# Sexism and fat shaming



## jefmcg (18 Aug 2015)

I found this really sad

https://thelonelycyclist.wordpress.com/2015/08/16/skinny-cyclist-not-likely/



thelonelycyclist said:


> Two cyclists come past me quite fast, one in black and red Castelli, the other in black and yellow Castelli cafe kit.
> ‘…off the farking road you fat bitch…’



Power to thelonelycyclist. As for the men, well, they are pathetic angry people. I'd guess one of two causes. There are some men who feel women owe them something; if they find a woman attractive, they think they have the right to tell her and they think she should be grateful; if they find a woman unattractive, they take it as a personal affront which gives them the right to "respond" angrily.

Or possibly - quite possibly - they are attracted to her, and feel ashamed of that attraction, so it turns sour and abusive.

Either way, the selfishness of someone to abuse a stranger is just appalling. 

This sort of incident is not that common: I've got a huge arse, big thighs and cankles and I've never _heard _any abuse from another _cyclist._ And I've done plenty of km around the area thelonelycyclist travels.

(already mentioned here, but worthy of it's own thread, I think)


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## winjim (18 Aug 2015)

I saw thisyesterday. Really horrible. Then today, a picture popped up on facebook of a larger lady riding a bike with loads of positive slogans, supposedly in solidarity with the article's author. It looked like one of those pictures taken at a sportive or something and it got me wondering, does that woman even know her photo is being used in this way, and has she against her will become a poster girl for fat cyclists? And despite the supposed positive message, isn't that just as bad?


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## slowmotion (18 Aug 2015)

I think that there is a slight human tendency for some people to become more obnoxious the more seriously they take their pastime/hobby. I've noticed it with sailors, fishermen, ramblers, hi-fi enthusiasts...you name it.

Quite a lot of cyclists take it very seriously.


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## Kbrook (18 Aug 2015)

I don't believe it to be honest. I can't imagine any cyclist abusing any other cyclist like that. She has come across two loathsome individuals in a short space of time, no not having it.


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## w00hoo_kent (18 Aug 2015)

User said:


> I would like this but it just feels inappropriate to.


Agreed, for all the getting hot under the collar for the odd RLJ or helmet activist this stuff is what truly needs to be stomped out.

@slowmotion, at which point is taking something seriously justification for treating another person like this? Or is someone who isn't stick thin an insult to serious cyclists?

I may not last long in this thread, it has the potential to make me quite uncivil.


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## Spinney (18 Aug 2015)

w00hoo_kent said:


> Agreed, for all the getting hot under the collar for the odd RLJ or helmet activist this stuff is what truly needs to be stomped out.
> 
> @slowmotion, at which point is taking something seriously justification for treating another person like this? Or is someone who isn't stick thin an insult to serious cyclists?
> 
> I may not last long in this thread, it has the potential to make me quite uncivil.


I read slowmotion's comment as an observation, not a justifcation for such obnoxious behaviour.


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## slowmotion (18 Aug 2015)

w00hoo_kent said:


> @slowmotion, at which point is taking something seriously justification for treating another person like this? Or is someone who isn't stick thin an insult to serious cyclists?
> .


 
It isn't a justification. Some people feel the need to parade their superiority by pissing on other people, unfortunately.


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

Kbrook said:


> I don't believe it to be honest. I can't imagine any cyclist abusing any other cyclist like that. She has come across two loathsome individuals in a short space of time, no not having it.


You really don't believe it happens...honestly...truly..
We've had guys come on here who've been abused for being on the heavy side, or just because they were riding an old bike

Lots of people have the capacity to be utterly foul to others who perhaps don't conform with their own blinkered stereotypes...regardless of their mode of transport

As a currently overweight and previously very overweight female I've had ample abuse, while cycling and otherwise

I'm sure lots of male cyclists have thought this, it's only the utterly contemptible twats who feel the need to say it out loud


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## w00hoo_kent (18 Aug 2015)

Spinney said:


> I read slowmotion's comment as an observation, not a justifcation for such obnoxious behaviour.


I may have read more in to the line break than was there.

And unfortunately with @Kbrook 's comment, I can completely believe it. Fortunately I'm merely a fat bloke so I don't warrant quite so much ire, but I recognise it all too well.


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## Kbrook (18 Aug 2015)

My other half is a largish lady she tells me she has never once experienced anything other than encouragement from other cyclists. Hence my scepticism of the article. But if you are all telling me it happens it truly is shocking, maybe I just don't want to believe it.


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## e-rider (18 Aug 2015)

in my teens and twenties I was a skinny cyclist, but now at forty I'm several stone overweight. Most people at my local cycling club make regular and sometimes offensive comments about my size - in the past as a thin person I never even imagined that this sort of thing happened so much to larger people; but now that I'm the larger person I see it first hand - I don't know why people have the need to take the piss out of other people all the time but sadly they do!


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## MontyVeda (18 Aug 2015)

jefmcg said:


> ...there are some men who feel women owe them something...



Well put... a couple of years ago a friend was telling me how much he liked and respected a mutual friend of ours, then said "but she's horrendously ugly" ...he got into a bit of a defensive grump, giving it "I'm only saying!" when i asked "What's the point of saying something nice if you're only going to punctuate it with something shallow and nasty?"

It's as if it's the woman's problem if their face/figure/breasticles don't meet with a man's approval... it's sad, it's shallow, and should always be challenged.


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## w00hoo_kent (18 Aug 2015)

@Kbrook - likewise, and I also wish I could believe it didn't happen. I'm not sure if my wife has had it, but she rarely rides in all female company. I've heard it first hand from a friend when she was riding with another woman. I don't have many links with cyclists outside of CC so it becomes quite a big sample I guess. My wife hasn't had any comments while riding with me, but it would seem if there is a man in the group they are less likely to happen. That probably says something, doesn't it.


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

Kbrook said:


> My other half is a largish lady she tells me she has never once experienced anything other than encouragement from other cyclists. Hence my scepticism of the article. But if you are all telling me it happens it truly is shocking, maybe I just don't want to believe it.


Maybe the Surrey hills attract more knob ends in Lycra than other parts of the country


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## sarahale (18 Aug 2015)

Group of 4 guys once overtook me laughing and said nastily 'why are you bothering?! Go home!'

But in 4 years of cycling everyday, that's the only bad comment I've had from another cyclist.

I reckon if I saw them now I could probably overtake them on my mtb anyway


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## Spinney (18 Aug 2015)

Easier said than done, but if it happens try to think something like...

If the only way they can feel good about themselves is to hurl hurtful abuse at other people, they must have very bleak and pathetic lives of their own...


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## winjim (18 Aug 2015)

vickster said:


> Maybe the Surrey hills attract more knob ends in Lycra than other parts of the country


Arrogant City boys?


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

winjim said:


> Arrogant City boys?


I think just twats

That said, I've been up Box Hill very slowly half a dozen times, never a negative word, only encouragement, generally from older guys. The younger ones just steam past at twice my speed, although some do pass way closer than they should


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

sarahale said:


> Group of 4 guys once overtook me laughing and said nastily 'why are you bothering?! Go home!'
> 
> But in 4 years of cycling everyday, that's the only bad comment I've had from another cyclist.
> 
> I reckon if I saw them now I could probably overtake them on my mtb anyway


Be satisfied that they probably have really small willies and suffer from PE


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## w00hoo_kent (18 Aug 2015)

winjim said:


> Arrogant City boys?


No, just more of this community of cyclists we allegedly belong to.


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## Bobby Mhor (18 Aug 2015)

I was doing some 'maintenance' work on Route 75 a couple of year ago and some old tosser told, nay shouted at me 'Get out the f'in road, r sole', I immediately regretted the broken glass I had 'blown' off the entire almost two miles of our beat..

Ironically, I bumped into him a few weeks later and stopped to talk to him and mentioned the fantastic job the local council blokes did in their maintaining of the track...He looked bemused and I reminded him that I was the f'in r sole he bawled at, 'No me, mate'...'Sorry Bud I never forget a face'.. as he wheeled away keeping his head down..

