# Cyclists Always Say Hello But Joggers Not So Much.



## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

Years ago, I had a 1965 Morris Minor 1000 and they were not uncommon on the roads at the time.

But whenever you saw one approaching, you always gave a flash of your lights and maybe a smile in recognition of your shared passion (although in my case, it was a very cheap car to buy at the time and I really wanted a Ford Capri).

Same on a bike. Pretty much every other cyclist I've met on the roads has waved, smiled, some have shouted "hi" and all have been genuinely friendly.

I see a few joggers on the last stretch of country lane I do (it's part of a popular local circuit used by the local running clubs).

Each time, I pass them with a very wide berth and I call out "good evening". 

Never had a single response?

Do joggers have a problem with cyclists or is it simply because they are too puffed out to speak?


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## oreo_muncher (28 Nov 2020)

I always say hello to cyclists as I ride past or at least give them a nod or wave my hand.


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## vickster (28 Nov 2020)

Probably wearing earphones and can’t hear you


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## oreo_muncher (28 Nov 2020)

Think we're just nicer than joggers...  I don't know how anyone enjoys jogging.


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## vickster (28 Nov 2020)

oreo_muncher said:


> Think we're just nicer than joggers...  I don't know how anyone enjoys jogging.


Each to their own


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## Pale Rider (28 Nov 2020)

Is @ianrauk still doing that kerching! thing?


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## Spiderweb (28 Nov 2020)

oreo_muncher said:


> Think we're just nicer than joggers...  I don't know how anyone enjoys jogging.


I think you are right, joggers can’t possibly be enjoying what they are doing so grumpiness will set in and you never get a hello or a wave whereas cyclists are a completely different breed so jazz hands from me every time!👋👋👋👋


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## vickster (28 Nov 2020)

Pale Rider said:


> Is @ianrauk still doing that kerching! thing?


Isn’t that more about cyclists not saying hello?


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## oreo_muncher (28 Nov 2020)

Pale Rider said:


> Is @ianrauk still doing that kerching! thing?


Haha what kerching thing?


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

Spiderweb said:


> I think you are right, joggers can’t possibly be enjoying what they are doing so grumpiness will set in and you never get a hello or a wave whereas cyclists are a completely different breed so jazz hands from me every time!👋👋👋👋


I tried running years ago in London. I used to do a circuit around Harrow On The Hill with a mate of mine and I hated every minute of it.

All I used to wonder was "when will this be over"?

If someone had whizzed past me on a bike back then and said "good evening" I'd have thought "WTAF mate! Are you taking the piss or something?"


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## oreo_muncher (28 Nov 2020)

Lovacott said:


> I tried running years ago in London. I used to do a circuit around Harrow On The Hill with a mate of mine and I hated every minute of it.
> 
> All I used to wonder was "when will this be over"?
> 
> If someone had whizzed past me on a bike back then and said "good evening" I'd have thought "WTAF mate! Are you taking the piss or something?"


I tried running before I took up cycling, did 3 months- 3 times a week and I just didn't enjoy it at all! Just painful! Cycling is the way to go.


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## Drago (28 Nov 2020)

Having been a jogger until recently giving it up due to artritis, I reckon its because a lot of them get in the zone and their conscious brain retreats to let the autonomous systems run things for a while.


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## DRM (28 Nov 2020)

I've had one or two joggers say hi usually when on the canal towpath, also get a thanks for slowing down, backing off, and letting them go through when the paths are busy, or when I've let them know I'm behind & they go to one side so I can pass, & I go wide opposite, rather than just go barreling past like some do.


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## Juan Kog (28 Nov 2020)

Why run /jog when someone went to the trouble to invent the Bicycle. That's just weird.


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## Tripster (28 Nov 2020)

I run in the fells to purposely avoid people and interaction... the Herdwicks are my only friends


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

Drago said:


> Having been a jogger until recently giving it up due to artritis, I reckon its because a lot of them get in the zone and their conscious brain retreats to let the autonomous systems run things for a while.


I have to take the weight off my bended left knee when carrying stuff. I go down steps with my left leg dead straight and my right leg leading the way and doing the bending. When I'm not carrying stuff, I can manage it normally but I get a pinch pain with every step.

No trouble at though pumping my legs up a steep hill on a bike?


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## snorri (28 Nov 2020)

Lovacott said:


> Years ago, I had a 1965 Morris Minor 1000 and they were not uncommon on the roads at the time.But whenever you saw one approaching, you always gave a flash of your lights and maybe a smile in recognition of your shared passion (although in my case, it was a very cheap car to buy at the time and I really wanted a Ford Capri).


Indeed, I heard that thousands of Royal Mail and Post Office Telephone employees were on the sick due to eye damage caused by these flashing lights.


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## lazybloke (28 Nov 2020)

Obviously every step of 'pavement pounding' sends a shockwave up through the skeleton to the brain, causing a cumulative liquifaction that gradually turns all joggers into grumpy aholes.


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

lazybloke said:


> Obviously every step of 'pavement pounding' sends a shockwave up through the skeleton to the brain, causing a cumulative liquifaction that gradually turns all joggers into grumpy aholes.


I was thinking about that when they were talking on the news earlier in the week about the link between dementia and heading a football.

Surely an hours jogging (which makes your brain to do a six inch slam dunk every half a second) would cause at least as much damage as a lifetime of FA Cup winning glancing headers?


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## cougie uk (28 Nov 2020)

You're forgetting that runners have shock absorbers such as their legs to take the impact.


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

cougie uk said:


> You're forgetting that runners have shock absorbers such as their legs to take the impact.


I see proper runners and I see joggers.

Proper runners glide along with their head up, joggers pound along looking down using a technique specifically designed to destroy their internal organs.


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## byegad (28 Nov 2020)

I always remember that the guy, from I think California, who 'invented' jogging died early on a run.


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## Mburton1993 (28 Nov 2020)

I do both and a nod will do. It's exercise time not social time. 

Also headphones when running.


