# Road World Championship 2010



## Flying_Monkey (20 Sep 2010)

Okay, so who's going to win? Will it be a successful defence by Cadel Evans? Will it come down to a sprint between Griepel, Cavendish and Farrar? Or will it be one of the current form all-rounders like Gilbert? 

My money is on Gilbert... but what do you think?


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## rich p (20 Sep 2010)

I think it may be too tough for CAv with a small team and the apparent uphill finish. 
Maybe Hushovd if it comes to an uphill sprint or Sammy Sanchez or someone else!


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## raindog (20 Sep 2010)

Not certain this suits Gilbert. He's being touted as favourite and it's true there's a hill near the end but it's not _at _the end. In fact there might even be enough of a run-in for a broken peloton to re-form. If he's feeling good on the day, I reckon Evan's could well do it. Has anyone been world road champ two years running before?

Pleasant vid here of some local riders doing the circuit - that last hill has a kick at the top all right.
http://www.cyclingtipsblog.com/2010/01/2010-world-championship-course-geelong-australia/


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## HLaB (20 Sep 2010)

Will any of it be on Freeview or will it only be on Eurosports?


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## Ball (20 Sep 2010)

HLaB said:


> Will any of it be on Freeview or will it only be on Eurosports?



Just Eurosport I imagine! If you wanna stream online try myp2p.eu. 

Would love to see Gerrans put in a good performance after such a poor year. Very interesting to see the course, it's nowhere near as hilly as I thought, although I still believe that after 11 circuits people like Cav just won't be in contention. Sooo, Gilbert, Evans, Nibali?!


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## Ball (20 Sep 2010)

Ball said:


> Just Eurosport I imagine! If you wanna stream online try myp2p.eu.
> 
> Would love to see Gerrans put in a good performance after such a poor year. Very interesting to see the course, it's nowhere near as hilly as I thought, although I still believe that after 11 circuits people like Cav just won't be in contention. Sooo, Gilbert, Evans, Nibali?!



Actually I'm not sure I'll count Farrar out that easily after his great show in the sprint into Toledo last week in the Vuelta.


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## Flying_Monkey (20 Sep 2010)

Ball said:


> Actually I'm not sure I'll count Farrar out that easily after his great show in the sprint into Toledo last week in the Vuelta.



Um, was that the one where he failed to catch Gilbert?


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## raindog (21 Sep 2010)

Ball said:


> Actually I'm not sure I'll count Farrar out that easily after his great show in the sprint into Toledo last week in the Vuelta.


Not to take anything away from Farrar - he's a great sprinter - but I think Cav would've taken that without his buckled wheel.


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## rich p (21 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> Not to take anything away from Farrar - he's a great sprinter - but I think Cav would've taken that without his buckled wheel.




Different day RD. The one that Gilbert won up the slope and Farrar almost got to him on his left. Cav was back in 15th I think.


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## Stange (21 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Different day RD. The one that Gilbert won up the slope and Farrar almost got to him on his left. Cav was back in 15th I think.


Maybe if it's too hard for Cav, Millar will go for one of his breaks, you never know, might work (for once).


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## raindog (21 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Different day RD. The one that Gilbert won up the slope and Farrar almost got to him on his left. Cav was back in 15th I think.


Oh Toledo - yes, sorry.

Anyone know if Sagan will be at the Worlds?


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## philipbh (21 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> Anyone know if Sagan will be at the Worlds?




Looks like it

http://www.saganpeter.com/en/calendar


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## raindog (21 Sep 2010)

Thanks philip

series of vids here of Robbie talking us through the circuit
http://www.roadcycling.co.nz/RaceTalk/mcewen-walks-through-the-worlds-course.html


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## rich p (21 Sep 2010)

Cheers RD, that's interesting listening to Robbie and makes me think it won't be a pure sprinter that wins. I don't think it'll suit Cav with that uphill 700m drag at the finish though. It looks tough enough for a good climber or strong man to try and get away on the last 2 hills. 22% is a serious climb after 2km of 10-13%.
He also said that they'd hit 90-100kph after the ascents - blimey!
It was obviously filmed some time ago with the Kirchen and Armstrong references.

The winner? No idea - Evans maybe!


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## Ball (21 Sep 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Um, was that the one where he failed to catch Gilbert?



Yep that one  But in another sprint on another day...who knows???

Peter Sagan is a very good shout!


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## kennykool (22 Sep 2010)

Going for Cav - if he can be bothered to contest a sprint finish there is no-one better. Problem he has is as soon as it looks like someone is putting up a challenge he gives up

He has david Millar riding with him this year - he'll bust a gut

If not Cav then its got to be the God of Thunder - Big Thor!!!


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## raindog (22 Sep 2010)

I doubt very much Hushovd is going to be world road race champ this year.


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## raindog (22 Sep 2010)

I meant to mention this the other day, but no-one's talked about the gals and yet the uk have serious contenders with Emma Pooley and Lizzie Armistead.


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> I meant to mention this the other day, but no-one's talked about the gals and yet the uk have serious contenders with Emma Pooley and Lizzie Armistead.



Indeed - not sure whether the course is lumpy enough to really favour Pooley though.


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## raindog (22 Sep 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Indeed - not sure whether the course is lumpy enough to really favour Pooley though.


hmmm...I'm not so sure. Did you look at the Robbie McEwan vids I put up? Those are a couple of serious lumps, and she won the GP de Plouay a few weeks ago with a similar steep climb near the end. The only problem with the Oz circuit is there's 10ks after the hills where the peloton might have time to reform. Still think she's in with a shout though. 

I love this endless speculation before races, don't you?


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> hmmm...I'm not so sure. Did you look at the Robbie McEwan vids I put up? Those are a couple of serious lumps, and she won the GP de Plouay a few weeks ago with a similar steep climb near the end. The only problem with the Oz circuit is there's 10ks after the hills where the peloton might have time to reform. Still think she's in with a shout though.
> 
> I love this endless speculation before races, don't you?



Absolutely! If she can get enough of a devastating attack in on the last lap, she might well be able to stay away for the 10k (it's not that far after all), but I can't see it. Unlike for the men, the UK at least does have a strong team that it can put out in support to try to control the race behind if she does go off the front.


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## montage (22 Sep 2010)

Not so sure about the Cav win this year, but I will be supporting him for sure. This is nowhere near the sprinters course that people were claiming, and for that reason I'm going to have to say Evans following his performance this year... Is Chavanel racing? The course wouldn't be too bad for him looking at the stages he won in le tour


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## Team Fiwip (22 Sep 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> If she can get enough of a devastating attack in on the last lap, she might well be able to stay away for the 10k (it's not that far after all), but I can't see it. Unlike for the men, the UK at least does have a strong team that it can put out in support to try to control the race behind if she does go off the front.



Wise words, if Pooley can FM is vindicated but if she cant FM is vindicated. I for one truly appreciates your cycling intellect. A strong team may be able to offer support its leader when chasing down a break or riding tempo, it cannot disrupt the pelotons chase of its leader, pro riders dominate or chase they don’t disrupt!


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Sep 2010)

Team Fiwip said:


> I for one truly appreciates your cycling intellect.



And I truly 'appreciates' your wonderful command of the English language, and all your worthwhile contributions to this forum. We are blessed by your presence: birds sing and the stars shine just a little brighter when you post here. Thank-you. Really.


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## BigSteev (22 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> I meant to mention this the other day, but no-one's talked about the gals and yet the uk have serious contenders with Emma Pooley and Lizzie Armistead.



Should be fine as long as their DS doesn't decree that they should all work for Nicole! 

Liz was in great form in the Ardeche.


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## raindog (23 Sep 2010)

BigSteev said:


> Liz was in great form in the Ardeche.


Indeed. Three consecutive stage wins!


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## Ball (24 Sep 2010)

http://saddlewithaview.blogspot.com/

Read my preview of the race! Feel free to comment/slate/support


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## rich p (24 Sep 2010)

According to this
http://www.livesportontv.com/cycling/all-fixtures

the women's road race is live on BBC3 from 04:00am. 
No mention of the men's race.

Anyone know the score?


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## raindog (24 Sep 2010)

Ball said:


> http://saddlewithaview.blogspot.com/
> 
> Read my preview of the race! Feel free to comment/slate/support


Nice blog - thanks.


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## philipbh (24 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> According to this
> http://www.livesport...ng/all-fixtures
> 
> the women's road race is live on BBC3 from 04:00am.
> ...




Eurosport TV Schedules have :

Mens Time Trial at 14:00 Thursday 30th September - 145min (Repeat at 20.45)

Mens Road race at 07.35 Sunday 3rd October - 190 Mins


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## Ball (24 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> Nice blog - thanks.



Thanks raindog


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## Team Fiwip (24 Sep 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> And I truly 'appreciates' your wonderful command of the English language, and all your worthwhile contributions to this forum. We are blessed by your presence: birds sing and the stars shine just a little brighter when you post here. Thank-you. Really.




Wow! I didnt fink yew card. That aside… I av always helled yew in high hesteem az the watchman of the watchmen but it terns owt your just a gramer Nazi. Btw when posting views on pro cycling a learn-ned man such as yourself shouldunt ignore Wittgenstein's 7th Proposition from the _Tractatus_.


