# Netherlands tour



## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

I'm in the early stages of preparing a weeks tour of Holland for next Spring. I spoke to a Dutch bloke on an Italian campsite last year who suggested getting a train from the Hook to Zwolle and cycling north in a circuitous route to Groningen. Time permitting he suggested doing an island like Ameland and either train or cycle back.
Is it permissable to cycle on the A7/E22 between Zurich(?) and Wieringen on the Afsluitdijk. 
My spelling may be awry.
Any alternative suggestions would be welcome as my knowledge of the Netherlands is nil.
Is accommodation available easily?
Advice welcome.


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## chris__P (21 Oct 2009)

Hi Rich

Cycling in Holland is, of course, ridiculously easy. Every main road also has a cycle path running alongside it, which is almost always well-maintained. The only trouble is these aren't terribly interesting, so you might be better off heading off onto the country cycle routes which are often on-road but with little traffic. This works by a numbered system - you follow that number (say 26) until you get to 26. Then there might be 14 to the left and 43 to the right, and often theres a map on a board and you decide whether you want to go to 14 or 43 as it suits and off you go. All you really need is a semi-decent map and you don't really need this, as I found my way without one, just a compass. AND in addition to these country routes, and the cycle paths alongside every main road (which are very well signposted) you also have the LF long distance routes. http://holland.cyclingaroundtheworld.nl/Wheretogo/WhereToGo-LongDistance.html Theres a map on that site and as you can see the LF10 goes between Zurich and Wieringen and so really theres no problem at all. If you follow the LF routes you will probably get a more scenic tour, although obviously less direct. Ones thing is for sure and that is that you will never be stuck for somewhere to cycle


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## ComedyPilot (21 Oct 2009)

Rich, I am also doing a short trip of the Netherlands in spring, hopefully to co-incide with the tulip fields blooming late April/ early May.

There is a fantastic cycle path over the Afsluitdijk.

This site is a good start point:

http://www.fietsersbond.nl/urlsearchresults.asp?itemnumber=1


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## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

Thanks for that lads. It's given me something to work on.


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## psmiffy (21 Oct 2009)

I have just cycled east to west across Holland – As Chris P says there is a cycle path or route for every occasion - the problem with Holland is that it can be a bit samey – a quick check of how many photos I took in the countryside and in towns would seem to indicate that the towns were generally more “interesting” - the country routes are often much longer than the direct routes – On one occasion I had completed 6k of 11k and the cycle route sign said 15k – signing on the country routes is good 95% of the time but every now and the it went free association with I assume quite a few options to get to the same place –nice if you are just wandering and have the time to sort it out but not so good if you want to find a campsite before dark (lots of campsites so would have not been a problem before 30 September) – I would suggest that maps at 100k or better would be a good idea – I was using 200k but luckily had the GPS mapping to dig myself out

Whatever you do cycle north or east – winds can be naughty – crossing the Zuider Zee with the wind behind on a previous tour I averaged 36kph which is the highest I’ve ever done on a heavy bike on the flat

Cycling in Dutch towns was a bit of a culture shock after cycling on generally cycle free roads and paths for a long while – hundreds of cyclists zipping about and expecting you to be doing the same – no idea how you work out who gives way to who – stopping I found to be a bit fraught as there was often people very close behind on narrow paths – Danish one hand in air “I am stopping” didn’t seem to be recognised


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## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

I expect it to be largely flat, of course, but I was hoping the northern half might have a bleak charm; especially in April!


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## BigonaBianchi (21 Oct 2009)

Rich I have a full set of cycle maps you can have if it helps.


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## chris__P (21 Oct 2009)

I think its worth doing. It won't be the _most_ interesting tour in the world, but theres quite a few pretty girls 



rich p said:


> I expect it to be largely flat, of course, but I was hoping the northern half might have a bleak charm; especially in April!


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## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

BigonaBianchi said:


> Rich I have a full set of cycle maps you can have if it helps.




That would be useful BoaB. We didn't get it together this week but I've had a dose of the lurgi anyway. I'm away next week but we could try for a ride the week after?



chris__P said:


> I think its worth doing. It won't be the _most_ interesting tour in the world, but theres quite a few pretty girls



No, I realise it won't be my touring career highlight! Pretty girls, eh? I wonder if I can dump the 3 I'll be with!


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## Dayvo (21 Oct 2009)

My brother lived in the south of Holland very near to the German and Belgian borders.

It is surprisingly hilly there with a lot of very good cycling terrain/landscapes, and not too far from Luxembourg, which also has plenty of hills!


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## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

Dayvo said:


> My brother lived in the south of Holland very near to the German and Belgian borders.
> 
> It is surprisingly hilly there with a lot of very good cycling terrain/landscapes, and not too far from Luxembourg, which also has plenty of hills!



The people I'm going with are novices so I thought flat would be good. I really liked rural Luxembourg as it happens.


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## slowmotion (21 Oct 2009)

psmiffy said:


> _Whatever you do cycle north or east – winds can be naughty – crossing the Zuider Zee with the wind behind on a previous tour I averaged 36kph which is the highest I’ve ever done on a heavy bike on the flat_



I had to laugh reading that. I did a one way ride from Hook of Holland to Amsterdam in September, and caught the train back. I had read about the winds, and cunningly figured that I would ride with the prevailing wind behind me. The prevailing wind is from the south west.

The weekend I went, the wind was from the NE, Beaufort 4. For a beginner like me, it felt like riding through treacle, and it was right on my nose all the way. The people coming towards me on the LF1 were freewheeling and still cracking along. Not good for morale. I had fun though.


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## Will1962 (21 Oct 2009)

I cycled around holland clockwise a couple of months ago, north from Amsterdam, across Friesland and then came south from Groningen via Emmen, Zwolle, and Arnhem.

