# Stage 17 SPOILER



## rich p (22 Jul 2010)

Well, they're off for the big one and it's on Eurosport all ady so that's my chores buggered.
Go Andy!!!

Against a backdrop of Chimera Hamilton talking to US investigators about USP

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/hamilton-to-speak-with-federal-investigators


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## rich p (22 Jul 2010)

User3094 said:


> If Contadors going to take this with any credibility then its going to have to be a 31+ second margin?
> 
> (same goes for Saturday)




True but Bertie will be expected to take several minutes in the ITT


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

A mate of mine's on the Tourmalet. The weather is minging up there. Harmon on Eurosport reckons the helicopters won't be beaming pictures from the climbs - we'll be following from ground level.

I think AS and AC will end up marking each other out and no change to the GC. Don't think AS has quite got enough to get clear away. That said, he's got to try his utmost as Menchov (even Sanchez) could still out-TT him.....


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## rich p (22 Jul 2010)

Sanchez is badly injured by the look 

Maybe not but ...


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## rich p (22 Jul 2010)

Bertie slowed everyon down but Sastre has refused to slow down by the look of it


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

rich p said:


> Sanchez is badly injured by the look
> 
> Maybe not but ...



Not badly injured but he certainly doesn't look too comfortable. Good news for Menchoz, perhaps.....provided he can keep it upright. He's managed it so far.....


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## rich p (22 Jul 2010)

theboytaylor said:


> Not badly injured but he certainly doesn't look too comfortable. Good news for Menchoz, perhaps.....provided he can keep it upright. He's managed it so far.....




 not got a good track record tho!


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

rich p said:


> not got a good track record tho!



nope

http://snipurl.com/zpqxd


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## Scoosh (22 Jul 2010)

On how many of this year's stages has a rider from Euskatel-Euskadie NOT fallen ? At least one of them seems to hit the ground sometime on each stage !


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

ha! ha! a load of sheep have just legged it across the road right in front of the peloton on the Soulor! Everyone stayed upright

Wonder if Bertie would have waited if Schleck had been taken out?

Weather looks absolutely abysmal there.


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

Vino stops to collect a snacking sheep for later.


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

The descent looked f*king terrifying. I'd have pulled over and waited.


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> The descent looked f*king terrifying. I'd have pulled over and waited.


Or walk. It's a long way down in Sidis.

Carlos Sastre for fruitless venture of the day award?


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## Steve Austin (22 Jul 2010)

i don't understand what sastre was hoping for, now he's completely blown and been spat out the back of the peleton. silly move


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

man, this is really tense. will it all kick off @10km ?


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

Christ almighty, Liggett and Sherwen don't half talk shite.


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> Christ almighty, Liggett and Sherwen don't half talk shite.



My Virgin subscription has paid it's way by allowing me to avoid listening to them this year

Schleck's moving!


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## Steve Austin (22 Jul 2010)

schleck has just put the hammer on contador


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## Dave Davenport (22 Jul 2010)

during the f'ing adverts on itv!


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## zacklaws (22 Jul 2010)

Why do these 7% and 9% slopes look so fearsome, they seem to dwarf the 14% to 20% I'm used too, is it due to telephoto lenses etc?


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## biking_fox (22 Jul 2010)

Not much of a hammer though - Bertie's right with him?


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## Steve Austin (22 Jul 2010)

zacklaws said:


> Why do these 7% and 9% slopes look so fearsome, they seem to dwarf the 14% to 20% I'm used too, is it due to telephoto lenses etc?



and they're in the big ring


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Jul 2010)

this is very tense! neither looks like they can give much more...


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## biking_fox (22 Jul 2010)

What's Andy shouting?

Stop wheelsucking?


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

Those crowds scare the hell out of me...


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

Bertie lets Schleck take it! Fair enough.


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## biking_fox (22 Jul 2010)

No time difference at all!

Bertie for the win then. Maybe I prefered it when there were bonus seconds on the placings too.


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## Crankarm (22 Jul 2010)

biking_fox said:


> No time difference at all!
> 
> Bertie for the win then. Maybe I prefered it when there were bonus seconds on the placings too.



Errr .......... Andy Schleck stage 17 win. Maybe Contadour for the GC win, but who can say he might fall off ................


