# does using a camera



## dr snuggles (1 Mar 2015)

Automatically turn you into a nob? 
I've been wanting to get one for a while now but I'm afraid I'm gonna turn into one of these vigilantes.
I make mistakes, I know that so would like to review situations to see what I could have done better. It could have come in handy with a recent taxi driver situation as well.
Be interesting to hear from fellow commuters who do use them and whether or not (truthfully) it has changed them.


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## Drago (1 Mar 2015)

That's a fair point. Why don't the Camera Qaeda post up footage of their own terrible riding?


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## theFire (1 Mar 2015)

Drago said:


> That's a fair point. Why don't the Camera Qaeda post up footage of their own terrible riding?



Don't be silly, every cyclist with a camera is perfect. They never make mistakes! Never ever ever....

Well almost never.... just sometimes, once in a while 


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsmC1Vh0ibI


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## andyfraser (1 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> Automatically turn you into a nob?
> I've been wanting to get one for a while now but I'm afraid I'm gonna turn into one of these vigilantes.
> I make mistakes, I know that so would like to review situations to see what I could have done better. It could have come in handy with a recent taxi driver situation as well.
> Be interesting to hear from fellow commuters who do use them and whether or not (truthfully) it has changed them.


I haven't got round to buying a camera because I'm worried I'd got mad. There are a few times when being about to send footage to a coach company or the police would make me feel like I'm doing something positive. I can then see me 6 months down the line shouting out registration numbers for the benefit of YouTube.


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## Sharky (1 Mar 2015)

I'm not convinced yet. A camera would be good evidence in an actual accident, but the evidence could be used against you. All these films we keep seeing of near misses and confrontations, sometimes amusing, but I don't think really adds. I just wonder what is going to happen with the irate driver who has just been pushed into a confrontation by a cyclist. Will he be more tolerant with the next cyclist he sees, or will he treat all cyclists with increased contempt?


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## byegad (1 Mar 2015)

Drago said:


> That's a fair point. Why don't the Camera Qaeda post up footage of their own terrible riding?



They do! But not on purpose. While some posted footage does show good riding a lot shows the opposite.


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## jonny jeez (1 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> Automatically turn you into a nob?
> I've been wanting to get one for a while now but I'm afraid I'm gonna turn into one of these vigilantes.
> I make mistakes, I know that so would like to review situations to see what I could have done better. It could have come in handy with a recent taxi driver situation as well.
> Be interesting to hear from fellow commuters who do use them and whether or not (truthfully) it has changed them.


No it doesn't automatically turn you into a nob, don't worry.

But from my own personal experience,(I filmed my rides as a black box recorder) it does make a difference to the enjoyment of riding.

I filmed my rides for s few years and eventually found that reviewing others mistakes kind of made me "hang on" to the negative experience, as opposed to just moving on .

I chose to never post negative videos on the web as I just thought it was unbalanced, after all no one posts hours and hours of enjoyable trouble free riding.

I personally only film important rides so that I can make highlight videos like my lejog ride, now and never commute with my go pro anymore.

Ps the constant downloading, reviewing and editing is proper time consuming and I don't have time for that so used to just delete everything as soon as I arrived at my destination, after a few years of non incident, I just stopped.


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## Sara_H (1 Mar 2015)

I find the opposite.
When I started using a camera I found I was less likely to tut, shake my head or in any other way react negatively to errant driver behaviour as I know that if the footage was ever viewed such reactions are likely to be used as mitigation by and on behalf of the errant drivers in question.
I've never posted any footage any where of close passes etc, I literally only have it in case something happens.
Sods law of course that the day I did get knocked over I didn't have it on.


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## AndyRM (1 Mar 2015)

To answer your question: No.

I read an article the other day about the perception of danger. Changed my thinking about the use of cameras.


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## Turbo (1 Mar 2015)

Sara_H said:


> I find the opposite.
> When I started using a camera I found I was less likely to tut, shake my head or in any other way react negatively to errant driver behaviour as I know that if the footage was ever viewed such reactions are likely to be used as mitigation by and on behalf of the errant drivers in question.
> I've never posted any footage any where of close passes etc, I literally only have it in case something happens.
> Sods law of course that the day I did get knocked over I didn't have it on.


+1


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## dr snuggles (1 Mar 2015)

AndyRM said:


> To answer your question: No.
> 
> I read an article the other day about the perception of danger. Changed my thinking about the use of cameras.


You care to elaborate?


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## AndyRM (1 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> You care to elaborate?



So originally I viewed those 'close pass' (etc) videos online with disdain as I didn't think they were close at all, without even considering what others might perceive as close. 

The article I read (I think it was in Cycling Plus) made me realise that folk react in different ways on the road, and I suppose that cameras make them feel a bit more secure.


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## Drago (1 Mar 2015)

It doesn't actually make the rider any more secure though.


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## Markymark (1 Mar 2015)

.....and again. You only see the videos of people who out up videos. They are a subsection of people with cameras. Some only use them to report dabgerous driving rather than creating conflicts for YouTube hits.

Therefore your view is weighted by a subsection of users as by definition, the larger group do not all post videos.


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## ufkacbln (1 Mar 2015)

Sara_H said:


> I find the opposite.
> When I started using a camera I found I was less likely to tut, shake my head or in any other way react negatively to errant driver behaviour as I know that if the footage was ever viewed such reactions are likely to be used as mitigation by and on behalf of the errant drivers in question.
> I've never posted any footage any where of close passes etc, I literally only have it in case something happens.
> Sods law of course that the day I did get knocked over I didn't have it on.




Perhaps we should add cameras to the Helmets and Headphones ghetto as there is a biased and immovable view?

I agree with the above. 

The only footage I keep is where the driving is unacceptable and the video is used to demonstrate this


I have a 100% hit rate where I have used video the driver has either been censured, warned, sacked or the matter dealt with by the Police


If the biased few consider dealing with dangerous driving in an effective, calm and non-confrontational manner being a nob, then I am guilty!


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## ufkacbln (1 Mar 2015)

Drago said:


> It doesn't actually make the rider any more secure though.




