# Can you see cruise holidays ever recovering ?



## Dave7 (8 May 2020)

Prior to this virus there were a number of cases were sickness overtook an entire cruise ship.......just one person catches something or a bit of food poisoning and you have nowhere to go.
WITH this virus there have been cruise ships with 100s dying and no real way to help them.
We were close to booking a cruise around Croatia this year but chose a land holiday............now there is absolutely no way we would go on a cruise. 
There must be £billions of new, super big/super luxury cruise ships that will just sit there empty.
I cannot see it recovering for many years.


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## Gunk (8 May 2020)

They’ll have to sail with vastly reduced passenger numbers which means it just won’t be profitable, so like you say I can’t see it recovering.


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## Slick (8 May 2020)

I think it will eventually but there is bound to be casualties along the way as much like the airport industry 8 think it will be at least 2 years before they do. They were never my favourite ways of holidaying but I certainly wouldn't fancy going on one anytime soon.


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## sleuthey (8 May 2020)

Yes the liners are built to last decades and as long as they are maintained whilst they are alongside they are an asset that can be put straight back into service. The maintenance cost should be relatively small compared to the fuel and manning costs when in use. I assume they are owned by the cruise companies as fixed assets not leased so as long as they can retain the staff when the furlow ends they should be ok


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## MarkF (8 May 2020)

They'll be up and running by winter. If we can't fly then l'd go on a winter sun cruise.


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## snorri (8 May 2020)

Dave7 said:


> there have been cruise ships with 100s dying


I hadn't heard of things being as bad as that, where did you get this information?


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## NorthernDave (8 May 2020)

I've never seen the attraction, floating around in a seaborne Petri dish, but a mate and his wife absolutely love them and are busting at the gut to book another cruise as soon as it's safe to do so.

Rather them than me.


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## Alex H (8 May 2020)

snorri said:


> I hadn't heard of things being as bad as that, where did you get this information?



think it may be 'rumour' - THIS is the definitive cruise death website (allegedly)


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## GM (8 May 2020)

Dave7 said:


> Prior to this virus there were a number of cases were sickness overtook an entire cruise ship.......just one person catches something or a bit of food poisoning and you have nowhere to go.
> WITH this virus there have been cruise ships with 100s dying and no real way to help them.
> We were close to booking a cruise around Croatia this year but chose a land holiday............now there is absolutely no way we would go on a cruise.
> There must be £billions of new, super big/super luxury cruise ships that will just sit there empty.
> I cannot see it recovering for many years.




Jane McDonald's out of a job then


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## Slick (8 May 2020)

GM said:


> Jane McDonald's out of a job then


We live in hope.


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## snorri (8 May 2020)

Alex H said:


> think it may be 'rumour' - THIS is the definitive cruise death website (allegedly)


Yes, I think it is just rumour, according to Wikipedia the death toll is less than 100.
That cruise death website is quite something, I have scanned many shipping websites over the years but had not heard of that site before, not sure that I want to hear of it again.


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## slowmotion (8 May 2020)

I don't think the current mass market model of toxic overcrowding, diarrhoea and drunken brawling is sustainable.











Smaller cruise ships have a better chance but they'll be expensive.


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## MarkF (8 May 2020)

NorthernDave said:


> I've never seen the attraction, floating around in a seaborne Petri dish, but a mate and his wife absolutely love them and are busting at the gut to book another cruise as soon as it's safe to do so.
> 
> Rather them than me.



I'll give you pros and cons Dave and like you I have never seen the attraction of cruises but know people who swear by them. I've spent long time in many port cities and cringed as regular bar & restaurant A boards were replaced with others at a mega mark up, yep, a load of dullard cruisers are arriving!

Me & MrsF decided to try one for some late sun a couple of years ago, first package deal either of us had been on in over 30 years. We booked one to do go down Portugal, so Porto, Lisbon, then onto a resort (?), Gibralter, Malaga and Casablanca. I think the cost was about £850 for 7 nights and it was phenomenal value.

Cons.
Spending time with a lot of fatsos. Never seen anything like it, still have nightmares about Captains night & fit-to-burst sequined dresses.
Boorish cruise experts who basically eat till they can't and get pissed every single day and NEVER leave the ship. 
Food, I don't eat meat but was truly amazed at the choice and quality 24/7. So we didn't eat out, which is what we like doing on holiday.
Same place to eat/drink every night.
Can't get off it when you want. Was like jail for us.

Pros.
Wake up in a different place every morning.
Food, 24/7 whatever you want.

We both thought we'd never do one again but...........there was a caribbean one we saw for March that we'd have done. Jamaica, some other islands, Havana (not been), Limon (Costa Rica) & Cartegena. (Columbia) so that's the caribbean, Cuba, central & south america, a lot of boxes ticked for about £150 a night with PP, flights, transfers, food and drink! To try to do that yourself would cost many ££££'s more.


