# Cycling can be so dangerous!



## gavroche (29 Oct 2019)

The brother of a friend of my stepdaughter had a cycling accident yesterday. He slipped on some leaves and went head first into a wall. His helmet was completely smashed and he was rushed , by air ambulance to a hospital in Stoke on Trent. Bear in mind his accident happened in North Wales. He is now in intensive care with wires coming out of his head to check his brain activity.
Be careful people at this time of the year and the next few months, as cycling can indeed be very dangerous .


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## Drago (29 Oct 2019)

Ouch! Still, as dangerous as it can sometimes be, climbing large chimneys while drunk and shirtless on a freezing night currently has a much, much higher mortality rate.

On a more serious note, one of my neighbours is about 60, so not a great deal,older than me. He's currently in Stoke Mandeville in an artificial coma with serious head and spinal injuries after taking a bad fall while indulging in that daredevil pastime known as taking a shower at home.


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## tom73 (29 Oct 2019)

oh that sounds bad hope they recover well.


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## DCBassman (29 Oct 2019)

Oh dear, hope all is well soon. Having lost my right shoulder to wet leaves, I'm deeply sympathetic.


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## Smokin Joe (29 Oct 2019)

I have a blacklist of roads I avoid at this time of years, anywhere leaves lie I avoid like the plague. That's one of the reasons I hate autumn.


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## Drago (29 Oct 2019)

Of course, I sold my soul to the Devil so I'm safe from such trifles.


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## Ian H (29 Oct 2019)

I've come off three or four times on slippery stuff over the years, but I try to avoid high-speed collisions with solid objects.


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## fossyant (29 Oct 2019)

I was in hospital with a broken spine because a car hit me, the guy opposite, more serious break, only tripped and fell back on a stair (not all the way down). He's since had rods in his back as the vertebrae collapsed a year later. Mine has been fine.

Shoot happens. I now ride MTB on permanent 'slippy stuff'. I may fall off regular.

Take care all.


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## fossyant (29 Oct 2019)

Don't mention conkers either.... slippy.


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## Drago (29 Oct 2019)

Ian H said:


> I've come off three or four times on slippery stuff over the years, but I try to avoid high-speed collisions with solid objects.


Is that one giant euphemism?


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## Ian H (29 Oct 2019)

Drago said:


> Is that one giant euphemism?



I've never owned any Giant models. Mostly Ribble, Omega, and Qoroz.
(Can't see the Euphemism in their current catalogue).


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## johnnyb47 (29 Oct 2019)

Oh good grief, i hope he makes a full recovery. That sounds truly awful. 
This time of the year i pick and choose my night ride routes very carefully avoiding busy and poorly maintained roads. Even with the best lighting you can miss nasty potholes in the dark. Rides this time of year do become repetitive in the dark, but on the plus side i tend to built up a mental image of were the roads are at their worst along the way


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## Vantage (29 Oct 2019)

There's nothing dangerous about cycling. 
A person could just as easily slip and break a bone/other injury through walking running, running etc etc. Indeed, sitting on one's arse watching eastenders/or some other crap whilst stuffing one's face with a 12" pepperoni pizza (like I did last night) is far more dangerous to one's health.


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## classic33 (29 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> There's nothing dangerous about cycling.
> A person could just as easily slip and break a bone/other injury through walking running, running etc etc. Indeed, sitting on one's arse watching eastenders/or some other crap *whilst stuffing one's face with a 12" pepperoni pizza (like I did last night) *is far more dangerous to one's health.


In one bite!!


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## Ian H (29 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> There's nothing dangerous about cycling.


Novices at speed can put themselves at risk of encountering solid vertical objects. Such collisions can be unforgiving. Most people have a few lucky escapes and learn from them. A few are not so lucky.


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## snorri (29 Oct 2019)

gavroche said:


> Be careful people at this time of the year and the next few months, as cycling can indeed be very dangerous .


Strikes me greater dangers lurk in my booze locker than lurk in my bicycle shed.


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## presta (30 Oct 2019)




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## rustybolts (30 Oct 2019)

The older you get , the more you know the vulnerability of the human body , its not making you afraid or "losing it", its a caution blended with wisdom . I descend ( almost) as fast as I used to, but ….


