# London to Hastings



## anothersam (15 Jul 2014)

I'm hoping to rustle up a ride from London to Hastings. Though I'm mostly posting about it over at LFGSS, if anybody here is interested, the more the merrier. I haven't the expertise in event planning that some illustrious CCers can boast, but l've traveled the route often enough to be comfortable bringing company, so hopefully there won't be too many casualties. Except perhaps on the hills.





_We won't be doing this one._

Briefly, I'm aiming for a weekend in August, and at the moment am just looking for a show of hands for interested parties.

Here's a detailed map of the route:


----------



## martint235 (15 Jul 2014)

Depending on the weekend I'm interested.


----------



## wanda2010 (15 Jul 2014)

Will it include beer, Guinness, chips, burgers, ice-cream................. and a tow-rope?


----------



## StuAff (15 Jul 2014)

Interested.


----------



## Dogtrousers (15 Jul 2014)

Could be. Provided that you wouldn't mind me intercepting the ride somewhere (around the Biggin Hill area or the N Downs ridge or something like that) rather than going all the way into town, and then riding back through the grottiness. Diary permitting, of course.


----------



## anothersam (15 Jul 2014)

Grand. I will return later in the day to give this thread the attention it requires. First I have to source tow-ropes and possibly crampons.

I'll also make an attempt to categorise the hills.


----------



## wanda2010 (15 Jul 2014)

Secret and honest hills. Only.


----------



## martint235 (15 Jul 2014)

wanda2010 said:


> Secret and honest hills. Only.


Not a huge fan of secret hills personally. Honest hills only please.


----------



## anothersam (15 Jul 2014)

I'm planning a recce of the entire route on *August 3rd*, a Sunday. Anybody is welcome to come along. We could even call it a 'ride'. Raincheck day will be the 9th or 10th, to be determined.

The date for the Official L2H is Saturday *August 30th*; the 31st or September 6/7th if it rains, tbd.

I'll be along with the route and other trifling details later.


Dogtrousers said:


> Could be. Provided that you wouldn't mind me intercepting the ride somewhere (around the Biggin Hill area or the N Downs ridge or something like that) rather than going all the way into town, and then riding back through the grottiness. Diary permitting, of course.


A Biggin Hillish capture should be doable if one of us brings a net.


wanda2010 said:


> Secret and honest hills. Only.





martint235 said:


> Not a huge fan of secret hills personally. Honest hills only please.


I think they're all honest, though some will extract more of a toll than others. Here's an overview I made earlier of most of the *special* ones [scroll to 'twinned hills' if that link doesn't take you there directly]. Note that isn't the route I'm planning for the last bit.

The worst, Hogtrough Hill, I can't even cycle up on my SS. Fortunately we're going down it. Hosey Hill follows soon after, and will get the blood pumping, but it's not what I'd call terrifying. Rogues Hill south of Penshurst Place near T. Wells is a nasty piece of work though. We won't be touring the ancestral home of the the Sidney family, whose Elizabethan forebear Sir Philip died in battle of gangrene and gallantly gave his water to another wounded soldier, saying "Thy necessity is yet greater than mine," think nothing of it, 'tis merely a scratch, cue the Black Knight. If you run out of water you can probably fill up at the pub in the village, and nobody else need suffer for it.






The highest climb is King's Hill Road, which is the main impediment between Burwash and the Brightling pyramid. It's about the same as Ditchling Beacon, but you get twice the distance to do it in. And there are lots of smaller hills in between; nothing to write home about, but cumulatively they will take their toll, so when we reach Hastings you'll have earned whatever debauchery you may have planned. Personally I'd like a nice game of air hockey, if the amusement arcades are open.


----------



## martint235 (15 Jul 2014)

I may be able to make the 3rd but I'm out for the 30th I'm afraid.


----------



## anothersam (15 Jul 2014)

Route


----------



## wanda2010 (16 Jul 2014)

30th now in the diary. Doing recce ride would be a step too far after Manchester/Morecambe ride the day before.


