# Hybrid v 'road race' bike for commuting



## roscco (11 Oct 2010)

in the near future i may consider commuting to work (36 mile round trip) a few days a week using pedal power. Ive never used a hybrid and was wondering... for those who have had the use of both typres of bike (road race and hybrid), is there much difference (apart from the handlebars!)


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## rb58 (11 Oct 2010)

I've used both on my commute and the main difference for me was the upright riding position on the hybrid meaning better visibility in traffic. Also, the V brakes on my hybrid were better than the dual pivot callipers on the road bike. Which was good for confidence. Having said that, my road bike is steel and so much more comfortable than my hybrid that I now only use the road bike.


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## Tynan (11 Oct 2010)

I rode mtbs and then hybrids in London traffic and now a road bike and the road bike has been best, it's faster, comfier and visibility is just as good and it stops just fine, I consider the theory that road bikes arent good in traffic nonsense, you can ride on the hoods if want to be upright

if you're going to be riding 35 miles you'll most definitely enjoy and benfit from a proper road bike with thinner tyres and the ability to use drops in a head wind


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## Crankarm (12 Oct 2010)

Get a touring bike such as a Dawes Galaxy. You can then fit panniers and not have the discomfort and nuisance of a rucksack on your back. Plus it will be more comfortable to ride than a race bike, almost as quick and still have drop handle bars. A touring bike should be a lot more durable. A hybrid doesn't excel at anything it is a ......... hybrid. If I was buying a bike again then I wouldn't buy a hybrid which I have done, but a proper touring bike with drop handle bars as I find my road bike with drops so much comfortable to ride except it would be no good for commuting. Hyrbids have frame geometry that is a compromise and certainly not ideally suited to cycling lots of miles in comfort at a fair old pace. Plus when you want to go on a touring holiday or a few days away you already have the touring bike to do it.


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## Browser (12 Oct 2010)

I use a Tifosi CK7 classic as a commuter and it does the job nicely, apart from the fact that it came fitted with 20mm tyres which, given the rapidly deteriorating state of our roads, aren't really deep enough to soak up all of the bumps thrown at them. I've fitted a rack but have to take cars I don't load it up too much as it is strictly speaking an ali-framed audax bike. Nice and quick for the work run though


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

Commute bike MUSTs.
1/ Lamps. Hub dyno preferable. 
2/ Mudguards. With a LONG front splash flap.
3/ Schwalbe Marathon + tyres.

Commute bike desirables.
1/ Disc or drum brakes.
2/ Back box on rack.
3/ Chainguard. 

Thus...

http://www.pashley.co.uk/products/roadster-26.html


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## Asprilla (12 Oct 2010)

My daily commute is a 36 miles round trip which I do on either a 'road race' bike, a fixed track bike or an alfine tourer. The one thing they all have in common are drop handlebars. My flat bar fixed and mtb are for shorter journeys as they simply aren't quick or comfortable enough for a commute of 18 miles.

It's worth noting that my drop bars also have a flat bit along the top, so if I'm worried about visability (which I'm not as I'm higher than most vehicles even on a size 51 frame) I can use that and be in the same upright position as a hybrid.

My tourer and fixed have panniers, but in the summer I use a rucksack on the road bike. It's can get annoying sometimes, but that's mainly if I've loaded it badly, otherwise I don't really notice it.


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## fossyant (12 Oct 2010)

For that distance, I would consider a road bike - guards, rack, panniers. Road bikes have more hand positions than Hybrids anyway. Hybrids are great in heavy traffic, or where you might have a bit of 'track' to cycle down.


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## SquareDaff (12 Oct 2010)

I use a hybrid with bar ends. Commute about 16 miles a day. I'm a short @rse so the compromise in the hybrid frame actually suits me - plus the bar ends let me get down over the bars in the event of a headwind! Don't notice any discomfort and the options for storage on the bike, rather than on my back, win it for me.


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

My commute is 14 miles, 23 if I ride the full distance.

