# Ottolock defeats thief...just



## Randy Butternubs (14 Jan 2018)

After waiting for several months my brother finally received his Ottolock from the states. It originates from Kickstarter and aims to replace lightweight cable locks but with better security thanks to a mix of steel bands and kevlar fibres. 

Unfortunately someone decided to have a go at it last night and it is no more.











He got caught out and ended up using it to secure an expensive bike in London at night, which is pretty far from its intended use I assume.

The would-be thief seems to have gotten frustrated and has tried to melt it apart, with no success. They came very close to getting through it but seem to have either given up in frustration or been scared away. Apparently it looked much more intact last night and they may not have realised how close they were to cutting it.

I know it's a bit iffy to make conclusions based on one event but here goes:

- I'm impressed by how tough it is. I've a fair amount of experience cutting different materials and it looks like a right pig to get through. They appear to have spent some time on it. I feel that it is probably much tougher than an equivalent weight cable lock.
- On the other hand, the fact that it was attacked just days after receiving it perhaps highlights the importance of a visual deterrent. It looks like a bit of a toy, but perhaps a black one would be better. An expensive lock than invites attack is a bit of an issue, even if they don't manage to nick the bike.
- Overall my impression is that it would make a good, if expensive, cafe lock. It might be good for touring cyclists too as it is light and convenient to carry. It is available in long lengths which would allow you to lock up to small trees.

I hope this is of some help to people who are considering buying one. I have no relation to the seller etc. etc.


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## gaijintendo (14 Jan 2018)

Maybe they just wanted to have a go on a new and expensive lock, to see how it fared.

Do they actually feel that light? My current cafe lock would also double as a hotel retractable clothes line, so could potentially do with an upgrade once the gadget funds return.


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## Banjo (14 Jan 2018)

Impressive that it survived. My bike was saved by a £2.99 Cable lock once . Outsside a leisure center I had passed it through the pedal and around a post.

Some kid grabbed the bike and ran towards a maze of paths but had a shock when the lock ripped it out of his hands. Couple of scratches on bike but it saved the day .Clearly wouldnt have survived an attack like the Ottolock did but coped with a casual scrote.


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## Tangoup51 (14 Jan 2018)

I'm surprised too, after seeing many of those kinds of locks started up by college boys on kickstarter, I am impressed.

Still, while I don't want to steal praise from the lock I do think the only reason they didn't get through it is because they were spooked. 
If someones using a flame to melt your lock, probably going to have more tools in your arsenal that'd attract alot of attention, plus the fact that they would of known that it was about to break, so had to bolt for some reason. 

That said, I do agree with what you said. They shouldn't come in colours that'd make them seem feeble. Matt Grey, Matt black should be the only colour options IMO 

But I wouldn't buy one even if the colours had the same strength appearance as hulk hogan, the reason being they are Kickstarter made which means they are very expensive as everything is sold at full production price + the profit gap, in total the ottolock (depending on the size you buy) ranges from £45-60

And I don't believe in "lightweight" locks, to me, a lightweight lock is the same as saying "light-weight brake mount thread inserts" or "lightweight cleat bolts" 

Some things can afford to be heavy, especially when their job is demanding. But if you spend enough money it is possible for light-weight items to be light with no drawbacks, as evidenced here.

But obviously to achieve that you do need to spend alot of money. £45-60 for a lock that effectively is designed for cafe stops is a bit strong in the price field, especially when for less than half of that price you can pick up very small cable locks that have built-in alarms, which do the job of being compact, light and a very effective bicycle lock for short stops where you can see your bike, etc.


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## Levo-Lon (14 Jan 2018)

Ill say ill equipped opportunist trying to burn it speaks volumes about this parasitic nobbers skills


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## gaijintendo (14 Jan 2018)

Tangoup51 said:


> ...
> And I don't believe in "lightweight" locks, to me, a lightweight lock is the same as saying "light-weight brake mount thread inserts" or "lightweight cleat bolts"
> ...


That's the crux of a lot of bike components. Lights are safety equipment. Your clothes are. Your brakes more obviously. Gears too - don't want to fly off because your chain dropped. Tyres too, got to have that magical grip. Wheels. Frame. Hmm... Saddle can protect your jewels.

Basically everything. Really helps with justifying purchases.


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## DaveReading (14 Jan 2018)

Light, strong, cheap. You have have any two.


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## Cycleops (14 Jan 2018)

Has anyone had experience of using the Litelock?


