# My work pension scheme.



## MontyVeda (3 Jun 2020)

I had look at my workplace pension today...

Estimated value of your retirement pot on your retirement date (2036): £7,530.00 
Your retirement income each year could be: £180.00 

...it's not going to go very far is it.


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## fossyant (3 Jun 2020)

Many of them aren't going to go far.


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## ColinJ (3 Jun 2020)

Blimey - I only paid into my scheme for 2 years and got £2.5k at age 60 plus (currently) £600 p.a. from it!


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## screenman (3 Jun 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> I had look at my workplace pension today...
> 
> Estimated value of your retirement pot on your retirement date (2036): £7,530.00
> Your retirement income each year could be: £180.00
> ...



Not much of a gamble for them.


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## DCLane (3 Jun 2020)

Mine vary; I've a Teacher's Pension that can start from now due to additional payments plus AVC's, which I'm keeping for another 10 years then taking. I'll get a decent amount from that even if I stopped now.

My earliest FT workplace is worth £800pa at present, so probably about £1000pa in 15 years time, whien it's due to mature.
Another is currently worth £6pa in 5 year's time as it's set for then. Won't get much from that one!

That's apart from my 'alternative' pension scheme: I collect paintings, vintage watches and antique books. Along with bikes.


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## marzjennings (3 Jun 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> I had look at my workplace pension today...
> 
> Estimated value of your retirement pot on your retirement date (2036): £7,530.00
> Your retirement income each year could be: £180.00
> ...



It's enough to pay for a nice bike in 16 year's time if you cash it out.


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## MontyVeda (3 Jun 2020)

DCLane said:


> ...
> Another is currently worth £6pa in 5 year's time as it's set for then. Won't get much from that one!


That's even funnier than mine 

I knew my workplace pension wouldn't be worth much, but £180 a year has far exceeded my lowest expectations.


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## neil_merseyside (3 Jun 2020)

How much are you paying in?


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## MarkF (3 Jun 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> I had look at my workplace pension today...
> 
> Estimated value of your retirement pot on your retirement date (2036): £7,530.00
> Your retirement income each year could be: £180.00
> ...



The £180pa is of no consequence, but the £7530 could do a lot, nice motorbike, vintage car, a good cruise, a Rolex, a convertible and a grand european tour. I wouldn't bother with the £180.


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## Drago (3 Jun 2020)

It'll be enough to service your bicycle every 2nd or 3rd year.


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## PK99 (3 Jun 2020)

A neighbour's husband worked for Unilever, he died in his 40s 40 years ago on a salary of around £10k.

She got 50% index linked lifetime spousal pension and 2 year old daughter got 1/3 dependants pension to age 23.

Widows pension is now over £40k per year.


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## MarkF (3 Jun 2020)

DCLane said:


> That's apart from my 'alternative' pension scheme: I collect vintage watches and antique books. Along with bikes.



My sons & daughter have no interest so I'll cash in my watches when I retire, they'll prove to have been a good investment.


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## DCLane (3 Jun 2020)

MarkF said:


> My sons & daughter have no interest so I'll cash in my watches when I retire, they'll prove to have been a good investment.



I've bought them over a 25 year period for the purpose of selling if my pension wasn't decent, having started when I worked for a US firm all over Europe. Back then the idea of a decent pension wasn't great. I began with antique books, added watches and then paintings from emerging artists: some aren't worth anything but a few have increased in value. 

The idea is I'll sell a painting, a watch or a couple of books a year to supplement pension earnings when I start a staggered retirement in 10 year's time. If that ever happens. If not my kids get to decide what to do with them.


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## neil_merseyside (3 Jun 2020)

You can cash in small pensions below a certain threshold so you might be able to do that if the rules stay the same and the threshold is OK.


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## MontyVeda (4 Jun 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> How much are you paying in?


no idea... the absolute bare minimum... it's just an automated workplace pension scheme


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## shirokazan (4 Jun 2020)

DCLane said:


> ...I collect paintings, vintage watches and antique books. Along with bikes.



Makes a refreshing change from the usual "rental properties".


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## DCLane (4 Jun 2020)

shirokazan said:


> Makes a refreshing change from the usual "rental properties".



Buying property to rent would probably have been more profitable. I just didn't need the hassle accompanying them and, having moved round the UK plus not originally intending to stay in the UK beyond 1995, it didn't make sense at the time. In 2020 I'm still here!


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## shirokazan (4 Jun 2020)

DCLane said:


> Buying property to rent would probably have been more profitable. I just didn't need the hassle accompanying them and, having moved round the UK plus not originally intending to stay in the UK beyond 1995 it didn't make sense at the time. In 2020 I'm still here!



