# Tour de France 2018 **SPOILERS**



## rich p (3 Jun 2018)

Time to start the speculation and soothsaying.

Is Bardet good enough to provide France with their first home winner since the Dark Ages?

Will Froomedawg be allowed to ride, keep his result, recover from the Giro?

Will Thomas and Bernal be Plan B and C?

Will Tom Dumoulin ride?

Will Valverde really ride for Quintana and Landa?

Can a 2 leader strategy ever work properly?


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## Crackle (3 Jun 2018)

There's a 35k TTT which is going to put Bardet and a few others 2 minutes down. Isn't the route in the Dauphine this year?


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## Beebo (3 Jun 2018)

Crackle said:


> There's a 35k TTT which is going to put Bardet and a few others 2 minutes down. Isn't the route in the Dauphine this year?


Not a big fan of TTT, they don't seem fair for the GC guys from smaller teams.


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## rich p (3 Jun 2018)

I don't like TTTs either. 

The 20th and last meaningful stage is a 31 km ITT, featuring a few climbs and at km 27 has a 900m climb averaging 10% and maxing at 21%.
That should sort a few out.

I wonder if Warren Barguil is riding for a place or just for shíts and giggles and the odd stage win. Waste of his talent, if so.


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## Crackle (3 Jun 2018)

I like the TTT's ever since I stood in a village in France and watched them come through, re-forming after a corner and yelling at each other to close the gaps and get in line, the effort absolutely plain on their faces and then looking to see what the timing board said as they went through. It was pretty exciting which you don't quite quite get the flavour of on telly.


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## Bollo (3 Jun 2018)

Crackle said:


> I like the TTT's ever since I stood in a village in France and watched them come through, re-forming after a corner and yelling at each other to close the gaps and get in line, the effort absolutely plain on their faces and then looking to see what the timing board said as they went through. It was pretty exciting which you don't quite quite get the flavour of on telly.


I've never seen a TTT in the flesh to my shame, but the ITTs are good value for the spectator as they spread the racing time, rather than a "blink and you've missed it" view of the peloton flashing by. I managed to watch the TdF prologue in Utrecht a couple of years ago and the atmosphere was mental.
I recently watched a Velon clip of the end of a sprint stage for one of (I think) the GTs and was surprised how much verbal there was going on between the riders. I don't know why, as I've been on the receiving end of it a few times in my sorry-ass Cat 4 attempts at critérium racing.


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## Adam4868 (3 Jun 2018)

Been to quite a few TT including giro this year,in the flesh so to speak there good to watch.Plenty of time to see riders ect.The team time trials are just as manic.Im not a massive fan on TV either.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (3 Jun 2018)

I'm fairly sure* that when LA and his team were the best cheats in the peloton that some of the Tour TTTs didn't have real time gaps but applied time gaps based on positioning.

*I can't be arsed checking, and I may be making this up


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## Pro Tour Punditry (3 Jun 2018)

Here's a "special feature" for stage 17 of this year's Tour:






I can't help but think that falls into the "utterly pointless things to do" category. Or am I missing something?


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## Adam4868 (3 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Here's a "special feature" for stage 17 of this year's Tour:
> View attachment 412351
> 
> 
> I can't help but think that falls into the "utterly pointless things to do" category. Or am I missing something?


Lost me after first line....no wonder I was shite at sports day


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## rich p (3 Jun 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Lost me after first line....no wonder I was shite at sports day


2nd from last in the sack race?


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## rich p (3 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Here's a "special feature" for stage 17 of this year's Tour:
> View attachment 412351
> 
> 
> I can't help but think that falls into the "utterly pointless things to do" category. Or am I missing something?


WTF?


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## Crackle (3 Jun 2018)

Didn't they do that in the women's Le Tour. It was totally shite and a non event.


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## Aravis (3 Jun 2018)

What follows may be total sloblock.

Stage 17 is very short, about 40 miles, with severe climbs and a mountain top finish (I think I'm on safe ground there). They'll want the leaders to kick off from the start, so I think the arrangement is akin to the starting grid in motor racing, preventing a quick breakaway from low-ranking riders and clearing the way for one or more of the leaders to really go for it.


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## FishFright (3 Jun 2018)

Aravis said:


> What follows may be total sloblock.
> 
> Stage 17 is very short, about 40 miles, with severe climbs and a mountain top finish (I think I'm on safe ground there). They'll want the leaders to kick off from the start, so I think the arrangement is akin to the starting grid in motor racing, preventing a quick breakaway from low-ranking riders and clearing the way for one or more of the leaders to really go for it.



The coke* must have been amazing at that meeting !!

*You wouldn't get that nonsense with Pepsi


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## Pro Tour Punditry (3 Jun 2018)

Aravis said:


> What follows may be total sloblock.
> 
> Stage 17 is very short, about 40 miles, with severe climbs and a mountain top finish (I think I'm on safe ground there). They'll want the leaders to kick off from the start, so I think the arrangement is akin to the starting grid in motor racing, preventing a quick breakaway from low-ranking riders and clearing the way for one or more of the leaders to really go for it.


If they think that then they have obviously never watched a race; they expect the leaders to go full out for 65km up 3 mountains and the rest of the team to pootle along together further back?


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## Adam4868 (3 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> If they think that then they have obviously never watched a race; they expect the leaders to go full out for 65km up 3 mountains and the rest of the team to pootle along together further back?


Panic will be from the sprinters trying to make the time cut.


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## smutchin (4 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> I wonder if Warren Barguil is riding for a place or just for shíts and giggles and the odd stage win. Waste of his talent, if so.



I vaguely recall he said that one of his reasons for stepping down from a WT team to a PC team was so he didn't have to deal with the pressure of being a GC contender. Shame, and yes, a massive waste of his talents. Like Pinot, he's got the legs but he hasn't got the head. He truly is the new Tommy Voeckler.

Bardet by contrast has the mindset of a winner but I suspect is never going to be strong enough in the time trials to be a GC contender. However, this one does look to be reasonably well suited to him. As long as his team doesn't cock up the TTT too badly, he could be in with a real chance. Interesting.


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## smutchin (4 Jun 2018)

Aravis said:


> What follows may be total sloblock.
> 
> Stage 17 is very short, about 40 miles, with severe climbs and a mountain top finish (I think I'm on safe ground there). They'll want the leaders to kick off from the start, so I think the arrangement is akin to the starting grid in motor racing, preventing a quick breakaway from low-ranking riders and clearing the way for one or more of the leaders to really go for it.





Pro Tour Punditry said:


> If they think that then they have obviously never watched a race; they expect the leaders to go full out for 65km up 3 mountains and the rest of the team to pootle along together further back?



I reckon it's more to ensure that none of the GC contenders are disadvantaged by being trapped at the back of the peloton while someone makes an attack. It's such a short stage, it is going to be brutal racing from the moment the flag goes down, and if you're not near the front of the pack at the start, you'll be out of contention very quickly.

Last year's 100km stage to Foix was insane, as was the 109km stage to Alpe d'Huez in 2011. This one is even shorter, and could be even more exciting to watch.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (4 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> I reckon it's more to ensure that none of the GC contenders are disadvantaged by being trapped at the back of the peloton while someone makes an attack. It's such a short stage, it is going to be brutal racing from the moment the flag goes down, and if you're not near the front of the pack at the start, you'll be out of contention very quickly.
> 
> Last year's 100km stage to Foix was insane, as was the 109km stage to Alpe d'Huez in 2011. This one is even shorter, and could be even more exciting to watch.


It's up to them to make sure they get themselves properly positioned. What about those targeting KOM who are lower down on GC?


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## Bollo (4 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> It's up to them to make sure they get themselves properly positioned. What about those targeting KOM who are lower down on GC?


Exactly this. Race the stage that’s been set. They’ll be introducing F1 style KERS boosts next. If the riders had motors. Which they don’t. Obvs.


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## deptfordmarmoset (4 Jun 2018)

From _départ fictif _to _départ farfelu.^_


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## Beebo (4 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> It's up to them to make sure they get themselves properly positioned. What about those targeting KOM who are lower down on GC?


And the green jersey, im sure they will be looking for points at the traditional end of stage sprint.

On a serious note, it will make it harder for teams like Sky to get a big train rolling up the hill, as their riders will be spread throughout the field.


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## smutchin (4 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> It's up to them to make sure they get themselves properly positioned. What about those targeting KOM who are lower down on GC?



I was thinking that this is probably something that has come at the request of the teams, and the organisers have complied so they don’t kick up a fuss at the short stage format.

Normally, you’d expect the riders to be quite good at sorting it out among themselves, but this stage is so short and hard, it’s going to be a real scrap for position.

Wouldn’t be surprised if the German team came down the night before and laid out their beach towels on the start line. </casual racism>


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## mjr (4 Jun 2018)

I want to see a standing start like at the Brompton World Championship! I'll go tweet @letour...


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## Dave Davenport (4 Jun 2018)

We're flying out to Vienna for our summer tour on that day so won't be able to watch it live We're in a hotel near the airport for the first night so hope we can find some highlights on telly without seeing the result.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (4 Jun 2018)

Beebo said:


> And the green jersey, im sure they will be looking for points at the traditional end of stage sprint.
> 
> On a serious note, it will make it harder for teams like Sky to get a big train rolling up the hill, as their riders will be spread throughout the field.


Depends if they are just off in waves, one after the other - or if they put time limits between the groups. I'm sure SKY will have worked out if Froome waits for his train or if he just looks at his stem for the 65km


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## smutchin (4 Jun 2018)

I presume it will be similar to the gridding at the start of a cyclocross race - ie riders will be called to the line in order, but in every other respect it will be no different to any other mass start.

Setting them off in waves would be silly - it's not a sportive, you know.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (4 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> Setting them off in waves would be silly - it's not a sportive, you know.



I'm beginning to wonder


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## mjr (8 Jun 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> My guess: The riders will invent their own ad-hoc neutralised zone in which the teams sort themselves out, and then get going.


I'll be surprised if the teams cooperate that much. Possibly a few of the teams with numbers near the front in places 11-40 will collaborate to hunt down chasers until their domestiques can move up, but it'll all depend on the GC.


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## smutchin (8 Jun 2018)

I've seen it reported that the riders will be setting off in 'waves', but that doesn't make any sense to me and I can't see the evidence for it in the official documentation.

I'm envisaging something more like the start of a cyclocross race, where the riders are 'gridded' according to league standings, but it's not like an F1 grid - they're all closely bunched up on the start line and all set off at the same time. A good grid position is a major advantage in CX races where it pays to be ahead of the bunch going into the first tight bend. For this Tour stage, they're starting at the foot of the Peyresourde and the road starts going uphill immediately, so being at the front will be an advantage for anyone who wants to attack from the gun.

Any team that has a number of riders high on GC will do very well out of this.

The likes of Warren Barguil and Pierre Rolland will want to target a stage like this but they'll most likely be stuck somewhere in the middle of the bunch, which will hamper their chances.


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## smutchin (8 Jun 2018)

Something like this:

View: https://youtu.be/p9J5ZKfRhoc


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## Beebo (8 Jun 2018)

I presume it will be a rolling start. Not a standing start?


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## smutchin (8 Jun 2018)

Beebo said:


> I presume it will be a rolling start. Not a standing start?



No, it's a standing start. No neutralised zone.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (8 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> I've seen it reported that the riders will be setting off in 'waves'...


So it is a sportive after all, hopefully they'll have their numbers tied to their handlebars...

Standing start/neutralised zone/whatever. Utterly pointless. 
Unless anyone thinks the top GC riders are going to knock their pans in alone for 65km in a head-to-head toe-to-toe WWF last-man-standing style - which is probably indicative of how drunk the people who came up with the idea must have been


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## smutchin (8 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> So it is a sportive after all...



They're not setting off in waves though, I think that was the reporter misunderstanding the concept (I think it was on Cycling News, so it seems likely). And it's definitely not what it says in the official documentation.

It does all sound a bit bonkers but I'm reserving judgment until I see how it works in practice.


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## Adam4868 (8 Jun 2018)

The only thing that's exciting about this stage is seeing how the organisers are going to get all the riders in their ''correct" positions.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (8 Jun 2018)

I have decided that I am going to rejoice in the lunacy that is Carlton Kirby; it's too painful otherwise. Rejoice one and all.


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## Adam4868 (8 Jun 2018)

I love Carlton Kirby.....


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## Pro Tour Punditry (8 Jun 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> I love Carlton Kirby.....


That's the spirit!!


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## Adam4868 (8 Jun 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> That's the spirit!!


T shirts on its way to you,XXl ?


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## mjr (8 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> No, it's a standing start. No neutralised zone.


Surely it's a grid start (riders on their bikes but not moving), not a standing start (riders stood near their bikes)?


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## smutchin (8 Jun 2018)

mjr said:


> Surely it's a grid start (riders on their bikes but not moving), not a standing start (riders stood near their bikes)?



Yes, if you want to be hyper-pedantic and ignore common usage.


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## mjr (8 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> Yes, if you want to be hyper-pedantic and ignore common usage.


I'll settle for not being farking confusing. A standing start is still an actual thing in bike racing and it ain't what the Tour de France is apparently going to do.


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## Aravis (8 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> I've seen it reported that the riders will be setting off in 'waves', but that doesn't make any sense to me and I can't see the evidence for it in the official documentation.
> 
> I'm envisaging something more like the start of a cyclocross race, where the riders are 'gridded' according to league standings, but it's not like an F1 grid - they're all closely bunched up on the start line and all set off at the same time. A good grid position is a major advantage in CX races where it pays to be ahead of the bunch going into the first tight bend. For this Tour stage, they're starting at the foot of the Peyresourde and the road starts going uphill immediately, so being at the front will be an advantage for anyone who wants to attack from the gun.
> 
> ...


Doesn't this mean there's a strong incentive for support riders to look after their GC positions in the stages leading up to this? If that means they're not so free to bury themselves for their leaders it should lead to more open and unpredictable racing on all the key stages.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (8 Jun 2018)

Aravis said:


> Doesn't this mean there's a strong incentive for support riders to look after their GC positions in the stages leading up to this? If that means they're not so free to bury themselves for their leaders it should lead to more open and unpredictable racing on all the key stages.


No. 

But it's probably what the really drunk people who came up with the idea thought might happen; that and unicorns...


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## deptfordmarmoset (8 Jun 2018)

Aravis said:


> Doesn't this mean there's a strong incentive for support riders to look after their GC positions in the stages leading up to this? If that means they're not so free to bury themselves for their leaders it should lead to more open and unpredictable racing on all the key stages.


Won't they just spend a lot of early time simply jostling for position, regrouping with team members while keeping an eye on breaks? Which might lead to lots of early crashes from different riders at different speeds, which is what I thought the départ fictif was meant to avoid.


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## smutchin (12 Jun 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> An interesting Tour related obituary, courtesy of inrng. Yvette Hornère:
> http://inrng.com/2018/06/yvette-hornere-obituary/



There's an homage to her in Belleville Rendezvous (or Les Triplettes de Belleville if you prefer). Makes me want to watch the film again.


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## Bollo (12 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> There's an homage to her in Belleville Rendezvous (or Les Triplettes de Belleville if you prefer). Makes me want to watch the film again.


Ooooh, haven’t seen that in years. I think I’ve got it on ye olde DVD.


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## gavroche (12 Jun 2018)

Glad to see some of you had heard of her. She died last night, age 95.


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## smutchin (13 Jun 2018)

Bollo said:


> Ooooh, haven’t seen that in years. I think I’ve got it on ye olde DVD.



I used to own a copy on DVD but now I can't find it anywhere. Nuts! I do hope I didn't do anything foolish like lend it to someone...


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## T4tomo (13 Jun 2018)

mjr said:


> I'll settle for not being farking confusing. A standing start is still an actual thing in bike racing and it ain't what the Tour de France is apparently going to do.


what about standing astride the cross bar (or top tube for the hyper pedantic)?


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## Adam4868 (14 Jun 2018)

I probably think the same most years,but for sure this year it's going to be hard for the tour to top this year's Giro.Rewatching the giro this week it really was a fantastic race.Heres hoping...


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## Slaav (14 Jun 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> I probably think the same most years,but for sure this year it's going to be hard for the tour to top this year's Giro.Rewatching the giro this week it really was a fantastic race.Heres hoping...



Does anybody know of a good (long enough) summary of the Giro from this year? A round up if you like? Thx


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## Adam4868 (16 Jun 2018)

Thibaut Pinot to miss Tour de France following illness at Giro d’Italia

http://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/r...-france-following-illness-giro-ditalia-383232


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## Pro Tour Punditry (16 Jun 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Thibaut Pinot to miss Tour de France following illness at Giro d’Italia
> 
> http://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/r...-france-following-illness-giro-ditalia-383232


I thought he wasn't riding it anyway. Maybe I've picked it up wrong but I had thought the Giro was his target this year.


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## rich p (26 Jun 2018)

Quickstep team looks an all rounder bunch. Stages for Gaviria, Terpstra, Alaphilippe; Jungels for a top ten GC.
Lampaerts for a long range attack?

The Mitchelton team announced the other day looked a bit lightweight in the mountains in support of Adam Yates. He'll have to fly solo a lot of the time I suspect. Nieve is his main wing man but he's approaching the twilight years.

Movistar have 3 leaders in Quintana, ValvPiti and Landa. Can't see that going tits up...


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## Adam4868 (26 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> Quickstep team looks an all rounder bunch. Stages for Gaviria, Terpstra, Alaphilippe; Jungels for a top ten GC.
> Lampaerts for a long range attack?
> 
> The Mitchelton team announced the other day looked a bit lightweight in the mountains in support of Adam Yates. He'll have to fly solo a lot of the time I suspect. Nieve is his main wing man but he's approaching the twilight years.
> ...


Caleb Ewan wasn't too pleased at not being picked !


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## smutchin (26 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> Movistar have 3 leaders in Quintana, ValvPiti and Landa. Can't see that going tits up...



Landa has already said he's racing to win.

I doubt even Valverde fancies his own chances at overall victory, so it will be interesting to see which of the other two gets his support.


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## Adam4868 (26 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> Landa has already said he's racing to win.
> 
> I doubt even Valverde fancies his own chances at overall victory, so it will be interesting to see which of the other two gets his support.


Too many cooks ?


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## cisamcgu (26 Jun 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Too many cooks ?


Many hands make light work ?


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## smutchin (26 Jun 2018)

Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.


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## Slaav (26 Jun 2018)

rich p said:


> Quickstep team looks an all rounder bunch. Stages for Gaviria, Terpstra, Alaphilippe; Jungels for a top ten GC.
> Lampaerts for a long range attack?
> 
> The Mitchelton team announced the other day looked a bit lightweight in the mountains in support of Adam Yates. He'll have to fly solo a lot of the time I suspect. Nieve is his main wing man but he's approaching the twilight years.
> ...



Why did Landa leave Sky again? I had the impression that he was being groomed as a No 2 or 3 and would get fully supported cracks at a GT?


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## rich p (26 Jun 2018)

Slaav said:


> Why did Landa leave Sky again? I had the impression that he was being groomed as a No 2 or 3 and would get fully supported cracks at a GT?


I suspect he thought Valverde would have given up on GC ambitions and he could swap leadership with Quintana.
At Sky he was always going to play second fiddle to Froome who wants to take the penalties, free kicks and throw ins. As Thomas has found out.


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## rich p (26 Jun 2018)

I also read an unsubstantiated rumour that Quintana was being courted by Astana.


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## brommers (27 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> I doubt even Valverde fancies his own chances at overall victory, so it will be interesting to see which of the other two gets his support.


Neither


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## Adam4868 (27 Jun 2018)

Valverde has the seniority,Quintana has the ability(I think !) and Landa has......big eyebrows ? 
It's only gonna be Quintana barring a crash.


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## smutchin (28 Jun 2018)

After Cinderella outfit Fortuneo-Samsic had their bikes taken away from them a couple of days ago, the BH fairy godmothers have stepped in, so Warren Barguil will be going to the ball after all...

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/fortuneo-samsic-sign-deal-with-bh-after-split-with-look/


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## rich p (28 Jun 2018)

smutchin said:


> After Cinderella outfit Fortuneo-Samsic had their bikes taken away from them a couple of days ago, the BH fairy godmothers have stepped in, so Warren Barguil will be going to the ball after all...
> 
> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/fortuneo-samsic-sign-deal-with-bh-after-split-with-look/


He's probably ambivalent about that given his poor form this year.


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## Too Tyred (1 Jul 2018)

Has anyone seen the official guide anywhere? I'm looking for the one with the three pairs of socks but I can't find it anywhere.


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## Bonefish Blues (1 Jul 2018)

I always lose socks too.


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## brommers (2 Jul 2018)

Breaking News - UCI have cleared Chris Froome


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## brommers (2 Jul 2018)

He wouldn't say it of course, but I reckon Geraint Thomas was hoping that Froome would get banned.


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## LarryDuff (2 Jul 2018)

Too Tyred said:


> Has anyone seen the official guide anywhere? I'm looking for the one with the three pairs of socks but I can't find it anywhere.


The 3 socks were only available for online orders. 
They are very nice too especially the polka dot ones.


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## Mark Grant (2 Jul 2018)

I'm sure my local Tesco had the mag with the socks a couple of weeks ago.


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## gavroche (2 Jul 2018)

Got mine from WH Smith, with the three socks, keyring, neck thingy and a water bottle too. Really, I think the water bottle was supposed to be with another magazine but the shop assistant wasn't sure so she let me have it too.


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## Adam4868 (2 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> Got mine from WH Smith, with the three socks, keyring, neck thingy and a water bottle too. Really, I think the water bottle was supposed to be with another magazine but the shop assistant wasn't sure so she let me have it too.


I used to pull the freebies of magazines as a kid too.


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## gavroche (3 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> I used to pull the freebies of magazines as a kid too.


I didn't take it off another mag. She got it from behind the counter and gave it to me.


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## rich p (3 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I didn't take it off another mag. She got it from behind the counter and gave it to me.


Yeah, right!!!!


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## brommers (5 Jul 2018)

Eurosport 1 is showing the TdF team presentation Thursday 5.15pm to 7.00pm


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## Shadow (5 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Eurosport 1 is showing the TdF team presentation Thursday 5.15pm to 7.00pm


The details you drag up astound me - in a good way. This will be about as exciting as an ITT!!


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## brommers (5 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> The details you drag up astound me - in a good way. This will be about as exciting as an ITT!!


I've watched these before and they're not too bad


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## Bollo (5 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> The details you drag up astound me - in a good way. This will be about as exciting as an ITT!!


Might be interesting to see the response when Sky rock up.


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## Adam4868 (5 Jul 2018)

On a exciting theme.....
http://road.cc/content/news/244357-eurosport-signs-sir-bradley-wiggins-tour-de-france-podcast-series
Brad is hosting a podcast/Eurosport TDF show every monday
Expect guests such as Danny Dyer discussing Brexit,Paul Weller with the music.Should be a useful insight into the workings of Team Sky and his close friendship with Froomedawg !


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## Broadside (5 Jul 2018)

Has anyone seen any links to the exact route for each stage?

I’m going out to see some of the bits through northern France next weekend but the precise road route maps seem a bit elusive.


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## Alan O (5 Jul 2018)

Broadside said:


> Has anyone seen any links to the exact route for each stage?
> 
> I’m going out to see some of the bits through northern France next weekend but the precise road route maps seem a bit elusive.


This site appears to have a stage-by-stage breakdown...
https://www.cyclingstage.com/tour-de-france-2018-route/

And on each individual stage page there's a zoomable map at top-right of the whole stage and some more detailed maps and profiles at the bottom of the page.


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## Broadside (5 Jul 2018)

Alan O said:


> This site appears to have a stage-by-stage breakdown...
> https://www.cyclingstage.com/tour-de-france-2018-route/
> 
> And on each individual stage page there's a zoomable map at top-right of the whole stage and some more detailed maps and profiles at the bottom of the page.



@Alan O thats brilliant, thank you.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (5 Jul 2018)

#14 Dylan Groenewegen

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stfHE8bwvro&feature=youtu.be


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## Tin Pot (5 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> On a exciting theme.....
> http://road.cc/content/news/244357-eurosport-signs-sir-bradley-wiggins-tour-de-france-podcast-series
> Brad is hosting a podcast/Eurosport TDF show every monday
> Expect guests such as Danny Dyer discussing Brexit,Paul Weller with the music.Should be a useful insight into the workings of Team Sky and his close friendship with Froomedawg !


Subscribed


----------



## brommers (5 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> On a exciting theme.....
> http://road.cc/content/news/244357-eurosport-signs-sir-bradley-wiggins-tour-de-france-podcast-series
> Brad is hosting a podcast/Eurosport TDF show every monday
> Expect guests such as Danny Dyer discussing Brexit,Paul Weller with the music.Should be a useful insight into the workings of Team Sky and his close friendship with Froomedawg !


Danny Dyer?


----------



## Bollo (5 Jul 2018)

I’m just watching the rider presentation now. It’s kinda awkward.


----------



## Bollo (5 Jul 2018)

Plenty of booing and whistling for Team Sky, which was to be expected. Froome was quickly bypassed but the crowd are giving the entire team a hard time. That was uncomfortable.


----------



## Viking (5 Jul 2018)

Looked pretty unpleasant. Thomas looked as if he was getting ready for some action. Hinault must be pleased.


----------



## Adam4868 (5 Jul 2018)

Wonder how many of the ones who accused Froome will be big enough to apologise ? Not many id guess.


----------



## roadrash (5 Jul 2018)

Too Tyred said:


> Has anyone seen the official guide anywhere? I'm looking for the one with the three pairs of socks but I can't find it anywhere.



WH Smiths still have them


----------



## perplexed (6 Jul 2018)

I wonder if Froome will feel inclined to retire after this season? I've no particular basis for pondering this, just an idle thought. He's achieved so much in winning all the Grand Tours, holding all three at the same time, multiple TdF wins etc. He doesn't need to prove anything and he has a young family, and he gets so much stick... Will he be tempted to go whilst he's at the top of his game?


----------



## Bollo (6 Jul 2018)

I can't link directly to the video as it's facebook via twitter?! but this gives some idea of the welcome for Sky yesterday. The article's worth a read, but the video is just a short scroll down. You'll need the sound on.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...ucation-first-chris-froome-jonathan-vaughters


----------



## Adam4868 (6 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> He was "accused" (I'm sure someone will be along to point out that is the wrong word for the proceedings) on the basis of a failed test AAF. Are you expecting WADA to say "we're very sorry we noticed your elevated Salbutamol levels and we now realise we should never have doubted you. If it happens again we won't be so impudent"


https://www.teamsky.com/article/chris-froome-writes-in-le-monde
There was never really a case to answer though...I was thinking more along the lines of those who were more vocal about him Hinault ? Ect.Anyway on with the race,I read Bardet has said he deserves respect as the current champ,so theres one !


----------



## smutchin (6 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> There was never really a case to answer though...



I don't think any of us is in a position to confirm or deny that for certain. Not enough detailed information about the case has been made public, and even if it were, would we have the expertise to analyse it? 

After being told one thing and then another about this case by various experts, I've given up having an opinion on the matter.


----------



## Alan O (6 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I don't think any of us is in a position to confirm or deny that for certain. Not enough detailed information about the case has been made public, and even if it were, would we have the expertise to analyse it?
> 
> After being told one thing and then another about this case by various experts, I've given up having an opinion on the matter.


I think the point is that a case _was never actually brought_ - it was just a routine examination as part of regular procedure, which happens to many riders but is usually not leaked. So there was, _literally_, no case to answer.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (6 Jul 2018)

I wonder how many stages it'll take before we get the traditional "this is boring" posts


----------



## FishFright (6 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> https://www.teamsky.com/article/chris-froome-writes-in-le-monde
> There was never really a case to answer though...I was thinking more along the lines of those who were more vocal about him Hinault ? Ect.Anyway on with the race,I read Bardet has said he deserves respect as the current champ,so theres one !



19.5% , remember that next time you think he was exonerated


----------



## FishFright (6 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> I wonder how many stages it'll take before we get the traditional "this is boring" posts



Is there a prologue this year ?


----------



## Crackle (6 Jul 2018)

I'm looking forward to the Vuelta.


----------



## smutchin (6 Jul 2018)

FishFright said:


> Is there a prologue this year ?



No. Stages 1 & 2 are very flat so likely to finish in bunch sprints - although being on the west coast of France, there's the possibility of wind being a factor (stage 1 definitely, but stage 2 is more inland so less likely).

Stage 3 is a TTT, so there's every chance that we'll see riders from the same team occupying all the top places after stage 3. I'm sure the French public will be very happy if that's Team Sky.


----------



## Crackle (6 Jul 2018)

I'll be very happy to see the French public unhappy


----------



## FishFright (6 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I'll be very happy to see the French public unhappy



Not as happy as they will be to see the back of us next year


----------



## Bollo (6 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> No. Stages 1 & 2 are very flat so likely to finish in bunch sprints - although being on the west coast of France, there's the possibility of wind being a factor (stage 1 definitely, but stage 2 is more inland so less likely).


Good point! There's an argument that the 2015 tour was decided by the wind on the flat-as-a-kippers stage 2 from Utrecht to Zeeland.


----------



## Adam4868 (6 Jul 2018)

FishFright said:


> 19.5% , remember that next time you think he was exonerated



View: https://twitter.com/velorick/status/1014451508950327296?s=19


----------



## Crackle (6 Jul 2018)

FishFright said:


> Not as happy as they will be to see the back of us next year


Never underestimate the insecurity of the French. Which sounds like I dislike them but nothing could be further from the truth. I only tease nations I like.


----------



## perplexed (6 Jul 2018)

Froome has had a piece published in Le Monde.

https://www.teamsky.com/article/chris-froome-writes-in-le-monde


----------



## gavroche (6 Jul 2018)

I hope it was all translated in French otherwise, waste of time. Personally, I believe Froome is clean.


----------



## rich p (7 Jul 2018)

I bought the tdf magazine from WHS yesterday.
3 prs of socks, green, polka dot and yellow. Plus a bottle opener keyring and a buff. 
I was so excited I haven't even looked at the mag yet.


----------



## mjr (7 Jul 2018)

perplexed said:


> I wonder if Froome will feel inclined to retire after this season? I've no particular basis for pondering this, just an idle thought. He's achieved so much in winning all the Grand Tours, holding all three at the same time, multiple TdF wins etc. He doesn't need to prove anything and he has a young family, and he gets so much stick... Will he be tempted to go whilst he's at the top of his game?


After what's been said, I think Froome will want to take Hinault off the top step of history now, if he can. Which will please the French(!)


----------



## mjr (7 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> I can't link directly to the video as it's facebook via twitter?! but this gives some idea of the welcome for Sky yesterday. The article's worth a read, but the video is just a short scroll down. You'll need the sound on.
> 
> https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...ucation-first-chris-froome-jonathan-vaughters


Vaughters does speak an awful lot of sense about this sort of thing. Unlike team finance.


----------



## mjr (7 Jul 2018)

perplexed said:


> Froome has had a piece published in Le Monde.
> 
> https://www.teamsky.com/article/chris-froome-writes-in-le-monde


TMN to @Adam4868


----------



## brommers (7 Jul 2018)

The 3-2-1 seconds time bonuses in the first week, approx. ¾ into each stage, could prove to be interesting.


----------



## Adam4868 (7 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I bought the tdf magazine from WHS yesterday.
> 3 prs of socks, green, polka dot and yellow. Plus a bottle opener keyring and a buff.
> I was so excited I haven't even looked at the mag yet.


Polka dot socks,buff and a bottle opener on your key chain is a good look for watching the footy Rich !


----------



## Bollo (7 Jul 2018)

Kickoff around now. I've just checked the weather and there are only light winds so it's likely to be a sprinters' stage.


----------



## perplexed (7 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> After what's been said, I think Froome will want to take Hinault off the top step of history now, if he can. Which will please the French(!)



True, I hadn't thought of that angle on things.


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

And there off !!!!


----------



## TissoT (7 Jul 2018)

Guess the rest of the peloton will be happy No Nasir Bouhannin ?


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Im happy , no boohoohani


----------



## TissoT (7 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Im happy , no boohoohani


Hopefully he will be sat on his own tearful watching the TDF in shame... thinking what a "Dick" hes been in the Past.


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Ive decided to give itv4 a go , I don't think I can cope with Kirby for three weeks


----------



## Tin Pot (7 Jul 2018)

A quiet start, nice to see it all begin. Surprised it’s all within France this year.

Go Brits!


