# '86 Peugeot Elite Road Bike Project



## Rachid (4 Mar 2013)

Hello!

I recently purchased a 1986 Peugeot Elite road bike. Always been a huge fan of these road bikes and when I found one on Gumtree I quickly snapped it up. It's in really good condition with all the original 80's components still fitted. I've done some research online and found that It has the low end carbolite 103 frame however I'm still really keen to continue with the project. My plans are to use the bike for road cycling this summer.

The bike currently has:

CLB brake levers
CLB front and rear brake calipers
Simplex downtube friction shifters
Simplex front and rear derailleurs
5 speed maillard free wheel
Double front crankset (unbranded)
Rigida chrome rims on maillard hubs

I've been out on the bike in the wet and i'ts rather scary, takes so much longer due to the chrome surface of the oldschool rims. I'm looking to upgrade the wheels and some of the components, hopefully to a nice campagnolo/ultegra groupset. Has anyone done anything similar? I'm worried about compatibility issues etc.


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## biggs682 (4 Mar 2013)

std issue steel rims and damp weather can be improved by using koolstop brake pads or as you say alloy rimmed wheels .

the old Pugs make great everyday bikes no matter what tubing so enjoy it , pics please


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## smokeysmoo (4 Mar 2013)

What biggs said 

I've done a couple of 'low end Carbolite' Pugs and they've always turned out well and ridden really nicely.

+1 for a brake pad upgrade, and this will benefit you even if you replace the wheels, so it's a win/win.

The only negative with some French bikes, and Pugs in particular is their use of 24mm seatposts, but if it's not stuck and/or you've got enough post then it's not a problem, if not they are a right bitch to find.

A word of warning though, resto's can easily run aawy with your budget if your not careful, trust me on that 

These are the two I've previously done. First one I did a fixed gear conversion and cheated with PX10 decals for a period look, but it was a 198* Carbolite in reality 

BEFORE:






AFTER:





The second one I did a modern 10 speed conversion from what was basically another Carbolite frame, (can't find the before pic), into a full on winter bike/commuter: Note the use of older decals again 






Both projects were a joy to do, but both blew my initial budget out of the water, but you do these things for fun don't you. You'd never make money doing this for a living!

Important note: COLD SETTING alu frames to accept modern hubs is not recommended. I braced the whole thing at every stress point and went really slowly using the threaded bar method. Steel is perfect for cold setting but alu is a no no, although it can be done you need to be aware of the risks.


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## HovR (4 Mar 2013)

Rachid said:


> I've been out on the bike in the wet and i'ts rather scary, takes so much longer due to the chrome surface of the oldschool rims. I'm looking to upgrade the wheels and some of the components, hopefully to a nice campagnolo/ultegra groupset. Has anyone done anything similar? I'm worried about compatibility issues etc.


 
Wheels are a good upgrade, but there are some compatibility issues you can work around. Older hubs were narrower than modern versions, either 120 or 126mm over locknut distance, whereas modern bikes use 130 or 135mm. This can be solved by 'cold setting' the frame, as Smokey has linked to above. Be sure to measure the frame spacing first though, as I found out one of my bikes had been re-spaced to 130mm by the original owner.

As above, don't expect to be able to turn a profit on a retro rebuild - Whilst the project is great fun and you'll end up with an excellent bike at the end, it's not exactly cheap!


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## Rachid (4 Mar 2013)

biggs682 said:


> std issue steel rims and damp weather can be improved by using koolstop brake pads or as you say alloy rimmed wheels .
> 
> the old Pugs make great everyday bikes no matter what tubing so enjoy it , pics please



I'll look into those brake pads, thanks!



smokeysmoo said:


> What biggs said
> 
> I've done a couple of 'low end Carbolite' Pugs and they've always turned out well and ridden really nicely.
> 
> ...



Wow! Great work, they both turned out really well! I know who to ask of some advice then? 
I think I will definitely look into cold setting the frame to accept a newer hub. Looking to upgrade the components.


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## Teuchter (4 Mar 2013)

I love my 80s Carbolite Peugeot - I find it a great bike to ride.

I do second the advice on changing wheels to something with aluminium rims. Saying that, I do have an old Raleigh with chrome rims and I don't actually find it that bad unless it's chucking it down. In the more usual damp conditions or light rain it stops perfectly adequately (with forward planning!). Having the brakes properly set up with decent pads and free running cables helps a lot here.