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## Randy Butternubs (14 Jan 2018)

Since the lock was toast I had a go cutting it up with various tools.






From left to right we have a junior hacksaw, side-cutting pliers, small bolt croppers and long handled end-cutting pliers. Ignore the cable lock.

Hacksaw - cuts through easily given very good support in a vice but is much slower and more awkward in other situations. When cinched tight to a pole I think it might not be possible to get a hacksaw on it at all. Even a tiny bit of wiggle makes it very difficult to saw.

Side-cutting pliers - Very hard work. I tried both nibbling at it and flexing the lock back and forth to fatigue it but neither method worked very well. I did manage to get through eventually by taking small bites and levering against an immovable object. I suspect this is what the thief was using.

Bolt croppers - These were highly ineffective. They made a cracking noise on the first cut but seemed to do relatively little to the steel bands. I think it was mostly just compressing the sandwich together without cutting.

End-cutting pliers - These were quite effective. I was able to nibble through fairly fast with the beefy head and long handles. However, the bulk of the head makes it hard to get a suitable angle on the lock and I suspect that when actually locked to a bike a thief might not be able to get the angle.

I have no other experience cutting locks and all the tools above were cheap and unloved. On the other hand, I feel a bike thief is unlikely to be rocking Knipex side-cutters and I was working mostly at a comfortable height with the lock in a bench vice.

I would love to know how easy a regular cable lock is to cut through for comparison but am unwilling to sacrifice one. The one in the picture is 8mm diameter and roughly the same length as the Ottolock and weighs 300g. The long Ottolock weighs about 240g so it is lighter while being (I strongly suspect) more resistant to attack. I feel that a huge advantage of the Ottolock over a cable lock is the ability to cinch it down tight - I don't think this aspect can be understated. A cable lock can generally have a loop pulled into a comfortable position to be worked on. When locked up tight I think one might be able to make it impossible for a hacksaw to be used and almost impossible for bulky end-cutting pliers or bolt croppers. Side-cutting pliers will slip in but as I found and as shown by the real thief is is not very easy to get through with these.

Overall, I am quite impressed and would rather like one. It is light and easy to pack whilst offering what I feel is significant resistance to petty thieves. However, I agree with @Tangoup52 that it is rather expensive compared to other options. I'll be keeping an eye out to see if we get a proper UK importer which should drop the price considerably.


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## Randy Butternubs (14 Jan 2018)

Tangoup51 said:


> And I don't believe in "lightweight" locks, to me, a lightweight lock is the same as saying "light-weight brake mount thread inserts" or "lightweight cleat bolts"



The problem is that for out-of-city use which makes up almost all my cycling there are few convenient Sheffield stands. D-locks simply won't work as I need something that can wrap around a tree really or at least a fat lamp post or something. I've eyed up the Abus Bordo locks but these are also on the short side. That leaves, what, long cable locks? 

In very rural areas a cable lock (or no lock) is probably fine but they become a bit sketchy as you get closer to urban centres. I have a relatively beefy cable lock but I'm not sure how secure it really is and it is very awkward to use thanks to its stiffness and its desire to spring back into a coil. It ain't light either, although that is not my main concern.

The Ottolock seems to hit a nice combination of being light and packable while still being a significant barrier to petty thieves. The rub is, of course, the price.


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## classic33 (14 Jan 2018)

Cycleops said:


> Has anyone had experience of using the Litelock?


Cut in less than 14 seconds. Now a court case in America because the insurance refused to pay out and the locks owner put the video* of the theft on YouTube.

*Blocked in the UK.


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## Levo-Lon (14 Jan 2018)

Its all about time and the right tool.
Few seconds and not too noisy..a petrol saw will eat any chain in under 10 seconds but makes a racket.
If your nicking a 8k bike or a 1k one its all you need im afraid


http://www.diy.com/departments/worx...mA&gclsrc=ds&dclid=CIa434KF2NgCFYaq7QodbFcGhA


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## Deafie (14 Jan 2018)

classic33 said:


> Cut in less than 14 seconds. Now a court case in America because the insurance refused to pay out and the locks owner put the video* of the theft on YouTube.
> 
> *Blocked in the UK.


Last time I locked my bike to a street sign like that it was with a Kryptonite lock and chain as well as a kryptonite D lock and cable and some bastard unbolted the sign and lifted it over the top.