I wouldnt' do rental properties, not domestic anyway - doesn't fit with my ethics. As for your original plans...I had similar 1990s too.


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## Drago (4 Jun 2020)

If I didn't rent out a place then the lady that lives in it would not only be homeless, she'd quite likely have to leave the island in order to be able to afford somewhere else. It's a good thing I have no ethics.


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## neil_merseyside (4 Jun 2020)

MontyVeda said:


> no idea... the absolute bare minimum... it's just an automated workplace pension scheme


Well if it's not costing much then it isn't so bad, you can probably make Additional Voluntary Contributions so it builds up to a better return. and if the company is paying all the fees then any contribution will go straight into the pot (and tax man puts in a good whack too).

You need proper advice, a lot has changed in pensions relatively recently, and don't bank on a state pension - lots of people have had their state retirement deferred, I'm on a 'delay' from the traditional 65, some ladies pensions are 6 years later than 'back in the day'. 
My private pension and my state pension should be enough - we'll see...


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## DCLane (5 Jun 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> don't bank on a state pension



Agreed. I'm hoping the government don't make them means-tested, which would cause issues. A sure-fire vote loser no party seems willing to try it ... yet.


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## Milkfloat (5 Jun 2020)

DCLane said:


> Agreed. I'm hoping the government don't make them means-tested, which would cause issues. A sure-fire vote loser no party seems willing to try it ... yet.


I was given some advice by a financial consultant 25 years ago when I started 'proper' work that said don't count on any state pension when I retire. This was before a worldwide pandemic that will create a recession/slump like nothing seen before plus our local issue of Brexit, I honestly don't see how when I come to retire the state will be giving me any pension at all. I have been fairly fortunate in my career lived reasonably frugally and have been pumping a very large percentage of my salary into my pension in anticipation of this, my worry is that I will get further penalised when I come to draw down on my pension at retirement, which I have not accounted for.


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## Drago (5 Jun 2020)

Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?


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## vickster (5 Jun 2020)

Personally, I’m paying in around 9k a year in tranches (self employed). This thread has reminded me I need to add some more
(esp as the stock market has picked up from its March free fall)


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## figbat (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?


At the risk of sounding boastful, I joined a multi-national company in the early 90s and immediately joined their final salary pension scheme. At the time it was non-contributory for a 1/55th accrual rate, but subsequently it was changed to being a 10%-of-salary contribution, although any existing members at the time of this change only had to pay 10% of any pay rise received since the amendment. This company was then acquired by a much larger multi-national with a similar pension scheme - over time the various pension schemes have been combined meaning that currently I pay 5% of my salary for a 1/54th accrual rate. This is a voluntary payment - I could choose to make no payment for a 1/60th accrual. The scheme has a normal retirement age of 60 with an early retirement option from 55. Unsurprisingly it has been closed to new members from some time now.


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## Milkfloat (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?



For the last few years I have been stuffing in over 2.7K monthly between mine and my employers contribution. This is more than double than ever before, although I have always put in enough to get the highest matching that my company offered. The reason I ramped it up a few years ago was partly because I did pretty well out of some stock options which meant I was not reliant on all my salary for day to day living and as a way of trying to reduce my tax liabilities. This is likely to be short term as I am worried about my job and then in a covid world getting a new one, so I will start to take more as cash to squirrel away somewhere more accessible.


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## dodgy (5 Jun 2020)

Just a word of caution on annual income forecasts from Defined Contribution pensions, the annual figure they calculate is deliberately conservative as pension companies got their hands slapped for over egging the income expectations a few years ago.

Also, these forecasts are based on you buying an annuity, almost nobody does that these days as the returns are so low. Most seem to be going the drawdown route on their pot, the safe withdrawal (SWR) figure changes depending on what article you read but you often read of figures around 4% as the SWR. So if you had £100,000 in your pot, you could take £4000 out a year and possibly not diminish the value of the pot (this includes inflation at 1.5% or so).

I've now stoked a hornets nest and someone will come along to rubbish my figures, that's fine, but the basics are about right.


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## Electric_Andy (5 Jun 2020)

I'm on an NHS pension, I pay in £160/month. I have absolutely no idea what it all means. I started on the 2008 scheme and then was moved to the 2015 scheme in 2015. It says:

2008 scheme: Pension = £2368. lump sum £0 But then goes on to say that if I take the maximum lump sum (at 65) of £10k, my pension will be £1522 - I'm guessing that's in total, so £152/year for 10 years?

2015 scheme: pension = £1698. Then says if I tale the lump sum (£7k) there will be a pension of £1k.