You can cycle across the Afsluitdijk (LF10), but I wouldn't cycle across in a SW direction unless you are particularly keen on slogging away all day into a strong head wind. Why not head to Starum (Stavoren) and get the ferry across to Enkhuizen instead.

There is a lot of water in Friesland (especially around Sneek), so watch out for the mozzies. 

The Frisians have their own language, and many place names are given in dutch & fresian. Make sure your map has place names in both languages.

Will


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## rich p (21 Oct 2009)

The wind seems to be a recurring factor here! 

I'm not particular about the Afsluitdijk but it looks like it might be fun to do?


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## psmiffy (21 Oct 2009)

sllowmotion- its still good advice - I was not laughing much over the last few weeks cycling into the SWstly across germany and holland from the Polish border


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## snorri (21 Oct 2009)

rich p said:


> I'm not particular about the Afsluitdijk but it looks like it might be fun to do?


Fun in a perverse sort of way, like thinking up what you can do to pass the time as you cycle. Some things you could be tempted to do, see how far you can cycle with your eyes shut, trying to read a book whilst cycling, checking the calibration of your computer using the track side markers.
It certainly is a bit of a novelty and likely to be the longest flat straight you have ever cycled.


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## slowmotion (22 Oct 2009)

psmiffy said:


> sllowmotion- its still good advice - I was not laughing much over the last few weeks cycling into the SWstly across germany and holland from the Polish border



I did not wish to seem to disagree. I just had bad luck with the wind on the day. Actually, I got lost for a couple of miles, somewhere, and asked a delightful Dutch couple for directions. I mentioned the wind.

"Ah yes, the wind is your destiny, and if you go in the other direction, it will still be in your face", and he gave me a very big wink. 

A great place to cycle, and utterly delightful people.

Just go...


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## rich p (22 Oct 2009)

slowmotion said:


> I did not wish to seem to disagree. I just had bad luck with the wind on the day. Actually, I got lost for a couple of miles, somewhere, and asked a delightful Dutch couple for directions. I mentioned the wind.
> 
> "Ah yes, the wind is your destiny, and if you go in the other direction, it will still be in your face", and he gave me a very big wink.
> 
> ...



I am going!!! It's route advice I'm after


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## ComedyPilot (22 Oct 2009)

I am doing a clockwise route from the 'Hook' past Haarlem up to the Afsluitdijk, to Sneek (love the name!!) over to Assen, down to Amsterdam and back to the 'Hook'.

Not bothering planning a precise route, just going to 'wing it'.


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## User169 (22 Oct 2009)

The Wadden islands are very nice, but they are small so there's not much there in the way of cycling. Also, there aren't any ferries between islands so you can't hop directly from one to another.

On the other hand, they have fantastic beaches. Texel is probably the most developed, Schiermonnikoog the least, with the rest somewhere in between.


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## rich p (22 Oct 2009)

ComedyPilot said:


> I am doing a clockwise route from the 'Hook' past Haarlem up to the Afsluitdijk, to Sneek (love the name!!) over to Assen, down to Amsterdam and back to the 'Hook'.
> 
> Not bothering planning a precise route, just going to 'wing it'.



I prefer that approach generally CP, but with 6 of us I have found that it's safer to pre-plan the accommodation.


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## ComedyPilot (22 Oct 2009)

rich p said:


> I prefer that approach generally CP, but with 6 of us I have found that it's safer to pre-plan the accommodation.



Jack Jones here Rich, so can do what I like, when and where I like for as long as I like.


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## Amanda P (22 Oct 2009)

rich p said:


> I'm not particular about the Afsluitdijk but it looks like it might be fun to do?



Mrs Uncle Phil and I crossed it a few weeks back. With the wind behind us, it was fun to do! 

It's quite a novelty (well, it was to us) to be cycling along with sea on both sides, and not to be able to see proper land in either direction. Every so often, we'd pass a fishing boat working just off the Ijsselmeer side of the dike.

Just when it starts to get dull, you come to the cafe (heading north). Then when the kaffee en gebak starts to wear off, you come to the sluices, where you could well be held up for ten minutes while a procession of picturesque sailing barges goes through. Then there's a little harbour, where there's an outdoor display showing how the dike was built - it's an impressive bit of engineering, on an impressive scale.

And when you've forgotten that bit of excitement, you're in Zurich already (not the one in Switzerland).

We'll have a CrazyGuy page up in the next few days with some pictures.


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## rich p (22 Oct 2009)

Uncle Phil said:


> Mrs Uncle Phil and I crossed it a few weeks back. With the wind behind us, it was fun to do!
> 
> It's quite a novelty (well, it was to us) to be cycling along with sea on both sides, and not to be able to see proper land in either direction. Every so often, we'd pass a fishing boat working just off the Ijsselmeer side of the dike.
> 
> ...




That's sounds promising Unc. I'll check out you CGOAB.


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## ComedyPilot (22 Oct 2009)

As an aside, I pulled the longest wheelie I have ever done on the Afsluitdijk. I got my Fireblade into 4th gear, and about 80mph before the front wheel came down.


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## Dayvo (22 Oct 2009)

Big skid-mark, CP?


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## ComedyPilot (22 Oct 2009)

Dayvo said:


> Big skid-mark, CP?



No, but I lost two of the five 1 litre beer steins I (cough) liberated from a bar in Assen, that had spent the journey thus far nestling under the cargo net on the back.


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## slowmotion (23 Oct 2009)

*rich p*

If you need cycle maps, go here, a Dutch map shop....

www.dezwerver.nl

You cannot buy them on the phone, but a delightful Dutch lady will tell you how to fill in the on-line form, and patiently, in perfect English. I bought the www.falk.nl maps,

1:50,000 scale . 1 cm= 500 metres

Fietskaart met knooppuntennetwerk

They turned up in the post three days later.

If you want me to sing the praises of cycling in Holland, just send a PM. I am still on a big high... and no... not like that!


