# Am I training right?



## La_Pluie (23 Apr 2013)

Hi all,
I've only been cycling for about six months but want to try and get as fast as possible so I can keep up with the local club run.
Currently I can average 15-16mph without pushing too hard but I want more!
Haven't had as much free time as I'd like recently to spend on the bike but I've just started cycling to work every day to try and solve that problem. This is what I do...

1 hour in the morning of HR zone 2 with 3 x 10 mins tempo effort.

15-20 minutes tempo in the gym at lunch (mixture of high cadence and big gear work).

30 minutes home zone 2 but with a 1 mile climb in the middle which gets my HR up to around 90% max.

Trying to fit in a longer (around 2 hour) zone 2 ride at the weekend too.

Do you think this is a good plan? Any suggestion of ways to change/improve it?
Thanks


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## User16625 (24 Apr 2013)

When you say you average 15-16mph, is that on a particular type of road or overall?

Specific workouts like that are way beyond me. I do what I can when I can. My strait line speed is about 20mph but my overall average usually ends up about 15mph, which will vary depending on type of ride.


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## marzjennings (24 Apr 2013)

Sounds like a lot of zone 2 stuff and not enough 3,4, or 5. Or even 6. 

Maybe on the 2 hour weekend ride, knock it up to a zone 4 ride then use the zone 2s during the week for recovery and strength. 

Not sure of the benefit of the 20 mins at lunch time, maybe a quick interval session, 5 min warm up (zone 2), 2 min sprint (zone 5), 3 min cool off (zone 3), 2 min sprint (zone 5), 3 min cool off (zone 3), 5 min cool down (zone 2).


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

Sounds to me like a bit of a hodgepodge, also you do all of this daily?



marzjennings said:


> Sounds like a lot of zone 2 stuff and *not enough 3,4, or 5. Or even 6.*
> 
> Maybe on the 2 hour weekend ride, knock it up to a zone 4 ride then use the zone 2s during the week for recovery and strength.
> 
> Not sure of the benefit of the 20 mins at lunch time, maybe a quick interval session, 5 min warm up (zone 2), 2 min sprint (zone 5), 3 min cool off (zone 3), 2 min sprint (zone 5), 3 min cool off (zone 3), 5 min cool down (zone 2).


 
He has been cycling for 6 months only, chances are he has not developed an adequate base to undertake and benefit from high intensity interval training.


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## Herzog (24 Apr 2013)

I would suggest working on your endurance (if your primary goal is to keep up with club runs). The benefits of decent stints in Z2/3 (on what are you basing your zones?) would be greater than banging out L5 intervals. Also, split your week into sensible workouts rather than trying to do everything each day!


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## marzjennings (24 Apr 2013)

Rob3rt said:


> He has been cycling for 6 months only, chances are he has not developed an adequate base to undertake and benefit from high intensity interval training.


 
True, maybe something the OP can start to consider is throwing in the odd high intensity session. If riding about 2 hours a day and averaging ~16mph is easy, then it's time to up the game to NOT easy.


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## Norry1 (24 Apr 2013)

get used to riding close with others - if you can average 16mph on your own over extended distances - you should be able to average a couple of mph higher riding close in a group.


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## La_Pluie (24 Apr 2013)

I'm fully aware that I need to improve my base fitness. Is zone 2-3 the way to go? Currently that is what most of my time is spent doing. How much of each would you recommend? Mostly one particular zone?

Another real problem I have is with hills. I cant climb any hill of more than 5% gradient in zone 2. My HR always jumps up to zone 3 or even 4 on the steeper stuff.
Will improving base fitness help with this? Do I just need to keep riding hills to improve?

Thanks for all the advice so far


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

La_Pluie said:


> I'm fully aware that I need to improve my base fitness. Is zone 2-3 the way to go? Currently that is what most of my time is spent doing. How much of each would you recommend? Mostly one particular zone?
> 
> Another real problem I have is with hills. I cant climb any hill of more than 5% gradient in zone 2. My HR always jumps up to zone 3 or even 4 on the steeper stuff.
> Will improving base fitness help with this? Do I just need to keep riding hills to improve?
> ...


