# R4 You & Yours on cycling safety



## the snail (19 Apr 2011)

Today on radio 4 at 12.00 they are inviting calls on the subject of how 'we can make cycling safer and what cyclists can do for their own safety'....


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## mr Mag00 (19 Apr 2011)

beat me to it.....interesting listen i feel


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## Glow worm (19 Apr 2011)

Heads up for a programme coming up in a bit that may be of interest on R4. I've just heard a trailer for it saying it will be about how to make the roads safer for cyclists, with particular focus on HGVs. They also mentioned the 'Save a Cyclist' campaign- should be interesting.
See My link


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## sheddy (19 Apr 2011)

details on http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b010gb8z 
call 03700 100 444 or email youandyours@bbc.co.uk


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## benb (19 Apr 2011)

I won't be able to call, but I'll listen in at work.


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## benb (19 Apr 2011)

Also discussed here.
https://www.cyclechat.net/


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

First caller is a prat. I'll keep you updated.


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## benborp (19 Apr 2011)

Great start with Adrian in Bristol.


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## mr Mag00 (19 Apr 2011)

i agree origamist


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Second caller better. Facts and stats on the way...


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Third caller, Elizabeth struggled a bit.

Roger Geffen from the CTC is on.


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Geffen did fine.

Solicitor form Russell, Jones and Walker now on.


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Gaz is on!


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## mr Mag00 (19 Apr 2011)

yay the VED arguement.


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Journalist from The Independent - pretty good stuff.


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## mr Mag00 (19 Apr 2011)

oh was that GAZ, not bad!


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Kate Cairns - See Me, Save Me. Articulate and passionate about HGVs.


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## Origamist (19 Apr 2011)

Road Haulage Association speaker. Anti-sensors, unsure of technological developments. Pushing for "sharing space" responsibly.

Off to ride my bike in the sun.


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## trio25 (19 Apr 2011)

Oh dear, cyclists must use cycle lanes!


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## benb (19 Apr 2011)

That email "Cyclists should be licensed - I'm sick of them running red lights, putting everyone at risk"

Yes, because licensing has stopped all motorists from doing that!

Also, this lorry driver on now is a prat.


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## gaz (19 Apr 2011)

Origamist said:


> Gaz is on!



I haven't heard what i said, certainly hard to get a good and strong point across whilst you are under pressure!
I had a lot more which i could have talked about but i was limited.


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## gaz (19 Apr 2011)

The lorry driver on now has some good points. but he falls flat on his face when he says we should use cycle lanes!


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## Bigsharn (19 Apr 2011)

Well after listening in, I doubt very much if it'll have made a difference. There were people suggesting greatly segregated cycle lanes (and someone suggesting confining bikes to the pavement) and nobody seemed to bat an eyelid. Glad that the presenter rubbished the road tax issue right at the start though.


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## Glow worm (19 Apr 2011)

gaz said:


> The lorry driver on now has some good points. but he falls flat on his face when he says we should use cycle lanes!



Well done Gaz- top marks. Yes I thought the lorry driver was doing OK til then, although he seemed to think that also being a motorcyclist gave him insight into what it's like to be a cyclist- lots of motorists come out with that. My heart bleeds for the man whose poor son had his car's paintwork spoilt by a cyclist bouncing off his bonnet. Poor lamb. Honestly, dealing with motorists is like dealing with spolt children sometimes.

Generally though, it was certainly a more balanced programme than some I've heard. Good to hear the concept of shared space and the importance of good manners highlighted. And at least they didn't wheel out that chinless wonder from the RAC (forget the moron's name). The CTC guy was great.


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## benborp (19 Apr 2011)

After a worrying start - I was concerned that Adrian might set the tone (however his response to 'but won't that put off occasional cyclists?' was to go silent for three or four seconds and then mutter 'You've got a point.' I wish other muppets had that degree of awareness), it was a pretty good programme. The main contributors didn't seem to have been set up as adversaries and produced some decent discussion. The less impressive phone ins and e-mails didn't get too much prominence and the better callers were given the opportunity to get their points across well.
Each time there is a high profile, well argued, discussion such as this, it makes it harder for people to trot out the rubbish we usually hear in phone ins as their opinions will be much more easily dismissed and less likely to be accommodated by the producers of the next piece.