I used get the fat jibes occasionally from the local neds but now I get offers of strong cider or Buckie as I pass them...


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## bozmandb9 (18 Aug 2015)

winjim said:


> Arrogant City boys?


Isn't this and the comment about knob ends in Lycra the same as the fat shaming? Name calling and abuse at random and without justification based on ignorance?

I'm sure the guys who assaulted me on Saturday were thinking or saying something similar just before they launched their attack!


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## Spinney (18 Aug 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> Isn't this and the comment about knob ends in Lycra the same as the fat shaming? Name calling and abuse at random and without justification based on ignorance?
> 
> I'm sure the guys who assaulted me on Saturday were thinking or saying something similar just before they launched their attack!


It's not at random if they mean the ones who are shouting abuse...


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> Isn't this and the comment about knob ends in Lycra the same as the fat shaming? Name calling and abuse at random and without justification based on ignorance?
> 
> I'm sure the guys who assaulted me on Saturday were thinking or saying something similar just before they launched their attack!


I was referring to the ones hurling unwarranted abuse at a woman just out enjoying her bike ride


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## bozmandb9 (18 Aug 2015)

But isn't attaching a derogatory label, and generalisation based on appearance geography etc the first step on this road?

Far better not to judge them by any other criteria than their actions. No need to group or stereotype, or assume others would stoop so low based on association.


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## Effyb4 (18 Aug 2015)

I've only had one nasty comment about my speed from a group of male cyclists and one supposedly helpful comment about gears from a male cyclist, when I have been riding. The first time I was with another female cyclist and my teenage son and the second time I was just with my son. I have been riding two or three times a week for 2 years and overwhelmingly I get nods and positive greetings from other cyclists.


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## gbb (18 Aug 2015)

Kbrook said:


> I don't believe it to be honest. I can't imagine any cyclist abusing any other cyclist like that. She has come across two loathsome individuals in a short space of time, no not having it.


TBH I'm struggling to comprhend the writer had seperate three comments made in one jpurney, one I assume positive, two negative, all on different occasions in one ride. In years of cycling covering many thousands of miles, ive maybe had maybe ONE comment thrown at me I could remember and I dont even know if that was good or bad. ...just a garbled something as I passed.
That said, I may be wrong, I couldnt possibly bring someone down that way, I couldnt sleep if I had, but...thats me, there are plenty of a**eholes around.
Id look at ot this way, when I was at my best, maybe once a year something would happen to cause you to question what you were doing, then you remember all the good times you've had, the vast majority of drivers that were considerate...an odd nutcase should be shrugged off, whether its an errant driver, ped...or cyclist. Fcuk em. (Sorry but its how I'd think)


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## theclaud (18 Aug 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> *Isn't this and the comment about knob ends in Lycra the same as the fat shaming?* Name calling and abuse at random and without justification based on ignorance?
> 
> I'm sure the guys who assaulted me on Saturday were thinking or saying something similar just before they launched their attack!



No. HTH.


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## ChrisEyles (18 Aug 2015)

slowmotion said:


> I think that there is a slight human tendency for some people to become more obnoxious the more seriously they take there pastime/hobby... Quite a lot of cyclists take it very seriously.



This is unfortunately a very true observation! 

Of course it doesn't have to be lycra-clad-shaven-legged-carbon-straddling roadies who are guilty (I absolutely agree with those who warn against judging by appearances), but these are typically the people who have sunk the most time and money into their hobby, and are most likely to have their self-worth linked in some way to their cycling ability. IMHO those who feel the need to re-assure themselves of their superiority by making these sorts of comments have some serious ego related issues and deserve contempt (and perhaps a little pity too) as well as disapproval. Either that or you're in "their" way and deserve the abuse for interfering in their "serious" training - equally bad if they mouth off at you as a result. Of course, you also get some people who are plain d*ckheads and think it's funny and clever to upset people, and they could be riding anything (or in the car, on the footpath etc)... 

Fortunately there are plenty of "serious" cyclists out there who are full of nothing but mutual enthusiasm and encouragement for anyone out their on the road, and just like to see people out enjoying themselves on the bike - these make up the vast majority of lycra-clad roadies I see out and about, and this forum seems to be full of them too. 

It must be absolutely awful being the target of this sort of abuse - the only thing I would say to anyone who suffers from it is that the idiot spouting it is probably the biggest loser out there on the road today, whatever speed they sprint away, while the victim is an absolute winner if they carry on riding and keep on getting out there on the bike in spite of it. 

My wife gets the odd comment when she's out and about, but nothing like the story that the OP linked to!


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## Saluki (18 Aug 2015)

I have had the odd comment but generally not from cyclists. I have heard comments, mostly from other women who are often more overweight than I am. 
The only comment I have had from a cyclist was when I overtook a chap going up a hill. He called me a 'Lardy slapper'. Charming. I cleared off up the hill, super determined to get a PB on it. I did get the PB too. Thanks chap.


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## Roadrider48 (18 Aug 2015)

This is absolutely dreadful!
I wish I would have been there at the time; they would have definately apologised.


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## Spinney (18 Aug 2015)

Saluki said:


> I have had the odd comment but generally not from cyclists. I have heard comments, mostly from other women who are often more overweight than I am.
> The only comment I have had from a cyclist was when *I overtook a chap going up a hill.* He called me a 'Lardy slapper'. Charming. I cleared off up the hill, super determined to get a PB on it. I did get the PB too. Thanks chap.


Jealousy because you were going faster than him...


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## Saluki (18 Aug 2015)

Spinney said:


> Jealousy because you were going faster than him...


Absolutely. He had nicer kit and bike than me too.


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## winjim (18 Aug 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> Isn't this and the comment about knob ends in Lycra the same as the fat shaming? Name calling and abuse at random and without justification based on ignorance?


No, I think it's entirely plausible.


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## Spinney (18 Aug 2015)

Saluki said:


> Absolutely. He had nicer kit and bike than me too.


So he just found out that all the expensive kit etc doesn't actually make you go any faster...


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## Dave 123 (18 Aug 2015)

You get these dickheads in all walks of life, these Draco Malfoys (to go all Hairy P Otter) and they have a small circle of friends, or more accurately arse kissers.
They seem to be quite insensitive to the fact that nobody wants to be their mate, only the arse kissers. They are short sighted.

I'd much sooner go for a ride with a nice person who's out of shape and have a good laugh than a bore fest with captain arrogant who will most likely have moved on to fishing or shotguns or whatever else takes their fancy by the end of the year.

If these people were any good they'd be pro riders, but they're just like the rest of us- a bit crap, and there's nowt wrong with that!


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## raleighnut (18 Aug 2015)

Some people are just twats, keep on riding.


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## ClichéGuevara (18 Aug 2015)

I wonder if the same people that are being abusive to those of more ample proportions, are the same ones that reckon being overweight is a life choice? I wonder how many spot the irony? 

We all come in different shapes and sizes, and not all larger people are trying to slim, but anyone exercising sensibly should be encouraged and praised, more so if they're trying to do it for positive reasons.

I did get described as a "Henry the Eighth" by a someone on a group ride. It was meant and taken in jest, but I still took great delight in catching them on a hill and then forcing them into conversation before I upped the pace while they were blowing out of their arse and dropping further back. 

On another occasion, it was clear from their tone that one or two riders judged from appearances, as I'm not only portly, I also don't do fashion type clothing. A fat bloke in joggers on an oldish cheap bike taking best part of an hour out of their time spoke more than any words needed to, especially as the rest of their group noticed it.

Just to be clear, in both cases, it's not that I'm good, I'm decidedly average on a good day, it's more that they assumed that having the right gear for the 'look' was enough.


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## bozmandb9 (18 Aug 2015)

ClichéGuevara said:


> I wonder if the same people that are being abusive to those of more ample proportions, are the same ones that reckon being overweight is a life choice? I wonder how many spot the irony?
> 
> We all come in different shapes and sizes, and not all larger people are trying to slim, but anyone exercising sensibly should be encouraged and praised, more so if they're trying to do it for positive reasons.
> 
> ...



I also used to be very portly. Funnily enough it was when I chose to eat badly, drink too much, and do little exercise. 

