# Brad Wiggins 2012 TDF - Best ever British Sporting Achievement?



## Dags11 (21 Jul 2012)

Chris Hoy thinks so, it certainly knocks Torvill & Dean into a cocked hat.

Can you guys think of a better achievement.........


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## MattHB (21 Jul 2012)

He's not won it yet!


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## Dags11 (21 Jul 2012)

A fiver he does....


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## black'n'yellow (21 Jul 2012)

if Sir Chris thinks so, then it must be true...


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## Mad Doug Biker (21 Jul 2012)

Sir Steve Redgrave comes to mind for messing about in some boats once apon a time.....


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## raindog (21 Jul 2012)

What about the lass who sailed single handed round the world? Was it Helen McArthur or something? I thought that was pretty exceptional.

EDIT
Ellen MacArthur it was - and she's from Derbyshire into the bargain.


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## ohnovino (21 Jul 2012)

Just had a look a past Sport Personality of the Year winners for ideas, but nobody stands out as better than Wiggins.

BTW, did you know that in the year Bannister broke the four-minute mile barrier he came second in SPOTY behind one of his pacemakers?!


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## Ajay (21 Jul 2012)

I'd say so.
I can only think of Linford winning gold in Barcelona to put in the same bracket.
Both iconic events with genuine worldwide competition.


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## swansonj (21 Jul 2012)

There must be a difference between best single achievement (eg Bannister) and best sustained series of achievements (eg Redgrave). With Wiggins, there are some people who are acclaiming him mainly just for the single achievement of winning the TdF (which presumably would be less noteworthy if Britain's previous record in the TdF was more similar to France, Spain, Italy etc), and others for the sustained achievement of (to summarise) winning the TdF after winning 6 Olympic medals.


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## Noodley (21 Jul 2012)

Shergar winning the horse hide-and-seek competition for 39 years in a row


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## Mad Doug Biker (21 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> Shergar winning the horse hide-and-seek competition for 39 years in a row



Neptune Collonges for being the first Grey to win the National since 1960 or whatever it was!


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## Dags11 (21 Jul 2012)

Noodley said:


> Shergar winning the horse hide-and-seek competition for 39 years in a row


No probs in who would pick up the comedy award......


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## Mad Doug Biker (21 Jul 2012)

swansonj said:


> There must be a difference between best single achievement (eg Bannister) and best sustained series of achievements (eg Redgrave). With Wiggins, there are some people who are acclaiming him mainly just for the single achievement of winning the TdF (which presumably would be less noteworthy if Britain's previous record in the TdF was more similar to France, Spain, Italy etc), and others for the sustained achievement of (to summarise) winning the TdF after winning 6 Olympic medals.



For me, it is, without a doubt, Sir Steve. In terms of sustained period of time at the top, few people will ever even dream of coming close to him. He is a living legend!

There are the other categories though, and undoubtedly Bannister et al will corner their own.


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## Boris Bajic (21 Jul 2012)

Wiggins is quite a rider and the team around him are unbelievably good. I am slack-jawed in my admiration of him, even as one of the gainsayers who thought he'd never win a TdF. He seems to have the job done and I find that exraordinary and wonderful.

I find it hard to compare achievement between disciplines and decades, but these are some names:


I recall the absolute domination of *Coe* and *Ovett* in 800, 1500 and Mile over a number of years. Cram and others came in on the end of that surge of fantastitude, but Coe and Ovett seemed somehow capable of hoovering up titles and records at will in what are some of the _blue ribband_ track distances.

After many years of injuries at unfortunate times, I found *Kelly Holmes'* twin golds in the same Games quite a stunner. Most would have quit by then.

From the world of motorsport, I have a great regard for *Barry Sheene* and also *Dave Thorpe*.

Thorpe took several World titles in a sport hardly covered by UK media but hugely popular in France, Belgium, Italy, Spain and elsewhere.... which sounds uncannily familiar to many a cycling fan. I saw him ride in a one-off event while living in France many years ago and he was greeted like some sort of deity by the crowd. Back here, he'd have gone unnoticed.


