# ultra light panniers



## willem (9 Feb 2014)

New technologies have created a wave of significantly lighter camping gear. Sleeping bags, mattresses or tents are now often only half the weight of what they were only a few years ago, and their volume is also much reduced. Therefore, using just a set of rear panniers is now perfectly feasible for many trips. However, thus far the panniers themselves were still as heavy as ever, and in fact modern panniers are often quite a bit heavier than classic panniers like the Karrimor ones of old.
Well respected Canadian pannier manufacturer Arkel has now changed all this in one dramatic move, with the introduction of their waterproof Dry-Lite panniers, at 420 gram for a 32 liter set: http://www.arkelpanniers.co.uk/uk/all-categories/randonneur-series/dry-lites.html These are not only much lighter, but also somewhat smaller than most alternatives, but that matches the reduced volume of much modern gear, and compares with modern ultralight backpacs. The Dry-Lites can be lighter because they use a lighter modern fabric, and because they avoid heavy stiffeners and metal/plastic adjustable hooks. As a result of such simplicity, these panniers are also relatively cheap.
I have not yet been able to test them personally, and I would perhaps hesitate to use them on an expedition tour. But for a fast tour in temperate Europe, they seem an appealing and 3 pound lighter alternative to traditional panniers. There are few cheaper ways to cut 3 pounds off your luggage weight.
Willem


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## toekneep (9 Feb 2014)

Interesting. I agree that some of the modern panniers can be a bit over-engineered. I suspect the only argument against these will be durability.


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## YahudaMoon (9 Feb 2014)

Carradice Kendals

Super light as they are made of canvas and corragated plastic, had mine over 15 years and get used daily, if Id lose them I would be out buying another pair

Heres mine












Ive used other panniers, soon got rid and kept these


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## Roadrider48 (9 Feb 2014)

YahudaMoon said:


> Carradice Kendals
> 
> Super light as they are made of canvas and corragated plastic, had mine over 15 years and get used daily, if Id lose them I would be out buying another pair
> 
> ...


Nice SS! What seatpost is that?


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## MarkF (9 Feb 2014)

willem said:


> New technologies have created a wave of significantly lighter camping gear. Sleeping bags, mattresses or tents are now often only half the weight of what they were only a few years ago, and their volume is also much reduced. Therefore, using just a set of rear panniers is now perfectly feasible for many trips. However, thus far the panniers themselves were still as heavy as ever, and in fact modern panniers are often quite a bit heavier than classic panniers like the Karrimor ones of old.
> Well respected Canadian pannier manufacturer Arkel has now changed all this in one dramatic move, with the introduction of their waterproof Dry-Lite panniers, at 420 gram for a 32 liter set: http://www.arkelpanniers.co.uk/uk/all-categories/randonneur-series/dry-lites.html These are not only much lighter, but also somewhat smaller than most alternatives, but that matches the reduced volume of much modern gear, and compares with modern ultralight backpacs. The Dry-Lites can be lighter because they use a lighter modern fabric, and because they avoid heavy stiffeners and metal/plastic adjustable hooks. As a result of such simplicity, these panniers are also relatively cheap.
> I have not yet been able to test them personally, and I would perhaps hesitate to use them on an expedition tour. But for a fast tour in temperate Europe, they seem an appealing and 3 pound lighter alternative to traditional panniers. There are few cheaper ways to cut 3 pounds off your luggage weight.
> Willem



Excellent, I have good make of panniers, they are far too sturdy and durable for "normal" touring. On my last tour I worked out that 1.5kg of panniers carried 3.5kg's, silly!


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## andrew_s (9 Feb 2014)

willem said:


> Well respected Canadian pannier manufacturer Arkel has now changed all this in one dramatic move, with the introduction of their waterproof Dry-Lite panniers, at 420 gram for a 32 liter set: http://www.arkelpanniers.co.uk/uk/all-categories/randonneur-series/dry-lites.html


Those seem very similar to what a number of people have being doing in a DIY manner, by attaching an Ortleib hook rail (available as a spare) to a standard drybag.
[edit - add link]
http://forum.ctc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=73924&p=644064



I'd agree that durability is the likely issue. Probably best to use a propstand (losing some of your weight saving) rather than lean the bike against a stone wall.