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## Penfold (24 Oct 2009)

slowmotion said:


> *rich p*
> 
> If you need cycle maps, go here, a Dutch map shop....
> 
> ...



Don't know how (or why) but my PC attached a google option to translate that page/site into good old English. Worked a treat....

May have to ring that 'nice lady' though cos I want to replecate the route that XXX Corps took from the Dutch/Belgian border right up to Arnhem (as the Bridge Too Far film) Hope to do that tour next September when the 'normal' celebrations take place. Back in the day, it was a single road al the way, however, modern times seem to have added a whole road network.


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## Will1962 (24 Oct 2009)

Penfold said:


> Don't know how (or why) but my PC attached a google option to translate that page/site into good old English. Worked a treat....



I've got I.E. 8 and when you go to a page that the meta data says is in a particular language, it offers to translate for you. It also prompts you to always translate from that particular language. If you say 'yes', then it automatically translates when you launch a page. You must have selected that option at some point. It is a really useful feature when planning tours. 




Penfold said:


> May have to ring that 'nice lady' though cos I want to replecate the route that XXX Corps took from the Dutch/Belgian border right up to Arnhem.



I came south from Arnhem (over the bridge), through Nijmegan, over the bridge at Grave, and then SW from there. The bridge the XXX Corps took at Nijmegen is the Waalbrug, but there is a really impressive cycle bridge (called the Snelbinder) that is attached to the railway bridge about 1KM west of the Waalbrug.

Will


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## chris__P (20 Nov 2009)

Hi Rich, hows it going?

After reading through this post in Germany, I decided to head back to the UK through Holland and see the Afsluitdijk for myself (the wrong way!). Well I wanted to be able to answer your Q properly!

I came in from Germany in the NE of Holland, and went to Groningen and Leuwarden in the North. Groningen is a fantastic place. Maybe I just think that because it is a University town and therefore full of pretty girls on bicycles! But bicycles rule here, the roads around town are just full of them and the few cars are forced to go at bicycle speed, brilliant. Leuwarden was smaller, had fantastic cycle routes, and, for some reason, the most learner drivers ever. Nothing much here. I also went up to the north coast, which was pretty remote and typically dutch - flat, wind turbines, cows and sheep.

Then the Afsluitdijk. I went through Zurich which is tiny, but I noticed at least one hotel, think it was called De Steenan Man or something, looked ok. The Afsluitdijk itself was ok, like others have said just a very long, straight path. But most of the time while you are riding you are between the road and a flood defence so its not like you feel you are riding across the sea. Its a novelty but not amazing. Had a few people toot their horns (I think in support) and when I got to Alkmaar the next day a woman came up to me and said she saw me riding across it, so it might make you a minor celebrity. I obviously went south across it, but didn't have any issues with the wind, maybe I was lucky but I never had any problems with it in Holland.

Now for the best bit of cycling I did in Holland - the west coast. It is brilliant, not like the rest of Holland at all. Its dunes country and you actually get some small 'hills' despite being so near the sea. I followed LF1 down the coast and would highly recommend it. All cycle paths and through some spectacular scenery. Definately the best bit of the country that I saw.

I also dipped inland to Alkmaar and Amsterdam, and then went down through Den Haag and Rotterdam. Not much to see in the last two, but if you do find yourself down there, try and take in Delft, its the best town down there.

So, my suggestion would be to DEFINATELY try and work the west coast into your route (LF1) but I would also suggest going somewhere else to get a taste of the 'real' Holland too

Hope this helps

I'll probably put something on CGOAB when I get the chance too with pics etc

Chris


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## Amanda P (20 Nov 2009)

I'll second that comment about the west coast. Much more pleasant and varied than the north.


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## rich p (20 Nov 2009)

Cheers Chris. That's great info which I'll incorporate into the route if at all possible. I had heard that Gronigen was worth a visit, so thanks for confirming that. Pretty girls too! I wonder if I can dump the wife

I think the jury's out on the Afsluitdijk - I'd imagined being able to feel you were cycling on the ocean but maybe my imagination ran a bit wild!

I look forward to your crazyguy though for more inspiration.


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## just4fun (22 Nov 2009)

i hope you have an amazing time, its not all flat though! The LF cycle paths from my limited experience (cycling from Hoek to Texel) are better than many british roads. I found it to be so beautiful and i liked the scenic routes the cycle paths take you on which for me was just sustained natural countryside. Depending on what you intend there are camp sites all over the shop including the nature camping where cars are not aloud on site. i met some lovely people there (in fact all through Netherlands). I would suggest you take detailed maps just in case as lots of time can be wasted getting lost in cities that you may pass though. 
You can cross the afsluitk on bike. ( i heard it boring and windy)

the bulbs in spring will be stunning whilst to the sand dunes in summer will be a wash with heather and the beaches along the entire west coast are fantastic and so close to the cycling routes.

have a wonderful time on your holiday


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## friedel (23 Nov 2009)

Well, I just saw this. Guess I need to drop in more often!

Sorry if these have been mentioned before. I haven't thoroughly scanned all the pages but:

1. Definitely check out the Wereldfietser cycling club http://wereldfietser.nl/ (translate it with Google if you need to) and see if you can meet them for one of their weekend trips. Great fun!
2. We just did a podcast on cycling in Holland: http://travellingtwo.com/2522
3. Come visit us, if we have a house by then! We are in Den Haag now.
4. This is a great site for route planning: http://www.nederlandfietsland.nl/home-nf/
5. The Veluwe is a beautiful place to ride in Holland and definitely not all flat. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veluwe


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## rich p (23 Nov 2009)

Thanks everyone for the help. I'm revising my ideas at the moment, in the light of what's been said and I'm thinking that I won't get the train from Den Hoek to Zwolle as I had planned. I see that you have to change trains twice and I see a few issues with 6 loaded tourers at Amsterdam station. 
Also as wind has often cropped up, although not for Chris P, maybe a better route would be travel up the west coast from Den Hoek and swing round to Gronigen.
the west coast seems attractive with or without the Afsluitdijk. 
Thanks for the offer Fridel but I suspect your house may not be big enough for all of us! I'll definitely check out your other links.