I'll use any bike in the shed except the Moulton Mini, 'cus it has a SS 48" gear and 5 1/2" cranks.

There is NOT a distance that is "Too long" for an Adult's bicycle.

It's the rider's ability that makes the decision.....


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## CharlieB (12 Oct 2010)

Road bike: lovely and quick for a commute, and for me, will use it if I do the full 32m.

Bejaysus though, it's scary to ride something that fast in heavy traffic, so generally prefer the roadified MTB or the Brompton for safety's sake.


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## XmisterIS (12 Oct 2010)

Hybrid for me, I can't get on with dropped bars; I feel far too ponderous. Same with motorbikes, I can't get on with clip-ons and a riding position like gorilla!


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## Jezston (12 Oct 2010)

My tuppence:

To add to what other people have said, DEFINITELY a bike with drop handlebars (i.e. racer type rather than flat handlebars). For those kinds of distances, you'll want to change your hand positions regularly, and being able to move down to the drops in a headwind when you feel confident enough too (which won't take long!) is a must. I got a flat barred bike when I started commuting and I REALLY regret it. Currently have a bizarre bullhorn based configuration which is an improvement, but my next bike is definitely going to be drop bar based.

So reiterate what others have said DROPS DROPS DROPS DROPS DROPS!

Now you have drop bars, this doesn't necessarily mean pure racing road bike. There are a lot of variations on themes. You have:
- Road bike - minimalist set up, low and fast, skinny-as tyres
- Audax - slightly beefier for harsher rides and able to take mudguards
- Tourer - longer, bigger, heavier, more upright for long load carrying journeys
- Cyclocross - beefier and heavier with chunky tyres for off road racing.

Then you have all sorts of 'hybrids' that mix elements of the above along with elements of mountain bike, utility, shopping basket etc type bikes.

Example - this is the bike I feel I should have got instead of the one I did:
http://www.cyclestore.co.uk/productDetails.asp?productID=22716
This is technically a hybrid - mountain bike frame and forks but based around thinner and bigger 700c wheels. Handlebar position is somewhat higher than a regular road bike for comfort and visibility (although I agree visibility is hardly reduced by riding lower). Wheel rims are flexible enough to take chunky 37mm commuter and offroad tyres, as well as narrower 25mm slick road tyres so you can swap depending on what ride you are doing. So it's very flexible and can keep up with the road boys if you feel like pushing it!


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## adds21 (12 Oct 2010)

I use both a hybrid (flat bars) and an audax (drops) for commuting, and would generally echo what others have said. I'm much quicker commuting on the audax than I am on the hybrid, but I'll still use the hybrid if I need to take a lot into work (mostly because I haven't fitted a rack on the audax. One of the best things I ever bought for the hybrid was a set of Ergon GC3 bar ends which, while not cheap, make a massive different to comfort. I get occasional back and neck trouble which sometimes makes riding on drops difficult, with the bar ends on the hybrid, I'm more than happy to take that instead.


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

CharlieB said:


> Road bike: lovely and quick for a commute, and for me, will use it if I do the full 32m.
> 
> Bejaysus though, it's scary to ride something that fast in heavy traffic, so generally prefer the roadified MTB or the Brompton for safety's sake.



This guy's got a 'Throttle sticking open' problem.


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## Norm (12 Oct 2010)

I agree with most of the above, with one small change...



Jezston said:


> - Cyclocross - beefier and heavier with chunky tyres _to look like it could be used for _off road racing.


My choice is to use the flat-barred bike if I'm doing 2-3 miles. Over that distance, the flat bars give more manoeuvrability through traffic but it is mainly because that's usually the journey into town, so I'll be wearing "civvies" rather than cycling gear and I don't mind leaving a 20-year old bike there.

Much more than that and I find the positions on drop bars invaluable to allow you to move around from tops to hoods to drops. 

