# Calf strain down to this?



## TwistedParsnip (14 Aug 2018)

can anyone shed light on this problem?

Ive up'd my mileage to around 100 miles a week - starting back in June. A bit of sprinting at start of week, hills in the middle of the week and then the usual long ride at weekend. Nurtition is good and I drink tonnes of water and finish with whey protein as I sometime do some light weights before going out the door.
Last Saturday I did 20 miles and then went out in the evening to a 20 year school reunion party.
I hadnt been drinking alcohol for some time and yes I had the dread hang over the next day but I also had calf pain of death in my left leg!
Ive done all the usual RICE and iburpofen but Im starting to wonder has the lack of electroytes drinks in my routine and the sudden drinking caused the prob?

Thoughts?


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## ColinJ (14 Aug 2018)

Did the pain go away again?


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## PK99 (14 Aug 2018)

TwistedParsnip said:


> can anyone shed light on this problem?
> 
> Ive up'd my mileage to around 100 miles a week - starting back in June. A bit of sprinting at start of week, hills in the middle of the week and then the usual long ride at weekend. Nurtition is good and I drink tonnes of water and finish with whey protein as I sometime do some light weights before going out the door.
> Last Saturday I did 20 miles and then went out in the evening to a 20 year school reunion party.
> ...



is it swollen and hot?

Don't want to cause panic, but a "calf strain" that does not respond to Rice etc could be a DVT.
Mine was in my thigh.


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## twentysix by twentyfive (14 Aug 2018)

TwistedParsnip said:


> calf pain of death



If that's still the case - see your GP


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## ColinJ (14 Aug 2018)

PK99 said:


> is it swollen and hot?
> 
> Don't want to cause panic, but a "calf strain" that does not respond to Rice etc could be a DVT.
> Mine was in my thigh.





twentysix by twentyfive said:


> If that's still the case - see your GP


My line of thinking too ...

My (main?) DVT was in my left inner thigh/groin area but it was the calf that hurt. I suspect that there may have been a DVT in the calf too, but the sonographer (ultrasound scan operator) stopped after finding the one in the thigh.


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## Alan O (15 Aug 2018)

TwistedParsnip said:


> can anyone shed light on this problem?
> 
> Ive up'd my mileage to around 100 miles a week - starting back in June. A bit of sprinting at start of week, hills in the middle of the week and then the usual long ride at weekend. Nurtition is good and I drink tonnes of water and finish with whey protein as I sometime do some light weights before going out the door.
> Last Saturday I did 20 miles and then went out in the evening to a 20 year school reunion party.
> ...


Not an expert, so pinches of salt and all that...

Had it been lack of electrolytes/dehydration, I might have expected cramp. But we all know what cramp feels like, and if I had some other serious pain in my calf like you describe, I would go and see the doc (especially if I had three parsnip-shaped legs ).

The chances of DVT might be low (I really don't know), but the consequences can be very serious (up to life-threatening). Best be safe.


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## Crankarm (24 Aug 2018)

TwistedParsnip said:


> can anyone shed light on this problem?
> 
> Ive up'd my mileage to around 100 miles a week - starting back in June. A bit of sprinting at start of week, hills in the middle of the week and then the usual long ride at weekend. Nurtition is good and I drink tonnes of water and finish with whey protein as I sometime do some light weights before going out the door.
> Last Saturday I did 20 miles and then went out in the evening to a 20 year school reunion party.
> ...



Could just be some tight/torn muscle fibres which will mean scar tissue at that point of the tear as you've been over doing it, too much too soon. Wait for it to heal a couple of weeks then begin massaging it to break up the scar tissue using a lacroix ball on a chair with you lying on your back adjacent to it with your lower leg up over the chair with your calf on top of the hard ball gently massaging the affected area and the whole calf. Make circular sideways movements starting at the heel around the Achilles working through the gastroc and soleus muscles to behind the knee. Go easy at first as you WILL be tender if you have never done this before. It will hit the spot and more importantly works. Initially I massaged like this morning and evening for a total of about 10-15 minutes.

I had recurring calf injuries for as period of 10-15 years meaning long periods without running through injury and reduced cycling performance. At one point I thought I would never run again or be 100% cycling fit until by chance I found this exercise on a YT channel given by a marathon runner earlier this year. Since then I used the technique to heal my calf and now use it pretty much every day meaning it has transformed my calfs back to rude health as if I was 16 years old again and keeps them that way as it is on going maintenance getting rid of knots and scar tissue in the muscle fibres. I now have full strength in my calfs again and no strain issues. If I miss a few days I am itching to get massaging when I next can as it is so good. Previously I went to my GP, saw physios, all well meaning but useless, watched many many crap YT videos none of which worked, then found this BINGO. Calfs healed in 6-8 weeks of massaging like I said. A chair and a hard ball is all you need.