If you're changing wheels, you may as well stick on a new 6 speed freewheel while you're at it. It'll be compatible with everything else you currently have. No need to cold set the frame if you're sticking with good old-fashioned freewheels... how many gears do you need? 

My Peugeot also has the original CLB brake calipers (though I fitted modern aero brake levers) and with alloy rims they stop me just fine. The Simplex kit is probably better than the Sachs-Huret that mine has - Simplex shifters seem to be well thought of.

As mentioned, the seat post is another issue - I'm lucky that mine fits me perfectly at max extension (based on the markings on the post). Longer replacements are hard to find being an unusual size.

Oh, and any photos of the bike?


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## Rachid (4 Mar 2013)

Teuchter said:


> I love my 80s Carbolite Peugeot - I find it a great bike to ride.
> 
> I do second the advice on changing wheels to something with aluminium rims. Saying that, I do have an old Raleigh with chrome rims and I don't actually find it that bad unless it's chucking it down. In the more usual damp conditions or light rain it stops perfectly adequately (with forward planning!). Having the brakes properly set up with decent pads and free running cables helps a lot here.
> 
> ...


 
Hey there,
Just noticed that you're in Erskine, I'm in Beith not too far away!
What wheels did you upgrade to on your Peugeot?
The seat post is just a little too short but not too bad, I'll be watching ebay for a longer one though.
Going on a cycle this afternoon so I 'll take a picture then


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## Teuchter (6 Mar 2013)

Rachid said:


> Hey there,
> Just noticed that you're in Erskine, I'm in Beith not too far away!
> What wheels did you upgrade to on your Peugeot?
> The seat post is just a little too short but not too bad, I'll be watching ebay for a longer one though.
> Going on a cycle this afternoon so I 'll take a picture then


Not far away at all!

I put on a new pair of Weinmann rimmed wheels available cheaply from eBay - think I paid somewhere around £50 for the pair.

Your bike is in a lot nicer condition than mine was when I pulled it out of the local skip. I posted about it in this thread:
http://www.cyclechat.net/threads/1989-peugeot-skip-find-restoration.107571/


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## Rachid (6 Mar 2013)




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## biggs682 (6 Mar 2013)

that looks nice and clean , so apart from wanting to upgrade the wheels whats the plan for the pug ?


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## Teuchter (6 Mar 2013)

Looks more or less the same as my frame including the brake cable routed inside the top tube.

Nice find.


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## Scilly Suffolk (6 Mar 2013)

Lots of Pugs of this vintage knocking about and they make great bikes to cut your retro teeth on (it's better to make cheap mistakes): you'll find lots of threads, both here and on other forums, about renovating/converting them.

Don't worry about it being made from a low-end tubeset: you don't want to practice on something exotic and the ride will be lovely.

As has been mentioned the seatposts are an unusual size and if you do find one on Ebay they go for around £50; I have seen bespoke options, but a similar price. A more viable option is this post from Decathlon; it's 23.4mm but comes with a 25mm shim which you cut in half along the vertical axis and with a bit of grease (both real and elbow) it will go in.

It's possible, but unlikely, that your bike may have a French bottom bracket: Peugeot completely swapped over from the French to British standard during the early/mid-Eighties, but were making British spec bikes throughout this period. Unless you plan on swapping-out the cranks, it won't be an issue and, as I say, it's likely that yours is British. All you need to know about bottom brackets can be found here (scroll down to the third from bottom table).

With regards to the spacing of the rear hub, yours should measure 126mm between the dropouts, which is the standard for 5 to 7 speed freewheels (which screw onto the hub). 8 speed cassettes and above (which slide onto a splined hub) are 130mm. Should you decide to upgrade to 8 speed, steel frames have enough flex to spring apart (it's only 2mm either side) so cold-setting isn't necessary but will make getting the wheel in and out easier.

You mentioned "a nice campagnolo/ultegra groupset" above; I would suggest you take things a little more slowly. First of all replace the consumables: cables, chain, brake pads and bar tape. With a good clean/degrease, lube and adjustment you will be surprised at the difference. Then upgrade to alloy rimmed wheels, a 7 speed freewheel, good tyres and dual pivot brakes. This will give you a good introduction to how your bike works, has minimal risk of compatibility problems and provide maximum performance bang for your upgrade bucks.