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## Slick (14 Jan 2018)

Deafie said:


> Last time I locked my bike to a street sign like that it was with a Kryptonite lock and chain as well as a kryptonite D lock and cable and some bastard unbolted the sign and lifted it over the top.


I did the very same thing today, but I was aware of the weak link in this arrangement so managed to keep it in eye contact at all times. You really do need to try and think of every possible way it could walk.


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## Randy Butternubs (14 Jan 2018)

meta lon said:


> Its all about time and the right tool.
> Few seconds and not too noisy..a petrol saw will eat any chain in under 10 seconds but makes a racket.
> If your nicking a 8k bike or a 1k one its all you need im afraid



Yeah, if you have an expensive bike in a theft hotspot then battery powered angle-grinders are a worry. My understanding though is that most will run out of juice before getting through a thick-shackled double-locking D-lock. Or was it before getting through two such D-locks?

Clearly a lot of thieves have nothing but an old pair of side-cutting pliers though, or bolt cutters, so it is worth protecting against such tools.


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## andrew_s (14 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> I would love to know how easy a regular cable lock is to cut through for comparison but am unwilling to sacrifice one.


We've cut 4 on club rides that I know of.

Cutting took about 30 sec to 1 min with side-cutters, and 5 or 6 minutes with the cutting bit of ordinary 6" pliers

2 x key at home (moral: always carry your lock in a locked state, so you need the key to attach the bike to something) 
1 x sticky lock that failed to unlock during 5 minutes of attempts by various people, but unlocked easily as soon as the cable was cut.
1 x key lost at pub; found on the wall-side pedal after the lock was cut and the bike moved.


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## Tangoup51 (14 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> The problem is that for out-of-city use which makes up almost all my cycling there are few convenient Sheffield stands. D-locks simply won't work as I need something that can wrap around a tree really or at least a fat lamp post or something. I've eyed up the Abus Bordo locks but these are also on the short side. That leaves, what, long cable locks?
> 
> In very rural areas a cable lock (or no lock) is probably fine but they become a bit sketchy as you get closer to urban centres. I have a relatively beefy cable lock but I'm not sure how secure it really is and it is very awkward to use thanks to its stiffness and its desire to spring back into a coil. It ain't light either, although that is not my main concern.
> 
> The Ottolock seems to hit a nice combination of being light and packable while still being a significant barrier to petty thieves. The rub is, of course, the price.





It seems that you need something that can survive a bad day at a cafe stop where the bike is out of your sight & both be flexible enough to be packaged conveniently and wrap around odd-sized obstacles. Something with nice weight & price too...

Honestly from the top of my head you can find things like ..





As an example. This is something I use to have for my "cafe" stops. - it's an alarmed cable-lock.
This one has a 12mm diameter cable, so it's a good medium size between fat and skinny, the cable length is 25 inches long.

It weights less than 290 grams and can folded into about an area of 20.25 square inch size by less than an inch depth.

Which is enough to easily fit into a jersey pocket. I recall being able to fit Two of these in one of mine, though it did get tight with two (but then again it was a cheap jersey.)

this costs, £10.00 and the most expensive thing on it, is the alarm. Which is very, very loud. Very loud. 110db infact, and the alarm was triggered by interference with the Cable, i,e, tugged, pinched, moved, etc and it worked like clock-work, always consistent.

Obviously you'd think for £10.00 there must be something you're missing, well the truth is you're not, the whole unit is very cheap to make so that's why it's not expensive. The steel used isn't the best quality and the majority of it is plastic and rubber to save costs and ultimately weight too.
But at the same time, the key/cylinder is smooth and doesn't jam, you can toggle the alarm on/off, it locks firmly and audibly and it doesn't feel like it will fall apart in seconds of a real attack.


But you must think surely this has no comparison of security against the £50 ottolock and you'd be right -- except if you was using it as a cafe lock, not an "overnight" lock.
Because you'd always be within earshot of the bike, as opposed to leaving it overnight outside where you couldn't hear it.

The thief would probably run too, because when the alarms going he knows you're on the way to see what's going on. - Also, thick cable locks can be quite hard to just "cut" cleanly in one go, even with short-handled bolt croppers.