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## Andy in Sig (23 Nov 2009)

You could have a bash at doing the whole country by getting the train down to Maastricht which is a lovely place at the southernmost tip of NL (apparently nowhere is more than 2 1/2 hrs from anywhere else by train). Utrecht is definitely worth a stop. My suggestion is to pick start and finish places, then have a flick through the Baedecker guide for the country and just plan in towns that are worth a look. You won't go wrong whatever you do.

And a note on embarrassment avoidance: slagroom is whipped cream. Knowing this will stop you following in the footsteps of a not too bright mate of mine who couldn't understand why the brothels looked like cafes.


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## User169 (23 Nov 2009)

Not sure that this is entirely helpful, but my own "research" indicates that Arnhem has the highest number of good looking girls.

If you do come through Delft, I can point in the direction of slagroom.


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## chris__P (23 Nov 2009)

Delftse Post said:


> Not sure that this is entirely helpful, but my own "research" indicates that Arnhem has the highest number of good looking girls.



Unbelievable - just about the only place I didn't go through in Holland


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## friedel (25 Nov 2009)

rich p said:


> Thanks for the offer Fridel but I suspect your house may not be big enough for all of us! I'll definitely check out your other links.



Well, you just never know! Do let us know if you're coming through and at least we can treat you to cake and coffee somewhere.


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## rich p (25 Nov 2009)

friedel said:


> Well, you just never know! Do let us know if you're coming through and at least we can treat you to cake and coffee somewhere.



Excellent! I will definitely advise you of our arrival for a cake stop at least!

What do you think of my latest plan to travel north up the west coast from Den Hoek and the head east towards Groningen, then south west towards Veluwe?


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## User169 (25 Nov 2009)

Same offer applies re cake (or something stronger) if you're passing through Delft, Rich.

You're plan looks good to me - you're definitely doing it the right way around. If you go to the Hoge Veluwe park, you could stop by the Kröller-Müller Museum (art museum with a good van Gogh collection).


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## rich p (25 Nov 2009)

Delftse Post said:


> Same offer applies re cake (or something stronger) if you're passing through Delft, Rich.
> 
> You're plan looks good to me - you're definitely doing it the right way around. If you go to the Hoge Veluwe park, you could stop by the Kröller-Müller Museum (art museum with a good van Gogh collection).



The Cake Tour!!! It get's better and better


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## Amanda P (25 Nov 2009)




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## rich p (25 Nov 2009)

Uncle Phil said:


>



Red Cross package, Unc?


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## Amanda P (26 Nov 2009)

Is that an offer? If I thought some real Dutch kaffee en gebak would survive the journey, I'd say yes please.

I suspect it's hard for any tour of the Netherlands not to turn into a cake tour. That's certainly how the Dutch cycle-tourists do it.


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## Andy in Sig (26 Nov 2009)

Dutch apple pie ... was there ever so much meaning conveyed in so few words?


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## User169 (26 Nov 2009)

Andy in Sig said:


> Dutch apple pie ... was there ever so much meaning conveyed in so few words?



Dutch oven?


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## con gibbens (26 Nov 2009)

Delftse Post said:


> Same offer applies re cake (or something stronger) if you're passing through Delft, Rich.
> 
> You're plan looks good to me - you're definitely doing it the right way around. If you go to the Hoge Veluwe park, you could stop by the Kröller-Müller Museum (art museum with a good van Gogh collection).



Definately worth a vist. We were there last year camped near Appeldoorn (Ugchelen) and toured the area on our recumbent trikes. Brilliant cycle tracks with hills!! and even a desert! Very friendly people but we didn't get cake


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## just4fun (26 Nov 2009)

our koffie en gebak tour became too expensive and become spars own brand cuppa soup and a cheap loaf of bread!


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## friedel (2 Dec 2009)

rich p said:


> The Cake Tour!!! It get's better and better



We should just arrange a get-together when you arrive in Den Haag area, since I'm in Den Haag and the other poster is in Delft. Maybe if it's a weekend we can give you an escort out of the city 

I'm so new here in Holland that I couldn't say if you're doing things the right or wrong way around for the route. Hopefully by next summer I'll be better informed. Apparently the road between Bovenkarspel and Lelystad is gorgeous.


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## rich p (1 Jan 2010)

friedel said:


> We should just arrange a get-together when you arrive in Den Haag area, since I'm in Den Haag and the other poster is in Delft. Maybe if it's a weekend we can give you an escort out of the city
> 
> I'm so new here in Holland that I couldn't say if you're doing things the right or wrong way around for the route. Hopefully by next summer I'll be better informed.* Apparently the road between Bovenkarspel and Lelystad is gorgeous*.




Is that the route over the Markerwaarddijk? That may be a better bet as I don't know if I've got time to do the Aflsluitdijk.


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## John Ponting (1 Jan 2010)

Rich, we were at an MG rally in September staying at Centre Parcs De Eemhof and we drove across Markerwaarddijk - not to be missed but (obviously) could be a bit blowy if wind in wrong direction. The huge wind farms scattered around Flevoland suggest that wind is expected. Checkpoint Charlie could be a welcome halfway point.

The old town and harbour of Enkhuisen was fascinating.

The only disappointment was that Lelystad had a shopping centre that was an (almost) exact copy of Bicester Shopping Village. The shops and contents were the same but the cafes sold herring instead of burgers.


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## Cathryn (1 Jan 2010)

Andy in Sig said:


> Dutch apple pie ... was there ever so much meaning conveyed in so few words?



Delectable groan from over here!! Heaven on a plate. I'm hoping to take Arthur on his first bike tour in the Netherlands next year...can't wait. It's a great place.