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

"There's no doubt that Armstrong would be close to the top were it not for his crashes and bad luck earlier in this Tour"
Oh _do_ piss off Liggett, you sycophantic old butt-sucker.


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## Crankarm (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> "There's no doubt that Armstrong would be close to the top were it not for his crashes and bad luck earlier in this Tour"
> Oh _do_ piss off Liggett, you sycophantic old butt-sucker.



Maybe LA will have to ride one more year ..................


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

Crankarm said:


> Maybe LA will have to ride one more year ..................


Sponsored by Stannah?


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

Interesting, Stephen Roche on Eurosport is suggesting AS' (or Saxo's) tactics weren't right. Schleck blew off the rest of the GC guys too early - he could have used them as foils for his own attacks, given AC loads of different things to think about. Also, his accelerations weren't sharp enough, he just steadily lifted the pace to a higher level. 

And he should have tried to counter AC's attack when he reeled it in.

It was as if Andy simply didn't believe he could break him. Maybe AS was hoping for AC to blow up straight away @ 10k out and as soon as that didn't work he was unsure what to do.


Still two stages to go, though.


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## Crankarm (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> Sponsored by Stannah?



Heheheheheeeee ..........


.


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Jul 2010)

I don't think Schleck had it, and nor did Contador. However what you've got to remember is that Schleck is a relatively weak time-triallist compared to some others in the GC positions just below him, so he had to make sure he got some time on them, not just try to gain some on Contador. He probably couldn't do both, so at least he may have secured his second place.


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## Chuffy (22 Jul 2010)

theboytaylor said:


> Interesting, Stephen Roche on Eurosport is suggesting AS' (or Saxo's) tactics weren't right. Schleck blew off the rest of the GC guys too early - he could have used them as foils for his own attacks, given AC loads of different things to think about. Also, his accelerations weren't sharp enough, he just steadily lifted the pace to a higher level.


It was classic Riis. Very conservative and very, very predictable. They did exactly the same on Alpe D'Huez when Sastre won. I don't think you can blow Contador off like that, I'm not sure exactly what _would_ do the trick, but steady riding definitely won't. 

I wonder what impact the loss of Franck actually had in the end? Personally I think that it forced Andy to ride his own race, rather than looking to Big Bro for guidance.


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## raindog (22 Jul 2010)

As far as climbing goes you couldn't get a fag paper between those two this year. I just curse that SRAM drama the other day for taking away some of the excitement. Dramatic image of them battling together in the mist though - doesn't get much better imo.


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## theboytaylor (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> I wonder what impact the loss of Franck actually had in the end? Personally I think that it forced Andy to ride his own race, rather than looking to Big Bro for guidance.



Saxo would have had someone else to fire up the road to maybe give Contador a few more problems. Saxo kept on using up all their domestiques to shake the bunch down to a manageable number, but all the other GC guys knew that as long as they could stick with AS and AC then they would always be in the final selection, without ever looking like they could actually get the yellow themselves. Therefore Contador only really had to keep his eye on Schleck. Having another guy capable of contesting the Classement (respect to Mr Kelly) would have certainly given Contador a few headaches.


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## Flying_Monkey (22 Jul 2010)

Chuffy said:


> It was classic Riis. Very conservative and very, very predictable. They did exactly the same on Alpe D'Huez when Sastre won. I don't think you can blow Contador off like that, I'm not sure exactly what _would_ do the trick, but steady riding definitely won't.
> 
> I wonder what impact the loss of Franck actually had in the end? Personally I think that it forced Andy to ride his own race, rather than looking to Big Bro for guidance.



Well, next year, Frank's going to be the big influence again, as they're both leaving Riis...


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## mangaman (22 Jul 2010)

Typically - I forgot to set the bleeding Sky Plus today (why doesn't Eurosport have series link?)

How were the 2 at the end - did Andy still seem pissed off with Bertie or did they show some mutual respect at the end?

Sounded like an amazing spectacle


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## Kirstie (22 Jul 2010)

Funnily enough my work has Eurosport player blocked, so I had to make do with the text updates. Bah.


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## frank9755 (22 Jul 2010)

mangaman said:


> Typically - I forgot to set the bleeding Sky Plus today (why doesn't Eurosport have series link?)
> 
> How were the 2 at the end - did Andy still seem pissed off with Bertie or did they show some mutual respect at the end?
> 
> Sounded like an amazing spectacle



Bad luck!