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## ebikeerwidnes (28 Nov 2020)

I started cycling more frequently last July - mostly along a route to the airport and back

At the time most cyclists nodded or waved to each other - which was nice so I joined in. As people started to recognise me I got more and more nice waved etc
On narrower paths - as opposed to proper roads - a lot of people also said 'morning' hello or whatever

Joggers - not so much - but I would agree with the concept that a lot of they do not have any breath to spare - or energy to move an arm out of the jogging swing

During lockdown the number of other cyclists increased - some nodded/waved but some didn't - you could say that if a cyclists didn't wave/nod then they were a 'lockdown only' cyclists

Slightly weird thing - passed a female cyclists on a path at one point - nodded and said 'morning' - she just glared at me and snapped "NO" - which was a bit strange - she must have been having a bad day


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## Notafettler (28 Nov 2020)

I find loads of cyclists are pig ignorant and ignore you if you say hello. Invariably on road bikes. Can't give an opinion on runners as see very little and those i do see I know.


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

ebikeerwidnes said:


> Slightly weird thing - passed a female cyclists on a path at one point - nodded and said 'morning' - she just glared at me and snapped "NO" - which was a bit strange - she must have been having a bad day



My daughter is 20 and is at Uni and she detests it when male cyclists say hello.

In her mind, she sees an ulterior motive which is a shame because 99.9% of them only see her as a fellow cyclist.


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## Archie_tect (28 Nov 2020)

Nobody's mentioned the simple truth that it's probably not possible to get any words out loud enough between breaths while running... all the ones I pass are friendly enough, just not capable of speech!


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## a.twiddler (28 Nov 2020)

With reference to joggers, maybe it depends on what sort of area you live in.

Are you confusing people in shell suits, fleeing the scene of a crime, with joggers? 

Some joggers do seem a bit intense, but perhaps they are focused on their own PBs dictated by their Smartwatch, or whatever system is favoured by runners, in the way some cyclists are, in their world of pain and determination. Everything else gets tuned out, they aren't deliberately being rude.

I certainly get responses if I come across joggers on a mixed use track for example.

I would rather sit on a saddle and let the chain take the strain than than walk or run and since I ventured into the strange and wonderful world of recumbents I can even do it lying down (almost).

.


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## lazybloke (28 Nov 2020)

Archie_tect said:


> Nobody's mentioned the simple truth that it's probably not possible to get any words out loud enough between breaths while running... all the ones I pass are friendly enough, just not capable of speech!


I doubt anyone jogging - or running - in public is putting in that level of exertion. They're simply being more miserable than those that do respond.


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## pawl (28 Nov 2020)

To busy trying to keep their lungs full of oxygen to gasp out a hello


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## bikingdad90 (28 Nov 2020)

I’ll admit to been a runner. At the start of a run I’ll say morning and give cyclists and pedestrians a wave but when I am midway through or near the end I am usually dying and struggling to keep my pace going so the most you’ll get from me is a nod or a wave acknowledgment as I can’t breath well and say hi back! It’s the equivalent of grinding up a hill trying to hold a conversation or sing when on a bike.


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## mikeIow (28 Nov 2020)

It is curious.....I’ve noticed on some recent rides that I would say only about half the cyclists wave/smile/nod. 
I’m baffled why so many ignore a cyclist going the other way. Not after a massive greeting, but a nod and/or a smile isn’t too hard to manage, surely. Or is that surly  I always try to smile and say “hi”.
Frankly, the ones who ignore me look somewhat miserable as well.
Maybe for some my lack of drop bars or excessive lycra paints me as a fake cyclist


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## steverob (28 Nov 2020)

Back when I was a runner, I never did it because I enjoyed it; it was a means to getting fitter or because I was training for something specific (usually a much longer run I'd planned in the future). Because of that, when I was out I was focused on just getting it done (and getting it over with as soon as possible!) with my head down and would rarely notice other people except to avoid them as though they were just obstacles I didn't want to run in to - mobile lamp-posts if you will. Plus I rarely had much breath left that could be used to say "hello" even if I'd wanted to.

Whereas when I'm out on my bike, I'm there because I want to be - I'm enjoying myself and the fitness/excerise I'm getting is just a happy by-product. So normally when I'm riding, unless I'm doing something silly like sprinting for a village sign or coming to the top of a big hill, I'm usually in a comfort zone and able to react to my fellow riders positively because I'm in a good mood. Or at least that's my excuse.


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## Mo1959 (28 Nov 2020)

Unlike some, I enjoy running, albeit slowly these days. Much better way to get through the winter for me, and actually gives me more of a buzz than cycling. I don’t see many people as I go out so early but on the odd occasion always say a Hi or Good Morning. 

Going to give the Marcothon challenge a go to get me through December. Have to run a minimum of 25 minutes or 3 miles every day of the month. It’s more of a mental challenge than physical.


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## Toshiba Boy (28 Nov 2020)

Tripster said:


> I run in the fells to purposely avoid people and interaction... the Herdwicks are my only friends


I bet they are ....... Baaaa!


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

bikingdad90 said:


> I’ll admit to been a runner. At the start of a run I’ll say morning and give cyclists and pedestrians a wave but when I am midway through or near the end I am usually dying and struggling to keep my pace going so the most you’ll get from me is a nod or a wave acknowledgment as I can’t breath well and say hi back! It’s the equivalent of grinding up a hill trying to hold a conversation or sing when on a bike.



To flip this thread onto its head, I see joggers as people trying to do exactly the same things as me. Getting out of the house and taking in the world in an attempt to improve their lives.

That's why I always say hello.


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## Moodyman (28 Nov 2020)

byegad said:


> I always remember that the guy, from I think California, who 'invented' jogging died early on a run.



James Fixx.

His premature death was deemed the result of his poor lifestyle outside of running. Hence, the term 'you can't outrun a bad diet'.


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## Moodyman (28 Nov 2020)

Running engages far more of the body than cycling and so, is much tougher. It's likely that the joggers the OP sees are puffed out.

Experienced runners, as @Drago mentioned, tend to zone out. It's a sort of semi-trance and the most wonderful feeling.


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## ebikeerwidnes (28 Nov 2020)

Moodyman said:


> Running engages far more of the body than cycling and so, is much tougher. It's likely that the joggers the OP sees are puffed out.
> 
> Experienced runners, as @Drago mentioned, tend to zone out. It's a sort of semi-trance and the most wonderful feeling.


Looks like that when you see proper runners bouncing along with a perfect rhythm and efficient looking action 
it's just the amount of effort to get to that stage when I've never been any kind of a runner - at school I used to job for most of the 400 yards races we had to do in PE in summer - turns out I had mild asthma which I found out when I was in my fifties!!