----------



## anothersam (16 Jul 2014)

Now that I've posted the route (and the L2H is actually in a diary*) I'm having one or two second thoughts, so if it's too ambitious there may be alterations; the jog around Westerham Hill, for example, which is there because I dislike that bit so much even though it's going down. And it has occurred to me that I don't have to be absolutely committed to starting from the middle of London, though I'm loathe to change that.

* two firsts, if you include the new branding


----------



## martint235 (16 Jul 2014)

It's your call. I go down Westerham fairly often on my own and it's ok. I once took a group of 5 down it and I was as nervous as hell. It's not overly pleasant and the potholes on the main right hand bend just add that extra frisson.


----------



## anothersam (16 Jul 2014)

Thanks for your input. I'd probably also be nervous taking others down that hill, but as you say, individuals might be fine with it.

I'm also considering going down Cudham & Downe Roads & through Cudham, though prefer the route as marked because a) it takes in Down House; granted just a fly-by, but after the dinos at Crystal Palace it seems appropriate, b) I've got friends in Berry's Hill, which might make a convenient comfort stop (if they don't mind me volunteering their facilities and hospitality), and c) Downe Road goes up sharply enough into Cudham that I for one would have to get off and walk past the grim reaper upthread. Which would still be faster I suppose.


----------



## Dogtrousers (16 Jul 2014)

I'm in for August 3rd. But probably not the main event. As said above I'll try to ambush you somewhere South of Crystal Palace.

For example: Let me know what time you're likely to be passing through and I could wait for you here

Personally, I'm not keen on Westerham Hill, and there are various other ways over the ridge. You don't have to go past the grim reaper. If you go straight on in Downe village rather than left towards the reaper and then go left on Jail Lane it brings you to the top of the grim reaper hill, but not as steeply (steep, but not as steep) Or you could do the more gentle ascent on the W side of the main road up Nash La/Layhams Rd/Skid Hill La to Titsey and down Clarks Lane to Westerham (like this). But I'm not trying to teach my grandmother to suck eggs. Too many cooks and other clichés. So I'll shut up.


----------



## mmmmartin (16 Jul 2014)

Consider going up the hill after penshurst place then via groombridge, town row, Mayfield, along newick lane to heathfield then along the cuckoo trail (old railway line now a cycle path and utterly flat) to hailsham then out through the marshes via downash and rickney then past Norman's bay to Hastings. This is far flatter and faster than the route you plan. There is also a pleasant bit of coast to ride alongside. 
For the train journey back you may prefer to put 20p in the Permit To Travel machine at West St Leonards station, which is usually unmanned, and if asked pay the fare to the ticket chappie on the train. If asked. Starting from Hastings means you must buy a ticket to get through the barrier. 
Just sayin'.


----------



## StuartG (16 Jul 2014)

We did a club run from Croydon to Rye, ending up at Hastings for the train home earlier this year. It was utterly flat*, gorgeously jaw dropping and mostly on very quiet back lanes. Rye is somewhat more beautiful intermediate destination than Hastings. So if you want to attract the flat earthers we have a route ...

* Well apart from the usual North Downs nonsense when you are fresh and one horrendous uphill approaching Hastings. Would there be a way round that?


----------



## User10571 (16 Jul 2014)

Sam, I did London to Hastings when there was some royal nonsense going on a couple of years ago.
Adam organised it and it is documented here. Somewhere.
It's a tough ride, with a tougher (unpleasant) ending.
Last few miles are nothing to write home about, and probably best avoided.
Consider Pevensey Bay as an alternative destination.
Really
It's not too far off target.


----------



## Dogtrousers (16 Jul 2014)

StuartG said:


> Well apart from the usual North Downs nonsense when you are fresh and *one horrendous uphill approaching Hastings*. Would there be a way round that?


 Battery Hill?
I have unfinished business there. Not that I'm terribly keen to go and finish it.


----------



## StuAff (16 Jul 2014)

User10571 said:


> Sam, I did London to Hastings when there was some royal nonsense going on a couple of years ago.
> *Adam organised it and it is documented here. Somewhere.*
> It's a tough ride, with a tougher (unpleasant) ending.
> Last few miles are nothing to write home about, and probably best avoided.
> ...


