# Thinking of getting a dog...



## potsy (8 May 2018)

Most probably from the dogs home/trust.

Not had a dog since I was a kid, but due to a change in circumstances feel it would be a good time to bring one in that needs a second chance.

Any experience good or bad with going for a rescue dog?

So far the thought is to get one that is maybe 2-4 years old.

Springer spaniel or Labrador are preferred but any medium sized dog would be considered.


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## swee'pea99 (8 May 2018)

Hate to say it but I'd suggest caution. No guarantees with any dog, but a rescue dog ups your chances of neurosis, which can make life very fraught, and health problems, which can make life very expensive. I'll be interested to hear what others say, but like I say, I'd be hesitant. We got a rescue cat, and that ended up being 12 years of bonkers, with, TBH, not a lot to show for it.

PS Having said which, best not to forget that getting a dog, per se, is a great idea!


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## smutchin (8 May 2018)

We got a dog about 16 months ago - first time we've ever owned a dog and it's a lot more challenging than anticipated. Our inexperience has been shown up, and although we try to be responsible dog owners, we have been not been hugely successful in the training department.

Breed may have something to do with that - ours is a feisty terrier. Very good natured on the whole but quite strong willed. Maybe other breeds would be better choices for inexperienced owners. 

As I understand it, Dogs Trust take the time to assess prospective owners quite thoroughly to ensure they are a suitable match for their chosen dog. We got ours as a puppy from a breeder but if we ever get another, I would probably go to the Dogs Trust.


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## uphillstruggler (8 May 2018)

be prepared to have your spare time taken up by the dog.

I really enjoy taking our dog out but when time is tight as mine is, other things (cycling) take a back seat. that's not a complaint, just a fact.

saying that, I wouldn't change it for anything now.


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## welsh dragon (8 May 2018)

I would urge caution as well and not just about getting a rescue dog. Dogs take up a surprising amount of your time and effort, can cost a lot of money to keep in food, vet bills, (kennels) maybe.

They can/do smell as well (even if you can't smell them) others can as soon as they walk into your home. They drool, dribble, and shed hair all over the place. You have to clean up after them as well. This is a fact.

Your time away from home, and ability to just take off somewhere can also be a problem. Finding holiday accomodation with a dog can cause problems if you want to take the dog with you as well. And of course you always have to get home because of the dog, and you can't leave him on his own for to long.

Having had a dog in the past i know how great they can be. I also know how much I / we enjoy our freedom now that we do not have that burden.

It is also wonderful to be honest that the dog smell and hair are no longer a problem. I loved my dog dearly and missed him for a long time when he died but to be honest, i will never have another dog. They are too restrictive and i no longer want the burden.

They can be a joy, but dam hard work. Good luck if you make the decision to have one.

Spaniels can be demented dogs, very excitable and will run circles round everyone. Labradors are greedy dogs that will eat anything they can get hold of.


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## Slick (8 May 2018)

Training any dog is a fairly straightforward affair, but it does require a bit of effort and the ability to remain patient and able to remain constant. Sometimes our insistence on humanising animals is our and their downfall. 

A rescue dog is a great idea. It no way means any additional expense and may actually mean less as everything will be up to date. Enjoy.


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## Slick (8 May 2018)

welsh dragon said:


> I would urge caution as well and not just about getting a rescue dog. Dogs take up a surprising amount of your time and effort, can cost a lot of money to keep in food, vet bills, (kennels) maybe.
> 
> They can/do smell as well (even if you can't smell them) others can as soon as they walk into your home. They drool, dribble, and shed hair all over the place. You have to clean up after them as well. This is a fact.
> 
> ...


Both your examples are good dogs but need worked.


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## Time Waster (8 May 2018)

New puppy owner here. Although it owns me really. Forget about going out and leaving it alone unless you know you'll be back guaranteed by a reasonable time. No more popping out and coming back an hour or more late. No more last minute holiday bookings because you'll have to plan what to do with the dog. Basically it takes a lot of your time up.

OTH it's the best thing you can do. Get the right dog for you and the rewards will be worth it. Certainly outweigh the negatives. Learn to enjoy being with it. You both will learn each others ways.

Personally I'd buy a puppy from a breeder if you have children. It'll be hard work but worth it. 

Breed? We've got a border terrier puppy. Bright as a button and a more manageable terrier trait. Learnt sit second attempt. Learnt paw like first attempt. Lie down first attempt. Little tip it's where you put your hand that's holding the treat. Bring it over the head for sit, hair height in front after the sit command for paw then to the ground for lie.

We looked at cocker spaniel. Don't! It's very intelligent and will try to outwit you. By that I mean it'll think it knows best and will take over if you're not careful and consistent with training. Two sets of cocker spaniel, working and show. Working are nicer looking IMHO but you need to factor in their working nature or you've got trouble.

Labrador? Big garden / house? Great, go for it. Food obsessed training. Go for a working Labrador if you're buying from a breeder as a puppy. Otherwise you'll get a fat lab from a breeder or rescue.

We went for a border terrier for several reasons. Intelligent, proper working dog, small size (actually a medium sized dog), double coat so hardy, has less of the terrier trait for turning a deaf ear, not yappy, if socialised when young they'll be good with other dogs and kids and mostly when no longer a puppy or adolescent they will become very calm dogs. Not the sort to go running of with another dog or just run off.

For us the hest bit is they are bred to run with hounds and horses. That means you'll not tire one out when older if you bring them up to be active. Mine is long legged. It follows us on walks and it's beginning to get recall even with other dogs to distract. Best thing still is it loves to run alongside us on our bikes on cycle paths. We don't go fast because of our 5 year old but she will be capable of going a lot faster. Only a puppy so we're careful of not pushing her. But she loves our rides along the canal towpath.

Seriously consider a BT. If you don't want a rescue you'll pay £700-1000. Worth every penny IMHO.

Just make sure any puppy gets properly crate trained from the earliest opportunity. You'll regret out doing it.

If you do get a BT puppy that's anything like ours learn to laugh at punishment poos if you ignore it. They're intelligent and I'm convinced ours likes to get us back.


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## raleighnut (8 May 2018)

I'd love another Dog but Maz won't hear of it, she says "We'll never have as good a Dog as Sabor was" but give me a Pup and he'll be just like him but then German Shepherds are so easy to 'train'.


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## Dave 123 (8 May 2018)

We got an 18 month old black lab from the Labrador Rescue Trust.
Cracking dog. Had him put down at 14.

We don't have one now, too much of a tie.


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## Andrew_P (8 May 2018)

Having three cats, a small dog and some rodents when they die off they will not be replaced.

Hard work at times, I also see a lot of people struggling with new Puppies some not all can be pretty troublesome and destructive when left alone even for a small amount of time


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## Katherine (8 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Most probably from the dogs home/trust.
> 
> Not had a dog since I was a kid, but due to a change in circumstances feel it would be a good time to bring one in that needs a second chance.
> 
> ...


I'm sure you will give a great home to any dog. 

My son and daughter in law have 2 rescue dogs. (The second was to help settle the first - big mistake) Despite lots of attention and training, due to their emotional needs they are not able to be left in kennels, which mean that they have to go to a dog sitter when they go anywhere that you can't take dogs.


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## bigjim (8 May 2018)

One of our neighbours got a rescue dog last year. It's totally off it's head. Never stops barking. Barks at everyone from behind her legs. You can't hold a conversation with her anymore. She loves it! Got rid of her lovely cat that she had had for a long time because it was being stressed out by the dog. I'd have dumped the dog.
I like dogs, proper well trained dogs, but don't see many of them about these days. On my rides I'm forever avoiding untrained, crazy, baby/child substitutes with useless owners.


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## jongooligan (8 May 2018)

I'd echo everything @welsh dragon said. We got a pup from the Dogs Trust when my Border terrier died. It was the kids idea as they could see I was lost without my dog. It was an emotional decision and the wrong one. Thing is, I didn't really bond with this dog and now the kids are gone I'm stuck with it and it's very tying. I'm partially retired now and want to spend my time on the bike and I resent having to be at home twice a day to feed and exercise it when there's nobody else here to do it.
The dog has a nice life (my wife and MiL spoil it) and it will be well looked after but I won't be sorry when it's gone. Think long and hard before you make your decision.


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## Bonefish Blues (8 May 2018)

Agree with the advice above reassuring you that a good Dogs Trust-alike is a very safe way to go v-a-v matching you to your new owner.