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## Aushiker (10 Feb 2014)

Steve at Trike Asylum has a few photos and thoughts shared on the Arkel Dry-Lites.











Andrew


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## YahudaMoon (13 Feb 2014)

Roadrider48 said:


> Nice SS! What seatpost is that?



Its a stolen seatpost 

Bike got stolen about 1 1/2 year back

Could be Ambrosio or a Terry Dolan?


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## Roadrider48 (13 Feb 2014)

YahudaMoon said:


> Its a stolen seatpost
> 
> Bike got stolen about 1 1/2 year back
> 
> Could be Ambrosio or a Terry Dolan?


Sorry to hear that.


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## jjb (14 Feb 2014)

These Arkels look great. It'd be 1kg saved for me, though I'd miss the end pockets of my current panniers. Just got to figure out if 32kg will do the trick. 

EDIT: Litres, not kg. 32kg would be a step in the wrong direction!


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## willem (14 Feb 2014)

In my own experience 32 liter will be enough for a summer tour in a temperate climate (plus a top tube or bar bag for little things). Last Spring I made a 4 day solo trip in Luxemburg and Germany, and I managed with 25 liters (Ortlieb frontrollers as main panniers), plus the tent on top of the rack. This included a mattras (Exped Synmat UL), PhD minim 200 sleeping bag, a Trangia 27 stove, food, and clothing for 4 days. On my solo trip to Norway a few years ago I needed 40 liters in two Ortlieb Backrollers (1.9 kg the set), but I carried a heavier sleeping bag, a Downmat, and warmer clothing. I think 32 liters is perfect for what most people do. For a trip in the colder and/or wetter season, and in more remote areas, I would want to have more space, and perhaps somewhat more robust materials. But who knows? My Dry-LItes are on their way, so I have no personal experience yet. To be continued when I have them.
Willem


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## willem (18 Feb 2014)

They arrived. My first impressions are that they look more robust than I feared. The material feels like the groundsheet material of the most sturdy Hilleberg tents. I am not too worried on that score, even if they will not last forever. I also like that the fronts are angled so you have more heel clearance, so you can fit them further forward for a better weight distribution. Finally, they are a bit smaller than I expected, and closer to the 25 liter Ortlieb frontrollers than to the 40 liter backrollers (though still larger than the former). This really is for the ultralight and ultracompact brigade, or for hostel tourers.
Willem


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## jjb (19 Feb 2014)

Thanks for the update - it'll be interesting to see just how much stuff you get in the panniers and how they fare on the road.


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## Aushiker (19 Feb 2014)

Yes thanks Willem. Much appreciated getting this early feedback.

Andrew


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## willem (19 Feb 2014)

To save volume, I will use them with a PHD Minimus 200 sleeping bag and an Exped Synmat UL mattress, both suitable for temperatures down to a few degrees above freezing. I will use a Trangia 27 stove, even though that is not the most compact system (but I like freshly cooked meals). If I want everything to fit, I will really need to keep the volume of the clothing down. For warmth, I have a PHD down vest, but beyond that the question is how much of a smelly tramp I am prepared to be.
Willem


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## willem (3 Mar 2014)

I tested them with real gear for the first time last weekend. Everything worked fine, but it was a tight fit indeed. I had planned to use only a small handlebar bag, but I needed my bigger one. I am trying to persuade Arkel to come with a largish but light handlebar bag as well. Handlebar bags are very convenient, but their the ratio of volume to weight is usually terrible. Since we do not need them as a platform for a map case anymore, they no longer need to be rigid and they can hang lower and closer to the head tube, which should reduce the weight and improve bike handling.
Willem


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## jjb (3 Mar 2014)

Thanks for the update, Willem. I stopped using my bar bag as it was 800g including the R&K fittings. I recently discovered there's a world of these slightly smaller, velcro-attached bar bags around 250g on ebay. They tend to be under £5, which is a bonus!