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## Durian (21 Jul 2012)

I would go for Steve Redgrave aswell. Winning gold in five different Olympic Games and in such a tough sport.


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## aJohnson (21 Jul 2012)

Dags11 said:


> Chris Hoy thinks so, it certainly knocks Torvill & Dean into a cocked hat.
> 
> Can you guys think of a better achievement.........


 
And many comments are anti cycling, no surprise there.


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## asterix (21 Jul 2012)

Ajay said:


> I'd say so.
> I can only think of Linford winning gold in Barcelona to put in the same bracket.
> Both iconic events with genuine worldwide competition.


 
I never realised that Linford had any sporting prowess. He's never mentioned it on here!

Anyway, I'd like to nominate Daley Thompson the supreme decathlete. A runner, thrower and jumper..


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## Fnaar (21 Jul 2012)

I'd like to nominate Jessica Ennis. Well, "nominate" is possibly not the word I'm looking for.

-----------------------------------
Sent mobile phone stylee


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## swansonj (21 Jul 2012)

Joss Naylor. Never heard of him? That's part of why his achievements are so special. But as he didn't compete in world championships or Olympics, preferring to set incredible new marks on his own, he probably doesn't count.


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## Durian (21 Jul 2012)

Never heard of Joss Naylor before but after looking at his achievements all I can say is, 'what a man'.


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## mr_hippo (21 Jul 2012)

George Pilkington Mills, aged 18, LEJOG 1886 in 5 days, 1 hour, 45 minutes on a penny farthing - record has never been broken


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## festival (21 Jul 2012)

Wiggins, sporting achievement and a personality.


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## raindog (21 Jul 2012)

User said:


> or even what the comedian Eddie Izzard did, 43 marathons in 52 days with very little training..


I like Eddie anyway, but I was gobsmacked when he did that. Amazing guy.


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## Dags11 (21 Jul 2012)

It might be said that Eddie ran solo as a charity participant, whereas Brad competed as a professional with the elite of cycling in its premier event.....and won for the record books


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## Accy cyclist (22 Jul 2012)

It might, or might not be the greatest British sporting achievement, but come 5 o clock(touchwood) our sport,hobby,pastime,means of transport etc will be the headlines on national television! I've watched the Tour of France from the days of the great Eddie Merckx always wishing for, but never really expecting, that Brit on the middle of the podium, even just on the podium would do for me!! We have non cycling folk out there talking of the tour and BW like once of a day they'd talk about football or motor racing. This achievement will be up there amongst the greatest, and it's been done by a man who seems surprised, even overwhelmed that he's the one to have been chosen!
I will shed a few tears when he steps up onto the podium to the sound of his/our national anthem, and be satisfied that i was around when one of ours won the greatest bike race in the world!!!


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## mr_hippo (22 Jul 2012)

If you are compiling a list of grear British sporting achievments, do not forget marathon runner Jim Peters, 1954 Empire Games Vancouver


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## Noodley (22 Jul 2012)

Okay, what about Joe Johnson winning the world snooker chamionship? 

He'd never held a cue until the week before and only got to play because he turned up in a smart 3-piece suit on a day when Tony Drago didn't make it back from the dry cleaners.


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## Accy cyclist (22 Jul 2012)

[QUOTE 1945452, member: 76"]How about a 15 times World Champion? 11 of them won consecutively? Phil Taylor[/quote]

Respect to a 4000+ messenger , but dare i suggest that Phil Taylor's ahem! "physique" gives one the impression that throwing darts at a board doesn't require much physical effort? Therefore it's not really a "sporting" achievement!


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## Accy cyclist (22 Jul 2012)

Accy cyclist said:


> Respect to a 4000+ messenger , but dare i suggest that Phil Taylor's ahem! "physique" gives one the impression that throwing darts at a board doesn't require much physical effort? Therefore it's not really a "sporting" achievement!


