# Is taking protein shakes ok before and after a long bike ride??



## theguru (13 Jul 2013)

I have protein shake that says perfect got before and after exercise but is it beneficial?? some some say on forums just before but alot say just after but no one mentions before and after..does do any harm?.. Does the legs still grow...

Just need advice on whats best


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## Ness (13 Jul 2013)

Unless you're competing or you're also a bodybuilder, I'd ignore the marketing people and get all of your protein from food. It's a lot cheaper.
If you're already eating 3 whole chickens and 4 tins of tuna a day and physically can't get any more solid food inside you, then I'd start considering supplements. Until you get to that point you don't need it.


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## Rob3rt (13 Jul 2013)

theguru said:


> I have protein shake that says perfect got before and after exercise but is it beneficial?? some some say on forums just before but alot say just after but no one mentions before and after..does do any harm?*.. Does the legs still grow...*
> 
> Just need advice on whats best


 

Save your money! As for the bold part, LMFAO!


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (13 Jul 2013)

Ness said:


> Unless you're competing or you're also a bodybuilder, I'd ignore the marketing people


What marketing people?



> and get all of your protein from food. It's a lot cheaper.


It isn't really.



> Until you get to that point you don't need it.


How do you know for sure the OP isn't?



theguru said:


> I have protein shake that says perfect got before and after exercise but is it beneficial?? some some say on forums just before but alot say just after but no one mentions before and after..does do any harm?.. Does the legs still grow...
> 
> Just need advice on whats best


Before is pointless. After is one of those pain in the arse arguments that everyone with zero clue chimes in on.

Simple answer is try it and see. You can buy samples from most decent places that will save bulk buying of 500g or more. (bulkpowders/myprotein)


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## Ness (13 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> What marketing people?


 
You obviously, given the rest of your comments. 



Protein shakes won't do anything. If you want something that works, do a cycle on the gear.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (13 Jul 2013)

Ness said:


> You obviously, given the rest of your comments.


I don't work in marketing, nor am I here to sell anything. But feel free to avoid everything else.



> Protein shakes won't do anything. If you want something that works, do a cycle on the gear.


lol, just lol


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## jay clock (13 Jul 2013)

eat food.


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## theguru (13 Jul 2013)

Protein has been proven to be beneficial especially for the muscles that is fact not fiction..I have been cycling for some time now and I have been taking it before and after...as for legs grow part it was a question in the fact that lower part of my legs don't seem to perhaps it's that fact I only do long cycles not often enough I only do 16-20 miles 3 or 4 times a week and only been doing it on and off for a year or so other than that just short ones but I have found my legs do not hurt at all taking it before and after the long cycles


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## AndyPeace (13 Jul 2013)

The benifit of protien shakes for cyclist's is debated. If you do a long or intense ride it may be of benifit but for the average ride it will do little. Most cyclists can easily eat suficient protien in there day to day meals. It is recomended that you get 1-1.5g of protien per kg of body weight. Rather than drink shakes you'd be better off planning out a menu that forfilled this need.
It is also generally agreed that you need to eat within an hour of finishing exersice to get the full benfit of your training.

This was a useful article I read http://cyclingtips.com.au/2012/04/protein-for-cyclists/


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## ayceejay (13 Jul 2013)

If we assume that the OP is just an ordinary (non professional) cyclist who eats a balanced diet and sleeps well then no supplementation is needed although emergency anti bonk food should come along on every ride just in case. Vitamin pills protein powders and the like can solve a deficiency problem otherwise the main difference is in urine colour.
If on the other hand the objective is to have awesome legs do squats and eat 12 chicken breasts a day.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (13 Jul 2013)

theguru said:


> Protein has been proven to be beneficial especially for the muscles that is fact not fiction.


I think you need to do a little research on protein.



> I have been cycling for some time now and I have been taking it before and after..


Before pointless - after is going to be debated until the cows come home



> as for legs grow part it was a question in the fact that lower part of my legs don't seem to


In reality, cycling causes very little muscle hypertrophy.



> perhaps it's that fact I only do long cycles not often enough I only do 16-20 miles 3 or 4 times a week and only been doing it on and off for a year or so other than that just short ones but I have found my legs do not hurt at all taking it before and after the long cycles


As above - hypertrophy from cycling is limited. At that distance, there's no real reason protein intake can't be done without shakes.


