# Wanstead Flats - proposed cycle track



## JamesAC (3 Aug 2008)

Local people are in uproar because there is a proposal to build a cylcle facility across Wanstead Flats (a remnant of ancient Epping Forest in north east London). The cycle track, forming part of a cycle route from Epping to the Olympic site in Stratford, would be surfaced and lit. People say that this is yet more transgression onto this ancient common land (along with car parks, changing rooms, football pitches and so on) , and that there are perfectly adequate cycling facilities (or the potential for such facilities) on near by roads.

I'm in a dilemma, because on the one hand I'm a cyclist, and a reasonably surfaced off road track could be very pleasant for people to cycle on; but on the other hand I'm alert to the fact that Wanstead Flats has been encroached upon for centuries, as land speculators have nicked parcels of land , nibbling away at the edges. It's thanks to Queen Victoria, who gave the flats to the people _in perpetuity_ that they are there at all.

Any views or comments?

Cheers


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## simon l& and a half (3 Aug 2008)

it's a crap idea. 

This is probably all that remains of what was GOAL 2012 the much vaunted and much derided attempt by Sustrans to 'crack London'. People were sent out to find bits of London to draw wiggly green lines on, given that, we were told, the road is no place for bicycles. (Memo to self: must inform the hundreds of cyclists pouring across Kennington every morning that the road is no place for bicycles). It was the misfortune of Wanstead Flats to be in the way of one of these wiggly green lines which bisected a blank area in the late unlamented LCN+ map. (And the subtext of this is that Sustrans were trying to hijack the LCC's LCN+ routes with barely a nod of appreciation).

Anyway - there's not one bit of evidence that there is a demand for a cycle route across Wanstead Flats, and nothing to justify the expense. How it fits in with promoting cycle use for short utility journeys heaven alone knows. I mention the lack of evidence because every time I suggested (when I turned up to the TfL Greenways committee) that we take the time to survey where cyclists were actually cycling before committing millions (repeat millions) to off road cycle paths the Sustrans response was that this was a silly idea, because the creation of cycle routes across green spaces would generate a whole new breed of cyclists. So......on our side of London we have the Wandle (no relation to Wanstead) Path which is a nice afternoon out for families with small children decorated with 1.3 million quids worth of signposting, bridges with a slippery surface and (deep sigh) public art, running parallel to roads used by thousands of cyclists who wouldn't consider switching to an off-road route that increases their commute time by upwards of 50%.

And, the more cynical of you will have already guessed that the consultants are having a field day. Paper after paper after paper is sent out to every 'stakeholder' (I'm one, and I'm beginning to form a plan for the stake) asking for comments on routes that are beyond crap. 

I sometimes take Mrs L on these rural rides. She thinks I'm getting her out and about, and that it's a nice Mr and Mrs thing, but, really I'm doing the stakeholder bit. She's no hardened road cyclist, but without exception the route out gets nul points (stop here, go through dopey barrier here, share surface with pedestrians here, get misled by poor signposting here) while the road back, be it through Hackney or straight up the A23 is just fine and dandy. In fact, the last time I took her down the Wandle Path she told me that we'd never do that again, thankyou very much.

Anybody who wants to cycle across Wanstead Flats can probably do it right now without the spending of a couple of million quid. If they want to do it at night then they can buy themselves a decent front light.

And don't get me started on the totally stupid bridge thing....


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## ufkacbln (3 Aug 2008)

From other projects....

This will be maintained well, lit and serviced until the day after the Olympics - after that it will be left to deteriorate and no maintenace of lighting or the surface will occur!


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## peanut (3 Aug 2008)

I used to play on Wanstead flats as a kid in the 50's it was huge back then with woods you could get lost in like Epping. Not sure what remains of it now though. They used to hold gigantic fairs there which would take all day and night to get right round.
If they are proposing to put a cycle /skating/jogging track around the edge I can't see how that would harm the flats ? probably bring it back into regular use if anything


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

There's no need for this at all, there are already bridle paths and the roads are ok round the park. The Flats are the beginning of Epping Forest, where Henry Eighth used to hunt.


