# What have you bought for the tent today?



## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

YACF has one of these threads as a sticky. Hope this one works as well.

Soooooooo, today I've bought...
A Trekology Aluft UL80 mat and a Trekology Aluft 2.0 pillow and a Flexigear pump to inflate them with.
The mat and pillow are well known in camping circles and generally well thought of. I'll be testing those myself during the week garden camping.
The pump on the other hand isn't as well known from what I gather.
£25 from Amazon, its a Chinese thing which uses a 3600 mah built-in rechargeable lithium battery. Even has a proper slider switch. None of that touch button crap.
It's a wee bit noisy but it's powerful. Had the pillow up in 15 secs and the mat fully inflated in 40 secs. Apparently it'll run for 40 mins on a full charge from a supplied micro usb cable, but no plug. Small too and weighs 150g. It comes with some various adapters for blowing things up and a little storage bag. Also available in grey (no more it seems) white or orange.
Handy if you have breathing difficulties or your site is at the top of a big steep hill. Or if like me, you're just plain lazy


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

First off, well wear and I hope you get lots of use out of them - and share some of the stories with us!

I have visions of next year and Vantage Snr. looking on jealously as you set up your new tent and new gear

I dislike your use of the word "lazy". I prefer to use "conservationist" - you're simply conserving your energy for more important tasks like pouring Guinness into a cooking pot! 

What encouraged you to change/upgrade the sleeping mat? 
I considered that before my trip and couldn't reconcile myself to the ultra thin materials being used. In one store I tried lying down on one (they thought I was mad) but the noise was really irritating and "rustly" in nature - not the kind of sound conducive to a good night's sleep in strange places.
A lot of them had a bag for inflation which just seemed like a lot of faff. 
A pump is a good idea but I've never understood why there isn't an adapter for a bike pump to inflate them. Can you use your new pump to inflate tyres?

Looking forward to hearing about the garden camping. I'm sure I read something about that before 

Happy Camping!


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## chriswoody (13 Oct 2020)

After years of using rolled up clothes, I got to the point where it was giving me back and neck ache, so I bought a pillow earlier this year.

It's a sea to summit ultralight and is really comfy, I should have done it years ago. It has velcro tabs that lock onto my sea to summit ultralight sleepmat so it doesn't move whilst I'm sleeping.

The stuff sac for the sleeping mat inflates both the mat and the pillow, it takes a little getting used to the technique, but once you have it, it's a real breeze to inflate them.


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## chriswoody (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> A pump is a good idea but I've never understood why there isn't an adapter for a bike pump to inflate them. Can you use your new pump to inflate tyres?



Talking of using your pump, I've not come across mats and suchlike doing it, but I did read about a new Vango tent that uses an airbeam instead of a pole, which inflates through a Schrader valve. I was pretty intrigued but couldn't find much on the net about them.


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

chriswoody said:


> Talking of using your pump, I've not come across mats and suchlike doing it, but I did read about a new Vango tent that uses an airbeam instead of a pole, which inflates through a Schrader valve. I was pretty intrigued but couldn't find much on the net about them.


It's a couple of years since I did any serious looking, and the thought never crossed my mind until @Vantage post. 
I know there's a US tent for bike touring/bikepacking (shorter pole segments and a hook for a helmet) and MSR did a tent with a "garage" for a bike. There's obviously a recognition that touring on a bike is a market segment.


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## Ajax Bay (13 Oct 2020)

chriswoody said:


> new Vango tent that uses an airbeam instead of a pole, which inflates through a Schrader valve


Nice idea (Vango Airbeam Flux 200) but weighs a ton (well twice and more as much as a compact lightweight tent with poles). USP is that it's easy and quick to pitch (so meets the Hobbes 'energy conservation' test (see above)).


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## matticus (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> There's obviously a recognition that touring on a bike is a market segment.


Most people at a campsite have driven there. So I would think that a large number of lightweight/small tents would be bought by cycle-campers - I get the impression that only alpine climbers care more about light weight.


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

matticus said:


> Most people at a campsite have driven there. So I would think that a large number of lightweight/small tents would be bought by cycle-campers - I get the impression that only alpine climbers care more about light weight.


I'm sorry, I'm struggling to understand your point?

I think it's interesting that a company like MSR design and release a bike touring tent but don't carry the logic through to the rest of their range, for example, having a sleeping mat inflatable with a bike pump.
It would be a marketing dream - tent, mat, pillow all from the one brand. A one stop shop for the aspiring bike tourist.
I'm not saying that it's something I would go for. I mean their competitor has a tent with a hook for a helmet - not something I'd think is particularly important. 

An adapter to inflate a mat with a pump would be very attractive to me. My "old" thermarest is not compatible with the stuff sack as a pump and in zero degrees or colder I have to balance the potential damage done internally by adding to the self inflation or sleeping on a less than fully inflated mat.

I'm not an engineer but it seems like there could be a market for an add-on device, even for "conservationists"


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## matticus (13 Oct 2020)

I'm just saying that the proportion of tent users travelling by bike may actually have *increased* in recent years! 

So yeah - probably a significant market segment (at the lightweight end). 



> An adapter to inflate a mat with a [bike] pump would be very attractive to me.


Yup, makes sense to this cyclist!


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

Howdy Mr Hobbes!
Why the change? Well, my shoulders really. They're knackered. Dunno why, the doc said it was because I hadn't worked for so long that those particular muscles weren't being used. But its not like I'm sitting around on my arse all day. I keep myself busy. Pams already made the obvious jokes about that 
I'm a side sleeper so all mats so far have had the issue of my shoulders hitting the ground and being in even more pain the following day. The previous mat, a Klymit Insulated Static V Lite (why can't they use shorter names for these things?) had an r rating of 4.2 (I think) but it was only about 2 inches thick so my hip and shoulders were feeling the cold as they rested on the ground. And despite the side baffles which were supposed to keep me from sliding off the mat, I slid off the mat. Pfft.
Soooooooooo, I was reading someone's review of the pillow and they were saying how it was big and soft and perfect for their shoulder issues. Ding dong! So I looked into it and the mat was amazon's recommendation (as they do). I looked into that too and saw a YouTube review from some big guy who also had you guessed it, bad shoulders! He (and others) commented on how comfy the mat is and especially mentioned how the curve in its profile kept them from sliding off. Plus, it rolls up smaller than the Klymit and weighs less. It's damn long though! I'm only 5'4! 
The pump. I'll start by saying that inflating a mat and pillow leaves me feeling lightheaded/dizzy and is not a pleasant feeling at all. Specially at the end of a long cycling day. 
I made my own inflating sack similar to those of thermarest/exped etc for the Klymit and decathlon pillows. It worked quite well. A Karrimor drybag with a hole in the bottom and a bit of water hose glued and taped into place to fit the air valves of mat and pillow. 




I suppose I could have adapted it to fit the new bed and pillow but tbh, I just couldn't be arsed  I looked at those offered by exped etc. Pricy? Jeeeeeeeez! £35 for a nylon bag of air. F that. Trekologies own bag was cheaper but really small. Coleman and others made pumps, but alot of reviews said they were cheap crap and prone to breaking. Then I saw this little Chinese one with quite a few good reviews.
Unfortunately it has nowhere near enough muscle to inflate a bike tyre. I actually did wonder about that possibility. Never mind. 
Bike pumps and sleep mats. Nope. They don't put out anywhere near enough air. I made an adaptor to use my bike pump on an earlier pillow. It took forever.
I suppose a good track pump for volume rather than pressure might do it, but who in their right mind lugs a track pump in their panniers?