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## SkipdiverJohn (30 Oct 2019)

Smokin Joe said:


> I have a blacklist of roads I avoid at this time of years, anywhere leaves lie I avoid like the plague. That's one of the reasons I hate autumn.



I'm very wary of leaves, especially on relatively narrow road tyres. Very dodgy, not to mention the leaves can hide a slotted drain cover which will swallow a road wheel. Much prefer riding on 26" MTB knobbly tyres as they seem to cope better, and wide enough to stay out of most drains, but still keep my speed right down and avoid using the brakes as much as possible. Doesn't take much braking or steering movement to provoke a slide. Nice time of year to ride so long as it's dry though; being able to go out without getting sunburnt or all hot and sweaty.


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## Smudge (30 Oct 2019)

Anyone that rides two wheels, will sooner or later know how slippy wet leaves can be on the roads.


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## classic33 (30 Oct 2019)

Diesel is as big a danger as leaves.


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## SkipdiverJohn (30 Oct 2019)

classic33 said:


> Diesel is as big a danger as leaves.



Like any hazard, the danger is minimised if you ride according to the conditions. You'll more likely find diesel on bends where vehicles brake than you will on a straight flat stretch of road. The trouble is there are a lot of kamikaze merchants on two wheels who go as fast as they can all the time with no thought about their ability to steer or slow down without losing control. Road cyclists are probably worse than motorcyclists in this respect. I see loads of idiots dressed up in all the gear tearing around flat out who are going to have a really nasty high speed accident if they hit anything slippery.


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## slowmotion (30 Oct 2019)

classic33 said:


> Diesel is as big a danger as leaves.


At least it's possible to see leaves and conkers. Diesel can be almost undetectable and it appears in the most unlikely spots, as well as the more obvious ones.


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

And let’s not forget our old friend black ice and nearly invisible frost patches on bitumen - as my right shoulder still reminds me on rainy days and whenever a change in weather is in the air.


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## steveindenmark (30 Oct 2019)

The thing to do at this time of the year is to slow down a bit. Lots of leaves, ice and mud from tractors at this time of year.


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## Milzy (30 Oct 2019)

Zwift, Sufferfest & more Zwift. It’s dangerous enough in the height of Summer. Sounds like the lid saved his life.


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

The only times I've come off the bike through slippage has been either during mountain biking where accidents are to be expected or when doing something completely bloody stupid...like braking on a corner on wet leaves. That happened a grand total of once, from which I learned my error. 
If someone can't ride a bike without causing themselves serious harm through their own actions, they shouldn't be on a bike.


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> The only times I've come off the bike through slippage has been either during mountain biking where accidents are to be expected or when doing something completely bloody stupid...like braking on a corner on wet leaves. That happened a grand total of once, from which I learned my error.
> If someone can't ride a bike without causing themselves serious harm through their own actions, they shouldn't be on a bike.


THat's a bit harsh. Anybody can have a lapse.


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## tom73 (30 Oct 2019)

Accidents happen no-one set's out to have one.


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

hoopdriver said:


> THat's a bit harsh. Anybody can have a lapse.



Yebbut, crashing into a wall?  That takes some doing.


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## Milzy (30 Oct 2019)

tom73 said:


> Remember who ever gets the attention of the stubby pencil. Since the 60's about 60% of seats in parliament have never changed the colour of the donkey. So happy voting folks it will all the fine and dandy


Wrong thread. People should stop harping on about politics & go ride their bikes outside or on Zwift.


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> Yebbut, crashing into a wall?  That takes some doing.


Not really, if the wall's on a curve and your mind is somewhere else...it can happen to anybody.


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## tom73 (30 Oct 2019)

Milzy said:


> Wrong thread. People should stop harping on about politics & go ride their bikes outside or on Zwift.


That is what you get for doing two things at once


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

tom73 said:


> That is what you get for doing two things at once


BANG! (wall)


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## DCBassman (30 Oct 2019)

Ian H said:


> I've come off three or four times on slippery stuff over the years, but I try to avoid high-speed collisions with solid objects.


You don't need to go quickly. I was essentially at a standstill...


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## Drago (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> There's nothing dangerous about cycling.
> A person could just as easily slip and break a bone/other injury through walking running, running etc etc. Indeed, sitting on one's arse watching eastenders/or some other crap whilst stuffing one's face with a 12" pepperoni pizza (like I did last night) is far more dangerous to one's health.