The two breeds you have highlighted need a lot of exercise - do you have the time & space? OTOH there are dozens of Staffys waiting for new homes, which might be an alternative thought, and who make great pets, particularly with kids.


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## pawl (8 May 2018)

Re comment on Cocker Spaniel.First off buy a crate .Sally our cocker soon learned this was her sanctuary.Onlyhad to say bed and she would flick open the door with her nose..Paitience and reparation are important.When they do as you have asked of them,then reward.Thos dosent have to be in the form of food give them a favourite toy to play with.It is so easy to let your new pet do what they like

There are lots of good books on dog training.Back this up with owner and dog training classes.

Not able to comment on rescue dogs other than a stray who adopted me.He was brilliant.No idea of his age.was always at my side.

Dog ownership is not cheap.

Insurance 
Kennel fees 
Annual vaccination 
Food

Cost per year soon ads up,but in my opinion worth every penny.


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## Levo-Lon (8 May 2018)

breaks my heart not having a dog.
miss my Border Terrier every day,usually when the wife needs to nag the hell out of me

dog walks are the best mind and soul treatment ever.
only thing id add to some great advice is insure for the first year at least.
if the dog seems healthy open a savings account and save what you can.

that way you should cover all normal vet fees.
if you find you have a massive bill to keep the dog then its your call.
i do feel that vets offer too much these days and this is why treatment can cost £1,000s.
not wanting to sound harsh, but your already giving a rescued animal a new life, so its already had its lucky escape.

if you just pay insurance none of my logic matters


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## annedonnelly (8 May 2018)

The bike shop where I volunteer has a cafe attached. The cafe owner got a rescue dog a few months ago. The previous owner was a lady who had to go into sheltered accomodation and couldn't take Oscar with her.

Oscar is the most friendly, well-behaved dog you could wish for, especially in a cafe setting where everyone is able to make a fuss of him. He will play for hours if you throw his toys for him and he'll be entertained all day watching light bouncing off bike wheels if the sun shines through through the workshop window. He really is the most good natured dog you could imagine and the lady who had him from a puppy deserves loads of credit for training him so well.


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## Andy_R (8 May 2018)

All our dogs have been rescues, all have given nothing but love. It's not about the dog, it's about how the owner treats the dog.


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## dan_bo (8 May 2018)

Get a dog.


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## raleighnut (8 May 2018)

Andrew_P said:


> Having three cats, a small dog and some rodents when they die off they will not be replaced.
> 
> Hard work at times, I also see a lot of people struggling with new Puppies some not all can be pretty troublesome and destructive when left alone even for a small amount of time


That was how we got Sabor, he'd been returned to the breeder after about a month due to him being destructive if left alone so when we got him he was about 14wks old. By then I was working nights and Maz days so he was never alone and plenty of 'chewy toys/treats' broke the habit, also cos he was older he was much easier to house train and borrowing a book from the Library on GSDs I learnt a few tips like the Police/Armed Forces trick of training the dog to toilet before a spell of duty, you use a 'command' word when they 'do' something and then praise them afterwards (me being me Sabor's 'command' word was "Haveacrap", used to drive the neighbours we didn't get on with crazy when the dog and I walked up the garden and I said "Haveacrap" and he did )


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## NorthernDave (8 May 2018)

We're on our second rescue dog, after having to let our first go just over a year ago.
We swore then we'd think long and hard before getting another dog after that - we lasted 7 weeks!

A rescue dog will always be thankful to you for taking it in, and the Dogs Trust spend a lot of time making sure you're a good match with each other.

Chance, gone but not forgotten:





Robbie, very much making himself at home:





They're two very different dogs, but our lives are so much better for having them.


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## I like Skol (8 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Just go flush it down the loo and get another from the pet shop



If you get a dog I will be straight on the phone to the RSPCA!

Seriously though, having grown up with dogs as family pets I have always longed to have one myself as an adult. Used to love walking the dog for miles when I was a teenager and didn't have any worries or responsibilities in my life. I know that I don't have that freedom anymore so getting a dog just wouldn't be fair for the dog.

How are you going to get around the 12hr shifts problem?


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## cosmicbike (8 May 2018)

I grew up with dogs and missed them after moving out. My wife was/is a cat person so we had 2 of them for years.
I got my way back in 2013, when we decided it would be good to get a dog as my daughter was absolutely terrified of them. At no point did I consider anything other than a rescue dog, and given we live only a couple of miles from Battersea Old Windsor became regular visitors. I ended up going one day on my own to look at a 3 month old something or other which had already been reserved.
On the way out I chanced across a returned dog, very shy, very nervous, and asked to meet. It took ages to get the poor soul out the door for a walk, and I was on all fours trying to get the dopey bugger to come along. He is still a dopey bugger, but we love him to bits. He's a shepherd X husky.
A year later the 2nd one arrived, a 2 yr old lurcher X collie X terrier. One of 28 rescued by the RSPCA from one place and used for breeding fighting dogs, some of whom had their teeth sharpened and ears cut. Very nervous, but after 2 years of effort she is an absolute cracker.

Cost? Well I reckon I don't see change from £120 a month in insurance and food. Vets annual jabs are £60 per dog. Worming and flea treatment doubles that. If you can't take them on holiday, kennels are not cheap. We put ours in together, £35 + vat per night makes it the most expensive part of our annual 2 week holiday.










Worth every single penny.


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## Kajjal (8 May 2018)

If you are looking at a rescue dog make sure you fully understand where it has come from and the challenges this will present. Don't get a dog to save it or because you feel sorry for it, get one because it is the right one for you and you can give it a great life.

Different breeds have differing needs and characters. Research these carefully and see if they fit in with your life and circumstances.

Having a dog means a commitment and it can tie you down in some ways but the rewards are huge if you get the right one for you. Ours is crazy terrier that is always into everything and as devious as they come. It is never quiet now


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## Levo-Lon (8 May 2018)

as above, my Daughter in law is a vet.

pedigree dogs can be very costly and some so called breeders have a lot to answer for


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## jayonabike (8 May 2018)

I’ve had 4 dogs since my 20’s. 2 were pups, 1 I bought off an acquaintance as I could see he wanted it for the wrong reasons (it was a pit bull, before pits were banned) he wanted it for the hard man image and mistreated it. Turned out to be the most gentle loving obedient dog I’ve had.
The latest dog is a Staffordshire bull terrier rescue dog from battersea. We got her at 8 months old. Best thing we ever did was getting a rescue dog. They are different, so much more love to give. We found this with the pitbull, it’s like they’re grateful for the new lease of life and are very loving. The staffie is also. She’s 2 now and a big part of the family. I’d say out of the 4 dogs, the one I rescued from said acquaintance and the battersea rescue are the most loving dogs I’ve had.
Go for it, you won’t regret it.
Giving a rescue dog a new lease of life is one of the best things you can do. I’d never buy a pup again.


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## potsy (8 May 2018)

Thanks all, some great advice and lots of things to think about.

Will update once a decision has been made either way.


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## midlife (8 May 2018)

We love our minature poodle . It has several winning points as well as being of little brain lol .It doesn't shed hair, being small it doesn't eat a lot and it's poos are small !


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## Piemaster (8 May 2018)

We've had ours for 2 years as of yesterday. A Romanian rescue and not one regret. We spotted her on the rescues web site - yeah, I know, not the best way to pick a lifelong companion. After a local had done a homecheck, went to meet her at the fosters house. She trotted in, sat on my daughters knee and put her head on my daughters shoulder. Came home with us. We've been fortunate in finding the perfect dog for us.
Insure the dog. She dislocated a knee and the operation, though fairly routine would have cost us £800+
As above it, may come with hangovers from its earlier life, though it wasn't a problem with ours. Getting through it may take time and theres no saying a pup would not develop its own interesting traits either.
The beast refusing to leave the park yesterday as she wasn't ready:


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## Milzy (8 May 2018)

I would love a dog but don’t want to be picking poop up for 12 years.


