# Stolen Bike. Known Perpetrator. How to get Police to take some action?



## Sheffield_Tiger (19 Apr 2016)

Just wondering if any of the members here who are on the force can give any advice.

We're getting frustrated by the fact that we have a 99% certainty that we know who stole a £1000 electric bike at the weekend. We have a name and address for them and a verifiable source for this information. The bike is very unusual and is not normally seen around. We have keys that will fit it and the serial number in the manual that should come with it, also the manufacturer has a record of the date of sale to us and the s/n

South Yorkshire Police promised to come and see us yesterday and didn't even bother turning up. Rung again and they reluctantly agreed to pop in today with a "we can't do anything about it though other than knock on the door and ask". But again, they never showed up.

"Hello sir, are you a bicycle thief". "No", "OK, thanks for your time, sorry to have troubled you"

Makes you wonder what is the point? I've already had to go up to sneak and peek at the property of a known violent criminal just served 180 hours for assault just to get information. Do I have to be violently beaten before police take action (probably against me for a breach of the peace or some nonsense like that)

Is there any way of prompting them into action because TWO DAYS ON THE TROT now they have promised to turn up and take details, copy of CCTV etc. And TOTALLY FAILED to do so.

Makes a nonsense of their poster


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## Pale Rider (19 Apr 2016)

No one, especially coppers, likes being told how to do their job.

I know that's not your intention, but it will be how it comes across to the police.

You need to use some psychology, even though you shouldn't have to.

The art is to find some way of conveying to the police what you want them to do, but making it appear as if it's their idea.


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## toffee (19 Apr 2016)

If you are not happy with their service to to you, have you made a complaint?

Derek


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## Cuchilo (19 Apr 2016)

When my friends bike was stolen ( see stolen bike forum ) He went into the police station and spoke to the officer in charge of the case . Gave his evidence as to the bikes where a bouts and said you can lift a finger to go and get my bike or you can lift a finger when i go and collect my bike with my friends . Its up to you .
While he agrees it isn't the way to go about things he got his bike back .


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## Sheffield_Tiger (19 Apr 2016)

Cuchilo said:


> When my friends bike was stolen ( see stolen bike forum ) He went into the police station and spoke to the officer in charge of the case . Gave his evidence as to the bikes where a bouts and said you can lift a finger to go and get my bike or you can lift a finger when i go and collect my bike with my friends . Its up to you .
> While he agrees it isn't the way to go about things he got his bike back .



One not insignificant problem being that this guy is a well built, physically fit person who has recently served 180 hours community service order for assault.


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## Kevoffthetee (19 Apr 2016)

How "bad" is this person? Do you share any mutual friends who you could trust to do some undercover work?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (19 Apr 2016)

toffee said:


> If you are not happy with their service to to you, have you made a complaint?
> 
> Derek


Well, that's a course of action. The problem being that it's very possible that this bike is there, on the premises, at the moment, but will not be soon after the charger is delivered. At which point the lead goes cold and the complaint is just a procedure


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## Cuchilo (19 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> One not insignificant problem being that this guy is a well built, physically fit person who has recently served 180 hours community service order for assault.


My friend had no intention of going to get the bike himself . He just gave the police the option on who they wanted to arrest and it worked out for him .


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## GrumpyGregry (19 Apr 2016)

Pale Rider said:


> No one, especially coppers, likes being told how to do their job.
> 
> I know that's not your intention, but it will be how it comes across to the police.
> 
> ...


Whilst I have no doubt you are right, one thing...

It is a disgrace that what you have described is the case


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## GrumpyGregry (19 Apr 2016)

I fear the poster shot is bang on, seems to communicate a message of "it is up to you to stop your precious bike from getting nicked because we are going to do nothing about it."


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## Levo-Lon (19 Apr 2016)

Get a mate to twat you on the nose...say it was him and he stole your bike...

Or just say you think he has a gun..that will have about 50 coppers there in about 90seconds..lol

bloody joke isn't it...


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## Slioch (19 Apr 2016)

meta lon said:


> Or just say you think he has a gun..that will have about 50 coppers there in about 90seconds..lol
> 
> bloody joke isn't it...



...or just tell the Filth that you suspect he posted an Islamophobic tweet on twatter, and they'll be round there within the hour.


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## Tin Pot (19 Apr 2016)

So, like the time my iPhone was stolen and I took the police to the exact GPS location of my iPhone and we stood outside the thieves house because "if we knock on the door, it will kick off."?

Yeah, I know how you feel.

Like the time I was arrested having done nothing wrong - proven unequivocally by video footage, and apologised for - simply on London Underground Staff say so?

Yeah, I know how you feel.

Like the time I was unlawfully cuffed and detained in the gym of a police station under"threat of arrest" because having arranged to accompany a girl to a police station, agreed time etc with officers, because she was in fear of her father - only to be attacked by said father in the station?

Yeah, I know how you feel.

Like the time I called the police because a gang of twelve youths was chasing me and my girlfriend through the estates of Romford, only to be told "deal with it"?