Indeed. 59 deaths per billion journey miles from walking, only 53 from cycling - it's an inherently safe activity.

Every good driver (not many of them about!) knows that a change in colour or texture indicates a change in grip, yet very few cyclists seem to understand this.


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## Globalti (30 Oct 2019)

On bike tyres your margin for error is terribly slim and it only takes a small change in the physics to turn a routine manoeuvre into a disaster. Like many others posting on this thread I know this only too well; mine was taking a dogleg corner at speed on a wet road, same as I had done before, but realising there was a car in the road and I couldn't straighten out the bend so would have to steer wide to avoid it. Bang.


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## cyberknight (30 Oct 2019)

Drago said:


> Of course, I sold my soul to the Devil so I'm safe from such trifles.


are you safe from cheesecake though ?


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## steveindenmark (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> The only times I've come off the bike through slippage has been either during mountain biking where accidents are to be expected or when doing something completely bloody stupid...like braking on a corner on wet leaves. That happened a grand total of once, from which I learned my error.
> If someone can't ride a bike without causing themselves serious harm through their own actions, they shouldn't be on a bike.


You mean like you? 🤔


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## MichaelW2 (30 Oct 2019)

My crashes happen when mistakes or conditions start to stack up and the total exceeds my traction. I figure it usually takes about three negative conditions for me to crash on my own. Eg wet leaves, slick road, negative camber.


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## Phil Fouracre (30 Oct 2019)

Some interesting comments! I always wonder what has led up to it, when someone tells me about an ‘unavoidable accident’! You tube is an unparalleled source of entertainment for this. I was recently criticised on another forum for being unsympathetic, and worse, when a cyclist hit a pothole and fell in front of a car. When I commented that it wold be wise to look where you’re going I was told ‘you can’t be looking at the road in front of you all the time! 😱 My question would be ‘why not’?


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## vickster (30 Oct 2019)

Phil Fouracre said:


> Some interesting comments! I always wonder what has led up to it, when someone tells me about an ‘unavoidable accident’! You tube is an unparalleled source of entertainment for this. I was recently criticised on another forum for being unsympathetic, and worse, when a cyclist hit a pothole and fell in front of a car. When I commented that it wold be wise to look where you’re going I was told ‘you can’t be looking at the road in front of you all the time! 😱 My question would be ‘why not’?


In traffic, it can be very difficult to see potholes, leaves, other road level hazards like drains with plenty of warning as well as being alert to car drivers, scooter riders, peds. Etc. This can be even worse in the dark and/or bad weather.
Many of us don't have the luxury of cycling on quiet country roads


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

steveindenmark said:


> You mean like you? 🤔


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

vickster said:


> In traffic, it can be very difficult to see potholes, leaves, other road level hazards like drains with plenty of warning as well as being alert to car drivers, pads. Etc. This can be even worse in the dark and/or bad weather



Imagine a driver saying that after hitting a cyclist. 
You can bet there would be hordes of cyclists saying that he/she should have been driving according to the conditions. Slow down, leave a safe gap, be on guard etc etc. 
Same rules apply to us lot too.


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## Racing roadkill (30 Oct 2019)

gavroche said:


> The brother of a friend of my stepdaughter had a cycling accident yesterday. He slipped on some leaves and went head first into a wall. His helmet was completely smashed and he was rushed , by air ambulance to a hospital in Stoke on Trent. Bear in mind his accident happened in North Wales. He is now in intensive care with wires coming out of his head to check his brain activity.
> Be careful people at this time of the year and the next few months, as cycling can indeed be very dangerous .


Yep, I 100 percent agree. This next couple of months are extra risky. It’s not just on the cyclist’s shoulders either. Drivers, and ped’s, and ped’s with dogs, also take time to adjust to the changing conditions ( regarding both surface, and lighting ). I regularly have issues with motorists overshooting junctions, not being able to judge my speeds accurately, slipping / skidding on leaves / ice, that they didn’t spot. Riding regularly at this time of year, has extra challenges galore. Take more time, adjust your riding ( braking, steering lighting) and be aware that if you have to stop for any length of time ( due to punctures / mechanicals for example ) or if you do come a cropper, you’ll get cold, pretty quickly, so layer up with your clothing, accordingly. Layer up considering how cold it will get, and remember you can always shed a layer ( warmers and bits ) if you get too warm, but not having them available, should you need them, can cause issues. Ride safe, try and enjoy the extra things that happen more, at this time of year.