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> I dislike your use of the word "lazy". I prefer to use "conservationist" - you're simply conserving your energy for more important tasks like pouring Guinness into a cooking pot!



Speaking of pots, I've bought some new ones too 
These are smaller than the ones I brought along on the tour as those were just too big really. 
It's a 2 pot set in titanium which cools down quickly so I don't burn my mouth off when drinking coffee and the fact that I can use one as a mug means it's less likely to topple over and spill said coffee all over the damn floor... again. 
The other one will hold the Guinness


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> It's a couple of years since I did any serious looking, and the thought never crossed my mind until @Vantage post.
> I know there's a US tent for bike touring/bikepacking (shorter pole segments and a hook for a helmet) and MSR did a tent with a "garage" for a bike. There's obviously a recognition that touring on a bike is a market segment.



Wild Country (Terra Nova) designed their latest Zephyros 2 Compact with the cyclist in mind. They specifically stated that they shortened the poles and subsequent pack size so it could be stuffed into panniers.


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## Blue Hills (13 Oct 2020)

Yesterday, yet another light drybag - extra large for sleeping gear on the top of the rack - surely have enough by now.


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## Blue Hills (13 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> Speaking of pots, I've bought some new ones too
> These are smaller than the ones I brought along on the tour as those were just too big really.
> It's a 2 pot set in titanium which cools down quickly so I don't burn my mouth off when drinking coffee and the fact that I can use one as a mug means it's less likely to topple over and spill said coffee all over the damn floor... again.
> The other one will hold the Guinness


mm - careful with the titanium thing vantage - it's my understanding that it's a poor conductor for cooking - I'm no scientist but that may be kinda related to its fast cooling. That design is very common in more humble materials - i got one for a fiver from Trespass.


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## Blue Hills (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> First off, well wear and I hope you get lots of use out of them - and share some of the stories with us!
> 
> I have visions of next year and Vantage Snr. looking on jealously as you set up your new tent and new gear
> 
> ...


i share your suspicion of ultralight stuff hobbes. One of the main bikes I use for tours (but nothing like your epics) is a quality bit of vintage steel but isn't light. Some bloke in a bike shop I popped in on one tour lifted it for some reason and, thinking he was being cute, told me it was very heavy and I needed I new bike. I shot him what I hope was a withering look.

good thread start vantage - look forward to some interesting (and I suspect some bonkers) stuff turning up - have thought for years that outdoor kit shops are the last refuge of the mad inventor.


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## IaninSheffield (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> An adapter to inflate a mat with a pump would be very attractive to me.


This has taxed me too. Having switched to an inflatable (Alpkit Numo), from a 'self-inflating' mat, to save both weight and volume, I was delighted with its performance. However, it really does take some puff at the end of a long day! Wouldn't it be great if I could use the bike pump?
Your post prompted me to go looking once more and I came across this adapter; there seems to be plenty of similar offerings from which to choose. Schrader fit, so that might make a difference, as indeed would the valve fitting on your bed. But my hopes started to rise ... right up until @Vantage 's follow up:


Vantage said:


> Bike pumps and sleep mats. Nope. They don't put out anywhere near enough air.


Makes sense of course


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> Why the change? Well, my shoulders really. They're knackered.


Hey, thanks for the really long and detailed reply. As a self confessed shorta*se you have the advantage of being able to use the extra height of the mat without hitting the side/end of the tent. 



Vantage said:


> The previous mat, a Klymit Insulated Static V Lite


That's really interesting (and has given me an idea). I was seriously considering a Klymit mat as I read they were designed specifically for side sleepers, but I couldn't find one in the flesh to text.



Vantage said:


> Unfortunately it has nowhere near enough muscle to inflate a bike tyre.


And there goes my retirement in luxury and being the toast of bike tourists everywhere!


Vantage said:


> but who in their right mind lugs a track pump in their panniers?


Ah, carry whatever you need to set off and enjoy yourself! I once read of a chap bringing along his own toilet seat (along with many other "unusual" items. There have been times when I wished I had his foresight!


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> The other one will hold the Guinness


Ah, but will it hold a pint or are you at the stage in life where a half is enough?


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> i share your suspicion of ultralight stuff hobbes.


I'd like to clarify...
I have nothing against ultralight gear and I'm very conscious of the fact that many members here use that gear in ways and places I never could.

It's just not for me and my particular style of touring. A rustly mat is good for a while, but sleeping on it night after night for months at a time? Not for me - I like my sleep😊

Similarly, my mat will get used in places that mats don't normally go. It's got to be good for the next night too! 

There's the psychological aspect too - my current mat was well tested before I set off. I don't want to waste time worrying if a new and improved one is going to work tonight.

And there's always the cat thing - there aren't too many things worse than your carefully researched (and expensive) tent becoming a plaything for cats! 

Lastly, I'm a tight *******


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> Ah, but will it hold a pint or are you at the stage in life where a half is enough?



Half a pint? Of Guinness? Don't be stupid! 
What kind of girly wuss of a man drinks a half pint of Guinness? Any man caught doing that should be hung, drawn and quartered then set on fire so people can piss on him to put it out.


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> Half a pint? Of Guinness? Don't be stupid!
> What kind of girly wuss of a man drinks a half pint of Guinness? Any man caught doing that should be hung, drawn and quartered then set on fire so people can piss on him to put it out.


Well, when it comes to setting things on fire........


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> mm - careful with the titanium thing vantage - it's my understanding that it's a poor conductor for cooking - I'm no scientist but that may be kinda related to its fast cooling. That design is very common in more humble materials - i got one for a fiver from Trespass.



You're right Mr Blue Hills. The heat from a stove doesn't spread very evenly across the base of a titanium pot. I discovered that whilst out with dad. My beans, despite being regularly stirred became superglued to said pot. Having said that, they didn't stick so much that scraping them off required a hammer drill. I can live with that


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> Well, when it comes to setting things on fire........



Feck off


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## Blue Hills (13 Oct 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> I'd like to clarify...
> I have nothing against ultralight gear and I'm very conscious of the fact that many members here use that gear in ways and places I never could.
> 
> It's just not for me and my particular style of touring. A rustly mat is good for a while, but sleeping on it night after night for months at a time? Not for me - I like my sleep😊
> ...


Mm - nothing really to clarify, barely a lightweight fag paper between our views/positions hobbes.


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## HobbesOnTour (13 Oct 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> Mm - nothing really to clarify, barely a lightweight fag paper between our views/positions hobbes.


I was clarifying for the benefit of the ultra lighters amongst us.


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## Vantage (13 Oct 2020)

Weight weeny here. 
I didn't used to be. I'd laugh at those plonkers who'd spend hundreds to shave a half gram from their already lightweight camp gear. However, that feckin stroke happened. 
It's not just pedalling the bike up hills that gets easier the lighter it is, it's carrying the stuff too. Less strain on racks and bags etc but also when one needs to lift the heavy barsteward across stiles, pushing it up hills, mounting it onto the cars bike rack etc. 
My Wayfarer was upwards of 80lbs when I toured and that's not a nice weight to push up a wet grassy hill. Loading the bike onto the car prior to setting off was causing enough pain in my shoulders that I near dropped it. Pam had to do it for me. 
I suspect that why most weight weenies do it. It just makes moving it around that little bit easier. It does come at the cost of expense and comfort though.