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## PK99 (24 Aug 2018)

Crankarm said:


> Could just be some tight/torn muscle fibres which will mean scar tissue at that point of the tear as you've been over doing it, too much too soon. Wait for it to heal a couple of weeks then begin massaging it to break up the scar tissue using a lacroix ball on a chair with you lying on your back adjacent to it with your lower leg up over the chair with your calf on top of the hard ball gently massaging the affected area and the whole calf. Make circular sideways movements starting at the heel around the Achilles working through the gastroc and soleus muscles to behind the knee. Go easy at first as you WILL be tender if you have never done this before. It will hit the spot and more importantly works. Initially I massaged like this morning and evening for a total of about 10-15 minutes.
> 
> I had recurring calf injuries for as period of 10-15 years meaning long periods without running through injury and reduced cycling performance. At one point I thought I would never run again or be 100% cycling fit until by chance I found this exercise on a YT channel given by a marathon runner earlier this year. Since then I used the technique to heal my calf and now use it pretty much every day meaning it has transformed my calfs back to rude health as if I was 16 years old again and keeps them that way as it is on going maintenance getting rid of knots and scar tissue in the muscle fibres. I now have full strength in my calfs again and no strain issues. If I miss a few days I am itching to get massaging when I next can as it is so good. Previously I went to my GP, saw physios, all well meaning but useless, watched many many crap YT videos none of which worked, then found this BINGO. Calfs healed in 6-8 weeks of massaging like I said. A chair and a hard ball is all you need.



See a doctor to rule out dvt before following this advice.

Quote 

For example, if someone had *DVT*(*deep vein thrombosis*) under no circumstances should the lower calf muscles be massaged. When there is a level of caution or danger associated with a *massage* treatment, it is called a relative *contraindication*.16 Feb 2015
*Indications and Contraindications for Massage: What You Need to ...*
www.sagemassage.edu.au › blog › indica...




*PEOPLE ALSO ASK*


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## vickster (24 Aug 2018)

@TwistedParsnip what happened? Did you see a doctor?


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## GmanUK65 (27 Aug 2018)

I've got calf strain at the moment and had it for about 7 weeks now and still really sore. I'm not sure how it happened but I think it was when I came off a stationary bike, clipped in and something stopped my bike and did not have time to clip out. I seen the docs about 3 weeks ago and took a week off work. Went back to work (heavy lifting and pulling cages); it mildly hurts when riding too. I think a visit to the docs is needed again.

I'm mentioning this in this forum because about 2 months ago I thought about taking up touring and about 2 weeks ago I got my touring bike (I used this for commuting past 2 weeks and thought my calf had healed but it hadn't, as its about as bad as before I was on the sick). I've got the panniers and most of camping gear, just waiting for the tent now. I am raring to go on a camping one nighter next weekend but with this calf injury I don't think it would be worth it. What do people think? With September coming and October as a push would be my last chance to camp this year and with this calf injury will it be better in time (I'm definitely not ready for winter camping yet)

I'm thinking about taking more time off work but after the week off they gave me a lot of grief and even gave me a warning can you believe. I don't know what to do?


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## vickster (27 Aug 2018)

Pay to see a physio privately unless you can get seen rapidly via the NHS, and get proper hands on treatment and an exercise programme tailored to your issue. Are you icing the area! Have you tried massaging with some voltaren gel (assuming you don't have stomach issues and thus can't use nsaid).

According to a recent knee MRI, I've got a gastrocnemius strain, not that I've done anything specifically about it. Probably just adds to the pain around my knackered knee


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## Crankarm (28 Aug 2018)

GmanUK65 said:


> I've got calf strain at the moment and had it for about 7 weeks now and still really sore. I'm not sure how it happened but I think it was when I came off a stationary bike, clipped in and something stopped my bike and did not have time to clip out. I seen the docs about 3 weeks ago and took a week off work. Went back to work (heavy lifting and pulling cages); it mildly hurts when riding too. I think a visit to the docs is needed again.
> 
> I'm mentioning this in this forum because about 2 months ago I thought about taking up touring and about 2 weeks ago I got my touring bike (I used this for commuting past 2 weeks and thought my calf had healed but it hadn't, as its about as bad as before I was on the sick). I've got the panniers and most of camping gear, just waiting for the tent now. I am raring to go on a camping one nighter next weekend but with this calf injury I don't think it would be worth it. What do people think? With September coming and October as a push would be my last chance to camp this year and with this calf injury will it be better in time (I'm definitely not ready for winter camping yet)
> 
> I'm thinking about taking more time off work but after the week off they gave me a lot of grief and even gave me a warning can you believe. I don't know what to do?