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## RoadRider400 (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> There's nothing dangerous about cycling.
> A person could just as easily slip and break a bone/other injury through walking running, running etc etc. Indeed, sitting on one's arse watching eastenders/or some other crap whilst stuffing one's face with a 12" pepperoni pizza (like I did last night) is far more dangerous to one's health.



Read the title again. Cycling can be so dangerous. It doesnt say cycling _is _so dangerous.

I think its rather cold to totally dismiss OPs well intended post off hand, especially as somebody they know has had an accident and is in a bad way. I certainly appreciate OPs reminder that we should all be careful out there this time of year. As they say; Cycling (like all methods of transportation) _can_ be dangerous in various seasonal conditions. I myself only the other week slid turning on to a sodden wooden cycle/pedestrian at very low speed, was very close to falling heavily but managed to grab the rail and stay up.

OP, hope they make a full recovery.


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## Drago (30 Oct 2019)

A change in surface, a change in grip...


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## RoadRider400 (30 Oct 2019)

... A white carrot, that be a parsnip...


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

RoadRider400 said:


> Read the title again. Cycling can be so dangerous. It doesnt say cycling _is _so dangerous.



Read my post again. I didn't say it wasn't dangerous. edit (oops... Yes I did ) I said it was no more dangerous than other activities.
Pointing out cycling can be dangerous on its own can make it look like it Is dangerous and is one of the reasons that some people want helmet use made mandatory.
Cycling needs to be seen as a safe activity, not the other way round.

To put this in perspective, if when walking you took your eyes off the path for a seconds or two and walked into a lamp post, would you then start a thread entitled "Walking Can Be So Dangerous!" 
If not, why not?


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

Vantage said:


> Read my post again. I didn't say it wasn't dangerous. edit (oops... Yes I did ) I said it was no more dangerous than other activities.
> Pointing out cycling can be dangerous on its own can make it look like it Is dangerous and is one of the reasons that some people want helmet use made mandatory.
> Cycling needs to be seen as a safe activity, not the other way round.
> 
> ...


Because few people walk at 30mph - which is a speed not at all hard to attain downhill on a bicycle. Even pedalling at a fairly leisurely pace on the flat you’ll still be doing nearly a four minute mile and not many people walk at that pace either. At these higher speeds the consequences of a slip up are considerably more troubling than inadvertently bumping into a lamppost as you amble along a footpath at 3mph or less


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## Drago (30 Oct 2019)

Leaving aside other road users trying to slaughter us - after all, that's nothing to do with cycling per se - cycling is as safe or as dangerous as the rider wishes to make it. 

Cycling 'accidents' don't just happen, they're a result of poor judgement, poor skills, or wilfully negligent riding behaviour. None of those behavioural attributes are anything to do with cycling, and everything to do with human nature.


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)

The severity of the accident isn't what I'm arguing against. Sure, the injuries can be worse than those sustained from walking, but a slip on a bike is no more likely than a slip on your feet. 
Cycling isn't in itself a dangerous activity.


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## hoopdriver (30 Oct 2019)

Consequence is as important a factor as likelihood in assessing the dangerousness of an activity. Consider this - if I were to ask you to walk for two hundred yards along a three foot wide strip of timber lying on the ground you would do so without a seconds thought To risk or danger. If I were to raise it ten feet, you (and I) would be aware of risk, but would still walk along it. If I were to raise that to 3000 feet we would go along it on all fours, if we dared do it at all, and would see it as extremely dangerous. It is the consequences that are different. The likelihood of us falling off a three foot wide strip is still negligible.


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## Vantage (30 Oct 2019)




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## Racing roadkill (30 Oct 2019)

Something only becomes dangerous if the associated risks have been assessed, and those assessments aren’t acted upon.