Documented here in fact. Adam put a cleaned up version of the route here.


----------



## anothersam (16 Jul 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> Let me know what time you're likely to be passing through and I could wait for you here


There looks good.







> Personally, I'm not keen on Westerham Hill, and there are various other ways over the ridge. You don't have to go past the grim reaper. If you go straight on in Downe village rather than left towards the reaper and then go left on Jail Lane it brings you to the top of the grim reaper hill, but not as steeply (steep, but not as steep)...


Church Hill? Funny you should mention that. I've never actually honked up it, and just assumed it's worse than what we're calling grim reaper hill. If I recollect correctly it's narrowish and busy enough (nothing like Westerham Hill of course) that a slow ascent might not be the most relaxing experience with cars on our tail, but it's not that long, and overall it would surely save a bit of time without sacrificing any real points of interest. Prefer it to the western approach. I'll do it on the recce.



mmmmartin said:


> Consider going up the hill after penshurst place then via groombridge, town row, Mayfield, along newick lane to heathfield then along the cuckoo trail (old railway line now a cycle path and utterly flat) to hailsham then out through the marshes via downash and rickney then past Norman's bay to Hastings. This is far flatter and faster than the route you plan. There is also a pleasant bit of coast to ride alongside.



I like going via Bidborough because it offers such a great vista north, and sets us up for a fast spin through Southborough then Tunbridge Wells.

At first glance T Wells might seem to be a place to avoid, but as we'll be getting a large serving of country, I think a brief dip back into town midway through the ride helps keep it from being too samey after London. Although the route I've chosen is the main road, it's not too bad, even with traffic; the bus lane through Southborough helps. Plus it's a good place to get food. I'm planning on stopping in the precinct for lunch.

Your Cuckoo Trail variation is flatter, at least the Cuckoo Trail part (and maybe some other bits; I don't know that route well enough to compare), but I prefer the very pretty lanes between Brightling and Herstmonceaux, former site of Royal Greenwich Observatory, which we won't be running into but will be able to see from a distance. From there it's mostly downhill then downright flat, with a great warmdown from Pevensey eastwards, ending with a spin along the boardwalk.


> For the train journey back you may prefer to put 20p in the Permit To Travel machine at West St Leonards station, which is usually unmanned, and if asked pay the fare to the ticket chappie on the train. If asked. Starting from Hastings means you must buy a ticket to get through the barrier.
> Just sayin'.


You can also get on at Warrior Square, which is often manned but also without a barrier. Speaking of trains, the Hastings line is usually pretty mellow. As for not paying Southeastern their due, I can of course offer no comment, other than the observation that once you get north of Frant it's all barriers (not always closed it must be said) and penalty fare stations, except for High Brooms I think. But I've never had a problem buying a ticket on the train.



StuartG said:


> We did a club run from Croydon to Rye, ending up at Hastings for the train home earlier this year. It was utterly flat*, gorgeously jaw dropping and mostly on very quiet back lanes. Rye is somewhat more beautiful intermediate destination...



I'm not particularly trying to flatten the route, though I'm not averse to shaving some miles; just not at the expense of the more interesting bits. Plus, I know this way well enough to feel comfortable escorting others.

User10571 – No, it's Hastings for me. Don't know what route Adam used, but I'd be surprised if it was this one!

As I was posting, StuAff put up Adam's route. Am giving it a look...

...and now that I have, I can see that it's doubtless faster, but offers a totally different experience.


----------



## mmmmartin (16 Jul 2014)

In Tunbridge Wells you could do a lot worse than stop at The Velo House, a brilliant new cycling cafe run by Ollie, you go past it from Southborough. It's the old natwest bank at the top of the drop down to the millennium clock. Highly recommended. Good coffee. Wifi. A cycle service operation. Cycle parking, and they supply the locks for you.....


----------



## anothersam (17 Jul 2014)

I'm doing my best to get the word out – besides the LFGSS/CycleChat thread [strikethrough as applicable], see later comments here (which I can't link to directly, grrr) and tweet here, which has yet to be retweeted by the power tweeters. Beyond that my influence dissipates even more alarmingly.