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## Blue Hills (17 Oct 2020)

Karrimor folding mat - £8 in Sports Direct. Similar _looking _to something from thermarest (Zlite?) - not sure if the thermarest is functionally better. Am hopeful that by combining this with one of my lightish self-inflating mats I may be able to do some short winter microadventures - am a great believer in "layering" and not having duplicate kit for different seasons/applications, It's a bit wider than I would like so may look a bit ungainly on the rack but it fits inside an XL lightish Karrimor drybag I got a few days earlier.
Re the layering, the label proudly proclaims that it's 5 season and good for temperatures of up to 80 centigrade and down to minus 20 centigrade. Sod the mat, if I survive the top one I'm putting myself down as a medical miracle and you folk can bow down before me.


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## Oldhippy (17 Oct 2020)

Many years ago I got an army surplus stainless steel pan/wok type pan from a military fair for a quid. It has never let me down and been dropped, fallen off the bike and bounced down the road but has remained useable. Best pound I ever spent.


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## Vantage (17 Oct 2020)

Rite, update on the Trekology Aluft UL80 and Aluft 2.0 pillow. Tested 'em both last night under the stars (technically under a tent but you know what I mean).
Temperatures last night in Bolton according to the met office dipped as low as 4 degrees. My bag has a comfort rating of 10 degrees and an extreme of 0 degrees. The mat has an independent R value of between 1.6 and 2.2.
I was cold. I even dug out my emergency foil blanket to put between the bag and mat which helped me warm up enough to sleep. This mat is definitely not for cold weather.
It was comfy though. I had to blow in a bit more air via my lungs so my body wasn't touching the ground but even then it was still nice and soft.
At 190cm, its a bit longer than most mats and only just fitted into my tent. Some reviewers have said they thought it narrow but that's not my feeling. None of my limbs were left dangling over the edge for the monster under the bed to chew on. Speaking of edges, the raised ones on this mat apparently keep you from falling off it. I'm not sure how realistic an expectation that is, but the tent was on a slight slope in my garden and I remained on the mat.
Other reviewers have also stated that the mat can rustle like crisp packets and be noisy. I can tell you now that my ears are sensitive enough to make little sounds almost painful to hear and I didn't think this mat to be unusually noisy compared to other mats out there.
It's supplied with its own storage bag and a patch incase the dog/cat/partner tries eating it. The mat rolls up to about the size of a beer can and has an elasticated strap to keep it all in place. The bags size is on the generous side and allows me to also store the pillow inside it.
Speaking of which...
For its size, the pillow is very comfy. I had it pumped up fairly hard so my head wouldn't sink too low but its shape supports my head, neck and to some extent, my shoulders. There were no crunchy type noises from it either. It has a strap which allows it to be fixed to the mat so it doesn't slide all over the place and this further helped by little rubber dimples on the under side. This means the pillow can be placed under the sleeping bag rather than on top which helps keep it clean...no greasy/oily/mucky/bug infested head laying on it. It does come with its own little bag for storage but I find it easier to just shove it in with the mat.
So there ya go.








I said I'd do a review on my new Decathlon tent a while back and whilst I have indeed camped in it a few times, these have all been in calm, dry weather. Any tent can cope with that. Only good ones survive a storm battering so soon as I can, I'll shove it into a storm setting see what happens and then I'll review it. However, I've had to again chop the poles as the amount of strength needed to bend them into their fixings was ridiculous. I've even managed to slightly curve the things from doing that.
And I've changed the guy line attachments. Decathlons method seemed overly complicated and prone to failure to me so I've done away with them and I'm now just using simple knots.
From this




To this





I'm also thinking of replacing the pegs, but more of that when I review it.


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## Blue Hills (17 Oct 2020)

Oldhippy said:


> Many years ago I got an army surplus stainless steel pan/wok type pan from a military fair for a quid. It has never let me down and been dropped, fallen off the bike and bounced down the road but has remained useable. Best pound I ever spent.


Picture?
I rather like stainless steel - simple stuff - very easy to clean - I don't mind a bit of extra weight.
You do have to be careful with military stuff though - some of it, particularly Brit stuff I think, can be DAMN heavy.


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## Blue Hills (17 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> I'm also thinking of replacing the pegs, but more of that when I review it.



Always a good idea to have some nice pegs - you of course only need one decent set however many tents you have.

Despite me poopooing your titanium cookwear I plead guilty to having a small number of titanium pegs (the only titanium I have and will be getting) - I got them from china when they were a bit cheaper - yep I hate china but of course pretty much everything comes from there anyway - the pegs I got are clearly exactly the same ones as sold by Planet X, who clearly don't hand forge them in Rotherham. Have also got some nice strong more humble Y section pegs from china. 
Both of the types could I reckon form a useful splint for a bust rack, though I don't expect my Tubus things to give way.


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## Oldhippy (17 Oct 2020)

I've had to interrupt Mrs Oldhippy making an indoor homemade pub burger dinner to get the photo.


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## Blue Hills (17 Oct 2020)

oo - I really like that - must say i thought maybe you were exaggerating when you said it was like a wok - i just imagined it was a largish frying pan. Have often thought a smallish wok would be great for camping as I eat a lot of stir frys but on camping trips tend not to eat enough veg. Can I ask if you've ever seen any others around?
(PS - very nice of you to let mrs hippy come indoors for the cooking in this increasingly nippy weather)

edit - found this - seems you got a bargain (tho you may be a very old hippy)
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/British-...Cooking-Wok-Pan-2-5L-3L-Grade-A-/372436393342


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## Oldhippy (17 Oct 2020)

I've not seen another I'm afraid.


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## Oldhippy (17 Oct 2020)

She is simultaneously making veggie sausage rolls for work lunches. She is awesome.


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## Blue Hills (17 Oct 2020)

Oldhippy said:


> I've not seen another I'm afraid.


when you have a mo I'd be interested in its weight (my wariness of the brit army, though i love my brit army bivi)


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## Oldhippy (17 Oct 2020)

Bit weighty at just under a kilo.


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## Blue Hills (18 Oct 2020)

Oldhippy said:


> Bit weighty at just under a kilo.


Ah, that's the brit army for you. Thanks for the info.


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## simongt (18 Oct 2020)

Went camping in the Dales a few weeks back and decided that I need a bigger food bowl to nosh from. I still do 'basic camping'; i.e, keep it simple and not take half the house which seem to be the trend nowadays, so mimimal cooking equipment is a must for me. Looked around the local camping shops and on t'net, nothing really suitable at a decent price. Wandered into Poundland and bought - a stainless steel dog bowl - !  Mock ye not; perfect capacity, lightweight, unbreakable and I can cook with it too - ! Result - !


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## uphillstruggler (18 Oct 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> Ah, that's the brit army for you. Thanks for the info.