----------



## Dave Davenport (7 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> A quiet start, nice to see it all begin. Surprised it’s all within France this year.
> 
> Go Brits!


It is every other year.


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Lawson Cradock of EF education first has had a fall resulting in a nasty looking cut over his right eye


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

crash , Ritchie porte caught in it and held up , why he was towards the rear of the peleton with ten km to go I don't know


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

demare held up also he wont be sprinting today


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

race radio says froome crashed no more info yet


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

puncture for quintana


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

cav also off the back


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

gaviria gets the win


----------



## Bollo (7 Jul 2018)

My, that all went a bit t1ts!


----------



## Adam4868 (7 Jul 2018)

First day nerves


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (7 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> A quiet start, nice to see it all begin. Surprised it’s all within France this year.
> 
> Go Brits!


Not all that quiet in the end!


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

that last 10km was chaotic, im knackered watching that


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Quintana loses about 3 mins , which will probably be music to landas ears


----------



## smutchin (7 Jul 2018)

That was mental. Quintana already out of GC contention for sure. BMC and Sky will really need to make the most of the team time trial.

QS absolutely bossed the sprint, almost HTC style. Great power finish by Gaviria - did well to hold off Sagan.


----------



## fossyant (7 Jul 2018)

Gee for the win !


----------



## jarlrmai (7 Jul 2018)

Hello chaps, well that was fun.


----------



## jarlrmai (7 Jul 2018)

Apparently the US coverage showed a bit more of Gaviria than is considered polite.


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Movistar just tweeted Quintana only 1 min 22 secs down..


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (7 Jul 2018)

I reckon there was a doctor or a scientist at the side of the road where Froome went down...


----------



## roadrash (7 Jul 2018)

Lawson Cradock sustained a broken scapula and stitches over his eye


----------



## mjr (7 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> A quiet start, nice to see it all begin. Surprised it’s all within France this year.
> 
> Go Brits!


It goes into Spain too. Not much but it does.


----------



## rich p (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> BMC and Sky will really need to make the most of the team time trial.


Agreed, plus Mitchelton Scott too for Yates.

If BMC, Sky, Movistar and M-S can do a decent TTT we could end up back to square one, which I'd prefer, to a whole team, Sky say, taking significant time from less able TTTers


----------



## roadrash (8 Jul 2018)

well cav looked downbeat in that interview


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> well cav looked downbeat in that interview



Didn’t see it. Did he say what happened? Looked to me like his gears seized up.


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Agreed, plus Mitchelton Scott too for Yates.



Forgot about Yates. Damn. Should have picked him for the punditry.


----------



## Levo-Lon (8 Jul 2018)

Omg that Willier with a copper chrome finish!!!! Want


----------



## roadrash (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Didn’t see it. Did he say what happened? Looked to me like his gears seized up.



he was asked what he thought his chances of winning the sprint today and mumbled "it will be really hard to beat bora and quickstep this year" when asked why , he mumbled "dunno really but it will be hard to beat them " he just looked like he couldn't be arsed


----------



## gavroche (8 Jul 2018)

Chavanel's bike is gorgeous. Great colour.


----------



## StuAff (8 Jul 2018)

Pete Kennaugh is proving a most excellent pundit. Very interesting discussions and answers to viewer questions. Good call, whoever got him involved.

Also, Chavanel's jockey wheels- I know aftermarket ones from the likes of CeramicSpeed are a big deal for pros these days, but that is a Really Big One!


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> Chavanel's bike is gorgeous. Great colour.



He's a beautiful rider too. Classic rouleur. He would have won a lot more in his career if he hadn't been competing against doping nobbers.


----------



## Beebo (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> He's a beautiful rider too. Classic rouleur. He would have won a lot more in his career if he hadn't been competing against doping nobbers.


He has raced 350 days in the TdF. 
If he makes it to the end he will have ridden more than a years worth of stages.


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

IIRC he’ll also set a new record for most completed Tours.

If it hadn’t been for his two DNFs, he would already have beaten Joop Zoetemelk’s record of 16 consecutive complete Tours.


----------



## StuAff (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> IIRC he’ll also set a new record for most completed Tours.
> 
> If it hadn’t been for his two DNFs, he would already have beaten Joop Zoetemelk’s record of 16 consecutive complete Tours.


Adam Hansen, surely? 20 consecutive GTs.


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

StuAff said:


> Adam Hansen, surely? 20 consecutive GTs.



Hansen’s record includes the Giro and Vuelta. Very impressive but in a different way!


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

View: https://twitter.com/stueyog/status/1015937927732490240?s=21



View: https://twitter.com/thejensie/status/1015947349154324480?s=21


Not sure how many Tours Stuart O’Grady completed but he started 17. Jens Voigt completed 14 out of 17 attempts.

This is Chava’s 18th start, so if he finishes it will be 16 completions to equal Zoetemelk.


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

Hincapie tied Zoetemelk’s record with 16 consecutive completions out of 17 attempts (only his first ever attempt was DNF) but three were struck off.


----------



## StuAff (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Hansen’s record includes the Giro and Vuelta. Very impressive but in a different way!


Aah...TdFs only. Forgot that one!


----------



## roadrash (8 Jul 2018)

that's kittel out of todays sprint


----------



## StuAff (8 Jul 2018)

Some Slovakian bloke got it. One to watch for the green jersey, perhaps.....


----------



## brommers (8 Jul 2018)

Sky have got a strong Time Trial team and Geraint Thomas will be wearing the Yellow Jersey this time tomorrow


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (8 Jul 2018)

LL Sanchez reported as having a fractured elbow


----------



## roadrash (8 Jul 2018)

and 4 fractured ribs...
Examination in local hospital is done, Luis Leon Sanchez has a fracture in the elbow and in four of his ribs. Full details: https://goo.gl/oVyzKj .


----------



## Crackle (8 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> and 4 fractured ribs...
> Examination in local hospital is done, Luis Leon Sanchez has a fracture in the elbow and in four of his ribs. Full details: https://goo.gl/oVyzKj .


Good grief and he tried to get back on his bike too!


----------



## Milzy (8 Jul 2018)

How come there’s no points added on our Velo games fantasy TDF?


----------



## roadrash (8 Jul 2018)

He did try didn't he, I couldn't believe Lawson Craddock rode today , given his fractured scapula


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (8 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> View: https://twitter.com/stueyog/status/1015937927732490240?s=21
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Ok, Jens Voight's post. Is aujourdhier today or yesterday?????


----------



## StuAff (8 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> Ok, Jens Voight's post. Is aujourdhier today or yesterday?????


I think his French went a bit awry there. Jensie probably meant this evening.


----------



## smutchin (8 Jul 2018)

He probably meant “Good moaning” as he was just pissing past the window.


----------



## gavroche (8 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> He did try didn't he, I couldn't believe Lawson Craddock rode today , given his fractured scapula


But they are cyclists, no footballers.


----------



## Mike_P (8 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> How come there’s no points added on our Velo games fantasy TDF?


Because its been pulled due to a solicitors letter - Le Tour have set up their own.


----------



## Mike_P (8 Jul 2018)

Bet you could hear Michelton Scott mechanics groaning as Jack Bauer completely forgot he had rested his bike on his left leg as he helped Adam Yates


----------



## 400bhp (8 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Sky have got a strong Time Trial team and Geraint Thomas will be wearing the Yellow Jersey this time tomorrow



May be, not will be.

Sunweb & BMC have good TTT, as do Lotto-Jumbo. My guess is it'll go to BMC tomorrow, so maybe GVA or TJ.


----------



## Milzy (9 Jul 2018)

Mike_P said:


> Because its been pulled due to a solicitors letter - Le Tour have set up their own.


FFS I need to go for a strong cup of sweet tea.


----------



## Beebo (9 Jul 2018)

Team SKY are 2nd team to start today. So will have nothing to compare themselves too on the course.


----------



## Beebo (9 Jul 2018)

SKY won't be winning the TTT as BMC have just gone top of the list for now.


----------



## smutchin (9 Jul 2018)

GVA provisionally in yellow, then?

Dumoulin would take it off him if Sunweb go faster...


----------



## smutchin (9 Jul 2018)

AG2R lose 1.15 to BMC. Could have been a lot worse!

Movistar finished 53 seconds down on BMC, which is not great.

EF only 35 seconds down, which keeps Uran in contention (still ahead of Porte and Froome on GC?).


----------



## smutchin (9 Jul 2018)

Cofidis have lost well over three minutes. That's frankly a bit rubbish.

Sunweb are doing better but aren't going to win it. ETA: strong finish, only 11 seconds down.


----------



## smutchin (9 Jul 2018)

Oooh, QuickStep miss out on nicking yellow for Gilbert by a couple of seconds!

They dropped Gaviria quite early - he'd be in yellow now if he'd been able to hang on.


----------



## smutchin (9 Jul 2018)

Sagan and Majka off the back of the Bora train. That'll be Majka out of GC contention (if he was ever in it).


----------



## rich p (9 Jul 2018)

As Smutch says, that's levelled the GC field a bit.
Slight advantage Dumoulin and Uran but that will all change on the first mountain, if not before.
This tdf has not been without incident already.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (9 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Sagan and Majka off the back of the Bora train. That'll be Majka out of GC contention (if he was ever in it).


What about Sagan? Why doesn't he just keep riding really fast in the mountains? Surely he'll be able to catch them up easy like.


----------



## mjr (9 Jul 2018)

Mike_P said:


> Because its been pulled due to a solicitors letter - Le Tour have set up their own.


Dopey gits ASO. At least other races are still on velogames. I wonder what was in the solicitors letter - other fantasy leagues are still up, but are mostly backed by much bigger companies. Who's going to be attacked next? road.cc?


----------



## rich p (9 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Dopey gits ASO. At least other races are still on velogames. I wonder what was in the solicitors letter - other fantasy leagues are still up, but are mostly backed by much bigger companies. Who's going to be attacked next? road.cc?


I'm hoping Marmy will feel the force of Prudhomme. He talks the talk but can he marcher le promenade?


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (9 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm hoping Marmy will feel the force of Prudhomme. He talks the talk but can he marcher le promenade?


I'd fry the Gallic nobber in olive oil with a hint of Provence herbs


----------



## brommers (10 Jul 2018)

400bhp said:


> May be, not will be.
> 
> Sunweb & BMC have good TTT, as do Lotto-Jumbo. My guess is it'll go to BMC tomorrow, so maybe GVA or TJ.


----------



## mjr (10 Jul 2018)

In ITV4's chat with Michael Rogers today, he's just claimed to have been literally a dead person on a bike at one tour. 

Break of the day has 8 minutes, 140km to go. Paste from live.cyclingnews.com:

Dimitri Claeys
Cofidis, Solutions Credits

Jérôme Cousin
Direct Energie

Anthony Perez
Cofidis, Solutions Credits

Guillaume Van Keirsbulck
Wanty-Groupe Gobert

It's every bit as exciting as an early flat stage usually is.


----------



## smutchin (10 Jul 2018)

Two Cofidis riders! Someone has obviously shot a rocket up their arse after their failure to get in the breaks on stages 1 & 2, and their dismal performance in the TTT yesterday.


----------



## mjr (10 Jul 2018)

Ned resumes commentary with "a million thanks, Matt". Is he going native French? Merci mille fois, indeed. (Yes, I know that gained some zeroes in translation. Must be exchange rates or something.)

Yes, it's that interesting so far.


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

bit of trouble for cavendish needing a radio change and dropped it , had to stop to retrieve it, he really does look totally pissed off


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (10 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Two Cofidis riders! Someone has obviously shot a rocket up their arse after their failure to get in the breaks on stages 1 & 2, and their dismal performance in the TTT yesterday.


There can't be (m)any teams who are more utterly pointless than Cofidis.


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

just having boohoohani makes them pointless


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (10 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> just having boohoohani makes them pointless


They have 2 of them...


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

twice as pointless , if that's possible


----------



## smutchin (10 Jul 2018)

I just had a look at the UCI rankings. Interestingly, Cofidis are ranked higher than Direct Energie in the Europe Tour and only have Wanty GG ahead of them.

Their top individual points scorer is Hugo Hofstetter, who isn't in the Tour team (his best result this season is winning a stage of the Tour de l'Ain, which was his first pro race win). Nor is their second-highest scorer, who is Boohoohanni, believe it or not.

Three of the Tour team - Herrada, Navarro and Perez - are literally pointless.


----------



## smutchin (10 Jul 2018)

Tony Gallopin just stopped for a wheel change. The mechanic was opening the door of the team car as it pulled up alongside him, whacking him on the arse. He did not look happy!


----------



## brommers (10 Jul 2018)

At the intermediate sprint, why did the peloton 'go for it'? surely the breakaway swallowed up the points?


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

crash at 4.7 km from the line , a lot of riders held up


----------



## smutchin (10 Jul 2018)

Nearly went for Cav in the punditry today. Looks like he’s well up for it...

But nowhere in the end. Oh dear!


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

what was cav protesting about


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

That was some acceleration from griepel


----------



## cd365 (10 Jul 2018)

Is Cav done as a TDF stage winner now? Looks like it to me.


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

cd365 said:


> Is Cav done as a TDF stage winner now? Looks like it to me.



I wouldn't write him off yet, but to me, he does look like his head isn't in the right place


----------



## gavroche (10 Jul 2018)

I think he is past his best. Newcomers have the advantage over him now. He will not equal, let alone beat Eddie Merks record.


----------



## Crackle (10 Jul 2018)

I would not write him off yet. In recent years he's taken a few stages to get going.


----------



## gavroche (10 Jul 2018)

I am not writing him off but he can't produce the consistency we were familiar to expect.


----------



## roadrash (10 Jul 2018)

he looked and sounded a lot happier in that post race interview


----------



## Bollo (10 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> what was cav protesting about


Sorry, late to the party today but I *think* he felt that Groenewegen cut across him towards the line. He did, but Cav's sprint was over by that point.


----------



## mjr (10 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am not writing him off but he can't produce the consistency we were familiar to expect.


The closest Cav came to consistency was 2009-2011 but even then he had off days and didn't take the green jersey until 2011. Since 2012 and the arrival of Sagan, Cav's faced tough competition in all sorts of sprint (he'd had some competition in train-launch sprints since Griepel switched teams in 2011 and other train-launch sprinters have kept coming through) and not really been the clear favourite in any sort of sprint since. Despite that, he's kept winning every year except when he's crashed out.


----------



## mjr (11 Jul 2018)

Kišerlovski in a horror smash while the break of the day tries to get away. Seemed like a crash into kerbs or street furniture followed by a photo moto piling in  Abandon and frankly it'll be astonishing if there's nothing broken.


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Kišerlovski in a horror smash while the break of the day tries to get away. Seemed like a crash into kerbs or street furniture followed by a photo moto piling in  Abandon and frankly it'll be astonishing if there's nothing broken.



Some reports are saying broken collarbone but nothing worse. Let's hope those reports are correct.

Whoever's in charge of the Telegraph twitter account takes the prize for insensitivity (Kiserlovski is Croatian so you can pretty much guess what they said).


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

Chavanel is in the break again. Seems determined to win the supercombativity prize this year.


----------



## jarlrmai (11 Jul 2018)

I thought Chavanel was French for breakaway...


----------



## jarlrmai (11 Jul 2018)

So anyone going to adopt an Orca?


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

Matthews has abandoned due to illness.

Benoot also out.


----------



## gavroche (11 Jul 2018)

Does Chavanel ride a different bike every day? What happened to the beautiful bronze and silver one he was riding the other day?


----------



## Bollo (11 Jul 2018)

Cav out the back. 

Boulting and Millar are talking about him missing the cut. If he packs up or gets DQed I think he'll be doing some serious thinking abut his future.


----------



## hoopdriver (11 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Cav out the back.
> 
> Boulting and Millar are talking about him missing the cut. If he packs up or gets DQed I think he'll be doing some serious thinking abut his future.


I agree. His heart just doesn’t seem to be in it this year.


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

Kittel is also in the group off the back with Cav. They're now over 9 minutes behind the leaders.


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Cav out the back.
> 
> Boulting and Millar are talking about him missing the cut. If he packs up or gets DQed I think he'll be doing some serious thinking abut his future.


Not really the time or place but Cav is out of contract this year. Not sure who else would want him these days if DD don't.


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

Lovely blue hydrangeas there. Must be acid soil in Brittany...


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

These 2 are going to be caught with 12 km to go and capacity for more attacks from the boonch


----------



## roadrash (11 Jul 2018)

yates caught up in a crash again

ah no it wasn't yates


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

fast and furious


----------



## roadrash (11 Jul 2018)

innit


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

Phew! Sagan again


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Lovely blue hydrangeas there. Must be acid soil in Brittany...



I remember my wife making a similar observation when we stayed on a campsite near Quimper a few years ago. There were masses of blue hydrangeas all over the shop.


----------



## Bollo (11 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Not really the time or place but Cav is out of contract this year. Not sure who else would want him these days if DD don't.


I almost typed the same thing but didn't end up posting it. Bad luck or not he just doesn't look in the game. Would he want to carry on riding if he isn't competitive?


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> I almost typed the same thing but didn't end up posting it. Bad luck or not he just doesn't look in the game. Would he want to carry on riding if he isn't competitive?


I think he's competitive enough to see if he can get back to a fitness with an injury free season. The last few have been blighted.


----------



## GuyBoden (11 Jul 2018)

Isn't Cav getting a bit too old for sprinting, 33 this year.


----------



## smutchin (11 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I remember my wife making a similar observation when we stayed on a campsite near Quimper a few years ago. There were masses of blue hydrangeas all over the shop.



Just realised it must have been 2009 we stayed there, which is longer ago than I thought - I can date it quite precisely because I remember watching the final stage of the Tour in the campsite bar and it was the year Cav and Renshaw got the 1-2. My son and I were cheering loudly while a load of disgruntled Frenchmen watched on in disgust. Then we had crepes to celebrate. 

Very nice campsite it was too - this one, if anyone is remotely interested: https://www.camping-castels.co.uk/campsite/lanniron


----------



## Bollo (11 Jul 2018)

GuyBoden said:


> Isn't Cav getting a bit too old for sprinting, 33 this year.


Greipel’s 35 and still competitive.


rich p said:


> I think he's competitive enough to see if he can get back to a fitness with an injury free season. The last few have been blighted.


I hope so, but I guess we’ll have to see.

Risking an OT slap on the wrist, I have the stages on in the background while I *cough* work, but I’ve found myself being drawn into The Professionals afterwards. Now I want a Ford Escort RS2000.


----------



## rich p (11 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Just realised it must have been 2009 we stayed there, which is longer ago than I thought - I can date it quite precisely because I remember watching the final stage of the Tour in the campsite bar and it was the year Cav and Renshaw got the 1-2. My son and I were cheering loudly while a load of disgruntled Frenchmen watched on in disgust. Then we had crepes to celebrate.
> 
> Very nice campsite it was too - this one, if anyone is remotely interested: https://www.camping-castels.co.uk/campsite/lanniron


I think that was the year Mrs rp and I did a cycle tour of the Loire and we watched on the ferry on the way over to Le Havre.
The sound was down and 95% of the people in the lounge weren't even watching it and when Cav won about 6 of us leapt up and cheered much to the others' bemusement.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (11 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I think that was the year Mrs rp and I did a cycle tour of the Loire and we watched on the ferry on the way over to Le Havre.
> The sound was down and 95% of the people in the lounge weren't even watching it and when Cav won about 6 of us leapt up and cheered much to the others' bemusement.


The year that cycling was invented by someone just a little bit fed up with playing golf in southern England


----------



## Adam4868 (12 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Just realised it must have been 2009 we stayed there, which is longer ago than I thought - I can date it quite precisely because I remember watching the final stage of the Tour in the campsite bar and it was the year Cav and Renshaw got the 1-2. My son and I were cheering loudly while a load of disgruntled Frenchmen watched on in disgust. Then we had crepes to celebrate.
> 
> Very nice campsite it was too - this one, if anyone is remotely interested: https://www.camping-castels.co.uk/campsite/lanniron


Going over there sunday for a week.


----------



## Beebo (12 Jul 2018)

Well done Dan Martin. 
Thomas was giving chase but seemed to look for support, none came, so he gave up. Either that or he just didn’t have the explosive speed. He is up to 2nd overall now. Froome lost a couple of seconds.


----------



## smutchin (12 Jul 2018)

Ned Boulting is really starting to wind me up with his infinitely variable pronunciation of Toms Squeench/Skurnch/Skoynsh. I like the Latvian rider but it's getting to the point where I wish he'd just return to the anonymity of the peloton.


----------



## Milzy (12 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Well done Dan Martin.
> Thomas was giving chase but seemed to look for support, none came, so he gave up. Either that or he just didn’t have the explosive speed. He is up to 2nd overall now. Froome lost a couple of seconds.


He was at 12/1 should have put a tenner on him.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (12 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Ned Boulting is really starting to wind me up with his infinitely variable pronunciation of Toms Squeench/Skurnch/Skoynsh. I like the Latvian rider but it's getting to the point where I wish he'd just return to the anonymity of the peloton.


At heart I like Boulting but his trivia tirades get on my nerves and I stop listening. Much like him, no doubt....


----------



## suzeworld (13 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Phew! Sagan again


Just watched this stage on catch-up TV (Since my humax recorder didn’t notice the “new” highlights time on Weds) 
Rather frustrating to see ITVhub illustrated the link to the prog with an image of Sagan crossing the line. Tried to assume it was a generic photo but it rather watered down the tension of the final rush for the line to realise I’d seen the winner’s face already. How stupid are these ppl?


----------



## ColinJ (13 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> Just watched this stage on catch-up TV (Since my humax recorder didn’t notice the “new” highlights time on Weds)
> Rather frustrating to see ITVhub illustrated the link to the prog with an image of Sagan crossing the line. Tried to assume it was a generic photo but it rather watered down the tension of the final rush for the line to realise I’d seen the winner’s face already. How stupid are these ppl?


My Humax didn't 'notice' either, but fortunately I did and set that recording manually.

Yes, the spoilers are annoying! I used to sometimes get those trying to find replays on Eurosport.


----------



## suzeworld (13 Jul 2018)

I’ve written in to the ITV - being awake in the night is a good opportunity to bang off some Mr-Angry letters! Wondering if their link to the World Cup
Final will show the winners clutching their trophy!


----------



## rich p (13 Jul 2018)

What do we think of the first week's parcours this year? A bit sprint heavy for my liking. A bit of a phoney war so far with the GC only involved by dint of crashes, punctures and the TTT.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (13 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> What do we think of the first week's parcours this year? A bit sprint heavy for my liking. A bit of a phoney war so far with the GC only involved by dint of crashes, punctures and the TTT.


Are you saying it's been boring?


----------



## Adam4868 (13 Jul 2018)

Only really been watching highlights and missed quite a bit for the football ! Saw yesterday's stage which was a great win for Dan Martin,looking good Dan ! Pretty boring so far,unless you count mechanicals and punctures as exiting.Should be getting warmed up by the cobbles on tuesday ?


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (13 Jul 2018)

I have seen no coverage other than the first and second stages, and even then I missed the finish.


----------



## Grant Fondo (13 Jul 2018)

Great so far and can't wait for the cobbles!


----------



## Beebo (13 Jul 2018)

Grant Fondo said:


> Great so far and can't wait for the cobbles!


The cobbles have the potential to really mix it up. Would have been good to see them a bit earlier in the race, to help @richp stay awake during his afternoon sit down.


----------



## rich p (13 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> I have seen no coverage other than the first and second stages, and even then I missed the finish.


 ...I haven't got a telly...


----------



## mjr (13 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> ...I haven't got a telly...


but you do have a computer and highlights at least are on youtube


----------



## rich p (13 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> but you do have a computer and highlights at least are on youtube


It was a joke....
...of sorts!


----------



## suzeworld (13 Jul 2018)

It’s certainly not been any more boring than usual!

I guess the run along the Britanny coast can sometimes shake things up with echelons which we didn’t get this year. I like seeing TTT but curious impact on GC. Would not say I was “glad” of crashes but I would say they’ve added a bit if spice to the GC too.

All the sprints have been exciting to watch and the Sagan / Martin stage wins were fab

I’d say a better than average first week, really. What more do you expect of it?


----------



## smutchin (13 Jul 2018)

That was a mighty impressive sprint by Groenewegen. He flew past Gaviria, Kristoff and Sagan like they were standing still. It looked like he was still accelerating when he crossed the line. Very convincing win.

Cav seemed to be in the mix, weaving through the bunch and picking the right wheels to follow. He was right on Groenewegen's wheel when he kicked but just couldn't hang on - not that Cav wasn't going fast but Groenewegen was going that bit faster. Definitely not the Cav of old. But I still think it remains to be seen if that's just lack of form or age-related decline...


----------



## philk56 (13 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Re Cav, DD say
> 
> View: https://twitter.com/TeamDiData/status/1017805998516523013?s=19



Unless I saw it wrong it looked like he had a brush with Sagan. But I'm not sure he could have made it anyway. Still good to see him getting back towards the business end.


----------



## brommers (14 Jul 2018)

philk56 said:


> Unless I saw it wrong it looked like he had a brush with Sagan. But I'm not sure he could have made it anyway. Still good to see him getting back towards the business end.



Yes, he touched wheels, with Sagan, then sat up. He wouldn't have won if he carried on sprinting, but would have been much closer than 10th. Cav needs to stay away from Sagan!


----------



## roadrash (14 Jul 2018)

Gaviria and griepel


----------



## roadrash (14 Jul 2018)

looks to me like Dan Martin has done his back again in that crash


----------



## roadrash (14 Jul 2018)

*Dan Martin*‏Verified account @*DanMartin86* 12m12 minutes ago
Feels like a lion has been clawing at my back but seems I am ok. Makes tomorrow’s stage even tougher but when have I ever walked away from a challenge.


----------



## roadrash (14 Jul 2018)

Tony Marti abandons..
*Team KATUSHA ALPECIN*‏Verified account @*katushacycling* 10m10 minutes ago
#*TDF2018*

 Unfortunately @*tonymartin85* won‘t start tomorrow in stage 9. A spinal fracture (vertebral compression fracture) makes it impossible to continue


----------



## Tin Pot (14 Jul 2018)

I can’t imagine what cycling in that peloton is like.


----------



## suzeworld (14 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Gaviria and griepel



Ooh. 
I think the commissaires were hard on Griepel.


----------



## suzeworld (14 Jul 2018)

Where are you all?
Finding other sports / distractions of a Saturday I suppose.


----------



## brommers (15 Jul 2018)

Have you seen the state of the roads in today's stage? You would of thought that with the amount of revenue the TdF creates for the local community, that they would be able to afford a bit of tarmac on the roads!


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Have you seen the state of the roads in today's stage? You would of thought that with the amount of revenue the TdF creates for the local community, that they would be able to afford a bit of tarmac on the roads!


You're talking a load of old colbrellis, Brommers


----------



## Tin Pot (15 Jul 2018)

Ironman UK today is far more entertaining!



For the Brits, Fraser Cartmel in 3rd Joe Skipper about 4 mins off the lead and Lucy Gossage breezing it in the Women’s. About 2.5hrs in.


----------



## Bollo (15 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> Ironman UK today is far more entertaining!
> 
> 
> 
> For the Brits, Fraser Cartmel in 3rd Joe Skipper about 4 mins off the lead and Lucy Gossage breezing it in the Women’s. About 2.5hrs in.


You are dead to me.


----------



## mjr (15 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> Where are you all?
> Finding other sports / distractions of a Saturday I suppose.


Unable to face another sprint stage in real time. Ready for the cobbles!


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> Ooh.
> I think the commissaires were hard on Griepel.



yeah , that's what I thought, griepel said in interview ...if they do the same to every one ,then nobody will make it to paris


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (15 Jul 2018)

Looks a bit stoorie...posted on twitter by Les Amis de Paris-Roubaix


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

Who was thee Aussie previewing the pavé on Eurosport? I just caught the last couple of minutes


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

That crash looks messy , Ritchie porte down


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

Oh bollox, not again. Poor Richie Porte


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

looks like collar bone and game over for porte


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

porte has abandoned ,


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

His bones must be made of glass
or carbon
or poppadom
or meringue


----------



## smutchin (15 Jul 2018)

I was just catching up on the ITV Tour podcast this morning, and an interview with Porte after stage 3, in which he was reminiscing about “lying in a ditch this time last year” and how “to be in with a chance of winning this race, first you’ve got to make it to Paris”.

He sounded quite jolly in the interview. I’m really feeling sorry for him now.


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

if it wasn't for bad luck, porte would have no luck at all


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

J.J rojas also abandonded for movistar


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> J.J rojas also abandonded for movistar


That leaves them with only 4 domestiques!!!!!!


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

4 domestiques for three GC contenders


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> That leaves them with only 4 domestiques!!!!!!


If you don't count Marc Soler as leader #4...


----------



## Va Va Froome (15 Jul 2018)

Aww no... absolutely gutted for Porte. 

I hope the win he got with the team in the sprint, on the anniversary of last year's big crash, shows he'll fight back from this!


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

I do like Dan Martin's attitude.
Shame he's not English!


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (15 Jul 2018)

Interesting fact - Porte has never won an individual stage in a Grand Tour (he won as part of the team in this year's TTT)


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (15 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I do like Dan Martin's attitude.
> Shame he's not English!


He's not a fan of disc brakes.
From twitter:
Many of the crashes @LeTour have been caused by guys in front braking, the guys behind not being able to stop. Rider error perhaps, but it’s also the 1st TDF where disc brakes are in wide use. The real cause?


----------



## rich p (15 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> He's not a fan of disc brakes.
> From twitter:
> Many of the crashes @LeTour have been caused by guys in front braking, the guys behind not being able to stop. Rider error perhaps, but it’s also the 1st TDF where disc brakes are in wide use. The real cause?


Shhhhhhh! Or you know who will be along any minute.


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

Terpstra down in a crash , after the cobbles


----------



## smutchin (15 Jul 2018)

AG2R will be looking for a new tyre supplier.


----------



## Va Va Froome (15 Jul 2018)

He is still in it I guess, but Bardet is having a horrible time of it today...


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

This is mental


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

Landa down hard


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

they are going to need a two hour long highlights programme at this rate


----------



## roadrash (15 Jul 2018)

didn't expect to see dan martin going for bonus seconds


----------



## Dayvo (15 Jul 2018)

They all want to finish quickly (at least the French) so they can get to the local bar and cheer on _*The Blues* _(specially for @Vantage).


----------



## Va Va Froome (15 Jul 2018)

I'm really intrigued to see how van Avermaet handles the mountains. I don't really know how he has managed them in previous Grand Tours. Is he expected to go all the way in this?


----------



## Beebo (15 Jul 2018)

what a fantastic photograph. Froome and others crash. From the bbc website.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (15 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> I'm really intrigued to see how van Avermaet handles the mountains. I don't really know how he has managed them in previous Grand Tours. Is he expected to go all the way in this?


He's not a climber; he'll lose the yellow jersey on Tuesday with the first Alpine stage, and be doing well if he's in the top 50 coming out of the Alps.


----------



## brommers (15 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Interesting fact - Porte has never won an individual stage in a Grand Tour (he won as part of the team in this year's TTT)


What's interesting about that?


----------



## brommers (15 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> I'm really intrigued to see how van Avermaet handles the mountains. I don't really know how he has managed them in previous Grand Tours. Is he expected to go all the way in this?


He won't be wearing yellow this time on Tuesday


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (15 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> What's interesting about that?


Just that he is viewed by many as a genuine grand tour contender, yet has never even won a stage of any grand tour.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (15 Jul 2018)

Absolutely thrilled for Degenkolb. Can see how much it meant to him and how much the injury could have wrecked his career. Should see a resurgent John in next years classics hopefully


----------



## Crackle (15 Jul 2018)

Just caught the highlights. Brutal stage. Degenkolb though, whoo, may just rejoin ptp


----------



## mjr (15 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Just that he is viewed by many as a genuine grand tour contender, yet has never even won a stage of any grand tour.


Hasn't Porte just copied Froome in crashing out on the cobbled stage before reaching the first cobbled sector? So he's behaving like a contender...


----------



## alicat (15 Jul 2018)

> I do like Dan Martin's attitude.
> Shame he's not English!



Born in Birmingham, grew up in Tamworth. Chose to take on his mother's Irish nationality when the British talent squad overlooked him.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (15 Jul 2018)

alicat said:


> Born in Birmingham, grew up in Tamworth. Chose to take on his mother's Irish nationality when the British talent squad overlooked him.


