# Bafang BBS01b ETM vs Tongsheng TSDZ2 kits



## savannah3107 (13 Nov 2019)

Been umming and ahhing over electrifying one of my bikes and considering the Bafang BBS01b ETM (36v) and Tongsheng TSDZ2 (48v) kits does anyone have experience of both?

In particular I'd like to know how they compare for noise, drag when going above cut off speed or when motor is off, reliability / availability of spares and very importantly cadence. I'll want the assistance to be at a decent level at 70-90rpm. I had an old Panasonic motored bike a while back and really didn't like have to change to a harder gear to maximise the motor assistance going uphill.

I'll not need / want a throttle.

I'd be buying in the UK as I'd want the backup. I don't think I'm interested in tweaking software and would be looking to run stock set ups, certainly until warranty ends.

I understand the Tongshen has a torque sensor and that is likely to feel more natural, though I'm not sure if the extra complication is worth it for a kit.

I might still decide to go for a ready made Shimano Steps ebike, which I know would likely be more reliable and more refined, but one of the things I really like about standard bikes is how everything can be relatively easily replaced and a conversion would keep that aspect.


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## CXRAndy (14 Nov 2019)

You will pay through the nose to get the kit from a UK supplies. 

Chinese websites are by far the cheapest for Tongscheng and Bafang. That is what makes the kits so attractive to fit. 

I have fitted a TSDZ2 custom kit, sourced from the USA and battery from Chinese supplier. Cant comment on feel of the standard kit, with custom software the bike feels almost natural like a non powered bike. except effort is significantly reduced, if you want it

If your cadence is around 70-90 then most standard kits will be fine. 

A higher voltage allows for lower current which reduces heat in the motor circuits, go for 48v system.

If you're determined to use UK for getting the kit, it might be beneficial to you having a designed ebike


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## the snail (14 Nov 2019)

The biggest difference is the torque sensor in the Tongshen - if you want a more bicycle-like experience, that's the one to go for. If you want to ride with less effort then the Bafang is better. The Bafang has been around longer, is a bit simpler and more reliable. The Tongshen has a couple of issues reliability wise - the blue plastic gear can fail if you're not careful, and the sprag clutch is another weak point (failed on mine pretty quickly, although it was a fairly easy fix). For that reason, I may buy from a UK supplier next time and pay a bit extra. I do like the Tongsheng kit though - it works really well, has a good range, and it great fun to ride. I believe there are some other mid-drives coming on the market, but I don't know anything about them.


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## Pale Rider (14 Nov 2019)

The Panasonic bikes you mention were famously reliable but not very pokey.

I reckon any of your choices will be an improvement in that respect.

A Steps bike would have ordinary bike components either side of the bottom bracket in the same way a conversion would.

Warranty on a Steps bike would be almost certainly superior.

The local bike shop wouldn't have much of a clue, same as with the kits, but they would at least have access to established service from Madison, who handle Shimano in the UK.

Buying a kit from abroad would leave you largely on your own.

You might get some back up from a UK supplier, but I wouldn't expect miracles.

If you want a Steps bike, you could do worse than Whyte which is a well thought of UK brand.

That also gives you warranties from two companies which is some extra reassurance.


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## savannah3107 (15 Nov 2019)

Thanks for the input, helps to add more detail to the choice. I tried a couple of Whyte STEPS bikes and a Ridgeback one. I preferred the Ridgeback which may have been as much to do with where I was riding (Edinburgh City for the Whyte and Perthshire countryside for the Ridgeback). The Ridgeback has the added advantage that I can get it from LBS, rather than 50 miles away for the Whytes.

Of course what I'd actually like to do is try the BBS and Tongshen kits for a week each on one of my bikes and then make a decision


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## voyager (16 Nov 2019)

We have purchased a couple of tongsheng tsdz2 for our trikes, one with and the other without throttle and brakes , both work well in the mountain area of Wales . Woosh in Essex supplied them at a good price , they also stock bafang units .
Middie drives were chosen as they have the advantage of using the gears on these long or steep "hills".