I adopted a very disciplined diet, stopped drinking, worked out a lot, and lost 25kg. I keep the weight of by doing more of the same. 

I'm not saying being overweight is a life choice. More of a default if you don't make these more challenging choices, every hour/day/week/month/year.


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## Levo-Lon (18 Aug 2015)

Not sure i believe that tale either..

ive not come across stuff like this other than cheeky kids, but who gives a toss if your doing something You enjoy..


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## Crandoggler (18 Aug 2015)

I haven't read any other replies.

I find this disgusting and absolutely heart wrenching. I'm by no means Chris Froome, I look more like a rugby player than a cyclist. But I've chosen my hobby and I enjoy it. Cannot believe anyone would have the sheer outright audacity to say something like that to another person enjoying the sport they clearly hold so dearly.

I often see others that may not take the sport quite as seriously as me and always pass without a word, or a quick hello. I often look at that person, judge them on their appearance and think no more about it. I may think 'I know that feeling', when they're blowing out on a hill, or spinning the bottom ring on the lowest gear. But who the fark am I to say something to someone about their ability?

I've only had one moment where I wanted to tear another cyclists head off. That was in Cornwall, when cycling a new route with a couple of mates. We found a rather steep hill and made haste. Everyone was comfortable, but we were in the lower gears giving it stacks. A car came down the hill, (single lane) so, because we were all over the road, I decided the best course of action was to dismount. Little did I know, a rapha clad* cyclist was behind that car. He made a remark; 'it's not that steep', with a little grin. I thought 'you obnoxious prick' and said 'there's a car in my way'. Just because I'm a big lad, it does not mean I cannot get up this hill. I honestly wanted to smack the living shoot out of him. But the time went, and I will never see that guy again. This forum boils me sometimes, maybe through patronisation, maybe through misjudgement of the situation. But, I boiled over the other night. When someone said 1700ft climb over 30 miles is considered flat. Well it wasn't to me! Prick. 

I feel for this person. Nobody should ever feel like an outsider doing whatever they want to do. This is a free world where we are free to enjoy ourselves. Nobody has the right to comment like this. At least they're out there, doing it and getting fitter.

Why do people do it? What's the need? To elevate their already inflated ego? Not on my watch shipmate. Why not keep your patronising, obnoxious, selfish and foolhardy comments to yourself.

Awful. Truly sad and awful.

*unfortunately there are some.


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## Citius (18 Aug 2015)

The hits on that blog must have gone through the roof...


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## Saluki (18 Aug 2015)

Spinney said:


> So he just found out that all the expensive kit etc doesn't actually make you go any faster...


The words "all the gear and no idea" did cross my mind but I just wanted to miff his day off further. Scalp him then accelerate away. Sticks and stones and all that. He now has to live with the shame of being scalped by an overweight, middle aged woman on a CX bike.


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## ClichéGuevara (18 Aug 2015)

bozmandb9 said:


> I also used to be very portly. Funnily enough it was when I chose to eat badly, drink too much, and do little exercise.
> 
> I adopted a very disciplined diet, stopped drinking, worked out a lot, and lost 25kg. I keep the weight of by doing more of the same.
> 
> I'm not saying being overweight is a life choice. More of a default if you don't make these more challenging choices, every hour/day/week/month/year.



Congratulations on your weight loss and good luck in keeping it that way. 

Obviously there's truth in what you say, but based on experience, I'd say it's a generalisation. I know a fair few people that have gone through hell to lose weight with no success. I also know people who have had expert tuition and spent a small fortune trying to gain weight, and failed.

Some things in life simply can't be taken at face value, however, back to the point of this thread, people out on bikes or exercising seem to be giving the impression of trying at least, so for that alone, they deserve encouragement, not abuse.


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## outlash (18 Aug 2015)

The reaction that surprises me the most is 'how can one (or more) cyclist(s) be like that to another?' as if somehow putting your feet on pedals somehow makes you a better person. *peanuts* are *peanuts* no matter how you get about, this sort of thing is disgusting regardless of where or who it comes from.

Edit: swear filter is working well i see .


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## Glow worm (18 Aug 2015)

outlash said:


> The reaction that surprises me the most is 'how can one (or more) cyclist(s) be like that to another?' as if somehow putting your feet on pedals somehow makes you a better person. *peanuts* are *peanuts* no matter how you get about, this sort of thing is disgusting regardless of where or who it comes from.
> .



Im not sure the cycling thing is most relevant, they just sound like mysogynistic wnakers to me, irrespective of the situation. Probably the same sort of morons who still think its OK to wolf whistle 'cos they love I'd don't they'. I just hope karma catches up with them one day and the cyclist described in the OP keeps on riding. The fact that women have to put up with this kind of pathetic $hite is just so utterly depressing.


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## ScotiaLass (18 Aug 2015)

I've had a couple of abusive comments aimed at me, (young males) and some food thrown out the window of a (close) passing car which exploded at my feet, covering me and the bike in some sort of sauce.
It's pathetic...all I can say is that they must be really horrible individuals with issues, to treat a fellow human in this way.
I hope one day when they are older, less able, fatter etc that karma will come round and bite them on the ass!


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## outlash (18 Aug 2015)

Glow worm said:


> Im not sure the cycling thing is most relevant, they just sound like mysogynistic wnakers to me, irrespective of the situation. Probably the same sort of morons who still think its OK to wolf whistle 'cos they love I'd don't they'. I just hope karma catches up with them one day and the cyclist described in the OP keeps on riding. The fact that women have to put up with this kind of pathetic $hite is just so utterly depressing.



Undoubtedly they're bellends of the highest order, but it's still all too common unfortunately. The reaction I've described is the surprising part for me.


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## bozmandb9 (18 Aug 2015)

ClichéGuevara said:


> Congratulations on your weight loss and good luck in keeping it that way.
> 
> Obviously there's truth in what you say, but based on experience, I'd say it's a generalisation. I know a fair few people that have gone through hell to lose weight with no success. I also know people who have had expert tuition and spent a small fortune trying to gain weight, and failed.
> 
> Some things in life simply can't be taken at face value, however, back to the point of this thread, people out on bikes or exercising seem to be giving the impression of trying at least, so for that alone, they deserve encouragement, not abuse.


Totally agree!


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## Cuchilo (18 Aug 2015)

vickster said:


> Maybe the Surrey hills attract more knob ends in Lycra than other parts of the country


I'm often there so you may have a point .


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## classic33 (18 Aug 2015)

Link from stayin alive at 1.5, an Irish site
http://road.cc/content/news/161155-...eckling-attracts-hundreds-supportive-comments


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## Hip Priest (18 Aug 2015)

Only bad people feel the need to make such hurtful comments towards a complete stranger. People like this are probably empowered by the popularity of Katie Hopkins and her ilk. They probably think they're brave non-PC renegades 'telling it like it is', the absolute flutes.


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## swansonj (18 Aug 2015)

outlash said:


> The reaction that surprises me the most is 'how can one (or more) cyclist(s) be like that to another?' as if somehow putting your feet on pedals somehow makes you a better person. *peanuts* are *peanuts* no matter how you get about, this sort of thing is disgusting regardless of where or who it comes from.
> 
> Edit: swear filter is working well i see .


But I do expect cyclists to be better people. Cycling is physically and morally healthy; it tends to expand horizons rather than limit them; it gives experience, albeit in one narrow context, to those who do not have it already of being on the weaker side of a power equation; so, quite reasonably I feel, I do expect it to attract and to produce nicer people.


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## swansonj (18 Aug 2015)

User said:


> theres a lot of chatter over this, a lot of patronising rubbish about how good it is to see fat cyclists etc etc and other rubbish about how its the lycra crowd causing the problems...2 things most people are not getting is that the blogger is one of the lycra crowd and *she not really that fat...*
> anyway theres a lot of anger for a one sided anecdotal blog which may or may not be totally true...