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## Klaus (19 Apr 2011)

Bigsharn said:


> Well after listening in, I doubt very much if it'll have made a difference. There were people suggesting greatly segregated cycle lanes (and someone suggesting confining bikes to the pavement) and nobody seemed to bat an eyelid. Glad that the presenter rubbished the road tax issue right at the start though.



I started listening whilst having my sandwiches, and after the first couple of callers I decided to get on my bike for a few miles. Beats talking about it anytime!


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## benb (19 Apr 2011)

I wouldn't have too much of a problem with segregated cycle lanes, as long as:

they were given the same priority as roads (not having to give way at side junctions)
they were maintained to the same standard as roads
we didn't have to pay extra
But seeing as those requirements are already served by the road network, it would be a large additional cost at not much benefit.


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## benb (19 Apr 2011)

I think the big plus was that it got the "road tax" myth across prominently.


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## adds21 (19 Apr 2011)

Glow worm said:


> My heart bleeds for the man whose poor son had his car's paintwork spoilt by a cyclist bouncing off his bonnet. Poor lamb. Honestly, dealing with motorists is like dealing with spolt children sometimes.



To be fair, I think he had a point about that, although I don't think compulsory insurance for cyclists is the answer.

If we take him as his word, and we have no reason not to, a drunk, teenage cyclist caused £3,000 damage to his sons car by coming out of a side road and damaging the front wing, bonnet and windscreen. I’d be pretty unhappy if someone did that to me. I would obviously primarily be concerned about the health of the cyclist, but that doesn’t detract from the fact I’ve now got a £3,000 bill for something that wasn't my fault. 

However, I don’t see why he can’t attempt to claim back his costs in the small claims court.


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## ufkacbln (19 Apr 2011)

benb said:


> I wouldn't have too much of a problem with segregated cycle lanes, as long as:
> 
> they were given the same priority as roads (not having to give way at side junctions)
> they were maintained to the same standard as roads
> ...



There is a big problem with Cycle lanes!

Too many motorists using them!


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## downfader (22 Apr 2011)

Well done Gaz! Just heard you on the webcast:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b010gb8z#p00gg3g9

And well done Roger, too!


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## Bikepeter (24 Apr 2011)

Hi Everyone,

I recently had the misfortune of losing a friend in a cycle accident in London. She was run over by an HGV after being caught in its blind spot. This is the most recent fatal accident in London involving a bicycle.

It has reopened the debate on cycle safety at crossroads especially busy ones in London about whether more can be done to help reduce the blind spot for HGV's when turning left.

A cheap and effective way of doing this is using the trixiemirror which is attached to the street lights and is used to great effect in Switzerland & Germany already.

This mirrow is incredibly cheap and could be installed tomorrow.

To help with this debate and to try to stop any other lives from being ruined I am trying to make a difference to the safety of the streets.

For more information on this debate take a look at the below petition which has been created in the name of my deceased friend, and I would also be interested in hearing your comments about the suggestion of the trixiemirror and if you think it would save lives.

Thanks for reading.

Peter
http://www.gopetition.com/petitions/boris-install-mirrors-that-save-cyclists-lives-petiti.html


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## downfader (25 Apr 2011)

Bikepeter said:


> Hi Everyone,
> 
> I recently had the misfortune of losing a friend in a cycle accident in London. She was run over by an HGV after being caught in its blind spot. This is the most recent fatal accident in London involving a bicycle.
> 
> ...




I read Mr Dean's (iirc) article on the Guardian Bikeblog about this. A worthy cause imo!


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## Andy_R (29 Apr 2011)

Cunobelin said:


> There is a big problem with Cycle lanes!
> 
> Too many motorists using them!



The other problem with cycle lanes....they're not designed by cyclists. To ride in the best position on the road, you normally have to ride right on the edge of the cycle lane...and of course, people park in them! Do I use them? Not if I can help it. Stay in the flow of traffic when you can, and make sure you know what eveyone else is doing


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