Yeah I know how you feel.

Like the time I was assaulted in the street nearby, walked into an empty police station, eventually phoned 999 as there was no one there only to be told "we don't believe you." And hung up?

Yeah I know how you feel.

There are also good police officers in the Met, I hear.


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## derrick (19 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Just wondering if any of the members here who are on the force can give any advice.
> 
> We're getting frustrated by the fact that we have a 99% certainty that we know who stole a £1000 electric bike at the weekend. We have a name and address for them and a verifiable source for this information. The bike is very unusual and is not normally seen around. We have keys that will fit it and the serial number in the manual that should come with it, also the manufacturer has a record of the date of sale to us and the s/n
> 
> ...


If you are not happy with the way the police perform. Contact the police complaints commision. I did and i got a result.
https://secure.met.police.uk/complaints/


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## PhilDawson8270 (19 Apr 2016)

derrick said:


> If you are not happy with the way the police perform. Contact the police complaints commision. I did and i got a result.
> https://secure.met.police.uk/complaints/



I'd agree with this, but probably after trying to get the police to deal with the issue.

While their behaviour warrants a complaint, it won't get the bike back.


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## derrick (19 Apr 2016)

PhilDawson8270 said:


> I'd agree with this, but probably after trying to get the police to deal with the issue.
> 
> While their behaviour warrants a complaint, it won't get the bike back.


No but it might give them the kick up the backside some of the police need.


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## Sara_H (19 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Just wondering if any of the members here who are on the force can give any advice.
> 
> We're getting frustrated by the fact that we have a 99% certainty that we know who stole a £1000 electric bike at the weekend. We have a name and address for them and a verifiable source for this information. The bike is very unusual and is not normally seen around. We have keys that will fit it and the serial number in the manual that should come with it, also the manufacturer has a record of the date of sale to us and the s/n
> 
> ...





Six hours after I'd been deliberately run over by a man who threatened to kill me and in my opinion then tried to kill me, we were still waiting for SYP to turn up.
My OH emailed the Chief Inspector of SYP (email address seems to be openly on the website or at least it was then) explaining the situation and asking why no one had attended.
Three bobbies turned up 30 minutes later.


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## fossyant (19 Apr 2016)

Do you have a number of big mates that would help ?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (19 Apr 2016)

fossyant said:


> Do you have a number of big mates that would help ?



If it was my personal bike there'd be no garage door left at the bloke's hose especially since it's pretty damn local to me

But it's a work issue so strictly above board.


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## fossyant (19 Apr 2016)

Ah..... I could round up a few friends for a 'personal thing'.....


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## Kajjal (19 Apr 2016)

If you don't get a reasonable response go on the police website and contact the senior officer. While the police do an sometimes dangerous job under difficult circumstances it does not mean they can just ignore you.


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## Accy cyclist (20 Apr 2016)

Where are the plod, who post on here, to defend their incompetent buddies?


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## Milkfloat (20 Apr 2016)

Accy cyclist said:


> Where are the plod, who post on here, to defend their incompetent buddies?



Why don't you defend every cyclist that acts like a nobber?


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## Angry Blonde (20 Apr 2016)

nowt a quick ding dong on the door bell...and swill him with a bucket of petrol wouldnt sort out


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## glasgowcyclist (20 Apr 2016)

This needs some input from @CopperCyclist or @Drago who may not have seen the thread yet.

GC


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## Sheffield_Tiger (20 Apr 2016)

Accy cyclist said:


> Where are the plod, who post on here, to defend their incompetent buddies?


Perhaps they are staying away to avoid getting embroiled in this sort of thing, or being called "the filth" by an earlier poster?
Perhaps they would have had some helpful ideas but some posts have made them not bother?


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## Brandane (20 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Just wondering if any of the members here who are on the force can give any advice.
> 
> We're getting frustrated by the fact that we have a 99% certainty that we know who stole a £1000 electric bike at the weekend. We have a name and address for them and a verifiable source for this information. The bike is very unusual and is not normally seen around. We have keys that will fit it and the serial number in the manual that should come with it, also the manufacturer has a record of the date of sale to us and the s/n
> 
> ...



I am a retired cop. This is what they should be doing, and is the way it would have been done 10 years ago prior to the brutal cuts in personnel (although denied by senior officers and politicians):..........
They have information from you or someone else which (in Scotland; I am sure England must have a similar system) would be sufficient for an Officer to go to a Justice of the Peace (Magistrates court in England?) and take the oath to get a search warrant. With search warrant in hand, go to scrotey boys home address and demand entry to search for the stolen bike. The warrant allows for forced entry if it is denied. Conduct the search and take possession of the bike if it is there, and anything else they might find!
If I was you, or the owner of the bike, I would not bother messing around on the phone with some disinterested call taker. Go in person to a main Police office where you might find a supervisor if necessary. Calmly explain the circumstances, and ask them if there is any possibility that they might actually do the above. There may well be some good explanation why they won't, but don't be fobbed off with excuses if they don't seem reasonable. Threaten to make a complaint against the Police if you don't get any satisfaction. It is their job to do these things after all, and by not doing it they are creating all sorts of problems and giving thieves the green light.