I used a cyclo-cross style bike for my commute of just under 10 miles each way. I left the chunky tyres on it because the road surfaces were pretty atrocious in places and the 32mm rubber allowed me to ride over it without too many concerns for my coccyx. There was basically no difference in the riding times between the CX bike and the road bike because, although the road bike would be faster on decent tarmac, I spent too long slowing and accelerating, dodging potholes and being concerned for the narrower tyres and lighter wheels.

Summary, I'd go touring or CX-style.


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

No bike is any faster than another. If you threw a bunch of bicycles out of an aeroplane, they'd hit the ground at roughly the same time.

It's the rider's power to weight ratio that makes the difference. 

In other words, a thin weakling on a roadrace bike wouldn't be faster than a well trained cyclist on a Raleigh 20. 

But if its the same individual, in city traffic, a roadrace bike might be only slightly faster than the Raleigh 20.
Like 1 minute in a 40 minute trip across town.


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## twowheelsgood (12 Oct 2010)

I tend to mostly use a modified hybrid. 28c touring tyres (305g panaracer paselas) and a lower stem for a more aero position.

The difference over 20km each way compared to a road bike is around a minute and a half according to their computers. So basically not worth giving up mudguards and taking my clothes in a rucksack compared to panniers on the rack. I think in most cases it "feels much quicker" rather than "it is much quicker". But then 36 miles is a pretty long commute.

It also depends on what you mean by "road bike". I also have a Kaffenback, with drops set up for light touring (25c types). In real world road conditions there is no difference whatsoever between this and my Trek road bike going to work. I'd seriously question the wisdom of owning a "pure road bike" if you weren't into competition or fitness training, especially if it were your only bike. An audax-type bike would make infinitely more sense and not be any slower.

The problem is that most hybrids as sold seem unecessarily clunky in one way or another, usually cr@p tyres or worse "puncture proofs" weighing 600g a piece. Suspension on anything not a mountain bike is of course the work of the devil.

There are other advantages too. One of my routes the hybrid is faster because the broken asphalt surface means I need to slow down on the road bike. Another thing is road bike gearing is typically stupidly high for commuting (I can get 60kph and not spin out down hill on my hybrid, I'm not sure who travels faster than that to work).

Marin seem to have hit the sweet spot IMHO with their "Alp bikes". Pity they are overpriced and have some odd component choices.


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## adds21 (12 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> But if its the same individual, in city traffic, a roadrace bike might be only slightly faster than the Raleigh 20.
> Like 1 minute in a 40 minute trip across town.



Totally depends on the route. I'm between 5 and 10 minutes quicker on a 9 mile, 1,000 feet climb, country commute on my audax than I am on my hybrid. 5 or 10 minutes in the evening makes a big difference when you have young children. It's the difference between a family meal together, and me eating alone.


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## Asprilla (12 Oct 2010)

adds21 said:


> Totally depends on the route. I'm between 5 and 10 minutes quicker on a 9 mile, 1,000 feet climb, country commute on my audax than I am on my hybrid. 5 or 10 minutes in the evening makes a big difference when you have young children. It's the difference between a family meal together, and me eating alone.




Yup, 5 minutes is the difference between me seeing my baby daughter before bedtime or not. That's all the difference in the world.

Also, some bikes are faster than others for a number of reasons ranging from rolling resistance of tyres and gearing to how long the rider can sustain a certain level of effort comfortably. If these things didn't make a difference then why have 'racing bikes'?

Also, can someone tell me why a flat bar makes a bike more manouverable in traffic? As far as I'm aware is't the length of the bike from front wheel contact point to the same at the back that determined this?


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

And another point of view.

If the aim of your commuting by bike is to lose a few excess pounds of fat from around your midriff, the heavy cumbersome bike is the one to chose.

Get the roadbike when the waist and legs look the part.


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## adds21 (12 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> And another point of view.
> 
> If the aim of your commuting by bike is to lose a few excess pounds of fat from around your midriff, the heavy cumbersome bike is the one to chose.
> 
> Get the roadbike when the waist and legs look the part.



That's true, when I come home on my hybrid (which is heavy, and has Marathons on), I can really feel it! Not that it's necessary a bad thing.


