# Le Tour - Stage 4 - ***SPOILER***



## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Well?

Astana, Garmin, Cervelo, Columbia....?


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## Landslide (7 Jul 2009)

Garmin.

Astana will roll over the line in two separate groups - The Lancers vs Berty's Allsorts!


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

Landslide said:


> Garmin.
> 
> Astana will roll over the line in two separate groups - The Lancers vs Berty's Allsorts!



Yeah but 5 and 4 works, 4 and 5 doesn't!


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## Landslide (7 Jul 2009)

Who's 5 and who's 4 should show the camp's true colours!


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

I think Columbia will take it today. They have been so strong in the first couple of days.


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

kennykool said:


> I think Columbia will take it today. They have been so strong in the first couple of days.



Kenny, Kenny - Lance is in Astana not Colombia


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Bertie's in a no-win situation, he's got to pull to further his own cause, but to do so puts Lance in a dominant position, and if he doesn't.......?


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Nice one Rich

Lance has more important things on his mind at the moment tho - like how he will get Berty Boy to sleep in for the start of the first Mountain stage 

Some Night Nurse should do the trick or if all the stroies were to be believed I'm sure Dr Michele Ferrari can help him out  

Is he still in the free world actually???


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## zimzum42 (7 Jul 2009)

I think everyone seems to be forgetting that it's very likely that Contador will leave Lance for dead on the mountains. He did just that in the giro and was riding totally within himself...


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Yeah agree ZimZum - thats why Lance has to hope he'll sleep in for the one of the mounatin stages 

What a great start to the Tour!!!!


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

zimzum42 said:


> I think everyone seems to be forgetting that it's very likely that Contador will leave Lance for dead on the mountains. He did just that in the giro and was riding totally within himself...



True but LA will be stronger than he was when recovering on the Giro. I still think Bertie will do it but a nice tangle awaits.


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

LA is no slouch in the mountains, and rode the Giro with a recently broken collarbone. Has Bertie peaked too soon in the season?


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## garrilla (7 Jul 2009)

DO you think that Astana will put on a show of unity of today, false or otherwise? Bertie will come into his own on Fri with a 2km climb up to Andorra and then the race within a race will really start.

Columbia or Cervelo for the TTT today.


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## Skip Madness (7 Jul 2009)

ComedyPilot said:


> Has Bertie peaked too soon in the season?


I don't think so. There was the danger of it, and it certainly happened to Leipheimer, who eventually ran to empty in the Giro. Contador took an important break and rode the Dauphiné very conservatively by his standards. Without knowing for certain, I reckon he has judged his preparation pretty much perfectly.


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## Skip Madness (7 Jul 2009)

Oh yeah, better make a prediction for the stage, too.

Not sure about time gaps (they will most likely be fairly small among these teams), but I reckon the finishing order will be:

(1) Columbia
(2) Garmin
(3) Astana
(4) Saxo Bank
(5) RaboBank


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Skip Madness said:


> I don't think so. There was the danger of it, and it certainly happened to Leipheimer, who eventually ran to empty in the Giro. Contador took an important break and rode the Dauphiné very conservatively by his standards. Without knowing for certain, I reckon he has judged his preparation pretty much perfectly.



Good call, although when it was flat and windy he did nothing IMO to help or consolidate his 'position' as GC team leader by getting up there and pulling with LA and the Columbia express.

I just don't see how today (being a TTT) will help Bertie, he's damned if he does, he's damned if he doesn't.


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## Skip Madness (7 Jul 2009)

I think Contador really needs to look beyond Armstrong for the time being. It's daft to pretend there isn't a lot of tension there, but today is the day to stick it to some other rivals - chiefly Evans, Sastre and Menchov. Contador is only 19 seconds down on Armstrong - he can worry about that at Arcalís and, more seriously, the Alps.


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Skip Madness said:


> I think Contador really needs to look beyond Armstrong for the time being. It's daft to pretend there isn't a lot of tension there, but today is the day to stick it to some other rivals - chiefly Evans, Sastre and Menchov. Contador is only 19 seconds down on Armstrong - he can worry about that at Arcalís and, more seriously, the Alps.



Fair do's, but do you think Brown-eel (sp) will allow the team to run so long without a defined GC leader? 

And if at a later point in the tour LA or Bertie are GC team leaders, will How-Now-Brown-Cow allow in-fighting to ruin chances of a Champs-Elysee victory?