It does!


There are a number of times where stupid moves have been prevented by the camera.

Classic example the other night approaching a set of red lights.

In "primary" and a car starts to force it's way past an inch away from the right wheel.

Smile, point out camera and the driver suddenly changes their mind and decides to wait in an orderly manner

Same with a local taxi firm.

Had two of their drivers fined or issued with penalty points due to stupid overtakes at a pinch point near their office

Word got around that I have a cemara nad will report dangerous driving..... amazing how careful and courteous they can be 

So yes a camera CAN make you safer


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## CopperBrompton (1 Mar 2015)

I've used a bikecam for several years, and have posted online exactly one example of stupid driving and made exactly one complaint based on camera footage.

To me, a bikecam has two benefits. First, when you are on the wrong end of bad driving, you know you have the power to embarrass them on YouTube or report them should you wish. That enables me to simply shrug it off and not let it spoil my ride.

Second, and more importantly, you can enjoy looking back on some fun rides.


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## jonny jeez (1 Mar 2015)

Sara_H said:


> I find the opposite.
> When I started using a camera I found I was less likely to tut, shake my head or in any other way react negatively to errant driver behaviour as I know that if the footage was ever viewed such reactions are likely to be used as mitigation by and on behalf of the errant drivers in question.
> I've never posted any footage any where of close passes etc, I literally only have it in case something happens.
> Sods law of course that the day I did get knocked over I didn't have it on.


If you are replying to mine then to be clear...I'm not suggesting a camera makes you ACT negatively, in the moment.

I'm saying it makes you hang on to negativity.

reviewing footage to see if you were in the right, prooving you were right for sure (you knew you were already) and getting upset all over again...hours after the incident has passed.

Then worse still, posting it and having others contribute toward an ever more growing negativity.

I found the camera offered too much opportunity for me to revisit stuff that I would have just shrugged off...and do today, that isn't really dangerous or bad...or deliberate.

Imagine having one record every moment of your life, every rude person in the street, every disagreement, row, poor experience. Then reviewing all that again each night.

Drive you mad.

If you are recording for a cause, a project or perhaps as @gaz does, to try and educate, then I get it but In General, I found it a burden...emotionally.


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## dr snuggles (1 Mar 2015)

Sara_H said:


> I find the opposite.
> When I started using a camera I found I was less likely to tut, shake my head or in any other way react negatively to errant driver behaviour as I know that if the footage was ever viewed such reactions are likely to be used as mitigation by and on behalf of the errant drivers in question.
> I've never posted any footage any where of close passes etc, I literally only have it in case something happens.
> Sods law of course that the day I did get knocked over I didn't have it on.


I would also like to think that I could use it to look back on any incidents where I reacted badly in an attempt to learn how to deal with things in a more sensible manner.


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## dr snuggles (1 Mar 2015)

0-markymark-0 said:


> .....and again. You only see the videos of people who out up videos. They are a subsection of people with cameras. Some only use them to report dabgerous driving rather than creating conflicts for YouTube hits.
> 
> Therefore your view is weighted by a subsection of users as by definition, the larger group do not all post videos.


I wouldn't be posting videos online unless it was a question regarding my own riding on a site like this.


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## jonny jeez (1 Mar 2015)

Drago said:


> That's a fair point. Why don't the Camera Qaeda post up footage of their own terrible riding?


I've seen some, they are rare and the commenters are often comically confused...


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## HLaB (1 Mar 2015)

I held off buying a camera at first mainly due to the cost to quality ratio and a little bit not wanting it to affect my riding. Since cost to quality ceased to be an issue and I've bought a camera. I've found I was completely wrong on the latter; most rides are deleted but it actually lets me draw back on some of the positives of rides; skies, views, wildlife encounters etc and mine also syncs with GPS so hopefully captures a feel of exhilaration too. If it captures bad driving/cycling so be it.


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## gaz (1 Mar 2015)

0-markymark-0 said:


> .....and again. You only see the videos of people who out up videos. They are a subsection of people with cameras. Some only use them to report dabgerous driving rather than creating conflicts for YouTube hits.
> 
> Therefore your view is weighted by a subsection of users as by definition, the larger group do not all post videos.


And not all of us that upload to youtube do it for hits.


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## ufkacbln (1 Mar 2015)

The other aspect is the bizarre assumption that everything needs to be public

We all make mistakes, and review footage ... this is known as reflection in professional circles

I know that I have reviewed footage and thought that I could have done better

However once that is done then it is deleted...... I could write to myself and point out that I could have done better, but to be quite honest it does not have any purpose

There is no real difference between reviewing the footage and thinking it was a silly mistake on the part of the driver, or understanding why it happened and dismissing it in the same way as I consider my errors


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## CopperBrompton (1 Mar 2015)

jonny jeez said:


> I'm saying it makes you hang on to negativity.


Nope, it's the exact opposite in my experience.

Before, if someone did something stupid, I might still be annoyed by it even after the ride. Knowing I have the footage, and could use it if I want to (ie. have the power to do something about it), enables me to forget about it almost immediately. Then later, because I've been able to let it go right away, I don't actually do anything with the footage, just delete it when I recharge the camera.


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## buggi (1 Mar 2015)

No it doesn't. You make a conscious choice. When I got mine i decided i was not gonna be a nob, and I'm not


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## dr snuggles (1 Mar 2015)

buggi said:


> No it doesn't. You make a conscious choice. When I got mine i decided i was not gonna be a nob, and I'm not


I'm convinced it won't change my outlook but it's priceless for me to read the experiences of others. If I have another incident like a recent one I will use the footage. Just some of the videos I've seen are so blatantly people looking for problems which sometime don't really exist and I wonder is it the camera which has changed them? Does it make you start looking for problems to justify the existence of one? It isn't my intention to post any footage online but if I have one will I feel the need to start doing just that?


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## spen666 (1 Mar 2015)

I have a helmet camera, and use it everyday on my commute.