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## Dave7 (9 May 2020)

snorri said:


> I hadn't heard of things being as bad as that, where did you get this information?


As others have said it appears my info' was flawed......soz.
Having checked I see there are at least 40 ships affected. Many of them have hundreds of cases (one having over 700 cases). At least 70 dead in total.
However, the general point stands that it must be doing untold damage to the cruise industry as people start to think/realise how bad it must be to be trapped on a ship when any virus breaks out.
@slowmotion that photograph will be giving me nightmares for months to come


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## Fab Foodie (9 May 2020)

A few boats met-up for a meeting in Dover the other week....


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## wafter (9 May 2020)

Considering the amount of pollution they're apparently responsible for I certainly hope recent events have truly sealed their fate tbh.


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## Slick (9 May 2020)

A slot on the news this morning saying the industry is worth 10 billion to our economy with lots of service businesses on shore currently losing out like taxi companies but the worst was the food supplier sitting waiting on 1 million quid coming in from supplies already delivered and is holding on to 9ver one and a half million quids worth of stock. It's probably not that easy but I reckon I would have taken advantage of the panic buying and got rid of that long ago.


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## snorri (9 May 2020)

Dave7 said:


> As others have said it appears my info' was flawed......soz.


That's OK Dave7, there's a lot of info around and it's not easy to separate the true from the false.


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## dodgy (9 May 2020)

wafter said:


> Considering the amount of pollution they're apparently responsible for I certainly hope recent events have truly sealed their fate tbh.



I came here to make the same point but you beat me to it. Here's a non paywalled alternative https://www.euronews.com/2019/06/10...-oxide-than-all-europe-s-cars-analysis-claims

The pollution is absolutely staggering, I memorised some of these facts when they first emerged to quote to friends/family about to go on cruises, they completely rejected it simply because it is so mind bendingly unbelievable!

I would't go on a cruise pre-CV, but I wouldn't go now if you paid me.

That photo of the on-board swimming pool is my idea of hell btw.


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## NorthernDave (9 May 2020)

Slick said:


> A slot on the news this morning saying the industry is worth 10 billion to our economy with lots of service businesses on shore currently losing out like taxi companies but the worst was the food supplier sitting waiting on 1 million quid coming in from supplies already delivered and is holding on to 9ver one and a half million quids worth of stock. It's probably not that easy but I reckon I would have taken advantage of the panic buying and got rid of that long ago.


Slight risk of thread diversion, but it was on the news last week that catering suppliers are running out of storage space, especially freezers. They still have (or had) orders coming in to them, but with pubs, restaurants, etc being closed they can't ship it on.

Apparently they were getting rid of what they could to alternative sources, including food banks, but were having issues with the sheer amount of stock and the fact it was in catering sized packs - a pub might get through a 20kg pack of frozen chips in a few hours, but where is a normal shopper going to store that?


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## buzzy-beans (9 May 2020)

wafter said:


> Considering the amount of pollution they're apparently responsible for I certainly hope recent events have truly sealed their fate tbh.



You and me together as well as any and all long haul holidays in the sun, delivered by aircraft!

Personally speaking I would have to be dragged kicking and screaming onto one of those super liners, the very thought of being locked up on one of those infernal vessels ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.

The amount of pollution these and other large ocean going vessels and of course aircraft give out to the atmosphere honestly does beggar the question, why are they allowed to burn such fuels?


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## Slick (9 May 2020)

NorthernDave said:


> Slight risk of thread diversion, but it was on the news last week that catering suppliers are running out of storage space, especially freezers. They still have (or had) orders coming in to them, but with pubs, restaurants, etc being closed they can't ship it on.
> 
> Apparently they were getting rid of what they could to alternative sources, including food banks, but were having issues with the sheer amount of stock and the fact it was in catering sized packs - a pub might get through a 20kg pack of frozen chips in a few hours, but where is a normal shopper going to store that?


Not so much of a diversion as I think its relevant to the discussion. 

I did think that the catering sizes would be an issue, as nobody would sit on that level of stock if they could get rid.


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## wafter (9 May 2020)

buzzy-beans said:


> You and me together as well as any and all long haul holidays in the sun, delivered by aircraft!
> 
> Personally speaking I would have to be dragged kicking and screaming onto one of those super liners, the very thought of being locked up on one of those infernal vessels ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
> 
> The amount of pollution these and other large ocean going vessels and of course aircraft give out to the atmosphere honestly does beggar the question, why are they allowed to burn such fuels?


Absolutely! As with so many things I guess they're allowed to do it because it satisfies demand from those who either don't know or don't care about the environmental impact of their frivilous pursuits and it drives the economy / makes politically-influential people richer


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## Brandane (9 May 2020)

slowmotion said:


> I don't think the current mass market model of toxic overcrowding, diarrhoea and drunken brawling is sustainable.
> View attachment 520934
> 
> 
> ...