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## Andrew_P (8 May 2018)

raleighnut said:


> That was how we got Sabor, he'd been returned to the breeder after about a month due to him being destructive if left alone so when we got him he was about 14wks old. By then I was working nights and Maz days so he was never alone and plenty of 'chewy toys/treats' broke the habit, also cos he was older he was much easier to house train and borrowing a book from the Library on GSDs I learnt a few tips like the Police/Armed Forces trick of training the dog to toilet before a spell of duty, you use a 'command' word when they 'do' something and then praise them afterwards (me being me Sabor's 'command' word was "Haveacrap", used to drive the neighbours we didn't get on with crazy when the dog and I walked up the garden and I said "Haveacrap" and he did )


My GSD was one of the most loyal creatures I have ever come across.

I took him over from my Mum we lived in a Studio flat and he was enormous, luckily at the time I worked as a delivery driver and my boss loved dogs and GSD's so he came with me to work and when he was older stayed in the office. Only downside was my mum was a fan of Robert Redford and called him Redford... He responded to Red though.

He had some kind of weird disease when he was 8 my boss lent me 2k for pioneering treatment with a Vet miles away. This was the eighties, the following Christmas he let me off the repayment. Bought red a good few more years.

My point was that it takes time and effort to train a pet and so often modern life means they end up alone for hours, they are still instinctively a pack animal so this drives them mad.

Not all breeds are as instinctively pack driven but I have seen people try and fail to leave a Husky all day and even try and Dog Crate them in desperation.

Even the food bill for a big dog is a lot of money let alone potential vet bills.

If like you and others spend time and effort then mostly it works out but a lot of people under estimate or have no clue how much effort is required!


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## SpokeyDokey (8 May 2018)

Having had a Weimaraner in my life for 12 years I can testify that some breeds need an awful lot of exercise and are very expensive to keep.

Admittedly a male Weim' is a large dog and not a medium as per the OP - although a male Labrador is a hefty dog.

It breaks my heart to see an under-exercised dog. Not just because of their physical condition but the thought of the mental anguish they must suffer - akin to caged zoo animals I'd suggest,

Our boy sadly died in 2012 (although he had a fabulous life roaming in the mountains) and at that stage we estimated his 'running' costs as being in the order of £2500 pa - this included around £500 pa carting him to and from his daily walk in the car.

Insurance was around £850 pa. The rest was food (lots), toys, assorted vet fees, insurance excesses, balls/kongs/collars/leads/bedding etc and as he got older some drugs for mild arthritis.

He was worth every penny though.

Biggest downside of having a dog in your life - the inevitable end of life scenario. Still, better to have loved and lost than never to have loved at all.


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## Piemaster (8 May 2018)

Andrew_P said:


> My point was that it takes time and effort to train a pet and so often modern life means they end up alone for hours, they are still instinctively a pack animal so this drives them mad.


We've been fortunate in that my wifes job means that at most she is only alone in a morning and doesn't seem to bother her - just part of the routine. And we have a dogsitter neighbor for the rare occasions its any longer that will look in. During the early days, at a puppy training class, giving her with a distraction kong and leaving the room she didn't even noticed we'd gone. At other times she does get a bit miffed and sulk if she thinks we are going somewhere without her and its about time for the afternoon walk - more missing out on something than wanting to be with us.
We've never crated her, but there is a bed in the dining room she uses when wanting a bit of peace and quiet. Or monitoring cooking activity in the kitchen.

The local park cafe and one on a nearby beach both welcome dogs. Without dogs + owners they would both be very quiet over the winter months. Holidays aren't that difficult to find somewhere. The dog gets a holiday too - there is no way she is going in a kennel. And she is a great camping buddy - something my wife refuses to do.

And to the OP there is a social aspect to having a dog. They socialise with other dogs when out and about - you'll end up chatting to the dogs owners. I know other dogs names but not their owners names!
Rescuing a dog is one of the nicest things you can do for an animal


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## SpokeyDokey (8 May 2018)

[QUOTE 5237915, member: 9609"]Very true, we lost our Black Lab last June, he was 15 and ready to go but it was still truly awful when he went, nearly broke my heart. I still miss him, *his bed is still on the floor *next to where I'm sitting now (how sad is that)

We're dogless now, first time in my entire life - so much more freedom not having a dog though, it is surprising how much of your life revolves round a dog when you have one.

I guess we will have another but for the moment we're enjoying the freedom - doing odd things like sitting inside a cafe rather than freezing outside with the mutt.[/QUOTE]

7 years on, his first and last collars still hang on the coat hooks in the hall.


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## Fab Foodie (8 May 2018)

The Whippet is a cheap and undemanding breed to keep. Don’t need heaps of excercise (but will walk all day), calm, rarely bark, don’t dribble or slobber, don’t shed much hair, don’t go swimming or rolling in mud, cheap to feed, generally good heathwise too.
Hugely affectionate but not very bright. Don’t try to teach one more than a few essential commands.
They will steal your sofa, bed and heart however....


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## Nigeyy (9 May 2018)

My kids and wife keep pestering me to get a dog, but I'm not having it. It's not that I don't like dogs, just that I feel inevitably on a cold wet rainy day and the dog needs to go out, I know who will be doing it (having a mental image of my wife holding a lead near the front door late in the evening with cold wet windy weather outside saying "would you honey?" has helped harden my heart to all doggie owning entreaties!)

Besides, as I get older I want to be less tied down rather than more. While I do have cats, I can easily set up huge bowls of food and water and automatic feeders and water containers knowing they will be fine for a couple of days. I fear a dog would more than likely just keep eating all the food at one going...... And I don't want to pick up poop either (another job that I'm sure would be mine too). Add in that doggie smell which I don't find overly pleasant and that make me wonder too.

But I also think there is huge reward involved, and I also think getting a dog that otherwise would meet an untimely end is a very noble idea. I hope I don't sound too curmudgeonly with my post. I should also add that if I won the lottery I'd definitely get a dog as assuming I wouldn't need to work I wouldn't, and I feel leaving a dog unattended isn't quite the same as doing it to a cat. I'd also buy a lifetime supply of Shake 'n Vac to put the freshness back for doggie smells and a baby elephant to wash my car as well.


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## biggs682 (9 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Most probably from the dogs home/trust.
> 
> Not had a dog since I was a kid, but due to a change in circumstances feel it would be a good time to bring one in that needs a second chance.



Best place to get one from rather than a puppy farm and we all need a 2nd chance for sure


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## uphillstruggler (9 May 2018)

This from this mornings walk

I like the cold wet morning walks too


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## Profpointy (9 May 2018)

If you want to keep the cost down - get a Dalmatian .....

....... it's a cheaper licence for a black and white !


Boom-tsch, I'm here all week folks


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## Mile195 (9 May 2018)

The dog in my avatar is Lucas. He's a rescue and is 6 years old. He was 18 months when we got him. There was a little training to do. We had to get him used to our chickens, and try and reduce the excitement on spotting foxes or cats, but he's the most loyal companion we could ever have wished to have.
Yes, some dogs have problems and if you get a dog, you have to accept that you may have to work with the animal a bit to gain his trust and feel settled with you. Lucas didn't come with any serious issues, but it was still a good six months before he became well and truly settled with us.

It is important to choose a dog breed that suits your lifestyle, not just one you like the look of. You will probably have to make some adjustments whatever dog you get, but some need more attention than others. Spaniels for example need alot of exercise. Greyhounds are more likely than some to suffer seperation anxiety. Jack Russells are feisty and can get a bit tetchy around new people and big dogs. Lucas is aloof with strangers. You have to gain his trust (bribery with cheese usually works) before a new person can stroke him. That's not specific to him - the whole Shar Pei breed is like that. However, he does spend alot of time sleeping, so he's alright for a good number of hours on his own, and he won't even know you're gone which is ideal if you can't be around as often as a more anxious dog might need. However, on the other hand he is prone to skin and eye problems. We've thankfully not had much trouble, but it's something we were well aware of before we decided to adopt him.

Getting a rescue is an incredibly rewarding experience. So many dogs need homes, and don't be put off by any negativity you read. You take the time into getting to know your dog, and he'll soon settle into a routine with you. Just make sure you research the breed you choose thoroughly so you know what to expect and what adjustments you may need to make to your lifestyle.

Finally, a note on insurance. Vets bills are indeed expensive. But pet insurance companies are sheisters, just as much as car and house insurers. We have no insurance for Lucas because they wouldn't cover eyes or skin and still wanted £80 a month. He doesn't have great recall so he's always walked on a lead and therefore less likely to have an accident. We put £1000 in a bank account when we got him, and transfer £60 a month into that same bank account for him which over 5 years has more than covered the vets bills we've had. He had a knee operation which it covered in it's entirety. (Vets4Pets tried to charge us £3000 for an overly complicated and invasive op that he didn't need. We shopped around and found an independent vet who did a simpler op for £650).

