkers for safety reasons! They can see back along their own bodies, so what they can't see due to wearing blinkers, they can't shy at.



Whoosh?


----------



## Tin Pot (14 Nov 2017)

[QUOTE 5039561, member: 9609"]
I am not using the flash to see but to be seen. [/QUOTE]
The vast majority of drivers, reasonably attentive, will drive up to a cyclist in the dark _entirely without lights_, see them in the headlights and pass them, perhaps feeling mildly annoyed that the cyclist hasn't afforded them the common decency of having lights on.

The average driver who thinks peds and cyclists have no right to be on the road, is posting on pistonheads while eating a bowl of cereal and watching a movie, will run clean over your strobing quasar-strength light, you, into a field and back onto the road without pausing for thought.

At best it gives the headlines the opener "A cyclist, who had bright lights on, was hit and killed yesterday..."

Not that I'm a pessimist.


----------



## ozboz (15 Nov 2017)

Bollo said:


> Your girlfriend's a Centaur?!



Mmm, very droll,
An idiom in my day , perfectly accepted and understandable ,
However, if you must partially de- humanise the Girl , at least give her some courtousy and apply the feminine name for these mystical and mythological creatures, or, possibly your were unaware of this ?


----------



## jefmcg (15 Nov 2017)

ozboz said:


> Mmm, very droll,
> An idiom in my day , perfectly accepted and understandable ,
> However, if you must partially de- humanise the Girl , at least give her some courtousy and apply the feminine name for these mystical and mythological creatures, or, possibly your were unaware of this ?


Wow, really? You are going to complain about a throwaway joke about a centaur, which is *not* one the ways our society belittles women and immediately call a grown woman a "Girl", which is.

(yes, and I am sure she calls herself a girl, because society perpetually tells as that the most important attribute a woman can have is youth)


----------



## ozboz (15 Nov 2017)

jefmcg said:


> Wow, really? You are going to complain about a throwaway joke about a centaur, which is *not* one the ways our society belittles women and immediately call a grown woman a "Girl", which is.
> 
> (yes, and I am sure she calls herself a girl, because society perpetually tells as that the most important attribute a woman can have is youth)



Yes really , I do complain about a throw away joke which in my opinion is derogatory to her as a person, a friends sister almost had her career ruined because of some smart arse and their throw away joke on Facebook was picked up by some nasty piece of work , (oops there goes another idiom ) and it escalated to the point where she ended up very close to resigning ,
And yes I call her Girl ,to my knowledge it is not cast in stone , ( oops , I'm at it again ) when there is cut of point in life that a female has to drop this if she does not wish , a term of endearment , from friends , family , lover ,


----------



## Apollonius (16 Nov 2017)

Riding a bridle path yesterday (in daylight) and came up behind a horse and rider. Started talking about 30m behind the horse and slowed right down. The rider moved left to let me pass. I said cheerfully, "I believe the best thing to do is to pass wide and slow and keep talking." "That is exactly right, thank you," she said. Everybody happy. Not difficult is it!


----------



## classic33 (16 Nov 2017)

Drago said:


> Were the horses displaying lights?


Tail light?


----------



## oldstrath (18 Nov 2017)

Apollonius said:


> Riding a bridle path yesterday (in daylight) and came up behind a horse and rider. Started talking about 30m behind the horse and slowed right down. The rider moved left to let me pass. I said cheerfully, "I believe the best thing to do is to pass wide and slow and keep talking." "That is exactly right, thank you," she said. Everybody happy. Not difficult is it!


Except when they decide to ride on a narrow cycle path and the only way to pass "wide" would be in the field. So the rider demands you get off and walk because "you frighten my horse". Since the horse is way bigger than me and has metal shoes, I'm never clear why it's allegedly the frightened one.

Then the horse stops to deposit a load, which the arrogant twerp on top has no intention of clearing away.


----------



## Ajax Bay (18 Nov 2017)

User13710 said:


> asking someone to do a trivial thing like getting off their bike for a moment is nothing when compared with the fear and risk associated with being on board a bolting horse.


(Typing as a relatively capable horse rider (and having enjoyed the odd 'bolt') I sense an imbalance here. Perhaps if he/she is unsure of their horse, they should ("do a trivial thing" like) dismount and control their horse while the cyclist passes, pedalling or not. I think the issue of whether the route is a 'cycle' (or shared use) path or a bridleway also has a bearing on management of this need to pass one another.


----------



## Apollonius (18 Nov 2017)

I would ask @oldstrath to consider the language, tone and attitudes in his/her post. They seem to me very similar to those found in the anti-cycling rants of certain newspapers and their readers. Prejudice breeds prejudice. Horse riders and cyclists need to be allies in the never-ending battle to convince drivers of powered transport that they do not have exclusive use of the roads - and the tracks, come to that.


----------



## oldstrath (19 Nov 2017)

User13710 said:


> People often assume riders are 'arrogant' because they are quite literally looking down on people standing on the ground. And why is this person a 'twerp'? I suppose you might be trying to be funny, but asking someone to do a trivial thing like getting off their bike for a moment is nothing when compared with the fear and risk associated with being on board a bolting horse.



They are a twerp, which i accept is insulting, because they have taken a horse which apparently cannot cope with cyclists in close proximity onto a path where that specific event is almost certain to occur. They compound that by refusing to clear up the muck deposited in the middle of the narrow track.

As for all the "scared horse" stuff maybe you should remember some of us didn't grow up around horses and have never ridden them. To me a few hundred kilos of muscle equipped with steel shoes and a rider worried about controlling it is pretty bloody terrifying.

By the way i do get off in these circumstances, purely out of self preservation. And i usually end up clearing away the mess. I simply don't understand why horese owners don't have the same obligations as dog owners.


----------



## Ian193 (19 Nov 2017)

Apollonius said:


> Riding a bridle path yesterday (in daylight) and came up behind a horse and rider. Started talking about 30m behind the horse and slowed right down. The rider moved left to let me pass. I said cheerfully, "I believe the best thing to do is to pass wide and slow and keep talking." "That is exactly right, thank you," she said. Everybody happy. Not difficult is it!




I did a similar thing on a quiet country lane earlier in the year called out morning as I approached to which she said “shoot you made me jump” which made us both laugh as I went past


----------



## oldstrath (19 Nov 2017)

Apollonius said:


> I would ask @oldstrath to consider the language, tone and attitudes in his/her post. They seem to me very similar to those found in the anti-cycling rants of certain newspapers and their readers. Prejudice breeds prejudice. Horse riders and cyclists need to be allies in the never-ending battle to convince drivers of powered transport that they do not have exclusive use of the roads - and the tracks, come to that.


I must admit that as someone who avoids horses as much as possible, and certainly has no clue how to ride one, the demand from some riders to "stop, you're frightening the horse" sounds much more like the attitude of car drivers than anything I might say. 

I suppose it's true that, because I'm scared, I hadn't considered the possibility that they are so peremptory because of their equally real fear, but sim!ply interpreted it as an arrogant assumption of superiority. So I'll try harder to sympathise.


----------



## ozboz (21 Nov 2017)

The CC Monopoly Ride Contingent knew just how to deal with these Sabre rattling Horse Riders on Sunday , 
We stood back .....
and let em ' Pass !!


----------