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## C R (28 Nov 2020)

I get as many hellos from runners as I get from cyclists, some runners are miserable as are some cyclists. I do normally greet either cyclists or runners I come across, but it doesn't bother me if the greeting is not returned.


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## ebikeerwidnes (28 Nov 2020)

When I'm on canal paths I normally stop to let joggers get past without too much slowing down or moving - I reckon it is easier for me to stop and get going again on my ebike than it is for a jogger - partly due to breaking their rhythm
If I do that I normally get a thanks - or wave or something


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## CanucksTraveller (28 Nov 2020)

You know all is well in the world when threads about "which oil", "what do you wash your bike with" and "waving at people" are trending. 
Reassuringly, all is fine in the world of CycleChat. 😊


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## faster (28 Nov 2020)

As someone who's equally keen on running and cycling, I think this is because the runner will already have said 'hi' or given a friendly wave to multiple runners that they actually know, and probably doesn't feel the need to respond to random strangers.

Running has a very strong community aspect to it at the moment which is almost completely absent from cycling. Hard truth, but as a pastime, running is more sociable than cycling by a factor of about 1,000 - the differences are stark in my opinion.

The difference is undoubtedly due to parkrun - cycling has no equivalent.

It's not difficult to see how hundreds of runners meeting up every Saturday at over 700 different locations in the UK alone will build strong friendly communities.


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> Unlike some, I enjoy running, albeit slowly these days.



My legs are like tree trunks from cycling and (even though I say it myself), I am pretty fit.

But running for even a few minutes plays buggery with my knees.


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## lazybloke (28 Nov 2020)

bikingdad90 said:


> I’ll admit to been a runner. At the start of a run I’ll say morning and give cyclists and pedestrians a wave but when I am midway through or near the end I am usually dying and struggling to keep my pace going so the most you’ll get from me is a nod or a wave acknowledgment as I can’t breath well and say hi back! It’s the equivalent of grinding up a hill trying to hold a conversation or sing when on a bike.


Not sure how a monosyllabic 'Hi' is anything like singing or holding a conversation!

It's fine if people don't want to be sociable, there's no need for spurious excuses.


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## Lovacott (28 Nov 2020)

C R said:


> I get as many hellos from runners as I get from cyclists, some runners are miserable as are some cyclists. I do normally greet either cyclists or runners I come across, but it doesn't bother me if the greeting is not returned.


It could be simply that there is a code of conduct which dictates that cyclists must give a nod to other cyclists?

Or maybe there isn't a code of conduct at all?

F*(ed if know.

That's why I asked the question,


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## Globalti (28 Nov 2020)

Juan Kog said:


> Why run /jog when someone went to the trouble to invent the Bicycle. That's just weird.



Exactly my point. Why run when you can get there faster and have more fun on a bike?


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## mudsticks (28 Nov 2020)

lazybloke said:


> I doubt anyone jogging - or running - in public is putting in that level of exertion. They're simply being more miserable than those that do respond.



I'm a runner as well as a cyclist.

And relentlessly cheery when out and about.

But running is definitely harder, unless we're talking 1 in 4 Hill climbs.

I only run from home atm so there's a fair chance that anyone I see will know me at least by sight, so it makes sense to be friendly, just in case.

Resisting the temptation to stop and chat, esp on hills is, actually quite hard.

Especially as my running mate is 20 *years my junior and has even longer legs than me. 

The being out of puff thing, is definitely a thing.

Outside of that, I think it's the same as with anyone, cyclists, runners, walkers whoever.. Some folks are friendly, some are in 'the zone' and others just cba with greeting passing strangers.

Surely sheer volume of people makes a difference too?? If I'm hiking and haven't seen anyone all day, then I'll stop for a chat if I see someone.

In a busier place where there's someone every half mile, that gets a bit repetitive, so I don't bother ..

Edit.. *Oh shoot.. It's more like 30 years


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## shnjmsn (28 Nov 2020)

I'm mostly a cyclist, though when the roads are horrible and very dark after work in the winter I do tend to migrate a bit more to running during the week, albeit very slowly.......... I always say hello to everyone I pass, dog walkers, cyclists, runners.......... Whether I'm on the bike or running. Some respond, some don't.......... I'm not too hung up on it. It makes me happy that I've said hello or good morning and they've ignored me  I may even shout 'lovely day' afterwards if they've chosen to ignore me...........

To be fair it's been proper murky dark and grey here in Somerset today, visibility was rubbish for most of the morning. I was ignored on two different occasions by cyclists dressed in black with no lights................ But to be fair I was in yellow lycra with lights everywhere............ Everyone else said hello !


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## nickyboy (28 Nov 2020)

For all the cyclists here looking down on runners, belittling what they do, don't complain when other road users look down on you, belittling what you do


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## a.twiddler (28 Nov 2020)

Even if I am feeling particularly grumpy and unsociable I try to remember that it's nice to be important, but it's more important to be nice. So even if your greeting seems to be wasted on people, perhaps just by the law of averages, some of them will feel better disposed to the next cyclist they may come across. Usually, once I get going on two wheels I feel pretty good anyway, so I'm not too bothered if someone doesn't respond. I think it would be a fair stretch for anyone to describe me as relentlessly cheery, even so.

If I'm on the tourer people are least responsive, if I'm on the folder people find me more approachable, if I'm on the recumbent I have to beat them off with a stick! Yet there are still people who are so oblivious to their surroundings that you could ride past naked on a unicycle and they still wouldn't acknowledge you if you said hello.


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## Tripster (28 Nov 2020)

Yesterday I slowed right up on canal path to 4 Mph (on Garmin) and from 10 metres or so away gentle said ”Good Morning, may I just squeeze past” as I had done multiple times along the path. On this occasion the couple turned and stepped aside and as I past told me to “bloody slow down”........... I was at walking pace. I said what a lovely day it was and hoped they had a lovely walk. Miserable gits. My broken nose and scares above eyes must make me look a crazy cycling thug  
Miserable people in all walks of life. Hence I run in the hills away from them all.
Social distancing Rules
Keep the 2 metre rule
No mixing forever


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## Notafettler (28 Nov 2020)

Come to think of it a "pack" of cyclist used to pass me regularly on the way to the pub. About 15 of them all but one was pig ignorant apart from a lady cyclist. All the rest clearly thought it was beneath them to say hello to someone on a touring bike.