I have not posted any footage of bad driving. To me it serves little positive purpose to put an individual incident on the internet. If I thought driving was criminal, then I would chose to provide footage to the relevant police authority as they are the ones who would prosecute, not you tube etc.

I use a helmet camera to record evidence in case of an accident so that I can prove the other party was responsible, if that were the case. Fortunately I have not hd the need to use it this way so far.

I have reviewed a number of incidents and have always found that if I had ridden differently, I could have affected the outcome for the better. This may have been by riding more assertively, taking a different line etc.

Finally, as at least one person has said, the mere fact that a 3rd party is aware the incident is being recorded affects their behaviour in a positive way, either making them drive less aggressively or behave in a less aggressive manner etc

Its up to you how you behave, using a camera does not make someone a knob. A knob using a camera is still a knob


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## buggi (1 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> I'm convinced it won't change my outlook but it's priceless for me to read the experiences of others. If I have another incident like a recent one I will use the footage. Just some of the videos I've seen are so blatantly people looking for problems which sometime don't really exist and I wonder is it the camera which has changed them? Does it make you start looking for problems to justify the existence of one? It isn't my intention to post any footage online but if I have one will I feel the need to start doing just that?


No it doesn't make you start looking for problems. It's just once you go down the route of uploading to youtube I think its a bit like taking selfies... A bit addictive. I decided that unless I had something worth giving to the police I wasn't going to bother even reviewing my recordings. So far I've only given something to the cops once and they "had words" with the driver. Which I was happy about as I know it was a lapse in concentration rather than malicious. ( It was after 3 malicious incidents that I decided to get it in the first place. )


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## steveindenmark (1 Mar 2015)

It doesnt turn you into a nob. To be a vigilante, you need to be a nob to begin with.

Just remember that the World and his dog are not interesting your near misses on social media sites. Especially when it turns out that you are to blame for them.

Your rides in the country, could be interesting to watch though.


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## jarlrmai (1 Mar 2015)

I think a lot of people who don't think some close passes on youtube are close should get a camera wait for a close pass (unless you are one of those magic cyclists who has never had a close pass) then have a look at the footage, you'll see the wide angle makes it look less close than it was.

I think the visible camera has prevented some dangerous driving, I had a car full of scallies drive really well behind me on a narrow 20 road where I was avoiding the doorzone when they did pass one said "is that a gopro mate?" when I said yes he said "told ya" to the driver, they then sped off at way over the speed limit on the white line around a blind bend.

Companies whose drivers drive dangerously have acted on footage, the police very rarely do.

But the main reason I record my ride is that the guy who knocked me off got away with it because no-one got his plate and that wasn't happening again.


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## crazyjoe101 (1 Mar 2015)

Getting a camera helped me improve my riding re safety a lot. I'm no more of a nob than I was before, if anything it's calmed me down a lot.


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## slowmotion (1 Mar 2015)

I went through a phase when I thought a camera might be quite fun but decided against getting one. I didn't want to get on the bike and be reminded that I might be a victim of something nasty everytime I set the camera rolling.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> Automatically turn you into a nob?


Sorry to confirm your suspicion Snuggles but Yes! Think about it. I know there are apparently convincing arguments on both sides but what would you think of someone who wore a camera on their shoulder or hat when out and about, walking around town?


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## S.Giles (2 Mar 2015)

slowmotion said:


> I didn't want to get on the bike and be reminded that I might be a victim of something nasty every time I set the camera rolling.


I think that is exactly the effect it would have on me. That's one of the reasons I won't be getting one any time soon.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

S.Giles said:


> I think that is exactly the effect it would have on me. That's one of the reasons I won't be getting one any time soon.


Not wanting to derail this thread into the helmet debate but, I recently had to buy a helmet to participate in an event I had entered without reading the small print. After the event, the helmet was consigned to the back of a dusty cupboard for the next time I mistakenly signed up to a compulsory helmet event. I then headed out on the MTB helmetless a week later and promptly fell off while attempting to ride down an old flight of steep, irregularly shaped stone steps. I badly smashed my right knee and I am still walking funny two weeks later but didn't bang my head. I'm not sure what my point is, maybe that shlt happens anyway, or perhaps I wouldn't have fallen and hurt my knee if I was wearing a helmet?


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## classic33 (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Not wanting to derail this thread into the helmet debate but, I recently had to buy a helmet to participate in an event I had entered without reading the small print. After the event, the helmet was consigned to the back of a dusty cupboard for the next time I mistakenly signed up to a compulsory helmet event. I then headed out on the MTB helmetless a week later and promptly fell off while attempting to ride down an old flight of steep, irregularly shaped stone steps. I badly smashed my right knee and I am still walking funny two weeks later but didn't bang my head. I'm not sure what my point is, maybe that shlt happens anyway, or perhaps I wouldn't have fallen and hurt my knee if I was wearing a helmet?


Not all cameras are helmet mounted. The GoPro has a chest mount available.


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## jonny jeez (2 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> Automatically turn you into a nob?
> I've been wanting to get one for a while now but I'm afraid I'm gonna turn into one of these vigilantes.
> I make mistakes, I know that so would like to review situations to see what I could have done better. It could have come in handy with a recent taxi driver situation as well.
> Be interesting to hear from fellow commuters who do use them and whether or not (truthfully) it has changed them.



Reading some of the comments and reflecting on this I would revise my initial comment and say...it really depends on you.

And your personality

In your heart, if you know you are the type of person to get upset quickly, angry perhaps, then a camera is probably not a good idea...and posting footage to you tube an even worse one.

But if like some on here, you would find the review of footage both educational and a little cathartic, maybe helping you become a better rider and shaking off negativity, then perhaps you are an ideal candidate for a camera.

So, back to you really, do YOU think it will turn you into a nob?


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## dr snuggles (2 Mar 2015)

jonny jeez said:


> Reading some of the comments and reflecting on this I would revise my initial comment and say...it really depends on you.
> 
> And your personality
> 
> ...


