# Why I dont go more than 25 mph, even downhill.



## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

As we get older several unwanted things happen. Among these are
a) relexes slow down.
b) you dont bounce as well as you used to 
This has really been brought home by that accident to Ben Swift of team Sky fame.
Out training he hit a loose stone!! Ruptured spleen and in intensive care.
I am now 72 and just feel very uneasy when I get to my magic figure of 25.
I dont advocate that for others, its just how I feel.


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## Drago (22 Feb 2019)

Ha! I tweak the nose of fear, and laugh in the face of death.


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## SkipdiverJohn (22 Feb 2019)

I'm not as old as the OP and I know I don't bounce well either, and have no desire to tear about at motor vehicle speeds whilst riding a push bike. The fastest speed I've achieved on a level road was 22 mph on a flat bar Raleigh hybrid , and that was only for a short distance and there was no way I was going to be keeping up that pace for any amount of time.
When I read on here about 50 mph descents on public roads open to other traffic, animals, pedestrians etc I can only assume the poster is completely nuts.


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## Ming the Merciless (22 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> Ha! I tweak the nose of fear, and laugh in the face of death.



Is that because you nicked his bike?


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## classic33 (22 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> Ha! I tweak the nose of fear, and laugh in the face of death.


You willing to set the speed cameras off in a 50mph zone?


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## rugby bloke (22 Feb 2019)

You've got 20 years on me but I agree. Just like when I'm skiing, whenever I'm going fast my primary thought is "This is going to bloody hurt if I pile it".

Respect to those who have the necessary surplus of bravado for a 50 mph descent though !


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## Ian H (22 Feb 2019)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> When I read on here about 50 mph descents on public roads open to other traffic, animals, pedestrians etc I can only assume the poster is completely nuts.



I've never managed more than 58mph. I prefer good sightlines at speed. 50+ years of cycling of all kinds and still alive.


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## derrick (22 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> As we get older several unwanted things happen. Among these are
> a) relexes slow down.
> b) you dont bounce as well as you used to
> This has really been brought home by that accident to Ben Swift of team Sky fame.
> ...



When your time is up thats it. It could be 2mph or 50mph. Live your life. I have always loved speed. Now 67 have no plans to slow down.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdC3Llo2TCE&feature=youtu.be


We hit 40+mph on that day.


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## Threevok (22 Feb 2019)

You don't have to go at breakneck speeds - to live dangerously

Just ride a Raleigh Chopper above 12mph


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## Vantage (22 Feb 2019)

I once hit a smidgin over 50. Yes, I was nuts. 
I no longer have the brass monkeys to push the boundaries of how much wind resistance I can overcome. 
If the bike coasts to 40, thats OK.
If it coasts to 15, that's ok. 
But it'll get there under the weight of gravity, nothing more.


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## raleighnut (22 Feb 2019)

I've kept up with traffic on the Ashbourne to Derby road whilst pulling a trailer, no speedo but I reckon 45mph+ (downhill with a tailwind)


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## SkipdiverJohn (22 Feb 2019)

Speed in itself isn't what's dangerous. It's perfectly safe to go bombing along at warp speed as long as there are no nasty surprises awaiting you on the road surface, and no people, animals or other vehicles that can suddenly appear from nowhere in your path. Unfortunately, public roads have all those hazards - unlike a closed racing circuit. Yet a lot of cyclists use the roads as though they were on a race track - and are the first to complain about cars being driven in a similar manner! Having good visibility & some common sense goes a long way to staying in one piece, but ultimately if you hit something at 50 mph the results are going to be much more severe than if you are doing 20 - and if you are going slower you have more time to react and stop so a crash is less likely in the first place.
I remember reading somewhere, possibly on here, that in the Netherlands non-helmeted cyclists were rarely hospitalised, whereas a far greater proportion of helmeted ones were. I can only assume the helmeted ones were mainly mad roadies going flat out and the non-helmeted ones were just pootling around at much lower speeds. I'm totally pro-choice as regards helmets, so I have no axe to grind either way, and I don't wear one myself.