 
Lots of endurance miles is a great way to build base fitness as it lends itself to volume, it will bring about training adaptation and also allow you to recover at a fast rate. You should note, training zones are continuous, not discrete, by moving from one zone to another, you change emphasis on which physiological system if being stressed, but you don't turn one system off and another on.

What you experience when going up hill is to be expected, as base fitness improves you will be able to ascend at the same speed for a lower heart rate.

There will be some occasions you simply have to end up in higher zones, this is fine. My comment re. high intensity training was more along the lines of not undertaking such things as smashing yourself to bits doing VO2 max intervals or sprint work.


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## gam001 (24 Apr 2013)

I started some training 6 months ago. Did a lot of reading on the internet and asked a couple of good TT'ers for their advice. To begin with, for improving cruising speed, seems that raising your LT is a really good way to go. There's lots of reading out there and everybody has their own opinions, so do lots of reading. I think I'm basically saying what Rob3rt's saying but just giving the detail of how I did it.

I followed the priciples below and my speed has since increased by roughly 2mph for the same HR (and 1 hour power from 250watts to 300watts for those who have a power meter!) ...

- Use a 4-week cycle of 3 weeks gradually increasing length of intervals / distance + 1 easy week to recover (this is where you actually get faster so don't forget to be strict here and cut volume by around half and cut out workouts harder than tempo)
- Focus on 1 or 2 key energy systems for each 4 week block to stress that area and get maximum improvement, starting with lower intensities to build a base and then increasing intensity with time
- Use back-to-back training days to increase stress on the body, eg I did interval sessions Tues / Weds / Thurs and endurance sessions on Sat & Sun (Start with just Sat for month 1 maybe) with Mon & Fri recovery days
- Try as best you can to keep within the zone when on the road by using gears / keep pedalling as much as possible, eg no free wheeling down hills / don't start racing others who overtake you
- Do a 20-minute all out test before you start to see what your average HR is and then knock 5bpm off to estimate your 1 hr TT HR to set HR zones - you may want to repeat every 1 to 2 months to see if this changes and to track your increase in speed.
- Months 1 & 2 - I focussed on Tempo (HR around 90% of 1hr TT HR) building gradually week by week from 3 x 15 mins with 5 mins easy between to 60 mins continuous. Also did with 2 to 3 hours at an easy pace, non-stop pedalling, on Sat and Sun
- Months 3 & 4 - I focussed on Sweet Spot (HR around 95% of 1hr TT HR). Did this on Tues & Thurs with an easier 1 hr endurance session on Weds. Building from 3 x 10 mins with 5 mins easy between to 3 x 20mins with 3 mins easy between. Also did with 2 to 3 hours of hilly endurance on Sats and 3 to 4 hrs flat endurance on Suns.
- Months 5&6 - as 3&4 above but focus on sub-LT efforts (HR around 97-98& of 1hr TT HR). Build from 3x8 mins (5 mins easy between) to 3x15mins and 2x20mins. This is hard graft but you'll now have the engine to do them and fitness to recover quickly - you'll also improve your cruising / TT speed a LOT at the end of this period. Also upped Sat hilly ride to 3 to 3.5 hrs and Sun flat ride to 4 to 4.5 hrs.
-You could maybe swap a weekend day for a group ride to have a bit more fun

I know this is very structured and won't suit a lot of people who'd rather just get out and ride, which will improve you too, but this is the kind of approach that the professionals use and I can vouch that it definitely worked wonders for me. Horses for courses and all that! Hope it's of some use to you 

(PS - I've used HR zones above as most people have a HRM, but happy to quote power zones if you have a power meter which I do (well, borrowed).)


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## 400bhp (24 Apr 2013)

I can vouch it's worked for gam001 too.

Avnyway, when are you starting TT'ing?