@Blue Hills IKEA have a kids cooking set that people use bits and pieces from, I’m sure there’s a small frying pan/wok thing in that for pretty cheap.
I’m also keen to see your fabled stove and coffee press set up, I don’t drink proper coffee, I’m just nosey


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## Blue Hills (18 Oct 2020)

uphillstruggler said:


> @Blue Hills IKEA have a kids cooking set that people use bits and pieces from, I’m sure there’s a small frying pan/wok thing in that for pretty cheap.
> I’m also keen to see your fabled stove and coffee press set up, I don’t drink proper coffee, I’m just nosey


not a coffee press - espresso - leave it with me - will find details of key bits and try to take a pic next week - seems OK for thread to highlight favourite stuff bought a while ago.


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## uphillstruggler (18 Oct 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> not a coffee press - espresso - leave it with me - will find details of key bits and try to take a pic next week - seems OK for thread to highlight favourite stuff bought a while ago.



no rush, it’s just out of nosiness


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## Blue Hills (18 Oct 2020)

uphillstruggler said:


> no rush, it’s just out of nosiness



Here you are, it's this, though I paid £3.40

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/362496129040

That's just for the cranky looking thing with the legs.

Which isn't that cranky as the arrangement of the connection to the gas cartridge ensures that it stays a certain way up.

If it doesn't stay that way up it's my understanding that you are likely to get rather alarming flaring from those cheap long gas cartridges unless they are connected to a stove with a pre-heat coil.

In addition to that cranky legged thing I use: 

One of those cheap long gas cartridges (you can see one in the ad pic) - can be had for £1 or not much more if bought in multiples. They last for ages -god knows how many coffees you can make with one.

A small mini (kinda similar to the pocket rocket I think) Vango stove - screws onto cranky thing.

2 cup Bialleti coffee maker on top of stove

Note that this set up is only used for fast coffees on the road - I use it a fair bit on day rides, night rides - @ColinJ has seen it in action. For cooking I use a different set-up and more conventional gas cartridges.

I also have a small windshield but the coffee making process is so fast with this set-up that I tend to just shield it with my body.

Last used this handy set-up for 4 coffees and some fine Lidl cake in a rural underpass on a night ride from London to Southampton.

all pretty compact and no probs to carry for sensible folk who use panniers. May not fit in a racer's back pocket.


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## jay clock (18 Oct 2020)

chriswoody said:


> After years of using rolled up clothes, I got to the point where it was giving me back and neck ache, so I bought a pillow earlier this year.
> 
> It's a sea to summit ultralight and is really comfy, I should have done it years ago. It has velcro tabs that lock onto my sea to summit ultralight sleepmat so it doesn't move whilst I'm sleeping.
> 
> The stuff sac for the sleeping mat inflates both the mat and the pillow, it takes a little getting used to the technique, but once you have it, it's a real breeze to inflate them.


I have a Sea to Summit pillow and it is excellent


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## Vantage (20 Oct 2020)

A newer, warmer, shorter sleeping bag. Warmer in that its rated to 0c rather my old 10c one. Shorter in that it fits my munchkin size perfectly unlike the old one which is about 2ft too long. And it's lighter too! Slightly.


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## IaninSheffield (23 Oct 2020)

chriswoody said:


> Talking of using your pump, I've not come across mats and suchlike doing it, but I did read about a new Vango tent that uses an airbeam instead of a pole, which inflates through a Schrader valve. I was pretty intrigued but couldn't find much on the net about them.





Ajax Bay said:


> Nice idea (Vango Airbeam Flux 200) but weighs a ton (well twice and more as much as a compact lightweight tent with poles). USP is that it's easy and quick to pitch (so meets the Hobbes 'energy conservation' test (see above)).








Saw a Vango Hydrogen air beam expedition tent pitched today. Very impressive ... especially if minimising weight is important - barely over 700g! If you have deep pockets!
I'm not keen on that form factor (or price!), but if they start to expand air beam technology into other styles (and achieve a more affordable price) I might be tempted.
<_Waits for @HobbesOnTour to mention scratchy claws ... _>

Edit: Doh! Forgot to mention it has a Schrader valve for inflation.


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## Fram (24 Oct 2020)

jay clock said:


> I have a Sea to Summit pillow and it is excellent


Ours lost their internal shape thingies and turned into fooballs (after 3 months).


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## Oldhippy (24 Oct 2020)

Can't decide if I like the idea of an inflatable tent. Would definitely want to see it in the flesh and a bigger one.


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## Blue Hills (24 Oct 2020)

Oldhippy said:


> Can't decide if I like the idea of an inflatable tent. Would definitely want to see it in the flesh and a bigger one.


I think I posted about the Vango a while ago.
After some thought I don't think there's a great advantage for the sort of tent you will be putting on a bike rack for one or two folks. Poles for those sort of tents aren't too bulky or heavy.


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## HobbesOnTour (24 Oct 2020)

I can't see a price for that Vango and it seems to suggest using a pump bag to inflate and a bike pump to fine tune the pressure.
To my way of thinking after the material, the poles are the next thing to worry about, so I can see advantages of a pole less tent, all other things being equal.

However, given my propensity to not fasten things properly in the middle of the night it's easy for my mind to conjure up the image of such a tent slowly descending on top of me, perhaps with a cat or two on top😊


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## Ajax Bay (24 Oct 2020)

£600
And what's the mitigation if the airtube fails, in some way. Poles you can bodge a temporary mend.
Perhaps you could use an inner tube or two, cut in one place and tied at the open ends. Mmmm. That's another 300g.
As for blowing it up, I reckon a tube device to connect a pumped up schrader valved tyre to the inlet (schrader) valve of the 'airbeam' would be a compact and efficient way to go for cyclist use (carrying the pump anyway), rather than a pillow/bag.


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## HobbesOnTour (24 Oct 2020)

Ajax Bay said:


> £600
> And what's the mitigation if the airtube fails, in some way. Poles you can bodge a temporary mend.
> Perhaps you could use an inner tube or two, cut in one place and tied at the open ends. Mmmm. That's another 300g.
> As for blowing it up, I reckon a tube device to connect a pumped up schrader valved tyre to the inlet (schrader) valve of the 'airbeam' would be a compact and efficient way to go for cyclist use (carrying the pump anyway), rather than a pillow/bag.


I'm working off the assumption that an airtube failure is a puncture that I can presumably patch. If it isn't that simple then all bets are off!

Im not fully understanding their inflation process but it needs to be simple and workable in windy conditions.

I have difficulty seeing how this type is compatible with most inner-first designs, but I can see advantages for any tent that uses pole sleeves. 
Inserting and removing poles on a soaking tent will be gone for one, damaged pole ends will no longer be a threat to tent material and the need to replace that elastic string within the poles is done away with. It may also be useful to those who stay mainly in coastal areas.

But £600? Steeeeeeeep!


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## IaninSheffield (24 Oct 2020)

For a 'conventional' rear rack set up, a tent with poles perhaps doesn't need a new solution, other than snapped poles ripping fabric, as @HobbesOnTour identified. For a bike packing setup, the incredibly small pack size, rather than the weight consideration, might be attractive.

The tent does come with patches for the airbeam bladder.
There are two valves for inflation: the Schrader, and one to which the pump bag can be attached - this is also the pack sack, so you don't need an additional sack.

Although I didn't see the pitching process, I imagine it's a matter of pegging the 4 corners (fly and inner together), then pump up the volume (if you'll forgive the somewhat dated cultural reference) then trim the tent. I too like the idea of not having to thread poles through sleeves.