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## Notafettler (28 Nov 2020)

I would expect a runner to just lift there hand in a reply to a cyclist hello. They are after all likely to be out of breath. Unlike a cyclist they are working just as hard running downhill as they are uphill.


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## mudsticks (29 Nov 2020)

Notafettler said:


> Come to think of it a "pack" of cyclist used to pass me regularly on the way to the pub. About 15 of them all but one was pig ignorant apart from a lady cyclist. All the rest clearly thought it was beneath them to say hello to someone on a touring bike.



Interesting isn't it. 

I'll often be ignored by packs of roadies, if I'm out on an unclad bike. 

But if I've got all my touring packs on they will more often acknowledge me. 

As if I at least fit into some sort of 'proper' cyclist category..


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## Lovacott (29 Nov 2020)

mudsticks said:


> I'm a runner as well as a cyclist.
> 
> And relentlessly cheery when out and about.
> 
> But running is definitely harder, unless we're talking 1 in 4 Hill climbs.



I considered joining the local "couch to 10k" group a year ago after seeing what it had done for a couple of my mates.

I actually went down to the park to join but one of the more popular members is a guy I caught pinching (big time) from work a few years ago. I gave him the choice of either resigning his job or being reported by me. He resigned citing "family issues" and we have retained cordial (but not entirely friendly) relations since.

When I saw him holding court as I entered the park, I couldn't bring myself to ruin his evening so I looked down at the pavement and did a quick jog around half of the park before walking home via the pub and the chippy. Running seems too complicated for me.

When I'm blasting it down a hill on my bike, I don't have people yapping in my ear.

Solitude for an hour or two is a great thing.


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## mudsticks (29 Nov 2020)

Lovacott said:


> I considered joining the local "couch to 10k" group a year ago after seeing what it had done for a couple of my mates.
> 
> I actually went down to the park to join but one of the more popular members is a guy I caught pinching (big time) from work a few years ago. I gave him the choice of either resigning his job or being reported by me. He resigned citing "family issues" and we have retained cordial (but not entirely friendly) relations since.
> 
> ...



Yes solitude can be a fine thing, for sure... 

But running is only as complicated as you want to make it. 

I put on my running shoes, suitable clothes and go out for an hour, twice or three times a week. 

It helps that I have someone living here who is into running at a similar speed, and for a similar distance, to go with on the cba type days. 

Sometimes we chat, sometimes not. 

Sentences are necessarily short on the uphill  

But I do have the advantage of living in an area with an abundance of green lanes, heathland, and fine views for off road running. 

I'm not sure how I'd feel about doing it in the town, but you can usually find somewhere reasonably nice / interesting wherever you are. 

But no, running whilst being harangued by a loudmouthed, ego tripper doesn't sound like much fun at all


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## Tripster (29 Nov 2020)

I love living so close to the lakes, in winter especially its great seeing hardly anyone out running in the hills


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## mudsticks (29 Nov 2020)

Tripster said:


> I love living so close to the lakes, in winter especially its great seeing hardly anyone out running in the hills




No need to rub it in.. 

Today wasn't so awful in these parts either.


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## DCBassman (30 Nov 2020)

About 50/50, I'd say.


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## jpj84 (30 Nov 2020)

This caught me out when I started running a few years ago - I assumed the etiquette was the same as cycling, and was a bit surprised when most runners ignored my greeting.

I quickly realised road running is rubbish,and started running on the fells though - where everyone greets everyone


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## carvelos (30 Nov 2020)

Joggers are just fine it's the dog walkers who literally pour out venom like a hagfish pours out slime that I love saying hello to when cycling. I always explain that I have plenty of time for them to leash their hounds and that I am not in the habit of squashing sausage dogs or spaffing spaniels. Nothing seems to make them believe me

We have a great series of passive aggressive signs on our cycle routes here on the iOW. The signs read 'cyclist ring bell' but does not go on to explain when or why. I have worn out three cheap pingers and an old trusty bell of a Raleigh complying with this instruction.


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## Mo1959 (30 Nov 2020)

Seems to be a few runners here but the running forum off-shoot never seems to have taken off.


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## LJR69 (30 Nov 2020)

I found most joggers would nod or smile when I was jogging. I tell you what I have noticed though. If I'm out on my road bike most other road cyclists will acknowledge or say hi when you pass them. If I'm out on my mtb and pass a road cyclist the acknowledgement drops to about 50% lol


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## Lostagain (30 Nov 2020)

Plenty of cyclists in this part of Kent who steadfastly ignore me. Just assume that they are miserable b*st*rds


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## Ming the Merciless (30 Nov 2020)

carvelos said:


> Joggers are just fine it's the dog walkers who literally pour out venom like a hagfish pours out slime that I love saying hello to when cycling. I always explain that I have plenty of time for them to leash their hounds and that I am not in the habit of squashing sausage dogs or spaffing spaniels. Nothing seems to make them believe me
> 
> We have a great series of passive aggressive signs on our cycle routes here on the iOW. The signs read 'cyclist ring bell' but does not go on to explain when or why. I have worn out three cheap pingers and an old trusty bell of a Raleigh complying with this instruction.



You are only meant to ring the bell when passing the sign.


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## MntnMan62 (30 Nov 2020)

I'm going to disagree with those who are saying runners aren't friendly. First of all, I haven't run in many years. But I used to run the same trails that I have ridden on the mountain bike. Runners are just as friendly. I will admit that running is more difficult or more taxing on the cardiovascular system than biking. Therefore it can be harder to speak while running. But when I would pass another runner there was always some sort of recognition, whether it be a nod of the head to a wave of the hand or a "Hey!" as I used to do. To suggest that bikers are more friendly than runners is a gross over-generalization. It's like saying that all Trump fans are stupid or all Biden fans are liberals. I haven't run in ages and identify more as a biker these days. But I don't presume to think that bikers are more friendly or better than runners. That's just silly.


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## carvelos (30 Nov 2020)

YukonBoy said:


> You are only meant to ring the bell when passing the sign.


If I ring my bell but there is no one there to hear it, have I TRULY rung my bell??


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## C R (30 Nov 2020)

carvelos said:


> If I ring my bell but there is no one there to hear it, have I TRULY rung my bell??