"Oh, so you have to be fat to be stout now, do you?"
(One for the Not the Nine O'Clock News fans, I'm sure someone can post a link)


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## Sandra6 (18 Aug 2015)

"Cyclists are friendly" 
"People who cycle are more awesome than average"
" all good people ride bikes" 
Catchphrases, slogans, things we all believe that make us feel we're part of a positive clique so when " one of our own" goes bad we take it personally. 
Reality is even dick heads ride bikes.
There's a similar blog about a fat runner, the motive of these posts being that we look at overweight people in future and think good on you. But why can't we just look at people fat or thin and not actually think anything, because its none of our business?! 
I did have an altercation once with a guy on the station, I was wheeling my bike, I gave way to him, he deliberately obstructed me anyway, I muttered that he was a dick he ranted after me as I carried my bike up the stairs. I thought it was over until he bellowed " and lose some weight" I just laughed at the irony.
These people can't make you feel bad, only you can do that.


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## screenman (18 Aug 2015)

There are cyclist and there are thugs on bikes, to me they are not the same thing.


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## Andrew_P (18 Aug 2015)

Have to say it bought out the cynic in me. Box Hill was a mistake though. If she is pissed off enough she could easily name and shame using Strava flyby.


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## RedRider (18 Aug 2015)

I'm not sure why people find it so hard to believe cyclists might abuse cyclists. There's always insecure, prickish bullies looking to make themselves feel better. daffodils.


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## bianchi1 (18 Aug 2015)

RedRider said:


> I'm not sure why people find it so hard to believe cyclists might abuse cyclists. There's always insecure, prickish bullies looking to make themselves feel better. daffodils.



Just as there are media savvy blog blog writers who know how to use an emotive story as click bait. I'm not saying it's not true, it's the internet after all, but 3 cyclist making cruel fat comments to a non fat cyclist in one ride?


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## RedRider (18 Aug 2015)

bianchi1 said:


> Just as there are media savvy blog blog writers who know how to use an emotive story as click bait. I'm not saying it's not true, it's the internet after all, but 3 cyclist making cruel fat comments to a non fat cyclist in one ride?


Well I tend to believe the blogger and I say that as a former professional cynic.


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## bianchi1 (18 Aug 2015)

RedRider said:


> Well I tend to believe the blogger and I say that as a former professional cynic.



The blogs been shared 2000+ times on Facebook and 500+ times on Twitter. Her blogs normally go relatively unnoticed. This all a week after a jogger has become a minor web based celeb after being called fat by a van driver...I remain sceptical.

In over 150000 miles of cycling (and I'm fat, slow, bald and wear glasses) no cyclist has ever abused me...let alone 3 in one day!


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

Are you a woman though?


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## bianchi1 (18 Aug 2015)

vickster said:


> Are you a woman though?



No, but my daughter is and she can confirm that no cyclist has ever said anything disparaging to her either. 

Males and females, young boys and girls have always had quite specific taunts aimed at them that ruin lives, stop participation in sport etc. With women and girls it's often body size, while men and boys it tends to focus on genital size strangely. But you would never equate the size of a mans penis with his worth...would you?


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## double0jedi (18 Aug 2015)

I had someone shout something at me, I started a thread about it on this very forum, and I received nothing but support from every one. Thank you. 
At the time I was incensed, very angry and I have to be honest hurt. I've always struggled with my weight, and someone attacking that weak point really pissed me off. The worst thing was, he was gone before I could respond properly, by the time I realised something had been said he was gone.
Looking back I feel a bit stupid, guy was just a dick. I would bet every penny I have if I ever got to confront him he would be meek as a kitten. Just a dick shooting his mouth. 
Why wouldn't cycling have its portion of dicks? 
I mean with it being so popular, the law of averages says a percentage the community are going to be dickish.


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## vickster (18 Aug 2015)

bianchi1 said:


> No, but my daughter is and she can confirm that no cyclist has ever said anything disparaging to her either.
> 
> Males and females, young boys and girls have always had quite specific taunts aimed at them that ruin lives, stop participation in sport etc. With women and girls it's often body size, while men and boys it tends to focus on genital size strangely. But you would never equate the size of a mans penis with his worth...would you?



These weren't teenagers though, nor were the four peanuts who recently hurled a barrage of abuse at me several times from a taxi recently while in traffic. I'm. Just glad the driver looked suitably embarrassed, I expect he was glad to get rid of them

Their big mouths were evidently making up for some deficiency, be it penis size or lack of intelligence


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## double0jedi (18 Aug 2015)

Why is penis size always cited as a cause for some one being a dick? Are all well endowed men "upstanding " ( scuse da pun) citizens? Maybe it's related to brain size? 
:-))


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## bianchi1 (18 Aug 2015)

vickster said:


> These weren't teenagers though, nor were the four peanuts who recently hurled a barrage of abuse at me several times from a taxi recently while in traffic. I'm. Just glad the driver looked suitably embarrassed, I expect he was glad to get rid of them
> 
> Their big mouths were evidently making up for some deficiency, be it penis size or lack of intelligence



Being shouted at by car passengers, drivers, pedestrians etc is a weekly event, but the blogger was picked on (apparently) by 3 other cyclists...on one ride. I'm just not buying it I'm afraid. 

Also I'm interested...at what size does a penis become sufficient as opposed to deficient?


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## totallyfixed (18 Aug 2015)

I only wish we had been with her at the time, first dr_pink could have "chicked" them going up the hill, then I could have "explained" the serious error they had just made.
There are an increasing amount of nobs out on road bikes these days, my impression is that they are generally newbies who think because they have all the gear it gives some kind of power to say and do what they like. I would be very surprised if a club cyclist ever behaved in this way and if they did it would be easy to report them.


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## Crandoggler (18 Aug 2015)

bianchi1 said:


> Being shouted at by car passengers, drivers, pedestrians etc is a weekly event, but the blogger was picked on (apparently) by 3 other cyclists...on one ride. I'm just not buying it I'm afraid.
> 
> Also I'm interested...at what size does a penis become sufficient as opposed to deficient?



If you have to ask, you already know!


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## buggi (18 Aug 2015)

When I'm doing cycle/driver training at work, one of the things we talk about is the small minority of drivers and cyclists who are complete knob heads. I tell them that it is not the mode of transport that defines their personality, if they are a knob in the car, they are a knob on the bike and vice versa, and a knob in life in general... and they should be judged as such individually and not be allowed to cloud your judgement of the next cyclist and driver that you come across. 

This is a clear case of two such knobs who just happened to be riding a bike. They are probably the kind of people who upload their ex girlfriends images to revenge porn sites to regain a feeling of control after being dumped bcoz their girlfriend realised they were a knobhead. 

Coming on this site restores my faith in men when I hear the way the majority of you talk about women. Most of you have a level of respect that is rarely seen these days.


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## Scotchlovingcylist (19 Aug 2015)

Theres a guy I see regularly who overtakes me in a morning, his bike looks ridiculously expensive and he looks about 9 stone wet through. I on the other hand am 18 stone and carry a rucksack and ride an entry level bike. He always stares at me as he passes far too close with a really smug look on his face as if to say haha. Yeah right mate great achievement your faster than the heavy lad. 
Some people take their hobby way to seriously.


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## BigCoops (19 Aug 2015)

As a somewhat rotund hector, I ride for myself, in a state of zen. Other people, whether motorists or those providing 'negative encouragement' very rarely pierce my bubble.

A lion cares not for the opinion of sheep. It really is that simple. If someone else wishes to use me to cover their own shortcomings, crack on, a few barely intelligible words make zero difference to me.

Besides which, there are advantages to being a little on the 'heavy' side of life.

I bounce better and I'm far, far harder to kidnap.


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## swansonj (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> sorry but what utter tosh...


I'd be happy to have a rational debate about this if you wanted, but I'm afraid you might have to expand on the reasons why you disagree with me beyond just "tosh". 

In the meantime:



User said:


> I agree. I reckon the detachment brought about by closing yourself off from the outside world has an effect. It may be greater in some than others but it is not nothing.


already starts to expand on one of the points I was making.


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## Spinney (19 Aug 2015)

The comments about not believing that three people (in two incidents) insulted her on the same ride - maybe it was the double whammy that made her write the blog article? 