Edit .... As above, Drago or CopperCyclist will have more up to date practical advice, and they work south of the border too....


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## Dec66 (20 Apr 2016)

South Yorkshire Police.

Enough said, really.


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## Sheffield_Tiger (20 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> By all means force the Police into action but I dont think it will be recovered it will have been sold on by now.



This is the frustration. It's not. I know it's not because they are waiting for a charger which they don't have to make the bike saleable. But the charger will be delivered soon and then it WILL be too late.


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## e-rider (20 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> This is the frustration. It's not. I know it's not because they are waiting for a charger which they don't have to make the bike saleable. But the charger will be delivered soon and then it WILL be too late.


If I was you I'd go and get it back myself - don't rely on the police. However don't do anything silly!


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## PhilDawson8270 (20 Apr 2016)

Or if it's work property. Let your employer deal with it. it's not your property to stress about.


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## steveindenmark (20 Apr 2016)

What information are you giving the police to begin with and why do you think he stole it?

If someone gave you information, they should be telling the police what they know, otherwise we are into Chinese whispers.

Instead of ringing the police, go and see them and ask to speak to a senior officer and tell him about whats going on and their lack of action.


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## Hill Wimp (20 Apr 2016)

Accy cyclist said:


> Where are the plod, who post on here, to defend their incompetent buddies?


I don't defend incompetence.

Bearing in mind only one side of the story has been posted which i have no evidence at all to say is wrong this is my take FWIW. I agree with @steveindenmark. 

Contact the Police again and check that your complaint of theft has actually been recorded first by asking for a crime number, then ask to speak to the officer dealing noting the failure of their attendance on two occasions and if not ask to speak to the duty officer as you wish to make a complaint.

The fact that your information has come from someone else makes it third party and so will have to be verified by the Police and a statement taken from you or your employer as the loser and from the person with the information as to it's alleged whereabouts. If the information can be verified then the Police have half a chance of getting a warrant from the Magistrates to search the property where the information indicates it is.

Without this verification the Police can do nothing. It would be pointless just knocking on the door of the premises and asking for the bike back. If that person has it it will tip them off and the bike will disappear plus we can't just charge through someone's door without lawful permission either by statute or court unlike they do on the TV.


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## Ajax Bay (20 Apr 2016)

Why not enquire whether he's got a bike for sale?


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## ayceejay (20 Apr 2016)

As for the complaint thing - I was pushed into speeding by Surrey police who came up behind my car at night with lights full on I sped off to a place where I could pull over to let the crazy sod go by, it was at this point they put on the blue light. In court they told their story and I told mine "Are you calling these two police officers liars?" the magistrate asked, I looked to my solicitor and he was shaking his head. WTF I said later. He told me that if I had pursued the case I would have them on my case overtime I went outside = so be careful


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## Sheffield_Tiger (20 Apr 2016)

steveindenmark said:


> What information are you giving the police to begin with and why do you think he stole it?
> If someone gave you information, they should be telling the police what they know, otherwise we are into Chinese whispers.
> Instead of ringing the police, go and see them and ask to speak to a senior officer and tell him about whats going on and their lack of action.



The police have been informed that
1) it's an unusual and distinctive e-bike and brand not normally seen regularly (i.e it only brings up one result on this busy forum)
2) the morning following the theft, a replacement charger was ordered direct from the manufacturer for this exact model of bike to a nearby address. AFAIK the only one they have ever sent out locally. This is where the information comes from - not some mysterious "snout" and no chinese whispers.
3) The name given brings up ONE local facebook result with a profession matching that of the person of that name at the delivery address of the charger. The one fb profile photo is 4 years old but bears more than passing resemblance to the CCTV footage
4) If a warrant were to be issued to search, the police have both the frame number and a key which would fit the stolen bike with which to identify the property


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## fossyant (20 Apr 2016)

Send a few burly blokes round in company vans and politely ask for the bike back. Tell them what you know.


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## DaveReading (20 Apr 2016)

ayceejay said:


> I was pushed into speeding by Surrey police who came up behind my car at night with lights full on



What did they do - ram the back of your car when tried to maintain your original speed ?


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## glasgowcyclist (20 Apr 2016)

DaveReading said:


> What did they do - ram the back of your car when tried to maintain your original speed ?



Uh oh...





GC


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## ayceejay (20 Apr 2016)

DaveReading said:


> What did they do - ram the back of your car when tried to maintain your original speed ?


Sorry Dave shall I speak really slowly just for you. I was not aware it was the police - they were so close with the lights full on that it was scary and I wanted to get out of the way as quick as I could so that they could be on their way. There is no doubt that they did this on purpose, Maintaining my original speed under such intimidation would make the driver even more angry I thought, the blue light announcing themselves as police was not switched on until I had stopped. 
Feel free to ask for further information if you need it.