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## vorsprung (12 Oct 2010)

For commuting I have a Cotic Roadrat (which is essentially a hybrid with drops) and an Orbea racing bike

In the winter, when I need panniers or on poor weather days I use the Roadrat

On fine days I use the Orbea

The round trip is about 30 miles. The Orbea is 2 or 3 minutes faster each way


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## Tynan (12 Oct 2010)

I ride what i consider to be a road bike (Fratello) and it came as standard with full guards, a rack and a pannier

It's also a joy to ride and goes quick when you want it too, I use to ride lots of London miles on a hybrid when younger and hitting 20mph was a high point, older these days and I expect to cruise at 20, often faster and 30 is my new 'cor' speed, I don't buy the 1mph difference

Not that many people commute on an out and out race bike, an awful lot do on frames with drops and thin tyres, yes lots use rucksacks but they'll all take a frame if you want them to, if it has to use clips

If you;re buying new you can defo get a road bike that will take every commute accessory you need


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## nightoff (12 Oct 2010)

I've commuted on and off over the last 10 years. All but the last 3 months were on a hybrid with full guards, panniers etc. This bike has carried me thousands of miles with very little money spent on it's upkeep. It has been reliable and cheap. The flip side is it's dull, relatively slow and fairly uncomfortable on anything over 5 miles.
I now commute on a road race bike with a nice big Carradice saddle bag. I can honestly say I don't miss a thing about the hybrid. I am loving the extra speed, hand positions, acceleration and increased filtering options. With a few extras like clip on mudguards and saddlebag it is upto the challenge of commuting.
The hybrid will get another turn when the gritters come out though. 
If the roads were in bad nick where I live I would consider an audax, tourer or cyclo-cross bike. Drops are waaaay better than flat bars IMHO.


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## jimboalee (12 Oct 2010)

And yet another point of view.

Half way between a 'Hybrid' and a roadrace bike is a 'Sports' bike.

They are not tourers. Today's 'Audax' bikes are akin to a 'sports' bike. Some mudguard clearance.


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## jonny jeez (12 Oct 2010)

Hi Roscco and Welcome.

My commute is the same (more or less) distance and i use an antique MTB to do the job.

My only concern is comfort, forget about speed, when you ride in town speed has more to do with you than the bike ...see below

Personally I am starting to find my MTB to be a little uncomfortable. Especially after the 6th (hour to an hour and a half) ride in a week. After about 15 miles my back begins to ache and I cannot find a comfortable ...er…"seating" position. So I find myself adjusting my position too much to get comfy.

On the speed front, traffic, lights, other bikes and vigilance all contrive to keep your speed down. The only exception I would have is that, towards the end of my ride I hit more open and faster roads. In these circumstances (and with the benefit of a year or so of commuting behind me) I, personally, would like to have a little more top end speed so a road bike is looking more favourable.

In summary. Buy something cheap and crap...do the ride for a few weeks so that you can appreciate what it is that you need, then make a choice that suits YOUR considered needs.


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## CharlieB (12 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> This guy's got a 'Throttle sticking open' problem.


Guilty as charged.


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## sadjack (12 Oct 2010)

+1 for the tourer and Marathon Plus's


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## Norm (12 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> No bike is any faster than another. If you threw a bunch of bicycles out of an aeroplane, they'd hit the ground at roughly the same time.
> 
> It's the rider's power to weight ratio that makes the difference.
> 
> ...


I almost, but not quite, totally agree with this. 

As I already said, there is no noticeable difference between my CX-style bike (comfortable seating, more upright, slightly heavier with heavy duty rims and 32mm tyres) and the audax-style bike with 25mm tyres.

However, when moving out to the extremes, I am around 20% faster on tarmac on either of the road bikes than I am on the fat-tyred (2.25x26 knobblies) MTB over the same 7-mile circuit. I think that's the tyres more than anything else. Switch from the fat tyres to, for instance, 1.5x26 City Jets and the difference comes down to closer to 5%, which is, as you say, just a minute or two over 40 minutes.