That scene looks just like my idea of hell . However @MarkF lists some good reasons for taking a cruise. Myself and the now ex fiancee took a 10 day cruise out of Newcastle last year with Fred Olsen, and I have to say she was the driving force with me being less keen - but I was pleasantly surprised. It was a more mature clientele though, which made for a better experience. We were actually quite young, at 56 and 57 .


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## slowmotion (9 May 2020)

Brandane said:


> That scene looks just like my idea of hell . However @MarkF lists some good reasons for taking a cruise. Myself and the now ex fiancee took a 10 day cruise out of Newcastle last year with Fred Olsen, and I have to say she was the driving force with me being less keen - but I was pleasantly surprised. It was a more mature clientele though, which made for a better experience. We were actually quite young, at 56 and 57 .


I'm sure there are some very pleasant cruises. I was just commenting on the 5000 passenger monsters. We rented a flat on St Kitts last year. Every single day, five ships docked at breakfast time and disgorged up to twenty thousand cruise passengers on an island with a local population of about 40,000. They all sailed away at tea time and were replaced by another load next day. The entire economy was geared to extracting as much cash as possible from them.


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## slowmotion (9 May 2020)

An eleven storey apartment block on a shallow keel can get quite lively in a bit of a blow.
[media]
]View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csQNTSwcN8E[/media]


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## buzzy-beans (9 May 2020)

Brandane said:


> That scene looks just like my idea of hell . However @MarkF lists some good reasons for taking a cruise. Myself and the now ex fiancee took a 10 day cruise out of Newcastle last year with Fred Olsen, and I have to say she was the driving force with me being less keen - but I was pleasantly surprised. It was a more mature clientele though, which made for a better experience. We were actually quite young, at 56 and 57 .



I know several people who go on those 5,000 or more cruise ships, some of whom go year after year, some even going several times a year. For me that would be nothing more and nothing less than tortured hell.

Before she died, my late mother in law borrowed my most beloved to go on cruises with her and she loved the experiences, but these were on very select small ships such as those owned by Fred Olsen and SAGA where the care and attention to finite detail was of an all together different nature.

But, as for me, never, I hate airports, I hate crowds and I hate the very thought of being crushed inside some darned great floating gin palace!


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## MarkF (9 May 2020)

buzzy-beans said:


> But, as for me, never, I hate airports, I hate crowds and I hate the very thought of being crushed inside some darned great floating gin palace!



From my one experience it is no more crushed than a hotel. I suppose were designed that way and my ship was a mid 1980's oldie.


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## screenman (9 May 2020)

Although not a style of holiday I desire, I do care for the effect it will have on the people who depend on the industry to feed themselves and their families. Whilst I agree it is bad for the environment, out of interest what is anyone in here doing to create employment that is green, I know of one who is, perhaps others can chip in as I am certainly interested.


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## snorri (9 May 2020)

For all of those decrying cruising holidays, what about the uncrowded luxury of a cruise on the 'Hebridean Princess'?


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## Slick (9 May 2020)

snorri said:


> For all of those decrying cruising holidays, what about the uncrowded luxury of a cruise on the 'Hebridean Princess'?


Quality. Probably shouldn't let them all into the secret though.


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## Brandane (10 May 2020)

snorri said:


> For all of those decrying cruising holidays, what about the uncrowded luxury of a cruise on the 'Hebridean Princess'?





Slick said:


> Quality. Probably shouldn't let them all into the secret though.


A converted 1960's car ferry .
If it's good enough for Her Maj, then I guess it would be ok for me .
It comes into Largs on a regular basis. I think I would need to save up my pennies for a while, and probably sell several body parts, to be able to afford a few nights cruising around the Western Isles.


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## Beebo (10 May 2020)

My parents were going to the Fjords in late May 2020, but have now rolled it over to Iceland in 2021. 
I’m surprised they didn’t just ask for money back but they wanted to do their bit.


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## fossyant (10 May 2020)

NorthernDave said:


> I've never seen the attraction, floating around in a seaborne Petri dish, but a mate and his wife absolutely love them and are busting at the gut to book another cruise as soon as it's safe to do so.
> 
> Rather them than me.



Not for me, I'd go stir crazy - floating prison comes to mind.


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## Rusty Nails (10 May 2020)

I hope so. I was planning on going on one when I am too old and feeble to go on proper holidays.





And no, not next year!


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## Dave7 (13 May 2020)

fossyant said:


> Not for me, I'd go stir crazy - floating prison comes to mind.


Me too.
We had friends who did 2 per year. They loved to take all the fancy suits and dresses plus sitting at the captains table.
I must say the photos of the food and various parts of the ships were impressive but not for me (or MrsD fortunately).