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## Dave7 (30 Oct 2019)

gavroche said:


> The brother of a friend of my stepdaughter had a cycling accident yesterday. He slipped on some leaves and went head first into a wall. His helmet was completely smashed and he was rushed , by air ambulance to a hospital in Stoke on Trent. Bear in mind his accident happened in North Wales. He is now in intensive care with wires coming out of his head to check his brain activity.
> Be careful people at this time of the year and the next few months, as cycling can indeed be very dangerous .


That is something that I am aware of every autumn. I choose my routes. There are 2 regular summer routes I wont touch over autumn.
I do hope he is better soon.


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## akawsar5885 (30 Oct 2019)

Cycling is dangerous if you don't know how to ride safely. My first accident happened when i was 17 years old. Its was an U turn where I can't control my bicycle speed and fall in the road. It take 3 months to recover but still there are some scratch in my body after 5 years maybe it will stay for ever. This scratches always remind me my mistake and not to do the same thing again.


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## rustybolts (31 Oct 2019)

but the sun sets every day, and people die every minute, and we mustn't be scared by the common lot. If we failed to hold our own, because that equal foot at all men's doors was heard knocking somewhere, every object in this world would slip from us. No! Ride on! Rough-shod if need be, smooth-shod if that will do, but ride on! Ride on ( Dickens ) and that was in the days of the penny farthing !


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## Heltor Chasca (31 Oct 2019)

This thread has convinced me to give up cycling...

...and walking...

...and showering...

I know my 8 year old self from the past would be pleased...


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## mjr (31 Oct 2019)

Milzy said:


> Zwift, Sufferfest & more Zwift. It’s dangerous enough in the height of Summer. Sounds like the lid saved his life.


Or encouraged excessive risk-taking. Or both. Or neither. Hope he recovers but I wish the OP hadn't left that bait there for the zealots to take.

Life's too short to ride nowhere while watching TV. Good tyres and riding within your abilities in winter will keep you upright.


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## mjr (31 Oct 2019)

Phil Fouracre said:


> When I commented that it wold be wise to look where you’re going I was told ‘you can’t be looking at the road in front of you all the time! 😱 My question would be ‘why not’?


Sometimes you need to look to the side or behind to give way, or spot others not giving way. You try to do this after you've seen there is no hazard ahead but sometimes you miss something, more likely on unlit roads at night...


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## pjd57 (31 Oct 2019)

We can't guarantee our safety, cycling or walking or even driving.
All we can do is take care.
This time of the year , I try to give myself a bit more time for journeys on my bike so I can ease up long before every corner and when necessary alter my route.
Any hint of frost , I tend to walk out my own street to the main roads which have been gritted and generally stick to bus routes.


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## Milzy (31 Oct 2019)

Some plank in a black Audi set off with a frozen windshield this morning & he eventually pulled over. Idiot.


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## MarkF (31 Oct 2019)

I am winding down my working life as a hospital porter, 5 years this month. It's incredible the stories you hear from people who woke up, got dressed and set about a normal day, only to end up in hosptial injured. Yet despite spending maybe 75% of my time in A&E, I've yet to meet a fellow cyclist.......................


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## classic33 (31 Oct 2019)

MarkF said:


> I am winding down my working life as a hospital porter, 5 years this month. It's incredible the stories you hear from people who woke up, got dressed and set about a normal day, only to end up in hosptial injured. Yet despite spending maybe 75% of my time in A&E, I've yet to meet a fellow cyclist.......................


Which A&E?


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## 8mph (1 Nov 2019)

Someone in a car gave me such a wide berth recently that I felt compelled to acknowledge them with a raised palm and a smile. The driver was busy making the same gesture when a Land Rover came around the corner doing 60 and they narrowly missed each other. Oops!


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## Phil Fouracre (1 Nov 2019)

mjr said:


> Sometimes you need to look to the side or behind to give way, or spot others not giving way. You try to do this after you've seen there is no hazard ahead but sometimes you miss something, more likely on unlit roads at night...


Totally agree - when I say look where you’re going I don’t mean stare at the road in front, as seemed to be assumed, but, scan all around continuously! If you can’t realistically process what you see, slow down - the same as you would/should do when driving!


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## gavroche (1 Nov 2019)

Update on the lad's accident is not good. He is still in a coma. Will keep you posted.