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

ComedyPilot said:


> Fair do's, but do you think Brown-eel (sp) will allow the team to run so long without a defined GC leader?


Astana said pre-tour that Berto was the leader.

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/contador-named-astanas-tour-leader-22177

100% OF FACT.


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

John the Monkey said:


> Astana said pre-tour that Berto was the leader.
> 
> http://www.bikeradar.com/news/article/contador-named-astanas-tour-leader-22177
> 
> 100% OF FACT.



what is said and the truth are often very different.


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## yello (7 Jul 2009)

After reading this and thinking it was too early to start calling for the leader's role, I wondered whether LA is just ramping up the pressure on Contador (or even deflecting attention from him??). Hmmmm....

Anyway, today. Columbia and Garmin also have a chance of putting their man in yellow... and I'd really love to see Wiggins top of the podium! So it should be fiercely contested. I'm not sure Columbia having put in a lot of work yesterday will make any difference, they'll still be up for it. I'm hoping for a Garmin win but I can't see them taking it by the necessary to put Wiggins in yellow. 

I reckon Contador's got to play his part today, he needs the time. 

I reckon it'll be Astana, Garmin, Columbia.


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## Will1985 (7 Jul 2009)

+1. When push comes to shove, more of the Astana team will fall into line behind Lance.


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

_The team time-trial is making a comeback in the Tour de France, but with one major change: the time recorded on the line will be taken into account without tables. Real time is still the absolute rule at the 2009 Tour. That is also why the route in Montpellier is short._

Can anybody explain what is meant by 'without tables'? Does each rider score individually?


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## Landslide (7 Jul 2009)

dellzeqq said:


> Can anybody explain what is meant by 'without tables'?



That ASO have given up all hope of things being "above board".


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## Noodley (7 Jul 2009)

Columbia for today's stage, and Martin in Yellow


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## garrilla (7 Jul 2009)

The 'tables' were a matrix used to adjust the GC position so that big differences in the TTT didn't have such a big impact on the overall classification. Basically, the time posted on the TTT will be added to the GC times. AFAIK.


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## simon_brooke (7 Jul 2009)

rich p said:


> True but LA will be stronger than he was when recovering on the Giro. I still think Bertie will do it but a nice tangle awaits.



Lance doesn't have to attack Contador in the mountains, he only has to defend - and he's shown over seven victories that he's very, very good at defending. Furthermore, I think that Lance will care a lot more about beating Contador than he will about beating Sastre and the Schleck brothers.

Today? Columbia, but not by 33 seconds over Saxo.


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## yello (7 Jul 2009)

simon_brooke said:


> Lance doesn't have to attack Contador in the mountains, he only has to defend



I think, more realistically, he'll have to hang on! He can't 'defend' against his own team mate.... can he??


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## garrilla (7 Jul 2009)

User3094 said:


> Anyone seen a schedule for start times?



http://www.letour.fr/2009/TDF/LIVE/us/400/etape_par_etape.html

Select the 'Time Schedule' tab


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

Good god.

Menchov needs training wheels for the tour, ffs.

My pick for today would be Garmin...


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

Maybe the rest of the team should buy a tag-along for Menchov


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

johnnyh said:


> Maybe the rest of the team should buy a tag-along for Menchov



You do wonder.

I like him as a rider, and he had a good Giro (imo) but the tour always seems to make him nervous - remember him coming off when he was going away with Sastre last year?

Mind you, Ballan off at the same corner as Menchov, apparently - and Le Blaireau on the recce, according to Eurosport!


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## simon_brooke (7 Jul 2009)

Have you seen that road surface! We run the Girvan race on better roads than that!


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

Bbox go off-roading - sheeesh


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## simon_brooke (7 Jul 2009)

Hey! Bouygues! It's not _meant _to be cyclocross!


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## karlos_the_jackal (7 Jul 2009)

Whoever of the top riders finish this TTT without injury would be an acheivement it seems


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## dtp (7 Jul 2009)

Anyone know of any website streaming the TT live? 

Can't seem to find one


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## PpPete (7 Jul 2009)

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/klitschko


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

hens teeth, they're going down like flies!


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## dtp (7 Jul 2009)

Thanks


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## PpPete (7 Jul 2009)

http://teampilipinas.info/2009/07/tour-de-france-2009-free-live-stream.html


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Jeezy Peeps - the road does look a little dodgy at bits


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

It's a bit of an odd parcours for a TTT.


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

Blinking heck, Garmin down to 5 already!