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## Louch (13 Jul 2013)

my process is when i finish a cycle over 30 miles, I will have something suger rich to give my body a quick spike, then 20 mins later have a 500ml protein shake. 

at the end of the day, best thing to do is try various combos, and see what works best for you. if your diet is too high in protein, it can do damage to organs. id not do the before, as will sap energy as body breaks down proteins, rather than give you energy to ride. just my opinion. you may want your body working double time


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## Ness (13 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> I don't work in marketing, nor am I here to sell anything. But feel free to avoid everything else.
> 
> 
> lol, just lol


 
I'm glad that tickled you. 

If the OP is going to waste money on supplements, then at least it would be beneficial to waste money on stuff that's going to actually work. Protein powder won't make your legs grow. Steroids will. 
I don't advocate the use of PEDs but then I'm not against them either. Each to their own.

I do however think that it's unhelpful and ignorant to recommend something that is not going to work. Food supplementation is just that. A supplement. To use when you're at such a high level of sports performance that solid food isn't enough and you physically can't stomach the quantities of food required to provide the needed nutrients.
Solid food is cheaper because it provides so many of the nutrients that aren't found in protein supplements. Add in the cost of tablets or powders to replace those nutrients, and you're looking at a ridiculous amount of money.
It's only people who have fallen victim to the marketing machine (as I was referring to) who recommend supplements. They have absolutely no place in the diet of the average active person.
Don't get me wrong, I was once a gullible person who bought all the latest proteins and BCAAs and Creatine and anabolic boosters etc etc. While I was taking them, I thought they were great. 
On reflection though, it was all in my head. Psychosomatic. I should have saved my money and bought proper food.


Lol


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## theguru (13 Jul 2013)

Ok thanks all I think I will go through a phase of just trying it after..it is tricky because there are various opinions on what is best and a certain famous brand won't name names but it does say perfect before and after ..strange


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (13 Jul 2013)

Ness said:


> If the OP is going to waste money on supplements, then at least it would be beneficial to waste money on stuff that's going to actually work. Protein powder won't make your legs grow. Steroids will.


You are actually so wrong I feel sorry for you. Protein is the building block of all muscle fibre. Exercise tears these fibres. The issue is actually the sport undertaken as cycling isn't a major promoter of muscular hypertrophy.

So actually - protein (regardless of source) will contribute to muscle fibre repair or indeed growth (therefore legs) but it depends how you train them.,



> I don't advocate the use of PEDs but then I'm not against them either. Each to their own.


Protein is not a PED. Strange that you mention steroids do work though.



> I do however think that it's unhelpful and ignorant to recommend something that is not going to work.


Much like telling people that steroids do work.



> Food supplementation is just that. A supplement. To use when you're at such a high level of sports performance that solid food isn't enough and you physically can't stomach the quantities of food required to provide the needed nutrients.


Not sure where you get the idea that amateurs don't work extemely hard either.



> Solid food is cheaper because it provides so many of the nutrients that aren't found in protein supplements. Add in the cost of tablets or powders to replace those nutrients, and you're looking at a ridiculous amount of money.


Per g of protein, solid foods are not cheaper.



> It's only people who have fallen victim to the marketing machine (as I was referring to) who recommend supplements. They have absolutely no place in the diet of the average active person.


Once again, what marketing machine? Who are you to decide what people do with their diets?



> Don't get me wrong, I was once a gullible person who bought all the latest proteins and BCAAs and Creatine and anabolic boosters etc etc. While I was taking them, I thought they were great.
> On reflection though, it was all in my head. Psychosomatic. I should have saved my money and bought proper food.


Yawn


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## Louch (13 Jul 2013)

behave children


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## Scoosh (13 Jul 2013)

Mod hat ON.

Don't get personal.

Some people have information or knowledge with which others agree or disagree. Unless we are experts in sports science/nutrition/recovery etc etc, please be very careful how responses are made to posts.

This is Beginners, not CAD !


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

This is interesting for me because I've actually just started taking on some supplements over the last month or so. I sought advice from a physiotherapist friend (he encouraged me) and I bought products he recommended that were significantly cheaper than what you pay at holland and Barrett et al. I'm not a nutritional professional but the benefits I believe are as below:

Before exercise (football or a ride of significant distance or intensity) I will have half the quoted dose of Amino energy supplement. Basically it's got lots of caffeine in, as well as green tea and obviously amino acids. The combination is supposed to make me train harder (the caffeine most likely - I don't like coffee anyway) helps me strip away fat (green tea - I don't have much to lose but we'd all like to be trimmer) and amino acids are the building blocks of proteins and also kick starts your metabolism. 