On the whole I'm actually quite laid back about incidents. I do have my under the breath comments but that is usually that as far as I'm concerned. I did have a run in recently and reacted badly but it was an extreme case of stupidity which could have cost me my life and the Police were involved and completely understood my reaction.
I genuinely believe it will help me to improve my riding by reviewing riding position etc. and I certainly do not intend to start posting the footage online, that is definitely not in my nature. I would like to have the opportunity to use it in a similar case to my recent run in though but not by posting it online which, in my opinion, is pretty pointless.


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## dr snuggles (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Sorry to confirm your suspicion Snuggles but Yes! Think about it. I know there are apparently convincing arguments on both sides but what would you think of someone who wore a camera on their shoulder or hat when out and about, walking around town?


Do you honestly think it is the same thing though? Yes I would find people walking around with cameras pretty nobbish but we are riding on busy roads at busy times!
I would like to think it could be educational for me as well as the knowledge that should anything happen then I have a good chance of having some evidence against the "I couldn't see him" and other get out clauses you generally get.


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## BenM (2 Mar 2015)

I got a camera (well two in the end) for my own fun and enjoyment - learning to fall off ride a recumbent bike si a fun experience and I wanted some record of it - so there are videos of tumbles, some scally threatening me with death if I didn't give him a go and another scally deciding that a chain ring to the crotch wasn't in his days list of enjoyable things... there is even one video of a close pass - three cars passing very close to a pinch point, first two get by easily the third waits until the pinch point and just squeezes past. meh. Stopped using them becuase the first one broke and the second was just a bit of a PITA. Can't justify another so won't be getting one unless things change.

IMHO if, as mentioned above, you are likely to be a nob anyway then a camera will enhance your nobbishness... otherwise its just there.

B.


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## DaveReading (2 Mar 2015)

Deeply disappointed to find this wasn't a thread about precocious female deer.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

classic33 said:


> Not all cameras are helmet mounted. The GoPro has a chest mount available.


You missed the point of my post completely


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## Panter (2 Mar 2015)

No difference in my case.

Nobber before. Nobber after


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## Markymark (2 Mar 2015)

DaveReading said:


> Deeply disappointed to find this wasn't a thread about precocious female deer.


Don;t be surprised what can take photos these days. My car has started taking selfies....usually of my flying along the motorway.


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## gavintc (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Sorry to confirm your suspicion Snuggles but Yes! Think about it. I know there are apparently convincing arguments on both sides but what would you think of someone who wore a camera on their shoulder or hat when out and about, walking around town?


And the scenarios are even comparable? 

Sharing space with cars able to maim or kill and sharing space with pedestrians is somewhat different. I record my commute, but have never downloaded any of the images. For me, it is purely an insurance system, having had some very close ones.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

gavintc said:


> And the scenarios are even comparable?
> 
> Sharing space with cars able to maim or kill and sharing space with pedestrians is somewhat different. I record my commute, but have never downloaded any of the images. For me, it is purely an insurance system, having had some very close ones.


I reckon it's just as possible/likely that I could be robbed, assaulted, accidently bumped into, fall down a missing manhole, tripped, run over when crossing a road or hit on the back of the head by a badly kicked football as it is that I will be maimed/killed by a fellow road user, so surely camera footage would be useful in proving fault in any of these instances?


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## gavintc (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> I reckon it's just as possible/likely that I could be robbed, assaulted, accidently bumped into, fall down a missing manhole, tripped, run over when crossing a road or hit on the back of the head by a badly kicked football as it is that I will be maimed/killed by a fellow road user, so surely camera footage would be useful in proving fault in any of these instances?


If you feel that way, you can get small cameras which will attach to a headband.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

Perhaps I worded that badly? I feel the probabilities may be similar but I do not think it would be useful or necessary to carry a camera to capture these possible incidents, doing that would make me a nob.


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## jarlrmai (2 Mar 2015)

Rest assured if people felt as threatened whilst walking around towns as they do when cycling people would wear cameras, cameras are a reaction to the problem of cars driven dangerously around vulnerable road users.

And if anyone of those things happened to you I'm sure you would look to see if there was a CCTV camera near you, and would hope that the police might take it seriously.


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## Panter (2 Mar 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> Automatically turn you into a nob?
> I've been wanting to get one for a while now but I'm afraid I'm gonna turn into one of these vigilantes.
> I make mistakes, I know that so would like to review situations to see what I could have done better. It could have come in handy with a recent taxi driver situation as well.
> Be interesting to hear from fellow commuters who do use them and whether or not (truthfully) it has changed them.



I did touch on this in another thread actually. I've just started using a camera again, I first dabbled with one a couple of Years ago but quickly got bored keep charging the thing up etc.
When I first used one, I did feel a little bit of bad attitude from it for some odd reason, almost as if, at times, I'd be willing something to happen just because I was in a position to capture it. 
I don't want to be criticized/appraised on the strength of that, just being honest that I did notice an effect. It was, however, small and I modified my behaviour appropriately and I don't feel that it changed either my riding, or perception of ,my riding. in the end.

This time, it's made absolutely no difference, maybe because of last time? 
I think it was summed up perfectly above, if you're of that persuasion, then, yes, it may well exacerbate that otherwise it will make no difference. 

Funnily enough, I captured my first "incident" this morning when fairly aggressively left hooked. I did wonder whether to edit the footage down this morning and post it, but won't because: 
1) On reflection, my road positioning wasn't as assertive as it should have been on that particular roundabout
2) I can't be arsed.


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## crazyjoe101 (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> I reckon it's just as possible/likely that I could be robbed, assaulted, accidently bumped into, fall down a missing manhole, tripped, run over when crossing a road or hit on the back of the head by a badly kicked football as it is that I will be maimed/killed by a fellow road user, so surely camera footage would be useful in proving fault in any of these instances?


I've experienced far more aggresive / dangerously bad driving whilst cycling than I have all other threats from people whilst out and about on foot.
More interesting stuff happens whilst riding in my experience. I would wager that a lot of this is down to location, riding style, frequency and maybe even 'luck'.


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

crazyjoe101 said:


> I've experienced far more


Experienced, or focused on?