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## rich p (1 Jan 2010)

Cheers John. I presume you can cycle across it okay?


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## John Ponting (1 Jan 2010)

Wide open, no hidden spots, plenty of pull off areas, wonderfull views.

Not the view you will see but some idea of the road - this was a Saturday mid afternoon in early September.






















and on a different day in a different place


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## Arch (2 Jan 2010)

John Ponting said:


> and on a different day in a different place



An inspiring pic that should be in all the guide books!


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## rich p (2 Jan 2010)

Arch said:


> An inspiring pic that should be in all the guide books!



It looks like the top of Ventoux in March!


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## John Ponting (2 Jan 2010)

right place but it was 2nd week in September 2008.


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## rich p (3 Jan 2010)

The swimming pool might be a bit fresh in early April

Our last night looks like being in a lowly rated hotel in Gouda but there's little choice in the area at a reasonable price. Is Gouda a reasonable town?


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## User169 (4 Jan 2010)

rich p said:


> The swimming pool might be a bit fresh in early April
> 
> Our last night looks like being in a lowly rated hotel in Gouda but there's little choice in the area at a reasonable price. Is Gouda a reasonable town?



Gouda's a pretty place, but there's not an awful lot to see/do there.


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## Haitch (4 Jan 2010)

Just seen this thread.

Gouda has a market square, a town hall, a cheese museum and that's it. Half an hour tops. Try pushing on if possible.

The dyke from Enkhuizen to Lelystad is definitely doable. There is a cycle path alongside the road. I prefer this dyke to the Afsluitdijk (quieter, got a curve in it, more to see and only slightly shorter). Be aware though that cycling along a dyke might not be as great an experience as you might think. You will always have the dyke (i.e. a grass embankment and no view) on one side of you. The Markerwaarddijk (which turns into the Houtribdijk halfway across the Ijsselmeer) has the additional disadvantage of ending in Lelystad (an ugly town built for cars and a bugger to find your way out of) which is in Flevoland province (deadly dull but can fortunately be exited in a couple of hours). 

Of your route suggestions, Groningen is a nice town but the countryside around it turns a young person's thoughts to suicide. If you go over the Afsluitduijk the eastern side of the Ijsselmeer is very nice and will give you access to the Veluwe (definitely worth visiting) although a grand tour with six novices in one week may be asking a bit much.


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## rich p (4 Jan 2010)

I'd prefer the towns to be nice rather than dire but as it's only an evening including a meal it's not critical. The days of travel are the main event.
Alan, there are only 2 novices but we have the lowest common denominator factor. Given that and the time available it will be the Markerwaarddijk to enable a round tour.


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## Haitch (4 Jan 2010)

Presuming you're coming from Hook of Holland, the route would then be LF1 Route north along the coast via Delft, Leiden and tulip fields around Lisse to Haarlem -- Amsterdam -- LF23 Zuyderzee Route clockwise via Edam, Volendam, Hoorn and Enkhuizen -- Makerwaarddijk (retrace route from Enkhuizen for about 2km) -- leave Flevoland via the bridge to Elburg -- south and then west to cross the Veluwe (either Apeldoorn - Utrecht or Apeldoorn - Arnhem - Utrecht depending on time) -- Hook of Holland.


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## Cathryn (4 Jan 2010)

Delftse Post said:


> Gouda's a pretty place, but there's not an awful lot to see/do there.



I stayed in Gouda and, whilst beautiful, it was SO dull. I got there at midday on a Sunday and nearly died of boredom. I really regret not pushing on and covering more miles that day, but I had a hotel booked.

Hotel in question was the Kraiserkroon. I had the world's smallest single room which was very basic, but it was very clean and the breakfast buffet was good. Not sure I'd recommend it though.


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## rich p (4 Jan 2010)

Alan - that's pretty much the route in a nutshell

Cathryn - I suspect you mean the Keizerskroon which seems to be the only reasonably priced one in the area. Maybe I'll have a rethink .


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## Cathryn (4 Jan 2010)

I did mean that one, I just can't spell.

It's not a bad hotel by any means, so don't let me put you off. I got a bit annoyed at a postage stamp single room. But you'd stay in doubles/twins I guess so you'd avoid that room and, as I said, the breakfast buffet is good. I ate my room price in the morning.

You're right that it's the only reasonable place in Gouda.


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## Arch (4 Jan 2010)

Alan H said:


> Gouda has a market square, a town hall, *a cheese museum* and that's it. Half an hour tops. Try pushing on if possible.




A cheese museum! What more could you want?

I think it's Bruges, has a chip museum. Those continentals know what's important...


Presumably, anywhere is less dull in company, if it has a restuarant or bar or two...


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## Haitch (4 Jan 2010)

rich p said:


> that's pretty much the route in a nutshell.




If you fancy meeting up, ping me nearer the date. I'm in Amersfoort. 

If you are leaving from Hook of Holland, you might want to consider getting the train back from Gouda or Utrecht. A quick glance at Google maps shows that virtually all the route from Gouda is either urban sprawl or polder. The train from Utrecht to Rotterdam (bike the last bit) costs 9.20 euros plus 6 euros for a bike per person. Bikes aren't allowed on trains during the rush hour (something to bear in mind with a view to the ferry times).


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## Haitch (4 Jan 2010)

Arch said:


> A cheese museum!



Take a butcher's cheesemaker's.




> What more could you want?



There is a pasta museum in Rome near the Trevi Fountain.

And Leer in Germany has a tea museum.


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## Haitch (5 Jan 2010)

Back to the tour, I forgot to mention it but there is a ferry service from Enkhuizen across the Ijsselmeer to Stavoren (starting on 17 April). 

If you have time, the Zuyderzee Route along the Ijsselmeer from Stavoren is very nice.