So when you stop and think about it, you do get alot for £10.00


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## Cycleops (14 Jan 2018)

An alarmed D lock like this might give you a bit more time for fifty quid:
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/oxford-alarm-d-max-duo-lock-set/rp-prod144268


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## SkipdiverJohn (14 Jan 2018)

I think the lesson to be learned here is that you simply can't expect to expect to be able to keep hold of a desirable bike if you park it on-street in dodgy locations. Expensive (or even just nice) bikes really have to be saved for those occasions where you have control over the parking/storage situation at both ends of your journey. If you have to leave the bike out of sight, or on the street, then only use a low value/undesirable bike for those journeys.
The only bike I will willingly leave on the street in my area is my skip recue job, and I've even gone to the trouble of painting what is just a low-value 1990s Apollo MTB in midnight blue, to destroy any remaining vestige of stolen resale value by making it's brand identity anonymous. I've also got a duct tape repaired saddle fitted and left the horrible rusty wheels on rather than swap them for tidy ones. It looks like a total minger, which is simply not worth nicking.


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## Levo-Lon (14 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> Yeah, if you have an expensive bike in a theft hotspot then battery powered angle-grinders are a worry. My understanding though is that most will run out of juice before getting through a thick-shackled double-locking D-lock. Or was it before getting through two such D-locks?
> 
> Clearly a lot of thieves have nothing but an old pair of side-cutting pliers though, or bolt cutters, so it is worth protecting against such tools.




Most thieves are toss pot junkies and chancers so you may escape with a decent lock.
I leave my lock at work as its a monster motorcycle job and its secure while im working plus cctv.
I work on the 1minute and its gone adage so make that minute count.
Once that lock fails their gone,and they dont tend to care about being caught if they are desperate.

Sad thing is a fantastic expensive bike is £20 baggy to a junkie as is a 100 quid one


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## HLaB (14 Jan 2018)

meta lon said:


> Most thieves are toss pot junkies and chancers so you may escape with a decent lock.
> I leave my lock at work as its a monster motorcycle job and its secure while im working plus cctv.
> I work on the 1minute and its gone adage so make that minute count.
> Once that lock fails their gone,and they dont tend to care about being caught if they are desperate.
> ...


One of the €8,000 vuelta bikes was nicked last year and turned up with junkie trying to sell it for €80


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## SkipdiverJohn (14 Jan 2018)

meta lon said:


> Most thieves are toss pot junkies and chancers



Exactly right. The same sort of scumbags you get aggressively begging for "any spare change for a cup of tea, mate?" and rummaging through the donations left outside the door of the local charity shop. They'd nick the laces out of your shoes given half a chance, let alone take your bike.


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## DaveReading (14 Jan 2018)

Tangoup51 said:


> It weights less than 290 grams and can folded into about an area of 4.5 square inch size by less than an inch depth.



4.5 square inches, or 4.5 inches square ?


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## DRM (14 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> Yeah, if you have an expensive bike in a theft hotspot then battery powered angle-grinders are a worry. My understanding though is that most will run out of juice before getting through a thick-shackled double-locking D-lock. Or was it before getting through two such D-locks?
> 
> Clearly a lot of thieves have nothing but an old pair of side-cutting pliers though, or bolt cutters, so it is worth protecting against such tools.


Our fabricator/welder at work uses a battery powered angle grinder, and with the cutting discs he uses I wouldn't give ANY lock a snowballs chance in hell of staying in one piece, it really does go through all metals like a hot knife through butter.


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## Tangoup51 (14 Jan 2018)

DaveReading said:


> 4.5 square inches, or 4.5 inches square ?


?


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## Randy Butternubs (14 Jan 2018)

DRM said:


> Our fabricator/welder at work uses a battery powered angle grinder, and with the cutting discs he uses I wouldn't give ANY lock a snowballs chance in hell of staying in one piece, it really does go through all metals like a hot knife through butter.



There exist some monstrous cordless grinders but I'm not sure how well your average consumer tool will fair against a really tough lock. I think I've seen figures like "3 minutes" bandied about (for two cuts) which is a lot of battery power. My impression was that even very large batteries only lasted around 5 minutes if you are really giving it some.

That said, I think you need to be prepared for any bike left on the streets to be replaced at short notice; either use a cheap one or insure it.


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## Alan O (14 Jan 2018)

Tangoup51 said:


> ?


4.5 sq inches would be, for example, something like 4.5 inches long by 1 inch wide.

4.5 inches square is 4.5 inches by 4.5 inches, which is 20.25 square inches.


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## Tangoup51 (15 Jan 2018)

Alan O said:


> 4.5 sq inches would be, for example, something like 4.5 inches long by 1 inch wide.
> 
> 4.5 inches square is 4.5 inches by 4.5 inches, which is 20.25 square inches.