Aye, so the shame is that the British talent squad were blind.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (15 Jul 2018)

Not sure what all this stuff about Porte is. He was a definite contender for this years tour and I’m sorry to see him go.

But surely everyone knows you can win a tour without ever winning a stage. Ever. Right


----------



## Crackle (16 Jul 2018)

Anyone think yesterdays stage was too much? Too many cobble sectors. The cycling press is full of those comments this morning, as it always is after a controversial stage but even so, I was thinking there was just a few too many cobble sections for a GT race and the biggest disappointment for me is seeing Uran slip back, not so bothered about Porte, though sad to see, I thought at least one stage would do for him.


----------



## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

I also felt sorry for Uran. I had high hopes for him in this Tour and that's a big setback. Didn't see what actually happened to him though - did he fall off or was he caught behind someone else's crash? Or was it mechanicals?

Bardet had some rotten luck yesterday too - _five_ punctures, was it? AG2R need to have a word with their tyre suppliers. Still, he and his team did phenomenally well to make sure he didn't lose any time.

Nibali was conspicuously inconspicuous yesterday. I wondered if he might try something* but he's obviously keeping his powder dry - and most importantly, keeping out of trouble. 

Don't know about fairness or otherwise of the cobbles. It made for an entertaining stage. Probably tougher in some ways than Paris-Roubaix because it was that much shorter that it made for more intense racing from the start. Very different kind of racing in the context of a stage race rather than a one-day race too. It was good to watch, but a bit chaotic. 


*late change of mind in the punditry saw me change my third pick from Degenkolb to Nibali. Doh!


----------



## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I also felt sorry for Uran. I had high hopes for him in this Tour and that's a big setback. Didn't see what actually happened to him though - did he fall off or was he caught behind someone else's crash? Or was it mechanicals?
> 
> Bardet had some rotten luck yesterday too - _five_ punctures, was it? AG2R need to have a word with their tyre suppliers. Still, he and his team did phenomenally well to make sure he didn't lose any time.


Ag2R's tyres probably aren't to blame. It seemed only Bardet punctured so much and I suspect it was because he kept heading for the sharp-filled gutters instead of the crown of the road, which usually works on Belgian cobbled roads but is not good for the farm track sectors of Paris-Roubaix where if there's no dirt path alongside (Arenberg forest?), it's better to stay in the middle. It's why PR is so much harder on the bikes than Belgian races.

Uran fell just before Landa but had already burned most of his teammates chasing back after being caught behind both Porte and Froome crashes, while Movistar hadn't yet had to chase.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (16 Jul 2018)

Loved yesterday's stage, Grand Tours need grand stages and not just mountain stages should be seen as grand.


----------



## roadrash (16 Jul 2018)

I did hear the question, is it fair to have the Roubaix stage in the tour de france , as @Dogtrousers mentioned above, when riders have put so much effort into training for the mountains, My take on it , of course its fair ,if its the same for all the riders then its fair ,some riders are sprinters some are climbers etc...they all have to ride the stage.
Does the stage have a place in a grand tour would have been a better question , rather than ask is it fair on climbers, 
for what its worth , I think it does ,it gave the race something different , something it needed, as mentioned above the tour de france isn't only about who can climb the best, I hate the way some years the organisers say something along the lines of , the tour has been designed with (insert rider of choice) in mind. bollox to that , that's what isn't fair.


----------



## Crackle (16 Jul 2018)

Nice footage from Velon again.


----------



## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> _[...] we'll hope that Tejay [van Garderen] steps up and is able to do something in the mountains."_


Wow, harsh, even his teammates take the mickey out of Tejay! What did Tejay do in the mountains last time he rode the Tour as leader?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WivglTITDLs


----------



## rich p (16 Jul 2018)

It was attritional yesterday, right enough, but massive fun for the viewers...

...especially after the dross of the previous two days.


----------



## suzeworld (16 Jul 2018)

I am so excited about G being in front of Froome now. 

I have never forgiven Froome for that withering over the shoulder look he gave Wiggo when he wanted to go faster in 2012. 

I really, really, really would love it if G buried that loyalty card and chased his own yellow jersey to Paris. 

Is it possible? Do the Sky boffins “know” who is literally strongest out of these two? 
A bit of team-leader rivalry always adds spice, this is one I really care about


----------



## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

I think Geraint Thomas's best chance of overall victory came - and very rapidly went - in 2011. When Wiggo crashed, Geraint waited for him and by the time they worked out that Wiggo couldn't carry on, Thomas had lost too much time to be worth considering as a Plan B. Just as the course was suited to Wiggo that year, it would have been well suited to Thomas as well, who was still built more more like a pursuiter.

He's undoubtedly a lot stronger on the climbs now than he was then but he'll still get found out on the steepest slopes. It will take a lot of other riders coming unstuck for him to be in with a chance of overall victory this year.

For me, Froome remains Sky's only realistic GC hope.


----------



## PK99 (16 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I think Geraint Thomas's best chance of overall victory came - and very rapidly went - in 2011. When Wiggo crashed, Geraint waited for him and by the time they worked out that Wiggo couldn't carry on, Thomas had lost too much time to be worth considering as a Plan B. Just as the course was suited to Wiggo that year, it would have been well suited to Thomas as well, who was still built more more like a pursuiter.
> 
> He's undoubtedly a lot stronger on the climbs now than he was then but he'll still get found out on the steepest slopes. It will take a lot of other riders coming unstuck for him to be in with a chance of overall victory this year.
> 
> For me, Froome remains Sky's only realistic GC hope.



I think you are right, but one aspect that will be interesting and different this time round, rather than Sky having the Yellow jersey and all the "rights and privileges"* that go with it, and defending a lead, Froome will be chasing seconds from the start of the mountains and if he has a mechanical no one will neutralise the race till he gets back

* https://www.velonews.com/2017/07/co...been-yellow-fleeced-by-unwritten-rules_443430


----------



## Crackle (16 Jul 2018)

His GT results thus far, for a rider of his calibre, have been less than stella. Naturally he's been riding as support but I'm unconvinced he can do it over three weeks. Plus, when push comes to shove, the team are going to throw themselves behind Froome and he won't get the support when he most needs it.







The Paris Nice win, remains his grittiest performance in a stage race.


----------



## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> His GT results



GT's GTs? 



> The Paris Nice win, remains his grittiest performance in a stage race.



Yeah, that was good. 

And then a month later, at the Tour de Romandie, he got his ass well and truly whupped in the mountains by Quintana.


----------



## Beebo (16 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> I am so excited about G being in front of Froome now.
> 
> I have never forgiven Froome for that withering over the shoulder look he gave Wiggo when he wanted to go faster in 2012.
> 
> ...



Sky's mountain tactics have always been the big train giving their chosen rider an armchair ride as far up the mountain as possible. Before they unleash the final attack. That doesn't work with 2 team leaders, one has to sacrific themselves for the other. Thomas is prone to the odd bad day in a three week race, you can't win a GC if you have a bad day and drop 5 mins.

They could both finish on the podium, but I suspect Froome will be given top billing.


----------



## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

PK99 said:


> I think you are right, but one aspect that will be interesting and different this time round, rather than Sky having the Yellow jersey and all the "rights and privileges"* that go with it, and defending a lead, Froome will be chasing seconds from the start of the mountains and if he has a mechanical no one will neutralise the race till he gets back


Sky should inherit yellow as soon as GVA falters, but with Thomas... and then it could get interesting: does he try to play patron and neutralise it if Froome has a mechanical, or does he keep chasing attacks?


----------



## PK99 (16 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Sky should inherit yellow as soon as GVA falters, but with Thomas... and then it could get interesting: does he try to play patron and neutralise it if Froome has a mechanical, or does he keep chasing attacks?



Would it be seen as "bad form" for the yellow jersey at the front to neutralize the race to help a team mate back in the field?


----------



## rich p (16 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> His GT results thus far, for a rider of his calibre, have been less than stella.



Oy, the lager thread is thaddaway....>>>>>>


----------



## Crackle (16 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Oy, the lager thread is thaddaway....>>>>>>


I wish I could blame spell check.....


----------



## rich p (16 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I wish I could blame spell check.....


Your honesty does you credit!

GT won't wait for Froome if something happens, imho, but the order Sky ride up a mountain will tell us more tomorrow.


----------



## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

PK99 said:


> Would it be seen as "bad form" for the yellow jersey at the front to neutralize the race to help a team mate back in the field?


I think they've been accused of doing it before. Also, it's certainly been done by the yellow neutralising the GC race to allow another team's leader back on. A Sky yellow for a BMC leader, maybe Cadel, on some stage where some nobber had spread tacks on a descent IIRC. Ah here it is https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...os-after-tacks-found-on-the-road-7945409.html


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## PK99 (16 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> I think they've been accused of doing it before. Also, it's certainly been done by the yellow neutralising the GC race to allow another team's leader back on. A Sky yellow for a BMC leader, maybe Cadel, on some stage where some nobber had spread tacks on a descent IIRC. Ah here it is https://www.independent.co.uk/sport...os-after-tacks-found-on-the-road-7945409.html



Neutralising the race because of spectator interference would be par for the course - if I may mix my sporting metaphors!


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## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

PK99 said:


> Neutralising the race because of spectator interference would be par for the course - if I may mix my sporting metaphors!


The course by the Tour de France is the women's race on Tuesday. Not sure what that's got to do with G v Froome.


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## brommers (16 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> The course by the Tour de France is the women's race on Tuesday. Not sure what that's got to do with G v Froome.


Par for the course is a saying, which has got nothing to do with the women's race. Google it.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (16 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> His GT results thus far, for a rider of his calibre,





rich p said:


> Oy, the lager thread is thaddaway....>>>>>>





Crackle said:


> I wish I could blame spell check.....



At least he didn't go low alcohol Kaliber


----------



## PK99 (16 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> The course by the Tour de France is the women's race on Tuesday. Not sure what that's got to do with G v Froome.



Don't you mean La Course?


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## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

PK99 said:


> Don't you mean La Course?



He was translating it into English for the benefit of forum members who have had a bad day.

Although strictly speaking the correct translation would be The Race by The Tower of France.


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## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Par for the course is a saying, which has got nothing to do with the women's race. Google it.


Why would I want to bowl googlies at a saying?

ObTopic: on the rest day, BMC announces CCC as new sponsor http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ccc...cing-ochowicz-announces-at-the-tour-de-france - is that the rest day's worst-kept secret? - and Trek-Segafredo announce they've signed Lizzie Deignan http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/tre...m-set-to-race-on-the-womens-worldtour-in-2019


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## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Interesting blog about the climbs
> https://www.podiumcafe.com/2018/7/2/17515890/2018-tour-de-france-mountains-preview



Tomorrow's stage looks like an absolute motherloving bastard. Should be fun to watch.

Stage 12 is also Pure Evil.


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## perplexed (16 Jul 2018)

Regarding the Yellow jersey fight as far as Froome and Thomas are concerned - Froome allegedly happy for Thomas to have a tilt at it.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cycling/44842715


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## stoatsngroats (16 Jul 2018)

It would be great to see GT and CF contest their own final positions, without team interference, if such an idea were plausible, it would make great tv.


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## DogTired (16 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Bardet had some rotten luck yesterday too - _five_ punctures, was it? AG2R need to have a word with their tyre suppliers. Still, he and his team did phenomenally well to make sure he didn't lose any time.



Interesting interview with Matt White of Mitchelton Scott on the BBC podcast https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p06dv0s1 (fast forward to 14:00) He has a slightly cynical view of Bardet's performance...


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## smutchin (16 Jul 2018)

DogTired said:


> Interesting interview with Matt White of Mitchelton Scott on the BBC podcast https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p06dv0s1 (fast forward to 14:00) He has a slightly cynical view of Bardet's performance...



_Slightly_ cynical!


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## mjr (16 Jul 2018)

stoatsngroats said:


> It would be great to see GT and CF contest their own final positions, without team interference, if such an idea were plausible, it would make great tv.


At some point, the team would have to decide how the domestiques are allocated and how do you do that without it being interference? Or if they support neither, isn't that itself interference?


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## Crackle (16 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> _Slightly_ cynical!


They commented on it on ITV4 as well. 

In the meantime. What does everyone think of the 8 rider teams? Doesn't seemed to have stopped the crashes. A few saying there's a lot less aggressive riding with teams knowing they can't waste riders in a break. I dunno yet, waiting to see what happens in the mountains, it certainly doesn't seem to have encouraged more instinctive riding, with riders thinking there might be less chance of an organised chase but let's see.


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## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

8 rider teams has made the crashes worse because it means no sprinter has a full train any more so they're often all freelancing which is sketchier, plus a higher percentage of the peloton is now team leaders, so there's slightly more chance of a leader being next to a crash.


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## BrumJim (17 Jul 2018)

I think that Chris Froome is playing the long game, as per The Giro. He now knows that, with a TT almost at the end, he can afford to go into the last few stages with 4 minutes deficit or more, as he can pull that back in one mountain stage and a TT compared to his rivals, who are less able time triallers, and too cooked for the last mountain stage having fought to gain seconds in the ones immediately before. So he will let GT take the yellow jersey this week, rather than grab it early on and have to defend it every day on Giro-fatigued legs.

Just my theory.


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## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> I think that Chris Froome is playing the long game, as per The Giro. He now knows that, with a TT almost at the end, he can afford to go into the last few stages with 4 minutes deficit or more, as he can pull that back in one mountain stage and a TT compared to his rivals, who are less able time triallers, and too cooked for the last mountain stage having fought to gain seconds in the ones immediately before. So he will let GT take the yellow jersey this week, rather than grab it early on and have to defend it every day on Giro-fatigued legs.
> 
> Just my theory.



This is probably right.
Just at a really visceral level my reactions to Froome are so negative, his interviews always make me feel repulsed. I love to cherish a little dream of him coming unstuck and G getting to triumph.


----------



## Dave Davenport (17 Jul 2018)

I can understand he's not everyone's cup of tea but 'repulsive', really?


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## kingrollo (17 Jul 2018)

Not sure what - but think the organisers need to do something to spice up the TDF - The giro to me often seems to produce a better race. Don't really like the cobbled stages as I don't like seeing people fall off bikes which seems to be the idea - In general all the cobbles do is introduce a stage where no one attacks.


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## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> _Slightly_ cynical!



He’s not wrong, though, is he? Bardet kept getting back on after every puncture. He must have been drafting and yeah, usually the filming would have been done at the back, but this time it wasn’t

I feel sorry for Dumoulin.


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## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Ask Cath Wiggins



And me! Yes I find him repulsive 

I know it’s “mad” in the sense that I don’t know him at all - but his face/voice/body on TV interviews literally make me creep inside. Bleugh!
.


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## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

I mostly love them all. I even noticed that watching last night’s summary show I said something warm/enthusiastic about ever fellah they showed. Even whiney voiced Richie Porte evoked some sympathy ... I know! 

I support anyone who can beat Froome. If there is anyone!


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## PK99 (17 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> And me! Yes I find him repulsive
> 
> I know it’s “mad” in the sense that I don’t know him at all - but his face/voice/body on TV interviews literally make me creep inside. Bleugh!
> .



Ummm...if a man said that about a female athlete....


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

stoatsngroats said:


> if such an idea were plausible



Hmmmm. It’s a bit like suggesting that Harry Kane and Raheem Sterling should fight it out among themselves to see who can score more goals without any interference from the rest of the team.


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I think Geraint Thomas's best chance of overall victory came - and very rapidly went - in 2011. When Wiggo crashed, Geraint waited for him and by the time they worked out that Wiggo couldn't carry on, Thomas had lost too much time to be worth considering as a Plan B.



Coming back to this for a moment, I suspect this hints at the real reason why Thomas is being given his chance. Froome is still team leader, but having already done the Giro it's not clear how well he will cope with the Tour, so Sky are keen to have an insurance policy in place in case Froome blows up.

The next three days should sort out the true pecking order in the team though.

Personally, I have no strong feelings about Froome but I don't think it's good for the sport for one rider to be so dominant, so I'd like to see someone different win it this year. I'd really love that to be Bardet or Uran but I suspect it's more likely to be Nibali.


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## Crackle (17 Jul 2018)

Definitely Uran for me. I can't think of another rider I'd like to see win it more but I think he might have blown it on that cobbled stage. Nibali is conspicuous by his absence at the front of the race.

Today should show us who's got the legs though.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (17 Jul 2018)

kingrollo said:


> Not sure what - but think the organisers need to do something to spice up the TDF - The giro to me often seems to produce a better race. Don't really like the cobbled stages as I don't like seeing people fall off bikes which seems to be the idea - In general all the cobbles do is introduce a stage where no one attacks.



The idea of cobbled stage is for people to not fall off; maybe that's where the problem lies in that some riders do think it's the idea


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## Phaeton (17 Jul 2018)

I'm not a big watcher of cycle racing, I do like to drop in/out of the classics when it's available to watch on terrestrial TV but I do find I can condense 4-6 hours of racing down to 20 minutes. There's far too much waffle in there, but I watched the Roubaix stage the other day & thought it was out of place, would you expect F1 cars to have to do a Rally stage, the motorbikes were throwing up so much dust I'm surprised the riders could even breathe, let alone see where they were going. Far too Mickey Mouse for me, if competitors want to race over that type of terrain then there are specific races, yes the roads were like that 50 years ago, but by the same token you could make the riders ride bikes from 50 years ago for the whole race if that is what they are trying to achieve.


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## perplexed (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Hmmmm. It’s a bit like suggesting that *Harry Kane and Raheem Sterling* should fight it out among themselves to see who can score more goals without any interference from the rest of the team.



Wouldn't be much of a fight would it?


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## perplexed (17 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> They commented on it on ITV4 as well.
> 
> In the meantime. What does everyone think of the 8 rider teams? Doesn't seemed to have stopped the crashes. A few saying there's a lot less aggressive riding with teams knowing they can't waste riders in a break. I dunno yet, waiting to see what happens in the mountains, it certainly doesn't seem to have encouraged more instinctive riding, with riders thinking there might be less chance of an organised chase but let's see.



I don't think the 8 rider format brings anything to the party myself. It seems to have somehow watered down, or diminished the status of the race. Prefer 9 man teams, but of course it's just my opinion.


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

perplexed said:


> Wouldn't be much of a fight would it?



In many ways, Geraint Thomas is the Raheem Sterling of pro cycling.


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## perplexed (17 Jul 2018)

suzeworld said:


> I mostly love them all. I even noticed that watching last night’s summary show I said something warm/enthusiastic about ever fellah they showed. Even whiney voiced Richie Porte evoked some sympathy ... I know!
> 
> I support anyone who can beat Froome. If there is anyone!



It's horses for courses I guess. I like Froome and I suspect he's just not as naturally 'bloke-ish' and is a little awkward (not in the 'difficult' sense) in interview which probably doesn't endear him to some. Wiggins is undoubtedly a terrific rider but he blows a little hot and cold for me. Sagan I find really difficult to warm to because of his previous behaviour. I like Thomas and would love him to have a Grand Tour win, but I suspect he hasn't quite got a 3 week tour in him, but is more naturally gifted for shorter races.

Still, it'd be dull if we all thought the same! Looking forward very much to todays stage


----------



## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Don't feel the need to justify it. Following sport is the last bastion of irrational prejudice, where people can "hate" towns they've never visited on the basis of their footy team, and use chummy nicknames for athletes they've never met as if they are their mates. Roll with it. It's part of the fun, especially if it's kept positive. And I'm sure my mate Cav would agree.
> 
> On the subject of Froome's (un)popularity there was a small smattering of very half-hearted booing for him at the sign-in at Fougères, Hardly a vengeful pitchfork brandishing mob. Peter Sagan definitely won hearts and minds with plenty of autograph signing and crowd interaction (and if you want someone with a funny/whiny voice, look no further)



How true, but his voice is absolutely part of his charm! 

I just loved the way Sagan smiled when he crossed the line to win his first stage .. just so engaging, and then did you see Cav congratulating Denglkob (sp!) he was obviously just so warm and and delighted for him. That's class, innit? 

I wasn't so much trying to justify myself as realising that I do have enormous warmth and respect for them all, and really get huge pleasure from watching any of them -- except the slimy reptile .... 
That said ... 
I DO feel sorry for Froome about the "drug" hatred that's been whipped up around him - plus, it could prove dangerous for them all if some 1/2-witted "fan" decides to take the law into their own hands after sitting boozing on a mountain all day. Fingers crossed that danger doesn't arrive. 

Getting excited about today's stage. That col de columbier is the first Alpine climb I ever did myself ...


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## suzeworld (17 Jul 2018)

PK99 said:


> Ummm...if a man said that about a female athlete....



offs

Really - if he did he'd be entitled to his opinion, so long as he acknowldged that is't totally irrational ... which I have the sense to realise about myself.


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

There's a good race on ahead of the tour. It seems the riders liked the pursuit finish last year so much that they're replicating it!


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> There's a good race on ahead of the tour. It seems the riders liked the pursuit finish last year so much that they're replicating it!



Just switched the coverage on with 2km to go... Cracking finale.


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Watching pure CX, meanwhile, bores me to death



Funnily enough, I was just thinking to myself that it's about time the Tour had a cyclocross stage. 

The Giro had a truly memorable stage over the Strade Bianche in 2010, which remains one of my favourite ever single days of Grand Tour racing.

View: https://youtu.be/tkjSLKuqmmg

(ETA: that stage is among the reasons I still have a grudging respect for Vino, despite him being an unrepentant doping nobber.)


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (17 Jul 2018)

*Poor surface alert*

Some of today's stage covers a dirt road <shudders>


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> I think that Chris Froome is playing the long game, as per The Giro. He now knows that, with a TT almost at the end, he can afford to go into the last few stages with 4 minutes deficit or more, as he can pull that back in one mountain stage and a TT compared to his rivals, who are less able time triallers, and too cooked for the last mountain stage having fought to gain seconds in the ones immediately before. So he will let GT take the yellow jersey this week, rather than grab it early on and have to defend it every day on Giro-fatigued legs.
> 
> Just my theory.


Nice theory but hope it’s wrong.


----------



## Crackle (17 Jul 2018)

Cruel finish for Van Der Breggen, she looked like she had Van Vleuten licked but that slight uphill did for her right on the line. Doesn't get much crueller than that.


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

The first climb on today's stage takes me back to when I was 16 and on a cycling holiday in France with a couple of mates. We were staying in Annecy and decided to ride to Chamonix, but we didn't have any maps other than a rudimentary leaflet from the tourist office that was somewhat lacking in both scale and detail. It looked like there were two options - the main road or the shorter, more direct route on minor roads. Of course we chose the latter, not considering that there was a reason why the main road didn't take the more direct route...

And thus it was that the Col de Croix Fry (not to be confused with the Croix de Fer) was my first taste of Alpine cycling. There's a little village called Manigod halfway up where we stopped at a tabac and played pool with a couple of local young ladies... And not much else. The cycling was good though.


----------



## Phaeton (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> On the one hand you dismiss racing on pavé as a 50 year old anachronism yet simultaneously point out that there are other current specific races that include that type of terrain. And those races are conducted on modern road bikes.


Was there a point you were trying to make?


----------



## Phaeton (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Something to do with cake ... and eating it.


WHOOSH


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> *Poor surface alert*
> 
> Some of today's stage covers a dirt road <shudders>


You say dirt, but it looked more like a stone road aka packed gravel, familiar to many riders on Sustrans routes. I'll be amazed if it hinders anyone.


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

GVA in the break. Anyone fancy it staying away, handing him a surprising lead?


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> GVA in the break. Anyone fancy it staying away, handing him a surprising lead?



Still over 100km of the stage to go, so I'm reserving judgment until after the next climb at least - 6km at 11.2% is considerably harder than the climb they've just done.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

Hey guys can I get the tour on radio ??


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Blimey, I think I’ve got some of the dust from that gravel road in my eyes...


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Looks like Froome is off the back of the peloton. Any interesting reason? Or just a natural break/minor mechanical.



He swapped a wheel with a team mate so presumably a puncture.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (17 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> You say dirt, but it looked more like a stone road aka packed gravel, familiar to many riders on Sustrans routes. I'll be amazed if it hinders anyone.


Given that Froome punctured, it probably should be a sustrans route


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I don't know. Best of luck finding out, but in the meantime there's live internet coverage here:
> 
> https://racecenter.letour.fr/#/stageprofile



Thanks @Dogtrousers. I have visual but just no English commentary. BBC radio 5 have done in the past but not today. Thanks all the same chap.


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

Fight.The.Power said:


> Hey guys can I get the tour on radio ??


Not today because there's international cricket and BBC insist on putting that on two channels at once (4LW and 5LSX), but most stages are on BBC 5 Live Sports Xtra from about 2pm or whenever they can be bothered.

It annoys me a bit. They shoot on us with intermittent/late/inconsistent coverage so that fans make other arrangements and then use that to say there's no demand for coverage on the radio.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

Credit to GVA putting in a 7 min lead. Hope he retains yellow but only a slim chance. Will probably lose 30 mins from here.


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Ain't gonna happen for the break today, is it? Gap is starting to come down quickly now.


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Warren Barguil: "I ATEN'T DED!"


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Warren Barguil: "I ATEN'T DED!"


Are you sure you don't want to reserve judgment until after the next climb at least?


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Are you sure you don't want to reserve judgment until after the next climb at least?



His attack was never going to amount to anything but he's shown his face, at least. That's probably about the best we can hope for from Barguil these days.


----------



## roadrash (17 Jul 2018)

I think his head was writing cheques that his legs couldn't cash


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

I’m not impressed with team sky and their tactics at all today.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

Nibali FTW


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> I’m not impressed with team sky and their tactics at all today.


There's something impressive about doing the bloody obvious and to hell with all of you, isn't there?

Or do I mean depressive?


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> There's something impressive about doing the bloody obvious and to hell with all of you, isn't there?
> 
> Or do I mean depressive?



Well it’s old Postal tactics


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Sounds like Uran is in trouble.


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> In what way?
> 
> I've not seen it but I've seen the internet coverage. They've got a man in the break, and the break will probably get reeled in. And if it doesn't nothing is lost as there are no real contenders out there. That's how I "see" it. But of course, I haven't seen it.


You’d think Froome would start the assault today. They are way too far back. Quick step kicking their butts.


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

Brailsford will leave it too late this year if they’re not careful.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (17 Jul 2018)

Yeh dogtrousers is right. It’s too early and next two days have MTF. Too much holiday sun and beer. Sky will hold. Alaphillipe FTW


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

Fight.The.Power said:


> Yeh dogtrousers is right. It’s too early and next two days have MTF. Too much holiday sun and beer. Sky will hold. Alaphillipe FTW


Don’t want JA to win but he looks absolute class today.


----------



## Crackle (17 Jul 2018)

Nothing was going to kick off in the GT battle until this next descent or the final climb


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Alaphilippe is 14 minutes down on GC so this ride is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. Hugely impressive though.


----------



## mjr (17 Jul 2018)

Fight.The.Power said:


> Yeh dogtrousers is right. It’s too early and next two days have MTF. Too much holiday sun and beer. Sky will hold. Alaphillipe FTW


Yeah, Sky don't want the win bonus in play or too many GC contenders blown out on a descent finish because that invites Bardet and Nibali to attack over the top. Or Martin


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Dropped by the peloton according to letour.fr



Yeah, he got dropped on the Romme but got back on, and then got dropped again near the summit of the Colombiere. He's clearly suffering.


----------



## ozboz (17 Jul 2018)

That was impressive from the Frenchman ....
Very impressive !!


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Great ride by GVA too. He's obviously enjoying being in yellow.


----------



## Crackle (17 Jul 2018)

Looks like Mollema, Zakarin and Jungels don't have it this year, everyone else, barring Uran, up there in the main GC group.


----------



## woodbutcher (17 Jul 2018)

Alaphilippe fantastique tour


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (17 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> He's not a climber; he'll lose the yellow jersey on Tuesday with the first Alpine stage, and be doing well if he's in the top 50 coming out of the Alps.


Or not. That was some ride by GVA. Amazing stuff.


----------



## ozboz (17 Jul 2018)

Amazing really , they are the iron Men , day after day , stage 11, no easy feat by the look of it ,!
GT doing xlnt to hold in there , also Froome and Yates steadily moving up the ladder , It is as if Yates has got a Star Trek style tractor beam connected to Froom ,, he’s never that far away , 
Big climbing day tom’w , be interesting ,,


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> In many ways, Geraint Thomas is the Raheem Sterling of pro cycling.


He's completed a few more passes, though.


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> He's completed a few more passes, though.



Very good!


----------



## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

who on earth will win tomorrow? It has to be the Dog!?


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Following up on earlier comments about Romain Bardet being a bit crafty, what do we make of this? Apparently he rode 11km less than Michal Kwiatkowski today...







(It's actually very easily explained, which I shall leave as an exercise for the reader to work out.)


----------



## ozboz (17 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> who on earth will win tomorrow? It has to be the Dog!?



Froome !


----------



## ozboz (17 Jul 2018)

Also , forgot to mention the Respect of the TdF riders to the fallen of the French Resistance who died at the hands of the Nazis and Collaborators when they passed the Monument ,Brilliant !!!


----------



## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

ozboz said:


> Also , forgot to mention the Respect of the TdF riders to the fallen of the French Resistance who died at the hands of the Nazis and Collaborators when they passed the Monument ,Brilliant !!!



I found that very moving. Beautifully done.

https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/tour-de-france-2018-spoilers.235038/post-5316133


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Does it involve Gallic collusion and TV censorship?



I’m saying nothing!


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## deptfordmarmoset (17 Jul 2018)

ozboz said:


> Also , forgot to mention the Respect of the TdF riders to the fallen of the French Resistance who died at the hands of the Nazis and Collaborators when they passed the Monument ,Brilliant !!!


I just caught that in the highlights. Moving.


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## roadrash (17 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Following up on earlier comments about Romain Bardet being a bit crafty, what do we make of this? Apparently he rode 11km less than Michal Kwiatkowski today...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



would it be the ride back to the team bus

.


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## Beebo (17 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> would it be the ride back to the team bus
> 
> .


Don’t be silly. He clearly cheated. No other explanation will suffice.


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## Mike_P (17 Jul 2018)

Could just be Strava inaccuracy - I do the same home-work journey and it varies daily in distance and height, coupled with factors like one rider more than the other going round the outside of a bend.


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## Milzy (17 Jul 2018)

One had a garmin and the accurate one had a wahoo device.


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## deptfordmarmoset (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> One switched on at the_ départ fictif _and the other at the _départ réel_?


Seems a big difference to me for the sole explanation. I gather that there was a crash before the flag went down but 11km is a long way.


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## Aravis (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> One switched on at the_ départ fictif _and the other at the _départ réel_?


Looking at the Strava Flybys, this does seem to be exactly it. It's not just Bardet and Kwiatkowski; there are two distinct groups, one of which started recording at Annecy, the other at Château de Ruphy. That was where the flag dropped, wasn't it?

Apart from Silvan Dillier, that is, whose SRM DC8 seems to have thrown a wobbly mid-stage. It's interesting to see the hardware they're using - a bit of everything, just like us lot.


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> One switched on at the_ départ fictif _and the other at the _départ réel_?



We have a winner! 

Yes, the flag was dropped after 11km of riding. I don't know whether or not this is an unusually long _départ fictif_ as I don't often watch from the very start, but I was watching from the start today, so I realised pretty quickly that was the explanation for the discrepancy when the rides popped up on Strava.


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## smutchin (17 Jul 2018)

Mike_P said:


> Could just be Strava inaccuracy - I do the same home-work journey and it varies daily in distance and height, coupled with factors like one rider more than the other going round the outside of a bend.



11km would be a much larger margin of error than you'd expect though.


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> We have a winner!
> 
> Yes, the flag was dropped after 11km of riding. I don't know whether or not this is an unusually long _départ fictif_ as I don't often watch from the very start, but I was watching from the start today, so I realised pretty quickly that was the explanation for the discrepancy when the rides popped up on Strava.


I think it was scheduled to be fairly long at about 10km and then Landa crashed, slowing it and lengthening it further.


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## Crackle (18 Jul 2018)

I'm looking forward to today and tomorrow


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I'm looking forward to today and tomorrow


At your age, every waking dawn is a blessing...


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

First appearance of itv4's "We've got a problem" screen AFAIK as the feed from the Coventry Box vanishes, probably collapsing at the sight of David Millar apparently wearing a Dave baseball cap with his Anti Cycle Cycle Club top. Replaced in under 10s by Daniel Friebe interviewing Adam Yates.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

For those who are interested in such matters, the _départ réel_ was scheduled to come just 1.6km into today's stage but has been delayed for reasons that TV's Ned Boulting and David Millar are unable to relay to us.