After exercise I have half the stated dose (or the woman's dosage - I don't remotely want to bulk, just achieve leanness, efficiency and muscle tone) of a diet whey protein shake. This is supposed to help me to recover quicker, and tone the muscles, and also contains green tea and flaxseed etc for metabolic boosting. 

I came into it very open minded with the thought that if it worked then great!, But it's not something that I could overdose or damage myself on. 
I also thought that it would be difficult to quantify the results because as a result of starting to use the supplements I will naturally be more careful with my diet and have added motivation when I train in order to see better results. 

3-4 weeks in I'm feeling in great shape. I'm not sure as yet how much (if anything) of that is down to the supplements. I'll continue using them until I've used them up and I'll see what shape I'm in then and whether I feel I would have reached those levels anyhow. On Friday I recorded my fastest ever commutes to and from work (I log everything!) and most significantly I don't seem to feel as sore the days after hard rides. 

I'm not saying that they're not a placebo, but I will give them a fair go and post back with a truthful summary for anyone who's interested.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (14 Jul 2013)

lejogger said:


> This is interesting for me because I've actually just started taking on some supplements over the last month or so. I sought advice from a physiotherapist friend (he encouraged me) and I bought products he recommended that were significantly cheaper than what you pay at holland and Barrett et al. I'm not a nutritional professional but the benefits I believe are as below:
> 
> Before exercise (football or a ride of significant distance or intensity) I will have half the quoted dose of Amino energy supplement. Basically it's got lots of caffeine in, as well as green tea and obviously amino acids. The combination is supposed to make me train harder (the caffeine most likely - I don't like coffee anyway) helps me strip away fat (green tea - I don't have much to lose but we'd all like to be trimmer) and amino acids are the building blocks of proteins and also kick starts your metabolism.
> 
> ...


What supplements are you taking? This post lacks context without


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> What supplements are you taking? This post lacks context without


Before: http://www.onacademy.co.uk/essential-amino-energy

After:
http://www.phd-fitness.co.uk/store/p/38751/1/PhD-Nutrition---Diet-Whey-1Kg.html#.UeJA5qa9LCQ


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (14 Jul 2013)

lejogger said:


> Before: http://www.onacademy.co.uk/essential-amino-energy
> 
> After:
> http://www.phd-fitness.co.uk/store/p/38751/1/PhD-Nutrition---Diet-Whey-1Kg.html#.UeJA5qa9LCQ


And what exercise? Non-discounted PHD is very much overpriced. Can get 2.5kg for not much more from myprotein/bulkpowders amongst others.

I'm struggling to see why a cyclist(we are on cyclechat afterall) would need a pre-WO


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> And what exercise? Non-discounted PHD is very much overpriced. Can get 2.5kg for not much more from myprotein/bulkpowders amongst others.


I paid just over £30 for both. 
If I decide to continue I'll be able to get it cheaper in larger quantities... Because I'm only taking smaller doses its lasting a while anyway. 

My riding is high intensity. Eg my commutes on Friday were at 22mph average carrying a rucksack and with lots of stop start. Circa 10 miles each way - enough to burn significant calories. I took the 1/2 dose of amino in the morning as a kickstart and then the half dose of phd when I got home to aid recovery. 

I'll do the same before and after a football match (90 mins) on a Monday but I also cycle there and back. I'll do the same before and after the club run today. Same dose as club run will be longer but lower intensity than my solo rides. 

I won't use them unless I'm exercising.


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## GrasB (14 Jul 2013)

Taking a small amount of protein before a ride helps a bit, it's a last few % thing. Post ride protein intake is more beneficial.

Taking protein after exercise helps with muscle repair regardless of taking in enough dietary protein. One thing you can consider is changing the way you consume so your protein with your normal diet is just after exercise. For me this means having what amounts to vegetarian meals & post exercise 'protein snacks'. Scrambled eggs, cold cooked chicken pieces or even a simple glass of milk can be consumed to help supply protein when the body needs it very quickly after finishing your exercise. The key here is to consume the protein as quickly as possible after exercise. In this regard a lower quality protein source consumed within 5 min of getting off the bike is better than consuming from a high quality source say 15-20 min after. 

I use whey protein shakes after harder or longer 'hot' (over 23C) rides because it is very easy to make up & consume when exhausted (it takes 30s to lob everything in a blender & mix it up). For recovery rides or longer tempo rides which are 'cold' (read under 18C) I'll tend to have food-stuff based protein, it's not about cost, as T.M.H.N.E.T said if you look at it in terms of g protein per £1 there's very little cost difference to the non-premium brand whey 'supplements' (e.g. whey from myprotein.co.uk) & 'real' food. In fact because I can't easily transport cooked meat to work in summer from home, due to ride length & heat, whey products actually work out cheaper because quality pre-cooked supermarket meat is quite expensive.