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## montage (24 Sep 2010)

just had a look at the start list, some teams have 14 people!
Cav will have to be hands down the best rider there to win, and I am not just talking about the sprint. Teams of 14 vs teams of 3. If Cav does win then millar and hunt deserve a biscuit or two


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## Keith Oates (24 Sep 2010)

Much as I want Cav to win I think it's not so likely with the team numbers involved, but having Millar and Hunt as his two team mates means that he is getting the best that's available.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Flying_Monkey (25 Sep 2010)

Team Fiwip said:


> when posting views on pro cycling a learn-ned man such as yourself shouldunt ignore Wittgenstein's 7th Proposition from the _Tractatus_.



By the way you're using the reference here, it's pretty clear you don't get what Wittgenstein was actually saying... the 7th Proposition is not a normative statement, but a logical statement derived from previous propositions. if you follow the train of the 6th Proposition you will see where he's coming from - I direct you to 6.5 and 6.51 in particular. Now, I don't actually agree with several of the assumptions that underlie them from further back in the _Tractatus_, but enough of this philosophical banter... 

I'll tell you something - if you know so much about pro-cycling (and I am pretty certain you do know a thing or two), why don't you take a step back, stop the tedious trolling and draw on that knowledge to contribute a bit more positively to the forum? I don't claim to know much about pro-cycling, I simply enjoy the pleasure of watching it and discussing it in an entirely inconsequential way (read the sign on the door - and if you don't like it maybe you should find another venue for your particular, if not peculiar, talents).

So who do you fancy for the World's then?


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## raindog (25 Sep 2010)

montage said:


> just had a look at the start list, some teams have 14 people!
> Cav will have to be hands down the best rider there to win, and I am not just talking about the sprint. Teams of 14 vs teams of 3. If Cav does win then millar and hunt deserve a biscuit or two


Other, bigger teams should be able to control breaks in the peloton. All Cav has to do is sit tight and make it over those two lumps each lap. Don't think only having two team mates will really change much, it's the nature of the course that will scupper him more than anything else. Whatever, I reckon it's going to be great veiwing.


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## yello (25 Sep 2010)

Did someone mention Wittgenstein? It's not a circuit for him methinks. And since that bust up with Popper (I reckon it was a chain whip btw and not a poker) he's just not been a team player. So he'd get little or no support from either Popper or Russell. No, these are not philosophical problems we have here but merely ones of tactics.

Cavendish is in with a shout I reckon. I'm sure I recall reading recently that he described the circuit as 'not that hard'. Clearly, one has to take into account that Cavendish is a bit of a lippy sod but I'm sure he's also adept at playing the head games too; for both himself and to try and physce out others. What I'm saying is, I reckon he fancies his chances...

Interesting quotes from the above article...



> "It's not really an uphill finish, it is a flat finish in terms of professional cycling," he said.





> "That's going to make the race, I think that bridge."





> "We will just do our best, I've got two really strong guys with me and you know we will hopefully bank on the other teams wanting to do the same as we want to do," Cavendish said. "We will have to ride off the back of that. I think a lot of the other smaller teams want the same situation as we do so maybe it will work out like that."



A much more measured interview here



> The Isle Of Man sprinter says he can figure in world title medal calculations only if there is a reasonably big group together at the end of the 262.7km. *"It's a tough circuit, a hard circuit"*, he said. "But there's enough recovery not to be on your knees. I don't regard myself as one of the main contenders unless there's the possibility of a bunch sprint.



Bigger teams can control the pace/peleton but they can't control (as easily) who takes benefit. If Hunt and Millar can keep Cavendish in the frame (with our without the assistance of smaller teams) then I reckon Cavendish is right to think about his chances. 

I guess we're just going to see how it pans out, just play the conjecture game until then.


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## raindog (25 Sep 2010)

Interesting to see the difference of opinion between Bettini and Cipollini. Cipo has been criticising Bettini's selection saying a sprinter like Bennati should be included in the squad, but Bettini insists it's not a sprinter's circuit and guys like Cavendish won't be in contention at the end. Cipo's favourites for the win are Cav, Gilbert and Freire.
hmmmmm........

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/bettini-rejects-cipollinis-worlds-criticism


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## rich p (25 Sep 2010)

Monty, I believe the squads are 14 but the maximum in a team is 9 but I could be mistaken. It's still an unfair advantage in my opinion.


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## rich p (25 Sep 2010)

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/7594114/Cycling-on-television.html


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## Rassendyll (25 Sep 2010)

Team Fiwip said:


> Wise words, if Pooley can FM is vindicated but if she cant FM is vindicated. I for one truly appreciates your cycling intellect. A strong team may be able to offer support its leader when chasing down a break or riding tempo, it cannot disrupt the pelotons chase of its leader, pro riders dominate or chase they don’t disrupt!




I've seen riders disrupt a group plenty of times. Not coming through, sitting at the back. OK they don't actively get in the way but they don't contribute to the rhythm and as anyone knows from riding in a group that in itself is disruptive. Harder in the full peloton but if a group of pursuers tried to chase her down then they'll try to get a rider in there to make it less effective.


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## BigSteev (25 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Monty, I believe the squads are 14 but the maximum in a team is 9 but I could be mistaken. It's still an unfair advantage in my opinion.



Yes, that's right.


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## Sambu (26 Sep 2010)

Newb question. wy has cav only got 2 teamates?


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## lukesdad (26 Sep 2010)

Tactics in the worlds are always interesting and, history tells us that the Italians and Spanish usually have the edge, due mainly to superior numbers. last years worlds were a one off due to Fabs efforts to do the double which gave Evans the oppurtunity which he took wonderfully well. As to Cav s chances I think they are very very slim. Miller is a great road captain, but he needs some troops to bring his man to the line, he ll need outside help and its hard to see where that would come from. The US being really the only possible allies IMO, But only if the deal has been done before the race starts.

The Italians will send men up the road accompanied by a Spaniard a Frenchman a Belgian etc. So none of those teams will work on the front (unless to slow the pace down ). The only fly in that particular ointment would be if a sprinter from one of the smaller teams got into a break. The bigger names will keep their powder dry. My own choice ?.... Hard one as ever, but, I d keep an eye on Tommy if ever their was an oppurtunist to pull it off its Tommy.


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## rich p (26 Sep 2010)

Sambu said:


> Newb question. wy has cav only got 2 teamates?




It's all to do with how many points your nation has racked up during the past year in pro races. Last year, Cav and Wiggins got enough ranking points with the MSR and TdF to entitle GB to 9 riders. This year we only have Cav's stage wins so we only get 3.


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## raindog (26 Sep 2010)

lukesdad said:


> Miller is a great road captain, but he needs some troops to bring his man to the line, he ll need outside help and its hard to see where that would come from. The US being really the only possible allies IMO, But only if the deal has been done before the race starts.


I don't think a deal needs to be done. The teams with sprinters like GB (Cav), USA (Farrar), Belgium (Gilbert) or Spain (Freire) will naturaly work together to pull any breaks back. But in the end it's still the two steep hills and the uphill finish that will decide everything. Can't bloody wait!


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## Skip Madness (26 Sep 2010)

Why aren't Eurosport showing any of it live? That means I'm going to have to watch it on the bloody BBC (please change the commentators, BBC). I'm not sticking around to watch it delayed just so that I can get the Eurosport commentary.

For a minute I thought we weren't going to get the two days of the year of proper live women's cycling.

I'm especially hopeful for the British women in the road race. I know it's not a pancake-flat course, but the fact that it ain't Mendrisio should mean that the likes of Colclough and Martin can stick around for a while, and Armitstead has a genuine though outside chance at the victory.


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## Ball (26 Sep 2010)

Lukesdad, who do you mean by Tommy, Tom Boonen?

Also, there is coverage on Eurosport, definitely. I think they're showing delayed coverage early in the morning, as well as highlights later in the day.


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## rich p (26 Sep 2010)

Ball said:


> Lukesdad, who do you mean by Tommy, Tom Boonen?
> 
> Also, there is coverage on Eurosport, definitely. I think they're showing delayed coverage early in the morning, as well as highlights later in the day.




Voeckler, I would think


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## rich p (26 Sep 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> Why aren't Eurosport showing any of it live? That means I'm going to have to watch it on the bloody BBC (please change the commentators, BBC). I'm not sticking around to watch it delayed just so that I can get the Eurosport commentary.




If you look at the link I posted Skip, I think that there is the final hour or so live on Eurosport. Not ideal I agree and having to suffer the miscalls of L&S may be too painful. 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/7594114/Cycling-on-television.html


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## Skip Madness (26 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Not ideal I agree and having to suffer the miscalls of L&S may be too painful.


BBC usually means Hugh Porter...


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## lukesdad (26 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> I don't think a deal needs to be done. The teams with sprinters like GB (Cav), USA (Farrar), Belgium (Gilbert) or Spain (Freire) will naturaly work together to pull any breaks back. But in the end it's still the two steep hills and the uphill finish that will decide everything. Can't bloody wait!


I dont think they will want to take Cav to the line, do you ?


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## yello (27 Sep 2010)

Cav talks himself up...

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cavendish-warns-his-world-championship-rivals


You've got to laugh sometimes...