It depends on whether you're recording your ride on Strava.


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> Seems to be a few runners here but the running forum off-shoot never seems to have taken off.



Well I'm a runner, as in I run.. 
But maybe don't think of myself as "A Runner" - 

But then I'm also a cyclist, as in that I cycle. 
But not sure if I think of myself as "A Cyclist" 

So.. 

In which case - 

- what the heck am I even doing _here _??? 

Oh shoot, thanks for the existential crisis @Mo1959 

And its only Tuesday


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## DCBassman (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Oh shoot, thanks for the existential crisis @Mo1959


You think, therefore you am.
Crisis averted!


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

DCBassman said:


> You think, therefore you am.
> Crisis averted!


Phew thanks.. 

Does this mean if I screw up my little ol eyes as tight as can be, and thunk a big ol thunk .. 

I can be whatever I want to be


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## Mo1959 (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Well I'm a runner, as in I run..
> But maybe don't think of myself as "A Runner" -


I'm definitely a plodder these days with all my lumbar disc and sciatic issues that have plagued me, but I am a stubborn pig so have just started day one of the Marcothon Challenge. Just another 30 days to run this month!


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## DCBassman (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Phew thanks..
> 
> Does this mean if I screw up my little ol eyes as tight as can be, and thunk a big ol thunk ..
> 
> I can be whatever I want to be


Oh yes!


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> I'm definitely a plodder these days with all my lumbar disc and sciatic issues that have plagued me, but I am a stubborn pig so have just started day one of the Marcothon Challenge. Just another 30 days to run this month!



Just keep going.. 

And in my professional yoga teaching capacity, I do have to enquire as to whether you're doing your post run stretches _properly?? _

I didn't the other day, post run and my sacro iliacs really gave me a hard time for it. 

I've got a number of runners in my classes who say they've been pretty much pain free knees, hips and back since learning the right moves. 

Although my back hurt quite a lot the other day after all day work on the farm, and then felt better for a run.. 

Maybe we just need to keep moving, otherwise we might seize up..


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## DRM (1 Dec 2020)

carvelos said:


> Joggers are just fine it's the dog walkers who literally pour out venom like a hagfish pours out slime that I love saying hello to when cycling. I always explain that I have plenty of time for them to leash their hounds and that I am not in the habit of squashing sausage dogs or spaffing spaniels. Nothing seems to make them believe me
> 
> We have a great series of passive aggressive signs on our cycle routes here on the iOW. The signs read 'cyclist ring bell' but does not go on to explain when or why. I have worn out three cheap pingers and an old trusty bell of a Raleigh complying with this instruction.



View: https://youtu.be/vsBak0oCgdY

Here you go, a musical treat to go with your signs, if you wear out your current bell you can always call out ding dong, but you must be careful with how you say it, you don't want to mistaken for Terry Thomas and chased up the road by a young ladies angry boyfriend!

View: https://youtu.be/0awJf7OWMmo


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## Mo1959 (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> And in my professional yoga teaching capacity, I do have to enquire as to whether you're doing your post run stretches _properly?? _


Not even sure what ones to do to be honest. I am as stiff and tight as a plank of wood! 

Definitely agree that you have to keep moving though.


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> Not even sure what ones to do to be honest. I am as stiff and tight as a plank of wood!
> 
> Definitely agree that you have to keep moving though.



Sensible hamstring, and calf stretches. 
And things that lengthen and broaden your sacrum / lumbar area. 

Not the kind of bouncy, yet cursory type stuff you'll often see people doing post run. 

I often want to go and intervene and ask why people are adding insult to injury. 

But its none of my business so.. 

It's best if you can go to someone who knows their stuff to get them to show and tell on your body, for your specific issues.


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## LJR69 (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> I didn't the other day, post run and my _sacro iliacs _really gave me a hard time for it.



Isn't that just south of Bristol?


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

LJR69 said:


> Isn't that just south of Bristol?



Yes there's a lovely hillfort there


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## DCBassman (1 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Maybe we just need to keep moving, otherwise we might seize up..


Truth


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## Mo1959 (1 Dec 2020)

@mudsticks What do you think of these? Gimmick, or of some benefit. My hamstrings are very tight and feel a bit knotted. Thought it might help?


View: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B083PYWWF9/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> @mudsticks What do you think of these? Gimmick, or of some benefit. My hamstrings are very tight and feel a bit knotted. Thought it might help?
> 
> 
> View: https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B083PYWWF9/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1





I don't know, is the short answer. 

But you can do a lot with good stretching and targeted massage, that won't require you pay for, or carry around something that looks like it could get you arrested


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## a.twiddler (1 Dec 2020)

carvelos said:


> If I ring my bell but there is no one there to hear it, have I TRULY rung my bell??


Ah yes, but_ you_ will know you have rung your bell, in a spirit of wholeheartedness, and the balance of the universe will be maintained!


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## mudsticks (1 Dec 2020)

Dogtrousers said:


> My bell is connected by bluetooth to my Garmin so I can do analysis on bell-ringing rates and big data analysis from lots of riders can highlight bell-ringing hotspots.



I'll show you my bell ringing spreadsheet,
if you'll show me yours..


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## LJR69 (1 Dec 2020)

a.twiddler said:


> Ah yes, but_ you_ will know you have rung your bell, in a spirit of wholeheartedness, and the balance of the universe will be maintained!


Ah yes, Bell's Conservation of Campanology Momentum law which states a ringing opportunity can neither be created, nor destroyed.


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## Fivethumbs (1 Dec 2020)

I've come to this thread late, round here if I see a runner or a cyclist there is a good chance they are a family member or neighbour so greetings are always given! Of the non locals about 90% of both cyclists and runners respond to a greeting (and 100% of horse riders!) 
On the stretching, I find it really useful to keep me even vaguely flexible and to minimise injury, I run as well as cycle and do it after both.


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## MntnMan62 (1 Dec 2020)

I'll add that I'm one of those cyclists who doesn't wave back. I live in NJ. The most densely populated state in the country. Where I tend to ride there are lots of other people riding as well. If I had to wave and acknowledge every biker that I pass, I'd have a sore arm or sore throat. It just becomes annoying. At most I nod my head. So, if people think that I'm unfriendly or anti-social, they would be mostly correct.