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## NorthernDave (22 Feb 2019)

I've not quite broken the magical 50mph barrier yet, although I've been very close a couple of times.

That may be because of my masterful bike handling skills, my hydraulic disc brakes or that I've simply yet to have a big off?

That said, I've had several low speed offs and a couple of them were quite hurty, so who knows?


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## Drago (22 Feb 2019)

I managed 670 knots before transonic buffeting caused a compression instability and I fell off.


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## SkipdiverJohn (22 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> I managed 670 knots before transonic buffeting caused a compression instability and I fell off.



I don't think stowing away in the landing gear of an aircraft is quite the same as cycling!


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## Ming the Merciless (22 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> I managed 670 knots before transonic buffeting caused a compression instability and I fell off.



Luckily the sonic boom caught you up just as you were about to hit the Tarmac.


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## Ming the Merciless (22 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> As we get older several unwanted things happen. Among these are
> a) relexes slow down.
> b) you dont bounce as well as you used to
> This has really been brought home by that accident to Ben Swift of team Sky fame.
> ...



Remember whether you come off at 12mph or 25mph you will hit the ground with the same impact forces. It is only in head on collisions that that extra speed will make much difference.


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## Phaeton (22 Feb 2019)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> Speed in itself isn't what's dangerous.


No it's hitting things that hurt,

Worst accident I ever had (grabs a bit of wood) was less than 15mph broken tibia, fibula & compound fracture of femur still suffering from that 40 years later.


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

derrick said:


> When your time is up thats it. It could be 2mph or 50mph. Live your life.



Cant agree with that sentiment and I dont want to 'invite' death earlier than necessary.
But as I said "i am not advocating that for everybody, its how I feel".


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## mudsticks (22 Feb 2019)

Yes i'm a proper slow coach going downhill these days - by some folks standards - especially on twisty muddy Devon lanes - you don't know who is coming the other way - and if they've been to spec savers recently enough.

Enough gravel has been dug out of my knees - from previous mishaps - for any one lifetime.

Plus the downside of being a self employed landworker, is that if I'm broken in body, then I'm very quickly become broken in bank too


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> Remember whether you come off at 12mph or 25mph you will hit the ground with the same impact forces. It is only in head on collisions that that extra speed will make much difference.


When I came off my motorbike at 40 mph I ended up in hospital having gravel picked out of my aris, doubt that woul happen at 12mph.


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## Ming the Merciless (22 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> When I came off my motorbike at 40 mph I ended up in hospital having gravel picked out of my aris, doubt that woul happen at 12mph.



Gravel rash and impact force are not the same.


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> I don't think stowing away in the landing gear of an aircraft is quite the same as cycling!


That wasnt what happened. He was strolling along the runway when the tail end got hooked on his famous Y fronts.


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## SkipdiverJohn (22 Feb 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> Remember whether you come off at 12mph or 25mph you will hit the ground with the same impact forces. It is only in head on collisions that that extra speed will make much difference.



Not sure I agree entirely about the impact thing. Ever seen a high speed motorcycle racing spill, where the rider goes bouncing along the track, carried for a considerable distance by their momentum at the point they come off?


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> Gravel rash and impact force are not the same.


I realise that. I didnt mention impact I am generalising about coming off at speed and how much more likely (i think) that is at faster speeds.


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## Slioch (22 Feb 2019)

You need one of these...


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## MontyVeda (22 Feb 2019)

I'm much the same as Dave7... although i don't have a speedo so don't really know how fast i'm going, I always wimp out on descents these days, even on roads i know well. I almost had an off last summer, bombing down a little well known descent, only to find a bank of gravel in the middle of the road just at the bottom, crapped myself when the front wheel hit it and slid a bit. Another was bombing down a big hill out in Wyresdale somewhere... i could see the road ahead and seemed like i could just 'let go'... but the cattle grid just after a bit of a bend was unexpected. Didn't come off but did crap myself. I don't want surprises like that when i'm doing around 40mph


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## Ming the Merciless (22 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I realise that. I didnt mention impact I am generalising about coming off at speed and how much more likely (i think) that is at faster speeds.