 
"Oh dear, you may have just bought the whole 'What is a sport?' thing into the debate, this could run"...

Good,let the debate begin!..and as for the snooker one...!


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## Accy cyclist (22 Jul 2012)

Pity these "sportsmen" aren't British. Otherwise we'd be the world champs(!!)


View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67VumrieWm8 Correction! One of them is!!!


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## Smokin Joe (22 Jul 2012)

aJohnson said:


> And many comments are anti cycling, no surprise there.


Why should there be?

Start a thread on football or F1 to name but two and this forum will get loads of haters contributing. Just enjoy your sport and stop looking for love.


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## Fab Foodie (22 Jul 2012)

Dags11 said:


> Chris Hoy thinks so, it certainly knocks Torvill & Dean into a cocked hat.
> 
> Can you guys think of a better achievement.........


 Steven Redgrave.


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## Smokin Joe (22 Jul 2012)

Fab Foodie said:


> Steven Redgrave.


Really?

And how many mountain passes did Redgrave have to paddle his canoe over then? Go on, answer that one.

*FAIL*

Next please.


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## aJohnson (22 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Why should there be?
> 
> Start a thread on football or F1 to name but two and this forum will get loads of haters contributing. Just enjoy your sport and stop looking for love.


 
I'm not complaining, just observing. Though it is sports news as opposed to it being in a football forum.


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## Fab Foodie (22 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Really?
> 
> And how many mountain passes did Redgrave have to paddle his canoe over then? Go on, answer that one.
> 
> ...


 About as many lakes as Bradders had to cycle through .....


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## Smokin Joe (22 Jul 2012)

Fab Foodie said:


> About as many lakes as Bradders had to cycle through .....


Come on, it did rain one day you know.


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## Fab Foodie (22 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Come on, it did rain one day you know.


 Fair point .....


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## Herbie (22 Jul 2012)

Boris Bajic said:


> Wiggins is quite a rider and the team around him are unbelievably good. I am slack-jawed in my admiration of him, even as one of the gainsayers who thought he'd never win a TdF. He seems to have the job done and I find that exraordinary and wonderful.
> 
> I find it hard to compare achievement between disciplines and decades, but these are some names:
> 
> ...


 I think its a fantastic achievement by Wiggo and should be celebrated afterall it might not happen again...Thinking of past glories how the great Eric Liddell and Harold Abrahams 1924 Olympics and even Daley Thomson he was some athlete!


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## Linford (22 Jul 2012)

Boris Bajic said:


> From the world of motorsport, I have a great regard for *Barry Sheene* and also *Dave Thorpe*.
> 
> Thorpe took several World titles in a sport hardly covered by UK media but hugely popular in France, Belgium, Italy, Spain and elsewhere.... which sounds uncannily familiar to many a cycling fan. I saw him ride in a one-off event while living in France many years ago and he was greeted like some sort of deity by the crowd. Back here, he'd have gone unnoticed.


 
For me, the best in motorsport has to be John Surtees.

Wiki - He was 500cc motorcycle World Champion in 1956 and 1958–60, Formula One World Champion in 1964, and remains the only person to have won World Championships on both two and four wheels.

That really is IMO some sort of incredible achievement to attain.


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## pplpilot (22 Jul 2012)

Dougie Lampkin trials rider.Has won five consecutive World Indoor (1997–2001) and seven consecutive World Outdoor Championships (1997–2003). He has also won four World Team Championships (Trial des Nations) in years 1997, 1999, 2002 and 2003, six British Adult Championships, two Spanish Adult Championships and the world famous Scott Trial on three occasions...


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## PaulB (22 Jul 2012)

Ajay said:


> I'd say so.
> I can only think of Linford winning gold in Barcelona to put in the same bracket.
> Both iconic events with genuine worldwide competition.


Drug cheat.


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## Buddfox (22 Jul 2012)

A lot of people are talking about multiple events, but didn't Chris Hoy really mean a one-off achievement? That's how I heard it, and he has a point. Winning an olympic gold, a golf major, the world cup... all seem less impressive than winning the Tour de France, IMHO.