And if the media/magazines/'beauty'/fashion industry didn't make such a thing about women being thin/skinny then maybe being 'fat' wouldn't be something that some people choose to use as an insult.

I do occasionally have a mental 'tut tut' at very overweight people (although I would not dream of saying anything to them or about them) - but these are the ones who are unhealthily and grossly overweight and who are sitting stuffing their faces with burgers, chips, cakes etc (and are obviously _not_ refuelling after exercise).


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## EltonFrog (19 Aug 2015)

That blog story is shocking, if it's true then the behavior of those cyclists is abhorrent, and if they ever get to read the feedback that is on social media about this story I hope they are ashamed of themselves. Apart from attention seeking I can't think why the blogger would want to write such a story if untrue, so I'm inclined to believe it.

Yet, I find the story incredible too, my wife has ridden ten thousand miles in the last three years, mostly on her own, and has never ever reported any verbal abuse. I have never experienced verbal abuse either and I'm no lightweight. Dangerous and inconsiderate driving on nearly every ride, but never abuse.


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## Pale Rider (19 Aug 2015)

The fat lass has done well to get one roadie to even speak to her, let alone two.


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## swansonj (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> I am starting to despair at some of the comments such as above and the many similar that can be only described as idiotical....


I've now lost track of your own views. You tell me I'm talking tosh for suggesting there should be a correlation between cycling and behaviour; you've now told my friend @buggi that she's an idiot for suggesting that there may not be? Is the guiding principle here, in fact, that any view beyond the superficial is idiotic?


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## EltonFrog (19 Aug 2015)

If ever there was any proof needed that cyclists could be unpleasant to one another, one only needs to read this thread.


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## Joffey (19 Aug 2015)

I think @buggi is spot on. If you are a knocbhead off the bike you will be one on it. You see it all the time, the cycling snobs. 

I'm a larger lad and thankfully have never experienced abuse on the road but when I'm out and about both in the car and on my bike you do see some idiots, they are out there for sure.


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## w00hoo_kent (19 Aug 2015)

bianchi1 said:


> Males and females, young boys and girls have always had quite specific taunts aimed at them that ruin lives, stop participation in sport etc. With women and girls it's often body size, while men and boys it tends to focus on genital size strangely. But you would never equate the size of a mans penis with his worth...would you?



Surely with a cyclist in lycra it never becomes a point of debate?



BigCoops said:


> and I'm far, far harder to kidnap.


Bizarrely we saw this on someone's T-shirt going in to Tesco last night (with a thin stick figure attempting to drag a comatose fat stick figure.)

And it's great to suggest you just let it wash over you. Lots of people can't.


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## Saluki (19 Aug 2015)

I have just commented on the lady's blog. I got asked if I was a FLOB the other day. I gave him a bit of a look, and then he said "Fabulous Lady on Bike". Made me smile anyway.
There has got to be a better acronym for us gorgeous girls on our bikes though


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## PhilDawson8270 (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> if cycling attracts and produces nicer people, what sports or activities don't......



Football


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## Oldbloke (19 Aug 2015)

Nauseating behaviour.

A couple of years ago I was fishing off a bridge by the roadside, talking to a black Frenchman, when a big bunch of (French) club cyclists rode past loudly making monkey noises.

I was horrified, the bloke just shrugged his shoulders. Cycling has it's share of scumbags like every other sport.


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## PhilDawson8270 (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> Association, union, or league?


Association


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## derrick (19 Aug 2015)

We just have to except the fact that there are plenty of moron's around.


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## PhilDawson8270 (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> sorry to say but another poor thought out comment....


Or an attempt at humour?

Lighten up?


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## Spinney (19 Aug 2015)

*Mod note*: please stick to the topic, thanks.


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## Red17 (19 Aug 2015)

If the comments happened as blogged then that is despicable, but expecting a different type of person or behaviour from people just because they ride a bike is nonsense

In my case I -
ride a road bike, mountain bike and hybrid (not all at once) generally deemed good on here  (apart from not wearing a helmet to commute which 50% on here would see as evil) 

drive a car - not so good sometimes  
drive a white transit van - evil 
ride a motorcycle - hells angel

By my own scoring I have 2 x  and 3 x


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## w00hoo_kent (19 Aug 2015)

But are a ninja, so it doesn't matter. :-)

People are people, I just wish less of them were shoots. (should that be fewer?)


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## jefmcg (19 Aug 2015)

What a healthy little thread I've started 

One thing I note is that while there a quite a few skeptics on here, none of the women are skeptical (hearsay evidence is not admissible  ) I've had enough abuse from strangers in my life that I wouldn't be shocked if it came form a cyclist. So that it could happen twice is one day to someone in London who keeps a blog does not sound unlikely at all.

Actually, I have had some nasty abuse from a cyclist, as a pedestrian. I was walking towards a busy train station, quite near the kerb and a narrow cycle lane. A cyclist came from behind me and hit my arm as he attempted to filter past me. I turned and chastised him, and he called me a "farking daffodil" (I wonder how the censor-bot with treat that). The deep and misogynistic hatred in that short sentence has stayed with me.

Edit: The anglo-saxon noun he chose was not _daffodil _


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## MacB (19 Aug 2015)

I'm surprised by the amount of disbelief being displayed, and no that isn't me saying the blog is 100% accurate with no embellishment.

As for whether lifestyle choices can make you a better or worse human being, or whether you'd be the same regardless of your hobbies, well I thought that was an interesting thought to explore...rather than nonsense. On a personal level, having played rugby for many years, I can attest to the deplorable behaviour a group of rugby players can descend to, especially on tour, and including myself. Yes it's fuelled by drink, was a while ago and peer pressure/wanting to be a part of the group played a part - but even then I knew some of the stuff was out of order and I'd have been ashamed if it had come under public scrutiny.

The comments here, and what I've just posted from my own experience, got me thinking about peer groups and positive affirmation of negative behaviour. Younger people especially seem to be immersed in social media and there's always a corner of the internet where you can get a pat on the back for all sorts of behaviours. So does that play a part? Do people sort of feel like they are constantly with a group because of social media?

I remember a bit of debate/furore on here over a thread posting images of 'hot' girls and especially that some guys couldn't see any harm. After all it was only a bit of fun...the same excuse used all over the net for all sorts of stuff and the excuse myself and my fellow rugby players would have trotted out.


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## Red17 (19 Aug 2015)

MacB said:


> I'm surprised by the amount of disbelief being displayed, and no that isn't me saying the blog is 100% accurate with no embellishment.



I think some of that possibly comes from it being so close to the incident with the runner being insulted in the same way which made the national press.

Could be that the runner incident in the press encouraged the cyclists to copy and insult the woman, but IMO anyone blogging is just screaming look at me and looking for attention anyway which is where the cynicism comes in.


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## slowmotion (19 Aug 2015)

I think social media cuts both ways. Yes, you might get a lot of approval for your behaviour, but you'll probably get an equal amount of disapproval. Of course, that depends on how widely and promiscuously you advertise your actions.


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## jefmcg (19 Aug 2015)

winjim said:


> I saw thisyesterday. Really horrible. Then today, a picture popped up on facebook of a larger lady riding a bike with loads of positive slogans, supposedly in solidarity with the article's author. It looked like one of those pictures taken at a sportive or something and it got me wondering, does that woman even know her photo is being used in this way, and has she against her will become a poster girl for fat cyclists? And despite the supposed positive message, isn't that just as bad?



I agree. Probably not quite as bad, but not great. It very patronising and I think I would avoid a place where there was a good-on-you-just-for-trying vibe, as one where I was being openly abused.



Kbrook said:


> My other half is a largish lady she tells me she has never once experienced anything other than encouragement from other cyclists.


See, that's actually the problem. I am sure the blogger also found other cyclists supportive, so this abuse came from a safe place, which makes it much worse than random abuse from a passing van, or a building site.



MontyVeda said:


> It's as if it's the woman's problem if their face/figure/breasticles don't meet with a man's approval..



But there is more to it than that. This may shock some people, but men have different tastes in women. Some men think their taste is universal, or at least "correct". So no matter what a woman looks like, there will be a man who won't approve.