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

oh well, it's Lance time!...


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

Eurosport were talking about gravel on the road - explains the crashes and slips - little stones are a bugger under high pressure tyres.


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Cancellarra just looks at home in a time trial - Leading his team well!


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Lance is also looking quite at home at the front of Astana


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## Halfmanhalfbike (7 Jul 2009)

What a course! It would be bad enough for an individual TT never mind a TTT. Great sport though


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## karlos_the_jackal (7 Jul 2009)

I think Garmin gamble of dropping riders that early might pay off


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

rich p said:


> Blinking heck, Garmin down to 5 already!


given the condition of the road that's pretty brave


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

Astana second fastest at the first check! Lance is getting measured up for the jersey!


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

User3094 said:


> Stupid question but whys Contador in different colours?



He's in yellow


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

champion of Spain?


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

Thats right he is the spanish National champion


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

dellzeqq said:


> given the condition of the road that's pretty brave



Planned do you think, then?


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

rich p said:


> Planned do you think, then?


The TdF site says it's planned, but..phew!

Tony Martin can forget about the podium girls. Colombia look out of it at the second checkpoint. 

Astana are scorching - 23 seconds clear at the second checkpoint!


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## alecstilleyedye (7 Jul 2009)

it's yellow for armstrong almost certainly…


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

Fair play to Garmin - they're going to be second on the day.


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## Halfmanhalfbike (7 Jul 2009)

Now Astana know whats needed. LA prob in yellow. Who would have thunk it
The Tour just got interesting


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

Colombia 40 seconds down on Garmin at 3rd checkpoint. Whoops!


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

has to be said, Lance looks very comfortable.


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

Kenny, yellow on the road for LA


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

I know Rich - how exciting????

never thought I'd see that again!


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Columbia 4th (so far)


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## dodgy (7 Jul 2009)

Brilliant stage this, I'm rooting for Lance (sorry)


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

Astana 41 seconds ahead of Saxo at the 3rd checkpoint!

Can't they do something to make this Tour just a little bit interesting????


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

With Garmin's performance today, Wiggy could have had Yellow. Will have to see if Asatna blow up?


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

dodgy said:


> Brilliant stage this, I'm rooting for Lance (sorry)




Dont apologies - I'm proud of you!


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## Halfmanhalfbike (7 Jul 2009)

Just shows how important yesterdays split was


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

40 seconds!!!


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## johnnyh (7 Jul 2009)

Whatever happens to Lance in the rest of the Tour, to come back at 37 and be in contention for the yellow is an amazing achievement.
Fair play!


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## biking_fox (7 Jul 2009)

1s in it by my sums!


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Cancellara might still have yellow!!


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They're going to have to use the Duckworth-Lewis method!


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Cancellara in Yellow!!!


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## dodgy (7 Jul 2009)

kennykool said:


> Dont apologies - I'm proud of you!


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## kennykool (7 Jul 2009)

So close for Lance


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## garrilla (7 Jul 2009)

LA only in 2nd. Cancellara keeps the Maillot jaune


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## biking_fox (7 Jul 2009)

TdF newsflashes have LA in Yellow, his 84th of his career! But it's very very close. Maybe 10ths of second!

Mountains tomorrow? Surely LA will stretch gain time there?


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## RabbitFood (7 Jul 2009)

what another amazing stage Cancellara still in yellow


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

from the TdF site


*17:30 - Fraction Of A Second To Decide Lead*

_The Astana team is 40" ahead of Saxo Bank. That’s the time that Armstrong had to make up to take the yellow jersey. We await confirmation on who is in the yellow jersey but whoever it is, it’s going to be a fraction of a second..._

_*17:29 - Astana Win By 17"!*_

_The Astana team has won the fourth stage. This is a double triumph as Lance is about to receive his 84th yellow jersey in the Tour de France._


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## rich p (7 Jul 2009)

biking_fox said:


> TdF newsflashes have LA in Yellow, his 84th of his career! But it's very very close. Maybe 10ths of second!
> 
> Mountains tomorrow? Surely LA will stretch gain time there?



Flat tomorrow.


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

TdF now has Cancellara in yellow, Astana second, third, fourth, fifth, Wiggers in sixth


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## biking_fox (7 Jul 2009)

Bad day for Evans - 2'59 down. That's a long way to come back from this early in the tour, Sastre in the same trouble at 2'44 and Schleck at 1'41 really looks like it's between LA and Conti - unless Cancerella can hold on through the bumpy bits? Does he really have a chance?