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## NorthernDave (13 May 2020)

Dave7 said:


> Me too.
> We had friends who did 2 per year. They loved to take all the fancy suits and dresses plus sitting at the captains table.
> I must say the photos of the food and various parts of the ships were impressive but not for me (or MrsD fortunately).



Does the Captain's Table still have those huge silver platters full of fish fingers on it?


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## steveindenmark (14 May 2020)

The ferry from Denmark to Harwich was as much as I could stand. The thought of then being coerced into trips on land with a guide waving a red flag to view things you have no interest in. Its not my idea of a holiday.

On the other hand. A Nile cruise would be appealing. I like Egypt and if you didnt like the cruising, you could always jump ship and get a hotel.


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## jowwy (25 Jun 2020)

i guess its all according who you cruise with, where you go and what you like in life.......i would never go to ibiza clubbing, benidorm disgusts me and sharm el sheikh no thanks.....

but i do love a cruise ship, with its 24/7 food, balcony views over the sea and setting sun, dolphins crashing around in the waves behind the ship, evening shows of comedy, song and acrobats..........chilling on the balcony while room service delivers a steak breakfast.

everyone is different and i for one can't wait to book up my next cruise, when safe to do so and wake up in a different country each morning.

Monaco, rome, lisbon, cartegina, barcelona, the canaries, madiera........all places i have cruised to and loved


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## MarkF (25 Jun 2020)

jowwy said:


> i guess its all according who you cruise with, where you go and what you like in life.......i would never go to ibiza clubbing, benidorm disgusts me and sharm el sheikh no thanks.....
> 
> but i do love a cruise ship, with its 24/7 food, balcony views over the sea and setting sun, dolphins crashing around in the waves behind the ship, evening shows of comedy, song and acrobats..........chilling on the balcony while room service delivers a steak breakfast.
> 
> ...



All our 3 kids got to choose where we went on holiday when they turned 16, the youngest son chose Benidorm much to MrsF's chagrin. We took out first cruise in Oct 2018 and tbh it didn't half remind me of Benidorm.


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2020)

MarkF said:


> All our 3 kids got to choose where we went on holiday when they turned 16, the youngest son chose Benidorm much to MrsF's chagrin. We took out first cruise in Oct 2018 and tbh it didn't half remind me of Benidorm.


like i said, its all according who you cruise with.........


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## Darius_Jedburgh (26 Jun 2020)

Took a cruise to Norwegian Fjords with Fred Olsen.
Whatever we do in future we will never waste as much money for so little return as on that cruise.
Caged up, everything costs an arm and a leg, food and drink were **** and if you didn't pay extra for the trips you were treated as a second class citizen.
Wouldn't worry me if the whole shebang went tits up.
Only good thing is when the big liners come into Liverpool with their oversized and overdressed yanks they put an awful lot of money into the local economy very quickly.


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## dodgy (26 Jun 2020)

Surely even the regular cruise goers are looking at the environmental impacts now which are well understood and at least having pause for thought before going on another?
We see stupid stuff all the time, Bournemouth the other day for instance, but none of us would admit to doing that. So why go on a holiday that you know is harming the environment, and not just an 'ickle bit'?


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2020)

dodgy said:


> Surely even the regular cruise goers are looking at the environmental impacts now which are well understood and at least having pause for thought before going on another?
> We see stupid stuff all the time, Bournemouth the other day for instance, but none of us would admit to doing that. So why go on a holiday that you know is harming the environment, and not just an 'ickle bit'?


like flying you mean.....aeroplanes do some damage to the environment too, with the huge runways and carbon foot print


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## AndyRM (26 Jun 2020)

jowwy said:


> like flying you mean.....aeroplanes do some damage to the environment too, with the huge runways and carbon foot print



They do, but nowhere near as much as cruise ships/cruises. 

The only cruise I've ever been interested in is 7,000 Tons of Metal, but I think it'll be a while (if ever) before that returns.


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## dodgy (26 Jun 2020)

jowwy said:


> like flying you mean.....aeroplanes do some damage to the environment too, with the huge runways and carbon foot print



Yup, that too. But right now, it's cruise ships that have the attention and rightly so.


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## MarkF (26 Jun 2020)

jowwy said:


> like i said, its all according who you cruise with.........


Who did I cruise with?


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## Gunk (26 Jun 2020)

Oops


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## jowwy (26 Jun 2020)

MarkF said:


> Who did I cruise with?


Yes........which company???


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## oldwheels (29 Jun 2020)

Slick said:


> Quality. Probably shouldn't let them all into the secret though.


Used to be the MV Columba the ferry for Mull. It was rumoured that it was lead lined as it was to be a refuge for royalty fleeing an atomic bomb attack. Side loader but it sailed in all weather conditions unlike today's modified blocks of flats.


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