> Cavendish’s claimed that one specific team manager "tries to f**k with me at every possible opportunity, which is ironic considering he was a sprinter and I actually looked up to him. But now I have no respect for him." The situation has got so bad, Cavendish claimed that it's affecting the way he sprints. *Though he insisted he will not play similar mind games with his rivals.*








The guy's complex, perhaps even damaged. I read it as mind games but perhaps he's genuine. Perhaps he's not the sharpest tool in the box, and just perhaps he doesn't see the irony in what he says.


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## yello (27 Sep 2010)

lukesdad said:


> I dont think they will want to take Cav to the line, do you ?



They'll want to get their own sprinters there, should it come to a bunch sprint. I think that's the point being made. 

Maybe this course is actually going to be a really good one. It's not an out-and-out sprinters course yet sprinters don't rule themselves out of it. There's probably, equally, a number of roulers who fancy their chances on this one, should things pan out for them. I'm actually becoming quite interested in watching this one. It might turn out to an intriguing race; with tactics, circumstance and even luck playing equal measures.


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## rich p (27 Sep 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> BBC usually means Hugh Porter...




Oh Gawd, I'd forgotten about him.  

This is a classic Cavism! Hilarious!

_Cavendish has never been afraid to speak his mind in interviews and blasted a journalist for daring to accuse him of holding onto a team car in the mountains at the Tour de France._

_"Are you f**king kidding me? If I go back, let alone if I'm dropped, I have two race officials, TV cameras, an ice-cream van and a marching band following me. How the f**k am I going to hold on to a car?” he asks_


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## Noodley (27 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> _"Are you f**king kidding me? If I go back, let alone if I'm dropped, I have two race officials, TV cameras, an ice-cream van and a marching band following me. How the f**k am I going to hold on to a car?” he asks_


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## yello (27 Sep 2010)

Yep, the lad's still got a scally turn of phrase! Could have done with being 'a _f*cking_ marching band' but otherwise classic!


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## Flying_Monkey (27 Sep 2010)

I think the other teams will soon realise that, like the Incredible Hulk, winding up Cav only seem to make him stronger.


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## raindog (27 Sep 2010)

Except now he's seen the course he thinks it's harder than he first thought.
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/5804/Mark-Cavendish-backtracks-on-World-Championship-chances.aspx


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## Flying_Monkey (27 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> Except now he's seen the course he thinks it's harder than he first thought.
> http://www.velonatio...ip-chances.aspx



Oh, I don't think he'll win this year. Next year is more likely given the type of course. I meant in general.


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## Skip Madness (28 Sep 2010)

Profile for tomorrow's women's ITT:







And the start list:

Verónica Leal (Mexico)
Kimberley Yap (Malaysia)
Chanpeng Nontasin (Thailand)
Kathryn Bertine (St Kitts and Nevis)
Lesya Kalitovska (Ukraine)
Valeria Muller (Argentina)
Mariana Mohammad (Malaysia)
Tatiana Panina (Belarus)
Yelena Antonova (Kazakhstan)
Dinah Chan (Singapore)
Svitlana Galyuk (Ukraine)
Patricia Schwager (Switzerland)
Shara Gillow (Australia)
Tara Whitten (Canada)
Grace Verbeke (Belgium)
Doris Schweizer (Switzerland)
Rosa Bravo (Spain)
Monrudee Chapookham (Thailand)
Evelyn Stevens (United States)
Melissa Holt (New Zealand)
Emma Johansson (Sweden)
Katazina Sosna (Lithuania)
Tatiana Guderzo (Italy)
Anne Samplonius (Canada)
Charlotte Becker (Germany)
Belen López (Spain)
Jeannie Longo (France)
Vicki Whitelaw (Australia)
Tatiana Antoshina (Russia)
Emilia Fahlin (Sweden)
Emma Pooley (Great Britain)
Noemi Cantele (Italy)
Regina Bruins (Netherlands)
Amber Neben (United States)
Olga Zabelinskaya (Russia)
Linda Villumsen (New Zealand)
Alexis Rhodes (Australia)
Judith Arndt (Germany)

Embarrass yourselves me with your predictions, comrades:

(1) Arndt (2) Whitelaw (3) Neben

Looking forward to this, if not the early start. 0550-0810 on the BBC red button, or some time in the afternoon on Eurosport.


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## Flying_Monkey (28 Sep 2010)

With that course, Pooley had got to be in with a shot - I am being hopeful with 1. Pooley, 2. Neben, 3. Arndt.


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## dmoan (28 Sep 2010)

I'll go for Pooley, Whitten, Longo*

For the men's race, I have a sneaking feeling that Filippo Pozzato might just pull this one off for the Italians ...



*what the hell - I've got a thing for mad Jeannie!


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## zacklaws (28 Sep 2010)

yello said:


> Cav talks himself up...
> 
> http://www.cyclingne...pionship-rivals
> 
> The guy's complex, perhaps even damaged. I read it as mind games but perhaps he's genuine. Perhaps he's not the sharpest tool in the box, and just perhaps he doesn't see the irony in what he says.




It looks like Cav's had a rethink:-

http://www.melbourne...-display&id=635


He should have gone onto Bikeroute toaster or Bikehike and plotted the course beforehand like us mere mortals


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## BigSteev (28 Sep 2010)

Whitelaw - Arndt - Pooley


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## raindog (29 Sep 2010)

Phinney takes the under 23s as expected. Dowsett was matching his time but rolled a tub off his rear rim. Slap on the wrist for his mechanic.

1 Taylor Phinney (United States Of America) 0:42:50.29 2 Luke Durbridge (Australia) 0:00:01.90 3 Marcel Kittel (Germany) 0:00:24.01 4 Nélson Oliveira (Portugal) 0:00:27.96 5 Rohan Dennis (Australia) 0:00:46.87


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## BigSteev (29 Sep 2010)

2 out of 3 ain't bad!

Woop!


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## raindog (29 Sep 2010)

Pooley takes the ladies TT. 
Fantastic Jeannie Longo in 5th - she's almost 52!!

1	Emma Pooley (Great Britain) 0:32:48.44
2	Judith Arndt (Germany) 0:33:03.61
3	Linda Melanie Villumsen (New Zealand) 0:33:04.24
4	Amber Neben (United States Of America) 0:33:26.10
5	Jeannie Longo-Ciprelli (France) 0:33:32.38


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## BigSteev (29 Sep 2010)

Love Emma's Cérvelo earrings.


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## Skip Madness (29 Sep 2010)

Awesome stuff there. No question mark for me over whether or not she was the rider of the season already, but what a lovely little cherry to plonk on the top. The most impressive thing was the time she continued to take out in the second half of the course. Disappointed with Whitelaw, pleasantly surprised by Longo.

Can't wait for Saturday morning now.

And yes, I noticed those Cervélo earrings!


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## rich p (29 Sep 2010)

Well done to Pooley indeed.
Did GB only have one entrant in this?


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## Skip Madness (29 Sep 2010)

Yeah - Emma Trott was down to ride initially I think but for one reason or another didn't make it in the end.


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## Genman (29 Sep 2010)

raindog said:


> Pooley takes the ladies TT.
> Fantastic Jeannie Longo in 5th - she's almost 52!!
> 
> 1 Emma Pooley (Great Britain) 0:32:48.44
> ...


Pooley's win wasn't all plain sailing apparently.


*http://tinyurl.com/37kwwob*


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## raindog (29 Sep 2010)

Genman said:


> Pooley's win wasn't all plain sailing apparently.


Yes, that was mentioned on CN during the race.
On another note, she praised the fact that team radios are banned this year "You just have to go out and race flat out" or words to that effect.


----------



## Flying_Monkey (29 Sep 2010)

Woo-hoo for Pooley! Bad luck for Dowsett though I suspect Phinney would have taken it anyway.


----------



## Origamist (29 Sep 2010)

Great result for Pooley...

Should/could the thread title have **Spoiler** added?! Serves me right for checking this thread I suppose...


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## rich p (29 Sep 2010)

Origamist said:


> Great result for Pooley...
> 
> Should/could the thread title have **Spoiler** added?! Serves me right for checking this thread I suppose...




Is it on the box somewhen Matt?


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## Origamist (29 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Is it on the box somewhen Matt?




I was hoping that I had recorded it via the BBC red button this morning. I might have cocked up though!


----------



## the_mikey (29 Sep 2010)

It was on the BBC interactive channel on freeview this morning, although there's no way to record it via freesat, it's not on the EPG.  

Here's the freeview schedule:

Thursday BBCi: 30/9/10: 3.50am - 8.40am - Mens elite time trial.
Saturday BBCi: 2/10/10: 3.50am - 8.00am - Womens elite road race.


While it's not on the freeview EPG, on the BBC website it says the mens elite road race is on from 10.00pm on saturday night until 6am ish sunday morning (sounds a bit vague to me), while the freeview epg says it's showing Moto GP....

If you want to catch up on the u23's race, then Eurosport has highlights, if you really want to catch it live, then the only place I can find it on satellite is RaiSport2 on Hotbird.


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## rich p (29 Sep 2010)

It's on Eurosport now


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## zacklaws (29 Sep 2010)

the_mikey said:


> While it's not on the freeview EPG, on the BBC website it says the mens elite road race is on from 10.00pm on saturday night until 6am ish sunday morning (sounds a bit vague to me), while the freeview epg says it's showing Moto GP....