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## CotterPin (7 Jul 2009)

Wow - I need a sit down after all that.

Mind you, shame about Garmin. They seem to be turning into a team of Poulidors - just never quite making it. Which is why I like 'em so much


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## Skip Madness (7 Jul 2009)

biking_fox said:


> looks like it's between LA and Conti - unless Cancerella can hold on through the bumpy bits? Does he really have a chance?


No.


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## maurice (7 Jul 2009)

And who said Lance's return wasn't good for the tour?!

Awesome stuff, gripping!


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## dellzeqq (7 Jul 2009)

biking_fox said:


> Bad day for Evans - 2'59 down. That's a long way to come back from this early in the tour, Sastre in the same trouble at 2'44 and Schleck at 1'41 really looks like it's between LA and Conti - unless Cancerella can hold on through the bumpy bits? Does he really have a chance?


I think that's a little premature.


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## simon_brooke (7 Jul 2009)

alecstilleyedye said:


> it's yellow for armstrong almost certainly…





Halfmanhalfbike said:


> Now Astana know whats needed. LA prob in yellow. Who would have thunk it
> The Tour just got interesting





User3094 said:


> LA in yellow by 1 sec at 3rd split.



Ha! How does crow taste?



biking_fox said:


> Bad day for Evans - 2'59 down. That's a long way to come back from this early in the tour, Sastre in the same trouble at 2'44 and Schleck at 1'41 really looks like it's between LA and Conti - unless Cancerella can hold on through the bumpy bits? Does he really have a chance?



Yes. He was first in the Tour of Switzerland this year, and towed the whole peloton over the Galibier on Stage 17 last year. He's a big man and doesn't have a lot of acceleration in the mountains, but he can climb. He's also lost a fair bit of weight this year. Furthermore, if the team decide to make him their leader, they are one hell of a team - as they showed today.

I'm not saying he will do it - I think probably not - but it's not an outside chance.


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## Cathryn (7 Jul 2009)

Awesome day's cycling. Kind of wish I hadn't checked the results before watching it on TV. Credit to Lance..don't like the bloke but he's doing incredibly well.


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

Ride of the day to Garmin, 25k out with 5 men!!!


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

By gum.

Surprised Saxo did so well, gutted for Garmin (seems to be my common refrain these days).

The other teams will have to do something pretty spectacular in the mountains to dislodge the Borats' grip on the GC, won't they? Odd to see Lance's conversion to the idea of multiple leaders on one team voiced by the man himself in interview...


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## Chuffy (7 Jul 2009)

John the Monkey said:


> By gum.
> 
> Surprised Saxo did so well, gutted for Garmin (seems to be my common refrain these days).


About 20% difference perhaps? 



> The other teams will have to do something pretty spectacular in the mountains to dislodge the Borats' grip on the GC, won't they? Odd to see Lance's conversion to the idea of multiple leaders on one team voiced by the man himself in interview...


I presume that as we're all aware of cancer now he must have more time to devote to the racing side of things. Seems like he's shifting position from stage to stage. By Stage 14 I fully expect Bertie to be found floating, half eaten, in a tank full of sharks while LA strokes a fluffy white cat and gloats over a really big map of the world.


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## yello (7 Jul 2009)

John the Monkey said:


> Odd to see Lance's conversion to the idea of multiple leaders on one team voiced by the man himself in interview...



I mentioned that in another thread and nobody picked up on it.... 

...but, yes, wouldn't have happened in his day would it 

I was expecting Columbia to have done better... perhaps they were a little tired. Good to see Cav paying back to the team too, he was not shurking.

I too was hoping Garmin would win today but wasn't expecting it. Saxo did better than I was expecting though.

I didn't think it was the best TTT course I've seen though. I thought it a bit, um, 'technical' I guess is the euphamism!


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## stoatsngroats (7 Jul 2009)

maurice said:


> And who said Lance's return wasn't good for the tour?!
> 
> Awesome stuff, gripping!



+1


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## mike e (7 Jul 2009)

Bouygues Telecom would have been better off on cyclo cross bikes


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

yello said:


> I mentioned that in another thread and nobody picked up on it....
> 
> ...but, yes, wouldn't have happened in his day would it
> 
> ...



Or saving themselves for another 'cross-wind massacre' tomorrow?


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

Chuffy said:


> About 20% difference perhaps?


I try to watch the tour uncynical.