They were hugging at the end.


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## darkstar (22 Jul 2010)

Great effort by both of the leaders today, both matched each other till the end. Not fussed who wins out of the two.

Have to say though, the crowd are absolutely nuts, weird as hell. Where do they come from??


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## raindog (22 Jul 2010)

Second in the Tour, White Jersey winner, two stage wins and a big future ahead is hardly f*cked imo.


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## mik (22 Jul 2010)

maybe they should start to employ team tactics al la F1... so that say half way up the Tourmalet Fabian Cancellara could have steered his bike flat out into Contador's thus allowing Andy Shleck to escape to a well deserved victory


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## mangaman (22 Jul 2010)

mik said:


> maybe they should start to employ team tactics al la F1... so that say half way up the Tourmalet Fabian Cancellara could have steered his bike flat out into Contador's thus allowing Andy Shleck to escape to a well deserved victory



Actually I've often wondered that. A skilled bike-handler like Canellara, when finishing his turn on the front, pulls away into Contador's path. I'm sure they could make it look accidental. Of course Schleck wouldn't have to wait after the last little spat they had.

I'm surprised Riis hasn't had the team out practising for months  

I suppose there's a danger of Cancellara breaking a bone or something.


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## Scoosh (22 Jul 2010)

mik said:


> maybe they should start to employ team tactics al la F1... so that say half way up the Tourmalet Fabian Cancellara could have steered his bike flat out into Contador's thus allowing Andy Shleck to escape to a well deserved victory


... or like the final lead-out guy in the sprint, when moving over, chooses the side when the main perceived threat is coming .....


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## mangaman (22 Jul 2010)

scoosh said:


> ... or like the final lead-out guy in the sprint, when moving over, chooses the side when the main perceived threat is coming .....



Er - I think Mark Renshaw's already done that


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## Willo (22 Jul 2010)

mangaman said:


> Typically - I forgot to set the bleeding Sky Plus today (why doesn't Eurosport have series link?)
> 
> How were the 2 at the end - did Andy still seem pissed off with Bertie or did they show some mutual respect at the end?
> 
> Sounded like an amazing spectacle



The highlights show works on Series link (well most of the time unless Eurosport juggle their schedule at short notice). Harman and Kelly have confirmed themselves as my favourites this tour in watching both them and ITV4. 

Even though nothing in it at the end, have to be impressed to see them go up today. I think it's always looks more dramatic to see them cycling through the clouds rather than the sunshine. Schlek's come across well on this tour, and I enjoyed watching him stare out Contador today even if he couldn't break him down. Suspect the TT will see AC wipe out any doubt, but it would be horrible if the time gained on the chain stage became the margin.


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## mangaman (23 Jul 2010)

Willo said:


> The highlights show works on Series link (well most of the time unless Eurosport juggle their schedule at short notice).



Thanks Willo - although I've left it a bit late to find out  

As you say - they aren't good at juggling their schedules. I gather it's up to the TV stations to alert Sky if a programme time will change and the sky + will automatically change. Eurosport don't do that.

Having said that - the coverage on Eurosport has been excellant for me. James Richardson is learrning year by year about cycling and now seems to really like it. Stephen Roche has been great - especially with the insights from his son.

Harmon and Kelly are the kings of commentary for me.

We've had whole stages from start to finish and I've been interested. It must be virtually impossible to commentate for that long alone for 3 weeks and not become too boring - I think Dave Harmon gets as close as anyone.

And he rides the finishes sometimes and gives little titbits of insider knowledge.

Sean Kelly is, of course, a legend.


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## threebikesmcginty (23 Jul 2010)

The average speed was over 19mph and it looked bloody hard work - gasp!

Nice to see Shleck and Contador are bestest friends in the whole wide world again.


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## Globalti (23 Jul 2010)

From the look of him I reckon Contador could have blown Schleck away any time he fancied. How do those barstewards manage to climb for so long out of the saddle? What would have happened if Contador had had a mechanical during the climb?


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## raindog (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> From the look of him I reckon Contador could have blown Schleck away any time he fancied.


So how come, when he tried, about 3ks from the summit, Andy stayed with him?