You will then have a rather decent bike for minimal outlay (£100ish) and have learned a lot. All that's then left to do is ride the hell out of it!


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## biggs682 (7 Mar 2013)

bravo Scilly Suffolk


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## Rachid (7 Mar 2013)

Scilly Suffolk said:


> Lots of Pugs of this vintage knocking about and they make great bikes to cut your retro teeth on (it's better to make cheap mistakes): you'll find lots of threads, both here and on other forums, about renovating/converting them.
> 
> Don't worry about it being made from a low-end tubeset: you don't want to practice on something exotic and the ride will be lovely.
> 
> ...


 
Thanks for your reply, some really good advice that I will take on board, thanks!

Since buying the bike I've replaced gear and brake inner cables, stripped and cleaned the calipers and fitted new brake blocks and also replaced both tyres and tubes.

I went on a 25ish mile round trip cycle from Beith to Largs today. The cycle there was really good, it was all uphill and very challenging (for me anyway). I was looking forward to the cycle back however my rear derailleur broke about 1 mile into the return journey. Nightmare!

So now I'm looking to replace the rear derailleur asap. Can you recommend a make/model ? I'm not really sure what is compatible and what isn't .


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## jim55 (7 Mar 2013)

i recently bought an 80s peugeot and then sold it on after converting ait to fixed gear ,i had a lot of spare parts so over and above the cost of the bike (50)i didnt spend much on it ,bar tape (8) chain (4) and inner tubes(3 quid for 2 from decathlon ) i think were the only parts i bought new the rest was just stuff i had lying about ,sold it for 150 ,lovely bike in the end
from this




to this


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## Teuchter (8 Mar 2013)

Rachid said:


> Thanks for your reply, some really good advice that I will take on board, thanks!
> 
> Since buying the bike I've replaced gear and brake inner cables, stripped and cleaned the calipers and fitted new brake blocks and also replaced both tyres and tubes.
> 
> ...


I replaced mine with a "vintage" shimano 600 derailleur from eBay fairly cheaply after missing out on the bidding on a few nice looking Suntours. Easy to set up (none of this modern indexing carry on!) and I'm now running it with a 14-28 with no problems. I think most old derailleurs will do the job, just make sure you get one that's bolt-on and not hook-on.


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## Scilly Suffolk (9 Mar 2013)

Rachid said:


> ...I went on a 25ish mile round trip cycle from Beith to Largs today. The cycle there was really good, it was all uphill and very challenging (for me anyway). I was looking forward to the cycle back however my rear derailleur broke about 1 mile into the return journey. Nightmare!...


 
Sorry to hear that, but don't despair as you're probably better off without it; although Simplex had a long history and a great reputation, by the Eighties they had been going downhill for some time. I bought a bike with a SX610 GT which promptly exploded into the spokes, so you're in good company!

Period Shimano mechs, such as Teuchter referred to, are plentiful and reasonably priced; assuming you won't be going 8 speed, then you have a huge choice. As a beginner you would be well advised to stick to Shimano or Campagnolo, so as to avoid any complications.

There used to be many more component manufacturers and it was quite common for one company's product to be rebranded: you might think you had avoided the woeful SX610 when you bought a Gipiemme Cronosprint, when they are one and the same.

Another reason to stick with the two most common brands, is that the Seventies and Eighties was also a period of great innovation and there are some weird and wonderful bits floating around that will have you pulling your hair out.

Although it's not likely to be an issue with your set-up, now would be a good time to familiarise yourself with two points to consider when choosing a rear mech: chain wrap and sprocket (the rear cogs) capacity.

Sprocket capacity is simply the largest sprocket it can handle. Using the SX610 GT as an example, you can see (listed as _Max Cog Size_) that it can handle a sprocket with 36 teeth, which is pretty generous by today's standards.

If you look at a mountain bike (which tend to have larger sprockets than road bikes) you'll see that the cage (which contains the two jockey wheels) is longer than that typically found on a road bike, so that it can cope with the bigger sprockets: the longer the cage, the greater the capacity. The advantage of a shorter cage is that changing gear is quicker and crisper, hence the different versions.