That give me the joy of that punch in the guts "you f*****g mug" feeling once the retrospective test results are released...



> I presume that as we're all aware of cancer now he must have more time to devote to the racing side of things. Seems like he's shifting position from stage to stage. By Stage 14 I fully expect Bertie to be found floating, half eaten, in a tank full of sharks while LA strokes a fluffy white cat and gloats over a really big map of the world.


Tish and pshaw!

There were tanks of sharks everywhere today, and me and my cat just happened to be on the right side of the bridge over that particular one when it suddenly opened, innit.


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

yello said:


> I mentioned that in another thread and nobody picked up on it....


I only saw it on tonight's highlights show just now, yello, no slight intended!


> ...but, yes, wouldn't have happened in his day would it


It might have done.

But there would have been CONSEQUENCES.


> I was expecting Columbia to have done better... perhaps they were a little tired. Good to see Cav paying back to the team too, he was not shurking.


Columbia seem to be able to win at will on the flat stages - maybe that's enough for them? Their sponsors will be happy, I'd imagine.


> I didn't think it was the best TTT course I've seen though. I thought it a bit, um, 'technical' I guess is the euphamism!


I like it, even though it did for poor old Denis - mind you, I liked the Giro TT course too...


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## Noodley (7 Jul 2009)

Chuffy said:


> I presume that as we're all aware of cancer....a really big map of the world.



***STOP PRESS***

Man in Nicaraguan forest has not heard of cancer and Lance's saintly crusade to single handedly cure it...someone send him a tweet to let him know.

***STOP PRESS***


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## John the Monkey (7 Jul 2009)

Noodley said:


> ***STOP PRESS***
> 
> Man in Nicaraguan forest has not heard of cancer and Lance's saintly crusade to single handedly cure it...someone send him a tweet to let him know.
> 
> ***STOP PRESS***


How can this be?

Lance has been riding his bike _REALLY_ fast.


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## Noodley (7 Jul 2009)

John the Monkey said:


> How can this be?
> 
> Lance has been riding his bike _REALLY_ fast.



***BIG PROBLEM IDENTIFIED***

Lance has been riding his bike REALLY fast in countries where people already know about the fight against cancer.

***BIG PROBLEM IDENTIFIED***


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## ComedyPilot (7 Jul 2009)

I have Twittered LA, but not that. Just waiting for a reply, who knows, I might have a FAMOUS cyber-mate.


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## Speicher (7 Jul 2009)

Did anyone hear Mr Leggitt saying "he must get all his _prawns_ to the front"


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## Crackle (7 Jul 2009)

Speicher said:


> Did anyone hear Mr Leggitt saying "he must get all his _prawns_ to the front"




Yus


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## Toshiba Boy (7 Jul 2009)

Speicher said:


> Did anyone hear Mr Leggitt saying "he must get all his _prawns_ to the front"



+1


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## scook94 (7 Jul 2009)

Really? I heard pawns...


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

Of course, I wasn't going to bother watching the Tour this year. It's only thanks to Team LA turning up to make me aware of cancer that I'm tuning in at all.

Did the Tour happen in the last three years? LA wasn't riding so I assume not. Could anyone fill me in?


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## johnnyh (8 Jul 2009)

gosh you're a cynical lot


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## Will1985 (8 Jul 2009)

Chuffy said:


> Did the Tour happen in the last three years? LA wasn't riding so I assume not. Could anyone fill me in?


Sure! The first year in 2006, to try and wean the fans off Lance a bit slower an American who used to ride for Lance finished in yellow. The heroic element of the story was that Mr Landis had a wrecked hip and was riding the Tour in pain. Celebrations were a little premature when his incredible solo escape turned out to be fuelled by drugs, so the organisers gave yellow to a Spaniard instead.

Next in 2007 taking advantage of a new loophole, a chicken entered the race and was winning until stage 16 when somebody claimed they had spotted the chicken in the wrong coop. His team withdrew him from the Tour, leaving a Spanish lad to wear the maillot jaune. To continue with the heroic comeback theme of the past decade, this chap once had brain surgery to correct a genetic complaint and still bears visible scars.

In 2008 the Spanish brain boy wasn't allowed to come back because his new team had been employing some drugged up Soviets, so he had to make do with just winning the Giro. This left the race wide open and the maillot jaune changed hands many times - first between two suspected/implicated dopers, then an Australian with a high voice and a poodle before ending up as CSC-SaxoBank property. At the end a quiet Spanish climber finished in yellow after riding the TT of his life to finish only 30 seconds slower than Aussie poodle lover. 