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> I'm struggling to see why a cyclist(we are on cyclechat afterall) would need a pre-WO



How many cyclists load up on strong coffee in the cafe before a club run and stick energy bars galore in their back pockets? It's just the same thing surely?

It depends on what sort of cyclist you are. Is your cycling a means of getting to work? A pootle? Or is it part of a more intensive exercise regime to increase fitness and performance? My commutes are usually ridden at 90-95% intensity so a supplement that gives me a bit of a boost to work a bit harder, is a bonus and hopefully helps me to get more out of the ride


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (14 Jul 2013)

lejogger said:


> How many cyclists load up on strong coffee in the cafe before a club run and stick energy bars galore in their back pockets? It's just the same thing surely?


Not quite. You'll probably find that those cyclists are heavy consumers of coffee anyway, which is more to do with withdrawal than stimulant benefit.

Energy bars/gels are a different product with much different ingredients.



> It depends on what sort of cyclist you are. Is your cycling a means of getting to work? A pootle?


Very much so. A 10mi canal pootle isn't the same level as 80mi/5000ft/19mph average - the energy and dietry demands are going to differ significantly.



> Or is it part of a more intensive exercise regime to increase fitness and performance?


Depends on the regime. Stuff like ON Amino Energy is generally aimed at gym based exercise (you may have noticed the tingling feeling?)



> My commutes are usually ridden at 90-95% intensity so a supplement that gives me a bit of a boost to work a bit harder, is a bonus and hopefully helps me to get more out of the ride


You could probably gain more by simply riding fasted. But that depends on the overall goal.


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## Louch (14 Jul 2013)

lejogger said:


> How many cyclists load up on strong coffee in the cafe before a club run and stick energy bars galore in their back pockets? It's just the same thing surely?
> 
> It depends on what sort of cyclist you are. Is your cycling a means of getting to work? A pootle? Or is it part of a more intensive exercise regime to increase fitness and performance? My commutes are usually ridden at 90-95% intensity so a supplement that gives me a bit of a boost to work a bit harder, is a bonus and hopefully helps me to get more out of the ride



Protein doesn't give a boost in same way the caffeine or carb enegry bars do though, it's more for repair than performance. If you are taking it with milk, it's the carbs in that you are burning , and I could only see the protein hindering as your body tries to bak it down, whilst maintaining your high average speed.


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

Louch said:


> Protein doesn't give a boost in same way the caffeine or carb enegry bars do though, it's more for repair than performance. If you are taking it with milk, it's the carbs in that you are burning , and I could only see the protein hindering as your body tries to bak it down, whilst maintaining your high average speed.


No milk, I take both with water only, and 
I wouldn't take the whey protein before exercise.


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## lejogger (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> Not quite. You'll probably find that those cyclists are heavy consumers of coffee anyway, which is more to do with withdrawal than stimulant benefit.
> 
> Energy bars/gels are a different product with much different ingredients.
> 
> ...


Even with a half dose I notice the tingling... It's a little disconcerting. 

Don't get me wrong, I'm not an staunch advocate or trying to sell anything to anyone. I was sold (on giving it a go) on the basis that I'm doing x level of exercise anyway, so ensuring I have correct supplement nutrition just capitalises on that - almost as if I'm not making the most of my workouts otherwise. 

I don't have false or high expectations... I'm just willing to give it a try before making up my mind either way. 

The protein is low calorie and I'm only taking a minimal dose around exercise so my weight shouldn't be affected. Any extra protein etc that the body can't process just gets passed so the worst that can happen is I pay £30 for a placebo or a plateaued performance.


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## Ness (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> And what exercise? Non-discounted PHD is very much overpriced. Can get 2.5kg for not much more from myprotein/bulkpowders amongst others.
> 
> I'm struggling to see why a cyclist(we are on cyclechat afterall) would need a pre-WO


 
And hypocritical at that.

Who are you to say what someone can or can't spend their money on.


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## Shaun (14 Jul 2013)

Hint: Don't post rude replies and your posts won't be rudely deleted or _edited_!!


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## amaferanga (14 Jul 2013)

Someone who is only riding 16-20 miles a few times a week should not need protein supplements!