Do you mean, square inches is the rounded answer and inches squared is the base answer?


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## jefmcg (15 Jan 2018)

DaveReading said:


> 4.5 square inches, or 4.5 inches square ?


Neither, I'd say. 3 dimensional objects are cubed not squared.


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## Tangoup51 (15 Jan 2018)

jefmcg said:


> Neither, I'd say. 3 dimensional objects are cubed not squared.



The plot thickens ..


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## Drago (15 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> There exist some monstrous cordless grinders but I'm not sure how well your average consumer tool will fair against a really tough lock. I think I've seen figures like "3 minutes" bandied about (for two cuts) which is a lot of battery power. My impression was that even very large batteries only lasted around 5 minutes if you are really giving it some.
> 
> That said, I think you need to be prepared for any bike left on the streets to be replaced at short notice; either use a cheap one or insure it.



Do Kryptonite still give their "£500 if someone nicks your bike while secured to something solid using our lock" type guarantee?

Edit - yurp, they sure do. https://www.kryptonitelock.com/en/customer-service/register-for-anti-theft.html


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## Thorn Sherpa (15 Jan 2018)

1st I've actually heard of these locks! Good site the guarantee is definitely a big selling point in my eyes. I'm not one for locking my bike up in public, the only time my bike is left unattended is at work (chained up on site) or if I'm in the car. Would be handy to have a lock that id be confident using in public places when I'm out on rides though.


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## stewie griffin (15 Jan 2018)

Any hardened steel lock can be cut in seconds with the correct tools & know-how.


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## DaveReading (15 Jan 2018)

jefmcg said:


> Neither, I'd say. 3 dimensional objects are cubed not squared.



Give me strength.

To make it easier - does it fit into a jersey pocket when folded up?


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## mjr (15 Jan 2018)

Drago said:


> Do Kryptonite still give their "£500 if someone nicks your bike while secured to something solid using our lock" type guarantee?
> 
> Edit - yurp, they sure do. https://www.kryptonitelock.com/en/customer-service/register-for-anti-theft.html


And it's still marketing BS because you need the broken lock. Try finding reports of claim attempts.


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## gaijintendo (15 Jan 2018)

Tangoup51 said:


> It seems that you need something that can survive a bad day at a cafe stop where the bike is out of your sight & both be flexible enough to be packaged conveniently and wrap around odd-sized obstacles. Something with nice weight & price too...
> 
> Honestly from the top of my head you can find things like ..
> View attachment 391526
> ...



Not wanting to fan the fires of the 4.5inch crew... 
But it may be a 12mm cable... but how much of that is steel? 

I totally appreciate the use case, and the alarm. But I suspect you could cut that with some rusty secateurs, then just cycle away from the noise.


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## mjr (15 Jan 2018)

gaijintendo said:


> Not wanting to fan the fires of the 4.5inch crew...
> But it may be a 12mm cable... but how much of that is steel?
> 
> I totally appreciate the use case, and the alarm. But I suspect you could cut that with some rusty secateurs, then just cycle away from the noise.


Something more sensible than rusty secateurs but yes, it's only useful as a sole lock when you're within earshot and will react once the alarm sounds.


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## derrick (15 Jan 2018)

Randy Butternubs said:


> Since the lock was toast I had a go cutting it up with various tools.
> 
> View attachment 391501
> 
> ...


What you need is one of these, https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dcg412n-18v-li-ion-xr-5-angle-grinder-bare/34861


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## dodgy (15 Jan 2018)

Relevant external thread https://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=13076261
And video 
View: https://vimeo.com/196548742
(I think this is the video that is blocked on youtube due to a defamation complaint)

*Edit: *I think more likely this is the video that Litelok used to demonstrate how well the product stands up to attack.


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## Tim Hall (15 Jan 2018)

As noted above, the "12mm" cable is unlikely to be 12mm of wire. The picture shows an amount of plastic covering. If I were to be in the business of nicking bikes and couldn't get hold of a battery powered disc cutter, I'd use some GBFO wire cutters with overlapping blades not bolt croppers. Of course using huge bolt croppers against cable in a promotional video makes the lock look good.


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## SkipdiverJohn (15 Jan 2018)

derrick said:


> What you need is one of these, https://www.screwfix.com/p/dewalt-dcg412n-18v-li-ion-xr-5-angle-grinder-bare/34861



People go on about battery life, but what counts is the abrasive disc used. A 1mm slitting disc will cut through a D-lock or heavy chain like a hot knife through butter with hardly any pressure applied, and you don't need to make 2 cuts of a chain either if you cut the link face-on so the grinder goes through both sides of the link at the same time.