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## jarlrmai (2 Mar 2015)

Most threats (that are not cars) you get whilst walking are nowhere near as dangerous as a badly driven motor vehicle, and the most common threats while walking around are generally from poorly driven cars anyway, mounting kerbs, ignoring zebra crossings and red lights etc.


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## crazyjoe101 (2 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Experienced, or focused on?


Experienced.

After most rides there's nothing negative in the footage worth looking at again.

Most drivers are competent enough to be OK most of the time.
Quite a few are good/great.
A smaller minority are totally ****.

As for "focused on", for me it's hard not to notice particularly good or bad drivers as they break the second on second norm...


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## ufkacbln (2 Mar 2015)

Someone mention Doe - A deer, a female deer?


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## I like Skol (2 Mar 2015)

Cunobelin said:


> Someone mention Doe


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## dr snuggles (2 Mar 2015)

Been excellent to read all of your opinions so thanks to everyone for that. I think I'm gonna go for it. I'm convinced I'll use it as intended and not become any more of a nob.
Just got to decide on which one now.


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## slowmotion (2 Mar 2015)

jonny jeez said:


> So, back to you really, do YOU think it will turn you into a nob?


I think it would turn me into a nob even more of a nob.

_{ There, I saved you all the trouble of editing my post. }_


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## ufkacbln (2 Mar 2015)

0-markymark-0 said:


> Don;t be surprised what can take photos these days. My car has started taking selfies....usually of my flying along the motorway.




OT...

We had a Polish lass working with us and after a few weeks had gone back to Poland in order to pick up Husband and car.

On her first day back she asked me why we took pictures of cars?

I explained the concept of the speed camera

Her reply was that there were a lot of photos taken of her car!


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## Kookas (3 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Sorry to confirm your suspicion Snuggles but Yes! Think about it. I know there are apparently convincing arguments on both sides but what would you think of someone who wore a camera on their shoulder or hat when out and about, walking around town?


What if they were walking around, idk, Syria?


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## Sharky (3 Mar 2015)

This thread has been very enlightening and there have been many informative and sensible examples of how to use a camera.

In my case I have had one situation where there would have been a valid case for a camera. I was taken out by a car, knocked out and air lifted to hospital where I woke up. Of the scene, I could remember nothing, but the were plenty of witnesses and I was compensated in due course, so the absence of a camera was not significant. A few months after the accident, I got back to cycling with no real problems and no fear of traffic. I had no memory of the crash. My thoughts now are that if I had filmed the accident, I would have a permanent and continual reminder of what happened and I am not sure if I would have had the confidence to even get back on the bike.
A still darker thought I have, if the outcome had been a bit worse, my family would have been left with that permanent reminder and would have blamed me for riding too fast or without care and could deter future generations from taking up the sport.

So for the time being, I will remain camera free.

Happy Cycling
Keith


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## Custom24 (3 Mar 2015)

I have two, front and back on the bike. Initially I had one on my helmet but found it too heavy, so I went with the front/ back instead. One I did that, I pretty much forgot about them. I mean, I charge them and turn them on, etc, but I don't think about them as I ride along. I also have large sd cards in them (the largest mine take is 32gb, and these are about a tenner for branded ones) and I have them set to rolling delete, so I never look at footage unless there is a particular reason.


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## Drago (3 Mar 2015)

Was watching The History Channel last night. Hitler had a helmet cam. Say no more.


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## ufkacbln (3 Mar 2015)

Sharky said:


> This thread has been very enlightening and there have been many informative and sensible examples of how to use a camera.
> 
> In my case I have had one situation where there would have been a valid case for a camera. I was taken out by a car, knocked out and air lifted to hospital where I woke up. Of the scene, I could remember nothing, but the were plenty of witnesses and I was compensated in due course, so the absence of a camera was not significant. A few months after the accident, I got back to cycling with no real problems and no fear of traffic. I had no memory of the crash. My thoughts now are that if I had filmed the accident, I would have a permanent and continual reminder of what happened and I am not sure if I would have had the confidence to even get back on the bike.
> A still darker thought I have, if the outcome had been a bit worse, my family would have been left with that permanent reminder and would have blamed me for riding too fast or without care and could deter future generations from taking up the sport.
> ...



....... or on a positive note, witnesses are not always available, or reliable. The video could have enabled the prosecution of the driver who put you there?

How many times do we read of a cycle accident (especially hit and run) where a camera could have made the prosecution so very simple, and answered a lot of questions?

Would a family not be better off knowing what actually happened than having to guess?


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## jonny jeez (3 Mar 2015)

Sharky said:


> This thread has been very enlightening and there have been many informative and sensible examples of how to use a camera.
> 
> In my case I have had one situation where there would have been a valid case for a camera. I was taken out by a car, knocked out and air lifted to hospital where I woke up. Of the scene, I could remember nothing, but the were plenty of witnesses and I was compensated in due course, so the absence of a camera was not significant. A few months after the accident, I got back to cycling with no real problems and no fear of traffic. I had no memory of the crash. My thoughts now are that if I had filmed the accident, I would have a permanent and continual reminder of what happened and I am not sure if I would have had the confidence to even get back on the bike.
> A still darker thought I have, if the outcome had been a bit worse, my family would have been left with that permanent reminder and would have blamed me for riding too fast or without care and could deter future generations from taking up the sport.
> ...



Good post.


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## gaz (3 Mar 2015)

Drago said:


> Was watching The History Channel last night. Hitler had a helmet cam. Say no more.


hitler also wore shores. say no more.


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## wam68 (3 Mar 2015)

DaveReading said:


> Deeply disappointed to find this wasn't a thread about precocious female deer.


Now that's funny. Nearly spilt my tea in the van.


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## Mile195 (3 Mar 2015)

My camera, as a secondary function, could be used in the event of an accident or hit-and-run to prove who was at fault.

However, its primary function is to show my other half all the cute dogs I saw on my way into work, the occasional Classic Car that deserved a second look, and any talent that I saw walking along the pavement and didn't have time to ogle properly at the time.