I have seen a few outlets selling them for £539, but even then, that's getting close to Hilleberg territory. If the Hydrogens are as robust, reliable and long-lived, then fair enough ... but I still couldn't justify that cost. The shopfloor person I was talking with (not a Vango rep) claimed Vango were barely making anything on these tents; they were more a proof of concept. Whether true or not, I applaud the company for trying something new.


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## Oldhippy (24 Oct 2020)

I always strap tent poles to the bike frame and roll tent with army surplus vacuum sack, likewise with sleeping bag. I like space in a tent so don't mind a bit of extra weight as comfort beats being cramped for me. Together with four Carridice panniers I fit in all I need.


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## HobbesOnTour (24 Oct 2020)

Decathlon have been doing "inflatable" tents for a while, mainly for the car camping / festival crowds.

I too think it's good to see a little innovation and I'd imagine that as with most concepts the price will come down.

I can see the whole bike-touring thing becoming a lot more popular in a post-pandemic world. That's going to be good for all of us!


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## Vantage (24 Oct 2020)

I don't really trust the concept of air tents. I mean, how stiff are they in a bad wind? I imagine that the air sleeves need to be up to a fair old pressure and that might require thicker material to withstand that pressure meaning more weight?
Do the 'poles' have their own individual air chambers or are they all connected and then inflated by a single valve? If they're all one piece, wouldn't that make finding a puncture a rather laborious process? What if the valve fails to close properly or starts to detach from the pole? 
Nah, I think I'll stick with good old fashioned poled tents.


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## IaninSheffield (25 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> I don't really trust the concept of air tents. I mean, how stiff are they in a bad wind? I imagine that the air sleeves need to be up to a fair old pressure and that might require thicker material to withstand that pressure meaning more weight?
> Do the 'poles' have their own individual air chambers or are they all connected and then inflated by a single valve? If they're all one piece, wouldn't that make finding a puncture a rather laborious process? What if the valve fails to close properly or starts to detach from the pole?
> Nah, I think I'll stick with good old fashioned poled tents.


For the moment, I'm with you on poled tents, but, much like an air beam tent in the wind, I'm beginning to sway the other way.
Having recently been looking at awnings (a whole other thread I'll park for the moment), the popularity and usage of blow ups has begun to increase. For those larger shelters, you're right, they are heavier (and have a larger pack size), but their performance in winds is arguably better - a sudden strong gust may distort them temporarily, but they won't fail catastrophically like a pole might. The bladders which fit in different sleeves are isolated from one another, making punctures relatively easy to find. The (single) bladder in the Vango Hydrogen is not much bigger than a bike tyre. If the valve fails, you will have a problem no doubt, and I suspect that finding a replacement bladder out on tour is likely to be tougher than finding a pole ... at least until they become more ubiquitous. Maybe you could whack in a pole as a temporary fix!

I'm not sure why I'm trying to argue the case. I guess it's because *if* they were no heavier, and *if *they were no larger when packed, and *if* they came in form factors which suited me, and *if* spares were relatively easily sourced, and *if* ... *if* the price was competitive with poled tents, I'd definitely give one a try.


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## Vantage (25 Oct 2020)

Aha! I didn't think of bladders.  That would make sense.


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## uphillstruggler (25 Oct 2020)

Vantage said:


> I don't really trust the concept of air tents. I mean, how stiff are they in a bad wind? I imagine that the air sleeves need to be up to a fair old pressure and that might require thicker material to withstand that pressure meaning more weight?
> Do the 'poles' have their own individual air chambers or are they all connected and then inflated by a single valve? If they're all one piece, wouldn't that make finding a puncture a rather laborious process? What if the valve fails to close properly or starts to detach from the pole?
> Nah, I think I'll stick with good old fashioned poled tents.



we have a air type tent, absolutely bombproof even in the heaviest wind and rain but ours is a family tent. I see no reason why the smaller version wouldn’t be as stable etc.

the air tube is robust too

horses for courses I suppose but if you are happy with the extra weight, then theyre a decent option


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## HobbesOnTour (26 Oct 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> Having recently been looking at awnings (a whole other thread I'll park for the moment),


I recall that you were looking at new tents....go on.... Start a new thread! You know you want to!


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## Vantage (1 Nov 2020)

Bought me new tent pegs. Similar to those supplied with my Zephyros. They're a V shape and can be pushed into the ground with my palm without excruciating pain unlike those stupid x shape ones. A handy hole in the top takes a loop of paracord for easily pulling them out. 
Didn't half take some finding as they seem to be only made by terra nova/wild country and vango.


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## simongt (1 Nov 2020)

Bought an airbeam tent from Go Outdoors a couple of years back. On a windy festival site, despite being correctly inflated ( also factor in the weight of a pump ) pegged and guyed, it bent and swayed in the wind. also rainwater ingressed and pooled at the bases of some of the airbeams. So it went back and money refunded. Not impressed.


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## uphillstruggler (1 Nov 2020)

simongt said:


> Bought an airbeam tent from Go Outdoors a couple of years back. On a windy festival site, despite being correctly inflated ( also factor in the weight of a pump ) pegged and guyed, it bent and swayed in the wind. also rainwater ingressed and pooled at the bases of some of the airbeams. So it went back and money refunded. Not impressed.



that’s a different experience from Mine, ours has, when correctly inflated performed brilliantly But when I left a vent open, it wasn’t so good


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## HobbesOnTour (1 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> Bought me new tent pegs. Similar to those supplied with my Zephyros. They're a V shape and can be pushed into the ground with my palm without excruciating pain unlike those stupid x shape ones. A handy hole in the top takes a loop of paracord for easily pulling them out.
> Didn't half take some finding as they seem to be only made by terra nova/wild country and vango.


May I ask why you didn't keep the ones from your Zephyros?

If you use cycling gloves (I always do) the padded bit at the base of the thumb gives a bit of protection for pushing in pegs. Since I normally have at least one pop bottle on the bike, the cap inverted can work great for really tough ground.
And yes, those paracord loops are great things!


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## Blue Hills (1 Nov 2020)

Plastic hammer.
Mocked in some circles I know but I find them surprisingly effective.


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## Vantage (1 Nov 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> May I ask why you didn't keep the ones from your Zephyros?



I've still got them Hobbes, but they're packed up with the zephyros. 
I like to have separate pegs for separate tents


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## HobbesOnTour (1 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> I've still got them Hobbes, but they're packed up with the zephyros.
> I like to have separate pegs for separate tents


Now that paints a picture I didn't have of you!


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## Blue Hills (1 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> I've still got them Hobbes, but they're packed up with the zephyros.
> I like to have separate pegs for separate tents


cripes - colour co-ordinated?
you surely just need a single good set - with some variants for different surfaces?


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## Vantage (1 Nov 2020)

Nah not colour coordinated, however it just so happens that the orange bits on my new sleeping bag match the orange bits on my new tent...and they match the orange bits on my camping chair! Who'd have thought it? 
I like to have each tent ready to go, with its own pegs and footprint. Less farting about to do when going camping. Plus there's the benefit of having lots of spare pegs should some vanish on site.


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## Vantage (1 Nov 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> Now that paints a picture I didn't have of you!



Oh I'm quite an organised type of person. Doesn't half take me ages to do anything, such as packing up the camp site. Jeez that takes forever with me


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## Vantage (5 Nov 2020)

A silk sleeping bag liner.
The project I had to shorten my old one using my new sewing machine went tits up.
However, my other project to personalise the footprint to match the tents shape seems to have gone quite well. Putting the tent up tomorrow night in the wilderness that is my back garden to test it.