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## peanut (6 Aug 2008)

spindrift said:


> There's no need for this at all, there are already bridle paths and the roads are ok round the park. The Flats are the beginning of Epping Forest, where Henry Eighth used to hunt.



err Wanstead flats and Epping forest are two distinctly seperate areas seperated by 10 miles of urban sprawl and inner city roads .
They may have been joined in Henry the eighth's time though


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

*Wanstead Flats - an overview*​The area known locally as 'The Flats' is the southern-most portion of Epping Forest and a welcome intrusion into the suburbs of east London. 

http://www.wren-group.net/LOCATION_FILES/WANSTEAD_FLATS/Wanstead_Flats_Text.htm​ 

The City of London Corporation manages Wanstead Park as a part of Epping Forest under the terms of the Epping Forest Act of 1878

http://www.wansteadwildlife.org.uk/LOCATION_FILES/WANSTEAD_PARK/Wanstead_Park_text.htm


Please don't ignore my questions about your dishonesty elsewhere and then follow me round like a love-struck teenager.


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## domtyler (6 Aug 2008)

My house looks out over Wanstead Flats, the views were the reason we bought there. I will certainly be strongly and vociferously opposed to any form of tarmaccing over. I have not seen anything come through my door yet though.

OT, it's already bad enough that Thames Water have ploughed it up and cut down a load of trees to stick in their new pipes!!!


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

Ever use The North Star Dom?

Same people run The Bell, next to the fire station, Leytonstone High Road.


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## Riding in Circles (6 Aug 2008)

I am all for facilities to enable disabled access to recreational areas and areas of natural beauty but not extra cycle facilities if they can be added to roads instead, at least if the cycle facilities are on the roads then they have a (slim) chance of being maintained, off road routes are always neglected.


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## domtyler (6 Aug 2008)

spindrift said:


> Ever use The North Star Dom?
> 
> Same people run The Bell, next to the fire station, Leytonstone High Road.



Heh heh, lots of times, although very rarely go out drinking since becoming a dad. Is that your local then?


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## peanut (6 Aug 2008)

heres a nice map of Epping forest 
http://www.eppingforest.co.uk/eppfor.html
My family come from Chingford and I was schooled at Ongar so I spent a lot of time cycling in Epping and Hainault forests and the Wanstead flats as a kid and know them well
Epping forest is nowhere near Wanstead flats these days although it may have been joined in the Mediaeval times


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

You claimed Wanstead Flats isn't part of Epping Forest. You're wrong. Deal with it.

*




*Epping Forest is an historic woodland lying in the west of the county of Essex on the ridge of high ground which separates the Lea Valley on the west from the Roding Valley on the east, and which extends southwards into what are now the London Boroughs of Redbridge, Newham and Waltham Forest. 

It's South Epping Forest, but still Epping Forest.​





http://www.wansteadwildlife.org.uk/images/various_images/map_south_epping_forest.jpg


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

domtyler said:


> Heh heh, lots of times, although very rarely go out drinking since becoming a dad. Is that your local then?




The Bell's closer, but They've done up the garden in The North Star and it's a sun trap now.

They met Clyde Loakes cos the residents had complaints about Zulus and a halfway house that opened for alcoholics with the attendant public urination and bum fluff twockers running about.


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## domtyler (6 Aug 2008)

Peanut, don't pretend to know anything about this issue, it is clear that you don't. And to make matters worse you have already admitted you come from Chingford! Ha ha ha!


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## spindrift (6 Aug 2008)

pwn3d


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## CopperBrompton (6 Aug 2008)

This plan is utterly barking. Where do we register our opposition to it?


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## bazzadigz C+ (1 Oct 2008)

i live by leytonstone fire station and although the theory is ok, in practice its pointless!!!

i mean unless ur using a racer to head across the field then its easy enough to cross the flats on a bike! and if ur stupid enough to do it at night then some tarmac and lighting is not really going to save you from the hoodies!

I head from my house to go Ilford some days and would prefer that route too a tarmac'd road any day!

yeah the Bell is pretty much the only decent pub left on Leytonstone high road..Licolns (formally Big Hand Mo's) is not somewhere i'ld like to spend my days, Zulus (formally Red Lion) is ok but full of folks from the southern hemisphere, Kirkdales is ok but closes too early, Sheepwalk dead as a door nail most nights, Walnut is usually 4 deep at the bar and o'neils dance floor is always covered in glass and smells of sweat!


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## bazzadigz C+ (1 Oct 2008)

peanut said:


> heres a nice map of Epping forest
> http://www.eppingforest.co.uk/eppfor.html
> My family come from Chingford and I was schooled at Ongar so I spent a lot of time cycling in Epping and Hainault forests and the Wanstead flats as a kid and know them well
> Epping forest is nowhere near Wanstead flats these days although it may have been joined in the Mediaeval times



sorry im with Spin on this one


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## Smokin Joe (2 Oct 2008)

I was brought up down the road from the flats and spent more than enough time cycling, playing football and generally messing around over there. I can't see the reason for a cycle path, there is simply no need.


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