Insurance can be wise if your dog has an accident (where bills get very high, very quick). However (and I know I will incur the wrath of other dog owners here by saying this), but I don't consider it essential IF (and only if!) you've made other arrangements to cover vets bills. And don't forget, all vets are not created equal. Some really care about animals. Others are simply there to make money. You CAN shop around and go elsewhere if you are quoted a stupid amount of money for something. However, I think some prey on the fact that most people probably won't.

Good luck whatever you decide to do... your new friend is out there waiting for you somewhere, and make sure you post pictures on here when you get him!


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## Maenchi (9 May 2018)

If you're in the posh part of Manchester then get a Cavalier, ..........in the area I used to live it was said to me 'that's a bit of a posh dog for around here'......'.not really' I would reply and grin as my Cavalier would make friends with their supposedly hard Staffi's,,,,,,,,,,,,( I know it's all in the training)..............as for health problems, a lot of dogs have problems, do a bit of research, and a Cavalier will give you at least 10 years and be easy to look after


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## jayonabike (9 May 2018)

Here’s Daisy our rescue staffie


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## Slick (9 May 2018)

jayonabike said:


> Here’s Daisy our rescue staffie
> 
> View attachment 408372
> 
> ...


Easily my favourite so far, Daisy is a wee beaut.


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## siadwell (9 May 2018)

Have you heard of https://www.borrowmydoggy.com/?

We looked into this but didn't actually try it out before jumping in the deep end with a puppy of our own. As others have said, it's not an easy ride and gets very expensive with things like daycare, kennels and insurance. He's coming up to a year old now and is a lot of fun, but can be an overexcited handful - he's been expelled from one doggy daycare place and his current walker yesterday described him as a hooligan!


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## Crackle (9 May 2018)

Get a dog, Potsy. When you're out with the dog your IQ will be doubled.


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## I like Skol (9 May 2018)

Maenchi said:


> If you're in the posh part of Manchester


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## GM (9 May 2018)

_Excuse the plug....._If you do ever decide to get a dog Potsy and want a portrait of it, my son is an artist and does dog portraits. As an example my avatar was one he did, the owner wanted an abstract of his French Bulldog 90cm x 60cm. Keep an eye out I'll be changing my avatar each month to a different one that he's done. Good luck!


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## Mile195 (9 May 2018)

GM said:


> _Excuse the plug....._


Shouldn't that be "excuse the Pug"?!


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## Maenchi (9 May 2018)

I like Skol said:


>


.........................................


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## potsy (9 May 2018)

Maenchi said:


> If you're in the posh part of Manchester then get a Cavalier, ..........in the area I used to live it was said to me 'that's a bit of a posh dog for around here'......'.not really' I would reply and grin as my Cavalier would make friends with their supposedly hard Staffi's,,,,,,,,,,,,( I know it's all in the training)..............as for health problems, a lot of dogs have problems, do a bit of research, and a Cavalier will give you at least 10 years and be easy to look after


They are the current favourite and were from day 1 for Mrs P, I'm not so sure myself


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## potsy (9 May 2018)

I like Skol said:


>


It's all relative


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## Maenchi (9 May 2018)

potsy said:


> They are the current favourite and were from day 1 for Mrs P, I'm not so sure myself


well as i'm a Cavalier convert i'll try and persuade you..............our's seemed easy enough to train, love to follow you around the house, will go for long walks if you want, I take our's for four to six hour wanders, and equally they would be happy lazing inside all day if a walk is not on for any reason, originally bred as comfort dogs, so cuddling up on the settee is a favourite, as is sprinting up the beach.
The breeding protocol is rarely followed exactly which I think can show in their cost being anywhere between £400-£1000...........our first one was £100, rescued, other have been £400, top price does not always guarantee a healthy dog, it can be tricky, Bailey the dog in the photo lived until he was 10, the mvd got him..................
Currently Danny is five and in fine fettle, so is the loopy two year old Bron who is a quarter Bichon, she looks just like a Cavalier but is very confrontational for a Cavalier ................last word.........................when puppies CUTE.....................


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## SteveF (9 May 2018)

My two rescue mutts...


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## BSOh (9 May 2018)

SteveF said:


> My two rescue mutts...
> 
> View attachment 408389
> 
> ...



Lovely. What's the second, a border terrier cross?


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## Time Waster (9 May 2018)

One breed, border terrier. Healthy, intelligent, easy to train, very calm when adult, energetic, capable of running all day, tough not prone to hereditary diseases, sight or joint issues, terrier traits but without the really bad deaf ear issue must other terriers have and they're cute in a full on character sort of way. I'm sorry but the oh so cute king Charles cavalier spaniel thing is all looks but nothing else. Plus various hereditary / breed conditions to worry about.

Personally I believe all the breeds with health issues should be avoided until they are at least bred out of them. I also think the kennel club needs to completely rethink their breed standards to eliminate excessive breeding to a particular extreme look For example the British bulldog should not be a short, fat dig with breathing difficulties. It should be like the earliest forms when it was a long legged, athletic dog full of power, strength and agility. IMHO the true British bulldog b is nearer the boxer breed than what it is.

Sorry but a dog should be capable of doing what it was originally bred for. A bulldog is for baiting large, aggressive animals for sporting entertainment. I reckon a victorian or earlier gentleman watching today's bulldog baiting a bull would be sorely disappointed with the spectacle.
BTW I do not advocate using them for what they're bred for just that they are able to do it.

I guess that's why I love terriers and proper working dogs. Always a working dog over a show dog version. Examples of two breeding populations are Labradors and cocker spaniels. Completely different in look and ability to perform.

Sorry for the long winded post. I just feel strongly about how man has destroyed breeds by following strict breed standards. Breeds still used as working dogs tend to be better especially if you go for a breeder who has actively bred for working traits.


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## potsy (9 May 2018)

Uh oh, just been informed a 9 month old 'spaniel' has been found and is available 

More news when I can.


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## SteveF (9 May 2018)

BSOh said:


> Lovely. What's the second, a border terrier cross?



Yes, definitely some border in him, God knows what else !


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## SpokeyDokey (9 May 2018)

User said:


> Jack's insurance costs me around £300 p.a. (via PetPlan). It's been a worthwhile investment - he's needed £8k's worth of knee surgery in the last couple of years.
> 
> Mr R's father hasn't bothered to insure his dog (a Cavalier King Charles pure bred) arguing it was a waste of money. He's regretting it now, as Charlie needs knee surgery (about £3.5k) and also has a heart defect (due to inbreeding) which requires daily meds.
> 
> I'd recommend PetPlan - go for a 'whole life' policy. One or two of the ladies at the park also recommend Tesco's pet insurance.



How old is Jack?

Our insurance started out at about £9 in 1999 and it slowly ramped up until our dog was 8 and then it went through the roof.

I used to belong to a big Weimaraner forum and the general range of insurance pm was about £60 to £100 some years ago.


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## SpokeyDokey (9 May 2018)

Mile195 said:


> The dog in my avatar is Lucas. He's a rescue and is 6 years old. He was 18 months when we got him. There was a little training to do. We had to get him used to our chickens, and try and reduce the excitement on spotting foxes or cats, but he's the most loyal companion we could ever have wished to have.
> Yes, some dogs have problems and if you get a dog, you have to accept that you may have to work with the animal a bit to gain his trust and feel settled with you. Lucas didn't come with any serious issues, but it was still a good six months before he became well and truly settled with us.
> 
> It is important to choose a dog breed that suits your lifestyle, not just one you like the look of. You will probably have to make some adjustments whatever dog you get, but some need more attention than others. Spaniels for example need alot of exercise. Greyhounds are more likely than some to suffer seperation anxiety. Jack Russells are feisty and can get a bit tetchy around new people and big dogs. Lucas is aloof with strangers. You have to gain his trust (bribery with cheese usually works) before a new person can stroke him. That's not specific to him - the whole Shar Pei breed is like that. However, he does spend alot of time sleeping, so he's alright for a good number of hours on his own, and he won't even know you're gone which is ideal if you can't be around as often as a more anxious dog might need. However, on the other hand he is prone to skin and eye problems. We've thankfully not had much trouble, but it's something we were well aware of before we decided to adopt him.
> ...