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## CycleFar James (5 Mar 2014)

I know I'm not really answering the question by saying this but: perhaps rather than a pannier a drybag might the a lighter option. Just one or two big stuff sacks in place of the panniers and a top bar bag. It sounds like your logic is leading you to full blown Ultralight Cycle-Touring which is something I've been very involved with lately. Good luck and don't stop counting grams!

p.s. I use a top bar bag like the Topeak Fuel tank rather than a handle bar bag - that shaves a few grams! I have a picture of my ultralight bike on my website if you want to see the Topeak Fuel tank in action. But I'll leave it at that as I'm not here to advertise.


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## marcusjb (5 Mar 2014)

I have ordered a set of the Dry-lites (stock coming into the uk arkel warehouse later this week apparently) - they do look like a good solution for light weight touring. 

I plan to use them on a 1300km 5 day trip around the Highlands and Islands in Scotland this summer, and I think they tick the box for enough capacity whilst not being heavy or massive (I.e. You always fill up whatever capacity you have). 

Need to think about handlebar solutions as well.


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## Miles Togo (5 Mar 2014)

Going down the same lines as cycle far James. I use a light rucksack The type that goes around the top of your hips . As I am touring the alps. I also want to do a bit of walking . And this is ideal .


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## BalkanExpress (6 Mar 2014)

willem said:


> I tested them with real gear for the first time last weekend. Everything worked fine, but it was a tight fit indeed. I had planned to use only a small handlebar bag, but I needed my bigger one. I am trying to persuade Arkel to come with a largish but light handlebar bag as well. Handlebar bags are very convenient, but their the ratio of volume to weight is usually terrible. Since we do not need them as a platform for a map case anymore, they no longer need to be rigid and they can hang lower and closer to the head tube, which should reduce the weight and improve bike handling.
> Willem


 
Willem,

Once you had packed the sleeping bag, mat and Trangia what else was there room for: I see from reading elsewhere you had the tent across the top, so what else was did you manage to squeeze inside the bags?


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## willem (6 Mar 2014)

Full gear for, say, three weeks in France, apart from what I would be wearing. So (if I remember it all):
spare cycling shorts
long trousers
evening shirt
two underpants
one undershirt
two pairs of warm socks
two cycling shirts (one cool and short sleeved, one warm with long sleeves)
one light sweater/warm shirt to be worn on top of the cycling shirts
a down vest
an Ikea plastic plate
a plastic tea/coffee mug, plus folding Ortlieb coffee filter
lexan cutlery
a lexan wine glass
0.7 litre of wine in a Platypus wine bag
500 grams of macaroni as emergency food,
grated cheese
a small bottle of pesto
a small flask of olive oil
a plastic jar with jam/marmelade
a tea towel
a sponge to wash the dishes
a folding piece of closed cell foam to sit on, and to use as some protection of the panniers against the sharper sides of the Trangia
toiletries
a small synthetic towel
All this in the panniers.

Strapped on the outside because like the tent they might be wet and dirty: a Goretex jacket, rain pants and overshoes

In the bar bag: phone, first aid kit, charger, medication, sun screen, spare tube and brake pads, (very) basic tools, sunglasses, leg warmers, buff, gloves
On the bike: a bottle of water, a Thermos with hot or cold water, and a 1 litre bottle of meths (the last two in a Bikebuddy).
It was a tight fit, but it worked.

Willem


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## BalkanExpress (7 Mar 2014)

Willem

That is a very impressive piece of packing

It suggests that with my far less developed stuffing skills there should still be enough room for a weekend's worth of stuff which is good news.


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## willem (7 Mar 2014)

Mind you, unless you decide that for a weekend you will simply eat out in a pub, the difference between a weekend and three weeks amounts to little more than one set of clean clothing. To get all this into the panniers, I did not pack particularly carefully. What I did do for the last few years was to collect some light and compact stuff, like the trousers. They are very light and compact, because they are made from some thin polyester stuff. They also come with an elasticated waist band so I do not need a belt. My wife once bought them for me for about 5 euros, not realizing that this was a great find. Similarly the evening shirt is an old thin polyester one. Like the trousers I will only wear it on my camping trips, to stretch its life for as long as I can. I am afraid I am running out of further ideas, however, and certainly of cheap ideas. Also, I just bought a Garmin Etrex 30. I went for the Etrex because it is light, relatively cheap, and has the best battery life. Even so, its batteries will need a charger, so my handle bar bag is getting fuller again.
Willem


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