If we're looking at a body of work, and include Wiggo's earlier successes, then it's impressive, but he's not done enough (yet) to top Redgrave.


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## Hip Priest (22 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Why should there be?
> 
> Start a thread on football or F1 to name but two and this forum will get loads of haters contributing. Just enjoy your sport and stop looking for love.


 
Never understood why people get upset if other people don't enjoy their chosen sport. Come to think of it, I don't understand why people are trying to place Wiggins' achievement into some sort of British sporting hierarchy.

He won the Tour de France - that's enough for me.


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## PaulB (22 Jul 2012)

swansonj said:


> Joss Naylor. Never heard of him? That's part of why his achievements are so special. But as he didn't compete in world championships or Olympics, preferring to set incredible new marks on his own, he probably doesn't count.


He counts for me. There's nothing nearer 'superhuman' than what Joss Naylor casually achieved.


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## PaulB (22 Jul 2012)

User said:


> there are many of a similar ilk to Joss Naylor, I read a book on someone who ran all the mountain ranges/peaks of Britian and Ireland (can't remember his name) unbelievable achievement or even what the comedian Eddie Izzard did, 43 marathons in 52 days with very little training..


You're thinking of Hugh Symonds.


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## Dags11 (22 Jul 2012)

Linford said:


> For me, the best in motorsport has to be John Surtees.
> 
> Wiki - He was 500cc motorcycle World Champion in 1956 and 1958–60, Formula One World Champion in 1964, and remains the only person to have won World Championships on both two and four wheels.
> 
> That really is IMO some sort of incredible achievement to attain.


In relation to fuel combustion achievments - 4/2 wheels - It might be said that Wiggo is the driver *&* the engine


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## 400bhp (22 Jul 2012)

PaulB said:


> Drug cheat.


 
Bollox


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## 400bhp (22 Jul 2012)

He [Wiggo] is up there in a very small group of sportsmen.

Whether he is at the top is likely to make this thread run for a long time. It's impossible to prove or disprove.


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## PaulB (22 Jul 2012)

400bhp said:


> Bollox


Well one of them was FROM that area but the others....not. He was caught and escaped (skin of his teeth) and caught and snared. You can read about it with little effort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linford_Christie


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## Dags11 (22 Jul 2012)

Maybe it's more about the achievment rather than the person, would you say the TDF ranks higher than darts, F1, snooker championships etc. instead of pitching Wiggo against Jenson Button etc?


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## 400bhp (22 Jul 2012)

PaulB said:


> Well one of them was FROM that area but the others....not. He was caught and escaped (skin of his teeth) and caught and snared. You can read about it with little effort. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linford_Christie


 
Like I said-bollox


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## ufkacbln (22 Jul 2012)

Totally OT, but my wife was Barry Sheene's bodyguard at Silverstone one year when she worked fro Securicor.


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## ufkacbln (22 Jul 2012)

I always dislike these types of accolade, as there are so many variables.

If you take theTdF as a one off then and then give Steve Redgrave the wasrd for the sustained performance over many yars then does that devalue the TdF

Equally treat the TdF as a more important even and do you devalue the sutaind sporting achievement of Steve Redgrave?

If Christopher Froome wins next year and has a greater margin over the second place, is that achievement greater or lesser than Bradley Wiggins?

What if Christopher Froome then wins the TdF twice - Does that devalue Wiggins' achievement this year?

Personally I feel it is very difficult to compare sports and sportsmen in this way.