Do you have separate arrangements for eg third party insurance?


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## I like Skol (9 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Uh oh, just been informed a 9 month old 'spaniel' has been found and is available
> 
> More news when I can.


Aren't Spangles hard to find nowadays? Didn't think they had been around for ages. Besides, they will wreck your teeth and your waistline......


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## Mile195 (9 May 2018)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Do you have separate arrangements for eg third party insurance?


Membership of the dogs trust. £25 a year, and they send you a magazine full of dog pictures to "ooh" and "aah" over too!


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## vickster (9 May 2018)

User said:


> Jack is 6 now.
> 
> We got a 'whole life' policy with PetPlan (on the recommendation of our vet). You pay a bit more each month but you don't get the huge hikes in premium each year or if you claim. In the five years we've had him the monthly premium has increased from c. £22 p/m to c £25 p/m. We've had £8k out of the policy!
> 
> They've also been really easy and pleasant to deal with.


What’s your excess

I have a similar policy for my cat. Little change in premium, but annual excess increased to £100 per condition claimed for (mog has epi and needs monthly vit b injections, at £17 a month)

Small dog insurance is certainly less than for larger pooches like a lab


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## vickster (9 May 2018)

User said:


> The cover I get is:
> 
> Vet fees - £4,000 pa
> Complementary Treatment - £1,500 pa
> ...


You might need to check the last bit, that it’s not an annual excess (I took same whole life policy out around 7 years ago, only premium increases are age related not claims related)


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## Venod (9 May 2018)

Time Waster said:


> I guess that's why I love terriers and proper working dogs. Always a working dog over a show dog version. Examples



I totally agree, the kennel club is ruining breeds, we had a working Beddlington, no fancy haircuts or any show traits, just a good fit dog, who is missed.


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## smutchin (9 May 2018)

Afnug said:


> the kennel club is ruining breeds



Remember the hunchbacked German Shepherd that won best in breed at Crufts a couple of years ago? The poor thing looked crippled, but he had been deliberately bred that way in order to conform to Kennel Club 'standards'. Disgraceful.


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## vickster (9 May 2018)

User said:


> Sorry - I should have been clearer. You would pay the excess each year - but only once.


Yes that’s it


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## SpokeyDokey (9 May 2018)

[QUOTE 5237929, member: 9609"]7 years- jeez.

as we speak - ours has been gone nearly 11 months now and we can't bring ourselves to put his bed away - it is amazing how attached you can get to a dog.
View attachment 408350
[/QUOTE]

I guess this will sound a bit pitiful to some people but I cried or 'welled-up' every day for 13 months or so after my dog died.

Looking back it sounds a bit OTT to me too if I'm being honest but that's how it was. 

I still say goodnight to his big piccie in the breakfast area of the house before I go to bed and tell him to dream of bunnies which I always did when he was alive - I guess I sound right soppy although I wouldn't really describe myself as such re my character. 

Maybe dogs can make you soppy!  They sure know how to burrow into your heart.


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## uphillstruggler (9 May 2018)

Alf is a mongrel (jack Russell x terrier) and all the better for it - I cant stand the show breed stuff. too much interbreeding and issues are being magnified.

he's full of bounce and isn't any problems. I've only taught him a couple of things like wait, down and recall - that's all I want from him.

couldn't recommend having a dog any more really, and this is my first!


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## Milzy (9 May 2018)

[QUOTE 5237915, member: 9609"]Very true, we lost our Black Lab last June, he was 15 and ready to go but it was still truly awful when he went, nearly broke my heart. I still miss him, his bed is still on the floor next to where I'm sitting now (how sad is that)

We're dogless now, first time in my entire life - so much more freedom not having a dog though, it is surprising how much of your life revolves round a dog when you have one.

I guess we will have another but for the moment we're enjoying the freedom - doing odd things like sitting inside a cafe rather than freezing outside with the mutt.[/QUOTE]
If I take the plunge it would be a Weimaraner. Pure class of a dog.


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## Kajjal (9 May 2018)

The thing to be careful of with pet insurance is if you move insurer preexisting conditions are normally not covered.


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## Pale Rider (9 May 2018)

To give a different slant on dog ownership, I was brought up on a farm and we had a semi-working collie sheep dog.

The dog never saw the inside of the farmhouse, its quarters was an old pig sty.

Quite luxurious for a dog, there was a pitched roofed covered area and a small enclosed yard.

Cosy enough under cover with plenty of straw.

I've no idea where it pooed - apart from the obvious 'where it wanted to' - the notion of clearing up dog mess didn't exist in rural Worcestershire.

The dog spent most of its days mooching around the farmyard, an almost ideal environment because there was lots of interest with workers working, other animals to look at, and occasional visitors to weigh up.

The dog didn't seem to need regular walks, although I and others would occasionally take it for a stroll across the fields.

There's an old saying a dog can only serve one master, but that dog managed to rub along well with anyone who came into contact with it.

I did some basic sheep rounding up a couple of times - the dog seemed to know instinctively what was required, so my input was minimal.

I don't recall the dog ever getting much medical attention, routine or otherwise, but it lived to a ripe old age so I reckon it was happy and healthy enough.


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## BSOh (9 May 2018)

uphillstruggler said:


> Alf is a mongrel (jack Russell x terrier) and all the better for it - I cant stand the show breed stuff. too much interbreeding and issues are being magnified.
> 
> he's full of bounce and isn't any problems. I've only taught him a couple of things like wait, down and recall - that's all I want from him.
> 
> couldn't recommend having a dog any more really, and this is my first!



My Alf is also a jack cross. With a patterdale terrier. He's hard as nails.


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## fossyant (9 May 2018)

A friend of ours fosters spaniels and has had over 40 (not all at once). Not a popular breed (fashion) as folk are going for stub nosed dogs. 

Couple of mates have springers and they love exercise.


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## Andy_R (9 May 2018)

Our current rescue lunatic dog Jed







He's a lot older and greyer now, but he still acts like a pup sometimes. Love him to bits.


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## keithmac (9 May 2018)

We've had a few neighbours next door to us, two of them owned dogs but were always out during the day..

If you can ensure you always have an eye on your dog and contact then fair enough, if you leave them locked up all day while you're out then thats not the best..

We won't have one because we can't commit to their daily needs, not fair to leave a dog locked in all day and we've heard the consequences of that..


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## Time Waster (9 May 2018)

Don't lump all pedigree breeds with the problematic ones. We have a border terrier with full KC registration right back generations with champions in its ancestry. However the gandparents are genetically free of the very few health issues which means she's free too. Add to that the breed is known as a very healthy breed.

I think the issues with KC is with certain breeds not all. The KC breed standard for many breeds doesn't create a driver for health problems. In fact some breed standards actually emphasises the healthy, working traits of their breeds. Take the parsons Russell terrier. It's the long legged version of Jack Russell terriers. There was a lot of debate and opposition among the breed club for them about becoming a KC recognised breed. They argued it would soften the real world, working traits. So they got written into the breed standard. In fact the parsons is one of only two breeds that are allowed to show with scarring from being worked. The phrase used is "honourable scars".

My dog breed of choice is the border terrier. It's a real terrier with real working dog traits. It's a good mover across terrain, being bred to run with horse and hound. Makes it good for running alongside our bikes on off road routes (incidentally forestry sites with mtb trails and cycling routes don't allow dogs on them with your bike but you can walk with them on those routes).


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## Lullabelle (10 May 2018)

One of my colleagues has 2 cross dogs, cockerpoodle or whatever. The 'breed' are given a fancy name so breeders can charge a fortune despite the fact they are mongrels. Anyway her 2 only leave the house to go out in the garden, they are never walked, stuck in the house all day they are destructive, she almost braggs about how much damage they have done, apparently it's the breed that is how they are. I feel sorry for them, so little attention they are just toys.


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## furball (10 May 2018)

Lullabelle said:


> One of my colleagues has 2 cross dogs, cockerpoodle or whatever. The 'breed' are given a fancy name so breeders can charge a fortune despite the fact they are mongrels. Anyway her 2 only leave the house to go out in the garden, they are never walked, stuck in the house all day they are destructive, she almost braggs about how much damage they have done, apparently it's the breed that is how they are. I feel sorry for them, so little attention they are just toys.