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## paulrw (6 Jan 2010)

I don't know if anyone has mentioned this already. There's an organisation called 'cyclists friends' in Holland and they provide cheap B&B. My experience is limited but Used them last summer for a night. I stayed with a nice couple who even made me a packed lunch and gave me some good route advice. It was only 16 euros. You send off for membership (8 euros I think) and they send you a book with about 2 or 3 thousand addresses and maps etc. I think the organisation is called "Vreinden op de Fietes" or similar. Nothing available on this via tourist offices.


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## User169 (6 Jan 2010)

http://www.vriendenopdefiets.nl/


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## rich p (6 Jan 2010)

I saw thaat site but I thought it was unlikely that they would have 3 doubles available. What do you think?


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## paulrw (6 Jan 2010)

Some of them can accomodate that number. All capacities are listed in the book right down to the type of room. eg 1x1;2x2;1x3 etc. Plus there are more than one in similar locations.


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## rich p (6 Jan 2010)

paulrw said:


> Some of them can accomodate that number. All capacities are listed in the book right down to the type of room. eg 1x1;2x2;1x3 etc. Plus there are more than one in similar locations.



Cheers Paul. It's worth a punt for a few euros.


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## Arch (6 Jan 2010)

Alan H said:


> Take a butcher's cheesemaker's.
> 
> There is a pasta museum in Rome near the Trevi Fountain.
> 
> And Leer in Germany has a tea museum.



"From 1850 onward only cheeses were admitted for weighing. "

Fantastic, I have an image of hams being turned away, looking sad...

Oh dear, you've started something here. I have a vague longterm plan to go off and 'do' Europe, although with no particular aim in mind. Food museums sounds like a jolly good aim...


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## Haitch (6 Jan 2010)

Arch said:


> I have a vague longterm plan to go off and 'do' Europe, although with no particular aim in mind. Food museums sounds like a jolly good aim...




France should be a piece of cake.


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## Arch (6 Jan 2010)

Alan H said:


> France should be a piece of cake.



I see they suggest it is a good location for

"vos rendez-vous d'affaires,"

Now, I think I'm right that affaires means 'business', but I love the idea of an illicit romantic rendezvous in a cake museum!


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## snorri (6 Jan 2010)

Arch said:


> a cake museum!


Cake _museum_  I like my cakes fresh, thank you


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## Arch (7 Jan 2010)

snorri said:


> Cake _museum_  I like my cakes fresh, thank you



I'm not fussy, I'll eat it until my teeth break....


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## soltour (16 Jan 2010)

I did holland last year....cut right before zwolle and took a ferry to go diagonal across the country...I tend to bypass big places, much prefer small villages..oh yes crossed the elbe at the usual place of gluckstadt...proceeded onto denmark....very nice as well, especially on that east coast


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## rich p (16 Jan 2010)

Route roughly decided and hotels booked. Thanks all.


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## Turdus philomelos (3 Feb 2010)

Rich p, This might be a bit cheeky but could you share your route plans and hotels with me. Since taking up cycling last year I've had a notion to cycle from my house to NL and back. Since I'm doing this on my own, (him in doors wont go out the UK), and not knowing anything about NL, I feel having a good information base to start from will give me confidence to go. Plus how are you getting to the NL.


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## rich p (3 Feb 2010)

Turdus philomelos said:


> Rich



You rang, Sir?


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## Turdus philomelos (3 Feb 2010)

Oh yes Rich p, I forgot, whats you time scale for your trip?


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## rich p (4 Feb 2010)

Turdus philomelos said:


> Rich p, This might be a bit cheeky but could you share your route plans and hotels with me. Since taking up cycling last year I've had a notion to cycle from my house to NL and back. Since I'm doing this on my own, (him in doors wont go out the UK), and not knowing anything about NL, I feel having a good information base to start from will give me confidence to go. Plus how are you getting to the NL.



Hi Song Thrush
I'm more than happy to share my details with you. I'm travelling on the overnight ferry from Harwich to the Hook of Holland on Saturday 17th April and returning on the overnight boat on Friday 23rd.

The itinerary is:
Hoek van Holland
74k
IJmuiden
71k
Enkhuizen
68k
Putten
53k
Tiel 
65k
Gouda 
51k
Hoek van Holland - via Delft

If you pm me your email address I'll send you the list of hotels in these places that I've booked. I chose them on a basis of cheapness, availability and quality - in that order!!

I've also got a googlemap of the rough route which I sent to my travelling companions which I'll forward too.

Feel free to ask for more info.
Cheers Rich


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## walt (4 Feb 2010)

Am also thinking of a trip to NL later this year. Would anyone know whether you can simply disembark at IJmuiden (from Newcastle) and cycle directly away from the port - any restrictions? 

Anyone done it? Thanks.


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## Haitch (4 Feb 2010)

walt said:


> Would anyone know whether you can simply disembark at IJmuiden (from Newcastle) and cycle directly away from the port - any restrictions?
> 
> Anyone done it? Thanks.




No problem. You ride off the boat, go a couple of hundred yards down the quayside and turn left at the roundabout (if you turn right you go into the town of IJmuiden). That's it. On the left-hand side just before the roundabout there are a couple of very good fish shops/cafes/restaurants.

You can follow the route on Google Street View using this link.


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## Haitch (4 Feb 2010)

rich p said:


> Putten
> 53k
> Tiel




If you're staying in Putten use the fietsnetwerk to plot a course over the Veluwe (in an arc going towards Apeldoorn and Arnhem) and through the woods to get to Tiel. You'll be riding on small paths, low/no-traffic roads. It might turn out a lot longer than 53km but if you have a good route it will be one of the best, if not the best, day's cycling.


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## walt (4 Feb 2010)

Thanks Alan H


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## rich p (4 Feb 2010)

Alan H said:


> If you're staying in Putten use the fietsnetwerk to plot a course over the Veluwe (in an arc going towards Apeldoorn and Arnhem) and through the woods to get to Tiel. You'll be riding on small paths, low/no-traffic roads. It might turn out a lot longer than 53km but if you have a good route it will be one of the best, if not the best, day's cycling.