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> At your age, every waking dawn is a blessing...


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

David Millar used the phrase "break of they day" so clearly he reads this site(!) Today's is Alaphillipe, Barguil and the inevitable De Gendt after a final split on the first climb. 41s to the chasers, 6min to the peloton, 75km to go.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Most of the Fortuneo team are in the big leading group. Will be interesting to see if they can actually ride as a team to set up the win for Barguil.


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

I thought Movistar were going to animate the race


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Maybe they are. TFFT


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Adios Uran


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Fortuneo are the new Team Sky! They're doing a cracking job of hammering the breakaway. With Valverde's attack as well, this is turning into a very interesting stage.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Valverde is properly hornering his way up this climb.


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Disappointing rides from Mollema, Uran and Maijka


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## Crackle (18 Jul 2018)

Mark Cavendish is by himself now. I reckon he's on for an abandon here


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Mark Cavendish is by himself now. I reckon he's on for an abandon here


They've just mentioned it on ITV4 coverage. Sad, but no surprise if he bails.


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Fortuneo are the new Team Sky! They're doing a cracking job of hammering the breakaway. With Valverde's attack as well, this is turning into a very interesting stage.


Is this Barguil's Team Sky job application?



Spoiler


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Mark Cavendish is by himself now. I reckon he's on for an abandon here


He'll be having a picnic at the top of the climb


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Cav is now over 35 minutes off the leaders. Even if he doesn't abandon, he probably won't make the time cut.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Kittel is at nearly 24 minutes off the pace, also riding alone. The autobus is at 16 minutes.


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Start the engine for Cav and Kit


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Groenewegen is behind the autobus as well, but he's in a group of six stragglers. Not a good day for the sprinters!


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Groenwegen for the Broomewegen?

Sorry.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

There will be no sprinters left by stage 17, when there will deffo be none left. Green jersey to a climber...


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

I can't see Sky letting Valverde or TD take any time here


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> There will be no sprinters left by stage 17, when there will deffo be none left. Green jersey to a climber...


I still haven't got my head round S17


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Cav is over the summit of the Cormet de Roselend. Yay!


----------



## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Ooooh, it's all kicking off! This is just odd.


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## Crackle (18 Jul 2018)

Can't work out the tactics yet


----------



## Twizit (18 Jul 2018)

Oooh this is getting interesting. Shame the TV in our office is behind me so it's a right pain to keep turning around without being too obvious about it. TV combined with CC and the tour live page is a good combo though


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Nieve's toast.


----------



## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Or not.


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

What. Is. Happening?!


----------



## roadrash (18 Jul 2018)

cracking win for Thomas


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## deptfordmarmoset (18 Jul 2018)

Brilliant from GT!


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## Crackle (18 Jul 2018)

Thomas looked immense then


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Big T wins


----------



## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Feel sorry for Nieve. He must be feeling absolutely crushed.


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Big T wins


G Spot!


----------



## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Can't work out the tactics yet



I'm still none the wiser. Good fun to watch though!


----------



## Twizit (18 Jul 2018)

Cracking ride from GT and he looks in great form, but I can't help feeling that Froome is quite happy to let G take yellow and deal with the stress of defending it for the next week or so - keeping himself in there or thereabouts, but saving it all for a big push in the Pyrenees. Sort of like he did in the Giro - i.e. it's not about how you perform in the first 2 1/2 weeks, but all about who's left standing come the final mountain stage or two.


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## rich p (18 Jul 2018)

Froome can't help himself. He wants to win this


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Cav has started the final climb.

Kittel is inside the final 10km.


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## Twizit (18 Jul 2018)

Just picking through the results - what happened to Yates today - dropped right out of the top 10 - difficult to follow online. Jour sans?


----------



## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Cav has started the final climb.


Will it be the final climb, do you think?


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## deptfordmarmoset (18 Jul 2018)

I want to hear Froome's account of the finish now. G's reasoning was that if he went, Froome could hitch a ride from the chasers.


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

Twizit said:


> Just picking through the results - what happened to Yates today - dropped right out of the top 10 - difficult to follow online. Jour sans?


Not sure. Definitely got blown up pretty quickly once the other GC leaders started throwing kitchen sinks around.


----------



## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> I want to hear Froome's account of the finish now. G's reasoning was that if he went, Froome could hitch a ride from the chasers.


Anyone want to place bets on Froome giving an interview?













No, me neither.


----------



## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Will it be the final climb, do you think?



Rough calculation/guess off the top of my head... the time cut will be around 35 minutes, so he's well outside that. Kittel and Renshaw will probably miss the cut as well (Renshaw is a bit behind Kittel at the moment).

Groenewegen looks like he should be safe.

ETA: Boardman just said the cut will be 27.15, which puts Groenewegen right on the limit. There are a few smaller groups and lone stragglers behind the autobus, so potentially quite a few eliminations today.


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Rough calculation/guess off the top of my head... the time cut will be around 35 minutes, so he's well outside that. Kittel and Renshaw will probably miss the cut as well (Renshaw is a bit behind Kittel at the moment).
> 
> Groenewegen looks like he should be safe.


Boardman estimating 27 minutes.


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## Twizit (18 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Anyone want to place bets on Froome giving an interview?
> 
> No, me neither.



I'll stand by my comment earlier - I think Froome is quite happy with the status quo and will let Thomas have his time in yellow, knowing he is fully capable of overtaking him later on. Don't think this is a Wiggo / Froome repeat - although am sure the media will try to stir it up like it is.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Boardman estimating 27 minutes.



Yeah, I was guessing a bit - can't find the regulations on the Tour website, so I don't have the list of stage coefficients which is what you need to calculate the time cut.

The live tracker seems to have gone offline now as well, so we'll have to wait for the official report later.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Time limit is 31.26 according to INRNG


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## Beebo (18 Jul 2018)

I will watch highlights tonight. But I suspect that Thomas will do a Yates in the Giro. 
He will burn out in the final stages when Froome will be strong.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Aha! I've found the rules, buried deep in the Tour website...

Today's stage was Coefficient 5 ("short and very difficult") and the average speed of the stage winner (31.06kmh) means a delay of 13%, which puts the cut-off at 27.14 - which means Boardman got it spot on.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I have been looking for those too. To no avail.



http://netstorage.lequipe.fr/ASO/cycling_tdf/tdf2018-reglement.pdf

Time-cuts and stage coefficients are on pages 9-11


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Twizit said:


> I'll stand by my comment earlier - I think Froome is quite happy with the status quo and will let Thomas have his time in yellow, knowing he is fully capable of overtaking him later on. Don't think this is a Wiggo / Froome repeat - although am sure the media will try to stir it up like it is.


I think you’re right. The only way Sky’ll let Thomas ride for the Tour is if Froome blows spectacularly, crashes or is caught live on TV chugging an inhaler the size of an oil drum.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I have been looking for those too. To no avail.
> 
> 
> (Quoted using my new found mastery of the selective quote function)





smutchin said:


> http://netstorage.lequipe.fr/ASO/cycling_tdf/tdf2018-reglement.pdf
> 
> Time-cuts and stage coefficients are on pages 9-11



Here you go, to save trying to work it out - all stages calculated for you, just enter the winning time

http://www.velofacts.com/cx-laps/tour-de-france-2018-time-limit-calculator.html


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Here you go, to save trying to work it out - all stages calculated for you, just enter the winning time
> 
> http://www.velofacts.com/cx-laps/tour-de-france-2018-time-limit-calculator.html



As Roy Walker would say, it's good but it's not right - they've got the delay as 15%, which is at odds with the 13% quoted in the official rules.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Stage 17 gets the same coefficient as the ITT (stage 20), which is a fixed 25% regardless of speed.


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> they've got the delay as 15%, which is at odds with the 13% quoted in the official rules



...although it looks like the commissaires have gone with the more generous interpretation of the rules:


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## Adam4868 (18 Jul 2018)

Strangely the only sky supporter in the bar in Brittany today...... different yesterday wasn't it !
Great win by Thomas,but it's still Froomes race I think.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> As Roy Walker would say, it's good but it's not right - they've got the delay as 15%, which is at odds with the 13% quoted in the official rules.
> 
> View attachment 419938





smutchin said:


> ...although it looks like the commissaires have gone with the more generous interpretation of the rules:
> 
> View attachment 419939
> View attachment 419940



Yeh, the "powers that be" made an announcement after yesterday's stage that there would be an amended limit


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Yeh, the "powers that be" made an announcement after yesterday's stage that there would be an amended limit



Well, they could have thought to let me know that, the inconsiderate sods.


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

Do any of you experts mining letour.fr know what time the final stage finish is predicted to be, please? I just looked on one preview that contained no information useful to work out whether I can be near a TV at the right time!


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Do any of you experts mining letour.fr know what time the final stage finish is predicted to be, please? I just looked on one preview that contained no information useful to work out whether I can be near a TV at the right time!



Time schedules are listed on the page for each stage. For stage 21 it says between 19.01 and 19.19. 
https://www.letour.fr/en/stage-21


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## smutchin (18 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Yeh, the "powers that be" made an announcement after yesterday's stage that there would be an amended limit





smutchin said:


> Well, they could have thought to let me know that, the inconsiderate sods.



I feel some consolation in the fact that Boardman obviously didn't get the memo either.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Do any of you experts mining letour.fr know what time the final stage finish is predicted to be, please? I just looked on one preview that contained no information useful to work out whether I can be near a TV at the right time!


Between 19.01 and 19.19 local time according to the usual time/3 option kph speeds


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Looks like the "powers that be" are in a very generous mood, seems as if they have permitted Rick Zabel to start tomorrow's stage after missing the cut by 5 seconds


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## Mike_P (18 Jul 2018)

So Kittle out (why did I pick him for my fantasy team) - do I replace him with Gaviria or skip having a sprinter


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## Crankarm (18 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Aha! I've found the rules, buried deep in the Tour website...
> 
> Today's stage was Coefficient 5 ("short and very difficult") and the average speed of the stage winner (31.06kmh) means a delay of 13%, which puts the cut-off at 27.14 - which means *Boardman got it spot on*.



You wouldn't expect anything else from the great man.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (18 Jul 2018)

Crankarm said:


> You wouldn't expect anything else from the great man.


Apart from him being wrong...


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## stoatsngroats (18 Jul 2018)

stoatsngroats said:


> It would be great to see GT and CF contest their own final positions, without team interference, if such an idea were plausible, it would make great tv.


Who could have thought such a thing?
I know it’s only half done, but it’s looking good, no?


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## Milzy (18 Jul 2018)

Who will win Alpe du huez ? 
Mikel Landa could surprise.


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## deptfordmarmoset (18 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> Who will win Alpe du huez ?


I'd love to win Alpe d'Huez but I've got nowhere to put it so I'm not competing.


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## Milzy (18 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> I'd love to win Alpe d'Huez but I've got nowhere to put it so I'm not competing.




Should have put stage 12. Ohh well.


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## deptfordmarmoset (18 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> Should have put stage 12. Ohh well.


Sorry but it's my birthday stage tomorrow and a certain flippancy has set in.....


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## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

This is either bluff, double bluff or triple bluff with pike, but this article suggests that Froome is still Sky’s plan A.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...r-leader-and-team-sky-teammate-geraint-thomas


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## Tin Pot (18 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I'd be amazed if Froome was anything but plan A. Thomas was in yellow for a bit last year too, wasn't he?
> 
> By the way, Guardian journalist, the expression is "toe the line", not "tow the line"



How else will the line get from A to B if no one tows it. Prodding it with you foot will achieve nothing!

Madness!


----------



## Bollo (18 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I'd be amazed if Froome was anything but plan A. Thomas was in yellow for a bit last year too, wasn't he?
> 
> By the way, Guardian journalist, the expression is "toe the line", not "tow the line".


Geraint is......








G Plan!


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> How else will the line get from A to B if no one tows it. Prodding it with you foot will achieve nothing!
> 
> Madness!


You're going at that eggcorn like a bowl in a china shop. It'll end in tiers.

Actually, isn't it Kwiatkowski who has been towing the line of sky riders?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (18 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Geraint is......
> 
> 
> View attachment 419977
> ...


Is that Quintana at the bottom?


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## Tin Pot (18 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Geraint is......
> 
> 
> View attachment 419977
> ...



...An occasional table?


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## mjr (18 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> ...An occasional table?


An occasional team leader: shaped like Froome, but made of chipboard and has a frilly cloth covering it.

Oh go on then: Bardet to win on the Alpe, showing that he's just been pacing himself the last two days and playing a long game.


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## Va Va Froome (18 Jul 2018)

I'm so pleased to see Thomas take a stage win, the yellow is a nice bonus! 

TAKE IT ALL THE WAY TO PARIS!


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## BalkanExpress (19 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> I can’t imagine what cycling in that peloton is like.
> 
> View attachment 419376



Try and see “Time Trial” the documentary made during David Millar’s last season, there is some fantastic footage from inside the peloton.


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## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

brilliant to see Thomas win yesterday but the ride of the day for me was tom dumpmoulin absolutely brilliant,

are we going to get to the point where Thomas is forced to work for froome today ??? interesting to see what will happen

apart from Thomas, froome and dumpmoulin not a lot from the other GC contenders yet


----------



## suzeworld (19 Jul 2018)

I think Froome will have enough other ppl to be "working for him". The other 6 will be working for G and Froome as a unit, I reckon.
Hat's off to G - the boy done good. 
And obviously I hope he can stay out there, while not really thinking that's going to happen.

"towing" the line made me cringe too, Dogtrousers! 

Poor Cav - amazing he stayed on to the end, he was clearly totally exhausted - then the media scrum was all over the road and nearly knocked him off.


----------



## Shadow (19 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> ...the ride of the day for me was tom dumpmoulin absolutely brilliant...
> apart from Thomas, froome and dumpmoulin not a lot from the other GC contenders yet


This. 
Totally agree about TD's ride yesterday. Shame Nibali or Bardet did not go with him on the descent. But then maybe Froome would have latched on quickly too.

Also agree about other contenders. Quintana, Nibali, Bardet or Roglic seemed to be watching other instead of making a move. Afraid of making a doomed move perhaps? But maybe they couldn't. 
Or maybe they are waiting for another moment - today? Pyrenees?


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> This.
> Totally agree about TD's ride yesterday. Shame Nibali or Bardet did not go with him on the descent. But then maybe Froome would have latched on quickly too.


ITV highlights speculates that the sunweb two were on the front of the peloton with Sky behind and the lead Sky rider made a mistake, opening the gap, but no heli shots and the moto well ahead so maybe we'll only know if some fan videoed it or a rider in the top 20 downhill there says it or was carrying a camera.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> This.
> Totally agree about TD's ride yesterday. Shame Nibali or Bardet did not go with him on the descent. But then maybe Froome would have latched on quickly too.
> 
> Also agree about other contenders. Quintana, Nibali, Bardet or Roglic seemed to be watching other instead of making a move. Afraid of making a doomed move perhaps? But maybe they couldn't.
> Or maybe they are waiting for another moment - today? Pyrenees?


Agree. It's easy enough to moan about Team Evil, but very few of the other GC names seem interested in forcing the race. Powder can only be kept so dry.

It was good to see Barguil showing his face at the pointy end again.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

It's the third day in the mtns. You would really expect the climbers to thrive today, especially on the Col De La Madeiline and the Croix and the Alpe and people like Thomas and Dumoulin to begin to struggle. There were also a few worrying signs in the Sky train yesterday. They could have made a mistake bringing Bernal, he dropped off yesterday and probably went deep trying to stay and fulfil his role. Likewise, Poels dropped off early, leaving Kwiatkowski to do more than he probably should have. Of course they could all have recovered today but I bet the other teams noted it yesterday.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (19 Jul 2018)

I reckon Sky will want to let the break get a decent lead and possibly the win, and try to contain the GC contenders. As Crax says, there were chinks shown yesterday and the GC contenders may want to make things less than smooth for Sky, but then again we've said this in past years and \sky have prevailed..


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

It looked like only Movistar were willing to try to disrupt the Sky train and while that may have been why Bernal popped (I think Poels was being saved for today), it didn't end well enough for Movistar that any other team will want to join their effort and 8 man teams, Movistar having 3 leaders and Sky being 100% GC means that Movistar can't derail the train alone.

In other words, unless Movistar AND sunweb or Ag2r or maybe Lotto Jumbo decide to play derail-the-train today, I think Sky may have already won this as long as one of their riders can keep near the front.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> It's the third day in the mtns. You would really expect the climbers to thrive today, especially on the Col De La Madeiline and the Croix and the Alpe and people like Thomas and Dumoulin to begin to struggle. There were also a few worrying signs in the Sky train yesterday. They could have made a mistake bringing Bernal, he dropped off yesterday and probably went deep trying to stay and fulfil his role. Likewise, Poels dropped off early, leaving Kwiatkowski to do more than he probably should have. Of course they could all have recovered today but I bet the other teams noted it yesterday.


Do you think it's possible that Poels was being spared from going into the red?


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> Do you think it's possible that Poels was being spared from going into the red?


As per mjr, it's possible. I didn't see his face before he dropped off but Bernal was definitely struggling. Don't forget, Poels did the Giro this year.


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

To lose Cav , Zabel, Kittel and Renshaw in a single day could be seen as somewhat negligent on the part of the course designers, it also shows the difficulty of creating a course that suits all types of riders ove 3 weeks. This was only the second tough stage of the race, there are still plenty harder days to come, and the list of guys who only just made the cut today was long. How will they cope today?

The first week was a bit boring but there has to be something in the race for sprinters, and we dont want to get to Paris with none of the fast guys left.


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Uran is out.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Gallopin right off the back reportedly and not gallopin at all. AG2R about to lose yet another rider?


It took me a while, but very good.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Dylan groanagain abandoned..


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Groenewegen in the Broemewegen
> 
> (acknowledgements to @rich p )



sshhh, he will be wanting royalties for using the phrase


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Griepel has abandoned now!
No sprinters left soon.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Hmmmmm, that's an unusual amount of sprinters out.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Is Kruijswijk attacking for the GC or attacking trying to be there for Roglic's attack?


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

This is brave from Kruijswijk but surely ultimately foolhardy. He could lose big here, I just can't see him staying away.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Not just Griepel, but he's the highest profile
> 
> _Three more riders have pulled out: Poljanski (Bora), Zabel (Katusha) and Greipel (Lotto)_
> 
> So the commissaries' mercy yesterday at forgiving Zabel a few seconds over the time limit wasn't worth much.


*BORA – hansgrohe*‏Verified account @*BORAhansgrohe* 10m10 minutes ago




#*TDF2018*


just to clarify, @*pawelpoljanski* is still in the race, he is in a big group with @*maciejbodnar* @*letourdata* @*LeTour* #*BORAhansgrohe*

according to twitter 10 mins ago..


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Is Kruijswijk attacking for the GC or attacking trying to be there for Roglic's attack?



I think Kruijswijk is going for GC. He did same in Giro a few years back successfully. Kruijiswick FTW.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

boulting just said race radio says gaviria has abondodned , but they are awaiting confirmation, gonna be no sprinters left at this rate


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Gone-viria! Who's going to win on the Champs?


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Gaviria abandon too


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Eddie The Boss on Champs


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

sagans job is getting easier


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

WTF is Latour up to?


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

The crazy stage with the starting grid format could see another load of riders miss the cut too. 
Especially if the GC guys go full speed from the start.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

*Quick-Step Cycling*‏ @*quickstepteam* 31s31 seconds ago
Unfortunately, the brutal course and extreme heat took their toll on Tour de France debutant @*FndoGaviria*, who pulled out of the race.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Poels has gone


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Poels has been unexpectedly poor this year. Too much after the Giro?


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Looks like it. Sky's team selection is beginning to look dodgy here.


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

My spirits always rise a little when Pelizotti drops back


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Yates has popped again


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

I cant remember a day with so many abandones


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

I wonder if Kruijswik will fall into a snow bank again


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> The crazy stage with the starting grid format could see another load of riders miss the cut too.
> Especially if the GC guys go full speed from the start.


Didn't someone write that the cut will be 25% that stage? That's compared to 13% or so yesterday, so maybe fewer will miss it than you'd think.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I wonder if Kruijswik will fall into a snow bank again



Well it’s deja vue so far


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> *Quick-Step Cycling*‏ @*quickstepteam* 31s31 seconds ago
> Unfortunately, the brutal course and extreme heat took their toll on Tour de France debutant @*FndoGaviria*, who pulled out of the race.


Extreme heat? Websites make it look like mid 20s C.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I wonder if Kruijswik will fall into a snow bank again


Something white, probably a camper van


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Something white


Young rider?


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Are they taking SK too lightly or playing it cool?


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

I don't think they've got the firepower to chase this


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Something white, probably a camper van


Didn't Nieve or Landa try that a year or two ago?


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Didn't Nieve or Landa try that a year or two ago?


I don't recall. I remember Thomas knocking a few deckchairs over and bouncing off a telegraph pole.


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Didn't Nieve or Landa try that a year or two ago?


Was it Froome?


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

I drove up the Glandon once - it was tough but I hung in there,


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Was it Froome?


This year's Giro?


----------



## Twizit (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I don't think they've got the firepower to chase this


'tis a long valley ride along the bottom before the Alpe - surely they can pull back some of 6 minutes along there, compared to a sole rider?


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> This year's Giro?


I'm not sure. Vuelta last year?
ISTR him missing a turn at the bottom of a hill and cycling between some caravans


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_megz_t5Hhw


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Haha remember it well


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Twizit said:


> 'tis a long valley ride along the bottom before the Alpe - surely they can pull back some of 6 minutes along there, compared to a sole rider?


Normally but there's not many who seem willing to pull, no one is contributing yet.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm not sure. Vuelta last year?
> ISTR him missing a turn at the bottom of a hill and cycling between some caravans


To be honest, the days are all merging into one. 

I was going to nip out for a ride but Alpe d'Huez is looking too tasty to miss. Safe money is on Kruijswijk but it'll be interesting to see if Sky limit losses or blow completely.


----------



## Twizit (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Normally but there's not many who seem willing to pull, no one is contributing yet.


Yeah, although I was thinking the 5 remaining Sky riders should be able to pull back something - but granted 6 minutes is a decent lead.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Twizit said:


> Yeah, although I was thinking the 5 remaining Sky riders should be able to pull back something - but granted 6 minutes is a decent lead.



Although Sky have something of a dilemma right now. Not sure Froome will have G on th Alpe


----------



## Twizit (19 Jul 2018)

Fight.The.Power said:


> Although Sky have something of a dilemma right now. Not sure Froome will have G on th Alpe



???


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_megz_t5Hhw



It's not shown there but I'm sure I remember a Sky rider in white going further off, between the camper vans.


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Griepel has abandoned now!
> No sprinters left soon.



Given the problems Yates had yesterday, I wonder what Caleb Ewan thinks of all this. Would he have lasted the distance?


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

15 to go to the alpe and SK has lost 20 seconds only


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Given the problems Yates had yesterday, I wonder what Caleb Ewan thinks of all this. Would he have lasted the distance?


If Grepel couldn't I have doubts that Ewan would have


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

5,25 now with 26 km to go. Coming down


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Spectacular scenery today


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

SK must be farked doing this section on his jack jones


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> SK must be farked doing this section on his jack jones



Easy day tomorrow though, although not sure in last 5km


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> If Grepel couldn't I have doubts that Ewan would have



Agreed. Mitchelton-Scott probably made the right decision to leave him behind - whether by luck or judgment - but he'll still be pissed off, having been promised the Tour at the start of the season.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> SK must be farked doing this section on his jack jones


Sk? Can you spell who you mean


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Sk? Can you spell who you mean



He can spell it about as well as Ned can pronounce it.


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> The crazy stage with the starting grid format could see another load of riders miss the cut too.





mjr said:


> Didn't someone write that the cut will be 25% that stage?



Yep, it's Coefficient 7, same as the ITT, so 25% - although I wouldn't be surprised if the commissaires were considering increasing it to 30%...


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_megz_t5Hhw



That's the chap! That was a year ago?! Christ I've wasted my life.

Also, is there any uglier sight in cycling than Aru and Froome together giving it beans?


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

"Mano a mano" alert! Ned is turning into Paul Sherwen! Oh no!


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Next on the left isn’t it ?


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Time dropping fast now. 
4.20. Is the current gap. 
I don’t think he will hold on.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Time dropping fast now.
> 4.20. Is the current gap.
> I don’t think he will hold on.


To keep it interesting I'm going to say he'll hold on, but not get yellow.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

4.20 is way better than I thought he'd have. GC is probably out but if he doesn't blow and there aren't many successful attacks behind, he could, could hold on for a win, which he'd deserve. Sadly I don't think he will.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Sky looks shagged out


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

And if G doesn’t pull Froome up


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> "Mano a mano" alert! Ned is turning into Paul Sherwen! Oh no!


ITYM "oh no a oh no"


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

C’mon Kruijiswik


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Kwia


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> 4.20 is way better than I thought he'd have. GC is probably out but if he doesn't blow and there aren't many successful attacks behind, he could, could hold on for a win, which he'd deserve. Sadly I don't think he will.





Fight.The.Power said:


> Sky looks shagged out



Maybe that was the plan all along, to set it up for Roglic?


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Hmmm maybe. Good point


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Only Bernal left. Sky exposed for the first time, this is going to be interesting.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Fight.The.Power said:


> Hmmm maybe. Good point


TMN to me  https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/tour-de-france-2018-spoilers.235038/post-5318644


----------



## smutchin (19 Jul 2018)

Maybe Quintana could be a beneficiary of Lotto-Jumbo's tactics as well?


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

time gap dropping quickly now


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

GT back in virtual yellow.....


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Kruijiswuck is cooked


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> GT back in virtual yellow.....


Or not. Thanks telemetry people.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Martin looking bobby, yoyoing off the back. One of Dumoulin's teammates handed over a bottle and parked up. Quintana looking like he's sizing up when to attack.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Noooo dan Martin​


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Timing went awry then


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

what the feck....clock on screen bouncing about like a box of frogs


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> what the feck....clock on screen bouncing about like a box of frogs


Today's timekeeping is provided by La Vuelta.


----------



## rich p (19 Jul 2018)

Bernal has done good today


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Shark


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

oohhh Nibali having a dig


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> To be fair he's been looking like that for several years, and has never done so.


Thank you  Quintana attacks!


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Quintana goes


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Fuglsang dropped. Hope he feels better in the Pyrenees.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

bardet on the attack


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Bardet goes.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Landa counterattacks, barely gets anywhere before being reeled slowly back in. Bardet attacks and gets further away.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Quintana getting dropped


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Quintana joins those playing yoyo off the back


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Crowd getting too close to Froome. Some guy looked like he tried to push him off.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Crowd getting too close to Froome. Some guy looked like he tried to push him off.


They've not been allowed to drink today, according to reports, which I fear may improve their aim and coordination


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

theres a lot of booing going on


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

The gap is dropping very fast. Nearly under a minute now.


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> They've not been allowed to drink today, according to reports, which I fear may improve their aim and coordination


How do they police that?


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Froome being dropped?


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Looked like a few things were being thrown. Police grabbed a guy.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Nibali?! WTF!!!


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Nibbles takes a tumble
Not nice.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

Nibali down but didn't see how


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Chaos


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Froome launches an attack


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

In the barrier section so hopefully the crowd can't bugger it up now.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Dumoulin coming back


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Nibali down but didn't see how


Ned and Dave speculated the motos were involved


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

4 top riders no one wants to attack


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Wowsers!


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> 4 top riders no one wants to attack


Bardet attacks, Froome counters, Dumoulin drags Thomas back up to them, then Dumoulin attacks, Thomas chases him down - have Thomas and Froome divided up marking the opponents between them?


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

hell of a ride from dumpmoulin again


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

under 2km to go... surely they can't keep this up?


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

C’mon dumoulin ​


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

1.4km to go, now grinding along in line again, Bardet positioned on the back ready for the sprint...


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Landa back on. Nibali and Roglic at about 45s, Quintana another 5 or 10 back. (Timings from tv, may all be junk.)


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (19 Jul 2018)

G looks cooked.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Landa attacks at 700m, N&Rin sight behind


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (19 Jul 2018)

Useless twonks, I'd be a great DS and make sure Sky didnae win.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Oooooooooh!


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (19 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> G looks cooked.


Famous last words!


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Thomas full-on sprint, wins in yellow, taking another win bonus!


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

fekin brilliant , another win for thomas


----------



## Twizit (19 Jul 2018)

Unreal!!!


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Wow an GT was domestique for Froome with about 5k to go.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> G looks cooked.


That was even better than my prediction of a Bardet win


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

im knackered watching that.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

What a stage. I'm still taking it all in


----------



## Dave Davenport (19 Jul 2018)

Cracking ride by G! 

Strong possibility of a spectator/s doing something really stupid before it gets to Paris I'd say.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

"G, zip up, man. It looks bad." itv capture a bit of behind-the-scenes chat from G's warm-down.


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Boardman calls Landa the sole leader of Movistar now - but doesn't Quintana prefer the Pyrenees? Not that that's helped before, as alluded to above.


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Jeez what a great stage. What a win!! Lots to think about ahead of Wednesday for the Welshman


----------



## Fight.The.Power (19 Jul 2018)

Would love to see the text from Wiggins to Geraint tonight


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

If things remain as they are, Dumoulin has got to be a strong favourite to win this at the death in the TT.

Too many permutations....


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Lots of booing for GT at the ceremony. Very sad as he has nothing wrong.


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Lots of booing for GT at the ceremony. Very sad as he has nothing wrong.


I think that stage was the one that was going to attract potential nutters, so hopefully booing is as bad as it'll get from here on in.


----------



## gavroche (19 Jul 2018)

Why would Thomas say he is still riding for Froome when he seems to be stronger? Is he under team orders as Sky want to make sure Froome gets his 5th Tour? That wouldn't be fair on Thomas .


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (19 Jul 2018)

Twizit said:


> Unreal!!!



Indeed...


----------



## Twizit (19 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Indeed...


Now now


----------



## 3narf (19 Jul 2018)

That was superb!


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

So


Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Indeed...


41.16, not even in the top 100 fastest times


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> So
> 
> 41.16, not even in the top 100 fastest times


Didnt Pantani do it in under 35mins.


----------



## hoopdriver (19 Jul 2018)

It was 37- something, I believe

37:35 - I just checked...


----------



## hoopdriver (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> So
> 
> 41.16, not even in the top 100 fastest times


Wrong. It would be the 25th fastest.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

hoopdriver said:


> Wrong. It would be the 25th fastest.


Where did you get that?

http://www.climbing-records.com/2013/07/all-time-top-100-fastest-rides-on.html?m=1


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Where did you get that?
> 
> http://www.climbing-records.com/2013/07/all-time-top-100-fastest-rides-on.html?m=1


Every single one of those times is more than 10 years old. 
That must be a good sign.


----------



## hoopdriver (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Where did you get that?
> 
> http://www.climbing-records.com/2013/07/all-time-top-100-fastest-rides-on.html?m=1


http://www.stickybottle.com/uncateg...s-ever-up-alpe-dhuez-how-many-doping-related/

This is the Tour we’re talking about, right?


----------



## Adam4868 (19 Jul 2018)

Been watching here in France,great win by Thomas ! Especially two in a row,is he first British/Welsh rider to take this stage ? 
What happened to Nibali when he went down ?


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

hoopdriver said:


> http://www.stickybottle.com/uncateg...s-ever-up-alpe-dhuez-how-many-doping-related/
> 
> This is the Tour we’re talking about, right?


I think they are measuring for different start positions. Compare the Pantani times and they are all different. Plus I think your list is just the winners.


----------



## PaulB (19 Jul 2018)

Is it just me or does anyone else think Tom Demoulin could make some money on the side by hiring his chin out as a seasonal runway to busy airports to ease the strain over the summer? Just me then?


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Been watching here in France,great win by Thomas ! Especially two in a row,is he first British/Welsh rider to take this stage ?
> What happened to Nibali when he went down ?


He is the first British rider to win up the Alp but more amazingly they said on Eurosport that he is the first British rider to ever win a race stage whilst in yellow. Is that true?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (19 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> What happened to Nibali when he went down ?


The pictures didn't show it and the commentators didn't know but thought it involved motos at a pinch point behind the barricades. I'm watching the highlights now - perhaps they'll have found out what happened.