Situations like this make my blood boil. The dogs have only been bred because of the stupid combination of names creating a fashion. These are then sold to idiots that have the money to pay the premium price but who are totally ignorant about dogs.


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## smutchin (10 May 2018)

Time Waster said:


> I think the issues with KC is with certain breeds not all. The KC breed standard for many breeds doesn't create a driver for health problems. In fact some breed standards actually emphasises the healthy, working traits of their breeds. Take the parsons Russell terrier. It's the long legged version of Jack Russell terriers. There was a lot of debate and opposition among the breed club for them about becoming a KC recognised breed. They argued it would soften the real world, working traits. So they got written into the breed standard. In fact the parsons is one of only two breeds that are allowed to show with scarring from being worked. The phrase used is "honourable scars".



Ours is a pedigree Parson Russell Terrier, but we couldn't show him even if we wanted to because his coat doesn't conform to the breed standards - they're meant to be short or 'broken', he's more 'wiry' - he gets that from his mum, though his dad is a proper show dog with several awards. 

Apart from the coat, I would agree that the breed standard does in his case emphasise the positive aspects, and he's a lively, athletic chap who could run all day. And buying from a KC certified breeder means you have some guarantees about the dog's health - we can trace the ancestry of ours back several generations so we can be confident there are no genetic defects.

On the other hand, I can't help thinking that dogs have evolved over hundreds of thousands of years and therefore should be pretty resilient on the whole. It's only human interference in their breeding that has created a lot of the health problems many breeds suffer, and a lot of that interference is driven by the Kennel Club.

Anyway, he's a lovely dog who brings joy to our lives, and I hope we give him a happy home life.


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## Time Waster (10 May 2018)

What's wrong with getting one of the low shed breeds in the first place if you're allergic to dogs. Say a poodle instead of a cockerpoo? If it wasn't at least partly about the fashion or looks of the dog they'd surely get a poodle. They're an intelligent breed, trainable, low /non- shed and really a good breed to have.

What these cockerpoo dogs have is the looks of a cocker added to the low allergic response the owner gets from the poodle genetics. It's fashion and looks. As much as anyone claim the allergy card it's not really about that. There's pure breeds that have it such as the underrated poodle. It's really one of the most intelligent dogs you can get, even more so than cocker spaniels.

However, my issue isn't with the breeders of these. They're a business afterall. It's the people who buy these mixes at pedigree prices. Especially when they're buying into the look and the allergy card they're waving to excuse it. You're feeding the market for hybrids which as I understand it first generation are usually ok but breed from one then you're increasing the risks of various issues. As I understand it you don't get the best of the breeds with second, third generation you get increased risk of the worst. This can be genetic conditions common in either feeder breeds or just plain behavioural issues.

Why get a cocker mixed with a poodle to get low shed when you can just get a poodle which gives the hybrid the low shed on the first place?


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## Piemaster (10 May 2018)

Lullabelle said:


> One of my colleagues has 2 cross dogs, cockerpoodle or whatever. The 'breed' are given a fancy name so breeders can charge a fortune despite the fact they are mongrels. Anyway her 2 *only leave the house to go out in the garden, they are never walked, stuck in the house all day they are destructive*, she almost braggs about how much damage they have done, apparently it's the breed that is how they are. I feel sorry for them, so little attention they are just toys.


Why destructive? because they are BORED. Mine wanders about, huffing and puffing and giving me the 'get off your arse and take me out' look when she gets like that.
A neighbour has a large black lab, that while walked regularly is never left off the leash. You can see the frustration in him walking around the edge of the local field, watching other dogs run around and do dog stuff.


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## EltonFrog (10 May 2018)

furball said:


> Situations like this make my blood boil. The dogs have only been bred because of the stupid combination of names creating a fashion. These are then sold to idiots that have the money to pay the premium price but who are totally ignorant about dogs.



This.



User said:


> Really? Or they've been bred, for example, to stop them shedding - which means that people like my brother-out-law, who is allergic to most dogs, can have a dog.



This



User said:


> You're entitled to your opinion...
> 
> ...and I'm entitled to treat is as bo11ocks!



And this.

We have a Cockerpoo. Winnie the Cockerpoo, she is 11 months old, and we re-homed her. A nice family bought her paid a disgusting amount of money for her from a breeder, and after four months decided they couldn't cope, two teenagers and busy lives etc., etc. We lost our beloved Nettiethedog on September the 9th last year, she had a stroke and it was time for her to go, she was a 15 years old and we were distraught. Our other dog 6 year old JessiethePup, started behaving oddly, not eating, not wanting to go out. By sheer chance a colleague of mine bought a a dog from the same litter as Winnie and was on a whatsapp group with the other owners from the litter, and he told me about an owner that wanted a new home for their dog. We took JessiethPup to see Winnie ( her name was Amber then) and they got on like a house on fire, and we made a deal and we bought Winnie for a lot less than half of what they paid.

Winnie the Cockerpoo is the loveliest, loving, happy little thing and had brightened up our lives no end, we didn't go looking for her, she sort of found us, she needed us, and my wife, me and Jessie most assuredly needed her. Jessie and Winnie love each other and the gaping NettietheDog shaped hole in our lives is starting to heal, very ...very slowly, we miss her every day, but it _is_ getting better ( I can hardly see the keyboard now) . Winnie is a mongrel, she's a feckin expensive posh mongrel and we love her to bits, we've noticed that since getting her, that there's loads of these designer mongrels around here, its definitely a fashion thing. 





NettieTheDog 7th May 2017





JessieThePup





Winnie the day we got her. 


@potsy I hope you get a dog, don't be in a rush you'll know when its the right one, and I hope it brings you many years of unreasonable joy.


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## EltonFrog (10 May 2018)

jayonabike said:


> Here’s Daisy our rescue staffie
> 
> View attachment 408372



This dog wins the internet today.


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## Salty seadog (10 May 2018)

@CarlP 

Hello stranger.


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## Profpointy (10 May 2018)

furball said:


> Situations like this make my blood boil. The dogs have only been bred because of the stupid combination of names creating a fashion. These are then sold to idiots that have the money to pay the premium price but who are totally ignorant about dogs.



What do you think is actually wrong with mixing traits from different types of dogs to get a so-say desirable mix ? I suggest that all existing breeds have been created by doing exactly that. If you think about what you say logically, anything other than a wolf is a "fashion" breed.

Many, "pure-bred" (scientifically close to a nonsense term anyway), have all sorts of problems because of fashion. Mixing things up genetically is likely a good thing, no ?

It is common in horsey circles to do this - eg 3/4 racehorse and 1/4 irish carthorse or whatever to get a more robust and healthy animal than the more in-bred pure this or that. Why is that wrong with dogs.

For what it's worth I don't have a dog, nor a horse.


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## smutchin (10 May 2018)

Likewise the best wines are blends of different grapes rather than single varietals.


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## potsy (10 May 2018)

Well the dog we were going looking at today has been reserved by somebody else, literally minutes before we were about to set off to visit.

The search continues...


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## Piemaster (10 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Well the dog we were going looking at today has been reserved by somebody else, literally minutes before we were about to set off to visit.
> 
> The search continues...


I wouldn't think you would, but don't feel you have to take a dog because you've gone to meet it. It has to be the right one for you. It's a lifelong thing and increasingly can outlive a marriage.


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## jamin100 (10 May 2018)

We have a English Springer Spaniel who's nearly 18 months old and we've had him from 8 weeks old. He's the most loving, dopey and crazy dogs i've ever had.
He's very energetic and gets a 30 minute walk first thing of a morning and an hour to an hour and a half off the lead of an evening - Even more at weekends!. His recall and training is pretty good at the moment. Not perfect by any means but good enough.

He's left alone in the day for 2-3 hours at a time 4 days a week and we're with him the rest of the time and he's never been any trouble and mainly sleeps (I have a cheap wifi camera watching him). He really is one of a family though, even sleeps in our bed under the covers in the winter. We wouldn't be without him.

In terms of ongoing costs, its £25 per month for insurance, works out about £5 per month for flea treatment and about £50 per month in food/treats. So far, thats about it. Vets4Pets do a vac for life program that is a one off cost of £99 and he gets a yearly checkup including his boosters (apart from kennel cough which is £20) for the rest of his life, which i thought was a good deal considering the last invoice was for £64 (which I didn't have to pay  )

He is very spoilt and really is one of the family, he sleeps in our bed under the covers in the winter! The one thing I will say though is if you like your garden then i'd think twice. In the winter ours is just a mud bath primarily caused by the dog and the rain!