(I've got fat legs. That's not self deprecating, I've had fat fold measured quite a few times, and the leg ones are off the scale compared to my upper body ones. Anyway, most men regard them as fat, and some will let me know. They have also been compared favourably to Marilyn Monroe's. I wonder if some those men shout abuse at women with more contemporary skinny legs?)



double0jedi said:


> Why is penis size always cited as a cause for some one being a dick? Are all well endowed men "upstanding " ( scuse da pun) citizens? Maybe it's related to brain size?
> :-))



Many men regard penis size as a gauge of their masculinity. So it seems likely that if they don't feel that they measure up, they may compensate in other ways. Can't say for sure about that, I've never wanted to see the penis of a swaggering, bullying peanut. I can, however, attest to the confidence granted to someone who has no doubts they measure up in that department. 

Also, most men are around average or smaller (assuming it's a bell curve), and are not totally sure it's "enough" - whatever that might mean. So if you want to find a man's weak spot, it's likely to be that. Like telling a woman she has a fat arse.


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## Spinney (19 Aug 2015)

Red17 said:


> I think some of that possibly comes from it being so close to the incident with the runner being insulted in the same way which made the national press.
> 
> Could be that the runner incident in the press encouraged the cyclists to copy and insult the woman, but IMO anyone blogging is just screaming look at me and looking for attention anyway which is where the cynicism comes in.


In some ways, it doesn't really matter whether or not the blog is true - this _does_ happen to some people, as previous posters have pointed out. And if it makes only a few of those name-calling people think twice before opening their mouths, then it will have done some good.


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## slowmotion (19 Aug 2015)

"assuming it's a bell curve......"


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## w00hoo_kent (19 Aug 2015)

slowmotion said:


> I think social media cuts both ways. Yes, you might get a lot of approval for your behaviour, but you'll probably get an equal amount of disapproval. Of course, that depends on how widely and promiscuously you advertise your actions.


Not as much as you'd like. Social media is a great way to get your personal view vindicated, because you can remove anyone who doesn't agree with how you think and end up with a group of people around you that just agree with you. It's quite dangerous to be honest as it blinkers balanced thought, you end up convinced you must be right, because everyone around you thinks it's right too.


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## slowmotion (19 Aug 2015)

w00hoo_kent said:


> Not as much as you'd like. Social media is a great way to get your personal view vindicated, because you can remove anyone who doesn't agree with how you think and end up with a group of people around you that just agree with you. It's quite dangerous to be honest as it blinkers balanced thought, you end up convinced you must be right, because everyone around you thinks it's right too.


 Yes, absolutely.


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## w00hoo_kent (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> of course it matters if its true, because those prepered to name call are highly likely to continue, a blog isn't really going to stop them, but on the other hand what this blog has done, it has put lyrca clad roadies in a very poor light, just like at the comments all over the internet and here...


I'd suggest the way large numbers of people have jumped to the conclusion 'well it's because they were lycra clad roadies' says more about people than the blog. From what I remember, while she described them she didn't particularly group them beyond being 'cyclists'. And it's been mentioned, she falls in to the lycra clad roadie category anyway.

It might be more interesting pondering why people jumped to the conclusion rather than suggesting the blog post has somehow created the animosity.


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## alecstilleyedye (19 Aug 2015)

i did the ken laidlaw sportive a few years ago and, as my riding partner and i were ready to start, i saw quite a large lady in pink lycra, and remarked to my riding partner that i admired her for her courage to attempt such a long sportive, assuming that perhaps she was at the start of her 'career' as a cyclist. my cycling partner, unlike me, no stranger to events in that part of the world, told me that she did the event and others regularly, and had done so for a while.

she probably did a better time than some of the skinny blokes...


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## jefmcg (19 Aug 2015)

Red17 said:


> I think some of that possibly comes from it being so close to the incident with the runner being insulted in the same way which made the national press.



Yes, because what is the chance that two female athletes would be abused in the same week in a country of only 64 million people?


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## lesley_x (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> Dentists on Pinarellos is the cliché, I believe.



I'm a dentist but I'm not on a pinarello, what does that make me? 

I have never really had much animosity on the bike. I have had one occasion where two blokes shouted something out the window, but to this day I'm not sure if it was directed at me and I can't even remember what they said so it didn't exactly have a big impact. 

I am sometimes genuinely surprised by how little grief I get all round when you look at footage on youtube 

If I did get comments like that lady experienced it wouldn't put me off. I would just despair at why we can't all be nice to each other. But if I was a little more insecure or new to cycling then it might upset me. I certainly wouldn't cry over it.


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## Crandoggler (19 Aug 2015)

Not sure she needed to mention they were in Castelli. They could have bought it from aliexpress to be fair.


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## Tin Pot (19 Aug 2015)

In other news, Scientists Report Young Men Are Often Abusive


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## w00hoo_kent (19 Aug 2015)

Crandoggler said:


> Not sure she needed to mention they were in Castelli. They could have bought it from aliexpress to be fair.


I'd noted she said they were in Castelli, I just presumed that meant they were thin. I've never been able to get in to anything from an Italian manufacturer (bike or bicycle kit). Other people have taken that to mean 'lycra clad blowhards'.


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## buggi (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> you've lost me now....she wrote that they were possibly similar to those that partake in revenge porn, then there are the comments by others such as small dicked, thugs, losers or cyclists are zen like, etc etc etc are all idiotical....


Probably a strong example to use but both choose their course of action to make the women feel bad and to feel superior. That's the similarity. They are, in short, just nasty pieces of work.


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## s7ephanie (19 Aug 2015)

well, one good thing about cycling in france, is that don't understand what is said to me !!


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## Joffey (19 Aug 2015)

w00hoo_kent said:


> I'd noted she said they were in Castelli, I just presumed that meant they were thin. I've never been able to get in to anything from an Italian manufacturer (bike or bicycle kit). Other people have taken that to mean 'lycra clad blowhards'.



She actually stated on her Twitter that she wears Castelli and is a big fan of their clothes so I don't think she was trying to tarnish all Castelli wearers.


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## Red17 (19 Aug 2015)

jefmcg said:


> Yes, because what is the chance that two female athletes would be abused in the same week in a country of only 64 million people?



Don't know - do you have the statistics?


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## Red17 (19 Aug 2015)

Then why ask me what the chance is?


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## clid61 (19 Aug 2015)

Cant believe this yhread is 9 pages long and full of utter twaddle ...shame on the lot of you .


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## vickster (19 Aug 2015)

Got an opinion on the blog which lead to the initial post?


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## clid61 (19 Aug 2015)

Nope and nore do I desire one thanks


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## swansonj (19 Aug 2015)

For the benefit of the sceptical Mr Irish, my justification for why I do and will continue to expect cyclists to be nicer people.

It seems to me blatantly obvious that, for any activity people can choose to participate in, (a) the people who choose to participate in it will almost always be a slanted section of the population in one way or another, and (b) participation in it will have an effect in them.

To give an example: I would be amazed if people who choose to volunteer for the TA were not a slanted section (e.g. more militaristic) of the population; and I would be amazed if participation in the TA did not have some effect on their character (make them more militaristic, but also change their approach to leadership, discipline, etc). Another example could be rugby players, which I think @MacB was citing, though I would not have done so, not being a rugby player and not wanting to promulgate my own stereotypes.

So I would be amazed if people who choose the open air rather than a confined space; who choose their own resources rather than relying on external power; who expose themselves to the vagaries of nature rather than insulate themselves from them; who match themselves to nature rather than using noisy, throbbing, vibrating engines to overcome nature; etc etc, did not tend to be different from the population as a whole, specifically, a nicer (under my definition of the word) sample. And I would be amazed if exposure to cycling did not tend to change people's character, again, in a direction that matches my definition of nicer.

So I will continue to expect cyclists to be nicer people, and when I meet or hear of one who is manifestly a knobhead, I will continue to be disappointed. 

(@User has, I think, already pointed out the fallacy of thinking that a population average - a "tendency" - has to apply to every member of that population to be true, although, as ever, he pointed it out more succinctly than me.)