----------



## Adam4868 (19 Jul 2018)

Not had much internet,but I read that something with a Moto with Nibali ? Saw some bloke trying to push Froome when he was chasing Bardet and also getting spat at ! If that's the best they can do I'd find some other sport to watch


----------



## Crankarm (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> He is the first British rider to win up the Alp but more amazingly they said on Eurosport that he is the first British rider to ever win a race stage whilst in yellow. Is that true?



I believe he is the first ever rider in yellow to win on the Alp. Well that's what they said earlier, but I might very well be wrong as my hearing isn't so good. If you watch the highlights on ITV4 now you will know cos they never it wrong . But what ever it is an absolutely fantastic result for GT, absolutely bloody fantastic. Congratulations to him. I hope the powers that be at Sky don't tell him to ease up and let Froome go in front which would be a shockingly bitter pill for him to swallow if indeed he did. But there is still a long way to go to Paris.


----------



## Crankarm (19 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Not had much internet,but I read that something with a Moto with Nibali ? Saw some bloke trying to push Froome when he was chasing Bardet and also getting spat at ! If that's the best they can do I'd find some other sport to watch



It was a combination of road narrowing, bend, trees, spectators getting too close, flags and motorbikes. Geraint said he thought he rode over Nibali's rear wheel as he went down in front. It wasn't very pretty and iirc happened just before the barriers started. Really bad crowd control again from ASO again. Fortunately Nibali was ok. Some of these nutters who hit/slap hard the riders or try to block them should be fined or jailed. Like the spectator who looked like he tried to hit Froome hard on the back to knock him off. It shouldn't be hard to id them with all the footage being taken. Wait till the race gets high into the Pyrenees. The Spanish spectators are nutz.


----------



## hoopdriver (19 Jul 2018)

If you go by W


Beebo said:


> I think they are measuring for different start positions. Compare the Pantani times and they are all different. Plus I think your list is just the winners.


Could be. Looking over my post, I came off sounding rather abrupt. I didn’t mean to - I was writing in haste, being summoned to dinner! My apologies for sounding so brusque.


----------



## Crankarm (19 Jul 2018)

Pantani like all the others of that era was drugged up to his eyeballs. UPS and Lance Armstrong got a favourable mention at the bottom of the Alp as the team that started the trend of riding at the front full gas to tear the field apart to get up to the end of the straight leading up to first hairpin of the climb proper.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

Both lists are right then, if you're looking at individual and winning times.


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> The pictures didn't show it and the commentators didn't know but thought it involved motos at a pinch point behind the barricades. I'm watching the highlights now - perhaps they'll have found out what happened.


There is a report that he hit a police motorbike. 
Also more worryingly he may have fractured a vertebrae. He is undergoing X-ray.


----------



## Crankarm (19 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> There is a report that he hit a police motorbike.
> Also more worryingly he may have fractured a vertebrae. He is undergoing X-ray.



Cracked vertebrae and out of tour which is rotten luck for him and not his fault.


----------



## Crankarm (19 Jul 2018)

It might just start to be sinking in for GT what he has just achieved. Fantastic result. The booing by the French on the finish line as he and Froome went by and at the presentation was shameful. Mind you Froome didn't have anything to say post race, so maybe Mrs F will now be speaking to Mrs T.


----------



## Adam4868 (19 Jul 2018)

After all this time you don't really think anything bothers Froome,he'll take it in his stride,so will Thomas.Its a shame but that's the way it is.


----------



## Tin Pot (19 Jul 2018)

Someone took a swing a Froome on the way up too.

Thomas and Froome, it’s great drama - I’m not calling it, but I think Sky would be surprised if Thomas holds through. I just hope it doesn’t fark up the team strategy and let Dumoulin take it.


----------



## roadrash (19 Jul 2018)

didn't know about this yesterday..
..
*The Cycling Podcast*‏Verified account @*cycling_podcast* 10h10 hours ago
Yesterday Edvald Boasson Hagen was stranded with a broken bike and no team car. Team Sky gave him a bike to finish the stage, for which he and Servais Knaven were fined. This morning Boasson Hagen came and found Knaven with €150 to cover the fine.






84 replies . 560 retweets 2,730 likes


----------



## Beebo (19 Jul 2018)

There are lots of silly rules in cycling. This appears to be one of the silliest. 

EBH is an ex Sky rider. 



roadrash said:


> didn't know about this yesterday..
> ..
> *The Cycling Podcast*‏Verified account @*cycling_podcast* 10h10 hours ago
> Yesterday Edvald Boasson Hagen was stranded with a broken bike and no team car. Team Sky gave him a bike to finish the stage, for which he and Servais Knaven were fined. This morning Boasson Hagen came and found Knaven with €150 to cover the fine.
> ...


----------



## Mike_P (19 Jul 2018)

Barking rule - cannot ride another teams bike but can run uphill bikeless aka Froome last year


----------



## mjr (19 Jul 2018)

Mike_P said:


> Barking rule - cannot ride another teams bike but can run uphill bikeless aka Froome last year


The only reason that was allowed is that the commissaires declared the race neutralised from the motorbike crash onwards. Covering any of the course without a bike is not allowed. Strictly speaking, Froome should have picked up the largest part of his snapped bike and run with it until a neutral service or team car could swap it.


----------



## andrew_s (19 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Yesterday Edvald Boasson Hagen was stranded with a broken bike and no team car. Team Sky gave him a bike to finish the stage, for which he and Servais Knaven were fined.


I gather the EBH only made the time cut by 4 minutes, so I expect he considered the fine and time penalty good value.


----------



## andrew_s (19 Jul 2018)

Crankarm said:


> I believe he is the first ever rider in yellow to win on the Alp.


I believe L. A*******g won in yellow too, but that it was a TT stage.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (19 Jul 2018)

I suppose one "good" thing from a doping perspective is the number of autobus members who have retired, required a loosening of time limits or who have been eliminated, given that in years past they would have breezed the limits.


----------



## Mike_P (19 Jul 2018)

Probably the most unnoticed ride of the day is the injured Lawson Craddock managing to get into the top 50 at 42nd 23 mins 39 secs down albeit still lanterne rouge 6 mins 14secs adrift, but a big improvement on 13mins 28secs adrift as he was after yesterday.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (19 Jul 2018)

INRNG have recently shared a video clip of Nibali's tumble which seems to indicate it was not a moto but a fan/fans who brought him down (not deliberately), despite Nibali saying it was a moto - looks like moto may have clipped him when he was on the way down/already down as it looks as if there is a moto which was level with him with a decent enough gap:


----------



## Bollo (19 Jul 2018)

Mike_P said:


> Probably the most unnoticed ride of the day is the injured Lawson Craddock managing to get into the top 50 at 42nd 23 mins 39 secs down albeit still lanterne rouge 6 mins 14secs adrift, but a big improvement on 13mins 28secs adrift as he was after yesterday.


There was a brief bit of footage during the live coverage where he was handed something from the team car. He then absolutely lost his sheet and threw whatever it was to the ground. I wagging finger then appeared out of the car window. Wonder what that was about?


----------



## Adam4868 (19 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> INRNG have recently shared a video clip of Nibali's tumble which seems to indicate it was not a moto but a fan/fans who brought him down (not deliberately), despite Nibali saying it was a moto - looks like moto may have clipped him when he was on the way down/already down as it looks as if there is a moto which was level with him with a decent enough gap:
> 
> View attachment 420123



View: https://twitter.com/diegoalvarez12/status/1020035493734559749?s=19


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

I've gone through that frame by frame but the crucial bit is not on camera, however it looks very much like his handlebars caught a spectator or something they were holding. It's a pretty innocuous fall, I can't believe he's fractured a vertebrae doing that


----------



## Jimidh (19 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> View: https://twitter.com/diegoalvarez12/status/1020035493734559749?s=19




That’s a nightmare especially if the rumours are true and he has done himself serious damage.


----------



## Crackle (19 Jul 2018)

The other view from the Inner ring post is better but still not good enough, however you can see his bars twist. Here's a still






You can see the direction of the front wheel and if you run through the frames before this, you see the bars twisting. He's down almost immediately after this frame.


----------



## Jimidh (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> The other view from the Inner ring post is better but still not good enough, however you can see his bars twist. Here's a still
> 
> View attachment 420126
> 
> ...


Certainly doesn’t look like there’s a moto in the way.


----------



## Adam4868 (19 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I've gone through that frame by frame but the crucial bit is not on camera, however it looks very much like his handlebars caught a spectator or something they were holding. It's a pretty innocuous fall, I can't believe he's fractured a vertebrae doing that


I kmow what you mean but the slow speed falls can often do more injury than the high speed ones


----------



## Crankarm (20 Jul 2018)

andrew_s said:


> I believe L. A*******g won in yellow too, but that it was a TT stage.



You misunderstand the significance of GT's stage win today. I don't think there has ever been a TT stage up the Alp d'Huez do you, but I may be wrong? The Alp has until today with GT, been a yellow jersey killer. No yellow jersey rider had ever taken the stage win on it.  Geraint!


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Crankarm said:


> You misunderstand the significance of GT's stage win today. I don't think there has ever been a TT stage up the Alp d'Huez do you, but I may be wrong? The Alp has until today with GT, been a yellow jersey killer. No yellow jersey rider had ever taken the stage win on it.  Geraint!


2004 was a TT up it, but that now has no winner. http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2004/tour04/?id=results/stage16


----------



## suzeworld (20 Jul 2018)

Ref policing the booze policy: 

Apparently no official booze sales on the roadside - so they’re limited to what they carry up in their own knapsacks. Obviously not a problem to ppl with a camper van, but the vast majority of the crowd walk or cycle up
Mountain stages.


----------



## suzeworld (20 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> Why would Thomas say he is still riding for Froome when he seems to be stronger? Is he under team orders as Sky want to make sure Froome gets his 5th Tour? That wouldn't be fair on Thomas .



I suppose there’s some toeing the party line - but his own comment was about Froome’s stamina over 3 weeks. That’s going to be the decider. If Froome’s tired out they’ll promote G anyway because “a bird in the hand etc.... “. but G is more likely than Froome to flag in the third week.

Plus Dumoulin looks very cool and threatening to them both atm. Very exciting. 

Superb stage today bodes well for the final week. Plus the mystery of what will happen on the Champs Elysée with no pure sprinters left !!


----------



## jarlrmai (20 Jul 2018)

The time trial is going to be very interesting if TD is still close.


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

jarlrmai said:


> The time trial is going to be very interesting if TD is still close.



If Thomas can maintain his current margin, I’d imagine that ought to be enough to stay ahead of Dumoulin after the TT. 

But there are some big stages to come before the TT...


----------



## andrew_s (20 Jul 2018)

The TT is twisty and turny, and up and down a lot (incl 900m @ 10%), so previous TT form may not bear as much weight as normal.


----------



## jarlrmai (20 Jul 2018)

Yeah it makes it interesting, TD being close to Froome means it keeps Sky honest, if it were just climbers close by Sky could be confident of Froome taking enough time out of the close climbers on a Time Trial to win but with TD being there the lead G has over him is priceless in terms of a Sky winner.

yeah the parcour for the TT is interesting but it would seem to suit all 3 riders.


----------



## jarlrmai (20 Jul 2018)

Him taking the right line through that roundabout was so cool.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Prediction for today: A repeat of stage 19 last year. EBH in the break pulls a blinder on one of the roundabouts leading in to the finish and solos to victory.


I'll go for Chavanel finally getting away at the fourth (?) attempt and winning a small group sprint.


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> If Thomas can maintain his current margin, I’d imagine that ought to be enough to stay ahead of Dumoulin after the TT.
> 
> But there are some big stages to come before the TT...


I agree, right now Thomas is the only one with a chance of beating Dumoulin in the TT but it's whether he'll still be in that position come Stage 20. What Sky can't afford to do is just keep the status quo. Unless Dumoulin cracks then he's the favourite for this. There's only two summit finishes left, if Froome doesn't take time on them then he's left with only a Giro style attack, same as Bardet and a couple of others. Surely though, Dumoulin won't make the same mistake twice but even if he chases, he'll have Thomas on his wheel, potentially. I guess it all depends on how either of them respond to the 2nd GT in a year and whether Thomas has a jour sans (sorry Vantage (bad day)). Stage17 is the mystery package though.


----------



## Beebo (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I agree, right now Thomas is the only one with a chance of beating Dumoulin in the TT but it's whether he'll still be in that position come Stage 20. What Sky can't afford to do is just keep the status quo. Unless Dumoulin cracks then he's the favourite for this. There's only two summit finishes left, if Froome doesn't take time on them then he's left with only a Giro style attack, same as Bardet and a couple of others. Surely though, Dumoulin won't make the same mistake twice but even if he chases, he'll have Thomas on his wheel, potentially. I guess it all depends on how either of them respond to the 2nd GT in a year and whether Thomas has a jour sans (sorry Vantage (bad day)). Stage17 is the mystery package though.


In an ideal world Froome and Thomas would work together to break Dumoulin. 
Then fight it out between themselves.


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> There's only two summit finishes left



Well, there's one proper summit finish but that's stage 17, which isn't normal, so who knows how that's going to pan out... Tomorrow's stage to Mende finishes with a cat 2 climb then a plateau to the finish line - 3km at 10%, steep and hard, but too short to be really selective?

The other Pyrenees stage finishes with a descent, and the climbs might not be long or steep enough to put Thomas out of contention - but given the way the race has gone so far, I'm not putting any money on any predictions.



> Surely though, Dumoulin won't make the same mistake twice but even if he chases, he'll have Thomas on his wheel, potentially.



Exactly what Thomas did yesterday, and why he was able to win the stage - let Froome attack, Thomas has shown so far that he is strong enough to stay with Dumoulin and that's all he needs to do. It's a win-win situation for Sky - if Froome can attack and take enough time to take the race lead, so be it, I don't imagine Brailsford cares which one of them is wearing yellow, as long as it's one of them. All Thomas needs to do is sit on Dumoulin's wheel and not crack...



> I guess it all depends on how either of them respond to the 2nd GT in a year and whether Thomas has a jour sans (sorry Vantage (bad day)). Stage17 is the mystery package though.



Dumoulin is clearly in great form but given that he does already have the Giro in his legs, in theory it should be more likely that he'll crack than Thomas.

On the other hand, this is uncharted territory for Thomas and he could well go pop on the Peyresourde à la Yates if the pace is high enough from the start of that stage. But which team has the firepower to put Sky under that kind of pressure? Not Sunweb, that's for sure.

Froome's form is hard to judge. He clearly didn't have the legs to make his attack stick yesterday and Dumoulin didn't seem to have too much problem reeling him in.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> In an ideal world Froome and Thomas would work together to break Dumoulin.
> Then fight it out between themselves.


In the Alps, we've seen that: one attacks or goes with an attack, while the other sits on TD and then counterattacks after TD has dragged them up, or when TD attacks, one sits on and once the other has caught back on, they counterattack. Only the Alpe d'Huez sprint didn't go like that, but I suggest Froome's loss was his own fault for touching his brakes and staying tight around the final corner instead of following G's lead out like G claimed he expected.

So G's increasing lead has mainly been luck of how the attacks have fallen. If they keep panning out the same way in the Pyrenees, will Froome really settle for that and not attack G on the final summit? We've seen hints that he'll attack, such as attacking Martin up la Rosiere when Martin faltered, which wasn't completely conventional tactics.


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

I suppose the other question is what happens if Froome starts to struggle at some point and Thomas is the only one left to act as a domestique for him...


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> In the Alps, we've seen that: one attacks or goes with an attack, while the other sits on TD and then counterattacks after TD has dragged them up, or when TD attacks, one sits on and once the other has caught back on, they counterattack. Only the Alpe d'Huez sprint didn't go like that, but I suggest Froome's loss was his own fault for touching his brakes and staying tight around the final corner instead of following G's lead out like G claimed he expected.



Did you see Dumoulin's post-race interview? He mentioned that he had a mis-shift just at the moment Thomas started his sprint so couldn't go with him. He looked livid!


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

Froome reckons he's building nicely for week 3, which could all be a feint but

https://www.teamsky.com/article/thomas-conquers-alpe-d-huez
_
Froome lauded praise on teammate Thomas, and explained how the two are working together tactically at the sharp end of the race.

He told *TeamSky.com*: "He's ridden the race of his life so far at this Tour. It's been faultless and he fully deserves to be in yellow, having won two stages and the most iconic stage of the race Alpe d'Huez. It's a massive, massive feather in his cap. 

"I think it's a dream position for us to be in - first and second on GC. It allows us to play both our cards like we did today. Yesterday G went up the road and left other riders scrambling to try and chase. Today I went up the road and G sat on Dumoulin which worked out really well in the final. It meant G had a good punch at the finish. It's just a dream scenario for us right now.

"I definitely feel as if I'm building into this race. I'm really happy with how I'm feeling since we've hit the mountains. It was always a bit of an unknown after the Giro but I'm really happy with the first sensations and looking forward to the Pyrenees next week."_


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Froome reckons he's building nicely for week 3, which could all be a feint but


I reckon it's so that Thomas gets tested and Froome doesn't so he can keep "pushing the boundaries" for as long as possible...


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> I reckon it's so that Thomas gets tested and Froome doesn't so he can keep "pushing the boundaries" for as long as possible...


My cynicism meter didn't even twitch then. I reckon you've already broken it though.


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> My cynicism meter didn't even twitch then. I reckon you've already broken it though.


After going over the Nibali fall pixel by pixel I thought I’d relax with a visit to the Clinic. As you can imagine, the current standings have them vexed.


----------



## jarlrmai (20 Jul 2018)

if anything Froome tried to attack that, he was trying to go when they emerged from the smoke.


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Some people are odd.
> I saw that Bardet was getting stick on Twitter for attacking after Nibali had fallen. WTF did they expect him to do? Go back and help him back onto his bike?


Yeah, I only occasionally pop in to riders’ twitter feeds, but in amongst the needle and angry face emojis there were quite a few Bardet haterz. It was total chaos so I doubt he even knew Nibali had gone and, even so, it’s the top of Alpe d’Huez FFS.


----------



## Phaeton (20 Jul 2018)

I find it strange that people who are supposed to be fans, well logically they ought to be to either ride halfway up a mountain or drive a motorhouse halfway up, only to take a long pole that they hang a flag off, just so they can deliberately block the view of the riders.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Did you see Dumoulin's post-race interview? He mentioned that he had a mis-shift just at the moment Thomas started his sprint so couldn't go with him. He looked livid!


Yes, I did. He probably couldn't believe his luck when Froome let a space open up on G's wheel... and then couldn't believe his luck when his gears failed him. Has he dared either admit his mistake or blame his sponsor's equipment à la Cav?


----------



## Crankarm (20 Jul 2018)

You lot need to get off Cyclechat and do some work.


----------



## Crankarm (20 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> 2004 was a TT up it, but that now has no winner. http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2004/tour04/?id=results/stage16



So I was right. GT is the first rider to win the stage in yellow on the Alp d'Huez. You must be an LA hater as you are happy to use his cheating ways against him, fair enough, but anything else you'll use to suit your POV.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Crankarm said:


> You lot need to get off Cyclechat and do some work.


It's lunchtime and the rollout and my employer is luvverly anyway.


----------



## roadrash (20 Jul 2018)

boardman and imlach pointed out that Nibalis crash was just going into the barrier section , and even though there was a police presence , many spectators were on the wrong side of the barriers and quite a way into the road ,while the police did nowt about it.

they also said prudhome accompanied Nibali to hospital and that Nibali had asked for the timings to be altered as they were when porte hit the back of the motorbike and froome was running without a bike, his request was refused.


----------



## Beebo (20 Jul 2018)

Phaeton said:


> I find it strange that people who are supposed to be fans, well logically they ought to be to either ride halfway up a mountain or drive a motorhouse halfway up, only to take a long pole that they hang a flag off, just so they can deliberately block the view of the riders.


And let off smoke flares FFS. 
Would you want to ride up a mountain through a smoke flare? No wonder they all have asthma.


----------



## Crankarm (20 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> And let off smoke flares FFS.
> Would you want to ride up a mountain through a smoke flare? No wonder they all have asthma.



Fortunately there is clear footage of the thug who tried to push Froome off. Hopefully the race organisers and police will id and catch him if they are serious about ensuring the safety of all riders. What happened to Nibali was shameful. "Fans" letting off smoke flares was disgusting. Police should have stopped and arrested them.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

Lighten up, it's all part of the spectacle


----------



## Phaeton (20 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Lighten up, it's all part of the spectacle


So you think it's acceptable to block the road, hit the riders, block their vision etc?


----------



## Tin Pot (20 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Yeah, I only occasionally pop in to riders’ twitter feeds, but in amongst the needle and angry face emojis there were quite a few Bardet haterz. It was total chaos so I doubt he even knew Nibali had gone and, even so, it’s the top of Alpe d’Huez FFS.



Think I’m going to regret asking but why would anyone hate Bardet?

His performance yesterday was great...I’m guessing it’s not his cycling.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

Phaeton said:


> So you think it's acceptable to block the road, hit the riders, block their vision etc?


As I said, it's all part of the spectacle.

It all adds to the myths and legends.


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

I'm loving some of the translations from the LeTour feed


----------



## roadrash (20 Jul 2018)

translated one yesterday when Greipel abandoned..

Greipel has thrown away the sponge....


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

So, on a day that I had down as a banker for a breakaway win and picked three French riders in the punditry, the peloton looks like it's up for the chase - or at least is keeping the break within catchable distance - and it's the first day of this Tour that the break has had no French riders in it.

I give up.


----------



## Shadow (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Letour.fr: _Scully, De Gendt, Schär and Claeys have covered 48.1km in the first hour.
> _
> This after two arduous days in the mountains. It kind of brings it home how bonkers pro cycling is compared to normal people on bikes.



Yebbut,, it was all downhill...well, apart from the tiny cat 3 climb!


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Lighten up, it's all part of the spectacle


We're over halfway through, so it's time to ask the difficult questions, like: why are Sun Life advertising that they're too incompetent to send insurance documents to the correct address?


----------



## smutchin (20 Jul 2018)

And why is that idiot _still_ taking his fussy baby elephant to parties where they don't serve KP nuts?

And why does the Watchfinder bloke _still_ look like he's never ridden a bike before?


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> And why does the Watchfinder bloke _still_ look like he's never ridden a bike before?


To be fair, the same can be said of the reigning Tour champion...


----------



## suzeworld (20 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> We're over halfway through, so it's time to ask the difficult questions, like: why are Sun Life advertising that they're too incompetent to send insurance documents to the correct address?



In-very-deed. 
I have so often thought that. 
Closely followed by wondering why Parky doesn’t do the ads anymore and maybe he’s had his cash sum for his own funeral?


----------



## BrumJim (20 Jul 2018)

More importantly, how is Lawson Craddock still in there?


----------



## Tin Pot (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> And why is that idiot _still_ taking his fussy baby elephant to parties where they don't serve KP nuts?
> 
> And why does the Watchfinder bloke _still_ look like he's never ridden a bike before?



Ugh.

The upside down bike. To fit the front wheel. I can’t stand it anymore!!!!


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> More importantly, how is Lawson Craddock still in there?


Yep. Just saw him on the back of the peloton.


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

So, seeing as how it’s quiet, are we all looking forward to SirBrad’s appearance in the commentary booth tomorrow? I hoping it’ll be like Father Ted’s Priest of the Year speech....


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

"It's June, dad"


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> And why is that idiot _still_ taking his fussy baby elephant to parties where they don't serve KP nuts?
> 
> And why does the Watchfinder bloke _still_ look like he's never ridden a bike before?


He's got cyclist calf muscles


----------



## rich p (20 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Yep. Just saw him on the back of the peloton.


Fighting manfully for the lanterne rouge


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (20 Jul 2018)

While we're doing adverts, why does the front wheel in the GoDaddy ad have a freewheel?


----------



## rich p (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Is Sagan still "loving this coooking revoloootion"? I've been watching Eurosport this year, with the constant risk that I'm missing some good adverts on ITV4.


I switch to _ITV4_ when the ads come on or when Carlton effing Kirby does.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Is Sagan still "loving this coooking revoloootion"? I've been watching Eurosport this year, with the constant risk that I'm missing some good adverts on ITV4.


Not seen that but I did enjoy Kittel telling me to fight for my hair on the day after his elimination. Does he get held down and shaved now?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Is Sagan still "loving this coooking revoloootion"? I've been watching Eurosport this year, with the constant risk that I'm missing some good adverts on ITV4.


I really hope you're all sorted with the costs of your burial....


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> While we're doing adverts, why does the front wheel in the GoDaddy ad have a freewheel?


I'd not noticed that! They must be as good at teh cycling as they are at teh interwebtubes.


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> I really hope you're all sorted with the costs of your burial....


And if you are, they'll send the cheque next door.


----------



## roadrash (20 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I switch to _ITV4_ when the ads come on or when Carlton effing Kirby does.



all itv 4 for me this time I couldn't stand him anymore


----------



## rich p (20 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> all itv 4 for me this time I couldn't stand him anymore


But I quite like Robbie Hatch


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

BMC have the ugliest bikes


----------



## Beebo (20 Jul 2018)

The green jersey competition isn’t really hotting up then.


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> BMC have the ugliest bikes


Hey! I thought I had the ugliest bike!


----------



## Adam4868 (20 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> But I quite like Robbie Hatch


Can't stand the way he prounounces everything in pseudo accent's ! Give me Carlton and Kelly !



Bollo said:


> Hey! I though I had the ugliest bike!


Not the bike with you sorry x


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> "It's June, dad"


"It's farking not. It's July, you daft shoot."

I'm sure I noticed something else strange about the FAQs (frequently advertised quackery) but I've forgotten it already.


----------



## Ajay (20 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> And why does the Watchfinder bloke _still_ look like he's never ridden a bike before?



I assumed he'd just shat himself


----------



## Crackle (20 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Hey! I though I had the ugliest bike!


You do, I meant in the context of the race. No one is riding a Canyon with an undergrown back end are they?


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> You do, I meant in the context of the race. No one is riding a Canyon with an undergrown back end are they?


 







Although in fairness if Kittel had been riding a Dawes Galaxy with a triple he might still be in the Tour.


----------



## Bollo (20 Jul 2018)

I'm just catching up on the highlights of today, such as they were, because I went for a ride during the last 60k. 

Once, just once I'd like a rider NOT to thank his team. "Yeah, it was all me, the lads were sh1t."


----------



## bianchi1 (20 Jul 2018)

At least Froome was looking cheery at the start


----------



## mjr (20 Jul 2018)

bianchi1 said:


> View attachment 420240
> 
> 
> At least Froome was looking cheery at the start


He's not having to stand near a farking flag saying "Maillot Jaune" at the start (as G was seen doing on ITV highlights tonight), so of course he's happy.


----------



## Mr Celine (20 Jul 2018)

Meanwhile en France TV the most annoying and frequent advert features a creepy looking guy who takes pills only available from the pharmacist apparently to keep him looking creepy. And the Alpacin shampoo available here allegedly stops your hair falling out.

Then it's back to the studio with Marion Rousse. 

I'm going home tomorrow and the thought of having to look at Imlach, Boardman et al instead of her is making me


----------



## BalkanExpress (20 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Letour.fr: _Scully, De Gendt, Schär and Claeys have covered 48.1km in the first hour.
> _
> This after two arduous days in the mountains. It kind of brings it home how bonkers pro cycling is compared to normal people on bikes.



French Eurosport we’re having a discussion pre-stage about whether today was going to be the fastest road stage ever, as in effect it was all (well almost all) downhill.

And yes I should have checked if it was before posting, but facts, who needs’em?


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (20 Jul 2018)

He's moved from mobile doping to mobile dipping


----------



## Beebo (20 Jul 2018)

Mr Celine said:


> And the Alpacin shampoo available here allegedly stops your hair falling out.


They can’t say that in the U.K. as there is no proof. 
wonder why they can in France? The research must be the same.


----------



## gavroche (21 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> They can’t say that in the U.K. as there is no proof.
> wonder why they can in France? The research must be the same.


Maybe it is because most French people don't give a s**t about being politically correct?


----------



## Andy_R (21 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> Maybe it is because most French people don't give a s**t about being politically correct?


'tis nothing at all about "political correctness". It's about lying.


----------



## gavroche (21 Jul 2018)

Andy_R said:


> 'tis nothing at all about "political correctness". It's about lying.


Don't politicians lie permanently?


----------



## Beebo (21 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> Don't politicians lie permanently?


You don’t know what political correctness means. It has nothing to do with lying.


----------



## Crackle (21 Jul 2018)

Folks, can we leave this out of the Tour thread please?


----------



## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

The crosswind is already ripping the race up. Textbook echelons.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (21 Jul 2018)

The background to the intellectual abstraction of cavemen was interesting


----------



## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> The background to the intellectual abstraction of cavemen was interesting


Wasn't it.

SirBrad on now. All bestest behaviour so far.


----------



## Crackle (21 Jul 2018)

Fantastic Suhdave impression from Wiggins then


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (21 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Fantastic Suhdave impression from Wiggins then


Yes, great mimicry.


----------



## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

Very straight bat from Wiggins so far. Maybe should have got Cath on.


----------



## Supersuperleeds (21 Jul 2018)

So who in the Peleton is having an affair?

Impressed with BW so far


----------



## Crackle (21 Jul 2018)

He sounded practised for the Froome questions but a lot more uncertain over chewygate. Interesting to listen too though.


----------



## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> He sounded practised for the Froome questions but a lot more uncertain over chewygate. Interesting to listen too though.


Bugger. I’ve had to go out so missed the dirt. The Grauniad minute by minute hinted that he’d gone off piste.


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## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Gap to peloton 20 mins. Wife just said (rather vehemently) "I hope they all get timed out"


They should at least do the stage winners presentation before the peloton get in.


----------



## Crackle (21 Jul 2018)

Fraile got that spot on then. Alaphilipe too cool for his own good


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## Beebo (21 Jul 2018)

Poor Dan Martin
Puncture at a terrible point.


----------



## Beebo (21 Jul 2018)

Froome not looking great. 
Is he sandbagging?


----------



## Beebo (21 Jul 2018)

The big three finished together. Dumoulin is looking dangerous as the Sky riders tried but failed to break him.


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## Bollo (21 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Fraile got that spot on then. Alaphilipe too cool for his own good


It must be so difficult to know when to launch on a climb like that. Fraile picked his moment well.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (22 Jul 2018)

One of the non-contentious things that Wiggins mentioned was that GT weighed 90kg+ back in his track days. I don't know how much he weighs now but he is pretty skinny this year. I find it astonishing how much weight he's managed to lose without doing much harm to his sprinting ability. He seems to have found a very happy combination - better climbing and enough power to finish.


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## Beebo (22 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> One of the non-contentious things that Wiggins mentioned was that GT weighed 90kg+ back in his track days. I don't know how much he weighs now but he is pretty skinny this year. I find it astonishing how much weight he's managed to lose without doing much harm to his sprinting ability. He seems to have found a very happy combination - better climbing and enough power to finish.


He is about 70kg now. So has shed a fair bit. 
I doubt he was ever above 90kg. That is a big lump. Chris Hoy was 92kg and he is clearly a bigger built man with a focus on pure power.


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## bladesman73 (22 Jul 2018)

Carlton Kirby is annoying but Rob Hatch takes the "reach for the mute button" award for me. Anyone who has heard him speak off air knows he has a strong lancs accent..so why lose it on air? Also stop trying to pronounce french words as if you are french mate. Boils my piss.


----------



## smutchin (22 Jul 2018)

@rich p I might have been a bit early with my Arthur Vichot prediction but at last, he’s finally showing his face, as I knew he would sooner or later - in fact, he’s been quite conspicuous in today’s break. Interestingly, Inrng mentioned him as an outsider for today and he’s _never_ wrong...

ETA: although he’s suddenly a lot less conspicuous after the Pic de Nore climb.

ETA2: and then it turns out the most conspicuous thing he does on the whole stage is fall off his bike on the final bend. 

Disappointing.


----------



## rich p (22 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> @rich p I might have been a bit early with my Arthur Vichot prediction but at last, he’s finally showing his face, as I knew he would sooner or later - in fact, he’s been quite conspicuous in today’s break. Interestingly, Inrng mentioned him as an outsider for today and he’s _never_ wrong...
> 
> ETA: although he’s suddenly a lot less conspicuous after the Pic de Nore climb.
> 
> ...


Hope his cheekbones are okay...