As to a dog being a burden, i think it depends where you are in your life. For us, we have 3 young ish (7,9,13yo) children so we need dont have the freedom to randomly book holidays, stay out really late etc anyway as we need to be back for them. I think as long as you think of the dog like a (another) child then you'll be fine.

PS. Springers are awesome


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## raleighnut (10 May 2018)

Profpointy said:


> What do you think is actually wrong with mixing traits from different types of dogs to get a so-say desirable mix ? I suggest that all existing breeds have been created by doing exactly that. If you think about what you say logically, anything other than a wolf is a "fashion" breed.
> 
> Many, "pure-bred" (scientifically close to a nonsense term anyway), have all sorts of problems because of fashion. Mixing things up genetically is likely a good thing, no ?
> 
> ...


They even hybridise Wolves, normally with a GSD or a Husky,


View: https://youtu.be/HKSpg1eJ054


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## Profpointy (10 May 2018)

smutchin said:


> Likewise the best wines are blends of different grapes rather than single varietals.



But not whisky on the other hand 
:-)


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## Lullabelle (10 May 2018)

Piemaster said:


> Why destructive? because they are BORED. Mine wanders about, huffing and puffing and giving me the 'get off your arse and take me out' look when she gets like that.
> A neighbour has a large black lab, that while walked regularly is never left off the leash. You can see the frustration in him walking around the edge of the local field, watching other dogs run around and do dog stuff.



They are alone all day and don't get much attention when their owners are around, they haven't been trained in any way so have no boundaries. They are treated as toys to play with when the mood takes. Dogs need stimulation they get very little so they must get really bored being stuck in all day every day.


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## BSOh (10 May 2018)

Time Waster said:


> My dog breed of choice is the border terrier. It's a real terrier with real working dog traits. It's a good mover across terrain, being bred to run with horse and hound. Makes it good for running alongside our bikes on off road routes (incidentally forestry sites with mtb trails and cycling routes don't allow dogs on them with your bike but you can walk with them on those routes).



I have a border terrier, as well as a jack russell x patterdale terrier as mentioned above. Both working breeds, but the border is much more family friendly. She loves kids, people, other animals. Great for being outdoors, and socialising. Although she gives chase to small furries, she doesn't kill them (unless the other terrier is there egging her along). She has a really sunny, friendly disposition, a great companion dog. Also a great house dog, she hears everything outside.

The down side? well she's really not very bright. Instinctive yes. But I think she forgot to get in the queue when they were handing out intelligence. She also stinks. It doesn't matter how much she is bathed and washed, she will stink again within a day or two. And she is very vocal, likes a bark. And she's very greedy, have to be careful I don't overfeed because if it doesn't move she will eat it.

They are great family dogs.


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## Mrs M (10 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Well the dog we were going looking at today has been reserved by somebody else, literally minutes before we were about to set off to visit.
> 
> The search continues...


Aw, never mind, you’ll get the right one 
Would love a dog but not the right time for us.
Have a soft spot for greyhounds and Podencos (Spanish hunting dogs).
Exiting time for you though, can’t wait to see the wee pup


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## potsy (10 May 2018)

Mrs M said:


> Aw, never mind, you’ll get the right one
> Would love a dog but not the right time for us.
> Have a soft spot for greyhounds and Podencos (Spanish hunting dogs).
> Exiting time for you though, can’t wait to see the wee pup


Going to see one tomorrow, not a pup though.


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## furball (10 May 2018)

Profpointy said:


> What do you think is actually wrong with mixing traits from different types of dogs to get a so-say desirable mix ? I suggest that all existing breeds have been created by doing exactly that. If you think about what you say logically, anything other than a wolf is a "fashion" breed.
> 
> Many, "pure-bred" (scientifically close to a nonsense term anyway), have all sorts of problems because of fashion. Mixing things up genetically is likely a good thing, no ?
> 
> ...


Think you've missed the point. 
I'm talking about the unethical production of made up "breeds" to supply an ignorant market.
Where I live we have one of the main ports that is a route into the Uk for puppies raised in Irish puppy farms. Vehicles are regularly raided by the police and hundreds of designer puppies are removed and found to be sick or dead.
It's the demand for these made up breeds that create this disgraceful practice.


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## furball (10 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Well the dog we were going looking at today has been reserved by somebody else, literally minutes before we were about to set off to visit.
> 
> The search continues...


At least that's one dog that's going to a home where it will be wanted and you will do the same for another lucky dog. I'm sure one will find you.


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## Profpointy (10 May 2018)

furball said:


> Think you've missed the point.
> I'm talking about the unethical production of made up "breeds" to supply an ignorant market.
> Where I live we have one of the main ports that is a route into the Uk for puppies raised in Irish puppy farms. Vehicles are regularly raided by the police and hundreds of designer puppies are removed and found to be sick or dead.
> It's the demand for these made up breeds that create this disgraceful practice.



Yebbut, why is this related to "made up breeds" as opposed to "pukka breeds". 
Serious question, not dig


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## Andy_R (10 May 2018)

furball said:


> Think you've missed the point.
> I'm talking about the unethical production of made up "breeds" to supply an ignorant market.
> Where I live we have one of the main ports that is a route into the Uk for puppies raised in Irish puppy farms. Vehicles are regularly raided by the police and hundreds of designer puppies are removed and found to be sick or dead.
> It's the demand for these made up breeds that create this disgraceful practice.


Surely all breeds are "made up" in the first place to satisfy a certain set of arbitary requirements, be it utility, appearance, or temperament?


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## furball (10 May 2018)

Andy_R said:


> Surely all breeds are "made up" in the first place to satisfy a certain set of arbitary requirements, be it utility, appearance, or temperament?


Or


Profpointy said:


> Yebbut, why is this related to "made up breeds" as opposed to "pukka breeds".
> Serious question, not dig


It applies to whatever the demand is. Made up breeds with silly names attract the uninitiated.
Don't start me on handbag dogs.


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## furball (10 May 2018)

furball said:


> I don't think so.


I'm not sure what you think I'm assuming.


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## MarkF (10 May 2018)

My mother got lonely and fat when my father died, their dog died a few weeks after my father. I can't stand the things and left home early to get away from them but I knew she needed another. We went to view one she'd seen online at the RSPCA, it bounded into the viewing room and pissed on my leg. It was an old collie called Scrappy, my mother fell in love with it, thought about it for a few days and then rang them up to have him. He'd been taken, that was unlucky as he was a long term resident.

A couple of weeks later they rang her up, he was back, the new owners returned him as he needed walking too much, a collie, who'd have though that? They have been together 5 years now, my mother's diabetes has gone and she is slim, the dog landed right on it's feet and they both have had a great time. He's on his last legs now though.


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## andabby (11 May 2018)

I've a 2 year old Kelpie, its like aa Australian Border Collie on steroids, and we must walk about 5 miles a day everyday, he is the first dog I,ve had and has wrecked my cycling, and the first thing we look at when going on holidays is if they are pet friendly, but wouldnt be without him.
The most expensive thing about having him though is keeping me in walking shoes, decent ones only last 4-6 months


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## Pale Rider (11 May 2018)

jamin100 said:


> even sleeps in our bed under the covers in the winter... works out about £5 per month for flea treatment



A fiver well spent.


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## Time Waster (11 May 2018)

BSOh said:


> I have a border terrier, as well as a jack russell x patterdale terrier as mentioned above. Both working breeds, but the border is much more family friendly. She loves kids, people, other animals. Great for being outdoors, and socialising. Although she gives chase to small furries, she doesn't kill them (unless the other terrier is there egging her along). She has a really sunny, friendly disposition, a great companion dog. Also a great house dog, she hears everything outside.
> 
> The down side? well she's really not very bright. Instinctive yes. But I think she forgot to get in the queue when they were handing out intelligence. She also stinks. It doesn't matter how much she is bathed and washed, she will stink again within a day or two. And she is very vocal, likes a bark. And she's very greedy, have to be careful I don't overfeed because if it doesn't move she will eat it.
> 
> They are great family dogs.