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## Alan O (15 Jan 2018)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> People go on about battery life...


And it is entirely possible to actually buy two batteries.


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## dodgy (15 Jan 2018)

5 minutes of waffle, so I've linked to the relevant part of the test, looks like litelok didn't try that hard 

View: https://youtu.be/YirAiuGrFe8?t=302


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## jefmcg (15 Jan 2018)

dodgy said:


> 5 minutes of waffle, so I've linked to the relevant part of the test, looks like litelok didn't try that hard
> 
> View: https://youtu.be/YirAiuGrFe8?t=302



He cheats. The cover is supposed to stop an angle grinder, so stripping off the cover before using it, then saying 14 seconds is a lie.

And it's stripped before the video starts. How long did that take?


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## dodgy (15 Jan 2018)

Shame he's left his video open to accusations of unfair play. I doubt the cover would have made much of a difference, there's probably other videos online that I can't be bothered searching for now


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## Alan O (15 Jan 2018)

Right from the beginning of the video the outer cover is missing, and he says something about "I've been looking to see what it's made of" - which suggests he didn't see the outer cover as being much of a barrier. Reviews suggest the outer cover is a plastic braid, and I can't see that being too hard to remove.

Still, it's a little careless to not attempt the whole thing, outer cover and all, with the angle grinder - the time taken to remove it too should have been included.

(But for me, when I'm going anywhere where I'll need to lock a bike, I'm happy to ride the one that cost half the price of a Litelok )


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## Tangoup51 (15 Jan 2018)

gaijintendo said:


> But it may be a 12mm cable... but how much of that is steel?
> 
> I totally appreciate the use case, and the alarm. But I suspect you could cut that with some rusty secateurs, then just cycle away from the noise.



I think atleast 4mm is rubber and it's a pure 8mm cable. Keep in mind that the second you even seat your wire cutters or bolt cutters against it, the alarm will be sounding. You must appreciate how difficult it actually is to cut a cable lock in one, clean immediate cut.
- also, if you're worried about the lock failing as quickly as possible due to full length bolt croppers someone brought to a cafe stop, then you should probably jam you're gears so they can't ride away with it. - Keep in mind, that you won't be very far from your bike at all times either. 









mjr said:


> Something more sensible than rusty secateurs but yes, it's only useful as a sole lock when you're within earshot and will react once the alarm sounds.



Which is the exact point I was making, it's a cafe lock. It's very light, portable and 'earshot' is quite a big distance, given the 110db alarm. - although seldom will you be far from your bike anyway.


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## confusedcyclist (15 Jan 2018)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> I think the lesson to be learned here is that you simply can't expect to expect to be able to keep hold of a desirable bike if you park it on-street in dodgy locations. Expensive (or even just nice) bikes really have to be saved for those occasions where you have control over the parking/storage situation at both ends of your journey. If you have to leave the bike out of sight, or on the street, then only use a low value/undesirable bike for those journeys.
> The only bike I will willingly leave on the street in my area is my skip recue job, and I've even gone to the trouble of painting what is just a low-value 1990s Apollo MTB in midnight blue, to destroy any remaining vestige of stolen resale value by making it's brand identity anonymous. I've also got a duct tape repaired saddle fitted and left the horrible rusty wheels on rather than swap them for tidy ones. It looks like a total minger, which is simply not worth nicking.


Show us a pick John!


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## PpPete (24 Jan 2018)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> It looks like a total minger, which is simply not worth nicking.


Don't count on it.
I had a minger stolen from the local station recently. It was a ghetto fixed on a huge old steel frame that had been repainted. I always thought the chances of any undernourished scroat being able to get astride it, let alone ride the thing were, pretty slim. Resale value of components no more than £20, even if stripped down. And as stations go it's not a particularly high-crime area. And yet it still went.

I think I shall paint the next one intended for such uses in dayglo /rainbow stripes. Evidently matt black is just too attractive.


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## mjr (25 Jan 2018)

PpPete said:


> I think I shall paint the next one intended for such uses in dayglo /rainbow stripes. Evidently matt black is just too attractive.


Fluo pink with handlebar streamers?


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## PpPete (25 Jan 2018)

and green and yellow and blue
It will be christened Joseph...


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