You either continue to suffer and still not know what to do as your GP is not really geared up to treating sports injuries and NHS physic appointments are strictly rationed and they too don't have much experience of treating sports injuries, or you massage your calf as I described. You clearly haven't got a DVT, but a tear in either your gastroc or soleus muscle or where it joins the Achilles. Your calf will heal over time but will take longer if you are continually stressing it with heavy physical exertions such as lifting and pulling heavy items. My advice is don't bother with physio, certainly not NHS, total waste of time, well meaning, but waste of time. If pain really flares up then use frozen bag of peas and keep leg elevated, but after about one month depending on severity of tear in the fibres you should be able to gently start cross massaging.

You need to take ownership of your injury and sort it yourself. Your calf where the tear is will be trying to heal and scar tissue will be trying to form which won't be as strong as it previously was.. You need to wait about one month maybe more 6 weeks for it to actually heal AVOIDING heavy exertions such as lifting, that will just undo any healing that has taken place, then gently cross friction massage the area and adjacent to it as I described above with the ball, coupled with gently stretching the gastroc and soleus muscles to regain strength in other exercises. There are lots of videos on YT showing you the anatomy of the lower leg so you can get an idea of the physiology of the lower leg, but check out this guy Jon Blackburn on YT who is the chap whose video and advice helped heal my recurring painful calf injuries which would not heal. He is a runner. Here is his channel and video.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fP4nAWN0CEw&t=5s

With respect to your work situation, are you a member of a union? If so contact them for assistance. How long have you been with your employer? If you are unable to work through illness then you cannot work. Best get a doctor's note even if you can self certify. Short of dismissing you which might be unlawful depending on your length of service, the worst that can happen is they just don't pay you although you should still be paid SSP at the very least. Ask to see your company's sick policy and whether you qualify for company sick pay.


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## GmanUK65 (28 Aug 2018)

Crankarm said:


> You either continue to suffer and still not know what to do as your GP is not really geared up to treating sports injuries and NHS physic appointments are strictly rationed and they too don't have much experience of treating sports injuries, or you massage your calf as I described. You clearly haven't got a DVT, but a tear in either your gastroc or soleus muscle or where it joins the Achilles. Your calf will heal over time but will take longer if you are continually stressing it with heavy physical exertions such as lifting and pulling heavy items. My advice is don't bother with physio, certainly not NHS, total waste of time, well meaning, but waste of time. If pain really flares up then use frozen bag of peas and keep leg elevated, but after about one month depending on severity of tear in the fibres you should be able to gently start cross massaging.
> 
> You need to take ownership of your injury and sort it yourself. Your calf where the tear is will be trying to heal and scar tissue will be trying to form which won't be as strong as it previously was.. You need to wait about one month maybe more 6 weeks for it to actually heal AVOIDING heavy exertions such as lifting, that will just undo any healing that has taken place, then gently cross friction massage the area and adjacent to it as I described above with the ball, coupled with gently stretching the gastroc and soleus muscles to regain strength in other exercises. There are lots of videos on YT showing you the anatomy of the lower leg so you can get an idea of the physiology of the lower leg, but check out this guy Jon Blackburn on YT who is the chap whose video and advice helped heal my recurring painful calf injuries which would not heal. He is a runner. Here is his channel and video.
> 
> ...



I will look into this YT. I even know a guy that does sport physio/massage, I might get in touch with him. As for work, I know the sickness rules. At the minute I am on an 8 week programme where if I go on the sick in this period it goes up to 16 week programme. I've been with the company for 17 years so dismissal is doubtful. It is a supermarket so I might be able get them to put me on checkouts (I hate it but it may save me going on the sick). I've got a doctor appointment today.


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## GmanUK65 (28 Aug 2018)

vickster said:


> Pay to see a physio privately unless you can get seen rapidly via the NHS, and get proper hands on treatment and an exercise programme tailored to your issue. Are you icing the area! Have you tried massaging with some voltaren gel (assuming you don't have stomach issues and thus can't use nsaid).
> 
> According to a recent knee MRI, I've got a gastrocnemius strain, not that I've done anything specifically about it. Probably just adds to the pain around my knackered knee


Injuries eh! Yeah, I've got osteoarthritis in my left knee but if it gives me trouble I find cycling sorts it out


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## vickster (28 Aug 2018)

GmanUK65 said:


> Injuries eh! Yeah, I've got osteoarthritis in my left knee but if it gives me trouble I find cycling sorts it out


Indeed. Cycling is the one thing that doesn’t make my knee hurt as long as I avoid hills. Surgery in January to sort out the mechanical issues (trapped meniscus) and tidy up (hopefully relieve pain). Probably off bike for a couple of months (not such a hardship in winter)


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## Crankarm (29 Aug 2018)

GmanUK65 said:


> I will look into this YT. I even know a guy that does sport physio/massage, I might get in touch with him. As for work, I know the sickness rules. At the minute I am on an 8 week programme where if I go on the sick in this period it goes up to 16 week programme. I've been with the company for 17 years so dismissal is doubtful. It is a supermarket so I might be able get them to put me on checkouts (I hate it but it may save me going on the sick). I've got a doctor appointment today.