So far a great family dog. I think we got your dog's intelligence quota then because she's got intelligence going spare. Training? OK sit she did for a puppy sitting friend on second use of the word sit. Don't know how but she was obeying the sit command all day for her so it wasn't a fluke. At early training classes sit, lie, paw and even stay (but only for about 3 or 4m gap) on the first session. Lie and paw first attempt.

Food works with her training. In fact of the lead when she sees something of interest and goes off a rustle of the treats packet brings her back. Before my partner learnt that trick she used to only respond to my calling her. Upon calling she used to run full pelt and jump into my arms. That's from 12 weeks with no training on recall.

Scary part of her behaviour is the stare. You're relaxing in an evening (ok I'm lying on the couch) dog sleeping by my legs on the same couch. She's fast asleep and I'm watching TV. Next moment you feel a bit like you're being watched turn and she's sat there bolt upright staring at you. She just watches you without moving for minutes. It's a bit scary because you think she's studying you, well she must be right?

Smell? Every couple of weeks to a month it builds up. Then we both bath b her. One to hold, the other to wash. No single person can do it she's very slippery and cunning when it comes to escaping a bath.

BTW she's 5.5 months old now. Border terriers absolutely make good pets.

So far all doggy daycare options we've used have come back with tales of something special she's done. Three people / businesses so far. Whether it's the way she seemed to comfort a spaniel who was dropped off into the kennel next to hers for the first time in a very distressed condition (the dog was very unsettled). Our dog kind of calmed her down. The owner (over 40 years working with dogs) thought it special, or was her second time there too. A new place and 20+ years of experience and dog trainer owner said she was a special dog the way she instantly got on with other dogs of all sizes. Plus settled from arrival. She takes things as they come, my partner says she's like me in so many ways (including grey hair / beard - shaved off now).

She runs next to our bikes nicely on family rides on off road, mixed use paths. Has always walked better off the lead than on it.

So in case you hadn't guessed it, I'm taken by border terriers. Mine especially. I've got a good one but I do believe the breed is something special in terms of it's suitability for an active family.


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## fossyant (11 May 2018)

Someone is at The Dogs Trust. Bet he comes back with one.


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## potsy (11 May 2018)

fossyant said:


> Someone is at The Dogs Trust. Bet he comes back with one.





User said:


> Either that or they'll cage him, thinking a chubby chihuahua's been handed in...


Puppies


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## bigjim (11 May 2018)

I spent a large part of my childhood on the family farm in ireland in the 1950s. We had a lassie type of dog. it lived outside in the yard. Never allowed in the house and slept on the hay bales in the open barn or in the stable with the horses. No collar or lead. Just a dog. Part of my chores, was to go and bring the 6 cattle back from the fields for milking. I used to walk out the door and the dog used to see me, yawn, stretch and then walk at my heels out to the fields. cattle would be waiting at the gate, but once on the lane would stop and start when distracted by a tasty bit of grass or flower. The dog would nip at then to keep them moving for me. Same routine twice a day. I can't remember a happier time than being a scruffy ragamuffin kid walking down a lane carrying a stick with an equally scruffy, loyal dog at ones heels. Pity today's lads will never experience such a thing.


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## potsy (11 May 2018)

There will be a new arrival in the next couple of days


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## Fab Foodie (11 May 2018)

potsy said:


> There will be a new arrival in the next couple of days


And....


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## potsy (11 May 2018)

Fab Foodie said:


> And....


The dog we went to see wasn't quite what we expected, lots of issues (former police dog) but very unexpectedly a brand new arrival was mentioned and was a real hit.

More details on Sunday/Monday


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## potsy (14 May 2018)

Monday arrived, so did a certain somebody named Charlie


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## dan_bo (14 May 2018)

Ace. How old?


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## Crackle (14 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Monday arrived, so did a certain somebody named Charlie
> 
> View attachment 409218


That look says you're sussed and owned.


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## cuberider (14 May 2018)

Nice dog. Hope you get on well together


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## TVC (14 May 2018)

Cracking pooch @potsy.


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## SpokeyDokey (14 May 2018)

@potsy May you and Charlie have many happy years together.


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## potsy (14 May 2018)

dan_bo said:


> Ace. How old?


9 months.

Gonna run us ragged but already feels like he belongs here


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## Fab Foodie (14 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Monday arrived, so did a certain somebody named Charlie
> 
> View attachment 409218


Never has a dog looked more like his master ... instantaneously :-)

Enjoy, he looks fab!


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## Katherine (15 May 2018)

Congratulations on your new member of the family.


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## raleighnut (15 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Monday arrived, so did a certain somebody named Charlie
> 
> View attachment 409218


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## Fab Foodie (15 May 2018)

How’s the sofa, carpet and doors this morning?


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## potsy (15 May 2018)

Fab Foodie said:


> How’s the sofa, carpet and doors this morning?


All good, he spent the night at the foot of our bed


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## Fab Foodie (15 May 2018)

potsy said:


> All good, he spent the night at the foot of our bed


Oh dear.....


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## swee'pea99 (15 May 2018)

That's a lovely looking dog. I think you've found your 'best friend' for the next decade or more.


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## potsy (15 May 2018)

Back at work now but I hear reports of him barking at the bin men and anyone that comes to the door, will have to warn the kebab delivery man


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## Hill Wimp (17 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Monday arrived, so did a certain somebody named Charlie
> 
> View attachment 409218


Gorgeous 

He will keep you fit and want half of your kebabs


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## Piemaster (17 May 2018)

Hill Wimp said:


> Gorgeous
> 
> He will keep you fit and want half of your kebabs


NEVER let him get hold of your kebab. A dog should NEVER eat kebab.
I'm sure you can guess how I know this.

On the other hand the local fox population seems to do a splendid job of cleaning up discarded takeaways. But they don't live in my house.


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## swee'pea99 (17 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Back at work now but I hear reports of him barking at the bin men and anyone that comes to the door, will have to warn the kebab delivery man


He'll bark at any stranger approaching the door. He's defending the homestead. Good doggie!


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## Salar (17 May 2018)

@potsy

Lovely dog, he looks great.

On the subject of food /\ , you should have been given a leaflet advising about what not to eat in the home and garden (not you the dog !).
If not do your internet homework.

Even something as innocent as a few grapes or raisins can cause serious kidney problems to a dog.


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## swee'pea99 (17 May 2018)

Salar said:


> @potsy
> 
> Lovely dog, he looks great.
> 
> ...


NO CHOCOLATE! I very rarely use capitals, but that's a real biggie. Watch out for kids offering it - the dog will gleefully accept, but chocolate is very bad for dogs. Like poisonous bad.


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## Salar (17 May 2018)

Yes,

Chocolate is a real nasty.

Regarding other threats to our dogs the increase in cases of Alabama rot is very scary.


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## potsy (24 May 2018)

Well thought I'd give you a little update now he's settled in a bit.

Very happy with him, wonderfully loving dog, wants to please and is very well behaved.

Need to get him a bit more socialized with other dogs as he is very excitable around them.

Chilled?


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## swee'pea99 (24 May 2018)

Lovely!


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## Dave 123 (24 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Well thought I'd give you a little update now he's settled in a bit.
> 
> Very happy with him, wonderfully loving dog, wants to please and is very well behaved.
> 
> ...




It's nice the way you've got his head in focus this time, in the first pic he looked a little odd!

I hope you have fun with him.


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## potsy (24 May 2018)

User13710 said:


> Well, he's a spaniel. Excitable = awake .


Ha ha quite..


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## Mrs M (24 May 2018)

potsy said:


> Well thought I'd give you a little update now he's settled in a bit.
> 
> Very happy with him, wonderfully loving dog, wants to please and is very well behaved.
> 
> ...


He looks very happy already 
Love the new avatar!


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## TVC (24 May 2018)

Has he learned the route to the kebab van yet?


Definitely a handsome pooch.


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## Proto (25 May 2018)

potsy said:


> All good, he spent the night at the foot of our bed



Well, that won't last very long! 

Ours used to sleep downstairs but get up in the night, bored, and bark at the back door so she could go out and kill things. So, we moved her bed to the landing, hoping that would stop her nocturnal rambling but not much changed. So we put her bed at the bottom of our bed and she slept there. She didn't get up in the night and local wildlife was saved. This lasted all of three nights when I woke one morning to find my wife had turned into a lurcher during the night, head on pillow, legs stretched out, happy as larry. (wife had de-camped to another room). I've asked her (the dog) to sleep in her own bed but she ignores me. My wife now encourages her.


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