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## clarion (12 Oct 2010)

You want a compromise between comfort, reliability, light weight & ease of use.

I'd suggest that comes out as a lightweight tourer or audax bike.

You should be looking for some luggage carrying and mudguards, and a decent range of gears, depending on your route. 

Having said that, I ride fixed, but my commute is pretty much flat (with a slight rise over Clapham Common) until I get to the last five minutes, which is where the foothills of the North Downs start abruptly.

My fixed isn't some hipster thing, but a two-braked, drop-barred, rack- and mudguard-equipped steel machine.


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## - Baz - (12 Oct 2010)

Well, I'm gonna stick up for the hybrid... Tomorrow will see me clock up 1000 miles commuting since 22nd June, on a 14 mile round trip into Manchester city centre. I find the bike does everything I want it to and I've never once wished it was a road bike. It's as comfy as an armchair (since I fitted a Charge Spoon), has a decent turn of speed when necessary, can stop on a sixpence when required, thanks to V brakes with Kool Stops, and I like the riding position that flat bars give me. Continental Contact tyres soak up the bumps with ease, full mudguards for the crappy weather and a rack if needed (which it has been). Would definitely buy again.
 
Maybe if I was doing double the distance I MAY change my mind, but the advantages of anything else are insignificant for the distance/traffic and more a matter of bias/personal preference.


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## Andrew_P (12 Oct 2010)

er will do


jimboalee said:


> And another point of view.
> 
> If the aim of your commuting by bike is to lose a few excess pounds of fat from around your midriff, the heavy cumbersome bike is the one to chose.
> 
> Get the roadbike when the waist and legs look the part.




I know you seem like an abrassive sod at times (no offence), but darn you hit the nail on this and many other subjects.

I have been tooing and throwing at getting bike number two, eBay hunting carbon road bikes upto £1500, but at 15 stone what the hell is the differnce going to be saving a bit of weight on the frame, and christ I reckon I would look pretty funny too. So for me it will be my 13.5 stone treat. For now my Muirwoods 29er will suffice


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## HLaB (12 Oct 2010)

I used to think that a flat bar was better in traffic and wanted something light and fast for my old 17.5mile oneway commute and bought the sirrus (formerly a flat bar road bike). I've since discovered drop bar road bikes and found out how much more efficient they are and their brakes are fab (100x better than my circa 1985 Raleigh Racer). My current Hybrid is built like a tank, weighs the proverbial ton but its practical and is of less value so it'd be my choice for shorter journeys. For any commute of distance drops would be my preference.


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## J4CKO (12 Oct 2010)

I started on a road bike I was given, that got "ungiven" (brother in law) so I bought a Cannondal Bad Boy that took a while to get used to, was ok but when CTW came round again I got a Spec Allez Elite, much nicer to ride, lovely ride, nice lope and not too twitchy.

I prefer the lower bottom bracket and longer pedal stroke to the Hybrid, the hybrid is better in town but most of my riding isnt town and riding accordingly make enough difference.


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## Maz (12 Oct 2010)

Road bike all the way.

I had the usual misgivings about road bikes for commuting (low head position, traffic visibility, position of brakes, etc), but they are unfounded.

I wouldn't go back to riding flat-bar, given the choice.

And it _is _a personal choice.


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## J4CKO (12 Oct 2010)

I am thinking of selling my Cannondale Bad Boy, rode it a couple of weeks back and didn't enjoy it compared to the road bike, it just feels so right, it even seems tougher, was breaking spokes on the Cannondale on the rear, this is still 100 percent true and though whilst I am careful, I am no more careful than with the Cannondale, suspect having a stronger rear built by Rick Green cycles was a good move, its still like new despite potholes and 16 stones of me plus laptop and other stuff. Still tackle Bridle paths, farm tracks, muddy paths etc, I think the perception is Road Bikes are fragile, I don't think they are, the Allez isnt but then it isnt super light waif like thing at 20 lbs, still bloody light though.

Did I mention that i love it ?