It shows up on my Freeview EPG on Ch301, I set my recorder 2 weeks ago to record, today and tomorrow.


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## Keith Oates (29 Sep 2010)

It's a good result for Pooley and the margin of the win was impressive, now for the road race!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## raindog (30 Sep 2010)

Millar's on a flyer - about 5 seconds down on Fab at the mo.


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## rich p (30 Sep 2010)

Cancellara smashed it but Millar was superb to finish second. Well done old man!


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## raindog (30 Sep 2010)

rich p said:


> Cancellara smashed it but Millar was superb to finish second. Well done old man!


Indeed. Probably the ride of his life.

1	Fabian Cancellara (Switzerland) 0:58:09
2	David Millar (Great Britain) 0:59:11
3	Tony Martin (Germany) 0:59:21
4	Richie Porte (Australia) 0:59:28
5	Michael Rogers (Australia) 1:00:3


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## Keith Oates (30 Sep 2010)

Great result for Millar, it will make his cycling year into a happy period. Now what's he going to do in the Road Race!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## yello (30 Sep 2010)

That's a superb result for Millar and one that I frankly wouldn't have expected. There's life in those legs yet!

How much use is he going to be to Cav now?!  Maybe team GB's priorities have been illustrated?


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## raindog (30 Sep 2010)

yello said:


> How much use is he going to be to Cav now?!  Maybe team GB's priorities have been illustrated?



hmmmm....this is what he says about "the hills"



> "I felt good. I felt great on the first lap. My tactic was the opposite of Fabian's, it was to attack the first lap and then hang on for dear life. And that's basically what I did. I felt great and even at the first lap with the three climbs, by the end of the last climb I was coming up that the first time and I thought, 'Oh god this is going to hurt the next time round', and it did. It was very hard and I think we can safely say that in the road race that is going to be a hard climb. We suffered enormously just going up it twice. It is a hard course."


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## Flying_Monkey (30 Sep 2010)

Well, I didn't predict Millar getting on the podium. My top three would have been Cancellara, Martin, Porte, given recent form. That was a fine ride.


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## Genman (30 Sep 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Well, I didn't predict Millar getting on the podium. My top three would have been Cancellara, Martin, Porte, given recent form. That was a fine ride.



Amazing!
How about a prediction on 6th 7th 8th in the road race before the results are published to the entire world.
Or were you being ironic, or joking maybe?


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## Flying_Monkey (1 Oct 2010)

Genman said:


> Amazing!
> How about a prediction on 6th 7th 8th in the road race before the results are published to the entire world.
> Or were you being ironic, or joking maybe?



Do you have anything interesting to say or are you just here to troll?


----------



## rich p (1 Oct 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Do you have anything interesting to say or are you just here to troll?




You have to see the funny side though, FM! Post-race predictions are usually pretty accurate in my experience


----------



## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

*Under 23 RR
*

*Situation (after lap 7):*

1 Moreno Moser (Italy)
2 Alex Dowsett (Great Britain) @ 43 seconds
3 Peloton at 1:14 minutes




COME ON ALEX!


----------



## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

Well the two hills failed to break up the under 23 race which ended in a bunch sprint of about 40 riders. Looks like it's Cav's to lose on sunday. 

Michael Matthews (Australia)
John Degenkolb (Germany)
Taylor Phinney (USA)

That Phinney seems like a real all-rounder?


----------



## yello (1 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> Looks like it's Cav's to lose on sunday



Put the pressure on why don't you!  You're ok though, I don't suspect he reads this forum...

Where'd Dowsett finish?


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## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

Hardly matters in a bunch of 40 with only three medals to hand out. Mind you apparently there are now two riders sharing 4th place, so the bronze will need to be chopped in two.


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## yello (1 Oct 2010)

So he finished in the bunch then. That's all I wanted to know since the full results weren't up on Cycling News.


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## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

Sorry yello - don't know for sure. I just assumed he finished with the main bunch. 
Luke Rowe was 11th.


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## yello (1 Oct 2010)

What's with the bouff Fabian? Or is that a case of helmet hair? 

http://www.cyclingne...-tt-king/143484

(it appears I can't post images, only link to them!)


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## rich p (1 Oct 2010)

yello said:


> What's with the bouff Fabian? Or is that a case of helmet hair?
> 
> http://www.cyclingne...-tt-king/143484
> 
> (it appears I can't post images, only link to them!)




If only he was German he could be having a bad Herr day.


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## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

that's quite a mop


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## Keith Oates (1 Oct 2010)

yello said:


> Put the pressure on why don't you!  You're ok though, I don't suspect he reads this forum...
> 
> Where'd Dowsett finish?




Dowsett was DNF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## rich p (1 Oct 2010)

If you're done in and liable to finish way down there's little point in flogging round the last lap I guess


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## rich p (1 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> Well the two hills failed to break up the under 23 race which ended in a bunch sprint of about 40 riders. Looks like it's Cav's to lose on sunday.
> 
> Michael Matthews (Australia)
> John Degenkolb (Germany)
> ...




Even if it sticks together I can't see Cav doing it. I know he can get up smallish climbs but has he ever won an uphill sprint?


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## Keith Oates (1 Oct 2010)

To go back to the mens TT race, Millar didn't look so happy during the post race presentations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!






 




 David Millar (Great Britain) on the podium with his silver medal


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## Flying_Monkey (1 Oct 2010)

rich p said:


> You have to see the funny side though, FM! Post-race predictions are usually pretty accurate in my experience



Sure, if it was anyone else I would be amused. But not from some pathetic parasitic stalker.

And believe it or not, it wasn't a 'post-race prediction' - I was just reporting what I had been thinking before the race but didn't post - I know it's hard to believe but I don't actually post everything that I am thinking here! If you look at the Women's TT, my predictions (which are a matter of record here) were almost as accurate. But that's hardly anything to do with any particular talent of mine: TTs are more predictable than road races because there are far fewer variables. I don't think anyone of my limited levels of knowledge will have a hope with the road races.


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## philipbh (1 Oct 2010)

Keith Oates said:


> To go back to the mens TT race, Millar didn't look so happy during the post race presentations!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!




He was grinning like a lunatic during the Swiss National Anthem, I thought


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## Skip Madness (1 Oct 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> And believe it or not, it wasn't a 'post-race prediction' - I was just reporting what I had been thinking before the race but didn't post.


Yeah, it wasn't really a difficult time trial to get close to calling right, was it. I would also have gone Cancellara-Martin-Porte. Cancellara-Martin because those are the two best time triallists in the world, and Porte because he's good, in form and the course favoured him more than others. It's likely that Martin would have got second had it not been for the puncture.

Women's road race in the morning. I'm going with Vos-Johansson-Armitstead, but there are so many possibilities that this one's completely up in the air.

Yeah, I'm just adding a caveat to excuse my usual shoot predictions.


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## rich p (1 Oct 2010)

Flying_Monkey said:


> Sure, if it was anyone else I would be amused. But not from some pathetic parasitic stalker.



I know! I was just poking fun - I'd seen your spat with the dick in P&L!

Vos for the womens but I know nothing.


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## raindog (1 Oct 2010)

You can see the last couple of ks of today's race here
http://www.sporza.be/cm/sporza/videozone/MG_sportnieuws/MG_wielrennen/1.874634


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## yello (1 Oct 2010)

philipbh said:


> He was grinning like a lunatic during the Swiss National Anthem, I thought



Is it The Birdy Song?


----------



## yello (2 Oct 2010)

Good result for Nicole Cook (the forgotten women of British cycling?) this morning. She'll be smiling. Armitstead in 9th... not that those 2 final statements are related in any way.


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## yello (2 Oct 2010)

Just reading the text through from the race, it sounds like it was an exciting finish. And maybe I've done someone a disservice (no surprises there!) and Armitstead was working for Cooke...



> 16:09 EST They were joined by a Russian rider but Elizabeth Armitstead (Great Britain) wouldn't work and the trio has decided to sit up.



She gave it a darned good go, did Nicole, and it nearly came off got her.


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## chevin (2 Oct 2010)

yello said:


> Good result for Nicole Cook (the forgotten women of British cycling?) this morning. She'll be smiling.



I doubt it - it looked distinctly like she blew a medal, possibly even a gold.


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## raindog (2 Oct 2010)

yello said:


> Good result for Nicole Cook (the forgotten women of British cycling?) this morning. She'll be smiling.


Good result? Is this a joke yello? She finished outside the medals and she'll be smiling?


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## raindog (2 Oct 2010)

last kilometer
http://www.sporza.be/cm/sporza/videozone/MG_sportnieuws/MG_wielrennen/1.875442


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

It _was_ a good result for Cooke. Her form has been unknown and she hasn't had much top-level racing this year. Yeah, she nearly pulled off the win, but she didn't do a great deal wrong losing it.

Great ride by Bronzini and Leleivyte to hang in there while the other sprinters faltered, but it took it out of Leleivyte whereas Bronzini had enough left and judged her sprint perfectly. Superb display by the whole Italian team, especially in the first half of the race, and a richly deserving victor.


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## the_mikey (2 Oct 2010)

It was a great race, Emma Pooley was working hard on the last few laps. BBC News issued a report claiming Nicole Cooke won the gold medal this morning! It was corrected some minutes later however...