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## IaninSheffield (5 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> A silk sleeping bag liner.
> The project I had to shorten my old one using my new sewing machine went tits up.
> However, my other project to personalise the footprint to match the tents shape seems to have gone quite well. Putting the tent up tomorrow night in the wilderness that is my back garden to test it.


Photos of footprint to come?


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## Vantage (5 Nov 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> Photos of footprint to come?


 Can do


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## Blue Hills (5 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> A silk sleeping bag liner.
> The project I had to shorten my old one using my new sewing machine went tits up.
> However, my other project to personalise the footprint to match the tents shape seems to have gone quite well. Putting the tent up tomorrow night in the wilderness that is my back garden to test it.


The decathlon one by any chance? I have one. Very good.

Ps, if you can't manage to do a sack with your new sewing machine, i rather fear for your spring collection.


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## Vantage (6 Nov 2020)

Well here it is. So manly and butch it looks like a NASA space rocket.







I've had to undersized it at the doors because decathlons designers made the door bottoms arch up to aid airflow. Rain could get under those arches, land on the footprint and build up to a mighty swamp under the tent which could swallow the universe!











I just need to lengthen the corner elastics as I can't stretch the tent to its full size atm. Besides that, I'm quite proud of myself


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## HobbesOnTour (6 Nov 2020)

@Vantage 
Is that a footprint specific for that tent you've modified or something else?

One of my pet hates about specific footprints is the finickyness of them for us people who set up in a new location every day.
It is remarkable how few YouTube vids actually show it. 

Really interested in how your wildcamp will go. I'm intrigued at how those "dark" tents do in the cold. 

Happy Camping!


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## Vantage (6 Nov 2020)

Howdy Mr Hobbes. The footprint was a standard square generic type when I bought it. I did actually buy it with the intention of modifying it to specifically fit that tent. The 'wings' came from a coleman tarpy thing that was never used. Decathlons footprints are a 'one size fits all' type. 
One thing I noticed about the footprint I bought for the zephyros was indeed how finicky it was. I felt the bungees were too stretchy and as it used the same pegs as the tent, getting those pegs in the exact position to pitch the tent without repegging them all again was mission impossible. It took me twice as long to pitch mine as it took my dad to pitch his. 
Not a problem I've had with my new footprint. It goes down and the tent lines up almost perfect with the pegs. Slightly longer bungees and it'll fit perfeck.

2 things I note about this tent. The black inner and the silver backing on the fly. 
'kim' over on the YACF forum has one of these tents and said she noticed it had a tendency to keep it's ambient temperature inside steadier than other tents. I've camped in it a few times in the garden so far but I've yet to endure harsh weather so far so can't really comment on that but I do wonder if the silver lining might help to keep heat from escaping. It may also keep the tent from turning into an oven on sunny days too. I think the only thing the black does is keep the bulk of daylight out.


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## andrew_s (7 Nov 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> One of my pet hates about specific footprints is the finickyness of them for us people who set up in a new location every day.



My specific footprint remains attached to the tent, rolling up with the tent as I take it down, and pitching all in one operation with the rest of the tent. It attaches to rings sewn on the outer via toggles on elastic.
The only time it's ever finicky is when I've done something stupid like spill soup on top, and try to clean up without completely striking the tent.


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## HobbesOnTour (7 Nov 2020)

andrew_s said:


> My specific footprint remains attached to the tent, rolling up with the tent as I take it down, and pitching all in one operation with the rest of the tent. It attaches to rings sewn on the outer via toggles on elastic.
> The only time it's ever finicky is when I've done something stupid like spill soup on top, and try to clean up without completely striking the tent.


As does mine. In fact that's why I upgraded from a generic tarp as a footprint. Getting everything lined up was a PITA. 
Previously I used tyvek as a footprint for a pyramid tent. Surprisingly tough & robust, very light but not the smallest packsize. There are people on Ebay selling tyvek footprints for popular designs of tent.

However, I still think that having to pitch a footprint separate to the tent is something that gets old fast.

And what is it about the members of this forum spilling hot beverages in their tents?


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## Blue Hills (7 Nov 2020)

Have always used a £5 tarp from wickes/b&q, maybe i'll look into this dedicated footprint thing, particularly as i have settled on a favoured tent for cycle camping escapades. Then just pray that the manufacturers don't change the dimensions of what is a great tent.


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## Vantage (7 Nov 2020)

Didn't think to have the footprint attached to the tent...thats a bloody good idea really. I'm thinking carabiner clips so it's easy to remove...hmm.
I've used those £5 tarps in the past @Blue Hills and still use a big one for the family tents, they're bulky and heavy though. 
The one I've butchered rolls up to about the size of a beer can.


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## IaninSheffield (7 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> Well here it is. So manly and butch it looks like a NASA space rocket.
> 
> I've had to undersized it at the doors because decathlons designers made the door bottoms arch up to aid airflow. Rain could get under those arches, land on the footprint and build up to a mighty swamp under the tent which could swallow the universe!
> 
> I just need to lengthen the corner elastics as I can't stretch the tent to its full size atm. Besides that, I'm quite proud of myself


A most impressive feat of seamsperson-ship! Well done indeed. I see a whole new career opening up ... 😉


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## Blue Hills (7 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> Didn't think to have the footprint attached to the tent...thats a bloody good idea really. I'm thinking carabiner clips so it's easy to remove...hmm.



If you're looking for clips for something like that I can recommend these:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10pcs-He...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

maybe available cheaper from the east - i paid less but things have gone up.

That is a good supplier though.

I use them for clipping guy lines to tarps, clips for camp washing lines etc.

Preferable I think to many cheapo metal ones sold even by the likes of DD Hammocks - cheap, have moving bits prone to failure, potentially scratchy so can damage stuff.


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## Blue Hills (7 Nov 2020)

Vantage said:


> Slightly longer bungees and it'll fit perfeck.



ah on this

maybe you know about them, but I find the ball bungee useful for all sorts of cobbled together heath robinson lashings

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Silverli...178942?hash=item41fe2c203e:g:ossAAOSwKF5coce6

you can even loop/daisychain them together - useful for aforementioned washing lines - attaching to tent, overhanging trees, immobilising of bicycles, doubtless various nefarious uses.


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## chriswoody (8 Dec 2020)

My old Voyager is getting a bit long in the tooth now, the fly sheet has seen better days and the pack size is a little to big for my new stripped down touring style.

So today a shiny new Alpkit Soloist landed on my doormat. Pictured below next to the empty stuff sack and a 1litre bottle for size comparison. That's the full tent, pegs and poles included. It weighs in at a paltry 1.2 kilos.







It's dark now so I won't get chance to put it up yet, but hopefully at the end of the week.

First impressions are good though and for €140 I'm really happy.


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## Blue Hills (8 Dec 2020)

interesting.
How standard are the poles though?
Am somewhat wary of systems that might seem "too clever"


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## chriswoody (8 Dec 2020)

Depends really what you mean by standard. They are made from 7001-T6 alloy, so fairly standard pole material. Shape wise they are a slightly unusual shape: (Photo from the Alpkit Website.)