Thanks, Alan. I was thinking of doing a more circuitous route through the Veluwe after Friedel recommended it.


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## just4fun (5 Feb 2010)

In the Summer i will be heading back to the Netherlands for a touring holiday. Instead of my usual LF1 route, I am thinking of going to Gelderland because of the number of the natuur kampeer sites. Could anyone recommend any particularly nice natuur kampeer site in this (?)province please.
I would also appreciate any other cycling/ tourist info about Gelderland as i havent been to that area before.
Many thanks
Gary


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## Haitch (5 Feb 2010)

Sorry, just4fun, but I have no experience camping in Holland. Perhaps this site can help you. If you click through to the map you can zoom in on Gelderland and see precisely where the camp sites are. I understand that they can be fairly basic. 

Gelderland is a lovely province. If you want to do a good tour of it, the easiest thing to do would be to follow the Veluwe Route. There is information here in Dutch only I'm afraid but you can at least click the "Interactieve Fietskaart" button in the top left to find a map.


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## Domestique (5 Feb 2010)

Thi one is in Utrecht, Tull en 't Waal, was one of the most interesting sites we stayed at last year. The camp site is actually in a fort. 
http://www.natuurkampeerterreinen.nl/nl/terreinen/utrecht/werk-aan-de-korte-uitweg.html

Tbh we stayed at 9 sites in total, and they where all excellant imo.


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## just4fun (5 Feb 2010)

Thank you both for your replys. Fortunately my Partner is half Dutch so she can translate (most of) the info on those pages which will be very helpful to us. Sadly since i last posted she is having 2nd thoughts about another 'bike adventure' instead suggesting camping in the South of France because she needs a rest. Hmm..... there is work to be done!


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## Haitch (6 Feb 2010)

I've biked past that fort many times and never realised it housed a campsite. Glorious cycling territory on both sides of the river. 

If you're still looking for a route from Tiel to Gouda, Rich, you could do a lot worse than going via Buren / Culemborg (cross the River Lek in Culemborg) / Oudewater (famous for its witch dunking) and then enter Gouda from the north so that you cycle through the Reeuwijkse Plassen. A lot, lot worse.


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## Cathryn (7 Feb 2010)

There's a cafe in Oudewater on the bridge to the east of the witches weigh house and it does the BEST applecake I've ever tasted!!!


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## rich p (7 Feb 2010)

Alan H said:


> I've biked past that fort many times and never realised it housed a campsite. Glorious cycling territory on both sides of the river.
> 
> If you're still looking for a route from Tiel to Gouda, Rich, you could do a lot worse than going via Buren / Culemborg (cross the River Lek in Culemborg) / Oudewater (famous for its witch dunking) and then enter Gouda from the north so that you cycle through the Reeuwijkse Plassen. A lot, lot worse.



Cheers, Alan, duly noted. That's the route sorted for that bit.


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## rich p (7 Feb 2010)

Cathryn said:


> There's a cafe in Oudewater on the bridge to the east of the witches weigh house and it does the BEST applecake I've ever tasted!!!



I'm more of a savoury person but as you keep blarting on about applecake, Cat, I'm going to have to give it a go!


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## Cathryn (7 Feb 2010)

You won't regret it!!! Make sure you get it with cream.


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## Andy in Sig (7 Feb 2010)

Appelgebak with the g being pronounced like ch in Scottish "Loch".


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## User169 (7 Feb 2010)

Savoury you say? Bitterballen will be right up your street...


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## Haitch (8 Feb 2010)

rich p said:


> Cheers, Alan, duly noted. That's the route sorted for that bit.




After Buren, head north to Zoelmond and then up to the river and ride along the dyke, much nicer than going through the polder. Culemborg is an attractive, historic town; go into the centre for a coffee and some of Delft's bitter balls before catching the ferry.


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## Turdus philomelos (11 Feb 2010)

Here's a thing. What about travel insurance for ma wee jolly round Holland? Any recomendations? 
Also was reading that one in five bikes get knicked. Kricky!


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## Turdus philomelos (11 Feb 2010)

Also how many litres in relation to size of panniers do you think I will need. Will 40 do? I'm not camping so its just my clothes and stuff.


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## rich p (12 Feb 2010)

Alan H said:


> After Buren, head north to Zoelmond and then up to the river and ride along the dyke, much nicer than going through the polder. Culemborg is an attractive, historic town; go into the centre for a coffee and some of Delft's bitter balls before catching the ferry.



Is it a ferry or a bridge at Culemborg?


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## Haitch (12 Feb 2010)

rich p said:


> Is it a ferry or a bridge at Culemborg?




It's a ferry. It will start operating at about 6 in the morning and stop at about 11 at night, shuttling back and forth across the river all day. Maximum waiting time will be about 10 minutes. It takes 5 minutes or so to cross and will cost less than one euro per person with bike. 

Similar ferries are operated at Wageningen, Amerongen, Wijk bij Duurstede and Beusichem (to the east of Culemborg) and at Vianen (to the west). Cycling along the dyke (which really is preferable to going through the polder!!), you will see two bridges in the distance. The first one is a railway bridge and the second is the A27 motorway. Bikes are not allowed on either of these bridges. 

Further on, to the west of Vianen, is the A2 motorway bridge. Bikes can use this bridge to cross the river. Even further to the west, there are ferries at Ameide, Gelkenes and opposite Bergstoep. After that you have overshot Gouda and are into uncharted territory.


The River Lek is a branch of the Rhine. How cool is that? Going on a Rhine cruise!


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## rich p (14 Apr 2010)

I'm off on the tour on Saturday for a week.
Firstly, thanks for the route advice and food tips (apple wotsits and savoury balls!).
I'm slightly disturbed that Metcheck is forsating snow now and next week for the Netherlands
Is it snowing there? Temps of zero to 3 degrees predicted.