I find that most bad driving doesn't wind me up that much because I spot it in advance. Therefore I'm rarely angry enough to bother doing anything with the footage, and even when I think I am, by the time I get home it's dissipated to the point that I think "I'll do something about it later" and then never do.

Like others have said, having a camera doesn't make you a nob. Being a nob with your camera makes you a nob.


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## Custom24 (3 Mar 2015)

Mile195 said:


> However, its primary function is to show my other half ... any talent that I saw walking along the pavement and didn't have time to ogle properly at the time.


Do you like hand-shaped marks on your face, then?


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## Mile195 (3 Mar 2015)

Custom24 said:


> Do you like hand-shaped marks on your face, then?


Ah, we can all window shop... Provided you don't handle the merchandise...


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## ufkacbln (3 Mar 2015)

numbnuts said:


> So your driving your van, drinking tea and reading this forum



... but isn't on the phone!


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## crazyjoe101 (3 Mar 2015)

Mile195 said:


> ...Like others have said, having a camera doesn't make you a nob. Being a nob with your camera makes you a nob.


+1


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## Kookas (4 Mar 2015)

I like Skol said:


> Experienced, or focused on?



I know I have never had my life put in danger on foot (well, except by cars, funnily enough). Plenty of times on the bike.



Mile195 said:


> Ah, we can all window shop... Provided you don't handle the merchandise...



That's kind of disgusting, to be honest... there's a difference between thinking someone looks attractive and recording them on camera for later.


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## Mile195 (4 Mar 2015)

Kookas said:


> I know I have never had my life put in danger on foot (well, except by cars, funnily enough). Plenty of times on the bike.
> 
> 
> 
> That's kind of disgusting, to be honest... there's a difference between thinking someone looks attractive and recording them on camera for later.


Jeeeeeezzzz....no need to take things so literally! it's all in jest - I don't REALLY keep some kind of weird stash of old camera footage!... Note to self - immature schoolboy humour is probably more amusing when said, rather than written!


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## Kookas (4 Mar 2015)

Mile195 said:


> Jeeeeeezzzz....no need to take things so literally! it's all in jest - I don't REALLY keep some kind of weird stash of old camera footage!... Note to self - immature schoolboy humour is probably more amusing when said, rather than written!



Well, now I feel bad! Sorry about the misunderstanding.


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## Mile195 (4 Mar 2015)

Kookas said:


> Well, now I feel bad! Sorry about the misunderstanding.


Easily done. Context sometimes gets a bit lost in written form!..

The bit about classic cars is occasionally true though... Saw this beauty the other day and took a quick screenshot for my other half before I cleared the memory cards:


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## glenn forger (4 Mar 2015)

That's a bus.


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## crazyjoe101 (4 Mar 2015)

Mile195 said:


> Easily done. Context sometimes gets a bit lost in written form!..
> 
> The bit about classic cars is occasionally true though... Saw this beauty the other day and took a quick screenshot for my other half before I cleared the memory cards:
> View attachment 81380
> View attachment 81381



That's disgusting, there's a difference between looking at classic cars and filming them for later! 

Sorry.


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## wam68 (4 Mar 2015)

numbnuts said:


> So your driving your van, drinking tea and reading this forum


No man. I was on the site.


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## captain nemo1701 (4 Mar 2015)

I got my camera after I got assaulted by a nobber passenger in a car. He spat some liquid in my face while I waited for them to pass on a double parked street. I have recorded some daft and dangerous things but am always careful to make sure I follow the rules of the road which I do anyway, cam or no cam. I try to make little videos showing how pleasant and advantageous cycling can be, the places that you can get to without a car, and to show off Bristol and it's surroundings which are great to cycle around. I try not to be too negative in my videos and to be honest, most of the time nothing happens!. At other times, good old techno-problems and Sod's Law prevent you getting the shot you'd like. It happened this past monday evening as I was riding home up the Bristol Railway Path. The camera ran out of juice on the way back, but as I was on the path, I thought it wouldn't matter. Then two guys on motorbikes suddenly shoot across the path in ront of me, having come down the access ramp and using the path as a short cut to the adjacent road. Missed it!. 

I have noted that most hits on my videos seem to involve conflict but I don't go out of my way to create any. That being said, incidents can get the adrenalin flowing and in the heat of the moment...etc. However, I have learnt to stay calm. When you think about it, the danger of catching yourself out doing anything stupid encourages you to cycle properly.

If anything happens, near misses etc, I hopefully have it on video if needed as evidence for the police. But as I said earlier, most of the time, nowt 'appens. But I have noticed that some drivers do give me an extra wide berth when they spot the camera on my helmet. Nearly all of my videos get downloaded and deleted!.


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## dr snuggles (4 Mar 2015)

captain nemo1701 said:


> I got my camera after I got assaulted by a nobber passenger in a car. He spat some liquid in my face while I waited for them to pass on a double parked street. I have recorded some daft and dangerous things but am always careful to make sure I follow the rules of the road which I do anyway, cam or no cam. I try to make little videos showing how pleasant and advantageous cycling can be, the places that you can get to without a car, and to show off Bristol and it's surroundings which are great to cycle around. I try not to be too negative in my videos and to be honest, most of the time nothing happens!. At other times, good old techno-problems and Sod's Law prevent you getting the shot you'd like. It happened this past monday evening as I was riding home up the Bristol Railway Path. The camera ran out of juice on the way back, but as I was on the path, I thought it wouldn't matter. Then two guys on motorbikes suddenly shoot across the path in ront of me, having come down the access ramp and using the path as a short cut to the adjacent road. Missed it!.
> 
> I have noted that most hits on my videos seem to involve conflict but I don't go out of my way to create any. That being said, incidents can get the adrenalin flowing and in the heat of the moment...etc. However, I have learnt to stay calm. When you think about it, the danger of catching yourself out doing anything stupid encourages you to cycle properly.
> 
> If anything happens, near misses etc, I hopefully have it on video if needed as evidence for the police. But as I said earlier, most of the time, nowt 'appens. But I have noticed that some drivers do give me an extra wide berth when they spot the camera on my helmet. Nearly all of my videos get downloaded and deleted!.