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## strofiwimple (22 Jul 2012)

Just a thought-does the persons personality come in to the equation?
I'm a cyclist but also (was) an "afalete", cricketer, fitba player and golfer, IMHO daley is /was a c**k also mr woods IS.
Mr Wiggins and Redgrave from all I can gather are good blokes-either one one gets my vote


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## Norm (22 Jul 2012)

I'd be disappointed if the "Best ever British sporting achievement" was any specific event. Much as the Tour has captured and captivated over the last few weeks, it's only one event. Winning over a series of events or over a longer period (such as Redgrave or Pendleton) are much better achievements, IMO, as was the stuff done by Paula Radcliffe, Rebecca Adlington, Jessica Ennis, Ben Ainslie and a host of cyclists (Hoy, Boardman, Cav etc). Wiggins himself has some pretty special achievements, not just switching from World Champion on track to road racing but winning the Dauphiné and Paris-Nice as well as the TdF this year...

Yeah, it's a huge thing that he has done today but it's just one thing and suggesting it is the best ever by a Brit is, IMO, belittling all those who achieved at a similar level so consistently over a number of years.

Also, as said above, it would be a little bit tragic IMO, if our best ever sporting achievement was to win it once when Armstrong has won it seven times.


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## fozy tornip (23 Jul 2012)

Boris Bajic said:


> After many years of injuries at unfortunate times, I found *Kelly Holmes'* twin golds in the same Games quite a stunner. Most would have quit by then..


I don't share your confidence in Dame Kelly's late flowering


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## Mad Doug Biker (23 Jul 2012)

Cunobelin said:


> I always dislike these types of accolade, as there are so many variables.
> 
> If you take theTdF as a one off then and then give Steve Redgrave the wasrd for the sustained performance over many yars then does that devalue the TdF
> 
> ...



Yes, what I said originally was that there are different categories for things, it is impossible to give a diffinitive answer.
Sir Steve is certainly up there, yes, but then, how do you compare someone like Roger Bannister against him? You can't. What they did was so different from each other!

Also, yes, it is a constantly evolving and fluid situation, and I hope that one day someone beats Sir Steve's record, etc etc.



Cunobelin said:


> Totally OT, but my wife was Barry Sheene's bodyguard at Silverstone one year when she worked fro Securicor.



So, who wears the trousers in your house then?


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## swansonj (23 Jul 2012)

Interesting comparisons with formula 1. Not least because both are won by individuals but an individual can usually only win if they are in one of the best teams and have that team working for them. I remember the excitement when, in turn, each of Nigel Mansell, Damon Hill and Lewis Hamilton won their championships. But I wonder how much more the excitement would have been in each case if no Brit had ever won it before?


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## dellzeqq (23 Jul 2012)

I'd put Wiggins at number 2 in the UK's all time cyclists. No. 1 being Beryl Burton. As for the rest.......Bobby Moore and Lester Piggott stand out.


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## PaulB (23 Jul 2012)

Norm said:


> as was the stuff done by Paula Radcliffe, Rebecca Adlington, Jessica Ennis, Ben Ainslie and a host of cyclists (Hoy, Boardman, Cav etc).


 
We can dismiss one of those immediately. The one whose medals are thin on the ground (one silver in the World Champs and one gold in the Commonwealths but no Olympic medals) but whose wins in events attracting money are far more numerous. The one who has no trouble setting records where ££££ is concerned but doesn't seem to want to do it where the nation might benefit. The one who lives as a tax exile so s/he can avoid paying the Inland Revenue any pesky tax. Yes, that one.


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## palinurus (23 Jul 2012)

Dags11 said:


> Chris Hoy thinks so, it certainly knocks Torvill & Dean into a cocked hat.
> 
> Can you guys think of a better achievement.........


 
I once came fifth in a 25.


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## andrew_s (23 Jul 2012)

Buddfox said:


> A lot of people are talking about multiple events, but didn't Chris Hoy really mean a one-off achievement? That's how I heard it, and he has a point. Winning an olympic gold, a golf major, the world cup... all seem less impressive than winning the Tour de France, IMHO.