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## raindog (2 Oct 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> It _was_ a good result for Cooke.


Yes but Pooley has been by far our strongest rider all year - probably the best female rider in the world, and I can't help thinking that if she'd been left to do her thing on that last hill things might have been different, but it looks as if Cooke was chosen as leader for some reason. Team GB should've had a medal today - no doubt about it.


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## yello (2 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> Good result? Is this a joke yello? She finished outside the medals and she'll be smiling?



Ah, guilty of selective quoting there my friend. You chopped off my final sentence! I suggested the smile because she finished ahead of Armitstead! 

But, yes, I think it was a good result for her. For exactly the reasons SM gives above. Also, I think she's had a rough time these last couple of years and it seems, imho, that people have forgotten her due to the successes of Lizzie and Emma Pooley. So, I think she'll be happy to have 'shown' in the race, put in a good performance and remind people that she is still around.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> Yes but Pooley has been by far our strongest rider all year - probably the best female rider in the world, and I can't help thinking that if she'd been left to do her thing on that last hill things might have been different, but it looks as if Cooke was chosen as leader for some reason. Team GB should've had a medal today - no doubt about it.



I really don't think Pooley could have got enough on the climb to hold off the big threats, and there was the real danger if she had tried to power away that she would blow Cooke and Armitstead out the back completely. It didn't work out for Britain, but I don't think there was much more they could have done.


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## raindog (2 Oct 2010)

I suppose you're right Skip. I'm still disappointed though.

These hills aren't turning out to be as bad as we all thought are they? I reckon it'll come down to a massed sprint after all tomorrow. Going to be a good race I think.


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## yello (2 Oct 2010)

I figured your disappointment was the reason for the  emoticon raindog. Shows your passionate about your sport, I like that. Casual observers like myself blow in and out with the wind.

Do people think tomorrow will pan out like that last 2 days, i.e. a bunch sprint? Though, actually, just watching today's last km it wasn't really that. Cooke and Arndt nearly held off the chasers, and then that chase group was only 3. The rest of the bunch was some 5m back. I suspect the big teams will have the upper hand here and it could be a high paced war of attrition. I reckon Cavendish will be doing incredibly well to stay up there to contest. But, frankly, I have no idea I just hope it's going to be a good one.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Fantastic race. I'm just recovering. 


I'm with you skip. I think GB rode superbly well to their strengths. I think Emma knew she could not win in a finish with anyone else. If she had gone on her own, everyone else would have chased and so she had no winning chance and that was always the case on this course, even before she won the TT. After the TT result, she was never ever going to win. The big move to get a group away with Emma and Lizzie with 3 to go was sparked by Sharon. It was a good idea, well executed but did not work. Come the last time up, when it got real hard, Lizzie was not competitive enough to get into a realistic shout of getting onto the podium. Winning sprints in stage races just prior to the World Champs, riding for the dominant trade team is entirely different from being in the final shake up at this level. I actually thought it was game over for GB with 1 lap to go. However, I was writing off Cooke.

That was superb by Cooke. The lone break was to be there on the final hill as anything happened. It did, she was. Emma then rode shotgun as best she could. Lizzie got back up. Cooke and Arndt was a lot closer call than Porter was calling. This was a long uphill finish - exactly the type Arndt has won out of small groups. Arndt and Cooke were closer matched and both knew that giving too much would give the other the title. That is the way it fell. But even so they had done enough until.......

Team Canada decided to get their lead sprinter in Gold medal position. Canada buried themselves. They did it entirely for nothing. There is no accounting for idiots. They were riding for nobody.
They put the chasing group back in the hunt but it still needed a major commitment from somebody else.
In 2007 Vos beat Bronzini in the sprint for Silver, after Vos had done a modest amount of work, but Beltman had done the majority. Vos obviously made the same call today.

It was a fabulous race and the margins were slim. Arndt was 5th with not a bike length between her and Cooke. Cooke could not have gone much earlier. Vos could not have gone any later, she only just got past Cooke. Vos was gifted her chance by idiot riding by the Canadians. Bronzini was gifted the World title by Vos having to go when she did. It was a single tactic that was wholly reliant on several others doing things that played out exactly for her to put the final card on the table. It wasn't a game of poker because Bronzini had no other game to play, unlike Arndt, Cooke and Vos.


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## yello (2 Oct 2010)

Welcome resal, I've not read your posts before. That reads like an analysis of the type I like to read and I can learn from. Thanks 

It shows me the complexities of bike racing; the tactics, strengths, card playing... and the luck... and how all of them come together in random ways and amounts.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

Personally I enjoyed the Canadian's desperate attempt to drag it back. They didn't have anyone likely to win, but they knew doing something meant more of a chance than doing nothing.

The Dutch really squandered it by putting the whole team behind Vos/Wild. Had Loes Gunnewijk, Chantal Blaak, Regina Bruins, Adrie Visser, Noortje Tabak or Annemiek Van Vleuten (wait, that's the entire team except for Vos and Wild) got into a break, they'd have had (a) a genuine chance with riders who can win from a breakaway (who would want to take any of that lot to the line) and (b) an excuse to let other teams worry about the work and take the pressure off themselves. As it was, the other squads were happy to let them do as much as they could get away with. Chantal Blaak was absolutely, monstrously immense in that role, but she needn't have had to be.

That's where the Italians are consistently better - riders for all eventualities making sure they're all as useful as possible.


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## chevin (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> Fantastic race. I'm just recovering.


Agreed!



> But even so they had done enough until.......
> Team Canada decided to get their lead sprinter in Gold medal position. Canada buried themselves. They did it entirely for nothing.



and again.



> Arndt and Cooke were closer matched and both knew that giving too much would give the other the title.


Exactly - but by doing what they did, they both lost it. Obviously can't tell what was going on internally (physically, mentally) with Cooke, but it looked like she initially missed Arndt's jump (who had previously just taken her foot off the gas momentarily, but that's just enough with only 10-13 seconds to play with), and then when she got back on, she left it marginally too late to go past. Again, only a fraction, but that's enough. Whether she'd have still won is obviously uncertain, but much more likely that she'd have at least been amongst the medals. Being hyperpicky perhaps, but that's what the margins are at this level. And maybe it was all or nothing anyway. Not trying to be critical of Cooke who rode with real guts, just trying to review. Hindsight's a wonderful thing!



> It wasn't a game of poker because Bronzini had no other game to play, unlike Arndt, Cooke and Vos.


But she played what cards she had to perfection.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

The Dutch were also doing everything absolutely right. Wild wasn't supported, she just wasn't ever going to get to the finish with anyone who was riding for the gold medal. She was in the team just in case something crazy went on and it was a bunch sprint. She had nothing to contribute to the collective, so she did nothing. Getting herself round was her job. The Dutch rightly supported Vos and knew that the race would be allowed to go away from them by every other nation because they had the strongest team. when the gap to the American went up, every one else could play poker with the Dutch. They started to reel it in when they were close enough to the finish to preserve Vos and Van Vlueten for the finale. Then they could do a 1 - 2 on any other pairing. The only other team that could have been expected to contribute was GB, but GB was rightly seen as a 1 trick pony - Emma attempting to drive to the finish on the final lap. That was going to be unlikely so GB would not be expected to write down their chances by contributing to the modest chase needed.

Vlueten's puncture just before the penultimate hill was a game changer. As soon as that happened Vos' chances of a win became very slim. If Vos was in a break in which there were 2 riders from a single nation, it would be nearly impossible to win. With a rider up the road, everyone else who would be beaten by Vos in a normal sprint would then force Vos to do the lion's share of the chasing. Vos somehow needed to get in an elite break with only single riders from nations and yet other riders would want to hang back until their 2nd rider rejoined. 

That change of requirement was going to be difficult to effect with only 2/3rds of a lap left.


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## Keith Oates (2 Oct 2010)

I've only read the Cyclingnews report so can't give much in the way of a comment except to say a thankyou to the previous posters, it's good to have knowledgeable members of the forum giving their comments. As for Nicole, I'm happy to see that she is still a major force, even after a quiet year, I only hope she can get into a good team next year and get for herself and the fans some good results!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

chevin said:


> Agreed!
> 
> 
> But she played what cards she had to perfection.



No. that is wrong. Bronzini had only one card and could only play it once and that card could only be played at one point in the race. That is not smart, it is just facts and the outcome is related to other events totally out of control of Bronzini.

The difference in pressures during the race on selecting option choices open to Vos & Van Vleuten, Arndt & Worrack, Cantele & Guderzo, Stevens & Neben, Pooley & Cooke and a last 200m sprinter, is enormous.


----------



## HLaB (2 Oct 2010)

Keith Oates said:


> I've only read the Cyclingnews report so can't give much in the way of a comment except to say a thankyou to the previous posters, it's good to have knowledgeable members of the forum giving their comments. As for Nicole, I'm happy to see that she is still a major force, even after a quiet year, I only hope she can get into a good team next year and get for herself and the fans some good results!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Can you get BBC where you are ? their video may be blocked though (I think there's an IT work around but I'm unsure how its done); You'll probably get something here but it'll be in Flemish


----------



## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> Vlueten's puncture just before the penultimate hill was a game changer.