Today's Hastings pic: Energy Bike












mmmmartin said:


> In Tunbridge Wells you could do a lot worse than stop at The Velo House, a brilliant new cycling cafe run by Ollie, you go past it from Southborough. It's the old natwest bank at the top of the drop down to the millennium clock. Highly recommended. Good coffee. Wifi. A cycle service operation. Cycle parking, and they supply the locks for you.....



I'll have to stop by and check it out.


----------



## Dogtrousers (17 Jul 2014)

By the way I rode a similar route last year and enjoyed it (in a somewhat masochistic way). It was lumpy, but fun. And had one super long straight _*wheeeee*_ descent.


----------



## StuartG (17 Jul 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> Battery Hill?
> I have unfinished business there. Not that I'm terribly keen to go and finish it.


That's the one. And a very nasty one too. Hasting's own Ditchling?


----------



## anothersam (17 Jul 2014)

I've added a blog at road.cc, but will continue to monitor this thread.

Note that I've added a third ride, sort of. One weekday starting the week of July 21st I'll be doing a pre-recce recce down to where I live, which is not far from Etchingham station on the Hastings line. If anybody is free and fancies it, you're welcome to join me. I'll be shoving off at noon or a bit sooner from the vicinity of Charing X. It'll probably take 4-5 hours (though you don't have to commit to the whole ride). Which day depends on... the weather.


----------



## hairnetnic (17 Jul 2014)

I lead a lfgss forum ride down to Hurstmonceaux a month ago or so, it was considered hilly but too extravagant...

here: http://ridewithgps.com/routes/4727172

I think that's a comparable amount of climbing... And sooner or later yyou have to get over the North Downs ( South Downs?)


----------



## anothersam (17 Jul 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> By the way I rode a similar route last year and enjoyed it (in a somewhat masochistic way). It was lumpy, but fun. And had one super long straight *wheeeee* descent.


I've done that bit from around Battle south lots of times. I like the old London Road approach down to the Old Town.



hairnetnic said:


> I lead a lfgss forum ride down to Hurstmonceaux a month ago or so, it was considered hilly but too extravagant…


Best to take "extravagant" as praise.



> I think that's a comparable amount of climbing... And sooner or later yyou have to get over the North Downs ( South Downs?)



They flatten right down for us towards the end.



User13710 said:


> Who was that comedian who would say, 'You don't want to be doing that. You want to be doing this.' - Harry Enfield? I think he's come in here in disguise


A ladder for the hills!


----------



## Dogtrousers (17 Jul 2014)

I have been told that Judge's Bakery in Hastings sells mackarolls ... like sausage rolls but mackerel. Twice I've cycled to Hastings with the intention of trying one, and twice I have failed. Third time lucky?


----------



## anothersam (17 Jul 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> I have been told that Judge's Bakery in Hastings sells mackarolls ... like sausage rolls but mackerel.



I read that as maccarolls, so this came to mind







Dogtrousers said:


> Twice I've cycled to Hastings with the intention of trying one, and twice I have failed. Third time lucky?



Three times maccarolls-his-own, unlucky. I have a better feeling about your being able to leave Hastings saying So long and thanks for all the fish.


----------



## anothersam (18 Jul 2014)

Today's Hastings pic: ARRRRR!




point of order: AAAR or ARGH?


----------



## anothersam (21 Jul 2014)

Today's Hastings pic: Why it's never a good idea to have a BBQ at the edge of a cliff


----------



## jay clock (21 Jul 2014)

Not even read what this about, but just to say that my grandfather (born 1902) did London to Hastings and back in the twenties without touching a foot down. Singlespeed I think he said, and presumably bike weighed tonnes! He also did Rugby to Torquay in a day. 193 miles. Wish he was alive to recount my exploits to....


----------



## anothersam (21 Jul 2014)

jay clock said:


> my grandfather (born 1902) did London to Hastings and back in the twenties without touching a foot down. Singlespeed I think he said



I'm picturing him trackstanding amongst the net shops, luncheoning on the catch of the day.