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

He should start asap, after spending all that time training, you ought to get racing and enjoying your fitness  The season kicked off about 6 weeks ago. Racing is fun, it is the highlight of my week!


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## gam001 (24 Apr 2013)

400bhp said:


> I can vouch it's worked for gam001 too.
> 
> Avnyway, when are you starting TT'ing?


End of summer when my belly is a bit smaller and I can reach the TT bars


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## 400bhp (24 Apr 2013)

Be really interested to see how you go. I suspect you won't be much different to me (on the flat of course)


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## 400bhp (24 Apr 2013)

Rob3rt said:


> He should start asap, after spending all that time training, you ought to get racing and enjoying your fitness  The season kicked off about 6 weeks ago. Racing is fun, it is the highlight of my week!


 
What's your "regular" TT?

I need to force myself to do my first one (in 20 years).


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

Generally I ride whatever open event is on in Cheshire each weekend pretty much, preference given to events in the Cheshire points league  This weekend it is the Glossop Kinder Velo 25 on J2/9. The week after is ABC Centreville 10 on J2/1 I think.


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## 400bhp (24 Apr 2013)

cant do weekends unless my wife starts doing them

need midweek


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

Our club 10 series runs on Monday evenings on J2/1. We split it with Stockport Clarion taking turns to provide marshals etc.


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## gam001 (24 Apr 2013)

400bhp said:


> cant do weekends unless my wife starts doing them
> 
> need midweek


400bhp - you've nearly started your own club on CC! Maybe organise / marshall an informal one between the Sat ride threaders??
(Insurance consequences??)
Apologies - we're taking over this thread - maybe we can continue in our Sat ride thread?


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## Rob3rt (24 Apr 2013)

Nigel, other than our club 10's there are the following:

Westmead - Tuesday Evenings on J2/1 - http://www.westmeadteam88.co.uk/event.php?type=club
Congleton CC - Tuesday Evenings on Various Courses -http://www.congletoncyclingclub.org.uk/?page_id=98
Macc Wheelers - Wednesday Evenings on JC/5 -http://www.macclesfieldwheelers.org.uk/timetrials.php
Seamons CC - Wednesday Evenings, actually 8.75 mile -http://www.seamonscc.co.uk/Calendar5.html


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## Hacienda71 (24 Apr 2013)

Rob3rt said:


> Nigel, other than our club 10's there are the following:
> 
> Westmead - Tuesday Evenings on J2/1 - http://www.westmeadteam88.co.uk/event.php?type=club
> Congleton CC - Tuesday Evenings on Various Courses -http://www.congletoncyclingclub.org.uk/?page_id=98
> ...


 
Just avoid the Westmead ones where the 100%ME lot turn up and do sub 21 minutes on the 10.


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## 400bhp (24 Apr 2013)

Than


Rob3rt said:


> Nigel, other than our club 10's there are the following:
> 
> Westmead - Tuesday Evenings on J2/1 - http://www.westmeadteam88.co.uk/event.php?type=club
> Congleton CC - Tuesday Evenings on Various Courses -http://www.congletoncyclingclub.org.uk/?page_id=98
> ...


 
Thanks, I knew about the seamons one and the manc wheelers mon one. I had a practice on the seamons one yesterday. Reasonably happy given the circumstances.


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## Pedrosanchezo (24 Apr 2013)

La_Pluie said:


> Hi all,
> I've only been cycling for about six months but want to try and get as fast as possible so I can keep up with the local club run.
> Currently I can average 15-16mph without pushing too hard but I want more!
> Haven't had as much free time as I'd like recently to spend on the bike but I've just started cycling to work every day to try and solve that problem. This is what I do...
> ...


This is fine to begin with unless you are finding it all too easy. Just remember we don't get faster and stronger whilst riding, we get faster and stronger when we recover and rest. Recovery is paramount in cycling and if you don't pay particular attention to it then you will leave your body no time to adapt. Rest and nutrition after a ride will make the next days riding more productive.


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