It was certainly ill-timed and bad luck, but I wouldn't call it a game changer. Vos still had at least Gunnewijk, Tabak and Bruins with her making the Dutch team probably still the strongest of any. Gunnewijk would have fancied her chances against Cooke and Arndt (say), Bruins would have been good for solo attacks. They had cards which they didn't play, and they had them all day.


----------



## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> No. that is wrong. Bronzini had only one card and could only play it once and that card could only be played at one point in the race. That is not smart, it is just facts and the outcome is related to other events totally out of control of Bronzini.



Bronzini only had one card, but her team had many. Carretta tried, then Berlato tried, then Guderzo tried, then Cantele tried, and then when they had one lap left and Bronzini was still there they didn't attack so that she could stay in contention.


----------



## raindog (2 Oct 2010)

ha - someone on another forum agrees with me that Pooley should have been allowed to do her thing, and David Harmon thought Emma should have gone on the penultimate lap when she had a chance, but it looks as if GB team tactics were centered around Cooke today. Never forget that Pooley won the GP de Plouay a few weeks ago which is a similar circuit with a very stiff climb near the end. I'm still not convinced she wouldn't have won today. 
Still, no point in moaning about it, what's bloody done is done.


----------



## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> It was certainly ill-timed and bad luck, but I wouldn't call it a game changer. Vos still had at least Gunnewijk, Tabak and Bruins with her making the Dutch team probably still the strongest of any. Gunnewijk would have fancied her chances against Cooke and Arndt (say), Bruins would have been good for solo attacks. They had cards which they didn't play, and they had them all day.



Skip, events showed, regardless of what Gunnewijk may or may not have thought about her chances with Cooke or Arndt or Bruins enjoying doing solo attacks, they just were not in a position to do them. Arndt and Cooke were somewhere up the road. The Dutch burnt up Blak but not the others. The talk of Lizzie being in with a chance of the sprint was again, just that - talk. Van Vleuten has shown many times this year, she is the foil to Vos and together they are far stronger than the sum of their parts.


----------



## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

HLaB said:


> Can you get BBC where you are ? their video may be blocked though (I think there's an IT work around but I'm unsure how its done); You'll probably get something here but it'll be in Flemish


I'll try to get the final lap on to YouTube by the end of the day. Although it'll mean having to put up with Giorgia Bronzini being called Guderzo by Hugh Porter.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> Skip, events showed, regardless of what Gunnewijk may or may not have thought about her chances with Cooke or Arndt or Bruins enjoying doing solo attacks, they just were not in a position to do them. Arndt and Cooke were somewhere up the road.


But if they'd been trying not just to bring back attacks but instigate and follow them then they would probably have been up the road, too. They were in a position to do that all day until they let Arndt and Cooke get away. For that they have only themselves to blame. Ultimately they still had a great chance with Vos, but they'd have exponentially bettered their odds by taking the race to the other teams. The Italians only decided to settle for a sprint when they'd tried attacking and knew that Bronzini would still get to the end.


----------



## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> Bronzini only had one card, but her team had many. Carretta tried, then Berlato tried, then Guderzo tried, then Cantele tried, and then when they had one lap left and Bronzini was still there they didn't attack so that she could stay in contention.



We aren't in a position to know. You can propose that they elected not to attack to keep the race together for Bronzini. You may be right. My view of their attacks is that they just didn't have enough in the tank today, on a course that was flat with 2 vicious, but short hills, to do anything of any real tactical value. More usefully, they may well have towed Bronzini back on when she was dropped, but rightly, we rarely had shots which could have shown this. 

Again this is not a complex race decision, it is the final position. If you can't do anything yourself, at least do something for somebody who might.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

My point is that the Italians gave themselves every chance, using a multi-talented team to chisel away at different areas. The Dutch had a similarly multi-talented team and had the opportunity to do the same but they didn't.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Skip Madness said:


> My point is that the Italians gave themselves every chance, using a multi-talented team to chisel away at different areas. The Dutch had a similarly multi-talented team and had the opportunity to do the same but they didn't.



I understood your point. My counter is that the position of the Italian team and Dutch team, this championships, is entirely different. One has to rely on events and the other has the World number 1 and hot favourite, backed by riders that mean that every other nation can play them off. A failure to appreciate that allows for only a very shallow appreciation of what was a fantastic race, with a surprising result, that will keep us glued to our screens in other races. No matter how much out of it you are, there is always a chance of a win. 

The Italians have been highly successful at the Women's World Championship road race in recent years. Last year and in 2007 the Italians deserved the win their elegant and well crafted team-work deserved. In 2010 they achieved the win via fortune placed in their path by the stupidity of others. The Italian team did not have the riders to have options in terms of tactics. They rode a simple race.

That race was a fantastic tactical battle, that with 1km to go left 5 riders all with a very genuine chance of winning. 4 had complex permutations to keep re-processing throughout the race. 1 had the most simple tactics. It is why road racing is so much more than any other discipline in cycling.


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## chevin (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> No. that is wrong. Bronzini had only one card and could only play it once and that card could only be played at one point in the race. That is not smart, it is just facts and the outcome is related to other events totally out of control of Bronzini.
> 
> The difference in pressures during the race on selecting option choices open to Vos & Van Vleuten, Arndt & Worrack, Cantele & Guderzo, Stevens & Neben, Pooley & Cooke and a last 200m sprinter, is enormous.



I'd agree about the differing pressures - making decisions is far more difficult than having to simply play the one card you've got. But this is where it differs - in cards, you simply have one card and play it; there's no skill in the playing. But Bronzini still had to do what she could do. And she did - she was there when it mattered, and sprinted as it mattered. Timing was spot on. On the other hand.....a hand well played, but still not sufficiently perfect to make it happen. By the time they got to the last 500m, Cooke didn't have many, if any, more cards to play than Bronzini.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> I understood your point. My counter is that the position of the Italian team and Dutch team, this championships, is entirely different. One has to rely on events


_Bronzini_ had to rely on events, but Italy didn't. If Bronzini hadn't hung around, Cantele and Guderzo would have had their own chances.



> and the other has the World number 1 and hot favourite, *backed by riders that mean that every other nation can play them off.*


I don't really understand what the bit in bold means.



> In 2010 they achieved the win via fortune placed in their path by the stupidity of others.


I presume you're referring to Canada? If Bronzini was reliant on Canada for the win, surely Vos was equally reliant on them for second? How is that good tactical nous from the Netherlands? And as I said before, I don't accept that Canada were stupid - they were desperate and did the only thing that could give them a chance of winning anything.



> The Italian team did not have the riders to have options in terms of tactics. They rode a simple race.


The Netherlands rode the simplest race of all - "everyone try to get it back together for Marianne" when they had an embarrassment of riches for a course like today's. Italy were hopeful of Bronzini surviving, but they weren't relying on it.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

(No idea how this will turn out - cannot get the multi-quote editor up!)



Skip Madness said:


> _Bronzini_ had to rely on events, but Italy didn't. If Bronzini hadn't hung around, Cantele and Guderzo would have had their own chances.


 They did indeed have chances. However, as their form on the day became apparent, it was obvious that those chances were very slim. The riders, unlike us viewers, would have been in the position of knowing that before the race and able to form their tactics appropriately prior to the race.

I said :"..and the other has the World number 1 and hot favourite, *backed by riders that mean that every other nation can play them off.* .."





Skip Madness said:


> I don't really understand what the bit in bold means.



The last two number 1's since 2003 have been Cooke and Vos. Vos, throughout her career has had a strong Dutch team at every World Championships. Whilst Cooke was number 1 she had nobody effective in the last couple of laps of the World Championships. A rider could be sent up the road in the early part of a race and, whilst favourite, nobody would think that Cooke would do a one person chase from 100km to go. 30km to go and things are very different and within the last 10km, everyone would look at Cooke. Vos is in the same position in the closing stages and the benefit of a foil is so obvious. However, at 100km to go, the disparity between the assets of the Dutch team and everyone else is such that everyone would look to the Dutch to chase. 

I said "....In 2010 they achieved the win via fortune placed in their path by the stupidity of others. ...."


Skip Madness said:


> I presume you're referring to Canada? If Bronzini was reliant on Canada for the win, surely Vos was equally reliant on them for second?


Absolutely. Vos had lost the race. The Canadians, sacrificed themselves entirely, to put riders from other nations back in contention. It was incredibly stupid.


Skip Madness said:


> How is that good tactical nous from the Netherlands?


Correct assessment of the position. You are entirely right, it was not good. As Arndt and Cooke rode away, Vos was looking at either being forced to waste her sprint chasing or settle for winning the sprint for 3rd. However it was not a position created by the Dutch, it was a position created by the puncture. without the puncture, Vos could have dawdled with the chasers until Van Vleuten re-joined would then create an entirely different dynamic. Johansson would be the rider with most to lose and would then have to drive (with the Canadians?) to stop Van Vleuten making contact, or take her chances.



Skip Madness said:


> I don't accept that Canada were stupid - they were desperate and did the only thing that could give them a chance of winning anything.


The only chance they had of winning anything adopting that tactic, is if there was a big pile up of the riders in front of them who they had towed up to the break and they swerved around them all.  