(I think the recent explosion of interest in cycling in the Surrey Hills, the setting of the OP blog and my home turf, has been in a style of cycling where the factors I listed above may be less strong. I would expect to sample a different spectrum of attitudes in the cafe at the top of Box Hill from a Youth Hostel full of LeJog-ing cyclists. But I happen to think those factors still apply even if less strongly.)


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## jefmcg (19 Aug 2015)

clid61 said:


> Cant believe this yhread is 9 pages long and full of utter twaddle ...shame on the lot of you .


So what's your problem? You don't like sexism? You don't believe it exists? You don't think we should complain about it?

The content was obvious from the subject: why did you click?


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## MacB (19 Aug 2015)

clid61 said:


> Cant believe this yhread is 9 pages long and full of utter twaddle ...shame on the lot of you .



There you go you've expressed your opinion and you can even join in if you want to expand on what and why some of this is twaddle. There are two discussions emerging here:-

1. do these sorts of behaviours actually happen?
2. what are the causes of these behaviours?

If you are male, over the age of about 10 and have never been in a group of lads where derogatory comments have been made about females in the vicinity, or in general in the media or your acquaintance - then you've led a very sheltered life. That is not to say the same groups won't make derogatory comments about other males but the vitriol does seem to be reserved for females...any ideas as to why?


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## vickster (19 Aug 2015)

jefmcg said:


> So what's your problem? You don't like sexism? You don't believe it exists? You don't think we should complain about it?
> 
> The content was obvious from the subject: why did you click?


And seemingly read the whole thread!!


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## jefmcg (19 Aug 2015)

Red17 said:


> Don't know - do you have the statistics?


Are you serious???

OK. There are a little over 16,000,000 women in the UK over 40 (40 is the median age in the UK, so considerably more than that adult women). %57 are overweight or obese, so thus there 9,000,000 overweight women over 40 in the UK. similarly there are a little less adult men. I'm going to say 1 in 1000 is willing to abuse random people on their appearance. In my experience, that is low ball. So that's around 16,000 men. Let's say (low balling again) that each of these people abuses a stranger on average once a month. That's 500 per day. 

I would guess that the number of random abusive remarks made to overweight people or women in general is 10 times this. But even with my low estimate, it happens 3,500 times a week.


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## swansonj (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> sorry but still utter tosh, so I take it you expect the same from mountaineers, runners, canoeist, sailors, hill walkers, ramblers the list is endless, so basicially anyone who does anything outdoors,
> *people are the same from all walks of life irrespective of their outdoor/indoor activities* and to think different you must be delusional.


Are you seriously saying that people who go cock fighting or badger baiting are just as nice as people who volunteer for the Samaritans? Surely I must have misunderstood you.

Anyway, if you wish to leave me with my delusions, that's fine by me, my delusions are, I've found, a pretty good basis for getting through life.


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## Hip Priest (19 Aug 2015)

User said:


> who knows, who's to say the cockfighting badger baiter can't be good to his family, while the samaritan volunteer is a wife beating child molester....theres no way of telling....next you'll be telling me god fearing people do no wrong....
> people are people the same all over the world.. jobs, past times whatever have no bearing on how good or bad they really are...



Infamous US serial killer Ted Bundy famously manned a Samaritans-type phoneline.


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## Andrew_P (19 Aug 2015)

Joffey said:


> She actually stated on her Twitter that she wears Castelli and is a big fan of their clothes so I don't think she was trying to tarnish all Castelli wearers.


To be honest this is what perked my cynicism, that and the fact that she didn't want to use Strava to identify them and when someone appeared to have done it for her claimed it wasn't them which I couldn't understand how she could have known that as a fact.

In the great scheme of things whether it is true or not at least the blog has got people discussing it, my world view is that I have only experienced abuse from car drivers mainly doing it for what they think is a laugh. Even that is only twice in 5 years, and I am sure I look pretty amusing on a bike to some people. I tend to have this clan view of cyclists and have not really been disappointed, yet..


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## w00hoo_kent (20 Aug 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> To be honest this is what perked my cynicism, that and the fact that she didn't want to use Strava to identify them and when someone appeared to have done it for her claimed it wasn't them which I couldn't understand how she could have known that as a fact.


She identified the two that were found on Strava as being people she knew through work. I'm pretty sure I'd get to know people from work if I used flyby on strava with any regularity too.

Considering that 100% fact or embellished somewhat other people on here have agreed that they have direct knowledge of similar happening, I find it interesting that people are more willing to put effort in to labelling her a liar than addressing the issue. It's nice that only car drivers have abused you. Maybe you've been lucky, maybe you aren't a woman (that being quite a big factor here) who knows, I'm not sure I've been abused by another cycle rider, but then I don't share the road with that many. Maybe if I saw 50 in a day then one of them would. The fact is people on here have been, or do we need to prove that too?


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## jefmcg (20 Aug 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> To be honest this is what perked my cynicism, that and the fact that she didn't want to use Strava to identify them


Maybe she doesn't want to destroy them. The internet is a nasty place.

Google _Tim Hunt_ if you don't know what I am talking about.


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## Spinney (20 Aug 2015)

User said:


> the confusion about strava is that she was very specific about where it happened and the two riders who passed her around that time were two cyclist she happened to know.


Perhaps this should be 'two of the riders' rather than 'the two riders' - the fact that only two showed up on strava doesn't mean that they were the only two who passed her, nor that they were necessarily the two who hurled abuse.


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## bianchi1 (20 Aug 2015)

w00hoo_kent said:


> She identified the two that were found on Strava as being people she knew through work. I'm pretty sure I'd get to know people from work if I used flyby on strava with any regularity too.
> 
> Considering that 100% fact or embellished somewhat other people on here have agreed that they have direct knowledge of similar happening, I find it interesting that people are more willing to put effort in to labelling her a liar than addressing the issue. It's nice that only car drivers have abused you. Maybe you've been lucky, maybe you aren't a woman (that being quite a big factor here) who knows, I'm not sure I've been abused by another cycle rider, but then I don't share the road with that many. Maybe if I saw 50 in a day then one of them would. The fact is people on here have been, or do we need to prove that too?



There's nothing wrong with treating what you read on the internet (or anywhere) with a touch of scepticism, but I admit I do tend to be a bit more mistrusting than most.

So to play Devils advocate slightly

Its interesting that, despite giving a detailed description of the individuals involved, as soon as it goes wild on Twitter she doesn't want them identified. The ride on strave has been deleated, and she's saying the two riders it could have been are work mates. In her blogs, she always mentions people she sees out on rides, but not these two? 

The blog is called the 'lonely' cyclist which makes me think she is after sympathy straight away. Why not just the 'lone' cyclist? In the July blog she describes going out on a club run, choosing the fast group, feeling sad she kept getting dropped of the back, and deciding that the other Women on the ride were "snooty" so she didn't bother again. 

Most people on this forum have had abuse from drivers, pedestrians etc, some have also had funny looks from fellow cyclists, but actual verbal abuse? From 3 riders on one ride? The lonely cyclist isn't even remotely fat judging by her pictures. Self reported size 10/12


Anyway, without actually identifying the other riders we will all be guessing. Even the believers seem to hint that there may be a touch of embellishment in the blog. That said it makes an interesting read and the posts in this thread highlighted to me again the problems women face. After all, even if it's all made up, if the blogger feels that she is fat enough to be 'shamed' by a comment, despite not being overweight, that's proberly the issue that should be addressed.


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## jefmcg (20 Aug 2015)

bianchi1 said:


> The ride on strave has been deleated (sic)


http://www.strava.com/activities/370125053


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## bianchi1 (20 Aug 2015)

jefmcg said:


> http://www.strava.com/activities/370125053



Ta,

It was showing no page off Twitter. 

A good number of kudos for the ride.


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## Andrew_P (20 Aug 2015)

User said:


> Interesting use of the word interesting.


How would you rather it worded then?


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## Andrew_P (20 Aug 2015)

User said:


> I would have used the phrase "sad but sadly predictable".


Perhaps you would like to explain that?


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## Lonestar (20 Aug 2015)

She's better than me.I'm not even sure I could get up half the hills round there.