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## PhilDawson8270 (20 Apr 2016)

ayceejay said:


> Sorry Dave shall I speak really slowly just for you. I was not aware it was the police - they were so close with the lights full on that it was scary and I wanted to get out of the way as quick as I could so that they could be on their way. There is no doubt that they did this on purpose, Maintaining my original speed under such intimidation would make the driver even more angry I thought, the blue light announcing themselves as police was not switched on until I had stopped.
> Feel free to ask for further information if you need it.



So you wouldn't have sped off if you knew it was the police as you know that is wrong?

Generally if somebody is that close behind me and blinding me, I SLOW DOWN, and indicate to let the nutter go. Not speed off while being blinded by lights behind by some nutter.


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## rideswithmoobs (20 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> One not insignificant problem being that this guy is a well built, physically fit person who has recently served 180 hours community service order for assault.



Do you happen to know anyone skilled in Krav Maga ? Trust me, as big and as hard as he may be, he will be dropped in seconds


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## PhilDawson8270 (20 Apr 2016)

rideswithmoobs said:


> Do you happen to know anyone skilled in Krav Maga ? Trust me, as big and as hard as he may be, he will be dropped in seconds



Unfortunately, as anybody with combat sports (or resistance tested martial arts) experience will say. Size and Weight DOES make a difference, experience of fighting gives you the knowledge of when to walk away


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## ayceejay (20 Apr 2016)

PhilDawson8270 said:


> So you wouldn't have sped off if you knew it was the police as you know that is wrong?
> 
> Generally if somebody is that close behind me and blinding me, I SLOW DOWN, and indicate to let the nutter go. Not speed off while being blinded by lights behind by some nutter.


Jesus Christ have you all been celebrating the Queens b'day or what? Had I known it was the police then I would not have been afraid that they would ram me or push me off the road and I WAS signalling all the while. Now go and have a lie down will ya?


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## PhilDawson8270 (20 Apr 2016)

ayceejay said:


> Jesus Christ have you all been celebrating the Queens b'day or what? Had I known it was the police then I would not have been afraid that they would ram me or push me off the road and I WAS signalling all the while. Now go and have a lie down will ya?



Typical "Not my fault" drivers attitude, followed by over the top escalation of aggression.


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## steveindenmark (20 Apr 2016)

As an ex copper I would gave had no problem knocking on his door and asking him if I could search his place. He would refuse and I doubt if a JOP would issue a warrant under these circumstances. I've done my job, but according to a lot of posters on here I would still be a tosser. I would be heartbroken at being called nasty names. On the other hand if you have good quality CCTV footage of him and it is him who answers the door. Arrest him and search the place, its simple.

I think that about sums it up.

Maybe your employers will have better luck with the police. After all it is their bike


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## rideswithmoobs (20 Apr 2016)

PhilDawson8270 said:


> Unfortunately, as anybody with combat sports (or resistance tested martial arts) experience will say. Size and Weight DOES make a difference, experience of fighting gives you the knowledge of when to walk away



Krav Maga is not a combat. It's real world self defence and works.
I grew up with never over estimate the big ones and never under estimate the little one. My comment was more tongue in cheek but sometimes you have to fight. You can't always walk away. And growing up I couldn't 
Anyway this is digressing from the thread


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## Brandane (20 Apr 2016)

steveindenmark said:


> I doubt if a JOP would issue a warrant under these circumstances.


How much evidence do you need to get a search warrant in England then? If the OP had come to me at my place of work in 2001 with the following statement .....


Sheffield_Tiger said:


> we have a 99% certainty that we know who stole a £1000 electric bike at the weekend. We have a name and address for them and a verifiable source for this information.


I would have to clarify how he has come to the "99% certainty" bit. I can't see any JP that I knew having problems with issuing a warrant. The problem with Police going to the door_ without_ a warrant, is - as you know - that if the scrote is even a little streetwise he will tell you to F off and shut the door in your face. The property will then be disposed of, long before you_ can_ go and get a warrant.


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## Ajax Bay (20 Apr 2016)

Where does calling people eg the police names get you, exactly?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (20 Apr 2016)

steveindenmark said:


> As an ex copper I would gave had no problem knocking on his door and asking him if I could search his place. He would refuse *and I doubt if a JOP would issue a warrant under these circumstances*. I've done my job, but according to a lot of posters on here I would still be a tosser. I would be heartbroken at being called nasty names. On the other hand if you have good quality CCTV footage of him and it is him who answers the door. Arrest him and search the place, its simple.
> 
> I think that about sums it up.
> 
> Maybe your employers will have better luck with the police. After all it is their bike



Thanks for the sensible reply amongst an outbreak of keyboard warrior-ship, and I can understand if that is the case, that despite this being pretty clear it's still not enough to issue a warrant. Just seems to be a case of "what the hell do you need to do to get your collar felt" - and if the police are tied so much then I would find that frustrating enough to lose heart or interest

What does irritate with this is the promises to visit to take a statement and the 3x failure to follow through with this. "What we need to get a warrant is xxxx" would be a help...you just never know


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## DaveReading (20 Apr 2016)

ayceejay said:


> Sorry Dave shall I speak really slowly just for you. I was not aware it was the police - they were so close with the lights full on that it was scary and I wanted to get out of the way as quick as I could so that they could be on their way.