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## mjr (1 Nov 2019)

Phil Fouracre said:


> Totally agree - when I say look where you’re going I don’t mean stare at the road in front, as seemed to be assumed, but, scan all around continuously! If you can’t realistically process what you see, slow down - the same as you would/should do when driving!


Yes, but you tend to miss things when you haven't realised that you can't process what you're seeing fast enough - that's how you make mistakes and no amount of "look where you're going" solves it. Getting away with the mistakes and learning from the experience helps, but not everyone gets away with the mistakes. Let's not be too harsh on them.



gavroche said:


> Update on the lad's accident is not good. He is still in a coma. Will keep you posted.


Thanks for the updates. Still best wishes.


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## screenman (1 Nov 2019)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> Like any hazard, the danger is minimised if you ride according to the conditions. You'll more likely find diesel on bends where vehicles brake than you will on a straight flat stretch of road. The trouble is there are a lot of kamikaze merchants on two wheels who go as fast as they can all the time with no thought about their ability to steer or slow down without losing control. Road cyclists are probably worse than motorcyclists in this respect. I see loads of idiots dressed up in all the gear tearing around flat out who are going to have a really nasty high speed accident if they hit anything slippery.



Where in the country do you see these people as I encounter none like that in these parts.


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## fossyant (1 Nov 2019)

MarkF said:


> I am winding down my working life as a hospital porter, 5 years this month. It's incredible the stories you hear from people who woke up, got dressed and set about a normal day, only to end up in hosptial injured. Yet despite spending maybe 75% of my time in A&E, I've yet to meet a fellow cyclist.......................



I bypassed my last visit to A&E - straight to Resus !  Express service straight through !


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## DCBassman (1 Nov 2019)

fossyant said:


> I bypassed my last visit to A&E - straight to Resus !  Express service straight through !


 but not the way you'd prefer to do it, I'm sure!


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## MarkF (1 Nov 2019)

classic33 said:


> Which A&E?


Bradford, the only time I venture in the wacky place it is to work..........

So, about 35/45 patients per day, we'll call it 40, x 5 (week) = 200, x 45 weeks per annum = 9000, x 5 years is 45000 injured people and I've yet to meet an injured cyclist!


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## si_c (1 Nov 2019)

All activities carry some degree of risk but most of the time we rationalise it away entirely such that we don't wear plastic hats when walking.

Most people are really bad at accurately assessing the real level of risk we grossly over or under estimate it. Certainly the pedestrian who stepped out between two vans yesterday didn't think there was a risk until I hit him at just shy of 30mph. Both of us came off ok but it could have been much worse. 

There is no point worrying overly much about these things as for the most part they are out of your control. What you can do is manage those variables within your control - condition appropriate gear, well maintained bike and control your speed so you can stop in the distance you can see. Beyond that you just have to hope for the best and understand that your actual level of risk is very very small.


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## Milzy (2 Nov 2019)

si_c said:


> All activities carry some degree of risk but most of the time we rationalise it away entirely such that we don't wear plastic hats when walking.
> 
> Most people are really bad at accurately assessing the real level of risk we grossly over or under estimate it. Certainly the pedestrian who stepped out between two vans yesterday didn't think there was a risk until I hit him at just shy of 30mph. Both of us came off ok but it could have been much worse.
> 
> There is no point worrying overly much about these things as for the most part they are out of your control. What you can do is manage those variables within your control - condition appropriate gear, well maintained bike and control your speed so you can stop in the distance you can see. Beyond that you just have to hope for the best and understand that your actual level of risk is very very small.


Well that’s lucky as somebody recently died at a claimed 38 mph in the same situation although it was probably exaggerated by the police.


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## CXRAndy (2 Nov 2019)

From September to March, I cycle on a Neo using trainer road and Zwift. I use all the saved money from not doing maintenance and buying expensive winter clothes to go to Tenerife mid winter to enjoy warm sunny cycling

Too many of my friends in the mid age have broken numerous bones over winter cycling outdoors.


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## si_c (2 Nov 2019)

Milzy said:


> Well that’s lucky as somebody recently died at a claimed 38 mph in the same situation although it was probably exaggerated by the police.


Absolutely, neither of us seriously injured, bruises and scrapes - I was able to slow down but how much I don't know as he ran out as I was about than 3 or 4 metres away.