----------



## Viking (22 Jul 2018)

Moscon is out. Incident involving another rider afaik 

I guess he’ll be looking for a new team before too long - a bit of a liability


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## Crackle (22 Jul 2018)

Pauwels is out with a fractured elbow from his fall near the finish


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## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

Gianni Moscon could be fired from Team Sky now. This from the squad's May 2017 statement after the Romandie incident with Kevin Réza


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## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

imo, he should be fired on the spot by sky, feck off, shut the door on your way out


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## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

From twitter

Team Sky Team Principal, Sir Dave Brailsford, said: “We support and accept the decision by the race organisers to exclude Gianni Moscon from the Tour de France.

"Gianni is desperately disappointed in his behaviour and knows that he has let himself, the Team and the race down.

"We will address this incident with Gianni once the Tour is complete and decide then if any further action should be taken.

"I would like to offer my sincere apologies to both Elie Gesbert and Team Fortuneo Samsic for this unacceptable incident."
_Team Sky will be making no further comment at this time_


----------



## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

*Team Sky*‏Verified account @*TeamSky* 17m17 minutes ago
A message from @*GianniMoscon*:





10.5K views
0:51 / 0:51
0 replies . 3 retweets 21 likes


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## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

video on skys twitter but I cant copy it , don't know why


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## roadrash (22 Jul 2018)

View: https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/1021132958646919169


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## Bollo (22 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> imo, he should be fired on the spot by sky, feck off, shut the door on your way out


Wasn’t he on a final warning? There might be a few delays while the lawyers check the contracts, but I’d hope he’s out.


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## Crackle (22 Jul 2018)

So he punched a French rider on a French team. Gosh, that's going to ease tensions on the roadside.


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## Bollo (22 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> So he punched a French rider on a French team. Gosh, that's going to ease tensions on the roadside.


This could well jeopardise Brexit negotiations.


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## Beebo (22 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> View: https://twitter.com/TeamSky/status/1021132958646919169




The comment below the line about “Riod Rage” made me laugh.


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## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Poels has gone





rich p said:


> Poels has been unexpectedly poor this year. Too much after the Giro?





Crackle said:


> Looks like it. Sky's team selection is beginning to look dodgy here.



Listened to an interview with Portal this morning, he says they're saving Poels for the Pyrenees. I imagine they were also hoping to make use of Moscon in the Pyrenees though. They'll definitely miss him - for racing reasons, if not for his jolly bantz.

They're also expecting Bernal to drop off in the third week, though I reckon they've already got a lot more out of him than they imagined they would. He's been phenomenal so far. A number of pundits have expressed concern that Sky are over-working such a young rider and risking burning him out, but this is Sky we're talking about - I'm sure they'll be keeping a careful eye on him. If he didn't look like a future GT champion before, he definitely does now... The new Damiano Cunego?


----------



## Pale Rider (23 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Striking another rider.
> 
> 
> View: https://twitter.com/toutlesport/status/1021097869292470272




My grandma could punch harder than that.

If you are going to whack the other bloke, do it properly and put him on his backside.


----------



## brommers (23 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Listened to an interview with Portal this morning, he says they're saving Poels for the Pyrenees. I imagine they were also hoping to make use of Moscon in the Pyrenees though. They'll definitely miss him - for racing reasons, if not for his jolly bantz.
> 
> They're also expecting Bernal to drop off in the third week, though I reckon they've already got a lot more out of him than they imagined they would. He's been phenomenal so far. A number of pundits have expressed concern that Sky are over-working such a young rider and risking burning him out, but this is Sky we're talking about - I'm sure they'll be keeping a careful eye on him. If he didn't look like a future GT champion before, he definitely does now... The new Damiano Cunego?


Luke Rowe has been amazing, especially after coming back from a career-threatening injury.


----------



## mjr (23 Jul 2018)

Pale Rider said:


> My grandma could punch harder than that.
> 
> If you are going to whack the other bloke, do it properly and put him on his backside.


It was in the first km of racing. He hadn't warmed up yet(!)


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Luke Rowe has been amazing, especially after coming back from a career-threatening injury.



Yep. He's been superb.


----------



## Beebo (23 Jul 2018)

Rest day today!
Let’s have your final week’s crystal ball predictions. 
It seems to be a 3 way fight. 
Will Thomas keep Froome at bay?
Will Dumoulin ambush them both?
I think Thomas will hold on to Paris now. Albeit with a reduced margin.


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## Paulus (23 Jul 2018)

I do hope that Thomas keeps the jersey all the way. But, I do think that Dumoulin is the one to watch. if Froome is allowed to attack Thomas, Dumoulin could be allowed to sneak through and make up time on them both while The SKY riders worry about each other.
There is also the possibility of Dan Martin doing a deal with another team to make a concerted effort.


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Let’s have your final week’s crystal ball predictions.
> It seems to be a 3 way fight.



I'm not ruling out Landa or Roglic just yet. Landa in particular has the potential to do something spectacular on stage 17.

Bardet is still within touching distance too but even if he gains time on stage 17, he'll lose it again in the TT.


----------



## Crackle (23 Jul 2018)

Roglic is also looking dangerous, if he goes well in the Pyrenees, he can also TT, unlike Bardet for instance.


----------



## roadrash (23 Jul 2018)

I certainly wouldn't dismiss roglic or landa , The way dumpmoulin is climbing I cant see froome putting time into him and if he tries he risks helping dumpmoulin catch Thomas, it going to be interesting


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## Beebo (23 Jul 2018)

Paulus said:


> There is also the possibility of Dan Martin doing a deal with another team to make a concerted effort.


Hi is 7 minutes behind, it would be a miracle if he won, but could have a massive role to play in ultimately deciding the title if he does launch a crazy lone wolf breakaway.


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## Crackle (23 Jul 2018)

I'm still thinking Froome will do a Finisterre and completely split the GC order apart.


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## roadrash (23 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Hi is 7 minutes behind, it would be a miracle if he won, but could have a massive role to play in ultimately deciding the title if he does launch a crazy lone wolf breakaway.



I would love to see Dan Martin claw back some time , one of my favourite riders.


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## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Paulus said:


> There is also the possibility of Dan Martin doing a deal with another team to make a concerted effort.



Did you see Dan Martin and Bardet chatting away together for ages towards the end of yesterday's stage? One for the conspiracy theorists!


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## roadrash (23 Jul 2018)

in the interview after the stage , dan martin was asked about alliances, he said its something to think about


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## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Froome will do a Finisterre



He'll bore his rivals into submission by reading the shipping forecast at them?


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> (btw @smutchin Finisterre got renamed to Fitzroy ages ago)



Yes, I know that, but I'm not one to let the facts get in the way of any opportunity to make a cheap gag.


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## Crackle (23 Jul 2018)

I knew I should have just quickly looked that up......


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## Bollo (23 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> in the interview after the stage , dan martin was asked about alliances, he said its something to think about


I saw the same question asked of Dumoulin about alliances in general. He pretty much dismissed it, although that's not the same as not doing it.


Dogtrousers said:


> I'm looking forward to stage 17, to see if it's a masterstroke of race planning or a daft gimmick that will be nullified by the competitors.
> 
> I remember some race or other recently (I must pay more attention) that had a whacky arrangement of closely spaced intermediate sprints, possibly with a name like "PowerZone" or something. "Let's see what exciting racing this produces" said the commentators. Everyone completely ignored it.
> 
> (btw @smutchin Finisterre got renamed to Fitzroy ages ago)


I remain a little baffled by the point of the starting grid, but can see the fun in an ultra-short hilly stage. I was poking around the tour website and they've made this <informative> yet impossible to embed video clip. Apologies if its already been posted.

http://dai.ly/x6nks2m

I like the horse-racing style paddock before the start. With Sky as popular as they are, it could be like the coliseum in Gladiator. Maybe they missed a trick by not having a tiger hidden under a trapdoor.


----------



## Beebo (23 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Yes, I know that, but I'm not one to let the facts get in the way of any opportunity to make a cheap gag.


It’s a shame that Greipel didn’t show enough German bight.


----------



## rich p (23 Jul 2018)

Moscon is a Dogger to add insult to injury...
...allegedly


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> I remain a little baffled by the point of the starting grid, but can see the fun in an ultra-short hilly stage. I was poking around the tour website and they've made this <informative> yet impossible to embed video clip. Apologies if its already been posted.
> 
> http://dai.ly/x6nks2m



Thanks - I've definitely not seen that before.

One of the interesting things is that the graphic shows the polka dot jersey at the head of the second row, but I presume that's just artistic licence because the voiceover says that it will be the top 20 on GC who occupy the front end of the grid. This means Alaphilippe (41st overall) will be starting in the third wave - behind Barguil who is 23rd overall, so will be starting in the second wave. If Alaphilippe has any sense, he'll try to gain a few places on GC in the next stage. But also Barguil might try to get himself inside the top 20...

Majka in 21st and Bernal in 23rd are two more riders who might be trying to gain a few GC places in the next stage. Kwiatkowski and Poels are out of the reckoning down in 67th and 69th, so will be starting in the fourth wave - I imagine they'll find it very hard to fight their way to the front once it all kicks off.

Movistar have all three of their leaders in the top 20. That could prove very valuable, as long as they work together as a unit. You'd expect Valverde to go off like a rocket and burn himself out on the Peyresourde to set up Landa and/or Quintana. Likewise Latour (14th) for Bardet.

It's going to be fascinating to watch. And probably utter carnage.


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

OK, who wants to predict the winner's time on stage 17? And therefore what will the cut-off be?

I'm going for 2hrs 4mins (slightly ahead of the fastest schedule), so assuming the cutoff is 25% as advertised, that will be 2hrs 35mins.


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## Crackle (23 Jul 2018)

From that video, they all start together? I thought it was staggered, so all that will happen is that everyone will wait for teams to re-form and then begin the chase of anyone foolish enough to have set off by themselves. In other words, it looks like a load of old bollocks.....however, I'll wait and see.


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> all that will happen is that everyone will wait for teams to re-form and then begin the chase



I'm not sure... Will the Movistar trio have anything to gain by waiting for Amador to catch up? And who would Bardet and Dan Martin wait for?

Gesink in 40th is in the second wave so could be useful to Roglic and Kruijswijk. Tolhoek is 61st on GC (fourth wave) so will have a fight on his hands to get to the front - he's another who might try to climb a couple of places tomorrow.

I wonder if we'll also see teams using blocking tactics to stop lower placed Sky riders moving up the peloton.


----------



## Dave Davenport (23 Jul 2018)

My (probably totally wrong) prediction; Froome attacks, TD chases, G get's on TD's wheel who either closes down Froome (with G still sat on) or Froome gets away and takes yellow. Tour winning position for Sky either way, (I've got another prediction in which G blows and TD makes a tour winning attack which is just as likely to be codswallop).


----------



## 400bhp (23 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Did you see Dan Martin and Bardet chatting away together for ages towards the end of yesterday's stage? One for the conspiracy theorists!



I did and in my view this is what the fringe GT riders in "weak" teams need to do-form alliances Vs Sky. 

They are both bobbins in the TT though so they might just have been whinging to each other about that. Martin rides so un-aero on his road bike.


----------



## Beebo (23 Jul 2018)

The TT is going to be crucial.
All 3 main contenders are very good Sky should be worried as they could get leapfrogged.


----------



## smutchin (23 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I wonder if we'll also see teams using blocking tactics to stop lower placed Sky riders moving up the peloton.



The more I think about this, the more I think it could be a viable tactic. Sky have Bernal in 22nd place, but their next best placed rider is Kwiatkowski in 67th. Sunweb have Geschke, SK Andersen, Ten Dam and Arndt ahead of him in GC. They could easily form a rolling road block, right? Or at least use disrupting tactics.

Or, as Crackle says, it could all be bollocks and despite the grid formation start, the Sky train manages to get together and hit the front en masse within the first few km...


----------



## brommers (23 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I'm looking forward to stage 17, to see if it's a masterstroke of race planning or a daft gimmick that will be nullified by the competitors.
> 
> I remember some race or other recently (I must pay more attention) that had a whacky arrangement of closely spaced intermediate sprints, possibly with a name like "PowerZone" or something. "Let's see what exciting racing this produces" said the commentators. Everyone completely ignored it.
> 
> (btw @smutchin Finisterre got renamed to Fitzroy ages ago)


Golden Kilometre. Was that the Binckbank tour? Not sure, but I do remember it though.


----------



## brommers (23 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> The TT is going to be crucial.
> All 3 main contenders are very good Sky should be worried as they could get leapfrogged.


And Roglic in 4th.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (23 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> And Roglic in 4th.


Or Forth, if we go back to shipping forecasts....


----------



## Crackle (23 Jul 2018)

We'll soon see if Froome has any Bight.


Rest days eh...


----------



## Adam4868 (23 Jul 2018)

Mmm...now which grand tour recently did I hear Froome being out of contention,a spent force.... ?
Nah don't right him off yet,saying that I'd love Thomas to take it this year.
Just back off hols and looking forward to final week of this tour.


----------



## Shadow (23 Jul 2018)

Somewhere upthread was mention of a reflection.

Discovering what was happening was difficult at first as I was not here. I was in rural Brittany east of Lorient, which just happened to be the start of Stage 5. So, being a live Tour virgin, decided to visit the tiny hilltop village of Saint-Goazec - 1 church, 1 little shop and the 1 requisite tabac/bar; all 3 open. Exiting the village downhill with a sharp left and then immediately up was the first categorised climb of the day. 

Parked outside the church, purchased excellent chicken & avocado baguette from the store and a beer or two from the bar. Perched at the fountain, made friends with 2 year old Léa and her _grand-mère. _ Chatted to a few locals. Heard a few Brit accents. Gendarmes came thru, a few Skodas drove by. _Le temps perdu. _And then the Caravan arrived. Half the village suddenly appeared. Noise enveloped the village. Léa was content - we gave her our tidbit of _saucisson_, tidbit of _gateau _and fruit drink.

Walked down the approach hill to the village to find a suitable spot to spectate. Locals had set up a BBQ outside a school/village hall. Red, white and blue bunting was hung from fences, _le tricolore_ was waving in the warm breeze. Chatted to a few more locals. Heard a few more Brit accents, many accompanied with cleats. Chairs were set up in gardens and claiming roadside positions.

Expectation was building. Distinctive sound of helicopters approaching. And now the entire village must have come to the roadside or hanging out of windows. The break sped up the hill and disappeared. Chavanel and Calmejane were at the back and looked motivated. The next 2-3 minutes seemed to go by as quickly as Gaviria winding up for a finish. Filling the width of the road, the peloton rode by, led by BMC with Craddock heroically hanging off the rear.

Saying _au revoir_ to temporary friends and driving the route out of the village up the cat 4 climb, pondering who might win in Quimper, the army of workers deconstructing the roadside furniture and signage, the immense organisation involved. 

The atmosphere was wonderful, everyone full of _joie de vivre_. A glorious way to while away a few hours and highly recommended to anyone - bike aficionados or otherwise.










p.s. @Dogtrousers - if you were at Fougères, our paths must have passed close by.


----------



## Shadow (23 Jul 2018)

And everything you see below was garnered from the Caravan 
(apart from the shades)


----------



## Shadow (23 Jul 2018)

As for the next week, it is Sky's to lose. Any team, including Sky, would love to have the dilemma of being 1 and 2 going into the last week.
I never thought Thomas was a Grand Tour contender; he is proving me wrong this year. 
Fortunately for us , Dumoulin is keeping things interesting. Maybe Roglic can make the podium. 
Shame Nibali is gone; Quintana and Movistar have disappointed; Bardet needs team help and anyone else is too far behind. Like others, would love to see MartinD make a move that worked.


----------



## Bollo (23 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> And everything you see below was garnered from the Caravan
> (apart from the shades)
> 
> View attachment 420791


Jezuuz! And I have trouble getting back into the country.


----------



## Va Va Froome (23 Jul 2018)

I can't believe Thomas is leading the Tour after Rest Day 2. 
I'm so nervous for these upcoming stages.

Want him to take it home!


----------



## rich p (24 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> I can't believe Thomas is leading the Tour after Rest Day 2.
> I'm so nervous for these upcoming stages.
> 
> Want him to take it home!


Three leeks on the shirt
Henri Desgrange still screaming
G is looking pert
Froome is clearly steaming....


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Today's got to be a breakaway, shirley. 

Late attack for the last descent by a GC rider or save it for tomorrow's complete unknown, probably the latter I reckon?


----------



## rich p (24 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Today's got to be a breakaway, shirley.
> 
> Late attack for the last descent by a GC rider or save it for tomorrow's complete unknown, probably the latter I reckon?


I'm hoping the break will succeed.
Movistar is the only team with the pedal power to break it up early on but too many chiefs and not enough Indians.
Or a remote chance of an alliance alluded to in posts passim


----------



## sleaver (24 Jul 2018)

I know the short stage is still a couple of days away but I have just watched the video about the grid start on the Tour's website.

Is there going to be any time gaps between each group of 20 starting? If not, then surely the top teams domestiques will only have about 30-60 seconds to make up on the front 20. Although, as it is straight up from the start, maybe even that time will be hard to make up.


----------



## Dave Davenport (24 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Today's got to be a breakaway, shirley.


More than likely, who's Shirley?


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Dave Davenport said:


> More than likely, who's Shirley?


It's Rich's wknd name.


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Farmers push straw bales across the road in a protest. I didn't think anyone would take my suggestion of how to improve the Tour seriously.


----------



## roadrash (24 Jul 2018)

oooh a protest on the road, race stopped completely, looks like some riders have something sprayed in their face


----------



## roadrash (24 Jul 2018)

that's not a demonstration , that's assault


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Pepper spray is suspected. That is terrible.


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Blowback from the police using it on the farmers, it seems


----------



## roadrash (24 Jul 2018)

pepper spray used on the protesters by police, blown back into the riders faces just shown a replay on itv4


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

I imagine the French police are on edge for potential terrorism, so they went in hard. 

A tractor driven through a tightly packed peloton would be terrible.


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Release the Badger!


----------



## Milkfloat (24 Jul 2018)

How very French all that was.


----------



## Adam4868 (24 Jul 2018)

Good day to say you must of inhaled some "non performance enhancing substance "?


----------



## User6179 (24 Jul 2018)

BBC News

Tear Gas thrown at riders


----------



## User169 (24 Jul 2018)

Sagan really wants the yellow jersey


----------



## Pale Rider (24 Jul 2018)

I'm guessing the farmers will be protesting about the Common Agricultural Policy.

What next - Frexit?


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

I've only had half an ear on today's stage so far but it sounds absolutely mental. Relentless attacks but no break has stuck yet and they're nearly 100km into the race. Looks like it's _Everyone_ vs Team Sky.


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

Pale Rider said:


> I'm guessing the farmers will be protesting about the Common Agricultural Policy.



They're French farmers, they don't need an excuse. They're just as likely to be protesting because it's Tuesday.


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

The breakaway still hasn’t got away. The guys at the back of the peloton much be shattered.


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

And they've finally snapped the elastic - a 44-strong bunch containing pretty much every name you might expect. 

Except Thomas De Gendt.


----------



## Crankarm (24 Jul 2018)

Team Sky have tried to turn this into a boring race protecting their small GC advantage. I hope the large breakaway puts them under so much pressure it breaks them.


----------



## jarlrmai (24 Jul 2018)

who is closest on virtual yellow jersey?


----------



## jarlrmai (24 Jul 2018)

LaTour?


----------



## jarlrmai (24 Jul 2018)

haha GVA as well...


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Gilbert has taken a bad fall.


----------



## roadrash (24 Jul 2018)

Gilbert was incredibly lucky there going over that wall


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Gilbert has taken a bad fall.



Nearly did a Wim Van Est! Luckily it only _looked_ spectacular, he's back on the bike.


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Holy poodles, straight over a frikkin wall!


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Back on his bike now!


----------



## jarlrmai (24 Jul 2018)

There are descents with corners like that where over the wall is a big big sheer drop.


----------



## Milkfloat (24 Jul 2018)

That could have ended up so much worse.


----------



## Crankarm (24 Jul 2018)

Milkfloat said:


> That could have ended up so much worse.



Yeah like Fabio Casartelli in 1995.


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## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

Same descent, they just went past his memorial


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

Arnaud Demare is struggling on his own today. Currently just going over the top of the Col du Menté, 30 minutes behind the leaders. Cutoff is likely to be around 45-50 minutes.

The Sagan/autobus group is currently around 19 minutes behind the leaders, having completed the descent.


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Yates looking good.


----------



## smutchin (24 Jul 2018)

Alaphilippe looking even better!

ETA: just had to pop out of the room for a minute so I missed the Yates crash. That's very unfortunate. Was slightly surprised Alaphilippe had managed to catch him.


----------



## Bollo (24 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Yates looking good.


----------



## Bollo (24 Jul 2018)

I've been balls-deep in code all day so haven't been able to join in the bants. What a stage though and I think it's got some beef in it yet. I feel sorry for Yates, but Alaphilippe's descending is nuts. I can imagine the pressure of being hunted down contributed to Yates' crash.


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

My bloody phone rang and I came back to see this.


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

He lost grip on his front wheel


----------



## Supersuperleeds (24 Jul 2018)

The letour website is a pile of shoot. As soon as the winner has crossed the line it stops telling you where everyone else is, going to have to try the BBC which is always about three days behind!


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Supersuperleeds said:


> The letour website is a pile of shoot. As soon as the winner has crossed the line it stops telling you where everyone else is, going to have to try the BBC which is always about three days behind!


The GC guys all finished in a group. No fireworks.


----------



## User169 (24 Jul 2018)

Oh no, no, no, no, no! Oh Phil!!

https://streamable.com/porrd


----------



## brommers (24 Jul 2018)

Is it me? or am imagining things, but surely the most recent editions of the Vuelta and Giro have been tougher than this TdF for the GC men?


----------



## Bollo (24 Jul 2018)

DP said:


> Oh no, no, no, no, no! Oh Phil!!
> 
> https://streamable.com/porrd


Carlton Kirby or Alan Partridge?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (24 Jul 2018)

I had grandchildren distracting me when Gilbert lost it - did Alaphilippe pull out of a racing descent after that?


----------



## Beebo (24 Jul 2018)

Gilbert has withdrawn from the race according to BBC. 
Such a shame.


----------



## roadrash (24 Jul 2018)

*Le Tour de France*‏Verified account @*LeTour* 28m28 minutes ago
Unfortunately, @*PhilippeGilbert* won't start tomorrow. Thanks for ride, congratulations for your courage, Philippe!





Malheureusement, Philippe Gilbert ne prendra pas le départ demain. Merci pour tout et bon rétablissement, Philippe !




#*TDF2018*


----------



## Adam4868 (24 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Is it me? or am imagining things, but surely the most recent editions of the Vuelta and Giro have been tougher than this TdF for the GC men?


Agreed,Giro this year was a great race.Full on start to finish with no room to hide.The tour is more nervy/edgy but most of it is controlled.I guess its still the ultimate prize though....


----------



## rich p (24 Jul 2018)

Alan Philipp's descending was textbook stuff. He turned a potential dodgy descent into a masterclass. I think he'd have had Yates anyway but a great shame we didn't get to find out.


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Alan Philipp's descending was textbook stuff. He turned a potential dodgy descent into a masterclass. I think he'd have had Yates anyway but a great shame we didn't get to find out.


He's a fabulous rider, I can't help thinking he could be aiming higher.


----------



## rich p (24 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> He's a fabulous rider, I can't help thinking he could be aiming higher.


I'm not sure he's a GT potential winner so stage wins, classics and maybe short stage races is his forté?
A bit like Geraint Thom...oh, hang on!


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (24 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> He's a fabulous rider, I can't help thinking he could be aiming higher.


He can't count on the same quality of support that Sky riders have. Plus, there's enormous pressure on French riders to win stages (even if he won in Spain...).


----------



## Adam4868 (24 Jul 2018)

He's won two classy stages so far and the polka dot.He looks to enjoy himself which is nice !

View: https://twitter.com/richardmoore73/status/1017405476424724487?s=19


----------



## Shadow (24 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> even if he won in Spain...


Today's stage went into Spain but back out again for the finish; Bagneres-du-Luchon is deffo in France.
(At least it was last time I looked!!)


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (24 Jul 2018)

Shadow said:


> Today's stage went into Spain but back out again for the finish; Bagneres-du-Luchon is deffo in France.
> (At least it was last time I looked!!)


I stand, well sit, corrected!


----------



## Crackle (24 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm not sure he's a GT potential winner so stage wins, classics and maybe short stage races is his forté?
> A bit like Geraint Thom...oh, hang on!


I'm suspicious that all talented French riders are hiding behind the 'Panache' excuse. I find it hard to believe that a nation who gave us Hinault and Fignon are not capable of producing a rider who can win the Tour and think the difference is only the mindset.


----------



## Bollo (24 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Is it me? or am imagining things, but surely the most recent editions of the Vuelta and Giro have been tougher than this TdF for the GC men?


This tour route *could* have made great racing even without tomorrow's gimmick. I think the problem is that Sky are the cycling equivalent of tiki-taka. Like peak Spain, once they've scored and established control they just shut the game down.

The Giro was interesting because Sky weren't in control for much of the race; it took some monumental/well-planned/deeply-suspicious cycling to turn it around. Movistar have been disappointing, Sunweb don't have the depth to support Dumoulin, Porte and Nibali are out and Quickstep have entertained without challenging the GC. Midfield triangles for Team Evil.

You never know, it could all go to rat droppings for Sky tomorrow. I was chatting with my ride crony yesterday and we were speculating what would happen if, thanks to either tomorrow and/or the TT, there was maybe only a second or two between Dumoulin and either Froome or Thomas. Would they race the last day? Not one for the traditionalists, but it'd be epic.


----------



## Adam4868 (24 Jul 2018)

Wouldn't be very likely as any attack on the Yellow jersey would be swallowed up.


----------



## rich p (24 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I'm suspicious that all talented French riders are hiding behind the 'Panache' excuse. I find it hard to believe that a nation who gave us Hinault and Fignon are not capable of producing a rider who can win the Tour and think the difference is only the mindset.


Maybe, but Bardet and Pinot have had a go and come up short. I'm not sure if Alaphilippe or Barguil are any more likely, even if they were mentally up to it. But you may be right. JA is only 25 so he has 8 years to become the French Geraint Thomas.


----------



## Bollo (24 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Wouldn't be very likely as any attack on the Yellow jersey would be swallowed up.


It was just speculation and typical ride-talk, but a couple of seconds could easily be lost due to a split in the peloton over the line in Paris. I have a feeling in my water.......(goes and checks unpleasant burning sensation)


----------



## biking_fox (25 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> You never know, it could all go to rat droppings for Sky tomorrow. I was chatting with my ride crony yesterday and we were speculating what would happen if, thanks to either tomorrow and/or the TT, there was maybe only a second or two between Dumoulin and either Froome or Thomas. Would they race the last day? Not one for the traditionalists, but it'd be epic.



I think like that they may not race. But perhaps if Tom was dropped, and it was a second or two between froome and Thomas, then there might be grounds for a 'friendly' race. but it's basically a flat sprint so I'm not sure it would actually change anything.


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

This is the day they stop pretending and Froome goes for it from the penultimate descent or the top of the penultimate climb. Bluff over


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> This is the day they stop pretending and Froome goes for it from the penultimate descent or the top of the penultimate climb. Bluff over


I agree that he has to go for it today. Lets see if Froome has the legs to make a decent attack, after the Giro.

The thing about the Giro was that Sky had nothing to lose, either win or bust. At TdF Sky have a yellow jersey to protect..


----------



## BrumJim (25 Jul 2018)

Or the day that Froome gets a minute and a half over GT, which leaves them to duel it out on the TT. 
Only question is how Dumoulin fits into this. If he tries to follow Froome, knowing he can win some back on the TT, then he will be dragging GT with him.


----------



## Phaeton (25 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> Only question is how Dumoulin fits into this.


I think there are 2 questions, agree with yours & add, what does GT's contract say


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

There's also another question: Roglic? Will be interesting to see what he has up his sleeve for today. I didn't pick him in the punditry so he'll probably win the stage.


----------



## Adam4868 (25 Jul 2018)

Froomes day I think,at least to try.Theres no way that he would settle for even second place without going for it.
If it all rests on the TT there's not much between them


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Just catching up on the news front and read that Gilbert finished the stage with a broken patella. How the flippety flip did he do that. mad.


----------



## ColinJ (25 Jul 2018)

This is one stage that I will watch live - anything could happen!

For what it's worth, I think that Froome will try to launch a savage long distance attack like the one he did in the Giro, and Thomas will glue himself to Dumoulin's rear wheel until the last few kms of the final climb. He will then try and escape everyone else and set off in pursuit of Froome. If he can't break free, he will ride up with the others. (Oh, and Thomas will be praying that Froome gains about 45 seconds on him to leave Froome in second place comfortably clear of Dumoulin, that is in second place comfortably _behind _Thomas! )


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Just catching up on the news front and read that Gilbert finished the stage with a broken patella. How the flippety flip did he do that. mad.




View: https://twitter.com/PhilippeGilbert/status/1022061942104567808


----------



## uncle_adolph (25 Jul 2018)

I can't see Froome doing a long distance attack. Personally, I think the first climb will be pretty neutral; pretty nervy with Sky waiting for the remnants of their team to arrive and the other GC guys being wary of doing something from so far out.

I reckon it will kick off over the last part of the second descent with riders trying to position themselves for the last climb. Someone (non-Sky) has to try and kick on from there and how successful this is will decide the race. It is then a question of whether both Froome and G can stay; if either of them is in trouble the other won't wait. 

G could easily win the Tour today; on the other hand he could just as easily finish the day off the podium.


----------



## ColinJ (25 Jul 2018)

Gilbert - brave, but foolish!


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Sounds quite plausible.


View: https://twitter.com/daniellloyd1/status/1022052839235964928


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> View: https://twitter.com/PhilippeGilbert/status/1022061942104567808



Ouch!
Hope he hasnt done any long term damage. 


ColinJ said:


> Gilbert - brave, but foolish!


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

I like his World Champs Tattoo.
Classy if you have earned it. Naff if you are a wannabe.


----------



## Adam4868 (25 Jul 2018)

View: https://twitter.com/s_kruijswijk/status/1022076418736439296?s=19


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

arrgghh….. every channel on virgin working fine apart from itv4 , keeps freezing, ah well off upstairs to watch other telly , I cant put up with Kirby on eurosport


----------



## Aravis (25 Jul 2018)

106 miles and back in time for the stage.


----------



## Shadow (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Sounds quite plausible.
> 
> 
> View: https://twitter.com/daniellloyd1/status/1022052839235964928




Agreed, quite plausible.
Crazy start line? Crazy short stage?
Anything is possible, including not much change on GC. 

It is such an unknown quantity, I hope it works to a degree after all the speculation - one thing I do know for sure is I wont be disturbed over the next 3 hours!


----------



## Bollo (25 Jul 2018)

David Millar has just described the grid start as a "long lunch decision".


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

And they're off!

Bernal straight to the front of the peloton. 

Most interesting move is Geschke going on the attack.


----------



## FishFright (25 Jul 2018)

Well that was pointless, unsurprisingly


----------



## User6179 (25 Jul 2018)

Well that was pointless!, surprisingly


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

well didn't that start really make a difference , sky all together after 20 seconds,..... utter bolox.


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

FishFright said:


> Well that was pointless, unsurprisingly


What a waste of time. They all looked very bored and then just rolled off.


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

The stage is still going to be interesting though, never mind the barmy start


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Most interesting move is Geschke going on the attack.



...or it would have been if he'd persisted with it for more than a few seconds.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Soler and Valverde in the break. 

Is Kangert going for solo glory or setting something up for Fuglsang?


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Have Sunweb fired someone up the road? If so, we could see Dumoulin try an attack or it could just be a defensive thing if Froome goes long.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Have Sunweb fired someone up the road? If so, we could see Dumoulin try an attack or it could just be a defensive thing if Froome goes long.



Yeah, Geschke is up there. I thought he'd let himself drift back to the peloton after the initial attacks but he's listed in the break on the live tracker.


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

I can just imagine the next meeting at A.S.O, ...right , whos idea was that grid start bolox….. collect your p45 on your way out


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

"C'est la derniere fois je pense hors la boite!"


----------



## Milkfloat (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> I can just imagine the next meeting at A.S.O, ...right , whos idea was that grid start bolox….. collect your p45 on your way out



ASO sacking? Backslapping more likely.


----------



## FishFright (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> I can just imagine the next meeting at A.S.O, ...right , whos idea was that grid start bolox….. collect your p45 on your way out


Close but I expect it would end; Grab your bonus and golden parachute ....