I think you'll need to speak slower still. Regardless of who they were, why not just let them past?


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## ayceejay (20 Apr 2016)

Holy Molley that is what I was trying to do FFS but it was their intention to push me above the speed limit.
And, by the way read my lips Over and Out


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## fossyant (20 Apr 2016)

@Sheffield_Tiger I'm not surprised at the Police response. Unfortunately, there are not many officers available to investigate anything with sure evidence you have. As an employer, I'd park some liveried company vans outside the house for a day or two. 

My accident wasn't investigated. Long and short, I lived, can walk, the third party insurance will pay (police officers word). It's incredibly frustrating, but there aren't enough officers.


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## Cubist (20 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Perhaps they are staying away to avoid getting embroiled in this sort of thing, or being called "the filth" by an earlier poster?
> Perhaps they would have had some helpful ideas but some posts have made them not bother?


That's about it I'm afraid, and not for the first time. . PM incoming.


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## Tin Pot (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> What I cant get my head round is why even bother, its not your bike, its your employers, so its recovery and theft has absolutely nothing at all to do with you.Also the buisness will have to be insured for thefts so the correct thing is for your employer to make a claim. Problem solved, they get reinbursed.
> I could understand you being upset if the bike was your property but its not.



It's morally wrong to steal. It should upset every right-thinking member of society.


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (21 Apr 2016)

As @steveindenmark has said. If this log came to me first I'd visit you to verify what your saying, i.e how good is your info. This isn't a dig at you as there is a huge difference between truth and proof.
Then I'd call on the offender, he'd deny any knowledge at all and unless the info given by the OP was very very good I'd have no hope of getting a warrant.
It's all a bit crap I'm afraid, as is the part about them not turning up when promised.
Do they have an appointment system?


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## jefmcg (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> What I cant get my head round is why even bother, its not your bike


Wow. Seems like a member of South Yorkshire Police has come to explain their policy


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## screenman (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> What I cant get my head round is why even bother, its not your bike, its your employers, so its recovery and theft has absolutely nothing at all to do with you.Also the buisness will have to be insured for thefts so the correct thing is for your employer to make a claim. Problem solved, they get reinbursed.
> I could understand you being upset if the bike was your property but its not.



It costs a lot of money to make a claim.


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## Sheffield_Tiger (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> What I cant get my head round is why even bother, its not your bike.


Same reason that I phoned the police when someone was clobbered around the head. Even though it wasn't my head so apparently I shouldn't have worried about it.


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## jefmcg (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> .


This comes off as you crowing that someone is stupid enough to care about their work place, or to expect any sort of helpful response from the police.

I'm going to assume you aren't the sort of person your two posts here make you appear.


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## PhilDawson8270 (21 Apr 2016)

rideswithmoobs said:


> Krav Maga is not a combat. It's real world self defence and works.



Krav Maga can be seen more as situational reaction training rather than a martial art. With all the training in the world, F = ma will still win with a lucky hit.


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## Profpointy (21 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> Sorry for being a sensible realist. All the best with this daftness.



are you really saying we should all mind our own business when it comes to crimes unless we ourselves are the victim ?

If so i think that's a terrible attitude.

Not sure why the bloke being bashed was any different obviously assault is more serious but still a crime.

Crimes are legally seen as a against the state / against us all, rather than merely against the victim

An unpunished theft pushes up insurance and makes the risk to our own worked-for property higher


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## jonny jeez (21 Apr 2016)

e-rider said:


> However don't do anything silly!


What, like going round to the house of a known, violent criminal and accusing them of being a thief?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (21 Apr 2016)

Phew! Finally managed to give cctv to police and on viewing it their attitude shifted slightly to talk of ANPR checking a vehicle seen dropping the thieves off etc.

This crew has had 3 bikes over a few weeks. Even if no prosecution results, if they just get a visit enquiring about a bike theft, they might think "Ok we had a good run" and leave us alone


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## rideswithmoobs (21 Apr 2016)

PhilDawson8270 said:


> Krav Maga can be seen more as situational reaction training rather than a martial art. With all the training in the world, F = ma will still win with a lucky hit.



Let's agree to disagree on this one  and get back to the thread


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## CopperCyclist (22 Apr 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Perhaps they are staying away to avoid getting embroiled in this sort of thing, or being called "the filth" by an earlier poster?
> Perhaps they would have had some helpful ideas but some posts have made them not bother?



Personally I simply hadn't seen it yet.

The person that spoke to you over the phone more likely than not wasn't a police officer, though that doesn't matter as it's whatever they say that makes you forum an opinion of how we are treating it. 

I'll echo what most others have said. You say you are 99% sure. That's an interesting number, as it should certainly equate to the amount of proof needed to convict at court, if a jury member was 99% sure. 