I asked the pensions department to explain but they weren't able to. I will have to go in and have a face-to-face with someone and thet them to explain it to me. I have no idea if the two schemes are combined, or if I have to choose one or the other.

Anyway, I hope to retire at 55 which I htink is the earliest you can do it from. That's still 16 years off. As long as I get 80% of what I paid in, in some way or another, I'll be happy. And I mean the literal amount, not adjusted for inflation


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## dodgy (5 Jun 2020)

Electric_Andy said:


> I'm on an NHS pension, I pay in £160/month. I have absolutely no idea what it all means. I started on the 2008 scheme and then was moved to the 2015 scheme in 2015. It says:
> 
> 2008 scheme: Pension = £2368. lump sum £0 But then goes on to say that if I take the maximum lump sum (at 65) of £10k, my pension will be £1522 - I'm guessing that's in total, so £152/year for 10 years?



I think it means £2368 per year on retirement. If you take a bigger lump sum, the annual figure is reduced down to £1522 accordingly.

Edit to correct mistake


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## DCLane (5 Jun 2020)

I'm on the Teacher's Pension and put in over £6000 a year - it's a defined rate based on salary. I've bought extra years/made additional contributions to enhance it when I had the cash some time ago.


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## cisamcgu (5 Jun 2020)

Pensions are complex things, if in doubt, get advice 
https://www.pensionwise.gov.uk/en, 
or ask on MSE - lots of clever people there, with, seemingly, a lot of time on their hands  : 
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/categories/pensions-annuities-retirement-planning


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## dodgy (5 Jun 2020)

cisamcgu said:


> or ask on MSE - lots of clever people there, with, seemingly, a lot of time on their hands  :
> https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/categories/pensions-annuities-retirement-planning



I have learned a LOT from that very forum. They're knowledgeable, but can be unforgiving if you don't give them the information they need in the very first post


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## Electric_Andy (5 Jun 2020)

Just read this , might be helpful to anyone else on NHS pension. It's slightly clearer now, thanks @cisamcgu


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## shirokazan (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> If I didn't rent out a place then the lady that lives in it would not only be homeless, she'd quite likely have to leave the island in order to be able to afford somewhere else. It's a good thing I have no ethics.


A discussion more suited to the News & Current Affairs section, really. Your post makes it sound like your principal motivation is providing this lady with a roof over her head, and the rental income is irrelevant.


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## BoldonLad (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?



I am retired, and, taking out, rather than putting in, but:

During the years I was an Employee, I contributed 6% of Salary (Gross) into a Final Salary Scheme, Employer contributed 12%

For the last 10 years of my "working life" I was self employed and put an average of £20,000pa into a mixture of personal pension scheme, and Stocks/Shares ISAs.

Now retired and living off the proceeds, plus state pension. I am happy with my income, but, could always spend more (plenty of shiny toys out there).


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## Brads (5 Jun 2020)

Had a DB pension as an SSEB member from pre 2001.
Was going to pay around £18k + from aged 60.
Transferred it out into a SIPP at £730k value, now worth £812k. I am 52 so am jacking it all at 55

Lots of choices regards your pension nowadays.


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## Drago (5 Jun 2020)

shirokazan said:


> A discussion more suited to the News & Current Affairs section, really. Your post makes it sound like your principal motivation is providing this lady with a roof over her head, and the rental income is irrelevant.


If the discussion is more relevant elsewhere, then why do you keep mentioning it? You brought the matter up, not me.

I bought the place I tending to move back "home" when I left the army, but ended up ultimately moving in with Mrs D mark 1. I was going to sell,but was approached by the daughter of a friend of my dad's wanting to rent it for his daughter, and there she remained to this day. I don't need the money these days, with 5 separate and significant income streams between myself and Mrs D, and I still rent out to the same lady for the same £300 a month that I did 3 decades ago. She'd be paying 2.5 times that at least anywhere else on the island, if she could find anywhere at all. Indeed, shes not paying anything at the moment as I volunteered her a 3 month payment break while C19 was kicking off and she can't work.

My main motivation is simply hanging on to the place for when Mrs D joins me in retirement and having someone in it that I can trust who'll keep it in good order until that time. In recent years I've paid for all new external windows and doors and a re-slating of the roof, which is about 4.5 years rental income blown on that alone, so I'm not exactly being chauffeur driven in a Bentley while I light cigars with £50 notes off the back of it. I didn't purchase it as a buy to let profit making exercise. I ended up with it surplus through happenstance, and the profit you seem to think I'm revelling in does little more than attend to the physical upkeep of the property.

The lesson there is don't judge everyone by your own low standards.