Great post
I've actually taken the plunge. I'm waiting for it to be delivered but first signs of nobbishness from me and its getting sold!


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## slowmotion (4 Mar 2015)

Panter said:


> Funnily enough, I captured my first "incident" this morning when fairly aggressively left hooked. I did wonder whether to edit the footage down this morning and post it, but won't because:
> 1) On reflection, my road positioning wasn't as assertive as it should have been on that particular roundabout
> 2) I can't be arsed.


When it comes to cameras, I'm very much of the "I Can't Be Arsed" camp. It takes me long enough to find all my kit and get ready for my commute without having a blooming camera to p#ss about with.


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## RedRider (4 Mar 2015)

slowmotion said:


> I went through a phase when I thought a camera might be quite fun but decided against getting one. I didn't want to get on the bike and be reminded that I might be a victim of something nasty everytime I set the camera rolling.


Me too. Each to their own and I respect other choices but I don't want to think 'just in case something shoot happens' every time I hop on a bike. #happygoluckynobber


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## Panter (5 Mar 2015)

slowmotion said:


> When it comes to cameras, I'm very much of the "I Can't Be Arsed" camp. It takes me long enough to find all my kit and get ready for my commute without having a blooming camera to p#ss about with.



That's why I gave up on it last time, although that one needed charging after every trip so it had to be charged at work and again at home every single day.
The new one (coupled with a far shorter commute) does a day and a half, plus it cycles the footage so starts overwriting old film automatically so that I don't have the faff of keep deleting old footage. 
Even so, it's still extra hassle taking the thing out of the case to charge it and then re-fitting it so I suspect I won't keep it up for very long. 

I only got it after someone tried to knock me off the bike a couple of Months ago, but I wanted one anyway to use as a stills camera on the kayak and for fishing. MTBing etc so it won't be wasted. 
What would make it really easy if it had some sort of wireless charger that could just clip over the whole assembly when the bike's slung in the shed in the evening that would charge it over night. 
I'm the same as you in that although I've been cycle commuting every day now since October, for some reason it still seems to take me forever to get everything together in the mornings!


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## LeeM (13 Apr 2015)

I read this thread because I got "brake checked" last week, and braking myself to avoid hitting the car sent me over the handlebars, and I'm still in a fair bit of pain. I've never really considered a camera, but this lady was (probably pretending) to film me with her mobile as she overtook me, and then claimed she didn't slow down afterwards (which she did, suddenly and with no reason).

A witness behind saw me hit the back of her car, and very much supported my point of view, but the Police attitude was that there wasn't really anything that they could do, even with a witness, as there was no proof she slowed down, or used her mobile. As it is, I've got a couple of hundred quids worth of ripped clothing, helmet and glasses to replace, plus a bit of minor damage to the bike.

I had no way to prove what happened, so I got a good beating and she will inevitably get away with it scot free.

I think the approach many here have suggested here makes sense - record it, then delete it unless you need it. It doesn't stand up to scrutiny the idea that it's equivalent to pedestrians carrying a camera, there's generally a near miss with a car every time I go for a ride. I have no intention of posting these on Youtube or anywhere else, as the quicker they're forgotten the better, but we can't ignore the fact that riding our bikes is significantly more dangerous than walking around.

Funnily enough, the idea of the camera came from the copper who attended the scene. I told him the driver was using her mobile, and asked why he couldn't check that straight away. He said "sorry sir, we're not allowed. My brother-in-law's a cyclist, and he's got a camera himself, maybe you should do the same, it would be really helpful in these kinds of cases"....


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## crazyjoe101 (13 Apr 2015)

On my bike I have experienced several near misses of a kind which just do not happen when out and about off a bike in day to day life. Had any of these not been near misses, the camera would no doubt make insurance claims and or dealings with the police much easier with a greater chance of success. In fact footage from the camera allowed the police to prove an offense had occured once. 
The camera also acts to stop me doing stupid things, it would be quite embarrasing if I recorded myself getting crushed by a turning lorry because I wanted to save a few seconds. Not to mention that it can protect you in any cases where people would want to wrongly accuse you of being at fault.


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## Arjimlad (13 Apr 2015)

I'd be worried a camera might pick up my bad language directed towards the dozy & dangerous drivers I encounter..

Rather like Richard Hammond swearing at a van (I won't post a link as it's probably not a good idea to do that).


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## glenn forger (13 Apr 2015)

LeeM, the police gave you an awful lot of duff info in your short encounter.


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## dr snuggles (13 Apr 2015)

Arjimlad said:


> I'd be worried a camera might pick up my bad language directed towards the dozy & dangerous drivers I encounter..
> 
> Rather like Richard Hammond swearing at a van (I won't post a link as it's probably not a good idea to do that).


It does and it makes you realize what a dick you sound like as well!


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## dr snuggles (13 Apr 2015)

Been using mine for a while now and it's having the desired effect all round I reckon, shows how you shouldn't react, allows you to review road positioning as well as catching nobbers doing nobbish things. I've only had one incident where I could easily have reported the driver but because my initial reaction was a disgrace and in my view inflammatory I didn't.
Glad I got mine.


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## crazyjoe101 (13 Apr 2015)

dr snuggles said:


> It does and it makes you realize what a dick you sound like as well!


I know, I used to watch some things back and cringe. I'm much calmer now which is good I think.


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## dr snuggles (13 Apr 2015)

crazyjoe101 said:


> I know, I used to watch some things back and cringe. I'm much calmer now which is good I think.


It really is genuinely awful isn't it.