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## Haitch (15 Apr 2010)

It's a beautiful spring day here. Bit chilly in the morning but lots of sunshine.

Practise your Dutch by taking a look at this weather site.

Have a good trip.


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## HelenD123 (15 Apr 2010)

rich p said:


> I'm off on the tour on Saturday for a week.
> Firstly, thanks for the route advice and food tips (apple wotsits and savoury balls!).
> I'm slightly disturbed that Metcheck is forsating snow now and next week for the Netherlands
> Is it snowing there? Temps of zero to 3 degrees predicted.



Ignore the metcheck forecast. It predicted hail when Punkypossum and I did the Amsterdame ride last June and the weather was fine!


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## rich p (15 Apr 2010)

Alan H said:


> It's a beautiful spring day here. Bit chilly in the morning but lots of sunshine.
> 
> Practise your Dutch by taking a look at this weather site.
> 
> ...



Thanks, Alan, that looks altogether more promising!



HelenD123 said:


> Ignore the metcheck forecast. It predicted hail when Punkypossum and I did the Amsterdame ride last June and the weather was fine!



Metcheck does seem a bit melodramatic at times!


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## User169 (15 Apr 2010)

Very sunny here in Amsterdam today!

Have a good one.


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## rich p (15 Apr 2010)

Delftse Post said:


> Very sunny here in Amsterdam today!
> 
> Have a good one.



Are there any Dutch beers I should look out for, DP? I'm not expecting Belgian quality but .....


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## snorri (15 Apr 2010)

rich p said:


> I'm off on the tour on Saturday for a week.


Have a good trip richp, and don't worry about the weather, Saturday is far a way in met terms.


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## Haitch (15 Apr 2010)

rich p said:


> Are there any Dutch beers I should look out for, DP? I'm not expecting Belgian quality but .....




Your best bet is one of the bottled Belgian beers available in nearly every supermarket and bar.


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## User169 (15 Apr 2010)

rich p said:


> Are there any Dutch beers I should look out for, DP? I'm not expecting Belgian quality but .....



As Alan says, Belgian bottled stuff is widely available. However, there are some good Dutch beers, although you'll likely only find them bottled unless you find a good bar or go to the brewery itself. Look out for anything by:

Brouwerij de Molen - I think you're going through Gouda. Try to get there via Bodengraven and call in at Brouwerij de Molen; they have a very decent restaurant, tasting room and shop. Their own beers are excellent!
Brouwerij 't Ij - they have a brewery and pub in Amsterdam

La Trappe - only Dutch trappist brewery (just) and usually available in supermarkets. 

Brouwerij de Leckere - based near Utrecht and produces some good organic beer (might find them in an organic shop).

(I'll try to remember a few more when I have some more time.)


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## ComedyPilot (15 Apr 2010)

Have a great trip Rich, and get the Dutch warned ready for my visit in May.


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## Arch (15 Apr 2010)

Alan H said:


> It's a beautiful spring day here. Bit chilly in the morning but lots of sunshine.
> 
> Practise your Dutch by taking a look at this weather site.
> 
> Have a good trip.



Good lord how civilsed they have a cycling forecast!

http://www.weeronline.nl/Europa/Fietsen-Groot-Brittannie/165/5

Am I right, 10 is the best cycling weather, 1 the worst...?


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## Cathryn (15 Apr 2010)

Rich P, have an awesome time if I don't remember to say it again!! You know what to eat, on my behalf please. Met Slagroom please.


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## rich p (15 Apr 2010)

I'm salivating already!


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## Arch (15 Apr 2010)

Cathryn said:


> Rich P, have an awesome time if I don't remember to say it again!! You know what to eat, on my behalf please. Met Slagroom please.



Slagroom?


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## Cathryn (15 Apr 2010)

Sounds very saucy, doesn't it. Means 'with cream'. Pronounced 'sla-(phlem) -room'


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## Arch (15 Apr 2010)

ok, I sort of assumed it would be cream, but couldn't make it sound like cream, and I've noticed that a lot of Dutch words, once you get past the odd spelling, sound a bit like the English.


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## Haitch (15 Apr 2010)

Arch said:


> Am I right, 10 is the best cycling weather, 1 the worst...?




The figure is based on the chance of rain, wind, sunshine, temperature and fog between 8 in the morning and 8 at night. A standard score of 10 is computed for the country as a whole and marks are then deducted for the local probability of rain, wind, cloud, etc. The lowest score is 1.

On the UK map at the moment, the best biking weather is in Scotland with a 10, then Northern Ireland and East Anglia with a 9, etc.


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## Haitch (15 Apr 2010)

Can I just put a good word in for _broodje haring_: raw herring, raw onion, fluffy white bun. Food of the gods.

While I'm putting good words in, go to an Indonesian restaurant if you can (NOT a _Chinees-Indisch restaurant_, which are pretty much of a muchness with a UK Chinese but generally serve tasteless mush). There are also a few Indonesian takeaways, just make sure it is a proper Indonesian restaurant.


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## rich p (15 Apr 2010)

Sounds good. If I've got this straight, herring rolls, savoury balls, apple cake and trappist beer followed by an Indonesian with slag. I'll have to write it all down!


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## Haitch (15 Apr 2010)

rich p said:


> Sounds good. If I've got this straight, herring rolls, *savoury balls*, apple cake and trappist beer followed by an Indonesian with slag. I'll have to write it all down!




No, it's *bitter* balls. Have you ever enjoyed savoury balls?

Oh, and the slag comes with a room.


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## slowmotion (15 Apr 2010)

I'm insane with jealousy, rich p. I hope to visit again this summer, but it seems a long way off, right now.

Have a great time in Holland.


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## Tony (18 Apr 2010)

slagroom---whipped cream.
Like German schlag (rahm)
If you want your sorta cappuccino topped with whipped cream in Germany, "Mit Schlagobers"


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