However, the evidence you later gave is definitely not enough to convict - a name ordered a charger for a rare bike, Facebook shows a name the same as that living nearby. It starts with a circumstantial link, and then gets a second area of doubt. This alone isn't enough for court. 

As others have said, it IS enough to knock the door... But what will that alone gain. Will it simply let him know we are on to him and actually give him opportunity to dispose of items. 

Is it enough to get a warrant... That's down to the mags or the JP on the day. Actually, I think it is. I got one in very similar circs once, so personally I'd give that a go. 

CCTV is a big one. If it's good enough, I'd do the warrant, knock the door, and arrest him if it was him, and subsequently search. My concerns would be what if son/partner opened the door? No arrest, no search, gives him a head up to get rid of the bike. 

A few different ways that they can play it, none of which is going to happen until you've had a visit (which I see you've now had). 

The usual excuse - no, I hate that word, the usual REASON why - police numbers have been slashed and unless you are in physical danger your job probably sits on the list as "next available unit" for over 24 hours as other higher priority jobs keep taking precedence. 

The job I mentioned above, someone reported a stolen camera lens to me. They had found it on eBay, linked the seller to Facebook, found an address. The same day, I tried for and got a warrant, went round to the house, searched it, found the camera, dealt with the offenders and put the matter to bed. 

It took four of us all day on that one job. We wouldn't be allowed to do that any more, they couldn't justify losing four response officers for that long. Modern world of policing.


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## User16625 (22 Apr 2016)

CopperCyclist said:


> Personally I simply hadn't seen it yet.
> 
> The person that spoke to you over the phone more likely than not wasn't a police officer, though that doesn't matter as it's whatever they say that makes you forum an opinion of how we are treating it.
> 
> ...



The amount of fines that the police could make from speeding motorists in that time! In the mean time, Johnny Burglar is hard at work, making good profit with little interference from the authorities.

When Mr Burglar does get his collar felt, it takes 2 officers to make the arrest, 1 to ensure that the jungle of health and safety regulations are rigidly enforced, and 1 to ensure all the forms are filled in accurately. Burglar gets off with a suspended 23 second jail sentence and gets back to burgling. The police force add to their statistics and its a job well done.


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## Tim Hall (22 Apr 2016)

CopperCyclist said:


> The job I mentioned above, someone reported a stolen camera lens to me. They had found it on eBay, linked the seller to Facebook, found an address. The same day, I tried for and got a warrant, went round to the house, searched it, found the camera, dealt with the offenders and put the matter to bed.
> 
> It took four of us all day on that one job. We wouldn't be allowed to do that any more, they couldn't justify losing four response officers for that long. Modern world of policing.


Thanks for that @CopperCyclist . I had a camera and lens stolen from my (unlocked) car last year. I found it on Preloved at a Cash Generator in Peckham a few days later and informed Surrey Police. As it was for sale in London, they had to involve the Met. Camera and lens duly recovered, arrest made but due to lack of evidence they couldn't make the charges stick.
Daft question: Are the policing cuts a continuing thing and are police numbers down further this year than June last year? I was amazed at the time and effort both forces put into it, all because I was daft enough to leavemy expensive kit in the car and forget to lock it. So that if a similar thing happened this year, is it less likely I'd get such a stunning result? (I take a lot more care removing valuables and locking my car now)


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (22 Apr 2016)

CopperCyclist said:


> Personally I simply hadn't seen it yet.
> 
> The person that spoke to you over the phone more likely than not wasn't a police officer, though that doesn't matter as it's whatever they say that makes you forum an opinion of how we are treating it.
> 
> ...


Good work there, however recently they have tightened up on giving warrants, it's quite tricky now.


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## Incontinentia Buttocks (22 Apr 2016)

@Tin Pot ,yep cuts continue. My Force started on about 8000 Officers in 2015, we will be down to about 5000 by 2020.
Calls for services have gone up by 50% per day and recorded crime has gone up. It's not a good mix.


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## Leaway2 (22 Apr 2016)

What I see here is all the traffic wardens have turned into PCSO's. I see them walking round in pairs. Has this made no difference? I know they are not Police as I know it. In fact I really don't know what they are.


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## Tin Pot (22 Apr 2016)

Incontinentia Buttocks said:


> @Tin Pot ,yep cuts continue. My Force started on about 8000 Officers in 2015, we will be down to about 5000 by 2020.
> Calls for services have gone up by 50% per day and recorded crime has gone up. It's not a good mix.



Whilst my experience with the police is poor, I recognise my issues are low on the Richter scale - I hope that violent crime is better handled.

I expect the police to be no better or worse than anyone else is at their jobs, ie usually terrible.

I don't know any industry where demand is down and resources are up.

So...we're all in similar oil tankers heading for similar reefs.

The problem specific to the police is that our entire civilisation is based on one single stone - our (citizenry) voluntarily granting you (state) the monopoly on violence. If you fail to act, or act incorrectly...well you know the rest.


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## Sheffield_Tiger (27 Apr 2016)

User46386 said:


> Totally different, sorry you cant see the difference in circumstances. Good luck with getting the Police to do a dawn raid .