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

I had to google translate


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> "C'est la derniere fois je pense hors la boite!"


I had to google translate


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

Im beginning to think alaphilipe may be a cyborg


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

wheel change for Quintana, he didn't look pleased


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Nice road


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> wheel change for Quintana, he didn't look pleased


His technician nearly got run over when he was giving him a push.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> His technician nearly got run over when he was giving him a push.



By the medical car, no less.


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Latour looks like he's riding an under geared tricycle with square wheels


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Latour looks like he's riding an under geared tricycle with square wheels



"He always looks like that." - D.Millar


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Someone has to make a move soon.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Im beginning to think alaphilipe may be a cyborg


I've been fearing worse for a few days


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Anyone wanna donate to June's funeral?


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> I had to google translate


Il ne faut pas être fier de ça !


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> I've been fearing worse for a few days



Off to the Clinic with you!


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

dan martin and Quintana atack


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

The lotto jumbo pair look like they might have a plan, from how they didn't chase that attack but determinedly took bottles with gels taped on.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

All kicking off now. Time to stop pretending to work and pay full attention to the race...


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> The lotto jumbo pair look like they might have a plan, from how they didn't chase that attack but determinedly took bottles with gels taped on.


Told you! Roglic attacks, Froome follows.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Oooh, citing innit


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Bernal is amazing


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Bardet looks cooked.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Bardet looks a bit cooooooked to me


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

Did Kruijswijk really just ask Bernard why he closed down his attack? If so, nobber.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Bardet looks cooked.


My extra Sean Kelly ooooooo's took longer to write


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Kruijswijk is blocking the whole road with his shoulders


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

I'm not sure why a rider who has ridden harder in the break is an awful lot of help to Quintana


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

That only took three attempts to spell, I'm getting better


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> That only took three attempts to spell, I'm getting better


Kris Wick will do


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm not sure why a rider who has ridden harder in the break is an awful lot of help to Quintana


He wasn't


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm not sure why a rider who has ridden harder in the break is an awful lot of help to Quintana


Do you mean bloody Valvpiti?


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Do you mean bloody Valvpiti?


Yep


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Bardet cooked grilled and roasted


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

bardet popped


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

I guess this is the climb Sky were saving Poels for.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

Kruijswijk attacks, Poels pops, Bernard chasing him down again.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> Bernard


Cribbens?


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

Can Martin catch Quints before the finish? I think catch but not pass.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Cribbens?


Right (said Fred). The question is, who's he going to put in the hole he's digging?


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Tom D is either on the limit or has a lot of confidence in his TTing


----------



## BrumJim (25 Jul 2018)

Or banking on a bad day for GT.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Tom D is either on the limit or has a lot of confidence in his TTing


I think he's marking Froome, expecting him to go for the win like at the giro. I think that's a mistake and Froome has settled for G winning barring any mishaps.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> Or banking on a bad day for GT.


but running out of days


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Roglic goes


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

roglic goes


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Froome tempos back as per usual


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

froome looks to struggling , as dumpmoulin goes


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Froome sandbagging or is he really on the limit?

Dumoulin decides to find out...


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

This is a surprise


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Bernal can't be dehydrated with all that stuff coming out of his schnozzer


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

Froome unable to respond to Bernard's acceleration to chase, but that's not unusual. Seeing him drop is still a long way short of being able to distance him seriously... and with that, TD attacks, G follows, leaving Bernard pacing Froome back towards them.

Now, can they stay away and will G deliver the coup de grace at the finish?


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Hope Dan M has something left


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Oooh, TD drifting


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

TD unable to follow Roglic's attack but G does. That wasn't Tom's plan...


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Oooh, TD drifting



Never concerned about Dumoulin when that happens - he's so good at measuring his effort, you just know he's going to reel it back in.


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

I wouldn't be surprised to see Thomas put a dig in yet


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> I wouldn't be surprised to see Thomas put a dig in yet



Yeah, he's just been following wheels all the way, never once been on the front. If anyone has enough left for a sprint finish, it's him.

ETA: as if on cue...


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

and there he goes


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Well, no more speculation now.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Good stage. Short stage proved explosif but the start was bollocks


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

40 seconds deficit for Froome?


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

What did Thomas gain then, 10 seconds?


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Around 90 seconds for Bardet.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> What did Thomas gain then, 10 seconds?



Over Dumoulin and Roglic? Less than that, I think.

ETA: 5 seconds plus 4 seconds bonus, according to the official results.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> What did Thomas gain then, 10 seconds?


I think 5 on TD, about 50 on Froome.


----------



## rich p (25 Jul 2018)

Plus bonus seconds


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (25 Jul 2018)

Froome's fricasséed and G is in the climbing form of his life.


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Has Froome dropped out of top 3?


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

I meant with the bonus.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> about 50 on Froome



52 (48 + 4) 



Beebo said:


> Has Froome dropped out of top 3?



No, he's still 16 seconds ahead of Roglic. But 32 seconds behind Dumoulin.


----------



## BrumJim (25 Jul 2018)

All top 10 on GC yesterday evening were in the top 10 today. Except Bardet (wilted) and Fuglsang. What happened to him today?


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

Froome in real danger of dropping off the podium in the TT provided he's still there then. 

So now we're all really hoping, with everything crossed, that Thomas does not have that fabled bad day!


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> So now we're all really hoping, with everything crossed, that Thomas does not have that fabled bad day!


I've been hoping that in every stage for the last 2 weeks....


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Dumoulin sounded a bit dejected just then - seems resigned to finishing behind Thomas. I'm sure he'll give it everything in the TT though.


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

View: https://twitter.com/Doctor_Hutch/status/1022124201526878210


----------



## MasterDabber (25 Jul 2018)

I thought Alaphilippe comes out of this Tour with a lot of respect. Great riding plus a real bit of class with Yates today. Comes across a real good guy.


----------



## mjr (25 Jul 2018)

MasterDabber said:


> I thought Alaphilippe comes out of this Tour with a lot of respect. Great riding plus a real bit of class with Yates today. Comes across a real good guy.


He's after one of those T shirts from the cycling podcast.


----------



## brommers (25 Jul 2018)

BrumJim said:


> All top 10 on GC yesterday evening were in the top 10 today. Except Bardet (wilted) and Fuglsang. What happened to him today?


So that's 8 then?


----------



## Va Va Froome (25 Jul 2018)

G got through the crazy stage... Keep it up, these stages are getting harder to follow...  


Great stage win for Quintana. I always expect so much from him, so it was nice to see him live up to that today!


----------



## smutchin (25 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> Great stage win for Quintana. I always expect so much from him, so it was nice to see him live up to that today!



Odd to think that's his first stage win at the Tour since 2013. He's only marginally less disappointing than Thibaut Pinot.


----------



## PK99 (25 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> G got through the crazy stage... Keep it up, these stages are getting harder to follow...
> 
> 
> Great stage win for Quintana. I always expect so much from him, so it was nice to see him live up to that today!



Mindblowing how he rides up that final 10% climb, looking like he is on a Sunday morning pootle!


----------



## MasterDabber (25 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> G got through the crazy stage... Keep it up, these stages are getting harder to follow...
> 
> 
> Great stage win for Quintana. I always expect so much from him, so it was nice to see him live up to that today!


Just a shame he was considered so inconsequential by now that they just let him ride off and do his own thing.


----------



## Bollo (25 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Odd to think that's his first stage win at the Tour since 2013. He's only marginally less disappointing than Thibaut Pinot.


I'm now going to petition for the 'Pinot' to become the SI Unit of disappointment.


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

A Pinot is a unit of petulance


----------



## Bollo (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> A Pinot is a unit of petulance


The 'Kittel'


----------



## Crackle (25 Jul 2018)

I think a Kittel is a unit of unfulfilled potential, or is that a Voeckler?


----------



## Elybazza61 (25 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> G got through the crazy stage... Keep it up, these stages are getting harder to follow...
> 
> 
> Great stage win for Quintana. I always expect so much from him, so it was nice to see him live up to that today!



Suppose none of the main GCers cared about Nairo too much.

Needs to get away from Movistar/team Valverde asap.


----------



## Tin Pot (25 Jul 2018)

Easy with hindsight, but after watching Froome blow everyone out of the water at the Giro I did wonder if that was this year’s focus and the TdF his ‘B’ race if I’m allowed to say such a thing.

As much as I like G to win, part of me wants to see Froome GO FOR IT tomorrow whether he wins or not.

I mean, does G need Froome in his team with so many sky riders supporting him already? It would be great viewing.


----------



## Adam4868 (25 Jul 2018)

Great stage for G and sky today,although the grid thing was sh1te ! BBC news reporting on Froome blowing before the news about G (his teammate !) winning.Gutsy ride by Dan Martin who I was willing on for the stage win.

View: https://twitter.com/carltonkirby/status/1022189611597156353?s=19


Sorry for the source !


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I think a Kittel is a unit of unfulfilled potential, or is that a Voeckler?



or a Quintana, promised so much , etc etc


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> Great stage for G and sky today,although the grid thing was sh1te ! BBC news reporting on Froome blowing before the news about G (his teammate !) winning.Gutsy ride by Dan Martin who I was willing on for the stage win.
> 
> View: https://twitter.com/carltonkirby/status/1022189611597156353?s=19
> 
> ...



That doesn’t look good it wasn’t shown on TV.


----------



## Adam4868 (25 Jul 2018)

View: https://twitter.com/albertsecall/status/1022164075080560640?s=19

Seen this aswell,I think maybe on his way back to team bus


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I think a Kittel is a unit of unfulfilled potential, or is that a Voeckler?


 Voeckler is the patron saint of plucky but ultimately futile breakaways whilst pulling stupid faces.


----------



## Beebo (25 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> View: https://twitter.com/albertsecall/status/1022164075080560640?s=19
> 
> Seen this aswell,I think maybe on his way back to team bus



Grabbed by a policeman cos he looked like an amateur. Not great.


----------



## Bollo (25 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Grabbed by a policeman cos he looked like an amateur. Not great.


Easy mistake to make.


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

little info but this says froome and his bodyguard was asked to stop, causing them both to crash,...... what the feck, seems more to this than being asked to stop...
https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/...e-france-stage-17-finish-mistaking-fan-388101


----------



## roadrash (25 Jul 2018)

he should have butted the copper on the bridge of the nose and said sorry ociffer I mistook you for a nob ed


----------



## ColinJ (25 Jul 2018)

Pay attention at the back of class!


----------



## Tin Pot (25 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> View: https://twitter.com/albertsecall/status/1022164075080560640?s=19
> 
> Seen this aswell,I think maybe on his way back to team bus




But the French police are so well known for getting the right man?


----------



## jarlrmai (25 Jul 2018)

Thomas putting the G in GC.


----------



## CaadX (25 Jul 2018)

I really should be elated ! However this feels like a Sastre, Nibali win (someone else should have one! For whatever reason?) Well done G (hopefully !) Youve justified the wage packet. Hope you are happy.

Don't bother replying to the post cos i won't be listening or responding.

Regards Rich and the nobber north of the border.


----------



## Bollo (25 Jul 2018)

CaadX said:


> I really should be elated ! However this feels like a Sastre, Nibali win (someone else should have one! For whatever reason?) Well done G (hopefully !) Youve justified the wage packet. Hope you are happy.
> 
> Don't bother replying to the post cos i won't be listening or responding.
> 
> Regards Rich and the nobber north of the border.


Bradley, is that you?


----------



## mjr (26 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> little info but this says froome and his bodyguard was asked to stop, causing them both to crash,...... what the feck, seems more to this than being asked to stop...
> https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/...e-france-stage-17-finish-mistaking-fan-388101


I think the earlier tweets said he was "pulled" by the gendarme and I don't think it was slang but my Spanish is limited and my Catalan worse!


----------



## Nomadski (26 Jul 2018)

Froomedog doesn't do a very good angry.


----------



## hoopdriver (26 Jul 2018)

True. He’ll never make anyone forget Dr Banner...


----------



## Nomadski (26 Jul 2018)

I would have liked to have seen a road rage incident between Froome and M. Jackson.


----------



## Phaeton (26 Jul 2018)

Nomadski said:


> Froomedog doesn't do a very good angry.


If you'd just had his day would you be happy?


----------



## ColinJ (26 Jul 2018)

Phaeton said:


> If you'd just had his day would you be happy?


I think he meant that Froome wasn't acting scary-angry, not that he didn't have a good reason to be angry!


----------



## Crackle (26 Jul 2018)

He did say, Fook yoo, in a very French way though, including an expansive gesture, class.

I always remember being in a French taxi, I kinda loosely knew the couple who ran the firm, divorced from each other but still having to work together and it was her who was driving the taxi. Her phone lit up and his name was clearly displayed. She pressed her bluetooth headset and answered the call with a long withering, Oui, drawn out with so much expression in it, that I felt the need to sink slightly in the seat and look out the window. 

I practised saying it by myself for days after but I couldn't get one tenth of the expression she had managed in such a short syllable.


----------



## Nomadski (26 Jul 2018)

He is clearly following Steve Mclarens rule that if you speak to Johnny Foreigner in a quasi-English version of their language, they will understand you better.


----------



## mjr (26 Jul 2018)

Not even I'm foolish enough to watch all of today's live show but it's on in the background. Break Of The Day of Van Keirsbulck, Boudat, the dangerous Terpstra, the dangerous Hayman and the hero that is Turbo Durbo allowed to get away by Grouperama FDJ but kept on a stupidly short lead of 1-2 minutes, provoking attacks from hopefuls trying to bridge. Main other interesting event is running repairs on Quintana following a strange crash.

FDJ look like they're screwing this up and either another breakaway will go or they'll have burned too many riders bringing it back together to be able to control the sprint.


----------



## smutchin (26 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> FDJ ... control the sprint.



Computer says no.

I'm hoping the break stays away for the simple reason that I picked Terpstra in the punditry (almost picked Van Kersbulck as well, dammit) but you're right about the peloton keeping them on a short leash, so I can't see it happening.


----------



## Beebo (26 Jul 2018)

Breakaway has been caught with 16k to go.


----------



## roadrash (26 Jul 2018)

Demare gets the win


----------



## Crackle (26 Jul 2018)

Chaotic finish. They all looked tired


----------



## smutchin (26 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> Demare gets the win



He's been at the back of the race for the previous two stages - last finisher on stage 16, second to last yesterday. Obviously did a good job of conserving his energy for today.

Sagan was well off the pace, compared to his usual standards. Could be down to his injuries from yesterday? Hope he makes it to Paris...


----------



## roadrash (26 Jul 2018)

sagan looked pretty uncomfortable getting off the bike and walking up the steps to the podium, I was wondering if we would see Quintana have another dig tomorrow, but after his crash today???


----------



## Shadow (26 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> He's been at the back of the race for the previous two stages - last finisher on stage 16, second to last yesterday. Obviously did a good job of conserving his energy for today.



Which is _precisely_ why I did not pick him in PTP - bugger!


----------



## Beebo (26 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> He's been at the back of the race for the previous two stages - last finisher on stage 16, second to last yesterday. Obviously did a good job of conserving his energy for today.
> 
> Sagan was well off the pace, compared to his usual standards. Could be down to his injuries from yesterday? Hope he makes it to Paris...


Tomorrow is the only difficult day left. Hopefully he gets home within time. 
He should be ok in the TT.


----------



## brommers (26 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Tomorrow is the only difficult day left. Hopefully he gets home within time.
> He should be ok in the TT.


Thomas is a pretty good timetrialler, and I agree with you that Dumoulin is not 2 minutes quicker.


----------



## Beebo (26 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Thomas is a pretty good timetrialler, and I agree with you that Dumoulin is not 2 minutes quicker.


I was talking about Sagan for green making it tomParis, as he looked a bit off colour today. 
But it works for Thomas too. He should hold 2 mins against Dumoulin.


----------



## Crackle (26 Jul 2018)

The TT course is rolling with a few climbs so it's not a course for the purist, it might well suit Froome the most


----------



## rich p (26 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> The TT course is rolling with a few climbs so it's not a course for the purist, it might well suit Froome the most


It'll be fine. G has hidden the salbutamol.


----------



## brommers (26 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> I was talking about Sagan for green making it tomParis, as he looked a bit off colour today.
> But it works for Thomas too. He should hold 2 mins against Dumoulin.


Sorry, not concentrating @Beebo. I've got Marmyitis.


----------



## rich p (26 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Sorry, not concentrating @Beebo. I've got Marmyitis.


You're turning into a curmudgeonly, gigantic, lazy scotch git? My sympathies, Brommers, old chum.
I f there's anything I can do...


----------



## themosquitoking (26 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> You're turning into a curmudgeonly, gigantic, lazy scotch git? My sympathies, Brommers, old chum.
> I f there's anything I can do...


Go and find marmy and bring him back where he belongs.


----------



## Tin Pot (26 Jul 2018)

So what’s Dumoulins tactics now? He’s going to have to try to blitz it at some point.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (26 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> So what’s Dumoulins tactics now? He’s going to have to try to blitz it at some point.


Ride the TT of his life and hope G falls off.


----------



## PpPete (26 Jul 2018)

_L'Equipe_ are disappointed with the leading French GC hope.


----------



## Va Va Froome (26 Jul 2018)

PpPete said:


> _L'Equipe_ are disappointed with the leading French GC hope.
> View attachment 421231



Think he'll come good tomorrow. But he's like their Tim Henman!!


----------



## smutchin (26 Jul 2018)

PpPete said:


> _L'Equipe_ are disappointed with the leading French GC hope.



For the benefit of non-French speakers... that’s actually very funny.


----------



## smutchin (26 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> I don't know "barder" I'm guessing "ça va barder" means "it's going to go really well"?



Yeah, that’s the general gist of it. Idiomatically, “There’s going to be fireworks” or something like that.


----------



## brommers (27 Jul 2018)

Froome was chatting and smiling in the peloton yesterday, as though a huge weight is off his shoulders


----------



## Levo-Lon (27 Jul 2018)

Today's the day then ,And what a day it will be.
12 mile climb and the other 2 climbs are pretty damn steep too.

Come on Geraint


----------



## Tin Pot (27 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Froome was chatting and smiling in the peloton yesterday, as though a huge weight is off his shoulders



...What next for Chris Froome?


----------



## brommers (27 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> ...What next for Chris Froome?


I don't think that he'll do the Vuelta this year, but focus on the World Championships.


----------



## mjr (27 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> I don't think that he'll do the Vuelta this year, but focus on the World Championships.


Then back for the tour next year, or try the monuments in an attempt to have won everything?


----------



## Bollo (27 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> ...What next for Chris Froome?





brommers said:


> I don't think that he'll do the Vuelta this year, but focus on the World Championships.


I was going to go with Strictly and then Celebrity Love Island, but yeah, the Worlds.


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Yeah, that’s the general gist of it. Idiomatically, “There’s going to be fireworks” or something like that.


Google translated it as “sparks will fly”.


----------



## mjr (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Google translated it as “sparks will fly”.


Ah, Google translate, never afraid to call a spade a giant soil slicer!


----------



## Adam4868 (27 Jul 2018)

Tin Pot said:


> ...What next for Chris Froome?


A day in the mountains and a time trial....are we really going to see Froomey being a domestique for G ?


----------



## Phaeton (27 Jul 2018)

Adam4868 said:


> A day in the mountains and a time trial....are we really going to see Froomey being a domestique for G ?


If he has anything left surely he'd want step 2 not step 3, he could do worse than take TD on & hope he blows himself out, or take enough out of him that he poses no threat at all to GT on the time trail


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Google translated it as “sparks will fly”.



And what is a firework if not a flying spark?


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Phaeton said:


> If he has anything left surely he'd want step 2 not step 3, he could do worse than take TD on & hope he blows himself out, or take enough out of him that he poses no threat at all to GT on the time trail



I can't imagine that Froome is interested in anything other than the top step. In which case, he might as well go for broke today and risk ending up outside the top 10.

On the other hand, if he tries anything that puts Thomas under pressure and causes him to crack and they end up handing the yellow jersey to Dumoulin, the team won't be very happy.


----------



## Supersuperleeds (27 Jul 2018)

I'd love to see Froome go on the offence early on and ride away from everyone and take yellow, I suspect he is a bit knackered though and GT will just mark TD and not worry about Froome


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Supersuperleeds said:


> I'd love to see Froome go on the offence early on and ride away from everyone and take yellow, I suspect he is a bit knackered though and GT will just mark TD and not worry about Froome



If Froome goes on the attack, that would force Dumoulin to chase him down, which could in turn put pressure on Thomas. It would be an extremely risky strategy and I can't see the team countenancing it.

However, I agree that it looks like winning three GTs on the trot has finally caught up with him and he doesn't have it in his legs anyway.


----------



## Aravis (27 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> *If Froome goes on the attack,* *that would force Dumoulin to chase him down*, which could in turn put pressure on Thomas. It would be an extremely risky strategy and I can't see the team countenancing it.
> 
> However, I agree that it looks like winning three GTs on the trot has finally caught up with him and he doesn't have it in his legs anyway.


I was mulling this one over. What if Dumoulin declines to chase, pointing out to Thomas that it's his jersey disappearing up the road? If that happens, it looks very good for Froome if he has the legs, and if Sky start to panic Dumoulin could end up being the beneficiary.


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Sagan is off the back and looking tired. Will he make it? I hope so.


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Sagan is off the back and looking tired. Will he make it? I hope so.



Cut-off is likely to be around 45 minutes today. He's got two team-mates looking after him. Should be fine.


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Cut-off is likely to be around 45 minutes today. He's got two team-mates looking after him. Should be fine.



He’s now 7 minutes behind on the first climb of the day. 
Still has the biggest 2 climbs to go! 
Come on Sagan!


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

Kicking off a bit on the Tourmalet. Might be a good move this


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Yep, it's all bardering at last. And Bardet is involved.


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

90k to go though, no one is panicking yet.


----------



## rich p (27 Jul 2018)

Sky will be pretty confident that they can drag Firework homme and Landa on the last 2 climbs


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> He’s now 7 minutes behind on the first climb of the day.
> Still has the biggest 2 climbs to go!
> Come on Sagan!



He's caught up with the autobus on the descent of the Tourmalet, and they're now 18 minutes behind the race leader.

Jelle Vanendert is off the back and has only just gone over the summit, about 32 minutes behind.


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Cracking effort from Amador. Still a long way to go though.


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> He's caught up with the autobus on the descent of the Tourmalet, and they're now 18 minutes behind the race leader.
> 
> Jelle Vanendert is off the back and has only just gone over the summit, about 32 minutes behind.


Vanendert has quit.


----------



## rich p (27 Jul 2018)

Under 2 minutes now


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Sagan at minus 21 minutes so has an extra circa 20 mins in the bag to get up the final climb.


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Vanendert has quit.



That's a shame. But not entirely surprising.


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Oooh, Dumoulin is having some fun. *Like*


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

Big, big attack from Roglic


----------



## rich p (27 Jul 2018)

Roglic looks good


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Froome is cooked and losing a podium.


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

Stay on your bike, Thomas!


----------



## Incontinentia Buttocks (27 Jul 2018)

"Yes well", for the love of God does Kelly have to start every sentence with those words...


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

Awesome riding from Bernal


----------



## rich p (27 Jul 2018)

Awesome by Bernal


----------



## Supersuperleeds (27 Jul 2018)

Froome to attack on the descent and get 5 minutes on everyone


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Going to be a crazy run down. 
Hope everyone stays upright.


----------



## Supersuperleeds (27 Jul 2018)

Are there time bonuses for first three places?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (27 Jul 2018)

This descent goes on forever! I wish it would stop.


----------



## Milkfloat (27 Jul 2018)

I think Froome has just lost his podium.


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Supersuperleeds said:


> Are there time bonuses for first three places?


No


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Roglic looking good.


----------



## Supersuperleeds (27 Jul 2018)

How does Roglic TT?


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Supersuperleeds said:


> How does Roglic TT?



Well enough to be a concern for Dumoulin.


----------



## rich p (27 Jul 2018)

Supersuperleeds said:


> How does Roglic TT?


He's won them in the past


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Roglic now 19 seconds behind Dumoulin and 13 ahead of Froome on GC.


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

Goes off to dig up previous TT head to heads.....


----------



## brommers (27 Jul 2018)

A couple of classics from Kelly and Kirby
Kelly: "The time bonuses finished on stage 9"
Kirby: As they passed through the 4km mark with 3.9km on the clock "Passing through the 3.9km mark" (or words to that effect)


----------



## Beebo (27 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> No


Sorry I was wrong. 
Eurosport lied to me.


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Dumoulin not happy!


----------



## smutchin (27 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Goes off to dig up previous TT head to heads.....



Probably the most significant one recently is stage 10 at last year's Giro. Dumoulin won, Thomas was second, 49 seconds behind.

Roglic was 57 seconds behind Dumoulin at the Worlds last year.


----------



## Tin Pot (27 Jul 2018)

So who do Team Sky back as a winner next year?

I reckon Froome retires.


----------



## Va Va Froome (27 Jul 2018)

Really happy to see Sagan get through that stage. So dominant with the points - if anyone else is gifted the green jersey through a DNF, it would be sickening.


----------



## themosquitoking (27 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> Really happy to see Sagan get through that stage. So dominant with the points - if anyone else is gifted the green jersey through a DNF, it would be sickening.


We could do a whip and five it to Sagan so he can sponsor the jersey instead of skoda and then his name will be on it no matter what.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (27 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> Really happy to see Sagan get through that stage. So dominant with the points - if anyone else is gifted the green jersey through a DNF, it would be sickening.


At this point of the TdF, yes. But it's come at the expense of some of the fastest sprinters, which qualifies the outcome a little. Where are the pure sprinters to race these days?


----------



## PK99 (27 Jul 2018)

deptfordmarmoset said:


> At this point of the TdF, yes. But it's come at the expense of some of the fastest sprinters, which qualifies the outcome a little. Where are the pure sprinters to race these days?



During yesterday's itv4 commentary, Cav said that as soon as he saw the route for TDF2018, he said that no pure sprinters would finish. As far as his own performance went, he had trained for the mountains at the expense of sprinting power and still did not manage the mountains.

IIRC correctly, Cav's finish time on the stage he was eliminated was still 15 minutes better then the fastest Etape rider.


----------



## Crackle (27 Jul 2018)

I love what you can find on the internet


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I love what you can find on the internet



And Thomas has 4 seconds per km on the whole field. That does seem a big margin even with better TT riders behind.


----------



## brommers (28 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> And Thomas has 4 seconds per km on the whole field. That does seem a big margin even with better TT riders behind.


He's a top time triallist in his own right


----------



## Crackle (28 Jul 2018)

It's also the end of a 3 week tour, so we're not going to see everyone performing as you might expect


----------



## Milzy (28 Jul 2018)

What time does the TT start.
Come on Tom, put a few mins on that G.

*Live TV details: *Eurosport 12.15-4.45pm, ITV4 10.45am-4.45pm, S4C 2-4.35pm


----------



## Shadow (28 Jul 2018)

For most of the peloton, yesterday was their last day at work. The sprinters and opportunists can look forward to tomorrow. 
All the jerseys are secure. (As long as Thomas stays upright, which after 3 weeks and a forecast for a dry afternoon, should not be difficult).
But what of the GC, especially positions 2, 3 & 4? Only 32 seconds separates them. It will be a tough 31 km for these 3 and one of them will not be on the podium after all their exertions.


----------



## Bonefish Blues (28 Jul 2018)

It's been a strangely unengaging Tour, at least for me.


----------



## gavroche (28 Jul 2018)

It has also been a very dry TdF. I don't remember seeing any rain during the last 3 weeks on the Tour's roads. Very unusual.


----------



## 400bhp (28 Jul 2018)

Milzy said:


> What time does the TT start.
> Come on Tom, put a few mins on that G.
> 
> *Live TV details: *Eurosport 12.15-4.45pm, ITV4 10.45am-4.45pm, S4C 2-4.35pm



10:45am on Eurosport


----------



## 400bhp (28 Jul 2018)

Bonefish Blues said:


> It's been a strangely unengaging Tour, at least for me.



Agree with you.

Not enough mountain finishes for me and odd places to run the high mountains-tourmalet weas too far out yesterday in my view.


----------



## Toshiba Boy (28 Jul 2018)

They're off, and it's "damp". Safe riding everyone.


----------



## FishFright (28 Jul 2018)

Is there a cut off time for today's time trial ?


----------



## gavroche (28 Jul 2018)

David Millar just said 25/30% so plenty for slow riders.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> He's a top time triallist in his own right



Let’s not forget Düsseldorf...

Although that course didn’t have a ruddy steep ramp near the end. Will be interesting to see what effect that has on the times. 

Should suit Roglic best of the top riders, I reckon.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

FishFright said:


> Is there a cut off time for today's time trial ?



Yep, it’s coefficient 7, same as the 65km stage, so a fixed 25% regardless of the winner’s time. 

Generous enough to make sure no one is in real danger unless they take the piss and pootle round.


----------



## Crackle (28 Jul 2018)

I didn't even realize Sep Vanmarcke was in the tour!


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Would anyone object to the first 100 riders going off at 1 minute intervals to speed the whole thing up a bit. 
That would knock 1hour and 40 minutes off the whole thing. 
The riders above 100 would still go off at 2 minute intervals.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

Jeez, the state of Taylor Phinney’s face... Apparently he’s not allowed to fly because of his fracture, so he has to go in the team bus to Paris. That’s going to be a long old schlep.


----------



## rich p (28 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I didn't even realize Sep Vanmarcke was in the tour!


I did, cos I picked the layabout on the Roubaix stage for the PPP


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Would anyone object to the first 100 riders going off at 1 minute intervals to speed the whole thing up a bit.
> That would knock 1hour and 40 minutes off the whole thing.
> The riders above 100 would still go off at 2 minute intervals.



First 40 riders went off at 90 second intervals.


----------



## Crackle (28 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I did, cos I picked the layabout on the Roubaix stage for the PPP


You should have known he'd be looking after Uran, tut.


----------



## rich p (28 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I didn't even realize Sep Vanmarcke was in the tour!


Did you realise that Cofidis, Dimernsion Data and EF were in it too?


----------



## Va Va Froome (28 Jul 2018)

What start time is the last rider pencilled in for?


Edit:

15:29 - Thomas.

Selected riders plus Top 10 start times here:
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/l...b0a09780004038#block-5b5c3cfee4b0a09780004038


----------



## Crackle (28 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Did you realise that Cofidis, Dimernsion Data and EF were in it too?


I heard they were


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

“Castroviejo is dressed as a toilet” - D.Millar

#quoteoftheday


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

when I heard him say that I thought , hmm Castroviejo will be pleased to hear that , without the rest of the conversation for context


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

marc soler takes the lead by less than a second


----------



## mjr (28 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Would anyone object to the first 100 riders going off at 1 minute intervals to speed the whole thing up a bit.
> That would knock 1hour and 40 minutes off the whole thing.
> The riders above 100 would still go off at 2 minute intervals.


Would we see TT specialists deliberately losing time to get minute men to catch or would the traffic disadvantage them and mean only GC riders can win it?


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

kragh soren Anderson has the lead by 31 seconds,...


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

well that didn't last long  Kwiatkowski takes the lead


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

Dan Martin will be on the podium in paris , he wins the super combativity prize


----------



## suzeworld (28 Jul 2018)

Getting juicy now. 
Froome setting off.


----------



## Va Va Froome (28 Jul 2018)

Through the Pyranees and Alps and cobbles...

Here we go... keep it upright Thomas! I can hardly watch...


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Roads look very greasy and rain drops on the camera lens.


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

ooh that was a twitchy bum moment for Thomas locking the back wheel


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)




----------



## rich p (28 Jul 2018)

So far, so better than good, at 1st intermediate


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> ooh that was a twitchy bum moment for Thomas locking the back wheel



That corner has nearly caught out quite a few people. I was worried for Thomas even before he reached it. He saved it though. Phew!


----------



## Crackle (28 Jul 2018)

Thomas wouldn't be Thomas if he didn't slide the bike somewhere


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Roglic not looking good atm


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

theres a lot of welsh flags on the roadside


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

Disappointing from Roglic.


----------



## rich p (28 Jul 2018)

Froome must have found that inhaler that G hid.


----------



## rich p (28 Jul 2018)

I wonder who Sky's GC rider will be at the Vuelta?


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Pop the champagne, Thomas can’t lose it from here


----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

ooh that close between froome and dumpmoulin


----------



## Va Va Froome (28 Jul 2018)




----------



## roadrash (28 Jul 2018)

confused, who won the stage froome or dumpmoulin


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> confused, who won the stage froome or dumpmoulin


Dumoulin won. The screen went red when he crossed the line but it corrected itself but it was very confusing.