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## Tizme (20 Apr 2015)

I bought mine about 18 months ago after deliberating for quite a while following a few close passes on my commute. What finally persuaded me to get one were the 2 incidents within 3 days of each other. The first was riding home from work, I was aware of a noise behind me and glanced around, 2 vehicles behind, a black car and a builders-type pick up. The black turned off and I assumed the second one was full of his mates and they were shouting their goodbyes. How wrong can you be!! The next thing I was aware of was the passenger door beside me and the driver matching my speed, with the passengers face about 6" from mine, swearing and shouting that if I didn't get off the road he was going to kill me. Luckily I was turning off about 50 metres up the road, so I ignored him (and his mate in the open back, who was kneeling over the cab to add his 2p worth). I turned off they went straight on, but realising I they had lost me the driver reversed back and followed me down the road. I saw them coming and hopped off my bike and legged it across the road, thinking that I had at least the traffic coming in the other direction to make them keep their distance. Wrong again, the pick up swung across the road, narrowly missing a car coming in the other direction so that the passenger could lean across the driver and continue to shout ans swear at me. The driver only drove off when he realised I had my phone in my hand and had just asked the operator to put me through to the Police. After the had driven off, again swerving to avoid oncoming traffic, a motorcyclist and car stopped to check that I was okay, the bike said he was certain they were going to kill me.
The second incident was on my way to work, head down and struggling up hill I glanced up and saw a car heading towards me at reasonable speed, followed by white van man and another car. Luckily for me I was kept an eye on the traffic heading towards me as white van man decided to pull out and overtake, he even waved to me as I cycled on to the grass verge to avoid him, as I attempted to get off the verge the driver of the car behind the van decided it had to be clear if the van had overtaken and I ended up back on the grass.
In both instances the Police were either unable to take action (not enough mobile patrols in my area for the first incident) or just not interested (no witnesses to the second). At least with a camera the Police would have had video evidence to find the drivers.
That is why I decided to get a camera, if that has made me a nob, so be it, the camera records on a loop, so unless something drastic happens I don't even look at it, but if I end up dead in a ditch at least someone will hopefully look at the video and my family will might get justice.


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## Bewar3them00n (21 Apr 2015)

There's been many a time where I wish I'd had footage of my close shaves, to a) scare the driver b) actually send to the police when a bus driver has been involved,I've had one off duty driver try to side swipe me off the road a few years back.


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## Mr_Kipling (2 May 2015)

To be honest I turned in to a bit of a nob when I got my camera 2 years ago. In fact I'm probably still a bit of a nob now, but better a nob on a bike than a nob driving a ton of metal at 30mph. In my experience the cameras I use cause more positives then negatives. The amount of drivers, passengers, children and other cyclists who have waved at my camera is some what up lifting.


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## DrLex (2 May 2015)

I'd have liked a camera the other day to have helped determine if it was a stoat or a weasel that ran in front of me.


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## andyfraser (2 May 2015)

DrLex said:


> I'd have liked a camera the other day to have helped determine if it was a stoat or a weasel that ran in front of me.


Weasels are weasily identified. Stoats are stoatally different.


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## DrLex (3 May 2015)

I knew it wouldn't take long for that response...


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## glenn forger (4 May 2015)

motorbiker records a cyclist asking him to keep the ASL clear:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_fVLkN8qu8


weirdly, he's edited the clip to leave out how he arrived in the ASL. So we don't see what the cyclist sees. Predictably his mates post a load of homophobic abuse and threats of violence, and the uploader deletes any comments that ask why the clip's edited. Deliberately stirring up hatred, in other words.


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## Drago (5 May 2015)

Mr_Kipling said:


> To be honest I turned in to a bit of a nob when I got my camera 2 years ago. In fact I'm probably still a bit of a nob now, but better a nob on a bike than a nob driving a ton of metal at 30mph. In my experience the cameras I use cause more positives then negatives. The amount of drivers, passengers, children and other cyclists who have waved at my camera is some what up lifting.


Oh dear, I'd feel a bit vulnerable venturing out in a car that weighed only a ton.


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## Roxy641 (10 Sep 2016)

I have been thinking of getting a camera to film my cycle journeys. I've had some near misses while cycling ie. nearly car-doored, pedestians just walking out in front of me without looking, cars that come a bit to close for me (and to think, I hardly know them).


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## vickster (10 Sep 2016)

Roxy641 said:


> I have been thinking of getting a camera to film my cycle journeys. I've had some near misses while cycling ie. nearly car-doored, pedestians just walking out in front of me without looking, cars that come a bit to close for me (and to think, I hardly know them).


To avoid close doorings, just ride further out  peds, get a bell and a loud voice (I can't see what a camera would do to stop them)  close passes are unpleasant (you say a bit) but a camera won't stop them IMO

I'd spend money on organisation membership first, which provides third party indemnity (in case you damage a ped, another cyclist or car) and legal cover in case you or your bike gets damaged. British Cycling membership comes with the added benefit of Halfords discount for example


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## Roxy641 (10 Sep 2016)

Thanks Vickster,

all good points. One of the first things I was reminded of when I started cycling again was about the need to move further out, which I now do.

The camera/video would more be something that I could use in case I needed proof of an accident etc. Would also be nice to have a record of 
some of the nice journeys I've had where car/lorry drivers do give us enough room. So, it can be a postitive thing as well as highlighting negative
thigns that happen.



vickster said:


> To avoid close doorings, just ride further out  peds, get a bell and a loud voice (I can't see what a camera would do to stop them)  close passes are unpleasant (you say a bit) but a camera won't stop them IMO
> 
> I'd spend money on organisation membership first, which provides third party indemnity (in case you damage a ped or car) and legal cover in case you or your bike gets damaged. British Cycling membership comes with the added benefit of Halfords discount for example


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## vickster (10 Sep 2016)

Fair enough. If wearing on helmet, make sure everything is compatible (and check the helmet info too about attaching things to it)

Plenty of threads on which camera 

I got knocked off by a close pass (wing mirror hit my handlebar), no proof needed, driver/insurers quickly admitted liability (claim still to settle 2.5 years on though due to ongoing ails)


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## Vikeonabike (2 Oct 2016)

The answer is NO, unless you let it. Love my camera (although not used it in a while).
I also have a bodycam at work which I tend to turn on for nearly every encounter with the public. This doesn't turn me into a Knob either (although some would say being a Police Officer meant I already am). It's just a tool like any other!


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