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## Mike_P (17 Nov 2019)

I have a TSDZ2 bought from Germany on eBay far cheaper than available here, more so with an ebay discount offer, and also because it is the 36v version so a bit on the noisy side apparently compared to the 48v version. The blue gear issue can be resolved by replacing it with a metal one. The one issue I have with it is the lights, if you fit ebike lights, are switched on by the on off switch and it is far too easy to switch off the battery when attempting to switch the lights on. Also mine is very unhappy starting off upgrade with lights on and usually shuts down so I have now fitted it with a normal front light and have a rear light on the back of the helmet so the ebike lights are left off until a level or downhill stretch is reached. Once powered you have to wait 30 seconds before turning the pedals. From what I have read its a far simpler installation than the Bafang but with either you need to watch your rear derailleur cable and whether it needs rerouting. The TSDZ2 uniquely allows for a front derailleur to be fitted so I have a 38-48 on it; the hybrid originally having a 28-38-48.


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## voyager (17 Nov 2019)

We fitted a 42/36 on the trike running a 700c on the rear .
problem with trikes is all the cables need extensions.
The TSDZ2 is easy to convert to double by removing the single and chain guard and fitting 2 new 110bcd 5 bolt rings.
The manual states do not touch the pedals for 15sec after switch on to allow the torque sensor to calibrate itself . The speed sensors position I have been told is critical ( gap ) .


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## savannah3107 (17 Nov 2019)

TSDZ2 is becoming the front runner. I think I'd prefer a more natural feel and like the idea of easily running 2 x chainrings. I guess with the trike there's no chain alignment issues as the chain run is so much longer.

Next decision will be which bike to add it too.


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## voyager (17 Nov 2019)

With the difference of £25 , Personally I would say go for the throttle option , Then you can have a throttle later , there is NO upgrade path if you go for the non throttle option ( internal wiring is different) .


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## Mike_P (17 Nov 2019)

The one problem I had with a double chainring was correctly aligning a front derailleur as the chainrings are set further from the seat tube than normal and was almost in the need to do some metalwork situation. I did however find a Origin 8 adapter mount would work simply because the hybrid I fitted the motor to had a smaller seat tube than the 34.9mm tube the adapter is designed for and by cutting a Shimano front mech adapter clamp so that the Origin 8 was against the seat tube it could pad the excess size of the hole elsewhere. If the hybrid had a 34.9mm seat tube an exercise in metalwork would have been needed.
Mine came with the throttle and brake levers but I never used them and sold them on eBay, sure l read throttles make an ebike illegal while the motor cutting brake levers are only needed if you are daft enough to carry on pedalling whilst braking.


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## Mike_P (9 Jan 2020)

Fed up with the VLCD5 display that comes with the TSDZ2 having its power switch doubling as the light switch - try to switch lights on and power the motor off - switch back on while stopped pedalling for the requisite time - try to switch lights on and power the motor off...
so ordered a correctly set up for the TSDZ2 SW102 display from Eco eBikes in the USA - unfortunately I ordered it looking using IE and the web page did not fully load so it appeared as if it was supplied with all the possible necessary cables whereas you also have to order the right one.  The TSDZ2 is also been poorly since yesterday - only working occasionally - speed showing okay but I have had some display issues with the VLCD5 with it not showing speed or battery level so was hoping it was just a fault with that which the SW102 would correct.


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## CXRAndy (10 Jan 2020)

Mike_P said:


> Fed up with the VLCD5 display that comes with the TSDZ2 having its power switch doubling as the light switch - try to switch lights on and power the motor off - switch back on while stopped pedalling for the requisite time - try to switch lights on and power the motor off...
> so ordered a correctly set up for the TSDZ2 SW102 display from Eco eBikes in the USA - unfortunately I ordered it looking using IE and the web page did not fully load so it appeared as if it was supplied with all the possible necessary cables whereas you also have to order the right one.  The TSDZ2 is also been poorly since yesterday - only working occasionally - speed showing okay but I have had some display issues with the VLCD5 with it not showing speed or battery level so was hoping it was just a fault with that which the SW102 would correct.



Are you running standard firmware or the Open source? Open source has debugging feature to help pin down faults


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## Mike_P (10 Jan 2020)

CXRAndy said:


> Are you running standard firmware or the Open source? Open source has debugging feature to help pin down faults


Only the standard, not convinced I could install the open source without blundering somewhere. The standard does have a maintenance screen that shows the torque sensor details which is probably what is the fault. Will investigate it tomorrow.


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## CXRAndy (11 Jan 2020)

Mike_P said:


> Only the standard, not convinced I could install the open source without blundering somewhere. The standard does have a maintenance screen that shows the torque sensor details which is probably what is the fault. Will investigate it tomorrow.



I didn't feel that confident about doing the upgrade myself, so bought my kit pre installed. 

Saying that I used to install modified Android firmware on my phones, just not so interested these days


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