I would have thought leathers protected against gravel rash but guess not.


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

YukonBoy said:


> I would have thought leathers protected against gravel rash but guess not.


I am sure they would have, if I was wearing them .
But it was 1966.


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## Dave7 (22 Feb 2019)

MontyVeda said:


> I'm much the same as Dave7... although i don't have a speedo so don't really know how fast i'm going, I always wimp out on descents these days, even on roads i know well. I almost had an off last summer, bombing down a little well known descent, only to find a bank of gravel in the middle of the road just at the bottom, crapped myself when the front wheel hit it and slid a bit. Another was bombing down a big hill out in Wyresdale somewhere... i could see the road ahead and seemed like i could just 'let go'... but the cattle grid just after a bit of a bend was unexpected. Didn't come off but did crap myself. I don't want surprises like that when i'm doing around 40mph


I hope the "crapping yourself" was metaphorical otherwise you will be the owner of some very messy shorts


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## lazybloke (22 Feb 2019)

I take descents much more slowly when not wearing a piece of expanded polystyrene on my head. 

I know lids are no good in a high speed crash, but risk compensation clearly doesn't listen to logic.


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## MontyVeda (22 Feb 2019)

Dave7 said:


> I hope the "crapping yourself" was metaphorical...


isn't it always?


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## Pat "5mph" (22 Feb 2019)

mudsticks said:


> Plus the downside of being a self employed landworker, is that if I'm broken in body, then I'm very quickly become broken in bank too


Same here, plus there's no one to feed BigCat if I'm incapacitated.


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## Salty seadog (22 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> Ha! I tweak the nose of fear, and laugh in the face of death.



Don't tell me you're hitting 27mph, you crazy fool, the human body cannot cope with this red hot maximum pace. Your innards would melt.......this may explain the y fronts.


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## Salty seadog (22 Feb 2019)

Still to break 50mph, my highest recorded is 49.6mph.


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## tyred (22 Feb 2019)

Life is too short to waste rushing around like an idiot. Slow down and enjoy the ride.


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## classic33 (23 Feb 2019)

tyred said:


> Life is too short to waste rushing around like an idiot. Slow down and enjoy the ride.


Enjoy the free speed gravity gives you.


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## Markymark (23 Feb 2019)

25 mph on a steep hill sounds about right to me. Probably a bit faster when going back down the other side.


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## Nebulous (23 Feb 2019)

I'm an adrenaline junkie. Going downhill fast on a bike is the best bit. I had a longtime ambition to break 50mph and finally did it last year, which was a bit of an anti-climax. 

Prior to that on a steep narrow country road with a sharp corner about 2/3rds of the way down I was convinced I'd done it. I was too busy trying to slow down enough to manage the corner to look at my garmin, but I got home, plugged it in to my computer and found 49.9mph. 

I also broke 49 on Glenshee, it would have been more, but there was a large bird of prey sitting on a rabbit in the middle of the road and I began to worry that it would fly off just as I reached it. I imagined it hitting me in the chest and killing both of us. 

Finally the night before the etape caledonia I did part of the course as a short ride to test my legs. Heading backdown to Pitlochry, against the direction of the route I hit a deep pothole at about 40mph on a tight corner. I swear, my wheel bounced out of the pothole, the front wheel moved sideways about 18" to 2' and I somehow managed to stay upright and carry on. 

I think one reason I'm so willing to accept risk is that I've never had a bad accident. The ones I have had I've been able to rationalise (as somebody else's fault.)


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## Illaveago (23 Feb 2019)

Drago said:


> I managed 670 knots before transonic buffeting caused a compression instability and I fell off.


Did you sense a knocking noise which became louder and then a voice saying " Hello , can I come in ? It isn't half cold out here ? "


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

Nebulous said:


> I'm an adrenaline junkie. Going downhill fast on a bike is the best bit. I had a longtime ambition to break 50mph and finally did it last year, which was a bit of an anti-climax.
> 
> Prior to that on a steep narrow country road with a sharp corner about 2/3rds of the way down I was convinced I'd done it. I was too busy trying to slow down enough to manage the corner to look at my garmin, but I got home, plugged it in to my computer and found 49.9mph.
> 
> ...