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## Cirrus (1 Dec 2020)

Anecdotal so not empirical, but I sometimes get a wave from cyclists when on my bike, whereas I find runners more "friendly" and get a lot more waves etc when out running.


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## Rusty Nails (1 Dec 2020)

Pedestrians are not getting a look-in here. Whenever I walk in the city centre, or the park, or my local streets I wave at everyone I see. I get some strange looks and very few of the miserable buggers wave back.

Cyclists are the epitome of bonhomie in comparison (or bonfemie if that is even a word).


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## a.twiddler (1 Dec 2020)

Aren't joggers and runners a variety of pedestrian then? Just a bit faster.


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## Rusty Nails (1 Dec 2020)

a.twiddler said:


> Aren't joggers and runners a variety of pedestrian then? Just a bit faster.



No. Walking means you have to have one foot on the floor all time.


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## MntnMan62 (2 Dec 2020)

Rusty Nails said:


> No. Walking means you have to have one foot on the floor all time.



But what if your walk has a bit of a skip in it that causes both feet to leave the ground at the same time? What would you call that?


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## LJR69 (2 Dec 2020)

MntnMan62 said:


> But what if your walk has a bit of a skip in it that causes both feet to leave the ground at the same time? What would you call that?


Skipping 😂


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## gcogger (2 Dec 2020)

I find that skippers never say hello when I pass them on a bike...


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## Rusty Nails (2 Dec 2020)

MntnMan62 said:


> But what if your walk has a bit of a skip in it that causes both feet to leave the ground at the same time? What would you call that?



Weird, or very powerful hiccups.


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## SkipdiverJohn (2 Dec 2020)

mikeIow said:


> Frankly, the ones who ignore me look somewhat miserable as well. Maybe for some my lack of drop bars or excessive lycra paints me as a fake cyclist



I find them a mixed bag. Joggers generally are miserable buggers, or the've got headphones on and are oblivious to the world. There's the odd exception, but not many. Dog walkers on gravel paths are much more civilised and interactive.
Commuting cyclists on weekdays generally don't nod or wave. I suspect a lot don't cycle from choice and don't like having to do it, as they often look grumpy.
Weekend riders are more friendly, apart from the full-on head down, arse up in the air lycra brigade who are more concerned about getting their PB than they are about communicating with anyone else. God forbid, it might cost them 0.1 mph!


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## LJR69 (2 Dec 2020)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> God forbid, it might cost them 0.1 mph!



head down, head up, Lycra, or dressed as a gorillagram makes no odds to me. I’m always as slow as molasses


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## RoadRider400 (2 Dec 2020)

Speaking as a runner and a cyclist. I find it much easier to ease back, look towards somebody and say morning when on the bike. You can relax and rely on the momentum of the bike. When I used to respond to mornings whilst running I found it affected my rhythm so stopped doing it.

I think its a bit ignorant to consider a runner grumpy because they have not responded to a 'morning'/'evening'.


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## lazybloke (5 Dec 2020)

RoadRider400 said:


> Speaking as a runner and a cyclist. I find it much easier to ease back, look towards somebody and say morning when on the bike. You can relax and rely on the momentum of the bike. When I used to respond to mornings whilst running I found it affected my rhythm so stopped doing it.
> 
> I think its a bit ignorant to consider a runner grumpy because they have not responded to a 'morning'/'evening'.


Fair enough, I'm not a runner so I don't know how much effort is involved; although I'm surprised a leisurely jogger can't even lift a hand in greeting!
Even when I'm riding full-bore up a hill with heart-rate approaching 190, I still like to acknowledge others.

I see plenty of miserable cyclists too, in case you think I'm picking on runners specifically.


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## MntnMan62 (6 Dec 2020)

lazybloke said:


> Fair enough, I'm not a runner so I don't know how much effort is involved; although I'm surprised a leisurely jogger can't even lift a hand in greeting!
> Even when I'm riding full-bore up a hill with heart-rate approaching 190, I still like to acknowledge others.
> 
> I see plenty of miserable cyclists too, in case you think I'm picking on runners specifically.



The way I see it, those who would denigrate people simply because they can't be bothered enough to acknowledge some stranger passing by suggests that something else is afoot. Something like deep insecurity. I guess as I go by you on my bike and don't acknowledge your presence, that makes me a jerk? Yeah. That must be it.


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## shnjmsn (6 Dec 2020)

lazybloke said:


> Fair enough, I'm not a runner so I don't know how much effort is involved; although I'm surprised a leisurely jogger can't even lift a hand in greeting!
> Even when I'm riding full-bore up a hill with heart-rate approaching 190, I still like to acknowledge others.
> 
> I see plenty of miserable cyclists too, in case you think I'm picking on runners specifically.



I'm still waving to everyone on a bike..........whether they acknowledge it or not, I'm not too bothered, but it cheers me up and I often stop to speak to people, not just on the bike............. I'm a people person...... However, now I'm running a bit more regularly it's more of a struggle, but I do try to put my hand up even if I can't speak !!!! The other thing I've realised is anything that put's me off of my rhythm isn't good....... like checking behind for traffic etc, it really doesn't help....... Whereas those things on a bike are a bit easier ! Still, I shall persist with the running to help out over the cold dark winter months to supplement the cycling


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## Mo1959 (6 Dec 2020)

shnjmsn said:


> Still, I shall persist with the running to help out over the cold dark winter months to supplement the cycling


I'm doing the Marcothon Challenge. Running every day in December. 

Just back from a very leisurely 9 miles. Freezing here and roads a bit sparkly.


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## mudsticks (6 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> I'm doing the Marcothon Challenge. Running every day in December.
> 
> Just back from a very leisurely 9 miles. Freezing here and roads a bit sparkly.



Wow that's keen, but I'll bet it was very picturesque. 

You're not really running everyday are you -? 
Don't you need a day of rest and recovery, to prevent injury. 

Or is that just me finding an excuse not to go everyday ??


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## Mo1959 (6 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Wow that's keen, but I'll bet it was very picturesque.
> 
> You're not really running everyday are you -?
> Don't you need a day of rest and recovery, to prevent injury.
> ...


Lol. Has to be every day of the month with no rest days, even Christmas!  Just has to be for a minimum of 3 miles or 25 minutes whichever comes first, but I usually do a bit longer. Lots of easy days thrown in as a sort of recovery.