Thanks for your wishes of luck, even if they weren't meant entirely genuinely

Guess what happened this morning?
Guess what's locked in our wages office awaiting forensic examination?
And there's more, but I shan't add it to the internet at this point


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## PhilDawson8270 (27 Apr 2016)

Leaway2 said:


> What I see here is all the traffic wardens have turned into PCSO's. I see them walking round in pairs. Has this made no difference? I know they are not Police as I know it. In fact I really don't know what they are.



They're basically walking sign posts. Or Town Customer Services.


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## jefmcg (27 Apr 2016)

Good work! I'm glad your persistence paid off.


Sheffield_Tiger said:


> And there's more, but I shan't add it to the internet at this point


Your call, but I'd be interested in hearing what happened. It might also be useful if google brings someone here with a similar problem. 

Having been the victim of a workplace theft, I know; it's your community and it feels personal. In this case it was computers and our server was lying in pieces in the car park - they dropped it. I still got paid for the days we couldn't work, and the overtime to repair the damage, so I wasn't financially hurt, but it's still infuriating.


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## Sheffield_Tiger (27 Apr 2016)

Can't say right now....will add details later but don't want Google to index it right now, not whilst new information came to light last night


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## CopperCyclist (30 Apr 2016)

At least tell us if you're now happy with the police response, or if something else happened


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## Sheffield_Tiger (30 Apr 2016)

CopperCyclist said:


> At least tell us if you're now happy with the police response, or if something else happened



Sadly it took the boss' son happening to go to the same football training as a DCI's son and touchline chattering to get some movement. Which is disappointing as even though police ended up with about 40 pages of gleaned information which is now subject to ongoing investigation it turned out to be a case of not what you know but who you know...even though everything I gave police initially was rock-solid and, it seems, plenty to act upon


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## DiddlyDodds (1 May 2016)

Its not to be recommended in this day and age but i remember my mate getting his motorbike stolen a couple of days before were due to go on a biking holiday to France, (20years ago) it didn't take long for the thief to be identified as he was seen riding around the estate showing off, a gang of of us got in a transit van (we knew some big lads in them days and were all bikers so not the best looking bunch) and paid him a visit, there was no trouble or threats just the sight of us all piling out of the van and standing next to it as my mate went up to the house convinced the scrote to just hand it over.
The only damage was a broken seat lock and ignition barrel.
No police , no trouble , we just went and got it back and in time to set off for the France.


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## User16625 (1 May 2016)

DiddlyDodds said:


> Its not to be recommended in this day and age but i remember my mate getting his motorbike stolen a couple of days before were due to go on a biking holiday to France, (20years ago) it didn't take long for the thief to be identified as he was seen riding around the estate showing off, a gang of of us got in a transit van (we knew some big lads in them days and were all bikers so not the best looking bunch) and paid him a visit, there was no trouble or threats just the sight of us all piling out of the van and standing next to it as my mate went up to the house convinced the scrote to just hand it over.
> The only damage was a broken seat lock and ignition barrel.
> No police , no trouble , we just went and got it back and in time to set off for the France.



I think a bit of a kicking is recommended, just not to the point of hospitalization so as to save the NHS a few quid.


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## migrantwing (1 May 2016)

You should not have posted this on a public forum. Now, if you are not happy with the way this has been handled and DO take things into your own hands, you'll get into more trouble than the person who stole your bike. Sod's Law!


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## jefmcg (1 May 2016)

migrantwing said:


> You should not have posted this on a public forum. Now, if you are not happy with the way this has been handled and DO take things into your own hands, you'll get into more trouble than the person who stole your bike. Sod's Law!


They have the bike back.

(and even in the original post, it was clear the OP didn't want to break the law)


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## migrantwing (1 May 2016)

The Op'er hinted at 'something' related to the bike theft that is locked up in a cupboard at his workplace. Usually, if Police need to run forensics on a stolen and retrieved item, they will not hand back property until the forensics have been seen to. Therefore, not stating that it IS the bike, I stand by what I said, that it could be ANYTHING related to the theft.

Secondly, the additional posts about 'talking to a DCI' only mentions that it got 'things moving', not that it led to the recovery of the stolen item.

Anyhow, I'm glad Sheffield_Tiger got it sorted.


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## Moderators (1 May 2016)

*MOD NOTE: * I have removed the argument and I would like it to stop NOW.


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## jefmcg (12 May 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Can't say right now....will add details later but don't want Google to index it right now, not whilst new information came to light last night


Any update to share now?


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## Sheffield_Tiger (1 Sep 2016)

Well (and this is where I can see all the police members nodding sagely) now I see why the police couldn't really be bothered

What I provided the police with was, in addition to the details of the stolen bike, a verified eBay seller history - as a "private seller" listing and selling a volume of brand new cycling accessories, aside from the bicycles from us, 98% of the listings and documented sales were individual lots and all in Halfords inventory. And a not insignificant amount either. Everything was single units, i.e. not a genuine dealer except for small things where stealing a box full of bits would be fairly easy

In addition to this bike, there was a live listing of one of two bikes which were stolen previously (but to my annoyance not reported to police by the store manager, who will now be reporting things like this as he should!!)