Aha that would be it then.

Fair play to you.. So long as I'm not coming up the steep narrow country road as you descend at 49.5mph .

When you've had a few more "Wow that was seriously painful" type incidents you start to be a little more cautious maybe?

I've had gravel in so deep that it took ten years to work its way out again (quite exciting when it actually does emerge)


Plus did enough charging about on hoss back as a kid to develop an aversion to hitting the ground quickly.

Think my body would prefer i leave the speed induced adrenalin to the youngsters now


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## DCBassman (23 Feb 2019)

Injuries requiring such niceties as joint replacement (ok, am an oldie too) can happen at any speed, in my case at between 0 and 2 mph...
If it's gonna hurt, it's gonna hurt no matter your speed!


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

DCBassman said:


> Injuries requiring such niceties as joint replacement (ok, am an oldie too) can happen at any speed, in my case at between 0 and 2 mph...
> If it's gonna hurt, it's gonna hurt no matter your speed!



Indeed esp on a bike - if you achieve 0 mph, and forget to put yr feet down 

But that doesn't hurt so bad as falling off at speed - ime


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## DCBassman (23 Feb 2019)

mudsticks said:


> Indeed esp on a bike - if you achieve 0 mph, and forget to put yr feet down
> 
> But that doesn't hurt so bad as falling off at speed - ime


It certainly reduced the gravel rash a lot!


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

DCBassman said:


> It certainly reduced the gravel rash a lot!



But then, on the other hand, hurt pride can take longer to heal than mere mortal flesh


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## DCBassman (23 Feb 2019)

Nah. After a day or two of moaning and groaning, I just think 'Dumbass' and move on. Usually to an X-ray department...


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

DCBassman said:


> Nah. After a day or two of moaning and groaning, I just think 'Dumbass' and move on. Usually to an X-ray department...



Definitely.. Being selective in memory has many upsides


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## Nebulous (23 Feb 2019)

mudsticks said:


> Aha that would be it then.
> 
> Fair play to you.. So long as I'm not coming up the steep narrow country road as you descend at 49.5mph .
> 
> ...



I'm certainly not a youngster but have never lost that thrill. I come from a fishing community, where risk was part of life, and there was a very fatalistic approach, so I think culture is very much part of it. 

I've had my share of broken bones, including a car coming through a give way sign when I was coming down a hill. I rolled over the bonnet, but had a sense of relief that I got off with two broken fingers. It still didn't curb my enthusiasm for that wheeeee moment.


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

Nebulous said:


> I'm certainly not a youngster but have never lost that thrill. I come from a fishing community, where risk was part of life, and there was a very fatalistic approach, so I think culture is very much part of it.
> 
> I've had my share of broken bones, including a car coming through a give way sign when I was coming down a hill. I rolled over the bonnet, but had a sense of relief that I got off with two broken fingers. It still didn't curb my enthusiasm for that wheeeee moment.



Yeah, I still get the wheeeeeee, moment,

it's also the thought of responsibilities that will fall on others, if I can't function physically, as a result of my momentary indulgence.

Boring grown up considerations, n all that.


Although my job as a farmer, has statistically overtaken deep sea fishing in terms of personal injury risk. 

So perhaps I should cycle more to stay safer.


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

Dogtrousers said:


> I'm with the OP, being aware of my non bounceability. I don't do it by numbers though, just feel. I know what the numbers are by looking at my max speed after the ride. Normally 50-odd kmh.
> 
> At 92kg I carry a bit more kinetic energy than most but am made of the same squishy stuff.



Maybe you surfeit of squishy stuff will provide some padding, on impact


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

Dogtrousers said:


> I'm not overweight, I'm just a big bugger. I kick sand in @Drago s face.



I did wonder if maybe it was all muscle and bone.