And that brings it full circle back to topic. The main benefit for me is that I'm not spending my own pension, commutation or injury award maintaining the place. I can spend that money instead on being chauffeur driven in a Bentley and lighting cigars with fifties...


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## johnblack (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?


Just trying to stick in as much as possible, probaly about 15k pa. The returns have been so much better than any savings account, although I havent taken a look at the hit it's taken over the last few months. I'm a bit too young for retirement but I'm going to bang in as much as possible till I'm 55 and re-assess. Can't see there'll be any rush to take a lump sum or retire but I want options.


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## vickster (5 Jun 2020)

I’m thinking I should be paying rather more in, maybe once the economic upheaval settles and I don’t need such reserves in the business account

I do have a fair amount of cash in various places (PBs, ISAs) and much more is going in than out for now

My understanding of such matters is limited, should discuss with accountant


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## screenman (5 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> If the discussion is more relevant elsewhere, then why do you keep mentioning it? You brought the matter up, not me.
> 
> I bought the place I tending to move back "home" when I left the army, but ended up ultimately moving in with Mrs D mark 1. I was going to sell,but was approached by the daughter of a friend of my dad's wanting to rent it for his daughter, and there she remained to this day. I don't need the money these days, with 5 separate and significant income streams between myself and Mrs D, and I still rent out to the same lady for the same £300 a month that I did 3 decades ago. She'd be paying 2.5 times that at least anywhere else on the island, if she could find anywhere at all. Indeed, shes not paying anything at the moment as I volunteered her a 3 month payment break while C19 was kicking off and she can't work.
> 
> ...



What brand are you smoking, just in case I need to buy you a Xmas pressie and cannot come up with any other idea's.


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## PK99 (5 Jun 2020)

shirokazan said:


> *I wouldnt' do rental properties, not domestic anyway - doesn't fit with my ethic*s. As for your original plans...I had similar 1990s too.



Having seen first hand the way Buy to Let pushes up house prices in London, and the way it pushes down the quality of rental properties where BtL landlords are Annual Return driven, it does not fit with my ethics either.


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## johnblack (5 Jun 2020)

PK99 said:


> Having seen first hand the way Buy to Let pushes up house prices in London, and the way it pushes down the quality of rental properties where BtL landlords are Annual Return driven, it does not fit with my ethics either.


Not all heroes wear capes.


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## neil_merseyside (5 Jun 2020)

I paid in the same amount as my boss did (£170 back in the day, 6%?) and every pay rise after that I upped it to fight inflation, did that for maybe 15 years but it's had none in since, but as a supplement to state pension it should be enough. 
Pay in as much as you afford, do it NOW.

General rule of thumb was pay same percentage of salary as your age when you start paying in, says it all about what is needed for a NICE retirement. But 20% at 20 is "nah, I want a car/phone/holiday" 50% at 50 is "I can't I've a car/house and need a holiday" BUT it needs doing, you can't rely on the state as they run a Ponzi scheme, and in any case have too many takers (despite this latest thinning).


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## Dave7 (9 Jun 2020)

ColinJ said:


> Blimey - I only paid into my scheme for 2 years and got £2.5k at age 60 plus (currently) £600 p.a. from it!


Similar here. I started late and only had 10 years but it gives me £3K per year.
Scary what the future holds for the next generation.


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## Drago (9 Jun 2020)

I know people my age who are panicking now having made no pension provision and some are shovelling vast monthly amounts into pensions to try and claw something back. It also helps that the contributions aren't reckonable for CSA calculations, and I know one bloke who make huge pension payments solely to reduce his payments to his ex.


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## gavroche (10 Jun 2020)

We all have different needs and priorities but to me, the best advice I can give to people still working is this: make sure you are mortgage free when you retire and that's worth a pension on its own. On the other hand, if you are not a home owner and paying rent for the rest of your life, then you will need a good pension pot.
We own our own house outright so we don't need lots of money to live on. We both have a state pension , mine a bit higher than normal due to working 44 years and a small private one when I dropped out of SERPS in the 80s. We are not rich by any means, but live comfortably and can afford little luxuries. 
I feel sorry for young couples with families these days. Most have no hope to even be able to buy a house, let alone contribute into a pension scheme.


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## welsh dragon (10 Jun 2020)

I have a very small private pension that I didn't have to pay anything into at all.

It gives me about £3,500 per annum. Not a lot but better than nothing. I have been collecting it since I was 60. I took a lump sum out of it as well about £25,000 altogether and I have that in the bank not that I get any Interest on it.

I have another 2 years to go before I retire officially and can collect my state pension. What with that and Mr WD's pension we will be fine. We won't be rich, but we won't be struggling either.