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## MacB (23 Jul 2010)

I'm undecided on this, I sort of agree with Roche that the tactics were lacking from Schleck, did he really think he'd ride Contador off his wheel? But if they are this closely matched it seems a shame that the whole tour will really come down to time trialling. Call me old fashioned but I find the whole team setups, peleton control and predictability a bit boring at times. For something that's meant to be a race a heck of a lot of it looks like a training run.


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## MajorMantra (23 Jul 2010)

Good photos here:

http://www.steephill.tv/2010/tour-de-france/photos/stage-17/

That was one of the best bits of TV I've seen in a while. Just wish Schleck had got away. Having grown up in Lux I have to root for him.


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## Globalti (23 Jul 2010)

raindog said:


> So how come, when he tried, about 3ks from the summit, Andy stayed with him?



I think he struggled; Contador could have dropped him at that point IMO but he didn't want to; he was showing Schleck he could whip him any time but was going to give him the stage as a consolation prize. I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.


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## Shadow (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I worked in Spain for a year and _I know his type.
> _



As in brilliant rider. 

My opinion of him has changed since the chain incident but he is the best tour rider at the moment. And could be for a number of years.


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## Flying_Monkey (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.



We can do without this kind of racism in these forums, thanks.

Original post edited by admin.


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## Globalti (23 Jul 2010)

That's not racism; that's just plain unfounded prejudice. I never mentioned his race (except the Tour de France of course, ha ha ha).


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## raindog (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I think he struggled; Contador could have dropped him at that point IMO but he didn't want to; he was showing Schleck he could whip him any time but was going to give him the stage as a consolation prize. I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.


He couldn't drop Andy, and Andy couldn't drop him. I'm pretty sure Berto would've loved to take that stage, but he couldn't.

I echo Flying Monkey's comment about racism. I enjoy participating on this forum, but it can be a strange agressive place sometimes. Not very nice, really.


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## Crackle (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I think he struggled; Contador could have dropped him at that point IMO but he didn't want to; he was showing Schleck he could whip him any time but was going to give him the stage as a consolation prize. I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.



Nurse! Globalti has dropped his monocle and needs his bath chair wheeling out the sun and send the manservant with the fan to cool him down please.


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## Globalti (23 Jul 2010)

S'not my fault nurse! I had to watch it on the stupid little TV screen those football managers threw out.


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## Scoosh (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I think he struggled; Contador could have dropped him at that point IMO but he didn't want to; he was showing Schleck he could whip him any time but was going to give him the stage as a consolation prize.


I would agree with that.

Contador looked strong enough to take the stage had he gone away earlier then the final bend/'sprint' to the line. If he had dared to take the stage then, when Schleck had led him up 95% of the climb ... well, I don't think even all the Spanish fans there would have accepted that , nor been able to save him  !

I met a Swiss couple this arvo and the guy said that Schleck/Contador's cadence going up the Tourmalet was 100rpm !

That is amazing but that's what makes them so different from the rest (of us ).


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## Chuffy (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.


I've lived in this country all my life and I know your type too.


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## aJohnson (23 Jul 2010)

Globalti said:


> I think he struggled; Contador could have dropped him at that point IMO but he didn't want to; he was showing Schleck he could whip him any time but was going to give him the stage as a consolation prize. I don't like him: I worked in Spain for a year and I know his type.




I think Contador was just showing he is in decent form. If he could have dropped Andy, he would have, that way he could say that the 39seconds he took on the Pyrenees didn't matter and he would have won even if he would have waited. I do think Contador could have won the stage though.


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## Ludwig (24 Jul 2010)

Conty could have taken the stage but it would have been very unsporting to have sat on Schlecks shoulder all that way and nicked it at the end. Also they might be team mates next year. It has been a superb race, full of incident and drama and no drugs busts as yet. Still can get over that head butt. That was gbh. I think Chris Boardman and been superb and is a natural in front of the mike. Looking forward to todays time trial


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## raindog (24 Jul 2010)

Ludwig said:


> Conty could have taken the stage but it would have been very unsporting to have sat on Schlecks shoulder all that way and nicked it at the end. Also they might be team mates next year.


eh?!! Where did you hear that?

The Schlecks will head a team based in Luxembourg and Berto is on the point of resigning with Vino's mob, although there are rumours that Riis is trying to entice him with a big bucks contract.


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