Skip Madness said:


> The Netherlands rode the simplest race of all - "everyone try to get it back together for Marianne" when they had an embarrassment of riches for a course like today's. Italy were hopeful of Bronzini surviving, but they weren't relying on it.


Skip, Van Vleuten and Vos have been in breaks this year, and done their double act. The plan was, “get it back for Van Vleuten and Vos, for the final lap”. The execution was the complex part. Who to commit, how, when, how hard? Adopting that plan committed the Dutch team to the major responsibility for the race. 

Moving on - I had another look at the last 5km in slow mo. A super race. Even with the help of the Canadians, Vos could not win. Vos made a suicidal effort to get up to Cooke and Arndt and in doing so was weaker than either Johansen and Bronzini. Bronzini came past her and Johansson was passing her. Vos definitely left her racing line and impeded Johansen on the one side, pushing her so that she impacted into a spectator on the barrier. So maybe Cooke and Arndt had judged it right, the only way Vos could catch them was if she went way too early ? Vos' effort opened an 3 sec gap back to those that were on their wheels with 400 to go !!! (- beaten by 2 lots of stupidity ?) Bronzini and Johansson were never going to get up to Cooke and Arndt unless somebody took them up there. 

Whatever our debate, the narrowest of margins in a fantastic race finish.


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## yello (2 Oct 2010)

Excellent debate resal and SM. Thank you. As I said before, the sort of perspectives I love to read. That is, from people who know what they are talking about. No rights or wrongs, just a matter of interpretation.

And on that note of 'interpretation', who'd have a team manager's job. Trying to get a win for the team when you have a few riders in the team capable of doing it, depending on the course and how it pans out on the day. You look at the course, you look at your team's strengths, you try to take into account individual team member's desires and their egos... and you formulate a strategy. Maybe you get it right, maybe it goes right for you... or maybe at the end of it you think 'hmmm, maybe we should have done it a different way'. 

It's easier to say it in hindsight but calling it before hand, and adapting during, that takes some tactical nouse. I'm always in awe of someone that knows their stuff.


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## Skip Madness (2 Oct 2010)

resal said:


> Whilst Cooke was number 1 she had nobody effective in the last couple of laps of the World Championships. A rider could be sent up the road in the early part of a race and, whilst favourite, nobody would think that Cooke would do a one person chase from 100km to go. 30km to go and things are very different and within the last 10km, everyone would look at Cooke. Vos is in the same position in the closing stages and the benefit of a foil is so obvious. However, at 100km to go, the disparity between the assets of the Dutch team and everyone else is such that everyone would look to the Dutch to chase.
> 
> [...]
> 
> it was not a position created by the Dutch, it was a position created by the puncture. without the puncture, Vos could have dawdled with the chasers until Van Vleuten re-joined would then create an entirely different dynamic. Johansson would be the rider with most to lose and would then have to drive (with the Canadians?) to stop Van Vleuten making contact, or take her chances.



Vos needn't have been in that position, though - Van Vleuten's puncture was unlucky and it obviously hindered both her and Vos' chances, but at the time of the puncture Vos still had Tabak, Bruins and Gunnewijk with her. They lost touch on the climb, which it's doubtful would've happened to Van Vleuten, but if they'd been cannier earlier in the day then those riders would've been fresher. Plus there's Blaak who gave some almighty turns in bringing back attacks - a rider who should've been there with Vos come the end too, and who could've stayed with that group had she not killed herself earlier. The Dutch had the chance to be controlling the race with 100km to go. Get Tabak and Visser attacking, push for breaks and let the other teams do the chasing. With two laps to go they could have had four highly dangerous riders ready to work the others over. That puncture kicked a fair dent in the Dutch chances, but they'd over-exposed themselves to risk.



> Skip, Van Vleuten and Vos have been in breaks this year, and done their double act. The plan was, “get it back for Van Vleuten and Vos, for the final lap”. The execution was the complex part. Who to commit, how, when, how hard? Adopting that plan committed the Dutch team to the major responsibility for the race.



It's not just been Vos and Van Vleuten, though, it's been pretty much any two Nederland Bloeit riders of your choice. True that Vos and Van Vleuten have done it more than any others. Regardless, it's precisely that last point - that it was a plan which committed them to the responsibility for the race - which was what made it short-sighted. They could have given the field the run around, instead they adopted tactics which let everyone else make them run around.



> The Canadians, sacrificed themselves entirely, to put riders from other nations back in contention. It was incredibly stupid [...] The only chance they had of winning anything adopting that tactic, is if there was a big pile up of the riders in front of them who they had towed up to the break and they swerved around them all.



... or if Whitten told Willock, "You know, I feel OK, get this back and I might get a top ten." Likely? No. Stupid? On the biggest day of the year for promoting women's cycling, with teams looking at slots to fill, sponsors looking at potential exposure, and above all the only remote chance of placing well in what many regard as the biggest one-day race in the world (Not me, I prefer Flanders and the Flèche)? Definitely not.



> Whatever our debate, the narrowest of margins in a fantastic race finish.



Most certainly in agreement there. This race delivers year after year.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Attempting to answer the points as they appear - I just think that firing riders up the road is not the option the Dutch wanted to take on the basis that sometimes they might get the strongest rider with weaker ones, but more often. the other teams would just negate exactly that by soft pedaling and letting the break come back and let a new combination form, that had the other nations' riders stronger than the Dutch rider who is in the break. 

The Dutch find themselves in a difficult position that is unique within road cycling for either sex. 

Of the Canadians tactic - the outcome is the proof that the motive was not based on logic. Maybe one of them will pick up a contract from a team based on 16th place and "well I was lying 3rd with 1.5km to go". As you point out. The pair of them obviously had a thought something like that pass through their brains.


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## resal (2 Oct 2010)

Quote from Vos in Dutch Der Telegraph - from cyclingnews - 
How did it happen this year? “If I had sprinted later, then the escapees Judith Arndt and Nicole Cooke would have sprinted for the gold, “ she told the Dutch newspaper _De Telegraaf_. “So I took off at 300 metres from the finish and I felt the Italian Giorgia Bronzini coming up. I had no choice.”

No, and if she had gone with Arndt and Cooke, one of them would have gone up the road and the other would have sat on her, forcing her to chase. and after she had chased theother one would have gone. Vos knew that and that is why she waited. Vos is favourite but that brings with it real problems, which is why, once a year Cooke could never win the World Champs when she was number 1 in the World, without any team around her.


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

I never dreamt Thor would get that. The circuit's perfect for him but he seemed to be in such poor form lately. Anyway he timed it to perfection - well done lad.


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## Keith Oates (3 Oct 2010)

A great finish for Thor but what a tough race that was, those laps with the steep hills were killers. I think all of the riders earned their money in todays race!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187028"]
Thanks for that chaps, it's on Eurosport now with about a lap to go, I guess I can go to Tescos now eh 
[/quote]
WTF?
I watched it live - am I supposed to wait several hours before commenting on the result just in case someone hasn't seen a recording yet? Why come in to a thread called Road World Championship 2010 if you don't want to know the result? 


* 
*


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## rich p (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187028"]
Thanks for that chaps, it's on Eurosport now with about a lap to go, I guess I can go to Tescos now eh 
[/quote]


The clue's in the thread title! I watched ot on Eurosport too but I was canny enough not to look at this thread until it was finished


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## rich p (3 Oct 2010)

rich p said:


> I think it may be too tough for CAv with a small team and the apparent uphill finish.
> Maybe Hushovd if it comes to an uphill sprint!






raindog said:


> I doubt very much Hushovd is going to be world road race champ this year.




I hate to say I told you so but.....


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

rich p said:


> I hate to say I told you so but.....


nice one


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187030"]
I believe the protocol is to put 'Spoiler' in the title if you are giving the result before most people will have had chance to see the race. When the Tour is on, shall I just start thread called "Tour de France" and post the result immediately the stage ends? Or should I warn people that the result of the stage may be contained within, when they will probably watch the highlights in the evening?

So don't WTF me. This thread could have been about any of the last weeks racing. Why not start a thread entitled 'Mens Worlds Road Race-Spoiler' ? eh?
[/quote]
I didn't start the thread or write the title. As a forum member I have a right to post comments about the world's in this thread as soon as the races are finished.
WTF? was an appropriate response to such a daft, selfish post.


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## rich p (3 Oct 2010)

Spoiler would have been good but I can only refer you to The Likely Lads and recommend that you avoid threads named World Champs when you're avoiding news about the World Champs! 

What news? Link?


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187037"]
Please, explain how my annoyed post was selfish.

As a forum member you should know that the protocol is to put 'Spoiler' in a thread containing results that may not be common knowledge at the time of posting.

Or shall we establish a new protocol where just post away, regardless of the thread title, and put up results etc as soon as we know them, and sod anyone who may work such hours as means they have to watch highlights packages?
[/quote]
This is rediculous
I've already told you I didn't start the thread, so the thread title is nothing to do with me.
I posted my comment WHEN THE RACE WAS OVER. Apparently you were watching the race several hours after it was finished. Do you understand? Did you think you were watching it while it was happening? 
How long are we supposed to wait after a race is over before we can comment? Is there a forum rule about this?


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## iAmiAdam (3 Oct 2010)

Tbh, if you're planning on watching it later, and you know that the race has finished, don't look in the thread that is related to the race.