Shan't be challenging you to an arm wrestle then


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## mudsticks (23 Feb 2019)

Dogtrousers said:


> View attachment 454107



Nor that you're a secret ABBA fan 


In my defence they did create some cracking tunes for singing whilst cycling

(or tractor driving )


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## Vantage (23 Feb 2019)

DCBassman said:


> Injuries requiring such niceties as joint replacement (ok, am an oldie too) can happen at any speed, in my case at between 0 and 2 mph...
> If it's gonna hurt, it's gonna hurt no matter your speed!



0mph, I found myself plummeting towards the road on my right hand side on Wednesday.
It wouldn't have bothered me as much in my 20's, but at 42? Hurts like a sumbitch!


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## classic33 (23 Feb 2019)

Markymark said:


> *25 mph on a steep hill sounds about right to me. *Probably a bit faster when going back down the other side.


Derestricted?


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## SkipdiverJohn (23 Feb 2019)

Vantage said:


> 0mph, I found myself plummeting towards the road on my right hand side on Wednesday.]



Let me take a wild guess; clipless pedals?


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## DCBassman (23 Feb 2019)

Vantage said:


> 0mph, I found myself plummeting towards the road on my right hand side on Wednesday.
> It wouldn't have bothered me as much in my 20's, but at 42? Hurts like a sumbitch!
> 
> View attachment 454124


At 65, bits threaten to fall off, never mind the pain!


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## Edwardoka (23 Feb 2019)

I have lost some of the enthusiasm I used to have for my impetuous descending style (I seem to remember a blurry @Pat "5mph" describing me as "bloody reckless" on a muddy descent one time but it might just have been the noise of the air rushing past)

These days I tend to restrain myself to 70mph or so.


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## fossyant (23 Feb 2019)

I still do plus 25 MPH off road, where possible.


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## Dave7 (24 Feb 2019)

In my youth (a short while ago) myself and 2 mates cycled over the Horseshoe Pass on 3 speed Sturmey Archer bikes. The speedo only went up to 40 but we were WELL over that. No fears when you are just 16.
But that was 56 years ago


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## Milkfloat (24 Feb 2019)

My flawed logic tells me that the faster you go the more likely you are to be keeping up with traffic and therefore the safer you are. Well that’s my excuse anyway.


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## Vantage (24 Feb 2019)

Milkfloat said:


> My flawed logic tells me that the faster you go the more likely you are to be keeping up with traffic and therefore the safer you are. Well that’s my excuse anyway.



Richard Balantine wrote as much in his book and its a belief of mine too. 
Can't do it myself though...I'm too slow


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## Threevok (24 Feb 2019)

48 mph is the fastest I can find on Strava - and that was downhill on road on a GT Avalanche 2 MTB with knobbly tyres and spinning out.

Best I don't have a road bike methinks


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## boydj (24 Feb 2019)

Ultimate max speed does depend somewhat on the quality of the road surface. On the descent into Lochranza on Arran I bailed out just shy of 50mph because my glasses were rattling so much I was having trouble seeing the road. On Mallorca, I went comfortably faster because the road surface was excellent. On a good surface, speed is limited more by gravity and wind resistance, though I think you'd need to be very aero to get much above 55mph or so.


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## confusedcyclist (28 Feb 2019)

You never know what's around the corner

View: https://youtu.be/rmJMUuu6xfU

I once reached terminal velocity falling from the lofty heights of me saddle, it wasn't pretty.


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## dutchguylivingintheuk (1 Mar 2019)

Milkfloat said:


> My flawed logic tells me that the faster you go the more likely you are to be keeping up with traffic and therefore the safer you are. Well that’s my excuse anyway.


depends on what you have behind you, if i hear a car making much more noise than it has speed because all of it's 'performance' exhaust and tweaks i gladly stop peddling for a few seconds to let them pas rather see them in a tree in front of me then having them next to me for a prolonged time are doing dangerous things just to get past.


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## Milzy (1 Mar 2019)

Only 37.5 yesterday but it wasn’t a long or steep hill. I know a few who decende slow & steady but can make up for it by climbing fast.


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