Chain wrap is explained on this page (third and fourth paragraphs). These days you are unlikely to see the wrap quoted in the headline specs, as modern derailleurs can all cope with what has become the standard range of sprockets and chainrings. But if you are using older kit or have a set-up at the extreme of the usual range (touring in hilly areas for example), it's worth bearing in mind. The SX610 GT could cope with both of the example set-ups because it has a maximum chain wrap capacity of 38 teeth.


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## Scilly Suffolk (10 Mar 2013)

I forgot to mention two websites that I have found really helpful in getting my head around all the technical jargon, compatibility issues and for clear instruction on maintenance and repairs.

Sheldon Brown's website is a mine of information, particularly if your interest is in older bikes: the glossary is a good place to start. He also explains the different component standards you are likely to encounter: the pages on bottom brackets, headsets and tyre sizes are worth bookmarking.

The Park Tools blog is bang up to date, but much of it is relevant whatever you ride. The two articles I keep referring to are derailleur adjustment (front and rear) and handlebar wrapping. It's a good place to start if you are unsure as to whether a job is within your capabilities.


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## smokeysmoo (10 Mar 2013)

+1 for the mighty Sheldon and Park Tool as SS suggests.

I also have 3 You Tube vids saved in favourites that I refer to when I'm doing these jobs, one for gear adjustment, and two for wrapping bars.

View: http://youtu.be/SkzvfCaIbyQ



View: http://youtu.be/psmxYxmE3T8



View: http://youtu.be/P7KwGCDWlUk


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## biggs682 (10 Mar 2013)

i always start at the centre working along


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## thegravestoneman (11 Mar 2013)

I haven't had to wrap a bar in years, but I used to find starting from the middle used to cause the tape to 'curl' particularly on the top bend behind the levers once used for a short while? It did stop the unwinding at the tape end once the finishing tape failed though, due to it being held in by the plugs or champagne corks I liked to use.


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## SonicRob (13 Mar 2013)

i've just got an old ladies universal 12 speed bike cost me £30 and run's quite well but the crank has a 48/41 chainrings on it and i was wondering could i just get a modern day crankset compact like an fsa on the bardman bike will that work ? or the poor girl won't be able to get up the hills


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## Gravity Aided (17 Mar 2013)

​Ran across this 1988 Peugeot Versailles in a bookstore downtown. Needs a new saddle and some other maintenance, but the bike rides great.Hle frames are a lot lighter than the carbolite frames, IMHO.Well worth the U.S.120.00 spent. I'll take off the plastic pedals when the salt comes off the roads.​




​


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## Pedal Bob (22 Mar 2013)

It's a sure sign that you are getting older, when you think that 1988 was fairly recently, then you do the math and realise that it was 25 years ago...gulp!
Really like the look of your bike Gravity Aided, I'm going for a quick browse on Ebay......


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## thegravestoneman (22 Mar 2013)

Pedal Bob said:


> It's a sure sign that you are getting older, when you think that 1988 was fairly recently, then you do the math and realise that it was 25 years ago...gulp!
> Really like the look of your bike Gravity Aided, I'm going for a quick browse on Ebay......


 
shh! I am still kidding myself


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## Gravity Aided (23 Mar 2013)

Made of HLE, which had titanium, aluminium, and nobium added to the steel, and internal lugs, which makes it ride a bit stiffer than my old Uo-8, if memory serves. A very responsive cycle, especially in the turns. The test ride was a very positive experience for a ride in 36 degree weather.


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## lmk1 (25 Jun 2013)

this is a Peugeot perthus frame I bought a while back it's finished and i'll post a pic over next day or so. finished in modern components with a powder coating on frame.


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## lmk1 (26 Jun 2013)

my Peugeot perthus after a powder coat and some new bits and bobs


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## Gravity Aided (27 Jun 2013)

Nice ! A very interesting and tasteful update, lmk1.


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## Teuchter (1 Jul 2013)

lmk1 said:


> View attachment 25331
> 
> 
> my Peugeot perthus after a powder coat and some new bits and bobs


Nice. Thinking of getting a couple of old frames including my Peugeot powder coated some time. Did you have any issues sticking the decals on over the powder coat?


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## lmk1 (2 Jul 2013)

to Teuchter
no issues with sticking the decals over the powder coat. I did buy some lacquer from Halfords and gave everything a spray when I was finished. if you are getting the frames powder coated insist on getting them shot blasted then collect them to tape up all the threads before returning them to be powder coated. I had problems and needed to retap various threads.