If you work in a shop you should have joined the union USDAW. 17 years is long service. If you have not previously had any or much sick leave in 17 years and they now dismissed you without first conducting an occupational health assessment and from this not making reasonable adjustments, then you could take them to a tribunal for unfair dismissal and likely win. If you aren't a union member then join one pdq although events that predate your joining they likely won't assist you with. Retail is a crap industry and pay at the bottom is pitiful. You need all the support you can get. Most supermarkets already have collective agreements with unions.


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## GmanUK65 (29 Aug 2018)

Crankarm said:


> If you work in a shop you should have joined the union USDAW. 17 years is long service. If you have not previously had any or much sick leave in 17 years and they now dismissed you without first conducting an occupational health assessment and from this not making reasonable adjustments, then you could take them to a tribunal for unfair dismissal and likely win. If you aren't a union member then join one pdq although events that predate your joining they likely won't assist you with. Retail is a crap industry and pay at the bottom is pitiful. You need all the support you can get. Most supermarkets already have collective agreements with unions.


Yes I'm in the union and I know the shop won't sack me, it's just the way they treat the workers at times by trying to make them feel guilty.

As it. happens I went to the docs and was told carry on working as I do. He also told me that riding my bike to work and back would be beneficial to helping calf to heal. Looking at the video on the small ball massaging looks interesting and I'm planning on giving it a go. I also mentioned I knew someone that was qualified in sport massage, he charges £25; I'm thinking on this too when I can afford it


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## Crankarm (29 Aug 2018)

GmanUK65 said:


> Yes I'm in the union and I know the shop won't sack me, it's just the way they treat the workers at times by trying to make them feel guilty.
> 
> As it. happens I went to the docs and was told carry on working as I do. He also told me that riding my bike to work and back would be beneficial to helping calf to heal. Looking at the video on the small ball massaging looks interesting and I'm planning on giving it a go. I also mentioned I knew someone that was qualified in sport massage, he charges £25; I'm thinking on this too when I can afford it



I would contact your union tell them you got a warning for being sick and see what they can do. Maybe they can help you by arranging an occupational health assessment? If it were me I would be appealing any disciplinary action if I was off work because I was genuinely ill and couldn't work. I am sure they could put you on lighter duties for a short time until such time as you have made a recovery to return to your previous duties. I think any employer who cares about their staff welfare would not have a problem with this and genuinely want to help. Have you contacted HR which may mean you get much better treatment by management once you have? You might even find your employer has signed up to a basic BUPA package for established qualifying members of staff so might get treatment this way. As good as the NHS is, with sports injuries IME they are pretty hopeless.

As I said GPs are generally not up to the task of treating sports injuries which yours is. Sorry but being told to just carry on is not correct advice. I was told this on several occasions. Poor. You need to make allowances for your injury for it to heal properly and avoid heavy lifting, pushing or pulling your calf excessively which will cause excessive strain to the muscles which they cannot handle at present as your tear has not healed properly. It will only tear again. After about 4-6 weeks of taking it easy the fibres will have healed enough so you can begin cross friction massage with the ball as in Jon Blackburn's YT vid. But go easy at first very easy. In fact start with more gentle rolling using a roller which you could start with earlier as it doesn't get into muscle fibres so deeply and is not so aggressive. You want to be gentle with the affected injured muscle not go mad and undo what healing has already taken place. You want to try to gently break up scar tissue and encourage new blood to flow in and the muscle fibres to reform. Scar tissue will be weak and will never be as strong as before and prone to further injury. You need a Lacroix ball, something about the size of a tennis ball but hard. You could even use a tennis ball, or cricket ball, hockey ball. The smaller the diameter the more it gets into the fibres, but closer to the chair/ground your calf will be. I use a hard wooden seated chair. The massage is heaven. Far better than any sports/physio massage I have ever had and no cost except for the ball.

Strangely when I injured my calfs cycling wasn't really affected as not too much tension goes through the calf muscles as cycling is low impact. I cycle at a higher cadence anyway so don't push and pull heavy gears which can ruin your knees and Achilles tendons.

HTH.


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