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## jimboalee (13 Oct 2010)

LOCO said:


> er will do
> 
> 
> I know you seem like an abrassive sod at times (no offence), but darn you hit the nail on this and many other subjects.
> ...



Would you like me as your PT Sergeant ?


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## jimboalee (13 Oct 2010)

Here's the 'little' bike for nipping eight miles across the East side of Birmingham, when the job requires.
Dyno lights, back box, full mudguards, chainguard, low gears ( 32, 42 & 56 inches ) and sprung saddle for comfort.
Top ratio of 56 inches pulls speed down to 14 mph at 83sh rpm. This means the time is longer than other bikes, but sweat is non-existant. Spare undies in back box with PRK, bin liner, cable lock and carton of milk for coffee.


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## fixedfixer (13 Oct 2010)

Take a look at the Marin Toscana. I've had Galaxy tourers in the past but really like the Toscana. Comes with mechanical disc brakes, carbon fork and lots of braze on points. Has clearance for full sks mudguards and 35c tyres. Some people dislike the Sora shifters but the do the job. I think the gearing is a little high but that's an individual choice. Have done a camping tour on one of these using a Tubus Disco Rack.


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## Andrew_P (13 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> Would you like me as your PT Sergeant ?



Could do with one one the this week 15 miles home all the way a head wind, get right peed off with it. Why is the wind stronger later in the day, my normal head wind is the mornings but mostly is quite weak, its turned since Sunday. 

You could lend me that nice shopper further down


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## Norm (13 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> _Spare undies in back box_ with PRK, bin liner, cable lock and _carton of milk for coffee._


Blimey, Jimbo, how slow does the BSA make you that you need spare undies and coffee supplies for an eight mile trip to Tescos? 

I see that has the trademark Jimbo wetflap on the front guard but you do know you shouldn't leave it outside the door. Someone like me might come along and accidentally stand in the middle of the wheel if you do that.


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## Jezston (13 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> Here's the 'little' bike for nipping eight miles across the East side of Birmingham, when the job requires.
> Dyno lights, back box, full mudguards, chainguard, low gears ( 32, 42 & 56 inches ) and sprung saddle for comfort.
> Top ratio of 56 inches pulls speed down to 14 mph at 83sh rpm. This means the time is longer than other bikes, but sweat is non-existant. Spare undies in back box with PRK, bin liner, cable lock and carton of milk for coffee.



You know I had a go on my friend's bike which is like this when I was visiting them in Switzerland and found it a lot of fun! I felt very dignified riding around in such an upright position, and the small wheels giving plenty of carriage space and step through frame meaning you don't have to be an olympic gymnast to get on and off when fully loaded made me decide that I shall be getting such a bike for shopping on one day!

I certainly wouldn't want to do a 30 mile round trip on one, though.


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## Soltydog (13 Oct 2010)

roscco said:


> in the near future i may consider commuting to work (36 mile round trip) a few days a week using pedal power. Ive never used a hybrid and was wondering... for those who have had the use of both typres of bike (road race and hybrid), is there much difference (apart from the handlebars!)


N + 1
You need both 
I have a slighly shorter commute than that & I prefer to use my road bike, although depending what I need to carry, I quite often use the hybrid. There's a noticeable difference in my times, as on good days I've averaged close to 20mph for the total 35 miles on the road bike, but on the hybrid I'm lucky to average 16mph.
I've just taken delivery of a touring bike, so I'll see how that gets on over the coming weeks, but I'm expecting it to be somewhere inbetween the two.


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## jimboalee (13 Oct 2010)

Jezston said:


> You know I had a go on my friend's bike which is like this when I was visiting them in Switzerland and found it a lot of fun! I felt very dignified riding around in such an upright position, and the small wheels giving plenty of carriage space and step through frame meaning you don't have to be an olympic gymnast to get on and off when fully loaded made me decide that I shall be getting such a bike for shopping on one day!
> 
> I certainly wouldn't want to do a 30 mile round trip on one, though.