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## mudsticks (6 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> Lol. Has to be every day of the month with no rest days, even Christmas!  Just has to be for a minimum of 3 miles or 25 minutes whichever comes first, but I usually do a bit longer. Lots of easy days thrown in as a sort of recovery.



Sure its fine if you're used to it. 

Depends on your general level of fitness, but I was always under the impression you were supposed to have 'zero' days for recovery. 

Well that's my excuse for having slack days on long hikes, or bike rides, and I'm sticking with it Mo 

I remember being at a Col somewhere in the mountains enjoying the view. 

This guy sweated his way up to the top, clearly accompanied by some sort of personal trainer, he looked like he was about to pause for a breather (or die) but no his tormentor shouted out, "don't stop, no breaks" 

And harried him down the other side. 

Seems like you're a "no breaks" kind of woman too 

Have fun


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## shnjmsn (6 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> I'm doing the Marcothon Challenge. Running every day in December.
> 
> Just back from a very leisurely 9 miles. Freezing here and roads a bit sparkly.



Aaaaaaah............. I'm not that keen ! I'd still rather ride 100 miles for a coffee on a Saturday morning than run for 3 miles....... but needs must ! 🏃‍♂️😂


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## johnnyb47 (7 Dec 2020)

The only time i ever smiled whilst running, was when i managed to get to the pub before closing time


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## lazybloke (7 Dec 2020)

I've been far too rude to runners, and have decided i'll give a go so I can see for myself how difficult it is. I'm working up to it... Maybe this weekend.


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## John482 (14 Dec 2020)

I never noticed too much. A lot of cyclists will say hello though but that's understandable we're all into the same thing. Joggers might say hello to joggers I suppose. I've noticed I even get respect from ADV (adventure bike) riders. That surprised me, I don't think of myself as a biker. I guess it's because we both do our thing on 2 wheels.


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## mitchp (14 Dec 2020)

This is an interesting topic as I've often pondered on it as have been a little upset many times at not getting a return wave or hello ...... from fellow cyclists! Most of my cycling is around London and Essex countryside and perhaps being a little old fashioned (in my 60's now) I always waved to other cyclists but I have to say that about 50% never respond, which I find quite upsetting and bad mannered. I mostly ride solo and when out on a long ride it really does help to lift spirits when you get a friendly wave. Lady cyclists in particular never seem to respond for some reason.So come on all you cyclists and give a wave! On the other hand when I meet a jogger in opposite direction they always smile or wave when I say hello and I see and share their pain!


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## MntnMan62 (14 Dec 2020)

mitchp said:


> This is an interesting topic as I've often pondered on it as have been a little upset many times at not getting a return wave or hello ...... from fellow cyclists! Most of my cycling is around London and Essex countryside and perhaps being a little old fashioned (in my 60's now) I always waved to other cyclists but I have to say that about 50% never respond, which I find quite upsetting and bad mannered. I mostly ride solo and when out on a long ride it really does help to lift spirits when you get a friendly wave. Lady cyclists in particular never seem to respond for some reason.So come on all you cyclists and give a wave! On the other hand when I meet a jogger in opposite direction they always smile or wave when I say hello and I see and share their pain!



If you ride in a pretty densely populated area then there are tons of other cyclists out there riding. Waving or acknnowledging each and every one of them can become quite daunting. It then becomes a chore. You ride near London where I imagine there are lots of people riding. I find it interesting that you find it both upsetting and bad mannered. I don't want to offend but expecting each and every rider to acknowledge you seems to be a lil bit narcissistic. Just a lil bit.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcwxobtNRFQ


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## GoodLifeSpud (15 Dec 2020)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> Weekend riders are more friendly, apart from the full-on head down, arse up in the air lycra brigade who are more concerned about getting their PB than they are about communicating with anyone else. God forbid, it might cost them 0.1 mph!



You said what I was thinking. You can almost predict who you are or aren't going to get a nod from based on the seriousness of the kit/bike being used. There are obviously some exceptions but I can't believe it costs that much time or energy just to make a small acknowledgment. 

That said, I got overtaken going up a hill the other week by one such person and he shouted something like "let's have it" - I wasn't sure he was taking the piss or genuinely be encouraging as I was clearly knackered 

Different strokes or different folks I guess.


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## Drzdave58 (15 Dec 2020)

Are these sausage suits really necessary? They only look good on women IMO 🤣


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## ianrauk (15 Dec 2020)

SkipdiverJohn said:


> I find them a mixed bag. Joggers generally are miserable buggers, or the've got headphones on and are oblivious to the world. There's the odd exception, but not many. Dog walkers on gravel paths are much more civilised and interactive.
> Commuting cyclists on weekdays generally don't nod or wave. I suspect a lot don't cycle from choice and don't like having to do it, as they often look grumpy.
> Weekend riders are more friendly, apart from the full-on head down, arse up in the air lycra brigade who are more concerned about getting their PB than they are about communicating with anyone else. God forbid, it might cost them 0.1 mph!




I haven't really been following this thread, but i hasn't taken it very long to say roadie cyclists are unfriendly for not saying hello.
So here's your






And as for commuting cyclists not saying hello as they don't cycle from choice? 

Cycle Chat Bingo in full effect, so you've certainly earnt it.


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## MntnMan62 (18 Dec 2020)

I'm more of a mountain biker. Hence the mountain bike clipless pedals and shoes and helmet. I've already said that when road riding I don't give a rat's xxx whether anyone waves at me or I wave at them. I can't freaking believe there are 8 pages devoted to this ridiculous topic. There seem to be some pretty uptight people in here who get their panties in a twist if they some stranger doesn't wave at them and acknowledge their presence. How ridiculously insecure.


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## LJR69 (18 Dec 2020)

You know you've now contributed to this topic right


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## MntnMan62 (18 Dec 2020)

LJR69 said:


> You know you've now contributed to this topic right



Absolutely. And it needed to be said.


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> I'm doing the Marcothon Challenge. Running every day in December.
> 
> Just back from a very leisurely 9 miles. Freezing here and roads a bit sparkly.


I kept seeing that word popping up on people's Strava, and now I know what it is. 😊


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Wow that's keen, but I'll bet it was very picturesque.
> 
> You're not really running everyday are you -?
> Don't you need a day of rest and recovery, to prevent injury.
> ...


It's not just you, I run three times a week but if I tried everyday my joints wouldn't like it, rest days are my favourite days.