But my point is more that we can't account for some things and that obsessing about risks we can't control will stop is doing things that are on balance good for us and that we enjoy.

As mentioned upthread (I think) walking can be considered more dangerous per mile than cycling but we don't stress about it.


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## gavgav (2 Nov 2019)

It can be. Unfortunately a member of my distant family died last week, following a collision with a tractor a few miles from here, whilst riding his bike. However there are many walks of life that can be dangerous.


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## roubaixtuesday (2 Nov 2019)

Milzy said:


> Zwift, Sufferfest & more Zwift. It’s dangerous enough in the height of Summer. *Sounds like the lid saved his life.*



Very unlikely. If lids saved many lives in these situations, the rate of cyclists deaths by head injury would correlate to helmet use. 

It doesn't.


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## Milzy (2 Nov 2019)

roubaixtuesday said:


> Very unlikely. If lids saved many lives in these situations, the rate of cyclists deaths by head injury would correlate to helmet use.
> 
> It doesn't.


I’d rather head butt a wall with one though if I had no choice.


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## SkipdiverJohn (2 Nov 2019)

si_c said:


> Certainly the pedestrian who stepped out between two vans yesterday didn't think there was a risk until I hit him at just shy of 30mph. Both of us came off ok but it could have been much worse.



Riding in close proximity to vehicles parked at the roadside at almost 30 mph is not what I would call an example of responsible or safe cycling. You should have only been doing half that speed! Whilst the muppet pedestrian was entirely to blame, you didn't do yourself any favours by not riding according to the road conditions.


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## si_c (2 Nov 2019)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> Riding in close proximity to vehicles parked at the roadside at almost 30 mph is not what I would call an example of responsible or safe cycling. You should have only been doing half that speed! Whilst the muppet pedestrian was entirely to blame, you didn't do yourself any favours by not riding according to the road conditions.


I'll take that in part, the road had clear visibility and I was riding on the centre line of the road with parked cars on the left. Didn't expect him to run out between two vans.


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## mjr (2 Nov 2019)

Milzy said:


> I’d rather head butt a wall with one though if I had no choice.


There's a choice. One possible reason for the non correlation is that you're more likely to choose to with one, for reasons not understood.


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## roubaixtuesday (2 Nov 2019)

Milzy said:


> I’d rather head butt a wall with one though if I had no choice.



Sure, me too.

I'm not against helmets, it's just useful to be realistic about the level of protection they bring.


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## BorderReiver (3 Nov 2019)

To mangle a famous flying quote:
"Cycling in itself is not inherently dangerous. But to an even greater degree than walking(!), it is terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect".


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## Bhitucyclist (3 Nov 2019)

Oh no ! Thats a bad accident. I feel quite scared cycling in the slippery roads. Thats why hybrids with knobbly tyres are better for winters. I may change my tyres back to the previous knobbly ones ! Safety first


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## Milkfloat (3 Nov 2019)

Bhitucyclist said:


> Oh no ! Thats a bad accident. I feel quite scared cycling in the slippery roads. Thats why hybrids with knobbly tyres are better for winters. I may change my tyres back to the previous knobbly ones ! Safety first


As mentioned on your other thread , no the knobblies are worse.


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## gavroche (4 Nov 2019)

Latest update: he opened his eyes yesterday, said a few words and recognized his dad so hopefully no serious brain damage but he has a fractured skull, broken neck and shoulder blades so he will be in hospital for some time yet. By the way, he is 42 years old and rides his bike everywhere rather than take his car. This might change when he makes a full recovery.


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## DCBassman (4 Nov 2019)

gavroche said:


> Latest update: he opened his eyes yesterday, said a few words and recognized his dad so hopefully no serious brain damage but he has a fractured skull, broken neck and shoulder blades so he will be in hospital for some time yet. By the way, he is 42 years old and rides his bike everywhere rather than take his car. This might change when he makes a full recovery.


Glad to hear some positive notes!


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## confusedcyclist (4 Nov 2019)

What I want to know is why do they make everything hard. Why not soft? That way everything will be less dangerous.


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## simon the viking (4 Nov 2019)

Ouch.. I keep telling little V to watch out for leaves when cycling to school. He thinks im exaggerating how slippy they can be.


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