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## ColinJ (10 Jun 2020)

welsh dragon said:


> I took a lump sum out of it as well about £25,000 altogether and I have that in the bank not that I get any Interest on it.


Buy Premium Bonds with it ASAP!!!! You would probably win about £250-400 p.a. on average. You can cash bonds in online at a few days notice.


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## welsh dragon (10 Jun 2020)

ColinJ said:


> Buy Premium Bonds with it ASAP!!!! You would probably win about £250-400 p.a. on average. You can cash bonds in online at a few days notice.




I have been thinking investing in PB's to be honest.


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## marzjennings (10 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> Just as an aside, without wishing to seem nosey, what sort of monthly contributions do you good folks put into your pensions?


I put in 10% of my gross income a year and the company adds in another 14%. This is all into a US 401k program which has been growing on average about 8% a year for the last 17 years. I'm on track for earning just over 75% of my final wage when I retire in about 15 years.


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## Ridgeway (10 Jun 2020)

Here i pay the legal minimum which is about £22k p/a, ideally i should increase that to around £35k p/a but not this year...

Pension levels are high here as we retire with mortgages or rentals still to pay and of course nice monthly health insurance costs..... 

Some how i think we'll be moving before that day comes

France is beckoning


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## potsy (10 Jun 2020)

ColinJ said:


> Buy Premium Bonds with it ASAP!!!! You would probably win about £250-400 p.a. on average. You can cash bonds in online at a few days notice.


Inspired by your post I have just bought my first ever PBs, if I win big I will send you some commission 

Getting back to pensions, I paid into a final salary scheme at my previous job for 14 years before they stopped it and changed to a different scheme for my last couple of years there. 

Current employer I pay the max I can (6%) and they put in 9% (I think) so will hopefully have 2 small pensions to go with my state pension if they are still going.


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## vickster (11 Jun 2020)

welsh dragon said:


> I have been thinking investing in PB's to be honest.


There’s no risk in doing so and it’s very easy. Invest now, you’ll probably get into the August draw (maybe September)


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## Drago (11 Jun 2020)

gavroche said:


> We all have different needs and priorities but to me, the best advice I can give to people still working is this: make sure you are mortgage free when you retire and that's worth a pension on its own. On the other hand, if you are not a home owner and paying rent for the rest of your life, then you will need a good pension pot.
> We own our own house outright so we don't need lots of money to live on. We both have a state pension , mine a bit higher than normal due to working 44 years and a small private one when I dropped out of SERPS in the 80s. We are not rich by any means, but live comfortably and can afford little luxuries.
> I feel sorry for young couples with families these days. Most have no hope to even be able to buy a house, let alone contribute into a pension scheme.


My Mum was the one who hammered a constant chinese water torture drip drip drip of financial advice, but my Dad did manage one snippet:

"Son, when you own your own house you answer to no man."

And he was profoundly correct. I've applied for a couple of jobs along the way and been unsuccessful, but it doesn't matter simply because I don't have a mortgage. That gives a freedom of action - or inaction - which becomes uniquely valuable when you retire/are made redundant/simply can't be bothered any more and your income greatly reduces.

The only financial planning advice I'd add to that is avoid loans for holidays and cars, PCP plans, etc. Without them you have hundreds of pounds a month more you can use to to get that mortgage paid off early (8 years in my case - I started again at 35 when I divorced and didn't want to be paying a mortgage until I was 60, so bit the frugal bullet), and if you do suddenly find yourself out of work at any age you're not having to service debts you could do without.


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## potsy (11 Jun 2020)

vickster said:


> There’s no risk in doing so and it’s very easy. Invest now, you’ll probably get into the August draw (maybe September)


I invested last night and am in the August draw.


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## johnblack (11 Jun 2020)

Drago said:


> My Mum was the one who hammered a constant chinese water torture drip drip drip of financial advice, but my Dad did manage one snippet:
> 
> "Son, when you own your own house you answer to no man."
> 
> ...


Paying off the mortgage early absolutely felt the best thing to do for us, we did ours in 15 years by the time we were 45, it gaves us the ability to really invest in the future. I appreciate this is not practicle or possible for everyone but we did have to do without a lot of things to do get here. I dump everything I can on finance, as long as it's 0% or at least a lower rate than the return on investments I'd have to use to pay for things.


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## dodgy (11 Jun 2020)

Owning your own home is a great feeling and also a tremendous privilege in this day and age. But, don't prioritise paying off your mortgage over saving into your pension.


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## SpokeyDokey (21 Jun 2020)

Never been a big fan of pensions tbh. They're inherently biased towards the pension provider being the winner.

Much preferred the zeroing debt and save like crazy whilst enjoying yourself along the way approach. 