It's all one piece and I imagine that the centre spine may be a pig to field repair. However, I spent twenty years as an outdoor pursuits instructor and hundreds of nights nights under canvas in lightweight tents and yet to experience a failure. So hoping that the minimal use in comparison, that this tent will get, will be fine.

The inner then just clips onto the pole when it's up and the fly drapes over the top and clips into the corners.

One of the main selling points as well, was Alpkits after sales service. They are really good at patching up kit and if it's wear and tear, then their prices are really reasonable.


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## Blue Hills (8 Dec 2020)

I suppose by standard I meant diameter, one of the pretty common ones like 8.5 or 9mm.
But that was assuming you could swap pole sections.
You are clearly way more experienced than me but must admit I would feel uncomfortable if you can't even slot a new bit into that central pole.
I am also wary of those "hub" type things you get on some tents.
I did once abandon a cycle camping trip because of a bust pole but wouldn't have to these days - very easy to fix.


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## chriswoody (8 Dec 2020)

I must admit I did have a little ponder over the pole shape it wasn't my ideal shape, I prefer no nonsense straight poles. However, pack size and weight were big factors for me and the next tents on my list that would offer the right size (Big Agnes and MSR tents) were nearly 400 euros. At 140 Euros I figured it was worth a go, especially given I could easily pick up spares from Alpkit if need be.

If I need to field repair the centre section, I just need to undo the elastic at one of the hubs, then slide over the supplied pole sleeve. I little more of a faff than a straight pole, but I don't really envisage it breaking! One common issue with these poles is the corrosion of the pole feet splitting the ends of the pole section. However, if they're dried out properly after a trip, then that shouldn't be a problem.

I'll have to do a long term review though after this year and see how I get on. I'm only expecting to get 20 nights out at most this year, so not too heavy usage. I think if I had a big word wide trip planned, I'd save for a Hileberg or similar, but with my project usage this should be fine.


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## HobbesOnTour (9 Dec 2020)

Well wear @chriswoody 
(What do we say for a tent?)

I had a little poke around online. It seems to have different set up options - fly only, inner only which adds to the versatility. 

I've instinctively avoided inner pitch first tents because rain (in hindsight that's never really been an issue) and a belief that I'll royally feck up trying to get the fly in place in windy conditions

Enjoy your adventures!


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## andrew_s (9 Dec 2020)

chriswoody said:


> One common issue with these poles is the corrosion of the pole feet splitting the ends of the pole section. However, if they're dried out properly after a trip, then that shouldn't be a problem.


Hiileberg warn that a common cause of the poles splitting at the joints is letting the elastic snap the pole sections together, and that you should put the sections together by hand.


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## IaninSheffield (9 Dec 2020)

andrew_s said:


> Hiileberg warn that a common cause of the poles splitting at the joints is letting the elastic snap the pole sections together, and that you should put the sections together by hand.


As someone guilty of allowing pole sectiins to snap together, and who has suffered exactly that failure (although not on a Hilleberg), that's a really useful tip to know. I shall be more careful in future and hope I haven't unduly damaged the poles already. 👍


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## HobbesOnTour (9 Dec 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> As someone guilty of allowing pole sectiins to snap together, and who has suffered exactly that failure (although not on a Hilleberg), that's a really useful tip to know. I shall be more careful in future and hope I haven't unduly damaged the poles already. 👍


Which brings us back to......
AIRTENTS!

I've read that before as well as sea air can cause corrosion and weakness. On aluminium poles?

Based on my US experience in the US where a fine gravel is often the pitching surface, I'd say that that is also a factor in weakening the joints. 

Exped specifically advise that the whole pole section should be broken down from the centre - apparently this reduces pressure at the joints. Seems counterintuitive to me.

Nothing against Hilleberg (I can dream!) I can't help but feel a little cynical. Taking poles apart is ok, but putting them together without the individual poles "snapping" together is a tricky task. I don't think there's many can say it has never happened?

Working on the assumption that the poles are threaded for strength, yet the elastic nature can expose a weak point, I've often wondered why there isn't a "twist and lock" design instead of the elasticated threading.


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## chriswoody (9 Dec 2020)

@HobbesOnTour the multi pitching options were certainly one of the draws to this tent, though to be fair I'm not sure how much I'll take advantage of them. 

As you say, a lot of online reviews do mention the inner first pitch as a minus point, however I've owned many such tents including my current Voyager and never had an issue with it, so I chose to ignore that as a negative! 

The trick with placing the fly in high winds is to stand with the wind at your back and get the wind to "blow" the fly onto the tent. 

I'm intrigued overall how I'll get on with it, only time will tell. I'm getting quite excited now for some adventures I have planned for next year, though my daughters trip will be with my old Voyager. 



andrew_s said:


> Hiileberg warn that a common cause of the poles splitting at the joints is letting the elastic snap the pole sections together, and that you should put the sections together by hand.



You've reminded me, I used to work at a centre that was sponsored by Terra Nova and the rep was always drilling that into us. To be honest it's become so second nature to do that now that I'd completely forgot, thanks for bringing it up! He also used to tell us to pull the poles apart at the middle and then work back to the ends when dismantling them.


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## HobbesOnTour (9 Dec 2020)

chriswoody said:


> @HobbesOnTour the multi pitching options were certainly one of the draws to this tent, though to be fair I'm not sure how much I'll take advantage of them.


My Exped has similar "functionality" and a previous Hexpeak (tipi) did too. 
I've tried both out. The Exped is finicky in the extreme. The Hexpeak was better, especially fly only, as the user has the choice to regulate how close to the ground to set the fly.
I'm not sure that Europe has the ideal climate for inner only, but I do have dreams of wildly remote locations and shooting stars!



chriswoody said:


> The trick with placing the fly in high winds is to stand with the wind at your back and get the wind to "blow" the fly onto the tent.


Thanks!
I figured something like that. Knowing me as I do, I'd have visions of a fly...flying!


chriswoody said:


> I'm intrigued overall how I'll get on with it, only time will tell. I'm getting quite excited now for some adventures I have planned for next year, though my daughters trip will be with my old Voyager.



Wait until she's borrowing your Alpkit for herself!



chriswoody said:


> He also used to tell us to pull the poles apart at the middle and then work back to the ends when dismantling them.


Same as Exped, then


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## IaninSheffield (9 Dec 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> Working on the assumption that the poles are threaded for strength, yet the elastic nature can expose a weak point, I've often wondered why there isn't a "twist and lock" design instead of the elasticated threading.


That's a good point. Wonder if it's the convenience of all the poles being kept in the right order, rather than being separated and therefore taking longer to assemble? Surely a simple numbering/lettering system could quickly get round that though? And exactly how much longer would it really take compared with elasticated systems? But then why do all(?) manufacturers do seem to favour elastics?


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## HobbesOnTour (9 Dec 2020)

IaninSheffield said:


> That's a good point. Wonder if it's the convenience of all the poles being kept in the right order, rather than being separated and therefore taking longer to assemble? Surely a simple numbering/lettering system could quickly get round that though? And exactly how much longer would it really take compared with elasticated systems? But then why do all(?) manufacturers do seem to favour elastics?


Order is easily fixed as you say with labelling or colour coding. It even could mean standardisation of poles across tent designs as well as easily offering different lengths (shorter pole segments for cyclists, as an example.
It could be that any "lock" design might leave sticky out bits which could damage a fly - probably more of an issue with inner first designs?
In any case, a lot of tents are available in different standards, utilising different materials - but poles are normally the same. 
I'd certainly be willing to choose this option unless someone can point out a flaw.