If you're training HARD (intervals, etc.) and/or racing and you want all the help that you can get to recover so you can train HARD again the next day, then a protein shake MIGHT help. 

I can't believe anyone would say that protein shakes will make any difference for a recreational cyclist who rides less than 100 miles a week.


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## Ness (14 Jul 2013)

Shaun said:


> Hint: Don't post rude replies and your posts won't be rudely deleted or _edited_!!


 
Oh I get it. It's a clique thing.

One of your "friends" can be rude and offensive, but I can't.

Just telling it like it is. If your "friend" acts like a dick, he's going to get called a dick. But I guess I haven't made enough posts to have earned the right to say it yet. 

I didn't realise it was that type of forum. My bad.


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## Louch (14 Jul 2013)

This is first time I have seen anyone called a dick on here. You may call your friends dicks, but you need familiarity before throwing insults around with anyone. And not over protein shakes .


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## Shaun (14 Jul 2013)

Ness said:


> I didn't realise it was that type of forum. My bad.


 
It isn't. It's the sort of forum where calling someone a dick is not considered a reasonable reply.

Use knowledge, experience and reasoned counter-argument if you disagree with someone, _not _personal insults.

Thanks,
Shaun

P.S. Use the 'Report' link if you feel something needs addressing by the moderator team.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (14 Jul 2013)

lejogger said:


> Even with a half dose I notice the tingling... It's a little disconcerting.


I knew you would recognise that. It's the effect of the beta-alanine which buffers lactate buildup. In gym environments that can equal substantially more reps in the set.

If you're curious enough - have a quick google of the ingredients list. End of the day if you like it you're going to buy it regardless - although I'm not by any means trying to convince you otherwise.


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## T.M.H.N.E.T (14 Jul 2013)

Ness said:


> And hypocritical at that.


Not at all. The post you quoted refers to two different things.



> Who are you to say what someone can or can't spend their money on.


I didn't, I suggested that a greater quantity could be purchased for much less.


I detect a moderator intervention. Amazing as I've been perfectly civil unlike others


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## bicyclos (14 Jul 2013)

Experiment to see what works for you, I take powders and pills especially if I am cycling long distances so I don't cramp. What I take works for me and get me through a physcial job let alone cycling. A very good diet helps as well ie, plenty of veg and fruit. 
The suppliments I take are

Dextrose monohydrate
creatine monohydrate
vit C powder
magnesium
whey protien (natural)
zinc
B6
B12 (methylocobalamin)
vit D
and my own Ginger, Cumin and Corriander capsules.

I have not had flu or a bad cold in nearly 10yrs with suplimentation and can spike my drinks with some of the above for the hills....


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## Ness (14 Jul 2013)

Go on then, I'll bite as it's late and I'm bored.


T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> You are actually so wrong I feel sorry for you. Protein is the building block of all muscle fibre. Exercise tears these fibres. The issue is actually the sport undertaken as cycling isn't a major promoter of muscular hypertrophy.
> 
> So actually - protein (regardless of source) will contribute to muscle fibre repair or indeed growth (therefore legs) but it depends how you train them.,
> 
> ...


 
Very grown up Richard.


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## Ness (14 Jul 2013)

T.M.H.N.E.T said:


> I detect a moderator intervention. Amazing as I've been perfectly civil unlike others


 
Wow. You came to that conclusion on your own?

Even though it clearly states from a Mod that my post has been edited?

Literally ROFL


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## albion (14 Jul 2013)

I'm similar to bicylos for my 100 mile rides.

In that I often use a Vitamin C tab to flavour my water.
However I take it with a pinch of salt and lots of food on my 100 mile+ rides.

I'm also of the conclusion that the need for recovery food can be avoided by proper nutrition on the actual ride.


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## Ningishzidda (15 Jul 2013)

Bacon, sausage, eggs and beans on toast.

A £40 tub of powder comes to just over £1 per portion; and that's where it scores.
With Crusha, it also makes a decent 'Instant whip' or 'Angel delight' for afters.


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## jowwy (15 Jul 2013)

Ningishzidda said:


> Bacon, sausage, eggs and beans on toast.
> 
> A £40 tub of powder comes to just over £1 per portion; and that's where it scores.
> With Crusha, it also makes a decent 'Instant whip' or 'Angel delight' for afters.


crusha is foul - bacon, sausage, eggs and beans on toast sounds lovely though

hungry now


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## albion (15 Jul 2013)

"A £40 tub of powder comes to just over £1 per portion"

Am sure a bowl of gruel can be had for 5p


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