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## Mo1959 (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> It's not just you, I run three times a week but if I tried everyday my joints wouldn't like it, rest days are my favourite days.


My joints don’t like it either, but I am seriously stubborn and determined when it comes to a challenge.


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> My joints don’t like it either, but I am seriously stubborn and determined when it comes to a challenge.


That's why I never start those kind of challenges in the first place. 😂

I had a knee problem in the summer which was helped by online physio from Salford University's sports science department, they sent me emails with stretches and exercises that worked for me, I can see if I've still got them if you like?


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## Mo1959 (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> That's why I never start those kind of challenges in the first place. 😂
> 
> I had a knee problem in the summer which was helped by online physio from Salford University's sports science department, they sent me emails with stretches and exercises that worked for me, I can see if I've still got them if you like?


Think it’s nerve damage from my back Colin. Two very bad bouts of sciatica which, even after the worst of the pain cleared, left some numbness in my legs and feet that’s never gone away and I think leg strength has reduced too. Can’t even push off from my toes now. Maybe should have had back surgery but it’s not always a success and I don’t want to end up worse! Happened to speak to my retired doctor who’s a keen runner and he says surgery is last resort and avoid if possible so I will just plod on the best I can.


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

Mo1959 said:


> Think it’s nerve damage from my back Colin. Two very bad bouts of sciatica which, even after the worst of the pain cleared, left some numbness in my legs and feet that’s never gone away and I think leg strength has reduced too. Can’t even push off from my toes now. Maybe should have had back surgery but it’s not always a success and I don’t want to end up worse! Happened to speak to my retired doctor who’s a keen runner and he says surgery is last resort and avoid if possible so I will just plod on the best I can.


Pilates did my joints some good, the gym I used to use had a class on a Monday night, trouble was my running club had a track night at the same time. 😊


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## mudsticks (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> It's not just you, I run three times a week but if I tried everyday my joints wouldn't like it, rest days are my favourite days.



Well in my professional capacity as a yoga teacher I have come across a lot of people who have b*ggered themselves up with pushing on through joint pain, in running and other sporting activities.

Even 'excessive' cycling.

I've been able to help some of them, but not all.
Once cartilage is gone it's gone, although they can do marvels with keyhole surgery on some repairs.

I want and need to carry on hillwalking, cycling, running, farming, and practising / teaching Yoga for as long as possible.

So I'm afraid I'm one of those dull old 'moderation in all things' (not including moderation) type people.


Mo1959 said:


> My joints don’t like it either, but I am seriously stubborn and determined when it comes to a challenge.



Just keep up with the stretching then.

Sciatica is often, but not always related to tight hamstrings.

And a narrowing and or compressing of the sacro iliac joint - that can be too much sitting.. Or sitting on cr*p chairs..


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> Well in my professional capacity as a yoga teacher I have come across a lot of people who have b*ggered themselves up with pushing on through joint pain, in running and other sporting activities.
> 
> Even 'excessive' cycling.
> 
> ...


My right knee started to make a grinding noise not so long ago, no pain but it did seem a bit weird when I first heard it. The physio reckoned that it was just the joint being out of alignment, which was causing the pain, and nothing permanent. 

Luckily it seems as if she's right because plenty of stretches and strengthening exercises have settled things down, still taking my time building the running up again though, back in February I could run 11 steady miles easily, whilst 5 is enough at the moment.


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## mudsticks (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> My right knee started to make a grinding noise not so long ago, no pain but it did seem a bit weird when I first heard it. The physio reckoned that it was just the joint being out of alignment, which was causing the pain, and nothing permanent.
> 
> Luckily it seems as if she's right because plenty of stretches and strengthening exercises have settled things down, still taking my time building the running up again though, back in February I could run 11 steady miles easily, whilst 5 is enough at the moment.



Yes exercises properly done can really help knees . 

*I've had a lot of 'success with dodgy knees' over the twenty or so years I've been teaching. 

*Although of course, it isn't 'me' that's done it. It's the method, combined with their owners dedication to the craft.


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## stephec (20 Dec 2020)

mudsticks said:


> *Although of course, it isn't 'me' that's done it. It's the method, combined with their owners dedication to the craft.


On that subject, a mate in my club once said to me, 'my problem is that when I'm injured I do the exercises that the physio gives me, but I stop doing them once I'm better again,' and to be fair this is the first time that I've ever kept them up properly as well. 

As a physio once said to me, 'the biggest problem is getting a patient to do the exercises that we give them.' 

And if I think back to a few years ago when I used to lift weights regularly I never had any joint pains, well apart from a shoulder impingement once. 😄


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## mudsticks (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> On that subject, a mate in my club once said to me, 'my problem is that when I'm injured I do the exercises that the physio gives me, but I stop doing them once I'm better again,' and to be fair this is the first time that I've ever kept them up properly as well.
> 
> As a physio once said to me, 'the biggest problem is getting a patient to do the exercises that we give them.'
> 
> And if I think back to a few years ago when I used to lift weights regularly I never had any joint pains, well apart from a shoulder impingement once. 😄




I'm afraid it's an inescapable truth that you can get away with more, and recover from injury faster when you are younger. 

But it's never too late to start making those changes. 

I've had students start in their eighties, and gain benefit. 

But in general, the sooner the better 👍


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## lazybloke (20 Dec 2020)

stephec said:


> My right knee started to make a grinding noise not so long ago, no pain but it did seem a bit weird when I first heard it. The physio reckoned that it was just the joint being out of alignment, which was causing the pain, and nothing permanent.
> 
> Luckily it seems as if she's right because plenty of stretches and strengthening exercises have settled things down, still taking my time building the running up again though, back in February I could run 11 steady miles easily, whilst 5 is enough at the moment.


In my 30s, my right knee felt quite loose and unstable; I thought it would be the end of my cycling days, just as I was beginning to enjoy the local bridleways by mountainbile.
But it had been a LACK of exercise that was making my body fail. A few months of occasional rides and my knee was back to normal. 
Am on the cusp of 50 and still no problems.


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## Paul_Smith SRCC (21 Dec 2020)

oreo_muncher said:


> I always say hello to cyclists as I ride past or at least give them a nod or wave my hand.


So do I normally; at the moment I am living such an isolated life that I say hello to everything and everybody


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