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## cd365 (20 Aug 2015)

Just because it is on the internet doesn't make it true.

She doesn't look fat to me, so that bit is not true at all


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## theclaud (20 Aug 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> Makes no sense at all, last sentence completely contradicts the first.


No - it doesn't.

There's a current of misogyny that lies very close to the surface of everyday life, and runs very deep. Some women are on the sharp end of it every day or night of their lives - so much so that it may come to be their normalized life experience. For those of us who are more fortunate in our circumstances it is something that we are able to forget about until it sideswipes us - apparently out of nowhere, but of course it is not really out of nowhere. Often it lurks beneath a veneer or parodic courtesy, or only expresses itself as a hostile stare. Sometimes, even for those of us who fancy ourselves good at reading subtext, it comes from where we least expect it. Mostly, no-one but the recipient sees it, and most often she will tell no-one. Not really surprising, when she is disbelieved, dismissed or discredited, or her experiences are explained away by men who won't ever have the slightest idea what it is like.

To be abused by three different fellow cyclists in one day is unusual and unfortunate, but that doesn't make it implausible. I'm inclined to think there's something in what @swansonj says. Certainly it's far more common to receive abuse from drivers or their passengers, and not just because there are more of them. All the same, some male cyclists do abuse women, and some do it in the context of cycling. There's enough leering, casual sexism and machismo, even on this forum, to be illustrative of some of the contexts in which that might occur.

It is interesting, to borrow a phrase, that some men are even now pontificating on such matters as the clothing size of the woman concerned, as if it made the slightest bit of difference to anything.


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## Andrew_P (20 Aug 2015)

theclaud said:


> To be abused by three different fellow cyclists in one day is unusual and unfortunate, but that doesn't make it implausible. I'm inclined to think there's something in what @swansonj says. Certainly it's far more common to receive abuse from drivers or their passengers, and not just because there are more of them. All the same, some male cyclists do abuse women, and some do it in the context of cycling. There's enough leering, casual sexism and machismo, even on this forum, to be illustrative of some of the contexts in which that might occur.
> 
> It is interesting, to borrow a phrase, that some men are even now pontificating on such matters as the clothing size of the woman concerned, as if it made the slightest bit of difference to anything.



The only rider who would have been fairly easily to identify was the one on Boxhill but now thanks to an independent witness it is now said that the rider in black and on black bike was going in the opposite direction going down Boxhill the witness registered on Road.cc as kangaroocourt, and also says he/she was passing the lady blogger at the time the insult was thrown, so how exactly did he/she know it was aimed squarely at the blogger and not them as the insult had no sex identifier in it? That doesn't strike you as pretty strange? Plus I would think it would be barely audible an insult being thrown by a cyclist going down a hill unless they slowed down. This witness gets no mention in the blog, yet the kind person who praises the good cornering does, as does the nice driver.

I have never said it doesn't happen per se all I have spoken about is how I feel about this particular incident. 

As I said in my deleted posts it is a huge leap to make to have it implied that I am some sort raving misogynist just because for me some of it just doesn't add up, the sex of the person involved makes absolutely no difference to me.


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## theclaud (20 Aug 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> As I said in my deleted posts it is a huge leap to make *to have it implied that I am some sort raving misogynist *just because for me some of it just doesn't add up, the sex of the person involved makes absolutely no difference to me.



And who implied that?


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## Andrew_P (20 Aug 2015)

theclaud said:


> And who implied that?


If you quoted my last deleted post you would have seen the quotes, I don't really think I should regurgitate the posts that were deleted, as they were deleted for being off subject. If the comments were not directed at me then they should not have been made whilst quoting my posts. As someone else made the same observation then I don't really think I got the wrong end of the stick.


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## theclaud (20 Aug 2015)

Andrew_P said:


> If you quoted my last deleted post you would have seen the quotes, I don't really think I should regurgitate the posts that were deleted, as they were deleted for being off subject. If the comments were not directed at me then they should not have been made whilst quoting my posts. As someone else made the same observation then I don't really think I got the wrong end of the stick.


I'm afraid I haven't kept track of what's been deleted - which is of course the problem with the practice of silent deletion and not your fault - I was responding to your defensiveness in response to Adrian's observations about men who were more interested in discrediting the woman talking about the abuse than in discussing the abuse. At no time have I implied that you are a 'raving misogynist', or indeed an unraving one - I am merely suggesting that you think a little more.


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## MissyR (24 Aug 2015)

Whether or not it's true it's a subject that's made the headlines and divided opinions. It's not just men that look down their noses at women on bikes but occasionally women too. We put our bikes into the lbs the other day for their services and when we went into collect them there was a woman in picking up her bike also and for whatever reason she had a snigger when I asked the chap if our bikes were ready. I'm about 3 stone over weight and was wearing grubby clothes after taking the puppy through the woods. No idea what she thought! Don't really care either but can see how that may have effected someone who was self concious.about their weight. Last week we were out on one of our usual jaunts and we came across two chaps on the cycle path cruising along I shout coming through on the right, they looked over their shoulder and then wouldn't let us by!! Rude!! I waited patiently till I knew the path opened up a little and we got by...... the last thing they saw was writing on the back of my shirt "Fat Lass at the back". Unfortunately crap happens. Does it stop me riding? Hell no I just make sure I give each ride 100% for ME.


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## Scotchlovingcylist (26 Aug 2015)

@MissyR 
I get what you mean, I was in Halfords once and there was a woman in full Lycra picking up her bike bragging about doing a quick 10 miles before she went to pick the kids up. Another woman in the queue was amazed anyone could do 10 miles in one go and said to me wasn't she good! My reply was actually that was pretty easy when you get used to it as I do about 23 miles a day and since that's as a work commute it adds up to about 138 miles a week. The guy behind the counter suppressed a smile but the first womans face was a picture


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## PhilDawson8270 (26 Aug 2015)

speedfreak said:


> @MissyR
> I get what you mean, I was in Halfords once and there was a woman in full Lycra picking up her bike bragging about doing a quick 10 miles before she went to pick the kids up. Another woman in the queue was amazed anyone could do 10 miles in one go and said to me wasn't she good! My reply was actually that was pretty easy when you get used to it as I do about 23 miles a day and since that's as a work commute it adds up to about 138 miles a week. The guy behind the counter suppressed a smile but the first womans face was a picture




Or she has struggled with cycling and fitness in the past, possibly compounded with struggling to maintain fitness while looking after her children. She is happy, and proud enough of her progress to do 10 miles before picking them, that she likes to tell people.

So instead of just smiling and saying "yes, that's great", and gone about your business with no change to your life at all. Instead, you chose to take the opportunity to put her achievement down, and brag about what you can do instead.


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## jefmcg (26 Aug 2015)

speedfreak said:


> @MissyR
> I get what you mean, I was in Halfords once and there was a woman in full Lycra picking up her bike bragging about doing a quick 10 miles before she went to pick the kids up. Another woman in the queue was amazed anyone could do 10 miles in one go and said to me wasn't she good! My reply was actually that was pretty easy when you get used to it as I do about 23 miles a day and since that's as a work commute it adds up to about 138 miles a week. The guy behind the counter suppressed a smile but the first womans face was a picture


Oh, good. Now we have moved on to fit-shaming.


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## Scotchlovingcylist (26 Aug 2015)

PhilDawson8270 said:


> Or she has struggled with cycling and fitness in the past, possibly compounded with struggling to maintain fitness while looking after her children. She is happy, and proud enough of her progress to do 10 miles before picking them, that she likes to tell people.
> 
> So instead of just smiling and saying "yes, that's great", and gone about your business with no change to your life at all. Instead, you chose to take the opportunity to put her achievement down, and brag about what you can do instead.



You weren't there
She was bragging, I was about 5 stone overweight at the time and the other woman wasn't slim. She had that egotistical air about her.
I understand how you could have come to that conclusion though, I should have worded my post better


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## Scotchlovingcylist (26 Aug 2015)

jefmcg said:


> Oh, good. Now we have moved on to fit-shaming.


Not at all, see my post above


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