The photo was taken while I was waiting for 09:00. At 09:00, I used the Autoteller to get my starting proof for a 100km Audax DIY.


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## CharlesF (13 Oct 2010)

It is a very personal choice; I think you need to think about comfort convenience and fun. When I stopped riding over 30 years ago there were only two types of bike, both steel, one with lever brakes and the other a "racing bike". My racing bike had "semi-drops", a three speed Sturmey Archer with a two speed dérailleur. After being knocked off, I didn't ride until 2005 and the choice of bikes then was mind boggling.

In the end I chose a Claud Butler hybrid, mainly as it was in my price range and a nice green colour. It was a good way to get back into riding although any speed was just a dream. I then bought a second hand Flight with 28 tyres and calliper brakes.

What a shock, seemed very fast and didn't stop half as quick as the V-braked Claud. From riding these two, my conclusions are V-brakes are good for traffic, narrow tyres are quick but you have to watch for holes, badly filled trenches that are either below or above the surround tar as I used ride through anything on the Claud on the Flight they can at the least give you a nasty jolt and at worst throw you off-line. The Flight is much easier to ride, although it is 24 speed, I only use four speeds, 4-8, and occasionally third if I can't get a running start up University Ave in the evening.

My conclusion is I need more comfort, less gears, quicker brakes and still the ability to fit mudguards and rack, so my latest dream is the Genesis Day One Alfine. The big debate over flat bars or drops doesn't concern me too much, I reckon both are usable in traffic


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## Fab Foodie (13 Oct 2010)

LOCO said:


> er will do
> 
> 
> I know you seem like an abrassive sod at times (no offence), but darn you hit the nail on this and many other subjects.
> ...




Power to weight is one thing... but the real difference between flat-bar bikes and drop bar bikes is the Aerodynamics of the rider and this becomes really significant as speed increases. The benefit of drops is that in most cases the rider adopts a more compact riding position and punches a smaller hole through the air. Less effort for speed/distance. 
I grant you that it depends on the type of commute you have, but in most cases the effort to propel a drop-bar bike will be lower than a hybrid bike for a given person. In reality the differences in weight of the bike become insignificant. Loosing excess body lard though is generally considered a good thing for other reasons!


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## jimboalee (13 Oct 2010)

Fab Foodie said:


> Power to weight is one thing... but the real difference between flat-bar bikes and drop bar bikes is the Aerodynamics of the rider and this becomes really significant as speed increases. The benefit of drops is that in most cases the rider adopts a more compact riding position and punches a smaller hole through the air. Less effort for speed/distance.
> I grant you that it depends on the type of commute you have, but in most cases the effort to propel a drop-bar bike will be lower than a hybrid bike for a given person. In reality the differences in weight of the bike become insignificant. Loosing excess body lard though is generally considered a good thing for other reasons!



If the guy on the flat bar bike has his lumbar vertebrae at the recognised correct angle, he will be no less aerodynamic than the guy on the drop bar bike riding on the hoods.
When the guy on the drop bar bike goes in the tuck, the guy on the flat bar bike bends his arms.

The only difference which remains is the smoothness of airflow around the rider. The guy on the flat bar bike will prob' be wearing a flappyjacket, while the guy on the drop bar bike will be wearing a skin tight fleece jersey. The guy on the flat bar bike will be wearing baggie shorts and the guy on the drop bar bike will be in lycra.

Roadrace bike, slicked up MTB or hybrid. Adjust them correctly for an ergonomic ride and its all in the drag from baggyflappy clothing.


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## Fab Foodie (13 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> If the guy on the flat bar bike has his lumbar vertebrae at the recognised correct angle, he will be no less aerodynamic than the guy on the drop bar bike riding on the hoods.
> When the guy on the drop bar bike goes in the tuck, the guy on the flat bar bike bends his arms.
> 
> The only difference which remains is the smoothness of airflow around the rider. The guy on the flat bar bike will prob' be wearing a flappyjacket, while the guy on the drop bar bike will be wearing a skin tight fleece jersey. The guy on the flat bar bike will be wearing baggie shorts and the guy on the drop bar bike will be in lycra.
> ...