Only private pension I have is a big corporate no-option-no-contribution-so-why-not one. Provides a reasonable amount of income, will be bolstered by 2 x State pensions but in essence we can live off of our various investments ad-infinitum - if only life were that long.


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## dodgy (21 Jun 2020)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Never been a big fan of pensions tbh. They're inherently biased towards the pension provider being the winner.



You've lost me there!


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## SpokeyDokey (21 Jun 2020)

dodgy said:


> You've lost me there!



Take any given size 'pot' and the provider will usually make more from it than they pay out to you.


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## dodgy (21 Jun 2020)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Take any given size 'pot' and the provider will usually make more from it than they pay out to you.



I don't know if that's true or not, all I know is that if I calculate the contributions to my 20 year company pension it makes up about 30% of the current size of the pot, so I'm getting money for 'free' (yes I know how it really works), I couldn't care less if the pension provider also makes a living. I'd be cutting my nose off to spite my face if I gave all that up, not to mention the tax efficiency (which can be considerable depending on your salary).

I won't be changing the advice I give out to younger family members!


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## Salty seadog (21 Jun 2020)

SpokeyDokey said:


> Take any given size 'pot' and the provider will usually make more from it than they pay out to you.





dodgy said:


> I don't know if that's true or not, all I know is that if I calculate the contributions to my 20 year company pension it makes up about 30% of the current size of the pot, so I'm getting money for 'free' (yes I know how it really works), I couldn't care less if the pension provider also makes a living. I'd be cutting my nose off to spite my face if I gave all that up, not to mention the tax efficiency (which can be considerable depending on your salary).
> 
> I won't be changing the advice I give out to younger family members!



I came to pensions late at 37. I have since paid in around 12% as my employee contribution plus what the company contribute and tax relief.

I'm going to be poor in retirement.

@srw any comment. I believe at present you have more options with what to do with your pot in light of recent changes.


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## Goldenretriever (21 Jun 2020)

One of the first things I did when I became self-employed in the early eighties was sign up to a pension scheme. Knowing nothing about these in my early twenties I signed on the dotted line with the local man from the Prudential. Gradually upped contributions but never massively, paying £150 per month at the moment. They stopped selling this particular product shortly after, the reason being it has a guaranteed annuity which should almost double the market rate. Before covid! Only problem being looked into taking it early as wife has cancer but would lose out big time, so have to let it run till I'm 64.5 as that's what I signed up for. In hindsight I wouldn't have upped it even to that amount as we should have gone into property developing earlier, stuck with kitchens and joinery for to long but isn't hindsight a wonderful thing!


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## SpokeyDokey (21 Jun 2020)

dodgy said:


> I don't know if that's true or not, all I know is that if I calculate the contributions to my 20 year company pension it makes up about 30% of the current size of the pot, so I'm getting money for 'free' (yes I know how it really works), I couldn't care less if the pension provider also makes a living. I'd be cutting my nose off to spite my face if I gave all that up, not to mention the tax efficiency (which can be considerable depending on your salary).
> 
> I won't be changing the advice I give out to younger family members!



Sorry. I probably should've qualified my original statement by saying I'm not a big fan of private pensions excluding company funded pensions.

I have one reasonable company funded pension which was non-contributory but I never made any AVC's into it. 

I agree with you - why turn down 'free' money although the cynic could argue that if an employer can afford to pay into a pension fund on your behalf than it may have been better if they paid you more salary in lieu of this.


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## MontyVeda (21 Jun 2020)

Had a natter with my brother about my nest pension and it turns out that the default pension fund isn't great and advised me to switch to another one which means my £180 pa workplace pension could be worth £300+


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## stephec (26 Jun 2020)

screenman said:


> What brand are you smoking, just in case I need to buy you a Xmas pressie and cannot come up with any other idea's.


Whatever they are they'll have been hand rolled on the thighs of Cuban virgins.


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## Drago (28 Jun 2020)

stephec said:


> Whatever they are they'll have been hand rolled on the thighs of Cuban virgins.


...with names like Jose and Che.


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## ColinJ (4 Jul 2020)

potsy said:


> I invested last night and am in the August draw.


Good luck! I just won £25 in the July draw... 

They always send an email telling you to log in to your account to check how much your prize is. Nearly all of them are £25, but there is always a little bit of excitement in the few seconds it takes to check!

So, that will pay for a takeaway curry and a few spares for my bike this weekend.


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## neil_merseyside (4 Jul 2020)

Does the nice man from Ernie call personally if you win the £1m prize?


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## spen666 (4 Jul 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Does the nice man from Ernie call personally if you win the £1m prize?