Or.....
Remove the shock cord (that's the word!) and add a valve so we can pump the connected pole with air to a high enough pressure for security!


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## Blue Hills (10 Dec 2020)

HobbesOnTour said:


> I'm not sure that Europe has the ideal climate for inner only, but I do have dreams of wildly remote locations and shooting stars!


That's what bivis are for.
Lying in fields I've had to settle for looking at plane vapour trails after a hard day's pedal so far but hope to get to the Yorkshire Dales for some bivvying next year.

https://www.yorkshiredales.org.uk/things-to-do/get-outdoors/stargazing/


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## simongt (10 Dec 2020)

Up to recently when I bought a Vango Halo 300 which is a wee bit larger, for the last twenty four years I've used an ex Bundeswher cape as my footprint. Cheap and had never failed me - !


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## chriswoody (11 Dec 2020)

Well I finally had chance to put it up in the garden. It's an interesting tent and really nicely made. As well as the tent itself I also purchased the optional footprint for an additional €14. The footprint has metal eyelets at the corners so you can erect the tent like a tarp.







Because it's freestanding you can also erect the inner only:






There's a lot of mesh on the top and the door increasing ventilation but reducing its warmth, so really just a summer tent.

Then with the fly on top:











It's quite tall making sitting up a possibility, but it is a little tight in there.

The ends of the fly sheet clip onto the ends of the poles and have little adjusters for the tension. It's all from Aluminium and looks pretty solid:






So overall it looks a well built tent and for €140 you really can't go far wrong. I also had a little chuckle at the obligatory warning label, someone obviously has a sense of humour at Alpkit.






Roll on summer now, looking forward to sleeping out in it.


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## Blue Hills (11 Dec 2020)

That's a decent price for the footprint. Often they seem crazily expensive.


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## jay clock (11 Dec 2020)

Blue Hills said:


> Have always used a £5 tarp from wickes/b&q, maybe i'll look into this dedicated footprint thing, particularly as i have settled on a favoured tent for cycle camping escapades. Then just pray that the manufacturers don't change the dimensions of what is a great tent.


I have an MSR Hubba Hubba NX and got the footprint, but now use a much tougher plastic 2mx1m tarp which is not full width but length good and very light


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## HobbesOnTour (11 Dec 2020)

jay clock said:


> I have an MSR Hubba Hubba NX and got the footprint, but now use a much tougher plastic 2mx1m tarp which is not full width but length good and very light


The thing is that with tents such as Chris' that have a variety of set up options, the model specific groundsheet is probably best for utilising the options. 
That's why I eventually lumped for an Exped one. 
I have to say that that 14 quid for a branded footprint is excellent value!


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## andrew_s (23 Jan 2021)

HobbesOnTour said:


> Exped specifically advise that the whole pole section should be broken down from the centre - apparently this reduces pressure at the joints. Seems counterintuitive to me.


Since the pole elastic doesn't slide past a doubled over joint much, if you take the pole apart starting at one end, the elasitic end up quite slack at the starting end, and very tight at the finishing end.
I expect it's mostly to do with preserving the elastic, though I suppose that it could be possible that there is enough force applied round the pole end to do something, with long term storage.


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## chriswoody (20 May 2022)

Coffee has always been an important part of my trips and even with my predilection for ultralight touring, I need a good brew in the morning. Up till now, I'd used a Java drip filter, but I could never get a consistently strong brew from it. So I've finally decided to invest in an Aeropress Go. They get a lot of good reviews, and work in a similar way to a French press. The kit comes with the press itself, a mug, a stirrer, a spoon and 350 filter papers. 







Ditching the mug, spoon, stirrer and lid, you are left with quite a compact kit that fits relatively neatly into my Alpkit titanium mug. There's still space inside the middle of the whole assembly for the coffee grounds. 






Looking forward to giving it all a go now and see if it lives up to the positive reviews I've read online.


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## HobbesOnTour (21 May 2022)

@chriswoody 
Careful now adding gear! It's a slippery slope until you end up at the bottom with the likes of me!


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## alicat (21 May 2022)

chriswoody said:


> Looking forward to giving it all a go now and see if it lives up to the positive reviews I've read online.



I'd love to hear how you rate it.


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## chriswoody (21 May 2022)

I know @HobbesOnTour, it is a perilous decision, however, I've decided I'm allowed one luxury item though, or at least that's the excuse! 

So I decided to give the Aeropress a quick go for my morning coffee. As I'd seen recommend online, I used it upside down. Popping freshly ground coffee in followed by water, with it upside down, it can then spend a few minutes brewing.







When it's spent a few minutes brewing, I gently tipped it over the right way and on to the top of a mug, before gently plunging down and forcing fresh coffee through the filter.






So first impressions are really positive, it's a simple thing, but brews some nice coffee and should be a good addition to my kit. As well as tours it's so light and small that I can carry on longer day rides and brew a fresh coffee at break times if I want.


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## alicat (21 May 2022)

^^^ thanks for doing a review @chriswoody. I'm tempted to get one for when I go away.


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## HobbesOnTour (21 May 2022)

Ironically, I've gone in the opposite direction - lighter! 





A simple, reusable/washable filter picked up on my travels.
It replaces* a "pop up" cone that uses a normal paper filter.

I can strain the water straight through, or allow it to "soak" for a while if coffee is running low.

* When I say "replace" I mean I still have the original. No morning coffee would be a disaster and I'm a belts and braces kinda guy.


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## Sallar55 (23 Jun 2022)

Maintenance time, a service kit for the multi fuel stove
New jet, o rings and pre heat pad fitted, used unleaded petrol when we were away. Primus or Coalmans fuel is better less jet blockages, but unleaded petrol is easy to find. One problem France is awash with card operated fuel pumps with a minimum card charge. Most times drivers will fill the bottle for you and some won't accept the 2€ cost.


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## HobbesOnTour (15 Aug 2022)

My new home......
Decathlon "ultra light" offering (Forclaz MT 900 2 person).
Haven't had this "style" of tent before - inner pitches first so there's a bit of a learning curve.

First impressions:
A very thin floor (groundsheet currently sold out). I've improvised. 
Zips look cheap (but run fine).
I miss luminous tags on the zips but I'll adapt.
Doors in the fly (2) are a bit small and keeping the door open is a chore. I'll need to improve that for rain. 
Compact for two people but uses space well.
Very light (for me ) at 1.8kg.

We'll see how it goes. Decathlon are everywhere if there are problems and it's possible to buy entire polesets, inners and fly as time goes on. 

First night after setting up in the dark was fine - including my new Decathlon sleeping pad. Very, very comfortable. Thermarest - never again.


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## simongt (17 Aug 2022)

HobbesOnTour said:


> (groundsheet currently sold out).


Of groundsheets, for the last thirty years, I've been using a ex Bundeswehr cape as a footprint for various tents and it's more than paid for itself in said role.


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## HobbesOnTour (17 Aug 2022)

simongt said:


> Of groundsheets, for the last thirty years, I've been using a ex Bundeswehr cape as a footprint for various tents and it's more than paid for itself in said role.



I tried out tyvek under a pyramid tent and found it surprisingly good and strong. I may do the same for this one at some stage. At the moment a cheapy tarp is doing the job.


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