I also heard it to mean a one-off.
So compare it with Beryl beating Mike McNamara, or Bob Beamon's iconic long jump (for British, perhaps Seb Coe's 800m record that stood for many years)


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## dellzeqq (23 Jul 2012)

PaulB said:


> We can dismiss one of those immediately. The one whose medals are thin on the ground (one silver in the World Champs and one gold in the Commonwealths but no Olympic medals) but whose wins in events attracting money are far more numerous. The one who has no trouble setting records where ££££ is concerned but doesn't seem to want to do it where the nation might benefit. The one who lives as a tax exile so s/he can avoid paying the Inland Revenue any pesky tax. Yes, that one.


fair point, but nine years on her record still stands


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## Doseone (23 Jul 2012)

I think what Wiggins has achieved is amazing, really really amazing. But greatest British sporting achievement?....that's a tough one. It's really difficult to compare, it's like when a boxer does well and he is always asked would you have beaten (insert name of a good boxer from the past here) - who knows. The comparison is fun to make but largely irrelevant.

But if we are talking about great British sporting achievements then Chrissie Wellington surely needs a mention .


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## ufkacbln (23 Jul 2012)

Mad Doug Biker said:


> So, who wears the trousers in your house then?


 
If you have to ask you are obviously not married!


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## Smokin Joe (23 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> I'd put Wiggins at number 2 in the UK's all time cyclists. No. 1 being Beryl Burton. As for the rest.......Bobby Moore and Lester Piggott stand out.


Beryl Burton the best *Female *cyclist (I'd go for Nicole Cook as the standard of women's cycling was dire when BB rode - my club were involved in it) but as she would not be able to compete with the male pros she would not be the best ever.


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## PaulB (23 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> fair point, but nine years on her record still stands


Okay, that being the case then, the longevity of records by Ron Hill and Geoff Capes brings them into the equation. Both are still on the top ten lists of British athletes TODAY! Now that takes some doing, I'll warrant.


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## Linford (23 Jul 2012)

Dags11 said:


> In relation to fuel combustion achievments - 4/2 wheels - It might be said that Wiggo is the driver *&* the engine




Are you suggesting that people who compete at top level have no requirement for endurance fitness ? . A local rider to me does much of his training on a roadie . His name is Scott Redding. If you had spent any time on the track on a motorbike you would appreciate this. They are very physically demanding. 

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


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## Becs (23 Jul 2012)

I think something that makes Steve Redgrave's achievements even more impressive is that he's a type 1 diabetic. Similarly Paula Radcliff has asthma and manages to win marathons.

I think Wiggins is amazing (and pretty hot if he gained a few kilos ) but I'm afraid Sir Steve gets my vote for best achievement . . . . . so far.


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## Mad Doug Biker (23 Jul 2012)

Cunobelin said:


> If you have to ask you are obviously not married!



Her then.


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## Davidc (23 Jul 2012)

I don't like the concept of comparing very different achievements in a league table, but view those who overcome mental barricades as special.

Roger Bannister overcame the block created by a widespread belief that it was impossible to run a mile in under 4 minutes. Bradley Wiggins has just overcome the mental block caused by 98 consecutive failures to get a Briton winning the TdF. More of those mentioned above are in this category.

Celebrate the win, and see what comes next!


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## marinyork (23 Jul 2012)

Linford said:


> Are you suggesting that people who compete at top level have no requirement for endurance fitness ? . A local rider to me does much of his training on a roadie . His name is Scott Redding. If you had spent any time on the track on a motorbike you would appreciate this. They are very physically demanding.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


 
You know perfectly well that Surtees was very much regarded as the inferior driver compared to his two great mates and compatriots Clark and Hill with regards 4 wheels. Surtees's achievement remains literally that an achievement and a very interesting one at that. We'll never know how good he was because like many other drivers throughout history he fell out with Ferrari and didn't win a second title (Black Jack did instead). But most of the British Formula 1 world champions were more interesting characters than was made out in the history books.


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## dellzeqq (24 Jul 2012)

Smokin Joe said:


> Beryl Burton the best *Female *cyclist (I'd go for Nicole Cook as the standard of women's cycling was dire when BB rode - my club were involved in it) but as she would not be able to compete with the male pros she would not be the best ever.


SJ - Beryl Burton consistently beat all the men. Have you not heard the humbug story?