Thought the nice man was called Ernie.

I thought it was a requirement of the role to be called Ernie before you could apply


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## vickster (4 Jul 2020)

ColinJ said:


> Good luck! I just won £25 in the July draw...
> 
> They always send an email telling you to log in to your account to check how much your prize is. Nearly all of them are £25, but there is always a little bit of excitement in the few seconds it takes to check!
> 
> So, that will pay for a takeaway curry and a few spares for my bike this weekend.


I won 2 x £25


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## vickster (4 Jul 2020)

@ColinJ now I’m gutted. My mum got a PB win cheque for £1000 this morning


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## ColinJ (4 Jul 2020)

vickster said:


> @ColinJ now I’m gutted. My mum got a PB win cheque for £1000 this morning


Don't you like her very much?  

Congratulations, vickster_mum!


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## vickster (4 Jul 2020)

ColinJ said:


> Don't you like her very much?
> 
> Congratulations. vickster_mum!


Nah love her dearly, just jealous


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## potsy (4 Jul 2020)

Nice to see a lot of luck coming to the cc'ers, hopefully get my share too


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## ColinJ (4 Jul 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Does the nice man from Ernie call personally if you win the £1m prize?


I wondered about that - surely they wouldn't just send you just the usual ...







... email? 

I'll let you know after I've won my first million!


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## Jenkins (4 Jul 2020)

neil_merseyside said:


> Does the nice man from Ernie call personally if you win the £1m prize?


Up to recently they did. There was a feature in one of the papers a few years ago where they interviewed the (anonymous) person responsible and they actually called at your house to offer advice along with the good news. And at the time it was a Mrs Ernie.


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## Drago (5 Jul 2020)

potsy said:


> Nice to see a lot of luck coming to the cc'ers, hopefully get my share too


Speaking of luck, when I retired I just passed the time threshold and retired under new rules set in place by Teresa May. These have been successfully challenged in Court as unlawfully ageist and a breach of contract. Day to day it doesn't affect me greatly as about 85% of my pensionable service falls under the terms of the 1987 regulations. Nevertheless, it does make a difference, and I'm due not only a nice bump-up in my monthly income, but 3 years of back payments and interest. I'm also part of a class action against the HO, so I'll be due a payout for upset, distress and hurt feelings, another 4 or 5 grand. Teresa May's efforts to save some money is costing the county a fortune.


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## Mattk50 (15 Jul 2020)

I made enquiries about an old DB frozen scheme I had from 1988-1995 and got a valuation of £450k which I then promptly moved into a SIPP. it was only worth 15k a year when I hit 65 so the transfer option was worth it. Having made little conscious effort with pensions all my life until now (51) it's given me some security and incentive to add more now.


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## Drago (15 Jul 2020)

My pension gives me a little over 16k a year, plus 4k injury award (not counting the 136k commutation which I banked and which remains untouched). When you've no mortgage or car finance etc, 16 large doesn't do me badly at all - it comes in quicker than I try to spend it.


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## Mattk50 (15 Jul 2020)

I do think the pension industry has a vested interest in making us save more than we really need. I may be wrong but if when you retire with two state pensions say 19k per year, no mortgage, kids off hands, a new bike each year and that's without any private pension provision whatsoever. Surely that's 'do-able'?


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## Drago (15 Jul 2020)

I think it easily doable if you're not daft enough to be saddled with a mortgage (or perhaps a remortgage at that age), credit cards, loans, etc, Of course, if you want to go on cruises twice a year and drive a new Jag every September then it may not go very far, but if if you're prepared to forego needless fripperies and live modestly I think it's possible to live quite comfortably.

You'll also find you can retire a lot earlier without those things.

I've a rental income too and Mrs D is much younger than me and works and has her own Ill health police pension, but were saving every penny as shes unlikely to be well enough to work for more than another 4 or 5 years, so once she stops earning that's one of our income streams cut off permanently.


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## dodgy (15 Jul 2020)

Mattk50 said:


> I do think the pension industry has a vested interest in making us save more than we really need. I may be wrong but if when you retire with two state pensions say 19k per year, no mortgage, kids off hands, a new bike each year and that's without any private pension provision whatsoever. Surely that's 'do-able'?



If you're happy to wait until 67 to retire, that's entirely reasonable. I don't think there's any conspiracy, though (my words, not yours  ), pension companies might make some money, but the pot owner will also make some (potentially a *lot *more than they put in).