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## biggs682 (2 Jul 2013)

looks nice imho i would have gone for a more retro crankset


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## zophiel (2 Jul 2013)

I have one of these sat on my shed wall at the moment, unsure what to do with it. Just the frame forks and bars. there is some corrosion on the bottom of the headset tube.


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## shumidrivesaferrari (3 Jul 2013)

smokeysmoo said:


> What biggs said
> 
> I've done a couple of 'low end Carbolite' Pugs and they've always turned out well and ridden really nicely.
> 
> ...


 

have you resprayed this ? well obviously you did cos its a different colour but how did you go about it? sand the frame down? also is the best way just to remove the decals and buy new ones ?


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## smokeysmoo (3 Jul 2013)

shumidrivesaferrari said:


> have you resprayed this ? well obviously you did cos its a different colour but how did you go about it? sand the frame down? also is the best way just to remove the decals and buy new ones ?


 
Yup, both fully re-sprayed. I use Nitro Mors paint stripped to get rid of the bulk of the paint, then sand any areas that might have been missed, (not many if any TBH), then key the frame with a light sanding, then I gave them to a mate who owns a vehicle bodyshop, so exactly what he did I'm oblivious too TBH, they just come paint looking shiny and spanking.

You can do them with a rattle can, (aerosol), but you do need to take your time to get a good finish. Powder coating is another option, and this is more a lot harder wearing than a paint finish, just depends on what you plan to do with it, how good a finish you want, the timescale, facilities available to you and ultimately cost.

Not all decals are available, but loads of new decals are readily available from place like H.LLOYD CYCLES


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## ehutchison (11 Oct 2014)

Hi guys, really interesting reading here.

Smokeysmoo, I'm really interested in how you cold-set your carbolite frame. I've got a Premiere pug in carbolite 103 that I bought earlier in the year and I'm looking for a modern upgrade, much like what you've done but the dropout width seems to be my problem.
You mention you went for the threaded bar method, as opposed to Sheldon's 2x4 (something I'd be much more inclined to do).
I'm obviously keen to not damage the frame so I'm interested to know where you braced the frame and over what time you expanded the dropout?

I have a modern pair of alloy wheels with a 135mm hub width which _do fit _in-between the dropouts when stretched but the quick-release doesn't tighten sufficiently to be road-worthy, I assume because the dropouts haven't been *set*. Is this a problem anyone else has encountered?

As for the seat post, I'm lucky to have a peugeot mountain bike post to suit my height (6'3" on 60" frame) and there's a company in the states who make converters for the odd tub diameters for modern stems because I couldn't for the life of me find a suitably sized quill stem.

I just need to get ride of the suicide brake levers...



smokeysmoo said:


> What biggs said
> 
> I've done a couple of 'low end Carbolite' Pugs and they've always turned out well and ridden really nicely.
> 
> ...


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## smokeysmoo (11 Oct 2014)

ehutchison said:


> Smokeysmoo, I'm really interested in how you cold-set your carbolite frame. I'm obviously keen to not damage the frame so I'm interested to know where you braced the frame and over what time you expanded the dropout?


The threaded bar method allows for more finesse than simply levering things apart with a piece of 2 x 4, and I wouldn't recommend the latter on an alu frame anyway. BTW, cold setting in anyway shape or form is not recommended for alu frames at all TBH.

That said, it clearly can be done with a little patience.

I just braced the frame at the stress points between the chain stays and the seat stays




I just got a piece of threaded rod, size doesn't really matter as long as it fits in the drop outs, but not too thin so it bends under pressure. Spin two nuts onto the rod, then slide on two big flat washers.

Fit the rod in the drop outs with all the 'hardware' on the inside and then tighten the nuts upto the washers.

Just tighten one side a couple of turns and then the other, and just keep going until you've spaced it about 5mm beyond what you need it to be, (this allows for some springback).

I left it for a couple of days while I was doing other jobs anyway, but overnight should do it. If not just stick the bar back in for a bit longer.

Another way I've done it, (but it's a bit Heath Robinson TBH, and probably even less recommended on an alu frame than Sheldon's method as well), is to cut of piece of timber 5mm wider than you want, force the dropouts apart and wedge the timber in, leave it a day or so and Bob's your Uncle.

Hope that helps


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## ehutchison (20 Oct 2014)

Very helpful, thank you!


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