I don't disagree jimbo.
But let's face it, in the real world most flat barred/Hybrid bike riders tend to have a more upright riding position (this is often stated the reason why they want flat bars) and drop-bar bike riders will tend to be lower and more aerodynamic even on the hoods and then can be lower on the drops.


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## Andrew_P (14 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> If the guy on the flat bar bike has his lumbar vertebrae at the recognised correct angle, he will be no less aerodynamic than the guy on the drop bar bike riding on the hoods.
> When the guy on the drop bar bike goes in the tuck, the guy on the flat bar bike bends his arms.
> 
> The only difference which remains is the smoothness of airflow around the rider. The guy on the flat bar bike will prob' be wearing a flappyjacket, while the guy on the drop bar bike will be wearing a skin tight fleece jersey. The guy on the flat bar bike will be wearing baggie shorts and the guy on the drop bar bike will be in lycra.
> ...


 you just described me, except add a few kilos of gear in a old duff rucksack, and hairy legs. Anyways managed to avg 16.4 miles on my 15 mile yesterday (tasty wind behind me)


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## jimboalee (14 Oct 2010)

The 'Holy Grail' of cycling is getting the weight distribution of the torso even across the contact points on the saddle.

Having the lumbar vertebrae at the correct inclination is supposed to put the pelvis in a position where the 'Holy Grail' is achieved.



An 'upright' seating position will place more weight on the coccyx and promote soreness between the bum cheeks, and raise the need for creams and lotions.



This was explained to me when I was thirteen, and in the twenty or so bikes I've had since, I've not had saddlesoreness or need for creams or lotions.



Getting the body position right is two fold. One, the body presents the same cross section, and two, you can throw your creams and lotions away.


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## Andrew_P (14 Oct 2010)

jimboalee said:


> The 'Holy Grail' of cycling is getting the weight distribution of the torso even across the contact points on the saddle.
> 
> Having the lumbar vertebrae at the correct inclination is supposed to put the pelvis in a position where the 'Holy Grail' is achieved.
> 
> ...



Dont suppose you have a diagram for that


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## jimboalee (14 Oct 2010)

LOCO said:


> Dont suppose you have a diagram for that




It's in Richard Ballantine and Richard Grant's Book 'The Ultimate Bicycle Book". P 18.


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## Fab Foodie (17 Oct 2010)

Blimey Jimbo... how many Holy Grails are there in cycling? you should write a book about them.
When published we can then have a poll whether to file them under non-fiction or comedy


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## jimboalee (18 Oct 2010)

The 'Holy grail' of cycling is being able to shrug off witicisms and wise cracks from other riders in the peleton.
Too much adrenaline from minor annoyances early in the race ruins performance later in the race.


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## lmow20 (18 Oct 2010)

roscco said:


> in the near future i may consider commuting to work (36 mile round trip) a few days a week using pedal power. Ive never used a hybrid and was wondering... for those who have had the use of both typres of bike (road race and hybrid), is there much difference (apart from the handlebars!)



Hey there,
I have been a commuter for a couple of years, on and off. I got into it when I bought a specialized sirrus, which at the time was a nifty little hybrid. The wide bars give so much control, and if you have hills to descend, they feel a lot safer and easier on the neck. I also used it for a tour to Barcelona this summer - very versatile.

That said, I am now on a flatter commute stretch, and I fancy a bit more speed. The upright position of the hybrid does increase drag a bit. Now, the other issue is obviously, 'can I put a rack on it?'. Remember, the bike should be weatherproof, which is why I'm mortgaging the house for a titanium frame .

Safe riding big man


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## g00se (18 Oct 2010)

The 'Holy Grail' of cycling is finding a route that's downhill all the way...


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## jimboalee (19 Oct 2010)

g00se said:


> The 'Holy Grail' of cycling is finding a route that's downhill all the way...




You need a gravity distorter.


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