And if you're going to correct spelling on an internet forum, at least realise that everyone can post what they want, when they want.


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187039"]
I'm getting f'ing bored with this, are you completely f'ing thick or something?

[/quote]
If we're going to use abuse you're the thicko.
OK, tell me how long we're supposed to wait before posting about the world's result in a thread called Road World Championship 2010 just in case someone's on nights or something and hasn't seen the result? Half a day? A couple of days? What if you'd got to the end of your recording and posted in here about the result? Could someone who came in a couple of hours after your post, and hadn't seen the end of his recorded race, then complain to you because you'd commented on the result?

Anyway, I'm outta here, life's too short for this crap. 

* 
*


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## rich p (3 Oct 2010)

Spot on post RD.


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## chevin (3 Oct 2010)

The commentary on BBC was entertaining: yet again Porter talks about a 'winning margin', and yet again it was anything but, and then he talks continuously about the leader being Gilbert for several minutes after he's been swept up and the whole nature of the race is completely different to how he's describing it! What a fabulous race though!!!


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## iAmiAdam (3 Oct 2010)

And you wonder why people don't think about 'their fellow forumers' respect goes two ways, you can't expect people to do as you wish just for you to come about spouting insults.

Get off your high horse.


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## raindog (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187045"]
Read that last sentence again (or, may I suggest, for the first time), then go and write a hundred lines saying

"I must not butt in on private arguments with absolute non-sensical bollocks"

[/quote]
Please write out a hundred times
"I must not preach to my fellow forum members when it's obvious I don't have a leg to stand on"


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## iAmiAdam (3 Oct 2010)

Point proven.

And tbh, if you're going to have a private argument, do it over pm, not a public forum.


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## yello (3 Oct 2010)

anyway...

A great race (I watched the last 40 minutes or so live). Well pleased for Thor too as he's a rider I like. I was really interested in his comments afterwards, about thinking he stood no chance... and then the Russians took up the chase, then some others, and brought the peleton back. I was reminded of the debate between SM and resal re the women's result... and thought about tactics, chance and luck. On the day, things panned out for Thor. His decision to stay with the peleton proved to be a good one and then his strength did the rest. As the France 3 commentator remarked, it was a course for a strong rider than can sprint a bit!

Cadel certainly gave the title defence a shot. I think he tried too hard... but what do I know!


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## iAmiAdam (3 Oct 2010)

Wow, didn't know you'd go that low.


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## Dayvo (3 Oct 2010)

Was indeed a great race!

Tried to watch it live last night on Norwegian TV (no ads either), but they kept interrupting the coverage with interviews with Thor and Edvald, and anyone in Norway who knows them: went to bed at 02.00.

Woke this morning and watched the repeat of the whole race.

What a great break and lead the gang of five had! Then groups coming and going with different leaders. 

And finally the last 300 metres when it could have gone to anyone in the group!

Great finish by Thor, but ruined by the bloody jingoism of the Norwegian commentaters who were verbally up his arse all the time for the duration of the race!

I expect the prices of (ultra expensive already) bikes will now increase by 10% here now!


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## HLaB (3 Oct 2010)

It was a great race; I watched it on the net and even with the BBC healine spoiling it, it was still good to watch, Gibert must of thought he'd won. Its a bit ironic that the beeb spoiled it as I stayed out of this place so it wouldn't be spoiled but opened this thread to see other folk complaining about it. Simples if you don't want it spoiled avoid this section untill you've seen the race and imc avoid the net total  

If anybody wants to see it again, I've uploaded the highlights to you tube, so folk can get the pleasure of the BBC commentary where ever they are in the world.


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## Crackle (3 Oct 2010)

Another popular winner, two in a row, excellent. I watched it on BBC and neither whatisface or Boardman saw Gilbert swept up, which resulted in me shouting at the box to stop looking for him and concentrate on the sprint.


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## toby123 (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187034"]Anyway, with the revelation on ABC news-online, I don't know if the result will stand anyway.
[/quote]

What???


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## Fab Foodie (3 Oct 2010)

Crackle said:


> Another popular winner, two in a row, excellent. I watched it on BBC and neither whatisface or Boardman saw Gilbert swept up, which resulted in me shouting at the box to stop looking for him and concentrate on the sprint.



Ha! I wasn't the only one yelling at them then!


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## Fab Foodie (3 Oct 2010)

One thing I've been thinking...

Haven't the road races been great because of the absence of race-radios?


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## Ball (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187043"]
Don't post the result to a race, unless it carries a 'Spoiler' warning until the highlights package has been shown on TV. 

Never post a thread entitled 'Whoever Wins Worlds', 1 minute after the race finishes.

If it has a 'Spoiler' warning, then post as soon as you know the result.

I don't think that a little thought about your fellow forummers, who may work different hours or have other reasons for not watching live, is so difficult do you? Well, it seems obviously you do.
[/quote]


Mate you're an idiot. Honestly, if you really really really didn't want to know the result, you really really really wouldn't have read a thread titled Road World Championships. So basically, I think you were just a little bit tempted and perhaps even looking for an argument


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## Skip Madness (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187061"]I shall be posting the results of any race in any thread which contains the names of any participant, or even related subject in the future. After all, in a thread entitled "Le Tour" you will expect to see the results of any stage wouldn't you?[/quote] 

It would have been better has SPOILER been in the title, but even so if you'd been reading the thread before you'd see we'd all been discussing the previous races straight after they had finished. If you hadn't... you could still have thought, "Highlights will be on Eurosport in a couple of hours, I'll wait 'till then just in case."



> In a thread titled "Boonen" you would expect to see the result of any race just because he is in it wouldn't you?



If you had a thread titled *Boonen ***SPOLER****, that would probably be even more of a giveaway of recent results than if you didn't. People should be considerate about putting spolier warnings in thread titles, but when the World Championships are on, and it's race day, and the race has just finished, and you not only go on to a racing forum but deliberately click on a thread called *World Championship 2010* in which everyone has been discussing the other races as they finish... then you can't be very surprised if you read something you didn't intend to.


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## yello (3 Oct 2010)

More to the point, why is anyone on the web when there's cycling on the tele!!


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## Sambu (3 Oct 2010)

Applogies if this is repeated but ive been skim reading to avoid in depth self spoilage! but where can i watch this now?


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## Ball (3 Oct 2010)

[QUOTE 1187061"]
Thanks for your thoughts there Ball. It's always good to get the musings of such a deep thinker  

I shall be posting the results of any race in any thread which contains the names of any participant, or even related subject in the future. After all, in a thread entitled "Le Tour" you will expect to see the results of any stage wouldn't you? Thats why no-one ever posts "Stage 7-spoiler" do they? In a thread titled "Boonen" you would expect to see the result of any race just because he is in it wouldn't you?
[/quote]

Not sure it's something that really requires that much depth of thought. Yes, in a thread entitled 'Le Tour' I probably would expect to see stage results, and if I particularly didn't want to know those stage results, I definitely wouldn't be so stupid as to enter a race related thread. 

Maybe you should stop thinking so deeply and use a bit of common sense.


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## Flying_Monkey (3 Oct 2010)

Yes, the thread would have been better with SPOILER in front on it, but originally it was a pre-WCs discussion thread and it mutated. But, also yes, anyone with common sense who did not want to know the results would not look at a thread about the WCs if it was clear that it was still active during and after the races concerned. 

Anyhoo... the top three was a complete surprise to me, and a good one too. I've been admiring Matti Breschel this season and Thor totally deserves this. As a bonus, one of my favourite riders, Yukiya Arashiro, was 9th - and what's more there was another Japanese rider, Fumiyuki Beppu in 30th - two Japanese men in the top 30 of the World's? Now that is something no-one would have predicted!


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## kennykool (5 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> I doubt very much Hushovd is going to be world road race champ this year.



Sorry can you say that a bit Louder please...I cant hear you up here in Smug land!!!!


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## rich p (5 Oct 2010)

kennykool said:


> Sorry can you say that a bit Louder please...I cant hear you up here in Smug land!!!!




Kenny you wee scamp! You picked Cav!!!


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## raindog (5 Oct 2010)

kennykool said:


> Sorry can you say that a bit Louder please...I cant hear you up here in Smug land!!!!


I know, I know....I've already been reminded of that.


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## kennykool (5 Oct 2010)

rich p said:


> Kenny you wee scamp! You picked Cav!!!




No No No your honour i said ....and i quote....."If not Cav then its got to be the God of Thunder - Big Thor!!!"  

I spread my bets ha ha


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## kennykool (5 Oct 2010)

raindog said:


> I know, I know....I've already been reminded of that.




I was trying to post it just after the race but for some reason I cant reply to a post on the iPad or iPhone had to wait til i got onto a desktop


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## raindog (5 Oct 2010)

Go on, just keep rubbing it in.


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## michael2u (6 Oct 2010)

However, we can give credit to the worlds best cyclists for putting their efforts on some of the most exciting racing we have ever seen at a world championship. But, still, the thank you and congratulations should also be there to us also, I mean the cycling fans, isn't it?


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## yello (7 Oct 2010)

I think it also turned out to be a pretty darned good course as well. Those climbs seemed to add uncertainty for punters, pundits and praps even managers and riders alike.


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