Information was cross-referenced to people owning accounts, to the extent that one of the police officers viewing the facebook profile linking a person to a listing address via relationship status, commented that the cat in a facebook picture was "definitely the cat I saw thins morning" when they recovered the main bike.

Anyway, it all pointed to a very regular turnover of stolen sporting and motoring goods and a possible contact inside Halfords as a number of the listed/sold items were high value items secured in cabinets not accessible to the general public. Which is possibly where another name not recognised by me ended up in court..

All that and..

80 hours community service. Painting and decorating work for a builder! Ooooh, that'll show him
£85 victim surcharge and £85 court costs

Still, the bike was recovered and the attempts to steal bicycles seem to have ceased, for now at least


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## Bazzer (1 Sep 2016)

Pleased for you that your bike was recovered. Just a pity that the Courts or probably more accurately the sentencing system, don't take into account the inconvenience and distress people like this cause.


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## Bazzer (1 Sep 2016)

User13710 said:


> It wasn't an individual's bike, it was systematic pilfering from a shop. If it's stopped, that's a pretty good result?



Correction:
Pleased for you that your employer's bike was recovered. Just a pity that the Courts or probably more accurately the sentencing system, don't take into account the inconvenience and distress people like this cause.

If it has stopped the theft from the OP's place of employment to that extent it is a result, but unless the fencer has some damascene moment whilst painting and decorating, it is hardly likely to act a deterrent. Neither does it appear to reflect, based upon the OP's comments, the value of goods stolen.


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## glenn forger (1 Sep 2016)

I would have thought high-value stuff going missing from Halfords would get noticed quickly.


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## MiK1138 (1 Sep 2016)

glenn forger said:


> I would have thought high-value stuff going missing from Halfords would get noticed quickly.


Guess you've never ordered anything for Store pickup from them. their stock control is a joke


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## glenn forger (1 Sep 2016)

Get us a Boardman.


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## jefmcg (1 Sep 2016)

glenn forger said:


> Get us a Boardman.


They don't know where the boardmans are. @vickster had to chase all over SW London to find a store that actually had the one she was looking for, despite it showing in-stock on the website.


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## vickster (1 Sep 2016)

jefmcg said:


> They don't know where the boardmans are. @vickster had to chase all over SW London to find a store that actually had the one she was looking for, despite it showing in-stock on the website.


Well I got the second one I ordered!


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## Tin Pot (1 Sep 2016)

Sheffield_Tiger said:


> Well (and this is where I can see all the police members nodding sagely) now I see why the police couldn't really be bothered
> 
> What I provided the police with was, in addition to the details of the stolen bike, a verified eBay seller history - as a "private seller" listing and selling a volume of brand new cycling accessories, aside from the bicycles from us, 98% of the listings and documented sales were individual lots and all in Halfords inventory. And a not insignificant amount either. Everything was single units, i.e. not a genuine dealer except for small things where stealing a box full of bits would be fairly easy
> 
> ...



A conviction is a conviction. I'm glad to hear he got his.

Criminals provide their own punishment, crappy lives, worthless careers, etc. Maybe he'll see the value of being useful and change his ways.


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## keithmac (1 Sep 2016)

My friend had his car stolen years back, we all had a pretty good idea who'd done it and a few days later it turned up outside the thiefs house.

Anyway lad who owned the car went and stood ouside said house and rang the police to tell them he'd found it and to get them to come down so they could deal with it.

The answer was they were too busy to deal with it, and if they caught him driving a car with defective steering (due to lock damage) he would be dealt with accordingly....


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## Cubist (2 Sep 2016)

keithmac said:


> My friend had his car stolen years back, we all had a pretty good idea who'd done it and a few days later it turned up outside the thiefs house.
> 
> Anyway lad who owned the car went and stood ouside said house and rang the police to tell them he'd found it and to get them to come down so they could deal with it.
> 
> The answer was they were too busy to deal with it, and if they caught him driving a car with defective steering (due to lock damage) he would be dealt with accordingly....


Nothing like a good old "bloke in our pub" story!


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## keithmac (3 Sep 2016)

Search for "blip boy" in York and have a good read..


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## NorthernDave (3 Sep 2016)

glenn forger said:


> I would have thought high-value stuff going missing from Halfords would get noticed quickly.





MiK1138 said:


> Guess you've never ordered anything for Store pickup from them. their stock control is a joke



When I was picking my bike up from my local branch of Halfords a couple of weeks ago, there was an almightly flap on as they'd just realised that earlier in the day someone had walked in, cut the cable securing 2 (or 3, they weren't sure) brand new bikes to the display by the tills and walked out with them...
Then a couple of days later I tried to buy some inner tubes for Mrs ND's bike. None on the shelf, although the till was showing a lots in stock. It seems they have suspicions that a local 'entrepreneur' is running a car boot stall selling their stock, but they haven't been able to catch them, yet.


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