Sadly the winner had no heroic story to tell and was brushed aside when he came to Monaco because the celebrities were back in town.


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

Will1985 said:


> Sure! The first year in 2006, to try and wean the fans off Lance a bit slower an American who used to ride for Lance finished in yellow. The heroic element of the story was that Mr Landis had a wrecked hip and was riding the Tour in pain. Celebrations were a little premature when his incredible solo escape turned out to be fuelled by drugs, so the organisers gave yellow to a Spaniard instead.
> 
> Next in 2007 taking advantage of a new loophole, a chicken entered the race and was winning until stage 16 when somebody claimed they had spotted the chicken in the wrong coop. His team withdrew him from the Tour, leaving a Spanish lad to wear the maillot jaune. To continue with the heroic comeback theme of the past decade, this chap once had brain surgery to correct a genetic complaint and still bears visible scars.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the explanation Will. I guess that the Tour didn't really happen in the last three years then. Phew, not only have I been made aware of cancer, I've also been spared a fourth year without a Tour! Yay Lance!


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

User3094 said:


> I think if the Lance-meister had come back without a "cause" - the response would have been quite a bit worse.
> 
> (vain, selfish "money" rider yada yada)


Yes, because without him there doing his best to screw Bertie over the whole of Europe would be oblivious to cancer. HEY EUROPE! CANCER EXISTS!

Or was the whole cancer awareness thing a teensy bit of a smokescreen to deflect the inevitable criticism surrounding his return? Hmmmmm....


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

John the Monkey said:


> I try to watch the tour uncynical.
> 
> That give me the joy of that punch in the guts "you f*****g mug" feeling once the retrospective test results are released...


Heh, that 20% comment was purely gratuitous btw.


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

User3094 said:


> If the man hadnt suffered himself and started the whole yellow wrist band thing years ago, then I might agree with you re. his return.


I think it's possible to believe two things simultaneously:
1) He's very serious about campaigning/fund-raising etc. I don't doubt his commitment to that, for obvious reasons.
2) He's capable of using the whole cancer thing as a shield. Slag him and you're slagging cancer survivors, what kind of b*stard are you? That kind of angle. When The Great Comeback was announced it was all hung on a peg of raising cancer awareness. As time has gone on (and you can see it in progressive post-stage interviews) it's pretty damn clear that his only motive was to win. Those of us who have a slightly, _less than favourable_ view of him said that this would always be the case, but there were many more who said 'no, he's doing this to raise awareness of cancer, the man is a god, how dare you criticise him'. For some reason this evokes a slightly less than respectful response...


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## rich p (8 Jul 2009)

Did the $2m dollar appearance fee , sorry donation, he got for entering the Giro go to the profit or not-for-profit side of Livestrong?

BTW, what is this new disease that no-one has been researching called?
It's not the one that that this charity is involved in, is it?

http://www.cancerresearchuk.org/aboutus/whoweare/factsaboutus/
_
We are the world's leading independent organisation dedicated to cancer research

In the financial year 2007/08 our total scientific spend was £333 million


The charity supports research into all aspects of cancer through the work of more than 4,500 scientists, doctors and nurses_



Where would they be without LA?


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## John the Monkey (8 Jul 2009)

User3094 said:


> .... hate the whole big bold brash win-at-all-costs yank mentallity. Thats why hes not liked.


Hmm.

I'm not a fan of the attitude, but for me, it's the way he's come back to the sport and p*ssed on the promises he made about transparency and the anti-doping programme more than anything. 

I don't want it to be 2005 again, personally.


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## kennykool (8 Jul 2009)

Speicher said:


> Did anyone hear Mr Leggitt saying "he must get all his _prawns_ to the front"




ha ha - I thought thats what I said cos I repeated it out loud - my wife asked what the hell I was on about....are they really called Prawns??? she asked


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## Chuffy (8 Jul 2009)

kennykool said:


> ha ha - I thought thats what I said cos I repeated it out loud - my wife asked what the hell I was on about....are they really called Prawns??? she asked


With a team that smells as fishy as Astana it seem strangely appropriate...


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## John the Monkey (8 Jul 2009)

Forget who said it, but there was speculation on Twitter yesterday as to whether Kloden could turn up in an "I went to Freiburg, And All I got was this lousy blood transfusion" t-shirt and still have that unfortunate business generally ignored...


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