# Toilet cisterns, i had no idea.



## gbb (4 Oct 2020)

I was listening to R4 the other day, the discussion was water wastage via cisterns, something like 20% of houses leak up to 8000 litres of water a day (if I heard that bit right, but even so it's a substantial figure) , a figure I guffawed at out loud and uttered 'fark off'.
But as the program progressed I learned something. Typical push valve cisterns will inevitably leak by design, once the rubber seal inevitably gets detritus under it, or the seal perishes, leakage is inevitable.
Older style lever operated siphons cannot leak by design. They can fail of course but not leak.

This then made sense, I'm glad I'm an old stubborn so and so and stuck with what I know and have syphon systems. Also in maintenance at work, I know the quality of valve systems is becoming ever poorer.


Valve systems were vaunted by the EU beaurocrats in maybe the 80s and theyve become a popular choice now. 

Just a little something that caught my interest, who would have thought ?


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## cosmicbike (4 Oct 2020)

Yes, and since the failure mode simply amounts to a vary small, but constant, flow of water into the toilet bowl, most people never even notice it's happening.


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## Shreds (4 Oct 2020)

Worry more about a damaged old black cistern or seat. Check out the ones that contain asbestos fibres!


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## roubaixtuesday (4 Oct 2020)

gbb said:


> Valve systems were vaunted by the EU beaurocrats



I'm sceptical. Convince me.


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## Drago (4 Oct 2020)

roubaixtuesday said:


> I'm sceptical. Convince me.


I've just googled i to see that theres an avalanche of information for anyone that can be bothered to look (which I can't).


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## ProfSquirrel (5 Oct 2020)

gbb said:


> Older style lever operated siphons cannot leak by design. They can fail of course but not leak.
> 
> This then made sense, I'm glad I'm an old stubborn so and so and stuck with what I know and have syphon systems. Also in maintenance at work, I know the quality of valve systems is becoming ever poorer.



They don't tend to fail suddenly as well so gives you a chance.

They're really simple and the failure point are easy to fail. Recently cut the oval out of a thick dog food bag and fixed ours. Plumber previously said to us they'd just want to replace everything. I can see why they'd want to save time and all that - though I'd expect them to have spare seals and cones etc and generally know what a symptom means from experience...

Saw a video on YT recently about replacing the seal/cone in the fill valve. They cost <£1. But everyone was saying "too complicated, just buy a new one for £10 from x". Which is such a waste, considering you could replace the cone without removing the whole valve!


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