I'm retiring at 55, my choice, I'd rather be riding my bike around Europe while I'm still able to enjoy it


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## delb0y (16 Jul 2020)

Mattk50 said:


> I made enquiries about an old DB frozen scheme I had from 1988-1995 and got a valuation of £450k which I then promptly moved into a SIPP. it was only worth 15k a year when I hit 65 so the transfer option was worth it. Having made little conscious effort with pensions all my life until now (51) it's given me some security and incentive to add more now.



That's a great return on seven or eight years DB contributions. Nice :-)



dodgy said:


> If you're happy to wait until 67 to retire, that's entirely reasonable. I don't think there's any conspiracy, though (my words, not yours  ), pension companies might make some money, but the pot owner will also make some (potentially a *lot *more than they put in).
> 
> I'm retiring at 55, my choice, I'd rather be riding my bike around Europe while I'm still able to enjoy it



There was a time when I was aiming for 55, but as I approached 54 various factors (mainly business scandals that knocked the company share-price for six) combined to push my target out a year. Then Brexit came along and the investments now halved again. So I then started targetting 57 but subsequent pension changes, work changes, and other factors hit it again and it become 58. NextCovid-19 hit and with SWMBO not being able to work and investments halving yet again, 59 now looks more reasonable. Seems like there's this mean pension god that is having fun with me and a carrot on a stick that I can never quite grab.

I do agree that one should retire as soon as one can - you only live once and you never get the time back, and all that.

Derek


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## dodgy (16 Jul 2020)

delb0y said:


> That's a great return on seven or eight years DB contributions. Nice :-)
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Your investments halved with the vote leave? Really? And they halved yet again with Covid19? What are you invested in!!?

My pot wobbled a bit during vote leave but soon recovered, it dropped about 10% for Covid19 around March but it's now completely recovered and is worth more now than pre-covid19. Have you set your Target Retirement Date (TRD) with your pension provider, I'm guessing not? IF you do that, as you get nearer TRD, your pension pot is 'de-risked' and you're moved into less volatile stocks that can weather tough conditions much better.

I'm glad I did just that!


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## Mattk50 (16 Jul 2020)

delb0y said:


> That's a great return on seven or eight years DB contributions. Nice :-)



I fell off my stool that's for sure! I still can't fathom how they arrived at that number with the contributions being so early in my career with rubbish earnings!


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## dodgy (16 Jul 2020)

Mattk50 said:


> I fell off my stool that's for sure! I still can't fathom how they arrived at that number with the contributions being so early in my career with rubbish earnings!



25 years plus of compounded interest.


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## delb0y (16 Jul 2020)

dodgy said:


> Your investments halved with the vote leave? Really? And they halved yet again with Covid19? What are you invested in!!?



I used to work for BT, and had a bunch of shares. They were worth £5. Overnight, almost, with the coincidence of a Brexit vote and a BT Italia accounting scandal, they dropped 50%. At that point I got rid of all that I could. However, I still had some and they hovered around the £2 mark until Covid-19 when they dropped to around £1. A big fall from grace (many years ago when the configuration of BT was very different they were once worth £15 !)

These shares weren't / aren't part of my pension(s) - which have just about recovered to pre-Covid levels - but were a big part of my retirement plan. Hence the continued slippage year by year.

Regards
Derek


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## delb0y (16 Jul 2020)

The fall:


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## dodgy (16 Jul 2020)

Buy TSLA!!!! (this is not financial advice)


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## Mattk50 (17 Jul 2020)

I remember signing up for an endowment policy in 1985 paying 15 quid a month. After 3 years it was worth about 500 quid i.e. less than I paid in! Needless to say this was a good lesson because when I got my first mortgage in 1995 I absolutely refused to have an endowment mortgage and opted for the repayment type which wasn't as popular but was a good move on my part with all the mis-selling.


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## MontyVeda (2 Aug 2021)

MontyVeda said:


> Had a natter with my brother about my nest pension and it turns out that the default pension fund isn't great and advised me to switch to another one which means my £180 pa workplace pension could be worth £300+


after switching my NEST pension to the Sharia fund, this years annual statement suggests that my pension could be worth £530 a year!


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## MontyVeda (23 Jun 2022)

MontyVeda said:


> after switching my NEST pension to the Sharia fund, this years annual statement suggests that my pension could be worth £530 a year!



A year passes, a war begins, rent goes up, energy goes up, cost of food goes up, latest NEST pension statement estimates £250 a year


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## Ming the Merciless (23 Jun 2022)

MontyVeda said:


> A year passes, a war begins, rent goes up, energy goes up, cost of food goes up, latest NEST pension statement estimates £250 a year



It‘ll be £180 a year at next forecast.


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## MontyVeda (23 Jun 2022)

Ming the Merciless said:


> It‘ll be £180 a year at next forecast.



back to where it was with the original investment fund


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