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## User169 (24 Jul 2012)

Becs said:


> Similarly Paula Radcliff has asthma and manages to win marathons.


 
I'm always a little surprised at how many elite athletes claim to have asthma!


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## mr Mag00 (24 Jul 2012)

and no one has mentoned the prevous tour races wiggins has won this year which todate no one else has and then won the TDF too. there is no doubt he is up there with the best for sustained effort alone over 3 weeks.


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## Smokin Joe (24 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> SJ - Beryl Burton consistently beat all the men. Have you not heard the humbug story?


She did not consistently beat all the men. She once broke the 12 hour TT record (where she offered Nim Carline the legendary humbug, or was it a liquorice allsort?), but success in a domestic time trial is very small beer in the grand scheme of things, as proved by British TT legends who rode the GP des Nations and got hammered by all and saundy.


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## dellzeqq (24 Jul 2012)

one can only disagree. Her twelve hour record beat the mens twelve hour record and wasn't matched for two years - but the best thing about it is that the CTT were so worried about her overtaking men that they made her last out, hoping to limit the 'damage'. On the track she won the World Pursuit five times, the silver three times and the bronze three times - Vicky Pendleton, wonder that she is, has a way to go to match that. She also won the World Road Race twice.

And, whatever you think of domestic competition, being the top woman rider every year for 25 years isn't too shabby.

For those of you who are not familiar with BB - http://www.cyclorama.net/viewArticle.php?id=264


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## ACW (24 Jul 2012)

Ben Ainsley 3 gold 1 silver and still competing, switched sailing class and had to gain 18kg


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## tigger (24 Jul 2012)

Phil Taylor. 15 times World Champion. You can't argue with that!


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## User169 (24 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> Phil Taylor. 15 times World Champion. You can't argue with that!


 
Yeah, bet Wiggo couldn't have won the tdf with a pint in one hand!


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## dragon72 (24 Jul 2012)

tigger said:


> Phil Taylor. 15 times World Champion. You can't argue with that!


 
Yeah, "World" (aka UK & Holland) champion. .
Like the St Louis Cardinals are World Champs at baseball.


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## Smokin Joe (24 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> one can only disagree. Her twelve hour record beat the mens twelve hour record and wasn't matched for two years - _*but the best thing about it is that the CTT were so worried about her overtaking men that they made her last out,*_ hoping to limit the 'damage'. On the track she won the World Pursuit five times, the silver three times and the bronze three times - Vicky Pendleton, wonder that she is, has a way to go to match that. She also won the World Road Race twice.
> 
> And, whatever you think of domestic competition, being the top woman rider every year for 25 years isn't too shabby.
> 
> For those of you who are not familiar with BB - http://www.cyclorama.net/viewArticle.php?id=264


That is the normal starting position for the fastest rider in a TT and has been since the dawn of time.


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## dellzeqq (24 Jul 2012)

except that she wasn't nominally in the same TT


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## Noodley (24 Jul 2012)

Sheesh, it's like Jeremy Kyle meets Question of Sport in here.


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## Smokin Joe (24 Jul 2012)

dellzeqq said:


> except that she wasn't nominally in the same TT


Starting at the back gives you an advantage as you've got the rider in front as a target to catch. There's nothing worse than having a rider of similar ability setting off one minute behind you, they nearly always catch you up. 

Best woman rider of her era, but nowhere near the best ever British cyclist.


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## bof (25 Jul 2012)

Linford said:


> Are you suggesting that people who compete at top level have no requirement for endurance fitness ? . A local rider to me does much of his training on a roadie . His name is Scott Redding. If you had spent any time on the track on a motorbike you would appreciate this. They are very physically demanding.
> 
> Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2


Actually those guys and the F1 drivers are very, very fit. IMO one of the best ever reality TV shows was one for a competition for a place as trainee racing driver and the episode where they eliminated all the chubby boy racers who lived at home with their mums because they failed a simple fitness test was a joy to watch.


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