----------



## smutchin (28 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> confused, who won the stage froome or dumpmoulin



I was sure the clock had ticked past Froome’s time when Dumoulin crossed the line, but then it showed Dumoulin as being a second quicker. I think the timing kit is misbehaving.


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Is it still under investigation?


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Froome was given a provisional time that was quicker than Dumoulin final time. 
Very odd.


----------



## PaulB (28 Jul 2018)

Froome will have to take it on Doumoulin's chin.


----------



## cyberknight (28 Jul 2018)

Da iawn G melyn yn paris


----------



## Adam4868 (28 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> confused, who won the stage froome or dumpmoulin


So we're they....

View: https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/1023224621569593344?s=19


----------



## suzeworld (28 Jul 2018)

Yay. So so happy. 
Great result all round. 

Whatch’all reckon about tomorrow with all big sprinters @ home already?


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (28 Jul 2018)

Just fantastic! I was willing G to slow down all the way through that. Luckily Nicolas Portal managed to pass my message on to him....


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (28 Jul 2018)

Way to go Massive GT


----------



## Bollo (28 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Froome was given a provisional time that was quicker than Dumoulin final time.
> Very odd.


Plod stood on the timing strip a couple of seconds before Froome crossed the line according to ITV highlights, so the difference shown on the screen when Dumoulin finished was wrong.

It’s certainly not been a PR slamdunk for les flics this year.


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> Plod stood on the timing strip a couple of seconds before Froome crossed the line according to ITV highlights, so the difference shown on the screen when Dumoulin finished was wrong.
> 
> It’s certainly not been a PR slamdunk for les flics this year.


Froome has had a terrible time with the police. He has been pepper sprayed, assaulted and now this. 
Anyone would think they have it in for him.


----------



## Adam4868 (28 Jul 2018)

Great win by G,thoroughly deserved !


----------



## tommaguzzi (28 Jul 2018)

it was just a oversight.

the french timekeepers forgot to add froom's 2 second time penalty for being chris froome.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (28 Jul 2018)

Bloody French, being French in their French race. Yorkshire could do better.


----------



## Nomadski (28 Jul 2018)

That finish was Monty Python. How do you actually fark up timing chips?

Chuffed for Super G though, he's been fantastic and deserves it for not headbutting trees or the ground this year. His post race interview left made my eye sockets moist a little.

The fans en route have been a total embarrassment to the sport.

And my innocent man crush on Sagan is intact.


----------



## Beebo (28 Jul 2018)

Nomadski said:


> That finish was Monty Python. How do you actually fark up timing chips?
> 
> Chuffed for Super G though, he's been fantastic and deserves it for not headbutting trees or the ground this year. His post race interview left made my eye sockets moist a little.
> 
> ...


The fans have been ok. 
99% are just there to clap and cheer. There has been some pantomime booing but that is all it was. Let’s not pretend that the British don’t do the occasional booing. 

Maybe 1% have had any malice and a couple have gone too far. But there have probably been a million spectators on the course so there will be a few idiots.


----------



## cyberknight (29 Jul 2018)

Nomadski said:


> That finish was Monty Python. How do you actually fark up timing chips?
> 
> Chuffed for Super G though, he's been fantastic and deserves it for not headbutting trees or the ground this year. His post race interview left made my eye sockets moist a little.
> 
> ...


Read an an article in cycling weekly that tissot have a camera either side of the line and a 3rd one just in case, so plod shouldn't affect the result , and Sagan you have to admire in a "what a farking cool guy " way .


----------



## Phaeton (29 Jul 2018)

No conspiracy theory or anything but the Police involvement has got to be brolacks, do they not all have transponders on now, so they know exactly where they all are, it's more likely to be a server issue between the equipment & the TV companies equipment.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

I'm really pleased that Thomas won, a genuinely nIce guy, it seems. 
It's actually an amazing feat considering the criticism he's had on here and elsewhere with regard to his ability and cycling choices. Me included, I hasten to add.
Spent too long chasing track golds; can't climb in the high mountains; can't sustain it without a jours sans; can't stay in the saddle for 3 weeks without hitting telegraph poles, tarmac, motorbikes. 
So glad he proved us all wrong.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Listening to Jonathan Edwards, Brian Smith, Luke Rowe and SDB yesterday in various interviews was relatively interesting regarding Chris Froome's acceptance that he wasn't strong enough and his willingness to help GT.
Brian Smith also slipped in that SDB had tried to recruit Tom D.
And that Brian Smith had tried to get GT on loan for a year when he was at MTN Quebeca.


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Listening to Jonathan Edwards, Brian Smith, Luke Rowe and SDB yesterday in various interviews was relatively interesting regarding Chris Froome's acceptance that he wasn't strong enough and his willingness to help GT.
> Brian Smith also slipped in that SDB had tried to recruit Tom D.
> And that Brian Smith had tried to get GT on loan for a year when he was at MTN Quebeca.


SDB was very emotional, almost crying in the interview i heard, he said Froome could have sulked like other top riders have done in the past, especially after all he has been put through, but he didnt and rode for the team.


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

One other thing we can take away from this years first two grand tours is that the Yates brothers are good but nowhere near good enough just yet. 
It will be interesting to see if they both ride in Spain.


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (29 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> SDB was very emotional, almost crying in the interview i heard, he said Froome could have sulked like other top riders have done in the past, especially after all he has been put through, but he didnt and rode for the team.


During this Tour, Geraint has grown as a rider and Froome, by simply accepting things and getting on with it, has grown as a man, in my view.


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

Phaeton said:


> No conspiracy theory or anything but the Police involvement has got to be brolacks, do they not all have transponders on now, so they know exactly where they all are, it's more likely to be a server issue between the equipment & the TV companies equipment.


I think it was just the system that reports the time _immediately_ at the line for the TV and finish line display that was triggered accidentally, or incorrectly at least. The system used to give the verified official times would use a number of technologies to give a verifiable result. Tissot’s website likely goes into the details. Some of the split times during the TT and earlier stages were also out on occasion.

I don’t think anyone is suggesting a conspiracy with any seriousness.


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> I think it was just the system that reports the time _immediately_ at the line for the TV and finish line display that was triggered accidentally, or incorrectly at least. The system used to give the verified official times would use a number of technologies to give a verifiable result. Tissot’s website likely goes into the details. Some of the split times during the TT and earlier stages were also out on occasion.



I think a large part of the problem is that the times displayed on your TV screen don't come direct from the official timing - as one of the commentators (Millar?) said, the TV timings are basically done by a bloke with a stopwatch.

They'd already had a similar problem earlier - I think it was with Soler, who initially thought he had posted a slower time than Hepburn and was already on his way to the team bus when an official grabbed him and directed him to the hot seat.


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

What do we make of the story about Dumoulin losing his skinsuit? Lionel Birnie was cynical, suggesting it was a stunt to plug local firm Etxeondo. Looking at the Dumoulin interview again, he does seem to be struggling to keep a straight face when asked about it.


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I think a large part of the problem is that the times displayed on your TV screen don't come direct from the official timing - as one of the commentators (Millar?) said, the TV timings are basically done by a bloke with a stopwatch.
> 
> They'd already had a similar problem earlier - I think it was with Soler, who initially thought he had posted a slower time than Hepburn and was already on his way to the team bus when an official grabbed him and directed him to the hot seat.


The ITV evening coverage showed a slo-mo of Froome approaching the line and you could see the on-screen clock stop when he was about 10-20 metres from the line - the viewing angle was foreshortened so it was pretty difficult to see the true distance.

On the whole I found the way the time gaps were displayed confusing, especially for the TT. At one point they were showing Dumoulin 30 seconds up on something, but it wasn't clear whether that was the best split, the 'clubhouse' split or an estimated live gap to Froome.


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> What do we make of the story about Dumoulin losing his skinsuit? Lionel Birnie was cynical, suggesting it was a stunt to plug local firm Etxeondo. Looking at the Dumoulin interview again, he does seem to be struggling to keep a straight face when asked about it.


That is a proper conspiracy! Now I doubt Thomas' missing Oakleys in 2015.....


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm really pleased that Thomas won, a genuinely nIce guy, it seems.
> It's actually an amazing feat considering the criticism he's had on here and elsewhere with regard to his ability and cycling choices. Me included, I hasten to add.
> Spent too long chasing track golds; can't climb in the high mountains; can't sustain it without a jours sans; can't stay in the saddle for 3 weeks without hitting telegraph poles, tarmac, motorbikes.
> So glad he proved us all wrong.


That's more or less what I was going to say but I wasn't going to say it until the race had finished! .....Dances in a little circle with fingers crossed to break the hex......


----------



## mjr (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> What do we make of the story about Dumoulin losing his skinsuit? Lionel Birnie was cynical, suggesting it was a stunt to plug local firm Etxeondo. Looking at the Dumoulin interview again, he does seem to be struggling to keep a straight face when asked about it.


I'm with Napalm. Kudos to him for immediately following it with a Rapha plug.


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Those of you with long memories will know that I've been saying Thomas will one day win the Tour de France since 2011, if not earlier. Have to admit I'd pretty much given up hope of it ever happening - largely because until a couple of years ago he seemed more interested in track medals - but I'm pleased to finally have it confirmed that I wasn't just talking shite and he really is that good.

ETA: just searched the archive for what I've said publicly about him in the past. This is a good one: https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/will-cav-leave-sky.106752/post-1948740 - "more of a leader's temperament than Froome" - it seems I was more skeptical of Froome's potential in 2012 than of Thomas's


----------



## mjr (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm really pleased that Thomas won, a genuinely nIce guy, it seems.
> It's actually an amazing feat considering the criticism he's had on here and elsewhere with regard to his ability and cycling choices. Me included, I hasten to add.
> Spent too long chasing track golds; can't climb in the high mountains; can't sustain it without a jours sans; can't stay in the saddle for 3 weeks without hitting telegraph poles, tarmac, motorbikes.
> So glad he proved us all wrong.


Some of that's rather unfair. I doubt the team were letting motorbikes or Warren Bar guy anywhere near G once he took yellow!


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

28th July 2012:


smutchin said:


> I have a bit of a soft spot for Geraint Thomas, who I think is potentially better than Wiggins and Froome rolled together. That kind of talent is completely wasted on the track.


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> 28th July 2012:


You can't kid us, you didn't back him in the ptp, shame on you, shame....


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> You can't kid us, you didn't back him in the ptp, shame on you, shame....



Yep, I lost faith in him, and I'm giving myself a stern talking to for that. Sometimes I'm happy to be proved wrong though.

The one thing that would really seal his claims to true greatness now would be a Monument.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> You can't kid us, you didn't back him in the ptp, shame on you, shame....


Probably because by 2015 Smutch had changed his mind 

I'm actually embarrassed that I searched out this! 



smutchin said:


> G is a definite for the Tour and will be a very valuable domestique for Froome. I used to think he had GC potential himself but I can't see it now.


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Another post from that thread that's quite interesting/amusing from a historical perspective (Tour de Suisse final podium):



raindog said:


> View attachment 296449



Slightly surprised to note that Spilak hasn't taken part in a Grand Tour since abandoning the 2014 TdF on stage 17.


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

None of us have been kind about Thomas's propensity to come off his bike though. This is one of numerous from me, there was even one about him slipping in the shower but given his slide yesterday, this from 2011 seemed appropriate



Crackle said:


> Thomas, locked his back wheel, that'll knock his confidence - Jeez, again!


----------



## Va Va Froome (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I'm really pleased that Thomas won, a genuinely nIce guy, it seems.
> It's actually an amazing feat considering the criticism he's had on here and elsewhere with regard to his ability and cycling choices. Me included, I hasten to add.
> Spent too long chasing track golds; can't climb in the high mountains; can't sustain it without a jours sans; *can't stay in the saddle for 3 weeks without hitting telegraph poles, tarmac, motorbikes. *
> So glad he proved us all wrong.



I've been keeping the fingers crossed that he stayed upright, but expecting him to crash down at some point for more than the last fortnight!
Happy to be proven wrong. 

Did everyone else think that if there was going to be another GBR winner of a Grand Tour soon, that we'd be waiting for a Yates?


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

Perhaps we should let Thomas have the final word on crashes...

_“I have been unfortunate in the past,” Thomas said. “A lot of the crashes haven’t been my fault. Some have, obviously. I don’t dwell on it. People talk about it quite a bit, but I just get on with it, and blank it out.”_


----------



## Adam4868 (29 Jul 2018)

This was his time,he's prepared for this Tour more than ever with less racing this year than before.I don't necessarily see him crashing more than others.But that's bike racing,there's always going to be a element of luck involved.I mean Nibali and porte both had the bad luck this time.


----------



## Jimidh (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> What do we make of the story about Dumoulin losing his skinsuit? Lionel Birnie was cynical, suggesting it was a stunt to plug local firm Etxeondo. Looking at the Dumoulin interview again, he does seem to be struggling to keep a straight face when asked about it.



I thought so too - great publicity for them though.

Absolutely delighted for G - always comes across as a descent bloke. 

I had the pleasure of meeting him a few years ago and he did come across as a down to Earth lad who just loved racing his bike.


----------



## Freds Dad (29 Jul 2018)

Jimidh said:


> I thought so too - great publicity for them though.
> 
> Absolutely delighted for G - always comes across as a descent bloke.
> 
> I had the pleasure of meeting him a few years ago and he did come across as a down to Earth lad who just loved racing his bike.



He's quite good at going up hill as well.


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

Lawson Craddock is apparently the only person to hold the Lanterne Rouge for every stage of the race.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> Lawson Craddock is apparently the only person to hold the Lanterne Rouge for every stage of the race.


He must be very proud!
Geraint was almost the only rider, AFAIK, to hold the Lanterne Rouge and win it but sadly he finished 2nd from last in his Barloworld days.


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

Also, Taylor Phinney, with his bust eye socket, was not allowed to fly and made the 800km journey by car


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

I thought Lampaert might hold on then!


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Well, now my afternoons are free again for domestic duties.


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)




----------



## StuAff (29 Jul 2018)

Lampaert gave it a good go for sure.


----------



## StuAff (29 Jul 2018)

How long is it to the Vuelta?


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> I thought Lampaert might hold on then!



I was really willing him on. Great move.


----------



## stoatsngroats (29 Jul 2018)

mjr said:


> At some point, the team would have to decide how the domestiques are allocated and how do you do that without it being interference? Or if they support neither, isn't that itself interference?



Oh, yes, I see what you mean!


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

Have Ned & Dave never watched the Tour before? They were talking about the break as if it had a realistic chance of staying away to the finish. Or was it just a half-hearted attempt to generate some excitement?


----------



## Levo-Lon (29 Jul 2018)

What a great guy.he deserves all of whats to come.

My mate down the pub will be all Rorke's Drift and the TDF...feckin welshman..


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Have Ned & Dave never watched the Tour before? They were talking about the break as if it had a realistic chance of staying away to the finish. Or was it just a half-hearted attempt to generate some excitement?


Similar on Eurosport but only from that twat Kirby.
There were enough proper sprinters to ensure that wasn't ever going to happen.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Alan Phillips is a right little French geezer. 
Darling of les femmes au foyer...


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Alan Phillips is a right little French geezer.
> Darling of les femmes au foyer...


I so want this to be the start of a poem.


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

Thomas might be able to ride a bike but he sure can’t grow a beard. 
Terrible wispy beard.


----------



## gavroche (29 Jul 2018)

I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.


Oh. bog off.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Great speech!


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.


It’s not the English National anthem, it’s the British anthem. 

He has heard it twice before at the Olympics.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

Blimey, I've got something in my eye...


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

Luke Rowe drops an S-bomb!!!


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.


Are you old enough to remember them playing La Marseillaise ....


----------



## gavroche (29 Jul 2018)

A


Beebo said:


> It’s not the English National anthem, it’s the British anthem.
> 
> He has heard it twice before at the Olympics.


I expected this sort of reply but Wales is also a nation and a country.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (29 Jul 2018)

Well done to Sooper Dooper Geettee


----------



## gavroche (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Are you old enough to remember them playing La Marseillaise ....


Definitely.


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

SPOTY? Too soon?


----------



## Crackle (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> Are you old enough to remember them playing La Marseillaise ....


He can recall the great days of Anquetil


----------



## deptfordmarmoset (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.


Still, Luke Rowe got to conduct a beer-inflected version of ''Land of our fathers'' on live TV....


----------



## gavroche (29 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> He can recall the great days of Anquetil


Sure can and he is still my cycling hero. I also recall the days of Louison Bobet, 3 times winner, in the 50s.


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> SPOTY? Too soon?


Harry Kane, Anthony Joshua, Lewis Hamilton are all going to be in with a shout.


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.



I agree with this. The tune of the British national anthem is an awful dirge and the words are even worse. I hate it. 

Peter Tatchell got it right: 


> There are no noble ideals like liberty and equality. Our anthem is all about slavish deference and idolatry – the veneration of aristocratic privilege, inherited status and monarchical rule. It promotes jingoism, war, imperial conquest and the British people's subservience to God and royalty.


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2008/aug/27/britishidentity

Like him, I feel embarrassed every time I hear it, especially on occasions like this when the person it is being played for is Welsh or Scottish. 

By contrast, Land of My Fathers is both a cracking tune and expresses the right kind of sentiment for a national anthem - it’s about the country and the people, not some superannuated figurehead. La Marseillaise is even better, but I suspect it will be many more years before we hear that played for the Tour de France winner.


----------



## roadrash (29 Jul 2018)

As far as the national anthem goes ,I cant fekin stand it, I have never understood how ours is not a national anthem, it is not about the nation , it is about one person , did I mention that I fekin hate it


----------



## LarryDuff (29 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> SPOTY? Too soon?


No, too Welsh!


----------



## Bollo (29 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> Harry Kane, Anthony Joshua, Lewis Hamilton are all going to be in with a shout.


Sorry @Beebo, I wasn’t being entirely serious.


----------



## rich p (29 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> I agree with this. The tune of the British national anthem is an awful dirge and the words are even worse. I hate it.
> 
> Peter Tatchell got it right:
> 
> ...


I tend to regard it like turning up to a church wedding. I do it because it doesn't actually matter in the great scheme of things, despite being a republican atheist.
Hypocritical bastard that I am!!!


----------



## roadrash (29 Jul 2018)

At least they didn't have that awful screeching banshee singing the national anthem that they had when wiggins won


----------



## smutchin (29 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> I tend to regard it like turning up to a church wedding. I do it because it doesn't actually matter in the great scheme of things, despite being a republican atheist.
> Hypocritical bastard that I am!!!



This is also true. It's not hypocrisy, it's understanding that there's a time and a place to make your republicanism known.

Tbh, I don't know why they need to play anyone's national anthem at the end of the Tour de France anyway. It's not a national victory, it's a victory for a commercially sponsored trade team comprised of several nationalities who all contributed to the win.


----------



## Buck (29 Jul 2018)

gavroche said:


> I am very disappointing that they played the English national anthem, it should have been the Welsh one, Geraint is Welsh first.



The thing is that he was entered into the TdF under the GB banner rather than Welsh. Why I’m not sure. 

Would have been good for them to ask him his preference?!


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

What’s happened to cow bells. 
You used to hear them everywhere but I heard almost nothing now.


----------



## roadrash (29 Jul 2018)

there was loads of cow bells especially in the mountains


----------



## ColinJ (29 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> What’s happened to cow bells.
> You used to hear them everywhere but I heard almost nothing now.


The wasps took them!


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

Buck said:


> The thing is that he was entered into the TdF under the GB banner rather than Welsh. Why I’m not sure.
> 
> Would have been good for them to ask him his preference?!


I expect it will be due to affiliation to the UCI. Where we compete as GB. 
Same as the Olympics where we compete as GB. 
The only time I can think of Wales competing as a nation is at the common wealth games.


----------



## Va Va Froome (29 Jul 2018)

Dan Martin took the Combativity Award!

He stood out this Tour with some great attacks, strong top 10 performance and a stage win.


----------



## Mike_P (29 Jul 2018)

Beebo said:


> I expect it will be due to affiliation to the UCI. Where we compete as GB.
> Same as the Olympics where we compete as GB.


Correct, and why the Union Flag was shown against all the British riders names on the captions etc regardless of their respective home nation.


----------



## Beebo (29 Jul 2018)

Va Va Froome said:


> Dan Martin took the Combativity Award!
> 
> He stood out this Tour with some great attacks, strong top 10 performance and a stage win.


Well deserved, and he didn’t win any individual stage combativity awards during the actual race.


----------



## Smokin Joe (29 Jul 2018)

Buck said:


> The thing is that he was entered into the TdF under the GB banner rather than Welsh. Why I’m not sure.
> 
> Would have been good for them to ask him his preference?!


Wales is not a nation, it is a region of the United Kingdom.


----------



## Buck (29 Jul 2018)

Smokin Joe said:


> Wales is not a nation, it is a region of the United Kingdom.



It is a nation. It is not a nation state however.


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (29 Jul 2018)

Wales is a fecking dump.


Almost as bad as Yorkshire.


----------



## mjr (29 Jul 2018)

roadrash said:


> As far as the national anthem goes ,I cant fekin stand it, I have never understood how ours is not a national anthem, it is not about the nation , it is about one person , did I mention that I fekin hate it


Lichtenstein's is as bad. 

They should play Jerusalem for English winners... if we ever have one... one Belgian, one Kenyan and one Welshman so far, if you believe some people


----------



## Pro Tour Punditry (29 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Just got back from a week in Berlin. I didn't manage to catch much racing on telly at all. Out of curiosity I just watched a video of the gridded start of stage 17. Gosh, how exciting was that? (A: not in the least bit exciting)


Haven't managed to see anything from the last week (having not seen much of the 2 weeks before) but I'm hoping there may be a highlights compilation somewhere that I can watch this week when I'm off work; I am overly interested in seeing how stage 17 started.


----------



## Buck (29 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Wales is a fecking dump.
> 
> 
> Almost as bad as Yorkshire.



Cheeky bar steward! I could be offended if I tried but cba.


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## brommers (30 Jul 2018)

GB could have a great team suited to this year's World Championships in the Tyrol: From - Thomas, Froome, Yates, Yates, TGH, Rowe, Stannard, Kennaugh, Swift, Dowsett, etc.


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## PaulB (30 Jul 2018)

Buck said:


> It is a nation. It is not a nation state however.


It isn't a nation. Neither is England. Or Scotland. If a region isn't recognised by the UN as a nation, then it isn't a nation. If you are English but don't have an English passport, then you are from a region of the place you have a passport from.


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## Bollo (30 Jul 2018)

If only there were a sub forum where heavyweight issues like news and current affairs could be discussed in a vigorous but friendly manner.....


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## jarlrmai (30 Jul 2018)

Man I'd love to see Froome, Yates, Yates, Thomas in the team for Austria..


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

PaulB said:


> If a region isn't recognised by the UN as a nation, then it isn't a nation.



There's more than one definition of 'nation' (Wales, after all, has a National Assembly) but we're getting further and further off-topic so let's leave it there or start a separate thread in the appropriate forum.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

Bollo said:


> If only there were a sub forum where heavyweight issues like news and current affairs could be discussed in a vigorous but friendly manner.....



Makes a change from arguing about doping at least.


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## rich p (30 Jul 2018)

Kenya is a nation state...
Jus' sayin' like.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> He came in 21st & was a bit disappointed with that. He's also just said that he's re-signed for WGG and is looking forward to doing better next year. Which is a bit previous as WGG rely on a wildcard invitation don't they?



WGG are currently top of the Europe Tour team ranking and Andrea Pasqualon is top of the individual ranking, besides which they're a French outfit, so it's a pretty safe bet they'll get one of the wildcard slots next year. Having Guillaume Martin and Yoann Offredo on their books also helps - two very popular riders.


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## rich p (30 Jul 2018)

If it's a straight fight for a wildcard place, Cofidis and Fortuneo must be twitchy. Wanty and Dirct Energie were more apparent.
Barguil irritates me.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

rich p said:


> If it's a straight fight for a wildcard place, Cofidis and Fortuneo must be twitchy. Wanty and Dirct Energie were more apparent.
> Barguil irritates me.



Cofidis are somehow 2nd in the Europe Tour rankings - not that you'd know it from their showing at the Tour (though as noted a while ago, they left their two top UCI points scorers out of their Tour squad, for reasons best known to themselves). 

Direct Energie are currently 4th and Fortuneo are way down in 16th - presumably the main reason they got selected is because they had last year's spotty jumper winner. And because they're French, of course. But Barguil currently sits down in 642nd place in the individual rankings, so unless he bucks his ideas up, maybe they'll be in danger of losing their wildcard next season.

Mind you, there probably aren't that many Europe Tour teams who actually want a wildcard place in a Grand Tour because it would be such a big drain on their resources, plus the fact that they don't have any riders who are experienced at that level and might struggle to get round the full three weeks with any riders left.


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## GuyBoden (30 Jul 2018)

I'm still missing Phil Liggett and Paul Sherwen, apparently they're doing the TdF on NBC in the USA.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (30 Jul 2018)

Super GeeTee has made the A list; appearing on tonight's The One Show.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Super GeeTee has made the A list; appearing on tonight's The One Show.



Interesting that he mentioned not having signed a new contract yet. Very interesting indeed...


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## Bollo (30 Jul 2018)

GuyBoden said:


> I'm still missing Phil Liggett and Paul Sherwen, apparently they're doing the TdF on NBC in the USA.


I bet they’re all round to Lance’s.


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## Pro Tour Punditry (30 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Interesting that he mentioned not having signed a new contract yet. Very interesting indeed...


Good Lord man! I didnae actually watch it.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Good Lord man! I didnae actually watch it.



I didn’t know he was going to be on - caught it by chance because my wife flipped over to BBC1 just as it started. Only saw your post about it afterwards. 

The questions were as inane as you’d expect but that little nugget from Mega G-Man made it worthwhile.


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## Bollo (30 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Good Lord man! I didnae actually watch it.


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## Crackle (30 Jul 2018)

Pro Tour Punditry said:


> Good Lord man! I didnae actually watch it.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0bcpclx/the-one-show-30072018

1.06 to 8.50

I thank you...


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## brommers (30 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Cofidis are somehow 2nd in the Europe Tour rankings - not that you'd know it from their showing at the Tour (though as noted a while ago, they left their two top UCI points scorers out of their Tour squad, for reasons best known to themselves).


Their sprinter Christophe LaPorte had 4 top 5 finishes.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

brommers said:


> Their sprinter Christophe LaPorte had 4 top 5 finishes.



Apart from the one where he was comfortably beaten into second place by Demare, I don't remember any of them.

Still, I guess top 5 places are how you rack up UCI points, even if no one notices you doing it.


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## Crackle (30 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> Apart from the one where he was comfortably beaten into second place by Demare, I don't remember any of them.
> 
> Still, I guess top 5 places are how you rack up UCI points, even if no one notices you doing it.


Are they still going for the relegation thing this year, I've kinda lost track of that. As you'd guess, DiData are still propping up the bottom?

http://www.uci.ch/road/ranking/


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## BalkanExpress (30 Jul 2018)

smutchin said:


> WGG are currently top of the Europe Tour team ranking and Andrea Pasqualon is top of the individual ranking, besides which they're a French outfit, so it's a pretty safe bet they'll get one of the wildcard slots next year. Having Guillaume Martin and Yoann Offredo on their books also helps - two very popular riders.



Err....WGG are Belge..and before anyone asks, no, it is not a region of France


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## BalkanExpress (30 Jul 2018)

Crackle said:


> https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0bcpclx/the-one-show-30072018
> 
> 1.06 to 8.50
> 
> I thank you...



I love that he fell asleep in the dressing room. I suspect he got very little sleep last night.


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## smutchin (30 Jul 2018)

BalkanExpress said:


> Err....WGG are Belge



Yes, of course. Sorry!


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## rich p (7 Aug 2018)

Vegni has a pop at ASO...

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/vegni-blasts-tour-de-france-after-rider-security-issues/


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## Bollo (8 Aug 2018)

Apologies if this has made it in another thread, but Moscon avoids his P45...

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...con-escapes-sack-over-tour-de-france-incident


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## roadrash (8 Aug 2018)

Moscon is a nob, that is all...…...


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## Bollo (9 Aug 2018)

roadrash said:


> Moscon is a nob, that is all...…...


I believe that was the official finding of the UCI disciplinary panel.


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## Apollonius (9 Aug 2018)

roadrash said:


> Moscon is a nob, that is all...…...


Without a doubt. But he is a young and able nob, and definitely needs to be cut some slack. The pro peloton is a harsh place to learn, but learn he will. I think there are plenty of us who made crass mistakes in our twenties, and were given another chance (or several) by the powers that be. I will put my hand up as one!


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## hoopdriver (9 Aug 2018)

Not hitting people is something one should have learned and understood by the time one leaves nursery school. He is a man in his mid twenties, not a toddler being selfish in the sandbox. He needs the swift kick up the backsides that being sacked would have provided.


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## roadrash (9 Aug 2018)

Apollonius said:


> Without a doubt. But he is a young and able nob, and definitely needs to be cut some slack. The pro peloton is a harsh place to learn, but learn he will. I think there are plenty of us who made crass mistakes in our twenties, and were given another chance (or several) by the powers that be. I will put my hand up as one!



Iagree with you up to a point...



hoopdriver said:


> Not hitting people is something one should have learned and understood by the time one leaves nursery school. He is a man in his mid twenties, not a toddler being selfish in the sandbox. He needs the swift kick up the backsides that being sacked would have provided.



^^^^but mostly I agree with this^^^


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## smutchin (9 Aug 2018)

Apollonius said:


> The pro peloton is a harsh place to learn, but learn he will.



This is not his first offence. How many chances does he need? How many should he be given?


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## rich p (9 Aug 2018)

You have to wonder that, if he wasn't such a good cyclist, would have been given another chance. 
There's no need to answer that!
Have we heard (or have I missed) what caused him to lash out?


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## jarlrmai (9 Aug 2018)

word is it was because he's a nob.


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## suzeworld (10 Aug 2018)

According to the Grauniad article He didn’t actually punch the other guy in this incident. 
Has anyone seen any story in what provoked him to raise his fist?


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## ColinJ (10 Aug 2018)

Wasn't there a suggestion that Moscon's jersey was being pulled?


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## suzeworld (12 Aug 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Does it matter?


Does anything matter? 

If you’re not interested in my question you can just jog on by. 

It matters to me because provocation makes a difference, plus, Macon didn’t actually hit the other guy.


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## roadrash (12 Aug 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Why? Punch someone in some other sports it's a straight red. No excuses.



Except boxing..... sorry , couldn't resist


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## mjr (14 Aug 2018)

suzeworld said:


> It matters to me because provocation makes a difference, plus, Macon didn’t actually hit the other guy.


If Macon's the puncheur, is Moscon the French president and Macron Villages a wine?


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## mjr (16 Aug 2018)

Some discussion of the aftermath over in https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/nibala-goes-after-a-s-o-for-compensation.239001/


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## Slaav (16 Aug 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Why? Punch someone in some other sports it's a straight red. No excuses.



Err.... I am sorry to disagree with you but there are many instances where punching someone is justified. In elite sport where doing something completely dangerous or stupid could result in major consequences, in the 'heat of battle' I reckon that a playful slap can be justified....

And don't get me on to the occasion when I ran after someone playing rugby to slap them - he ran to the ref and hid behind the referee who calmed me down - the provocation completely justified the actions on my part I am afraid. (I obviously didn't actually manage to punch him and no doubt would have been punished for doing so but banned/thrown out? Not sure on that really...)

If someone has an incredibly low bar re temper and tolerance, then they can completely overreact but the provocation does play a part nevertheless.

In my view, Moscon got banned for a bit and that was probably the correct decision having seen it - whether the actual provocation warranted the punch and was understandable enough to make excuses for him - I have no idea.


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## smutchin (10 Oct 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> Send for Pickles the dog!



One for the teenagers, as Steve Lamacq often says.


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## Mike_P (10 Oct 2018)

Or maybe meant the gravitational pull of Sir Eric Pickles


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## fossyant (10 Oct 2018)

Twitter has it some bald headed skinny bloke.. looks a 'little' like Froomey.  Cracking !


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## nickyboy (11 Oct 2018)

Dogtrousers said:


> For the benefit of you youngsters out there Pickles (dog)
> 
> Pickles
> 
> ...



I wonder what a dog's got to do to win the Canine Defence League Gold medal?


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