----------



## anothersam (23 Jul 2014)

Today's Hastings pic: But is it art?




click to enlarge

A list has been started across the road (scroll down to post #32). Here's the CycleChatCohort so far:

wanda2010 - 30th
Dogtrousers - 3rd


----------



## anothersam (27 Jul 2014)

Today's Hastings pic: Fool's gold in an arcade





Did a recce of the home stretch the other day




After Brightling it's a breeze.


----------



## Dogtrousers (28 Jul 2014)

What time will you be going through Hayes on the 3rd? I have half a plan to ride to Hastings and then add on a bit, but it depends on our eta there.


----------



## Dogtrousers (28 Jul 2014)

Uh-oh. Sorry, can't join you on your recce. Sorry. My pathetic diary management skills strike again.


----------



## anothersam (29 Jul 2014)

Dogtrousers said:


> Uh-oh. Sorry, can't join you on your recce. Sorry. My pathetic diary management skills strike again.



No dog with trousers on the 3rd? Oh well. I think it may just be me. Still, I'll be trying your suggestion near Cudham.

In other news for the 3rd, on that day in history {I've got a Day in history thing going} I note that the US Senate began its hearing on Project MKUltra, the CIA's mind control program. They used "numerous methodologies to manipulate people's mental states and alter brain functions, including the surreptitious administration of drugs (especially LSD) and other chemicals, hypnosis, sensory deprivation, isolation, verbal and sexual abuse, as well as various forms of torture." And that was just on their witnesses for the hearing.

Today's Hastings pic: King of the hill


----------



## Dogtrousers (29 Jul 2014)

anothersam said:


> No dog with trousers on the 3rd? Oh well. I think it may just be me. Still, I'll be trying your suggestion near Cudham.


Sorry, fambly duties call.

By the way I think you may find my suggestion nearly as steep as the Grim Reaper hill: I rode _*down *_that hill on Sunday. It's much steeper than I remembered it, and accompanied by one just as steep in the other direction. I said confidently to my mate "It's OK, it's downhill into Hayes from here, we've got all the hills out of the way now". We hadn't. Several times we hadn't.

Amusingly we were taking a tough-guy direct route over the Downs, and we kept getting to the top of a steep climb to be passed by a high speed club group. They'd disappear into the distance on their wimpy roundabout route, and we'd trundle down and up the next hill, to be passed by them again. I think they passed us three times.


----------



## anothersam (29 Jul 2014)

That's OK. Actually I'm going to be cancelling the recce ride; I did one today. Barely made it up that hill on my SS! Fortunately it's short. The worst bits are the beginning where you go round the bend and think _Uh Oh,_ then the end where you go round another bend and think _Again?_ The middle's fine.


----------



## gbs (5 Aug 2014)

"Is that it? Talk but no action" he said getting up from his desk. "Hurry, hurry, summer is almost over".


----------



## anothersam (6 Aug 2014)

I would've liked to do an open recce as planned, because indeed, time is a-wasting, but it didn't work out. Am looking forward to the 30th, with fingers crossed that it stays the 30th.

Meanwhile, today's Hastings pic [rummages around]:


----------



## anothersam (20 Aug 2014)

Somebody on LFGSS has asked if gears are allowed.

Gears are allowed.

Thought I'd pass that along.


----------



## anothersam (29 Aug 2014)

Ride is going ahead tomorrow (the 30th), details here.


----------



## Dogtrousers (29 Aug 2014)

Have fun. Sorry I couldn't make it in the end.


----------



## StuAff (29 Aug 2014)

I can't make it either- though I forgot about it anyway. Have a good evening!


----------



## anothersam (29 Aug 2014)

Thanks -
'Tis a day ride, if we're riding into the evening, something's gone wrong!


----------



## StuAff (29 Aug 2014)

anothersam said:


> Thanks -
> 'Tis a day ride, if we're riding into the evening, something's gone wrong!


Indeed...my mistake.


----------



## wanda2010 (29 Aug 2014)

Sorry, AS. I'm out also. Not feeling very well so don't want to chance it. Have a good one.


----------



## anothersam (29 Aug 2014)

<helpful> We could make stops whenever you need to vomit


----------

